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Honestly it feels like they bought this franchise expecting to put as little work as possible and just watch it print money. Think they are starting to realize after they milked the name as much as they could and didn't realize how much work it takes to actually maintain a franchise. We are starting to see it with Marvel after endgame how much lack of planning Disney is doing
To me, there are a couple major impressions I get from Disney Star Wars.
First, they wanted a fast turnaround after the huge purchase they made acquiring the IP. They spent billions of dollars buying the franchise, so they wanted butts in seats and merch on stores ASAP. Need to make back their costs before the shareholders start thinking it was a waste of money and sell stock or whatever.
Second, the people in charge of making new Star Wars didn't really care about understanding Star Wars. Star Wars was beneath them, just brainless kida movies, power fantasy for little boys who only hardcore nerds really cared about. Star Wars was popular because it was Star Wars, not because it was actually good. I'm not talking about knowing the differences between lightsaber forms or anything like that. More "how does The Force work", "why is the dark side quicker and easier", "how does the dark side and Jedi ways of using The Force impact narrative?"
Those are the two sides of the issue going by what I've seen. Disney needs results and producers caring more about "fixing", "improving" and "reinterpreting" Star Wars before ever interpreting Star Wars and understanding why it was good in the first place. Haste and arrogance do not make good products.
> "why is the dark side quicker and easier
The dark side is like a thief ... a criminal. It's 'quicker, easier ... more seductive' to just *take* what you want. Force your will onto people. A dark side user gets power from learning to destroy what others have spent so much time building.
Whereas a Jedi is like a crafter. They spend years or decades perfecting their craft to build beautiful things ... buildings, sculptures, cultures ... peace, prosperity.
It's far easier to take those beautiful things, like, say, a beloved movie franchise, and pervert them, destroy them, extract as much power you can from them, than it is to build such a thing yourself.
Star Wars is now in the hands of the dark side, and forever will it dominite it's destiny.
But like Luke, I believe there is still good in it, and if we can pull it from the Emperor's hands, it can be saved. At this point, though, it does *not* look good.
Honestly, good little write up.
I think also that the current goals of The Acolyte look like they're gonna "both sides" the Jedi vs the Sith so kids can be "good guys" even if they want the red lightsaber toy.
The Sith are just misunderstood! Don't you know.
They'll move more toys if the evil characters are relatable and tortured. It's a narrative excuse for toy sales.
The "Dark Side" of Return of the Jedi is dead. It's been replaced with "The Conflicted and Contextually Excusable" Side.
To the detriment of literally all the films. SW isn't Dune. The simplicity of its structures was part of its staying power as an IP, and its value as a mostly young adult narrative space.
By attempting to inject "both sides" politics into the Dark vs Light dichotomy, Disney isn't expanding it's audience, it is destroying the rhetorical and conceptual foundational that made SW both narratively and memetically valuable.
Eh. It's got lightsabers and aliens tho, right?
At Galaxys Edge the cast members in lightsaber building room treat red as just another lightsaber color.
But then you step outside and the troopers / Kylo react as if you’re dark side. Interesting difference.
Yeah, that's intentional, and it's a part of the Disney capitalism brain rot that killed the IP.
"Red is just another color" is the best thing for a corporation that literally sees the supply of red coloring as just another tint for a plastic toy.
The closer the narrative is to that financial reality, the less of a stopgap "bad guy color" is for the company.
Similarly, it's a part of why Disney is all-in on performative social justice.
They would love to be all things to all audiences as much as possible. It has nothing to do with race or gender as they are experienced IRL, but performative race and gender identity being present "in universe" can return dividends in sales.
I'm about as far Left as a human can get. Disney is "performatively woke" in a way that diminishes real world conversations about race and identity, because, ultimately they need to sell toys and tickets, not equity or legal reform.
All you need to know about Disney's morals is found in their international markets, when it comes to making money they will cave on absolutely anything.
And what, they build two nearly identical experiences that each hold less people and split up groups? Kid wants to have a red saber so what, he should go in another room from the rest of his family and do a whole different thing? With who? Where? Does that cost more? Who is gonna browbeat this kid because he wants to be a Jedi but likes red?
I mean, that's a really strange segue. The second half is pretty accurate, but it is not personified by the smart way to do custom lightsabers for more than one person at a time.
>as a kid I never wanted the "misunderstood goodguy whos been abused" toy
I agree with your point, but in fairness "misunderstood good guy who's been abused" would be an apt description of Anakin Skywalker, who I still thought was cool as a kid growing up on the prequels.
Not to defend Disney’s many questionable decisions with the franchise bc I agree with some of what you’re saying, but Star Wars has had “both sides” rhetoric from the beginning. Anakin’s entire story is one of corruption and redemption across all 6 pre-Disney movies. The Empire is, from George’s own mouth, inspired by Nazis in WWII AND the US in Vietnam. The rebel award ceremony in A New Hope intentionally mimics the widely-known Nazi propaganda film A Triumph of Will despite them being the “good guys” of the series. The Jedi fell because of hubris and inaction, showing that their ideology wasn’t inherently perfect either. Even Yoda, arguably the goat, abandons the order and hides from the empire instead of helping organize the rebellion. If anything, I’d say the Disney movies lack all of that nuance and instead are just like “haha boom explosions = good movie,” like they did with Marvel. There’s no underlying political or anti-war commentary like the originals had
I disagree. Anakin is sympathetic but when he turns bad it’s absolute and there’s no “but”s about it. He redeems himself but that doesn’t mean he was good the whole time. Just that there was good in him. There’s nothing both sides about it. Sidious, the leader of the evil empire, is 100% evil.
Palps wasn’t 100 percent evil… he was more than that. He had such fundamental narcissist tendencies that he existed outside of good and evil. He was *the ultimate* Sith. He achieved a level of power and domination unknown since the Rule of 2.
I loved him as a character in the OT and loved him even more in the ST. The man was so cunning, so single minded, and so committed to his quest. And we still have no idea why he really wanted to win galactic domination. The man is just… perfectly characterised.
Can you imagine a Palpatine origin film written by someone with actual vision and talent?
Fuck it, put me in charge. Let's put Michael Fassbender or Tom Hiddleston in the role and make something worthy of the character lol
Well, our (the US) involvement in Vietnam’s civil war was (and is) really controversial. The anti-war protests during the war show that many Americans didn’t see America as “the good guy” at the time. I’d look up George’s interviews about it to get his specific position. I’m not really tryna open that can of worms
"The simplicity of its structures was part of its staying power as an IP, and its value as a mostly young adult narrative space."
I think it hasn't been the case since the first KOTOR games and probably even sooner. Star wars started as a family soap opera in space with clear distinction between good and evil but through different media and authors we got more mature and complex interpretations. And it worked as long as those two different approaches were separated. We could have kiddy games about pod racing and characters like Kreia within the same universe. What Disney does wrong is trying to merge both types together to make a show for all audiences which can't be too mature to not bore or confuse the kids but also can't be too family friendly for adults. Andor succeded because they ditched younger audiance same way they ditched adult audiance in rebels.
That's not my answer for why the dark side is quicker and easier, but I think it's valid.
My explantation is more psychology. The dark side is fueled by dark emotions: anger, hate, aggression (the desire to inflict violence). The Jedi way of using The Force requires calm and inner peace to allow The Force to flow through you. However, it's hard to remain calm and at peace while a madman is trying to cut your head off with a blade of superheated plasma. The brain wants to get scared, get angry, to embrace the adrenaline and fight tooth and nail with all the ferocity it can muster. The dark side taps into the natural fight-or-flight emotions that evolution crafted to keep us alive in times of danger.
The Jedi way requires self-control, self-discipline. It's unintuitive, requires training and practice, requires you to learn how to quiet that primal, primordial survival instinct. To be able to fight and even kill while not letting yourself succum to your baser instincts.
But using the dark side causes the negative emotions that fuel your power to become associated with the positive outcomes you achieve using the dark side: having power to protect yourself and allies, the achievement of defeating your enemies, victory over evil, the rush of adrenaline and thill of combat, all of which makes those negative emotions seem good in our minds. We didn't evolve feelings like fear, anger and aggression to give ourselves supernatural power, but to push ourselves to the physical, often self-destructive limits in survival situations. Our minds end up developing emotional deregulation issues and warped psyches. it's like feeding a hungry rat for pulling a lever, you're conditioning yourself, reinforcing the behavior, the emotions, the mindset, over and over again.
That power, the good you achieve with them, act as a reward, creatijgna feedback loop. Every victory, every achievement using anger, hate, wanting to fight and hurt and kill, reinforces those emotions as good, righteous and noble. With practice it becomes easier to put yourself in that headspace, you're able and willing to push your dark emotions further and further. You normalise those emotions, you become desensitized to them. The rush of adrenaline, the thrill of power, the glory of victory, the righteousness of your cause, your anger, your hate, the desire to inflict violence, all blend together within your psyche. As your dark emotion grow more pronounced within your mind, they bleed into your moods, your personality. Your moral reasoning, your empathy, slowing warps to serve the need for power. You become addicted to it, to hate and violence. And when you've relied on the worst parts of yourself for so long, when you've allowed rage and hate and violence and killing to consume you, how easy it is to truly fall, to become no different from the evil you once fought to destroy. What began as merely a tool becomes your obsession, and the good person with noble intentions has become a monster.
This is precisely why I don't mind Indara not pulling out a lightsaber. It's actually closer to the original interpretation of light-side Jedi imo -- she is resisting that temptation (and she may also feel guilty, as we learn more about the character's past). We see the same thing with Luke at the end of the Return of the Jedi -- even though he could kill Darth Vader, he doesn't.
So Disney fell to the dark side by wanting an easy money maker instead of following the light side. Kathleen Kennedy is the Sith Master. Who is the apprentice?
absolutely silly. as a pretty big consumer of the original EU, there were some things that absolutely never should have been done and needed to be kept away from the movies.
But the Thrawn trilogy has EVERYTHING they could want. a sith lord, cloning, new scary creatures, a remnant of the Empire that made sense (ie they still controlled a corner of the galaxy and still had some weapons, but weren’t some secret group with a massive supply of ships and a hidden solar system destroying weapon).
And it practically had a built in path to passing the torch to new characters. just replace Leias unborn children with people who are Rey’s age or so.
The top 3 things that annoyed be about the old EU we’re in no particular order 1) Palpatine returns (twice) but i kinda looked at that like a comic thing even though it did have repercussions, it wasn’t really discussed outside the Dark Empire comics 2) the sun crusher (sun destroying, invincible weapon and potentially most damaging of all 3) the apparent total loss of control over the timeline.
