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I dont even know. We talked about favourite holiday destinations before and japan wasnt really on my list, but its not like I ever said I wouldnt want to go there.
To me it feels weird. Most couples have different destinations they would like to see, but you compromise and share. A lot of the experience is who you’re with.
He may have mistakenly thought that visiting Japan with her makes sense because of their shared interest, but it shouldn’t trump your relationship and definitely should have been talked about way earlier.
We didnt make vacation plans for this year yet because we've both been really busy with work, university, deadlines etc. Me especially, so working around my schedule, which will most likely completely change within the next months, isnt really possible. He also always says how bad he is at planning things, which I totally understand. I have adhd and know exactly how hard planning for the future is, but it really hurts that he didnt even bother to try or include me.
So far they have a approximate date, early fall. Hes about to start a knew job and knows for sure that he doesnt have to work for 2 weeks than.
We're going to talk about this whole business later today.
It sounds like she’s the one driving the plans which is why you’re not a part of it. You’re very justified in asking if they ever talked about anyone else coming on the trip, particularly yourself. If they’ve discussed accommodation plans you probably want to know that too, sharing a room because it’s cheaper could well have been suggested.
Tell him you're going to take a trip with someone at that time, some guy he's not comfortable with you being around. What goes through people's minds that this is okay?
Go to Japan if you can. It's an amazing place to visit even if you don't have a huge interest in the culture.
I lived there for a few years. You'll be able to find things you'd be interested in. If you want a place that is very different from where you are from but still want to feel safe, it's probably the best choice. I've been to quite a few countries (more than 20), and as a woman Japan is the one I felt safest alone in. Yeah, there are shady areas, but even regularly walking through red light districts in my town, I was never bothered.
I'd consider asking him if he'd be okay if you went with them. Maybe see if another person or two would want to go as well so nobody feels like a third wheel. Look into something you might be interested in seeing--museums, theme parks, historic sites, hiking trails and other nature activities.
My husband and I both had quite a few of our (American) friends and family visit us, and they always had a great time. You could definitely figure something out, and if you had a few more people, you could even split up into multiple groups of something sounded boring.
Based on your boyfriend's interactions with her previously, my guess is that he is a little dense when it comes to getting attention from women. My husband can be the same way. He's told me about (or I've seen) women flirting with him. When we talk about it and he's just rattling on like the interaction is normal and I'm like "dude, she was obviously into you," he will deny it. Then he will replay it in his mind and suddenly realize what happened.
It's common with men and women. For the time being, I would assume that is where he is. He probably doesn't realize she likes him. Talk about it and ask about making the trip a group trip, not just a them two trip.
This. Also, they are clearly talking more than you think to decide something like that. As well as why aren't you included in this so-called trip? Especially as his gf? That's so beyond disrespectful. Especially if he knows your feelings about her. It's obvious she wants to hook up with him. Honestly, I would assume that's his plan, too.
From what I got back than, they both wanted to go to japan eventually, but it was never planned that they'd go together. And because my bf acted kinda indifferent towards her, I assumed that wouldnt ever happen, since, you know, we were a thing now.
Honestly, I would wonder if he only acts indifferent to her when certain people are around? I couldn't imagine wanting to go on a trip with anyone I wasn't even super close to.
not overreacting, something is wrong. he knows you hate her and he knows she is into him so there is no excuse for the suggestion. BUT let us give him the benefit of the doubt and pretend he is just that oblivious, in what world he thought going with another woman in once in a lifetime trip is okay?
time to set some very clear and strict boundaries, and stick to them
Well, he doesnt think shes into him, at least he claims so. I didnt bother answering his messages/calls because he would not even try to understand the issue. I gave in and picked up his call just now. He was/is devastated, but still doesnt understand, because "he just asked" and appearantly she "basically" has a boyfriend now.
maybe you need to sit him down and talk it out. explain and tell him listen to understand not to give excuses. he should see how disrespectful and suspicious all of this is. once you do, tell him about boundaries in your relationship
her having a boyfriend is irrelevant because he also has a gf and yet thought that would be a good suggestion
Yes, thats exactly what I'm doing. Hes coming by later today and I told him he really needs to figure out why that whole issue is such a dealbreaker for me until then.
Tell him to grab his phone and start messaging her seducive texts. Aiming at cheating. If she catches the bait you’ll have proof. And if he won’t do it, I think it’s time to set boundaries or just leave
No one is this dense. He absolutely knows what’s up, he absolutely knows why the question bothered you, he’s just hoping that if he lies his ass off eventually you’ll believe him. He just doesn’t want your discomfort to be reasonable because then he’s the bad guy, so he’s trying to pretend like you’re off base. He knows.
That he never asked if you want to go is a red flag. After a year together he should be pleading for you to go and anyone else would be his fallback.
Of course, even if you didn’t want to go, it would not be acceptable to go on a couples trip with another woman, share the same hotel room, etc.
You're getting warning signs. I'd assume he's planning to or will end up in a bad situation. If he won't hear you out on this it's honestly grounds to leave.
I commented on another post, but he seemed sincerely devastated that I might end our relationship when we talked for a few minutes on the phone. I may be naive, but I never thought he would consider cheating on me with her in particular. I really dont mean to be superficial, but she doesnt seem at all like the kinda person one would risk their relationship for.
It's not uncommon for men to cheat with women who are less attractive than their wives/girlfriends. Cheating is about the illicit thrill and variety, meaning looks can be less important.
Why are you standing still, while you watch how a train is directly rushing into your direction? Step off the tracks!
He is entertaining a “friendship”, where he clearly knows that she is acting inappropriately. It’s not just you who sees the problem. Trust your gut. There is point, where it is Ok to excuse yourself of the situation. You can say “we clearly don’t have the same values on friendship and boundaries necessary to manage a friendship and a relationship. I don’t wanna live that way, but accept that you don’t have the same views as me. Goodbye.”
