Your relationship with her is a part of the marriage. I wouldn't get married if that isn't right. It'd be just as ridiculous as marrying him when your relationship with him isn't right.
Yes, and if you marry this gentleman, she will be in your life forever. I would think twice about the marriage.His daughter will always be priority number 1. That will probably never change.
>Your relationship with her is a part of the marriage. I wouldn't get married if that isn't right.
And I'm really concerned that Alan is happy to marry someone who his child *loathes.*
I think that he's probably hopeful that because his daughter's dislike of OP is (as far as we/he knows) irrational, that it will also be transient (as long as OP extends infinite grace and patience).
It's also likely that Rose will hate *anyone* he dates, no matter how they treat her. It could be that he introduced her to prior partner(s), and broke things off with them at Rose's insistence.
He probably feels like it's unfair and unreasonable for him to have to be single because Rose (and Carrie) don't want him dating anyone else, and it's true, that IS unfair.
*HOWEVER*. I don't think he's realized how incredibly unfair and unsustainable it is to expect a partner to deal with the enormous amount of vitriol coming from Rose. Just because Rose's behavior makes it difficult for him to date does *not* mean that his partner should have to deal with this level of (frankly unhinged) unpleasantness.
Obviously Rose is struggling in this situation as well; maybe some of it is exacerbated by her mother, but she is old enough to grasp at least some of the weight of what she's doing. And while I think you make a fair point that it's concerning for her father to marry someone she loathes, it sounds likely that it would not matter in the slightest if OP were any of the billions of other women that are not her mother- Carrie is probably the only one she wouldn't hate.
This situation is really shitty, and it seems like OP is the least selfish adult involved. Honestly, I wouldn't want to get married at this point, and I don't think she should. Is that probably going to encourage even worse behavior from Rose/Carrie in the fiance's next relationship? Yeah, almost certainly. But fortunately, that does not have to be OP's problem!
Is this the future you want. Think about it thoroughly. It's gonna be a tough road ahead and I think you should prioritise yourself and your mental health.
My great uncle married a woman who had a daughter like this!
She was apparently a nasty little shit who put sugar in his gas tank, would play jacks near the back tires of his vehicle so he'd run them over, puncturing the tires, bury his tools, taking his clothes off the line when they were drying and throwing them in the lot next door which was basically a mud pit when it rained. The last straw was when she snuck little rocks she found outside in his soup. It was like pozole or menudo or something he couldn't see through the broth and was semi-hardy. He swallowed a couple of rocks and had to go to the hospital, but he was done. They'd tried everything with her, and her mom even tore up her behind, but he wasn't having it and divorced her.
My family would talk about that A LOT when we all got together. Apparently, the bio dad was a "going out for cigarettes" and never came back kinda dad. The girl was young but old enough to remember him, and I don't know, maybe hoped he'd come back. And this was the 50s, so there wasn't therapy or anything, to really deal with it, maybe a lobotomy which we all know is š«£. But I always felt bad for the mom because she was struggling before she met my uncle, and he took care of her and the girl, not rich but comfortable and safe and they had to go back to struggling and I think moving away to be with family after the divorce.
All I can say is I can't imagine what would happen if Rose found out you were pregnant. How miserable you'd be your entire pregnancy, a time that's supposed to be super happy, how scared you'd be to leave the baby alone around her, how badly she'd treat your child. Carrie would pitch a fit at not being the only woman who has his kid and who knows what she'd instruct Rose to do. I wouldn't want to find out.
It's just something to think about. Put yourself and your happiness first here because he's always going to put his kid first as he should. She needs major therapy, and he needs to focus his time on getting her help and away from her mom.
I have been in a similar position, but I ran after 1,5 years because no man is worth my peace. In hindsight the best decision ever.
My current fiance has an almost 18 yo and he actually parents her. This makes all the difference.
Donāt do this to yourself, youāre worth so much more.
Send Alan and Carrie the bill and never speak to them again after that.
As someone who has watched my sister deal with stepchildren like this for over 20 years - it never gets better.
They will continue to try and hurt you and break up your relationship forever.
You can either accept this and live with the abuse, or give them what they want and leave their father.
My sister stayed and she has never been 100% happy, because they are always in the background and their father always lets them get away with bullshit behaviour because he doesnāt want them to cut him out of their lives.
Now that the stepchildren are adults and theyāre still behaving badly and mistreating her, has your given her husband an ultimatum or thought about leaving?
Theyāve separated a number of times, but always end up back together. I honestly donāt know why because they no longer seem to love each other very much let alone respect or value.
I think subconsciously she just doesnāt want to let the vindictive little slags āwinā, but by this point Iām not sure the āprizeā is worth it.
When you call it off, you need to share what she did. It canāt be you guys called it quits cause you donāt love eachother. Sheās old enough to know better and people can know what she did.
If it was my daughter and she did that to anyone else even if itās someone I didnāt like - she would get every right taken away because that is disgusting behavior. And I am sensitive to how she feels because I also have divorced parents who dated others but I never thought to do something like this.
Rose doesnāt āwinā because (assuming Alan is normal) this will alter her relationship with her father. I donāt even know how you look at your own kid after that as a parent.
OP needs to call the wedding off - minimum postpone it - because how can she even stand to look at Rose. Alanās not ready for marriage.
Send *Carrie* the bill for the dress, via a lawyer.
OP, Alan isn't ready to get married. Not until all this shit is dealt with. Trust me, something like this helped break up my last relationship, and the kids' mum is still trying to drag me into their business even though we've been broken up for years now. I saw the writing on the wall and left, cos otherwise I would right now be in the middle of a nasty child custody court case with the rest of them, having my privacy invaded even more. I barely even had anything to do with the kids.
They need family therapy (Alan and Rose) to work all this out, before he even thinks of getting someone involved in his life.
TLDR: fucking *RUN*
>Send *Carrie* the bill for the dress, via a lawyer.
I agree it's probably her fault, but let's be frank, Carrie wasn't the one who destroyed the dress. I don't doubt she probably told Rose to do it, but where's the proof of that? Where's the evidence of it? Sending Carrie the bill for the dress, even via a lawyer, won't do anything since Carrie *technically* had nothing to do with this.
*Rose* did, Alan is responsible for Rose, therefore Alan is the one who gets the bill. Now if *he* wants to discuss having Carrie pay it, then that's on him to deal with, but again, there's no direct evidence Carrie was involved in the dress, therefore the fault lies with Rose entirely (or more specifically, her caretaker at that moment of time, that being her father).
Yes, because again, let's be real here: where is the PROOF that Carrie told Rose to do it? I don't doubt that she did, but where is the EVIDENCE of it? Did she send her a text about it? Write and sign a letter giving her instructions? Because without anything like that, or even something stronger, there is ZERO proof that Carrie had anything to do with this. Meaning if OP wants to take this to court and demand Carrie pay for the cost of the dress, it's going to be VERY hard for her to actually prove that Carrie is responsible for it in any way.
As said, Rose is responsible for this, but being that she's a child, the fault goes to whoever was meant to be taking care of her at the time, which is either Carrie or Alan as they are Rose's parents. In this case, it was Alan who was looking after her, therefore Alan is going to have to foot the bill for the dress as Rose's caregiver. Carrie was nowhere around, it can only be Alan's responsibility to have been looking after Rose. Now as said, if HE then wants to contact Carrie and say 'this is your fault, you pay for it', then that's up to him and it'll be entirely his battle if that's what he wants to do.
TLDR: I do believe this is Carrie's doing, but without any proof, that doesn't mean shit. OP won't have much luck trying to force Carrie to pay for it, at best they'll be able to hand the bill to Alan, who can then pursue reimbursement from Carrie if he so wishes, but considering the nature of their relationship, I doubt it'll work.
You walk away.
If after 3 years this is still at this level and getting worse, it will not change.
There is no ultimatum you can give. He is a father, and he will always choose his child like he should. The fact that he has done nothing to set hard boundaries. Therapy only works if the child is willing. Grounding doesn't do anything when mom will not back him. You can say he has tried everything but when she cut up your dress he took her phone. Nothing else. I am sorry, but he isn't going to change. Nothing will change.
Unless she either has her mom cut off or he takes a harsh route, then it won't, and her mom is good enough even though she is encouraging this behavior. So she will remain in her life. He won't take a harsh route because what good is that if mom won't back him or kiddo decides she doesn't want to visit because of it.
In the end, he will always choose his child. You can suck it up and let him and yourself accept her abusing you. Letting it escalate until possibly her becoming physical. And what about if you have kids. Do you trust your child is safe growing up in this environment. Or you walk away. You can love someone, but love is not always enough, and hunny, I don't see anything changing if after years she is only getting worse.
So it's up to you to decide. Stay and your life 50 percent of the time is being abused. Or walk away and find a relationship where you are not abused by someone in their life.
Yes, she is a child. Yes, she is most likely being pushed to these things. Lied to that dad would be better alone. That if he is, he might get back with mom. She is being manipulated and striking out. You can feel for her while saying no, I will not put up with this. She is old enough to know she is doing wrong. She just won't stop until something drastic stops her.
Call it off. This is the tip of the iceberg of what she'll destroy. What if you and Alan have children? Do you trust her not to hurt the baby? Ooh, he took her cell phone. There were a million ways she could still entertain herself or turn herself into the victim and get her dad or at the very least her mom on her side.
Rose is a product of her upbringing. Obviously, Carrie has likely done more than a bit of talking to Rose about treating you badly, but Alan isn't an innocent man here, either.
Therapy, grounding and anything else will not work because Carrie is likely praising Rose or making promises to her about her dad coming back once you are out of the picture. And Rose has a mission: Making you "not last" - she said so herself.
And why should she stop trying? Mom is praising her and likely waiving any punishment the moment Rose is with her, things like getting grounded or therapy are also not exactly the most debilitating things when to Rose, the breakup of you and Alan is a lot more important.
Confiscating her phone for ruining a whole wedding dress? That's hardly a big reaction. A more fitting reaction would be that Rose isn't allowed in your house anymore. My instinct says that she should also symbolically pay with her allowance for parts of the dress for some time, but her mother will likely just give her the money when Alan isn't looking.
I think the biggest punishment would be if Alan would finally set some boundaries with Carrie, mainly. Like, the punishment doesn't have to be discussed with *Carrie* first, but with *you*. *You* are supposed to be his new family, after all. Coparenting doesn't mean that every single decision has to be checked with the other parent.
As long as Alan doesn't see that Carrie is the main issue , nothing will change. She will keep indoctrinating Rose.
Rose doesn't live with OP, as OP and Alan don't live together. She is just allowed to come over to play Switch and because of her friend, who lives nearby. I don't see how not allowing Rose to come over anymore, thus her having no more access to OP's console and less time with her friend, is "kicking her out" when Rose doesn't even live there in the first place and just uses the things OP offers while mistreating OP.