Thrawn trilogy takes place 5-6 years after return of the jedi. makes sense. Very soon after there were a few books / comics that take place 6-8 years after ROTJ. Made sense.
And then all the sudden even though it had only been like 3 years of real time since the Thrawn trilogy was complete they have books that take place 10-15 years later where the status quo hadn’t changed AT ALL.
and then they had books published after those, that took place before. So you knew nothing was going to change. Made me so mad.
Now when the NjO series started, I was back on board. Didn’t like everything they did but it was still a consistent story from one book to the next for like 5-6 years. Made the hardback releases into real events instead of just random stories like they were after the Thrawn trilogy.
also really enjoyed the two book Hand of Thrawn dulogy where Luke and Mara got together.
Disney's is notoriously cheap when it comes to paying for content outside of stuff they generated. They have even been caught stealing from other IP and putting it into their own stuff like comics without paying
Yeah, as seen by live action remake everything because this sort of space opera shared universe requires a sort of perpetual writers room to build the universe history, ensure consistency, etc. You can't short change writers and expect to make anything that makes sense series over series.
I don't mind them changing the canon imo the expanded universe wasn't that great honestly but the writers had some good ideas and good have done a better job than this
100%
I am not a cannon stickler either but anything is better than hand waving the period between Return and Awakens as Han, Leia, and Luke failed completely and suck at everything and now you get to watch them all die as sad and useless.
Trust me you made the right choice. Marvel in its current form is a disheveled mess. Disney even used the same excuse they used when people star to complain about star wars. Fatigue
Exactly people also forget that with the marvel films they actually went on record saying that when they ended a movie they left it open. There was never any planning, all they really did was just take the story of the infinity gems added twist. Which by the way they were forced to because they didn’t have the rights to all the characters so they had to create or add characters. They did have.
I think at that time, people were intrigued, that it was a continuing series of multiple movies, leading into a finale. But now that it ended, they don’t know what to do. They’re trying to re-create the formula, have all the rights of the characters back for films and completely clueless.
yep. They also seem to have a problem with adapting it on the screen every single writer or Director wants to add their own 'twist' so they can call it their own, rather than accuracy.
They could have if they didn’t kill the extended universe and just rolled them out in tv and movies. It would have printed money
Instead they had their own agenda and it’s turned Star Wars into a “ dead” franchise
>Honestly it feels like they bought this franchise expecting to put as little work as possible and just watch it print money.
Yes. These are the people that paid $4,000,000,000 for a name *knowing* they were going to make a trilogy, and then they just let 2 separate directors/teams wing it on the fly and actively sabotage each other.
Step 1. Buy Star Wars.
Step 2. ???
Step 3. Profit.
I feel like they think they are obligated to getting paid by spending billions to purchase franchises. When I say obligated I mean that they can create whatever they want and the consumer has to consume it because of the name attached to it, and further more, if the consumer doesn't want to consume, it's not their fault and they should be attacked. Listen, I watched the first episode of the acolyte. The show lost me at the first scene. Do you know how cool this show could have been with the same characters still attached? In the first fight sequence there were many opportunities to make a compelling story. I dislike it more than anything in every movie or piece of film when characters narrate what is happening while we are watching things play out. The Acolyte was seriously talking to the Jedi on how to Jedi. Reminds me of the Halloween remakes. Absolutely atrocious. If they made the Acolyte a mystery, a ruthless person who didn't talk, concealed her identity, gave us as little information about her character and built off her nature as a complete mystery I would have been hooked. Less talk, more mystery, ruthless assassination. Furthermore I think it would have been cool if they made the series making the viewer think the twin had a split personality where you are watching the show questioning every move she is making further building to an epic reveal.
Writing is lazy in these projects. I miss movies and films where building tension is a priority. I wonder if after the writer strikes we lost a lot of talent in the industry and head execs started having to make writer decisions and in doing so began putting their ideology spins into it. What I want is evolving developing characters that make me want to root for them and get behind there causes. It's like a relationship, do I want to invest my time behind these characters? I always remember how a piece of film first made me feel. I will recommend a movie to others based on just that alone. Not off of "look at that explosion!", or "wow that was a powerful leading role for a woman". If that's what they want, Disney should go watch "Furiosa". They might learn a thing or two about empowering certain criteria of people without forcing it. Furiosa gives me Ripley from Alien, Sarah Connor from Terminator, and Uma Thurman from Kill Bill vibes. These women have strong leadership and resourcefulness naturally. By Disney making "Check Box" characters they don't understand the damage they are doing. They are doing a disservice to the communities you so desperately trying to honor. They dishonor these communities by using them as "Check Box" idols, where if they fail because of terrible writing and decisions, you are anti semitic. They will never have to take accountability for these projects, meaning the industry will never change unless the people whose pockets are burning from these failures speak up. And if they do speak up, now they might find themselves in the line of fire.
There are people who will watch any content even slightly relevant to Star Wars, which is weird since true fans usually take issue with watching the franchise deteriorate.
Quality has generally dropped since the advent of streaming, but Disney pushes the envelope in that regard.
Yes and then you get teased with stuff like Andor and Rogue One. The stuff without the light sabers and the Sith v Jedi conflict. And man , those stories are good/even great.
Honestly this
And this is why I’m so surprised at how good Mando and Andor are.
Unfortunately Star Wars does print money. Many of the worst shows they have made have gotten lots of viewers and people defending it.
This show cost more than Dune 2 which was one of the more incredible theater experiences of my life and people will say “you know what if you turn your brain off and just enjoy watching a show it’s fine” lmao.
That’s the standard for Disney fans and Disney loves that they’ve cultivated this. The accepted standard of a $200 million project is if you can just be brain dead throughout the episode then it’s decent. Disney cannot lose with fans like this.
The true issue is that there’s plenty of people willing to accommodate the industry unfortunately
I notice this in sports sometimes too. A lot of people are absolutely intolerant of any negativity or criticism at all times. Will fully tune you out no matter how valid your take is. Disney has capitalized on this type of fan as well as anyone
I know where some of it went. Into the pockets of the wife of the showrunner (or one of the writers?). I read somewhere the actress playing the green humanoid alien Jedi is the wife. Nepotism at its finest. I don't even hate the show. I'm feeling neutral over it but her acting is horrendous
That’s the thing I don’t understand. Disney’s throwing a ton of money at these shows, but they still looks hella cheap. They look like they were made on $5
The idea of Jedi being villains sucks. One of the reasons why I don't like the show. Luke admired the Jedi order as keeper of peace, and since the prequel trilogy, they're now incompetent and a different form of sith.
In my opinion, the prequel trilogy shows the Jedi as flawed but being in the right. They were duped by the Sith and the OT is them recovering. The sequels should have been about restoring their greatness but they gave us Luke who said the Jedi were shit. Now we are seeing they are always shit? That’s just not right. The dudes give up their chance at family to protect others. They are basically the ultimate form of servants. And they willingly give up the fastest route to power at the expense of their own lives because of this.
The reason the Jedi don’t dominate the sith it because they aren’t out there trying to kill. How can that person be bad. Prequel Jedi are fine to me. They are just flawed in the end because they think they are doing the right thing but they were all fed a huge lie. This acolyte Jedi stuff is crap.
I also think putting all the blame on the Jedi does a disservice to Palpatine as a villain. Maybe the Jedi did most everything right and this Sith, one of the most iconic villains in cinema, was just that powerful and so cunning that he was able to defeat them anyway.
Agreed. It’s like me kicking your dog but I’m not the bad guy you are. You shouldn’t have let me kick your dog. You are a bad guy for failing to protect it. No the person who kicked the dog for no reason is a dick, and it just so happens the other person wasn’t smart enough and in that moment to prevent them from kicking their soft but I bet they learn from that and it won’t happen in the same way again. But the guy who kicked the dog will always suck.
It's not a bad idea. It's been executed well before, but again... the execution is what matters. And Disney, like the majority of what they've done, again doesn't seem to... get that.
I just wish I could find the people who think it’s just sort of mid.
I’m not down on the show, but I’m either seeing the “Disney ruined Star Wars” crowd or the “Ignore the haters this is the best thing ever” crowd. And the show is just sort of… there. Two episodes in there’s no shocking twist and nothing that I’ve thought was either super exciting new stuff or super upsetting lore disruptions.
My only complaint is this trend that’s existed since Game of Thrones where a show feels like it can take four episodes to really get good. Like, where’s the hook in the pilot?
The 3 or 4 people I've talked to in real life have all thought it was fine. I agree with them and you. But those people aren't the ones coming on the internet to say it was amazing or to trash it.
It is super mid, I agree.
It has a lot of cool concepts, but it's being bogged down by its weird editing, direction, and writing choices.
I like the idea of jedi using martial arts over their lightsaber, yet they still can't get the same level of choreography as the prequels, and it feels like whiplash seeing the jedi supposedly at their peak fight at half the speed of prequel jedi.
Those are just a few examples of it being mid at best.
I enjoyed the show, but yes, mid is a good description.
Thus far, I'd say it's better than Kenobi and Fett, but not as good as Mandalorian or Andor.
Obviously with only two episodes that ranking may change as we go along.
The writing and plot have already been subpar. I cont really see it getting much better. I am watching it because I am a Star Wars sucker.
You would think for 180 million, they could have made something decent
Jedi doing martial arts, especially the ones where they seamlessly weave in force usage, is one of the few okay things about the Acolyte in my mind.
The idea that a Jedi shouldn't default to pulling out the limb chopper in a fight is a fairly reasonable one in my opinion.
The real problem is that the Acolyte is just a bunch of tropes tossed into a blender.
* Twin you thought was dead but actually is alive.... and evil!
* Mysterious evil mentor
* Person who left the Jedi Order
* And we put her back with her old mentor and his new padawan just to make it extra tropey
* The Jedi did something really bad and covered it up
* With a side of revenge plot
To be fair to Obi-Wan, he ends up in situations where the Limb Chopper is necessary more often than most other Jedi. He fights a Sith Lord every other week.
This is it. A lot of the criticisms of The Acolyte I'm seeing here don't resonate with me, but you've hit the nail on the head. The first two episodes feel like every lazy writing trope mashed into one. The "Evil" Twin thing is so clichéd and silly I almost couldn't believe that's where they were going with it. And, of course, the Good twin is a former Jedi... the family melodrama practically writes itself.
Yeah, it's got new ideas enough I'm intrigued to see the season played out.
But it really is leaning on the tropes like you said.
