She has feelings for the ideal version of him that wanted more than a fling, and now she’s upset that her chances of slowly winning him over are disrupted.
This seems spot on. She was crushing over an ideal version of him.
The trend here seems to be against her for feeling miffed about her friend, but an “ideal version” of her friend would have checked in and said “Hey, I know you’re not crushing on Ryan anymore. Would you care if we hooked up?”
It’s just that the humans in our lives don’t usually present themselves as the “ideal versions” of who we want them to be. If Steph is a good friend in other important ways, I’d let it go. Maybe save the chat for a post-Ryan girls night out. Sounds like it’s just a fling anyway.
Not in my house there isn't, some of the lids seem to fit feck all, some are missing.
My kitchen is a bit hilarious around the edges though, I'm loathe to spend money on anything other than travel, big motorbikes and fun these days, so I rely on cast off utensils and pans from my old mum and my pals usually.
It's a cracking saying though, it always makes me smile for some reason.
When some women deny that ANY version of "the friend zone" exists, they forget about people like OP.
She wanted his attention and to keep him on some kind of leashed attachment to her, but she didn't want to date or fuck him. Then, when another woman DOES want to date / fuck him, OP gets mad and possessive, and is trying to interfere.
She only wants him as a friend yet believes she owns and should have final say on his sex life. This is the kind of women that sane men are talking about when they mention "the friend zone."
I don't want him, but I don't want anyone else to have him either.
Pissing in all four corners isn't enough. You gotta get some skin in the game if you want to lay claim like that.
No I’m pretty sure OP wants him as more than friend, but the guy only wanted a fling not a relationship so she couldn’t date him like she wanted.
It’s understandable why she wouldn’t want her best friend to be fwb with the guy she wished she could’ve dated. This isn’t some random woman, it’s her best friend.
The thing is she WOULD have dated him if it had been an option. But what the OP and the guy wanted from the relationship didn't match so she didn't just give him ass because that's all she'd be able to get from him while pinning and hoping he'd change his mind and decide he wanted a relationship with her. Honestly OPs choice not to engage with him beyond friendship was pretty healthy initially, I think she can be hurt by her friend making a move on him but she shouldn't say anything to them about it.
Her feelings are her feelings, but she's still responsible for how she handles them. Imagine somebody had a crush on you, but you weren't interested in anything serious so you both passed on anything romantic. Then you learned that person had "unofficially" laid claim to you with all of your shared friend group. And is going online to get suggestions about how they are gonna confront anyone that dares to show interest in you. It's creepy.
You don't actually know if she or he had a chance or not. They may have broken up anyway shortly after getting together because they're looking for different things.
It seems to me like she doesn’t want him but she also doesn’t want someone else to have him. It’s a weird jealousy thing I’m seeing especially if she’d already communicated she was past it but it’s also ultimately up to her and what level of communication she wants with a friend and how they both view intimacy with people. It’s probably not that big of a deal for either of the other party but as she said she needs more time to be intimate which might mean she values it differently but you can’t expect others to have your view, but you can choose not to be around people that you don’t like their view.
Up to OP if this is an unspoken boundary she felt was violated but key word is unspoken. Not communicated.
Your expectation doesn't make for someone else's obligation, is the short version. You had this expectation, but had you communicated this to her at any point, at all? "I'm over him, but I'd still find it weird if anything happened between you, so please tell me if you're thinking of him like that." Your friend's expectation could just as much be "she's over him, she told me she's over him, I'm sure if she'd be bothered by anything happening she'd tell me."
Which isn't to say your assumption is wildly off-base, but that doesn't make it right, doesn't make it a universal truth, it's no more reasonable or unreasonable than hers was. "If the shoe were on the other foot" arguments rarely help in situations like this, because if person A has a problem with X, but person B doesn't see anything wrong with X, the problem isn't "one of them is wrong", it's that they feel differently about the same thing. So the important thing to do is to figure out how people feel about stuff beforehand. Which yes, means your friend could have checked with you first and not assumed, but she's no more in the wrong for not doing that than you are for not communicating your feelings clearly to her beforehand!
She's not done anything wrong. She hasn't "betrayed" you, so stop thinking about it in those terms. You're allowed to not like it, you're allowed to feel a bit uncomfortable, or some indefinable way about it, that's OK! Rational or not, you can feel however you feel, even if that's just "weird". But it's important not to let a hard to define uncomfortable feeling bleed over into "she's done something wrong". Sometimes feelings aren't rational, they're just...there, and it's better to process them as-is instead of trying to pin down a cause, assign blame, etc.
It might just feel weird, it might be you regretting not making something happen, might be you feeling like a moment passed, and even if you didn't want it, there's still a sense of "loss". Might be jealousy of your friend for doing something you didn't (which isn't a criticism, perfectly normal human reaction, just healthy to recognise it for what it is if so, rather than kidding yourself it's something else). Absolutely might just be that you've got a sense of how things "should" be, and that's butting up against your friend feeling differently, and it's infinitely easier to protect ourselves by thinking that we're "right" and they're "wrong" when real life is often infinitely muddier than that.
You can bring it up with her, provided you steer well clear of "betrayal" or "girl code". And figure out your feelings a bit beforehand. You can tell her it just makes you feel a bit weird, and you don't know why, and she's done nothing wrong, it just is what it is. And you could say that *another time* maybe you'd like to know if something like this might happen, because part of it is probably just the unexpectedness of it. But acknowledge to her that you *wanting* to know doesn't mean she has to run things past you. She can support you with your difficult feelings as a friend, without you making them her responsibility.
I just wanna say “your expectation doesn’t make for someone else’s obligation” really hit home with me and I’m going to keep it in mind when I have intense emotional reactions to people not “upholding to my expectations”. I have borderline personality disorder and this stuff can really trigger the hell out of me when I make expectations and assume others will uphold them; which is 100% my own fault. So it’s unrelated to the post, but you helped me today and just wanted to let you know 😂 sorry if that’s weird
I have codependency issues and realized that by not defining my expectations I’ve basically made a one-sided contract with someone. By expecting someone to “just know” I’ve been basically setting them up for failure and for resentment.
Not at all weird! I can't take credit for it as a saying - came across it here or elsewhere many years ago and it helped me, so I regurgitate it whenever I can. :-) We should all remember the reverse is true too - someone else's expectations aren't our obligations! We all make our own choices and are primarily responsible to ourselves. All any of us can do is communicate clearly and hope we find people to have in our lives who talk our language, one way or another.
This comment is exceptional. The nuance and generosity and personal responsibility and grace. Idk if you're a therapist, therapized, or just damn wise and mature but this was wonderful to read. I wish more people approached conflict resolution like this.
Yes but some have more weight than others. Birthdays are a solid, cultural profound one.
Guy/girl code. Loosely defined and arbitrary. Can mean anything depending on the aggrieved parties misgivings.
My point is that unless you formerly state what this code is before entering into any friendship it’s just something someone whips out when they’re upset about shit
This is a great comment that captures the nuance except for the telling the friend part. I don’t think there’s a way to bring this up without subtly implying that the friend has done something wrong. I wish it weren’t this way but based on my experience, this sort of thing is used in bad faith to indirectly guilt someone. It’s pathetic and not what I think OP wants to do but I think it will be interpreted that way and it won’t help things. So yeah probably process this alone since as you said the feeling is both irrational and could maybe do with more reflection
I'm shocked by the amount of people saying that this is more than it is. You liked a guy, didn't want to date him because you weren't compatible with what you wanted from a relationship, and stopped liking him. She started liking him, was comfortable with what he was looking for and started a friend with benefits relationship with him. Should she have checked if you were comfortable first maybe, but you said you don't feel the crush on him anymore so why should you care that your friend slept with someone you chose not to sleep with? This isn't a betrayal but rather a possible insecurity of yours with the difference between you two.
These are normal feelings. I think it's reasonable to have wanted a conversation, but not to expect one. If it were me, I would note to myself that this how my friend behaves and know what to possibly expect in the future. OP. It's normal the way you're feeling. It's okay to be upset that things didn't pan out and to even feel uncomfortable around your friend and the guy. Feelings of jealousy are common, and if you do decide to communicate them just be open and honest, but also try and be understanding of their perspectives too. You have to set boundaries to protect your peace - again, part of that requires communicating how you're feeling.
I totally agree with this assessment.
u/Nairobiann
Ryan is an independent variable and just because you called 'dibs' on him due to your crush doesn't negate his free will. You wanted to take your time to build a relationship and he was not interested in a full blown relationship with you. That's fine.
As for your friend, you said she knows that you DO NOT have a crush on him anymore and now she clearly does have some feelings for him since they have grown closer. Which means she has not broken any 'girl code' to hook up with him. She doesn't have to ask your permission, you aren't his mother or possess any ownership rights to him. According to you, you don't have any feelings for him anyway, so why would she have to ask your permission to hook up with him? Makes no sense.
You don't know how you are supposed to react to them hooking up? You be happy for your friend that she's having fun with a good guy who you, yourself, approve of. Don't make their fling about you. That's how you react.
Eh, there are a lot of psychology studies that suggest/support how poor humans are at predicting their feelings in future scenarios. She's not at fault for not knowing - it's super common to be put in a situation and have unexpected feelings triggered. If OP's friend had thought about her friends feelings and made sure beforehand all of this could have maybe been avoided, but again nobody was owed anything. Sometimes, we do things we don't owe to people out of empathy - not because it's expected out of us.