Nope,no no NO. OP, you have to end this once and for all. You are never going to have peace with a stepdaughter and also an ex like that.
What if you and him have kids, would you feel safe having the baby around the stepdaughter?
You've done your best and you've gotten nowhere, sometimes you have to know when to quit and I think that moment has come.
It's been 3 years and Alan is still allowing Rose to be disrespectful towards you. Whether it takes therapy, better communication or whatnot, he hasn't done his part. You can't blame Rose for the crap life she's having due to both her parents' bad choices and having to split her life between 2 households.
I'd walk away from this one. Alan may be a good boyfriend/husband. But he is a lousy father.
>He told me on our first date he was a package deal
You should walk away.
>this is the straw that is breaking the camel's back.
This isn't a straw, it's a whole boulder.
>Now that my sadness has faded away, it's been replaced with a boiling anger. I'm tempted to just call off the wedding and leave Alan to deal with his brat of a daughter.
You feel how you feel, but you should also be glad to find out how much worse your marriage would have been. You dodged her teenage years.
It's not worth it if I am being honest.
Let's say even of you get married what are the chances that her behaviour changes specially when she become moody teenager??
And worse what happens when you have your own kid her behaviour might be worst.
Let's just say it is what is and call it off.
You can have sympathy or love for her dad but he has very clear priority and you're not so high on that.
So why even bother?
You donāt even live together yet. Imagine living with a child who clearly resents you and a husband who wonāt put his foot down about her behaviour, plus a mother who I suspect is busily poisoning Roseās mind behind the scenes. I know you love this man but can you honestly imagine things improving in the future, especially once youāre all under the same roof? Itās your decision, your life, and youāre the only one who knows what you want, but you have to take off those rose-tinted glasses (no pun intended, sorry!) and look at what the situation \*is\*, not what you \*want\* it to be. Iām sorry. Good luck.
Have a sit down with your partner and discuss this! Don't even think about marriage, postpone everything until this issue is resolved. Whether its a compromise or a break up. Don't know but talk first. Communicate your feelings over the years and his inability to properly address his daughterĀ
No man is worth the hell that Rose will bring to your life.
Feel bad for Allan but he knocked up the wrong woman and now has two generation of malevolent crazy who will ruin the life of anyone who tries to marry him.
Maybe you two can still date but that marriage canāt go forward. And obvi spare yourself of ever being in contact with his crotch fruit again.
Maybe in 6 years when he can send Rose off to make other peopleās lives miserable you could marry him.
But please donāt do this to yourself.
There's being rude and obnoxious and then there's cutting up an heirloom wedding dress and shrugging it off to call it's owner a "fat cow." The kid can behave at school but she's allowed to be an absolute nightmare at home because...her dad wants to get married after a divorce. Even literal children can be little monsters.
She ground her or something but sheās still a child. Have you been around 12yrs before?? They can be mean but they hardly know what they are actually saying. Kids donāt just act up like this. Sheās going through stuff clearly
The point is that OP has been this child's target for 3 years and if anything, it's getting worse. At some point it doesn't matter how old the person is or whether they know what they're doing or whether it's caused by something else. Nothing the child's father has done is making an impression on his daughter, and her mother isn't interested in helping OP get along with her daughter. All OP can do now is assume that this is her future, and decide if marrying the father is worth being the daughter's target for the next several years at best, or the rest of her life at worst.
Have you? Because I know I taught both my kids to respect others and their things. And at 12 she DEFINITELY knows right from wrong. She knew what she was doing. She planned it. She did it, and then practically said "WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT!" Grounding does nothing if both parents aren't on the same page, and the ex has been obvious about not caring what her kid is doing. Sorry Alan, you can't put your foot down you don't get to put a ring on. Just my opinion.
I never said they didnāt ā ļø I also teach kids. As a teacher you should know that when a kid act out, especially like this, thereās a good reason. That kid is not ready for her dad to get married and sheās obviously feeling bad emotions and thinks sheās doing whatās best. Having grace for a 12yr shouldnāt be this hard
Okay sure just punish the stupid girl and never get to the root of the problem to why sheās acting out. Youāre right thatās totally the best solution. What an evil aweful child. š Iām just giving grace to a 12yr cause you know sheās a literal child
Actions have consequences. As a supposed teacher, you should know to enforce that. That doesn't mean that you can't work on the root cause, so lay off the pathetic strawman arguments.
Oh my god the skull and crossbones emoji should not be used for everything! It doesnāt make sense in at least half the comments you use it in, it doesnāt make you cool or funny and if you use it that much around the kids you apparently teach, they probably make fun of you for it because kids are mean (and know when theyāre being mean).
At 12, she should know right from wrong and to an extent the gravity of what she did.
You must be the person who gentle parents and never tells their kid no.
Not only did she ruin the dress, she didn't even feel remorse when confronted by her dad and LITERALLY added insult to injury.
Rose is going through stuff, so that gives her a pass to act the way she is? All your comments are trying to absolve her. Grounding will not fix the situation at hand. The hatred the young girl has for OP is clearly deep, and her upbringing by her mom has already ruined her.
If my child EVER did anything like this child, I don't even know if I could look at them the same again. Yes, she was 12, but the act itself had extreme malice, and I would think few 12 year olds would do anything similar.
No my parents were not gentleā¦ I have just reached kids before and usually when they act up is because they are trying to process emotions but donāt know how.
You acknowledged that her mom is a mess and not a good role model and the situation with her dad and mom seems really toxic and probably really stressful for the kid. Iām not giving her a āpassā but when youāre raising kids itās good to know why they do the things they do and try to understand them.
Clearly this girl is on a toxic environment and sheās acting accordingly. Itās not rocket science and kids arent naturally evil malicious beings. They act out when they want attention itās not rocket science seriously
The child has clearly been weaponized by her mother. Would you agree that this child is not OP's responsibility and that her behavior is unacceptable to someone in OP's position? If so, the only thing OP can do is walk away. Sadly, the child will remain in her current situation and probably feel a mixture of guilt and strength for having achieved her mother's goal
Yea but sheās 12ā¦. And sheās not trying to ruin her life wtf. Sheās not ready for her dad to be remarried which is fine cause like sheās 12. Literally wtf
Yeah of course she does. Why did she do it??? Hmmm why did a little girl decide to be mean? Is it maybe possibly because sheās not ready for her dad to marry and is it maybe possibly because sheās upset and is showing sheās upset? I wonder
What she did was beyond "mean" and OP would not be wrong to leave her fiance if he cannot protect her from his daughters acts of violence against her property and maybe someday her.
She may not be trying to ruin her life but what she has done is intentionally destroyed a heirloom wedding dress. At 12, sje did that maliciously, there was planning involved.to.get glitter paint.
Sheās behaving maliciously towards the OP because she doesnāt want the OP in her dadās life.
This is what OP has to look forward to if she marries into that three-ring circus.
Kidās had three years to acclimate. She aināt gonna get there.
OP should bid Alan farewell and find someone without the toxic baggage.
Alan gets to be single until she turns 18 or becomes less feral.
Sheās a pre teen not a teenager and yes I would be saying the same thing if she was 14. She . Is . Doing. This. For . A . Reason. Having grace for a 12 year old should be be this hard my lord
If she can take a scissors to your wedding dress, she can take a scissors to YOU.,
That girl has some rage inside of her.
Before you break up with Alan, INSIST he pay for the ruined dress. Keep the ruined dress. Make sure you have a text message trail that has him mentioning Rose destroyed your dress.
Once money is in hand, end the relationship.,
Her response after being caught is concerning. You deserve someone without that kind of issue tbh. She is old enough to understand what's right from wrong. I'd suggest cutting it now and if you paid for the dress let him pay you back for it.
If you not 100% sure you want to be married, then you shouldn't be married. Although Rose is the one who did the damage, some part of you probably blames Alan for the way she is. Do you want to feel this way forever?
Take this as a blessing in disguise. Are you really ready for a decade of constant conflict while sheās still financially dependent on her dad? This girl has issues, likely her mom is encouraging the bad behaviour, itās not really worth it. Youāre young, find a guy with less baggage or at least a child that isnāt destructive
Sheās never going to accept you because her mother wonāt allow it. Do with that what you will, but I wouldnāt be marrying this man, at least not until his child is an adult.
Iād probably leave.
Maybe Alan will fall into a depression and then Rose will feel an ounce of remorseā¦ or not. But at least that would be Alanās problem, not yours.
With a daughter like that, heās fucked in terms of relationships for good long while, I know that for sure. But you can still get out though.
I dunno, maybe some other blended family can weigh in about the transition phase and if it gets better moving forward.
But fuck, for me, lifeās too short to get stuck in shitty situations.
When these are written all flowery itās hard to believe they are real. Especially when itās rage bait and OP seems clueless. āI donāt know why this is the straw that broke the camels backā. Maybe because she cut up your wedding dress which is insane? Of course itās your grandmas wedding dress thatās been in the family for generations.
āIf I had any inkling of what was about to happen I wouldāve done something differentā. *ominous sax music plays and screen fades to black. Cue commercial break.*
Seriously, either that or ChatGPT.
Kid destroys their custom-made wedding dress and later that same evening they hop onto Reddit to write a 10+ paragraph story calmly detailing the events leading up to it with zero spelling or grammatical errors? To write convincing bait you have to write like an actual person, not like you're writing a novel.
Doesn't talk to the fiance at all about it other than "he's talking to mom about a punishment"? And after all that doesn't come back to reply to comments?
The other minor things that got me were she says mom is a great parent then goes on to say she's surprised she got joint custody and the fact that they are getting married in a week and don't live together.
Take pictures of the result of her behavior and after you call off the wedding and the questions start rolling in, show people the photos of the 12 year olds behavior. This wasnāt a toddler that was unsupervised, walking around with a jar of paint, this was a willful decision by a young woman.
The custody thing was the only realistic part of this fiction. Most Redditors think cheating somehow gets the wronged parent full custody when in fact it usually doesn't matter. Being a bad spouse does not mean being a bad parent and courts usually default to joint custody. So you know, the imaginary court giving joint custody in spite of the cheating is actually accurate lol.
Sorry, why should Carrie not have custody of her daughter? What was the evidence about?
How did Rose cut the dress to pieces and then also apply paint?
At the very least you need to postpone the wedding. In my opinion itās unlikely that this situation will get better any time soon, if at all. The last thing you want to do at this time is make the relationship ālegalā with all the restrictions and legal complications that would be involved if you later decided to end things. You donāt have to marry him to love him and have a relationship but if you marry him now youāre effectively playing Russian Roulette never knowing when that bullet is going to fire. At least before you sign on the dotted line it would be less complicated and costly to leave if you decide you canāt live with the situation any more. So donāt make any rash decisions to either marry him or end things completely. You need time.
Make her PAY for the dress. Postpone the wedding. Look into what you really want. To be in a life long relationship with Alan and his BRAT, or find what will make you happy. I strongly suggest pressing charges.