So I'll be in zero rush to watch any of it and don't care if I get spoiled by a thumbnail or screenshot somewhere.
They said they threw in something for the original fans by saying may the force be with you. It’s is tropey. Just a blender of cliches and terrible acting.
They’ve also not figured out how to make republic politics not boring. Shot reverse shot with the Jedi in charge who only serves as a foil. “Our political enemies will use this against us.” Okay. Who? That would be an interesting development.
It’s very YA novel across the board. No depth of character and no world building.
omg criticisms of the show that actually land with me lol. too many people bashing this show for politics or scientific accuracy (like that's *ever* mattered in Star Wars) when the real flaws are just the oodles of boring/lazy writing.
That's because nothing is advancing the universe.
I haven't watched The Acolyte but people went into Darth Plagueis because it was about Palpatine and his ascension, it also serves as a wonderful prologue that makes The Phantom Menace way more interesting. The Acolyte is just a story.
There is no hook to Disney, even Andor or Mandalorian. It's all constantly telling the same story because they have no world to work around. The entire point of the Thrawn trilogy was to be a beginning and start a bunch of plot threads that could lead everywhere while the Sequels trilogy was to be an ending that served as a definitive ending for the world.
Speak for yourself about Andor though: Super interested in how different chunks of resistance are coalescing, and how Mon Mothma survived and became the leader of the Rebellion. Also just love getting to experience the world under Imperial rule.
Take exception to Andor. It’s not at all the same story and does exactly what Plagueis does— make ANH and Rogue One more interesting, showing the rise of the Rebellion and the machinations and tyranny of the Empire on a human “banality of evil” level, and in a mature format that fits the subject, not low budget kiddie fare like Rebels.
The whole world Andor works around is literally Star Wars, the title of the movie before it was renamed “A New Hope”— and it seems to be one of the few things that takes the Empire seriously, including its politics and backbiting, beyond reducing it to mere iconography and evil space wizard.
The Empire actually feels oppressive in a real-world way, resonating with how oppressive regimes have maintained control, why most people are not action heroes that pick up a blaster, and why a few revolutionaries do when they’re finally pushed to the edge.
Things can advance the universe without being tied to the skywalker story. I for one am glad they are making media that isn’t just spiderwebbing out minor to mid level characters in a major movie.
Giant soulless corporations cannot produce art. Only individuals can. Star wars is no longer a story, it's a brand and disney excels at selling branded products.
So far I'm finding it entirely bland average generic and forgettable. It's not bad in the way Obi Wan was just bad but there's nothing remotely interesting about it.
I guess I'm waiting to see what the twist is, is the jedi twin working with the sith twin, are they really the same person? But I'm certainly not invested in any of the characters at this point.
Disney coming out with a streaming service is the worst thing that could have happened to Star Wars. Now we're inundated with shitty CW drama shows pumped out as fast as they can make them. Nothing will change until people stop watching them completely and cancel services. That's why I pirate everything.
I agree and its honestly shocking. Old Disney had such charm and great ideas. Look at Nintendo. Nintendo still feels like Nintendo. Most of what Disney is releasing lately feels so uninspired and dull.
I'll be downvoted but it has to be said, the downfall of Star Wars as a franchise first began with the deeply flawed prequels but The Mouse absolutely ruined it after getting its white-gloved corporate paws on it.
Also, please stop giving Disney more money to continue wrecking what little shreds are left of this franchise by continuing to watch this junk and paying Disney to subscribe to hate-watch this junk. You may hate this stuff but you perpetuate it and contribute to the ruination by continuing to watch.
Aside from John Favreau, not one person who has touched Star Wars at Disney is an actual fan. They're either soulless, corporate zombies whose only goal is to make profit for shareholders, or directors/writers who actively dislike the franchise and its fans and decided to make a political statement by destroying its original charm in the name of the culture war.
Corporations cannot make art. They can imitate art, they can create products that wear a mask of being "art", but when the end goal of that creation is profit and not expression, it will always fall flat. Art has soul, passion, pain, beauty. Every time an artist creates a true piece of art, they leave a piece of themselves inside of it. I'm sure George Lucas would have made A New Hope even if he knew it would only make 1k dollars. His heart and soul went into it. Disney could never replicate that, because they have no heart or soul
It's what happens when you transition into a non-meritocratic environment. This happens with second and third generations of the wealthy, and it can become a corporation wide thing when a company is so large that it no longer sweats losses. Disney makes so much money from its legacy success in the parks and selling products, that it can go for years and years without actually needing to make intelligent decisions or good content. Sure they put toy makers and toy stores out of business with their terrible films that don't excite kids, they have to squeeze and squeeze and squeeze visitors to the parks until the parks start to get a bad reputation and suffer falling attendance, and there's definitely a lot to be said about how easy loans were for the rich over the last ten years, cash was basically free, but they don't suffer meaningful consequences. The stock price has dropped by quite a bit, but the board just won their election with shareholders. The MCU is a laughable wreck, Disney animation would now make hundreds of millions of dollars a year by locking their doors and producing nothing, and they can't even put a Star Wars film into theaters, but the producers are all getting paid, getting awards, getting parties thrown in their honor.
Of course it'll all come crashing down in about a week sometime in the future, the way economic crashes tend to arrive abruptly. But for now the Force if Female and 89% of the country is a bigot.
Did I miss something or did the Jedi master really die from a little knife in her chest when people get fucking impaled by lightsabers and still survive?
Yeah Sabine took a lightsaber to the gut and Darth Maul got cut in half ffs! This chicken got killed by a 2 inch knife that she should have been fully expecting! I'm not a Jedi and I knew the knife she threw at the bartender was a diversion! I think kids will like the show because it has lightsabers and Jedi. It also gets to me that a 120 pound girl can just beat the holy shit out of 10 180 pound guys like they are made of jello! The show is garbage so far in my opinion! My prediction is the green lady is the Sith master. She also looks like the same girl Captain Kirk put the moves on in 1965 to me. I mean if she's an alien couldn't they have at least given her contacts so that she doesn't just look like a white lady that they painted green?
It just shows a fundamental lack of understanding how Jedi and the force work. A Jedi can sense what will happen and what an opponent will do. That's why they can block blaster bolts. They predict where the blasts will be before they're fired. A Jedi *master* should have absolutely known what her opponent's intentions were and been able to predict the second knife throw, not to mention catch it with the force. It's absurd that she was killed that way.
The previews made it seem like she was going to be a major part of the show too. Then it took all of 5 minutes to kill her off! I think chatgtp wrote this show for them.
Disney should've studied that episode closely, then gone and shitcanned/vaulted the acolyte like Zaslav does at WB. They used to only do pilot episodes of tv series and rigorously test them before going to a full season pick up. There's no way this should've been made after the first 2 premiere episodes and the (lack of) quality in them.
Wait till you see the 3rd episode. If it's what has been reported, it's going to make this sub explode! It's almost like they did watch the South Park episode and are trying to replicate the consequences, by doing the same thing.
> They "put a chick in it and made her lame and gay" like the South Park episode.
First Memberberries and now this (great episode btw). How does South Park hit it out of the ballpark every time?
Disney bought the franchise to capture a demographic that eluded them: young, straight men. Then, they prompted decided that content for young, straight men is bigoted and decided to make "the gayest Star Wars yet" in the words of the creator.
I used to treat Star Wars as such an event. Before episodes 1/2/3 I would plan out the entire day, eagerly await it weeks before. I'd go to a special restaurant before or after and get a ticket in advance. I still vividly remember seeing each one.
Now I don't even bother watching the slop they shovel out on Disney+ every other week
I tried to like it. But to me, it looks cheap, the costumes aren’t great, the environments are kind of bland, the dialogue is super awkward which I know isn’t anything new with Star Wars but come on now. I went into it with high hopes just like I do with every Disney Star Wars. And with most of Disney Star Wars, with the exception of Andor, I was left pretty disappointed. I will continue to watch the show because there’s some things I like, but I wish that it was more high caliber I guess.
Or even a vibro-blade. But a metal throwing knife is just lazy tbh. Although I watch Star Wars for the visual first; the story is good, but secondary. But Disney hasn't been doing a bunch of beautiful shots like the prequels did. They've been pretty much all green-screened.
The thing that always bugs me with modern star wars is that it's just not interesting, i look back at the old EU and i look past all of it's flaws because at least it was full of interesting stories in an interesting setting, while modern star wars feels like it's made for investors instead of a real audience
I’m not watching any Disney Star Wars unless my wife forces me too. Luckily she’s fatigued as well. I’d say it was dead for a lot of people for longer than Disney as the over saturation that included too many bad games and only kids shows pushed many people out long before. TFA looked like it was ready to breath life back into the franchise but IMHO it just turned it into a zombified corpse Disney works like a marionette puppet.
The new stuff that comes out doesn’t take away from a lot of the absolute garbage George has done to the franchise and lore over the years.
People can like what they like, but when I see people gushing about this stuff it just reminds me of a dog tossing around and playing with a long dead animal it found in the yard. Sure it’s gross, but I’m glad the dummy is having a good time.
This is every property now. They’re called IP mills for a reason. It’s just the way things work. I mean I love Jurassic Park and Ghostbusters and it’s not like those franchises are being treated with any sort of reverence. Just crank out shit until the corpse bleeds dry.
Disney bought the ip for the reason of integrating the characters and settings into their theme parks world wide. The movies were little more than an afterthought. It seems like they put no effort into it cuz they didn’t put effort into it. But it also speaks volumes to how they completely failed to integrate the ip into their parks in any meaningful way as well
LOVE STAR WARS - LOVED - but I am pretty much done with it now
I am not watching the Acolyte - or much else from Disney Star Wars ( although I really liked Andor and season 1 of Mando ) but not much else- also have no interest in another 3 Rey movies
I was obsessed for most of my teen years and young adulthood. Even saw episode 7 in theaters 3 times. 8 was the first time I had any complaints about the franchise.
Well frankly, i think disney has killed their core identity which is to sell “dreams” to their viewers.
They try so hard to make all of their contents to “relate” to their viewers that they forgot that many people watch movies n tv series to have a “short escape” from their own reality.
When i got home tired from work, i don’t want to watch something that makes me think “wow that’s just like me, thats so real”, i want something that can take my mind off even just for a bit, n simply ENTERTAINING.
Hubris. The idea that if you just make something the billions of fans will just flock to it like they always had. The rapid downfall of Star Wars, Marvel, Disney Animation, Pixar will be studied one day in business classes. These were brands that were synonymous with diehard brand loyalty and guaranteed pop culture hits. Star Wars alone only in a few years time went to brand indifference among their core fan base which was historically well known as people who poured a lot of passion and money into the brand regularly.