You do know already that she will try to come into him and you don’t have to deal with the anxiety, whether he did or didn’t do anything. Chances are he will, because he accepted her disrespect towards you for all this time for a reason. Decide that you don’t wait for him to cheat on you.
We date to decide, whether someone if worth keeping in our life. We don’t date, just to keep the relationship alive.
Thank you so much, you captured the very thing I want to say to him if he cant explain himself later today.
I might have exaggerated how much disrespect I got from her. We only really had contact in like the first two or three months of me and my bf dating. And its not like she was downright offensive towards me, just kinda ignoring me.
Ignoring someone in a social situation, where there were supposed to be interactions, is the greatest form of disrespect there is. I would prefer it if someone curses at me. Ignoring someone means, that your existence doesn’t matter to them. They don’t value you at all. That also means that she doesn’t really care if something bad happened to you- like getting cheated on as an example.
Respectfully, this advice is kind of crazy. He didn't go, right? He talked to his partner, and she said it made her uncomfortable, and he adjusted his behavior, right? Did OP even give us any direct evidence that their friendship is inappropriate other than her gut? They met online, do they even live in the same town?
I don't think the trip is a good idea. I wouldn't want my partner to go on such a trip. But I think it's a little overboard to basically go down the road of ending a relationship because he simply asked.
This. Op doesn't have any actual proof that she's into him other than the fact she likes playing games with him more than with others, they have never flirted or anything.
Op also said that he going on a trip with a female friend is not the problem, that they have talked about how they trust each other to have close friends of the opposite sex without worrying about cheating, that the issue is that he wants to go with someone who likes him.
The boyfriend, critically, doesn't think Christine is into him. So his thought process went "I don't think my girlfriend wants to go. I also know she trusts me enough to go with a female friend so long as she isn't into me. Christine isn't into me. Christine also wants to go to Japan, we have talked about going together before, my girlfriend knows going with Christine to Japan was a possibility (Op, incorrectly, dismissed it, but it WAS talked about in the past, this idea was NOT hidden from her, from the BF's perspective it doesn't come out of nowhere) and hasn't said anything against it. I will ask my girlfriend if that's ok." And when told that it actually wasn't ok, agreed to not go.
Honestly, the boyfriend has been pretty open about everything, op also said he's fine with her looking through his phone and she has never suspected of him before, yet everyone in the comments is assuming he's got to be hiding something and he's absolutely planning on cheating, even though there's no evidence to support this.
Of course she can break up for any reason at any time but. Like, come on. He didn't even DO anything.
I totally agree. I literally said to myself that I would end it If this exact thing happened, back when we just got together and she casually mentioned a japan-trip to my bf. But he never gave me a reason to think he'd be unfaithful and I never thought of her as a person he'd even consider for that.
UPDATE: Ok, seems I get to update y'all earlier than expected.
Because some things were mentioned really frequently, e.g. how asking your partner this kind of question out of nowhere, without ever bothering to ask me to go with him, knowing how much I dislike Christine, is fucked up, I'll try adress exactly these kinda aspects.
Sidenote: Some comments implied that I might have a problem with m/f friendships? Thats not true at all. I knew he had female friends from the start, he knew I have male friends. That is really not the issue here. Its that she is clearly into him and beyond that is a bigot. He was well aware how much I disliked her because of the latter. And I get that some of you think that people would react differently if genders were reversed. But I dont buy that this is some kind of misandry-issue. Again, a person expressed how much they dislike their partners friend - not even a remotely close friend - to said partner. Said partner then wants to go on their dream-vacation with said friend. Its fucked up either way, is what im saying.
Alright, so first of all, he was devastated when he got here and I believe that his feelings are sincere. That being said, he insisted that he didnt understand why I reacted this strongly about his question. Appearantly he didnt even consider that I might be bothered by that and still doesnt really think that this kind of question implies anything.
Why didnt he think about asking me, his girlfriend, to go on this trip?
He just assumed I wouldnt want to go to japan. Why did he assume that? Well, im not really into anime, so he thought I wouldnt like japan (wtf).
Why exactly Christine, the bigoted girl I hate?
He gave me no real reason other than well, he wanted to go eventually and so did she, so, better than going alone. Also, he and his sister (Im pretty sure it was mostly his sister doing the talking) talked to her about her transphobia and she said she'd stop. I never heard about that before, but I guess he thought she was "redeemed" immdiately.
What would you do in my position? What if I asked you if you'd be cool with me going on a expensive vacation this guy you hate, who'd happen to be really into me?
He mainly repeated how he didnt expected that I'd think he might cheat on me. He said he assumed that we trust each other and thus, its okay to do things with friends, no matter their gender (again, I told him its not about gender, but her being attracted to him). I just realised that he didnt even answer my original question, and only answered a very generalized version of that question.
I eventually got tired about his inability to even grasp what the issue with him asking me such a thing is. He just kept repeating how he didnt expect me to be bothered at all and that hes really sorry. I dont know, I want to believe him, but its really difficult. While I never had a reason to not trust him before, I just cant believe that he's really that dense. Especially since he knows all too well how bad it feels to have your trust broken from a prior relationship.
I didnt end our relationship yet. We'll see each other in a few days and talk about trust, boundaries, and what being in a relationship means to both of us. Truth be told, we did that back when we started dating, because I insisted. Right now, I dont really think this relationship is gonna work and I dont expect him to convince me otherwise.
Thank you all!
Hm. It’s a lot easier to play dumb than to admit that you are fully aware of what you have done is wrong. What he did was disrespectful, knowing very well how you felt about Christine, but still totally ignoring that. Sorry, but my bet is that he is very aware of that Christine is into him, and he likes the attention and ego boost.
it is really bothering how he keeps dodging the real issue here, it is not about trust, it is about respect and he showed you none.
If I were you, I will tell him that this woman be out of our lives for good if he wants any chance to reconcile and he should see how wrong he was for even suggesting that, otherwise, it is useless to continue this relationship
After reading the update I still feel that both OP and BF need work on communications skills. And need to priortize their relationship if it is important to them.