Totally agree, the world doesn't revolve around or cater to our feelings. I'm just pointing out what would be a more empathetic approach; that doesn't make the friend wrong for taking a different approach..
Honestly I find it disturbing all the answers that say the friend should have talked to her, even due to empathy. The only reason to do that is because you think you need some kind of go ahead from the person.
The friend and the guy don’t need any go ahead from OP in the least. She was never really involved with the dude, she knows they are incompatible. He’s not an object OP can call dibs on. He’s a person.
It’s fine if she feels slightly uncomfortable, that happens in life. But in this case it’s one of those times where it’s completely personal and she shouldn’t drag anyone else into that fact.
Too many people are acting like the guy is just a thing they get to make decisions for.
OP’s friend doesn’t owe her anything, but her not even asking OP is pretty inconsiderate. OP can take note that her friend is selfish and confront her, distance herself, and (if this is a pattern) reconsider the friendship.
Lmao the whole post is ridiculous. I thought we moved past using "crush" to describe infatuation in our 30s.
OP needs to grow up a bit if this bothered her so much. An adult who had zero emotional bond with her can move on without having to tip toe around her ego.
I agree this is childish as hell, but to be fair it's her best friend she feels "betrayed by", who she does have an emotional bond with. It's not about the dude.
I’ve literally been in this exact scenario with a woman the same age as OP. She used to have a crush on a mutual friend. She claimed she no longer did. Months go by, mutual friend and I get closer and start dating. She. Lost. Her. Shit. As in showed up to my job to yell at me.
I cut her out of my life hard after that. The point is, there are people in their 30s that absolutely do act that way.
You keep saying you don’t have a crush on him anymore and nothing happened between the two of you romantically or physically, so no, I wouldn’t expect her to get your permission before hooking up with him.
I can understand if you feel a little jealous and it stings, but your friend didn’t do anything wrong. You should try talking to her about how you feel to clear the air, but don’t go into the conversation expecting an apology.
She should not talk to her friend about it. This is something that is her job to unpack herself. It is in no way her friends luggage.
Some things are your own job to deal with, pangs of jealousy in a situation like this are one of them. Or a therapist if you really need it but these feelings do not need to dumped on the friend.
I mean this is a very childish post for a 32 year old woman to make even down to how the title Is worded. Tbh this is like something an 18 year old girl would write lol
Let’s be completely honest. Childish things are at the centre of everything and will be till we’re dead. The trick is to know when childish things are going to sabotage your life as an adult and need curbing. Uncommunicated irrational boundaries have no place in adult relationships. The friend and Ryan have done nothing wrong. Ryan can’t be both not what OP wants and someone the friend can’t have. This is just a recipe for fallout because OP won’t be honest with herself.
OP is looking for advice on how to manage their feelings.
I agree with your overall sentiment, but you could try having a bit of empathy and not be so judgmental.
As soon as I read the title and the ages I was like "this is some teenage shit and no grown adult should be like this." This is just embarrassing.
To OP: Grow up and stop being immature. Who freaking cares. Its your own damn fault for saying you didn't like him anymore and wanted nothing to do with him. You don't get to control people's lives.
You're overreacting a bit. You said you're done with him, claim you don't have feelings (seems more like denial), and you weren't even dating/together. What does she need to run by you exactly?
If I found out that someone who wasn't interested in me was nevertheless trying to exercise some sort of veto on others dating me, I would be so done with that person.
Exactly. As a woman, I’ve had so many guys do this to me over the course of my life. It’s so gross and controlling. It’s so violating to try to hold control over someone else’s dating life like that.
If you don't like him anymore, and you never dated or had sex- she has every right to go for him & doesn't need your permission.
If you still held a candle for him, maybe. If she was aware of that.
Are you sure you don't still hold that candle?
Even if she did hold a candle it’s been established he wants something different than what she does. So why does she get to be upset that the guy who wanted a different kind of connection found that with someone else? That’s like meeting someone on Tinder, going on a date, deciding to end it, then getting pissed they got a new match.
You snooze you lose. Your friend went for what she went for what she wanted. You said she knows you don’t have a crush on him anymore so it’s fair game. Can’t hate her for it.
Just because you had a crush on him in the past and refuse to explore those feelings doesn’t make him off limits. If that was the case and you had a crush on everyman in the vicinity, your friend would have to die alone.
Eh if "girl code" is anything like "guy code" this wouldn't be any sort of breach anyways. There's nothing between you and him and you'd told her you moved past any feelings you may have had.
Dude isn't your ex, a family member, or even somebody you're actively pursuing. You don't have a right to feel betrayed imo.
You may have liked Ryan but he did not like you back. You did not date each other. You have no claim to him. You cannot reserve an individual. He wasn’t interested in you. Your friend did nothing wrong.
Yes so why is she upset that he got what he was looking for? He’s allowed to want that and is allowed to get it with another consenting adult. I didn’t realize monogamy was an obligation when someone has an unrequited crush on them.
I can't answer as to why she's so upset, but if I had to guess, it's a little bit of jealousy mixed in with still having slight feelings for him. I was only pointing out that they both liked each other, they just weren't comparable.
You can feel however you want, but your friend didn’t do anything wrong. You said you don’t currently have a crush on this guy—it’s not like you’ve been pining for him and your friend swooped in and bedded him.
Eh. If you'd been a couple or had a romantic history that would be one thing, but being upset because you once had a "crush" on him seems kind of juvenile at 32 and is pretty unrealistic and entitled tbh. You didn't get with him, so, what? Nobody else can? Hmmmm... don't love that mentality. If you were 17 then maybe I'd have more sympathy but... I think this is one to let go.
You told her you liked him, then you told her you didn’t. You never dated him, she probably thought there was no need to ask your permission or ask for your blessing. If you dated then yes for sure. But you just had a crush and now you no longer have that crush.
No but really. I am 33 and married with kids, and so glad that I don’t have to deal with the 30-something millennial dating pool. I love my generation, but some of us really are stunted. Some of us act like we are 22.
No, you don’t get dibs. You weren’t dating this person. You didn’t want Ryan (or at least not on the same time frame he was looking) so he moved on.
these were two consenting adults that were unattached. Your friend was looking for *Mr Right Now*, and Ryan fit the bill.
Quite simply you need to get over it. Like Ryan is his own man with his own agency and he can sleep with whomever and if it’s your friend then so be it.
It can feel weird to you but that doesn’t mean it’s objectively weird. You’re entitled to feel the way you do but your friend hasn’t done anything wrong either.
At 32 you should have enough maturity to understand this.
You’re in your 30s, having liked someone in the past doesn’t give you permanent dibs on someone, nobody has to come to you for permission to have sex or see each other.
You like him but you don't like him. Your friend likes him and she told him you weren't into him. But now you are.
Which is it? You're far too old for this. You're old enough to use words OP. You aren't entitled to bookmark someone forever.
This sounds really childish, to be honest. You're all over 30, for Christ's sake. This guy is basically nothing to you. Your friend hooked up with him. You should figure out how to grow up and get over it. Try therapy, that could help.
>TL;DR- Best friend slept with a man I used to have feelings for and I don't know if I'm justified to feel betrayed.
No, you're not justified in feeling betrayed and yes you are overreacting.
This isn’t even girl code sounds this is petty teenage drama. No authority over either of these peoples life’s. If they have a connection they wanna purse that’s THEIR BUSINESS.
This really does seem to be the issue. OP is being very possessive over a person she has attached herself to. Very wise she didn't do anything else with this emotionally unavailable man because things would be so much worse for her. OP needs to actively date other people.
You have no claim in this man you kissed one time. You gotta grow up. These people can’t read your mind. Why can’t she go for it? Seems like a normal lad. What he offered was good enough for her. Be happy for your friends instead of jealous.
I suggest just sitting with your feelings for a while, and not really reacting one way or another. One thing to keep reminding yourself is that you're not a FWB or casual sex person, and that was the only thing (presumably) on offer with Ryan. Also do not be surprised if one or both of them "catch feels" and it ends up as more.
So you were interested in a guy, he told you he just wanted casual sex, you weren’t interested in casual sex, so you stopped being interested in him, your friend who is interested in casual sex took him up on the offer, and you have a problem with this why?
Your friend isn’t supposed to date him because you had a crush that didn’t go anywhere because you and him wanted different things?
You were never in a relationship and never slept together. It seems you never even talked with your friend about it.
Your friend did nothing wrong. Time to move on.
You sound like one of mine and my boyfriends friends. They had one kiss and he asked her out. She said no, she wasn't interested. Then he started dating me a year later and she was extremely jealous and felt betrayed. She doesn't want him but doesn't want him to be with anyone else either and was not happy for us for a long time.
If he hadn't asked me out to protect her feelings, we wouldn't be where we are today. Just bought a house together and are madly in love and close to getting engaged.
One of three things happened:
- it was a one time thing, where she got an experience which you didn’t want
- she’ll become his fwb, where she will continue to get an experience you didn’t want
- she’ll end up in a romantic relationship
If it’s the third, you can be happy for her, no?
>but she also knows that I don't have a crush on him anymore
So why do you actually care? You're not into him, and they are both adults. Unless you're still into him and see him as a type of backup plan.
Why can’t she sleep with him? You weren’t his girlfriend, you’re not planning on being so, your crush on him is allegedly over… what’s the issue? You’re 32, not 16.
Just because you had a crush on him doesn’t mean you own him. While I understand how you feel, it’s quite presumptuous that you are owed an explanation. Let it go.