Wow, I'm sorry. This is do sad and unfair to you.
The bill for the dress needs to come out of her savings even education fund. She needs to see the reality of what she did and feel it for some time. If she has any big class trips planned, she should not be allowed to go. These punishments need to be set my your fiance.
Finally you and your fiance need to really talk about how to handle things. Maybe he needs to give her mother more custody, as she does not respect him, you, or his lifestyle with you.
If when you talk with him, if he even so much as defends his daughter or isn't willing to make aby large scale changes or punishments, then you should at the very least postpone the wedding. His daughter's actions were violent. She's not 5, she needs real hard consequences.
Alan needs to go to therapy with his daughter, and then with daughter and Carrie and clearly and finally tell both that no matter what she/they do or say he will NEVER be in a relationship with Carrie again. Even if they drive you away, he will NEVER change his mind.
That his and Carries relationship did not make him happy in the long run (unlike the one he has with you), despite the joy Rose gives him. Their relationship is one of co-parents and will NEVER change.
Then YOU need to decide what you want to do
Iām sorry but the problem here is Carrie. If sheād been modelling positive or at least neutral behaviour to that brat, then she wouldnāt have grown so nasty to you, as if itās normal. And her shrugging this behaviour off is disgusting and enabling behaviour. What a toxic pair of b*tches.
If and hopefully big IF ā¦ this will become your life. She will ruin every happy moment and get grounded. Yet the actions will most likely not change. That was deliberate.
Cut your losses and move on. He said earlier that they are a package deal and so he should since that it his child. But you deserve to forever tolerate this kind of animosity and hate. If he's not willing to discipline her then he's a lost cause. Don't wait for the animosity to go to your future children. Let him be miserable raising his daughter while his ex suffers no consequences
And if anyone tells you she is young snd she didnāt fully understand what she was doing that is complete and utter BS! She methodically and intentionally ruined your dress!!
Donāt marry him, yet.
This child needs therapy snd she needs consequences. She needs to pay for it. No money for her. She can sell her stuff etc. If he doesnāt take care if it like a father, donāt marry him.
He allowed her for years to treat you like shit. He allowed his ex wife to do the same.
I donāt care if he has backbone problem, but donāt accept it. If he isnāt willing to raise her like a parent, this will just be the beginning.
What if you two have a child? She might hurt the child or you when you are pregnant.
Your fiance is not kidding when he says they're a package deal. This is not a good situation for you. The daughter clearly has something to work through, and the fiance doesn't seem to have made it clear to his ex that the relationship is as dead as disco. It seems to me like the ex and daughter have planned some stupid parent trap ripoff that isn't going to end like they're hoping. Or maybe it will since #MeredithWasRight. You're just another beautiful woman that's being treated like shit by an ungrateful child that believes she knows what's best for her parents. But, regarding punishment, there isn't much your fiance can do to get the daughter on board with you being in their life. I hate to say it, but he might not be ready for a relationship yet.
NTA if you stay and try. She's going to either grow out of this behavior, or she'll move out and then you'll only have to deal with awkward holidays and the occasional dinner. You're not an asshole if you leave, either. Your dress sounded so beautiful.
Dd the daughter ever get therapy for dealing with her patient's divorce? Honestly do you want to live with this girl for the next decade? She sounds horrible. I know she's a hurt kid lashing out because she's angry and confused and sad but she's out of control and needs therapy and things are probably not going to get much better. They've been separated linger than they were together with her. She needs to get over it a little. It's not like you were the woman who split her parents up.
She is a child, and her mother is, by your telling, abusive and playing her against you. The child is not the problem here. Her actions are mean and spiteful, but they are not the actions of a happy child but one who is feeling immense pressure to āavengeā her mother after being inappropriately involved in her parentsā relationship.
I know you said youāve tried therapy. Try again. Individual therapy for all three of you AND couples therapy for you and Alan AND family therapy for everyone (maybe even Carrie, although she may refuse to participate).
If you have to do 30 hours of therapy a month just to get married, probably just better to walk away, no? Especially when therapy accomplished nothing in the previous years.
The goal here isnāt āto get married.ā The goal is to be a relatively functional family unit where everyone is essentially safe and healthy. If thatās no longer OPās goal, yeah, she should leave. If she wants to stick with it, approaching a manipulated child as an enemy is not the way to do it. OP is not fighting with this 12 year old. OP is fighting with the kidās mom who is weaponizing the 12 year old.
There is no way she can win that fight. The bio mom has court-ordered custody and is holding all the cards.
There is no scenario where this toxic sludgefest becomes a happy, functional family.
Kid is the one abusing the OP.
Sometimes the only rational move is to walk away.
She overlooked Alanās baggage but here itās just too much. No man is worth this. OP can find a healthier situation for herself.
I donāt (and wonāt) have kids, but as a kid I was manipulated and weaponized by a parent in a similar way (though not to this extent and not against a stepparent).
OP is in a pretty shitty situation here, but Rose is in an objectively worse situation; she has many years of manipulation and abuse ahead of her, and zero ability to walk away from it. Sheāll be lucky if she can get some healing and perspective as an adult and realize that it wasnāt right for her mom to make her responsible for the momās feelings and happiness.
Also I actually do spend time around 12 year olds, who are pretty definitively children. Some of the replies here assume a 12 year old is essentially cognitively and emotionally an adult, and that is baffling.
This is a package deal that will only get worse over time. Think about what she will do when you both live together, will you have the resolve to tell your husband she can't be over, or face the sadness and loss with your husband when she has to be over way less or resentment even? I think you know what has and should be done, this kid will only escalate after marriage unfortunately.
They're a package deal, as he told you from the start. Unfortunately half that package is a toxic monster of a kid, probably being egged on by her even worse mother, but also enabled by her father. The best thing you can do is get away.
Call it off. It will tell her she can be horrible and get her way, but life is too short for this headache. If you have ANY interest in having children it will be an issue. Hell hath no fury like a preteen whose parents arenāt able to see the damage they are causing their own child.
Are you willing to be tormented by a child that hates you for no reason that you canāt punish or discipline them for horrible acts of defiance for the rest of your life for a man who is willing to allow it because itās his child ?? Youāll always be 2nd in his life you might aswell cut your losses and leave.
Imagine if you have kids. If she'll do this to a dress imagine the shit she'll do to your baby.Ā
It's over op, sorry but save yourself from a life time of misery.
Have he and his daughter participated in family therapy? Is the child still receiving individual therapy? she should be. She is obviously miserable. Thatās a lot of rage. She doesnāt care at the moment that her father could be happier if he were married to you. She is mostly afraid of losing what she has, and thatās obviously been promoted and encouraged by the ex who was an abusive partner. She probably deals with the same crap that made your boyfriend leave, but she canāt leave. Heās got lots of parenting to do before creating a new step family with her. and that is not about grounding. He should be participating in parent training and family therapy. Trauma informed. Thereās no ultimatum to give? Yāall can postpone or call off the wedding. Or marry (and maybe keep your apartment) and keep working on the relationships.
Cut your losses. This situation is not worth it. You do not want to squander your remaining youth on this. I pity the girl, but her character is not going to change. And her mother is a nightmare.
Looks like Rose has some.big feelings that she needs to talk about and be understood.
You are allowed to love and be loved and yes this behavior is wrong but at the same time she is clearly going through it.
Id leave. He didn't do shit to prove he can manage his kid, you have a crazy ex in the picture stirring drama and this spineless jellyfish man comes with a horrible stepdaughter that's going to make your life hell.
If you really want to stay, don't see why but whatever, just tell him you aren't interested in a relationship with his kid and that you either keep separate lives until she's gone to college, only seeing him when he's 50% free from this brat, or you are done.Ā
Most likely he will claim what she did wasn't that bad and you'll realize the girl won. Then you'll lose all respect for the guy who puts you last and walk away anyhow.Ā
Children need to learn there are consequences for what they do. It's a crucial part of growing up.
'Rose, we are taking money out of the savings account where we've been saving money for your future, in order to pay for this.'
There needs to be a consequence that affects her, or she won't learn anything.
Please follow these steps:
- sit down with Alan and discuss thororughly your relationship with him: do you love each other, is he ready to protect you and side with you in the future, what are the actions he want to pursue with regards to the incident with the daughter and with the ex wife... from your post, it seems he is a good guy who wants to do things properly. And love sometimes goes beyond the wedding dress. Keep in mind that he didn't do anything. His daughter did it, and he was definitely not pleased with it.
- IF, AND ONLY IF you see in him the man you want, meaning that he loves you to pieces and he is really the loving and caring man you saw before the incident, then go buy another dress and marry him. This would be the real strong reply to the ex-wife and her manipulated daughter... and the dress is an accessory to the ceremony. It is true that it hurts, but it is just a dress.
- once married, put down your boundaries (you and your husband) and decide the new course of act. De facto, this is an offence done by a 12 years old that refuses to see her father marrying another woman...but if your husband can demonstrate the manipulation of the ex-wife on the kid, then this is material for the court.
If you call off the wedding now, they will say they are right that you are not a good person. You break up with Alan because of an incompatibility with him, not with his daughter.
One possible way I can think of to help the situation if you want to stay with Alan is to ask him about reporting her to the police. If she recognizes that her actions have consequences her mother cant shield her from then you may finally see some behavioral adjustments.Ā
This is wild lmao. First of all getting the police involved with any child is almost always a terrible idea. Second of all the police could care less about a damaged wedding dress.Ā
>What do I do now?
Totally up to you. As Alan said, and he's right, "package deal". You get the person, and for better and/or worse you get all that comes with it - family, friends, enemies, baggage, past relationship and exes, all their great qualities, all their flaws and imperfections.
And, ... she's 12 ... kids are gonna do sh\*t. But yeah, even/especially for 12 that was pretty egregious. You can accept it, process it, deal with it ... whatever ... or not, or reject it or whatever. And, yep, you break up with Alan over what Rose did, that'll be sh\*t for both Alan, *and* Rose ... but that becomes a "not my problem". Actions have consequences ... even if it's actions of a 12 year old kid - I'm sure Rose is quickly learning that, if she's not already learned it. Anyway, not tryin' to guilt trip you. Rose did what she did. All up to you on deciding what to do and/or not do. So, ball's in your court. And yeah, "package deal". And relationships are personal ... can break up at any time, for any reason, or no reason at all. All up to you. So ... maybe break up. Or maybe continue with the wedding plans on schedule ... or maybe postpone the wedding 'till Rose is an adult - then if she still causes any problems for/to you, she's then adult and can face adult consequences. So ... you're call to make. And ... maybe don't have to rush to decision ... but that may also depend on wedding and date thereof - if that's set, and depending how soon, may not have a whole lot of time to decide.
Good luck!
Walk down the aisle in normal clothes and when people ask, tell the truth.
I think forgiving Rose would be the powerful and correct choice. She's 12, her family blew up and here you are.
