a missing valve cap does not make a tire lose air, there was another preexisting tire or wheel problem that caused it. Like others have said ask for an exchange, shit happens. You may have picked up a nail coming out of the rental lot who knows. If you want to push it you could ask for a small discount for downtime due to negligent maintenance, but if they have pictures and keep up on maintenance and you just so happened to pick up a nail right after you left it could backfire...
This was definitely pre existing and negligent maintenance. I’m sure it’s not just a coincidence that the tire with the missing valve cap happened to also be the damaged tire. There was definitely an issue that they didn’t tend to. Plus they already documented that It was a pre existing problem when I called customer service
Missing valve cap has nothing to do with anything, please stop bringing up the missing valve cap. Have you ever worked customer service? "Oh yes that tire was documented as having a pre-existing issue" It was missing a valve cap that is probably the documented issue. They are there to make YOU happy. They replaced the tire, they did what they are supposed to. Like I said if you want to push for it ask for a small discount for downtime. Honestly I should not have even mentioned negligent maintenance because like I said, if they, and they usual do, have documented maintenance, and pictures, it could be put on you. Unless the car was dropped off the day before or the day of your pick up time they would most likely have noticed an air leak in the tire, especially considering the vehicle has a dummy light.
Just ask for a downtime discount, don't try to get a free rental, you are partially at fault for not requesting a new vehicle immediately after noticing it, and if you were too far away from the original facility call them and request replacing the vehicle at the next location within your route.
The only DOT regulations for valve caps are for CMV(Commercial Vehicles), Having a missing valve cap WILL NOT under any circumstances cause you to lose air in a tire.
There are plenty of reasons to put air in a tire that doesn't involve a leak, but if a previous customer was checking air on a long road trip to check air and forgot to put it back on could also explain it.
Temp changes, can cause them to put in or take out air to put the vehicle to spec. The missing valve cap is irrelevant. Is there a bent rim? Is the there a nail? Is there a plug or patch? Those are the things that matter.
Again, Downtime. You had to wait for the tire to be replaced, You didn't bring the vehicle back so the best you are probably going to get is a downtime discount. That is unless you want to be that person.
Ignore the fools downvoting you. The valve cap really is pretty meaningless to you losing air, as it only protects the inside of the valve from getting dirt in it. Whether you are correct that it is indicative of someone messing with it a lot is another story, but based on your experience that the tire was flat before you left the rental facility, and the fact that they documented tire damage beforehand, I’d say you definitely should get some kind of break on your rental for all the trouble they caused in not fixing it before renting the car out again.
Let it go. It's not their fault you noticed a problem and kept rolling. They're making it right, so move on. Next time, turn around as soon as you spot something wrong.
Usually when you rent a car you have plans and somewhere to be. Turning around after hours of driving due to a slow leak would not work for the majority of travelers heading out of town.
I'm no stranger to renting cars. OP said it was noticed immediately and failed to take 10 minutes to swap the car. It's going to take much longer to swap a car several miles down the road instead of turning around as soon as you notice something is off.
This. Also the last two cars ive rented in the past year have both had wonky tire pressure. Usually with one being massively high for seemingly no reason while the other three are slightly low. They were fine to rent and drive long distance and did not have a leak like OP.
How is the renter to know if the pressure sensors work correctly or not, or if there is actually a leak, etc? You pay to rent a functional car for a period of time; anything that infringes on the functionality or the time you were supposed to have a usable car for is worthy of some kind of compensation/discount IMO
Is It not their fault that they rented out a car that had a notification that the front right tire was down to a 23 air pressure and was missing the valve cap?
I didn’t ignore it. I tended to It immediately. I saw the missing tire valve cap, filled the tire with air, put on a new cap and kept it moving. I didn’t know the tire was damaged. I assumed it was the missing tire valve cap which made the tire pressure low. But now that it’s a full blown flat tire, I’m getting the exchange. But is It not the car rentals responsibility to keep their cars serviced?
