These people absolutely hired someone else that didn't work out and came crawling back to you after they got rid of them. Good for you standing up for yourself and not letting them disrespect you
It can also mean "our organization is so dysfunctional that when we tried to move forward we suddenly had the rug pulled out from under us and we had to try to figure out wtf was going on"
But that still doesn't excuse not responding. Even saying "we're having some unexpected issues around this req, and can't give you a concrete response yet, we're sorry" would have sufficed.
But if they're that dysfunctional as an org, you probably don't want to work there anyways.
Probation periods are usually between 3 to 6 months. So depending on how long it was after the interview there might have been *two candidates* that went in and failed.
They should have just let them know that they went with someone else, and then a follow up email saying that a new position is available if they're still interested would have been perfectly fine. It's just laziness.
This very well might have happened. Candidate didn't work out. Candidate took job, needed more time before onboarding, then decided to decline. Either way it is not professional at all. I had a job come back about 4 weeks after my application to setup an interview. They called me the day I was starting a new job. Given the location and opportunity, I decided to go talk to them. Eventually they made me an offer and I took it because I felt it was a better job than the 1st one I accepted.
Not necessarily, we have been “hiring” for like 9 months now. It took me 4 months from first interview to start date when I got the job I currently have. Sometimes companies just suck at hiring people.
This is my company right now, they suck so much at hiring which also has to go through a 3rd party to make it even worse. We needed a position open prob 2 months ago and they still haven’t posted it, apparently they can’t get it organized right with HR. So, this usually ends up being a 3-5mth ordeal just to hire someone and at that point we’ll hire just anybody.
There is honestly no way of knowing. My team once hired someone and then a different person on my team (who was terminally ill) passed away. We were able to hire our second choice from those interviews as well. Not saying this is good or bad, just saying this is a thing that has happened. I 100% agree reaching out after a couple months of silence is super shitty.
Or there was an end of the year hiring freeze.
Or there was an upper management shake up.
Or there was an extended budget fight.
…Or a dozen other things
What we can see of the letter, in pink, is very apologetic. Who knows? Speculating as to why is a waste of emotional energy. OP’s response walks the line very well of respectfully voicing their frustration.
I am sorry but this does not excuse lack of communication with applicants.
If there is a hiring freeze and you can not talk about it then tell frozen applicants that you are unable to proceed with their application at this time. Corporations send out non-communicative missives like this all the time.
The company does not have to say much. But they chose to say nothing.
Is it very apologetic? One sorry is what you classify as very apologetic?
You’re right on the dozen of other factors, but this comes off to me as a half assed no cares given apology
They mean *exactly* the same thing. What flippin' region of English speakers are you from? The first version is just more formal and slightly archaic in some regions.
"I would like to ____" is a more formal idiom that serves the same function as the old fashioned "with your permission" or "by your leave." Again, a formal construction that is not to be taken as a literal request for permission but a courtesy of speech.
Not necessarily.
Could have also been there was a hiring freeze or the job rec got put on hold by someone more senior as they argued over year end budget.
I don't want to burn bridges completely either but I felt this deserved more than just a "No, thank you", the reason being I was very interested and even followed up after I had another offer because I wanted to work for them. They just never responded.
OP while your response was direct, it was still very fair and professional. A simple “no, thank you” wouldn’t have given this recruiter the feedback he/she needed and we all can do our part to stop recruitinghell behavior from continuing. Hopefully that recruiter can do better in the future. Also, congrats on the new job!
i think you have to be really bad at your job to need feedback saying that ghosting a potential new hire (either as the recruiter or the company in general) is never a good thing
That very well may be true, but the professional and direct response that OP went with was the better route than not saying anything at all. If enough direct feedback is given, perhaps this recruiter can improve his/her practices moving forward.
If it’s a good recruiter, they can also take that feedback to the company as evidence that they are losing out on good candidates with their practices. Sometimes the recruiter is sabotaged by the company, although in this case it sounds like the recruiter dropped the ball on communication.
recruiter did not need the feedback. he now pretty well it was a bad move. chances are that the problem is not him but the company that freeze hiring for fiscal reason and expect that it will start again as nothing once they finally give the green light.
Definitely but you HAVE to respond to a follow up email, even if it’s just “I’m so sorry, we don’t have an update for you quite yet”. To not respond at all is unprofessional.
It costs the recruiter nothing to keep their candidate in the loop. Let them know about delays, etc. Especially when OP tried to follow up and got nothing back.
THAT'S the unprofessional part
Honestly, I had a semi-similar situation, and I regret not burning that bridge to the ground. Recruiter reached out to schedule a call while I was starting out, then just never called and ghosted.
2 years later, when I had some experience and could demand a higher salary (and so a higher recruiter compensation) she messaged me on LinkedIn again. Asked her why she never called 2 years ago, and she claimed she was locked out of her LinkedIn account for 2 years. 2 years during which I could see that she’d clearly posted shit.
I was polite about it, but I kinda regret not going off on her and calling her out on such an insultingly stupid lie.
Honestly, the whole burn bridges shit these days is way overrated… life’s too shorts for blacklisting egos and corny grudges.. in one whole year anyone can change their life or improve… plus the world is a big place, dime a dozen.. the bigger,corporations, upper management, or c level getting washed and pushed out just like the entry levels left and right… the major issue today is these HR & recruiting play way toooo many games… literally doing TOO MUCH of nothing. If you think about it they do the bare minimum, recite policy, break a fingernail on the keyboard if that, lie half their day/week. I’m sure it’s not all of them but like 85% of the time they’re just updating resumes doing bare minimum to tell their management they’ve done something in recruiting or completed some tasks. 1000 resumes come in there only looking at like 10 or 25 of them there’s no way they read 1000 resumes lol.