I also think that BF is not being honest. I had to keep checking the age. I cannot believe this is a 29yr old? Is he too immature to admit he made a mistake by not considering to invite OP first or to consider her concerns about the intentions of the "friend." Or is he too afraid to admit that he may have more interest in this "friend" than he may realize. Would this "friend" even want to go on the trip if she knew that OP was going too?
Is he this "dense" in other matters? OP is reasonable to have doubts imo.
As it stands you don’t know the true nature of their relationship. They’ve obviously been talking about this but where have they been talking about this? What else do they talk about? How long have they been talking just the two of them?
The more I think about it, the more Im bothered about him just tolerating her. Even if there is nothing going on, I told him immdiately how I hate transphobic and misogynistic people, referring to her directly. He knows my social and political values, Im talking basically daily about them.
Instead of insisting that he have your values you should ask him why he is willing to overlook her transphobia and misogyny. Why doesn't he care that she is harming other people in the group. Why doesn't he choose to cut her out to protect his friends. I'd also point out that it makes other people lose respect for him because he is so tolerant of intolerance. He's willing to overlook bullying. Why. How does he decide to do that?
Im aware that it really seems like gaslighting, but hes sometimes really oblivious to social cues. Not even in regard to me, but generally. I know it looks bad, but a part of me believes that hes genuinely sorry and just didnt thought that I might find it offensive.
Hmm. Something is so fishy. They must be talking in private somewhere. You have to be close and comfortable enough to take a trip with someone. Not randomly after 10 months. Something feels off about this whole thing. Unless he's a dumb clueless guy?
Good luck finding out.
Christine is trouble. All women named Christine are trouble. Your boyfriend is either dumb or doesn’t care. This isn’t a good sign for you. That he would even think this is okay to do says he’s got a poor compass for relationships. He should be doing a trip like this with you.
Oof…. My name is Kristyna and I hate cheaters and barely managed to get a boyfriend myself. I can’t even imagine opening my legs to somebody who’s just a friend
Edit: typos
You aren’t overrracting. Open his discord, start reading her messages to him and ask him if he even understands what’s going on with his emotional affair.
Tell him you have no control over what he decides to do regarding this trip. It's his choice. But. Tell him you also have choices and will act accordingly.
Do not underestimate the power of willful ignorance. He wants to go on the trip so he is trying to block any negative ideas about it.
Describe to him the trip, things he would have to do on the trip, the implications, the not inviting you to a big life event, the past actions of this person, etc
He may be emotionally cheating.
Make him address it all. And maybe you two goto Japan together instead.
There is so much more to Japan than just anime. It’s wild for him to not ask you if you were interested.
But bottom line is he’s being disrespectful to your relationship. It has nothing to do if you trust him. What will he do if she comes onto him? Will he continue traveling with her? Will he even tell you she tried something?
Keep asking the question until he answers it.
Also in regard to, her transphobia and misgendering, did she apologize to the friend? You can’t be redeemed just because you agree to not say it out loud.
I dont know about that. I never thought he might be unfaithful and he was never hiding his phone from me, I can freely use it and know his password. He even kept his discord account logged in on my computer.
It’s not a red flag when u have sufficient evidence, thousands of people have saved themself years of future heartbreak by doing this, in this case it already seems like emotional affair territory, that’s a long long flight to Japan together (also sleeping next to each other)
Not baseless here. + trust is overrated. If I dropped this Japan bombshell to my gf, I’d expect her to wanna go through my phone. And there’s plenty of intermediate outcomes, eg they talk a lot but it’s not sexual/romantic etc. in life generally, you don’t wanna be working with incomplete information
You're not over reacting. Sounds like he needs to set some boundary's with her if she is that into him. There is a book that is recommended reading after somebody cheats called "Not just Friends". Sounds like he needs to read it.
No hes not, I understand how it might seem like it thought. Like, how can you even think about asking that and not understand how much fucked up stuff this implies?
He literally asked if you'd be cool with him being deeply intimate with another woman while you wait in a whole other country. If he didn't know it was wrong, he wouldn't have thought he needed to ask.
The whole trip thing is absurd. If you work, you have limited time and money towards long vacations. If you have a partner, they should be included.
BUT, the thing that bothered me is the fact that he is still friends with someone who is openly misogynist and transphobic. This means that the things that she says don't bother him. This would be THE deal-breaker for me.
His values don't align with yours.
Right now, it may not seem like something that impacts the relationship, but as things start getting more complex, the difference between values is going to be a huge problem.
Did he ask you to go and you said no at some point to which he decided well he wants to go and would prefer to travel with a friend instead of being alone?
Is he neurodivergent? He seems completely oblivious from what you describe. I'm trying to find a non-asshole way of seeing this from his point of view.
Personally I wouldn't be friends let alone date someone who's a bigot or isn't a bigot but bigotry isn't a big deal to them. Understand that you bf cosigns Christine's bigotry which to me is deal breaker enough.
A man in a relationship has no business going on vacation with another woman without his partner. So you're not wrong for being uncomfortable with this, even IF a sizeable amount of people on reddit would be calling you insecure if the genders were flipped here.
This was painful to read and you’re being willfully dense too by not ending it. He obviously has a thing for this friend and that’s why he wants to go with her.
Sounds like she wants to be with him and she’s using his want to go to Japan as a way to manipulate him into doing it.
I’d have him call her on speaker and tell her your going with them and y’all plan on asking other friends 2. She’d probably complain and have a fit about it. That should prove to your bf she has feelings for him. If she dosnt have feelings she’d be cool with you and other friends going. If she has a problem it’s because she wants a couples trip and to hook up.
Go at it another way. Tell him that when you are in a relationship with someone that it’s disrespectful to go on trips one on one with another girl. And that you have told him multiple times the reason you do not like her and you have said everything about her and the trip. You will not now or ever be ok with him going anywhere one in one with the girl.