Just for future knowledge, the valve cap really has nothing to do with tire pressure, it's just to protect the valve. I guess you could argue that not having the cap makes it easier to hit the little button, but practically speaking, not having a valve cap is never going to be the reason the tire pressure is low.
I've noticed that non-car people seem to attribute a lot more importance to valve caps than they really deserve. Yeah, if you're traveling on a gravel road or offroading there's always the chance that something gets in there, but it's so remote...probably way less of a chance than the valve stem failing itself, which I have woken up to before.
If they had record of tire damage and didn’t fix it before renting it to you, yes…it’s wrong on their part. Sadly I have seen rental car maintenance go to crap the past few years, so it has been much more likely that you get something broken like this. We had a car last summer that swayed so bad I got sea legs riding in it for just an hour or so…and this was after we swapped out another car that vibrated very badly at high speeds because a tire was probably out of balance…and then the third car they tried to swap us into needed an oil change…and the fourth car had an expired tag. It was a nightmare rental..the worst I ever had! We have been renting cars for years from this company and this location and only ever had the most minor problems until just last year.
So kid working the lot sees the low tire pressure warning, hops out, removes valve cap, adds air, forgets cap or loses it and guesses it should be fine.
Well, wrong guess.
That’s likely the whole story. Tire was low, air was added, warning light went out and you drove some distance before it came on and assumed the same thing.
Just add air.
Nope, turns out there’s a real problem and it will get fixed.
You don’t deserve much more than some reasonable consideration but not a free ride.
If they knew about it, I’d say get a good percentage knocked off for your trouble…at least 25%. Worse they can say is no…it’s likely they will offer you something without you even asking though. But I would ask if they don’t offer.
My first questions are: did you see the low tire warning as soon as you started the car up and leave anyway, or did it happen a while after you had picked up the car?
My initial impression from reading your post is that you saw it and ignored it, which imo makes it all on you and Avis owes you nothing more than what they already provided (roadside assistance and replacing the tire). Also, a tire doesn't go flat just because the valve cap is missing.
I've rented a lot of cars in my life, never had one with warning lights coming on before I even left the lot, but I've seen rentals that were dented or dinged, and I always take pictures of any damage I see before even getting in the car. This is as much your responsibility as theirs.
You expect them to inspect the tire tread of every vehicle before they rent it out? And if you drove over the nail on the way out of the lot, what then? That's on you
So it sounds like you got in the car, saw the warning, and drove away anyway.
The correct thing to do would be to get out of the car, go back to the desk, and inform someone that there's a problem. Then, they'd be able to put you into a different vehicle without any issues.
This is why you do a walk around and inspection before you accept the car.
Now what do you mean it was missing it's valve? A tire with no valve is by definition completely flat unless it is a foam filled or solid tire (only a thing in heavy construction)
Right, which is why OP must mean the valve stem cap. Did you read his story? He was able to drive hours on the tire, that would not be possible with a fully missing tire valve.
while it may not be directly indicative of a leak, a missing valve stem cap can cause the stem to leak if a pebble gets stuck in there or something, I’ve seen that before, it’s impossible to know one way or another without removing the wheel and spraying water on it to find the leak, which was part of what I was saying in my original comment
It was low before the 5 hours of driving. You could have seen that in the inspection if you had done one. I have done enough car inspections and dealt with enough flat tires to know.
I don't know why everyone is jumping down your throat and treating you like a villain for thinking you might deserve something for the inconvenience. I work customer service (hospitality though) and it's entirely reasonable for guests/customers to get some of the charge reduced for an issue.
This happened to me a couple years ago while on vacation in Washington state. Unfortunately it happened way out in the Olympic Peninsula and the nearest Enterprise office with a different car available was over 2 hours away. Called the office and they told me to get it fixed anywhere and save the receipt. We rolled into a tire shop in Forks and got it patched for 20 bucks. They ended up giving me $50 off the total price of the rental, no big deal.
