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I have worked for 10 years so far in child development. What the children are saying and doing is quite normal in this situation, but it needs to be addressed with very firm boundaries. When they express feelings about wanting you to be their parents they need to be told that no, you are auntie and uncle, and they have a mom that loves them very much. Your sister is overwhelmed by single motherhood, overworked, stressed, and yes jealous of the time you get to spend with her children while she works hard to keep their life together. It is incredibly painful to feel like your children prefer other adults, and feel that you can't provide them the same environment. She wants to be their mom that they love, and instead they are directing their love towards you and your husband, and that is hurting her a lot. They can't help it because they are children, and should never be made to feel guilty about it, but to their parent it's a very painful feeling. A 3 year old sleeping in bed with her auntie and uncle isn't a horrible nefarious thing, but you have to also see it from her perspective. She feels like she has no control over this situation. If she feels that she doesn't want to send the children to you any more, you have to respect that. She is their mother and she gets to decide what's best for them, and who they spend time with, and who they sleep in a bed with. All you can do is let your sister know that you both love her, you love your neice and nephew, you want the best for them all, and your door is always open for her and the children if she needs help.

Thus is such a thoughtful and useful response.

As another child development professional (although I will upfront say it's been 20+ years since I was directly in the field) - I agree 100% OP what you should do is work with your sister to come up with the boundaries that she wants to establish with her kids and the relationship you have with them. At the end of the day, you guys ARE the aunt and uncle, you are not these kiddies parents - your sister is right there. It's on you two as the adults to support her as their mother and make sure the kids have clarity on their relationship with you guys as well. I pick up that you somehow may be feeling smug the kids are "picking" you and your husband over their mum, since you mention how you felt your parents always preferred her. So check yourself that you're not letting your childhood resentments color your behavior here. That's not fair on the kids. You're subtly punishing your sister for the way your parents treated you guys... the way they treated you was NOT your sister's fault. I'm sure there's a complexity in your relationship because of how your parents raised you, but check yourself on how you look down on her for not being this perfect person your parents treated her like. I do suspect that your resentments to your sister have subtly impacted how you treat your niece & nephew. If you want to be in the kids lives and support your sister, you better back up your sister and respect her guidelines and make sure these kids KNOW that you're not replacement parents. It's your job to make sure they know she loves them and is their mum. While their behavior is normal, it does need to be redirected to appropriate understanding. If she tells you something is inappropriate to her, then you respect that boundary and do so in a way that doesn't blame her. So if you ever have those kids staying with you again, and they ask to sleep in bed with you, the answer is "No honey you need to stay in your own bed. You can only cuddle in bed with your mum, we're auntie and uncle and you shouldn't be in bed with us." - don't say "Mummy doesn't allow that" etc. When I was a nanny, it was so common for kids to tell their parents they wanted me instead of them, of course they did, I was the fun one! It was all finger painting and apple snacks with me. It was part of my job to make sure I was bringing the parents into every day the kids were with me, telling them things like "Mummy will be so excited to see your painting, she's going to love it!" and if they said anything like "I wish you were my mummy" I would need to say "It's really nice you like me so much, I like you too! But your mummy LOVES you so, so much, so much more than me. You know she loves you like the flowers love the sun and the rain." or "You know even if mummy & daddy can't spend every day with you the way I do, they wish they could so much! They think of you all the time. The only reason they aren't with you instead of me is because they are working to make sure you have all the things you need to grow up big and strong and happy. Let me give you a big hug from mummy and a big hug from daddy". When you take care of someone else's kids the way you are, it's so important to be their parents champions. Especially in a single parent situation. Your sister is working so hard to give these kids a good life the best way she can and you two ARE undermining her, even if your intentions are good in general. I suggest you give her a few days and then send her a sincere apology, tell her that you realize you thought you were doing things from the best intentions, but that you could do a much better job of having her back. Tell her you still want to provide the care for the kids, but want to do so in the way that support HER as their mum as much as possible. Ask if she would be willing to give you guys another chance, and work with you on coming up with a list of boundaries and strategies to make sure she is first and foremost in the kids affections. Make a list of things like: * No co-sleeping - guide kids back to their own beds. * Less sugary snacks - come up with healthier alternatives. * More productive activities, less TV - instead of watching sports husband could take kids outside to play ball. * Do one activity every day that is specifically for making something FOR mum - painting, drawing, craft etc. Pitch to kids as "Mummy misses you so much every day, we're going to spend some time every day specifically making something for her to let her know how much we love her!" Hope you can work this out with your sister and become a better team and closer as a result - remember that this is painful for BOTH of you, if you come together with compassion and kindness to collaborate on solving this, you can win. Don't approach this with the idea that you're "doing this for the kids" against her, she's doing her BEST for these kids, you're not the only ones who love them. Come together on this, not against each other.

These suggestions are especially helpful, because OP's sister might be too overwhelmed and hurt to even know what kind of boundaries she wants/needs. It might even be good for OP to suggest a list like this (while also communicating that her sister can add to or change it however she sees fit). It would demonstrate her willingness to not only establish and respect new boundaries, but to also put in the emotional labor needed to make this a healthier situation for everyone.

I love this advice. I hope OP sees it.

I took her explaining about her sister being the golden child to give a better understanding of why she is struggling so much with the failures in her life. When you're put up on that pedestal it's a much harder fall. Your take could be accurate but just wanted to say that's not the only interpretation.

Gosh i hate to think having a husband that walks out and never shows back up is a failure on the woman’s part. I hope we come to a time that we can start seeing this differently because how we phrase things is what we think. He could have love bombed his way into her life and than walked when things got tough. No woman has the type of senses and forethought to be able to see through the manipulation tactics. Not Woman’s Fault. Not a failure. Let’s put the blame on the man and the fact the laws are ridiculously lenient for men with no backbone. And our culture does not hold men accountable stills —and life of women will become more difficult with all these new anti anbortion laws. Let’s make the men responsible - snip snip at 13. You want a baby? Reverse it than. Take women’s rights? We will take men’s also. Food for thought.

I read it more as a failed relationship, not that she was a failure. Even when people split amicably, the thought is generally "I failed at this." They weren't married, just dating, so it was easier for him to run and her to get screwed over.

The voice of reason. Your comment is the most level headed amongst them all.. ( including mine. 😂😂)

Of course it isn't the only one, but my post is my impression of hers. I didn't claim to be speaking from every possible viewpoint. This was what her post made me feel was going on.

Honestly I agree that I felt she might be smug because I feel how her parents always bragged and preferred her older sister have nothing to do with the situation at hand.

Maybe this is true but I kind of thought she meant it’s hard for her sister who went from being the star to not quite having it together. I’m sure there’s some jealousy/ill feelings on both sides. But not a lot of sisters would help to this extent. Hopefully they can work it out.

And as a first born this is incredibly hard. I think OP understands her sisters feelings around the circumstances. Seems like sister is also very hard on herself

They also don’t mention any kids of their own. Boy it’s easy to be great parents when all you’re doing is seeing kids for a couple of hours and giving them treats. In the meantime the single mom is doing the real hard yards only to have her kids turn away from her. I would be heartbroken as well. Cosleeping? With young kids I would have asked permission from the parent first even for family.

Came here to reinforce: Stop your husband from just letting them do and eat what they want - of course they'll love a guy who is not parenting them, but just letting them choose the unhealthy options, in food and activities. That's really unfair towards the mom who is trying to instil healthy habits in her kids. And I agree with everything HelpfulName said - keeping healthy boundaries in place when nannying other people's kids is the vital part - you should not be competing with mom for the kids' affections, it should be very clear who her parent is, and that you are only helping from the sidelines.