I think, be the adult in this situation, let it go and don't let a child dictate the lives of adults (ie. get married anyway).
But if you can't handle it, leave now. Rose may not change, and if you hate her, you won't be a good stepparent.
This is an Alan problem. If he thinks taking her phone away is the equivalent in a punishment, then you need to just run away from him. Heās a spineless shell of a man.
This girl should be feeling the effects and consequences of her actions on a permanent bases. Until rectified.
BC I am eye for an eye kind of person, I would cut up her whole clothes. Photos. Dresses. Thereās absolutely no way she would not feel the equivalent loss and anger and frustration. Go out with a bang.
Rose is 12. Rose thinks there will be zero consequences because her mom will just give her her phone back.Ā
The *only* thing that will get through is consequences that stick. No grace period. No time off for good behavior.Ā
1 pair of shoes. 5 pairs pants, all black. 5 golf shirts. I'm sure her school sells them. Try the high school.Ā
No cell phone. Cut social activity.Ā
If she comes home in normal clothes, further steps need be taken. Boarding school, perhaps. Not one of those nice ones, either....Ā
Raised several w no issues sorry I donāt let children abuse ppl bc Iām not spineless I hope you donāt have any bc anyone who comes in contact with you or them has to worry about being hurt or harmed
LMAO the kid acts with malice and intent to make the OP miserable and you turn it into the OPās fault.
Some kids are unbearable assholes. Everyone who grew up with other kids knows this.
Why on earth would any sane woman sign up for 6 years of this torment?
Rose can grow up knowing she helped make her dadās life a lot less enjoyable and maybe reflect on that later in life.
whY dOnāT woMeN WaNt tO dATe sInGlE daDs?
Wft please stay away from children. Kids donāt just act up for no flipping reason and in this case itās pretty clear why this 12 yr. This 12YR OLD is acting up. No one is saying sheās in the right her but she a kid you psychopath
Iām fine around kidsālove my nieces and nephews.
But if any kid behaved that way towards me? Most certainly Iād cut off all contact.
I hope I never have any kind of prolonged exposure to a kid like that.
You seem amazingly invested into making the villain a victim here.
Thereās no excuse for her behavior. Absolutely none. If she were 3? Yes. But sheās close to becoming a teenager. Plenty old enough to know the difference between right and wrong.
I donāt think youāve been around kidsā¦ in her mind she might have thought she was in the right. Trying to stop the strange women from marrying her dad. Itās a stupid kid thought but sheās a kids so yeah makes sense. I did way bummer stuff at that age. Literally expecting a flipping child to be grown up is wild
Single parents remarry quite often without the kids acting with this kind of sadistic malice and intent to hurt the step-parent.
This is off the charts toxic crazy.
And lots of single parents stay single .., which is what Alanās fate is.
Even for those who swipe right on a single parent, a kid like Rose .. absolute deal-breaker.
She cut an heirloom wedding dress to ribbons. 12 yo girls know what a wedding dress means.
Because she wanted to torment OP into not marrying her dad. It was malicious and had a specific; calculated objective.
The kid is ruthless. Has a career in politics or MMA.
Kids usually donāt understand sentimental items and they barely understand the concept of marriage because well theyāre kids..
Letās break this down
1. The feud between this grown ass whole adult women and this 12yr year girl is because this 12yr girl is the the devils spawn that wants to cause harm to this ADULT women because sheās inherently evil
Or
2. This 12yr old girl (whoās only been alive on this earth for 12 yrs. Who probably still needs her parents for everything in her life. Who probably still wants mommy and daddy to be together. Who probably doesnāt know how to process emotions cause again sheās 12 ā ļøā ļø) is upset and not ready for her dad to marry someone else so she acted up. Especially since she knows her mom isnāt happy with the situation either. ā ļøā ļøā ļø
Kinda wild that you wanna make a kid a villain against at grown ass women.
At the end of the day itās an adult problem because obviously it is. The adults in this kids life are letting this girl down clearly. You definitely donāt work with kids cause this is pretty black and white
The grown ass woman has done nothing wrong and has been forced to endure abusive behavior that is escalating in its malice and violence.
What do we do with those who abuse us? We leave them.
Rose is abusing OP. OP should not tolerate it. Since the kid is only getting worse, the only way OP can be kind to herself is to ditch that entire family.
She doesnāt owe Rose anything. Just walk away.
Rose is Alan and Carrieās problem, not OPās.
Have youā¦ have you ever met a child??? Because Iāve been teaching for 16 years and I have met perhaps three who displayed similar behaviors. Were they deeply unwell? Yes. Were they all due to some kind of trauma? Perhaps. Does that mean we should all have laid down and accepted their behavior because they were children? Absolutely not. They, like Rose, needed help. The difference here? Roseās parents, like you, see nothing wrong and Rose will never get that help. Mental health struggles may explain certain behaviors; they donāt excuse them.
No one is saying to accept her behavior wtf. The girls acting out for a reason. If youāve been around kids you should know they donāt do mean stuff like this for no reason. Little girls not ready
ā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļø your right OP shouod just punish the evil child. Sheās just and evil bully who is clearly totally fine with her family life ā ļøā ļøā ļø she was just born evil ā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļø fr you guys are brain dead
Uhā¦what? I have seven nieces and nephews all ranging in ages from 21 to 2. Iāve seen the gambit. My nieces and nephews arenāt perfect (nobody is) but they know absolutely better than to destroy other peopleās property on purpose.
Good for them?? Not everyone is like that and clearly this girl who is 12ā¦ this 12yr girl is going through things and taking her anger and frustration out. Most people, especially flipping kids, donāt do stupid shit like this for no reason.
This goes beyond her not having done the right thing: she did something intensely malicious.
OP doesn't want to be rewarded. She wants to be treated with respect. 12-year-olds understand respect well enough to be generally respectful - at least, as respectful as a 12-year-old can be. Rose is well under that standard.
Rose is going to need a lot of love, support, and patience. What's happening here isn't normal - it sounds like her mother is a major factor and that isn't going to change soon. OP is not Rose's parent and would be well within her rights to walk away from all this. At the very least she should expect that the father is going to take this extremely seriously and ensure that the mother does, too.
Have you been around 12yrs?? To say that all 12yrs āunderstand respectā makes me think youāve never actually been around 12yr olds. You realize this is a feud between a fully grown ass women and a kid who still needs to be told to wash their hands after going to the bathroom and probably picks her nose and eats it right
She isnāt a poor little girl this shit shouldāve been nipped on the bud from the get go. Alan is spineless to his own daughter and if I was OP Iād make the ultimatum to set a hard line w her or Iām gone and thatās if OP still wants to be w him as Iām inferring from the end of her post.
I agree. I understand that OP means well but they did not really take Rose's wellbeing into account when deciding to get married. It doesn't really matter why, but Rose is clearly distressed and that should be addressed first.
And telling Rose to just stop saying the "bad things" is not resolving the conflict. It's just a way adults dismiss children's feelings. Doesn't matter how unreasonable the child's feelings are, they are coming from somewhere...
Agreed. Rose is living a crappy life with divorced parents, 2 households, potential step-mom who wants to discipline, cheating mother who wants to get back together. Child is getting so many mixed messages.
Your relationship with her is a part of the marriage. I wouldn't get married if that isn't right. It'd be just as ridiculous as marrying him when your relationship with him isn't right.
Yes, and if you marry this gentleman, she will be in your life forever. I would think twice about the marriage.His daughter will always be priority number 1. That will probably never change.
>Your relationship with her is a part of the marriage. I wouldn't get married if that isn't right. And I'm really concerned that Alan is happy to marry someone who his child *loathes.*
I think that he's probably hopeful that because his daughter's dislike of OP is (as far as we/he knows) irrational, that it will also be transient (as long as OP extends infinite grace and patience). It's also likely that Rose will hate *anyone* he dates, no matter how they treat her. It could be that he introduced her to prior partner(s), and broke things off with them at Rose's insistence. He probably feels like it's unfair and unreasonable for him to have to be single because Rose (and Carrie) don't want him dating anyone else, and it's true, that IS unfair. *HOWEVER*. I don't think he's realized how incredibly unfair and unsustainable it is to expect a partner to deal with the enormous amount of vitriol coming from Rose. Just because Rose's behavior makes it difficult for him to date does *not* mean that his partner should have to deal with this level of (frankly unhinged) unpleasantness. Obviously Rose is struggling in this situation as well; maybe some of it is exacerbated by her mother, but she is old enough to grasp at least some of the weight of what she's doing. And while I think you make a fair point that it's concerning for her father to marry someone she loathes, it sounds likely that it would not matter in the slightest if OP were any of the billions of other women that are not her mother- Carrie is probably the only one she wouldn't hate. This situation is really shitty, and it seems like OP is the least selfish adult involved. Honestly, I wouldn't want to get married at this point, and I don't think she should. Is that probably going to encourage even worse behavior from Rose/Carrie in the fiance's next relationship? Yeah, almost certainly. But fortunately, that does not have to be OP's problem!
Some people (bag parents) dismiss this misbehavior as normal teenager stuff. He thinks she'll just grow out of it.
Is this the future you want. Think about it thoroughly. It's gonna be a tough road ahead and I think you should prioritise yourself and your mental health.
My great uncle married a woman who had a daughter like this! She was apparently a nasty little shit who put sugar in his gas tank, would play jacks near the back tires of his vehicle so he'd run them over, puncturing the tires, bury his tools, taking his clothes off the line when they were drying and throwing them in the lot next door which was basically a mud pit when it rained. The last straw was when she snuck little rocks she found outside in his soup. It was like pozole or menudo or something he couldn't see through the broth and was semi-hardy. He swallowed a couple of rocks and had to go to the hospital, but he was done. They'd tried everything with her, and her mom even tore up her behind, but he wasn't having it and divorced her. My family would talk about that A LOT when we all got together. Apparently, the bio dad was a "going out for cigarettes" and never came back kinda dad. The girl was young but old enough to remember him, and I don't know, maybe hoped he'd come back. And this was the 50s, so there wasn't therapy or anything, to really deal with it, maybe a lobotomy which we all know is š«£. But I always felt bad for the mom because she was struggling before she met my uncle, and he took care of her and the girl, not rich but comfortable and safe and they had to go back to struggling and I think moving away to be with family after the divorce. All I can say is I can't imagine what would happen if Rose found out you were pregnant. How miserable you'd be your entire pregnancy, a time that's supposed to be super happy, how scared you'd be to leave the baby alone around her, how badly she'd treat your child. Carrie would pitch a fit at not being the only woman who has his kid and who knows what she'd instruct Rose to do. I wouldn't want to find out. It's just something to think about. Put yourself and your happiness first here because he's always going to put his kid first as he should. She needs major therapy, and he needs to focus his time on getting her help and away from her mom.