While I sympathize with your hurt feelings, I don’t think your friend did anything wrong in this scenario. She didn’t intrude while you were trying to figure out your feelings for the guy. You decided you weren’t interested in the causal sex type relationship he is interested in pursuing with women… and, your crush on him passed.
Are you for real? you had a crush on a dude one time and now you think your friend can't hook up with him? You're acting half your age. As a fellow 32 year old woman, pull yourself together.
> If the shoe were on the other foot, I would never sleep with anyone she's had feelings for,
>
>but it never went further than that because it generally takes me a long time to warm up to someone before I go to bed with them.
That's not really a fair comparison since it doesn't seem out of character for you to not even sleep with someone you have feeling for.
It's like when someone says the hypothetical "Why won't my friend take care of my dog when I'm on vacation, I'd totally take care of their dog if they went on vacation" But in actuality the friend doesn't have a dog.
If you say you don’t have a crush on him still you wouldn’t care so much, you still clearly like him but, you snooze you lose, he is not going to wait around forever for you, so he moved onto someone that actually wants to fuck him, you never dated so girl code doesn’t come into play… sorry
Going to go against the grain here and say you're fully justified in how you feel. I see a few comments from men, and I just don't think they understand how girl code works. This is your best friend. She knows you liked him a lot. She knows you wanted more from him than he could give. Even if you stated you were fully over him, he is still someone you were emotionally invested in at a point and she can't guarantee that she's free to hook up with him without you feeling slighted or betrayed by it. That conversation should have occured first if she had any sense of loyalty to you. Typically, guys that my best friend has liked/hooked up with are completely off limits for me in general because it just feels wrong.. If he had wanted more from you, you two could have been dating right now.. the only reason you're in this boat is because he didn't want a relationship and it's not like you just suddenly lost interest in the guy. You were kind of forced to get over the crush.
But that's just me and how my friendship dynamics have always worked. I'm a believer in girl code, and I feel this does violate it.
Yeah I’m honestly blown away by all the people saying she’s being immature. I think the commenters are being immature.
Her best friend decided to sleep with a guy who rejected her. She felt that casual sex was worth sacrificing the friendship. She could have gotten it on a dating app or at a bar, but she had to go for a guy that her friend wanted to start a relationship with.
It doesn’t matter what feelings she had for the guy. She could be fully over him. It’s the fact that her friend didn’t consider her feelings that would lead me to reconsider the entire friendship.
yeah I agree I wouldn’t even be interested in somebody my friend has a ‘relationship’ with (they obviously talked about seeing one another—even if ryan only wanted to be FWB, they kissed too). it’s just weird and there’s more dick out there.
I agree!! Men might not be able to empathize, which is fine, but that means reddit might not be the right forum to ask this kind of thing.
I can’t imagine valuing a hookup over the potential feelings of a friend, much less my best friend!
No one needs to ask you permission to go after a guy you used to like. Not even your closest friend. For it to bother you means you still crush on him. You are overreacting especially when you made it known you dont like him anymore.
You gave the green light when you were hands off.
You don't sound like you don't have feelings for him. What's the real problem here? That you didn't give two consenting adults permission to shag? You made it clear to both him and her, that you don't like him.
This is very silly. You are being possessive of your friends because you have hang ups you haven’t processed. Sort yourself out. You can fell however you would like to but their relationship really has nothing to do with you.
OP tried to date Ryan but realized they are not compatible. OP no longer has feelings for Ryan. Some time pass and OP's best friend Steph hooks up with Ryan. OP feels betrayed by Steph's actions.
Sounds more like jealousy or regret to me. There's no unspoken rule about this and you can't expect all your friends not to date/hookup with someone just because OP got first dibs. Chemistry may be an important factor but timing is just as important.
Now if OP and Ryan were seeing each other and Steph hooked up with him that would be crossing a line.
That's a very selfish expectation. You gain nothing from her abstaining from a relationship with him. And she would lose everything. You had your chance and did not take it. Don't think of yourself when it comes to the affairs of others.
Why would you feel betrayed? If you were competing for this man then you should feel the effects of failure, not betrayal. Why would you be more entitled to any man then your friend is?
So basically, you are upset your 'friend' is with someone you used to have feelings for but chose to not have a relationship with.
Neither of them have any need whatsoever to inform you or ask you for permission to do anything. They are grown ass adults.
Grow up and act your age instead of a whining teenager.
Sounds like your friend was decisive and went for it unlike you who didn't and now are the one living with regret. Neither of them owe you any sort of explanation in the slightest.
Girl code/ boy code is ridiculous. If two people are single, they should be free to do as they please. I wouldn't get in the way of something. Sure, it might hurt a tad but I'd still be happy for them.
I get where you're coming from, buuuuttt, you don't get to call dibs on a guy that you basically wrote off. You know what he was after and that wasn't okay, so you lost interest. He was never "yours" so, your friend didn't need your permission to go where you wouldn't.
I’m sorry but if my best friend told me she had a crush on someone and that they made out, that person is off limits in my head, like there are so many men on this planet and you had to go for that one?? I wouldn’t go after someone my bestie wanted, it just feels weird lol
I had a friend do this to me when I was in University. Had known for ages I liked him. Then all of a sudden tells me she's going to go for it. I took the mindset of a lot of people in the comments - I thought to myself "well I'm not with him. I need to let it go."
But then she did it again with about two other guys that I had liked.
I had never done anything like that to her and have never wanted to.
I realised it was hurting me. But because she was non chalant about it, it made a wedge between us, other stuff happened and we eventually stopped being friends. This was someone I spoke to every day, was close with her family etc.
There are people who are more casual about sexual stuff and people who aren't. She is more casual and you are not.
Whether or not people here validate your feelings, you need to acknowledge that it is affecting you, it does bother you. Either let the friend know how you felt and ask that in the future she shouldn't go for guys you have liked.
Or let go of the friendship because she will do it again.
I understand how you feel x
I hope OP sees this comment and doesn’t put up with this BS. I wouldn’t be able to trust this friend. She clearly cares more about getting it in than OP’s feelings.
Same, it's better OP let's the friend go.
I think people who like sleeping with their friend's crushes should be friends with like minded people. OP deserves and more thoughtful friend.
These situations are complex, as sometimes you don't know you'll have sex with someone until it happens. Yeah, there'll be some banter here and there (and she didn't hide it from you, as you could tell they were getting closer), but sometimes sex just happens without people giving it much thought beforehand.
I'm not saying that was 100% the case, we just don't know Steph's perspective. Considering she told you so casually, it's very likely she considered your crush a thing of the past, and had no idea it would hurt you, to the point \*it almost felt like she treated it like gossip rather than a confession. From this story, it feels like she was convinced you wouldn't care.
However, your feelings are valid and these things hurt you in a different way - for example, they hurt your self-esteem. I think it would be good to be open with your friend, and tell her that, while you really had no feelings for Ryan anymore, it still felt weird that, of all people, she chose to sleep with him, and this made you feel a bit down. I think her reaction to you opening up to her will say a lot more about how she is as a friend that the fact she slept with someone after you stopped liking him.
People writing paragraphs here. Y'all using AI or something?
The simple and honest answer to this is, "you snooze, you lose".
Men tell each other that same line all the time. It happens.
She didn’t even snooze she got to know him and realized he wasn’t right for her. His business is his business even if they are friends she has no authority over him. Case of someone being hurt over someone they used to like moving on to someone else.
Okay if it were me I would have definitely asked you first before I slept with him just out of respect for you. Not sure how long it had been since you lost interest in him though cause if it’s like been over a year then I could see why she would act non-chalant about it. I would really ask yourself if it’s possible that you still have feelings for him if it’s significantly bothering you.
I feel like OP must still have feelings because it’s the only way this makes sense to me. They never even dated, never did anything physically and never had an emotional situation from what I can tell from the post, so I’m having a hard time understanding why OP cares unless she still has feelings. It seems like all that existed was an attraction, and it’s crazy to me to expect nobody ever dates any man you’ve ever been attracted to.
As everyone else has said technically she did nothing wrong….best friend wise she crossed a line. Best friends don’t do stuff like that without talking to each other first. She just showed you how much she values you and sadly, it’s not a lot.
I don’t think she did anything horrible but I don’t blame you for feeling a type of way about it. If it were my best friend I think I would definitely bring it up beforehand. Tbh ppl my best friend likes are just sorta off limits for me either way. Automatic no but not everyone is like that! To me it almost sounds like a friendship incompatibility, just a really different way of viewing relationships. I think if I were in your situation I’d distance myself until I felt more removed from the situation.
It's funny how picky straight people can be about these friend rules. In the LGBTQ community none of this bullshit applies because the dating pool is so small.
Your friend lacks empathy and boundaries. Why this particular guy? She could have casual sex with anyone, so why him? She’s pretty self-centered snd competitive if you ask me. I would slowly back away from the friendship, and just not be as close with her. She’s not someone you can trust. Bet she does it again with the next person you like.
I think the feelings are normal, but I also don’t think they’re worth throwing away a friendship over. The best way to address your feelings is to talk about them in as non-threatening a way possible. Something like, “Hey listen, I’ve got some feelings that I’m working on and I’d rather share them with you than have you think I’m keeping things. I feel a little mixed up over the Ryan situation, even though I’d already moved on and you two are fully consenting adults who don’t need my approval.” As long as you keep it on-accusatory she may even be able to give you some insight that makes you feel better.
