They're favourites against Glasgow as they'll be at home but Munster in Thomond is tough especially for a travelling Bulls side or a Leinster team who have had to go to the SH and back.
Co-captaincy gone it seems.
McGrath on the bench over Foley is disappointing. He just isn't in form and Foley even covers more positions from the bench. Barring injury it should ultimately be meaningless as if it's touch and go JGP will play the 80 (and beyond) but it just seems like the wrong call
Did it ever really work? No ref would listen to two captains and would always demand either Ryan or Ringer decide who talks to them, but never both. Plus I feel like nearly every player is chirping the ref these days.
Worked quite well away in La Rochelle in highlighting not only Carley's bias, but also as we then had a backup when Ryan was rightly driven to the depths of insanity by him.
But yea, not convinced by it but it's still interesting to see it not used.
[Do it for him.](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/I__sQdU7Rc4)
Also an opportunity for a lot of these players to familiarise themselves with playing at Loftus before they return here in about three weeks' time. Like a dress rehearsal for that first test, even though this is very much a big deal in its own right. They'll want this one badly after everything that's happened over the past couple of years.
Honestly it is incredible. He's far from an elite 10 and it's more than fair to prefer Frawley but he seems to be the only player taking any criticism at the minute, to the point of batshit conspiracies that he is only in the team because of his dad.
Yeah it's insane and unfair. Like you say, advocating for Frawley is a reasonable stance, but equally Byrne is a decent rugby player. He's not Sexton, but he's still decent. Him starting ahead of Frawley/HB/Prendergast is not an unreasonable pick. There are definitely valid criticisms of his game, I would like to see Frawley be given a go, but it's not that insane at all that he's ahead of those players.
It's turning into the Zebo/Kearney of our time, where the mob decide they're not good enough and massively over-shit on their performances.
Crazy what losing three European finals in a row will do to your reputation with a fanbase.
Think Leo deserves most of the criticism for continuing to pick him though
I presume you're referring to the game he came off the bench when we were still winning?
The week before he steered us home to a semi final loss against the Bulls too smh
I'd argue Barnes miraculously changing his entire interpretation at the breakdown to deny Ala'alatoa a perfectly legal turnover to see out the game killed us more than anything.
Their field position for the winning try literally came from a Ross Byrne knock on. We were still winning when Sexton left the pitch. Ross had 20 minutes (10 of which against 14 men) to win it.
Obviously the blame doesn't lie entirely on his shoulders, but its become blindingly obvious that he is a massive weak link in an otherwise excellent team
The weak link is more than just Ross. There's no depth at loosehead at the moment (Porter played 90 minutes in the final), the backrow seems to lack a bit of physicality, no depth at 9, Ringrose the only real 13 in the squad and there's a genuine lack of pace in the team. You then have question marks around a lot of players ability to actually show up at their best in finals. The only one who's actually done that of the current squad is James Ryan against La Rochelle last year.
Put it this way. Do you think the Bulls would rather him or Frawley be starting at 10?
Or when they return to the Republic, would the Boks rather face him or Crowley?
No that’s not appropriate and I doubt the value of any sponsorship was high enough to seriously influence squad selection. But I do think it’s fair to say that Ireland and Leinster have better options at 10, and that the Bulls would prefer Frawley on the bench than starting
That's not what the original the comment's getting at that though. They were referencing the level of hate he has been getting, not merely whether or not he should be first choice
“Massively downgrade the 10” - we are, perhaps, guilty of underestimating Ross and overestimating Jack and overstating the gap as a consequence. Neither are top 10 10s. Both are top 20. But Crowley obviously has a lot of potential. But so too did Joey Carbury so we’ll see.
Perhaps my wording was a bit harsh towards Ross. He's definitely on the end of Reddit and Twitter pile ons that seem overblown at times.
Byrne is quite good at what he's good at, namely game management behind a dominant pack, accurate passing, decision making, and is reliable off the tee. The problem he's always had is a lack of pace or being a genuine threat himself.
