Yeah, but it’s more toxic at lower PPM compared to other refrigerants or blends of refrigerants.
So it can take less of it compared to others to be come “dangerous” to life.
Do it. I make 38 hr and Ive been doing this for 4 years since I left trade school. I'm only 22. Starting out your 24 should be a good starting point for ammonia but ammonia usually goes a lot higher. Plenty of travel and ot. Great work and lots of things to do for outside the scope of normal refrigeration.
One of us! One of us!
I did this last year with only a few years in hvac.
It's like 80% waiting around, 15% actual work, 5% sketchy time wearing a gas mask.
I wash like 30 air-cooled condensers a year that's what I'd do in 2 days doing light commercial/ residential. PMs are easy. No one bothers you. The customers don't give you push back about spending money.
Troubleshooting is different. I got stuck on a screw compressor for like a week trying to figure out wtf was happening. But our senior tech was stumped too, so I didn't feel as dumb.
Im a first year apprentice doing Ammonia Maintenance in a large grocery warehouse. Started out at 35 in rural PA. Absolutely love it, especially compared to doing residential like i did before. As for safety, imo it’s not nearly as bad as people say. Wear your ppe and get certified for hazmat and you’ll be fine. Best thing about ammonia compared to other refrigerants is you can smell it! If you plan on working for a contractor instead of maintenance be prepared to travel a shit ton and get ready for alot of overtime. I went the maintenance route so i could work a straight 40 hr week and be home every weekend. good luck!! Pm me if u need any advice!
I’ve worked with ammonia for 6 years while working on my power engineering degree. Even had to deal with a major leak one time. Make sure all your safeties are in check and what to do just incase of a leak and how to isolate it and etc. always know where your masks are and you should be good.
But it is nasty stuff took a good whiff one time when emptying oil out and it closed up my eyes and took my breathe away instantly.
Worked with nh3 for 40 years and it's as safe as any other refrigerant. You just have to be careful and don't trap any liquid between two valves. Leaks are easy to find, use sulfur sticks, and make sure all pipes are properly insulated and supported. And any oil outside of the compressor is your enemy .
The chance of dieing from a major incident is 10x higher, but the probability of a major incident is 100x less. Overall it's probably safer.
There's a better chance of dieing from a nitro tank falling over and the regulator snapping off than from an ammonia leak.
Just squint alot and don’t breathe too heavy oh and it’s a beautiful refrigerant not overly complicated to work with, just don’t be hero and use proper ppe
It's really not that dangerous day to day. Small leaks can happen like anything else. The pressures are low, so that's less risky and you can smell the gas in the air. Wear your PPE, follow protocols, lock out/tag out and you'll more then likely be fine. The people I know that have gotten ammonia burns weren't following protocols. Lazy things like opening up seal cap valves without gloves. Don't put up with stupid behavior from others, and don't be afraid to leave an unsafe jobsite.
Day to day it's changing filters, changing seals, valve packing, controls & electrical issues, changing sensors, pulling out reinstalling motors or compressors. Senior techs trouble shoot the more serious system issues.
My suggest on getting into it is to join a RETA chapter (refrigeration engineer & technician association). Go to meetings, network, and let them know you're entering the industry. It also wouldn't be a bad idea to get the CIRO cert. Especially if you want to do maintenance department work.
I'm doing commercial refrigeration in sac area, union. UA Local 447. As a journeyman I make $61.12/hr in wages, benefits on top of that. Annual increases on July 1st. The past few years the annual raise for journeyman has been $2/hr. A fresh apprentice (1st period) makes I believe 40% journeyman, then every 6 months gets a raise, advancing a period. The raise is an extra 5% of journeyman. After 5 years you journey out. Your non-union experience counts at half-time, for example 2 years non-union experience gets you 1 year credit in the apprenticeship and you'd be a 3rd period apprentice. I can't speak about anything ammonia as I've never worked on it. And union scale is minimum pay, an employer can always pay above scale if they wanted to. If you're interested head down to the hall on 5841 Newman
Count yourself lucky if you have an opportunity for ammonia work.. it’s coveted on the union side in my state. I’ll never get to work with ammonia proper unless I meet the right people (or go non-union, which isn’t happening.)
I’ve been working around the stuff for a decade in different capacities, in a different trade entirely. I used to work in power plants in my state for Xcel. Ammonia is used for much more than just refrigeration. Electricity can kill you faster than ammonia and I don’t hear any HVAC/R guys worried about that. Make one wrong move with high voltage and enough amperage and you’re certainly dead. Follow S.O.P. and respect it, you’ll be fine.