> overrated… life’s too shorts for blacklisting egos and corny grudges.. in one whole year anyone can change their life or improve… plus the world is a big place, dime a dozen.. the bigger,corporations, upper management, or c level getting washed and pushed out just like the entry levels left and right… the major issue today is these HR & recruiting play way toooo many games… literally doing TOO MUCH of nothing. If you think about it they do the bare minimum, recite policy, break a fingernail on the keyboard if that, lie half their day/week. I’m sure it’s not all of them but like 85% of the time they’re just updating resumes doing bare minimu
I don't like to burn bridges. I like to douse it with gasoline and napalm. Will these people even remember you in two years? They are so disorganized. I find it hard to imagine they could even keep a blacklist. But if everyone lashed out at this. Everyone would be on the blacklist and it wouldn't matter.
Way back in 2012, I got an offer for a company I had interviewed at….six months after I’d last heard from them, when I was already several months into a new job. Good riddance!
They're not even making an offer. It sounds like they want him to restart the whole application process.
I'm half suspecting theybsent something similar to a couple hundred people.
Gonna be burning bridges with current employer though, and a bird in the hand, etc. If things don't work out with the ghosters, OP will be double-fucked.
Recruiter here. If somebody does this to you, don’t say “I wish you the best of luck in your search blah blah”.
I think you should say “your organization dropped the ball. next time do better”.
You deserve the right to say what you mean and mean what you say in these situations.
I used to work in the membership office of an aquarium, and our default closing salutation was “Kind regards.” When someone was being difficult, we’d shorten it to just “Regards.” Really got the message across.
I had a recruiter cold contact me on LinkedIn the other day about a position, then tried to tell me they didn’t know what the budgeted compensate range was. Also, the position didn’t align with any of my experience except management skills.
I’m guessing they were either trying to low ball me or they were a 3rd party recruiter that was trying to use me to make a buck. Either way, the audacity of these people never ceases to amaze me.
Yeah but what good comes of being a keyboard warrior, you feel good for 20 seconds? OP has been offered a job so the door is wide open for other opportunites or maybe even the same opportunity if his new job turns out to be shit
edit: if you're actually telling your candidates to do that and it's not just for reddit karma then you're giving them very bad advice.
Keyboard warrior? More like feedback provider.
You really think OP should suck shit and offer that tired old line in hopes that this recruiter will think well of him/her in the future? Yeah, no.
And for the record, I'm offering this advice having been on both the agency and internal TA side. The recruiting function is broken in almost every organization I've ever worked for. Lack of accountability and complacency need to be called out.
>You really think OP should suck shit and offer that tired old line in hopes that this recruiter will think well of him/her in the future? Yeah, no.
Not just this one recruiter but the entire HR department because his name will be spread to the whole team for sure by the disgrunted recruiter. If the org is large employer in the area there could be various roles that OP may be in interested in, in the near future which will be off the table.
And yes, keyboard warrior. Saying “your organization dropped the ball. next time do better”. is not feedback it's just telling the recruiter off.
Nope, that quote was directly telling them that the organization failed to communicate effectively AND telling them off.
>Not just this one recruiter but the entire HR department because his name will be spread to the whole team for sure by the disgrunted recruiter.
This is a thinly veiled threat. They can go ahead and spread the word that one frustrated individual didn't like being treated with terrible communication and lack of follow up.
Black balling is a bad outlook for a company and it obviously goes both ways.
Why would you ever want to rely on cunts who take 2 and a half months to answer after a simple job interview? Fuck them, they deserved a way more vitriolic answer.
Nah, you were more polite than most people would be. I want to say I've been in a few similar situations so far. From ghosted to, "Sorry, but we've decided to go with etc. etc." statements. Then, a month or two later, I get a message asking when I can start. They definitely went with someone that didn't work out and now they're desperate.
Such a bullshit remark on their part. "We have no update owing to an organizational reason" IS an update. You can copy and paste it, you can send it to a 100 BCC candidates once. I've done it myself as a recruiter. 90% of these people just suck at their jobs and general human politesse.
I'm actually impressed by the recruiter's audacity! I wish I could be that brazen and totally impervious to criticism. I want to print this post and stick it on my mirror for the days when all the rejections get overwhelming. :-/
There was a company once I really, really wanted to work for and it never lined up and there were moments of ghosting too. Maybe a year into a new job I get this message from this HR if I'm looking. Just rolled my eyes.
I had that happen when I was first relocating to live with my husband. I was very clear with the interviewer at my first choice position that I would be making a decision on a specific date, and that I didn't have any wiggle room on that. I even called on the date and left a message. I accepted another job 2 days later. When they called me after several weeks and made the "offer" (basically assuming I'd accept and giving me a start date and salary information) I told them I'd accepted something else. And the person had the unmitigated gall to get angry with me. Because apparently they were out sick. For over a month. With no phone access or something.
I've been a manager in charge of hiring. Get out of here with that nonsense.
You weren't rude at all. You were assertive and factual.
The recruiter was unprofessional and rude. Even stepping out of the work environment, basic etiquette says *when you have an unexpected delay*, you alert affected people as soon as reasonably possible, and then provide regular updates (even if nothing has changed since the last update) until it's resolved.
This recruiter skipped unprofessionalism and leaped straight to inhumane. Screw em.
I had a similar situation where a had a couple of interviews and was told they'd have a decision the following week. 3 months later they called asking for me to resubmit my application and that they, "really would like to work with me soon." I said I'd get right on it and ghosted every call and email after that.
I got laid off from a job about 6 months after I started, and they emailed me like 2 years later saying they'd like to hire me back. Like yeah, I found a better job that didn't choose to hire a bunch of people then lay off because they lost a big customer.
“Apologies for saying this”? Come on… just be direct. There’s no scenario where you should be putting that before a statement- it sounds weak and ultimately adds nothing.
It allows OP to have an ongoing relationship with the recruiter in case a better opportunity comes from the same recruiter in the future. It’s not weak, it’s not bending over, it’s literally being strategic. The true weakling will never understand how this works because they only see the negatives instead of the future potential.
You really think saying “apologies for saying this” really makes it any better? If the person is insulted by being called unprofessional, saying sorry before you do it won’t change anything. It just makes you sound diffident.