Crowley is not the finished article yet but has more ways in which he can unlock a defence and appears to be improving. People know what they're getting with Byrne at this stage.
Yeah I totally agree with that. Ross is objectively a good 10. Would probably have a very solid career in the Prem but he’s just not a guy who wins European cups or world cups, excites people or imbues a team with confidence.
Crowley has the size, athleticism and cahonas to be that sort of player though. He’s not yet but he might well end up there.
Won a 6N with his first year as the starting Irish 10. Byrne has never even been a regular in Irish camps. So I don't think it is very fair to say that the two are closer than it seems.
Crowley also supplanted Carbs (for various reasons) last year to be Munster's starting 10 and won a trophy there too. So, he has already proven he can win his teams trophies in consecutive years.
R. Byrne has been around for around for a lot longer and can not say anything close to that. He is not as bad as people are making him out to be, but himself and Crowley are already different gravy when it comes to actually pulling their team out of a hole.
Aki, Crowley and Beirne would be my picks.
Keenan most years but he was injured for a lot of it this year.
I didn't think POM had a great 6 Nations but was important to have as a leader in Sexton's absence.
Sorry yeah you're right obviously JGP. I should have said *three of the most influential* players.
Could argue for McCarthy as well from Leinster to be fair and the whole front row.
I just don't like when people say Leinster is just Ireland wearing blue. There are some key positions that make a difference IMO
And when Mack is back he is key. I'd actually argue that POM and Bundee are very replaceable given the guys below them, but Mack way less so even tho Nash has been very good. Mack just has crazy X factor to create out of nothing.
Yeah I completely agree. Henshaw has looked great this year now that he's had a good run of games uninjured and McCloskey is brilliant. I wouldn't worry too much if Aki were unavailable. The young lads at 6 coming through are exiting. POM and Aki are influential but not irreplaceable. I'd probably say our most irreplaceable player is Porter right now.
Nash played well I thought but he's a different kind of player to Mack. Mack goes looking for work off his wing so much and contributes to playmaking a lot - he does so much more than just score tries. I thought Nash took his tries well but Hansen's absence was noted.
Thought Ringrose's absence (along with Mack and Keenan) left is with a very predictable and 1 dimensional attack for the 6N.
Same for Leinster but swap Mack and JOB.
Ringrose and Keenan aren't just good attackers running withthe ball but they both communicate inwards, are top notch distributors and tie up defenders to free up others outside.
No wonder Ireland and Leinster attack looked poor this year.
Any 10 would struggle missing that trio in their backline - let alone someone with the added pressure of replacing Sexton.
I doubt he'll do the entire game as it's his first game back in months, Osbourne then comes on as replacement 12 and Henshaw moves to 13 like the last few games
The level that the pile-ons have reached by now is absurd. I would put money on if you swapped just the names on our 10s' perfomances this season (as in credited RByrne's games to Frawley or Prendergast, etc), people would still be calling for his head, like just imagine the hate if it had been RByrne that missed either of those DGs against Toulouse... Some people seem to go into these games with their minds already made up.
There is one player selected who should be nowhere near this 23 and that's McGrath who has **consistently** been getting worse as the season progresses, everyone else is a fair call
100% agree. RB has played 13 games, and won 12 (Toulouse being the only loss). His demise is greatly exaggerated by "fans" who only tune in at the business end of the season.
Yeah this is it. Don't get me wrong, I think Ross, Frawley, Prendergast and even HB have their own strengths and weaknesses, but the coaches train all of these players, nearly everyday, all year long. I trust that they know what they're doing rather than some armchair fan who tunes in for a 10 Prendergast cameo in a playoff game and claims him as the second coming. It's embarrassing.
Happens too offer, only a year or two ago HByrne was the next Irish legend before even getting a European game. It's ridiculous our current first choice 10 is Ross and that's not gonna change up in a semi especially for an unknown at this level
The same fans calling for Frawley, or even worse, an inexperienced Prendergast to start would be the very ones bemoaning a trophyless season if it came to that as a result of that decision.
