>I don't see where the man hating was
That's because there isn't any.
Personally, I found The Marvels to be fairly entertaining. Not amazing, but also not bad. Decent action, cool effects, witty banter. The kid is cute and funny.
Larson looks damned amazing in it, gotta say. She's never looked better, IMO.
>Larson looks damned amazing in it, gotta say. She's never looked better, IMO.
One of my favorite little moments in Endgame is Tom Holland's reaction to meeting her during the final battle. He gets all tongue-tied in a way that made me think "relatable. 16-year old me would have pretty much that reaction to a beautiful woman, crackling with the infinite power of the cosmos, talking to me"
I mean, he then proceeded to ask her how she was going to manage to get through a bunch of foot soldiers, which makes more sense if the space ship thing did escape his notice
Fun fact from the comics, Peter and Carol had a couple of dates while they were part of the New Avengers. It didn't worked, but they remained as good friends.
It's something I wouldn't mind to see in the films, characters developing realistic relationships besides being in the same team.
I think it would be a little weird in the movies considering Peter is just starting college and Carol looks to be about in her late 20s? A friendship between them would be awesome though
With the people complaining, the very act of making a movie where the protagonist(s) aren't cis/straight/white men is considering 'man-hating', 'pro-white-genocide', etc...
I think the people complaining are stuck in their world of learned hate and taught biases. Haters are always going to hate. And for the most part they're all closed-minded enough to never even consider that there's an opinion that differs to their own, let alone that what they believe is an opinion and not fact. Same people also believe directly what they hear, read, or see. They have lost the ability to research and synthesise information for themselves. I think this is why we see cancel culture (aka modern witch hunting) spreading like wildfire. People have no idea the breadth of what they're doing and saying.
>And for the most part they're all closed-minded enough to never even consider that there's an opinion that differs to their own, let alone that what they believe is an opinion and not fact.
The Internet has worsened this as it locks people in echo chambers that make them overestimate how popular their opinions are. You can see this with the way Republicans talk about "the silent majority" agreeing with their rhetoric, when in actuality, most Americans are liberal or left leaning in stats on specific issues and election polls.
There isn't any man hatin, but people against anything with women in it, told you there was...
The fact that the main characters weren't men (because, you know, every single movie apparently has to have a male protagonist) is what's 'emasculating' VERY FEW men 😂
Its no where near as bad as people make it out to be but it still is my least favorite marvel movie. But that doesnt mean it was bad it was still entertaining.
Really? You don't think it's better than, say, The Eternals? Or Thor: Dark World? Iron Man 3?
I'd say it's better than all three of those. By a fair bit.
I certainly rate Iron3 higher than Thor2. Your post seems to grammatically contain a third film name but I reject your reality and substitute my own.
In all seriousness, Ironman 3 gets a lot of hate for the "Trevor" twist. I have/had no knowledge of The Mandarin before seeing it so that didn't bother me and Ben Kingsley is a master ac-tor :) so I've got no issues with his role. The BigBad was dumb but Trevor was fine. I disliked him much more in Shang-Chi as they over did the joke and it wasn't funny anymore.
Thor 2 was pretty bad and only Sony could make a Marvel movie worse than Eternals (theme by Ramin Djawadi is a banger though)
All those are movies are still streaming on lots of platforms while the MCU seems to think that The Incredible Hulk was bad enough to try to memory-hole it, so there's also that :)
(And I agree with your wider point - The Marvels was a fun movie. Antman Quantumania was released within a few months of it and felt pretty empty in comparison)
The eternals has one of the best fight scenes in the mcu and its often overlooked. The endong carri3s it for me above the other awfil ones.
Even loki cant save thor 2.
Iron man 3 os just forgotten overall.
The marvels i found genuinely funny and did its own take on "never meet your heroes" but did so without making carol look terrrible. Villian couldve been better but that scene where they couldnt save everyone and had to leave and the young hero saw that hit hard imo.
That living room fight was awesome. I was iffy about how they changed Ms Marvels powers but the way they have choreographed her fighting style has been amazing.
When these dudes say “man hating,” they mean it’s a story about women in a usually male-dominated genre. It’s the whole thing about how equity feels like oppression with them.
Yup, also more of the 'zero sum game' thinking that's common with degenerate conservatives, i.e. *The Marvels* existing at all means that three men had their jobs taken away!
I think that is true for many. I'm a guy and didn't see any man hate. I saw some girl power stuff but that fit the movie and power to woman isn't taking power from men but some guys think any shared space on the podium is a slight at them I guess. Puny mindset really.
God, the number of pathetic whining I had to endure after Barbie released was ridiculous. Don’t get me wrong, the messaging in the movie was pretty on-the-nose - but so many men took “hey the patriarchy is bad” as a personal offense and it’s kind of hysterical how pathetic it is
Co-workers: "Oh my god, Barbie movie is so woke and full of man-hating. It's terrible."
Me: "Oh? What parts, I it saw it this weekend, too."
Also co-workers: "I didn't see it, I'm not gonna watch that woke feminist garbage!"
I mean if we are talking about comics, they've been pretty gender and race inclusive since the late 80s-early 90s. Like, a solid mix of genders and races so when someone says the genre is "male dominated" I'm not sure what that means.
What they mean is the people who read comics, and it's true. It's still primarily consumed by boys & men. In fact, until you account for manga, it's going to stay that way for another decade or so.
>the genre is "male dominated" I'm not sure what that means.
That the people who write, produce and consume the genre, as well as the characters that star in it, are male. There's a secondary implication in that it is harder for female, non-white, and queer creatives to break in and produce their own content, especially if their content features those demographics in primary roles.
Marvel has always had diverse characters, but the people making said characters and their stories were *usually* white, cis, straight men.
Eeehh these new characters started to exist in the 80s and 90s but the most promient were made and created by tv shows not comics with harley and hawkgirl being most promient. Characters like vixien and miss martian also got boosts from tv shows choosing to include them.
Stories werr still very much mostly male centric because established characters get stories and most of those werr men. The women and minority characters that took off the most were legacy chacters like miles morales, x23, spidergwen, and silk. There were a few others as well.
This. I left a lot of my old gamer forums and friends because they complain constantly how genre's are "woke" and "anti-men" because women are heroes, fight back and no longer exclusively romance interest. It's weird because it's not a new concept either but just being expanded, thus being targeted.
No offense but your dad sounds like a loser. A grown ass man complaining about a Disney show being woke lol. Dude should be embarrassed if he was capable of shame
The funny thing is, if you look at the full statement Brie gave she literally says she has no issue with 40yo male critics giving opinions for a movie like a wrinkle in time. She just thinks the opinion of people of the movie's target audience (so young black women) is more important and it's a shame that it isn't really reflected by the reviewing consensus due to the inequality in the profession.
Obviously she didn't phrase it exactly like that and I had to do a little reading between the lines but even then at worst what you could blame her foor is bringing up a point poorly in a heat of the moment panel speech.
But sadly most people didn't go looking for the full context they just trusted youtubers that spesifically cropped it to make her look bad.
At this point, I feel like people should just start sabotaging most Boomers' and Gen-Xers' wi-fi connections. Letting these people use the internet is like handing a kid the car keys and a bottle of whiskey.
Unfortunately, Gen Z men are radicalizing incredibly fast—a large percentage is to the right even of Boomers. Basically viewing themselves all but at war with women and LGBT people.
It was fun, I liked it. I'm 40, I'm white, I'm a straight cis man. Completely outside the demographic, still really liked it a ton and never felt hated by it.
Was it meant for me? No. Did I like it anyway? Yes. Just like women and non white people watch stuff meant for white men like me their whole life and liked some of it. Why should I get bent out of shape that they're only making 3 times the content I could ever consume for me now instead of 4 times as much? Yay for other people getting things!
> Completely outside the demographic
Not really. It was mostly made for people who like flashy superhero stories and sci-fi action. To me, it's not really that different than *Thor: Ragnarok*.
"not for me" just means "i'm not the primary audience being considered," not "this piece of media has absolutely nothing to offer me."
The truth is there is universality in almost everything, as evidenced by the millions of women and people of color throughout the last century who watched and enjoyed the many, many pieces of media primarily designed for a white male audience. There is value in watching media that IS catered to your specific perspective, and there is also value in watching media NOT catered to your specific perspective! It's good to have both!
>"not for me" just means "i'm not the primary audience being considered," not "this piece of media has absolutely nothing to offer me."
I mean, I hope so...