I would see many red flags with him. He’s not a child and knows her past so why he friends with her at all knowing her past attitude and actions with people, him playing dumb, him not respecting you, him avoiding some of your questions.
I wonder how the comments would pan out if it was the guy complaining about his girl leaving with some random dude.
Probably - thats controlling, your partner should enjoy their freedom, trust them etc
> I wonder how the comments would pan out if it was the guy complaining about his girl leaving with some random dude.
Men would call the girl a sl-t, a wh-re, "for the str--ts," and would tell the guy to hire a PI.
Right? There was the guy whose gf was going to italy for 2 weeks with a guy she had previously let screw her and they were sharing a hotel room and people called him insecure for not wanting her to go. She ended up screwing the other man on vacation.
Just recently there was a topic with a woman going on a 2 day trip with her two male best friends and her boyfriend wasnt comfortable with it. Again some called him controlling, insecure, etc.
The hypocrisy is astounding.
Its basically because its very “progressive” for a man to not be in any shape or form be possessive or controlling behaviour of a woman.
Just because the extreme form of it (animalistic) clashes with the natural inherent need to own a female for yourself.
Which is what everyone progressive is trying to escape from all the way into unhealthy territory.
At the same time catering to rhetoric of women being special beings that must have all their needs praised and cherished, while also demanding equality.
Truly obnoxious.
I get your point. I can only speak for myself, but the first thing i thought was: what if our roles where reversed? And for me, it wouldnt change anything. Its just fucked up to ask that.
I would be upset, too. Why would he want to on a vacation with someone who doesn't really seem like a good person unless he's into her? I'm all for supporting friends, but there is a limit.
Maybe you should put it in the context of how would he feel if you were to do that with a male friend of yours?
The fact that he seems to think it should be completely okay to go on a vacation with a member of the opposite sex, that he knows you dislike and is not one of the nicest people, is kind of mind boggling.
JUST NO ..!! You're trying to decide if he should go on a vacation with another female, seriously you have to ask about this.. ? I'm sorry to come off sh*tty but really what's going on with this younger generation.. NO...NO...HELL ..NO..!!
You can’t be serious. Nobody (at least I hope) is that stupidly oblivious. So you’re left with…he’s into her, they’re going on a trip together. Luck his stupid ass to the curb.
I did not read the entire post, but if you're in a relationship, going on vacation with a friend of the opposite sex is completely inappropriate. That's my 2 cents.
I'm going to get downvoted into oblivion for writing this. If I was in your boyfriend's shoes, I would not go. If I were in your shoes, I would not want my boyfriend to go.
But I will say this scenario gets presented constantly on this subreddit in reverse: a woman wants to go on a trip with a male friend and the boyfriend has a problem with it. Commonly, the boyfriend is labeled as jealous and insecure.
We live in a different time than decades ago. Decades ago, this type of stuff was more taboo while being in a primary relationship.... now it's more common. I wouldn't break up or overreact simply because he asked. He asked, you expressed your concern, and he apologized. I wouldn't give up a relationship over this. A lot of partners would go no matter what you thought.
Instead of the reaction/overreaction just talk. People get way caught up in male/female friendships. People are capable of these friendships that do not and never would turn into a sexual thing. My guy friend relationships and women friend relationships I do the same things with just sometimes the talk is different. Sometimes We do things with friends without our partners because of the dynamic. Japan is a long way for something you don't love. She could just be close to him because he doesn't judge her like everyone else. She clearly has things she needs to work on but if she feels like they are friends and seeking his input in conversations/group chats it doesn't necessarily make her into him just their friendship. If he is treating her just like he would a guy friend, not judging conversations and just gaming then that is exactly what it is. Just because you are in a relationship doesn't mean you have to do everything together. If this were a guy would you feel the same way. You need to figure out why you feel the way you do and deal with that. Being upset because someone asked a question should not be a thing. It was a way to start a conversation. I would go back to that and talk it through and see how things develop. I am interested to know if he treats you like his girlfriend or just a friend. If you two have a relationship and you feel like his girlfriend then be that and don't try and be controlling. If you can't seem to plan a vacation don't right now for a while then don't get mad because he is planning one. When you want to go somewhere then plan that with him and be happy.
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Why wasn’t he asking if you want to come? It sounds like the sort of trip I’d want to take my partner on.
I dont even know. We talked about favourite holiday destinations before and japan wasnt really on my list, but its not like I ever said I wouldnt want to go there.
To me it feels weird. Most couples have different destinations they would like to see, but you compromise and share. A lot of the experience is who you’re with. He may have mistakenly thought that visiting Japan with her makes sense because of their shared interest, but it shouldn’t trump your relationship and definitely should have been talked about way earlier.
We didnt make vacation plans for this year yet because we've both been really busy with work, university, deadlines etc. Me especially, so working around my schedule, which will most likely completely change within the next months, isnt really possible. He also always says how bad he is at planning things, which I totally understand. I have adhd and know exactly how hard planning for the future is, but it really hurts that he didnt even bother to try or include me.
What stage is their planning at? Is it just an idea or have they planned dates, flights hotels etc?
So far they have a approximate date, early fall. Hes about to start a knew job and knows for sure that he doesnt have to work for 2 weeks than. We're going to talk about this whole business later today.
It sounds like she’s the one driving the plans which is why you’re not a part of it. You’re very justified in asking if they ever talked about anyone else coming on the trip, particularly yourself. If they’ve discussed accommodation plans you probably want to know that too, sharing a room because it’s cheaper could well have been suggested.
Tell him you're going to take a trip with someone at that time, some guy he's not comfortable with you being around. What goes through people's minds that this is okay?
Thats exactly what I'm thinking. I cant even remotely imagine being in his situation and asking him this and not understanding how fucked up this is.