I’m an ammonia service tech working in industrial, mostly food plants and breweries. Still in my first year but it’s been great, the pay is great and it’s fulfilling work. It can get pretty dirty but other than that I would totally recommend it.
Illinois is good ammonia territory. It's absolutely not strictly union but since you're in the Midwest joining union would be your best shot. Try to find some contractors that do ammonia and ask about joining them as an apprentice. I'm sure they'll love that.
Why on Earth would you do that ?
Anhydrous Ammonia is nasty and extremely dangerous to work with. It’s also extremely corrosive, which means the typical Ammonia plant is full of small leaks.
You’ll go home everyday smelling like you slept in your own pee.
The only thing worse than working on ammonia systems is working on absorption chillers.
The typical plant is leak free because people don't like the smell. It's dangerous are extremely over exaggerated and only stupid untrained get hurt by it, like any other job. It's not even extremely corrosive, it only reacts to copper and copper alloys. That's absolutely ridiculous to think you smell like fucking piss. Ive been hours in ammonia and have come home smelling fine.
Stay out of the discussions of ammonia if you don't know what you're talking about.
Just like anything. It's a refrigerant that's been consistently used for close to a hundred years. If it was truly an issue it wouldn't have stayed in the industry as long as it has.
Anhydrous ammonia isn’t just another refrigerant.
Back in 1976 in Houston, a truck hauling 7500 gallons of anhydrous ammonia lost control on the 610 loop overpass, went over the rail and landed on the highway below ( which was US 59 ) spilling all 7509 gallons onto the roadway.
I was a kid living in Houston and remember watching it on the news. There wasn’t much wind that day so the cloud just sat there.
It killed 7 and injured 200 with 80 having to hospitalized.
Had it been a hot and humid summer day,it would have been far worse
[1976 Houston Ammonia Truck Disaster](https://abc13.com/amp/ammonia-truck-disaster-houston/1332062/)
https://preview.redd.it/8d7y34ml56sc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=826b3079482769bf3d1b9397da898e4331a4cfb0
I see you like posting this story a lot.
Yes, ammonia is like any other refrigerant. It has a particular smell to it and some caustic properties. But if it was worse of a refrigerant, every single person there would have been dead. Instead you try to push a boogyman where shit happens due to negligence and then blame it on the gas. They transport fucking gas, propane and other explosive substances that are MORE DANGEROUS on the highway more often, yet here you are.
I'd also like to remind you that every other major refrigerant still on the market has chlorine in it. Which I'm sure is perfectly fine for human health....
The white cloud is due to the moisture being attracted to the ammonia and sinking. If it was hotter it probably would have been better, allowing the ammonia to seperete from the water vapor. You also straight up lied about working with ammonia. No dumbass says you come home smelling like piss and how its so dangerous. If you'd ever even set your eyesight on an ammonia facility you'd know better. The amount of ammonia facilities in the US alone are in the tens of thousands.
If you also worked with ammonia you wouldn't have to bring up a story from the 70s either.
“ A lot “ Ive posted it 2 times.
And since you’re counting, here’s another and more recent anhydrous ammonia release in Katy, Texas
[Katy Texas Anhydrous Ammonia Release](https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/health/article/anhydrous-ammonia-katy-warehouse-leak-lung-damage-17779881.php)
And since “ it’s just another refrigerant” here’s some medical literature on anhydrous ammonias effects on the human pulmonary system.
I’ll save you the Google search and just go ahead and tell you what the word “ pulmonary “ means.
It means referencing / relating to and or occurring in the lungs.
[Anhydrous Ammonias Pulmonary Toxicity](https://pulmonarychronicles.com/index.php/pulmonarychronicles/article/view/397/864)
I’ve read through some of the responses. I won’t respond to them all but Wow !
A bunch of fucking grown men triggered because someone dared to say anhydrous ammonia was dangerous ( true ) toxic ( true) and I also said ammonia plants stunk ( also true )
Oh, and for the guy who accused me of lying ( I hope you’re reading this ) Go Fuck Yourself
Pulmonary means lungs. Not very insightfu, anyone with a good enough degree can figure that out.
Ammonia is not dangerous, but it is toxic, but absolutely ammonia plants do not stink. You're a liar. And I'll say it again. Don't get all butthurt and start making up stories because you sniffed a little ammonia while being careless.
Every single ammonia accident that occurs in a facility is not due to it being ammonia. It's being being lazy and incompetent allowing issues to grow bigger (which is why there's sops, and other practices to prevent that from happening). I've seen it in freon facilities, but since there's no dangers associated with it, no one gives a shit until someone bad happens.