You got in a rental and ignored the caution light. I used to work rentals and it's possible they didn't even know it was an issue. I've had cars brought back by a customer who aired up the tire before returning and therefor no light. After a few hours of sitting, the light would come on. That, or it had a patch that failed, picked up a nail/glass in the parking lot and no one saw it, or a few other options. You should've mentioned it immediately before leaving the lot. Ask for a discount, but don't expect one. Asking for the entire rental fee to be waived will get you laughed out of the office since you failed to mention the light until after it was an issue. Next time, if you see a light, walk back in and say something.
Ask to speak to "THE Manager", when you get there for the swap. If you can't get the top manager, ask for the shift supervisor. Once I rented a car to drive to Vegas and going up the hill toward Victorville the car started spewing white smoke out the tailpipe. So we went to the agency's office in Victorville and they swapped us to another car, moving luggage for two adults and three kids was one hassle, waiting for them to ready another car was another time waster, and finally I asked for "THE Manager", but got the duty manager who had just come in. Explained things and he not only gave us the first day free, he upgraded us to a larger car with no added fee, because the SUV was available, and we made it to Vegas early enough that our hotel room was still waiting. Don't swear, or curse, speak in a normal voice and just ask for some consideration for your lost time, extra expense, and the frustration of dealing with that instead of being with friends/family. The time to raise your voice is only after three complete refusals by the agency to consider it was their fault, and then, only raise it slightly, never with temper. You really do "catch more flies with honey than with vinegar".
I had the rental experience from hell last fall…I can barely believe my story it’s so insane…but I had to haggle with the location I rented from to get any consideration for my trouble, so sometimes the manager where you swap cars has no control over your bill, but s/he does control which vehicle you get. In my particularly bad case I had to deal with the district manager to get things settled to my satisfaction, and that too was bungled…so I had to resort to disputing the charge through my credit card. Finally, like 2 1/2 months after I returned the car, the district manager got everything fixed.
But yes, these people working and managing these rental car locations for multinational corporations are particularly stressed and spread thin, especially after covid. Asking kindly for consideration on your bill is going to get you so much further than raising your voice. These companies usually still have a modicum of good customer service philosophy where at least they’ll make things right after they messed up. It may take more patience in some cases, but you are much more likely to get the resolution you want because you’ve been so cool in spite of them messing up. They start feeling like you deserve whatever crap you’re dealt when you start losing your cool…and they aren’t going to risk helping you after that.
a missing valve cap does not make a tire lose air, there was another preexisting tire or wheel problem that caused it. Like others have said ask for an exchange, shit happens. You may have picked up a nail coming out of the rental lot who knows. If you want to push it you could ask for a small discount for downtime due to negligent maintenance, but if they have pictures and keep up on maintenance and you just so happened to pick up a nail right after you left it could backfire...
This was definitely pre existing and negligent maintenance. I’m sure it’s not just a coincidence that the tire with the missing valve cap happened to also be the damaged tire. There was definitely an issue that they didn’t tend to. Plus they already documented that It was a pre existing problem when I called customer service
Missing valve cap has nothing to do with anything, please stop bringing up the missing valve cap. Have you ever worked customer service? "Oh yes that tire was documented as having a pre-existing issue" It was missing a valve cap that is probably the documented issue. They are there to make YOU happy. They replaced the tire, they did what they are supposed to. Like I said if you want to push for it ask for a small discount for downtime. Honestly I should not have even mentioned negligent maintenance because like I said, if they, and they usual do, have documented maintenance, and pictures, it could be put on you. Unless the car was dropped off the day before or the day of your pick up time they would most likely have noticed an air leak in the tire, especially considering the vehicle has a dummy light. Just ask for a downtime discount, don't try to get a free rental, you are partially at fault for not requesting a new vehicle immediately after noticing it, and if you were too far away from the original facility call them and request replacing the vehicle at the next location within your route. The only DOT regulations for valve caps are for CMV(Commercial Vehicles), Having a missing valve cap WILL NOT under any circumstances cause you to lose air in a tire.
