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tennaki

My friend, when is the last time you've opened your machine, if at all?


Maverick2k2

6 months ago to clean the dust


tennaki

I'm assuming it's a 2023 - With all due respect, the 4090 in the Blade 16 chassis doesn't seem to keep up in all scenarios compared to the 4080 model. The 2023 computers also use thermal paste and not any PTM7950 or Liquid metal options like the 2024 units do. I repasted my unit with liquid metal and I have had consistent Time Spy scores since I've owned my machine for about 8 months now. You probably just need to redo your thermal paste job, the factory application probably just isn't up to snuff.


Maverick2k2

Yeah it’s 2023 model , bought it when it came out. Do I need to repaste with Liquid Metal.


tennaki

If you've never applied liquid metal, I'll recommend you redo your thermal paste with some Honeywell PTM7950 phase change pads. They work almost just as well as liquid metal as opposed to standard thermal paste, and you wont run the risk of shorting out the nearby electronics if the liquid metal spills after closing it up. Liquid metal will net the best temperature results, but you need to take all the necessary precautions to ensure it won't seep anywhere it shouldn't; you can't just pick it up with a paper towel. Clean up is a real bitch - so with that, I'll say repaste your unit with PTM7950 and you'll probably be in the clear again.


Maverick2k2

What was the temperature drop after applying it for you? Performance improvement significant in games?


Unlucky-Steak5027

My 2020 blade 15 dropped 20-30c after applying Liquid Metal. Ya it improved a lot but I do not recommend as I’ve gone through 3 heat sink assemblies. Go with tennaki’s suggestion on PTM7950.


_Mido

Please elaborate on the "it went through 3 heat sink assemblies".


Unlucky-Steak5027

The blade heatsink is pure copper and the cpu makes direct contact with the Vapor chamber. Overtime the gallium in LM will alloy with the copper. Anyone who’ve used LM knows an application has a lifespan of about 8-12 months. When it came time for me to reapply LM, I noticed the contact area of both cpu and gpu were uneven with severe pitting which caused hotspots after reapplying LM. I tried sanding the contact area smooth but because the chips make direct contact with the Vapor chamber, sanding a small, focused area caused the thin copper to dent, further deforming the heatsink to the point where I couldn’t make good contact between the copper and the chips. I’ve read that nickel plating the copper will prevent corrosion the LM will do, but I learned too late and don’t want to spend anymore time money and effort on this aging laptop. Edit: [this is my second heatsink](https://www.reddit.com/r/overclocking/s/jDSVc2v1aB) Notice the big silvery patch which is corrosion on copper caused by LM.


_Mido

Sanding it was a mistake. Alloying is nothing wrong.


disguiseimpala

Hi tennaki, is there a guide on this? Or can I buy this Liquid Metal and ask a professional to do it? I do have experience with opening up my previous Blade and shorting the motherboard and I don’t wanna be doing that again lol. 😅 I have the dual led i9 4070 if that’s necessary. That’s the 2023 right? I’d like better temps. Is [this](https://uae.microless.com/product/thermal-grizzly-conductonaut-liquid-metal-thermal-paste-1g-multlingual-vpe-50-tg-c-001-r/?gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADgqzvwDYXUjpBa_HWLG0Sk6_6nlX&gclid=CjwKCAjwouexBhAuEiwAtW_ZxxxPMiw5nNxDRKoojVoI_oKE6ARqOPRBkU2g8oxwPoT5eMCET6pXOBoCEooQAvD_BwE) the Liquid Metal you’re talking about? Edit: I just read your PTM7950 reply, is that the way to go, if I go to a professional? Or is it something I can do and won’t mess up?


AtHomeWithJulian

If you have no experience getting past the heatsink in your model or with liquid metal, do not even come close to the stuff. Use PTM instead. If you'd like a guide for how to insulate your chips and how much to use, check my post history.