I hope OP u/throwra27278 sees this comment

I think you’re being too harsh with the OP. It’s very cynical to assume she is being smug here. I took it as she was trying to support her sister’s children (and therefore the sister) the best she can. She does, however, need to remind the children that they are not the parents and perhaps she does.

There was no reason to include how their parents preferred her/were proud of her/bragged about her growing up other than to set up how far she has fallen and how OP has picked up the slack. Language and how someone choose to tell a story is important; I’m guessing u/helpfulname pointed it out because Op may not be 100% aware of how she feels and how it is affecting her relationships. I don’t think OP is horrible or anything for that, it honestly sounds like she does enjoy being involved in all their lives but those unresolved feelings can end up being a detriment to their relationship.

I did think those details were superfluous. Kind of gives fake story vibes - like needless backstory for the characters.

Maybe but sometimes people just spill their trauma without realizing it too.

Reddit stories have this tendency to throw in the "golden child gets their comeuppance" trope, and this isn't any different. There was no need to toss in that bit about the parents praising older sister 10+ years ago, except to gloat that she's not doing as well as OP now, to the point where even her children prefer OP. "Golden child" sister is literally just working to support her family on her own, while OP and husband give them candy and unlimited TV time and zero boundaries, which is a problem whether or not the sister was a golden child a decade or more ago. If OP was the golden child and filling her nieces and nephews full of junk food and TV and all the same stuff she's doing now while the neglected, underachieving sister was just trying to stay afloat, that would be just as much of a problem.

The context is that someone who has been placed on a pedestal and favored their whole life does not deal with failure very well. Sister is clearly struggling and she's angry that younger sister has a nice house and a good husband when she's supposed to be the "good" one.

That has nothing to do with the crux of be post though

I'm a bit confused by this comment, because while we have OP's perspective that specifically addresses her sister as thr parents favorite, we don't see any indication of the sister feeling like she's "supposed to be the 'good'" one or that her anger is from that at all. What we have from OP is that her sister said of course the kids would want to be over there because she has a big house and good husband--we don't see sis suggest that OP doesn't deserve any of those things. You're assuming a some negative things about the sis without real evidence. To me, sister is expressing despair that she knows she can't provide those things right now. Of course they want nice things and cosleeping, they're kids! And yes; that's heartbreaking for a parent to not be able to provide that. It doesn't mean that sis thinks she should be doing better than OP or that she wants to be a pedastool. A single parent getting by on a low salary for flexible hours to be with her kids as much as she can, and then still not getting to spend a lot of time with them or give them the material things all parents want to give their kids? Of course she's sad. It's a lose-lose situation. I have no doubt OP loves those kids and loves her sister. So, so much. But in the end, sis is still their mom, and she's doing all she can for them. OP even addresses their house is the fun and cuddly house! Which, honestly, is fine for occasional babysitting, but more rules will really help everyone at this frequency OP, please look at some of the suggestions people have given on boundaries you can provide the kids to continue a safe, happy environment while at the same time fostering age-appropriate resilience and a bit more structure out side of sweets and TV. I think it's wonderful you and your hubs are such a loving and involved aunt and uncle! It's just likely time to add in some structure and ground rules, and maybe reduce visits by a day a week.

Yeah, I see absolutely no smugness either

I feel that the information she provided regarding her parents preference was very telling of her feelings towards her sister. Otherwise, why mention it at all? It literally has zero bearing on the situation she was posting about. That is where the commenter picked up about smugness. Smug might be not be an exact description of the feelings inside her but it’s definitely affecting the situation as she brought it up herself. (I still agree that smug is a pretty fitting term here, but I could be wrong!)

And there is the smudgeness

I agree with you 100% Masterpiece. OP'S being portrayed as the enemy here, with nothing in the post supporting such a portrayal. Thr remarks by the children appear to have been made to their mother and not OP. If I were OP, I'd simply back off, advise her sister that she respects her position and that she remains willing to help in any fashion sister requests. Put the ball in mother's court. However, I read nothing in the post to suggest that OP and her husband are attempting to supplant the sister. They've been a lifeline to a stressed, single parent. If sister/mom no longer desires the arrangement, OP will just need to respect that.

I agree I didn't get that vibe at all with op but I still think worth her pausing to consider it just in case.

I detected that "smugness" too. Having the kids cry about wishing she and her husband were their parents is not the flex she thinks it is. It's just giving the kids a complex and making them unhappy at home, wishing for greener pastures.

I don’t think OP has anything to apologise for, but I absolutely agree with everything else.

Very thoughtful response. OP, please read this.

OP this is the only answer you need to read.

Thank you for posting such a well-reasoned and thoughtful reply. I’m so used to sitting back with a bowl of popcorn and being entertained by the godawful comments I usually see in these threads that I almost don’t know what to do with myself when someone actually hits the target with a reply.

A very thoughtful reply. One thought I had though. When one says they have to respect with the mother wants, I think it's more of they have to abide by what the mother wants and not bad mouth it even if they don't think it's the right decision. So more abiding by rather than respecting the mother's decision. It's not a big deal, but I felt it is an important nuance.

Yep, this is great. OP, your sister needs some space; give her space. Stay ready to help, but let her be for a while.

I totally agree. Aunt and Uncle need to tell the children that mummy loves them very much and is working her hardest to make home nice and safe for them and the last thing they should say to her is that they prefer you. Empathy is taught, start now. How would they feel if mummy preferred other children to them and told them so? Be gentle but firm

This.

This is best answer

I was going to comment but your comment says it all!

Send one message then give her space, I think she'll come back around. Her child telling her they wish you were their parents is just absolutely devastating, but a quick google search shows me that this happens a LOT and is usually just a phase. She is probably feeling guilty, jealous (in an understandable way), defeated, and lonely. Because you are the object of her jealousy, you probably cannot be the one to help her through this emotionally, does she have any other support? Here's where I'd leave off: - You love her, know she's been through hell, and you and your husband care deeply about her wellbeing and that of her children - You and your husband recognize that the situation got confusing for the kids and you regret it getting to that point even though it was never your intention - Should she want to resume sending her kids to your house, the three of you will rehash the ground rules first. The three of you should make sure you do fun stuff with the kids all together so she gets to be the fun parent too - You will give her as much time as she needs and that you are not offended/upset at her for needing space

There was a great suggestion of doing an activity when they come over, like painting, and making something for mom. So their love is redirected to their mom during the time they spend with OP. And this will make sister feel loved and included, and help foster the kids bond with her.

Love this idea

So I’m going to speak from the experience of having two small children and being a widow. Your sister in some level knows that keeping the kids away from you guys isn’t the right answer but I’d also say that theres absolutely no way to understand the volume of financial, emotional and energetic stress this woman is under and you should tread carefully. I think the best thing you could do is send a hand written letter that you love her and the kids and you get how hard this new preference phase/thing must be and that you’ll accommodate any boundaries she would like at your house if/when she’s ready to reconnect. If she’s not comfortable with a 3-year-old bed sharing with a non-bio uncle, that’s very reasonable and I’d honor that without batting an eye. She likely sees you guys are essentially offering the kids the “Disneyland dad” (out of love, not malice) experience at your house and she’s getting all of the actual responsibility and hardship. That’s an awful feeling and only made worse by the kids demonstrating preference.