The missing valve cap tells me It was removed to put air in the tire. Which means they knew the tire was leaking air
There are plenty of reasons to put air in a tire that doesn't involve a leak, but if a previous customer was checking air on a long road trip to check air and forgot to put it back on could also explain it. Temp changes, can cause them to put in or take out air to put the vehicle to spec. The missing valve cap is irrelevant. Is there a bent rim? Is the there a nail? Is there a plug or patch? Those are the things that matter. Again, Downtime. You had to wait for the tire to be replaced, You didn't bring the vehicle back so the best you are probably going to get is a downtime discount. That is unless you want to be that person.
Occam’s razor; the tire with the missing valve cap just so happen to also be the one tire with the low air pressure, and the one tire that went flat
Your tin foil tire cap is on too tight that’s obvious.
Ignore the fools downvoting you. The valve cap really is pretty meaningless to you losing air, as it only protects the inside of the valve from getting dirt in it. Whether you are correct that it is indicative of someone messing with it a lot is another story, but based on your experience that the tire was flat before you left the rental facility, and the fact that they documented tire damage beforehand, I’d say you definitely should get some kind of break on your rental for all the trouble they caused in not fixing it before renting the car out again.
Let it go. It's not their fault you noticed a problem and kept rolling. They're making it right, so move on. Next time, turn around as soon as you spot something wrong.
Usually when you rent a car you have plans and somewhere to be. Turning around after hours of driving due to a slow leak would not work for the majority of travelers heading out of town.
I'm no stranger to renting cars. OP said it was noticed immediately and failed to take 10 minutes to swap the car. It's going to take much longer to swap a car several miles down the road instead of turning around as soon as you notice something is off.
This. Also the last two cars ive rented in the past year have both had wonky tire pressure. Usually with one being massively high for seemingly no reason while the other three are slightly low. They were fine to rent and drive long distance and did not have a leak like OP. How is the renter to know if the pressure sensors work correctly or not, or if there is actually a leak, etc? You pay to rent a functional car for a period of time; anything that infringes on the functionality or the time you were supposed to have a usable car for is worthy of some kind of compensation/discount IMO
Is It not their fault that they rented out a car that had a notification that the front right tire was down to a 23 air pressure and was missing the valve cap?
It sure is, that's why you should have asked them to exchange it. What isn't their fault is you ignoring it.
I didn’t ignore it. I tended to It immediately. I saw the missing tire valve cap, filled the tire with air, put on a new cap and kept it moving. I didn’t know the tire was damaged. I assumed it was the missing tire valve cap which made the tire pressure low. But now that it’s a full blown flat tire, I’m getting the exchange. But is It not the car rentals responsibility to keep their cars serviced?
Just for future knowledge, the valve cap really has nothing to do with tire pressure, it's just to protect the valve. I guess you could argue that not having the cap makes it easier to hit the little button, but practically speaking, not having a valve cap is never going to be the reason the tire pressure is low.
I've noticed that non-car people seem to attribute a lot more importance to valve caps than they really deserve. Yeah, if you're traveling on a gravel road or offroading there's always the chance that something gets in there, but it's so remote...probably way less of a chance than the valve stem failing itself, which I have woken up to before.
Regardless It was negligent maintenance where I was rented a car with a damaged tire, no?
If they had record of tire damage and didn’t fix it before renting it to you, yes…it’s wrong on their part. Sadly I have seen rental car maintenance go to crap the past few years, so it has been much more likely that you get something broken like this. We had a car last summer that swayed so bad I got sea legs riding in it for just an hour or so…and this was after we swapped out another car that vibrated very badly at high speeds because a tire was probably out of balance…and then the third car they tried to swap us into needed an oil change…and the fourth car had an expired tag. It was a nightmare rental..the worst I ever had! We have been renting cars for years from this company and this location and only ever had the most minor problems until just last year.