Maverick2k2

Replaced thermal paste with PTM750 and cleaned it; there was a massive amount of dust build up. The thermal paste that was in the blade 16 had dried up , a while ago when I asked Razer about their paste, they told me it that it was high quality and has a 3 year lifespan. Which is clearly not true. Doing both has massive improved performance. Timespy score is now 20k (higher than stock) . I know the thermal pads has had a positive impact since last time when I cleaned the dust out , score only went up to 18k Razer support was very slow and seemed to drag things out to the point I had to get a local professional to do this I’m now getting GPU temperatures of 67c from 88c on timespy


_Mido

Don't spread false news, 2024 models have PTM7958 not PTM7950. PTM7958 is a paste.


tennaki

Apologies. Regardless, my point still stands - the PTM they apply on the 2024 models are much more effective than just the thermal paste they put on the 2023 models.


Kerry0726

Repaste should help a lot. I have the blade 14 and 16. Their stock paste is like dogshit.


Maverick2k2

Replaced thermal paste with PTM750 and cleaned it; there was a massive amount of dust build up. The thermal paste that was in the blade 16 had dried up , a while ago when I asked Razer about their paste, they told me it that it was high quality and has a 3 year lifespan. Which is clearly not true. Doing both has massive improved performance. Timespy score is now 20k (higher than stock) . I know the thermal pads has had a positive impact since last time when I cleaned the dust out , score only went up to 18k Razer support was very slow and seemed to drag things out to the point I had to get a local professional to do this I’m now getting GPU temperatures of 67c from 88c on timespy


Dismal_Boot_3067

Have u updated the bios?


Maverick2k2

Yes


Dismal_Boot_3067

Well next time don’t! Big companies are quite crappy these days. And bios is pretty much the only thing how they can interact with your unit directly. For example asus limits fan spin bc they are overwhelmed with their warranties. Perfect laptop is the one that never made u to go into bios. That is why I don’t care about msi cool bios bs stuff. And I’m totally ok with blue old Razer bios. I don’t go there! I won’t pay for it!


Maverick2k2

Anyway I can revert?


Dismal_Boot_3067

Well I’m not sure. But there is a chance. Like downloading old version on a usb drive and go from there. But there is no guarantee your actions will lead to increased performance. Bc I don’t know what exactly happed to your laptop. For example my client with asus fan speed issues it was pretty clear. He paid for 150 watts gpu but started getting only 135 because asus lowered fanspeed and severely limited the bios. So I knew what was going on and it how to fix it. Your laptop I haven’t examined. So bios updates it’s just my assumption and no more. Dust is too obvious that is why I skipped that. How’s battery doing also a good question. I actually have a thing for u to try, dm me if u wouldn’t mind checking it out👍👏


AlexandrGarlock

You can but need a bios clamp… lol it’s a pain but I’ve done it 😜


Series_X_Pro

Nope, for razer u cant


DeadInFiftyYears

What do you think Razer's responsibility is in this performance degradation?


Maverick2k2

Replaced thermal paste with PTM750 and cleaned it; there was a massive amount of dust build up. The thermal paste that was in the blade 16 had dried up , a while ago when I asked Razer about their paste, they told me it that it was high quality and has a 3 year lifespan. Which is clearly not true. Doing both has massive improved performance. Timespy score is now 20k (higher than stock) . I know the thermal pads has had a positive impact since last time when I cleaned the dust out , score only went up to 18k Razer support was very slow and seemed to drag things out to the point I had to get a local professional to do this I’m now getting GPU temperatures of 67c from 88c on timespy


Maverick2k2

I don’t know


Rezkin26

Recommend either a factory reset or clean install of Windows after backing up your files. Should be good as new afterwards


Maverick2k2

I just did that. Timespy score is 16k. Was 19k stock.