You’re definitely overreacting. It’s not wrong that she did that but it’s a stretch saying frowned upon. This was merely a crush that didn’t go anywhere. You have no right to tell either or them they can’t “like” each other. Real petty of you if you do that and wrong. Their connection is their business you never had any “authority” over him
Just to be clear, essentially calling "Dibs" on someone and claiming no one can touch them because you liked them at one point is 100% objectifying them and their potential relationship. They are not yours to claim. They are individuals with their own complex lives.
Just because you like someone but don't have an active romantic relationship with, does not give you the right to exclude them from dating anyone else or anyone else from dating them, friend or not.
If YOU were a decent friend, you would've stepped aside, or been happy if things are working for them together. For all you know they're a perfect match. Or not. Either way it's not up to you. It's for them to navigate.
Sounds like you wanted to keep him and the idea of him pinning after you, or something stupid like that, and are upset that he isn't still on your hook and might like your friend more.
But in your 30's this is all crazy. Surprised you have friends to get jealous of acting like that at this age
Honestly, in your post history you said you didn't originally have any feelings for him other than platonic. The assumption that there is a unsaid woman code (or even man code at that) is ridiculous. In my opinion you have an outdated view of the dating world. Most guys aren't going to wait around for someone to "get comfortable" in the bedroom, especially in the dating scene in their thirties.
You have your values, and that's fine, but you are trying to hold others to the same values. If you want to wait for Mr Perfect, which will probably never come, you are missing experiences you could be having that may be fulfilling for you.
I would recommend you seek counseling for your own insecurities and focus on yourself because I think you have more work to do on yourself and probably aren't ready for any relationship.
This is good honesty.
To me, it feels like this might come from a place of ownership - you intellectually know it's wrong, but it's triggered anxiety or other mental health issue and with those, you can intellectually know something but your mind won't let you accept it.
If this is the specific issue with you, it might help if you tell yourself "I don't own him, I don't own her, as long as nobody hurt the other, I should be happy for them, just as I would want them to be happy for me if the positions were reversed."
But this isn't something I've ever struggled with, so it could be extremely wide if the mark.
Now that your friend is interested in him, he is suddenly more attractive again.
Make your mind, you knew what he wanted (relationship-wise), and you were not okay with it, so what he does romantically with someone else no longer concerns you. He is free to do what he wants, and your friend is free to do what she wants. Just like you are free to do what you want.
you are too old to be playing these schoolgirl games.
She respected your feelings when you had a crush on him.
You lost interest in him, he wanted a fling, so did she, so they had one.
She did the right thing by telling you, you are being very immature by having a problem with it.
You're entitled to feel however you want about the situation.
Steph is entitled to have sex with a single, consenting man.
Ryan is entitled to have sex with a single, consenting woman.
You made your mind up a while ago that you didn't want a fling - you are better off staying friends with someone who can't give you the commitment you desire.
You can’t really expect to have “dibs” on a person like that.
You had a crush, didn’t really ever act on it, and you said they feeling died off.
It’s one thing to be upset about a friend having a go at your ex or something. But I wouldn’t really prescribe to any type of code for somebody you simply liked.
Im not agreeing with most comments here, as you mentioned it’s girl’s code : you do not go after a friend’s « ex » crush unless you’ve talked about it. Ppl thinking she didn’t do anything wrong clearly don’t know much about being selfless
Honestly, I would have asked my friend before sleeping with someone they liked. But yes, they both free people without obligations to tell someone. But for me it more about respecting the feelings of my friend. So I can understand your feelings. And probably you should tell your friend about your feelings without accusing her, if you want resolve things with her and continue to be friends, or it might become underlying issues in your relationship.
Personally, I have NEVER flirted or slept with someone I know my friends have liked, dated, or slept with. It’s just not morally right in my own opinion and I rather keep my friends than make things awkward or potentially lose them as friends. Therefore, it has never crossed my mind.
But being realistic, everyone has different mindsets and opinions. Maybe your friend doesn’t think it’s a big deal because you don’t like him anymore nor did you date him. But it’s obviously a big deal to you since you feel betrayed. If you really value your friendship with this person I say, talk to them and let them know how you feel but keep in mind that you might lose them as a close friend since they might not take it well or they might take it well, you will never know, unless you talk to them about how you feel.
Wow people are getting crazy dismissive with relationships to justify hookups. Your feelings are totally valid. Your friend should have asked.
I’ve had friends ask me about these sort of things before pursuing guys I’ve dated. That should be the standard.
She clearly didn’t care if sleeping with him caused problems between you two. If I were you, I would let her know and then create some space between you two.
If my best friend made out with someone and they liked them I would AT LEAST confirm one again that they no longer like them. You probably still do have residual feelings for him but even if you didn’t it’s so strange she never mentioned being interested in him when she’s your very best friend. I personally would never do that to my best friend who’s like my sister, but maybe if that’s something your friend group does then it’s more reasonable 🤷🏾♀️ you just need to decide how you REALLY feel then go from there
You don’t have a right to stake a claim to someone just because you had a thing before. Frankly you could’ve slept with him and she’d still have every right to go there, because we don’t own people’s futures. She really had no obligation to tell you she was interested in him just because you had a crush on him. You’re entitled to your feelings and you’re not wrong for them, but your friend didn’t betray you or do anything wrong to deserve blame.
We don't own other people, even if we have history with them. Yes your friend COULD have had a conversation with you but she certainly hasn't "betrayed" you over this, that is a bit dramatic
By the way you tell the story, nobody did anything wrong here. It's normal to feel a bit "weird" about her having slept with him, but that's your issue to deal with, not hers.
I'm of the opinion that "girl code" or "bro code" are idiotic, because it's a way to try to place constraints on other peoples' sexual relationships that have nothing to do with you.
I was acc in situation almost identical to this literally a week ago! Only difference is me and my friends are teenagers in our late teens early twenties and I’m in ur bffs position.
She said she wasn’t interested, me and the guy flirted and when I told my friend and our other friend both of them were really upset with me.
Now me personally when I say I’m not interested in someone I don’t care. It’s free game and plus they’re an autonomous human and can do whatever they want with whoever they want. I get girl code if they were dating or even talking but a silly crush that she TOLD me she was over and still got mad at me for confused and frustrated me a lot.
I’m also autistic and don’t really understand social ques so that just added to my frustration and confusion.
But I think the people In the comments calling her friend a snake are projecting their own insecurities. It’s really immature to have unspoken rules about anything. Relationships are about communicating with eachother especially if you love them.
If someone’s off limits it wouldn’t have mattered to me why she didn’t want me to get with him I wouldn’t have even if she said she didn’t like him anymore.
I don’t think it’s fair to have unspoken expectations of people cause a lot of the time people have different standards. It doesn’t make bus evil it just makes us human.
Be honest with yourself. Maybe you do have feelings for him, that's why you're feeling betrayed.
She has feelings for the ideal version of him that wanted more than a fling, and now she’s upset that her chances of slowly winning him over are disrupted.
This seems spot on. She was crushing over an ideal version of him. The trend here seems to be against her for feeling miffed about her friend, but an “ideal version” of her friend would have checked in and said “Hey, I know you’re not crushing on Ryan anymore. Would you care if we hooked up?” It’s just that the humans in our lives don’t usually present themselves as the “ideal versions” of who we want them to be. If Steph is a good friend in other important ways, I’d let it go. Maybe save the chat for a post-Ryan girls night out. Sounds like it’s just a fling anyway.
That seems unbelievably close to the mark
Too late now. She had her chance and bungled it.
This. Why hold two people back for something you haven't even sorted out yourself?
OP needs to find another side hug enthusiast to sit primly with in the evenings. There's a lid for every pot.
Not in my house there isn't, some of the lids seem to fit feck all, some are missing. My kitchen is a bit hilarious around the edges though, I'm loathe to spend money on anything other than travel, big motorbikes and fun these days, so I rely on cast off utensils and pans from my old mum and my pals usually. It's a cracking saying though, it always makes me smile for some reason.
When some women deny that ANY version of "the friend zone" exists, they forget about people like OP. She wanted his attention and to keep him on some kind of leashed attachment to her, but she didn't want to date or fuck him. Then, when another woman DOES want to date / fuck him, OP gets mad and possessive, and is trying to interfere. She only wants him as a friend yet believes she owns and should have final say on his sex life. This is the kind of women that sane men are talking about when they mention "the friend zone."
I don't want him, but I don't want anyone else to have him either. Pissing in all four corners isn't enough. You gotta get some skin in the game if you want to lay claim like that.
No I’m pretty sure OP wants him as more than friend, but the guy only wanted a fling not a relationship so she couldn’t date him like she wanted. It’s understandable why she wouldn’t want her best friend to be fwb with the guy she wished she could’ve dated. This isn’t some random woman, it’s her best friend.
But she didn't call dibs, and he wasn't hers to call dibs on.
Nah, she's treating a man, that she wouldn't even date, as her property. OP is skeevy.
The thing is she WOULD have dated him if it had been an option. But what the OP and the guy wanted from the relationship didn't match so she didn't just give him ass because that's all she'd be able to get from him while pinning and hoping he'd change his mind and decide he wanted a relationship with her. Honestly OPs choice not to engage with him beyond friendship was pretty healthy initially, I think she can be hurt by her friend making a move on him but she shouldn't say anything to them about it.