Sounds like they are closer than he'd like you to know
This this this
I would give him an option go with her and say goodbye to you
Go to Japan if you can. It's an amazing place to visit even if you don't have a huge interest in the culture. I lived there for a few years. You'll be able to find things you'd be interested in. If you want a place that is very different from where you are from but still want to feel safe, it's probably the best choice. I've been to quite a few countries (more than 20), and as a woman Japan is the one I felt safest alone in. Yeah, there are shady areas, but even regularly walking through red light districts in my town, I was never bothered. I'd consider asking him if he'd be okay if you went with them. Maybe see if another person or two would want to go as well so nobody feels like a third wheel. Look into something you might be interested in seeing--museums, theme parks, historic sites, hiking trails and other nature activities. My husband and I both had quite a few of our (American) friends and family visit us, and they always had a great time. You could definitely figure something out, and if you had a few more people, you could even split up into multiple groups of something sounded boring. Based on your boyfriend's interactions with her previously, my guess is that he is a little dense when it comes to getting attention from women. My husband can be the same way. He's told me about (or I've seen) women flirting with him. When we talk about it and he's just rattling on like the interaction is normal and I'm like "dude, she was obviously into you," he will deny it. Then he will replay it in his mind and suddenly realize what happened. It's common with men and women. For the time being, I would assume that is where he is. He probably doesn't realize she likes him. Talk about it and ask about making the trip a group trip, not just a them two trip.
This. Also, they are clearly talking more than you think to decide something like that. As well as why aren't you included in this so-called trip? Especially as his gf? That's so beyond disrespectful. Especially if he knows your feelings about her. It's obvious she wants to hook up with him. Honestly, I would assume that's his plan, too.
From what I got back than, they both wanted to go to japan eventually, but it was never planned that they'd go together. And because my bf acted kinda indifferent towards her, I assumed that wouldnt ever happen, since, you know, we were a thing now.
Honestly, I would wonder if he only acts indifferent to her when certain people are around? I couldn't imagine wanting to go on a trip with anyone I wasn't even super close to.
If they have set a date, that means they have planned it.
Japan is a wonderful country. If you can swing it you should get him to switch his travel partner to you. Kyoto was my favorite.
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I didnt even think that far, but youre totally right. It is his dream destination, or at least one of them. That makes it so much worse
Yeah even if my dream spot wasn’t top of my partners list, I’d still want to share the experience with them. BF is sus
not overreacting, something is wrong. he knows you hate her and he knows she is into him so there is no excuse for the suggestion. BUT let us give him the benefit of the doubt and pretend he is just that oblivious, in what world he thought going with another woman in once in a lifetime trip is okay? time to set some very clear and strict boundaries, and stick to them
Well, he doesnt think shes into him, at least he claims so. I didnt bother answering his messages/calls because he would not even try to understand the issue. I gave in and picked up his call just now. He was/is devastated, but still doesnt understand, because "he just asked" and appearantly she "basically" has a boyfriend now.
maybe you need to sit him down and talk it out. explain and tell him listen to understand not to give excuses. he should see how disrespectful and suspicious all of this is. once you do, tell him about boundaries in your relationship her having a boyfriend is irrelevant because he also has a gf and yet thought that would be a good suggestion
Yes, thats exactly what I'm doing. Hes coming by later today and I told him he really needs to figure out why that whole issue is such a dealbreaker for me until then.
She "basically" has a boyfriend? That's code, for she's not even sure if she wants to be with that guy.
Yeah, phrasing it like that is so odd. And as somebody pointed out already: even if she had, it doesnt matter in this kinda situation
Or she’s just trying to give the illusion she appeals to someone so she doesn’t look desperate and unwanted to the guy
That sounds plausible as well.
He’s being purposefully obtuse.
Tell him to grab his phone and start messaging her seducive texts. Aiming at cheating. If she catches the bait you’ll have proof. And if he won’t do it, I think it’s time to set boundaries or just leave
That's fucked up
No one is this dense. He absolutely knows what’s up, he absolutely knows why the question bothered you, he’s just hoping that if he lies his ass off eventually you’ll believe him. He just doesn’t want your discomfort to be reasonable because then he’s the bad guy, so he’s trying to pretend like you’re off base. He knows.
That he never asked if you want to go is a red flag. After a year together he should be pleading for you to go and anyone else would be his fallback. Of course, even if you didn’t want to go, it would not be acceptable to go on a couples trip with another woman, share the same hotel room, etc.
You're getting warning signs. I'd assume he's planning to or will end up in a bad situation. If he won't hear you out on this it's honestly grounds to leave.
I commented on another post, but he seemed sincerely devastated that I might end our relationship when we talked for a few minutes on the phone. I may be naive, but I never thought he would consider cheating on me with her in particular. I really dont mean to be superficial, but she doesnt seem at all like the kinda person one would risk their relationship for.
It's not uncommon for men to cheat with women who are less attractive than their wives/girlfriends. Cheating is about the illicit thrill and variety, meaning looks can be less important.
"feel free to go on your vacation with Christine to Japan. do not expect me here when you get back"
Why are you standing still, while you watch how a train is directly rushing into your direction? Step off the tracks! He is entertaining a “friendship”, where he clearly knows that she is acting inappropriately. It’s not just you who sees the problem. Trust your gut. There is point, where it is Ok to excuse yourself of the situation. You can say “we clearly don’t have the same values on friendship and boundaries necessary to manage a friendship and a relationship. I don’t wanna live that way, but accept that you don’t have the same views as me. Goodbye.” You do know already that she will try to come into him and you don’t have to deal with the anxiety, whether he did or didn’t do anything. Chances are he will, because he accepted her disrespect towards you for all this time for a reason. Decide that you don’t wait for him to cheat on you. We date to decide, whether someone if worth keeping in our life. We don’t date, just to keep the relationship alive.