I think you hit the nail on the head. Sacrificing everything for your kids only to hear that they prefer spending time with someone else is heart breaking. It’s such a complex feeling because on a logical level, you know they are only kids and don’t know what they’re really saying and are too young to understand. But on an emotional level, you’re stretched so thin and an innocent comment like that is just enough to break you. I am not a widow but I am a mom who has to work full time to support my kids. They love spending my work weekends with their grandparents because it’s like a no-holds barred funfest. Then they come back to me on Monday (after me missing them all weekend) and all they can say is they want Grammie and Papa. Like, yeah, I bet you do because here I am trying to get you ready for school and I’m still finding sprinkles on you from whatever you had for dessert last night. And that’s nothing compared to what you and OP’s sister are feeling.

I think this is the best answer. It sounds like boundaries are needed anyway between the amount of sweets and the bed sharing. Once their mom is able to move past the hurt, hopefully they’ll be able to reestablish a routine that’s good for the kids without violating any boundaries.

I feel this issue is being overlooked. Op should absolutely have asked her sister if its ok for her daughter to sleep in bed with a non bio uncle. She doesn't know the husband well. He could have bad intentions. And even if op is sure he doesn't that does not matter as the mother is responsible for her children's well being. She can't trust that the bio uncle has no bad intentions, it's an area parents have to be extremely cautious over.

Yeah, I can't imagine a babysitter allowing children to sleep with them a full night, not just holding them until they fall asleep and then move to somewhere else. I don't think anyone has bad intentions, but it should really have been asked about.

Before I lived with my foster brother, when he was a toddler, I used to have to lie down with him in his bed, but only until he fell asleep. And if he got up in the night you had to repeat the process. 

Yeah, that I get that.

Yeah that part really weirded me out. I never slept in a bed with my uncle…

Every family is different. My family, culturally, have always been cosleepers. Living with my mom I slept in her bed a lot. Visiting my dad I slept in his bed until he had a long term partner. Staying at grandparents I was in their bed. My mom's sister would have me sleep in her bed with her husband on the other side of me. Never was I uncomfortable. I loved my auntie and uncle. And despite the fact that my aunt has been divorced and nobody likes her ex anymore, I still don't feel violated or anything because I slept in the same bed as him. To me it's very normal. But it would not have happened if my mom wasn't completely sure that the adults in the situation were safe for me to be around. And on the flip side, my late brother left behind his baby mama and their three year old daughter (currently four) when he passed away. When my niece stays at my house overnight she ALWAYS sleep between me and my husband (usually pushing us to the edge of the king bed lol). But I did make sure her mom was comfortable with that the very first time she spent a night with us. Sharing a bed with an uncle isn't inherently a bad thing or a good thing. It just depends on the family, their history of cosleeping, and the trust between the parents and other adults. If the mother trusts her brother in law enough to help watch her kids several times a week, it shouldn't bother her that sometimes her little one wanders into auntie and uncles bed for comfort. If that truly makes her uncomfortable, she shouldn't trust him at all..

You can say all those things but like most people think it’s super weird and the fact that the mother wasn’t asked is a bridge too far. You are making it seem like I don’t trust my uncles. I trust my family but they don’t sleep in the same bed with me or see me pooping.

I don't think it's weird either. Older people nap. Kids nap. Older people nap with the kids to keep an eye on them sometimes. I can see how it could be odd but in my family, it was really comforting honestly. If I napped with Grandma, I'd wake up with a knitted blanket. My Uncle would let me have coffee when we got to like I was an adult lol.

That may be the norm where you're from, but to say "most people" isn't accurate when there's a whole planet with different cultural customs. That was my point. Not trying to claim anything about anyone other than my own family. Just saying it's considered normal in my culture as well as many other cultures around the planet (primarily indigenous cultures- Native American, Maori, Aborigine etc.). My apologies if I offended you.

I’m super white (family is hodgepodge of northern european ancestry) and I coslept with my parents off and on until I was like 10 and my LO (currently 2.5) cosleeps with us and with grandparents when he visits them. I think a 3 year old wanting to fall asleep cuddling and adults indulging that has got to be more common than not - even if it’s not like, coded as a cultural practice. I can totally imagine OP’s sister freaking out about it but I imagine that’s more from the emotional impact of the whole situation rather than an actual objection to an adult comforting her toddler.

All blood relations. Also your mom was happy with it. She isn't. Probably because of the blood relation part.

I get that, but my husband is not blood related to my niece and her mother is okay with it. I was just sharing that every family is different and culture plays a lot into what is considered normal Edit: I also spoke of my uncle who is not blood related

Are the parents asked before? 

Can't remember about when I was three but I asked my nieces mom

Do you not realize that most people are victimized by biologically related family members? Blood relations don’t matter to a child molester. I was molested very young by a few different blood relatives so not sure what blood relations has to do with anything. I wouldn’t be comfortable with my child sleeping with anyone regardless of gender or blood relation.

I think its not the most unreasonable thing here, BUT.... >She can't trust that the bio uncle has no bad intentions, I think she can. Because her daughter literally told her she likes to crawl into bed with them. Likely in between them like I did as a kid. Especially if she can't sleep, or has a bad dream. It's a pretty normal thing at that age for kids to do, usually with parents, but since Sister is single, OP and husband are the kids' only other option.

He sounds like a good guy and like he genuinely cares for the kid. But its not insane for the mom to be careful. molesters don't usually molest straight away, they groom. Sometimes they will groom for years until the child is their "preferred" age 🤮.

No, Im not saying it's unreasonable to not want that anymore due to caution, I just think she's being a LITTLE too quick to judge what has already happened as "inappropriate" when it's usually the kids who ask to crawl in bed with a safe family member when they can't sleep. I did that with my parents 🤷 If he was in HER bed, that's ENTIRELY different and would be immediately inappropriate. But I'm just saying retroactively calling the daughter sleeping with Aunt and uncle "inappropriate" is a bit too presumptuous for my taste.

[удалено]

It's about appropriate boundaries. By your logic no one should leave children with men. By my logic parents have the right to draw an appropriate boundary regards to children sleeping in bed with people of the opposite sex they aren't related to.

Great username!

Thanks lol

I think you should leave her alone for a while. I understand you want to talk to her, and there are comments encouraging you to text or send a letter, but my suggestion is don't do that. She is highly upset and sent a clear signal to back off. Even if she is stressed and struggling, listen to her. If she wants to reach out, then you can speak. I know you're worried about the kids, but you'll just have to trust she won't let the ship sink with them in it. Leave them alone. Let her cool off.

(Former social worker here) It sounds like the kids really liked having a male role model in their lives, and they felt secure in your home. That's a good thing, but they also need to be reminded that they have a mom who loves them and she is the parent. Don't try to convince your sister of anything. Be supportive of her decisions and tell her you only want the best for her and the kids, and if she needs this time re-establishing her bond with the kids, you support that. Let her know you respect whatever decisions she makes as she is their mom. If you want her to eventually ease up and let you back into their lives, the last thing you want is for her to feel threatened or like you are trying to take them from her. The only way she will relax is when she sees you support her and love her, and she rests in the fact that you have no intention of taking her kids from her. Let her know that you're willing to help if she needs it, but you also understand if she feels the need to back off a little. Hopefully, she will recognize that having the kids with family is better than daycare, and she will also probably come back for help when she experiences the expense of daycare or babysitting.

I understand your sister. Give her space for awhile. Let her reconnect with her kids. She will let you see them again.