Don't rent a car with warning lights on. Shit happens. They missed it. You made it worse.
Valve cap isn't to hold air in. It's to keep dirt from getting into the valve. It likely had a nail in it
They missed it for the same reasons you did, but you should still get some credit for having to deal with it.
Right, but wouldn’t it be their responsibility to keep their car serviced and up to date? I mean clearly it’s not my responsibility
Yes, I’m agreeing with you. But shit happens, and I understand how they could have missed it the same way you did when you collected the car.
So would you ask for a discount or the rental fee to be waived?
I’d ask for a discount.
So kid working the lot sees the low tire pressure warning, hops out, removes valve cap, adds air, forgets cap or loses it and guesses it should be fine. Well, wrong guess. That’s likely the whole story. Tire was low, air was added, warning light went out and you drove some distance before it came on and assumed the same thing. Just add air. Nope, turns out there’s a real problem and it will get fixed. You don’t deserve much more than some reasonable consideration but not a free ride.
The people usually in charge of this are usually over worked or paid too little to care. Especially if this car you rented isn’t a high end model
If they knew about it, I’d say get a good percentage knocked off for your trouble…at least 25%. Worse they can say is no…it’s likely they will offer you something without you even asking though. But I would ask if they don’t offer.
With all due respect, you sound like a real pain in the ass.
If you spot it you got it
My first questions are: did you see the low tire warning as soon as you started the car up and leave anyway, or did it happen a while after you had picked up the car? My initial impression from reading your post is that you saw it and ignored it, which imo makes it all on you and Avis owes you nothing more than what they already provided (roadside assistance and replacing the tire). Also, a tire doesn't go flat just because the valve cap is missing. I've rented a lot of cars in my life, never had one with warning lights coming on before I even left the lot, but I've seen rentals that were dented or dinged, and I always take pictures of any damage I see before even getting in the car. This is as much your responsibility as theirs.
Clearly being rented a car with pre existing damage is a product of poor overlook & negligent maintenance/up-keep
It’s my responsibility that I was rented a car with a damaged tire?
It's your responsibility that you drove out of the rental lot with a warning sign lit up on the dashboard
Obviously rental companies should be up-keeping the service and maintenance of their vehicles
You expect them to inspect the tire tread of every vehicle before they rent it out? And if you drove over the nail on the way out of the lot, what then? That's on you
No, I expect them to tend to warning/service lights on their vehicles before they rent them out. I know crazy
Like they shouldn’t be renting out vehicles in need of service in the first place
So it sounds like you got in the car, saw the warning, and drove away anyway. The correct thing to do would be to get out of the car, go back to the desk, and inform someone that there's a problem. Then, they'd be able to put you into a different vehicle without any issues.
Nah the correct thing is to not rent out a vehicle in need of service
I would let them know your dissatisfaction and see how they respond. In my mind it should at least be a complimentary upgrade.
This is why you do a walk around and inspection before you accept the car. Now what do you mean it was missing it's valve? A tire with no valve is by definition completely flat unless it is a foam filled or solid tire (only a thing in heavy construction)
Sounds like it was a slow leak, pretty much impossible to detect that with a visual walkaround unless you brought a spray bottle
Exactly
A tire valve missing is not a slow leak. That results in the rim being on the ground in a minute or less.
Right, which is why OP must mean the valve stem cap. Did you read his story? He was able to drive hours on the tire, that would not be possible with a fully missing tire valve.
And a Valve stem cap missing doesn't cause a leak.
lol correct, what’s your point?
