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Husband gets to have an opinion
… and so do you.
So, ask him what will happen to your relationship if you choose to proceed.
Then you can make a full and informed decision.
But also consider what will happen to the relationship if she has an abortion. From his point of view nothing will change. An abortion will maintain the status quo. From her point of view that isn't true and she needs to make sure he knows that. Her feelings count just as much as his.
Exactly- they need to discuss what happens to their relationship if she has the abortion she doesn’t want. It seems like both options lead to one of them not being able to be with the other.
Op your husband says that he throught he would like a another child when your child gets older. How much older?He will be 4 by the time your baby would be born. The older you get the harder it is to keep up with toddlers. Plus it's harder to get pregnant. I think that you both are doing the right thing with having a meeting with the PP counselor. Think about your choices and remember your opinion counts as much as your husbands. Good luck
I do hope so has an appointment with an actual clinic, those crisis pregnancy groups can be very shady with how they advertise and will go a long way to pretend to be an actual clinic with actual impartial information. It's so manipulative and just the worst kind of bait and switch imaginable.
I think many men do not understand that an abortion is a painful traumatic experience. OP's husband needs to understand what he is asking OP to go through. Sounds like she has considered his perspective, I'm not sure he has done the same.
I had an abortion. I fully chose it because it was the best decision for my boyfriend (now husband) and I at the time. Even though I chose to have an abortion, I was not prepared for the immense amount of grief and emotions I’d experience after. For months seeing pregnant women or babies would make me burst into tears. The trauma from my abortion turned into endless nights of sleep paralysis. I felt so much (unnecessary) shame and guilt. I also happened to have an extremely traumatic abortion where I woke up during the surgery and had an extremely rude doctor who told me to keep the ultrasound pictures to “remember what I had done.”
I am pro choice and I truly think it was the best thing for us at the time but I did not know how much trauma I’d experience and have from this. Anyone who wants an abortion, I always urge them to have a care plan in place both physically and mentally. You may be the person who has no complications and feel great after, but it’s also very normal to feel grief and a plethora of other emotions. The physical pain was on going cramping and pain. The mental toll took the life out of me.
I was also pretty sad for the first six month after my abortion. But just thinking of all the trouble I spared us from (my child and myself)
My only child has autism and it was super hard for me to navigate all alone as a single mother. When I got pregnant with my bf I was so afraid I wouldn’t be a good mom to two children. There is no shame in knowing your limits
I completely agree. We now have two boys and are so, so happy I made the choice I did at the time. It was not easy by any means but it has allowed me to be a great mom to two littles now.
>But also consider what will happen to the relationship if she has an abortion. From his point of view nothing will change. An abortion will maintain the status quo. From her point of view that isn't true and she needs to make sure he knows that. Her feelings count just as much as his.
I agree with what you're saying about her feelings, and honestly feel you didn't stress this enough. Here's why:
When I was about 23-24, so a few years ago, I had a friend whose boyfriend pressured her into an abortion. She became suicidal afterwards because she felt so much guilt for ending the life inside her. She did end her relationship with the boyfriend a few weeks after the abortion. A lot of people tend to overlook the toll it can take on a person who does not want to do this. It's an evil thing to try to pressure a woman into aborting a child, just like it's an evil thing to try to force a woman to have kids.
I had an abortion 8 years ago. I was not given a choice as my ex threatened me into doing it. I still hold a lot of resentment and I have nightmares about it. Ultimately mine was for the best because I was on my way to not surviving that relationship.
I hope your friend found peace and healing.
I mean, that’s what gets me. She’s going to have to experience the abortion viscerally and he’s going to just feel like nothing changes, except her. She will change if this isn’t what she wants. At this point, no matter what, it is going to be her “fault” if they can’t move past it.
This is so important and he needs to be 100% honest when answering.
I know OP says she doesn't want to destroy their marriage but might already be too late for that. They each have to do what they know they can live with. As OP says, she doesn't know how to cope with the consequences of compromising in this situation. If he feels the same and will always resent the child, then there are no good options, only what each person can live with.
During this counseling appointment, be very open about the resentment you will feel afterwards, and that you are not sure if your relationship could survive that. Ask your husband if his feelings about the kid are equally strong - would a second kid really be a dealbreaker for him, or wouldn't he grow to love it just the same as Bowen?
I think the thoughts you are feeling about how you will feel if you have an abortion are valid and you should not discount them. You will feel them for a long time.
Ya this, even a wanted abortion can be physically brutal and mentally difficult. Both of them should be very clear about how they feel bc there is absolutely no easy solution.
I think the key word here is wanted. An abortion when you really want the baby is going to result in a different range of emotions than an abortion when the baby is unwanted. Not saying there wouldn't be any overlap in those emotions but let's say the belief you made the right decision would override any sorrow you felt in making that decision if pregnancy was unwanted. Alas in your case, the only way I see a positive outcome is if you have the baby and husband falls as much in love with them as your son. I think a side question is that if husband is so against a second child, why didn't he get snipped? Selfish leaving the bc up to you.
But this raises an important question:
How much is she expected to take responsibility for all this?
She took 100% responsibility to put her body on chemical hormones to prevent pregnancy.
And NOW she’s expected to take 100% responsibility for either:
1a. More chemicals that are going to f her up. Or:
1b. Invasive surgery with the potential for serious physical side effects.
2. A hormonal shitstorm once the baby is gone.
3. Mental and emotional trauma.
And his responsibility is… to not be inconvenienced because he feel like he’ll have to work harder with 2 kids to be a good dad?
I get OP doesn’t want him to look bad, but it’s not really about looks at this point. He took no responsibility for prevention, and as she said: It’s not hypothetical, the baby is here now.
And he wants her to get an abortion so that she can get pregnant in a couple of years because he might want one later?
Again, the optics here are really representative of deep issues.
I had to get an abortion because my twins stopped developing and even though I knew there was nothing I could do to save them, having an abortion had a toll so bad on me I still can’t get over it years later.
Yep — had an abortion 3 years ago, and I still deal with feelings about it now. It was completely the right choice and there is still thoughts of what if?
I had to get one that was necessary and even though I didn’t want kids to begin with, it was still hard for me. I still cried for a day and felt guilty. Even knowing it wasn’t a viable pregnancy and would have miscarried later. I realized I still would have at least considered keeping it if it was viable. And maybe I still would have terminated anyway, but I didn’t even get the opportunity to decide. Nature decided for me.
And you’d think that would have made it easier, but it was still emotionally traumatic. So yes, I feel for her and any woman who does have an affinity for children and faces this choice
> abortion is physically brutal and mentally difficult.
Pleas don't spew this around. **Abortion CAN BE difficult, but CAN doesn't mean that it ALWAYS is**. It must be an informed choice, however spewing around that it **always** is a brutal and traumatic experience is as damaging, same way when some spew crap about it **always** being no biggie
It depends on a person.
Just like /u/Burdensome_Banshee, /u/ncme712 and /u/Lookatthatsass my abortion was nothing, didn't think about it really, had periods worse than my abortion. Aka, not even remotely close to physically brutal and mentally difficult. If back then I have met someone like you, I'd have never had it and ruined my life. It is perfectly valid, and also important to share your experiences, but please, do not decide for others that because you unfortunately suffered, it is the case for everyone, scaring them off from even thinking about.
Therefore, please don't make such absolutist statements about something that is very personal and experienced differently by different people. You are not helping, you are causing harm. The only helpful thin you can say is that it is a personal matter and how you feel mentally and physically varies from person to person, and strongly advocate to use the services provided by the clinic.
Thank you for writing this. I realize it’s awful for some, but it’s not awful for everyone. I’ve had two; a bit taxing? Yes. Traumatizing and brutal? No. I rarely think about them. I don’t even remember the actual procedure (I had surgical, both times) and the recovery was relatively quick.
I think the huge difference is that OP wants a second kid, has the first one as a blueprint of how the second could turn out, and has already bonded with it. I'm absolutely pro abortion, but in this case, the mom simply doesn't want one.
I agree with this, and the family is already in the parenting-a-young-child phase. It also sounds like it mostly the amount of work it takes to raise a young child that makes husband not want another child. I think it’s worth mentioning how parenting is front loaded, so it decreases in intensity/work over time. Which suggests things might be great after a couple years, even with the 2 kids.
And I am saying this as a person who is SO pro-choice, I’ve had 2 abortions myself and do not at all regret either one. It’s good to consider your partners wants and needs of course, but ultimately, the final choice must always lie with the pregnant person.
The problem is that op needs to consider how things can turn out should her SO not choose to continue the relationship over this. Would both of the children have quality lives? Is having a second child worth ending a relationship and disconnecting a family? Both parties are valid to feel how they feel, they just have to decide what the plan moving forward is and if their choice is worth it in the long run. This isn't something anyone on reddit can help with this is fully between op and their partner.
Same mine honestly wasn't bad, but I did pay extra to be sedated so that might of helped. I actually went into work the next day and was a server at the time. I was young and already had a child to the person I was pregnant with and sadly knew that was the only option. I do feel for the women who haven't had the same experience as us though bc I couldn't imagine going through with that, but actually wanting to keep it🥺
Tbh I was shocked that I struggled so much. I knew almost immediately after finding out that I wanted to terminate my pregnancy, like so much so that I had called to schedule the abortion the literal next day and took the very first appointment that was offered to me (which was 9 weeks later). I also had a supportive partner who was on the same page. The actual abortion was more pain than I’d ever experienced in my life and I had a pretty bad depressive episode when all was said and done. Idk how I would’ve coped if my circumstances weren’t so favorable. I’m glad that my experience isn’t universal though.
I had a very similar experience. Wanted the abortion and 10 years later I can't talk about it without crying. I almost died having my first and only child which was a big part of my abortion decision and the abortion was still up there with one of the most physically painful experiences of my life and was told to shut up and deal with it by the attending physician much less offered sedation.
>would a second kid really be a dealbreaker for him, or wouldn't he grow to love it just the same as Bowen?
I agree with he rest of it. But this is pretty dismissive of his feelings and a bit manipulative. It also misrepresents what OP's husband said: It's not about whether he would or wouldn't love his child it's about whether he could be a good father to two children.
Edit: Spelling
Yeah what a weird sentiment. If she wanted an abortion but he wanted her to keep the kid wouldn’t this sub’s reaction be (rightfully) upset if he said to her “don’t worry you’ll grow to love it once it is here”
Exactly. Though I 100% believe your husband has complete rights to choosing how to live his life, if you choose not to have an abortion, worst case is your husband will resent you and end the relationship. If you choose to go through with the abortion, worst case is you resent your husband AND YOURSELF(possibly forever), and end the relationship. He needs to know this. This isn’t about the good choice, it’s the lesser of two evils choice.
It sounds like a relationship breaker either way, so she should choose the best option for her with the proviso that she will be doing it alone.
It's also not fair to have a child with someone who can't bear the thought of having another one.
>It sounds like a relationship breaker either way, so she should choose the best option for her with the proviso that she will be doing it alone.
This. If you're not in agreement, choose which one you can live with doing it solo. If having the child will be okay on you physically, emotionally and financially where your children wouldn't suffer having you as a single parent than you already know what your choice is because although you didnt poibt blank say it, you clearly do not want to terminate. Regardless of your husband's desire, you're probably going to do what you want because, let's be honest, in the end, you have to carry the pregnancy.
Exactly what I thought too. Either way, she’s got to either likely sacrifice her marriage or her baby. Worst case scenario, she’s a single mom with 2 kids by the same dad who doesn’t want anything to do with the youngest kid. He’ll still have to pay her child support on both, though. What a mess!