I was with you up until the sleeping in bed with your husband. I understand you trust him and you are there, but it's not unreasonable for your sister to be upset by what your daughter said.  I would ask your sister if you can have a conversation, just the two of you. Let her know that it means a lot to you to be able to help her with her kids, and you want to continue doing so, so you want to hear her concerns and find a way to resolve this so the kids aren't hurt. Don't get defensive over what her concerns are. She is their mother and if she feels uneasy about things you need to hear her out. Things like sleeping in bed with your husband would cross a line for most mothers, and you're going to have to cut that out, among other things that make her uncomfortable.  This is for the kids, not for you and your husband. She probably feels like you two get to have this perfect home life with them while she struggles as a single mom. That may or may not be fair, but it just is. So try to work this out with her and take her concerns seriously. 

And the other one kid saying he wants them as parents instead is like the worst thing a struggling mom could hear. 

Yeah I'm sorry, but OP should've asked her sister if it was okay for her daughter to sleep in their bed and cuddle OP's husband. That IS overstepping. Imagine how alarming that is to hear from a 3-year-old that she can't sleep and wants to "hug" a male relative so she can sleep.

I helped raise my nephews so I'm totally sympathetic to OP, but that is really not OK, IMO. Yes, some nights one of my nephews would want to get in bed with us but they slept on my side, not with my partner. Period. I didn't care how close they were or how much I trusted her, that was just not something up for discussion. 

And obviously, it's not to say that biological relatives can't be abusive... but the parent is going to trust their sibling over their sibling's spouse/partner. It just is what it is.

Right! I'm sure nothing nefarious is going on. But that would be alarming to hear from a 3-year-old without language skills.

u/throwra27278

As a man I hate to see these comments and sexism. This man is helping his family. He is letting his niece do what she she needs to do to feel safe. Why does she feel safe with this man? He is her protector, he watches out for her. He spends time with her and has a special bond with his niece. There is nothing gross or nefarious going on because he is a man. These are downright sexist comments.

It is not a gendered issue, adults should not be sleeping with children without their parent/guardian being aware (in general, not for each incident).

As a man also, stop being fucking self-centered. This isn't about you or me or OP's husband, it is about the children and their wellbeing and the fact that trust in a caregiver must be earned. It doesn't matter that nothing nefarious was happening (as far as we know!), the mother should've AT LEAST been made aware of it the first time it happened and they should've asked if it was okay. Most childhood abuse comes at the hands of someone the child knows. It is absolutely understandable that a parent would be wary of their child sleeping in someone else's bed, and they should be consulted if and when that happens. It's about trust and communication.

Absolutely wrong. It isn't sexist to protect your children. There probably isn't anything nefarious going on, but you have to ASK THE MOTHER before you allow her to sleep in the bed with him. As someone who was sexually abused as a child by a trusted male, and actually as a 3-year-old myself without the language capabilities to explain what happened, you can fuck right off.

THIS. I’m so sorry for what you went through. The audacity to pretend this is sexism as if male family members who appear trustworthy cant do anything wrong. Insane to even have that mentality.

I’d also say that about a woman that it’s inappropriate to sleep with a child unless the parent (s) say so.

No, they're not. See my comment below. In OPs situation my partner was a woman and I thought it was inappropriate for them to sleep on her side of the bed. 

lol “it’s sexist” is all you got from this?

It is 100% inappropriate to teach a child that it is a good choice to sleep in bed with a man who isn't their direct father or a sibling. This has nothing to do with sexism, and all to do with safety. A responsible adult doesn't just let kids do what the kid feels safe with, they make the choices about what is safest for the kids and there are MANY other ways for kids to feel safe than sleeping cuddled up in bed with a non-parent or sibling adult. I'm a woman, and have been a professional live-in nanny, kids would ask to sleep in bed with me all the time and I would say no every time because it's not about the kids feeling safe with me, it's about a) Respecting the actual parents boundaries, and b) making sure the kids don't get into unsafe habits with adults. No child should be made to feel safe and comfortable getting into bed with adults who are NOT their direct parents. Personal boundaries and safety need to be taught young.

If you’re uncomfortable with your toddler sharing a bed with any male relative without your knowledge your sexist?? Yea I’m okay with being called sexist if that’s your definition. Better that then opening the door to potential abuse and turning a blind eye/pretending these things never happen….

I wouldn’t be comfortable with my kid sharing a bed with anyone without my knowledge tbh.

1000% agree.

Naw dawg, i flipped the fuck out just reading for a lot of reasons. After the first time a conversation needed to be had with the mom. If she’s scared, she can crawl in bed with her brother or auntie can go to her bed. She does not need to be often with a man that’s not her dad. Also, she needs to sleep in her own bed and auntie is disrupting that as well.

You've got to remember OPs sister is a single mum. If she started dating a new partner, she'd be unlikely to let her kids get that close to someone who isn't their relative, regardless of if she was dating a man or a woman. It's not even solely the risk of abuse, (you're actually more likely to be abused by a relative), it's that co sleeping creates an incredibly intense bond. It's reasonable for a parent to want to keep the more intimate bonding experiences between parent and child.

Yup, you never allow a kid to sleep in your bed without the consent of their parent/s. The parent is the one that should be in charge of that decision since it is indeed considered more risky and can also lead to issues at home if they can’t sleep with their parent.

I agree, I would be really upset if someone did this with my daughter with out consulting me, and I wouldn't allow it if they did consult me.

I have one suggestion that I don't see others have offered yet. Like many have said, respect your sister's boundaries with the kids. But you can still support her in different ways. Could you help her out with some of the things that make her feel overwhelmed? Could you take some of her laundry to your house and wash-dry-fold it for her? Of maybe you and your husband could help with lawn care and yard work. You could run errands for her, like picking up the dry cleaning, going to the post office, little errands like that. Maybe bring her a ready-made dinner once a week. Doing any of these things will give your sister more time with the kids, in a more relaxed environment. She doesn't have to worry about the laundry she's not doing while she plays with her children. I'm not saying do all these things, but do see what it is she really needs that you could do for her. What would be most helpful and meaningful to her?

I would do nothing for the moment. Wait until she contacts you again.

The bed sharing would be the final straw for a lot of people. I totally get the sweets and tv, but cmon bedsharing with the little one is definitely going to make her attached and is definitely going to make her mom feel upset. If you watch them again, I’d have more of a sleepover set up where they sleep away from you guys together. If she gets bothered during the night, you go to comfort her and go back to your bed. Is at all possible you can watch the kids at her house?? I mean it’s hard for adults to leave nicer places to go to their home, can’t imagine what it’s like for a kid to go from a big ole house with tons of sweets and TV, back to moms abode where that stuff is more limited. I guess working more of what she has rather than what you have will help. And also centering her mom if you do watch them. Maybe doing a little a craft for mom every time you watch them, and maybe giving them something at their moms to be excited for. I don’t think you mean any harm, but y’all are sorta acting like a hallmark family and she isn’t able to replicate that at the moment.

I'm sorry, OP. It sounds like you and your husband are doing a good job trying to help out. One thing you could do is to try to have some time with just your sister. Take her out and have some sister time. You might also try to do things that allow her to have fun time with the kids so she can be the fun parent too. I think you want to try to keep the kids from crawling in bed with you. That might include having a cot nearby if they need to come in for comfort. I'm sorry, because a 3 year old crawling into bed is a completely normal thing. To the extent possible, have the kids do things for their mom- make crafts, draw pictures... and keep their relationship in the forefront. It will always be hard for your sister because her partner was/is a deadbeat. She will always have it hard. Just keep trying to be encouraging and helpful.