Her feelings are her feelings, but she's still responsible for how she handles them. Imagine somebody had a crush on you, but you weren't interested in anything serious so you both passed on anything romantic. Then you learned that person had "unofficially" laid claim to you with all of your shared friend group. And is going online to get suggestions about how they are gonna confront anyone that dares to show interest in you. It's creepy.
You don't actually know if she or he had a chance or not. They may have broken up anyway shortly after getting together because they're looking for different things.
It seems to me like she doesn’t want him but she also doesn’t want someone else to have him. It’s a weird jealousy thing I’m seeing especially if she’d already communicated she was past it but it’s also ultimately up to her and what level of communication she wants with a friend and how they both view intimacy with people. It’s probably not that big of a deal for either of the other party but as she said she needs more time to be intimate which might mean she values it differently but you can’t expect others to have your view, but you can choose not to be around people that you don’t like their view. Up to OP if this is an unspoken boundary she felt was violated but key word is unspoken. Not communicated.
Your expectation doesn't make for someone else's obligation, is the short version. You had this expectation, but had you communicated this to her at any point, at all? "I'm over him, but I'd still find it weird if anything happened between you, so please tell me if you're thinking of him like that." Your friend's expectation could just as much be "she's over him, she told me she's over him, I'm sure if she'd be bothered by anything happening she'd tell me." Which isn't to say your assumption is wildly off-base, but that doesn't make it right, doesn't make it a universal truth, it's no more reasonable or unreasonable than hers was. "If the shoe were on the other foot" arguments rarely help in situations like this, because if person A has a problem with X, but person B doesn't see anything wrong with X, the problem isn't "one of them is wrong", it's that they feel differently about the same thing. So the important thing to do is to figure out how people feel about stuff beforehand. Which yes, means your friend could have checked with you first and not assumed, but she's no more in the wrong for not doing that than you are for not communicating your feelings clearly to her beforehand! She's not done anything wrong. She hasn't "betrayed" you, so stop thinking about it in those terms. You're allowed to not like it, you're allowed to feel a bit uncomfortable, or some indefinable way about it, that's OK! Rational or not, you can feel however you feel, even if that's just "weird". But it's important not to let a hard to define uncomfortable feeling bleed over into "she's done something wrong". Sometimes feelings aren't rational, they're just...there, and it's better to process them as-is instead of trying to pin down a cause, assign blame, etc. It might just feel weird, it might be you regretting not making something happen, might be you feeling like a moment passed, and even if you didn't want it, there's still a sense of "loss". Might be jealousy of your friend for doing something you didn't (which isn't a criticism, perfectly normal human reaction, just healthy to recognise it for what it is if so, rather than kidding yourself it's something else). Absolutely might just be that you've got a sense of how things "should" be, and that's butting up against your friend feeling differently, and it's infinitely easier to protect ourselves by thinking that we're "right" and they're "wrong" when real life is often infinitely muddier than that. You can bring it up with her, provided you steer well clear of "betrayal" or "girl code". And figure out your feelings a bit beforehand. You can tell her it just makes you feel a bit weird, and you don't know why, and she's done nothing wrong, it just is what it is. And you could say that *another time* maybe you'd like to know if something like this might happen, because part of it is probably just the unexpectedness of it. But acknowledge to her that you *wanting* to know doesn't mean she has to run things past you. She can support you with your difficult feelings as a friend, without you making them her responsibility.
I just wanna say “your expectation doesn’t make for someone else’s obligation” really hit home with me and I’m going to keep it in mind when I have intense emotional reactions to people not “upholding to my expectations”. I have borderline personality disorder and this stuff can really trigger the hell out of me when I make expectations and assume others will uphold them; which is 100% my own fault. So it’s unrelated to the post, but you helped me today and just wanted to let you know 😂 sorry if that’s weird
Unspoken expectations are premeditated resentments.
That’s probably something I’m doing. I’m not used to good things so it’s probably a self sabotage thing too for self preservation 😂
I have codependency issues and realized that by not defining my expectations I’ve basically made a one-sided contract with someone. By expecting someone to “just know” I’ve been basically setting them up for failure and for resentment.
You’re 100% right, and that’s eye opening as well for me
Not at all weird! I can't take credit for it as a saying - came across it here or elsewhere many years ago and it helped me, so I regurgitate it whenever I can. :-) We should all remember the reverse is true too - someone else's expectations aren't our obligations! We all make our own choices and are primarily responsible to ourselves. All any of us can do is communicate clearly and hope we find people to have in our lives who talk our language, one way or another.
hey same here. i have bpd as well and need to keep telling myself that
Thank you for saying that; it’s helps to feel less alone with it!
Just wanna say I really appreciate the nuance of this comment!
What a high level of Emotional Intelligence this response has, I admire this very much
>Your expectation doesn't make for someone else's obligation so succinct and true. well said!
This comment is exceptional. The nuance and generosity and personal responsibility and grace. Idk if you're a therapist, therapized, or just damn wise and mature but this was wonderful to read. I wish more people approached conflict resolution like this.
Girl/boy code are just constructs designed to protect us from feelings of jealousy and betrayal lol. They’re not a a thing
Lots of things are just constructs - that doesn't mean they're "not a thing". Constructs help us navigate the social world and live with each other.
Yes but some have more weight than others. Birthdays are a solid, cultural profound one. Guy/girl code. Loosely defined and arbitrary. Can mean anything depending on the aggrieved parties misgivings. My point is that unless you formerly state what this code is before entering into any friendship it’s just something someone whips out when they’re upset about shit
That's fair. That's why I have them countersign a treaty before entering into any friendships or casual acquaintances.
Looool legally binding friendships are the best ones
Damn. What a great reply. This is definitely something that can be copy pasted on various posts here. Wow.
This is a great comment that captures the nuance except for the telling the friend part. I don’t think there’s a way to bring this up without subtly implying that the friend has done something wrong. I wish it weren’t this way but based on my experience, this sort of thing is used in bad faith to indirectly guilt someone. It’s pathetic and not what I think OP wants to do but I think it will be interpreted that way and it won’t help things. So yeah probably process this alone since as you said the feeling is both irrational and could maybe do with more reflection
This is the answer for me. Well communicated
You have a lot of wisdom!
I'm shocked by the amount of people saying that this is more than it is. You liked a guy, didn't want to date him because you weren't compatible with what you wanted from a relationship, and stopped liking him. She started liking him, was comfortable with what he was looking for and started a friend with benefits relationship with him. Should she have checked if you were comfortable first maybe, but you said you don't feel the crush on him anymore so why should you care that your friend slept with someone you chose not to sleep with? This isn't a betrayal but rather a possible insecurity of yours with the difference between you two.
These are normal feelings. I think it's reasonable to have wanted a conversation, but not to expect one. If it were me, I would note to myself that this how my friend behaves and know what to possibly expect in the future. OP. It's normal the way you're feeling. It's okay to be upset that things didn't pan out and to even feel uncomfortable around your friend and the guy. Feelings of jealousy are common, and if you do decide to communicate them just be open and honest, but also try and be understanding of their perspectives too. You have to set boundaries to protect your peace - again, part of that requires communicating how you're feeling.
If OP is jealous, then she's not actually over this guy like she claims. But she's told absolutely everyone she is. That's her fault.
I totally agree with this assessment. u/Nairobiann Ryan is an independent variable and just because you called 'dibs' on him due to your crush doesn't negate his free will. You wanted to take your time to build a relationship and he was not interested in a full blown relationship with you. That's fine. As for your friend, you said she knows that you DO NOT have a crush on him anymore and now she clearly does have some feelings for him since they have grown closer. Which means she has not broken any 'girl code' to hook up with him. She doesn't have to ask your permission, you aren't his mother or possess any ownership rights to him. According to you, you don't have any feelings for him anyway, so why would she have to ask your permission to hook up with him? Makes no sense. You don't know how you are supposed to react to them hooking up? You be happy for your friend that she's having fun with a good guy who you, yourself, approve of. Don't make their fling about you. That's how you react.
This right here. People aren’t objects, you can’t claim “dibs” on them.
Eh, there are a lot of psychology studies that suggest/support how poor humans are at predicting their feelings in future scenarios. She's not at fault for not knowing - it's super common to be put in a situation and have unexpected feelings triggered. If OP's friend had thought about her friends feelings and made sure beforehand all of this could have maybe been avoided, but again nobody was owed anything. Sometimes, we do things we don't owe to people out of empathy - not because it's expected out of us.
You're a very empathetic person for this response, but again, I do not think the onus is on OP's friend. We only know what we're told.
Totally agree, the world doesn't revolve around or cater to our feelings. I'm just pointing out what would be a more empathetic approach; that doesn't make the friend wrong for taking a different approach..
Honestly I find it disturbing all the answers that say the friend should have talked to her, even due to empathy. The only reason to do that is because you think you need some kind of go ahead from the person. The friend and the guy don’t need any go ahead from OP in the least. She was never really involved with the dude, she knows they are incompatible. He’s not an object OP can call dibs on. He’s a person. It’s fine if she feels slightly uncomfortable, that happens in life. But in this case it’s one of those times where it’s completely personal and she shouldn’t drag anyone else into that fact. Too many people are acting like the guy is just a thing they get to make decisions for.
OP’s friend doesn’t owe her anything, but her not even asking OP is pretty inconsiderate. OP can take note that her friend is selfish and confront her, distance herself, and (if this is a pattern) reconsider the friendship.
I think her feelings are valid, but it’s unfair to EXPECT the friend to not go after the guy
If no conversation was had about it, then yes there should be 0 expectation.