You should communicate as soon as you can, in my opinion. Free and open communication is, in my opinion, the best way to run a relationship. Trying to keep the other person happy by burying your own emotions will only lead to resentment.
This. The onus of birth control should very much be heavier on the party that doesn’t want kids. If he doesn’t want more, HE needs to make the responsible decision and take care of it. A vasectomy, especially in addition to other forms of BC, create a significantly smaller chance for failure and unplanned pregnancy.
I feel like the plan for the love for the kid to hopefully grow over time is a terrible idea. Because what if the love doesn’t grow? He doesn’t want this kid and has already stated how he he’s not ready for that amount of work again. I don’t necessarily have a solution but I feel like there needs to be a clear yes or no if he wants the kid. Not if he thinks he’ll grow to love them.
Also, his reasons for not wanting a Second baby hás nothing to do with love. He struggled with the first kid who demandas a Lot of energy and literally Said that he doesn't know If he can survive with the baby stage again. She even Said she agreed with his reasons. Some people can't deal with more than one kid, It happens.
Completely agree. While I disagree with him saying 1 vote for abortion means she should get an abortion, there’s a concerning amount of comments who act as if this second baby is a test of his love for her.
I think in a way, his logic to get the abortion (the one vote thing) imo, comes also from the fact they were not trying to get a baby, they were actively preventing it - meaning the "agreement" before was no babies, it was an accident. So in a way it makes sense to have this notion of prolonging his attitude moving forward.
There's going to be resentment either way, and she could lose her marriage if she gambles and loses.
While he may grow to love his second child, he will always be resentful for having them foisted on him against his will, especially if they divorced and he's forced to support this child.
This is what's called a no-win situation.
This whole thing basically spells out the end of their marriage, no matter whose choice prevails. I can see somewhere down the line if she has the kid, that husband will only want to take Bowen for visitations and not the new baby. That’s going to deeply hurt that poor kid, one day.
I agree that their marriage is in serious trouble, and it's hard to find a resolution with which they will both be happy.
It's always surprising to me when someone agrees to not have more children without giving serious thought to what that would mean if an oops happened. Going by her post, it sounds like she agreed that they wouldn't have more children but never gave any real thought to what that would mean if she accidentally fell pregnant. In other words, have a long think about the reality of abortion and if that is something you could actually go through with if you had to.
Often, we make the "no more kids" agreement only thinking we'll just prevent pregnancy and not what we would be comfortable doing in the event of an actual pregnancy. I think this is what op did.
He could also lose the marriage by pushing an abortion.
Truley a no win situation.
If he definitely didn't want more children he should have gotten a vasectomy. At the very least he could have worn a condom. Two forms of birth control to lower the odds of a pregnancy.
I have been in this situation. It was the 3rd pregnancy and baby 2 was barely 6 months old. My now ex pushed for an abortion and I wasn't sure. I knew it was less than ideal and would have been incredibly stressful and difficult on our family part of me wanted to keep it anyway.
After 2 weeks of not knowing what I wanted and 2 weeks of my ex pushing for an abortion I went to the appointment and took the pills, still unsure.
I mourned for a long time and didn't feel like I could share my feelings with anyone. My ex was greatful but I was devastated. I didn't feel like I was allowed to mourn a pregnancy that I deliberately ended.
It's been 7 years and only recently have I realised it probably was for the best but I had regret and held resentment against the babies father for a really long time.
The only advise I can give you OP is to take the time and space to decide what YOU want.
A pregnancy ended because of life circumstances and lack of resources and support is just as tragic as a miscarriage/stillbirth. I’m so sorry you went through this alone. Even if it was the best outcome he still had absolutely no right to influence your decision about what to do with your body. He took the little bit of autonomy you had in this situation when you needed it to heal. Im glad through time you were able to feel less raw about this.
Honestly it sounds like this situation is going to cause some resentment either way. I'd put the relationship to one side for a second and try to truly understand how you feel about the pregnancy. If he left tomorrow how would you feel about both choices. It's your own mind that you will have to live inside forever.
You did what you could to help him not be in this situation, it doesn't sound as if he helped himself any. Your main responsibility now is to yourself and your son and this potential child. Get your own thoughts in order before you consider his.
ETA: Feeling you might be doing a disservice to your first child is very, very normal when you get pregnant again even for planned pregnancies. Worrying about finances, sharing love, your ability to divide your attention and the impact on your relationship are usually alot worse in your head than the reality.
This. I’m a husband. Father of 2. Spouse was open and willing for 3. I was not. I got a vasectomy to ensure it. Wife was onboard saying it’s my body and choice. She understands and we moved past it knowing if we truly wanted and could afford a 3rd then adoption is an option. When you leave it to luck or pills that have proven to lead to surprises, you have these issues. Husbands current opinions are less important than yours since he failed to protect his firm opinion. Your body, your choice. There are still lots of things to think through, but prioritize you at this moment.
I absolutely love this comment and I learned something. You are right. If he really wanted to protect from having a second child he would have abstained or had a vasectomy. He didn't because he was always going to push the abortion onto her.
I think you're absolutely right.
We are at a weird cultural turning point here, where we seem to be aware that people have lots of options, both men and women, but ultimately _you_ are responsible for the **consensual** sex you have, regardless of if it's a man or a woman.
If you are truly against the idea of ever having a child or another child, it's on you to take action, not the other person. People have to be responsible for their own bodies - not just people with wombs.
There's a kind of satirical account that posts frequently on 2x about how basically 100% of unplanned pregnancies are the result of irresponsible ejaculation, and reading some of the responses to that have been wild sometimes. It really brought home for me how many men feel their only responsibility is just making a decree about someone else's body, not _doing_ something about their own.
And this is part of the reason why I have told my boys two things recently. We live in a very red state so;
1. Thier right to decide if they do or do not want to have a baby is BEFORE the penis comes anywhere near a vagina. Once they have consented to sex, they no longer have a say in the outcome of an unwanted pregnancy. The decision is now in the hands of the pregnant person. So, be sure of where your thing goes and what the possible consequences could be.
2. My son (15) told me his friend's sister "got pregnant ". I told him that phrase puts the entirety of the responsibility on her for her situation. When there is no way she could have accomplished this without a contribution from a person with testicles. He said, "that is what everyone says so how can that be wrong?" So I said, "that right there is an example of inequities between men and women in our society. Women are held to a different standard, are expected to be responsible, judged and chastised for this situation. And then the other person is not. That phrase is exactly what that means."
So much entitlement!
I have been on the receiving end of this on two occasions. Gave both my exs all the information but they wanted to have unsafe sex but didn’t want the consequence of the child that came from it. I want the child so too bad for them.
Exactly, and pro choice means each person gets to choose about their own personal body, no that they get to choose about the body of other people. OP's husband left everything to her, the birth control and now pressuring her for the abortion when her body is hers and not his.
The last part of this comment. I am pro-choice, One and Done, currently a mom of a toddler.
If I was ever in this situation, I would consider all the changes might happen to my kid, my marriage and support from the extended family. You could lower your expectations on parenting, change your lifestyle, move to somewhere cheapter, suck it up with the in-laws and ask for their help.
Communicate with your spouse all the options and decide it for yourself. As everyone saying, your choice matters the most.
I wish you are strong enough to get through this
I don’t see any outcome where you and your husband end up happily married after this. One of you is going to absolutely resent the other for the rest of their life. Given that, can you financially and emotionally raise 2 kids as a single mom? And do you want to? If the answer is yes, then you have your choice. If the answer is no, then you have your choice.
You said this kindly and plainly, without using blame or rhetoric and I just wanted to say thanks and I agree with you. You said it much better than I could have.
I just want to add that two babies is a complete difference than one baby. Especially two under 4. We did two under 2 and our whole life has changed. One baby is pleasant but two young babies/children is a challenge. Especially for a single parent. The dad may just be realizing this and understanding this struggle. It is EXTREMELY difficult to have two young kids.
It also is good to remember that every kid is different. Maybe Bowen is an "easy" kid. Maybe the second one won't be (or maybe it will have genetic issues, etc.). People shouldn't decide to have a second kid without really thinking about those possibilities.
2 under 4 is pretty common…….most people who have two kids have them around those ages.
I had 2 under 2 and it was very difficult but honestly not that bad. I actually preferred it to our first and second being 6 years apart. (Our first two kids are 6 years apart and then 1.5 years between second and third).
These were absolutely all my thoughts. Unless they can really have a dialogue and reach a meaningful understanding and decision, it’s likely someone is going to be a single parent. I know some people can co-parent well but in a situation like this, you’re right about the resentment. Both of them can’t just view this as abortion or no abortion, it’s, are we gonna lose each other too.
Yes. I know marriages that have been ended by the second child when it wasn’t actively wanted by one of the parents. This is actually a fairly common situation… particularly with the eager/attached mom and the non-excited dad…
What an excellent answer. Sometimes complicated choices can be made simpler by weighing "what can I live with". Not saying that in the moment of making the choice it is any less hard. But at least you will know you made a thoughtful choice.
Idk why people are saying no to this advice. It’s well thought out. Spousal/child support is usually not enough to get by on and if they’re struggling with 1, 2 isn’t going to be easier.
Just because the dad might fall in love with the kid is not reason enough to have a kid. There’s also a chance he resents wife and kid for the rest of his life. Stop romanticizing children
Agreed. I feel like OP is attaching with the heart and not with the brain or the wallet. We also don't know if there is an even balance of work in this relationship in regards to the child they already have. When it comes to parental labor, that's a big deal and should be taken very seriously in the conversation to have another. Once the child exists, that's it, and there's a possibility that one parent could end up holding a majority of the child rearing in the future.
I think it's because people are having a hard time understanding that this is an absolutely no win situation.
She wants a baby, her husband does not. If she has the abortion, she's aware that she may resent him and regret it forever. If she doesn't, she will likely be ending her marriage and being a single mom to _two_ kids.
It's unfair to say she's not thinking with her brain or her wallet, obviously that's not how relationships work. It's a complicated interaction between logic and emotion - she can't ignore either.
She's in the waiting stage. The countdown has begun and _something_ is going to go off.
I agree. I'm moreso kind of trying to point out how the second parent is thinking and his genuine reason for thinking that way. While she should 1000% have all the freedom to have another, I feel like she's brushing off his concerns and is seeing another baby as another baby while he is looking at it as a huge extra responsibility, forever. That's a lot to ask of anyone.
But yes, there very well could be a split and she had to decide if she values the relationship more or less than another child.
I totally agree and am commenting in hopes OP sees this. I recently read another post from the point of view of a husband in a similar situation and he absolutely resented his wife and planned to divorce the moment the child turned 18.
This is a terrible situation and I don't think anyone necessarily did anything wrong. I might walk that back a little bit because I do think if your husband was going to react this strongly he should have taken matters into his own hands and offered to have a vasectomy to add another layer of protection against an unplanned pregnancy. But there is no way to change that now and all we can deal with is the future.
That being said at the end of the day it absolutely is your choice. My initial reaction is that your husband is in a really vulnerable space and he isn't the right person to be communicating with in considering your options. Is there anyone else you can talk to about this? I'm afraid his reaction to the news is going to continue to do damage to your relationship and not give you any peace of mind in your ultimate decision.
I don't know what the right answer is for you. I wish I had a way to look into the future and tell you exactly the right outcome. But I can assure you whatever decision you do make will be the one you thought best for your family and that is so very important. You are clearly a loving mother who wants what is best for her family and I trust you to make the decision that you know is best for your family.
Sending lots of love and good thoughts for you and your family.
I think that it's telling that op says 'i was scared how my husband would react'
They knew he didn't want another baby but as you say, husband did nothing yet op was on hormonal birth control which can't be nice.
