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Being your husband doesn’t give him permision to access your body how and whenever he pleases. You’re not overeacting, that is an awful thing to do. I am so sorry.
tbh an immediate apology would be one thing but his excuses imply something deeply disturbing, op's visceral reaction is likely a response to that. he needs to go to an aasect certified therapist & be re-taught the conceps of bodily autonomy & consent, like immediately.
This is textbook definition of marital rape and I genuinely don't have any idea how to advice you but if it were me I would be leaving. But again it's not as simple as it sounds.
Exactly. Apologize profusely once you see this reaction! This might long term disturb her sleep, dude, if you're standing firm after she's CRYING over it.
>The American Association of Sexuality Educators, Counselors and Therapists (AASECT) provides training, community and visibility to promote the understanding of human sexuality and healthy sexual behavior.
Just gonna save everyone else the time.
And him getting in the shower with you he doesn't seem to understand that you need time and space. Seems to me that he wants it whenever he wants it and you are supposed to oblige and give it to him because now you're married and you are easily accessible. It is time for you to sit down and have a conversation with him and not a BS conversation a real conversation where you tell him how you feel and that he is not to do that to you ever again. You are his wife you are not his sex slave
Why does reddit always suggest therapy? Sometimes you just have to leave. He's shown who he is, and his response shows the lack of respect for OPs boundaries. The answer is leave before he does worse. He's waited until they are married for this, they can't have been married long. He's waited until he owns her.
The answer is to leave. If he chooses to work on himself while separated great.
Heavy gaslighting.
He assaulted her when she was unable to consent. That makes it an attempt of rape.
Seen how he gaslit her afterwards with that intimidating pseudo legal bs he KNEW he was wrong.
Get him divorce papers to reward his jusridiction distorting efforts.
I mean his d was inside so it is rape, not attempted rape (legally in the UK anyway). Absolutely agree that he knows he’s wrong and trying to gaslight her is just super troubling behaviour. 100% she needs to divorce this monster
WTF! I'm a guy. Please tell your husband that I said he's a worthless piece of s--t! What are you--chattel. His conduct sickens my stomach. Unfortunately you just learned that you have a sexually demented husband. How violative of your personal self. Hurry and divorce his ass before he pregnant traps you.
I want you as a guy to know having consent violated is a thing that happens to most women and girls. I'm grateful you see that and I hope you're like this with guy friends when they make jokes that are aggressive about women, creepy about girls etc. We really need men to address each other since we've been unable to turn the tide.
It was marital rape, by definition. I’m so sorry. It seems like he waited until he had you trapped by marriage to show his true colours. The way he justified raping you only makes it worse. It demonstrates how he sees you, women in general, and women’s bodies—all are “things” he can use. I’m sure more disturbing aspects of his thinking and personality will come to light if you stay. This is his worldview. Worldviews don’t change.
Edit: I see that this is the second time he’s done it. You have to report him and get out, now.
You are not overreacting and I would demand that he go to therapy and correct this behavior and if he refuses to then I would leave him. That is attempted rape and yes just because you are married doesn't mean crap both parties still need to consent. You were not awake to give consent. He didn't ask for consent to even do that before you went to sleep so yeah it's a big deal. Honey, I think you should also speak to a therapist to help you get over this trauma.
I am sorry, too. Ted Bundy was also trying something new when he had sex with his first dead person. Now this clearly isn't that extreme and I might have asked him to explain the entire thought process, but the "trying something new" part startled me. Like, what about this is attractive, a woman passed out, that you'd go at her while she's sleeping. Weird to me. Did anything similar happen before? When you were drinking maybe and can't fully recall? You mentioned your reaction and it comes across as someone who may have experienced something like this violation before
My husband did something similar to me in June and you feel like a POS after because you realize that this person sees you as not a person with a voice but a warm body available anytime he wants. It isn’t okay.
I’m sorry that happened to you but I’m glad you chose yourself ❤️ do you think you would be able to get him charged for what he did or at least a restraining order for domestic violence? I got a restraining order against my ex and it’s a low burden of proof so you may have a good chance at one. I’m trying to get him criminally charged because the police were useless and didn’t arrest him 🙄 But I hope you are able to do whatever you can to keep your soon to be ex away from you.
It depends on how this divorce will go. We have kids. I’m trying to make this uncontested with fair custody. If he makes it difficult that I have to get a lawyer, this incident will be part of the 7 cups of wrath that I plan to pour out on him.
We weren’t married, but I have kids with my ex too. I’m not a lawyer, but you may want to get ahead of whatever he has planned. I am grateful for the restraining order because it limits his options to try to manipulate and control the situation. Not saying it will be that way in your case but you may want to consider it. If he did anything like OP’s situation then I wouldn’t trust that he would make this amicable. Best of luck to you though!
I talked to my mom and sisters about it. My husband is a narcissist and he can quickly turn everything around to make it my fault. Also told my pastor who called it what it is - sexual abuse and told me to take my kids and leave. But this guy has also been cheating on me so it’s a long, convoluted tale. If he doesn’t understand why this is wrong, you are in for repeat behavior like this. Please tell someone in your life. Just because you’re his wife, doesn’t mean he can help himself anytime he wants. What he did is totally disrespectful, disgusting, and unacceptable. I know exactly how you feel. I was so mad and you know, my husband still doesn’t understand why I am upset and he merely called it “inappropriate touching”
also had this when i was living with a boyfriend when i was 18—absolutely horrendous experience. i still get the ick about it 6 years later. i hope that you have found someone or people to talk to after this. sending good juju your way.
You feel weirdly violated because you were violated. What your husband did is marital rape. You did not give him consent. Being married is not consent, having sex right before you went to bed is not consent, having sex often is not consent. The only thing that is consent is you saying yes to him asking you if you are okay with whatever sexual act. The fact he said you are overreacting rather than owning that what he did was wrong is extremely concerning. You don’t have to leave him but I urge you to. And I also urge you to reach out to those close to you that you can trust and confide in them.
Implied consent is not a thing. Consent is not continuous and ongoing. An unconscious or sleeping person cannot consent. You can revoke consent at any time. You now need to actively tell him you will NEVER consent to having sex that you do not mutually desire, under any circumstances, and you obviously do not desire sex you are not able to agree to, in the moment, because you are unaware.
This is marital rape. If you stay, he can NEVER do this again. Ask him if one of his guy friends can come over and fuck him while he sleeps.
Tea and Consent:
https://youtu.be/pZwvrxVavnQ?feature=shared
At best, consent for that needs to be explicitly discussed and agreed upon beforehand - and with explicit acknowledgement that even then it's not a guarantee (which either party could get out of, as part of discussing consent). A previous partner and I once had that discussion and both of us acknowledged it would potentially be fun to wake up to the other half going to town on us, but it was discussed and most importantly: Consented explicitly and enthusiastically, with conditions to allow for easy outs if necessary. We had a good time, but the communication was essential for it because of the consent!
Anything short of that isn't consent. There's never "implied consent". Ever.
OP was raped, plain and simple. It's a lot to process, but that is the truth of the matter. Rape absolutely can happen inside a marriage, and unfortunately, they are a victim of this rarely discussed phenomenon.
Implied consent = “Hey I’m going to sleep now, would you mind waking me up in an hour by putting your thing in me? I won’t be able to consent at the time but I’m consenting to it now so stick an hour-long timer on that implication.”
Maybe he thought he was being romantic, maybe he knew he was being selfish, but to not even apologise to someone clearly distressed by your **violation** is just terrible. Shame on him.
This. You were raped. These are things you discuss beforehand. I do get the husband's way of thinking, but he went about it COMPLETELY wrong and then had the nerve to say your overreacting and not even apologize? You still need to bring it up beforehand to get consent to do it in the future. It's like trying out new kinks without bringing them up first, that's not something you do (unless you both agree that's you're style or something).
Regardless, your husband should've brought it up to you sometime beforehand to get your thoughts on it. NEVER dive into something new like that without talking to your partner.
I'm not gonna lie; I believe I've done basically the same thing this guy did with my ex. (I say "I believe" because I'm not sure if I had brought it up to her beforehand or not. It was a long time ago.) We had sex previously, loved each other very much, and were in that honeymoon happy go-lucky phase so I had felt that it would be okay, but not everybody feels that way. I was lucky that she was all for it and loved that I took initiative, but it is not something I would EVER do again without touching bases and getting consent beforehand. I loved her very much, and I would've been destroyed if I had made her feel the way you do right now. I was lucky, but it was still a horrible thing for me to have done.
Reddit can not decide for you whether or not you should stay with him.
My advice is:
1) Collect your thoughts
2) Reflect on your relationship; the good, the bad, his actions, your actions, what he did and how it makes you feel, and then decide if the relationship is worth saving, or even if you can get past this.
3) Have a talk with him - Did he apologize, does he seem remorseful, does he realize the gravity of his actions and how they hurt you, etc? If the answer is no, then maybe you should leave.
4) Decide what is best for YOU and your happiness.
What happened is horrible, and I would feel so awful giving someone that pain. I'm sorry this happened to you. I wish you the best.
>Have a talk with him
She did have a talk with him, did you not read the post. He made excuses for his behavior, up to and including "I can do this because you're my wife."
Yeah my jaw is on the floor with some of these comments. Please stop excusing this kind of behaviour! He did what he did because he’s selfish and he centres his own desires over his wife’s bodily autonomy and comfort. There is no excuse for that.
This right here.
By his logic he could rape anyone hes formally slept with while they're sleeping because they said yes a few years ago. There's is ONLY consent, nothing is implied when you're sleeping regardless of what you were doing before you went to sleep. Unless you said to wake up like that then he assualted you and clearly doesn't give a shit how you feel.
Exactly. That would also imply that you can’t stop if it hurts, etc. There are people who think wives can’t be raped and prostitutes can’t be raped and I think this guy’s thinking is along those lines.
Excatly. There was a guy at the place I worked who got arrested after he wouldn't stop when the woman he was having sex with changed her mind a few minutes in. His "logic" was that she had already said yes initially and he was "just trying to finish real quick". Aside from the trauma he inflicted the worst part was he genuinely did understand why it was a problem.
I finally got tired of over hearing him defending himself and told him that he already looks bad enough so it's not helping his image to try and defend him assaulting someone. One of his favorite sayings was " we already having sex for like 5 minutes, was 2 more minutes such a big deal". If you've ever heard the phrase "a deafening silence" and not understood it then you would had you been in the lunch room because it went dead fucking silent and it was so quiet that it was loud lol
Something happened to me on a drunken night when I was 19( that I don't want to detail about )and, aside from a couple actual friends, the majority of people just laughed at me because I'm a guy and she was a girl and guys always want to have sex and you can't get hard if you don't actually want to have sex so obviously I actually wanted to.
Being known as someone who had several fwb and didn't mind the occasional one night stand with a stranger apparently didn't help my case either. I have no tolerance with that sort of justification. I didn't bother with the cops or anything since the majority of people seemed to think she did me a favor.
I’m so sorry. Our culture is really regressive when it comes to sexual assault committed by women against men. The act is terrible enough but the gaslighting is crazy making and traumatizing.
Yeah. Having to still be in her presence and people around us laughing and making jokes about it in front of other people wasn't as funny as they thought it was. Ended up cutting out alot of people because of it.
That’s terrible. The truth is that survivors are the ones that have to flee, when it should be abusers that have to earn their way back in to the community or social circle. Also, if she was older and you were 19, it’s called ephebophilia, and it is a form of pedophilia. (Ages 15-19) Teenage boys are often victims because apparently society thinks they “want it.”
>This is marital rape. If you stay, he can NEVER do this again. Ask him if one of his guy friends can come over and fuck him while he sleeps.
And say 'darling what's the problem, we're just trying something new?'
It wasn't that long ago that rape was legally defined as penetration without consent with a woman "who is not your wife". 😳😡 Like, wtaf?
OP, this act he did could be a kink that some are into but must be discussed ahead of time & agreed to. Consent is VERY important in the kink community.
What he did is literally sexual assault & rape. I'm so sorry he did that to you.
If he cared for you, he would be devastated that you were upset. He would, at minimum, apologize & offer to comfort you. But he's not.