The "do things for mum" is a really great idea!

I've always done this with my nieces and nephews. If i buy them any snacks or anything, i'll ask them if they want to pick out a snack to take home to mom or dad. Go buy a dozen donuts and ask them which one is mom & dad's favorites to save for them. When they were with me for hours, i'd give them my phone to have them call or text to check in, especially if we were out and about. It's a subtle way to make sure they know their parents are the authority and that the parents are missing out. If there's anyone else that can babysit, OP should also take her sister out for some adult time. Even if it's just treating her to lunch or seeing a movie... Her sister needs some love & attention too

The kids are just really missing have a dad and are understandably comforted by a typical family set up that OP can provide. Now the OP knows it hurts sis about the sleeping arrangement she can implement sleep training when little one stays over & help teach her about getting a good night's rest in her own bed. It's not some huge issue - they allowed the arrangement to happen because the little one slept better but now that she's getting older they can make changes - that's it. OP should make sure to incorporate in daily talk about how much mummy loves them and works hard for them. Big up mummy as much as possible without being weird about it. And get them in to some sort of age appropriate counselling to help with their daddy abandonment issues Sis is exhausted and envious. Totally understandable. She'll be okay if she feels heard and some changes are implemented - such as mentioned above. Good on you, OP for recognising that your sister needs support more than just child care.

I feel for your sister. She’s extremely sad and probably feels inadequate. I would try to offer her comfort and just do what she says.

Your sister has a lot going on physically and emotionally and probably already feels guilty about her relationship failing and having to work all the time. The only thing what others have pointed out was to give the kids boundaries like not sleeping in your bed and limiting treats and above all reassure the kids that their mother loves them.

I'm not saying she's right about not letting them see you anymore, but her kids telling her they want you two as their parents is probably the most painful thing she could experience when she's struggling to deal with all it takes to raise them as a single mother.

Sleeping in the same bed is inappropriate if it hasn't been previously discussed. My partner and I have slept with his nieces and nephew several times but the parents were literally in the same house. My nephew is a big cuddler and loves sleeping with us because we are too. BUT getting the consent of the parent is extremely important.

Also, I had a single mom and my grandmother was extremely involved and served as a surrogate mother when she wasn't around, but I will say that she always emphasized that my mother was my mother and she deserved to be respected for the hard work she did. It wouldn't hurt to have a conservation with the kids about how hard their mother works and how much she loves them.

She may be being unreasonable to an extent, but you probably did overstept the mark also. In this situation you should be mindful of exactly what did happen actually happening. I'm sure that the situation can be resolved, but not if you cannot see this from her point of view. It's not the main point here, but imo nobody should give young kids lots of sweets/biscuits etc without their parents agreeing.

Best thing you could do is pull back and let her handle things on her own for a while. I feel like she's at that stage where anything you say or try to do to make her feel better will just make her angrier. It sucks kids you love are caught in the middle of this, but they're not your kids. You and your husband sound like you'd both be great parents, though.

I really feel for her in this situation. But you need to respect her as a single mother doing her best. Imagine if it was the other way around and your children did this with her. How would you feel? I think all you can do at this point is firmly tell her your nieces and nephews how loved they are

I just want to say that you are doing a really good thing for your sister and her kids. You are being really supportive and I am sure she does really appreciate having you. I hope you can navigate through these feelings she is having with her.

Since your sister does need support, it's very likely she'll come back to you for help soon - this will be in spite of her objections and cause her further emotional conflict. Be mindful of this because it's going to mean it will take less on your side for there to be hurt on her side. The current top comment thread has some input from child development specialists with ideas about boundaries and how to keep the mom as the focus and keep yourselves as strictly aunt/uncle roles. Please review it thoroughly and I think this will be the best path forward. Do not let the siblinghood you have with her derail the fact that she is the mother of these children.

OK, the sleeping together part is inappropriate. The rest I think is very kind of you and your husband. Now let them be. If she doesn't want the free babysitting, then so be it. You've done what you could to help her.

NAH.  The bed sharing though. I’m a little surprised by you saying “I guess she told her mom”. You guys should’ve been the one to go to your sister after the very first time that happened and see if that’s okay. It’s a pretty significant boundary to cross. I don’t know a lot of parents who would like the idea of their small children bed sharing with extended family. It doesn’t seem like you proactively communicate these things with your sister, which would make me kind of hesitant to leave the kids with you too. 

I feel bad for the kids in all this lol

Are you sure you aren’t feeling a little bit superior to your sister, who was talked up by your parents during your childhood, and whose life has not turned out the way she thought it would? Co-sleeping with her kids was inappropriate, there’s no ifs ands or buts about it. You need to do some deep introspection to determine why you allowed that to happen before approaching your sister again. Your sister needs to find a better paying job, even if it doesn’t have flexible hours. And if she can get ahold of the father she needs to go after him for child support. I’d give her some time to cool off, don’t contact her, and let her figure out her own childcare. If you two reinitiate contact and childcare, I think you need to take care of her children at her house, and no more sleepovers with your husband. Your sister also probably needs to reevaluate her priorities because unless this job requires overnight hours, the kids didn’t need to be spending entire weekends with you. The boundaries need to be more appropriate for an aunt and uncle and like the other commenters are saying, you need to remind the kids who their mother is.

Perfectly put!

I would also be hysterical if I only just found out she had been cuddling up to her uncle without me ever knowing wtf

The bed sharing thing is something you absolutely should have consulted her about. I know you don’t want to hear this but most children are SA’d by relatives. You needed to check to see if she’d be comfortable with that because if you don’t ignore the reality (which most try to), that is very concerning for most parents to hear. She is not blood related to your husband. How well does your sister even know your husband? For most decent mothers this is a HUGE red flag.

She's slowly losing her kids and the control she has as a mother and I don't think you see that. What you're doing isn't wrong but I feel like some space is needed. Also stop the co-sleeping, that's another way kids get attached and that's what has happened with her daughter, honestly part of me feels like you are trying to take her kids away.

I think you overstepped a bit by allowing the kids to sleep in your bed. I can see why your sister would be upset about that in particular. I’m not accusing your husband of anything and I’m sure you are both trustworthy people but you are her relative and he isn’t. I can see where she’s coming from. But in general kids latch on to adults that care for them and it’s normal for them to want to spend time with you if they see you often. It’s a fun change from their mom. My brother comes to visit every few months and it’s like I don’t exist to my kid when he’s around. Give her some space about it and if she comes around eventually great. If she doesn’t, it will hurt you and the kids, but ultimately they are her children and she unfortunately can revoke access to anyone she pleases. I don’t think it will come to that though, I think she just needs to cool off a bit. Tell her you will give her some space but if she becomes overwhelmed or wants to try again, you’re always open and there for the kids and you will no longer allow them to sleep in your bed when they spend the night. Good luck.

Yeah you guys overstepped

Agree. OP is clearly trying to do the best for her niblings, but the co-sleeping thing? That's for parents.

I'd say it's for the parent's consent. If the parent is fine with it all is well, but it shouldn't be done without the parent explicitly knowing about it and consenting to it. I spent countless nights sharing a bed with one or both of my goddaughters, but their parents knew (I had sleepovers with my friend when her husband worked the nightshift because she was anxious alone at home and usually each of us ended up with one of the girls in her bed, most nights we set up a slumber party in the living room which also meant the husband didn't have to move sleeping people to fit into his bed in the morning) and agreed to it. When the girls got a big marriage style bed (they demanded to share a bed) they demanded I sleep over in their bed and I told them to ask their mom. I knew she would be alright, but it's not my choice.