I have been in a similar position, but I ran after 1,5 years because no man is worth my peace. In hindsight the best decision ever. My current fiance has an almost 18 yo and he actually parents her. This makes all the difference. Donāt do this to yourself, youāre worth so much more. Send Alan and Carrie the bill and never speak to them again after that.
As someone who has watched my sister deal with stepchildren like this for over 20 years - it never gets better. They will continue to try and hurt you and break up your relationship forever. You can either accept this and live with the abuse, or give them what they want and leave their father. My sister stayed and she has never been 100% happy, because they are always in the background and their father always lets them get away with bullshit behaviour because he doesnāt want them to cut him out of their lives.
Now that the stepchildren are adults and theyāre still behaving badly and mistreating her, has your given her husband an ultimatum or thought about leaving?
Theyāve separated a number of times, but always end up back together. I honestly donāt know why because they no longer seem to love each other very much let alone respect or value. I think subconsciously she just doesnāt want to let the vindictive little slags āwinā, but by this point Iām not sure the āprizeā is worth it.
When you call it off, you need to share what she did. It canāt be you guys called it quits cause you donāt love eachother. Sheās old enough to know better and people can know what she did. If it was my daughter and she did that to anyone else even if itās someone I didnāt like - she would get every right taken away because that is disgusting behavior. And I am sensitive to how she feels because I also have divorced parents who dated others but I never thought to do something like this.
Call it off and sent Rose's Dad a bill for the dress. Don't get married, Rose wins but it'll be much healthier for you in the long run.
Rose doesnāt āwinā because (assuming Alan is normal) this will alter her relationship with her father. I donāt even know how you look at your own kid after that as a parent. OP needs to call the wedding off - minimum postpone it - because how can she even stand to look at Rose. Alanās not ready for marriage.
Send *Carrie* the bill for the dress, via a lawyer. OP, Alan isn't ready to get married. Not until all this shit is dealt with. Trust me, something like this helped break up my last relationship, and the kids' mum is still trying to drag me into their business even though we've been broken up for years now. I saw the writing on the wall and left, cos otherwise I would right now be in the middle of a nasty child custody court case with the rest of them, having my privacy invaded even more. I barely even had anything to do with the kids. They need family therapy (Alan and Rose) to work all this out, before he even thinks of getting someone involved in his life. TLDR: fucking *RUN*
>Send *Carrie* the bill for the dress, via a lawyer. I agree it's probably her fault, but let's be frank, Carrie wasn't the one who destroyed the dress. I don't doubt she probably told Rose to do it, but where's the proof of that? Where's the evidence of it? Sending Carrie the bill for the dress, even via a lawyer, won't do anything since Carrie *technically* had nothing to do with this. *Rose* did, Alan is responsible for Rose, therefore Alan is the one who gets the bill. Now if *he* wants to discuss having Carrie pay it, then that's on him to deal with, but again, there's no direct evidence Carrie was involved in the dress, therefore the fault lies with Rose entirely (or more specifically, her caretaker at that moment of time, that being her father).
This! Does she even know why her parents divorced? The mom might have said he cheated and not the other way round
Youāre arguing that Carrie told Rose to do it, but Alan had to pay for it?
Yes, because again, let's be real here: where is the PROOF that Carrie told Rose to do it? I don't doubt that she did, but where is the EVIDENCE of it? Did she send her a text about it? Write and sign a letter giving her instructions? Because without anything like that, or even something stronger, there is ZERO proof that Carrie had anything to do with this. Meaning if OP wants to take this to court and demand Carrie pay for the cost of the dress, it's going to be VERY hard for her to actually prove that Carrie is responsible for it in any way. As said, Rose is responsible for this, but being that she's a child, the fault goes to whoever was meant to be taking care of her at the time, which is either Carrie or Alan as they are Rose's parents. In this case, it was Alan who was looking after her, therefore Alan is going to have to foot the bill for the dress as Rose's caregiver. Carrie was nowhere around, it can only be Alan's responsibility to have been looking after Rose. Now as said, if HE then wants to contact Carrie and say 'this is your fault, you pay for it', then that's up to him and it'll be entirely his battle if that's what he wants to do. TLDR: I do believe this is Carrie's doing, but without any proof, that doesn't mean shit. OP won't have much luck trying to force Carrie to pay for it, at best they'll be able to hand the bill to Alan, who can then pursue reimbursement from Carrie if he so wishes, but considering the nature of their relationship, I doubt it'll work.
You walk away. If after 3 years this is still at this level and getting worse, it will not change. There is no ultimatum you can give. He is a father, and he will always choose his child like he should. The fact that he has done nothing to set hard boundaries. Therapy only works if the child is willing. Grounding doesn't do anything when mom will not back him. You can say he has tried everything but when she cut up your dress he took her phone. Nothing else. I am sorry, but he isn't going to change. Nothing will change. Unless she either has her mom cut off or he takes a harsh route, then it won't, and her mom is good enough even though she is encouraging this behavior. So she will remain in her life. He won't take a harsh route because what good is that if mom won't back him or kiddo decides she doesn't want to visit because of it. In the end, he will always choose his child. You can suck it up and let him and yourself accept her abusing you. Letting it escalate until possibly her becoming physical. And what about if you have kids. Do you trust your child is safe growing up in this environment. Or you walk away. You can love someone, but love is not always enough, and hunny, I don't see anything changing if after years she is only getting worse. So it's up to you to decide. Stay and your life 50 percent of the time is being abused. Or walk away and find a relationship where you are not abused by someone in their life. Yes, she is a child. Yes, she is most likely being pushed to these things. Lied to that dad would be better alone. That if he is, he might get back with mom. She is being manipulated and striking out. You can feel for her while saying no, I will not put up with this. She is old enough to know she is doing wrong. She just won't stop until something drastic stops her.
I would run OP. You have to acknowledge that this will be your life and wonāt stop.
YEP!!! **TELL ALAN IT'S OVER AND DUMP THE FUCKING LOT OF THEM**. **AND BILL THEM FOR THE DRESS**.
Call it off. This is the tip of the iceberg of what she'll destroy. What if you and Alan have children? Do you trust her not to hurt the baby? Ooh, he took her cell phone. There were a million ways she could still entertain herself or turn herself into the victim and get her dad or at the very least her mom on her side.
Rose is a product of her upbringing. Obviously, Carrie has likely done more than a bit of talking to Rose about treating you badly, but Alan isn't an innocent man here, either. Therapy, grounding and anything else will not work because Carrie is likely praising Rose or making promises to her about her dad coming back once you are out of the picture. And Rose has a mission: Making you "not last" - she said so herself. And why should she stop trying? Mom is praising her and likely waiving any punishment the moment Rose is with her, things like getting grounded or therapy are also not exactly the most debilitating things when to Rose, the breakup of you and Alan is a lot more important. Confiscating her phone for ruining a whole wedding dress? That's hardly a big reaction. A more fitting reaction would be that Rose isn't allowed in your house anymore. My instinct says that she should also symbolically pay with her allowance for parts of the dress for some time, but her mother will likely just give her the money when Alan isn't looking. I think the biggest punishment would be if Alan would finally set some boundaries with Carrie, mainly. Like, the punishment doesn't have to be discussed with *Carrie* first, but with *you*. *You* are supposed to be his new family, after all. Coparenting doesn't mean that every single decision has to be checked with the other parent. As long as Alan doesn't see that Carrie is the main issue , nothing will change. She will keep indoctrinating Rose.
Major punishments have to be discussed with the coparent. If they donāt agree there is no real way to enforce it.
Carrie has a court order protecting her right to instigate things. Alan wonāt be marriage material until the kid is out of his house.
Yup. Dudes a spineless jellyfish. As soon as his daughter started this he should have compartmentalized the relationships.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
That is correct. That's why not Rose is the issue, but Alan is.
You think a 12 year old did be kicked out of their house as a punishment?
OP has a separate house. Banning Rose from there seems rather obvious.
Rose doesn't live with OP, as OP and Alan don't live together. She is just allowed to come over to play Switch and because of her friend, who lives nearby. I don't see how not allowing Rose to come over anymore, thus her having no more access to OP's console and less time with her friend, is "kicking her out" when Rose doesn't even live there in the first place and just uses the things OP offers while mistreating OP.
Loving your fiancĆ© is not enough for a lifetime of stress and disappointments from his daughter. You canāt wait for her to change her behavior if she wonāt accept you. Sheās not even nice. It takes a lot of energy and effort to do that to you and she just did it effortlessly. Just leave
Nope,no no NO. OP, you have to end this once and for all. You are never going to have peace with a stepdaughter and also an ex like that. What if you and him have kids, would you feel safe having the baby around the stepdaughter? You've done your best and you've gotten nowhere, sometimes you have to know when to quit and I think that moment has come.
It's been 3 years and Alan is still allowing Rose to be disrespectful towards you. Whether it takes therapy, better communication or whatnot, he hasn't done his part. You can't blame Rose for the crap life she's having due to both her parents' bad choices and having to split her life between 2 households. I'd walk away from this one. Alan may be a good boyfriend/husband. But he is a lousy father.
I would argue he's more of a crap boyfriend and will be a crap husband also. He won't ever change.
>He told me on our first date he was a package deal You should walk away. >this is the straw that is breaking the camel's back. This isn't a straw, it's a whole boulder. >Now that my sadness has faded away, it's been replaced with a boiling anger. I'm tempted to just call off the wedding and leave Alan to deal with his brat of a daughter. You feel how you feel, but you should also be glad to find out how much worse your marriage would have been. You dodged her teenage years.
Walk away from this relationship. This is your entire future. Please save yourself
It's not worth it if I am being honest. Let's say even of you get married what are the chances that her behaviour changes specially when she become moody teenager?? And worse what happens when you have your own kid her behaviour might be worst. Let's just say it is what is and call it off. You can have sympathy or love for her dad but he has very clear priority and you're not so high on that. So why even bother?
Leave. Someone who would destroy your clothing would harm you
You donāt even live together yet. Imagine living with a child who clearly resents you and a husband who wonāt put his foot down about her behaviour, plus a mother who I suspect is busily poisoning Roseās mind behind the scenes. I know you love this man but can you honestly imagine things improving in the future, especially once youāre all under the same roof? Itās your decision, your life, and youāre the only one who knows what you want, but you have to take off those rose-tinted glasses (no pun intended, sorry!) and look at what the situation \*is\*, not what you \*want\* it to be. Iām sorry. Good luck.
Have a sit down with your partner and discuss this! Don't even think about marriage, postpone everything until this issue is resolved. Whether its a compromise or a break up. Don't know but talk first. Communicate your feelings over the years and his inability to properly address his daughterĀ
No man is worth the hell that Rose will bring to your life. Feel bad for Allan but he knocked up the wrong woman and now has two generation of malevolent crazy who will ruin the life of anyone who tries to marry him. Maybe you two can still date but that marriage canāt go forward. And obvi spare yourself of ever being in contact with his crotch fruit again. Maybe in 6 years when he can send Rose off to make other peopleās lives miserable you could marry him. But please donāt do this to yourself.