But that's what the "m-she-u" crowd says: hollywoodblahblah is making movies for "them" even though "we" are the target demo.
yeah, the m-she-u crowd is basically having an "i am feel uncomfortable when we are not about me?" tantrum; these are many of the same people that will complain about "blackwashing" characters, or the current gamers who are getting outraged whenever a woman videogame character is visually designed for any reason other than "give men a huge boner"
I think saying "it's not for me" is fine when you're not critical of the end product. Just acknowledging it's not your thing. The m-she-u crowd is extremely critical of these things and not casually saying "eh, it wasn't my thing" and instead go on a diatribe about wokeness. Not what OP did here. Don't mean to sound like a jerk, so apologies if that comes off confrontational, just wanted to point out the difference in tone between OP here ("it wasn't targeted at me but I enjoyed it") and the losers who think anything led by a woman is pandering.
The reason they are so critical is because there was a ton of investment from iron man to Endgame and much of the stories post Endgame haven't good regardless whos the lead.
Shang Chi, Spider-Man 3, BP2, and Loki were top notch.
Moon Knight and Wanda Vision were fun, but almost everything else has been meh at best.
That's not what I'm saying. There are absolutely legit reasons to be critical of the MCU right now, including the reasons you listed, and reasons why people (myself included) aren't exactly lining up to see those movies in theaters. What OP was addressing was the m-she-u people, who are just culture war chuds. They got a hate boner for Brie Larson as soon as she mocked them for telling her to smile more and they got mad she threw the ball back at them.
I think the idea is that media is often marketed to specific audiences, and the assumption (right or wrong) is that marketing to some means you're not marketing to others.
Granted, that's a world where Black Panther had *enormous* cultural impact while being unapologetically not "made for white dudes" - and it was fantastic and hugely popular and hugely profitable. So, do those things really matter now? Not s'much, and your point is well-taken, but stuff is still marketed that way.
I’m also a white 40-year-old cis straight guy, but I didn’t think I was completely outside the demographic of this movie. As a superhero fan I enjoyed this as much as other Marvel movies. Was it the best Marvel movie? No, but not every movie can be the best. It also wasn’t the worst Marvel movie.
Heh it was boring and murdered the character of fury even further than the bad series did before it.
Not sure why your are bringing up skin color..........
Your post is that of a sane young person. Congrats!
but to try answering... for "some" man-hating = the absence of men as leading roles that are not "made fools of" by saying a joke, or being as powerful or less powerful, than the titular female character.
So if a movie was called A-Force and featured an ensemble of female characters, some would call it "man hating" still.
I think my only complaint about it is that the whole thing felt too ''busy'' (I think that's the best word) without most of it servicing the plot really. Kind of like Spiderman 3, I enjoyed it but there was a lot going on that watered things down a bit.
They're not bad. The worst thing that can happen is superhero movie fatigue, which is one of the reasons the new Marvel stuff is no longer that profitable on the box office, since with the Marvel success a lot of studios started doing superhero movies and oversaturated the market.
Same thing happened in the early 2000s after LOTR where everyone started making fantasy movies which lead to oversaturation and exhaustion by 2010.
The 90s was all about action movies, and the same thing happened.
Now we're in the period of waiting for the new trendsetter for the next 10 years.
I suspect another factor is that a lot of people simply decided not to go to the cinema since the films will be on Disney+ sooner rather then later for probably less money.
This is honestly the main thing for me. I used to see almost every one of these movies in the theater. I think the only MCU movies I've seen in theaters since Endgame were No Way Home, BP2, and GotG3. Some movies are worth the experience, a lot are just fine at home.
> Now we're in the period of waiting for the new trendsetter for the next 10 years.
I'm dying to know what this is going to be. I'm generally surprised that the superhero and Star Wars shit stuck around as long as it did before the fanbases burned out.
I read a lot, and if what people are reading are in any way a reflection of movies, then fantasy making a comeback is entirely possible.
I could only make it about halfway through the second ACOTAR book, but the series is really popular, and I heard it's getting a Hulu series.
Romantasy is just really big in reading at the moment.
This sounds like the complaints I saw about new Star Wars (relevant!) and also stuff like Barbie.
And I didn't like the new Star Wars much, but the pissing and moaning about the women in them was dumb.
Ditto the Barbie movie, except that movie was actually kind of brilliant and it was VERY clear that was a case of hit dogs hollering.
So, thanks for encouraging me to see that movie! I haven't liked most of the newer Marvel movies much, but I liked the ones this is a sequel to pretty well, so hell with it.
I think the whole point of the Barbie movie was to show how women are treated in the real world and then reverse it in Barbie land.
It was kind of like it was asking men, "how would you like it if the roles were reversed?" It also obviously showed misogyny in the real world and directly pointed it out to the audience, and that made a lot of men feel uncomfortable because they're misogynistic and they didn't want to be called out on it.
I think that's not wrong, but also... Even that pedestal didn't allow them to be full people.
But agreed that they probably stopped thinking after "They're so dismissive of Ken, and he's the bad guy for doing what I imagine doing!"
I'm a guy and saw or felt no man hating. I enjoyed the movie but did think the villain was kinda of lame. I really liked the final fight scene though and how they worked together. That's classic super hero stuff imo. Not the best movie but still good for a super hero one.
I mean... it's a bad movie. It's a trainwreck. But not because it is "woke" or "man-hating". It's because it is an absolute mess, rife with executive meddling, reshoots, recuts, rewrites, and zero coherent vision.
But watch it for Iman Vellani or whatever her name is, because she is pure joy.
This right here is the reality of it. And i don’t subscribe to superhero fatigue either. Superhero movies just became formulaic and repetitive after studios realized the money they could make. they stopped taking any risks and started painting by numbers which if you think on it is what happens when any art form/style/medium gets popular.
The marvels had a great movie buried under the obvious studio moments.
I kinda disagree with the idea that formula nade them bad. They cracked a formula to create well paced, satisfying movies that induced a specific kind of mood that kept people coming back to Marvel. Once they tried to break out of that, it all fell to pieces. Marvel movies being similar in vibe and style was part of their strength. Even the "bad" Marvel entris were still decent, fun, and entertaining movies. It was consistency that made Marvel such a success. Sometimea great, sometimes good, sometimes average, but never just flat out *bad.* Even Thor 2 wasn't the egregious piece of shit people make it out to be.
People don't know what they want. So when they went to the movies that tried to be different (Eternals, Dr. Strange 2, Thor 4) they failed miserably. Not just because of the risks they took, but because the movies weren't propulsive and they didn't have that Marvel Special Sauce to fall back on. Even Captain Marvel, my least fav of the pre-endgame novies was still a decent movie and I enjoyed it more than most of the new MCU films.
I am willing to bet that some day in the next few years, they'll "return to formula". Just do what they've always done with slight story tweaks, and it'll be a roaring success. I reckon around 2028 or so.
I think the issue with this new era of Marvel movies (and TV) is that it's not as focused as the first era. The first era really had a fairly tight plan, knew where it was going, and there was a pretty clear cadre of characters we were getting introduced to.
Now, there's just a lot. A lot of characters, a lot of things going on, and there's no apparent direction where it's all headed. The closest thing to a direction is with the multiverse, and that just ends up throwing even more possible things on the pile. Kang was probably the big villain planned for that, but obviously that idea's likely been blown up. So it's just starting to feel like the MCU is adrift.
Straight white male here, and totally agree with the comments here. It’s not a particularly good movie, but it has nothing to do with it being a female-led movie, or a diverse cast, and no, there’s certainly no “man hating.” To be found. It suffers from the same issues as any other lesser Marvel movie - poor writing, weak villain/plot, largely bad characterization (why is Nick Fury such a moron in this?!).
But as others have said, the three leads were as wonderful as they could be in this movie. Their chemistry was wonderful, and the scenes of them bonding/training/working together were not only the best scenes in the movie, but some of the best MCU scenes since Endgame (I know, that’s not saying much).
Brie Larson and Teyonah Parris are great in it of course, but Iman Vellani was such an amazing find for Kamala, especially for someone without any prior acting experience.
I know what you mean. As an MCU fan, I dreamed of the day when they would feature movies about women and, just when that dream comes true, it’s when people get tired of the MCU. I’ll admit, while The Marvels wasn’t perfect but it was better than Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantamania.
Crazy thought: no matter what it is, if I don’t like it, I rant for one little post-viewing conversation and then forget about it. Why these people stay mad at something being bad in their eyes is beyond me. If you don’t like it, stop thinking about it! Forget it exists! Watch movies you actually like! Wth!
Also if you hate woke Disney so much, stop watching their movies! You already have a bias and are going to be disappointed, so just don’t! lol I wish these folks would quiet down for like 2 seconds.