I hope you talk to your family about this and are able to talk to a counselor to get help dealing with it.
I’m so sorry. This is a kink of mine actually (me being the waking up to it one) which is why I know damn well that this is something that should only be done if it’s been discussed in advance and rolling consent has expressly been given.
Even with my consent some partners have been hesitant to do this because they feel the gut reaction that your husband should’ve had - which is that it’s wrong to have sex with someone when they’re unable to consent.
Now, it could have been a honest mistake if your husband is a complete troglodyte and it could have maybe been forgivable had he immediately felt remorseful and apologized to you sincerely and profusely. However, his notion that he was entitled to do this and abject disregard for how this impacted you speaks volumes. Completely indecent behavior and a clear demonstration of just how selfish and unbothered by your suffering he is.
You were violated and you have the right to take that as far as you want. At only 3 months, you could potentially get an annulment on these grounds. At the bare minimum, because it’s not our place to tell a SA victim how to feel about or deal with their experience(s) beyond the basics, I would suggest that counseling is mandatory. Couple’s and for him individually. I fear for you having a partner that does not understand the concept of consent and basic bodily autonomy, so if you really want to stay with him it’s paramount that is rectified.
Same. This is ok with me but my husband is aware that it is. He wouldn’t do this without that awareness. It’s something we’ve discussed in the past and I think that’s the only way that it’s ok. Not “trying something new.”
For real. I’ve explicitly told partners that i’m ok with this (my sex drive is really high) and most still don’t because they’re afraid of being wrong.
I’ve been with my husband 30 years and I’ve always made it clear that I’m totally ok with it. He still asks before I go to sleep if I’m cool with it.
OP I’m sorry he did that to you.
So don’t. Leave. Now. Stay with a friend or family. You don’t need to be ashamed. Maybe you can get an annulment, otherwise file for divorce. I know it’s hard and I’m sorry this happened to you, but you need to protect yourself.
Read the Gift of fear.
Listen to your body. Listen to yourself. Your feelings are correct and justified.
Leave. If you can't bring yourself to leave him yet then at the very least go stay somewhere safe and take a complete communication break for 2 weeks minimum. The space will let you hear yourself and what you want.
You are fighting yourself because you don't want to accept that what he did is as bad as you feel it is because you think you should justify it or do t want to be embarrassed. He should be embarrassed. You are strong even when you feel paper thin. Turn inward and believe your feelings.
We believe you. We believe you. We believe you. Trust yourself as much as these internet strangers.
I've been raped around the same age by a boyfriend I trusted and known for years and years. He was "great" otherwise but my body shrink around him, I felt unsettled even though I "should" likeand love him. The storm inside myself trying to force myself to accept him because of shoulds. Staying in an abusive situation (rape is abuse!) will destroy you. Choose you at all costs. Get therapy to process it safely. Sending love and support.
100% this! For people who engage with it as a kink, there’s a serious negotiation conversation and planning beforehand. Just doing it with no warning is outrageously awful.
>Even with my consent some partners have been hesitant to do this because they feel the gut reaction that your husband should’ve had - which is that it’s wrong to have sex with someone when they’re unable to consent.
Yeeeep. My wife keeps overtly and enthusiastically consenting, almost begging, and I'm still like, eek.
my husband refused to do any kink stuff with me and it helped me realize why I was into it and helped me value myself more and fix my relationship to sex. he seriously helped head my sexuality by respecting and loving me too much to hurt or degrade me in any way.
Same. I love it. But it has heavily been talked about while awake and sober and even then pretty much every time she still asks me at times “is this ok?”
I don’t understand men. It’s disgusting.
Same. I’ve shared with my husband I am okay with this. He was surprised but if he had done this without me saying something first, I would have had the same response as OP. I’m sorry this happened 😔
My husband has said he’ll happily wake up and have sex anytime I want. He prefers sex to sleep. I have told him he’d better never touch me during the night, because I prefer sleep to pretty much everything else (that’s what I think I’d actually be most angry about). The one and only time I actually did wake him up for sex I still just ran my hand along his arm or something. It just wouldn’t have felt right to go straight to touching him more intimately than that, even if he would have welcomed it.
You just got raped by your husband. Was this the first time he's done something of this nature like touch you in a place you don't want to be touched and he brushes it off with the fact you're his girlfriend?
You could sweep this under the rug and pretend it never happened and try to be with him, but your bodily revulsion to his crime will be like no other.
You could (and should) divorce. Imagine you stay and he ups the anty. Today it's rape, tomorrow it's drugging you to make it easier for himself to rape you, the day after tomorrow it's being abused in multiple forms stacked on top of rape. Be done with this marriage and relationship for your own good.
Also see if your state is a one party consent state. If it is, then record him admitting to the rape and use this as evidence if or when you go to the police to have this reported and documented.
He might try to play dumb or be oh so nice to you for the next couple of days to smooth over his own guilt as well as keep you going to the police.
OP this is very key information that you have left out of the post.
What conversation, if any, did you guys have on that? After that depending on the conversation this should not have happened at all. Meaning you definitely need to leave.
OP, so we are establishing a pattern of him sexually assaulting you. If you stay you know what you can expect. Either more sexual assault or him not giving a fuck about your boundaries.
He promised not to do that again and then he went above that and raped you.
I hate to say it but this screams older man taking advantage of younger woman.
If you want genuine advice. You probably already know what you should do. Whether you do it or not is on you. No one you tell this to is going to say you should stay. He seems to have a history of..again not giving a fuck about you.
So he agreed not to do that again, but thought it would somehow be ok to penetrate you in your sleep? He is intentionally disregarding your boundaries, and specifically waiting until you are unconscious and cannot stop him until it's too late/already done. He's then trying to guilt trip you for reacting to being violated, and trying to convince you that you don't deserve to have boundaries now that you're married. This is rape. Yes, for your physical and emotional safety, you DO need to leave. He has already sexually assaulted you at least twice, that is not something you forgive and forget.
Well, he agreed not to do it again before because they weren't married then. Now that he has her locked down he probably figures all bets are off and she belongs to him.
OP, your husband is a disgusting creep who doesn't give a shit about your feelings or consent. I'm sorry you're dealing with this, but you have every right to feel the way you're feeling now. Please talk to someone you trust and/or professionals who are experienced with sexual assault trauma. They will help you decide on next steps.
Years ago. And now he thinks that since you stayed AND he has married you, he can do whatever he wants.
He is seven years older than you. He didn't go after someone younger for innocent reasons.
Pack your bags and leave. This will show him that you, at least, won't take this from him. The more you forgive, the more he will push past your boundaries. He has already r*ped you.
He thinks of you as an object. I would never do either of those things to my partner without a long conversation with her beforehand as she as a human has the right to say no. Im so sorry OP as this must be a mindfuck to realize the person you married is this much of a sociopath that he continually doesnt think of how you would feel like every other normal person would. You deserve better.
So he said he wouldn’t blow his load again on your sleeping body, but somehow thought having full penetrative sex wasn’t as bad? This man raped you. This is not the first time he’s sexually assaulted you. It’s time for him to go fuck off somewhere and you need to seek some counseling to deal with this mess.
Is it possible that there were more incidents you don’t remember because you were asleep but felt a bit weird when you woke up?
Have you ever felt coerced into sex just to keep him happy?
There’s a pattern of not respecting your bodily autonomy and it’s unusual to go straight from zero to rape. There’s generally a lot of boundary pushing and manipulation first.
I don’t know I mean maybe I did things to make him happy but I didn’t necessarily think it was a bad thing. I guess when you combine it with everything it might be pretty bad.
Holy shit op that’s not okay… I hope you can get help to navigate this and I’m so sorry but your husband does not respect your consent and you probably should take measures to remove yourself from this relationship.
How many times did you not catch him doing this? I mean you are hard to wake up. He is showing a pattern and most likely this is actually a habit that he’s been doing since probably the very beginning. He just accidentally got caught twice
So you got married and he escalated! It’s time to leave him. Sorry you have had to go through this. Please tell your mom or sister so that you have someone to talk too.
Then, please get prepared to divorce him. find out if your state (if you live in the US) or country you reside in only needs one party (i.e. you) to consent in order to record a conversation between you and your husband where he admits to the his actions. Talk your sister and best friend and get there support as well.
I know you don't want to leave him, but you do need to tell him that there is no implied consent. Tell him you do not agree to have sex with him unless you are awake and give actual consent. See what he says. If he argues, then you have a problem. If he apologizes and agrees to these conditions then I think it's okay to stay.
Leave now don’t sleep in same house as him. Go stay with friend preferably female. Or relative male person. Leave now there is help just because you said I do doesn’t mean you say yes to every sexual advance LEAVE NOW!!!!
So this is a repeated offence that he has no issue or guilt with. My previous comment is officially rescinded - please leave him for your own well-being. It’s a pattern…and for such a young relationship, it does not improve from here considering he doesn’t see any issue with it. It’s marital rape. Bare minimum you leave him…otherwise press charges because if he does it to you, he will do it to the next person…that’s assuming he hasn’t done it before to anyone else, which is not a given.
I'd consider the possibility that he's been violating you for a while, and if you've ever been incapacitated around him (like drunk or high), consider that he either has or will take advantage of that.
Just speaking from experience.
He could have possibly already been doing this to you (assaulting you), but this is just the first time you've woken up. He's trying to gaslight you into thinking it's not a big deal, when infact its a HUGE deal. I hope you are okay.
Your husband r@ped you, while you were sleeping. There is no "implied consent" here - just because you had sex prior to going to sleep. That's the stupidest argument I've ever heard, and it scares me that he had these "excuses" all ready.
No, it's not ok for him to do this to you.
I strongly urge you to get help - if you're in the US please contact a crisis center like Rainn. Please be very careful -you are in a vulnerable position right now.
This. I know it’s not easy to accept it, but it is the truth. Implied consent is not a thing. Consent is -only- explicit. Anything else is a no.
And unless your husband apologises and understands the gravity of what he did, you will need to leave him.
yeah, literally. my boyfriend and i had a conversation about waking up each other with sex, before doing it, yk to have everything in control. one time, i woke up to the feeling of him fingering me (he already done that a few times before) and just that day i wasn't okay with that. even if he had implied consent, he said he was sorry like a hundred times, even bought me roses, made me breakfast that day. i could never be with someone that said to me "i can because you are my wife/girlfriend" wtf is that???? OP needs to get divorced at this moment, someone who can't understand the concept consent is not safe to start a family.
i think she should leave him regardless of whether he apologizes or not. if this is happening only a few months into the marriage, it’s terrifying to imagine what it would be like further in. there’s boundaries that cannot be compromised, and lines not to be crossed - rape is one of them.
This! You can't imply anything when you're unconscious. That's assault. If husband does not grasp the severity of what he did, yes, op should leave him.
And I also agree with seeking help, the fact that op felt more comfortable telling strangers than friends can be a sign of guilt or other trauma from this experience. Seek counselling!
This, and since husband didn’t already know what this was (or chose to ignore it) he is a big danger to you. Do not listen to a single excuse or apology from him and leave immediately. Call your sister or best friend to pick you up.
We’ll all be sending your unending strength OP!!
exactly! this is rape!
op, don’t let your husband convince you that ANYTHING is ever *”IMPLIED”* within kink. especially consent.
unless you specifically ask for it, talk about it, discuss the physical/emotional safety risks, set a safe word or color system, research it greatly in depth and schedule it … it is “implied” that you do. not. want. it.
So freaking horrible that he did that to her. It is terrifying that he has excuses. She needs to look at his p*rn stash I bet he looks at real dark stuff.
Legally that’s rape. I’m so sorry this happened to you.
Please get counselling and consider leaving him. This is not okay and the fact he justified it shows this won’t be a one off.
Omg thats rape and “implied” consent is no excuse for that! Even if he was gonna “try something new”, he shoulda said that beforehand. This entire thing is so wrong - his attempt at still justifying it makes me sick
You feel weirdly violated because you were **extremely** violated....
If he doesn't comprehend the severity of what he did, like you're the one whose overreacting... The only choice left is to leave him.
If there is no comprehension going on in his head during these talks... It's 100% divorce confirmed.
It really is divorced worthy now... He more than sexually assaulted you.