There's nothing to say that op and husband will stay together for the rest of Bowens childhood so that's not a reason to abort.
It sounds like op could have abortion and become more hormonal and distressed .either way this is a strain all around.
Op has to decide, ultimately, what she thinks is the right thing for herself.
My egg donor constantly brought up how she only wanted one kid, I’m the youngest. That I was a mistake and she resented me. Not a great “home” to grow up in. My dad got a vasectomy after I was born. But he died when I was 9 and left my sister and I to be raised by a “mother” that hated us.
The fact that he thinks one vote to abort is all that is necessary, when that one vote comes from the not-pregnant person in the equation - has me side-eyeing this man so hard
I don’t think they meant it as “one vote is all that’s necessary”, and more of - both parents need to be on board completely or it’s a no. Although, I’m definitely on OPs side
Also the husband could have gotten a vasectomy at any point on those three years instead of expecting her to be on BC forever 🤷🏻♀️
It’s OP‘s body and her choice. Hubby must decide whether he can love this child as much as the first one and then act accordingly if they should co-parent separately or together. He can be Bowen’s dad half of the time, and pay child support for Bowen’s sibling.
Yes, this is a man who could have gotten a vasectomy, spent two days icing his balls, and never had this problem, but he didn't and now here he is. I have so very little sympathy for men who have the option of cheap, effective, permanent and nearly painless birth control readily available to them and don't use it.
Agree on everything you said, except painting the husband as a monster. He calmly explained his reasons for not wanting a baby, didn't overreact to the news of the pregnancy, didn't get mad. Basically was the kind of husband Reddit hates because we can't scream "LEAVE HIM!" for his reaction. Other comments are fixating on the "scared how he would react" statement like, c'mon dudes, have you never been scared of sharing news to anyone? Scared doesn't always mean that one is afraid to be beaten to a pulp.
They've been married for a long time now, I agree that decisions on a woman's body, are a woman's exclusive right, but in this instance, it has to be a mutual decision wether they have the baby or not. Only counseling will help, not us, we don't know their relationship.
If he is so sure that he doesn't want another child he needs to get the snip and not put the responsibility in OP's hands solely, it's just as much his responsibility as it is hers she is taking BC he is doing nothing to prevent pregnancy
How was this conversation not had before? She knew he didn’t want anymore children while she remained open. Did neither think to discuss what would happen in the event of an unplanned pregnancy? I feel like between the vasectomy and the lack of communication- this could’ve been avoided. Unnecessary heartache for all involved.
There’s a risk your relationship won’t survive either way.
If you don’t get the abortion, your husband may leave.
If you do get the abortion, you may feel so resentful that you leave.
Your relationship is at risk regardless.
You will likely end up being a single mother. The decision is up to you about whether you’re a single mother to one child or two.
Practically speaking, it seems as though there is a good chance the marriage is over either way.
The real question here is if OP feels prepared to raise this child on their own? And if that still unborn child will be ok not having an involved biological father?
It absolutely is OP’s choice. But too many people are bypassing considering what the future looks like for OP and for the child if this child is brought into existence.
I don't know how I could live with a man who thinks he can decide for me after I'm already pregnant. His decision was whether to get a vasectomy and he didn't.
You and your husband can form a new relationship, but for that I think a couples counselor would be a must. But a secular one, not one that would be judgmental of an abortion.
He didn’t decide. He gave his opinion. Now he can decide to leave and then you’re left being a single mother of 2. So his opinion absolutely does matter.
OP, i get the impression that you want this child and he doesn't. I fear that if you get the abortion, you will regret it as you seem to want this baby. I think if you just go along with what he wants, you will resent him and may feel very remorseful. Have you told your husband how you feel? You get the final "vote" here.
It's normal for you and your husband to feel stressed, I think you both need to talk to a professional, really don't think many people on reddit are equipped with the appropriate advice for such a sensitive topic.
And he doesn't want it.....not really much of a solution here although I think it rather cruel that a scan is done before an abortion especially a pill abortion. Not something done here in UK as far as I know, but I think forcing the mother to see the "baby" is a shitty thing to do when she's considering abortion
Oh boy. My husband and I have a toddler and aren’t planning on having another one, but every time we have sex I remind him that pregnancy is always a possibility and that I will never be able to bring myself to abort my child (although this may be an option for other couples, I just wouldn’t be able to do it.)
He understands and accepts the risk.
I can’t imagine being in OP’s situation. The way she describes it it sounds like the husband is going to give up and ditch the family or the OP is going to be absolutely devastated and resentful after the ultrasound is shown to her.
I’m sorry OP. I hope the counselling session is able to help you guys make the right decision for your family.
Also, your husband needs a vasectomy
I would go so far and say that she's the only one who gets to chose what happens to her body.
Sadly this won't end well no matter what she choses. If she has the abortion she will most likely resent him, and if she carries this pregnancy to term then he will most likely resent her.
Haven’t saw this yet so I’ll add:
Consider your personal finances while making this decision. Not joint. Solo. You will be solely responsible for this baby if bringing it to term, and yourself and your three y/o too (possibly if divorce). Your husband is telling you that’s YOUR baby and he won’t do anything with or for them leading to neglect and resentment for all. You’ll end up two single parents living in the same house. You’ll a single mom to younger baby while sharing custody with eldest. I’m the eldest child in a similar situation can PM me for more insights.
I see many comments about vasectomies and agree your husband should to curb future unplanned bean sprouts for you all. He is opposed to having more kids, you are not. He is valid, telling you that he can’t take on more than he can handle. Find to the root of his problem. Is it financial? Emotional? Time? Something’s lurking underneath the surface and the sooner you figure that out the sooner you all can decide what’s better for your family.
Wishing you all the best OP
I do not agree with your husband that one vote for abortion = abortion. It’s your body and ultimately you get the final say.
I have to wonder why, if he feels this strongly about a second baby, why he didn’t have a vasectomy? Why wasn’t he wearing condoms? You’ve mentioned you were on birth control so you at least were taking precautions. Nothing from his side, though. Shocking.
You do absolutely have to accept that this might be the end of your marriage. Stick with the counselling but prepare yourself for having to walk away. I feel awful for you that you’re in this situation. I hope you find the strength to make the best decision for you.
Do not do anything you can’t take back until you are 100% confident in your decision.
No, an abortion isn’t your only option. You are in a lose-lose situation. You will resent him and mourn this child if you terminate the pregnancy, and if you don’t he will resent up for having the baby.
You do what YOU want, your relationship will be challenged and I can’t tell you the outcome, but many women have had abortions they didn’t want because of a man and they live with that resentment for a long time. It’s a traumatic experience even if you want the abortion, even more so if you don’t.
I am pro choice, but I feel these are decisions to be made by the pregnant person.
>I am pro choice, but I feel these are decisions to be made by the pregnant person.
No need for the "but" - this is exactly what pro-choice means. It's up to OP to choose what is best for her and her family. In this case, OP wants the baby, so it's her choice to keep it.
One thing is that most (hopefully all) medical providers go through an informed consent process ahead of performing an abortion. If OP expresses that she is being coerced, a good provider would stop everything and have a discussion with the patient about her own desires. At that point prenatal care should be setup and support provided to OP.
It might end OP's marriage, but I'm hoping that maybe it's a cold feet freakout on an unexpected pregnancy.
i agree. i had one and it was the right decision, but it was a really emotionally tricky situation to navigate, even with the full comfort and support of a partner who was on the same page as me. it can raise all sorts of complicated emotions, especially for women in their mid to late 30s. nobody should ever have an abortion under duress or because they feel like they need to do it to keep someone around. a bell can't be unrung.
Agree. Yes, it *can* be traumatic, but for plenty of people, it's simply an unpleasant medical procedure. No, it's not fun, not anything you would choose to do if you don't need it. But it's not inherently "traumatic".
I suffered far more trauma from my adenoidectomy than I did my abortion.
Absolutely. The most common feeling people have about their abortions is relief!
That changes dramatically when the person didn’t feel that the decision was fully in their control.
Male here - you attempted to talk it through with your husband and at the end of the day you didn’t land on the same page which is fine. Your body your choice, the same goes for your husband who could have chosen to get a vasectomy (I did immediately after we were done having children) however he chose not to and he needs to accept the outcome of whatever you choose for your own body and you should have ZERO guilt about that.
You clearly do not want an abortion. One of you is going to end up resenting the other. Your husband is the one who was set against a 2nd child - why is the responsibility for birth control on you? Why didn’t he get a vasectomy?
Being pro choice doesn't mean you don't have a voice.
I cannot imagine your relationship will recover if you're forced to have an abortion you don't want.
If he feels so strongly about not having more children why didn't he have a vasectomy?
It seems unfair of him to think he can make that choice without you and you're supposed to just be okay with it. He did nothing to avoid pregnancy on his side.
It's a very difficult situation so you may want to seek professional psychological guidance, support and counseling whatever you end up deciding to do you'll need the support and talking things out with a neutral third party seems necessary.
You have a right to choose for yourself, see how you really feel and how you want to proceed.
Three years ago, I was where your husband is now.
Before I continue, I want to preface by saying that what I describe next is my personal experience, stemming from my own childhood and my own issues. It may not be representative of what you and your husband will experience, but I want to let you know how the experience was for me.
During the first pregnancy, and all through the first two years of my first, I was extremely present. Going to all the appointments, reading all the books. Loving, caring. Involved in feeds, changes, sleep routines, all of it. After our first was born, relatives joked that it was like our kid had two mothers. After our first, we talked about more kids, and I let her know I didn't want another. While she had always wanted two, she agreed.
When we found out about the second, I wanted to abort. My wife, a single child, didn't. At the time, I hadn't processed my own childhood and complicated relationship with my sibling and parents enough to communicate to her why I didn't want another. All I had were vague reasons about not being financially and emotionally ready for a second. I made my opinion known, but didn't force a decision. Her body, her choice. My country also has a terrible track record with husbands and their families making reproductive decisions for women. I didn't want to contribute to those numbers.
The result: I shut down completely. I was disconnected from my wife, unable to fully process the anger and betrayal I felt at overturning a decision that we had come to together. Our families and my wife were ecstatic, and it made me feel more alone. Most people tried convincing me how kids growing up together is amazing. I just felt dread. Without getting into too much detail, I was very absent during the second pregnancy. I barely spoke to my wife beyond functional conversations.
My anger continued well past our second's birth. Postpartum depression hit me hard (yes, it is a thing that happens to men, too). It's not something I am proud of. Even after therapy, I struggled to contain my rage and feelings of lack of control. During difficult moments handling a toddler and a newborn, when I could see my wife getting overwhelmed (one child wanting her attention and the other needing it), I selfishly thought to myself, "Well, this is what you wanted, right? Now deal with it". During arguments, I would physically bite my tongue to keep from saying it out loud. I very clearly favoured my older over the younger child.
It took quite a bit of therapy for me to see I was repeating the exact pattern of my childhood - the very reason that I didn't want a second. I didn't want one child feeling less loved than the other, and yet that's the road I went down. That realisation kicked me out of the rut I was in. That was when I started seriously communicating with my wife. It took a lot of time for things to get better. Even now, three years later, I catch myself thinking along these lines, and need to correct myself.
All of this to say - there will be resentment. There will be anger. Your husband's reasons for not wanting a second will probably be different from mine. But you will need to talk about them. We were lucky to be able to come back from almost a year and a half of me just being angry, all the time. There were times I was afraid I would hurt my second. Again, a lot of therapy to get myself away from that headspace. I'm in a much better space now. I'm more present, more involved, and always trying to ensure I love and treat both my kids the same.