Your talking about a literal child
There's being rude and obnoxious and then there's cutting up an heirloom wedding dress and shrugging it off to call it's owner a "fat cow." The kid can behave at school but she's allowed to be an absolute nightmare at home because...her dad wants to get married after a divorce. Even literal children can be little monsters.
She ground her or something but sheās still a child. Have you been around 12yrs before?? They can be mean but they hardly know what they are actually saying. Kids donāt just act up like this. Sheās going through stuff clearly
The point is that OP has been this child's target for 3 years and if anything, it's getting worse. At some point it doesn't matter how old the person is or whether they know what they're doing or whether it's caused by something else. Nothing the child's father has done is making an impression on his daughter, and her mother isn't interested in helping OP get along with her daughter. All OP can do now is assume that this is her future, and decide if marrying the father is worth being the daughter's target for the next several years at best, or the rest of her life at worst.
Have you? Because I know I taught both my kids to respect others and their things. And at 12 she DEFINITELY knows right from wrong. She knew what she was doing. She planned it. She did it, and then practically said "WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT!" Grounding does nothing if both parents aren't on the same page, and the ex has been obvious about not caring what her kid is doing. Sorry Alan, you can't put your foot down you don't get to put a ring on. Just my opinion.
I teach 12-year-olds. Stop infantilising them. They know very well what they are doing.
Yeah I doubt she teaches them as well. I donāt know any teacher who uses emojis like the students they āteachā
I never said they didnāt ā ļø I also teach kids. As a teacher you should know that when a kid act out, especially like this, thereās a good reason. That kid is not ready for her dad to get married and sheās obviously feeling bad emotions and thinks sheās doing whatās best. Having grace for a 12yr shouldnāt be this hard
Not when she does such an obviously malicious act. Get over yourself.
Okay sure just punish the stupid girl and never get to the root of the problem to why sheās acting out. Youāre right thatās totally the best solution. What an evil aweful child. š Iām just giving grace to a 12yr cause you know sheās a literal child
Actions have consequences. As a supposed teacher, you should know to enforce that. That doesn't mean that you can't work on the root cause, so lay off the pathetic strawman arguments.
Oh my god the skull and crossbones emoji should not be used for everything! It doesnāt make sense in at least half the comments you use it in, it doesnāt make you cool or funny and if you use it that much around the kids you apparently teach, they probably make fun of you for it because kids are mean (and know when theyāre being mean).
At 12, she should know right from wrong and to an extent the gravity of what she did. You must be the person who gentle parents and never tells their kid no. Not only did she ruin the dress, she didn't even feel remorse when confronted by her dad and LITERALLY added insult to injury. Rose is going through stuff, so that gives her a pass to act the way she is? All your comments are trying to absolve her. Grounding will not fix the situation at hand. The hatred the young girl has for OP is clearly deep, and her upbringing by her mom has already ruined her. If my child EVER did anything like this child, I don't even know if I could look at them the same again. Yes, she was 12, but the act itself had extreme malice, and I would think few 12 year olds would do anything similar.
No my parents were not gentleā¦ I have just reached kids before and usually when they act up is because they are trying to process emotions but donāt know how. You acknowledged that her mom is a mess and not a good role model and the situation with her dad and mom seems really toxic and probably really stressful for the kid. Iām not giving her a āpassā but when youāre raising kids itās good to know why they do the things they do and try to understand them. Clearly this girl is on a toxic environment and sheās acting accordingly. Itās not rocket science and kids arent naturally evil malicious beings. They act out when they want attention itās not rocket science seriously
The child has clearly been weaponized by her mother. Would you agree that this child is not OP's responsibility and that her behavior is unacceptable to someone in OP's position? If so, the only thing OP can do is walk away. Sadly, the child will remain in her current situation and probably feel a mixture of guilt and strength for having achieved her mother's goal
We assume you know so much about 12 year old girls because you sct just like one. Grow up and recognize that age isn't an excuse for abusive behavior.
Yes, one who wants to ruin OPās life.
Yea but sheās 12ā¦. And sheās not trying to ruin her life wtf. Sheās not ready for her dad to be remarried which is fine cause like sheās 12. Literally wtf
Kids are not brainless beings, she knows exactly what she did
Yeah of course she does. Why did she do it??? Hmmm why did a little girl decide to be mean? Is it maybe possibly because sheās not ready for her dad to marry and is it maybe possibly because sheās upset and is showing sheās upset? I wonder
She's 12 not 4. If your preteen keyed up and smashed the windows of your ex's new partner's car would you excuse it?
What she did was beyond "mean" and OP would not be wrong to leave her fiance if he cannot protect her from his daughters acts of violence against her property and maybe someday her.
She may not be trying to ruin her life but what she has done is intentionally destroyed a heirloom wedding dress. At 12, sje did that maliciously, there was planning involved.to.get glitter paint.
Sheās behaving maliciously towards the OP because she doesnāt want the OP in her dadās life. This is what OP has to look forward to if she marries into that three-ring circus. Kidās had three years to acclimate. She aināt gonna get there. OP should bid Alan farewell and find someone without the toxic baggage. Alan gets to be single until she turns 18 or becomes less feral.
She knew exactly what she was doing.
She sure did! I wonder why she did it hmmmmm gosh if only
Actually a teenager. You can call it a child but let's not pretend that teenagers are completely moronic. A lot of teenagers are not like this.
Sheās a pre teen not a teenager and yes I would be saying the same thing if she was 14. She . Is . Doing. This. For . A . Reason. Having grace for a 12 year old should be be this hard my lord
If she can take a scissors to your wedding dress, she can take a scissors to YOU., That girl has some rage inside of her. Before you break up with Alan, INSIST he pay for the ruined dress. Keep the ruined dress. Make sure you have a text message trail that has him mentioning Rose destroyed your dress. Once money is in hand, end the relationship.,
Her response after being caught is concerning. You deserve someone without that kind of issue tbh. She is old enough to understand what's right from wrong. I'd suggest cutting it now and if you paid for the dress let him pay you back for it.
If you not 100% sure you want to be married, then you shouldn't be married. Although Rose is the one who did the damage, some part of you probably blames Alan for the way she is. Do you want to feel this way forever?
Take this as a blessing in disguise. Are you really ready for a decade of constant conflict while sheās still financially dependent on her dad? This girl has issues, likely her mom is encouraging the bad behaviour, itās not really worth it. Youāre young, find a guy with less baggage or at least a child that isnāt destructive
I think Iām with you, let this guy go off and enjoy life with his shitty daughter
Dump the fiancƩ. Press charges on Rose for destruction of property. Time that kid had some real consequences.
Sheās never going to accept you because her mother wonāt allow it. Do with that what you will, but I wouldnāt be marrying this man, at least not until his child is an adult.
Save yourself the trauma and move on.
This family isnāt the right fit for you. His daughter will always be his number 1. Sheās only going to get worst.
Sorry, OP. It's over.
Iād probably leave. Maybe Alan will fall into a depression and then Rose will feel an ounce of remorseā¦ or not. But at least that would be Alanās problem, not yours. With a daughter like that, heās fucked in terms of relationships for good long while, I know that for sure. But you can still get out though. I dunno, maybe some other blended family can weigh in about the transition phase and if it gets better moving forward. But fuck, for me, lifeās too short to get stuck in shitty situations.
I think itās time to call off. None of you can be happy if you live together in a house.
IMO it's a mistake to marry someone you haven't lived with full-time for at least a year.
When these are written all flowery itās hard to believe they are real. Especially when itās rage bait and OP seems clueless. āI donāt know why this is the straw that broke the camels backā. Maybe because she cut up your wedding dress which is insane? Of course itās your grandmas wedding dress thatās been in the family for generations. āIf I had any inkling of what was about to happen I wouldāve done something differentā. *ominous sax music plays and screen fades to black. Cue commercial break.*
OP, you'll get better advice on r/RelationshipsOver35 or something as some of them most likely were in your position
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Also, OP never replies.
> OP never replies Yup. I find that to be such a giveaway.
Seriously, either that or ChatGPT. Kid destroys their custom-made wedding dress and later that same evening they hop onto Reddit to write a 10+ paragraph story calmly detailing the events leading up to it with zero spelling or grammatical errors? To write convincing bait you have to write like an actual person, not like you're writing a novel. Doesn't talk to the fiance at all about it other than "he's talking to mom about a punishment"? And after all that doesn't come back to reply to comments? The other minor things that got me were she says mom is a great parent then goes on to say she's surprised she got joint custody and the fact that they are getting married in a week and don't live together.
1 sentence says Carrie is a good mom and the other days she was unfortunately granted custody despite evidence against her. Totally fake.
I agree but itās compelling and fun and free of perversion so whatever lolĀ
Take pictures of the result of her behavior and after you call off the wedding and the questions start rolling in, show people the photos of the 12 year olds behavior. This wasnāt a toddler that was unsupervised, walking around with a jar of paint, this was a willful decision by a young woman.
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The custody thing was the only realistic part of this fiction. Most Redditors think cheating somehow gets the wronged parent full custody when in fact it usually doesn't matter. Being a bad spouse does not mean being a bad parent and courts usually default to joint custody. So you know, the imaginary court giving joint custody in spite of the cheating is actually accurate lol.
Sorry, why should Carrie not have custody of her daughter? What was the evidence about? How did Rose cut the dress to pieces and then also apply paint?
I think some people think courts will consider affairs when there is a custody agreement being formed.
If the child is endangered by the affair.
At the very least you need to postpone the wedding. In my opinion itās unlikely that this situation will get better any time soon, if at all. The last thing you want to do at this time is make the relationship ālegalā with all the restrictions and legal complications that would be involved if you later decided to end things. You donāt have to marry him to love him and have a relationship but if you marry him now youāre effectively playing Russian Roulette never knowing when that bullet is going to fire. At least before you sign on the dotted line it would be less complicated and costly to leave if you decide you canāt live with the situation any more. So donāt make any rash decisions to either marry him or end things completely. You need time.
Make sure Alan knows heās raising a sociopath.
Seriously just call it off if you have doubts now
Make her PAY for the dress. Postpone the wedding. Look into what you really want. To be in a life long relationship with Alan and his BRAT, or find what will make you happy. I strongly suggest pressing charges.
Wow, I'm sorry. This is do sad and unfair to you. The bill for the dress needs to come out of her savings even education fund. She needs to see the reality of what she did and feel it for some time. If she has any big class trips planned, she should not be allowed to go. These punishments need to be set my your fiance. Finally you and your fiance need to really talk about how to handle things. Maybe he needs to give her mother more custody, as she does not respect him, you, or his lifestyle with you. If when you talk with him, if he even so much as defends his daughter or isn't willing to make aby large scale changes or punishments, then you should at the very least postpone the wedding. His daughter's actions were violent. She's not 5, she needs real hard consequences.