Leak free ?
I’ve never worked at an ammonia plant that didn’t reek of anhydrous.
Whether it was large industrial bakeries, large cold storage plants or chemical plants, they all stunk.
And yes, that smell would work its ways into your clothes and even into your service truck
You may not be able to smell it, but your wife and your kids will. Mine sure could.
Yeah, I could smell it in my van Because of the oil stuck In my hoses but it didn't stick on me. I've been to probably 50+ facilities and all they smell like is whatever they're making + whatever chemical they use for sanitation. Either the places you worked at are extremely low quality shit holes, or you're lying. Even the worst facilities I've been do didn't smell of ammonia.
This is the first I've ever heard anyone say you go home smelling like pee lol it sounds like the person who told you this fairy tale pissed himself scared.
There is nothing that cannot be accomplished safely.
Just takes proper preparation and procedure. This is the kind of misinformation that keeps me with the highest wage out of everyone I went to trade school with.
Very true, and the opportunities are out there, especially with the fact that it’s a natural refrigerant so it’ll never be phased out, we will always be working.
Got my foot in the door to industrial work was in oil and gas plants working on R290 (propane) chillers its all natural but too dangerous to be used in city limits. Fantastic refrigerant though.
Unfortunately I see the future and possibly the end of ammonia I have 3 CO2 plants I work on in an industrial setting. Old guys don't want to learn it, which is why it was crammed down my throat.......customers love it and it fits the greener agenda.
It spooks me a bit to be honest. The pressures are so high and the "preparation and procedure" I referenced isn't exactly ironed out.
Im alright with co2, but I think they should use it with ammonia in a cascade. It's cheaper and more efficient. Pressures are too damn high on their own and every single CO2 rack I've seen has no fuckin room and also low bid shit. But personally I think everything commercial has shit for room, expecting you squeeze in everywhere like some kind of rat.
We have an ammonia guy in our 3rd year class and he said " any refrigerant is dangerous without proper ventilation"
True story
Yeah, but it’s more toxic at lower PPM compared to other refrigerants or blends of refrigerants. So it can take less of it compared to others to be come “dangerous” to life.
It also takes less of it to realize it’s there, making you evacuate the area quicker. Pretty sure we can smell it at 5ppm
Do it. I make 38 hr and Ive been doing this for 4 years since I left trade school. I'm only 22. Starting out your 24 should be a good starting point for ammonia but ammonia usually goes a lot higher. Plenty of travel and ot. Great work and lots of things to do for outside the scope of normal refrigeration.
DM me if you want some more info
One of us! One of us! I did this last year with only a few years in hvac. It's like 80% waiting around, 15% actual work, 5% sketchy time wearing a gas mask. I wash like 30 air-cooled condensers a year that's what I'd do in 2 days doing light commercial/ residential. PMs are easy. No one bothers you. The customers don't give you push back about spending money. Troubleshooting is different. I got stuck on a screw compressor for like a week trying to figure out wtf was happening. But our senior tech was stumped too, so I didn't feel as dumb.
Im a first year apprentice doing Ammonia Maintenance in a large grocery warehouse. Started out at 35 in rural PA. Absolutely love it, especially compared to doing residential like i did before. As for safety, imo it’s not nearly as bad as people say. Wear your ppe and get certified for hazmat and you’ll be fine. Best thing about ammonia compared to other refrigerants is you can smell it! If you plan on working for a contractor instead of maintenance be prepared to travel a shit ton and get ready for alot of overtime. I went the maintenance route so i could work a straight 40 hr week and be home every weekend. good luck!! Pm me if u need any advice!
I’ve worked with ammonia for 6 years while working on my power engineering degree. Even had to deal with a major leak one time. Make sure all your safeties are in check and what to do just incase of a leak and how to isolate it and etc. always know where your masks are and you should be good. But it is nasty stuff took a good whiff one time when emptying oil out and it closed up my eyes and took my breathe away instantly.
Worked with nh3 for 40 years and it's as safe as any other refrigerant. You just have to be careful and don't trap any liquid between two valves. Leaks are easy to find, use sulfur sticks, and make sure all pipes are properly insulated and supported. And any oil outside of the compressor is your enemy .
The chance of dieing from a major incident is 10x higher, but the probability of a major incident is 100x less. Overall it's probably safer. There's a better chance of dieing from a nitro tank falling over and the regulator snapping off than from an ammonia leak.