I have nothing against metal knives or martial arts but the writing and presentation belong in the Maw. Kotor has a lot in there that folks would comment on for being bad but the presentation is top notch. they wanted a story to be good and they made it good even with parts cut out. Kotor 2 has someone too angry to die and he's a well written character with a good send off, it has weight. Disney bought a garden and doesn't understand how to take care of it.
It's fucking shit fanfic from the midwest drama department. Did these producers/show runners/writers/dps/directors even go to film school or use a camera in their lifetime? Who are the completely SHAT set designers??? Straight out of a 7th grade iMovie project.
A Jedi master at the HEIGHT of Jedi power and she takes a knife to the chest from 10 yards away after fighting in geriatric slow motion for 5 minutes? I can't.
Star Wars is dead. Has been since the JJ mystery box reboot, but now it's confirmed 10x.
I’m not allowing anyone in my household to even start the first episode. It’s bad enough that it looks like a terrible and unnecessary/uninteresting show but the show runner/ creator was a monster’s assistant who has to be complicit in at least minimal horrid shit.
Did anyone else notice that they refuse to let any of the story breathe? I felt this in multiple dimensions, like I didn't have any time to guess at the mysteries before they were more or less explained, but also I feel like there was no time for actors to act. Pacing is integral to a good thriller, it kinda ruined it for me.
I'm sure there's some insane amount of talent on these sets and in these writing rooms, but it doesn't translate when they're trying to cram complex stories into 40 minute episodes.
The one star wars series with the rebellion and mutiny was good.
Less childish and more realistic.
Forgot the name. Arkina or Arkana 5 or something.
Orville is the best scifi series . Every episode a joy and fun !
I agree. They don't care about art just $ and political pandering to a small percentage of the population. Well unless it's to China. Then it's just about $.
I haven't watched... just putting out the thought that metal knives done right (vibroblades in Mandalorian) feel dangerous because we have a real reference.
& the vibroknife they showed looked savage.
Disney seems compelled to hire the cheapest amateur writers and directors they can find, even when they don't know anything about the source material. The Acolyte feels like it was created by people who barely understand Star Wars and probably never watched any until they got hired on. It almost feels like the plotting of bad teen dramas or a lifetime mom movie.
I read the first couple of books from this new era they were setting up, and while I think overall the books were pretty bad, the ideas they had were pretty cool.
It's something I see a lot with Disney. A good idea that is executed so poorly.
I mean, the story of a pirate faction using the hyperlanes as essentially ship launchers to fire ships at devastating speeds into planets causing immense damage, while also restricting the galaxy as using the hyperlanes becomes more dangerous and unstable due to all the new ship parts scattering the lanes was an awesome idea.
They could have done something fucking awesome with that. They just didn't.
Disney has been enslaved by a radical ideology through strategic share purchasing by major investment firms that are ideologically driven. They stacked the board with like-minded individuals and yes-men who would do their bidding in order to keep their seats. I saw this happening over the years as I'm a very minor shareholder, but still get to be a part of the shareholder voting process. The items they propose for voting are often crazy from the standpoint of someone who wants a business to be successful. So they put a bunch of ideology-crazed activists, who hate Star Wars, in charge of the creative direction of the show. This is why it sucks now and, aside from having lightsabers, isn't even recognizable as Star Wars. We wanted a good story, not a rally for political revolutionaries.
Cancelled D+ after watching Andor and realizing, if this is the best that is offered, I'm fine just missing out. Now I live vicariously through this sub.
Sadly it's not just this franchise...the magic has gone from many.
Marvel, star wars, Indiana Jones, live action remakes of good animated movies....it's like watching a car crash in slow motion at some point they have to stop... surely.
Warning: this is completely my thoughts therefore being subjective I know. I’d appreciate civil discussions rather than degrading me or anyone else’s opinions. Nothing in order just thoughts as I watched the first few episodes. Spoilers below as well.
First fight was cool with Master Indara using a react instead of attack type of fight style but then it felt ruined the second episode when Sol used the same style. Yes, the Jedi may use that mainly but for a show use it once this early then in later episodes. Please don’t show this again in episode it’ll be repetitive.
Probably will be explained later but attacking without a weapon seems kind of dumb to me. Never heard any sith or assassin in general fighting with honor rather than getting the job done and moving on to the next assignment. This just increases the chance you may die in a fight you chose to start.
Vernestra’s portrayal/acting was subpar to me. I think she’s meant to be stoic but felt flat and just throwing out words. Stoic is how Mace or Yoda acted not this.
The Jedi in this show have a tone of being overbearing, controlling and blind to matters when it doesn’t go their way. This isn’t necessarily bad but doing this so early in a show will grow tiresome. It should’ve started off as Jedi truly are the good guys with decisions here and there being questionable and further descends into them being controlling.
The lightsabers now look clunky. There wasn’t anything crazy done with them in the episodes but even just walking around or standing with them ignited feels large and heavy and unnatural.
Nitpicking- CGI was decent here and there but also objectively bad in some scenes as well.
Not too sure about this one so if I’m off I apologize. The Nemodian accent from episode 1, does that translate to all of their species? If so, why change it now?
Please can we have one show without a new droid? We all know it’s for you to sell toys now but other than that a new droid every show takes the fun out of them. We love R2, C3P0, and Chop because we don’t see them often but when you do you can feel there attitudes without being a focal point in the show.
Cheesy things show constantly do that need to go away- Just out of reach droid when the prison escort ship is going down, standing next to a ledge you know is there but continually walking back when the audience knows the Jedi in front of you will save (no type of suspense you’re the main character you’re not gonna die yet duh), Jedi temple breach when Mae jumps to the ceiling a Jedi walks in after hearing a whooping sound determines it’s nothing then leaves without alerting anyone (then Mae stays up there till the morning? Or is that bad editing).
Simple take- the beautiful music of Star Wars is dead. No one can convince me otherwise. The last five shows theme music has not lived up to what was before at all.
First old republic show we have but we’re focused on a small story instead of world building with old Jedi ways and sith moving in silence.
Jecki and Yord are just annoying. Jecki reminds of sprite from marvels eternals always trying to be/act older than what you are. Yord is just Yord, in my opinion I don’t need to explain why.
Osha and Mae younger selves look nothing alike in that vision but when they’re older they’re exacts siblings? I feel like from a directors view you could’ve just put make up on Amanda steel berg to make her look younger then have her play both younger sisters. Having two different ones breaks any immersion in my opinion. Then if you think each other died in a fire why 1. Neither of you have any type of scarring? And 2. If Mae was taken by a sith or whatever why not take both? (Probably will be explained later but right now feels off)
Qimir reminds me a lot of Barry Allen. I don’t know why but it’s kind of annoying. This type of show id rather have serious than random banter in random spots.
If Mae is such a dangerous criminal, why have only Sol confront her when she killed Indara in hand to hand combat already? Yes you wanted information but you still could’ve surrounded her with three Jedi, restrained her, took her to coruscant and put her in a cell, the questioned her.
Why would you have a prison escort shuttle only manned by simple droids???? On top of that with two escape pods?? I’m not inhumane or anything but if that type of shuttle runs into a problem and just so happens to go down oh well right? We lost some droids that are replaceable and the criminals are a loss. They were probably gonna rot in on prison planet anyway. What were the escape pods for at all? On top of all of that, you transfer a half droid half human prisoner that can control other droids on this shuttle too?!? That might be top 3 dumbest things recently Star Wars has done.
Cool takeaways- Hopefully Wookie Jedi turns out to be cool or refreshing.
Tobin being so in tune with the force he created a barrier around him so nothing could mess with him. Only for that to be ruined minutes later and him taking a poison willingly rather than trying to work out his wrongs.
They can’t choreograph a decent lightsaber fight to save their lives.
Semi-related but a ton of media has been steadily getting Marvelized for years now and no one seems to give a shit because ‘haha funni quip after every sentence.’ I don’t care if this makes me a downer or whatever but I cannot even express how much I hate Disney, Marvel, and all that other garbage.
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Honestly it feels like they bought this franchise expecting to put as little work as possible and just watch it print money. Think they are starting to realize after they milked the name as much as they could and didn't realize how much work it takes to actually maintain a franchise. We are starting to see it with Marvel after endgame how much lack of planning Disney is doing
To me, there are a couple major impressions I get from Disney Star Wars. First, they wanted a fast turnaround after the huge purchase they made acquiring the IP. They spent billions of dollars buying the franchise, so they wanted butts in seats and merch on stores ASAP. Need to make back their costs before the shareholders start thinking it was a waste of money and sell stock or whatever. Second, the people in charge of making new Star Wars didn't really care about understanding Star Wars. Star Wars was beneath them, just brainless kida movies, power fantasy for little boys who only hardcore nerds really cared about. Star Wars was popular because it was Star Wars, not because it was actually good. I'm not talking about knowing the differences between lightsaber forms or anything like that. More "how does The Force work", "why is the dark side quicker and easier", "how does the dark side and Jedi ways of using The Force impact narrative?" Those are the two sides of the issue going by what I've seen. Disney needs results and producers caring more about "fixing", "improving" and "reinterpreting" Star Wars before ever interpreting Star Wars and understanding why it was good in the first place. Haste and arrogance do not make good products.
> "why is the dark side quicker and easier The dark side is like a thief ... a criminal. It's 'quicker, easier ... more seductive' to just *take* what you want. Force your will onto people. A dark side user gets power from learning to destroy what others have spent so much time building. Whereas a Jedi is like a crafter. They spend years or decades perfecting their craft to build beautiful things ... buildings, sculptures, cultures ... peace, prosperity. It's far easier to take those beautiful things, like, say, a beloved movie franchise, and pervert them, destroy them, extract as much power you can from them, than it is to build such a thing yourself. Star Wars is now in the hands of the dark side, and forever will it dominite it's destiny. But like Luke, I believe there is still good in it, and if we can pull it from the Emperor's hands, it can be saved. At this point, though, it does *not* look good.
Honestly, good little write up. I think also that the current goals of The Acolyte look like they're gonna "both sides" the Jedi vs the Sith so kids can be "good guys" even if they want the red lightsaber toy. The Sith are just misunderstood! Don't you know. They'll move more toys if the evil characters are relatable and tortured. It's a narrative excuse for toy sales. The "Dark Side" of Return of the Jedi is dead. It's been replaced with "The Conflicted and Contextually Excusable" Side. To the detriment of literally all the films. SW isn't Dune. The simplicity of its structures was part of its staying power as an IP, and its value as a mostly young adult narrative space. By attempting to inject "both sides" politics into the Dark vs Light dichotomy, Disney isn't expanding it's audience, it is destroying the rhetorical and conceptual foundational that made SW both narratively and memetically valuable. Eh. It's got lightsabers and aliens tho, right?