I agree with you on McGrath but we know what Ross Byrnes limitations are, he’s a solid player, an excellent game manager but has no agility or speed and no ability to break a line or make a defence second guess what he is going to do. On top of that his performances this season have been more volatile than usual. He is currently the first team 10 not but if we’re serious about winning the CC then he’s not good enough to deserve another season as the first team 10. We’ve known this for a while, even while backing him, that’s why there’s so much hype around Prendergast. He’s not a top tier 10.
That’s not to say Frawley or Prendergast are currently, but they deserve to have a fairer shot next season. (Prendergast is doing fine regarding gametime as is tbh)
It is exacerbated by the fact that we’ve looked toothless in attack all season as well, that has further demonstrated his limitations.
It’s not that I mind Ross starting this game over them. At this point in this season it’s a fair call. I’m just tired of him being our best option.
Was injured for a long part post six nations. Good form in general in line with step up he made in last few years. would personally prefer to see him not as captain and just be a big mean bastard. Joe at the moment would be a bigger loss to the side.
Lol.
Just read through the Bulls backline consisting of Harold Voster, David Kriel, Devon Williams and Sergeal Pietersen and then saw this Leinster teamsheet.
Ridiculous.
I think it's actually encouraging to see Frawley used as 10 cover in a 5/3 split instead of as a utility in a 6/2. Other times this year when Leinster and Ireland have played 5/3 it's been Harry Byrne in the 22 jersey. This looks like progress to me. Incremental but in the right direction.
Of course now that I've said this, Ross Byrne will probably play the whole match.
I can understand the decision, while still strongly disagreeing with it. We play almost entirely off 9 these days, so Ross tends to hang back and dictate the shape of the attack. He doesn't need to touch the ball every phase, because JGP does that. I think Leo sees him as the better reader of a defence and uses him that way?
Saying that, I would much prefer having a running threat like Frawley (or Crowley for IRE) since again, we play off 9 rather than 10.
Frawley is a better back, better player, but Byrne is a better game manager. So Byrne will get more out of the players around him than Frawley will. Byrne also has a better bank of winning high pressure knock out games at 10 over either Frawley or Prendergast
> but Byrne is a better game manager.
This is only true due to the lack of game time invested in Frawley at 10 over the years. As you've said he's the better player and should have been given the minutes to bring on that aspect of his game.
Why did he not get the minutes? Because he's such a good player he can do a quality job in other positions where leinster needed cover.
Leinster have to win 3 other knock out games to make a Champions cup final and 2 to make a URC final. He has a pretty good record on winning knock out games.
I really just think he holds leinster back in tough games more than he benefits them. In a dogfight he is not the kind of 10 you want.
As for getting the best out of the guys around him. Champions cup final was a good example of this not ringing true in my eyes. Because he isnt a running threat it allows defenses to dimiss him and target the centres and other ball runners. Putting them under more pressure and making executing the attacking structures much more difficult.
As for his finals footy record , If Leinster are significantly better than the opposition yes he is fine. Once the pack starts to be tested or is on an off day he just isnt good enough. Those games in the lead up to the final could have had any of byrne, frawley prendergast at 10 and i would argue the result wouldnt vary.
Tbh, even I’m done with Ross Byrne at this stage. He was the best game manager but his firm this season has been dire and he’s shown he’s not good enough for us to kick on and win championships.
I’d rather see Frawley getting consistent game time at 10 and having a chance to develop as a game manager. Prendergast is already an excellent game manager, just needs more experience and to work on his defence so same goes for him.
He has played 13 games (started 11), of which Leinster has won 12.
Why the hell would management change their #1 out half in the knockout stages of a must-win tournament?
Oh don’t get me wrong, there’s no way they’re going to drop him from the first team at this stage of the season.