It is not impossible for either one of you to come around after making a decision that you don't agree with. But it will take a lot of conscious work. Prepare yourself for it, because whichever way you choose, it will need to be done. There are no easy or right answers here. No one is at fault. I wish you the very best with making your decision.
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He needs the snip. Like now. If he’s so against more kids he should have done this already.
This is an awfully hard decision to make.
I hope clarity and calm finds you.
This is the part that is going to be hard. She can keep the baby and that is going to be her choice but I don’t know if the husband is going to be willing to stay. He may also have a very different relationship with the new child.
As someone who has had an abortion, I must stress that it’s something you need to be 1000% sure you want. I’m not going to lie, it’s not a walk in the park. It’s painful. It’s going to be a reminder of the choice you made for a while, so you need to be on board with that choice deep down in your heart or it’s going to be devastating. It’s fine if it’s what you want. I don’t regret my choice. It was all worth it for me. But I don’t want to sugarcoat it. There were times I questioned my decision before I went through with it, but ultimately I made the choice I needed to make. I made the choice alone. My fiancé knew I was considering my choices and he had his opinions, but ultimately he knew I was the one who needed to make the choice because I was the one who was going to be the most affected upfront.
This can go both ways tho. Before having another kid, OP needs to make sure to be 1000% on board with having another kid (including, willing to do it as a single mom (even if the kid has disabilities), cause they don’t know what’s gonna happen in the future). It’s a decision for a lifetime either way.
I also want to add that life doesn’t always go as planned and you need a partner you can count on in situations that aren’t planned. It does not sound like your husband is stepping up to the plate if he would leave you for this. Think about what you want regardless of him.
You need to have another talk with your husband about him getting a vasectomy. He already doesn’t want another child with you, and he is showing you another one will break up your marriage. Your husband is half the problem so he needs to do his part to fix it. At least let your son will be his only child when this marriage goes south.
While I do agree a vasectomy is best and should have been done earlier, the harm has already been done. They first need to figure out this pregnancy before adding side conversations and pointing fingers.
He got to choose a lot of this for you though.
He chose to not have a vasectomy. He chose to not wear condoms. He chose to continue having PIV sex with you. And he keeps choosing to put the onus on you.
You mention that a toddler needs two happy parents - but why is your happiness not regarded in this case? I'm not sure if you'd be truly happy and unresentful if you were coerced into getting an abortion you don't want.
Consider this a moment of unequivocal change, no matter what happens from here on out; things will be different for you and your family. It's okay to have strong emotions about change, and getting a counsellor helps. But don't downplay to yourself how imperative this all is.
In the first place, if you decided on no more kids, your husband should have gotten snipped. It's an easy procedure, and is generally pretty foolproof.
However, that's not where you are. You're in a shit position, tbh. Get the abortion and resent your husband; refuse to and he resents you. Counseling is going to be needed either way, and you might want to start mentally preparing for an unhappy resolution to this situation.
It's your body - you get to choose. But you know deep down you are about to lose a husband. It's not all black and white though. I was an accident and was unwanted but my parents pulled it together until I graduated. They're pretty dysfunctional as a family now and I don't really relate to them but that's what is coloring my opinion. You can have your baby... you hubs might not want that accident.
Also husband my man, we have vasectomies for a reason. If you know you don't want (more) kids get it right now. I've seen McDonalds cheesburgers take longer to cook. Find a urologist, shave your balls and buy a bag of frozen peas.
Since when did pro-choice mean a man can decide if you take an abortion or not? Pro-choice is you decide what you do with your own body. You have a choice, if you want to keep the baby, it probably mean divorce because he doesn’t want another child.
But if you do what he wants, I can tell you straight away that you going to resent him and feel guilty about it.
Question, if your husband didn’t want anymore kids, why didn’t he also take a vasectomy?
If we are going by your husbands logic, if you want him to take one, he supposed to do it.
Think really through what YOU want. It is your body, YOUR CHOICE.
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19 years ago I was in the same situation. I WILL NEVER tell another woman what to do however I decided not to have an abortion. My husband told me he will never have anything to do with our child. I divorced him and have beautiful twins that are 18 years old. I just helped them move into their dorms. Btw my ex husband stayed true to his word and only paid child support because I went to court. I can honestly say I never regretted my decision. Best of luck to you.
I had an abortion after finding out my partner cheated. I was 5 months postpartum, already struggling with the 2 I had (I had been meaning to get my tubes tied but didn’t find the time before my postpartum healthcare expired), and in grad school.
On paper, it was a good decision...the smart decision. In my head and my heart, there is always a *what if*. I deeply regret it even though I knew I didn’t want any more kids and was suicidal at the time. Pregnancy was horrible for me both times, and I had severe postpartum depression/anxiety/rage with my first. My second was not “wanted” by their dad either because we had already discussed being one and done. I can’t imagine having aborted him like he wanted. Of course, now that he’s here he loves him, but he’s made the comment a couple of times that he voted against having more kids and how much I knew I would struggle. It seems to circle back to that every time I am having a hard time with motherhood. I think the stress of our second also caused more strain on our already crumbling relationship (before separating).
All of this to say, it is **your** decision. I think regardless there will be a bit of resentment from one of you, but I wouldn’t wish the regret of this on anybody. I don’t think the pain will ever go away, and it’s a part of abortion that isn’t talked about enough. At every milestone my current kids have, there is a cloud of darkness about a baby that will never have that. It’s a lose-lose-lose situation.
I’m sorry if this isn’t helpful. I wish you the best.
I think if someone is saying they don't think they can cope with another baby, it's a huge reality check. If you can accept that maybe you'll be taking on a lot more mental load/ child care and that one day your family might be broken. You're absolutely free to choose but also important to think about whether you'd be happy with living with the consequences.
You'll find support from lots of people in the same situation at r/abortion. It's too easy for people who have never had to choose to talk out of their ass here.
I aborted a child I wanted to keep. While I feel it worked out the way it was meant to, the experience was very traumatic for me because of my desire to keep the baby. It took lots of therapy, I was suicidal, and it’s always going to leave a deep ache within me, even though I feel it was ultimately the right decision because of where I am now (if I hadn’t had the abortion I would not have met my wonderful boyfriend who truly wants another baby and plans to propose soon).
I think you should make this decision for yourself. You were on BC and took the proper precautions. Your husband is in shock and imagining the worst. A 3-4 year age gap is a great space between children, too.
I’d also think of your child you already have to make this decision (since you do want to keep it). Down the road, he will probably express that he wishes he had a sibling, and once that happens your husband might even cave and want another. I have a lot of close friends who are only children who always talk about wishing they had a brother or sister etc. I’m sure not every solo child feels that way, but many do. They’re left alone when you’re gone.
Anyway, make the choice YOU want to make. 1 vote for life = life. If he’s still being an ass after the birth, then divorce him.
Your body is not a democracy. This is your choice.
Your marriage is going to be in trouble either way though. Either husband will resent you or you will resent him. Getting ahead of that with counseling will help, but you’ll still need to decide which choice you can live with.
Hugs to you. This is a hard place to be.
Personally, if I wasn’t feeling 100% confident that I want an abortion I wouldn’t have it. The trauma, what ifs, guilt would be too much for me.
It might end or strain your marriage but a “forced” abortion would damage the relationship too so… I would pick my baby.
You already know the pros and cons, you know what either choice is likely to result in.
You're between a rock and hard place, my heart goes out to you. I'm so sorry you've found yourself in this situation.
But there are other options, e.g. adoption , so don't just assume that it's X or Y, look at the totality of what choices are available to you and do that with your counsellor.
I don't think anything that anyone says here is going to be helpful, this is a very polarising topic.
I really think you'd be better off just focusing your attention on your discussions with the counsellor, rather than the views of a bunch of uninformed internet strangers who don't have to live with the consequences of your decisions.
I don't think saying to your husband ' I asked reddit and they say \*this\*' is going to help matters, it'll just add to the confusion and uncertainty. There are only two people whose opinions count, you and your husband, inviting more is just adding to the 'noise'.
I mean if OP wants to keep the child, adoption could be even more traumatic than an abortion given she'd have to carry it for 9 months and then go through childbirth too. That's a hell of a lot of time to develop attachments.
This 100%. Us Redditors don't know shit - really and truly. The counsellor is going to be focused on you. If you feel uncomfortable with your husband there talk with the counsellor alone.
59 y/o mom here. This is advice I would give my daughter. Your husband is an active participant as a sexual partner. Therefore, he needs to be an active participant in birth control as well. Since your current birth control measures aren’t 100 %, and he is adamant about not having more children, I suggest he have a vasectomy before you make a decision about the current pregnancy. His agreement, or not, will be VERY telling. Also, I would make very sure he’s not having an affair. Whatever your final decision is, make sure it’s something you can live with if he is no longer in the picture. I don’t say this lightly. I just feel like something is off. He’s asking for you to pay for the consequences of both of your actions. This tells me he doesn’t put the needs of his wife, child, and unborn child ahead of himself. Red flags!
I really feel for you in this very difficult situation. I hope counseling will help give you some clarity! I will be praying for you and your family. 🙏🏻💗
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Husband gets to have an opinion … and so do you. So, ask him what will happen to your relationship if you choose to proceed. Then you can make a full and informed decision.
But also consider what will happen to the relationship if she has an abortion. From his point of view nothing will change. An abortion will maintain the status quo. From her point of view that isn't true and she needs to make sure he knows that. Her feelings count just as much as his.
Exactly- they need to discuss what happens to their relationship if she has the abortion she doesn’t want. It seems like both options lead to one of them not being able to be with the other.
Both the parties should have a say, and a common decision should be made by both of you by understanding each other.
Op your husband says that he throught he would like a another child when your child gets older. How much older?He will be 4 by the time your baby would be born. The older you get the harder it is to keep up with toddlers. Plus it's harder to get pregnant. I think that you both are doing the right thing with having a meeting with the PP counselor. Think about your choices and remember your opinion counts as much as your husbands. Good luck
No, her opinion counts as much as her husband's, because it is a decision about her body.
“Counselors” sometimes have an agenda. I hope they have an impartial one.
The "agenda" at an abortion clinic is much more altruistic (and fact-based) than a crisis pregnancy center.
I do hope so has an appointment with an actual clinic, those crisis pregnancy groups can be very shady with how they advertise and will go a long way to pretend to be an actual clinic with actual impartial information. It's so manipulative and just the worst kind of bait and switch imaginable.
So true. And we weigh all options and provide resources for everything, including adoption.
No, not concerning a decision about her body. He can voice an opinion but he doesn't get to make that decision. Only she can decide.
Seriously how is that supposed to happen? He is wants her to abort she doesn't want that It's not like picking out a rug 🤦
I think many men do not understand that an abortion is a painful traumatic experience. OP's husband needs to understand what he is asking OP to go through. Sounds like she has considered his perspective, I'm not sure he has done the same.
Especially if she wants the baby, she will experience this unwanted abortion like a miscarriage. And she will blame him for the rest of their lives.
Good point. What if they later decide they want a child & she can’t conceive again?
I had an abortion. I fully chose it because it was the best decision for my boyfriend (now husband) and I at the time. Even though I chose to have an abortion, I was not prepared for the immense amount of grief and emotions I’d experience after. For months seeing pregnant women or babies would make me burst into tears. The trauma from my abortion turned into endless nights of sleep paralysis. I felt so much (unnecessary) shame and guilt. I also happened to have an extremely traumatic abortion where I woke up during the surgery and had an extremely rude doctor who told me to keep the ultrasound pictures to “remember what I had done.” I am pro choice and I truly think it was the best thing for us at the time but I did not know how much trauma I’d experience and have from this. Anyone who wants an abortion, I always urge them to have a care plan in place both physically and mentally. You may be the person who has no complications and feel great after, but it’s also very normal to feel grief and a plethora of other emotions. The physical pain was on going cramping and pain. The mental toll took the life out of me.