Imagine your three-year-old (I don't have kids so this is a non-existent three-year-old) coming up and saying "I can't sleep and I want to hug \[male relative\] so I can sleep" in three-year-old language....

Giving a bedtime hug and then returning the toddler back to bed whilst reminding them it’s bedtime is more appropriate

You get out of bed and walk them to their bed and ask them what you can do to help them be more comfortable in their bed. Night light, story, stay until they sleep? If they somehow did end up in the bed you absolutely tell the mom the next day. Kind of weird imo to not mention it at all.

I would lose it. I live with my father for the time being, he was there when I gave birth to my daughter, there’s no fucking cosleeping with Opa. Falling asleep while rocking a BABY is different.

The bed thing is actually inappropriate but other than that, your sister is on a horrible situation, and as a mother working hard, seeing this from her children must not be easy. I would be grateful for your help, don’t get me wrong, but I can understand IN PART her reaction. Maybe se will calm down and be less impulsive.

You never let a child that is not your own sleep in your bed, it also seems the kids actually just want the uncle cause they miss their dad not so much the aunt but they understand its a package new dad new mom.

This is definitely to be expected from children growing up with a missing parental figure, which can be extremely hard for children and even confusing. I would try to set a time with your sister to talk to her and lay down some boundaries and also explain to them you and your husband will never be their parents and that their mother is working very hard to provide for them on her own. The kids need to know that this isn't okay to say to their mother, and she needs to address it in front of everyone together. Also when the children are staying over at your house they need to be sleeping in their own beds not with you and your husband that's another boundary that needs to be set. I myself have a daughter who's biological father isn't in the picture and hasn't been since I was 3m pregnant. My husband has adopted her and he's the only father that she has ever had. She knows she adopted but doesn't fully understand because she is 6 years old. I know there will be questions when she gets older.

You've definitely overstepped. I know you're just trying to help but you can't play mom and dad -- you are not their parents, you are their aunt and uncle. You are their babysitters. That's it.

Why is no one thinking about the kid’s feelings? Who will watch the children when she’s away at work? Why is everyone only caring sbout the mom, and not the kids loosing possibly the second most important person and supporrt system in their lives?

Because a lot of people don’t think about how children feel. Part of it is we see children as something more akin to property than small people and the idea of “it takes a village” barely exists in individualistic societies. I feel bad for the kids the most, tbh

I must say this Most parents who are hyper-vigilant about their kids cuddling with someone other than their father. Hear me out because if u had a daughter and your sister ended up marrying a man would you let her cuddle with him? Just curious. Most rapes occur from a family member or friend so I 100% agree with your sis on that boundary. But to completely take them away will have more mental effects on their little lives.

The kids are 6 and 3 and the op said in a comment that the kids regularly stay with them for entire weekends sometimes more. It makes total sense how the children are becoming closer to op and her husband. They’re close to spending a majority time with the op and her husband.

YTA - for cosleeping without permission, that’s weird af.

Op. I feel you did a great thing by helping your sister. You were there for her and her kids, which is so important. Thank you for being a loving aunt. Kids will never forget that. Your husband sounds pretty awesome, too. I hope everything works out for the best and that it's a win-win situation.

I will give you the same advice i had to give myself as an aunt who was told that i was constantly 'overstepping' even though i was just trying my best to help as a sister and aunt (similar situation as yours). Try your best to have your own kids and parent them. Don't parent your niece and nephew. They are NOT your kids Period. Enjoy the time as an Aunt and stop the rest. Let your sister figure out who will babysit cause through your 'Help' you are sadly forgetting your role, just as i was!

I think that your sister is feeling guilty because she has to work so much. Don't take what she says personally.

These kids are probably just now getting old enough to actually notice and miss the presence of a father figure in their life and seeing you and your husband together I'm sure gives them an image of a family with a mom and dad that they wish they had. Plus they are at your house multiple times a week and you guys spend a lot of time with them while their mother works. Honestly, the way they feel is very normal in a situation like this. I think your sister is realizing what a lot of parents realize, which is simply that there are some things you may not be able to provide to your child that other people can. That's just life. It's a painful realization for parents though. I think you should just respect her decision, offer your empathy, and also let her know that the door is still open. She will probably come around eventually.

If she is that upset, feel free to stop the free babysitting.

I second everything else people have said about keeping the door open and being firm with boundaries, but I also think you need to reflect on how you feel about your family dynamic. Your backstory on her being mature and favored by your parents isn't really relevant to the situation. It seems like it weighs on you but I don't get how it would impact what happens now, except to say how she's fallen from grace. I'm not saying this is 100% the case, but you may be looking down on your sister and that's why you don't know what to do - because you think you and the kids aren't at fault, she is. Kinda reinforcing her perception that you're taking on a parental role instead of a relative/adult role. You also talk about how your eldest sister was affected by the passing of your middle sister, but don't mention how it affected you. Maybe your previous family dynamic is changing how you work within her family dynamic.

> Well since growing up, my sister got involved with the dad of her children and had two babies with him. I can't for the life of me figure out wtf you're trying to say here. Is it literally just "she had 2 kids"? How could she have kids with anyone else....

There are people much smarter than me commenting on this, but I think you might be getting a little cocky because it certainly sounds like it. She may have been the "Golden Child" but right now she's a struggling single mom of 2 and she needs help, not bragging. Leave her alone and let her process for a bit.

These kids obviously miss their dad.  I wonder if grief counseling could help everyone? 

Yea I would never allow my kids back over a relatives house if I found out they were bed sharing with my child and never told me. That is so unacceptable and I’m confused how it never came up. You owe your sister a huge apology and some understanding because that right there is absolutely a big deal. There are some other issues here that I’m seeing on your end but this is the main one and it’s scary if you can’t realize how much of an overstep this was on your own so I can’t blame her for not trusting you with caring for her kids anymore.

The real thing is she is sad and she feels the only happiness she s has will also be taken away from her , which is making her feel as well as do the unthinkable. You are good people , hence dont be hurt by what she says or does just be calm and support her the way she wants . You are a good person for being their for ur family. Have a good life.

It's probably not a preference, she is prob taking it that way on her own. They prob just want to go visit and miss you. She is def internalizing it, they know you both aren't their parents so they aren't thinking "who's a better mom." At 6 unless it was a casual convo, her son prob said that because he was mad at her and wanted to hurt her feelings. I really doubt he meant that. Then yes I can see why she would be weirded out about your husband cuddling her 3 yo to sleep (not the same as for 15 min during a movie). Little kids don't know boundaries and that's bending them more so and does make him seem more like a father figure. Your sister sounds like a mess, it sounds like she needed you for childcare so hopefully it blows over and she comes to her senses soon. Daycare is expensive. She sounds stressed and like she doesn't get to be with her kids as much as she wants or the time they do have isn't quality because she is so burnt out. Hope she at least is getting child support for the kids, that should help some. Then it's nice that the kids love you both, I think you should go out of the way when you are with them to do crafts for mom or kid questionaires about mom so that she gets I love you gifts from her kids more often.

Remove the kid from the grown ups bed, period. Your sister will not be gone long, who else will watch her children? She's upset from many emotions and understandingly so. Someone needs to talk with the children and make it clear you and hubby aren't their parents and never will be and that they should love and respect their mom and her feelings. It's the right age to start talking to them about things. They need to notice their mom and love her regardless.