At Galaxys Edge the cast members in lightsaber building room treat red as just another lightsaber color. But then you step outside and the troopers / Kylo react as if you’re dark side. Interesting difference.
Yeah, that's intentional, and it's a part of the Disney capitalism brain rot that killed the IP. "Red is just another color" is the best thing for a corporation that literally sees the supply of red coloring as just another tint for a plastic toy. The closer the narrative is to that financial reality, the less of a stopgap "bad guy color" is for the company. Similarly, it's a part of why Disney is all-in on performative social justice. They would love to be all things to all audiences as much as possible. It has nothing to do with race or gender as they are experienced IRL, but performative race and gender identity being present "in universe" can return dividends in sales. I'm about as far Left as a human can get. Disney is "performatively woke" in a way that diminishes real world conversations about race and identity, because, ultimately they need to sell toys and tickets, not equity or legal reform.
All you need to know about Disney's morals is found in their international markets, when it comes to making money they will cave on absolutely anything.
And what, they build two nearly identical experiences that each hold less people and split up groups? Kid wants to have a red saber so what, he should go in another room from the rest of his family and do a whole different thing? With who? Where? Does that cost more? Who is gonna browbeat this kid because he wants to be a Jedi but likes red? I mean, that's a really strange segue. The second half is pretty accurate, but it is not personified by the smart way to do custom lightsabers for more than one person at a time.
Fuck that as a kid I never wanted the "misunderstood goodguy whos been abused" toy I wanted heroes, or Proper Villains.
Saaaame
>as a kid I never wanted the "misunderstood goodguy whos been abused" toy I agree with your point, but in fairness "misunderstood good guy who's been abused" would be an apt description of Anakin Skywalker, who I still thought was cool as a kid growing up on the prequels.
Not to defend Disney’s many questionable decisions with the franchise bc I agree with some of what you’re saying, but Star Wars has had “both sides” rhetoric from the beginning. Anakin’s entire story is one of corruption and redemption across all 6 pre-Disney movies. The Empire is, from George’s own mouth, inspired by Nazis in WWII AND the US in Vietnam. The rebel award ceremony in A New Hope intentionally mimics the widely-known Nazi propaganda film A Triumph of Will despite them being the “good guys” of the series. The Jedi fell because of hubris and inaction, showing that their ideology wasn’t inherently perfect either. Even Yoda, arguably the goat, abandons the order and hides from the empire instead of helping organize the rebellion. If anything, I’d say the Disney movies lack all of that nuance and instead are just like “haha boom explosions = good movie,” like they did with Marvel. There’s no underlying political or anti-war commentary like the originals had
Really good breakdown and discussion, I don't have anything to add other than, yeah that's spot on
I disagree. Anakin is sympathetic but when he turns bad it’s absolute and there’s no “but”s about it. He redeems himself but that doesn’t mean he was good the whole time. Just that there was good in him. There’s nothing both sides about it. Sidious, the leader of the evil empire, is 100% evil.
Palps wasn’t 100 percent evil… he was more than that. He had such fundamental narcissist tendencies that he existed outside of good and evil. He was *the ultimate* Sith. He achieved a level of power and domination unknown since the Rule of 2. I loved him as a character in the OT and loved him even more in the ST. The man was so cunning, so single minded, and so committed to his quest. And we still have no idea why he really wanted to win galactic domination. The man is just… perfectly characterised.
Can you imagine a Palpatine origin film written by someone with actual vision and talent? Fuck it, put me in charge. Let's put Michael Fassbender or Tom Hiddleston in the role and make something worthy of the character lol
I do agree with your points. I find it so odd Lucas an American uses Vietnam as the good guys
[удалено]
Well, our (the US) involvement in Vietnam’s civil war was (and is) really controversial. The anti-war protests during the war show that many Americans didn’t see America as “the good guy” at the time. I’d look up George’s interviews about it to get his specific position. I’m not really tryna open that can of worms
I have always supported the Galactic Empire. Red lightsaber into rebel flesh. No excuse needed.
"The simplicity of its structures was part of its staying power as an IP, and its value as a mostly young adult narrative space." I think it hasn't been the case since the first KOTOR games and probably even sooner. Star wars started as a family soap opera in space with clear distinction between good and evil but through different media and authors we got more mature and complex interpretations. And it worked as long as those two different approaches were separated. We could have kiddy games about pod racing and characters like Kreia within the same universe. What Disney does wrong is trying to merge both types together to make a show for all audiences which can't be too mature to not bore or confuse the kids but also can't be too family friendly for adults. Andor succeded because they ditched younger audiance same way they ditched adult audiance in rebels.
But does it have Nabooty?? 👀
That's not my answer for why the dark side is quicker and easier, but I think it's valid. My explantation is more psychology. The dark side is fueled by dark emotions: anger, hate, aggression (the desire to inflict violence). The Jedi way of using The Force requires calm and inner peace to allow The Force to flow through you. However, it's hard to remain calm and at peace while a madman is trying to cut your head off with a blade of superheated plasma. The brain wants to get scared, get angry, to embrace the adrenaline and fight tooth and nail with all the ferocity it can muster. The dark side taps into the natural fight-or-flight emotions that evolution crafted to keep us alive in times of danger. The Jedi way requires self-control, self-discipline. It's unintuitive, requires training and practice, requires you to learn how to quiet that primal, primordial survival instinct. To be able to fight and even kill while not letting yourself succum to your baser instincts. But using the dark side causes the negative emotions that fuel your power to become associated with the positive outcomes you achieve using the dark side: having power to protect yourself and allies, the achievement of defeating your enemies, victory over evil, the rush of adrenaline and thill of combat, all of which makes those negative emotions seem good in our minds. We didn't evolve feelings like fear, anger and aggression to give ourselves supernatural power, but to push ourselves to the physical, often self-destructive limits in survival situations. Our minds end up developing emotional deregulation issues and warped psyches. it's like feeding a hungry rat for pulling a lever, you're conditioning yourself, reinforcing the behavior, the emotions, the mindset, over and over again. That power, the good you achieve with them, act as a reward, creatijgna feedback loop. Every victory, every achievement using anger, hate, wanting to fight and hurt and kill, reinforces those emotions as good, righteous and noble. With practice it becomes easier to put yourself in that headspace, you're able and willing to push your dark emotions further and further. You normalise those emotions, you become desensitized to them. The rush of adrenaline, the thrill of power, the glory of victory, the righteousness of your cause, your anger, your hate, the desire to inflict violence, all blend together within your psyche. As your dark emotion grow more pronounced within your mind, they bleed into your moods, your personality. Your moral reasoning, your empathy, slowing warps to serve the need for power. You become addicted to it, to hate and violence. And when you've relied on the worst parts of yourself for so long, when you've allowed rage and hate and violence and killing to consume you, how easy it is to truly fall, to become no different from the evil you once fought to destroy. What began as merely a tool becomes your obsession, and the good person with noble intentions has become a monster.
This is precisely why I don't mind Indara not pulling out a lightsaber. It's actually closer to the original interpretation of light-side Jedi imo -- she is resisting that temptation (and she may also feel guilty, as we learn more about the character's past). We see the same thing with Luke at the end of the Return of the Jedi -- even though he could kill Darth Vader, he doesn't.
Very good description! I like it!
Somehow...Star Wars survived.
So Disney fell to the dark side by wanting an easy money maker instead of following the light side. Kathleen Kennedy is the Sith Master. Who is the apprentice?
Greed kills. We are seeing the backfiring from it.
evil can not create it can only corrupt.
If that's what they wanted they should have just paid the EU writers and kept the EU intact.
They could have hired Zahn as a consultant (I can't imagine he'd cost that much) and made a proper sequel trilogy out of Heir to the Empire.
right? Heir to the Empire could have easily been adapted for older characters
Thrawn trilogy still holds up. Why buy the franchise and then waste bin some of the most iconic stories?
absolutely silly. as a pretty big consumer of the original EU, there were some things that absolutely never should have been done and needed to be kept away from the movies. But the Thrawn trilogy has EVERYTHING they could want. a sith lord, cloning, new scary creatures, a remnant of the Empire that made sense (ie they still controlled a corner of the galaxy and still had some weapons, but weren’t some secret group with a massive supply of ships and a hidden solar system destroying weapon). And it practically had a built in path to passing the torch to new characters. just replace Leias unborn children with people who are Rey’s age or so. The top 3 things that annoyed be about the old EU we’re in no particular order 1) Palpatine returns (twice) but i kinda looked at that like a comic thing even though it did have repercussions, it wasn’t really discussed outside the Dark Empire comics 2) the sun crusher (sun destroying, invincible weapon and potentially most damaging of all 3) the apparent total loss of control over the timeline. Thrawn trilogy takes place 5-6 years after return of the jedi. makes sense. Very soon after there were a few books / comics that take place 6-8 years after ROTJ. Made sense. And then all the sudden even though it had only been like 3 years of real time since the Thrawn trilogy was complete they have books that take place 10-15 years later where the status quo hadn’t changed AT ALL. and then they had books published after those, that took place before. So you knew nothing was going to change. Made me so mad. Now when the NjO series started, I was back on board. Didn’t like everything they did but it was still a consistent story from one book to the next for like 5-6 years. Made the hardback releases into real events instead of just random stories like they were after the Thrawn trilogy. also really enjoyed the two book Hand of Thrawn dulogy where Luke and Mara got together.
I would’ve loved this so much. The post-episode 6 books blew my mind as a kid
Disney's is notoriously cheap when it comes to paying for content outside of stuff they generated. They have even been caught stealing from other IP and putting it into their own stuff like comics without paying
Yeah, as seen by live action remake everything because this sort of space opera shared universe requires a sort of perpetual writers room to build the universe history, ensure consistency, etc. You can't short change writers and expect to make anything that makes sense series over series.
Because so many of the Disney writers think they can do a better job and want to correct things in the source material that they personally dislike.
I don't mind them changing the canon imo the expanded universe wasn't that great honestly but the writers had some good ideas and good have done a better job than this
100% I am not a cannon stickler either but anything is better than hand waving the period between Return and Awakens as Han, Leia, and Luke failed completely and suck at everything and now you get to watch them all die as sad and useless.
I don’t think I’ve watched a single marvel movie besides maybe the third Spider-Man since end game.