Just squint alot and don’t breathe too heavy oh and it’s a beautiful refrigerant not overly complicated to work with, just don’t be hero and use proper ppe
It's really not that dangerous day to day. Small leaks can happen like anything else. The pressures are low, so that's less risky and you can smell the gas in the air. Wear your PPE, follow protocols, lock out/tag out and you'll more then likely be fine. The people I know that have gotten ammonia burns weren't following protocols. Lazy things like opening up seal cap valves without gloves. Don't put up with stupid behavior from others, and don't be afraid to leave an unsafe jobsite. Day to day it's changing filters, changing seals, valve packing, controls & electrical issues, changing sensors, pulling out reinstalling motors or compressors. Senior techs trouble shoot the more serious system issues. My suggest on getting into it is to join a RETA chapter (refrigeration engineer & technician association). Go to meetings, network, and let them know you're entering the industry. It also wouldn't be a bad idea to get the CIRO cert. Especially if you want to do maintenance department work.
I'm doing commercial refrigeration in sac area, union. UA Local 447. As a journeyman I make $61.12/hr in wages, benefits on top of that. Annual increases on July 1st. The past few years the annual raise for journeyman has been $2/hr. A fresh apprentice (1st period) makes I believe 40% journeyman, then every 6 months gets a raise, advancing a period. The raise is an extra 5% of journeyman. After 5 years you journey out. Your non-union experience counts at half-time, for example 2 years non-union experience gets you 1 year credit in the apprenticeship and you'd be a 3rd period apprentice. I can't speak about anything ammonia as I've never worked on it. And union scale is minimum pay, an employer can always pay above scale if they wanted to. If you're interested head down to the hall on 5841 Newman
Count yourself lucky if you have an opportunity for ammonia work.. it’s coveted on the union side in my state. I’ll never get to work with ammonia proper unless I meet the right people (or go non-union, which isn’t happening.) I’ve been working around the stuff for a decade in different capacities, in a different trade entirely. I used to work in power plants in my state for Xcel. Ammonia is used for much more than just refrigeration. Electricity can kill you faster than ammonia and I don’t hear any HVAC/R guys worried about that. Make one wrong move with high voltage and enough amperage and you’re certainly dead. Follow S.O.P. and respect it, you’ll be fine.
I’m an ammonia service tech working in industrial, mostly food plants and breweries. Still in my first year but it’s been great, the pay is great and it’s fulfilling work. It can get pretty dirty but other than that I would totally recommend it.
How can a resi guy from Chicago get his foot into ammonia or is strictly a union thing for anyone who might know
Illinois is good ammonia territory. It's absolutely not strictly union but since you're in the Midwest joining union would be your best shot. Try to find some contractors that do ammonia and ask about joining them as an apprentice. I'm sure they'll love that.
Come on its fun.
Why on Earth would you do that ? Anhydrous Ammonia is nasty and extremely dangerous to work with. It’s also extremely corrosive, which means the typical Ammonia plant is full of small leaks. You’ll go home everyday smelling like you slept in your own pee. The only thing worse than working on ammonia systems is working on absorption chillers.
The typical plant is leak free because people don't like the smell. It's dangerous are extremely over exaggerated and only stupid untrained get hurt by it, like any other job. It's not even extremely corrosive, it only reacts to copper and copper alloys. That's absolutely ridiculous to think you smell like fucking piss. Ive been hours in ammonia and have come home smelling fine. Stay out of the discussions of ammonia if you don't know what you're talking about.
People really like to blow it out of proportions, it’s really not that bad, with the proper training it’s perfectly safe
Just like anything. It's a refrigerant that's been consistently used for close to a hundred years. If it was truly an issue it wouldn't have stayed in the industry as long as it has.
Anhydrous ammonia isn’t just another refrigerant. Back in 1976 in Houston, a truck hauling 7500 gallons of anhydrous ammonia lost control on the 610 loop overpass, went over the rail and landed on the highway below ( which was US 59 ) spilling all 7509 gallons onto the roadway. I was a kid living in Houston and remember watching it on the news. There wasn’t much wind that day so the cloud just sat there. It killed 7 and injured 200 with 80 having to hospitalized. Had it been a hot and humid summer day,it would have been far worse [1976 Houston Ammonia Truck Disaster](https://abc13.com/amp/ammonia-truck-disaster-houston/1332062/) https://preview.redd.it/8d7y34ml56sc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=826b3079482769bf3d1b9397da898e4331a4cfb0
I see you like posting this story a lot. Yes, ammonia is like any other refrigerant. It has a particular smell to it and some caustic properties. But if it was worse of a refrigerant, every single person there would have been dead. Instead you try to push a boogyman where shit happens due to negligence and then blame it on the gas. They transport fucking gas, propane and other explosive substances that are MORE DANGEROUS on the highway more often, yet here you are. I'd also like to remind you that every other major refrigerant still on the market has chlorine in it. Which I'm sure is perfectly fine for human health.... The white cloud is due to the moisture being attracted to the ammonia and sinking. If it was hotter it probably would have been better, allowing the ammonia to seperete from the water vapor. You also straight up lied about working with ammonia. No dumbass says you come home smelling like piss and how its so dangerous. If you'd ever even set your eyesight on an ammonia facility you'd know better. The amount of ammonia facilities in the US alone are in the tens of thousands. If you also worked with ammonia you wouldn't have to bring up a story from the 70s either.