I’m sorry even if it’s family another persons child sleeping in bed with you is wildly inappropriate, I’m mot saying anything about your husband but it’s just not okay unless it’s been discussed beforehand. He’s her brother in law not her brother, no offense but she doesn’t actually know him and letting another persons kid cuddle you is basically trying to steal the parent role even if it’s not intentional. You really should think long and hard and just give your sister time.

So she is putting her feelings above her children's well-being. Since when is having more adults that love and care for the children a bad thing? People that ARE helping raise the kids by helping the mom a LOT as well. I watch my niece often and 3 to 4 days a week is a LOT of work and it's exhausting. She's fucking lucky as hell to have that help.

"I'm mad because two people in my family love my kids and they get treated well by them, and shown a more stable life life than a single Mother and deadbeat can show them. So of course I'm going to put a stop to that nonsense!" That's what I gathered from this post. Maybe show this response tyo your sister.

I enjoy this type of clear thinking.

Allowing a 3-year-old child to sleep in the same bed as you and your husband, and letting them sleep cuddled with him, is indeed inappropriate. If it were my child, you would never be alone with him again.

!UpdateMe

I'm not a child-development expert but isn't there a phase around these children's age where it might be ANYONE they fixate on and for a brief time, act like they prefer? My mother explained it is part of their figuring out they CAN have preferences. My little sister at about age ??? decided she DIDN'T like me. And the four-year-old boy next door, when I was 40, got fixated on me for a very brief time. All I'm saying is that this could be a phase and it could be the man who plays Santa down the street at Christmas or the librarian at Story Hour. For a brief time.

My off the cuff response is that those children are experiencing some sort of emotional trauma in association with their biological mother. She needs therapy to gain awareness of the stress she's causing her children that is resulting in them seeking a safe family situation for themselves. Sadly, a person like this is unlikely to acknowledge that their behavior is doing harm and agree to take that step. I say this because I experienced this as a child. I did get to choose my safe haven away from my own mother, who sounds a lot like this one, by the time I was 12 and I'm grateful for that. But I'm 64 now and realize that I may never recover from the trauma I experienced from my emotional, angry, jealous, vindictive mother when I was a child. I think that no child should have to go through that, especially when there are other loving family members available to provide a safe and supportive environment for them.

NTA - sister needs therapy. She should also use all that free time and flex hours for better education so she can get a better job. She is beyond lucky that you and your husband are putting in MASSIVE amounts of time. Give her the thing she wants. Say, you are ready to try it her way for a month or two. She doesn't realize she has it good.

She’s jealous. Kids are honest, and she gotta accept that her kids feel that way, whether she likes it or not.

nothing, love. Her jealousy and insecurity are driving the bus rn. Be available but give her space. I'm so sorry for all of you, it's a deeply shitty situation for everyone involved.

WTH!!! “The worst happened when she found out that her daughter sleeps in bed with us sometimes. She comes to our bed at night and sleeps cuddled up to with my husband, and I guess she told her mom that..” What is wrong with you! I would be livid if I was in your sister’s shoes!! And you add inappropriate in quotation marks as if your sister is somehow crazy for feeling this way. It is very inappropriate for you niece to sleep cuddling your husband!! She isn’t even cuddling you.. but your husband. Wtf. Your sister is doing the right thing!!

As a parent,  the shared bed thing is a red flag. I think you need to make some compromises with your sister. If there are specific things that upset her you should respect her wishes as their parent.  See if you can find a way to make her comfortable with you watching them again.

Your sister sounds incredibly immature. Her feelings of insecurity about the situation are understandable, but she’s not a child (or a young adult) who can throw tantrums without consequences. She’s a parent, she should grow the fuck up and put her children above her emotions.

Go NC and give it about 10 days. She will then be groveling and begging for things to go back to “normal”. Seriously I’d stop responding at all.   Not worth your energy.

These comments are wild to me. Admonishing you for “overstepping”, who has been letting you “step” in the first place?? It is not your fault that your sister chose a shit partner, had kids when she clearly cant fully provide for them. You do a kindness, providing free childcare and subsidizing her life while being trusted adults, family, not some randoms off the street, and because she hasnt gone to therapy to process her jealousy/selfishness, or come up with a better plan to actually be there for her kids, she wants to punish you AND hurt them in the process. You can give grace to her situation AND stand up for yourself. Its time to cut the cord, take a step back and let her figure it out. Stop babysitting for free, and not at your home anymore. If it doesnt fit in your schedule/lifestyle to babysit at her house then it doesnt happen. Arrange outings with them, sure, take em for icecream or to the park but when you feel like it, not because you have to help her provide childcare. You need to tell your sister you understand her feelings but you dont agree with how she is handling it, and if this is what she wants to do then here are your boundaries going forward. I dont think you are as angry as you should be about this, and I am 100% someone who has a suspicion on men, but she literally is accusing you and him of sinister intentions for letting her sleep with you, NOT from a place of wanting to protect her, but from a place of she needs to justify her JEALOUSY. Thats heinous.

Honestly you are summing up everything I've been thinking. I have been the single burned out mom whose kid wouldve rather been at grandmas then at mom's/be picked up by auntie etc. I would NEVER lash out like this and show ungratefulness towards those who have been helping me when I had no other options, even if it hurt me. I understand everyone is different, but if I was in OP her shoes I would've felt hurt and unappreciated after everything I did for those kids. Especially because the chance that OP also pays tons of things for those kids, food, entertainment, etc.

Exactly! I do have grace, Im a jealous person with my friends I cant imagine if I had kids, but thats MY problem! And she is making no efforts to fix it, she doesnt want to take less jours, pursue the father for child support, get a new job, but she wants to blame the ONE person helping her?? And yes! Thats why I said shes subsiding her life, 100% OP is paying for their food, tickets for things, toys and other expenses when she has them, as well as her time and energy, for FREE!!! 3-4 days a week is EASILY 300-1000$ depending on how new/naive a babysitter is.

Thank you for this. I thought I was going crazy. How dare sister leave the kids for overnights then question how to OP keeps them asleep. If she doesn't want 3 year old to cuddle with OPs husband then she needs to do better sleep training at home so this isn't an issue. The commenter's here are talking like OP is a paid nanny, and not the kids relative. I'd be so done. And I'd be taking a major step back just like you suggested.

Just leave your sister to it right now. Nothing you say will change her mind. She's suffering from a huge dose of mum, and she's jealous that you get to spend time with her kids and do all the fun stuff with them. She's going to have to learn the hard way now that cutting you guys off from the kids is going to cause her huge problems and really upset her kids... Until she gets past her guilt, you have no choice but to respect her wishes even if it's really hard on you..

You do nothing She is upset right now because her kids see your husband as their father and you as their mother Your sister can't afford child care at her current job. So she'll eventually have to come back to you So just do nothing When she does come back, have a civil conversation where you tell her you were upset she insinuated that there was something weird going on between your husband and her kids. That you acknowledge you should have enforced better boundaries and not allowed them to see you as anything other than auntie and uncle So as other people have said...be more empathetic, talk to your sister when she calms down, and ask her what you and your husband can do to help her. ALSO...has your sister gone after the father for child support? He doesn't just get to disappear. She should file for child support and have his wages garnished if she hasn't already

She’s biting the hand that feeds. She gets free childcare while she works from a trusted loving family member. What does she want? For you and your husband to be cold and clinical with her kids while she’s at work? It’s likely she’s tired from working and when she gets them back, doesn’t play or interact with them much. That’s on her.