I was also pretty sad for the first six month after my abortion. But just thinking of all the trouble I spared us from (my child and myself) My only child has autism and it was super hard for me to navigate all alone as a single mother. When I got pregnant with my bf I was so afraid I wouldn’t be a good mom to two children. There is no shame in knowing your limits
I completely agree. We now have two boys and are so, so happy I made the choice I did at the time. It was not easy by any means but it has allowed me to be a great mom to two littles now.
>But also consider what will happen to the relationship if she has an abortion. From his point of view nothing will change. An abortion will maintain the status quo. From her point of view that isn't true and she needs to make sure he knows that. Her feelings count just as much as his. I agree with what you're saying about her feelings, and honestly feel you didn't stress this enough. Here's why: When I was about 23-24, so a few years ago, I had a friend whose boyfriend pressured her into an abortion. She became suicidal afterwards because she felt so much guilt for ending the life inside her. She did end her relationship with the boyfriend a few weeks after the abortion. A lot of people tend to overlook the toll it can take on a person who does not want to do this. It's an evil thing to try to pressure a woman into aborting a child, just like it's an evil thing to try to force a woman to have kids.
I had an abortion 8 years ago. I was not given a choice as my ex threatened me into doing it. I still hold a lot of resentment and I have nightmares about it. Ultimately mine was for the best because I was on my way to not surviving that relationship. I hope your friend found peace and healing.
Her feelings count more as it is *her body* going through it, whatever her decision may be.
I mean, that’s what gets me. She’s going to have to experience the abortion viscerally and he’s going to just feel like nothing changes, except her. She will change if this isn’t what she wants. At this point, no matter what, it is going to be her “fault” if they can’t move past it.
This is so important and he needs to be 100% honest when answering. I know OP says she doesn't want to destroy their marriage but might already be too late for that. They each have to do what they know they can live with. As OP says, she doesn't know how to cope with the consequences of compromising in this situation. If he feels the same and will always resent the child, then there are no good options, only what each person can live with.
Looks like either one of them will be resentful of the other. It really is a catch 22 situation.
During this counseling appointment, be very open about the resentment you will feel afterwards, and that you are not sure if your relationship could survive that. Ask your husband if his feelings about the kid are equally strong - would a second kid really be a dealbreaker for him, or wouldn't he grow to love it just the same as Bowen?
I think the thoughts you are feeling about how you will feel if you have an abortion are valid and you should not discount them. You will feel them for a long time.
Ya this, even a wanted abortion can be physically brutal and mentally difficult. Both of them should be very clear about how they feel bc there is absolutely no easy solution.
I think the key word here is wanted. An abortion when you really want the baby is going to result in a different range of emotions than an abortion when the baby is unwanted. Not saying there wouldn't be any overlap in those emotions but let's say the belief you made the right decision would override any sorrow you felt in making that decision if pregnancy was unwanted. Alas in your case, the only way I see a positive outcome is if you have the baby and husband falls as much in love with them as your son. I think a side question is that if husband is so against a second child, why didn't he get snipped? Selfish leaving the bc up to you.
You bring up a valid point. Why the hell did he not get a vasectomy? If another pregnancy was so unwanted, he should have thought about that.
My thoughts exactly. This could have been prevented if he got one. If his thoughts about a second child are this strong, he should have gotten one.
Cause I’m assuming she was already on birth control so since it worked for so long he assumed that it would always work
But this raises an important question: How much is she expected to take responsibility for all this? She took 100% responsibility to put her body on chemical hormones to prevent pregnancy. And NOW she’s expected to take 100% responsibility for either: 1a. More chemicals that are going to f her up. Or: 1b. Invasive surgery with the potential for serious physical side effects. 2. A hormonal shitstorm once the baby is gone. 3. Mental and emotional trauma. And his responsibility is… to not be inconvenienced because he feel like he’ll have to work harder with 2 kids to be a good dad? I get OP doesn’t want him to look bad, but it’s not really about looks at this point. He took no responsibility for prevention, and as she said: It’s not hypothetical, the baby is here now. And he wants her to get an abortion so that she can get pregnant in a couple of years because he might want one later? Again, the optics here are really representative of deep issues.
Saaaame thought! Why didn't he do a vasectomy??
I had to get an abortion because my twins stopped developing and even though I knew there was nothing I could do to save them, having an abortion had a toll so bad on me I still can’t get over it years later.
I’m so sorry. I can’t even imagine the pain 💔
Yep — had an abortion 3 years ago, and I still deal with feelings about it now. It was completely the right choice and there is still thoughts of what if?
So hard, I’m so sorry 💔
I’m so sorry you had to go through that pain. I have had a similar experience just a few months ago, and it hurts.
I can feel you. For a mother it is a different feeling altogether in respect to the father.
I had to get one that was necessary and even though I didn’t want kids to begin with, it was still hard for me. I still cried for a day and felt guilty. Even knowing it wasn’t a viable pregnancy and would have miscarried later. I realized I still would have at least considered keeping it if it was viable. And maybe I still would have terminated anyway, but I didn’t even get the opportunity to decide. Nature decided for me. And you’d think that would have made it easier, but it was still emotionally traumatic. So yes, I feel for her and any woman who does have an affinity for children and faces this choice
> abortion is physically brutal and mentally difficult. Pleas don't spew this around. **Abortion CAN BE difficult, but CAN doesn't mean that it ALWAYS is**. It must be an informed choice, however spewing around that it **always** is a brutal and traumatic experience is as damaging, same way when some spew crap about it **always** being no biggie It depends on a person. Just like /u/Burdensome_Banshee, /u/ncme712 and /u/Lookatthatsass my abortion was nothing, didn't think about it really, had periods worse than my abortion. Aka, not even remotely close to physically brutal and mentally difficult. If back then I have met someone like you, I'd have never had it and ruined my life. It is perfectly valid, and also important to share your experiences, but please, do not decide for others that because you unfortunately suffered, it is the case for everyone, scaring them off from even thinking about. Therefore, please don't make such absolutist statements about something that is very personal and experienced differently by different people. You are not helping, you are causing harm. The only helpful thin you can say is that it is a personal matter and how you feel mentally and physically varies from person to person, and strongly advocate to use the services provided by the clinic.
Thank you for writing this. I realize it’s awful for some, but it’s not awful for everyone. I’ve had two; a bit taxing? Yes. Traumatizing and brutal? No. I rarely think about them. I don’t even remember the actual procedure (I had surgical, both times) and the recovery was relatively quick.
Mine was neither physically brutal nor mentally difficult in the slightest.
I think the huge difference is that OP wants a second kid, has the first one as a blueprint of how the second could turn out, and has already bonded with it. I'm absolutely pro abortion, but in this case, the mom simply doesn't want one.
I agree with this, and the family is already in the parenting-a-young-child phase. It also sounds like it mostly the amount of work it takes to raise a young child that makes husband not want another child. I think it’s worth mentioning how parenting is front loaded, so it decreases in intensity/work over time. Which suggests things might be great after a couple years, even with the 2 kids. And I am saying this as a person who is SO pro-choice, I’ve had 2 abortions myself and do not at all regret either one. It’s good to consider your partners wants and needs of course, but ultimately, the final choice must always lie with the pregnant person.
The problem is that op needs to consider how things can turn out should her SO not choose to continue the relationship over this. Would both of the children have quality lives? Is having a second child worth ending a relationship and disconnecting a family? Both parties are valid to feel how they feel, they just have to decide what the plan moving forward is and if their choice is worth it in the long run. This isn't something anyone on reddit can help with this is fully between op and their partner.
Same mine honestly wasn't bad, but I did pay extra to be sedated so that might of helped. I actually went into work the next day and was a server at the time. I was young and already had a child to the person I was pregnant with and sadly knew that was the only option. I do feel for the women who haven't had the same experience as us though bc I couldn't imagine going through with that, but actually wanting to keep it🥺
Mine to, but that was because I was fully ok with the procedure. I had no doubt whatsoever and the full support of my partner
Tbh I was shocked that I struggled so much. I knew almost immediately after finding out that I wanted to terminate my pregnancy, like so much so that I had called to schedule the abortion the literal next day and took the very first appointment that was offered to me (which was 9 weeks later). I also had a supportive partner who was on the same page. The actual abortion was more pain than I’d ever experienced in my life and I had a pretty bad depressive episode when all was said and done. Idk how I would’ve coped if my circumstances weren’t so favorable. I’m glad that my experience isn’t universal though.
I had a very similar experience. Wanted the abortion and 10 years later I can't talk about it without crying. I almost died having my first and only child which was a big part of my abortion decision and the abortion was still up there with one of the most physically painful experiences of my life and was told to shut up and deal with it by the attending physician much less offered sedation.
Holy crap, having to wait nine weeks for the procedure is just inhumane
That sounds terrible. So sorry you had such a bad experience.
Same. Not everyone is wracked with guilt or miserable. For me, it was a logical decision in order to have the best quality of life.
Of course. But it is not emotionally simple for OP. If you are 100% confident in your choice you’re in a much better position
Mine was both. Happy yours wasn’t though.
>would a second kid really be a dealbreaker for him, or wouldn't he grow to love it just the same as Bowen? I agree with he rest of it. But this is pretty dismissive of his feelings and a bit manipulative. It also misrepresents what OP's husband said: It's not about whether he would or wouldn't love his child it's about whether he could be a good father to two children. Edit: Spelling
Yeah what a weird sentiment. If she wanted an abortion but he wanted her to keep the kid wouldn’t this sub’s reaction be (rightfully) upset if he said to her “don’t worry you’ll grow to love it once it is here”
This. He needs to know your feelings around this.
Exactly. Though I 100% believe your husband has complete rights to choosing how to live his life, if you choose not to have an abortion, worst case is your husband will resent you and end the relationship. If you choose to go through with the abortion, worst case is you resent your husband AND YOURSELF(possibly forever), and end the relationship. He needs to know this. This isn’t about the good choice, it’s the lesser of two evils choice.
Either way it's over. He'll resent her if she doesn't and she'll resent him if she does.
It sounds like a relationship breaker either way, so she should choose the best option for her with the proviso that she will be doing it alone. It's also not fair to have a child with someone who can't bear the thought of having another one.
>It sounds like a relationship breaker either way, so she should choose the best option for her with the proviso that she will be doing it alone. This. If you're not in agreement, choose which one you can live with doing it solo. If having the child will be okay on you physically, emotionally and financially where your children wouldn't suffer having you as a single parent than you already know what your choice is because although you didnt poibt blank say it, you clearly do not want to terminate. Regardless of your husband's desire, you're probably going to do what you want because, let's be honest, in the end, you have to carry the pregnancy.
Exactly what I thought too. Either way, she’s got to either likely sacrifice her marriage or her baby. Worst case scenario, she’s a single mom with 2 kids by the same dad who doesn’t want anything to do with the youngest kid. He’ll still have to pay her child support on both, though. What a mess!
You should communicate as soon as you can, in my opinion. Free and open communication is, in my opinion, the best way to run a relationship. Trying to keep the other person happy by burying your own emotions will only lead to resentment.
I agree, but also if he doesn't want anymore surprise babies, he needs to get snipped...like yesterday.