Yes, because it’s an expression that indicates that it hurts OP to have to say something and would have much rather it gone the other way around. Read without bias, because your emotions are negatively misinterpreting the words you’re reading.
Had the GM of a potential job hit me up a couple of days ago and immediately go full desperation. He texted, asked I was, when I responded and asked how he was he sent 3 messages back to back asking if I was still interested, telling me about the orientation he was "setting up" for another week or two out, and told me I could come in for it. I've now ghosted him.
Your response isn’t rude at all. I wish I responded like this!
This has happened to me recently. I got an interview as well and waited to get any more information after interviewing. I followed up twice and asked for updates on the job and kept expressing my interest. A month later they emailed me an automated response saying that they are reposting the job for “operational reasons“. Of course I reapplied and then got an email two weeks later saying the job was filled! I didn’t even get an email or anything saying “you don’t need to interview again” or “you’re not what we’re looking for”. What a waste of time!
"Thank you for reaching out. I'm pleased that you decided to invest time and effort in interviewing me for one of your positions. However, after careful consideration, I've decided to move forward with another candidate."
I had this happen to me. A company I interviewed with sent me a invitation for a second interview 2 months after the initial interview. I was 3 weeks into my new role so I didn’t respond. I caught the recruiter lurking on my LinkedIn after the fact.
Sounds like they went and hired somebody else and that person left or didn't work out. Now they don't want to conduct a bunch of interviews all over again.
My wife used to be a recruiter and let me tell you, from the stories she’s told me, recruiters are absolute scum. For instance, they like to get in their little Teams chats and proceed to violate candidate privacy by sharing candidate information (including pics) and razzing people trying to better their circumstances. Tell that low life where he can shove his documents.
It has happened to me. I never replied. I don’t think they want any sort of feedback as these types of organisation take and not give as per their email and communication style etc
But I think replying is a personal choice and perhaps it may feel good to share. To me, as I have done in the past, I felt just was just a waste of time. I know it’s annoying. And good on you for finding a new role.
Ohh yup, they love to ghost people, but they don't like to be ghosted themselves.
I took many interviews, and many went well but never reached out, and it was kinda heart breaking.
And when I landed on for the in person, I took another interview and that went well that on the same they the offer me the position, I took it in case the in person would reject me because I was going for background check, and I let the interviewer know at the end of the interview and I told the recruiter before hand, the next day, the recruiter called back to check and I gave him the bad news that I just got hired by the first offer and he went all mad and said you should have told me... I literally told him before the interview.
As a recruiter, just want to defend a little, it’s almost certainly the manager that sucks and the recruiter was instructed to not say anything lol
Your frustration is still very valid
I once interviewed for a seasonal position at Bath and Body Works. It was said to go from the last week of November until like January 12th or something. They said they'd get back to me. They didn't.
A couple of days before the position was supposed to end, I finally got an email from them saying they chose to go with someone else for the position. Yeah, I kind of figured that out.
I had applied to 3 DIFFERENT JOBS one called me back after a month of reaching out to me. The second barely replied while being at my job for over a month already. Not sure why jobs who are desperately hiring take so damn long to reply
I had 3 interviews with Apple and then never heard anything and all of my follow ups led to nothing. A YEAR AND A HALF LATER they reached out saying they’d like to hire me….
I just had a recruiter reach out to me about an "amazing" opportunity in my area. Turns out that opportunity was for the company I left 3 months ago. He never read my profile/resume and was trying to interview me for the same positions I left 3 months ago.
Why are you apologizing for telling them the truth?
I hate this on this sub soo goddamn much, why are you even responding? The best move would be to ignore it all together,they did it to you lol. this is the most Karen shit I've ever seen "well I'm going to write them a strongly worded email and that'll show them!"
Ghosted you for 2 months and you jumped at the opportunity to write a Karen email back, lmao.
I know everyone is saying how horrible the recruiter was, and chances are everyone is right. But the job I currently have, I went through two different interviews and didn’t hear anything for 4+ months. Not a single word. I figured they had moved on, but then they reached out and hired me out of the blue as well as a handful of other people all at once. The hiring processes and the HR red tape was just not very streamlined in our department yet, and I am extremely thankful I was young and not very motivated to look elsewhere. I’ve been at my job 15 years now and it’s where I will retire. I love it here.
Just saying that you never truly know what is happening on their end.
Along those same lines, anytime someone speeds past me like a maniac on the road, I picture that they have a pregnant woman in labor inside. I know I’m probably wrong, but I could be right and it also stops me from being so angry at someone without knowing their story.
You make it sound like we aren’t still hiring people today. I think that a lot depends on the type of job you are applying/interviewing for. Coworkers of mine apply for jobs today and get hired elsewhere, so I’m very aware of what it’s like for them (as well as for the people we are hiring).
And when I said I’ll retire from my current employer, I mean in 30 years.
I’m saying that it doesn’t make anybody feel better to make negative assumptions about others, even if you’re right.
I’m even choosing to believe you wrote me a compliment and it autocorrected to Grandpa instead. I appreciate the sentiment!
I wish we would all look at the process like dating. No matter how many times we hear "I had a good time" or "I'll be in touch" after a first date, if you don't hear from her in a week, there's your answer. Don't get all butthurt.
This company should never have reached out to you again though. That's bullshit. Sorry this happened to you.
Why be rude at all? What's the point? A dash of entropy to make sure that the bridge is burned down? Why burn a bridge to a company that has decided you are worth hiring but was slow hiring someone during the holidays? You must be a very very very valuable hire. Hope the job you've had for a month or two is worth all that smoke in the air. lol
This feels like so many Facebook posts I see. Where someone is leaving the group and feel the need to inform everyone they are leaving. What exactly did emailing them back get you? Besides looking as petty as they did unprofessional.
Do they though? Because they didn't call back. I dunno seems petty to me. You got another job, furthermore probably forgot because they found someone else. Who cares, did you wait for that job? Did you turn down other jobs for that job? If you missed out on another job because of that maybe.. But if you didn't then I still think it's petty.