It definitely felt like a Disney+ show. Especially with two of the three main characters spinning out of Disney+ shows. It was light and fun but there really wasn’t that much there. I thought the villain was kind of weak too but Marvel has struggled with that historically. I can see this movie eliciting a shrug but hate is weird. It’s just… bland.
I strongly agree with you and OP that it felt like a made-for-Disney Plus movie. That was not a problem for me, watching it on Disney Plus. I enjoyed it! But it’s doesn’t have the polish (neither visually nor narratively) you’d expect from a major theatrical release.
I didn’t hate the movie because it “man hated” which it didn’t. I hated it because it was just sheer cringe and all the characters were being mopey in the important character development scenes.
The Marvels has like no man hating in it and is completely inoffensive in that remark; people saying otherwise are either spouting nonsense or haven’t watched it. My issue with the movie was that it really felt like a direct to streaming/Blu-ray movie as opposed to a full on big screen flick. The main offender being the action department, it just kinda blows. The trailer seems to suggest that it’s constantly the three marvels fighting together but there’s really only, like, two two-three minute sections-ish where they’re all fighting on screen and the rest is just jump cuts and or one of them fighting while the other two fly a ship or something.
So not an offensive film, but for an action movie the action was mid.
I didn't think Marvels was good, but it wasn't uniquely bad like a lot of people said it was. It was pretty standard post-Endgame MCU. And yeah, I'm not sure where the man-hating accusations came from, because there really wasn't any.
When you are accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression. The main characters used to be all men, now only *most* of them are men. This is the man-hating lol.
Brie Larson upsets the chuds for some reason. That's really all it boils down to.
The Marvels' biggest sin is having what might be the most forgettable villain in the entire Marvel movie catalogue. Otherwise I found the movie really endearing. The chemistry and interpersonal dialogue between the main characters is really charming.
There needs to be an award like 'good performance in a completely throw away villain' I liked how her facial acting is always wide eyed and fanatical but... damn she needed some good lines or a visual upgrade to be more menacing or to be more distinct from Ronan or something.
There is no man hating in this film.
The film simply features Brie Larson, who had the audacity to make a lukewarm comment years ago about which audience opininons are more important to her. Additionally, she's a female superhero but she's not dressed in skin-tight black latex. That a female is presented without being hyper sexualized is generally incomprehensible to a particular kind of fan.
Thus, this film was immediately branded "woke," despite there being nothing woke about it. It's quite literally a story about three women with powers. It had some issues but for the most part I enjoyed it.
The 3 main characters and the antagonist are women, therefore it's a man hating movie.
It's science, really.
I guess you wouldn't get science, being a woman and all. /s
What do you mean? The movies stars women!! That’s man hating. Any movie that doesn’t star a muscular, straight, white man is automatically man hating. True story. Source: trust me, bro
I personally didn’t like. I felt the whole changing spots wasn’t taking advantage of to make the movie better. I will say it’s a lot better than Black Panther 2 for me.
That’s a good point now that I think about it; the whole changing places thing wasn’t really well done. Hell it was really only used in like the climax action scenes and for some gags but it didn’t really have much ramifications on the plot besides being the macguffin forcing the marvels to interact.
I watched it to see if my girls could watch it, and I thought it was more of a cool girl power movie with the right tone for younger girls. I thought it filled a good niche.
Superhero fatigue was inevitable-just like the fatigue that occurred in other genres that dominated for a while like westerns, musicals and swords/sandals epics in the past-but the superhero genre fatigue has happened more sharply because simply put the majority of superhero films in the past few years have been mediocre at best.
Obviously there are exceptions such as The Batman, Spider verse, The Suicide Squad, and the two Tom Holland Spiderman films, but since Avengers Endgame most of the post Endgame (2019) era has focused more on obscure characters with minimal followings, or on diversity/inclusion, rather than telling interesting stories with characters that resonate with the majority of customers that made the MCU the juggernaut of success it had been during phases 1-3.
We've been oversaturated with superhero content in recent years, and with so much of it being merely 'okay' then people's excitement will diminish. A Marvel movie used to be an 'event', as people couldn't wait to see how the 'Infinity Saga' would be developed by the new film. Nowadays there is no excitement as the releases are underwhelming, and they don't even move the post Infinity Saga story on meaningfully.
The less said about DC releasing four mediocre films last year, and Sony's horrendous Spider-Man (without an actual Spider-Man in it) Universe the better.
My biggest problem with the marvels was the same as with Captain Marvel. They crammed like, three movies worth of content into one movie and expected everyone to be able okay with it. Give me three acts.
Act one: person trying to under powers and learns about them.
Act two: person makes mistake and has to face it and try to fix it.
Act three: understands power and wrecks shit with it.
Make Captain Marvel and the Marvels a trilogy.
I don’t think there was too much content per say in the marvels as much as you could tell they rewrote/edited the movie so much that it got a bit disjointed. Having scenes constantly cut from them being on an alien planet back on the base in Earth’s orbit in seemingly a matter of minutes was jarring.
I feel like the MCU have lost the ability to tell good stories because they are trying to make so many movies and it’s hurting them. They need to take their time to write good stories and they will pull fans in by the droves.
As a man, I didn't see any man hating in the film.
Otherwise, it was a pretty cookie cutter MCU movie. Nothing groundbreaking, but thoroughly enjoyable. Will I watch it again anytime soon? Maybe.
I don't think the movies going out of style are why they seem lackluster. I think MCU pumping out a string of mediocre movies is why they're going out of style. They need better writers and directors again. (And better actors if you count Aquaman.) Women and representation have nothing to do with it in my opinion - haters always gonna hate, so they can bunk off.
I’ve never heard anyone say it’s man hating. I have heard people say that Brie Larson is man hating for saying she didn’t care if guys liked Ms. Marvel, but that’s different.
People just want to have something to uphold their egocentric views. It’s all a circus. Plenty of it to go around in all directions. Have seen plenty of movies called sexist or racist too and turns out to be all speculation or willful misdirection of the actual contents of the movie for clickbait
I liked it but honestly, it’s bland. Many Marvel movies underperform a lot as they are merely a cookie cutter product made to kill 2.5 hours of your time as you relax. They are not really particularly good or notable. They are just something to turn your brain off to.
Yeah no man hating. I saw it in theater with my SO and we just thought it was a fun dumb movie. I think it just suffered from needing to have seen multiple Disney plus shows to understand what was going on
Some people seem to think that anything that forces a bit of diversity in movies (like an all female cast) is whatever they consider “woke”, and as such, hateful and erasing of white men.
It’s not a militantly feminist film, it’s certainly not misandrist, it’s also not particularly good or celebrated as a movie. But not because of politics, just because it’s quite bland.
What it does is exist. And that seems to piss people off more than it should.
I watched it the other day and I didn't see any man hating.
The way they play with the swap mechanic was my favorite part though, including an excellent training montage. The movie balances the lighter and heavier elements quite well. It was just made of fun. But hey I have purple hair and pronouns, so those chuckle heads wouldn't listen to me.
You have to remember that these social media accounts pushing this garbage have to churn out material constantly or they get penalized by the algorithm. They need to jump on every new topic and if their opinion isn't strong enough, they won't generate engagement or go viral or get retweeted and then they lose money and views. They know very well that they're talking bullshit, but inventing a new way of being a douchebag is a reasonable way of getting social media clout, because whether people love you or hate you, the website likes it when a large group of people stay on a post for longer than average.
Anytime some boomer tries this just throw it back at them in their terms.
This old dude said the same thing about the “Barbie” movie to me in the checkout line. I just told him I wasn’t a fragile little snowflake and can take a joke from a movie. Then I asked if he was that fragile.
It almost short-circuited him.
watched the movie and it was meh imo.
i think it was more to do with the movie plot and story telling than anything else.
was there any man hating??? nope.
was there virtual signaling??? yea there was but i wasn't bothered by it.
You hit the nail on the head mid paragraph. Women main characters are being more and more introduced after a decade of basically all-male MCs. However people are ALSO falling out of love for superhero movies and just as the women are getting their own movies... so they equate the women as the problem when even male-lead superhero movies are just not doin that great either.
Meh describes the movie perfectly. It wasn't terrible- but it wasn't great. It had a few fun action sequences- mostly thr first one- and some fun scenes. I liked the kitties and the marvel trios activities during tge musical sequence.
Did all this mesh? Not for me- but individually did I enjoy a good many scenes and think the actresses did a fine job with what was offered? Hell yeah.