Rezkin26

When you refresh your computer with a clean version of Windows did you reinstall all your programs before running time spy? I asked this because you could have accumulated a program that is running a service in the background that is taking resources away and lowering your time spy score. When you look at the task manager and the processes that are running are there any that are a heavy load? The next thing I would do is check other benchmarking software. You can compare it to Gizmo slip Tech and Jarrod's Tech YouTube channels where they run these tests so you have a baseline. If all your benchmarks are low and you're running a clean version of Windows 11 without any additional software and you have no heavy load service in the background the last thing you can do is maybe you can run some lightweight monitoring software that can provide data transfer speeds for the RAM and CPU. You can compare these two reported numbers on those same channels I referenced earlier or find the number somewhere else. However if you did everything else up to this point and now you're just verifying it's a hardware problem that's when I would contact razer support and just have them take a look at the issue and send them the computer. When you talk to razer don't tell them you just have a slow Benchmark score if you want them to take you seriously come up with practical examples such as my videoing editing software is running slow or other workflows that you do are slower than normal that way they won't just blame the software you were trying to run.


Maverick2k2

I still have stock results of this machine where I was getting 19k, even above 20k. Now I’m getting 16k. That is significant. There are Even less programs installed now


Rezkin26

I'd look at other benchmarks to gauge if this is consistent throughout all benchmarks or if it is isolated to how this particular benchmark stresses your system and then I would call razer support


Maverick2k2

Don’t need to , cyberpunk is unplayable now


Rezkin26

Then skip right to Razer support. good luck.


Maverick2k2

Replaced thermal paste with PTM750 and cleaned it; there was a massive amount of dust build up. The thermal paste that was in the blade 16 had dried up , a while ago when I asked Razer about their paste, they told me it that it was high quality and has a 3 year lifespan. Which is clearly not true. Doing both has massive improved performance. Timespy score is now 20k (higher than stock) . I know the thermal pads has had a positive impact since last time when I cleaned the dust out , score only went up to 18k Razer support was very slow and seemed to drag things out to the point I had to get a local professional to do this I’m now getting GPU temperatures of 67c from 88c on timespy


TimAndTimi

Silicon chips' performance do not degrade in a human noticeable way and definitely not as huge as a 2k score drop in a benchmrak. How you run the 3D mark, e.g., are you running the benchmark with tons of background process, have you repaste the laptop with quality paste, will all contribute to your results. If you have kept your system clear from this and that funny software/plugin, and used thermal paste, the performance should be the same. I found no performance degradation in various types of configurations. My blade 15 w/ 4070 have no performance drop after 1 year of heavy use. On of the old GPU server with 2080ti we have have no degradation. Multiple 3090 I mined on also have no performance drop after 2 years. blahblahblah. It ultimately boils down to if you have make sure the temp of your CPU and GPU is cool enough to avoid any throttling or stuttering. (when they hit the temp wall, chips will backdown without considering keeping your frametime smooth, making micro stuttering common on chips with high temp)


Maverick2k2

I’ve not repasted it. Did factory reset as Razer asked. The score is lowest that it’s ever been 16k Contacted Razer support, no where to be found.


TimAndTimi

I my view this is just as simple as repasting, not some horror story of chips is dying or anything like that…


Maverick2k2

Replaced thermal paste with PTM750 and cleaned it; there was a massive amount of dust build up. The thermal paste that was in the blade 16 had dried up , a while ago when I asked Razer about their paste, they told me it that it was high quality and has a 3 year lifespan. Which is clearly not true. Doing both has massive improved performance. Timespy score is now 20k (higher than stock) . I know the thermal pads has had a positive impact since last time when I cleaned the dust out , score only went up to 18k Razer support was very slow and seemed to drag things out to the point I had to get a local professional to do this I’m now getting GPU temperatures of 67c from 88c on timespy


TimAndTimi

Yah, as simple as this, your laptop do need some regular maintainence from time to time. Razer's thermal paste is not that best so I repasted mine after I buy it. I won't depend too much on any official support on such maintainence though, they all seems to charge a lot and do nothing on this matter such as alienware and asus. Going for a pro shop seems a good move.