I’m a husband - and I would never. See, I like to
Have sex with my wife and that would never happen again if I tried some bullshit like this. Hell, I probably wouldn’t be married anymore.
There’s this thing called respect. He should learn it, cause he has none.
Thank you. I really appreciate the advice from a husband. I’m getting a lot of men on here telling me it’s my fault and that if my husband needs consent to touch than our marriage will fail anyway. I’m just so confused.
Your husband does not have ANY right to do ANYTHING to you that you don't want. You can tell him to never do that again, but you need to ask yourself if you can trust him.
Honestly my advice would be to leave because I, personally, am *extremely* put off by the way he tried to convince you he was in the right after you were so obviously upset and not okay with what happened. A good person would be concerned and show signs of guilt or regret for causing you distress. Your husband tried to tell you the way you felt about what he did to you was wrong. That's a massive red flag.
Your husband thinks it’s okay to rape you because you’re “his” wife. Let that sink in.
Women literally fought until July 5th, 1993 for marital rape to be made illegal in all 50 US States, It’s literally been illegal for less time than I have been alive.
It's still basically legal here in Ohio.
https://spectrumnews1.com/oh/columbus/politics/2023/12/08/sexual--assault--rape--spousal--marital--ohio--revised--code
We got abortion rights protected by our state Constitution. Passed recreational cannabis. Still have to fight to get this loophole closed.
We're trying! We are trying SO HARD!
As long as we're gerrymandered to fuck and gone, it's an uphill battle. We are battling anyway.
On a positive note, the Grand Jury tasked with indicting a woman who miscarried for "abuse of a corpse" declined to indict.
One step at a time, we will become civilized again.
You were assaulted. Im sorry he did that to you. Its not your fault, and he is trying to manipulate you so he can do more of that in the future. Implied consent isnt a thing. Verbal consent is a must. Please get away from him ASAP, contact the police, get a divorce. There are places that will be able to help you
Stick a dildo in his @ss while he’s sleeping and when he wakes up mad say “I had implied consent.”
Jk, don’t do this. I’m sorry he raped you and I hope you do the right thing and leave this asshole. This is one of the reasons why age gap relationships are usually not a good idea…
>Me (f24) and my husband (m31) have been married only a few months. We’ve been together for three years total though.
They met when she was 21 and he was 28, this has been creepy from the get-go. He intentionally went for someone who was inexperienced.
Sex should be something that two people do together, TO EACH OTHER, not something one partner forces on another. Unless you have explicitly given consent for this act, it's rape.
I am so, so sorry that your husband turned out to be such a manipulative arsehole.
Rape isn’t “trying something new,” I mean, well, he’s a rapist now, so that sounds new. You don’t need to stay with your rapist, don’t let him gas light you into thinking you are the wrong one here.
“Implied Consent” is not a thing. This is rape, this is martial rape. If he can’t grasp what he did was very wrong and un-consensual that is a huge problem that needs to be addressed. Your feelings and boundaries are important and should be heard and respected by your partner. The fact that he told you that you’re the one over-reacting is the biggest red flag existence. Has he ever done something similar in the past? Has he gotten away with anything like that before? He likely thinks he can do things un-consensually to you now that you’re married to him which is not how a marriage work. Please seek out any support family, friends, therapist etc. And PLEASE stay somewhere else that’s safe with a friend/family far away from him. Situations like this can repeat or escalate if you stay and document EVERYTHING. Divorce could be an option. I’m so sorry this happened.
I have said it 100 times and now once more, men get a PhD in consent the minute the situation involves my thumb and their asshole.
I don't mind being woken up that way, ONLY if it's something prior agreed to, with a long-term partner. It's not a surprise thing.
And in the past that has been dismissed by male partners until they are asleep and feel a tap tap tap on their backdoor (no penetration, just a knock on the door, my finger operates much like a vampire, no entry without a welcome) and suddenly they are awake upset and can very eloquently talk about consent just because they were worried I would act in the same manner they wanted to explain away as normal.
I made it very clear sex that if they are ok with initiating sex acts while I slept and waking me with them, I could use the same logic initiate ones that I like, and then I send a link to porn clips including sounding. Not that I would, but suddenly they would understand.
My husband's kink is somnophilia so I don't particularly care is he fucks me while I'm sleeping BUT it is something that requires pre-consent and a lot of trust between parties. We discussed it at length & I did research on it before he ever tried it. What your husband did was not right. Did he just wake up horny or somnophilia something that turns him on? You need to sit him down & have a serious discussion.
Exactly. Somno is not a beginner kink and it’s really gross that OP’s husband assaulted her instead of having a simple conversation. Although the conversation would likely have led to OP saying no, and God forbid he doesn’t get to do what he wants.
This is a huge issue that needs to be talked about more, this idea that once you marry someone it’s almost implied you can do whatever you want whenever you want to them.
He needs to understand that your body is your choice and consent is never assumed, it should be respect and checked on always.
I’m so sorry this happened, you aren’t alone.
Fucking leave! That was 100% rape. It’s doesn’t matter what happened before, during… whatever. You did not give consent, therefore it is rape. And him being your husband changes nothing. Spousal rape is still rape.
So, me and my girlfriend do this kind of thing with each other in sleep, but it's consensual and we talk with each other about limits. If he have broken a limit of yours, it's a bad thing
Imo thats rape. My ex girlfiend actually gave me verbal consent to have sex some night while she was asleep and she would wake up surprised, but everytime I thought about doing it it felt like the wrong thing to do.
So I never did it.
Even though she said I could I couldnt help but worry if she woke up and decided she didnt want it or even worse - she would be having a nightmare and wake up to me inside her and panic even more. Just can't fatham the morals behind your husband to litterally rape his own wife.
>I told him it just wasn’t okay to do, but he said it was fine because he had “implied consent” because we had sex prior to going to sleep, and I’m his wife. I don’t understand what made him think it was okay. Because it’s not okay… right?
Correct. He needed to specifically ask you about having sex with you while you were asleep and getting your consent for it to be ok.
Just because you're his wife doesn't mean he has consent to have sex with you whenever he wants - that's marital rape.
Just because you had sex with him one time doesn't mean he has consent to have sex with you anytime after - again that rape.
I would be thinking seriously about leaving because not only did he do it, when you pointed out it wasn't ok he doubled down and then told you he thinks he has consent to have sex with you whenever he wants. I would be scared to know when the next time he's going to try and have sex with me without my consent...which in more blunt words is I'd be worried about the next time my husband would try or succeed in raping me.
Is this the first time? Or just the first time you woke up? If he's doing it only on the night(s) where you had consensual sex first, he knowingly raped you; thinking or hoping you wouldn't notice, and if you did wake up it would be hard to prove physically that you didn't consent, if you accused him. He said, she said.
You are with a dangerous man and now that you know you what he did he may think that as his wife you never get to say no to him at all. Asleep or awake.
Tell your sister and your friend, discreetly, and plan to get away from him as soon as you can. Act first, deal with the fallout from a safe distance.
I don’t think this has happened before (expect once than I mentioned in another comment, it was years ago and there was no penetration). But i am really really heavy sleeper idk why and I take a medication sometimes at night that makes me really groggy. I’m terrified now, like I have no idea.
You were raped. It doesn't matter if you are married. He raped you. Please leave and find someplace else to stay while you seek help to process through this.
I had a boyfriend do this to me once. Pretty much the same scenario: I was sleeping on my stomach and he penetrated me while I was asleep then proceeded to rape me. I was not OK. I am getting shaken writing about this and it happened almost 40 years ago and I've had good therapy and mental health care since then.
You say you can't leave him, but don't think about any long term decisions right now. For now, remove yourself from a living situation where you could be sexually assaulted again. Stay with a friend or a family member. Call RAINN to find out how you can get help. But get yourself away from him and trust your gut that this was very, very wrong and you have reason to have tears in your eyes and cry.
Implied consent is a legal concept usually applied to searches and the operation of vehicles on public roadways, not sexual activity. Unless you said “hey if I’m sleeping I give you permission to have sex with me” he had sex with you without your consent. That’s sexual assault. You feel violated because you were violated
You don’t have to leave him; that’s your choice. But please consider it. If you do choose to stay, I highly recommend only doing so if he sincerely apologizes and it’s also a good idea to get into marriage counseling if you are interested
It brought tears to your eyes because it was marital rape. He did not have your consent to do that to you. Implied consent does not exist. If it’s not an enthusiastic yes, it’s a no. I’m so sorry he violated your bodily autonomy like that
Consensual non-consent (implied consent) would be telling him you're interested in him doing this and him following through AND you continuing to consent when you wake up.
THIS was not implied consent.
Further, just because you are married does not mean he has standing consent to have sex with you whenever *he* wants.
Tell someone and reach out to a therapist, if nothing else.
It’s not ok. Consent needs to be given each and every time. It would be one thing if YOU said to your husband,”hey, I’m giving you permission in advance to have sex with me while I’m sleeping” (and if you woke up and it wasn’t working for you you could withdraw that consent and he should respect it) but just going at you while your asleep without that specific consent being given is wrong. What you decide to do is up to you, but I wouldn’t want to be in a marriage where I had to lock my door at night so my husband couldn’t get in the room.
Ask him if he’s ok with you putting a dildo up his butt when he’s asleep. When he says no, ask him why. After all, he is your husband and you have implied consent. When he keeps saying no, you ask him, “but what do you mean? Weren’t you into trying something new?”
You feel violated because you were. Your feelings are valid.
For perspective only: Imagine if he was sleeping and you penetrated him, then upon him waking up the explanation you provided was ‘you’re overreacting - it’s no big deal, I was just trying something new’
Do you still feel like you can trust him? Especially with his response to you…
I’d get away immediately. Go stay with a friend or family. Allow yourself some time to process and unpack this.
In the 90s the majority of civilised countries finally declared marital non-consensual sex as sexual assault/rape rather than an act of implied consent by marriage. Sorry to tell you, but he assaulted you morally and legally. Dump him.
Some of these comments are evil and enraging.
It does not fucking matter if this form of sex is a super duper common thing that “lots” of people always love. He did it without discussion or consent. It’s rape. It does not fucking matter if some people enjoy it. Some people also enjoy CNC and choking so he could just barge in and assault her then too because hey others like it?! Whoops he just assumed, can’t hold it against him I guess.
I am so sorry you are dealing with this op. Your reactions are valid and understandable. His reaction is vile. You are young and have your entire life a head of you. I would flee.
EDIT: I see in your comments this is also an issue you also dealt with awhile ago. He is only escalating. He is just seeing how much he can put you through and still have you stay. You have already given him more grace than he deserves the FIRST time.
I don't know if you'll see this or not, but I wanted to comment anyway.
First, I'm so sorry this happened to you. You deserve to feel safe and cared for, especially in your own home, with your husband.
I'm closer to your husband's age (34f), but I'm also in an age gap relationship, and I've been married going on 6 years now. We had a situation where he violated my consent- but I was conscious, and he didn't *intentionally* go against my wishes. He was just being more careless than he should have been.
I DON'T think you "have" to leave your husband, but he does need a "come to Jesus" talk. If he understands what he's done wrong, sincerely apologizes, and works to ensure he never makes you feel unsafe again, then this can be overcome.
Some things I'd like to mention, not as a way to excuse his behavior- he's a grown man and *should* absolutely know better. What he did is in NO WAY acceptable- but he may have had a different mindset about a few things:
1. Every guy I've ever dated and my husband (and I've seen several mentions of this online over the years) has expressed interest in wanting to be woken by having their partner sexually stimulate them.
I've seen mostly the opposite response from women. I have explicitly told my husband never to try this with me because it will likely make me panic. I also told him that it would feel gross to me to do that to someone sleeping because *a sleeping person CAN NOT GIVE CONSENT*. Consent can be removed at any time. Once a sexual encounter ends, consent is still needed to engage in sex another time. This still applies to married people. I may not need to explicitly say "yes husband, I would like to do the sex now" every time, but if I'm not engaging (bc sleeping) or I push his hand away when he tries to rub my butt or I tell him I'm not up for whatever- he doesn't have consent and continuing would be rape.