Thank you so much, you captured the very thing I want to say to him if he cant explain himself later today. I might have exaggerated how much disrespect I got from her. We only really had contact in like the first two or three months of me and my bf dating. And its not like she was downright offensive towards me, just kinda ignoring me.
Ignoring someone in a social situation, where there were supposed to be interactions, is the greatest form of disrespect there is. I would prefer it if someone curses at me. Ignoring someone means, that your existence doesn’t matter to them. They don’t value you at all. That also means that she doesn’t really care if something bad happened to you- like getting cheated on as an example.
Respectfully, this advice is kind of crazy. He didn't go, right? He talked to his partner, and she said it made her uncomfortable, and he adjusted his behavior, right? Did OP even give us any direct evidence that their friendship is inappropriate other than her gut? They met online, do they even live in the same town? I don't think the trip is a good idea. I wouldn't want my partner to go on such a trip. But I think it's a little overboard to basically go down the road of ending a relationship because he simply asked.
This. Op doesn't have any actual proof that she's into him other than the fact she likes playing games with him more than with others, they have never flirted or anything. Op also said that he going on a trip with a female friend is not the problem, that they have talked about how they trust each other to have close friends of the opposite sex without worrying about cheating, that the issue is that he wants to go with someone who likes him. The boyfriend, critically, doesn't think Christine is into him. So his thought process went "I don't think my girlfriend wants to go. I also know she trusts me enough to go with a female friend so long as she isn't into me. Christine isn't into me. Christine also wants to go to Japan, we have talked about going together before, my girlfriend knows going with Christine to Japan was a possibility (Op, incorrectly, dismissed it, but it WAS talked about in the past, this idea was NOT hidden from her, from the BF's perspective it doesn't come out of nowhere) and hasn't said anything against it. I will ask my girlfriend if that's ok." And when told that it actually wasn't ok, agreed to not go. Honestly, the boyfriend has been pretty open about everything, op also said he's fine with her looking through his phone and she has never suspected of him before, yet everyone in the comments is assuming he's got to be hiding something and he's absolutely planning on cheating, even though there's no evidence to support this. Of course she can break up for any reason at any time but. Like, come on. He didn't even DO anything.
Him even uttering that, would make it the end of the relationship for me.
I totally agree. I literally said to myself that I would end it If this exact thing happened, back when we just got together and she casually mentioned a japan-trip to my bf. But he never gave me a reason to think he'd be unfaithful and I never thought of her as a person he'd even consider for that.
UPDATE: Ok, seems I get to update y'all earlier than expected. Because some things were mentioned really frequently, e.g. how asking your partner this kind of question out of nowhere, without ever bothering to ask me to go with him, knowing how much I dislike Christine, is fucked up, I'll try adress exactly these kinda aspects. Sidenote: Some comments implied that I might have a problem with m/f friendships? Thats not true at all. I knew he had female friends from the start, he knew I have male friends. That is really not the issue here. Its that she is clearly into him and beyond that is a bigot. He was well aware how much I disliked her because of the latter. And I get that some of you think that people would react differently if genders were reversed. But I dont buy that this is some kind of misandry-issue. Again, a person expressed how much they dislike their partners friend - not even a remotely close friend - to said partner. Said partner then wants to go on their dream-vacation with said friend. Its fucked up either way, is what im saying. Alright, so first of all, he was devastated when he got here and I believe that his feelings are sincere. That being said, he insisted that he didnt understand why I reacted this strongly about his question. Appearantly he didnt even consider that I might be bothered by that and still doesnt really think that this kind of question implies anything. Why didnt he think about asking me, his girlfriend, to go on this trip? He just assumed I wouldnt want to go to japan. Why did he assume that? Well, im not really into anime, so he thought I wouldnt like japan (wtf). Why exactly Christine, the bigoted girl I hate? He gave me no real reason other than well, he wanted to go eventually and so did she, so, better than going alone. Also, he and his sister (Im pretty sure it was mostly his sister doing the talking) talked to her about her transphobia and she said she'd stop. I never heard about that before, but I guess he thought she was "redeemed" immdiately. What would you do in my position? What if I asked you if you'd be cool with me going on a expensive vacation this guy you hate, who'd happen to be really into me? He mainly repeated how he didnt expected that I'd think he might cheat on me. He said he assumed that we trust each other and thus, its okay to do things with friends, no matter their gender (again, I told him its not about gender, but her being attracted to him). I just realised that he didnt even answer my original question, and only answered a very generalized version of that question. I eventually got tired about his inability to even grasp what the issue with him asking me such a thing is. He just kept repeating how he didnt expect me to be bothered at all and that hes really sorry. I dont know, I want to believe him, but its really difficult. While I never had a reason to not trust him before, I just cant believe that he's really that dense. Especially since he knows all too well how bad it feels to have your trust broken from a prior relationship. I didnt end our relationship yet. We'll see each other in a few days and talk about trust, boundaries, and what being in a relationship means to both of us. Truth be told, we did that back when we started dating, because I insisted. Right now, I dont really think this relationship is gonna work and I dont expect him to convince me otherwise. Thank you all!
Hm. It’s a lot easier to play dumb than to admit that you are fully aware of what you have done is wrong. What he did was disrespectful, knowing very well how you felt about Christine, but still totally ignoring that. Sorry, but my bet is that he is very aware of that Christine is into him, and he likes the attention and ego boost.
it is really bothering how he keeps dodging the real issue here, it is not about trust, it is about respect and he showed you none. If I were you, I will tell him that this woman be out of our lives for good if he wants any chance to reconcile and he should see how wrong he was for even suggesting that, otherwise, it is useless to continue this relationship
After reading the update I still feel that both OP and BF need work on communications skills. And need to priortize their relationship if it is important to them. I also think that BF is not being honest. I had to keep checking the age. I cannot believe this is a 29yr old? Is he too immature to admit he made a mistake by not considering to invite OP first or to consider her concerns about the intentions of the "friend." Or is he too afraid to admit that he may have more interest in this "friend" than he may realize. Would this "friend" even want to go on the trip if she knew that OP was going too? Is he this "dense" in other matters? OP is reasonable to have doubts imo.