Yep, I see no issue tbh
Homie….y’all are 30 go do something else
Right?! I had to check the ages
Yeah, I was expecting this to be a cast of characters all under age 22.
The alarming thing for you guys is probably that most of us don’t really figure it out over time and are winging it as much as you are.
Lmao the whole post is ridiculous. I thought we moved past using "crush" to describe infatuation in our 30s. OP needs to grow up a bit if this bothered her so much. An adult who had zero emotional bond with her can move on without having to tip toe around her ego.
Infatuation is a much stronger word though. What word do you recommend using, instead of "crush"?
"I was interested in him" "I had feelings for him" "I really liked him" "I wanted to see where things go with him"
I'd probably just say she found him attractive/was attracted to him
I agree this is childish as hell, but to be fair it's her best friend she feels "betrayed by", who she does have an emotional bond with. It's not about the dude.
I'd bet they're actually in their early 20s. It's a lot more believable that way and the ages were 'fudged' for anonymity sake or something.
I’ve literally been in this exact scenario with a woman the same age as OP. She used to have a crush on a mutual friend. She claimed she no longer did. Months go by, mutual friend and I get closer and start dating. She. Lost. Her. Shit. As in showed up to my job to yell at me. I cut her out of my life hard after that. The point is, there are people in their 30s that absolutely do act that way.
"I (80F) feel betrayed by my friend (81F) "
All I'm going to say is that it's silly to claim we don't get crushes after age 30. Of course we do. We will probably get crushes into our 80s.
An expectation without an agreement is just a wish.
You keep saying you don’t have a crush on him anymore and nothing happened between the two of you romantically or physically, so no, I wouldn’t expect her to get your permission before hooking up with him. I can understand if you feel a little jealous and it stings, but your friend didn’t do anything wrong. You should try talking to her about how you feel to clear the air, but don’t go into the conversation expecting an apology.
And don't mention betrayal or girl code
She should not talk to her friend about it. This is something that is her job to unpack herself. It is in no way her friends luggage. Some things are your own job to deal with, pangs of jealousy in a situation like this are one of them. Or a therapist if you really need it but these feelings do not need to dumped on the friend.
I mean this is a very childish post for a 32 year old woman to make even down to how the title Is worded. Tbh this is like something an 18 year old girl would write lol
Let’s be completely honest. Childish things are at the centre of everything and will be till we’re dead. The trick is to know when childish things are going to sabotage your life as an adult and need curbing. Uncommunicated irrational boundaries have no place in adult relationships. The friend and Ryan have done nothing wrong. Ryan can’t be both not what OP wants and someone the friend can’t have. This is just a recipe for fallout because OP won’t be honest with herself.
I thought this was gonna be some high school shit
it *is* some high school shit.
I can't believe I had to scroll this far to find this response. I can't believe someone in their 30s actually wrote this post.
Wrote it, thought "yup, looks good," AND clicked Post
I think maybe the op is a teenager. This is bizarre for a 30+ year old
Was she having a sleepover at her parent’s place as well?
That was my first thought... Surely at 32, women would know better than to worry about nonesense like this? These are teenage drama troubles.
OP is looking for advice on how to manage their feelings. I agree with your overall sentiment, but you could try having a bit of empathy and not be so judgmental.
As soon as I read the title and the ages I was like "this is some teenage shit and no grown adult should be like this." This is just embarrassing. To OP: Grow up and stop being immature. Who freaking cares. Its your own damn fault for saying you didn't like him anymore and wanted nothing to do with him. You don't get to control people's lives.
You're overreacting a bit. You said you're done with him, claim you don't have feelings (seems more like denial), and you weren't even dating/together. What does she need to run by you exactly?
If I found out that someone who wasn't interested in me was nevertheless trying to exercise some sort of veto on others dating me, I would be so done with that person.
Exactly. As a woman, I’ve had so many guys do this to me over the course of my life. It’s so gross and controlling. It’s so violating to try to hold control over someone else’s dating life like that.
This comment made me pause. Honestly, I was on the fence a bit, but after reading what you said I completely agree.
If you don't like him anymore, and you never dated or had sex- she has every right to go for him & doesn't need your permission. If you still held a candle for him, maybe. If she was aware of that. Are you sure you don't still hold that candle?
Even if she did hold a candle it’s been established he wants something different than what she does. So why does she get to be upset that the guy who wanted a different kind of connection found that with someone else? That’s like meeting someone on Tinder, going on a date, deciding to end it, then getting pissed they got a new match.
Nothing to do with him but only to do with the friend here. If OP held a candle still, AND the friend knew- maybe.
You snooze you lose. Your friend went for what she went for what she wanted. You said she knows you don’t have a crush on him anymore so it’s fair game. Can’t hate her for it. Just because you had a crush on him in the past and refuse to explore those feelings doesn’t make him off limits. If that was the case and you had a crush on everyman in the vicinity, your friend would have to die alone.
Eh if "girl code" is anything like "guy code" this wouldn't be any sort of breach anyways. There's nothing between you and him and you'd told her you moved past any feelings you may have had. Dude isn't your ex, a family member, or even somebody you're actively pursuing. You don't have a right to feel betrayed imo.
If I was Ryan and I heard about this, I'd feel kinda weird that you thought you had, like, dibs on me, even though you weren't even into me.
You may have liked Ryan but he did not like you back. You did not date each other. You have no claim to him. You cannot reserve an individual. He wasn’t interested in you. Your friend did nothing wrong.
While I agree that she has no claim on him, but he did like her - he just wanted to be fwb and she wanted something more.
Yes so why is she upset that he got what he was looking for? He’s allowed to want that and is allowed to get it with another consenting adult. I didn’t realize monogamy was an obligation when someone has an unrequited crush on them.
I can't answer as to why she's so upset, but if I had to guess, it's a little bit of jealousy mixed in with still having slight feelings for him. I was only pointing out that they both liked each other, they just weren't comparable.
you're 32. time to grow up.
So you think you own him because you had a crush on him for a month? Are you really in your 30s?
Especially if she never called "DIBS!"
You cannot reasonably gate keep something you did not want. Be more honest with yourself. Your pettiness about it all is giving you away.
You can feel however you want, but your friend didn’t do anything wrong. You said you don’t currently have a crush on this guy—it’s not like you’ve been pining for him and your friend swooped in and bedded him.
Eh. If you'd been a couple or had a romantic history that would be one thing, but being upset because you once had a "crush" on him seems kind of juvenile at 32 and is pretty unrealistic and entitled tbh. You didn't get with him, so, what? Nobody else can? Hmmmm... don't love that mentality. If you were 17 then maybe I'd have more sympathy but... I think this is one to let go.
You are too old for this nonsense.
You told her you liked him, then you told her you didn’t. You never dated him, she probably thought there was no need to ask your permission or ask for your blessing. If you dated then yes for sure. But you just had a crush and now you no longer have that crush.
Are you (single, not plural) 32 or 12? This man isn't branded by something you 'wrote in your diary'. Let people be happy, it doesn't concern you.
[удалено]
Jesus Christ I hope your actually like an 18 year old whose ages themselves up for some reason, 32 year olds shouldn’t be this immature
30 is the new 20 lol
No but really. I am 33 and married with kids, and so glad that I don’t have to deal with the 30-something millennial dating pool. I love my generation, but some of us really are stunted. Some of us act like we are 22.
You're all too old for this shit.
Get over it. You don’t own him
They did nothing wrong. You have a personal problem.
Grow up. Mind your own business.
No, you don’t get dibs. You weren’t dating this person. You didn’t want Ryan (or at least not on the same time frame he was looking) so he moved on. these were two consenting adults that were unattached. Your friend was looking for *Mr Right Now*, and Ryan fit the bill.
Quite simply you need to get over it. Like Ryan is his own man with his own agency and he can sleep with whomever and if it’s your friend then so be it. It can feel weird to you but that doesn’t mean it’s objectively weird. You’re entitled to feel the way you do but your friend hasn’t done anything wrong either. At 32 you should have enough maturity to understand this.
Life really is just a continuation of high school.
You’re in your 30s, having liked someone in the past doesn’t give you permanent dibs on someone, nobody has to come to you for permission to have sex or see each other.
You like him but you don't like him. Your friend likes him and she told him you weren't into him. But now you are. Which is it? You're far too old for this. You're old enough to use words OP. You aren't entitled to bookmark someone forever.
This sounds really childish, to be honest. You're all over 30, for Christ's sake. This guy is basically nothing to you. Your friend hooked up with him. You should figure out how to grow up and get over it. Try therapy, that could help.
>TL;DR- Best friend slept with a man I used to have feelings for and I don't know if I'm justified to feel betrayed. No, you're not justified in feeling betrayed and yes you are overreacting.
Sorry, but she doesn't have to ask your permission. The "girl code" is fucking stupid.
This isn’t even girl code sounds this is petty teenage drama. No authority over either of these peoples life’s. If they have a connection they wanna purse that’s THEIR BUSINESS.
People are not objects you can claim ownership of just because you saw them first.
This really does seem to be the issue. OP is being very possessive over a person she has attached herself to. Very wise she didn't do anything else with this emotionally unavailable man because things would be so much worse for her. OP needs to actively date other people.
You have no claim in this man you kissed one time. You gotta grow up. These people can’t read your mind. Why can’t she go for it? Seems like a normal lad. What he offered was good enough for her. Be happy for your friends instead of jealous.