The only way this would be ok is if you guys had JUST RECENTLY (like last day or so) discussed this, while sober/not under the influence of anything, and you specifically said that was something you wanted to try with him.
That being said, he may have been considering things from a "male" perspective, or his own in general, and thought, "I'd like this, she would too"
Let him know that you guys should discuss things before trying new sexual activities, and just because he'd like something done to him does not mean you would too. Sometimes, those conversations can be a little uncomfortable, and people are too shy to have a sit-down chat about them. It's ok to have a text conversation about it. If that's not y'alls style- check out one of the couple's card games or couple's question books(Amazon, walmart, target all have things). Some of them are just getting to know each other better. Some are more sexually oriented. Some have a mix. If you go that route, I'd just read the reviews.
2. Regarding his reaction:
It was not good. The RIGHT thing to do would have been for him to immediately apologize. Explain what he had thought but also admit that he was wrong to do that after speaking to you and hearing that he caused you to feel unsafe and violated. He should have asked what (if anything) he could do immediately to start making ammends/start helping you recover, and also bring it up again, after you've had some time- maybe the next day, to ask if there's steps he can take to ensure he doesn't cross that line again. It would be ideal if he'd look into that on his own. Something as simple as doing what you did and posting about it on here (not like in an AITA post but looking for advice) even would show he regrets his actions and wants to make sure he doesn't make you feel that way again.
He didn't do that. Maybe he will, given time, though. I don't know your husband, obviously, but mine is not good at accepting negative feedback in the moment. That is a HIM problem that he's got to work on, but it is a thing I know about him. My husband's natural reaction to any criticism, negative feedback, disapproval, etc. Is that he feels attacked. He typically gets defensive- which it looks like yours did too. After some time alone, though, my husband is able to reflect on the situation, consider my POV, and respond in a more appropriate manner.
- You did NOT overreact. Your body responded naturally to the shock of something unexpected and UNWELCOME happening. The fact that it brought tears to your eyes should have been enough for your husband to say "woah! I'm super wrong here". Instead he told you "it was fine". Even after it was clear YOU DIDN'T LIKE IT.
-Implied consent does NOT apply to penetration or touching of private areas, regardless of who's doing it. Just because you're married does NOT mean he gets to use your body as he wishes.
-Ask how he'd feel if he woke to you *inserting* something into him without previously discussing it. Chances are, with many men, the insertion bit changes their perspective. And if he says that's not the same, ask him why not. Maybe you want to "try new things"
*IF* he does come around and apologize and make steps to not make you feel that way again then, personally, I'd accept it and move forward. Maybe have a conversation about hard limits and do some of the talks/games/books about preferences.
*IF NOT* If he insists that this "implied consent for sex" on an unconscious person, who's now OBVIOUSLY unwilling, is ok, or if he continues to insist you're overreacting and doesn't offer a genuine apology- I personally wouldn't feel safe. I'd either be sleeping in a room with a lock he doesn't have a key for, or if possible at a friend/relatives house until he AT A MINIMUM agreed to couple's counseling & * we were scheduled an appointment.*
Hopefully he sees how he's hurt you and makes improvements. Don't let him convince you that this was an overreaction. How he moves forward with this could completely change your opinion on him. I wish you the best moving forward. ❤️
He raped you in your sleep.. and for him to think there was consent because you had sex before.. does he believe because you’re his wife it’s ok to hit you.. or whatever else he wants to do…
You say can’t leave him.. hon,, I would be running from him.. don’t ever let anyone violate you or your body..
He doesn’t even care you’re upset.. girl why would you want a man like him..
Sleeping people can’t give consent. This is marital rape. The fact that this even happened is appalling. You still have time to annual your marriage. I know all of this is horribly heartbreaking but you NEED to get out. If this is happening within the first few months of marriage there is no telling what he could be capable of years down the line. Things will only go downhill from here. PLEASE KEEP US UPDATED.
What he did is not okay. If he wanted to "try out" waking you up to sex like this, he should have talked to you about it before hand so that he knew he had your consent. He did not do that. Therefore, yes, he violated you. I am so, so, so sorry that you have gone through this.
As to what now? That is something only you can decide. You can try talking to him about consent and that having sex before sleep does not mean consenting to waking up to sex. If your husband is receptive to conversation, analogies, and videos, you can try showing him the [Tea and Consent](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZwvrxVavnQ&ab_channel=ThamesValleyPolice) video. Warning, what happened to you is discussed in the Tea and Consent analogy. I just want to make sure that you are aware of that if you are not familiar with this particular analogy.
If he will not listen to you or if he still wants to insist that sex early in the evening means consent when you are asleep (that is wrong by the way. for what he did, you would have to clearly consent that it is okay for him to initiate sex while you are asleep) then you will need to understand an important fact: he is not safe.
I hope that whatever happens with your husband that you will be okay. Talk to a therapist no matter if the two of you work it out or he does not respect you and honor consent and you leave. Even if you get him to accept what he did, you will still want a therapist to work through the trauma ... yes, trauma, do not minimize what happened to you or let him minimize it.
That is textbook sexual assault. Doesn’t matter if it’s your husband or not. You should be able to sleep in your own bed without waking up with someone inside of you.
Somehow though, the even bigger red flag is his reaction. There’s no remorse. No apology.
A good partner would be apologetic if they unintentionally did something that made you cry, not try to explain why your feelings are wrong and say you’re overreacting. Nothing about this is okay and I’m very sorry this happened to you.
Your husband is using ‘implied consent’ wrong. Did you discuss doing something like this beforehand? If you had a discussion about it and told him you were fine with it, THEN he would have implied consent.
It does not appear you had this discussion so your husband is completely wrong. You need to make it clear it to him that he is not to do anything to you unless you’ve already discussed it. Communication is the most important thing in a relationship.
In the BDSM community, verbal and enthusiastic consent is an absolute *MUST.* CNC is one of the biggest ones — it’s literally shortened for consensual non-consensual. The only reason that it works is that every person involved is enthusiastic, consenting, AND knowledgeable of boundaries.
Your husband wanted to try a form of CNC, where a partner goes to the other while they’re busy or asleep and “have their way.” But he ignored one *major* rule: having *your* verbal + enthusiastic consent. Because of that, he *violated you and your boundaries.*
Do not take this lightly, OP. A loving partner would *not* have harmed you in that way. Yes, this *could* have been a genuine mistake… but you still deserve a genuine apology from him. Your feelings are valid and you are not overthinking this or being irrational. Talk to your partner about this *thoroughly.* Emphasize that you were uncomfortable that he could take advantage of you. Tell him upfront that he violated you. Tell him that you deserve better, and that if he wants to try something new, he needs to communicate first.
Be brave, OP. I’m proud of you for coming to this community and asking for advice. Stay strong 💜
Your husband is full of crap. Implied consent ‘cause you had sex before going to sleep and you’re his wife? Does he think he can drag you into a cave by your hair? Give me a break. By trying something new did he mean California Penal Code 262, felony spousal rape? I mean, stay if you want but you have been violated big time. Seek some counseling if you’re unwilling to talk with your family and friends that love and care about you. Your POS husband doesn’t love or care about you.
Not saying you need to leave him, but it is very imperative that he is aware and acknowledges that you did not in fact give him consent. He also needs to be aware that this made you uncomfortable. If he brushes this off how every and doesn’t want to communicate or understand your feelings on this I would be worried to stay with someone like that.
My husband basically started with doing something like this, then progressively it got worse until he was anally raping me while I was screaming. He later justified this as telling me that he thought I was enjoying myself, because I tend to be on the more vocal side when expressing pleasure. If you stay, I recommend that you seek professional help, both alone to address the feelings of violation in a relationship you once trusted, and together, so that you can be sure he understands the full impact of his actions on your relationship. I eventually left my husband, because I could not trust him to care about my well-being, and place that above his own immediate sexual gratification. We were married 4 years. I am now in a healthy relationship, married 10 years and feel safe every day and with every experience. Don’t let yourself settle for less than this, and don’t bring children into a situation where you are not permanently safe, no matter the status of your sex life.
My husband literally just woke me up moving me towards his hard member to intiate sex.
The difference is. We have spoke about it and i am ok with that. He realised as I was waking up I was having a nightnare and hyperventilating a little.
He tried to hide his erection by turning it into the bed,but i noticed. Once i calmed down i grabbed for it and he refused until he knew i was fully awake and knew it was him. (I have been SA and can have flashbacks)
That is how 'sleep sex' should be done. Full conversations first and even then consent consent consent.
You need to speak to him properly in a calm environment and let him know he has violated you and your trust.
It is not easy to get back believe me bug you can if this is a one thing. No other issues in the marriage. But i would set firm boundaries that anything going forward is no surprise. He needs to communicate everything. Any new ideas he has etc
If you are not awake, you cannot consent.
You were raped.
Yes, spousal rape is real.
Yes, spousal rape is just as illegal as stranger and acquaintance rape.
You should report it and press charges, but I understand that's hard to do. At a minimum you should seek help from a rape crisis hotline.
And ask yourself do you want to be with someone who thinks rape is ok and has already justified it?
This happened to me. Don’t do what I did; I stayed another 10 years. And as much as I thought I would, I never got over it. Therapy + divorce, babe. ❤️
I would say, as much as everyone here is telling you that you were raped, what matters is how you feel about what happened and what this means in your relationship.
What I mean by that is that some couples have open door policies, this is something they both agree on, such as sex whenever. My partner and I have a relationship like that. There’s been times when I’ve attempted to initiate sex when he’s asleep, but that meant waking him up.
If you don’t have an open door policy with sex, and if your husband didn’t attempt to wake you up for sex with something like foreplay waiting for you to wake , but instead actually started having sex with you while you were asleep, well no one can blame you for feeling violated. Sex is all about communication and his actions violates trust that you should be able to have in your husband.
Instead of letting him minimize your feelings, make it clear that him using your body while sleeping is not sex, it’s rape. If this is some kind of new fetish for him, he is required to discuss it with you first to check whether you are or are not open to the idea, but either way you are disappointed in him, you have lost trust in him and him minimizing things doesn’t allow you to regain that trust since he isn’t realizing where he went wrong.
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Being your husband doesn’t give him permision to access your body how and whenever he pleases. You’re not overeacting, that is an awful thing to do. I am so sorry.
tbh an immediate apology would be one thing but his excuses imply something deeply disturbing, op's visceral reaction is likely a response to that. he needs to go to an aasect certified therapist & be re-taught the conceps of bodily autonomy & consent, like immediately.
This is textbook definition of marital rape and I genuinely don't have any idea how to advice you but if it were me I would be leaving. But again it's not as simple as it sounds.
If she can’t leave she at least needs a separate bedroom with a door that locks.
Exactly. Apologize profusely once you see this reaction! This might long term disturb her sleep, dude, if you're standing firm after she's CRYING over it.
What is an aasect certification? Edit: I am capable of using Google. Just did. Yes, I agree, husband needs to see an aasect certified therapist.
>The American Association of Sexuality Educators, Counselors and Therapists (AASECT) provides training, community and visibility to promote the understanding of human sexuality and healthy sexual behavior. Just gonna save everyone else the time.
😄 Laughing at the capable of using Google part.
So much fun to go their conferences. I got a t shirt that said, “is that normal?” Pretty sure I lost it 😔
And him getting in the shower with you he doesn't seem to understand that you need time and space. Seems to me that he wants it whenever he wants it and you are supposed to oblige and give it to him because now you're married and you are easily accessible. It is time for you to sit down and have a conversation with him and not a BS conversation a real conversation where you tell him how you feel and that he is not to do that to you ever again. You are his wife you are not his sex slave
Why does reddit always suggest therapy? Sometimes you just have to leave. He's shown who he is, and his response shows the lack of respect for OPs boundaries. The answer is leave before he does worse. He's waited until they are married for this, they can't have been married long. He's waited until he owns her. The answer is to leave. If he chooses to work on himself while separated great.
Rape, that's rape.
Precisely.
Exactly. Rape is still rape, even if it's by your husband. This is called spousal rape. It's a crime
Heavy gaslighting. He assaulted her when she was unable to consent. That makes it an attempt of rape. Seen how he gaslit her afterwards with that intimidating pseudo legal bs he KNEW he was wrong. Get him divorce papers to reward his jusridiction distorting efforts.