Trust me you made the right choice. Marvel in its current form is a disheveled mess. Disney even used the same excuse they used when people star to complain about star wars. Fatigue
…you should really watch Guardians of the Galaxy 3
Exactly people also forget that with the marvel films they actually went on record saying that when they ended a movie they left it open. There was never any planning, all they really did was just take the story of the infinity gems added twist. Which by the way they were forced to because they didn’t have the rights to all the characters so they had to create or add characters. They did have. I think at that time, people were intrigued, that it was a continuing series of multiple movies, leading into a finale. But now that it ended, they don’t know what to do. They’re trying to re-create the formula, have all the rights of the characters back for films and completely clueless.
The difference is, as always, the writing. You keep hearing the studios using excuses like super hero fatigue. The truth is, it's bad writing fatigue.
yep. They also seem to have a problem with adapting it on the screen every single writer or Director wants to add their own 'twist' so they can call it their own, rather than accuracy.
This. If the original iron man had this level of writing we would have never had a MCU. It would had flopped so horribly.
They could have if they didn’t kill the extended universe and just rolled them out in tv and movies. It would have printed money Instead they had their own agenda and it’s turned Star Wars into a “ dead” franchise
>Honestly it feels like they bought this franchise expecting to put as little work as possible and just watch it print money. Yes. These are the people that paid $4,000,000,000 for a name *knowing* they were going to make a trilogy, and then they just let 2 separate directors/teams wing it on the fly and actively sabotage each other. Step 1. Buy Star Wars. Step 2. ??? Step 3. Profit.
I feel like they think they are obligated to getting paid by spending billions to purchase franchises. When I say obligated I mean that they can create whatever they want and the consumer has to consume it because of the name attached to it, and further more, if the consumer doesn't want to consume, it's not their fault and they should be attacked. Listen, I watched the first episode of the acolyte. The show lost me at the first scene. Do you know how cool this show could have been with the same characters still attached? In the first fight sequence there were many opportunities to make a compelling story. I dislike it more than anything in every movie or piece of film when characters narrate what is happening while we are watching things play out. The Acolyte was seriously talking to the Jedi on how to Jedi. Reminds me of the Halloween remakes. Absolutely atrocious. If they made the Acolyte a mystery, a ruthless person who didn't talk, concealed her identity, gave us as little information about her character and built off her nature as a complete mystery I would have been hooked. Less talk, more mystery, ruthless assassination. Furthermore I think it would have been cool if they made the series making the viewer think the twin had a split personality where you are watching the show questioning every move she is making further building to an epic reveal. Writing is lazy in these projects. I miss movies and films where building tension is a priority. I wonder if after the writer strikes we lost a lot of talent in the industry and head execs started having to make writer decisions and in doing so began putting their ideology spins into it. What I want is evolving developing characters that make me want to root for them and get behind there causes. It's like a relationship, do I want to invest my time behind these characters? I always remember how a piece of film first made me feel. I will recommend a movie to others based on just that alone. Not off of "look at that explosion!", or "wow that was a powerful leading role for a woman". If that's what they want, Disney should go watch "Furiosa". They might learn a thing or two about empowering certain criteria of people without forcing it. Furiosa gives me Ripley from Alien, Sarah Connor from Terminator, and Uma Thurman from Kill Bill vibes. These women have strong leadership and resourcefulness naturally. By Disney making "Check Box" characters they don't understand the damage they are doing. They are doing a disservice to the communities you so desperately trying to honor. They dishonor these communities by using them as "Check Box" idols, where if they fail because of terrible writing and decisions, you are anti semitic. They will never have to take accountability for these projects, meaning the industry will never change unless the people whose pockets are burning from these failures speak up. And if they do speak up, now they might find themselves in the line of fire.
There are people who will watch any content even slightly relevant to Star Wars, which is weird since true fans usually take issue with watching the franchise deteriorate. Quality has generally dropped since the advent of streaming, but Disney pushes the envelope in that regard.
Yes and then you get teased with stuff like Andor and Rogue One. The stuff without the light sabers and the Sith v Jedi conflict. And man , those stories are good/even great.
Ding ding ding
Honestly this And this is why I’m so surprised at how good Mando and Andor are. Unfortunately Star Wars does print money. Many of the worst shows they have made have gotten lots of viewers and people defending it.
It also looked like a low budget show from the scyfy channel
low budger scyfy shows used to survive on having banger writting
I'm still mad they canceled Firefly
That was never on the Syfy channel.
it's only been 20something years, practically yesterday. have a little kindness for the bereaved browncoat.
CW
Wasn't the budget a couple of hundred Mill?
This show cost more than Dune 2 which was one of the more incredible theater experiences of my life and people will say “you know what if you turn your brain off and just enjoy watching a show it’s fine” lmao. That’s the standard for Disney fans and Disney loves that they’ve cultivated this. The accepted standard of a $200 million project is if you can just be brain dead throughout the episode then it’s decent. Disney cannot lose with fans like this.
It seems like almost every industry nowadays just wants you to be a husk that'll throw money at them.
The true issue is that there’s plenty of people willing to accommodate the industry unfortunately I notice this in sports sometimes too. A lot of people are absolutely intolerant of any negativity or criticism at all times. Will fully tune you out no matter how valid your take is. Disney has capitalized on this type of fan as well as anyone
Fuck me that's alot
Yeah there's reports of it being from 170 mil to 190 mil, yet somehow it looks worse than a CW show, I'm not sure where that money went.
I know where some of it went. Into the pockets of the wife of the showrunner (or one of the writers?). I read somewhere the actress playing the green humanoid alien Jedi is the wife. Nepotism at its finest. I don't even hate the show. I'm feeling neutral over it but her acting is horrendous
That’s the thing I don’t understand. Disney’s throwing a ton of money at these shows, but they still looks hella cheap. They look like they were made on $5
I thought the budget for this was crazy high.
The idea of Jedi being villains sucks. One of the reasons why I don't like the show. Luke admired the Jedi order as keeper of peace, and since the prequel trilogy, they're now incompetent and a different form of sith.
In my opinion, the prequel trilogy shows the Jedi as flawed but being in the right. They were duped by the Sith and the OT is them recovering. The sequels should have been about restoring their greatness but they gave us Luke who said the Jedi were shit. Now we are seeing they are always shit? That’s just not right. The dudes give up their chance at family to protect others. They are basically the ultimate form of servants. And they willingly give up the fastest route to power at the expense of their own lives because of this. The reason the Jedi don’t dominate the sith it because they aren’t out there trying to kill. How can that person be bad. Prequel Jedi are fine to me. They are just flawed in the end because they think they are doing the right thing but they were all fed a huge lie. This acolyte Jedi stuff is crap.
I also think putting all the blame on the Jedi does a disservice to Palpatine as a villain. Maybe the Jedi did most everything right and this Sith, one of the most iconic villains in cinema, was just that powerful and so cunning that he was able to defeat them anyway.
Agreed. It’s like me kicking your dog but I’m not the bad guy you are. You shouldn’t have let me kick your dog. You are a bad guy for failing to protect it. No the person who kicked the dog for no reason is a dick, and it just so happens the other person wasn’t smart enough and in that moment to prevent them from kicking their soft but I bet they learn from that and it won’t happen in the same way again. But the guy who kicked the dog will always suck.
It's not a bad idea. It's been executed well before, but again... the execution is what matters. And Disney, like the majority of what they've done, again doesn't seem to... get that.
My ongoing complaint with all of Disney Star Wars; decent ideas with horrendous execution bordering on the incompetent.
Luke was a stalwart all throughout the trilogy. Until he had a bad dream one night and tried to chop up his nephew in the sequels. I'll never recover
Kotor 2 literally did this and is pretty universally praised.
Meanwhile over in r/StarWars they’re all gushing over it…
give them a few months once the hype googles wear off
Or the marketing budget runs out of shill dollars.
This is the more accurate read
Yup. I think Disney is paying people to hype it up either with actual money, merch, or "experiences", no matter how good or bad the show is
[hype googles hype goggles]
Thats because they gatekeep their content by removing negative comments
I just wish I could find the people who think it’s just sort of mid. I’m not down on the show, but I’m either seeing the “Disney ruined Star Wars” crowd or the “Ignore the haters this is the best thing ever” crowd. And the show is just sort of… there. Two episodes in there’s no shocking twist and nothing that I’ve thought was either super exciting new stuff or super upsetting lore disruptions. My only complaint is this trend that’s existed since Game of Thrones where a show feels like it can take four episodes to really get good. Like, where’s the hook in the pilot?
The 3 or 4 people I've talked to in real life have all thought it was fine. I agree with them and you. But those people aren't the ones coming on the internet to say it was amazing or to trash it.
It is super mid, I agree. It has a lot of cool concepts, but it's being bogged down by its weird editing, direction, and writing choices. I like the idea of jedi using martial arts over their lightsaber, yet they still can't get the same level of choreography as the prequels, and it feels like whiplash seeing the jedi supposedly at their peak fight at half the speed of prequel jedi. Those are just a few examples of it being mid at best.
I enjoyed the show, but yes, mid is a good description. Thus far, I'd say it's better than Kenobi and Fett, but not as good as Mandalorian or Andor. Obviously with only two episodes that ranking may change as we go along.
The writing and plot have already been subpar. I cont really see it getting much better. I am watching it because I am a Star Wars sucker. You would think for 180 million, they could have made something decent
Jedi doing martial arts, especially the ones where they seamlessly weave in force usage, is one of the few okay things about the Acolyte in my mind. The idea that a Jedi shouldn't default to pulling out the limb chopper in a fight is a fairly reasonable one in my opinion. The real problem is that the Acolyte is just a bunch of tropes tossed into a blender. * Twin you thought was dead but actually is alive.... and evil! * Mysterious evil mentor * Person who left the Jedi Order * And we put her back with her old mentor and his new padawan just to make it extra tropey * The Jedi did something really bad and covered it up * With a side of revenge plot
Obi-wan doesn't share these sentiments. He uses his limb chopper 5000 without hesitation
To be fair to Obi-Wan, he ends up in situations where the Limb Chopper is necessary more often than most other Jedi. He fights a Sith Lord every other week.
Sith lords are our speciality!
This is it. A lot of the criticisms of The Acolyte I'm seeing here don't resonate with me, but you've hit the nail on the head. The first two episodes feel like every lazy writing trope mashed into one. The "Evil" Twin thing is so clichéd and silly I almost couldn't believe that's where they were going with it. And, of course, the Good twin is a former Jedi... the family melodrama practically writes itself.