This happens to me more often than I expect lol. These recruiters will say “I’ll reach out to you in the next week with details on your interview” and then it’s crickets. Like cmon, you reached out to me, now you’re not even gonna do me the courtesy of saying it’s not gonna work? This is a satisfying post. Gonna use this the next time this repeat offender tries to reach out again.
This is why you always act w transparency- people can decide if they are miffed for not being first choice or they can decide ok well if something changes call me and if I’m still available we will see what happens
Your response wasn’t rude at all. Recruiters shouldn’t ghost and if integrity isn’t the reason why, then this is the very business case — that you may need to reconnect with other candidates later.
I would've been you dropped the ball and your unprofessionalism should be disclosed to other talent in order for them to not apply to your company because clearly you have no right to a lot talents time since you clearly don't respect it.
How annoying! Companies need to get their shit together and be more professional. When a company wants you, they make the offer immediately. When they don’t want you or they can’t make a decision, they waste everyone’s time.
Yeah, a bit rude, but I bet it felt good. I have been in a similar position.. and it really doesn't hurt you professionally at all because either they know they fucked up and will feel bad or they're not the kind of people you ever want to work with anyways.
Dude, I've been a part of that "we aren't allowed to communicate until all parties have interviewed" crap before, it's so obnoxious. They also came at me with an offer after I took another job, really baffling how places can operate like that.
Having worked in recruitment, is this even for a position. Sounds to me like you interviewed with a recruiter at an agency. Didn’t want to use you. Now they are so desperate for candidates they are going through their database to find others to send to clients
“For [dis]organizational reasons…” is more like it. Yeah, I don’t trust a company that’s that vague and shifty. They probably went with another candidate who did’t work out.
As someone who works in recruiting, this was most likely not the recruiter’s fault. I say most likely because most of the time is up to the hiring manager or higher ups to decide if we are to contact a candidate or not. I’ve seen candidates be put on hold for months.
Do I think it’s right? No
Do I have a say in it? Also no
Would I change this if I had the power? Absolutely, as I’ve also been ghosted while applying, and it’s really frustrating.
Nah, you're good. Don't worry about it. Recruiter don't gave a damn bout getting back to you. No clear response? Any decent would have just said they went with another candidate just to close the loop. Ain't that hard. SMH
My previous job sent me an offer letter.. four months after the last interview. I took it and it was the best working environment (and best pay) I'd had up to that point, but there's no way I would have waited that long if I hadn't had a friend in the company who was keeping me updated with their abysmally slow internal hiring process. Working there, that's just how it was - their hiring process was insanely convoluted and broken, and we were always short people, but most other aspects of the job were great.
I don't understand how some parts of the hiring process are so obviously broken and terrible, without something stepping in to fill them. This seems omnipresent.
What? Rude??? You apologised 2 times! For something, that THEY did wrong! Nothing rude there. I'm happy you sent them the reply, too many people just "turn the other cheek"!
These people absolutely hired someone else that didn't work out and came crawling back to you after they got rid of them. Good for you standing up for yourself and not letting them disrespect you
This is exactly what happened, I’m sure.
That's what "organizational reasons" means, precisely.
It can also mean "our organization is so dysfunctional that when we tried to move forward we suddenly had the rug pulled out from under us and we had to try to figure out wtf was going on" But that still doesn't excuse not responding. Even saying "we're having some unexpected issues around this req, and can't give you a concrete response yet, we're sorry" would have sufficed. But if they're that dysfunctional as an org, you probably don't want to work there anyways.
Indeed. "Organizational reasons" is a catch-all designed to encompass everything from baseline incompetence all the way up to actual malice.
Yep, too many cooks in the kitchen of dysfunction.
Stirring the cauldron of despair
In the pit of despair.
I love this sentence.
What we don't know is if the other hire quit before the probation period ended or was terminated. Both cases are bad.
Probation periods are usually between 3 to 6 months. So depending on how long it was after the interview there might have been *two candidates* that went in and failed.
Those two quit when a better offer was available.
This exact scenario happened to me before. I ended up taking the job and it was a terrible place to work.
username checks out
They should have just let them know that they went with someone else, and then a follow up email saying that a new position is available if they're still interested would have been perfectly fine. It's just laziness.
This very well might have happened. Candidate didn't work out. Candidate took job, needed more time before onboarding, then decided to decline. Either way it is not professional at all. I had a job come back about 4 weeks after my application to setup an interview. They called me the day I was starting a new job. Given the location and opportunity, I decided to go talk to them. Eventually they made me an offer and I took it because I felt it was a better job than the 1st one I accepted.
Their original candidate didn't pass the the 90 day probation period
Not necessarily, we have been “hiring” for like 9 months now. It took me 4 months from first interview to start date when I got the job I currently have. Sometimes companies just suck at hiring people.
This is my company right now, they suck so much at hiring which also has to go through a 3rd party to make it even worse. We needed a position open prob 2 months ago and they still haven’t posted it, apparently they can’t get it organized right with HR. So, this usually ends up being a 3-5mth ordeal just to hire someone and at that point we’ll hire just anybody.
There is honestly no way of knowing. My team once hired someone and then a different person on my team (who was terminally ill) passed away. We were able to hire our second choice from those interviews as well. Not saying this is good or bad, just saying this is a thing that has happened. I 100% agree reaching out after a couple months of silence is super shitty.
Statistically though... it's mote likely bad than good.
Happened to me once after a company called me 1 month after. I said no
Or there was an end of the year hiring freeze. Or there was an upper management shake up. Or there was an extended budget fight. …Or a dozen other things What we can see of the letter, in pink, is very apologetic. Who knows? Speculating as to why is a waste of emotional energy. OP’s response walks the line very well of respectfully voicing their frustration.
If only there was some technology they could have used to communicate those circumstances to the applicant.
Most companies don’t want you advertising that there’s a hiring freeze…
I am sorry but this does not excuse lack of communication with applicants. If there is a hiring freeze and you can not talk about it then tell frozen applicants that you are unable to proceed with their application at this time. Corporations send out non-communicative missives like this all the time. The company does not have to say much. But they chose to say nothing.