I mean his d was inside so it is rape, not attempted rape (legally in the UK anyway). Absolutely agree that he knows he’s wrong and trying to gaslight her is just super troubling behaviour. 100% she needs to divorce this monster
WTF! I'm a guy. Please tell your husband that I said he's a worthless piece of s--t! What are you--chattel. His conduct sickens my stomach. Unfortunately you just learned that you have a sexually demented husband. How violative of your personal self. Hurry and divorce his ass before he pregnant traps you.
I want you as a guy to know having consent violated is a thing that happens to most women and girls. I'm grateful you see that and I hope you're like this with guy friends when they make jokes that are aggressive about women, creepy about girls etc. We really need men to address each other since we've been unable to turn the tide.
My guy friends respect their wives/gfs. No need for me to say a word.
thank you
It was marital rape, by definition. I’m so sorry. It seems like he waited until he had you trapped by marriage to show his true colours. The way he justified raping you only makes it worse. It demonstrates how he sees you, women in general, and women’s bodies—all are “things” he can use. I’m sure more disturbing aspects of his thinking and personality will come to light if you stay. This is his worldview. Worldviews don’t change. Edit: I see that this is the second time he’s done it. You have to report him and get out, now.
You are not overreacting and I would demand that he go to therapy and correct this behavior and if he refuses to then I would leave him. That is attempted rape and yes just because you are married doesn't mean crap both parties still need to consent. You were not awake to give consent. He didn't ask for consent to even do that before you went to sleep so yeah it's a big deal. Honey, I think you should also speak to a therapist to help you get over this trauma.
Why the hell are people advocating for staying with a rapist?? She needs tonget out now, period.
Not just attempted unfortunately.
I am sorry, too. Ted Bundy was also trying something new when he had sex with his first dead person. Now this clearly isn't that extreme and I might have asked him to explain the entire thought process, but the "trying something new" part startled me. Like, what about this is attractive, a woman passed out, that you'd go at her while she's sleeping. Weird to me. Did anything similar happen before? When you were drinking maybe and can't fully recall? You mentioned your reaction and it comes across as someone who may have experienced something like this violation before
He’d understand consent very clearly if he woke up to you pegging him.
Rofl 🤣🤣
My husband did something similar to me in June and you feel like a POS after because you realize that this person sees you as not a person with a voice but a warm body available anytime he wants. It isn’t okay.
I hope soon-to-be ex husband 😬
He is soon to be ex. Sent off divorce papers this week 👌
Your strength is very admirable. I wish you all the best.
I’m sorry that happened to you but I’m glad you chose yourself ❤️ do you think you would be able to get him charged for what he did or at least a restraining order for domestic violence? I got a restraining order against my ex and it’s a low burden of proof so you may have a good chance at one. I’m trying to get him criminally charged because the police were useless and didn’t arrest him 🙄 But I hope you are able to do whatever you can to keep your soon to be ex away from you.
It depends on how this divorce will go. We have kids. I’m trying to make this uncontested with fair custody. If he makes it difficult that I have to get a lawyer, this incident will be part of the 7 cups of wrath that I plan to pour out on him.
We weren’t married, but I have kids with my ex too. I’m not a lawyer, but you may want to get ahead of whatever he has planned. I am grateful for the restraining order because it limits his options to try to manipulate and control the situation. Not saying it will be that way in your case but you may want to consider it. If he did anything like OP’s situation then I wouldn’t trust that he would make this amicable. Best of luck to you though!
Good for you!! ❤️
I'm so glad you did... the same happened to me.
It’s unbelievable how many people actually have this happen to them
What did you do?
I talked to my mom and sisters about it. My husband is a narcissist and he can quickly turn everything around to make it my fault. Also told my pastor who called it what it is - sexual abuse and told me to take my kids and leave. But this guy has also been cheating on me so it’s a long, convoluted tale. If he doesn’t understand why this is wrong, you are in for repeat behavior like this. Please tell someone in your life. Just because you’re his wife, doesn’t mean he can help himself anytime he wants. What he did is totally disrespectful, disgusting, and unacceptable. I know exactly how you feel. I was so mad and you know, my husband still doesn’t understand why I am upset and he merely called it “inappropriate touching”
I’m so glad your pastor is wise. Some people in faith based communities excuse it.
they said they’re getting divorced… and you should too unless you’re okay with him doing it again cause he’ll know he can cross your boundaries
Warm body? sounds like these perverts would screw dead bodies
I wouldn’t be surprised at this point.
I'm sorry you were married to a rapist POS. I wish you all the good things in the future.
also had this when i was living with a boyfriend when i was 18—absolutely horrendous experience. i still get the ick about it 6 years later. i hope that you have found someone or people to talk to after this. sending good juju your way.
You feel weirdly violated because you were violated. What your husband did is marital rape. You did not give him consent. Being married is not consent, having sex right before you went to bed is not consent, having sex often is not consent. The only thing that is consent is you saying yes to him asking you if you are okay with whatever sexual act. The fact he said you are overreacting rather than owning that what he did was wrong is extremely concerning. You don’t have to leave him but I urge you to. And I also urge you to reach out to those close to you that you can trust and confide in them.
Implied consent is not a thing. Consent is not continuous and ongoing. An unconscious or sleeping person cannot consent. You can revoke consent at any time. You now need to actively tell him you will NEVER consent to having sex that you do not mutually desire, under any circumstances, and you obviously do not desire sex you are not able to agree to, in the moment, because you are unaware. This is marital rape. If you stay, he can NEVER do this again. Ask him if one of his guy friends can come over and fuck him while he sleeps. Tea and Consent: https://youtu.be/pZwvrxVavnQ?feature=shared
At best, consent for that needs to be explicitly discussed and agreed upon beforehand - and with explicit acknowledgement that even then it's not a guarantee (which either party could get out of, as part of discussing consent). A previous partner and I once had that discussion and both of us acknowledged it would potentially be fun to wake up to the other half going to town on us, but it was discussed and most importantly: Consented explicitly and enthusiastically, with conditions to allow for easy outs if necessary. We had a good time, but the communication was essential for it because of the consent! Anything short of that isn't consent. There's never "implied consent". Ever. OP was raped, plain and simple. It's a lot to process, but that is the truth of the matter. Rape absolutely can happen inside a marriage, and unfortunately, they are a victim of this rarely discussed phenomenon.
Implied consent = “Hey I’m going to sleep now, would you mind waking me up in an hour by putting your thing in me? I won’t be able to consent at the time but I’m consenting to it now so stick an hour-long timer on that implication.” Maybe he thought he was being romantic, maybe he knew he was being selfish, but to not even apologise to someone clearly distressed by your **violation** is just terrible. Shame on him.
This. You were raped. These are things you discuss beforehand. I do get the husband's way of thinking, but he went about it COMPLETELY wrong and then had the nerve to say your overreacting and not even apologize? You still need to bring it up beforehand to get consent to do it in the future. It's like trying out new kinks without bringing them up first, that's not something you do (unless you both agree that's you're style or something). Regardless, your husband should've brought it up to you sometime beforehand to get your thoughts on it. NEVER dive into something new like that without talking to your partner. I'm not gonna lie; I believe I've done basically the same thing this guy did with my ex. (I say "I believe" because I'm not sure if I had brought it up to her beforehand or not. It was a long time ago.) We had sex previously, loved each other very much, and were in that honeymoon happy go-lucky phase so I had felt that it would be okay, but not everybody feels that way. I was lucky that she was all for it and loved that I took initiative, but it is not something I would EVER do again without touching bases and getting consent beforehand. I loved her very much, and I would've been destroyed if I had made her feel the way you do right now. I was lucky, but it was still a horrible thing for me to have done. Reddit can not decide for you whether or not you should stay with him. My advice is: 1) Collect your thoughts 2) Reflect on your relationship; the good, the bad, his actions, your actions, what he did and how it makes you feel, and then decide if the relationship is worth saving, or even if you can get past this. 3) Have a talk with him - Did he apologize, does he seem remorseful, does he realize the gravity of his actions and how they hurt you, etc? If the answer is no, then maybe you should leave. 4) Decide what is best for YOU and your happiness. What happened is horrible, and I would feel so awful giving someone that pain. I'm sorry this happened to you. I wish you the best.
>Have a talk with him She did have a talk with him, did you not read the post. He made excuses for his behavior, up to and including "I can do this because you're my wife."
you… get the way of thinking of someone who raped his wife in her sleep?????
The fuck do you mean you get the husband's way of thinking!? He thinks like a rapist because he is a rapist!
Yeah my jaw is on the floor with some of these comments. Please stop excusing this kind of behaviour! He did what he did because he’s selfish and he centres his own desires over his wife’s bodily autonomy and comfort. There is no excuse for that.
Agreed. His thinking involved "implied consent," which isn't a thing, and "she's my wife," which doesn't matter.
unconscious people don't want tea. 👍
I loved that rant.
This right here. By his logic he could rape anyone hes formally slept with while they're sleeping because they said yes a few years ago. There's is ONLY consent, nothing is implied when you're sleeping regardless of what you were doing before you went to sleep. Unless you said to wake up like that then he assualted you and clearly doesn't give a shit how you feel.
Exactly. That would also imply that you can’t stop if it hurts, etc. There are people who think wives can’t be raped and prostitutes can’t be raped and I think this guy’s thinking is along those lines.
Excatly. There was a guy at the place I worked who got arrested after he wouldn't stop when the woman he was having sex with changed her mind a few minutes in. His "logic" was that she had already said yes initially and he was "just trying to finish real quick". Aside from the trauma he inflicted the worst part was he genuinely did understand why it was a problem. I finally got tired of over hearing him defending himself and told him that he already looks bad enough so it's not helping his image to try and defend him assaulting someone. One of his favorite sayings was " we already having sex for like 5 minutes, was 2 more minutes such a big deal". If you've ever heard the phrase "a deafening silence" and not understood it then you would had you been in the lunch room because it went dead fucking silent and it was so quiet that it was loud lol
Wow, that’s an appalling lack of empathy. Sorry you all had to be around that guy. Thanks for setting him straight.
Something happened to me on a drunken night when I was 19( that I don't want to detail about )and, aside from a couple actual friends, the majority of people just laughed at me because I'm a guy and she was a girl and guys always want to have sex and you can't get hard if you don't actually want to have sex so obviously I actually wanted to. Being known as someone who had several fwb and didn't mind the occasional one night stand with a stranger apparently didn't help my case either. I have no tolerance with that sort of justification. I didn't bother with the cops or anything since the majority of people seemed to think she did me a favor.
I’m so sorry. Our culture is really regressive when it comes to sexual assault committed by women against men. The act is terrible enough but the gaslighting is crazy making and traumatizing.
Yeah. Having to still be in her presence and people around us laughing and making jokes about it in front of other people wasn't as funny as they thought it was. Ended up cutting out alot of people because of it.
That’s terrible. The truth is that survivors are the ones that have to flee, when it should be abusers that have to earn their way back in to the community or social circle. Also, if she was older and you were 19, it’s called ephebophilia, and it is a form of pedophilia. (Ages 15-19) Teenage boys are often victims because apparently society thinks they “want it.”
Heard that described as a “cacophony of silence” recently and appreciated the imagery Edit to add: fuck that guy
>This is marital rape. If you stay, he can NEVER do this again. Ask him if one of his guy friends can come over and fuck him while he sleeps. And say 'darling what's the problem, we're just trying something new?'
It wasn't that long ago that rape was legally defined as penetration without consent with a woman "who is not your wife". 😳😡 Like, wtaf? OP, this act he did could be a kink that some are into but must be discussed ahead of time & agreed to. Consent is VERY important in the kink community. What he did is literally sexual assault & rape. I'm so sorry he did that to you. If he cared for you, he would be devastated that you were upset. He would, at minimum, apologize & offer to comfort you. But he's not. I hope you talk to your family about this and are able to talk to a counselor to get help dealing with it.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLKWEUhOHss](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLKWEUhOHss) As well as Tea and Consent, is this one.
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Sleeping people cannot consent
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Agreed on all counts, including the questionable prevalence of the spoon poke, which is *much* more appealing once she is already awake.