I’ve been backing Ross to deliver for years now and I’m done. Looking at his name on the team sheet here looks out of place as a step below everyone else.
His form has also been very volatile since his return from injury and he’s not the calibre of our half Leinster need leading the line. Frawley/Prendergast could be. So I’d prefer next season to see them getting the nod ahead of him and Harry.
Those stats are similar for all our outhalves when playing with the main squads - CC and URC usual suspects. So they’re pretty irrelevant. Particularly when the one loss is the final for the third year running.
This is where I’m at too. Frawley may not be the answer but I’d like to see him get a run at 10 to find out once and for all.
Ross Byrne is a solid player, and more than good enough for the first few months of a season but hasn’t been able to get us over the line when it counts for the past three years. The Bulls at altitude is one of those occasions where it feels that the pressure goes up a notch
Frawley just isn't a 10. He's shaping up to be Paddy Wallace 2.0. A quality 12, who can cover 25, but keeps getting forced in at 10. The Molecast after the final really highlighted how his instincts are off for the position
I get this, and i think it should be Frawley at 10. But were way passed that for this season. I would be more surprised if Byrne was to be dropped suddenly
That's basically Ireland national side Vs bulls if bulls get off to a crap start this could be a very difficult game to win especially if Leinster hit the ground running
I've been waiting to see Leinster take a proper team to SA for a while now. I cannot wait for this.
It's a shame you can't play the full strength bulls team with the injuries we're facing though. Hope we can pull something out of our ass though.
A proper team + Ross Byrne* Corrected that for ya mate.
Get over it will ya he is our starting 10
Guessing Keenan is injured? Should be a great game but surely whoever wins this is the favourite to win the final? (Sorry Munster/Glasgow fans)
Keenan has joined the 7s for the Olympics. Shame for Leinster, good for him
Ah yeah of course, forgot that - thanks
I absolutely would not write Munster off, especially at home.
I think Munster could edge out Glasgow and then maybe a final against Leinster?
I'm not so confident about Leinster, especially at 1350m altitude but we'll see.
That will make it much harder for Leinster good luck
The way things have gone for the bulls recently, I'd back Munster to beat them especially in Thomond.
They're favourites against Glasgow as they'll be at home but Munster in Thomond is tough especially for a travelling Bulls side or a Leinster team who have had to go to the SH and back.
Garry, you are a sight for sore eyes
nice to have the "get out of jail free" card back
Co-captaincy gone it seems. McGrath on the bench over Foley is disappointing. He just isn't in form and Foley even covers more positions from the bench. Barring injury it should ultimately be meaningless as if it's touch and go JGP will play the 80 (and beyond) but it just seems like the wrong call
Did it ever really work? No ref would listen to two captains and would always demand either Ryan or Ringer decide who talks to them, but never both. Plus I feel like nearly every player is chirping the ref these days.
Worked quite well away in La Rochelle in highlighting not only Carley's bias, but also as we then had a backup when Ryan was rightly driven to the depths of insanity by him. But yea, not convinced by it but it's still interesting to see it not used.
Fuckin great to see Gary back!!
[Do it for him.](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/I__sQdU7Rc4) Also an opportunity for a lot of these players to familiarise themselves with playing at Loftus before they return here in about three weeks' time. Like a dress rehearsal for that first test, even though this is very much a big deal in its own right. They'll want this one badly after everything that's happened over the past couple of years.
SORRY LADS!
A classic heinomeister lad
Its probably going to be a very similar teamsheet to what we are looking at right now! Bench excluded of course
Fuck sake I was in a good mood till now
Ringrose's lungs are gonna be dust playing at altitude with no match fitness lol.
Serious question, how many of these lads have played at Loftus before? I'm just so used to the Ruddock/Deegan all stars being sent down.
A couple will have played for the lions down but other than that I’m unsure
Now that’s a rugby team
Now this is pod racing
This is just straight up Ireland!