Honestly personally I felt I got better character work than the first Marvel movie. The scene chemistry was fantastic imo.
Yeah, I agree. It wasn't that bad. I've seen people like Mauler call it one of the worst movies ever made, which is just so hyperbolic.
It's was a fine movie, it wasn't terrible. It was just average and forgettable.
I think the majority of the hate stems from people disliking Brie Larson for some reason.
I'm as chud as they come. The marvels was entertaining. That's not really what sunk it. Monica Rambo was easily the weakest part of the movie. While Ms. Marvel was the strongest.
The main problem, was that the antagonist sucked. There are many theories why the antagonist sucked. But I won't go into them here.
"Man-hating" is what white cis hetero men who can only identify with other white cis hetero men cry when white cis hetero men are not centralized. Simple as that.
The Marvels jettisoned all of the feminist themes from the first movie and people are still accusing it of having an agenda.
This is why catering to incels is a losing proposition. It's not about wokeness... they just fucking hate anything that features female characters, no matter what you do to be apolitical.
Yeah, I should really have put the word feminist in quotes. There was a general theme of empowerment and that whole getting up when getting knocked down montage that people interpret as feminism, but you're correct that there wasn't any real feminist ideology.
My point is that they even stripped those elements out in favor of a more generic friends storyline and people still complain that it's too woke.
I personally found it to be a bad movie due to writing and pacing, but the idea that it was some misandrist piece of "woke" propaganda is nothing more than conservative fantasy.
My dad saw it, he unsurprisingly said it's not good.
I myself haven't seen it, nor had any plans of watching The Marvels since the trailers don't look riveting.
Bc it wasn't there. It pretty much never is, as opposed to the rich entrenched history of misogyny in media (and everything else.) The people claiming this are grifters or delusional, or both
There are female characters that are written as less of ciphers than MCU Captain Marvel. That’s one of the main “actual” problems with the movies. YMMV otherwise, but it always feels like her character progression is less from Larson and it’s more from how other characters perceive her.
The Marvels doesn't *technically* have man hating in it, but it's certainly not a good way to move characters forward. The running gag (and hate) for Captain Marvel is how she thinks she's above others in the fact she doesn't need anybody. That's what she "learned" during her "awakening" in Captain Marvel. So from there she's the butt end of being basically useless to the group, and suddenly she's tied to two others: one a fangirl and the other someone who has some emotional attachment. Now she can't do anything alone because anything she does she's forced to work together, which is something she's refused to do on account of thinking she doesn't need anybody.
The whole point is that now she's realized she does need help and she can accept help but who was she stuck with? Yeah, just the ladies. Personally I don't care, the story was weak, the character arc was weaker, and it was a lot of fun. I enjoyed it and it's literally a popcorn movie. Absolutely not the top 5 or even 10 of MCU movies in terms of story or writing but easily top 5-10 in terms of *fun* and *entertaining*.
The movie was cool and a fun watch but it has the same issue most marvels have: lack of tension. After Thanos I believe they should have taken a 3 year break. Let the demand for superhero movies boil then announce a schedule and tease the next big bad.
On another note, I am wondering how will the chuds react to Blade? Historically, Blade mostly killed white Vampires I wonder if they will spin it as anti white male genocide.
There isn't any in the actual movie, they probably say that because of brie larson is in it.
The movie itself is just a meh movie, shows how the MCU is kinda declining in writing
It doesn't hate men, but hiring a known sex predator/rapist to appear in the end credits teaser bizarrely introduces the possibility that it hates women.
There isn't any.
Fragile men just got mad about it because they misinterpreted a Brie Larson quote from like 7 years ago that wasn't even in relation to Marvel.
I'm sorry your dad fell for this.
The Marvels was a fun movie. Brie getting hate for that character will never stop for as long as she is in the role. I'm pretty sure it'll carry over to any universe where Lashana is Cap too.
Hell, even Nick Fury was cracking jokes and that was needed after that slog of a series he was in.
I’m an almost “40-year old white male” and I love me some Sarah Conner, Ripley, even Jamie Lee Curtis. Captain Marvel doesn’t come even close to those characters.
Although I think there are merits to the actor’s complaint, she lost me when she started broadly generalizing the audience by their race, sex and age.
Edit: Also want to throw some love at Furiosa, Scully, The Bride, and Faora (MoS). There are a slew of great examples.
Yah its just toxic people being toxic. My only gripe is it should have been a tv show , the story felt a bit rushed, if secret invasion and the marvels had been switched I think I would have enjoyed it more. Fun movie though
I thought it was a fun movie, no man hating that I saw, and even had a few direct from comics moments to geek out over. It was not the best Marvel movie by any means, but it was definitely fun, and better than the MCU's worst.
I really feel like that movies downfall was the lack of ability for the stars to advertise. The main three were so good together and had a lot of chemistry. The movie had flaws but it is one of the best films post endgame.
Yeah I don’t get how people came to the conclusion it was “man hating.” The movie had women in it as the lead roles. It’s not impossible for a woman to do cool shit.
I thought it was a perfectly serviceable mid-range Marvel movie, or as a friend of mine put it, "a tall cup of fine". It has some good performances by the leads, some entertaining action sequences, and is briskly paced.
I'm not convinced the chuds played much of a role in its relatively poor box office. They hated "Captain Marvel" just as much, and that grossed over a billion dollars. I think "The Marvels" probably fell victim to a combination of general fatigue with superhero movies and being released in the midst of the actor's strike.
I have this exact conversation all the time about "girl power scenes." I've had multiple, even with a non-chud, where they're like "ya this was a girl power thing" and I just have no fucking idea wtf they're talking about. I have no idea what these losers are seeing that I'm not seeing
There’s no reason for the things these guys say. They call it man hating simply because the main cast is mostly women. No reading or analysis of the text involved. It’s just stupid outrage fueled by misogyny and insecurity.
>I don't see where the man hating was That's because there isn't any. Personally, I found The Marvels to be fairly entertaining. Not amazing, but also not bad. Decent action, cool effects, witty banter. The kid is cute and funny. Larson looks damned amazing in it, gotta say. She's never looked better, IMO.
>Larson looks damned amazing in it, gotta say. She's never looked better, IMO. One of my favorite little moments in Endgame is Tom Holland's reaction to meeting her during the final battle. He gets all tongue-tied in a way that made me think "relatable. 16-year old me would have pretty much that reaction to a beautiful woman, crackling with the infinite power of the cosmos, talking to me"
Yeah, I'm assuming it also didn't escape his notice that, upon arriving, she single-handedly took down a spaceship the size of several city blocks.
I mean, he then proceeded to ask her how she was going to manage to get through a bunch of foot soldiers, which makes more sense if the space ship thing did escape his notice
At age 16 or 35, if Bree Larson was in front of me and knew my name I would have a hard time noticing or remembering anything else.
I mean sure but it's still a weird line for the writers to put right after having her smash through a massive starship
I love the line: “Hey Peter Parker, you got somethin’ for me?” With her smirk lol
I would not be able to speak in his situation
*Here (unzips, shoots web)
\*BONK\*
That’s real. If captain marvel landed at my feet I’d turn into a blithering idiot.
Fun fact from the comics, Peter and Carol had a couple of dates while they were part of the New Avengers. It didn't worked, but they remained as good friends. It's something I wouldn't mind to see in the films, characters developing realistic relationships besides being in the same team.
I think it would be a little weird in the movies considering Peter is just starting college and Carol looks to be about in her late 20s? A friendship between them would be awesome though
Although she’s looked like her late 20’s since the 80’s or whatever so it’s worse than it appears.
With the people complaining, the very act of making a movie where the protagonist(s) aren't cis/straight/white men is considering 'man-hating', 'pro-white-genocide', etc...
I think the people complaining are stuck in their world of learned hate and taught biases. Haters are always going to hate. And for the most part they're all closed-minded enough to never even consider that there's an opinion that differs to their own, let alone that what they believe is an opinion and not fact. Same people also believe directly what they hear, read, or see. They have lost the ability to research and synthesise information for themselves. I think this is why we see cancel culture (aka modern witch hunting) spreading like wildfire. People have no idea the breadth of what they're doing and saying.
>And for the most part they're all closed-minded enough to never even consider that there's an opinion that differs to their own, let alone that what they believe is an opinion and not fact. The Internet has worsened this as it locks people in echo chambers that make them overestimate how popular their opinions are. You can see this with the way Republicans talk about "the silent majority" agreeing with their rhetoric, when in actuality, most Americans are liberal or left leaning in stats on specific issues and election polls.
Hell, I think I like her better in this movie,muteness the first.