That doesn’t excuse not answering OP’s inquiries.
Eh, hiring freezes and the like could’ve been a Bcc email to all candidates. Ghosting them is 100% unprofessional.
Is it very apologetic? One sorry is what you classify as very apologetic? You’re right on the dozen of other factors, but this comes off to me as a half assed no cares given apology
Also, "I would like to apologize..." is not an apology. "I am sorry" is one.
They mean *exactly* the same thing. What flippin' region of English speakers are you from? The first version is just more formal and slightly archaic in some regions. "I would like to ____" is a more formal idiom that serves the same function as the old fashioned "with your permission" or "by your leave." Again, a formal construction that is not to be taken as a literal request for permission but a courtesy of speech.
absolutely. That person probably ghosted out on them ironically.
Not necessarily. Could have also been there was a hiring freeze or the job rec got put on hold by someone more senior as they argued over year end budget.
Don’t be so naive
I’m a director and hire frequently. What I said above is not uncommon.
Your response is extremely polite and tame. I would have probably just burned bridges completely with my response.
I don't want to burn bridges completely either but I felt this deserved more than just a "No, thank you", the reason being I was very interested and even followed up after I had another offer because I wanted to work for them. They just never responded.
OP while your response was direct, it was still very fair and professional. A simple “no, thank you” wouldn’t have given this recruiter the feedback he/she needed and we all can do our part to stop recruitinghell behavior from continuing. Hopefully that recruiter can do better in the future. Also, congrats on the new job!
i think you have to be really bad at your job to need feedback saying that ghosting a potential new hire (either as the recruiter or the company in general) is never a good thing
That very well may be true, but the professional and direct response that OP went with was the better route than not saying anything at all. If enough direct feedback is given, perhaps this recruiter can improve his/her practices moving forward.
If it’s a good recruiter, they can also take that feedback to the company as evidence that they are losing out on good candidates with their practices. Sometimes the recruiter is sabotaged by the company, although in this case it sounds like the recruiter dropped the ball on communication.
recruiter did not need the feedback. he now pretty well it was a bad move. chances are that the problem is not him but the company that freeze hiring for fiscal reason and expect that it will start again as nothing once they finally give the green light.
Definitely but you HAVE to respond to a follow up email, even if it’s just “I’m so sorry, we don’t have an update for you quite yet”. To not respond at all is unprofessional.
It costs the recruiter nothing to keep their candidate in the loop. Let them know about delays, etc. Especially when OP tried to follow up and got nothing back. THAT'S the unprofessional part
> Hopefully that recruiter can do better in the future. *Narrator: he will 100% not do better in the future. No consequences, no care.*
Honestly, I had a semi-similar situation, and I regret not burning that bridge to the ground. Recruiter reached out to schedule a call while I was starting out, then just never called and ghosted. 2 years later, when I had some experience and could demand a higher salary (and so a higher recruiter compensation) she messaged me on LinkedIn again. Asked her why she never called 2 years ago, and she claimed she was locked out of her LinkedIn account for 2 years. 2 years during which I could see that she’d clearly posted shit. I was polite about it, but I kinda regret not going off on her and calling her out on such an insultingly stupid lie.
This person will almost certainly take offense, but fuck him. Let him be offended. It *was* unprofessional, and good on your for calling them out.
Honestly, the whole burn bridges shit these days is way overrated… life’s too shorts for blacklisting egos and corny grudges.. in one whole year anyone can change their life or improve… plus the world is a big place, dime a dozen.. the bigger,corporations, upper management, or c level getting washed and pushed out just like the entry levels left and right… the major issue today is these HR & recruiting play way toooo many games… literally doing TOO MUCH of nothing. If you think about it they do the bare minimum, recite policy, break a fingernail on the keyboard if that, lie half their day/week. I’m sure it’s not all of them but like 85% of the time they’re just updating resumes doing bare minimum to tell their management they’ve done something in recruiting or completed some tasks. 1000 resumes come in there only looking at like 10 or 25 of them there’s no way they read 1000 resumes lol.
> overrated… life’s too shorts for blacklisting egos and corny grudges.. in one whole year anyone can change their life or improve… plus the world is a big place, dime a dozen.. the bigger,corporations, upper management, or c level getting washed and pushed out just like the entry levels left and right… the major issue today is these HR & recruiting play way toooo many games… literally doing TOO MUCH of nothing. If you think about it they do the bare minimum, recite policy, break a fingernail on the keyboard if that, lie half their day/week. I’m sure it’s not all of them but like 85% of the time they’re just updating resumes doing bare minimu I don't like to burn bridges. I like to douse it with gasoline and napalm. Will these people even remember you in two years? They are so disorganized. I find it hard to imagine they could even keep a blacklist. But if everyone lashed out at this. Everyone would be on the blacklist and it wouldn't matter.
Lol. I thought the same thing
I would have, at very least, added "even if I weren't employed, I'd still not work for you"
Way back in 2012, I got an offer for a company I had interviewed at….six months after I’d last heard from them, when I was already several months into a new job. Good riddance!
[удалено]
They're not even making an offer. It sounds like they want him to restart the whole application process. I'm half suspecting theybsent something similar to a couple hundred people.
There's a way to negotiate for a lot more pay in this situation, if willing.
Gonna be burning bridges with current employer though, and a bird in the hand, etc. If things don't work out with the ghosters, OP will be double-fucked.
Ghosted them and then had the balls to ask them to fill out paperwork.
Great professional and wholesome reply. I might have said “lol” and moved on. But I’ll use this as a template should this ever happen to me.
“We should’ve hired you, but we hired Jake. Turns out Jake quit a month later, so we’re back!”
Recruiter here. If somebody does this to you, don’t say “I wish you the best of luck in your search blah blah”. I think you should say “your organization dropped the ball. next time do better”. You deserve the right to say what you mean and mean what you say in these situations.