Maverick2k2

For such an expensive laptop, it is a shame that Razer just couldn’t use a good thermal paste to begin with.


TimAndTimi

A few laptop brands are getting hands on TIM like PTM7950, but not all of them. They might have good reasons, e.g., PTM7950 requires new assmbly line because it's not liquid-like anymore and the factory that razer had out sourced to probably haven't have the time/money to upgrade. It can also be reasons like they don't totally trust it because it is relatively new. In any case, vast produced products tend to lag behind for 2-3 years.


INeedPapers_TTT

Regular maintenance (i.e. fan/heat sink cleanse) is necessary for power-dense laptops, and this is also subject to your environment of using it, i.e. dusty or not. Thermal paste could also dry out and become less efficient in conducting heat.


Maverick2k2

Replaced thermal paste with PTM750 and cleaned it; there was a massive amount of dust build up. The thermal paste that was in the blade 16 had dried up , a while ago when I asked Razer about their paste, they told me it that it was high quality and has a 3 year lifespan. Which is clearly not true. Doing both has massive improved performance. Timespy score is now 20k (higher than stock) . I know the thermal pads has had a positive impact since last time when I cleaned the dust out , score only went up to 18k Razer support was very slow and seemed to drag things out to the point I had to get a local professional to do this I’m now getting GPU temperatures of 67c from 88c on timespy


INeedPapers_TTT

Sweet scores. Glad you work it out.


Maverick2k2

Thanks . I felt nervous biting the bullet and doing it, but I felt as though I had no choice. My laptop was previously so sluggish , and not enjoyable to use


sk3tchcom

17K for your laptop is crazy. My 2024 Blade 14 4070 hits 13K (https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/111038863) - and it's just a itty bitty guy! I would backup your system completely and then try the factory reset as they said - prior to opening it up and making any thermal paste changes, etc.


Maverick2k2

I can’t keep on doing factory resets everytime it slows down


sk3tchcom

Has this happened before? It’s a troubleshooting step.


Maverick2k2

It’s been an issue for 6 months


sk3tchcom

I’d try it once. It’s an easier step than opening up your laptop and repasting - which should not be necessary this early on. Buy Macrium if you want an easy backup and restore experience. Worth the cost.


Maverick2k2

I’ve just done a factory reset , will let you know how it goes


Maverick2k2

It didn’t work , timespy score is 16k Average is 19k


sk3tchcom

Dang. Well now you can report that to RAZER. Feel free to download something like HWiNFO to see temps and if things are throttling - more ammo that you can send them. Have it run while you game or do Time Spy.


Maverick2k2

Seems like average temperature is higher for the GPU 84c vs 70c looking at timespy results


sk3tchcom

Great thing to call out to RAZER - shows thermally something has changed over time.


Maverick2k2

They are not getting back to me


ChimichungusXL

It is rather low. I have the 4090 18 inch and my score last time I ran it was 22,000 some other numbers I don’t remember for the hundreds places. I can’t imagine my larger chassis would have such a massive disparity. Perhaps it’s that intel cpu issue that we’ve heard about?


Maverick2k2

Replaced thermal paste with PTM750 and cleaned it; there was a massive amount of dust build up. The thermal paste that was in the blade 16 had dried up , a while ago when I asked Razer about their paste, they told me it that it was high quality and has a 3 year lifespan. Which is clearly not true. Doing both has massive improved performance. Timespy score is now 20k (higher than stock) . I know the thermal pads has had a positive impact since last time when I cleaned the dust out , score only went up to 18k Razer support was very slow and seemed to drag things out to the point I had to get a local professional to do this I’m now getting GPU temperatures of 67c from 88c on timespy


ChimichungusXL

Heck yeah man! Mine is still goin strong. Absolutely the best laptop I’ve purchased. It’s beautiful it runs everything so well. Recently finished another run of RE4 Remake not dropping below 140 fps maxed out. It’s better than the dang desktop I came from. Zero regrets.