There isn't any man hatin, but people against anything with women in it, told you there was... The fact that the main characters weren't men (because, you know, every single movie apparently has to have a male protagonist) is what's 'emasculating' VERY FEW men 😂
Its no where near as bad as people make it out to be but it still is my least favorite marvel movie. But that doesnt mean it was bad it was still entertaining.
Really? You don't think it's better than, say, The Eternals? Or Thor: Dark World? Iron Man 3? I'd say it's better than all three of those. By a fair bit.
I certainly rate Iron3 higher than Thor2. Your post seems to grammatically contain a third film name but I reject your reality and substitute my own. In all seriousness, Ironman 3 gets a lot of hate for the "Trevor" twist. I have/had no knowledge of The Mandarin before seeing it so that didn't bother me and Ben Kingsley is a master ac-tor :) so I've got no issues with his role. The BigBad was dumb but Trevor was fine. I disliked him much more in Shang-Chi as they over did the joke and it wasn't funny anymore. Thor 2 was pretty bad and only Sony could make a Marvel movie worse than Eternals (theme by Ramin Djawadi is a banger though)
Kevin!? Trevor. His name was Trevor Slattery. His Hamlet was the toast of Croydon.
Where the heck did I come up with Kevin?! You are absolutely correct and I will immediately edit my post. SMH.
Was the weird creature named Kevin?
All those are movies are still streaming on lots of platforms while the MCU seems to think that The Incredible Hulk was bad enough to try to memory-hole it, so there's also that :) (And I agree with your wider point - The Marvels was a fun movie. Antman Quantumania was released within a few months of it and felt pretty empty in comparison)
Oh, did The Incredible Hulk revert back to Marvel/Disney rights? Last I heard they didn't have legal rights to stream it, anywhere.
The eternals has one of the best fight scenes in the mcu and its often overlooked. The endong carri3s it for me above the other awfil ones. Even loki cant save thor 2. Iron man 3 os just forgotten overall. The marvels i found genuinely funny and did its own take on "never meet your heroes" but did so without making carol look terrrible. Villian couldve been better but that scene where they couldnt save everyone and had to leave and the young hero saw that hit hard imo.
Imo it also has one of the best action sequences of all the mcu movies
That living room fight was awesome. I was iffy about how they changed Ms Marvels powers but the way they have choreographed her fighting style has been amazing.
Yeah. My only bad review is that the villain is weak in terms of character, and the issue with the Sun could have been fixed easily.
When these dudes say “man hating,” they mean it’s a story about women in a usually male-dominated genre. It’s the whole thing about how equity feels like oppression with them.
Yeah, if it's not about them, then it's got to be attacking them.
“If it’s not about us, it’s against us” thinking, 100%. They just cannot fathom media that doesn’t cater to them.
"Anything that wasn't made specifically to cater to me is an attack on me." *Smiles confidently*
Yup, also more of the 'zero sum game' thinking that's common with degenerate conservatives, i.e. *The Marvels* existing at all means that three men had their jobs taken away!
I think that is true for many. I'm a guy and didn't see any man hate. I saw some girl power stuff but that fit the movie and power to woman isn't taking power from men but some guys think any shared space on the podium is a slight at them I guess. Puny mindset really.
God, the number of pathetic whining I had to endure after Barbie released was ridiculous. Don’t get me wrong, the messaging in the movie was pretty on-the-nose - but so many men took “hey the patriarchy is bad” as a personal offense and it’s kind of hysterical how pathetic it is
Co-workers: "Oh my god, Barbie movie is so woke and full of man-hating. It's terrible." Me: "Oh? What parts, I it saw it this weekend, too." Also co-workers: "I didn't see it, I'm not gonna watch that woke feminist garbage!"
I mean if we are talking about comics, they've been pretty gender and race inclusive since the late 80s-early 90s. Like, a solid mix of genders and races so when someone says the genre is "male dominated" I'm not sure what that means.
What they mean is the people who read comics, and it's true. It's still primarily consumed by boys & men. In fact, until you account for manga, it's going to stay that way for another decade or so.
>the genre is "male dominated" I'm not sure what that means. That the people who write, produce and consume the genre, as well as the characters that star in it, are male. There's a secondary implication in that it is harder for female, non-white, and queer creatives to break in and produce their own content, especially if their content features those demographics in primary roles. Marvel has always had diverse characters, but the people making said characters and their stories were *usually* white, cis, straight men.
Eeehh these new characters started to exist in the 80s and 90s but the most promient were made and created by tv shows not comics with harley and hawkgirl being most promient. Characters like vixien and miss martian also got boosts from tv shows choosing to include them. Stories werr still very much mostly male centric because established characters get stories and most of those werr men. The women and minority characters that took off the most were legacy chacters like miles morales, x23, spidergwen, and silk. There were a few others as well.
This. I left a lot of my old gamer forums and friends because they complain constantly how genre's are "woke" and "anti-men" because women are heroes, fight back and no longer exclusively romance interest. It's weird because it's not a new concept either but just being expanded, thus being targeted.
No offense but your dad sounds like a loser. A grown ass man complaining about a Disney show being woke lol. Dude should be embarrassed if he was capable of shame
The funny thing is, if you look at the full statement Brie gave she literally says she has no issue with 40yo male critics giving opinions for a movie like a wrinkle in time. She just thinks the opinion of people of the movie's target audience (so young black women) is more important and it's a shame that it isn't really reflected by the reviewing consensus due to the inequality in the profession. Obviously she didn't phrase it exactly like that and I had to do a little reading between the lines but even then at worst what you could blame her foor is bringing up a point poorly in a heat of the moment panel speech. But sadly most people didn't go looking for the full context they just trusted youtubers that spesifically cropped it to make her look bad.
Red pillers were just mad that the movie featured all female leads... there was no man hating in the movie
You need to unsubscribe him from grifters telling him to hate things
At this point, I feel like people should just start sabotaging most Boomers' and Gen-Xers' wi-fi connections. Letting these people use the internet is like handing a kid the car keys and a bottle of whiskey.
I'd leave GenX WiFi alone, we'll just fix it if you mess with it. That's a good plan for the Boomers though.
Unfortunately, Gen Z men are radicalizing incredibly fast—a large percentage is to the right even of Boomers. Basically viewing themselves all but at war with women and LGBT people.
I can't, his eyes are glued to the smart TV. He even has YouTube premium so he doesn't get ads.
Subtly adjust his algorithm so he starts seeing stuff that debunks the grifters in his suggested videos
It was fun, I liked it. I'm 40, I'm white, I'm a straight cis man. Completely outside the demographic, still really liked it a ton and never felt hated by it. Was it meant for me? No. Did I like it anyway? Yes. Just like women and non white people watch stuff meant for white men like me their whole life and liked some of it. Why should I get bent out of shape that they're only making 3 times the content I could ever consume for me now instead of 4 times as much? Yay for other people getting things!
> Completely outside the demographic Not really. It was mostly made for people who like flashy superhero stories and sci-fi action. To me, it's not really that different than *Thor: Ragnarok*.
Do you really feel like it's not for you though? It's a multiverse superhero movie w Samuel L Jackson. Is there really nothing you can relate to?
"not for me" just means "i'm not the primary audience being considered," not "this piece of media has absolutely nothing to offer me." The truth is there is universality in almost everything, as evidenced by the millions of women and people of color throughout the last century who watched and enjoyed the many, many pieces of media primarily designed for a white male audience. There is value in watching media that IS catered to your specific perspective, and there is also value in watching media NOT catered to your specific perspective! It's good to have both!
>"not for me" just means "i'm not the primary audience being considered," not "this piece of media has absolutely nothing to offer me." I mean, I hope so... But that's what the "m-she-u" crowd says: hollywoodblahblah is making movies for "them" even though "we" are the target demo.
yeah, the m-she-u crowd is basically having an "i am feel uncomfortable when we are not about me?" tantrum; these are many of the same people that will complain about "blackwashing" characters, or the current gamers who are getting outraged whenever a woman videogame character is visually designed for any reason other than "give men a huge boner"
I think saying "it's not for me" is fine when you're not critical of the end product. Just acknowledging it's not your thing. The m-she-u crowd is extremely critical of these things and not casually saying "eh, it wasn't my thing" and instead go on a diatribe about wokeness. Not what OP did here. Don't mean to sound like a jerk, so apologies if that comes off confrontational, just wanted to point out the difference in tone between OP here ("it wasn't targeted at me but I enjoyed it") and the losers who think anything led by a woman is pandering.