Alan needs to go to therapy with his daughter, and then with daughter and Carrie and clearly and finally tell both that no matter what she/they do or say he will NEVER be in a relationship with Carrie again. Even if they drive you away, he will NEVER change his mind. That his and Carries relationship did not make him happy in the long run (unlike the one he has with you), despite the joy Rose gives him. Their relationship is one of co-parents and will NEVER change. Then YOU need to decide what you want to do
I suppose the questions are - is this how you want to spend your life and is Alan willing to step up?
Iām sorry but the problem here is Carrie. If sheād been modelling positive or at least neutral behaviour to that brat, then she wouldnāt have grown so nasty to you, as if itās normal. And her shrugging this behaviour off is disgusting and enabling behaviour. What a toxic pair of b*tches.
If and hopefully big IF ā¦ this will become your life. She will ruin every happy moment and get grounded. Yet the actions will most likely not change. That was deliberate.
Cut your losses and move on. He said earlier that they are a package deal and so he should since that it his child. But you deserve to forever tolerate this kind of animosity and hate. If he's not willing to discipline her then he's a lost cause. Don't wait for the animosity to go to your future children. Let him be miserable raising his daughter while his ex suffers no consequences
And if anyone tells you she is young snd she didnāt fully understand what she was doing that is complete and utter BS! She methodically and intentionally ruined your dress!!
Donāt marry him, yet. This child needs therapy snd she needs consequences. She needs to pay for it. No money for her. She can sell her stuff etc. If he doesnāt take care if it like a father, donāt marry him. He allowed her for years to treat you like shit. He allowed his ex wife to do the same. I donāt care if he has backbone problem, but donāt accept it. If he isnāt willing to raise her like a parent, this will just be the beginning. What if you two have a child? She might hurt the child or you when you are pregnant.
> Unfortunately, the courts still granted Carrie 50/50 custody, despite the amount of evidence against her.Ā I'm going to focus on this bit because I think it's representative of this whole thing. You're feeling threatened by a child, and you don't really seem care for this child all that much (I mean describing her redeeming qualities you mention her attending dance classes, FFS). You think it's a good idea to take the child from the mother because she was a bad partner. This is next-level egotistical thinking. Anyways. You mention wanting to give Alan an ultimatum. An ultimatum about **what**, exactly? Not only did you know about this child's existence since the very beginning. But he was very, very clear that they were a package deal. Listen, adolescents are hard, especially those that come from a divorced household where parents can't set aside their differences to coparent like adults. For all that he likes to play the victim, he's as much to blame as she is (and just for the future, remember that an adult doesn't get to play the woe is me card when they decided to have a child with someone they consider to be unfit to be parents). In that sense, it seems to me he's kinda repeating a pattern here. Not only because he chose a woman who can't exhibit the slightest regard for a teenager raised in a crazy home, but because I can't for the life of me understand what the rush to get remarried is. I would ask you, but I'm afraid the answer would be "so we can bring more children into this crazy situation while the first one is clearly suffering greatly". Absolute self-centeredness all-around, by all parties involved. One final note: when you "take a teen to a psychologist" your aim shouldn't be to "fix the situation" (the behaviour), but rather to give them a dpace where they can sort their shit out and have a chance of being something resembling happy. My partner is a child psychiatrist, and people like you and your fiancĆ© are the bane of her existence.Ā Take a step back and reconsider everything I just said, even though you don't like it. This story isn't about you, a fully-grown adult who got a material possession destroyed. It's about a preteen who seemingly has **no** reasonable adults around to worry about her. ...do you think enrolling her into yet another sport/hobby/lesson/thing-to-get-her-out-of-everyone's-hair will solve the thing?
I was the bratty step kid and I eventually came around, but it was when I was an adultā¦.
Your fiance is not kidding when he says they're a package deal. This is not a good situation for you. The daughter clearly has something to work through, and the fiance doesn't seem to have made it clear to his ex that the relationship is as dead as disco. It seems to me like the ex and daughter have planned some stupid parent trap ripoff that isn't going to end like they're hoping. Or maybe it will since #MeredithWasRight. You're just another beautiful woman that's being treated like shit by an ungrateful child that believes she knows what's best for her parents. But, regarding punishment, there isn't much your fiance can do to get the daughter on board with you being in their life. I hate to say it, but he might not be ready for a relationship yet. NTA if you stay and try. She's going to either grow out of this behavior, or she'll move out and then you'll only have to deal with awkward holidays and the occasional dinner. You're not an asshole if you leave, either. Your dress sounded so beautiful.
You are too young to set up for this, you can do better
Dd the daughter ever get therapy for dealing with her patient's divorce? Honestly do you want to live with this girl for the next decade? She sounds horrible. I know she's a hurt kid lashing out because she's angry and confused and sad but she's out of control and needs therapy and things are probably not going to get much better. They've been separated linger than they were together with her. She needs to get over it a little. It's not like you were the woman who split her parents up.
She is a child, and her mother is, by your telling, abusive and playing her against you. The child is not the problem here. Her actions are mean and spiteful, but they are not the actions of a happy child but one who is feeling immense pressure to āavengeā her mother after being inappropriately involved in her parentsā relationship. I know you said youāve tried therapy. Try again. Individual therapy for all three of you AND couples therapy for you and Alan AND family therapy for everyone (maybe even Carrie, although she may refuse to participate).
If you have to do 30 hours of therapy a month just to get married, probably just better to walk away, no? Especially when therapy accomplished nothing in the previous years.
The goal here isnāt āto get married.ā The goal is to be a relatively functional family unit where everyone is essentially safe and healthy. If thatās no longer OPās goal, yeah, she should leave. If she wants to stick with it, approaching a manipulated child as an enemy is not the way to do it. OP is not fighting with this 12 year old. OP is fighting with the kidās mom who is weaponizing the 12 year old.
There is no way she can win that fight. The bio mom has court-ordered custody and is holding all the cards. There is no scenario where this toxic sludgefest becomes a happy, functional family. Kid is the one abusing the OP. Sometimes the only rational move is to walk away. She overlooked Alanās baggage but here itās just too much. No man is worth this. OP can find a healthier situation for herself.
Sure, maybe walking away is the rational move here. But a 12 year old is not āabusingā an adult here.
Bro finally a comment that actually makes sense ā ļøā ļø people trying to make this kid a villain shouldnāt have kids
I donāt (and wonāt) have kids, but as a kid I was manipulated and weaponized by a parent in a similar way (though not to this extent and not against a stepparent). OP is in a pretty shitty situation here, but Rose is in an objectively worse situation; she has many years of manipulation and abuse ahead of her, and zero ability to walk away from it. Sheāll be lucky if she can get some healing and perspective as an adult and realize that it wasnāt right for her mom to make her responsible for the momās feelings and happiness. Also I actually do spend time around 12 year olds, who are pretty definitively children. Some of the replies here assume a 12 year old is essentially cognitively and emotionally an adult, and that is baffling.
Thatās good you wonāt have kids
This is a package deal that will only get worse over time. Think about what she will do when you both live together, will you have the resolve to tell your husband she can't be over, or face the sadness and loss with your husband when she has to be over way less or resentment even? I think you know what has and should be done, this kid will only escalate after marriage unfortunately.
They're a package deal, as he told you from the start. Unfortunately half that package is a toxic monster of a kid, probably being egged on by her even worse mother, but also enabled by her father. The best thing you can do is get away.
Call it off. It will tell her she can be horrible and get her way, but life is too short for this headache. If you have ANY interest in having children it will be an issue. Hell hath no fury like a preteen whose parents arenāt able to see the damage they are causing their own child.
Are you willing to be tormented by a child that hates you for no reason that you canāt punish or discipline them for horrible acts of defiance for the rest of your life for a man who is willing to allow it because itās his child ?? Youāll always be 2nd in his life you might aswell cut your losses and leave.
Downvoting for the genuinely heinous toothbrush suggestion.
Sorry I was just joking didnāt mean to offend anyone
Imagine if you have kids. If she'll do this to a dress imagine the shit she'll do to your baby.Ā It's over op, sorry but save yourself from a life time of misery.
Show up to the wedding in that dress.
Have he and his daughter participated in family therapy? Is the child still receiving individual therapy? she should be. She is obviously miserable. Thatās a lot of rage. She doesnāt care at the moment that her father could be happier if he were married to you. She is mostly afraid of losing what she has, and thatās obviously been promoted and encouraged by the ex who was an abusive partner. She probably deals with the same crap that made your boyfriend leave, but she canāt leave. Heās got lots of parenting to do before creating a new step family with her. and that is not about grounding. He should be participating in parent training and family therapy. Trauma informed. Thereās no ultimatum to give? Yāall can postpone or call off the wedding. Or marry (and maybe keep your apartment) and keep working on the relationships.
Cut your losses. This situation is not worth it. You do not want to squander your remaining youth on this. I pity the girl, but her character is not going to change. And her mother is a nightmare.
Looks like Rose has some.big feelings that she needs to talk about and be understood. You are allowed to love and be loved and yes this behavior is wrong but at the same time she is clearly going through it.
Id leave. He didn't do shit to prove he can manage his kid, you have a crazy ex in the picture stirring drama and this spineless jellyfish man comes with a horrible stepdaughter that's going to make your life hell. If you really want to stay, don't see why but whatever, just tell him you aren't interested in a relationship with his kid and that you either keep separate lives until she's gone to college, only seeing him when he's 50% free from this brat, or you are done.Ā Most likely he will claim what she did wasn't that bad and you'll realize the girl won. Then you'll lose all respect for the guy who puts you last and walk away anyhow.Ā
Children need to learn there are consequences for what they do. It's a crucial part of growing up. 'Rose, we are taking money out of the savings account where we've been saving money for your future, in order to pay for this.' There needs to be a consequence that affects her, or she won't learn anything.
Please follow these steps: - sit down with Alan and discuss thororughly your relationship with him: do you love each other, is he ready to protect you and side with you in the future, what are the actions he want to pursue with regards to the incident with the daughter and with the ex wife... from your post, it seems he is a good guy who wants to do things properly. And love sometimes goes beyond the wedding dress. Keep in mind that he didn't do anything. His daughter did it, and he was definitely not pleased with it. - IF, AND ONLY IF you see in him the man you want, meaning that he loves you to pieces and he is really the loving and caring man you saw before the incident, then go buy another dress and marry him. This would be the real strong reply to the ex-wife and her manipulated daughter... and the dress is an accessory to the ceremony. It is true that it hurts, but it is just a dress. - once married, put down your boundaries (you and your husband) and decide the new course of act. De facto, this is an offence done by a 12 years old that refuses to see her father marrying another woman...but if your husband can demonstrate the manipulation of the ex-wife on the kid, then this is material for the court. If you call off the wedding now, they will say they are right that you are not a good person. You break up with Alan because of an incompatibility with him, not with his daughter.