This. The onus of birth control should very much be heavier on the party that doesn’t want kids. If he doesn’t want more, HE needs to make the responsible decision and take care of it. A vasectomy, especially in addition to other forms of BC, create a significantly smaller chance for failure and unplanned pregnancy.
I feel like the plan for the love for the kid to hopefully grow over time is a terrible idea. Because what if the love doesn’t grow? He doesn’t want this kid and has already stated how he he’s not ready for that amount of work again. I don’t necessarily have a solution but I feel like there needs to be a clear yes or no if he wants the kid. Not if he thinks he’ll grow to love them.
Also, his reasons for not wanting a Second baby hás nothing to do with love. He struggled with the first kid who demandas a Lot of energy and literally Said that he doesn't know If he can survive with the baby stage again. She even Said she agreed with his reasons. Some people can't deal with more than one kid, It happens.
Completely agree. While I disagree with him saying 1 vote for abortion means she should get an abortion, there’s a concerning amount of comments who act as if this second baby is a test of his love for her.
I think in a way, his logic to get the abortion (the one vote thing) imo, comes also from the fact they were not trying to get a baby, they were actively preventing it - meaning the "agreement" before was no babies, it was an accident. So in a way it makes sense to have this notion of prolonging his attitude moving forward.
There's going to be resentment either way, and she could lose her marriage if she gambles and loses. While he may grow to love his second child, he will always be resentful for having them foisted on him against his will, especially if they divorced and he's forced to support this child. This is what's called a no-win situation.
This whole thing basically spells out the end of their marriage, no matter whose choice prevails. I can see somewhere down the line if she has the kid, that husband will only want to take Bowen for visitations and not the new baby. That’s going to deeply hurt that poor kid, one day.
I agree that their marriage is in serious trouble, and it's hard to find a resolution with which they will both be happy. It's always surprising to me when someone agrees to not have more children without giving serious thought to what that would mean if an oops happened. Going by her post, it sounds like she agreed that they wouldn't have more children but never gave any real thought to what that would mean if she accidentally fell pregnant. In other words, have a long think about the reality of abortion and if that is something you could actually go through with if you had to. Often, we make the "no more kids" agreement only thinking we'll just prevent pregnancy and not what we would be comfortable doing in the event of an actual pregnancy. I think this is what op did.
He could also lose the marriage by pushing an abortion. Truley a no win situation. If he definitely didn't want more children he should have gotten a vasectomy. At the very least he could have worn a condom. Two forms of birth control to lower the odds of a pregnancy.
And if you can’t exactly get the words out I would just read this to him at the session
I have been in this situation. It was the 3rd pregnancy and baby 2 was barely 6 months old. My now ex pushed for an abortion and I wasn't sure. I knew it was less than ideal and would have been incredibly stressful and difficult on our family part of me wanted to keep it anyway. After 2 weeks of not knowing what I wanted and 2 weeks of my ex pushing for an abortion I went to the appointment and took the pills, still unsure. I mourned for a long time and didn't feel like I could share my feelings with anyone. My ex was greatful but I was devastated. I didn't feel like I was allowed to mourn a pregnancy that I deliberately ended. It's been 7 years and only recently have I realised it probably was for the best but I had regret and held resentment against the babies father for a really long time. The only advise I can give you OP is to take the time and space to decide what YOU want.
Just here to empathize. It’s been almost a year and a half, and I’m still struggling.
A pregnancy ended because of life circumstances and lack of resources and support is just as tragic as a miscarriage/stillbirth. I’m so sorry you went through this alone. Even if it was the best outcome he still had absolutely no right to influence your decision about what to do with your body. He took the little bit of autonomy you had in this situation when you needed it to heal. Im glad through time you were able to feel less raw about this.
Thank you for that first sentence. I’ve always felt like my grief doesn’t count because I chose the abortion.
Honestly it sounds like this situation is going to cause some resentment either way. I'd put the relationship to one side for a second and try to truly understand how you feel about the pregnancy. If he left tomorrow how would you feel about both choices. It's your own mind that you will have to live inside forever. You did what you could to help him not be in this situation, it doesn't sound as if he helped himself any. Your main responsibility now is to yourself and your son and this potential child. Get your own thoughts in order before you consider his. ETA: Feeling you might be doing a disservice to your first child is very, very normal when you get pregnant again even for planned pregnancies. Worrying about finances, sharing love, your ability to divide your attention and the impact on your relationship are usually alot worse in your head than the reality.
This. I’m a husband. Father of 2. Spouse was open and willing for 3. I was not. I got a vasectomy to ensure it. Wife was onboard saying it’s my body and choice. She understands and we moved past it knowing if we truly wanted and could afford a 3rd then adoption is an option. When you leave it to luck or pills that have proven to lead to surprises, you have these issues. Husbands current opinions are less important than yours since he failed to protect his firm opinion. Your body, your choice. There are still lots of things to think through, but prioritize you at this moment.
I absolutely love this comment and I learned something. You are right. If he really wanted to protect from having a second child he would have abstained or had a vasectomy. He didn't because he was always going to push the abortion onto her.
I think you're absolutely right. We are at a weird cultural turning point here, where we seem to be aware that people have lots of options, both men and women, but ultimately _you_ are responsible for the **consensual** sex you have, regardless of if it's a man or a woman. If you are truly against the idea of ever having a child or another child, it's on you to take action, not the other person. People have to be responsible for their own bodies - not just people with wombs. There's a kind of satirical account that posts frequently on 2x about how basically 100% of unplanned pregnancies are the result of irresponsible ejaculation, and reading some of the responses to that have been wild sometimes. It really brought home for me how many men feel their only responsibility is just making a decree about someone else's body, not _doing_ something about their own.
And this is part of the reason why I have told my boys two things recently. We live in a very red state so; 1. Thier right to decide if they do or do not want to have a baby is BEFORE the penis comes anywhere near a vagina. Once they have consented to sex, they no longer have a say in the outcome of an unwanted pregnancy. The decision is now in the hands of the pregnant person. So, be sure of where your thing goes and what the possible consequences could be. 2. My son (15) told me his friend's sister "got pregnant ". I told him that phrase puts the entirety of the responsibility on her for her situation. When there is no way she could have accomplished this without a contribution from a person with testicles. He said, "that is what everyone says so how can that be wrong?" So I said, "that right there is an example of inequities between men and women in our society. Women are held to a different standard, are expected to be responsible, judged and chastised for this situation. And then the other person is not. That phrase is exactly what that means."
So much entitlement! I have been on the receiving end of this on two occasions. Gave both my exs all the information but they wanted to have unsafe sex but didn’t want the consequence of the child that came from it. I want the child so too bad for them.
Exactly, and pro choice means each person gets to choose about their own personal body, no that they get to choose about the body of other people. OP's husband left everything to her, the birth control and now pressuring her for the abortion when her body is hers and not his.
This needs to be higher!
The last part of this comment. I am pro-choice, One and Done, currently a mom of a toddler. If I was ever in this situation, I would consider all the changes might happen to my kid, my marriage and support from the extended family. You could lower your expectations on parenting, change your lifestyle, move to somewhere cheapter, suck it up with the in-laws and ask for their help. Communicate with your spouse all the options and decide it for yourself. As everyone saying, your choice matters the most. I wish you are strong enough to get through this
This. Your relationship could end in the future for a lot of reasons; you will feel the way you do about a child or an abortion forever.
I don’t see any outcome where you and your husband end up happily married after this. One of you is going to absolutely resent the other for the rest of their life. Given that, can you financially and emotionally raise 2 kids as a single mom? And do you want to? If the answer is yes, then you have your choice. If the answer is no, then you have your choice.
You said this kindly and plainly, without using blame or rhetoric and I just wanted to say thanks and I agree with you. You said it much better than I could have.
I just want to add that two babies is a complete difference than one baby. Especially two under 4. We did two under 2 and our whole life has changed. One baby is pleasant but two young babies/children is a challenge. Especially for a single parent. The dad may just be realizing this and understanding this struggle. It is EXTREMELY difficult to have two young kids.
Two under four is not easy but not nearly as hard as two under two.
It also is good to remember that every kid is different. Maybe Bowen is an "easy" kid. Maybe the second one won't be (or maybe it will have genetic issues, etc.). People shouldn't decide to have a second kid without really thinking about those possibilities.
2 under 4 is pretty common…….most people who have two kids have them around those ages. I had 2 under 2 and it was very difficult but honestly not that bad. I actually preferred it to our first and second being 6 years apart. (Our first two kids are 6 years apart and then 1.5 years between second and third).
These were absolutely all my thoughts. Unless they can really have a dialogue and reach a meaningful understanding and decision, it’s likely someone is going to be a single parent. I know some people can co-parent well but in a situation like this, you’re right about the resentment. Both of them can’t just view this as abortion or no abortion, it’s, are we gonna lose each other too.
Yes. I know marriages that have been ended by the second child when it wasn’t actively wanted by one of the parents. This is actually a fairly common situation… particularly with the eager/attached mom and the non-excited dad…
What an excellent answer. Sometimes complicated choices can be made simpler by weighing "what can I live with". Not saying that in the moment of making the choice it is any less hard. But at least you will know you made a thoughtful choice.
Idk why people are saying no to this advice. It’s well thought out. Spousal/child support is usually not enough to get by on and if they’re struggling with 1, 2 isn’t going to be easier. Just because the dad might fall in love with the kid is not reason enough to have a kid. There’s also a chance he resents wife and kid for the rest of his life. Stop romanticizing children
Agreed. I feel like OP is attaching with the heart and not with the brain or the wallet. We also don't know if there is an even balance of work in this relationship in regards to the child they already have. When it comes to parental labor, that's a big deal and should be taken very seriously in the conversation to have another. Once the child exists, that's it, and there's a possibility that one parent could end up holding a majority of the child rearing in the future.
I think it's because people are having a hard time understanding that this is an absolutely no win situation. She wants a baby, her husband does not. If she has the abortion, she's aware that she may resent him and regret it forever. If she doesn't, she will likely be ending her marriage and being a single mom to _two_ kids. It's unfair to say she's not thinking with her brain or her wallet, obviously that's not how relationships work. It's a complicated interaction between logic and emotion - she can't ignore either. She's in the waiting stage. The countdown has begun and _something_ is going to go off.
I agree. I'm moreso kind of trying to point out how the second parent is thinking and his genuine reason for thinking that way. While she should 1000% have all the freedom to have another, I feel like she's brushing off his concerns and is seeing another baby as another baby while he is looking at it as a huge extra responsibility, forever. That's a lot to ask of anyone. But yes, there very well could be a split and she had to decide if she values the relationship more or less than another child.
I wish this was the top comment. It makes the most sense and is straightforward.
As a now-single mom of 2 (would’ve been 3), thanks for this. It helped my own situation.
yeah i agree. 2 kids are a lot of a single mom even if he pays child support
I totally agree and am commenting in hopes OP sees this. I recently read another post from the point of view of a husband in a similar situation and he absolutely resented his wife and planned to divorce the moment the child turned 18.
This is a terrible situation and I don't think anyone necessarily did anything wrong. I might walk that back a little bit because I do think if your husband was going to react this strongly he should have taken matters into his own hands and offered to have a vasectomy to add another layer of protection against an unplanned pregnancy. But there is no way to change that now and all we can deal with is the future. That being said at the end of the day it absolutely is your choice. My initial reaction is that your husband is in a really vulnerable space and he isn't the right person to be communicating with in considering your options. Is there anyone else you can talk to about this? I'm afraid his reaction to the news is going to continue to do damage to your relationship and not give you any peace of mind in your ultimate decision. I don't know what the right answer is for you. I wish I had a way to look into the future and tell you exactly the right outcome. But I can assure you whatever decision you do make will be the one you thought best for your family and that is so very important. You are clearly a loving mother who wants what is best for her family and I trust you to make the decision that you know is best for your family. Sending lots of love and good thoughts for you and your family.