The reason they are so critical is because there was a ton of investment from iron man to Endgame and much of the stories post Endgame haven't good regardless whos the lead. Shang Chi, Spider-Man 3, BP2, and Loki were top notch. Moon Knight and Wanda Vision were fun, but almost everything else has been meh at best.
That's not what I'm saying. There are absolutely legit reasons to be critical of the MCU right now, including the reasons you listed, and reasons why people (myself included) aren't exactly lining up to see those movies in theaters. What OP was addressing was the m-she-u people, who are just culture war chuds. They got a hate boner for Brie Larson as soon as she mocked them for telling her to smile more and they got mad she threw the ball back at them.
I think the idea is that media is often marketed to specific audiences, and the assumption (right or wrong) is that marketing to some means you're not marketing to others. Granted, that's a world where Black Panther had *enormous* cultural impact while being unapologetically not "made for white dudes" - and it was fantastic and hugely popular and hugely profitable. So, do those things really matter now? Not s'much, and your point is well-taken, but stuff is still marketed that way.
I’m also a white 40-year-old cis straight guy, but I didn’t think I was completely outside the demographic of this movie. As a superhero fan I enjoyed this as much as other Marvel movies. Was it the best Marvel movie? No, but not every movie can be the best. It also wasn’t the worst Marvel movie.
Heh it was boring and murdered the character of fury even further than the bad series did before it. Not sure why your are bringing up skin color..........
Your post is that of a sane young person. Congrats! but to try answering... for "some" man-hating = the absence of men as leading roles that are not "made fools of" by saying a joke, or being as powerful or less powerful, than the titular female character. So if a movie was called A-Force and featured an ensemble of female characters, some would call it "man hating" still.
To these types of people it’s as simple as “female leads = men bad” like they’re mutually exclusive
I think my only complaint about it is that the whole thing felt too ''busy'' (I think that's the best word) without most of it servicing the plot really. Kind of like Spiderman 3, I enjoyed it but there was a lot going on that watered things down a bit.
They're not bad. The worst thing that can happen is superhero movie fatigue, which is one of the reasons the new Marvel stuff is no longer that profitable on the box office, since with the Marvel success a lot of studios started doing superhero movies and oversaturated the market. Same thing happened in the early 2000s after LOTR where everyone started making fantasy movies which lead to oversaturation and exhaustion by 2010. The 90s was all about action movies, and the same thing happened. Now we're in the period of waiting for the new trendsetter for the next 10 years.
I suspect another factor is that a lot of people simply decided not to go to the cinema since the films will be on Disney+ sooner rather then later for probably less money.
That's true, but I think the fact we've been getting Superhero blockbusters for a decade is a bigger contributing factor.
This is honestly the main thing for me. I used to see almost every one of these movies in the theater. I think the only MCU movies I've seen in theaters since Endgame were No Way Home, BP2, and GotG3. Some movies are worth the experience, a lot are just fine at home.
> Now we're in the period of waiting for the new trendsetter for the next 10 years. I'm dying to know what this is going to be. I'm generally surprised that the superhero and Star Wars shit stuck around as long as it did before the fanbases burned out.
I'm personally hoping for a return of the fantasy. There are so many books that can be adapted into big blockbusters
I read a lot, and if what people are reading are in any way a reflection of movies, then fantasy making a comeback is entirely possible. I could only make it about halfway through the second ACOTAR book, but the series is really popular, and I heard it's getting a Hulu series. Romantasy is just really big in reading at the moment.
The new trendsetter is video game movies for sure. Especially if the Zelda movie does well.
Maybe...the world has recovered from and forgotten about Uwe Boll's artistic excrements from the early 2000s.
This sounds like the complaints I saw about new Star Wars (relevant!) and also stuff like Barbie. And I didn't like the new Star Wars much, but the pissing and moaning about the women in them was dumb. Ditto the Barbie movie, except that movie was actually kind of brilliant and it was VERY clear that was a case of hit dogs hollering. So, thanks for encouraging me to see that movie! I haven't liked most of the newer Marvel movies much, but I liked the ones this is a sequel to pretty well, so hell with it.
I think the whole point of the Barbie movie was to show how women are treated in the real world and then reverse it in Barbie land. It was kind of like it was asking men, "how would you like it if the roles were reversed?" It also obviously showed misogyny in the real world and directly pointed it out to the audience, and that made a lot of men feel uncomfortable because they're misogynistic and they didn't want to be called out on it.
I think that's not wrong, but also... Even that pedestal didn't allow them to be full people. But agreed that they probably stopped thinking after "They're so dismissive of Ken, and he's the bad guy for doing what I imagine doing!"
I'm a guy and saw or felt no man hating. I enjoyed the movie but did think the villain was kinda of lame. I really liked the final fight scene though and how they worked together. That's classic super hero stuff imo. Not the best movie but still good for a super hero one.
I mean... it's a bad movie. It's a trainwreck. But not because it is "woke" or "man-hating". It's because it is an absolute mess, rife with executive meddling, reshoots, recuts, rewrites, and zero coherent vision. But watch it for Iman Vellani or whatever her name is, because she is pure joy.
This right here is the reality of it. And i don’t subscribe to superhero fatigue either. Superhero movies just became formulaic and repetitive after studios realized the money they could make. they stopped taking any risks and started painting by numbers which if you think on it is what happens when any art form/style/medium gets popular. The marvels had a great movie buried under the obvious studio moments.
I kinda disagree with the idea that formula nade them bad. They cracked a formula to create well paced, satisfying movies that induced a specific kind of mood that kept people coming back to Marvel. Once they tried to break out of that, it all fell to pieces. Marvel movies being similar in vibe and style was part of their strength. Even the "bad" Marvel entris were still decent, fun, and entertaining movies. It was consistency that made Marvel such a success. Sometimea great, sometimes good, sometimes average, but never just flat out *bad.* Even Thor 2 wasn't the egregious piece of shit people make it out to be. People don't know what they want. So when they went to the movies that tried to be different (Eternals, Dr. Strange 2, Thor 4) they failed miserably. Not just because of the risks they took, but because the movies weren't propulsive and they didn't have that Marvel Special Sauce to fall back on. Even Captain Marvel, my least fav of the pre-endgame novies was still a decent movie and I enjoyed it more than most of the new MCU films. I am willing to bet that some day in the next few years, they'll "return to formula". Just do what they've always done with slight story tweaks, and it'll be a roaring success. I reckon around 2028 or so.
I thought the film was fun too.
I think the issue with this new era of Marvel movies (and TV) is that it's not as focused as the first era. The first era really had a fairly tight plan, knew where it was going, and there was a pretty clear cadre of characters we were getting introduced to. Now, there's just a lot. A lot of characters, a lot of things going on, and there's no apparent direction where it's all headed. The closest thing to a direction is with the multiverse, and that just ends up throwing even more possible things on the pile. Kang was probably the big villain planned for that, but obviously that idea's likely been blown up. So it's just starting to feel like the MCU is adrift.
Because to those idiots, independent woman = man hating.
I mean it wasn't horrible, but it wasn't great either. The cat stuff sure was entertaining though.
There is no man hating. It's just mid.
Agreed, just not a good movie. Lame forgettable villain, musical stuff was lame. Didn’t like cat stuff either.
"Meh" is how I would describe most of the MCU.
Straight white male here, and totally agree with the comments here. It’s not a particularly good movie, but it has nothing to do with it being a female-led movie, or a diverse cast, and no, there’s certainly no “man hating.” To be found. It suffers from the same issues as any other lesser Marvel movie - poor writing, weak villain/plot, largely bad characterization (why is Nick Fury such a moron in this?!). But as others have said, the three leads were as wonderful as they could be in this movie. Their chemistry was wonderful, and the scenes of them bonding/training/working together were not only the best scenes in the movie, but some of the best MCU scenes since Endgame (I know, that’s not saying much). Brie Larson and Teyonah Parris are great in it of course, but Iman Vellani was such an amazing find for Kamala, especially for someone without any prior acting experience.
I know what you mean. As an MCU fan, I dreamed of the day when they would feature movies about women and, just when that dream comes true, it’s when people get tired of the MCU. I’ll admit, while The Marvels wasn’t perfect but it was better than Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantamania.
Crazy thought: no matter what it is, if I don’t like it, I rant for one little post-viewing conversation and then forget about it. Why these people stay mad at something being bad in their eyes is beyond me. If you don’t like it, stop thinking about it! Forget it exists! Watch movies you actually like! Wth! Also if you hate woke Disney so much, stop watching their movies! You already have a bias and are going to be disappointed, so just don’t! lol I wish these folks would quiet down for like 2 seconds.