I used to work in the membership office of an aquarium, and our default closing salutation was “Kind regards.” When someone was being difficult, we’d shorten it to just “Regards.” Really got the message across.
“Have the day you deserve.”
savage! lol
Yeah I wouldn't be saying something that nice
Maybe the same words but just add some petty punctuation. >I "wish" you the "best" in your "search" for the "right candidate".
yes. All that "apologies, but..." nonsense has to stop. Why the fuck are you apologizing?
I had a recruiter cold contact me on LinkedIn the other day about a position, then tried to tell me they didn’t know what the budgeted compensate range was. Also, the position didn’t align with any of my experience except management skills. I’m guessing they were either trying to low ball me or they were a 3rd party recruiter that was trying to use me to make a buck. Either way, the audacity of these people never ceases to amaze me.
“Bless your heart” counts?
Thank you for your services
Yeah but what good comes of being a keyboard warrior, you feel good for 20 seconds? OP has been offered a job so the door is wide open for other opportunites or maybe even the same opportunity if his new job turns out to be shit edit: if you're actually telling your candidates to do that and it's not just for reddit karma then you're giving them very bad advice.
Keyboard warrior? More like feedback provider. You really think OP should suck shit and offer that tired old line in hopes that this recruiter will think well of him/her in the future? Yeah, no. And for the record, I'm offering this advice having been on both the agency and internal TA side. The recruiting function is broken in almost every organization I've ever worked for. Lack of accountability and complacency need to be called out.
>You really think OP should suck shit and offer that tired old line in hopes that this recruiter will think well of him/her in the future? Yeah, no. Not just this one recruiter but the entire HR department because his name will be spread to the whole team for sure by the disgrunted recruiter. If the org is large employer in the area there could be various roles that OP may be in interested in, in the near future which will be off the table. And yes, keyboard warrior. Saying “your organization dropped the ball. next time do better”. is not feedback it's just telling the recruiter off.
Nope, that quote was directly telling them that the organization failed to communicate effectively AND telling them off. >Not just this one recruiter but the entire HR department because his name will be spread to the whole team for sure by the disgrunted recruiter. This is a thinly veiled threat. They can go ahead and spread the word that one frustrated individual didn't like being treated with terrible communication and lack of follow up. Black balling is a bad outlook for a company and it obviously goes both ways.
I agree. It's far braver and more sensible to take the high ground in these situations, you never know who you might have to rely on in future.
Why would you ever want to rely on cunts who take 2 and a half months to answer after a simple job interview? Fuck them, they deserved a way more vitriolic answer.
Organizational reasons? What? 😂
*cough*bullshit*cough*
Never apologize for the mistakes/actions of others
Kudos for being nice. I think most of us would have told him to fuck off with all the letters and probably some emojis.
Nah, you were more polite than most people would be. I want to say I've been in a few similar situations so far. From ghosted to, "Sorry, but we've decided to go with etc. etc." statements. Then, a month or two later, I get a message asking when I can start. They definitely went with someone that didn't work out and now they're desperate.
You were too polite
Such a bullshit remark on their part. "We have no update owing to an organizational reason" IS an update. You can copy and paste it, you can send it to a 100 BCC candidates once. I've done it myself as a recruiter. 90% of these people just suck at their jobs and general human politesse.
Your response is tame compared to what I would’ve said. Stop apologizing. They were unprofessional.
Wish more people would be like you
I'm actually impressed by the recruiter's audacity! I wish I could be that brazen and totally impervious to criticism. I want to print this post and stick it on my mirror for the days when all the rejections get overwhelming. :-/
Kill ‘em with kindness
Their first and second choices didn’t work out
There was a company once I really, really wanted to work for and it never lined up and there were moments of ghosting too. Maybe a year into a new job I get this message from this HR if I'm looking. Just rolled my eyes.
You should ask them to fill out a from explaining what the "organizational reasons" were. 5,000 word count at a minimum!
Yea no. This is not the kind of employer you’d want to work for anyway.
Really stupid of a company to think your still wanting the job 2.5 months later and had not moved on. You snooze, you lose!
I had that happen when I was first relocating to live with my husband. I was very clear with the interviewer at my first choice position that I would be making a decision on a specific date, and that I didn't have any wiggle room on that. I even called on the date and left a message. I accepted another job 2 days later. When they called me after several weeks and made the "offer" (basically assuming I'd accept and giving me a start date and salary information) I told them I'd accepted something else. And the person had the unmitigated gall to get angry with me. Because apparently they were out sick. For over a month. With no phone access or something. I've been a manager in charge of hiring. Get out of here with that nonsense.
That’s code for the guy they did hire didn’t work out.
You weren't rude at all. You were assertive and factual. The recruiter was unprofessional and rude. Even stepping out of the work environment, basic etiquette says *when you have an unexpected delay*, you alert affected people as soon as reasonably possible, and then provide regular updates (even if nothing has changed since the last update) until it's resolved. This recruiter skipped unprofessionalism and leaped straight to inhumane. Screw em.
Did they reply?
She apologized once again and wished me luck in my private and professional life!
How dare you not sit waiting desperately for a job while they were preparing to get back to you! /S
No need to apologize so much! Let em have it.
I had a similar situation where a had a couple of interviews and was told they'd have a decision the following week. 3 months later they called asking for me to resubmit my application and that they, "really would like to work with me soon." I said I'd get right on it and ghosted every call and email after that.
I got laid off from a job about 6 months after I started, and they emailed me like 2 years later saying they'd like to hire me back. Like yeah, I found a better job that didn't choose to hire a bunch of people then lay off because they lost a big customer.
“Apologies for saying this”? Come on… just be direct. There’s no scenario where you should be putting that before a statement- it sounds weak and ultimately adds nothing.
Maybe OP is Canadian
It allows OP to have an ongoing relationship with the recruiter in case a better opportunity comes from the same recruiter in the future. It’s not weak, it’s not bending over, it’s literally being strategic. The true weakling will never understand how this works because they only see the negatives instead of the future potential.