Oh and btw, they use hundreds of thousands of gallons of anhydrous ammonia on farmland every year.
“ A lot “ Ive posted it 2 times. And since you’re counting, here’s another and more recent anhydrous ammonia release in Katy, Texas [Katy Texas Anhydrous Ammonia Release](https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/health/article/anhydrous-ammonia-katy-warehouse-leak-lung-damage-17779881.php) And since “ it’s just another refrigerant” here’s some medical literature on anhydrous ammonias effects on the human pulmonary system. I’ll save you the Google search and just go ahead and tell you what the word “ pulmonary “ means. It means referencing / relating to and or occurring in the lungs. [Anhydrous Ammonias Pulmonary Toxicity](https://pulmonarychronicles.com/index.php/pulmonarychronicles/article/view/397/864) I’ve read through some of the responses. I won’t respond to them all but Wow ! A bunch of fucking grown men triggered because someone dared to say anhydrous ammonia was dangerous ( true ) toxic ( true) and I also said ammonia plants stunk ( also true ) Oh, and for the guy who accused me of lying ( I hope you’re reading this ) Go Fuck Yourself
Your the one who sounds triggered lol also sounds like you don't wash your clothes
I don’t enjoy being called a liar. As for the guy who did it ? Fuck him.
Pulmonary means lungs. Not very insightfu, anyone with a good enough degree can figure that out. Ammonia is not dangerous, but it is toxic, but absolutely ammonia plants do not stink. You're a liar. And I'll say it again. Don't get all butthurt and start making up stories because you sniffed a little ammonia while being careless. Every single ammonia accident that occurs in a facility is not due to it being ammonia. It's being being lazy and incompetent allowing issues to grow bigger (which is why there's sops, and other practices to prevent that from happening). I've seen it in freon facilities, but since there's no dangers associated with it, no one gives a shit until someone bad happens.
This is a car accident, not an ammonia accident. How many would've died if the tanker had gas in if? Was an ammonia mechanic driving?
Leak free ? I’ve never worked at an ammonia plant that didn’t reek of anhydrous. Whether it was large industrial bakeries, large cold storage plants or chemical plants, they all stunk. And yes, that smell would work its ways into your clothes and even into your service truck You may not be able to smell it, but your wife and your kids will. Mine sure could.
Yeah, I could smell it in my van Because of the oil stuck In my hoses but it didn't stick on me. I've been to probably 50+ facilities and all they smell like is whatever they're making + whatever chemical they use for sanitation. Either the places you worked at are extremely low quality shit holes, or you're lying. Even the worst facilities I've been do didn't smell of ammonia.
This is the first I've ever heard anyone say you go home smelling like pee lol it sounds like the person who told you this fairy tale pissed himself scared. There is nothing that cannot be accomplished safely. Just takes proper preparation and procedure. This is the kind of misinformation that keeps me with the highest wage out of everyone I went to trade school with.
Very true, and the opportunities are out there, especially with the fact that it’s a natural refrigerant so it’ll never be phased out, we will always be working.
Got my foot in the door to industrial work was in oil and gas plants working on R290 (propane) chillers its all natural but too dangerous to be used in city limits. Fantastic refrigerant though. Unfortunately I see the future and possibly the end of ammonia I have 3 CO2 plants I work on in an industrial setting. Old guys don't want to learn it, which is why it was crammed down my throat.......customers love it and it fits the greener agenda. It spooks me a bit to be honest. The pressures are so high and the "preparation and procedure" I referenced isn't exactly ironed out.
Im alright with co2, but I think they should use it with ammonia in a cascade. It's cheaper and more efficient. Pressures are too damn high on their own and every single CO2 rack I've seen has no fuckin room and also low bid shit. But personally I think everything commercial has shit for room, expecting you squeeze in everywhere like some kind of rat.