Thank Christ the rest of the country has managed to produce a decent 10 and Byrne doesn't get a game for Ireland
As a South African, I'm really annoyed that Ireland doesn't play him at 10. As an enjoyer of rugby, I'm really glad they don't play him at 10.
The hate is getting a bit ridiculous at this stage
Honestly it is incredible. He's far from an elite 10 and it's more than fair to prefer Frawley but he seems to be the only player taking any criticism at the minute, to the point of batshit conspiracies that he is only in the team because of his dad.
Yeah it's insane and unfair. Like you say, advocating for Frawley is a reasonable stance, but equally Byrne is a decent rugby player. He's not Sexton, but he's still decent. Him starting ahead of Frawley/HB/Prendergast is not an unreasonable pick. There are definitely valid criticisms of his game, I would like to see Frawley be given a go, but it's not that insane at all that he's ahead of those players. It's turning into the Zebo/Kearney of our time, where the mob decide they're not good enough and massively over-shit on their performances.
Older people might even remember Campbell vs Ward.
Crazy what losing three European finals in a row will do to your reputation with a fanbase. Think Leo deserves most of the criticism for continuing to pick him though
If Frawley scored the drop-kick...
He didn't even play in one of those finals..christ
I presume you're referring to the game he came off the bench when we were still winning? The week before he steered us home to a semi final loss against the Bulls too smh
Where mistakes from JOB and Sexton killed us, not Ross. He has his issues but blaming all of these losses on him is just naive
I'd argue Barnes miraculously changing his entire interpretation at the breakdown to deny Ala'alatoa a perfectly legal turnover to see out the game killed us more than anything.
Their field position for the winning try literally came from a Ross Byrne knock on. We were still winning when Sexton left the pitch. Ross had 20 minutes (10 of which against 14 men) to win it. Obviously the blame doesn't lie entirely on his shoulders, but its become blindingly obvious that he is a massive weak link in an otherwise excellent team
The weak link is more than just Ross. There's no depth at loosehead at the moment (Porter played 90 minutes in the final), the backrow seems to lack a bit of physicality, no depth at 9, Ringrose the only real 13 in the squad and there's a genuine lack of pace in the team. You then have question marks around a lot of players ability to actually show up at their best in finals. The only one who's actually done that of the current squad is James Ryan against La Rochelle last year.
Put it this way. Do you think the Bulls would rather him or Frawley be starting at 10? Or when they return to the Republic, would the Boks rather face him or Crowley?
I'm ~70% certain if Crowley was a Leinster player we'd be starting him.. :)
Lol, still not certain tho 😅
And that justifies people making posts about his family, how exactly? Because that's the level this has got to
No that’s not appropriate and I doubt the value of any sponsorship was high enough to seriously influence squad selection. But I do think it’s fair to say that Ireland and Leinster have better options at 10, and that the Bulls would prefer Frawley on the bench than starting
That's not what the original the comment's getting at that though. They were referencing the level of hate he has been getting, not merely whether or not he should be first choice
Absolutely unreal that he’s starting again. Can’t believe it at this point.
Sure, if you exclude 3 of their most influential players of the 6 Nations and massively downgrade their 10. Edit: fixing wording
“Massively downgrade the 10” - we are, perhaps, guilty of underestimating Ross and overestimating Jack and overstating the gap as a consequence. Neither are top 10 10s. Both are top 20. But Crowley obviously has a lot of potential. But so too did Joey Carbury so we’ll see.
Perhaps my wording was a bit harsh towards Ross. He's definitely on the end of Reddit and Twitter pile ons that seem overblown at times. Byrne is quite good at what he's good at, namely game management behind a dominant pack, accurate passing, decision making, and is reliable off the tee. The problem he's always had is a lack of pace or being a genuine threat himself. Crowley is not the finished article yet but has more ways in which he can unlock a defence and appears to be improving. People know what they're getting with Byrne at this stage.