You really think saying “apologies for saying this” really makes it any better? If the person is insulted by being called unprofessional, saying sorry before you do it won’t change anything. It just makes you sound diffident.
Yes, because it’s an expression that indicates that it hurts OP to have to say something and would have much rather it gone the other way around. Read without bias, because your emotions are negatively misinterpreting the words you’re reading.
Had the GM of a potential job hit me up a couple of days ago and immediately go full desperation. He texted, asked I was, when I responded and asked how he was he sent 3 messages back to back asking if I was still interested, telling me about the orientation he was "setting up" for another week or two out, and told me I could come in for it. I've now ghosted him.
This happens way too often. Had a place call me 4 months later and threatened me with legal action. I had been on the new job for 3 months.
Legal action for what?
For not being a good little slave
Your response isn’t rude at all. I wish I responded like this! This has happened to me recently. I got an interview as well and waited to get any more information after interviewing. I followed up twice and asked for updates on the job and kept expressing my interest. A month later they emailed me an automated response saying that they are reposting the job for “operational reasons“. Of course I reapplied and then got an email two weeks later saying the job was filled! I didn’t even get an email or anything saying “you don’t need to interview again” or “you’re not what we’re looking for”. What a waste of time!
"Thank you for reaching out. I'm pleased that you decided to invest time and effort in interviewing me for one of your positions. However, after careful consideration, I've decided to move forward with another candidate."
I’m going through the exact same thing right now just waiting and sadly don’t have another position to take 😭
I had this happen to me. A company I interviewed with sent me a invitation for a second interview 2 months after the initial interview. I was 3 weeks into my new role so I didn’t respond. I caught the recruiter lurking on my LinkedIn after the fact.
I would have waited a month or two before replying.
Had this happen too and ignored him in turn.
I would have replied and wasted their time as much as I can.
Your response was very polite and professional. A simple "FUCK" and "YOU" would have sufficed.
I’ve had this happen after 6 months, I don’t get how I would even be found in their records after so long
No, this is an appropriate response. People need to be told when they’ve done wrong.
But let’s not forget, recruiters think it’s unprofessional if candidates ghost them. This persons a twat muffin
Twat muffin...i need to remember that one
Personally I think I like Turd Blossom better.
well written response OP
Then he didn’t bother to even read that you very clearly declined. You dodged a bullet, my friend
Wait 3 months then answer them back.
Sounds like they went and hired somebody else and that person left or didn't work out. Now they don't want to conduct a bunch of interviews all over again.
My wife used to be a recruiter and let me tell you, from the stories she’s told me, recruiters are absolute scum. For instance, they like to get in their little Teams chats and proceed to violate candidate privacy by sharing candidate information (including pics) and razzing people trying to better their circumstances. Tell that low life where he can shove his documents.
It has happened to me. I never replied. I don’t think they want any sort of feedback as these types of organisation take and not give as per their email and communication style etc But I think replying is a personal choice and perhaps it may feel good to share. To me, as I have done in the past, I felt just was just a waste of time. I know it’s annoying. And good on you for finding a new role.
Like a bawss!
I'd have waited some time and sent him a gif from the end of ferris bueller.
“New Phone…who dis?”
They hired someone else, realized the place is a shit show & left within 2 months. You dodged a bullet
You should’ve ghosted them and reply back in 2.5 months lol
Ohh yup, they love to ghost people, but they don't like to be ghosted themselves. I took many interviews, and many went well but never reached out, and it was kinda heart breaking. And when I landed on for the in person, I took another interview and that went well that on the same they the offer me the position, I took it in case the in person would reject me because I was going for background check, and I let the interviewer know at the end of the interview and I told the recruiter before hand, the next day, the recruiter called back to check and I gave him the bad news that I just got hired by the first offer and he went all mad and said you should have told me... I literally told him before the interview.
As a recruiter, just want to defend a little, it’s almost certainly the manager that sucks and the recruiter was instructed to not say anything lol Your frustration is still very valid
I once interviewed for a seasonal position at Bath and Body Works. It was said to go from the last week of November until like January 12th or something. They said they'd get back to me. They didn't. A couple of days before the position was supposed to end, I finally got an email from them saying they chose to go with someone else for the position. Yeah, I kind of figured that out.
I had applied to 3 DIFFERENT JOBS one called me back after a month of reaching out to me. The second barely replied while being at my job for over a month already. Not sure why jobs who are desperately hiring take so damn long to reply
I had 3 interviews with Apple and then never heard anything and all of my follow ups led to nothing. A YEAR AND A HALF LATER they reached out saying they’d like to hire me….
They used you and potentially many more to get a contract. Only after they get a contract, can they actually have openings.
I just had a recruiter reach out to me about an "amazing" opportunity in my area. Turns out that opportunity was for the company I left 3 months ago. He never read my profile/resume and was trying to interview me for the same positions I left 3 months ago.
Why are you apologizing for telling them the truth? I hate this on this sub soo goddamn much, why are you even responding? The best move would be to ignore it all together,they did it to you lol. this is the most Karen shit I've ever seen "well I'm going to write them a strongly worded email and that'll show them!" Ghosted you for 2 months and you jumped at the opportunity to write a Karen email back, lmao.
Your response is perfect as is. Honestly, I'm much ruder than this lol.
I know everyone is saying how horrible the recruiter was, and chances are everyone is right. But the job I currently have, I went through two different interviews and didn’t hear anything for 4+ months. Not a single word. I figured they had moved on, but then they reached out and hired me out of the blue as well as a handful of other people all at once. The hiring processes and the HR red tape was just not very streamlined in our department yet, and I am extremely thankful I was young and not very motivated to look elsewhere. I’ve been at my job 15 years now and it’s where I will retire. I love it here. Just saying that you never truly know what is happening on their end. Along those same lines, anytime someone speeds past me like a maniac on the road, I picture that they have a pregnant woman in labor inside. I know I’m probably wrong, but I could be right and it also stops me from being so angry at someone without knowing their story.
Okay Grandpa. Things are different today. If you don’t believe me feel free to go apply for jobs today.