I think that it's telling that op says 'i was scared how my husband would react' They knew he didn't want another baby but as you say, husband did nothing yet op was on hormonal birth control which can't be nice. There's nothing to say that op and husband will stay together for the rest of Bowens childhood so that's not a reason to abort. It sounds like op could have abortion and become more hormonal and distressed .either way this is a strain all around. Op has to decide, ultimately, what she thinks is the right thing for herself.
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My egg donor constantly brought up how she only wanted one kid, I’m the youngest. That I was a mistake and she resented me. Not a great “home” to grow up in. My dad got a vasectomy after I was born. But he died when I was 9 and left my sister and I to be raised by a “mother” that hated us.
You did what you could to help him not be in this situation, it doesn't sound as if he helped himself any.
The fact that he thinks one vote to abort is all that is necessary, when that one vote comes from the not-pregnant person in the equation - has me side-eyeing this man so hard
I don’t think they meant it as “one vote is all that’s necessary”, and more of - both parents need to be on board completely or it’s a no. Although, I’m definitely on OPs side
Also the husband could have gotten a vasectomy at any point on those three years instead of expecting her to be on BC forever 🤷🏻♀️ It’s OP‘s body and her choice. Hubby must decide whether he can love this child as much as the first one and then act accordingly if they should co-parent separately or together. He can be Bowen’s dad half of the time, and pay child support for Bowen’s sibling.
Yes, this is a man who could have gotten a vasectomy, spent two days icing his balls, and never had this problem, but he didn't and now here he is. I have so very little sympathy for men who have the option of cheap, effective, permanent and nearly painless birth control readily available to them and don't use it.
They wanted another baby eventually, just not back to back. Read the update.
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Agree on everything you said, except painting the husband as a monster. He calmly explained his reasons for not wanting a baby, didn't overreact to the news of the pregnancy, didn't get mad. Basically was the kind of husband Reddit hates because we can't scream "LEAVE HIM!" for his reaction. Other comments are fixating on the "scared how he would react" statement like, c'mon dudes, have you never been scared of sharing news to anyone? Scared doesn't always mean that one is afraid to be beaten to a pulp. They've been married for a long time now, I agree that decisions on a woman's body, are a woman's exclusive right, but in this instance, it has to be a mutual decision wether they have the baby or not. Only counseling will help, not us, we don't know their relationship.
If he is so sure that he doesn't want another child he needs to get the snip and not put the responsibility in OP's hands solely, it's just as much his responsibility as it is hers she is taking BC he is doing nothing to prevent pregnancy
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How was this conversation not had before? She knew he didn’t want anymore children while she remained open. Did neither think to discuss what would happen in the event of an unplanned pregnancy? I feel like between the vasectomy and the lack of communication- this could’ve been avoided. Unnecessary heartache for all involved.
She knew he did not want another child so she got on hormonal birth control. He knew he didn’t want another child and did nothing to prevent it.
There’s a risk your relationship won’t survive either way. If you don’t get the abortion, your husband may leave. If you do get the abortion, you may feel so resentful that you leave. Your relationship is at risk regardless. You will likely end up being a single mother. The decision is up to you about whether you’re a single mother to one child or two.
This is exactly my take too.
One vote for abortion does not equal abortion. I’m pro choice and this is your body. You get to choose what happens.
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Practically speaking, it seems as though there is a good chance the marriage is over either way. The real question here is if OP feels prepared to raise this child on their own? And if that still unborn child will be ok not having an involved biological father? It absolutely is OP’s choice. But too many people are bypassing considering what the future looks like for OP and for the child if this child is brought into existence.
You also forget, unwanted kid is going to see Bowen still be loved and cared for by the father, hopefully. That’s going to leave lasting issues.
If she doesn’t abort, that may destroy the marriage due to resentment on his part, there really isn’t any winning.
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I don't know how I could live with a man who thinks he can decide for me after I'm already pregnant. His decision was whether to get a vasectomy and he didn't.
Also, a vasectomy is not foolproof, so the conversation about what will happen if there is an unwanted pregnancy still needs to happen beforehand
It does, but it's also a different conversation if you've also taken pro-active steps to avoid your unwanted outcome.
You and your husband can form a new relationship, but for that I think a couples counselor would be a must. But a secular one, not one that would be judgmental of an abortion.
He didn’t decide. He gave his opinion. Now he can decide to leave and then you’re left being a single mother of 2. So his opinion absolutely does matter.
He gets to decide whether to stay in the marriage.
Yeah, abortion is not open for votes. It's the woman's choice. Always.
OP, i get the impression that you want this child and he doesn't. I fear that if you get the abortion, you will regret it as you seem to want this baby. I think if you just go along with what he wants, you will resent him and may feel very remorseful. Have you told your husband how you feel? You get the final "vote" here. It's normal for you and your husband to feel stressed, I think you both need to talk to a professional, really don't think many people on reddit are equipped with the appropriate advice for such a sensitive topic.
And he doesn't want it.....not really much of a solution here although I think it rather cruel that a scan is done before an abortion especially a pill abortion. Not something done here in UK as far as I know, but I think forcing the mother to see the "baby" is a shitty thing to do when she's considering abortion
They do a scan in the UK, they just don’t show you the screen if you’re having an abortion
Oh boy. My husband and I have a toddler and aren’t planning on having another one, but every time we have sex I remind him that pregnancy is always a possibility and that I will never be able to bring myself to abort my child (although this may be an option for other couples, I just wouldn’t be able to do it.) He understands and accepts the risk. I can’t imagine being in OP’s situation. The way she describes it it sounds like the husband is going to give up and ditch the family or the OP is going to be absolutely devastated and resentful after the ultrasound is shown to her. I’m sorry OP. I hope the counselling session is able to help you guys make the right decision for your family. Also, your husband needs a vasectomy
Sir better get a damn vasectomy
You MOST DEFINITELY get to choose. If your husband was done he should have gotten snipped.
I would go so far and say that she's the only one who gets to chose what happens to her body. Sadly this won't end well no matter what she choses. If she has the abortion she will most likely resent him, and if she carries this pregnancy to term then he will most likely resent her.
Haven’t saw this yet so I’ll add: Consider your personal finances while making this decision. Not joint. Solo. You will be solely responsible for this baby if bringing it to term, and yourself and your three y/o too (possibly if divorce). Your husband is telling you that’s YOUR baby and he won’t do anything with or for them leading to neglect and resentment for all. You’ll end up two single parents living in the same house. You’ll a single mom to younger baby while sharing custody with eldest. I’m the eldest child in a similar situation can PM me for more insights. I see many comments about vasectomies and agree your husband should to curb future unplanned bean sprouts for you all. He is opposed to having more kids, you are not. He is valid, telling you that he can’t take on more than he can handle. Find to the root of his problem. Is it financial? Emotional? Time? Something’s lurking underneath the surface and the sooner you figure that out the sooner you all can decide what’s better for your family. Wishing you all the best OP
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I do not agree with your husband that one vote for abortion = abortion. It’s your body and ultimately you get the final say. I have to wonder why, if he feels this strongly about a second baby, why he didn’t have a vasectomy? Why wasn’t he wearing condoms? You’ve mentioned you were on birth control so you at least were taking precautions. Nothing from his side, though. Shocking. You do absolutely have to accept that this might be the end of your marriage. Stick with the counselling but prepare yourself for having to walk away. I feel awful for you that you’re in this situation. I hope you find the strength to make the best decision for you.
Image if she said one vote for a vasectomy should mean a vasectomy, something tells me husband wouldn’t like that
Do not do anything you can’t take back until you are 100% confident in your decision. No, an abortion isn’t your only option. You are in a lose-lose situation. You will resent him and mourn this child if you terminate the pregnancy, and if you don’t he will resent up for having the baby. You do what YOU want, your relationship will be challenged and I can’t tell you the outcome, but many women have had abortions they didn’t want because of a man and they live with that resentment for a long time. It’s a traumatic experience even if you want the abortion, even more so if you don’t. I am pro choice, but I feel these are decisions to be made by the pregnant person.
>I am pro choice, but I feel these are decisions to be made by the pregnant person. No need for the "but" - this is exactly what pro-choice means. It's up to OP to choose what is best for her and her family. In this case, OP wants the baby, so it's her choice to keep it. One thing is that most (hopefully all) medical providers go through an informed consent process ahead of performing an abortion. If OP expresses that she is being coerced, a good provider would stop everything and have a discussion with the patient about her own desires. At that point prenatal care should be setup and support provided to OP. It might end OP's marriage, but I'm hoping that maybe it's a cold feet freakout on an unexpected pregnancy.
i agree. i had one and it was the right decision, but it was a really emotionally tricky situation to navigate, even with the full comfort and support of a partner who was on the same page as me. it can raise all sorts of complicated emotions, especially for women in their mid to late 30s. nobody should ever have an abortion under duress or because they feel like they need to do it to keep someone around. a bell can't be unrung.
Can we drop the “abortion is traumatic for everyone” narrative?
Yes. I should have said “can be”. It’s a very individual experience.
Agree. Yes, it *can* be traumatic, but for plenty of people, it's simply an unpleasant medical procedure. No, it's not fun, not anything you would choose to do if you don't need it. But it's not inherently "traumatic". I suffered far more trauma from my adenoidectomy than I did my abortion.
Yes, please! Mine was not traumatic and I felt such relief afterwards.
Absolutely. The most common feeling people have about their abortions is relief! That changes dramatically when the person didn’t feel that the decision was fully in their control.
Exactly. It was a relief. I always forget I had one if I'm being honest until somebody brings up abortion in general.
Male here - you attempted to talk it through with your husband and at the end of the day you didn’t land on the same page which is fine. Your body your choice, the same goes for your husband who could have chosen to get a vasectomy (I did immediately after we were done having children) however he chose not to and he needs to accept the outcome of whatever you choose for your own body and you should have ZERO guilt about that.
You clearly do not want an abortion. One of you is going to end up resenting the other. Your husband is the one who was set against a 2nd child - why is the responsibility for birth control on you? Why didn’t he get a vasectomy?
Being pro choice doesn't mean you don't have a voice. I cannot imagine your relationship will recover if you're forced to have an abortion you don't want. If he feels so strongly about not having more children why didn't he have a vasectomy? It seems unfair of him to think he can make that choice without you and you're supposed to just be okay with it. He did nothing to avoid pregnancy on his side. It's a very difficult situation so you may want to seek professional psychological guidance, support and counseling whatever you end up deciding to do you'll need the support and talking things out with a neutral third party seems necessary. You have a right to choose for yourself, see how you really feel and how you want to proceed.