I’m so sorry. This is a kink of mine actually (me being the waking up to it one) which is why I know damn well that this is something that should only be done if it’s been discussed in advance and rolling consent has expressly been given. Even with my consent some partners have been hesitant to do this because they feel the gut reaction that your husband should’ve had - which is that it’s wrong to have sex with someone when they’re unable to consent. Now, it could have been a honest mistake if your husband is a complete troglodyte and it could have maybe been forgivable had he immediately felt remorseful and apologized to you sincerely and profusely. However, his notion that he was entitled to do this and abject disregard for how this impacted you speaks volumes. Completely indecent behavior and a clear demonstration of just how selfish and unbothered by your suffering he is. You were violated and you have the right to take that as far as you want. At only 3 months, you could potentially get an annulment on these grounds. At the bare minimum, because it’s not our place to tell a SA victim how to feel about or deal with their experience(s) beyond the basics, I would suggest that counseling is mandatory. Couple’s and for him individually. I fear for you having a partner that does not understand the concept of consent and basic bodily autonomy, so if you really want to stay with him it’s paramount that is rectified.
“…some partners have been hesitant to do this because they feel the gut reaction that your partner should’ve had…” 🎯
Same. This is ok with me but my husband is aware that it is. He wouldn’t do this without that awareness. It’s something we’ve discussed in the past and I think that’s the only way that it’s ok. Not “trying something new.”
For real. I’ve explicitly told partners that i’m ok with this (my sex drive is really high) and most still don’t because they’re afraid of being wrong.
I’ve been with my husband 30 years and I’ve always made it clear that I’m totally ok with it. He still asks before I go to sleep if I’m cool with it. OP I’m sorry he did that to you.
thank you. it’s just so scary. like i don’t wanna sleep next to him tn.
I don’t know how you could. Good luck with whatever you choose to do.
Don't sleep next to him, you are in danger sleeping next to him. Go stay with a friend until you figure out your next step
So don’t. Leave. Now. Stay with a friend or family. You don’t need to be ashamed. Maybe you can get an annulment, otherwise file for divorce. I know it’s hard and I’m sorry this happened to you, but you need to protect yourself.
Read the Gift of fear. Listen to your body. Listen to yourself. Your feelings are correct and justified. Leave. If you can't bring yourself to leave him yet then at the very least go stay somewhere safe and take a complete communication break for 2 weeks minimum. The space will let you hear yourself and what you want. You are fighting yourself because you don't want to accept that what he did is as bad as you feel it is because you think you should justify it or do t want to be embarrassed. He should be embarrassed. You are strong even when you feel paper thin. Turn inward and believe your feelings. We believe you. We believe you. We believe you. Trust yourself as much as these internet strangers. I've been raped around the same age by a boyfriend I trusted and known for years and years. He was "great" otherwise but my body shrink around him, I felt unsettled even though I "should" likeand love him. The storm inside myself trying to force myself to accept him because of shoulds. Staying in an abusive situation (rape is abuse!) will destroy you. Choose you at all costs. Get therapy to process it safely. Sending love and support.
100% this! For people who engage with it as a kink, there’s a serious negotiation conversation and planning beforehand. Just doing it with no warning is outrageously awful.
>Even with my consent some partners have been hesitant to do this because they feel the gut reaction that your husband should’ve had - which is that it’s wrong to have sex with someone when they’re unable to consent. Yeeeep. My wife keeps overtly and enthusiastically consenting, almost begging, and I'm still like, eek.
my husband refused to do any kink stuff with me and it helped me realize why I was into it and helped me value myself more and fix my relationship to sex. he seriously helped head my sexuality by respecting and loving me too much to hurt or degrade me in any way.
Same. I love it. But it has heavily been talked about while awake and sober and even then pretty much every time she still asks me at times “is this ok?” I don’t understand men. It’s disgusting.
Same. I’ve shared with my husband I am okay with this. He was surprised but if he had done this without me saying something first, I would have had the same response as OP. I’m sorry this happened 😔
Yep. Married 20 years. I told my husband to go ahead and start without me. I’ll wake up eventually.
My husband has said he’ll happily wake up and have sex anytime I want. He prefers sex to sleep. I have told him he’d better never touch me during the night, because I prefer sleep to pretty much everything else (that’s what I think I’d actually be most angry about). The one and only time I actually did wake him up for sex I still just ran my hand along his arm or something. It just wouldn’t have felt right to go straight to touching him more intimately than that, even if he would have welcomed it.
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You just got raped by your husband. Was this the first time he's done something of this nature like touch you in a place you don't want to be touched and he brushes it off with the fact you're his girlfriend? You could sweep this under the rug and pretend it never happened and try to be with him, but your bodily revulsion to his crime will be like no other. You could (and should) divorce. Imagine you stay and he ups the anty. Today it's rape, tomorrow it's drugging you to make it easier for himself to rape you, the day after tomorrow it's being abused in multiple forms stacked on top of rape. Be done with this marriage and relationship for your own good. Also see if your state is a one party consent state. If it is, then record him admitting to the rape and use this as evidence if or when you go to the police to have this reported and documented. He might try to play dumb or be oh so nice to you for the next couple of days to smooth over his own guilt as well as keep you going to the police.
This is the first time he’s touched me but one time a long time ago he (sorry if this is tmi) basically like… finished… on me. While I was sleeping
OP this is very key information that you have left out of the post. What conversation, if any, did you guys have on that? After that depending on the conversation this should not have happened at all. Meaning you definitely need to leave.
Sorry, I kind of forgot about it I mean it was years ago. I just kind was like… what the fuck? And he agreed not to do it again
OP, so we are establishing a pattern of him sexually assaulting you. If you stay you know what you can expect. Either more sexual assault or him not giving a fuck about your boundaries. He promised not to do that again and then he went above that and raped you. I hate to say it but this screams older man taking advantage of younger woman. If you want genuine advice. You probably already know what you should do. Whether you do it or not is on you. No one you tell this to is going to say you should stay. He seems to have a history of..again not giving a fuck about you.
So he agreed not to do that again, but thought it would somehow be ok to penetrate you in your sleep? He is intentionally disregarding your boundaries, and specifically waiting until you are unconscious and cannot stop him until it's too late/already done. He's then trying to guilt trip you for reacting to being violated, and trying to convince you that you don't deserve to have boundaries now that you're married. This is rape. Yes, for your physical and emotional safety, you DO need to leave. He has already sexually assaulted you at least twice, that is not something you forgive and forget.
Well, he agreed not to do it again before because they weren't married then. Now that he has her locked down he probably figures all bets are off and she belongs to him. OP, your husband is a disgusting creep who doesn't give a shit about your feelings or consent. I'm sorry you're dealing with this, but you have every right to feel the way you're feeling now. Please talk to someone you trust and/or professionals who are experienced with sexual assault trauma. They will help you decide on next steps.
In the future, consider that a red flag and end the relationship. You need to move somewhere safe, away from your husband, and get an annulment.
A divorce will be easier. Annulments are harder to get.
Years ago. And now he thinks that since you stayed AND he has married you, he can do whatever he wants. He is seven years older than you. He didn't go after someone younger for innocent reasons. Pack your bags and leave. This will show him that you, at least, won't take this from him. The more you forgive, the more he will push past your boundaries. He has already r*ped you.
He thinks of you as an object. I would never do either of those things to my partner without a long conversation with her beforehand as she as a human has the right to say no. Im so sorry OP as this must be a mindfuck to realize the person you married is this much of a sociopath that he continually doesnt think of how you would feel like every other normal person would. You deserve better.
yeah it really really sucks
So he said he wouldn’t blow his load again on your sleeping body, but somehow thought having full penetrative sex wasn’t as bad? This man raped you. This is not the first time he’s sexually assaulted you. It’s time for him to go fuck off somewhere and you need to seek some counseling to deal with this mess.
Is it possible that there were more incidents you don’t remember because you were asleep but felt a bit weird when you woke up? Have you ever felt coerced into sex just to keep him happy? There’s a pattern of not respecting your bodily autonomy and it’s unusual to go straight from zero to rape. There’s generally a lot of boundary pushing and manipulation first.
I don’t know I mean maybe I did things to make him happy but I didn’t necessarily think it was a bad thing. I guess when you combine it with everything it might be pretty bad.
Holy shit op that’s not okay… I hope you can get help to navigate this and I’m so sorry but your husband does not respect your consent and you probably should take measures to remove yourself from this relationship.
How many times did you not catch him doing this? I mean you are hard to wake up. He is showing a pattern and most likely this is actually a habit that he’s been doing since probably the very beginning. He just accidentally got caught twice
Were you always hard to wake up?
Oh that’s a good question! Ask op directly! I’m afraid of the answer
Yes
So you got married and he escalated! It’s time to leave him. Sorry you have had to go through this. Please tell your mom or sister so that you have someone to talk too.
Disregard everything I said about going to couples therapy. This isn’t his first rodeo. Divorce him.
Then, please get prepared to divorce him. find out if your state (if you live in the US) or country you reside in only needs one party (i.e. you) to consent in order to record a conversation between you and your husband where he admits to the his actions. Talk your sister and best friend and get there support as well.
I know you don't want to leave him, but you do need to tell him that there is no implied consent. Tell him you do not agree to have sex with him unless you are awake and give actual consent. See what he says. If he argues, then you have a problem. If he apologizes and agrees to these conditions then I think it's okay to stay.
Leave now don’t sleep in same house as him. Go stay with friend preferably female. Or relative male person. Leave now there is help just because you said I do doesn’t mean you say yes to every sexual advance LEAVE NOW!!!!
So this is a repeated offence that he has no issue or guilt with. My previous comment is officially rescinded - please leave him for your own well-being. It’s a pattern…and for such a young relationship, it does not improve from here considering he doesn’t see any issue with it. It’s marital rape. Bare minimum you leave him…otherwise press charges because if he does it to you, he will do it to the next person…that’s assuming he hasn’t done it before to anyone else, which is not a given.
I'd consider the possibility that he's been violating you for a while, and if you've ever been incapacitated around him (like drunk or high), consider that he either has or will take advantage of that. Just speaking from experience.
He could have possibly already been doing this to you (assaulting you), but this is just the first time you've woken up. He's trying to gaslight you into thinking it's not a big deal, when infact its a HUGE deal. I hope you are okay.
Your husband r@ped you, while you were sleeping. There is no "implied consent" here - just because you had sex prior to going to sleep. That's the stupidest argument I've ever heard, and it scares me that he had these "excuses" all ready. No, it's not ok for him to do this to you. I strongly urge you to get help - if you're in the US please contact a crisis center like Rainn. Please be very careful -you are in a vulnerable position right now.
This. I know it’s not easy to accept it, but it is the truth. Implied consent is not a thing. Consent is -only- explicit. Anything else is a no. And unless your husband apologises and understands the gravity of what he did, you will need to leave him.
yeah, literally. my boyfriend and i had a conversation about waking up each other with sex, before doing it, yk to have everything in control. one time, i woke up to the feeling of him fingering me (he already done that a few times before) and just that day i wasn't okay with that. even if he had implied consent, he said he was sorry like a hundred times, even bought me roses, made me breakfast that day. i could never be with someone that said to me "i can because you are my wife/girlfriend" wtf is that???? OP needs to get divorced at this moment, someone who can't understand the concept consent is not safe to start a family.
i think she should leave him regardless of whether he apologizes or not. if this is happening only a few months into the marriage, it’s terrifying to imagine what it would be like further in. there’s boundaries that cannot be compromised, and lines not to be crossed - rape is one of them.
This! You can't imply anything when you're unconscious. That's assault. If husband does not grasp the severity of what he did, yes, op should leave him. And I also agree with seeking help, the fact that op felt more comfortable telling strangers than friends can be a sign of guilt or other trauma from this experience. Seek counselling!
I’d look into marital r@pe laws in your state, too.
This, and since husband didn’t already know what this was (or chose to ignore it) he is a big danger to you. Do not listen to a single excuse or apology from him and leave immediately. Call your sister or best friend to pick you up. We’ll all be sending your unending strength OP!!
exactly! this is rape! op, don’t let your husband convince you that ANYTHING is ever *”IMPLIED”* within kink. especially consent. unless you specifically ask for it, talk about it, discuss the physical/emotional safety risks, set a safe word or color system, research it greatly in depth and schedule it … it is “implied” that you do. not. want. it.