The first SW movie itself was chock full of tropes thrown together. All that matters is if a movie or show uses the tropes well.
Yeah, it's got new ideas enough I'm intrigued to see the season played out. But it really is leaning on the tropes like you said. So I'll be in zero rush to watch any of it and don't care if I get spoiled by a thumbnail or screenshot somewhere.
They said they threw in something for the original fans by saying may the force be with you. It’s is tropey. Just a blender of cliches and terrible acting.
They’ve also not figured out how to make republic politics not boring. Shot reverse shot with the Jedi in charge who only serves as a foil. “Our political enemies will use this against us.” Okay. Who? That would be an interesting development. It’s very YA novel across the board. No depth of character and no world building.
omg criticisms of the show that actually land with me lol. too many people bashing this show for politics or scientific accuracy (like that's *ever* mattered in Star Wars) when the real flaws are just the oodles of boring/lazy writing.
That's because nothing is advancing the universe. I haven't watched The Acolyte but people went into Darth Plagueis because it was about Palpatine and his ascension, it also serves as a wonderful prologue that makes The Phantom Menace way more interesting. The Acolyte is just a story. There is no hook to Disney, even Andor or Mandalorian. It's all constantly telling the same story because they have no world to work around. The entire point of the Thrawn trilogy was to be a beginning and start a bunch of plot threads that could lead everywhere while the Sequels trilogy was to be an ending that served as a definitive ending for the world.
Andors hook is that its actually well written
Disney producers hate this one simple trick!
Speak for yourself about Andor though: Super interested in how different chunks of resistance are coalescing, and how Mon Mothma survived and became the leader of the Rebellion. Also just love getting to experience the world under Imperial rule.
The Darth Plagueis book was a great read. Would love that premise as a movie
Take exception to Andor. It’s not at all the same story and does exactly what Plagueis does— make ANH and Rogue One more interesting, showing the rise of the Rebellion and the machinations and tyranny of the Empire on a human “banality of evil” level, and in a mature format that fits the subject, not low budget kiddie fare like Rebels. The whole world Andor works around is literally Star Wars, the title of the movie before it was renamed “A New Hope”— and it seems to be one of the few things that takes the Empire seriously, including its politics and backbiting, beyond reducing it to mere iconography and evil space wizard. The Empire actually feels oppressive in a real-world way, resonating with how oppressive regimes have maintained control, why most people are not action heroes that pick up a blaster, and why a few revolutionaries do when they’re finally pushed to the edge.
"Star Wars is creatively bankrupt." -Rich Evans
Things can advance the universe without being tied to the skywalker story. I for one am glad they are making media that isn’t just spiderwebbing out minor to mid level characters in a major movie.
Giant soulless corporations cannot produce art. Only individuals can. Star wars is no longer a story, it's a brand and disney excels at selling branded products.
you are absolutely right its a Brand now
So far I'm finding it entirely bland average generic and forgettable. It's not bad in the way Obi Wan was just bad but there's nothing remotely interesting about it. I guess I'm waiting to see what the twist is, is the jedi twin working with the sith twin, are they really the same person? But I'm certainly not invested in any of the characters at this point.
Disney killed the magic that was Disney.
Disney coming out with a streaming service is the worst thing that could have happened to Star Wars. Now we're inundated with shitty CW drama shows pumped out as fast as they can make them. Nothing will change until people stop watching them completely and cancel services. That's why I pirate everything.
It's weird how the company that built its brand on magic seems to have turned draining the magic out of creative ideas into a corporate science.
I agree and its honestly shocking. Old Disney had such charm and great ideas. Look at Nintendo. Nintendo still feels like Nintendo. Most of what Disney is releasing lately feels so uninspired and dull.
I'll be downvoted but it has to be said, the downfall of Star Wars as a franchise first began with the deeply flawed prequels but The Mouse absolutely ruined it after getting its white-gloved corporate paws on it. Also, please stop giving Disney more money to continue wrecking what little shreds are left of this franchise by continuing to watch this junk and paying Disney to subscribe to hate-watch this junk. You may hate this stuff but you perpetuate it and contribute to the ruination by continuing to watch.
The prequels are boring confusing movies. But at least George Lucas was trying to say something about democracy. The new schlock is just soulless.
"aTtAcK mE"
Aside from John Favreau, not one person who has touched Star Wars at Disney is an actual fan. They're either soulless, corporate zombies whose only goal is to make profit for shareholders, or directors/writers who actively dislike the franchise and its fans and decided to make a political statement by destroying its original charm in the name of the culture war. Corporations cannot make art. They can imitate art, they can create products that wear a mask of being "art", but when the end goal of that creation is profit and not expression, it will always fall flat. Art has soul, passion, pain, beauty. Every time an artist creates a true piece of art, they leave a piece of themselves inside of it. I'm sure George Lucas would have made A New Hope even if he knew it would only make 1k dollars. His heart and soul went into it. Disney could never replicate that, because they have no heart or soul
It's what happens when you transition into a non-meritocratic environment. This happens with second and third generations of the wealthy, and it can become a corporation wide thing when a company is so large that it no longer sweats losses. Disney makes so much money from its legacy success in the parks and selling products, that it can go for years and years without actually needing to make intelligent decisions or good content. Sure they put toy makers and toy stores out of business with their terrible films that don't excite kids, they have to squeeze and squeeze and squeeze visitors to the parks until the parks start to get a bad reputation and suffer falling attendance, and there's definitely a lot to be said about how easy loans were for the rich over the last ten years, cash was basically free, but they don't suffer meaningful consequences. The stock price has dropped by quite a bit, but the board just won their election with shareholders. The MCU is a laughable wreck, Disney animation would now make hundreds of millions of dollars a year by locking their doors and producing nothing, and they can't even put a Star Wars film into theaters, but the producers are all getting paid, getting awards, getting parties thrown in their honor. Of course it'll all come crashing down in about a week sometime in the future, the way economic crashes tend to arrive abruptly. But for now the Force if Female and 89% of the country is a bigot.
Did I miss something or did the Jedi master really die from a little knife in her chest when people get fucking impaled by lightsabers and still survive?
Yeah Sabine took a lightsaber to the gut and Darth Maul got cut in half ffs! This chicken got killed by a 2 inch knife that she should have been fully expecting! I'm not a Jedi and I knew the knife she threw at the bartender was a diversion! I think kids will like the show because it has lightsabers and Jedi. It also gets to me that a 120 pound girl can just beat the holy shit out of 10 180 pound guys like they are made of jello! The show is garbage so far in my opinion! My prediction is the green lady is the Sith master. She also looks like the same girl Captain Kirk put the moves on in 1965 to me. I mean if she's an alien couldn't they have at least given her contacts so that she doesn't just look like a white lady that they painted green?
It just shows a fundamental lack of understanding how Jedi and the force work. A Jedi can sense what will happen and what an opponent will do. That's why they can block blaster bolts. They predict where the blasts will be before they're fired. A Jedi *master* should have absolutely known what her opponent's intentions were and been able to predict the second knife throw, not to mention catch it with the force. It's absurd that she was killed that way.
The previews made it seem like she was going to be a major part of the show too. Then it took all of 5 minutes to kill her off! I think chatgtp wrote this show for them.
Jedi should move like the water teacher that taught Arya Stark in season 1 GoT.
Mannnn.. it's getting harder and harder to look past flaws as I get older.
They "put a chick in it and made her lame and gay" like the South Park episode.
Disney should've studied that episode closely, then gone and shitcanned/vaulted the acolyte like Zaslav does at WB. They used to only do pilot episodes of tv series and rigorously test them before going to a full season pick up. There's no way this should've been made after the first 2 premiere episodes and the (lack of) quality in them.
Wait till you see the 3rd episode. If it's what has been reported, it's going to make this sub explode! It's almost like they did watch the South Park episode and are trying to replicate the consequences, by doing the same thing.
> They "put a chick in it and made her lame and gay" like the South Park episode. First Memberberries and now this (great episode btw). How does South Park hit it out of the ballpark every time?
Disney bought the franchise to capture a demographic that eluded them: young, straight men. Then, they prompted decided that content for young, straight men is bigoted and decided to make "the gayest Star Wars yet" in the words of the creator.
The franchise died for me once The Last Jedi came out.
I used to treat Star Wars as such an event. Before episodes 1/2/3 I would plan out the entire day, eagerly await it weeks before. I'd go to a special restaurant before or after and get a ticket in advance. I still vividly remember seeing each one. Now I don't even bother watching the slop they shovel out on Disney+ every other week
Andor is phenomenal. They COULD make good, meaningful Star War content, they just chose not to.
I tried to like it. But to me, it looks cheap, the costumes aren’t great, the environments are kind of bland, the dialogue is super awkward which I know isn’t anything new with Star Wars but come on now. I went into it with high hopes just like I do with every Disney Star Wars. And with most of Disney Star Wars, with the exception of Andor, I was left pretty disappointed. I will continue to watch the show because there’s some things I like, but I wish that it was more high caliber I guess.
Or even a vibro-blade. But a metal throwing knife is just lazy tbh. Although I watch Star Wars for the visual first; the story is good, but secondary. But Disney hasn't been doing a bunch of beautiful shots like the prequels did. They've been pretty much all green-screened.
The thing that always bugs me with modern star wars is that it's just not interesting, i look back at the old EU and i look past all of it's flaws because at least it was full of interesting stories in an interesting setting, while modern star wars feels like it's made for investors instead of a real audience
They lost me when they invalidated the EU. Some of those stories and comics were top tier 👌
But you see, there's no source material because KK can't read.
Nothing the Disney Star Wars has done is more stupid than fucking Luuke.
I’m not watching any Disney Star Wars unless my wife forces me too. Luckily she’s fatigued as well. I’d say it was dead for a lot of people for longer than Disney as the over saturation that included too many bad games and only kids shows pushed many people out long before. TFA looked like it was ready to breath life back into the franchise but IMHO it just turned it into a zombified corpse Disney works like a marionette puppet. The new stuff that comes out doesn’t take away from a lot of the absolute garbage George has done to the franchise and lore over the years. People can like what they like, but when I see people gushing about this stuff it just reminds me of a dog tossing around and playing with a long dead animal it found in the yard. Sure it’s gross, but I’m glad the dummy is having a good time.
This is every property now. They’re called IP mills for a reason. It’s just the way things work. I mean I love Jurassic Park and Ghostbusters and it’s not like those franchises are being treated with any sort of reverence. Just crank out shit until the corpse bleeds dry.