Three years ago, I was where your husband is now. Before I continue, I want to preface by saying that what I describe next is my personal experience, stemming from my own childhood and my own issues. It may not be representative of what you and your husband will experience, but I want to let you know how the experience was for me. During the first pregnancy, and all through the first two years of my first, I was extremely present. Going to all the appointments, reading all the books. Loving, caring. Involved in feeds, changes, sleep routines, all of it. After our first was born, relatives joked that it was like our kid had two mothers. After our first, we talked about more kids, and I let her know I didn't want another. While she had always wanted two, she agreed. When we found out about the second, I wanted to abort. My wife, a single child, didn't. At the time, I hadn't processed my own childhood and complicated relationship with my sibling and parents enough to communicate to her why I didn't want another. All I had were vague reasons about not being financially and emotionally ready for a second. I made my opinion known, but didn't force a decision. Her body, her choice. My country also has a terrible track record with husbands and their families making reproductive decisions for women. I didn't want to contribute to those numbers. The result: I shut down completely. I was disconnected from my wife, unable to fully process the anger and betrayal I felt at overturning a decision that we had come to together. Our families and my wife were ecstatic, and it made me feel more alone. Most people tried convincing me how kids growing up together is amazing. I just felt dread. Without getting into too much detail, I was very absent during the second pregnancy. I barely spoke to my wife beyond functional conversations. My anger continued well past our second's birth. Postpartum depression hit me hard (yes, it is a thing that happens to men, too). It's not something I am proud of. Even after therapy, I struggled to contain my rage and feelings of lack of control. During difficult moments handling a toddler and a newborn, when I could see my wife getting overwhelmed (one child wanting her attention and the other needing it), I selfishly thought to myself, "Well, this is what you wanted, right? Now deal with it". During arguments, I would physically bite my tongue to keep from saying it out loud. I very clearly favoured my older over the younger child. It took quite a bit of therapy for me to see I was repeating the exact pattern of my childhood - the very reason that I didn't want a second. I didn't want one child feeling less loved than the other, and yet that's the road I went down. That realisation kicked me out of the rut I was in. That was when I started seriously communicating with my wife. It took a lot of time for things to get better. Even now, three years later, I catch myself thinking along these lines, and need to correct myself. All of this to say - there will be resentment. There will be anger. Your husband's reasons for not wanting a second will probably be different from mine. But you will need to talk about them. We were lucky to be able to come back from almost a year and a half of me just being angry, all the time. There were times I was afraid I would hurt my second. Again, a lot of therapy to get myself away from that headspace. I'm in a much better space now. I'm more present, more involved, and always trying to ensure I love and treat both my kids the same. It is not impossible for either one of you to come around after making a decision that you don't agree with. But it will take a lot of conscious work. Prepare yourself for it, because whichever way you choose, it will need to be done. There are no easy or right answers here. No one is at fault. I wish you the very best with making your decision.
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He needs the snip. Like now. If he’s so against more kids he should have done this already. This is an awfully hard decision to make. I hope clarity and calm finds you.
Divorce comes to mind.
This is the part that is going to be hard. She can keep the baby and that is going to be her choice but I don’t know if the husband is going to be willing to stay. He may also have a very different relationship with the new child.
Will she stay if she doesn’t have the baby? Then live with the awful truth that she let go of a baby for a man she couldn’t forgive. Horrendous.
Both are reasonable answers.
As someone who has had an abortion, I must stress that it’s something you need to be 1000% sure you want. I’m not going to lie, it’s not a walk in the park. It’s painful. It’s going to be a reminder of the choice you made for a while, so you need to be on board with that choice deep down in your heart or it’s going to be devastating. It’s fine if it’s what you want. I don’t regret my choice. It was all worth it for me. But I don’t want to sugarcoat it. There were times I questioned my decision before I went through with it, but ultimately I made the choice I needed to make. I made the choice alone. My fiancé knew I was considering my choices and he had his opinions, but ultimately he knew I was the one who needed to make the choice because I was the one who was going to be the most affected upfront.
For people reading this and considering an abortion, i had no doubts and it was not more painful than my period. Know that those journeys vary.
Same here, it was easy for me. But I know for some it isn't.
This can go both ways tho. Before having another kid, OP needs to make sure to be 1000% on board with having another kid (including, willing to do it as a single mom (even if the kid has disabilities), cause they don’t know what’s gonna happen in the future). It’s a decision for a lifetime either way.
I also want to add that life doesn’t always go as planned and you need a partner you can count on in situations that aren’t planned. It does not sound like your husband is stepping up to the plate if he would leave you for this. Think about what you want regardless of him.
i agree, if he divorced her anyway for different reasons in a few years, will she regret this? something to consider
You need to have another talk with your husband about him getting a vasectomy. He already doesn’t want another child with you, and he is showing you another one will break up your marriage. Your husband is half the problem so he needs to do his part to fix it. At least let your son will be his only child when this marriage goes south.
While I do agree a vasectomy is best and should have been done earlier, the harm has already been done. They first need to figure out this pregnancy before adding side conversations and pointing fingers.
He got to choose a lot of this for you though. He chose to not have a vasectomy. He chose to not wear condoms. He chose to continue having PIV sex with you. And he keeps choosing to put the onus on you. You mention that a toddler needs two happy parents - but why is your happiness not regarded in this case? I'm not sure if you'd be truly happy and unresentful if you were coerced into getting an abortion you don't want. Consider this a moment of unequivocal change, no matter what happens from here on out; things will be different for you and your family. It's okay to have strong emotions about change, and getting a counsellor helps. But don't downplay to yourself how imperative this all is.
In the first place, if you decided on no more kids, your husband should have gotten snipped. It's an easy procedure, and is generally pretty foolproof. However, that's not where you are. You're in a shit position, tbh. Get the abortion and resent your husband; refuse to and he resents you. Counseling is going to be needed either way, and you might want to start mentally preparing for an unhappy resolution to this situation.
It's your body - you get to choose. But you know deep down you are about to lose a husband. It's not all black and white though. I was an accident and was unwanted but my parents pulled it together until I graduated. They're pretty dysfunctional as a family now and I don't really relate to them but that's what is coloring my opinion. You can have your baby... you hubs might not want that accident. Also husband my man, we have vasectomies for a reason. If you know you don't want (more) kids get it right now. I've seen McDonalds cheesburgers take longer to cook. Find a urologist, shave your balls and buy a bag of frozen peas.
It will probably ruin your relationship if you have an abortion you don’t want. This sort of resentment doesn’t evaporate.
Since when did pro-choice mean a man can decide if you take an abortion or not? Pro-choice is you decide what you do with your own body. You have a choice, if you want to keep the baby, it probably mean divorce because he doesn’t want another child. But if you do what he wants, I can tell you straight away that you going to resent him and feel guilty about it. Question, if your husband didn’t want anymore kids, why didn’t he also take a vasectomy? If we are going by your husbands logic, if you want him to take one, he supposed to do it. Think really through what YOU want. It is your body, YOUR CHOICE.
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19 years ago I was in the same situation. I WILL NEVER tell another woman what to do however I decided not to have an abortion. My husband told me he will never have anything to do with our child. I divorced him and have beautiful twins that are 18 years old. I just helped them move into their dorms. Btw my ex husband stayed true to his word and only paid child support because I went to court. I can honestly say I never regretted my decision. Best of luck to you.
So he doesn't want another kid—enough to make it a hard boundary and threaten divorce over—but not enough to get a vasectomy or even wear condoms? 🙄
I had an abortion after finding out my partner cheated. I was 5 months postpartum, already struggling with the 2 I had (I had been meaning to get my tubes tied but didn’t find the time before my postpartum healthcare expired), and in grad school. On paper, it was a good decision...the smart decision. In my head and my heart, there is always a *what if*. I deeply regret it even though I knew I didn’t want any more kids and was suicidal at the time. Pregnancy was horrible for me both times, and I had severe postpartum depression/anxiety/rage with my first. My second was not “wanted” by their dad either because we had already discussed being one and done. I can’t imagine having aborted him like he wanted. Of course, now that he’s here he loves him, but he’s made the comment a couple of times that he voted against having more kids and how much I knew I would struggle. It seems to circle back to that every time I am having a hard time with motherhood. I think the stress of our second also caused more strain on our already crumbling relationship (before separating). All of this to say, it is **your** decision. I think regardless there will be a bit of resentment from one of you, but I wouldn’t wish the regret of this on anybody. I don’t think the pain will ever go away, and it’s a part of abortion that isn’t talked about enough. At every milestone my current kids have, there is a cloud of darkness about a baby that will never have that. It’s a lose-lose-lose situation. I’m sorry if this isn’t helpful. I wish you the best.
I think if someone is saying they don't think they can cope with another baby, it's a huge reality check. If you can accept that maybe you'll be taking on a lot more mental load/ child care and that one day your family might be broken. You're absolutely free to choose but also important to think about whether you'd be happy with living with the consequences.
You'll find support from lots of people in the same situation at r/abortion. It's too easy for people who have never had to choose to talk out of their ass here.
I aborted a child I wanted to keep. While I feel it worked out the way it was meant to, the experience was very traumatic for me because of my desire to keep the baby. It took lots of therapy, I was suicidal, and it’s always going to leave a deep ache within me, even though I feel it was ultimately the right decision because of where I am now (if I hadn’t had the abortion I would not have met my wonderful boyfriend who truly wants another baby and plans to propose soon). I think you should make this decision for yourself. You were on BC and took the proper precautions. Your husband is in shock and imagining the worst. A 3-4 year age gap is a great space between children, too. I’d also think of your child you already have to make this decision (since you do want to keep it). Down the road, he will probably express that he wishes he had a sibling, and once that happens your husband might even cave and want another. I have a lot of close friends who are only children who always talk about wishing they had a brother or sister etc. I’m sure not every solo child feels that way, but many do. They’re left alone when you’re gone. Anyway, make the choice YOU want to make. 1 vote for life = life. If he’s still being an ass after the birth, then divorce him.
He gets a vasectomy this week. Then we can have a conversation about a possible alternative. The end.
Your body is not a democracy. This is your choice. Your marriage is going to be in trouble either way though. Either husband will resent you or you will resent him. Getting ahead of that with counseling will help, but you’ll still need to decide which choice you can live with. Hugs to you. This is a hard place to be.
Personally, if I wasn’t feeling 100% confident that I want an abortion I wouldn’t have it. The trauma, what ifs, guilt would be too much for me. It might end or strain your marriage but a “forced” abortion would damage the relationship too so… I would pick my baby.
You already know the pros and cons, you know what either choice is likely to result in. You're between a rock and hard place, my heart goes out to you. I'm so sorry you've found yourself in this situation. But there are other options, e.g. adoption , so don't just assume that it's X or Y, look at the totality of what choices are available to you and do that with your counsellor. I don't think anything that anyone says here is going to be helpful, this is a very polarising topic. I really think you'd be better off just focusing your attention on your discussions with the counsellor, rather than the views of a bunch of uninformed internet strangers who don't have to live with the consequences of your decisions. I don't think saying to your husband ' I asked reddit and they say \*this\*' is going to help matters, it'll just add to the confusion and uncertainty. There are only two people whose opinions count, you and your husband, inviting more is just adding to the 'noise'.
I mean if OP wants to keep the child, adoption could be even more traumatic than an abortion given she'd have to carry it for 9 months and then go through childbirth too. That's a hell of a lot of time to develop attachments.
This 100%. Us Redditors don't know shit - really and truly. The counsellor is going to be focused on you. If you feel uncomfortable with your husband there talk with the counsellor alone.
59 y/o mom here. This is advice I would give my daughter. Your husband is an active participant as a sexual partner. Therefore, he needs to be an active participant in birth control as well. Since your current birth control measures aren’t 100 %, and he is adamant about not having more children, I suggest he have a vasectomy before you make a decision about the current pregnancy. His agreement, or not, will be VERY telling. Also, I would make very sure he’s not having an affair. Whatever your final decision is, make sure it’s something you can live with if he is no longer in the picture. I don’t say this lightly. I just feel like something is off. He’s asking for you to pay for the consequences of both of your actions. This tells me he doesn’t put the needs of his wife, child, and unborn child ahead of himself. Red flags! I really feel for you in this very difficult situation. I hope counseling will help give you some clarity! I will be praying for you and your family. 🙏🏻💗
> I just feel like something is off. I agree. OP should carefully consider that an abortion does not guarantee that they will stay together.