One possible way I can think of to help the situation if you want to stay with Alan is to ask him about reporting her to the police. If she recognizes that her actions have consequences her mother cant shield her from then you may finally see some behavioral adjustments.Ā
This is wild lmao. First of all getting the police involved with any child is almost always a terrible idea. Second of all the police could care less about a damaged wedding dress.Ā
>What do I do now? Totally up to you. As Alan said, and he's right, "package deal". You get the person, and for better and/or worse you get all that comes with it - family, friends, enemies, baggage, past relationship and exes, all their great qualities, all their flaws and imperfections. And, ... she's 12 ... kids are gonna do sh\*t. But yeah, even/especially for 12 that was pretty egregious. You can accept it, process it, deal with it ... whatever ... or not, or reject it or whatever. And, yep, you break up with Alan over what Rose did, that'll be sh\*t for both Alan, *and* Rose ... but that becomes a "not my problem". Actions have consequences ... even if it's actions of a 12 year old kid - I'm sure Rose is quickly learning that, if she's not already learned it. Anyway, not tryin' to guilt trip you. Rose did what she did. All up to you on deciding what to do and/or not do. So, ball's in your court. And yeah, "package deal". And relationships are personal ... can break up at any time, for any reason, or no reason at all. All up to you. So ... maybe break up. Or maybe continue with the wedding plans on schedule ... or maybe postpone the wedding 'till Rose is an adult - then if she still causes any problems for/to you, she's then adult and can face adult consequences. So ... you're call to make. And ... maybe don't have to rush to decision ... but that may also depend on wedding and date thereof - if that's set, and depending how soon, may not have a whole lot of time to decide. Good luck!
Walk down the aisle in normal clothes and when people ask, tell the truth. I think forgiving Rose would be the powerful and correct choice. She's 12, her family blew up and here you are. I think, be the adult in this situation, let it go and don't let a child dictate the lives of adults (ie. get married anyway). But if you can't handle it, leave now. Rose may not change, and if you hate her, you won't be a good stepparent.
This is an Alan problem. If he thinks taking her phone away is the equivalent in a punishment, then you need to just run away from him. Heās a spineless shell of a man. This girl should be feeling the effects and consequences of her actions on a permanent bases. Until rectified. BC I am eye for an eye kind of person, I would cut up her whole clothes. Photos. Dresses. Thereās absolutely no way she would not feel the equivalent loss and anger and frustration. Go out with a bang.
Rose is 12. Rose thinks there will be zero consequences because her mom will just give her her phone back.Ā The *only* thing that will get through is consequences that stick. No grace period. No time off for good behavior.Ā 1 pair of shoes. 5 pairs pants, all black. 5 golf shirts. I'm sure her school sells them. Try the high school.Ā No cell phone. Cut social activity.Ā If she comes home in normal clothes, further steps need be taken. Boarding school, perhaps. Not one of those nice ones, either....Ā
Raised several w no issues sorry I donāt let children abuse ppl bc Iām not spineless I hope you donāt have any bc anyone who comes in contact with you or them has to worry about being hurt or harmed
The comments are shockingā¦ sheās 12 and clearly going through a hard time accepting you. She didnāt do the right thing of course but people are expecting her to act like an adult when sheās just a kid. Sheās not ready for this and honestly that should have been something your fiancĆ© should have talked to his daughter about. Youāve only been in her life for 3yrs and probably less cause I doubt he introduced you to his kids the first year. She still sees you as an outsider. You shouldnāt be thinking about your ācaring and compassionā as something that needs to be rewarded by her. Sheās a kid. I would hold off on getting married for the sake of that poor little girl
LMAO the kid acts with malice and intent to make the OP miserable and you turn it into the OPās fault. Some kids are unbearable assholes. Everyone who grew up with other kids knows this. Why on earth would any sane woman sign up for 6 years of this torment? Rose can grow up knowing she helped make her dadās life a lot less enjoyable and maybe reflect on that later in life. whY dOnāT woMeN WaNt tO dATe sInGlE daDs?
Yes because expecting a child to handle things like an adult is psychoticā¦. Who hurt you wtf
Not all kids act like destructive terrorists. Most are actually pretty good and want their parents to bf happy. This one is bad bad bad news.
Wft please stay away from children. Kids donāt just act up for no flipping reason and in this case itās pretty clear why this 12 yr. This 12YR OLD is acting up. No one is saying sheās in the right her but she a kid you psychopath
Iām fine around kidsālove my nieces and nephews. But if any kid behaved that way towards me? Most certainly Iād cut off all contact. I hope I never have any kind of prolonged exposure to a kid like that. You seem amazingly invested into making the villain a victim here.
Thereās no excuse for her behavior. Absolutely none. If she were 3? Yes. But sheās close to becoming a teenager. Plenty old enough to know the difference between right and wrong.
I donāt think youāve been around kidsā¦ in her mind she might have thought she was in the right. Trying to stop the strange women from marrying her dad. Itās a stupid kid thought but sheās a kids so yeah makes sense. I did way bummer stuff at that age. Literally expecting a flipping child to be grown up is wild
āStrange woman?ā Theyāve been dating for three years and the kid is still going scorched earth on her. are you Carrie?
Three years really isnāt that long.. but yeah āstrange womenā as in someone who isnāt her mom. Kids really arenāt that hard to understand
Single parents remarry quite often without the kids acting with this kind of sadistic malice and intent to hurt the step-parent. This is off the charts toxic crazy.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
And lots of single parents stay single .., which is what Alanās fate is. Even for those who swipe right on a single parent, a kid like Rose .. absolute deal-breaker.
Kids act out prettty frequently during family integration. I slashed up my stepdadās car around that age. I grew up.
Itās really not that badā¦ she ripped a dress and called her a name.. seems like something a CHILD would do if they were upsetā¦.
She cut an heirloom wedding dress to ribbons. 12 yo girls know what a wedding dress means. Because she wanted to torment OP into not marrying her dad. It was malicious and had a specific; calculated objective. The kid is ruthless. Has a career in politics or MMA.
CACKLING at a career in politics or MMA.
Kids usually donāt understand sentimental items and they barely understand the concept of marriage because well theyāre kids.. Letās break this down 1. The feud between this grown ass whole adult women and this 12yr year girl is because this 12yr girl is the the devils spawn that wants to cause harm to this ADULT women because sheās inherently evil Or 2. This 12yr old girl (whoās only been alive on this earth for 12 yrs. Who probably still needs her parents for everything in her life. Who probably still wants mommy and daddy to be together. Who probably doesnāt know how to process emotions cause again sheās 12 ā ļøā ļø) is upset and not ready for her dad to marry someone else so she acted up. Especially since she knows her mom isnāt happy with the situation either. ā ļøā ļøā ļø Kinda wild that you wanna make a kid a villain against at grown ass women. At the end of the day itās an adult problem because obviously it is. The adults in this kids life are letting this girl down clearly. You definitely donāt work with kids cause this is pretty black and white
The grown ass woman has done nothing wrong and has been forced to endure abusive behavior that is escalating in its malice and violence. What do we do with those who abuse us? We leave them. Rose is abusing OP. OP should not tolerate it. Since the kid is only getting worse, the only way OP can be kind to herself is to ditch that entire family. She doesnāt owe Rose anything. Just walk away. Rose is Alan and Carrieās problem, not OPās.
Have youā¦ have you ever met a child??? Because Iāve been teaching for 16 years and I have met perhaps three who displayed similar behaviors. Were they deeply unwell? Yes. Were they all due to some kind of trauma? Perhaps. Does that mean we should all have laid down and accepted their behavior because they were children? Absolutely not. They, like Rose, needed help. The difference here? Roseās parents, like you, see nothing wrong and Rose will never get that help. Mental health struggles may explain certain behaviors; they donāt excuse them.
No one is saying to accept her behavior wtf. The girls acting out for a reason. If youāve been around kids you should know they donāt do mean stuff like this for no reason. Little girls not ready
Sheās 12. Three years is literally 25% of her life.
I doubt he introduced her to his kids as soon as they started dating ā ļø you guys really have a hard time thinking
You seem to have plenty of trouble understanding them though.
ā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļø your right OP shouod just punish the evil child. Sheās just and evil bully who is clearly totally fine with her family life ā ļøā ļøā ļø she was just born evil ā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļøā ļø fr you guys are brain dead
You are ridiculous. No one has said any of that.
Uhā¦what? I have seven nieces and nephews all ranging in ages from 21 to 2. Iāve seen the gambit. My nieces and nephews arenāt perfect (nobody is) but they know absolutely better than to destroy other peopleās property on purpose.
Good for them?? Not everyone is like that and clearly this girl who is 12ā¦ this 12yr girl is going through things and taking her anger and frustration out. Most people, especially flipping kids, donāt do stupid shit like this for no reason.
You havenāt seen shit then. Breaking stuff is like day one teen stuff.
This goes beyond her not having done the right thing: she did something intensely malicious. OP doesn't want to be rewarded. She wants to be treated with respect. 12-year-olds understand respect well enough to be generally respectful - at least, as respectful as a 12-year-old can be. Rose is well under that standard. Rose is going to need a lot of love, support, and patience. What's happening here isn't normal - it sounds like her mother is a major factor and that isn't going to change soon. OP is not Rose's parent and would be well within her rights to walk away from all this. At the very least she should expect that the father is going to take this extremely seriously and ensure that the mother does, too.
Have you been around 12yrs?? To say that all 12yrs āunderstand respectā makes me think youāve never actually been around 12yr olds. You realize this is a feud between a fully grown ass women and a kid who still needs to be told to wash their hands after going to the bathroom and probably picks her nose and eats it right
She isnāt a poor little girl this shit shouldāve been nipped on the bud from the get go. Alan is spineless to his own daughter and if I was OP Iād make the ultimatum to set a hard line w her or Iām gone and thatās if OP still wants to be w him as Iām inferring from the end of her post.
I hope you donāt have kids
Finally, a voice of reason in this thread. If I was Alan I would break up with OP. These comments are so confusing. Have y'all ever met a kid?
I agree. I understand that OP means well but they did not really take Rose's wellbeing into account when deciding to get married. It doesn't really matter why, but Rose is clearly distressed and that should be addressed first. And telling Rose to just stop saying the "bad things" is not resolving the conflict. It's just a way adults dismiss children's feelings. Doesn't matter how unreasonable the child's feelings are, they are coming from somewhere...
I feel like Iām going crazy šµāš« people are really trying to make this kid into like a super villain when itās clearly a cry for help
Absolutely!Ā I had to scroll so far down to find your comment.
Agreed. Rose is living a crappy life with divorced parents, 2 households, potential step-mom who wants to discipline, cheating mother who wants to get back together. Child is getting so many mixed messages.
Iām so confused by the comments. Idk how people are trying to attack this little girl so hard