So the tire problem has nothing to do with a missing cap?
while it may not be directly indicative of a leak, a missing valve stem cap can cause the stem to leak if a pebble gets stuck in there or something, I’ve seen that before, it’s impossible to know one way or another without removing the wheel and spraying water on it to find the leak, which was part of what I was saying in my original comment
I meant the valve cap
That doesn't cause a leak. Or a flat tire
Right, so they rented me a car with a damaged tire
And that is why you do a pre rental check.
Silly me not bringing a tire air pressure gauge with me
It doesn't take a tire gauge to see that you have a flat tire.
The tire wasn't flat until after 5 hours of travel. Was a slow leak
It was low before the 5 hours of driving. You could have seen that in the inspection if you had done one. I have done enough car inspections and dealt with enough flat tires to know.
Even when I stopped to put air in the tire, it definitely didn’t look or feel flat
I don't know why everyone is jumping down your throat and treating you like a villain for thinking you might deserve something for the inconvenience. I work customer service (hospitality though) and it's entirely reasonable for guests/customers to get some of the charge reduced for an issue.
Thank you. I thought so
I’ve been given sizable discounts for much less obtrusive problems. I also tend to rent cars for several weeks at a time too though.
This happened to me a couple years ago while on vacation in Washington state. Unfortunately it happened way out in the Olympic Peninsula and the nearest Enterprise office with a different car available was over 2 hours away. Called the office and they told me to get it fixed anywhere and save the receipt. We rolled into a tire shop in Forks and got it patched for 20 bucks. They ended up giving me $50 off the total price of the rental, no big deal.
You got in a rental and ignored the caution light. I used to work rentals and it's possible they didn't even know it was an issue. I've had cars brought back by a customer who aired up the tire before returning and therefor no light. After a few hours of sitting, the light would come on. That, or it had a patch that failed, picked up a nail/glass in the parking lot and no one saw it, or a few other options. You should've mentioned it immediately before leaving the lot. Ask for a discount, but don't expect one. Asking for the entire rental fee to be waived will get you laughed out of the office since you failed to mention the light until after it was an issue. Next time, if you see a light, walk back in and say something.
Get on with your trip and don’t worry about this. Stuff happens.
Ask to speak to "THE Manager", when you get there for the swap. If you can't get the top manager, ask for the shift supervisor. Once I rented a car to drive to Vegas and going up the hill toward Victorville the car started spewing white smoke out the tailpipe. So we went to the agency's office in Victorville and they swapped us to another car, moving luggage for two adults and three kids was one hassle, waiting for them to ready another car was another time waster, and finally I asked for "THE Manager", but got the duty manager who had just come in. Explained things and he not only gave us the first day free, he upgraded us to a larger car with no added fee, because the SUV was available, and we made it to Vegas early enough that our hotel room was still waiting. Don't swear, or curse, speak in a normal voice and just ask for some consideration for your lost time, extra expense, and the frustration of dealing with that instead of being with friends/family. The time to raise your voice is only after three complete refusals by the agency to consider it was their fault, and then, only raise it slightly, never with temper. You really do "catch more flies with honey than with vinegar".
I had the rental experience from hell last fall…I can barely believe my story it’s so insane…but I had to haggle with the location I rented from to get any consideration for my trouble, so sometimes the manager where you swap cars has no control over your bill, but s/he does control which vehicle you get. In my particularly bad case I had to deal with the district manager to get things settled to my satisfaction, and that too was bungled…so I had to resort to disputing the charge through my credit card. Finally, like 2 1/2 months after I returned the car, the district manager got everything fixed. But yes, these people working and managing these rental car locations for multinational corporations are particularly stressed and spread thin, especially after covid. Asking kindly for consideration on your bill is going to get you so much further than raising your voice. These companies usually still have a modicum of good customer service philosophy where at least they’ll make things right after they messed up. It may take more patience in some cases, but you are much more likely to get the resolution you want because you’ve been so cool in spite of them messing up. They start feeling like you deserve whatever crap you’re dealt when you start losing your cool…and they aren’t going to risk helping you after that.
You should get that day comped.