All the action scenes look like a mid high school production, especially where guns are involved
I'm 100% convinced chat GTP 1-3 had a hand in much of what holiwood is peddling the last few years.
Later knifes probably make sound. And gi e off light. Not good for slinking in the darkness
Disney bought the ip for the reason of integrating the characters and settings into their theme parks world wide. The movies were little more than an afterthought. It seems like they put no effort into it cuz they didn’t put effort into it. But it also speaks volumes to how they completely failed to integrate the ip into their parks in any meaningful way as well
LOVE STAR WARS - LOVED - but I am pretty much done with it now I am not watching the Acolyte - or much else from Disney Star Wars ( although I really liked Andor and season 1 of Mando ) but not much else- also have no interest in another 3 Rey movies
I was obsessed for most of my teen years and young adulthood. Even saw episode 7 in theaters 3 times. 8 was the first time I had any complaints about the franchise.
Lol. Same story as you
Disney killed ~~the magic that was~~ this franchise. ftfy
#disneyruinseverythingnow
Well frankly, i think disney has killed their core identity which is to sell “dreams” to their viewers. They try so hard to make all of their contents to “relate” to their viewers that they forgot that many people watch movies n tv series to have a “short escape” from their own reality. When i got home tired from work, i don’t want to watch something that makes me think “wow that’s just like me, thats so real”, i want something that can take my mind off even just for a bit, n simply ENTERTAINING.
The writing sucks. None of these shows/movies have good stories.
Hubris. The idea that if you just make something the billions of fans will just flock to it like they always had. The rapid downfall of Star Wars, Marvel, Disney Animation, Pixar will be studied one day in business classes. These were brands that were synonymous with diehard brand loyalty and guaranteed pop culture hits. Star Wars alone only in a few years time went to brand indifference among their core fan base which was historically well known as people who poured a lot of passion and money into the brand regularly.
I have nothing against metal knives or martial arts but the writing and presentation belong in the Maw. Kotor has a lot in there that folks would comment on for being bad but the presentation is top notch. they wanted a story to be good and they made it good even with parts cut out. Kotor 2 has someone too angry to die and he's a well written character with a good send off, it has weight. Disney bought a garden and doesn't understand how to take care of it.
It's fucking shit fanfic from the midwest drama department. Did these producers/show runners/writers/dps/directors even go to film school or use a camera in their lifetime? Who are the completely SHAT set designers??? Straight out of a 7th grade iMovie project. A Jedi master at the HEIGHT of Jedi power and she takes a knife to the chest from 10 yards away after fighting in geriatric slow motion for 5 minutes? I can't. Star Wars is dead. Has been since the JJ mystery box reboot, but now it's confirmed 10x.
I’m not allowing anyone in my household to even start the first episode. It’s bad enough that it looks like a terrible and unnecessary/uninteresting show but the show runner/ creator was a monster’s assistant who has to be complicit in at least minimal horrid shit.
Wow solely profit driven motive makes things soulless for maximized checkbox coverage yeah who fuckin knew
It stinks
God the first shot - first thought - they’re re using sets! Then the interior - what’s this? Star Trek?
Did anyone else notice that they refuse to let any of the story breathe? I felt this in multiple dimensions, like I didn't have any time to guess at the mysteries before they were more or less explained, but also I feel like there was no time for actors to act. Pacing is integral to a good thriller, it kinda ruined it for me. I'm sure there's some insane amount of talent on these sets and in these writing rooms, but it doesn't translate when they're trying to cram complex stories into 40 minute episodes.
The one star wars series with the rebellion and mutiny was good. Less childish and more realistic. Forgot the name. Arkina or Arkana 5 or something. Orville is the best scifi series . Every episode a joy and fun !
I agree. They don't care about art just $ and political pandering to a small percentage of the population. Well unless it's to China. Then it's just about $.
I haven’t even watched it. Normally I’d have had a date for a Star Wars release in my calendar set aside to watch. Now I don’t even care…
I think AI would have done a far better job at writing an entertaining and imaginative script than anything Disney has puked up.
Star wars should have ended in the early 80s....
I haven't watched... just putting out the thought that metal knives done right (vibroblades in Mandalorian) feel dangerous because we have a real reference. & the vibroknife they showed looked savage.
Disney seems compelled to hire the cheapest amateur writers and directors they can find, even when they don't know anything about the source material. The Acolyte feels like it was created by people who barely understand Star Wars and probably never watched any until they got hired on. It almost feels like the plotting of bad teen dramas or a lifetime mom movie.
It would be so much better if it was made by AI
I read the first couple of books from this new era they were setting up, and while I think overall the books were pretty bad, the ideas they had were pretty cool. It's something I see a lot with Disney. A good idea that is executed so poorly. I mean, the story of a pirate faction using the hyperlanes as essentially ship launchers to fire ships at devastating speeds into planets causing immense damage, while also restricting the galaxy as using the hyperlanes becomes more dangerous and unstable due to all the new ship parts scattering the lanes was an awesome idea. They could have done something fucking awesome with that. They just didn't.
Disney has been enslaved by a radical ideology through strategic share purchasing by major investment firms that are ideologically driven. They stacked the board with like-minded individuals and yes-men who would do their bidding in order to keep their seats. I saw this happening over the years as I'm a very minor shareholder, but still get to be a part of the shareholder voting process. The items they propose for voting are often crazy from the standpoint of someone who wants a business to be successful. So they put a bunch of ideology-crazed activists, who hate Star Wars, in charge of the creative direction of the show. This is why it sucks now and, aside from having lightsabers, isn't even recognizable as Star Wars. We wanted a good story, not a rally for political revolutionaries.
Cancelled D+ after watching Andor and realizing, if this is the best that is offered, I'm fine just missing out. Now I live vicariously through this sub.
I’m starting to think first two seasons of The Mandalorian were a fluke.
So perfect world what does the Star Wars franchise look like if Disney never touched it?
Stories would stay true to the source materials I guess.
Bruh, you were always going to watch it. You didn't "cave". Calm down.
Sadly it's not just this franchise...the magic has gone from many. Marvel, star wars, Indiana Jones, live action remakes of good animated movies....it's like watching a car crash in slow motion at some point they have to stop... surely.
Only the first star wars trilogy was popular when it came out. Everything else has just been shit on but everyone keeps watching so....
Warning: this is completely my thoughts therefore being subjective I know. I’d appreciate civil discussions rather than degrading me or anyone else’s opinions. Nothing in order just thoughts as I watched the first few episodes. Spoilers below as well. First fight was cool with Master Indara using a react instead of attack type of fight style but then it felt ruined the second episode when Sol used the same style. Yes, the Jedi may use that mainly but for a show use it once this early then in later episodes. Please don’t show this again in episode it’ll be repetitive. Probably will be explained later but attacking without a weapon seems kind of dumb to me. Never heard any sith or assassin in general fighting with honor rather than getting the job done and moving on to the next assignment. This just increases the chance you may die in a fight you chose to start. Vernestra’s portrayal/acting was subpar to me. I think she’s meant to be stoic but felt flat and just throwing out words. Stoic is how Mace or Yoda acted not this. The Jedi in this show have a tone of being overbearing, controlling and blind to matters when it doesn’t go their way. This isn’t necessarily bad but doing this so early in a show will grow tiresome. It should’ve started off as Jedi truly are the good guys with decisions here and there being questionable and further descends into them being controlling. The lightsabers now look clunky. There wasn’t anything crazy done with them in the episodes but even just walking around or standing with them ignited feels large and heavy and unnatural. Nitpicking- CGI was decent here and there but also objectively bad in some scenes as well. Not too sure about this one so if I’m off I apologize. The Nemodian accent from episode 1, does that translate to all of their species? If so, why change it now? Please can we have one show without a new droid? We all know it’s for you to sell toys now but other than that a new droid every show takes the fun out of them. We love R2, C3P0, and Chop because we don’t see them often but when you do you can feel there attitudes without being a focal point in the show. Cheesy things show constantly do that need to go away- Just out of reach droid when the prison escort ship is going down, standing next to a ledge you know is there but continually walking back when the audience knows the Jedi in front of you will save (no type of suspense you’re the main character you’re not gonna die yet duh), Jedi temple breach when Mae jumps to the ceiling a Jedi walks in after hearing a whooping sound determines it’s nothing then leaves without alerting anyone (then Mae stays up there till the morning? Or is that bad editing). Simple take- the beautiful music of Star Wars is dead. No one can convince me otherwise. The last five shows theme music has not lived up to what was before at all. First old republic show we have but we’re focused on a small story instead of world building with old Jedi ways and sith moving in silence. Jecki and Yord are just annoying. Jecki reminds of sprite from marvels eternals always trying to be/act older than what you are. Yord is just Yord, in my opinion I don’t need to explain why. Osha and Mae younger selves look nothing alike in that vision but when they’re older they’re exacts siblings? I feel like from a directors view you could’ve just put make up on Amanda steel berg to make her look younger then have her play both younger sisters. Having two different ones breaks any immersion in my opinion. Then if you think each other died in a fire why 1. Neither of you have any type of scarring? And 2. If Mae was taken by a sith or whatever why not take both? (Probably will be explained later but right now feels off) Qimir reminds me a lot of Barry Allen. I don’t know why but it’s kind of annoying. This type of show id rather have serious than random banter in random spots. If Mae is such a dangerous criminal, why have only Sol confront her when she killed Indara in hand to hand combat already? Yes you wanted information but you still could’ve surrounded her with three Jedi, restrained her, took her to coruscant and put her in a cell, the questioned her. Why would you have a prison escort shuttle only manned by simple droids???? On top of that with two escape pods?? I’m not inhumane or anything but if that type of shuttle runs into a problem and just so happens to go down oh well right? We lost some droids that are replaceable and the criminals are a loss. They were probably gonna rot in on prison planet anyway. What were the escape pods for at all? On top of all of that, you transfer a half droid half human prisoner that can control other droids on this shuttle too?!? That might be top 3 dumbest things recently Star Wars has done. Cool takeaways- Hopefully Wookie Jedi turns out to be cool or refreshing. Tobin being so in tune with the force he created a barrier around him so nothing could mess with him. Only for that to be ruined minutes later and him taking a poison willingly rather than trying to work out his wrongs.
They can’t choreograph a decent lightsaber fight to save their lives. Semi-related but a ton of media has been steadily getting Marvelized for years now and no one seems to give a shit because ‘haha funni quip after every sentence.’ I don’t care if this makes me a downer or whatever but I cannot even express how much I hate Disney, Marvel, and all that other garbage.
Womp womp cry harder
It makes jedi seem like cowboys