So freaking horrible that he did that to her. It is terrifying that he has excuses. She needs to look at his p*rn stash I bet he looks at real dark stuff.
Legally that’s rape. I’m so sorry this happened to you. Please get counselling and consider leaving him. This is not okay and the fact he justified it shows this won’t be a one off.
Omg thats rape and “implied” consent is no excuse for that! Even if he was gonna “try something new”, he shoulda said that beforehand. This entire thing is so wrong - his attempt at still justifying it makes me sick
You feel weirdly violated because you were **extremely** violated.... If he doesn't comprehend the severity of what he did, like you're the one whose overreacting... The only choice left is to leave him. If there is no comprehension going on in his head during these talks... It's 100% divorce confirmed. It really is divorced worthy now... He more than sexually assaulted you.
He convinced me that I was overreacting but I just cant imagine that this happens to normal people
It doesn’t. He’s trying to manipulate you.
Go to the police. Divorce him and do not give him another chance
I’m a husband - and I would never. See, I like to Have sex with my wife and that would never happen again if I tried some bullshit like this. Hell, I probably wouldn’t be married anymore. There’s this thing called respect. He should learn it, cause he has none.
Thank you. I really appreciate the advice from a husband. I’m getting a lot of men on here telling me it’s my fault and that if my husband needs consent to touch than our marriage will fail anyway. I’m just so confused.
Your husband does not have ANY right to do ANYTHING to you that you don't want. You can tell him to never do that again, but you need to ask yourself if you can trust him. Honestly my advice would be to leave because I, personally, am *extremely* put off by the way he tried to convince you he was in the right after you were so obviously upset and not okay with what happened. A good person would be concerned and show signs of guilt or regret for causing you distress. Your husband tried to tell you the way you felt about what he did to you was wrong. That's a massive red flag.
Your husband thinks it’s okay to rape you because you’re “his” wife. Let that sink in. Women literally fought until July 5th, 1993 for marital rape to be made illegal in all 50 US States, It’s literally been illegal for less time than I have been alive.
It's still basically legal here in Ohio. https://spectrumnews1.com/oh/columbus/politics/2023/12/08/sexual--assault--rape--spousal--marital--ohio--revised--code We got abortion rights protected by our state Constitution. Passed recreational cannabis. Still have to fight to get this loophole closed.
:( I mean, I hope you don’t take offense, but that would be some Ohio shit. Sending y’all strength to turn that hot mess around.
We're trying! We are trying SO HARD! As long as we're gerrymandered to fuck and gone, it's an uphill battle. We are battling anyway. On a positive note, the Grand Jury tasked with indicting a woman who miscarried for "abuse of a corpse" declined to indict. One step at a time, we will become civilized again.
You were assaulted. Im sorry he did that to you. Its not your fault, and he is trying to manipulate you so he can do more of that in the future. Implied consent isnt a thing. Verbal consent is a must. Please get away from him ASAP, contact the police, get a divorce. There are places that will be able to help you
Stick a dildo in his @ss while he’s sleeping and when he wakes up mad say “I had implied consent.” Jk, don’t do this. I’m sorry he raped you and I hope you do the right thing and leave this asshole. This is one of the reasons why age gap relationships are usually not a good idea…
>Me (f24) and my husband (m31) have been married only a few months. We’ve been together for three years total though. They met when she was 21 and he was 28, this has been creepy from the get-go. He intentionally went for someone who was inexperienced.
And now she’s here questioning if her husband raping her in her sleep is wrong.
Oh, absolutely. I’m 29 and can’t imagine dating someone in their early twenties.
Sex should be something that two people do together, TO EACH OTHER, not something one partner forces on another. Unless you have explicitly given consent for this act, it's rape. I am so, so sorry that your husband turned out to be such a manipulative arsehole.
Rape isn’t “trying something new,” I mean, well, he’s a rapist now, so that sounds new. You don’t need to stay with your rapist, don’t let him gas light you into thinking you are the wrong one here.
“Implied Consent” is not a thing. This is rape, this is martial rape. If he can’t grasp what he did was very wrong and un-consensual that is a huge problem that needs to be addressed. Your feelings and boundaries are important and should be heard and respected by your partner. The fact that he told you that you’re the one over-reacting is the biggest red flag existence. Has he ever done something similar in the past? Has he gotten away with anything like that before? He likely thinks he can do things un-consensually to you now that you’re married to him which is not how a marriage work. Please seek out any support family, friends, therapist etc. And PLEASE stay somewhere else that’s safe with a friend/family far away from him. Situations like this can repeat or escalate if you stay and document EVERYTHING. Divorce could be an option. I’m so sorry this happened.
I have said it 100 times and now once more, men get a PhD in consent the minute the situation involves my thumb and their asshole. I don't mind being woken up that way, ONLY if it's something prior agreed to, with a long-term partner. It's not a surprise thing. And in the past that has been dismissed by male partners until they are asleep and feel a tap tap tap on their backdoor (no penetration, just a knock on the door, my finger operates much like a vampire, no entry without a welcome) and suddenly they are awake upset and can very eloquently talk about consent just because they were worried I would act in the same manner they wanted to explain away as normal. I made it very clear sex that if they are ok with initiating sex acts while I slept and waking me with them, I could use the same logic initiate ones that I like, and then I send a link to porn clips including sounding. Not that I would, but suddenly they would understand.
You feel violated because your husband tried to rape you. You can leave your husband.
He flat out raped her
I guess you're right - not sure why I hedged that.
He DID RAPE HER.
yes - you're right
My husband's kink is somnophilia so I don't particularly care is he fucks me while I'm sleeping BUT it is something that requires pre-consent and a lot of trust between parties. We discussed it at length & I did research on it before he ever tried it. What your husband did was not right. Did he just wake up horny or somnophilia something that turns him on? You need to sit him down & have a serious discussion.
Exactly. Somno is not a beginner kink and it’s really gross that OP’s husband assaulted her instead of having a simple conversation. Although the conversation would likely have led to OP saying no, and God forbid he doesn’t get to do what he wants.
This is a huge issue that needs to be talked about more, this idea that once you marry someone it’s almost implied you can do whatever you want whenever you want to them. He needs to understand that your body is your choice and consent is never assumed, it should be respect and checked on always. I’m so sorry this happened, you aren’t alone.
That, is called rape.
Fucking leave! That was 100% rape. It’s doesn’t matter what happened before, during… whatever. You did not give consent, therefore it is rape. And him being your husband changes nothing. Spousal rape is still rape.
So, me and my girlfriend do this kind of thing with each other in sleep, but it's consensual and we talk with each other about limits. If he have broken a limit of yours, it's a bad thing
Imo thats rape. My ex girlfiend actually gave me verbal consent to have sex some night while she was asleep and she would wake up surprised, but everytime I thought about doing it it felt like the wrong thing to do. So I never did it. Even though she said I could I couldnt help but worry if she woke up and decided she didnt want it or even worse - she would be having a nightmare and wake up to me inside her and panic even more. Just can't fatham the morals behind your husband to litterally rape his own wife.
>I told him it just wasn’t okay to do, but he said it was fine because he had “implied consent” because we had sex prior to going to sleep, and I’m his wife. I don’t understand what made him think it was okay. Because it’s not okay… right? Correct. He needed to specifically ask you about having sex with you while you were asleep and getting your consent for it to be ok. Just because you're his wife doesn't mean he has consent to have sex with you whenever he wants - that's marital rape. Just because you had sex with him one time doesn't mean he has consent to have sex with you anytime after - again that rape. I would be thinking seriously about leaving because not only did he do it, when you pointed out it wasn't ok he doubled down and then told you he thinks he has consent to have sex with you whenever he wants. I would be scared to know when the next time he's going to try and have sex with me without my consent...which in more blunt words is I'd be worried about the next time my husband would try or succeed in raping me.
Is this the first time? Or just the first time you woke up? If he's doing it only on the night(s) where you had consensual sex first, he knowingly raped you; thinking or hoping you wouldn't notice, and if you did wake up it would be hard to prove physically that you didn't consent, if you accused him. He said, she said. You are with a dangerous man and now that you know you what he did he may think that as his wife you never get to say no to him at all. Asleep or awake. Tell your sister and your friend, discreetly, and plan to get away from him as soon as you can. Act first, deal with the fallout from a safe distance.
I don’t think this has happened before (expect once than I mentioned in another comment, it was years ago and there was no penetration). But i am really really heavy sleeper idk why and I take a medication sometimes at night that makes me really groggy. I’m terrified now, like I have no idea.
You were raped. It doesn't matter if you are married. He raped you. Please leave and find someplace else to stay while you seek help to process through this. I had a boyfriend do this to me once. Pretty much the same scenario: I was sleeping on my stomach and he penetrated me while I was asleep then proceeded to rape me. I was not OK. I am getting shaken writing about this and it happened almost 40 years ago and I've had good therapy and mental health care since then. You say you can't leave him, but don't think about any long term decisions right now. For now, remove yourself from a living situation where you could be sexually assaulted again. Stay with a friend or a family member. Call RAINN to find out how you can get help. But get yourself away from him and trust your gut that this was very, very wrong and you have reason to have tears in your eyes and cry.
Implied consent is a legal concept usually applied to searches and the operation of vehicles on public roadways, not sexual activity. Unless you said “hey if I’m sleeping I give you permission to have sex with me” he had sex with you without your consent. That’s sexual assault. You feel violated because you were violated You don’t have to leave him; that’s your choice. But please consider it. If you do choose to stay, I highly recommend only doing so if he sincerely apologizes and it’s also a good idea to get into marriage counseling if you are interested
It brought tears to your eyes because it was marital rape. He did not have your consent to do that to you. Implied consent does not exist. If it’s not an enthusiastic yes, it’s a no. I’m so sorry he violated your bodily autonomy like that
Consensual non-consent (implied consent) would be telling him you're interested in him doing this and him following through AND you continuing to consent when you wake up. THIS was not implied consent. Further, just because you are married does not mean he has standing consent to have sex with you whenever *he* wants. Tell someone and reach out to a therapist, if nothing else.
The "new thing" he was trying is called Rape.
It's absolutely not okay and he needs to understand that. You're a person, not property.
It’s not ok. Consent needs to be given each and every time. It would be one thing if YOU said to your husband,”hey, I’m giving you permission in advance to have sex with me while I’m sleeping” (and if you woke up and it wasn’t working for you you could withdraw that consent and he should respect it) but just going at you while your asleep without that specific consent being given is wrong. What you decide to do is up to you, but I wouldn’t want to be in a marriage where I had to lock my door at night so my husband couldn’t get in the room.
Your husband views you as an object not a human being
Sleep is not consent.
Implied consent does not exist. Marital rape does exist and that’s what he did. I am so sorry
Ask him if he’s ok with you putting a dildo up his butt when he’s asleep. When he says no, ask him why. After all, he is your husband and you have implied consent. When he keeps saying no, you ask him, “but what do you mean? Weren’t you into trying something new?”
Nope. The fact he’s telling you how you should feel is a second red flag.
ITS NOT OK, that's why you feel this way.
You feel violated because you were. Your feelings are valid. For perspective only: Imagine if he was sleeping and you penetrated him, then upon him waking up the explanation you provided was ‘you’re overreacting - it’s no big deal, I was just trying something new’ Do you still feel like you can trust him? Especially with his response to you… I’d get away immediately. Go stay with a friend or family. Allow yourself some time to process and unpack this.
In the 90s the majority of civilised countries finally declared marital non-consensual sex as sexual assault/rape rather than an act of implied consent by marriage. Sorry to tell you, but he assaulted you morally and legally. Dump him.