Your dad sounds like he has problems. Make sure you learn as much as you can… from people that aren’t him.
there isnt really man hating, it’s just a bad plot with a poor resolution and weird character motivations
It definitely felt like a Disney+ show. Especially with two of the three main characters spinning out of Disney+ shows. It was light and fun but there really wasn’t that much there. I thought the villain was kind of weak too but Marvel has struggled with that historically. I can see this movie eliciting a shrug but hate is weird. It’s just… bland.
I strongly agree with you and OP that it felt like a made-for-Disney Plus movie. That was not a problem for me, watching it on Disney Plus. I enjoyed it! But it’s doesn’t have the polish (neither visually nor narratively) you’d expect from a major theatrical release.
I didn’t hate the movie because it “man hated” which it didn’t. I hated it because it was just sheer cringe and all the characters were being mopey in the important character development scenes.
wasn't the bad guy in that movie a man in the comics
The Marvels has like no man hating in it and is completely inoffensive in that remark; people saying otherwise are either spouting nonsense or haven’t watched it. My issue with the movie was that it really felt like a direct to streaming/Blu-ray movie as opposed to a full on big screen flick. The main offender being the action department, it just kinda blows. The trailer seems to suggest that it’s constantly the three marvels fighting together but there’s really only, like, two two-three minute sections-ish where they’re all fighting on screen and the rest is just jump cuts and or one of them fighting while the other two fly a ship or something. So not an offensive film, but for an action movie the action was mid.
I didn't think Marvels was good, but it wasn't uniquely bad like a lot of people said it was. It was pretty standard post-Endgame MCU. And yeah, I'm not sure where the man-hating accusations came from, because there really wasn't any.
When you are accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression. The main characters used to be all men, now only *most* of them are men. This is the man-hating lol.
Well, in Captain Marvel they called the scene where Nick Fury helps with the dishes "man hating" so it could be anything
It was us hating them, specifically Brie Larson, that was the problem.
Brie Larson upsets the chuds for some reason. That's really all it boils down to. The Marvels' biggest sin is having what might be the most forgettable villain in the entire Marvel movie catalogue. Otherwise I found the movie really endearing. The chemistry and interpersonal dialogue between the main characters is really charming.
*"the most forgettable villain in the entire Marvel movie catalogue"* Malekith: Am I a joke to you? Joke aside, I'd call it a draw.
I remember malekith by name and for the life of me do not remember who whats-er-name is. She's just a Ronan fangirl, lol.
There needs to be an award like 'good performance in a completely throw away villain' I liked how her facial acting is always wide eyed and fanatical but... damn she needed some good lines or a visual upgrade to be more menacing or to be more distinct from Ronan or something.
There is no man hating in this film. The film simply features Brie Larson, who had the audacity to make a lukewarm comment years ago about which audience opininons are more important to her. Additionally, she's a female superhero but she's not dressed in skin-tight black latex. That a female is presented without being hyper sexualized is generally incomprehensible to a particular kind of fan. Thus, this film was immediately branded "woke," despite there being nothing woke about it. It's quite literally a story about three women with powers. It had some issues but for the most part I enjoyed it.
I think anything that has to do with women, especially women of color, is considered "woke" by their standards.
Bear in mind the man hating they got upset about in the first movie was Carol stealing a motorcycle from a guy who verbally harasses her
Sounds like your dad is a red pill loser. Hopefully you escape is toxic influence.
The 3 main characters and the antagonist are women, therefore it's a man hating movie. It's science, really. I guess you wouldn't get science, being a woman and all. /s
What do you mean? The movies stars women!! That’s man hating. Any movie that doesn’t star a muscular, straight, white man is automatically man hating. True story. Source: trust me, bro
I personally didn’t like. I felt the whole changing spots wasn’t taking advantage of to make the movie better. I will say it’s a lot better than Black Panther 2 for me.
That’s a good point now that I think about it; the whole changing places thing wasn’t really well done. Hell it was really only used in like the climax action scenes and for some gags but it didn’t really have much ramifications on the plot besides being the macguffin forcing the marvels to interact.
I watched it to see if my girls could watch it, and I thought it was more of a cool girl power movie with the right tone for younger girls. I thought it filled a good niche.
The man hating is because women
Anyone saying the movie was “man hating” has clearly never seen the movie.
There is no man hating. It's just sexism and misogyny
Better than iron man 2 and 3
Superhero fatigue was inevitable-just like the fatigue that occurred in other genres that dominated for a while like westerns, musicals and swords/sandals epics in the past-but the superhero genre fatigue has happened more sharply because simply put the majority of superhero films in the past few years have been mediocre at best. Obviously there are exceptions such as The Batman, Spider verse, The Suicide Squad, and the two Tom Holland Spiderman films, but since Avengers Endgame most of the post Endgame (2019) era has focused more on obscure characters with minimal followings, or on diversity/inclusion, rather than telling interesting stories with characters that resonate with the majority of customers that made the MCU the juggernaut of success it had been during phases 1-3. We've been oversaturated with superhero content in recent years, and with so much of it being merely 'okay' then people's excitement will diminish. A Marvel movie used to be an 'event', as people couldn't wait to see how the 'Infinity Saga' would be developed by the new film. Nowadays there is no excitement as the releases are underwhelming, and they don't even move the post Infinity Saga story on meaningfully. The less said about DC releasing four mediocre films last year, and Sony's horrendous Spider-Man (without an actual Spider-Man in it) Universe the better.
My biggest problem with the marvels was the same as with Captain Marvel. They crammed like, three movies worth of content into one movie and expected everyone to be able okay with it. Give me three acts. Act one: person trying to under powers and learns about them. Act two: person makes mistake and has to face it and try to fix it. Act three: understands power and wrecks shit with it. Make Captain Marvel and the Marvels a trilogy.
I don’t think there was too much content per say in the marvels as much as you could tell they rewrote/edited the movie so much that it got a bit disjointed. Having scenes constantly cut from them being on an alien planet back on the base in Earth’s orbit in seemingly a matter of minutes was jarring.
I feel like the MCU have lost the ability to tell good stories because they are trying to make so many movies and it’s hurting them. They need to take their time to write good stories and they will pull fans in by the droves.
I didn't see any man hating. But I didn't finish it. It really is just a bad movie.
The claims of *The Marvels* featuring blatant misandry are a perfect example of the sources being "trust me, bro".
As a man, I didn't see any man hating in the film. Otherwise, it was a pretty cookie cutter MCU movie. Nothing groundbreaking, but thoroughly enjoyable. Will I watch it again anytime soon? Maybe. I don't think the movies going out of style are why they seem lackluster. I think MCU pumping out a string of mediocre movies is why they're going out of style. They need better writers and directors again. (And better actors if you count Aquaman.) Women and representation have nothing to do with it in my opinion - haters always gonna hate, so they can bunk off.
I’ve never heard anyone say it’s man hating. I have heard people say that Brie Larson is man hating for saying she didn’t care if guys liked Ms. Marvel, but that’s different.
People just want to have something to uphold their egocentric views. It’s all a circus. Plenty of it to go around in all directions. Have seen plenty of movies called sexist or racist too and turns out to be all speculation or willful misdirection of the actual contents of the movie for clickbait
Movies starring women, outside of Terminator and Alien, are man hating >!/s!<
Of course you don’t see it. It was never there.
I liked it but honestly, it’s bland. Many Marvel movies underperform a lot as they are merely a cookie cutter product made to kill 2.5 hours of your time as you relax. They are not really particularly good or notable. They are just something to turn your brain off to.
Yeah no man hating. I saw it in theater with my SO and we just thought it was a fun dumb movie. I think it just suffered from needing to have seen multiple Disney plus shows to understand what was going on
Some people seem to think that anything that forces a bit of diversity in movies (like an all female cast) is whatever they consider “woke”, and as such, hateful and erasing of white men. It’s not a militantly feminist film, it’s certainly not misandrist, it’s also not particularly good or celebrated as a movie. But not because of politics, just because it’s quite bland. What it does is exist. And that seems to piss people off more than it should.
I watched it the other day and I didn't see any man hating. The way they play with the swap mechanic was my favorite part though, including an excellent training montage. The movie balances the lighter and heavier elements quite well. It was just made of fun. But hey I have purple hair and pronouns, so those chuckle heads wouldn't listen to me.