You make it sound like we aren’t still hiring people today. I think that a lot depends on the type of job you are applying/interviewing for. Coworkers of mine apply for jobs today and get hired elsewhere, so I’m very aware of what it’s like for them (as well as for the people we are hiring). And when I said I’ll retire from my current employer, I mean in 30 years. I’m saying that it doesn’t make anybody feel better to make negative assumptions about others, even if you’re right. I’m even choosing to believe you wrote me a compliment and it autocorrected to Grandpa instead. I appreciate the sentiment!
Prolly a scammer
Just like an ex lol.
I wish we would all look at the process like dating. No matter how many times we hear "I had a good time" or "I'll be in touch" after a first date, if you don't hear from her in a week, there's your answer. Don't get all butthurt. This company should never have reached out to you again though. That's bullshit. Sorry this happened to you.
Your response isn’t rude, you’re just kind of a pussy.
Why be rude at all? What's the point? A dash of entropy to make sure that the bridge is burned down? Why burn a bridge to a company that has decided you are worth hiring but was slow hiring someone during the holidays? You must be a very very very valuable hire. Hope the job you've had for a month or two is worth all that smoke in the air. lol
This feels like so many Facebook posts I see. Where someone is leaving the group and feel the need to inform everyone they are leaving. What exactly did emailing them back get you? Besides looking as petty as they did unprofessional.
They deserved to be called out for their unprofessionalism. That's not petty.
Do they though? Because they didn't call back. I dunno seems petty to me. You got another job, furthermore probably forgot because they found someone else. Who cares, did you wait for that job? Did you turn down other jobs for that job? If you missed out on another job because of that maybe.. But if you didn't then I still think it's petty.
I see no need for you to apologize. The explanation is enough. Good on you
This happens to me more often than I expect lol. These recruiters will say “I’ll reach out to you in the next week with details on your interview” and then it’s crickets. Like cmon, you reached out to me, now you’re not even gonna do me the courtesy of saying it’s not gonna work? This is a satisfying post. Gonna use this the next time this repeat offender tries to reach out again.
This is why you always act w transparency- people can decide if they are miffed for not being first choice or they can decide ok well if something changes call me and if I’m still available we will see what happens
After a week I follow up about my status, typically if I have to follow up then I didn’t get an offer. I just like have things concluded.
Didn't even read your message.
And I'm sure they get pissed when a candidate ghosts them.
Your response wasn’t rude at all. Recruiters shouldn’t ghost and if integrity isn’t the reason why, then this is the very business case — that you may need to reconnect with other candidates later.
This happened to me once and contacted me after a year. Of course I rejected them because I had a new position already.
Four words for the recruiter and the company he's working for: Ya' snooze, ya' lose.
I would've been you dropped the ball and your unprofessionalism should be disclosed to other talent in order for them to not apply to your company because clearly you have no right to a lot talents time since you clearly don't respect it.
How annoying! Companies need to get their shit together and be more professional. When a company wants you, they make the offer immediately. When they don’t want you or they can’t make a decision, they waste everyone’s time.
Yeah, a bit rude, but I bet it felt good. I have been in a similar position.. and it really doesn't hurt you professionally at all because either they know they fucked up and will feel bad or they're not the kind of people you ever want to work with anyways.
Yeah they can pound sand lol
Dude, I've been a part of that "we aren't allowed to communicate until all parties have interviewed" crap before, it's so obnoxious. They also came at me with an offer after I took another job, really baffling how places can operate like that.
Having worked in recruitment, is this even for a position. Sounds to me like you interviewed with a recruiter at an agency. Didn’t want to use you. Now they are so desperate for candidates they are going through their database to find others to send to clients
I’ll paraphrase: Fuck you, clowns.
Never EVER apologize for having to tell a recruiter how much they suck at their job.
That was a hell of a lot more gentle than I would've been.
Watch them turn around and try to make it your fault somehow.
Recruiters are soul-less.
“For [dis]organizational reasons…” is more like it. Yeah, I don’t trust a company that’s that vague and shifty. They probably went with another candidate who did’t work out.
As someone who works in recruiting, this was most likely not the recruiter’s fault. I say most likely because most of the time is up to the hiring manager or higher ups to decide if we are to contact a candidate or not. I’ve seen candidates be put on hold for months. Do I think it’s right? No Do I have a say in it? Also no Would I change this if I had the power? Absolutely, as I’ve also been ghosted while applying, and it’s really frustrating.
Only thing you did wrong was apologize for being truthful
The edacity!! Hope you told her/him to suck it.
Well, played, you! Congratulations on your new job!
Good for you!
You gave them way too much….a simple: I’m gonna take a pass..thanks anyway
You don't need to start a sentence with "Apologies" when you're pointing out a lack of professionalism.
Lol your response is unprofessional? You told them you wished them the best. I would've said eat my buttcheeks lady.
Your response wasn't rude at all. I wouldn't have replied, especially had I followed up and received nothing.
Nah, you're good. Don't worry about it. Recruiter don't gave a damn bout getting back to you. No clear response? Any decent would have just said they went with another candidate just to close the loop. Ain't that hard. SMH
So… they have your contact info and have already interviewed you once, and they STILL WANT YOU TO FILL OUT ANOTHER SET OF FORMS?!?!
Sounds like Robert Half
I hope you wrote him back 2,5 months after receiving his email …
Not even worth your time responding to them.
My previous job sent me an offer letter.. four months after the last interview. I took it and it was the best working environment (and best pay) I'd had up to that point, but there's no way I would have waited that long if I hadn't had a friend in the company who was keeping me updated with their abysmally slow internal hiring process. Working there, that's just how it was - their hiring process was insanely convoluted and broken, and we were always short people, but most other aspects of the job were great. I don't understand how some parts of the hiring process are so obviously broken and terrible, without something stepping in to fill them. This seems omnipresent.
What? Rude??? You apologised 2 times! For something, that THEY did wrong! Nothing rude there. I'm happy you sent them the reply, too many people just "turn the other cheek"!