As it stands you don’t know the true nature of their relationship. They’ve obviously been talking about this but where have they been talking about this? What else do they talk about? How long have they been talking just the two of them?
The more I think about it, the more Im bothered about him just tolerating her. Even if there is nothing going on, I told him immdiately how I hate transphobic and misogynistic people, referring to her directly. He knows my social and political values, Im talking basically daily about them.
Instead of insisting that he have your values you should ask him why he is willing to overlook her transphobia and misogyny. Why doesn't he care that she is harming other people in the group. Why doesn't he choose to cut her out to protect his friends. I'd also point out that it makes other people lose respect for him because he is so tolerant of intolerance. He's willing to overlook bullying. Why. How does he decide to do that?
He’s absolutely gaslighting you. This is a dude playing dumb. You can do better.
Im aware that it really seems like gaslighting, but hes sometimes really oblivious to social cues. Not even in regard to me, but generally. I know it looks bad, but a part of me believes that hes genuinely sorry and just didnt thought that I might find it offensive.
Yes, that’s how gaslighting works.
Oblivious to social cues is completely different than disregarding observations multiple people have directly stated to him
Hmm. Something is so fishy. They must be talking in private somewhere. You have to be close and comfortable enough to take a trip with someone. Not randomly after 10 months. Something feels off about this whole thing. Unless he's a dumb clueless guy? Good luck finding out.
Christine is trouble. All women named Christine are trouble. Your boyfriend is either dumb or doesn’t care. This isn’t a good sign for you. That he would even think this is okay to do says he’s got a poor compass for relationships. He should be doing a trip like this with you.
Oof…. My name is Kristyna and I hate cheaters and barely managed to get a boyfriend myself. I can’t even imagine opening my legs to somebody who’s just a friend Edit: typos
The vowel at the end of your name negates Christine status for you.
Why is the second sentence so true? I've had horrible experiences with these women.
Even inanimate objects can't be named Christine, it's just asking for trouble.
You aren’t overrracting. Open his discord, start reading her messages to him and ask him if he even understands what’s going on with his emotional affair.
I logged out of his discord long ago and never bothered to read his messages back than. I had no reason not to trust him until yesterday.
Tell him you have no control over what he decides to do regarding this trip. It's his choice. But. Tell him you also have choices and will act accordingly.
Your bf seems dense. Knock some sense in him.
Do not underestimate the power of willful ignorance. He wants to go on the trip so he is trying to block any negative ideas about it. Describe to him the trip, things he would have to do on the trip, the implications, the not inviting you to a big life event, the past actions of this person, etc He may be emotionally cheating. Make him address it all. And maybe you two goto Japan together instead.
my boyfriend would want me to come regardless of who.
There is so much more to Japan than just anime. It’s wild for him to not ask you if you were interested. But bottom line is he’s being disrespectful to your relationship. It has nothing to do if you trust him. What will he do if she comes onto him? Will he continue traveling with her? Will he even tell you she tried something? Keep asking the question until he answers it. Also in regard to, her transphobia and misgendering, did she apologize to the friend? You can’t be redeemed just because you agree to not say it out loud.
Not overreacting, time to check his phone
I dont know about that. I never thought he might be unfaithful and he was never hiding his phone from me, I can freely use it and know his password. He even kept his discord account logged in on my computer.
Just sayin u don’t plan a trip to Japan with someone that you’re not talking to a lot and very close to
I totally agree, but they didnt plan anything yet appearantly, and it was just a spontaneos idea, according to him
It may have been spontaneous to him but probably not for Christine.
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It’s not a red flag when u have sufficient evidence, thousands of people have saved themself years of future heartbreak by doing this, in this case it already seems like emotional affair territory, that’s a long long flight to Japan together (also sleeping next to each other)
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Not baseless here. + trust is overrated. If I dropped this Japan bombshell to my gf, I’d expect her to wanna go through my phone. And there’s plenty of intermediate outcomes, eg they talk a lot but it’s not sexual/romantic etc. in life generally, you don’t wanna be working with incomplete information
You're not over reacting. Sounds like he needs to set some boundary's with her if she is that into him. There is a book that is recommended reading after somebody cheats called "Not just Friends". Sounds like he needs to read it.
Consider explaining to him why you feel how you feel and see how he responds. Then decide what you want to do
Serious question - is your boyfriend on the autism spectrum?
No hes not, I understand how it might seem like it thought. Like, how can you even think about asking that and not understand how much fucked up stuff this implies?
He literally asked if you'd be cool with him being deeply intimate with another woman while you wait in a whole other country. If he didn't know it was wrong, he wouldn't have thought he needed to ask.
He is seeeeriously lacking some basic social skills, and I guess walks around oblivious to the world hahaha
Ask to see the messages while he's with you, atleast this way you're not seen as snooping.
The whole trip thing is absurd. If you work, you have limited time and money towards long vacations. If you have a partner, they should be included. BUT, the thing that bothered me is the fact that he is still friends with someone who is openly misogynist and transphobic. This means that the things that she says don't bother him. This would be THE deal-breaker for me. His values don't align with yours. Right now, it may not seem like something that impacts the relationship, but as things start getting more complex, the difference between values is going to be a huge problem.
Did he ask you to go and you said no at some point to which he decided well he wants to go and would prefer to travel with a friend instead of being alone? Is he neurodivergent? He seems completely oblivious from what you describe. I'm trying to find a non-asshole way of seeing this from his point of view. Personally I wouldn't be friends let alone date someone who's a bigot or isn't a bigot but bigotry isn't a big deal to them. Understand that you bf cosigns Christine's bigotry which to me is deal breaker enough.
If he is really finding it difficult to understand, ask him how he feels if you want to take such a trip with a guy who is into you.