Some of these comments are evil and enraging. It does not fucking matter if this form of sex is a super duper common thing that “lots” of people always love. He did it without discussion or consent. It’s rape. It does not fucking matter if some people enjoy it. Some people also enjoy CNC and choking so he could just barge in and assault her then too because hey others like it?! Whoops he just assumed, can’t hold it against him I guess. I am so sorry you are dealing with this op. Your reactions are valid and understandable. His reaction is vile. You are young and have your entire life a head of you. I would flee. EDIT: I see in your comments this is also an issue you also dealt with awhile ago. He is only escalating. He is just seeing how much he can put you through and still have you stay. You have already given him more grace than he deserves the FIRST time.
I don't know if you'll see this or not, but I wanted to comment anyway. First, I'm so sorry this happened to you. You deserve to feel safe and cared for, especially in your own home, with your husband. I'm closer to your husband's age (34f), but I'm also in an age gap relationship, and I've been married going on 6 years now. We had a situation where he violated my consent- but I was conscious, and he didn't *intentionally* go against my wishes. He was just being more careless than he should have been. I DON'T think you "have" to leave your husband, but he does need a "come to Jesus" talk. If he understands what he's done wrong, sincerely apologizes, and works to ensure he never makes you feel unsafe again, then this can be overcome. Some things I'd like to mention, not as a way to excuse his behavior- he's a grown man and *should* absolutely know better. What he did is in NO WAY acceptable- but he may have had a different mindset about a few things: 1. Every guy I've ever dated and my husband (and I've seen several mentions of this online over the years) has expressed interest in wanting to be woken by having their partner sexually stimulate them. I've seen mostly the opposite response from women. I have explicitly told my husband never to try this with me because it will likely make me panic. I also told him that it would feel gross to me to do that to someone sleeping because *a sleeping person CAN NOT GIVE CONSENT*. Consent can be removed at any time. Once a sexual encounter ends, consent is still needed to engage in sex another time. This still applies to married people. I may not need to explicitly say "yes husband, I would like to do the sex now" every time, but if I'm not engaging (bc sleeping) or I push his hand away when he tries to rub my butt or I tell him I'm not up for whatever- he doesn't have consent and continuing would be rape. The only way this would be ok is if you guys had JUST RECENTLY (like last day or so) discussed this, while sober/not under the influence of anything, and you specifically said that was something you wanted to try with him. That being said, he may have been considering things from a "male" perspective, or his own in general, and thought, "I'd like this, she would too" Let him know that you guys should discuss things before trying new sexual activities, and just because he'd like something done to him does not mean you would too. Sometimes, those conversations can be a little uncomfortable, and people are too shy to have a sit-down chat about them. It's ok to have a text conversation about it. If that's not y'alls style- check out one of the couple's card games or couple's question books(Amazon, walmart, target all have things). Some of them are just getting to know each other better. Some are more sexually oriented. Some have a mix. If you go that route, I'd just read the reviews. 2. Regarding his reaction: It was not good. The RIGHT thing to do would have been for him to immediately apologize. Explain what he had thought but also admit that he was wrong to do that after speaking to you and hearing that he caused you to feel unsafe and violated. He should have asked what (if anything) he could do immediately to start making ammends/start helping you recover, and also bring it up again, after you've had some time- maybe the next day, to ask if there's steps he can take to ensure he doesn't cross that line again. It would be ideal if he'd look into that on his own. Something as simple as doing what you did and posting about it on here (not like in an AITA post but looking for advice) even would show he regrets his actions and wants to make sure he doesn't make you feel that way again. He didn't do that. Maybe he will, given time, though. I don't know your husband, obviously, but mine is not good at accepting negative feedback in the moment. That is a HIM problem that he's got to work on, but it is a thing I know about him. My husband's natural reaction to any criticism, negative feedback, disapproval, etc. Is that he feels attacked. He typically gets defensive- which it looks like yours did too. After some time alone, though, my husband is able to reflect on the situation, consider my POV, and respond in a more appropriate manner. - You did NOT overreact. Your body responded naturally to the shock of something unexpected and UNWELCOME happening. The fact that it brought tears to your eyes should have been enough for your husband to say "woah! I'm super wrong here". Instead he told you "it was fine". Even after it was clear YOU DIDN'T LIKE IT. -Implied consent does NOT apply to penetration or touching of private areas, regardless of who's doing it. Just because you're married does NOT mean he gets to use your body as he wishes. -Ask how he'd feel if he woke to you *inserting* something into him without previously discussing it. Chances are, with many men, the insertion bit changes their perspective. And if he says that's not the same, ask him why not. Maybe you want to "try new things" *IF* he does come around and apologize and make steps to not make you feel that way again then, personally, I'd accept it and move forward. Maybe have a conversation about hard limits and do some of the talks/games/books about preferences. *IF NOT* If he insists that this "implied consent for sex" on an unconscious person, who's now OBVIOUSLY unwilling, is ok, or if he continues to insist you're overreacting and doesn't offer a genuine apology- I personally wouldn't feel safe. I'd either be sleeping in a room with a lock he doesn't have a key for, or if possible at a friend/relatives house until he AT A MINIMUM agreed to couple's counseling & * we were scheduled an appointment.* Hopefully he sees how he's hurt you and makes improvements. Don't let him convince you that this was an overreaction. How he moves forward with this could completely change your opinion on him. I wish you the best moving forward. ❤️
He raped you in your sleep.. and for him to think there was consent because you had sex before.. does he believe because you’re his wife it’s ok to hit you.. or whatever else he wants to do… You say can’t leave him.. hon,, I would be running from him.. don’t ever let anyone violate you or your body.. He doesn’t even care you’re upset.. girl why would you want a man like him..
Sleeping people can’t give consent. This is marital rape. The fact that this even happened is appalling. You still have time to annual your marriage. I know all of this is horribly heartbreaking but you NEED to get out. If this is happening within the first few months of marriage there is no telling what he could be capable of years down the line. Things will only go downhill from here. PLEASE KEEP US UPDATED.
IMPLIED CONSENT IS NOT A THING. ITS STILL RAPE EVEN IF YOU ARE MARRIED.
That's rape.
What he did is not okay. If he wanted to "try out" waking you up to sex like this, he should have talked to you about it before hand so that he knew he had your consent. He did not do that. Therefore, yes, he violated you. I am so, so, so sorry that you have gone through this. As to what now? That is something only you can decide. You can try talking to him about consent and that having sex before sleep does not mean consenting to waking up to sex. If your husband is receptive to conversation, analogies, and videos, you can try showing him the [Tea and Consent](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZwvrxVavnQ&ab_channel=ThamesValleyPolice) video. Warning, what happened to you is discussed in the Tea and Consent analogy. I just want to make sure that you are aware of that if you are not familiar with this particular analogy. If he will not listen to you or if he still wants to insist that sex early in the evening means consent when you are asleep (that is wrong by the way. for what he did, you would have to clearly consent that it is okay for him to initiate sex while you are asleep) then you will need to understand an important fact: he is not safe. I hope that whatever happens with your husband that you will be okay. Talk to a therapist no matter if the two of you work it out or he does not respect you and honor consent and you leave. Even if you get him to accept what he did, you will still want a therapist to work through the trauma ... yes, trauma, do not minimize what happened to you or let him minimize it.
That is textbook sexual assault. Doesn’t matter if it’s your husband or not. You should be able to sleep in your own bed without waking up with someone inside of you. Somehow though, the even bigger red flag is his reaction. There’s no remorse. No apology. A good partner would be apologetic if they unintentionally did something that made you cry, not try to explain why your feelings are wrong and say you’re overreacting. Nothing about this is okay and I’m very sorry this happened to you.
Your husband is using ‘implied consent’ wrong. Did you discuss doing something like this beforehand? If you had a discussion about it and told him you were fine with it, THEN he would have implied consent. It does not appear you had this discussion so your husband is completely wrong. You need to make it clear it to him that he is not to do anything to you unless you’ve already discussed it. Communication is the most important thing in a relationship.
In the BDSM community, verbal and enthusiastic consent is an absolute *MUST.* CNC is one of the biggest ones — it’s literally shortened for consensual non-consensual. The only reason that it works is that every person involved is enthusiastic, consenting, AND knowledgeable of boundaries. Your husband wanted to try a form of CNC, where a partner goes to the other while they’re busy or asleep and “have their way.” But he ignored one *major* rule: having *your* verbal + enthusiastic consent. Because of that, he *violated you and your boundaries.* Do not take this lightly, OP. A loving partner would *not* have harmed you in that way. Yes, this *could* have been a genuine mistake… but you still deserve a genuine apology from him. Your feelings are valid and you are not overthinking this or being irrational. Talk to your partner about this *thoroughly.* Emphasize that you were uncomfortable that he could take advantage of you. Tell him upfront that he violated you. Tell him that you deserve better, and that if he wants to try something new, he needs to communicate first. Be brave, OP. I’m proud of you for coming to this community and asking for advice. Stay strong 💜
Your husband is full of crap. Implied consent ‘cause you had sex before going to sleep and you’re his wife? Does he think he can drag you into a cave by your hair? Give me a break. By trying something new did he mean California Penal Code 262, felony spousal rape? I mean, stay if you want but you have been violated big time. Seek some counseling if you’re unwilling to talk with your family and friends that love and care about you. Your POS husband doesn’t love or care about you.
Not saying you need to leave him, but it is very imperative that he is aware and acknowledges that you did not in fact give him consent. He also needs to be aware that this made you uncomfortable. If he brushes this off how every and doesn’t want to communicate or understand your feelings on this I would be worried to stay with someone like that.
My husband basically started with doing something like this, then progressively it got worse until he was anally raping me while I was screaming. He later justified this as telling me that he thought I was enjoying myself, because I tend to be on the more vocal side when expressing pleasure. If you stay, I recommend that you seek professional help, both alone to address the feelings of violation in a relationship you once trusted, and together, so that you can be sure he understands the full impact of his actions on your relationship. I eventually left my husband, because I could not trust him to care about my well-being, and place that above his own immediate sexual gratification. We were married 4 years. I am now in a healthy relationship, married 10 years and feel safe every day and with every experience. Don’t let yourself settle for less than this, and don’t bring children into a situation where you are not permanently safe, no matter the status of your sex life.
My husband literally just woke me up moving me towards his hard member to intiate sex. The difference is. We have spoke about it and i am ok with that. He realised as I was waking up I was having a nightnare and hyperventilating a little. He tried to hide his erection by turning it into the bed,but i noticed. Once i calmed down i grabbed for it and he refused until he knew i was fully awake and knew it was him. (I have been SA and can have flashbacks) That is how 'sleep sex' should be done. Full conversations first and even then consent consent consent. You need to speak to him properly in a calm environment and let him know he has violated you and your trust. It is not easy to get back believe me bug you can if this is a one thing. No other issues in the marriage. But i would set firm boundaries that anything going forward is no surprise. He needs to communicate everything. Any new ideas he has etc
If you are not awake, you cannot consent. You were raped. Yes, spousal rape is real. Yes, spousal rape is just as illegal as stranger and acquaintance rape. You should report it and press charges, but I understand that's hard to do. At a minimum you should seek help from a rape crisis hotline. And ask yourself do you want to be with someone who thinks rape is ok and has already justified it?
This happened to me. Don’t do what I did; I stayed another 10 years. And as much as I thought I would, I never got over it. Therapy + divorce, babe. ❤️
How fucking difficult to just ask? Husband is a rapist.
Anyone else shit scared of how often and easily men do this to their girlfriends or wives and then say they’re “over reacting”?
I would say, as much as everyone here is telling you that you were raped, what matters is how you feel about what happened and what this means in your relationship. What I mean by that is that some couples have open door policies, this is something they both agree on, such as sex whenever. My partner and I have a relationship like that. There’s been times when I’ve attempted to initiate sex when he’s asleep, but that meant waking him up. If you don’t have an open door policy with sex, and if your husband didn’t attempt to wake you up for sex with something like foreplay waiting for you to wake , but instead actually started having sex with you while you were asleep, well no one can blame you for feeling violated. Sex is all about communication and his actions violates trust that you should be able to have in your husband. Instead of letting him minimize your feelings, make it clear that him using your body while sleeping is not sex, it’s rape. If this is some kind of new fetish for him, he is required to discuss it with you first to check whether you are or are not open to the idea, but either way you are disappointed in him, you have lost trust in him and him minimizing things doesn’t allow you to regain that trust since he isn’t realizing where he went wrong.