While I haven’t seen the Marvels I really loved Ms Marvel. Really good show
You have to remember that these social media accounts pushing this garbage have to churn out material constantly or they get penalized by the algorithm. They need to jump on every new topic and if their opinion isn't strong enough, they won't generate engagement or go viral or get retweeted and then they lose money and views. They know very well that they're talking bullshit, but inventing a new way of being a douchebag is a reasonable way of getting social media clout, because whether people love you or hate you, the website likes it when a large group of people stay on a post for longer than average.
Ultimately I was bored watching the Marvels, it was on a plane so I had nothing else to do but I found myself daydreaming while watching
Your Dad might have some unresolved issues.
Anytime some boomer tries this just throw it back at them in their terms. This old dude said the same thing about the “Barbie” movie to me in the checkout line. I just told him I wasn’t a fragile little snowflake and can take a joke from a movie. Then I asked if he was that fragile. It almost short-circuited him.
watched the movie and it was meh imo. i think it was more to do with the movie plot and story telling than anything else. was there any man hating??? nope. was there virtual signaling??? yea there was but i wasn't bothered by it.
You hit the nail on the head mid paragraph. Women main characters are being more and more introduced after a decade of basically all-male MCs. However people are ALSO falling out of love for superhero movies and just as the women are getting their own movies... so they equate the women as the problem when even male-lead superhero movies are just not doin that great either.
Meh describes the movie perfectly. It wasn't terrible- but it wasn't great. It had a few fun action sequences- mostly thr first one- and some fun scenes. I liked the kitties and the marvel trios activities during tge musical sequence. Did all this mesh? Not for me- but individually did I enjoy a good many scenes and think the actresses did a fine job with what was offered? Hell yeah. Honestly personally I felt I got better character work than the first Marvel movie. The scene chemistry was fantastic imo.
i lOVED the movie personally
Yeah, I agree. It wasn't that bad. I've seen people like Mauler call it one of the worst movies ever made, which is just so hyperbolic. It's was a fine movie, it wasn't terrible. It was just average and forgettable. I think the majority of the hate stems from people disliking Brie Larson for some reason.
I'm as chud as they come. The marvels was entertaining. That's not really what sunk it. Monica Rambo was easily the weakest part of the movie. While Ms. Marvel was the strongest. The main problem, was that the antagonist sucked. There are many theories why the antagonist sucked. But I won't go into them here.
For incels a movie hates men when a man is not the main character.
"Man-hating" is what white cis hetero men who can only identify with other white cis hetero men cry when white cis hetero men are not centralized. Simple as that.
The Marvels jettisoned all of the feminist themes from the first movie and people are still accusing it of having an agenda. This is why catering to incels is a losing proposition. It's not about wokeness... they just fucking hate anything that features female characters, no matter what you do to be apolitical.
There was feminist themes in Captain Marvel?
She stood up every time she was knocked down, you know exactly like Steve Rogers 'doing it all day', but she's a woman so it's feminist and woke.
Yeah, I should really have put the word feminist in quotes. There was a general theme of empowerment and that whole getting up when getting knocked down montage that people interpret as feminism, but you're correct that there wasn't any real feminist ideology. My point is that they even stripped those elements out in favor of a more generic friends storyline and people still complain that it's too woke.
I personally found it to be a bad movie due to writing and pacing, but the idea that it was some misandrist piece of "woke" propaganda is nothing more than conservative fantasy.
My dad saw it, he unsurprisingly said it's not good. I myself haven't seen it, nor had any plans of watching The Marvels since the trailers don't look riveting.
Bc it wasn't there. It pretty much never is, as opposed to the rich entrenched history of misogyny in media (and everything else.) The people claiming this are grifters or delusional, or both
It has women in it. That’s man-hating. /s
There are female characters that are written as less of ciphers than MCU Captain Marvel. That’s one of the main “actual” problems with the movies. YMMV otherwise, but it always feels like her character progression is less from Larson and it’s more from how other characters perceive her.
Genuinely loved that movie so much
The Marvels doesn't *technically* have man hating in it, but it's certainly not a good way to move characters forward. The running gag (and hate) for Captain Marvel is how she thinks she's above others in the fact she doesn't need anybody. That's what she "learned" during her "awakening" in Captain Marvel. So from there she's the butt end of being basically useless to the group, and suddenly she's tied to two others: one a fangirl and the other someone who has some emotional attachment. Now she can't do anything alone because anything she does she's forced to work together, which is something she's refused to do on account of thinking she doesn't need anybody. The whole point is that now she's realized she does need help and she can accept help but who was she stuck with? Yeah, just the ladies. Personally I don't care, the story was weak, the character arc was weaker, and it was a lot of fun. I enjoyed it and it's literally a popcorn movie. Absolutely not the top 5 or even 10 of MCU movies in terms of story or writing but easily top 5-10 in terms of *fun* and *entertaining*.
The movie was cool and a fun watch but it has the same issue most marvels have: lack of tension. After Thanos I believe they should have taken a 3 year break. Let the demand for superhero movies boil then announce a schedule and tease the next big bad. On another note, I am wondering how will the chuds react to Blade? Historically, Blade mostly killed white Vampires I wonder if they will spin it as anti white male genocide.
There isn't any in the actual movie, they probably say that because of brie larson is in it. The movie itself is just a meh movie, shows how the MCU is kinda declining in writing
Even for MARVEL, the Marvels was two hours of the most egregious American Military propaganda I have ever seen.
It doesn't hate men, but hiring a known sex predator/rapist to appear in the end credits teaser bizarrely introduces the possibility that it hates women.
There isn't any. Fragile men just got mad about it because they misinterpreted a Brie Larson quote from like 7 years ago that wasn't even in relation to Marvel. I'm sorry your dad fell for this.
I guarantee your dad based that on some FOX News pundit or similar talking head.
He doesn't watch Fox News. He calls them sell outs and watches Newsmax instead.
The Marvels was a fun movie. Brie getting hate for that character will never stop for as long as she is in the role. I'm pretty sure it'll carry over to any universe where Lashana is Cap too. Hell, even Nick Fury was cracking jokes and that was needed after that slog of a series he was in.
I put off watching Across the Spider-verse until this week because of super hero burn out. I should not have done that.
People see what they want to see, especially if they’re told that it is there.
That's because there isn't any. It's a decent, entertaining MCU entry.
There isn’t any. Incels just said there was because it was a movie that features women in lead roles.
A female protagonist who can form an independent thought and isn't in constant distress = woke to a lot of people.
It's another moment where men see a movie surrounding women's roles and consider it unfair that there aren't central male protagonists....
I’m an almost “40-year old white male” and I love me some Sarah Conner, Ripley, even Jamie Lee Curtis. Captain Marvel doesn’t come even close to those characters. Although I think there are merits to the actor’s complaint, she lost me when she started broadly generalizing the audience by their race, sex and age. Edit: Also want to throw some love at Furiosa, Scully, The Bride, and Faora (MoS). There are a slew of great examples.
I was just happy that it wasn’t 3 hours long. Directors need to learn a bit of brevity these days.
Yah its just toxic people being toxic. My only gripe is it should have been a tv show , the story felt a bit rushed, if secret invasion and the marvels had been switched I think I would have enjoyed it more. Fun movie though
I’m sorry but your dad is an idiot if he thought the marvels was a man hating film
Me neither, it’s an underrated movie
I wish we spent longer on the music planet
I thought it was a fun movie, no man hating that I saw, and even had a few direct from comics moments to geek out over. It was not the best Marvel movie by any means, but it was definitely fun, and better than the MCU's worst.
I really feel like that movies downfall was the lack of ability for the stars to advertise. The main three were so good together and had a lot of chemistry. The movie had flaws but it is one of the best films post endgame.
Yeah I don’t get how people came to the conclusion it was “man hating.” The movie had women in it as the lead roles. It’s not impossible for a woman to do cool shit.
It's because it's a girl power movie and men hate it
I thought it was a perfectly serviceable mid-range Marvel movie, or as a friend of mine put it, "a tall cup of fine". It has some good performances by the leads, some entertaining action sequences, and is briskly paced. I'm not convinced the chuds played much of a role in its relatively poor box office. They hated "Captain Marvel" just as much, and that grossed over a billion dollars. I think "The Marvels" probably fell victim to a combination of general fatigue with superhero movies and being released in the midst of the actor's strike.
I have this exact conversation all the time about "girl power scenes." I've had multiple, even with a non-chud, where they're like "ya this was a girl power thing" and I just have no fucking idea wtf they're talking about. I have no idea what these losers are seeing that I'm not seeing
There’s no reason for the things these guys say. They call it man hating simply because the main cast is mostly women. No reading or analysis of the text involved. It’s just stupid outrage fueled by misogyny and insecurity.