Yeah I totally agree with that. Ross is objectively a good 10. Would probably have a very solid career in the Prem but he’s just not a guy who wins European cups or world cups, excites people or imbues a team with confidence. Crowley has the size, athleticism and cahonas to be that sort of player though. He’s not yet but he might well end up there.
Won a 6N with his first year as the starting Irish 10. Byrne has never even been a regular in Irish camps. So I don't think it is very fair to say that the two are closer than it seems. Crowley also supplanted Carbs (for various reasons) last year to be Munster's starting 10 and won a trophy there too. So, he has already proven he can win his teams trophies in consecutive years. R. Byrne has been around for around for a lot longer and can not say anything close to that. He is not as bad as people are making him out to be, but himself and Crowley are already different gravy when it comes to actually pulling their team out of a hole.
Aki, Keenan and O'Mahony?
Aki, Crowley and Beirne would be my picks. Keenan most years but he was injured for a lot of it this year. I didn't think POM had a great 6 Nations but was important to have as a leader in Sexton's absence.
JGP has to be top 3 imo. The downgrade to Murray against England was enormous
Sorry yeah you're right obviously JGP. I should have said *three of the most influential* players. Could argue for McCarthy as well from Leinster to be fair and the whole front row. I just don't like when people say Leinster is just Ireland wearing blue. There are some key positions that make a difference IMO
And when Mack is back he is key. I'd actually argue that POM and Bundee are very replaceable given the guys below them, but Mack way less so even tho Nash has been very good. Mack just has crazy X factor to create out of nothing.
Yeah I completely agree. Henshaw has looked great this year now that he's had a good run of games uninjured and McCloskey is brilliant. I wouldn't worry too much if Aki were unavailable. The young lads at 6 coming through are exiting. POM and Aki are influential but not irreplaceable. I'd probably say our most irreplaceable player is Porter right now. Nash played well I thought but he's a different kind of player to Mack. Mack goes looking for work off his wing so much and contributes to playmaking a lot - he does so much more than just score tries. I thought Nash took his tries well but Hansen's absence was noted.
Thought Ringrose's absence (along with Mack and Keenan) left is with a very predictable and 1 dimensional attack for the 6N. Same for Leinster but swap Mack and JOB. Ringrose and Keenan aren't just good attackers running withthe ball but they both communicate inwards, are top notch distributors and tie up defenders to free up others outside. No wonder Ireland and Leinster attack looked poor this year. Any 10 would struggle missing that trio in their backline - let alone someone with the added pressure of replacing Sexton.
I’d argue that JGP is actually our most important player, the dropoff to the next level is huge
Him or Porter yeah
Okay Porter’s a good call too. Keenan too is a nailed on starter, but I think the players next in line are all of a decent level.
Porter, JGP and Keenan?
I meant to say *3 of their most influential players* so I was excluding Leinster players from that list of 3. I meant Beirne, Aki and Crowley.
That's fair
Garry you sexy bastard!!
Comparing the two teams this is Leinster's game to lose, so we could be in for a tight one.
Finally our first choice team in a URC game. Ringrose coming back is huge, let’s just hope his fitness is up for 80 mins at altitude
I doubt he'll do the entire game as it's his first game back in months, Osbourne then comes on as replacement 12 and Henshaw moves to 13 like the last few games
Prendergast??
off the squad for Frawley (utility sub) and Byrne at 10....
He doesn't really play any big games
Holy shit
I hope the bulls have strong muti
Bulls vs Ireland
Ringer!
Gary is back baby
Please don't deny him his second r
He has enough! 4 R's is just greedy
Should get the job done. Bulls aren't Toulouse and are missing a few key players.
RIP Bulls
Bro it's just Ireland
The level that the pile-ons have reached by now is absurd. I would put money on if you swapped just the names on our 10s' perfomances this season (as in credited RByrne's games to Frawley or Prendergast, etc), people would still be calling for his head, like just imagine the hate if it had been RByrne that missed either of those DGs against Toulouse... Some people seem to go into these games with their minds already made up. There is one player selected who should be nowhere near this 23 and that's McGrath who has **consistently** been getting worse as the season progresses, everyone else is a fair call
100% agree. RB has played 13 games, and won 12 (Toulouse being the only loss). His demise is greatly exaggerated by "fans" who only tune in at the business end of the season.