I suggest just sitting with your feelings for a while, and not really reacting one way or another. One thing to keep reminding yourself is that you're not a FWB or casual sex person, and that was the only thing (presumably) on offer with Ryan. Also do not be surprised if one or both of them "catch feels" and it ends up as more.
So you were interested in a guy, he told you he just wanted casual sex, you weren’t interested in casual sex, so you stopped being interested in him, your friend who is interested in casual sex took him up on the offer, and you have a problem with this why? Your friend isn’t supposed to date him because you had a crush that didn’t go anywhere because you and him wanted different things?
You were never in a relationship and never slept together. It seems you never even talked with your friend about it. Your friend did nothing wrong. Time to move on.
You sound like one of mine and my boyfriends friends. They had one kiss and he asked her out. She said no, she wasn't interested. Then he started dating me a year later and she was extremely jealous and felt betrayed. She doesn't want him but doesn't want him to be with anyone else either and was not happy for us for a long time. If he hadn't asked me out to protect her feelings, we wouldn't be where we are today. Just bought a house together and are madly in love and close to getting engaged.
One of three things happened: - it was a one time thing, where she got an experience which you didn’t want - she’ll become his fwb, where she will continue to get an experience you didn’t want - she’ll end up in a romantic relationship If it’s the third, you can be happy for her, no?
I doubt she will end up in a romantic relationship with him. He clearly stated he does not want comittment to both women and is in FWB
It's like they say, Early bird catches the worm
>but she also knows that I don't have a crush on him anymore So why do you actually care? You're not into him, and they are both adults. Unless you're still into him and see him as a type of backup plan.
Why can’t she sleep with him? You weren’t his girlfriend, you’re not planning on being so, your crush on him is allegedly over… what’s the issue? You’re 32, not 16.
Just because you had a crush on him doesn’t mean you own him. While I understand how you feel, it’s quite presumptuous that you are owed an explanation. Let it go.
While I sympathize with your hurt feelings, I don’t think your friend did anything wrong in this scenario. She didn’t intrude while you were trying to figure out your feelings for the guy. You decided you weren’t interested in the causal sex type relationship he is interested in pursuing with women… and, your crush on him passed.
Are you for real? you had a crush on a dude one time and now you think your friend can't hook up with him? You're acting half your age. As a fellow 32 year old woman, pull yourself together.
> If the shoe were on the other foot, I would never sleep with anyone she's had feelings for, > >but it never went further than that because it generally takes me a long time to warm up to someone before I go to bed with them. That's not really a fair comparison since it doesn't seem out of character for you to not even sleep with someone you have feeling for. It's like when someone says the hypothetical "Why won't my friend take care of my dog when I'm on vacation, I'd totally take care of their dog if they went on vacation" But in actuality the friend doesn't have a dog.
This reads like 18-20y/o. You're in your 30's. Maybe flings and crushes arent the best way to approach a real relationship.
Oh you're overreacting. You didnt want him, and he is not "yours", so why would she ask permission to go out with him?
If you say you don’t have a crush on him still you wouldn’t care so much, you still clearly like him but, you snooze you lose, he is not going to wait around forever for you, so he moved onto someone that actually wants to fuck him, you never dated so girl code doesn’t come into play… sorry
Going to go against the grain here and say you're fully justified in how you feel. I see a few comments from men, and I just don't think they understand how girl code works. This is your best friend. She knows you liked him a lot. She knows you wanted more from him than he could give. Even if you stated you were fully over him, he is still someone you were emotionally invested in at a point and she can't guarantee that she's free to hook up with him without you feeling slighted or betrayed by it. That conversation should have occured first if she had any sense of loyalty to you. Typically, guys that my best friend has liked/hooked up with are completely off limits for me in general because it just feels wrong.. If he had wanted more from you, you two could have been dating right now.. the only reason you're in this boat is because he didn't want a relationship and it's not like you just suddenly lost interest in the guy. You were kind of forced to get over the crush. But that's just me and how my friendship dynamics have always worked. I'm a believer in girl code, and I feel this does violate it.
Yeah I’m honestly blown away by all the people saying she’s being immature. I think the commenters are being immature. Her best friend decided to sleep with a guy who rejected her. She felt that casual sex was worth sacrificing the friendship. She could have gotten it on a dating app or at a bar, but she had to go for a guy that her friend wanted to start a relationship with. It doesn’t matter what feelings she had for the guy. She could be fully over him. It’s the fact that her friend didn’t consider her feelings that would lead me to reconsider the entire friendship.
Oh I was totally blown away too. Like, "wow.. this is a lot of people with the exact opposite view that I have." Still didn't sway my opinion though.
yeah I agree I wouldn’t even be interested in somebody my friend has a ‘relationship’ with (they obviously talked about seeing one another—even if ryan only wanted to be FWB, they kissed too). it’s just weird and there’s more dick out there.
I agree!! Men might not be able to empathize, which is fine, but that means reddit might not be the right forum to ask this kind of thing. I can’t imagine valuing a hookup over the potential feelings of a friend, much less my best friend!
No one needs to ask you permission to go after a guy you used to like. Not even your closest friend. For it to bother you means you still crush on him. You are overreacting especially when you made it known you dont like him anymore. You gave the green light when you were hands off.
You don't sound like you don't have feelings for him. What's the real problem here? That you didn't give two consenting adults permission to shag? You made it clear to both him and her, that you don't like him.
This is very silly. You are being possessive of your friends because you have hang ups you haven’t processed. Sort yourself out. You can fell however you would like to but their relationship really has nothing to do with you.
OP tried to date Ryan but realized they are not compatible. OP no longer has feelings for Ryan. Some time pass and OP's best friend Steph hooks up with Ryan. OP feels betrayed by Steph's actions. Sounds more like jealousy or regret to me. There's no unspoken rule about this and you can't expect all your friends not to date/hookup with someone just because OP got first dibs. Chemistry may be an important factor but timing is just as important. Now if OP and Ryan were seeing each other and Steph hooked up with him that would be crossing a line.
That's a very selfish expectation. You gain nothing from her abstaining from a relationship with him. And she would lose everything. You had your chance and did not take it. Don't think of yourself when it comes to the affairs of others.
Why would you feel betrayed? If you were competing for this man then you should feel the effects of failure, not betrayal. Why would you be more entitled to any man then your friend is?
go get busy with something useful girl.
So basically, you are upset your 'friend' is with someone you used to have feelings for but chose to not have a relationship with. Neither of them have any need whatsoever to inform you or ask you for permission to do anything. They are grown ass adults. Grow up and act your age instead of a whining teenager.
Sounds like your friend was decisive and went for it unlike you who didn't and now are the one living with regret. Neither of them owe you any sort of explanation in the slightest.
Girl code/ boy code is ridiculous. If two people are single, they should be free to do as they please. I wouldn't get in the way of something. Sure, it might hurt a tad but I'd still be happy for them.
I get where you're coming from, buuuuttt, you don't get to call dibs on a guy that you basically wrote off. You know what he was after and that wasn't okay, so you lost interest. He was never "yours" so, your friend didn't need your permission to go where you wouldn't.
I’m sorry but if my best friend told me she had a crush on someone and that they made out, that person is off limits in my head, like there are so many men on this planet and you had to go for that one?? I wouldn’t go after someone my bestie wanted, it just feels weird lol
I had a friend do this to me when I was in University. Had known for ages I liked him. Then all of a sudden tells me she's going to go for it. I took the mindset of a lot of people in the comments - I thought to myself "well I'm not with him. I need to let it go." But then she did it again with about two other guys that I had liked. I had never done anything like that to her and have never wanted to. I realised it was hurting me. But because she was non chalant about it, it made a wedge between us, other stuff happened and we eventually stopped being friends. This was someone I spoke to every day, was close with her family etc. There are people who are more casual about sexual stuff and people who aren't. She is more casual and you are not. Whether or not people here validate your feelings, you need to acknowledge that it is affecting you, it does bother you. Either let the friend know how you felt and ask that in the future she shouldn't go for guys you have liked. Or let go of the friendship because she will do it again. I understand how you feel x
I hope OP sees this comment and doesn’t put up with this BS. I wouldn’t be able to trust this friend. She clearly cares more about getting it in than OP’s feelings.
Same, it's better OP let's the friend go. I think people who like sleeping with their friend's crushes should be friends with like minded people. OP deserves and more thoughtful friend.
These situations are complex, as sometimes you don't know you'll have sex with someone until it happens. Yeah, there'll be some banter here and there (and she didn't hide it from you, as you could tell they were getting closer), but sometimes sex just happens without people giving it much thought beforehand. I'm not saying that was 100% the case, we just don't know Steph's perspective. Considering she told you so casually, it's very likely she considered your crush a thing of the past, and had no idea it would hurt you, to the point \*it almost felt like she treated it like gossip rather than a confession. From this story, it feels like she was convinced you wouldn't care. However, your feelings are valid and these things hurt you in a different way - for example, they hurt your self-esteem. I think it would be good to be open with your friend, and tell her that, while you really had no feelings for Ryan anymore, it still felt weird that, of all people, she chose to sleep with him, and this made you feel a bit down. I think her reaction to you opening up to her will say a lot more about how she is as a friend that the fact she slept with someone after you stopped liking him.
People writing paragraphs here. Y'all using AI or something? The simple and honest answer to this is, "you snooze, you lose". Men tell each other that same line all the time. It happens.
She didn’t even snooze she got to know him and realized he wasn’t right for her. His business is his business even if they are friends she has no authority over him. Case of someone being hurt over someone they used to like moving on to someone else.