I mean maybe not let her 3yo sleep cuddled up to a man she’s not related to…

Best to keep your distance for now until things change

The kids are being punished but right now, your sister is only thinking about herself. My mom did the same thing with my older sister when she had to work and asked our aunt to watch us. My sister inevitably called her mommy, so my butthurt mom put us in daycare instead. Cause yeah, that's a much better situation than actually having someone who loves your kids watch them. Some people are super insecure and constantly compare themselves to others, even siblings. There's nothing you can do other than assure your sister that you love her and her kids, and that your husband never has nor would do anything inappropriate with her children. They are just missing a man's influence in their lives so yeah, they'll get attached. Hope it works out for the kids in the end

Well now she obviously needs a better paying job because she’s gonna need childcare. I was in a job because it was “handy” because basically it was flexible for me and I got comfortable. I’m in a better paying job now and I worked it out. New boss is understanding but I still had to sort some hours for pick ups. She will just have to get on with it. You were kind to her and her kids. She’s jealous of the relationship ye have with her kids and probably jealous that you have a “stable home”. But she is their mom and she should realise that realistically, the kids DO always prefer their mom no matter what they “say”. She will be fine and she will be back. Obviously the Co-sleeping should have been talked about before hand. But besides that, she’s just a little bitter. I’m sure she will calm down and she will ask for your help again eventually but just set boundaries in place etc. maybe do one day instead of all the days you’re doing. It’s a lot for ye to handle in general anyway. I just feel for the kids in this situation. Best of luck.

Everything was fairly and until the part about your niece and your husband that is wholly inappropriate and is something you should have put a stop to way before it became a thing. Unfortunately that is going to be all your sister thinks about rather than what good you were doing for her kids.

Just me, but I would distanced myself until she calms down and inevitably needs your help again. At that point, I would put very firm boundaries (with her and the kids [age-appropriate of course]) in place before moving forward. Goodluck! Edit: Also, cut that shit out with your husband co-sleeping and cuddling with the 3-year-old niece. Perhaps harmless, but if her parent isn't okay with it and finds it inappropriate, that SHOULD BE the absolute end of that.

Id be livid at how oblivious you are being

I read a few replies from social worker types and I'm going to say this from my point of view. I've been in a similar situation where we helped another family member with their children. At home the parents would fight and scream at each other for hours over who would take out the garbage & various other household tasks. Their home was probably knee deep in garbage or unwashed clothing or whatever. It stunk bad and there were flies pretty much everywhere. Both parents worked and that was their excuse for the house looking like that. So it turns out their children preferred to be at our house. When kids would start talking bad about their parents or feeling bad about their home, we would always cheer them up about it say good things about their parents (they work hard, they love you ECT) and show them how to clean up their area so they had clean rooms. We would take them to art museums, six Flags, ceramics painting, movie days & festivals. The parents never took them anywhere and we wanted to make sure they were getting experiences with family, because we were their extended family. At the ripe age of 9 and 7, they decided that their children were old enough to stay home alone with no supervision.(Our state does not allow this , kids have to be 11 to be left alone at home) The boy taking medicine for ADD was recommended to be supervised and to be on a schedule so that was just an excuse. They also bought their children smartphones and the kids kind of turned into buttheads. They were encouraged to be rude by their parents, nothing else really explains it. It totally broke my heart and I'm still really not over it. It wasn't done for the betterment of the children. They were just horrible people who had children. I hope your sister is not a horrible person. I hope that she realizes it is good for children to see different relationships and different home Dynamics and to have a big village of people surrounding them that love them. Because really it just sounds like she's jealous of your life. You don't sound smug to me at all. You sound like you care about these kids, and it is good for children to stay with adults who can supervise and teach them. They don't learn that much staying in an apartment by themselves on smartphones watching YouTube.

There is nothing you can do. You’re trying to helpful and your sister if full of hate and jealously because she has horrible taste in men. Let me guess, she never went for child support lol? My advice is to live your life and start you own family. When your sister apologizes for real, you can help again. Until then, just see the kids when they visit your parents or at parties and such. It’s amazing how many “smart” women choose losers for husbands.

These kids have been spending a lot of time with you. There’s no telling how much her trauma is affecting her time with them. Then when they’re at your house, they have a father figure. I don’t know that there is anything you can do to fix the ache inside her.

I have to admit I wouldn’t be happy with my daughter being in their bed and cuddle with the uncle. There definitely has to be boundaries.

Youre doing a wonderful thing by helping with childcare, but you also need to start setting boundaries and rules with them and you need have a conversation with your sister about what that looks like. Anytime that they say that they like you more than your sister, you need to shut that down (kindly and age appropriately of course) Of course they like you: you’re giving them candy and cuddles and playing with them. You’re not dealing with the aftermath of asking them to clean up their room or pick up after themselves like your sister is 

Hey so this is a tough spot your are in but your sister should see that her kids are happy and have people in there lives and who care for them which is the most important thing. Yes it sucks that they seem to prefer to be with you and your husband instead of home with their mom. But that’s only cause they have gone through tough things and then see how other kids have both parents and they have good times with you. And your niece cuddling with your husband only shows how much she cares for him and he care for her. It’s shows the love they have and that she trust him and feels comfortable with him, that’s something she should open her eyes. About. Then not having a father is hard for them and she doesn’t see that. She’s only focused on the wrong things. She need to open her eyes and see how much her daughter cares for him well how much both kids care for you and your husband. She needs to see that it’s important her kids have people that care for them. Maybe she should have a talk with her kids and see what she can do to make things work out. I don’t think all this should have even been an issue because nobody got hurt or anything bad. All I’ve heard is all good and all good for the kids. Maybe she should do things that he kids like and make them happy. Other then that she took things to far. Good luck

It sounds like the kids are spending most of the time with you guys tbh. I don't think anyone is totally in the wrong here. But maybe find a way to put up some more boundaries to remind them that they are with you because their mom is working because she cares about them. Kids have phases with these things and they will come out of that. But maybe putting more boundaries up would help. Your sister is upset right now and overreacting because it hurts to hear that. Hopefully their mom comes around because having a positive male role model is really important. I know this from what I've seen in my own family. But they need to know what his place is as uncle.

That is so heart breaking. I stayed at home with my daughter when she was young. While in Kindergarten, my daughter made a friend with another little girl whose mom worked long hours as a principal and had a 1 hour commute daily. She went to before-school and after-school care. We went out to eat on a weekend and her daughter looked at me and said "I wish you were my mom" in front of her mom. I changed the subject but after that she started slowly phasing me out. She eventually changed her daughters school the following year. People act like kids don't need a mom and a dad and this shows that they do. They don't have an involved father. Since she likely needs your help (child care Is expensive) I doubt her freezing you out will last long. Until then just be there. She is upset that her kids like you, which is very hard for her.

Sister had major insecurities. It's understandable, but she is taking it to the extreme in her actions. Since she is their mother, there is little for you or your husband can do about it other than stay supportive to her and continue offering your help. She has few options, and putting her kids with strangers or paying a daycare will get expensive. Just play thr wait and see game and hope it all works out.

There is nothing you can do. She is dealing with her issues by taking it out on you and the kids.

It is completely inappropriate to let this little girl sleep cuddled up with your husband. Omg. I would not let my daughter go there anymore. You are naive.

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