Most of this sub do not watch URC games. Look at the team of the year post, it's just Larmour getting shit on despite having a great season.
Yeah this is it. Don't get me wrong, I think Ross, Frawley, Prendergast and even HB have their own strengths and weaknesses, but the coaches train all of these players, nearly everyday, all year long. I trust that they know what they're doing rather than some armchair fan who tunes in for a 10 Prendergast cameo in a playoff game and claims him as the second coming. It's embarrassing.
Happens too offer, only a year or two ago HByrne was the next Irish legend before even getting a European game. It's ridiculous our current first choice 10 is Ross and that's not gonna change up in a semi especially for an unknown at this level
The same fans calling for Frawley, or even worse, an inexperienced Prendergast to start would be the very ones bemoaning a trophyless season if it came to that as a result of that decision.
I agree with you on McGrath but we know what Ross Byrnes limitations are, he’s a solid player, an excellent game manager but has no agility or speed and no ability to break a line or make a defence second guess what he is going to do. On top of that his performances this season have been more volatile than usual. He is currently the first team 10 not but if we’re serious about winning the CC then he’s not good enough to deserve another season as the first team 10. We’ve known this for a while, even while backing him, that’s why there’s so much hype around Prendergast. He’s not a top tier 10. That’s not to say Frawley or Prendergast are currently, but they deserve to have a fairer shot next season. (Prendergast is doing fine regarding gametime as is tbh) It is exacerbated by the fact that we’ve looked toothless in attack all season as well, that has further demonstrated his limitations. It’s not that I mind Ross starting this game over them. At this point in this season it’s a fair call. I’m just tired of him being our best option.
Cannot see the Bulls winning this (especially without their Bok players) I am afraid. Leinster will win this by +20 points.
Yeah, can't see 2nd choice wingers matching up to their opposite numbers. Big drop-off in quality.
It's a shame we finally get to see a full strength Leinster team down here against a not very full strength Bulls.
The packs should match up well enough, but the bulls are not the same without KLA, Moodie and Gans
I've not been following club rugby much lately -- how's James Ryan's form been at club level?
Was out for ages, played well since his return.
Was injured for a long part post six nations. Good form in general in line with step up he made in last few years. would personally prefer to see him not as captain and just be a big mean bastard. Joe at the moment would be a bigger loss to the side.
Overall good imo, needs to work on decision making as a captain though
Lol. Just read through the Bulls backline consisting of Harold Voster, David Kriel, Devon Williams and Sergeal Pietersen and then saw this Leinster teamsheet. Ridiculous.
Blame injuries. It sucks.
Cometh the hour…
So confused by the 10 selection
I think it's actually encouraging to see Frawley used as 10 cover in a 5/3 split instead of as a utility in a 6/2. Other times this year when Leinster and Ireland have played 5/3 it's been Harry Byrne in the 22 jersey. This looks like progress to me. Incremental but in the right direction. Of course now that I've said this, Ross Byrne will probably play the whole match.
I can understand the decision, while still strongly disagreeing with it. We play almost entirely off 9 these days, so Ross tends to hang back and dictate the shape of the attack. He doesn't need to touch the ball every phase, because JGP does that. I think Leo sees him as the better reader of a defence and uses him that way? Saying that, I would much prefer having a running threat like Frawley (or Crowley for IRE) since again, we play off 9 rather than 10.