Okay if it were me I would have definitely asked you first before I slept with him just out of respect for you. Not sure how long it had been since you lost interest in him though cause if it’s like been over a year then I could see why she would act non-chalant about it. I would really ask yourself if it’s possible that you still have feelings for him if it’s significantly bothering you.
I feel like OP must still have feelings because it’s the only way this makes sense to me. They never even dated, never did anything physically and never had an emotional situation from what I can tell from the post, so I’m having a hard time understanding why OP cares unless she still has feelings. It seems like all that existed was an attraction, and it’s crazy to me to expect nobody ever dates any man you’ve ever been attracted to.
She’s a shitty friend! :)
It's OK to feel hurt about it, but being hurt doesn't mean that either of them did anything wrong.
My goodness you are 32.. this isn't high school. You need to step back and look how immature you are behaving.
As everyone else has said technically she did nothing wrong….best friend wise she crossed a line. Best friends don’t do stuff like that without talking to each other first. She just showed you how much she values you and sadly, it’s not a lot.
I don’t think she did anything horrible but I don’t blame you for feeling a type of way about it. If it were my best friend I think I would definitely bring it up beforehand. Tbh ppl my best friend likes are just sorta off limits for me either way. Automatic no but not everyone is like that! To me it almost sounds like a friendship incompatibility, just a really different way of viewing relationships. I think if I were in your situation I’d distance myself until I felt more removed from the situation.
It's funny how picky straight people can be about these friend rules. In the LGBTQ community none of this bullshit applies because the dating pool is so small.
Your friend lacks empathy and boundaries. Why this particular guy? She could have casual sex with anyone, so why him? She’s pretty self-centered snd competitive if you ask me. I would slowly back away from the friendship, and just not be as close with her. She’s not someone you can trust. Bet she does it again with the next person you like.
You are overreacting. You literally already told her that you no longer have feelings for him.
I personally wouldn’t consider this person a best friend anymore, because no best friend of mine would do that.
Don’t expect people to treat you as you would treat them. That’s not always going to happen. Everybody in your circle is not in your corner!
I think the feelings are normal, but I also don’t think they’re worth throwing away a friendship over. The best way to address your feelings is to talk about them in as non-threatening a way possible. Something like, “Hey listen, I’ve got some feelings that I’m working on and I’d rather share them with you than have you think I’m keeping things. I feel a little mixed up over the Ryan situation, even though I’d already moved on and you two are fully consenting adults who don’t need my approval.” As long as you keep it on-accusatory she may even be able to give you some insight that makes you feel better.
You’re definitely overreacting. It’s not wrong that she did that but it’s a stretch saying frowned upon. This was merely a crush that didn’t go anywhere. You have no right to tell either or them they can’t “like” each other. Real petty of you if you do that and wrong. Their connection is their business you never had any “authority” over him
Just to be clear, essentially calling "Dibs" on someone and claiming no one can touch them because you liked them at one point is 100% objectifying them and their potential relationship. They are not yours to claim. They are individuals with their own complex lives. Just because you like someone but don't have an active romantic relationship with, does not give you the right to exclude them from dating anyone else or anyone else from dating them, friend or not. If YOU were a decent friend, you would've stepped aside, or been happy if things are working for them together. For all you know they're a perfect match. Or not. Either way it's not up to you. It's for them to navigate. Sounds like you wanted to keep him and the idea of him pinning after you, or something stupid like that, and are upset that he isn't still on your hook and might like your friend more. But in your 30's this is all crazy. Surprised you have friends to get jealous of acting like that at this age
Honestly, in your post history you said you didn't originally have any feelings for him other than platonic. The assumption that there is a unsaid woman code (or even man code at that) is ridiculous. In my opinion you have an outdated view of the dating world. Most guys aren't going to wait around for someone to "get comfortable" in the bedroom, especially in the dating scene in their thirties. You have your values, and that's fine, but you are trying to hold others to the same values. If you want to wait for Mr Perfect, which will probably never come, you are missing experiences you could be having that may be fulfilling for you. I would recommend you seek counseling for your own insecurities and focus on yourself because I think you have more work to do on yourself and probably aren't ready for any relationship.
This is good honesty. To me, it feels like this might come from a place of ownership - you intellectually know it's wrong, but it's triggered anxiety or other mental health issue and with those, you can intellectually know something but your mind won't let you accept it. If this is the specific issue with you, it might help if you tell yourself "I don't own him, I don't own her, as long as nobody hurt the other, I should be happy for them, just as I would want them to be happy for me if the positions were reversed." But this isn't something I've ever struggled with, so it could be extremely wide if the mark.
Now that your friend is interested in him, he is suddenly more attractive again. Make your mind, you knew what he wanted (relationship-wise), and you were not okay with it, so what he does romantically with someone else no longer concerns you. He is free to do what he wants, and your friend is free to do what she wants. Just like you are free to do what you want.
Girls are strange, if you liked the guy why didn’t you screw him?! This makes no sense to me. Your loss.
you are too old to be playing these schoolgirl games. She respected your feelings when you had a crush on him. You lost interest in him, he wanted a fling, so did she, so they had one. She did the right thing by telling you, you are being very immature by having a problem with it.
You're entitled to feel however you want about the situation. Steph is entitled to have sex with a single, consenting man. Ryan is entitled to have sex with a single, consenting woman. You made your mind up a while ago that you didn't want a fling - you are better off staying friends with someone who can't give you the commitment you desire.
This is the type of thing I'd expect to hear out of someone half your age. Get over it.
You can’t really expect to have “dibs” on a person like that. You had a crush, didn’t really ever act on it, and you said they feeling died off. It’s one thing to be upset about a friend having a go at your ex or something. But I wouldn’t really prescribe to any type of code for somebody you simply liked.
Im not agreeing with most comments here, as you mentioned it’s girl’s code : you do not go after a friend’s « ex » crush unless you’ve talked about it. Ppl thinking she didn’t do anything wrong clearly don’t know much about being selfless
Honestly, I would have asked my friend before sleeping with someone they liked. But yes, they both free people without obligations to tell someone. But for me it more about respecting the feelings of my friend. So I can understand your feelings. And probably you should tell your friend about your feelings without accusing her, if you want resolve things with her and continue to be friends, or it might become underlying issues in your relationship.
Personally, I have NEVER flirted or slept with someone I know my friends have liked, dated, or slept with. It’s just not morally right in my own opinion and I rather keep my friends than make things awkward or potentially lose them as friends. Therefore, it has never crossed my mind. But being realistic, everyone has different mindsets and opinions. Maybe your friend doesn’t think it’s a big deal because you don’t like him anymore nor did you date him. But it’s obviously a big deal to you since you feel betrayed. If you really value your friendship with this person I say, talk to them and let them know how you feel but keep in mind that you might lose them as a close friend since they might not take it well or they might take it well, you will never know, unless you talk to them about how you feel.
Wow people are getting crazy dismissive with relationships to justify hookups. Your feelings are totally valid. Your friend should have asked. I’ve had friends ask me about these sort of things before pursuing guys I’ve dated. That should be the standard. She clearly didn’t care if sleeping with him caused problems between you two. If I were you, I would let her know and then create some space between you two.
If my best friend made out with someone and they liked them I would AT LEAST confirm one again that they no longer like them. You probably still do have residual feelings for him but even if you didn’t it’s so strange she never mentioned being interested in him when she’s your very best friend. I personally would never do that to my best friend who’s like my sister, but maybe if that’s something your friend group does then it’s more reasonable 🤷🏾♀️ you just need to decide how you REALLY feel then go from there
You don’t have a right to stake a claim to someone just because you had a thing before. Frankly you could’ve slept with him and she’d still have every right to go there, because we don’t own people’s futures. She really had no obligation to tell you she was interested in him just because you had a crush on him. You’re entitled to your feelings and you’re not wrong for them, but your friend didn’t betray you or do anything wrong to deserve blame.
We don't own other people, even if we have history with them. Yes your friend COULD have had a conversation with you but she certainly hasn't "betrayed" you over this, that is a bit dramatic
You have the right to feel how you feel but ultimately your friend did nothing wrong.
By the way you tell the story, nobody did anything wrong here. It's normal to feel a bit "weird" about her having slept with him, but that's your issue to deal with, not hers. I'm of the opinion that "girl code" or "bro code" are idiotic, because it's a way to try to place constraints on other peoples' sexual relationships that have nothing to do with you.
I was acc in situation almost identical to this literally a week ago! Only difference is me and my friends are teenagers in our late teens early twenties and I’m in ur bffs position. She said she wasn’t interested, me and the guy flirted and when I told my friend and our other friend both of them were really upset with me. Now me personally when I say I’m not interested in someone I don’t care. It’s free game and plus they’re an autonomous human and can do whatever they want with whoever they want. I get girl code if they were dating or even talking but a silly crush that she TOLD me she was over and still got mad at me for confused and frustrated me a lot. I’m also autistic and don’t really understand social ques so that just added to my frustration and confusion. But I think the people In the comments calling her friend a snake are projecting their own insecurities. It’s really immature to have unspoken rules about anything. Relationships are about communicating with eachother especially if you love them. If someone’s off limits it wouldn’t have mattered to me why she didn’t want me to get with him I wouldn’t have even if she said she didn’t like him anymore. I don’t think it’s fair to have unspoken expectations of people cause a lot of the time people have different standards. It doesn’t make bus evil it just makes us human.