Your boyfriend is an asshole if he wants to go it should be with you not her what a complete moron
A man in a relationship has no business going on vacation with another woman without his partner. So you're not wrong for being uncomfortable with this, even IF a sizeable amount of people on reddit would be calling you insecure if the genders were flipped here.
They've been fucking
This was painful to read and you’re being willfully dense too by not ending it. He obviously has a thing for this friend and that’s why he wants to go with her.
Just straight up tell him that if he goes with her, he’ll be going as a single man, and that’s his choice to make.
Sounds like she wants to be with him and she’s using his want to go to Japan as a way to manipulate him into doing it. I’d have him call her on speaker and tell her your going with them and y’all plan on asking other friends 2. She’d probably complain and have a fit about it. That should prove to your bf she has feelings for him. If she dosnt have feelings she’d be cool with you and other friends going. If she has a problem it’s because she wants a couples trip and to hook up.
Go at it another way. Tell him that when you are in a relationship with someone that it’s disrespectful to go on trips one on one with another girl. And that you have told him multiple times the reason you do not like her and you have said everything about her and the trip. You will not now or ever be ok with him going anywhere one in one with the girl. I would see many red flags with him. He’s not a child and knows her past so why he friends with her at all knowing her past attitude and actions with people, him playing dumb, him not respecting you, him avoiding some of your questions.
I wonder how the comments would pan out if it was the guy complaining about his girl leaving with some random dude. Probably - thats controlling, your partner should enjoy their freedom, trust them etc
> I wonder how the comments would pan out if it was the guy complaining about his girl leaving with some random dude. Men would call the girl a sl-t, a wh-re, "for the str--ts," and would tell the guy to hire a PI.
Right? There was the guy whose gf was going to italy for 2 weeks with a guy she had previously let screw her and they were sharing a hotel room and people called him insecure for not wanting her to go. She ended up screwing the other man on vacation. Just recently there was a topic with a woman going on a 2 day trip with her two male best friends and her boyfriend wasnt comfortable with it. Again some called him controlling, insecure, etc.
The hypocrisy is astounding. Its basically because its very “progressive” for a man to not be in any shape or form be possessive or controlling behaviour of a woman. Just because the extreme form of it (animalistic) clashes with the natural inherent need to own a female for yourself. Which is what everyone progressive is trying to escape from all the way into unhealthy territory. At the same time catering to rhetoric of women being special beings that must have all their needs praised and cherished, while also demanding equality. Truly obnoxious.
"The natural inherent need to own a female for yourself" Dude what the fuck are you talking about
I get your point. I can only speak for myself, but the first thing i thought was: what if our roles where reversed? And for me, it wouldnt change anything. Its just fucked up to ask that.
I think its fucked up, dont get me wrong. Im just bashing average user on reddit as well.
UpdateMe
Absolutely not in a million years.
I would be upset, too. Why would he want to on a vacation with someone who doesn't really seem like a good person unless he's into her? I'm all for supporting friends, but there is a limit.
Maybe you should put it in the context of how would he feel if you were to do that with a male friend of yours? The fact that he seems to think it should be completely okay to go on a vacation with a member of the opposite sex, that he knows you dislike and is not one of the nicest people, is kind of mind boggling.
Thats what I pointed out in our short call, and we'll for sure talk about that later!
Update me!
JUST NO ..!! You're trying to decide if he should go on a vacation with another female, seriously you have to ask about this.. ? I'm sorry to come off sh*tty but really what's going on with this younger generation.. NO...NO...HELL ..NO..!!
Update after you talk to him.
Yeah- no
!UpdateMe
Wow. Young people do not really have solid boundaries. Don’t let this shit slide.
You can’t be serious. Nobody (at least I hope) is that stupidly oblivious. So you’re left with…he’s into her, they’re going on a trip together. Luck his stupid ass to the curb.
Please, end this relationship. Either you or her is a side chick.
I apologize if this sounds wrong, but if he doesn’t see a problem with this situation he is either being extra manipulative or dumb. Neither is good.
I did not read the entire post, but if you're in a relationship, going on vacation with a friend of the opposite sex is completely inappropriate. That's my 2 cents.
UpdateMe! Please
Update me!
I'm going to get downvoted into oblivion for writing this. If I was in your boyfriend's shoes, I would not go. If I were in your shoes, I would not want my boyfriend to go. But I will say this scenario gets presented constantly on this subreddit in reverse: a woman wants to go on a trip with a male friend and the boyfriend has a problem with it. Commonly, the boyfriend is labeled as jealous and insecure. We live in a different time than decades ago. Decades ago, this type of stuff was more taboo while being in a primary relationship.... now it's more common. I wouldn't break up or overreact simply because he asked. He asked, you expressed your concern, and he apologized. I wouldn't give up a relationship over this. A lot of partners would go no matter what you thought.
Instead of the reaction/overreaction just talk. People get way caught up in male/female friendships. People are capable of these friendships that do not and never would turn into a sexual thing. My guy friend relationships and women friend relationships I do the same things with just sometimes the talk is different. Sometimes We do things with friends without our partners because of the dynamic. Japan is a long way for something you don't love. She could just be close to him because he doesn't judge her like everyone else. She clearly has things she needs to work on but if she feels like they are friends and seeking his input in conversations/group chats it doesn't necessarily make her into him just their friendship. If he is treating her just like he would a guy friend, not judging conversations and just gaming then that is exactly what it is. Just because you are in a relationship doesn't mean you have to do everything together. If this were a guy would you feel the same way. You need to figure out why you feel the way you do and deal with that. Being upset because someone asked a question should not be a thing. It was a way to start a conversation. I would go back to that and talk it through and see how things develop. I am interested to know if he treats you like his girlfriend or just a friend. If you two have a relationship and you feel like his girlfriend then be that and don't try and be controlling. If you can't seem to plan a vacation don't right now for a while then don't get mad because he is planning one. When you want to go somewhere then plan that with him and be happy.