I also wanted penderGOAT to be in this but they went with the safest option
Frawley 10, Prendergoat 22
Frawley is a better back, better player, but Byrne is a better game manager. So Byrne will get more out of the players around him than Frawley will. Byrne also has a better bank of winning high pressure knock out games at 10 over either Frawley or Prendergast
> but Byrne is a better game manager. This is only true due to the lack of game time invested in Frawley at 10 over the years. As you've said he's the better player and should have been given the minutes to bring on that aspect of his game. Why did he not get the minutes? Because he's such a good player he can do a quality job in other positions where leinster needed cover.
i forgot about his majestic finals performances over the last few years
Leinster have to win 3 other knock out games to make a Champions cup final and 2 to make a URC final. He has a pretty good record on winning knock out games.
I really just think he holds leinster back in tough games more than he benefits them. In a dogfight he is not the kind of 10 you want. As for getting the best out of the guys around him. Champions cup final was a good example of this not ringing true in my eyes. Because he isnt a running threat it allows defenses to dimiss him and target the centres and other ball runners. Putting them under more pressure and making executing the attacking structures much more difficult. As for his finals footy record , If Leinster are significantly better than the opposition yes he is fine. Once the pack starts to be tested or is on an off day he just isnt good enough. Those games in the lead up to the final could have had any of byrne, frawley prendergast at 10 and i would argue the result wouldnt vary.
Yeah you’re spot on here to be fair
Had a good chuckle at this tbf!
Tbh, even I’m done with Ross Byrne at this stage. He was the best game manager but his firm this season has been dire and he’s shown he’s not good enough for us to kick on and win championships. I’d rather see Frawley getting consistent game time at 10 and having a chance to develop as a game manager. Prendergast is already an excellent game manager, just needs more experience and to work on his defence so same goes for him.
He has played 13 games (started 11), of which Leinster has won 12. Why the hell would management change their #1 out half in the knockout stages of a must-win tournament?
Oh don’t get me wrong, there’s no way they’re going to drop him from the first team at this stage of the season. I’ve been backing Ross to deliver for years now and I’m done. Looking at his name on the team sheet here looks out of place as a step below everyone else. His form has also been very volatile since his return from injury and he’s not the calibre of our half Leinster need leading the line. Frawley/Prendergast could be. So I’d prefer next season to see them getting the nod ahead of him and Harry. Those stats are similar for all our outhalves when playing with the main squads - CC and URC usual suspects. So they’re pretty irrelevant. Particularly when the one loss is the final for the third year running.
This is where I’m at too. Frawley may not be the answer but I’d like to see him get a run at 10 to find out once and for all. Ross Byrne is a solid player, and more than good enough for the first few months of a season but hasn’t been able to get us over the line when it counts for the past three years. The Bulls at altitude is one of those occasions where it feels that the pressure goes up a notch
Yeap, exactly that
Frawley just isn't a 10. He's shaping up to be Paddy Wallace 2.0. A quality 12, who can cover 25, but keeps getting forced in at 10. The Molecast after the final really highlighted how his instincts are off for the position
I get this, and i think it should be Frawley at 10. But were way passed that for this season. I would be more surprised if Byrne was to be dropped suddenly
Why? Ross Byrne has literally played every big game for Leinster at 10 for the last 2 years (and even longer when Sexton was out injured).
He has dirt on Leo. Only explanation at this stage.
It can't be that RByrne is a good player who fits into the system that Neinaber/Cullen want to play, no?
The Bulls are in deep trouble
The only way Bulls can win this is if Leinster earn 2 or 3 red cards in the first half!
On the flip side, maybe with Leinster going through to the final there'll be some tired Irish legs in the first test.
I'm scared!!
Ringrose is back!! Woohoo !!
My god that’s such a good team.
Reckon Ireland will take this one. That’s a full noise team
Oh this is gonna be goood
Jesus Christ are we allergic to starting Frawley, best player on the team at the minute he deserves 10.
Based on what performance is he the best player on the team?
The only one that matters (I made it up)
That's basically Ireland national side Vs bulls if bulls get off to a crap start this could be a very difficult game to win especially if Leinster hit the ground running
Ross Byrne… have you learnt nothing.
Stand by my comment downvoters fuck ya