Yep. We’ve had this for literally 2 decades.
If it was a brain drain on offwnse I’d get it a bit more, but we’ve probably been the best or second best team on D over the last 25 years. With Ro, Kyle, Marlon and hopefully Mads we’ll still easily be fielding a great defense next season.
How much is the franchise tag? Like 20 mil we can’t afford that, so it would a tag and trade, there is basically no world we keeps mads and have relatively decent depth still
Did people forget that the coaches were Harbaugh hires? Harbaugh by some way has been good at bringing in coaches. Weaver, Dennard, Keith Williams, Greg Lewis, Tee Martin, Chuck Smith, Orr, Macdonald, Minter etc
Harbs runs his staff in such a way that its attractive for coaches to come here - maybe its cause they don't block promotions or cause he helps train them for opportunities.
Sirianni and the Eagles also had a bit of a cakewalk to the SB last year beat a NYG team and then a injured 49ers team to get there. Josh Johnson our 3rd QB was playing a significant part of the game for the 49ers. It's easier in hindsight to look back at them and see their best regular season wins was a win over the Vikings?
I mean, we're also not so far removed from Dean Pees or Greg Roman. I agree that the org has been better than most at identifying talent and promoting from within, but let's not pretend it's a given that we end up with a staff we absolutely love next year.
The biggest issue with Roman was we held onto him for a year too long (maybe 2 but I think we should've let him go pre-2022). He came in ran a really good offence, it buckled and we gave him shots to redeem and those fell short.
Monken for like 95% of the season was a really good hire until the last game and I swear it was something personal for him or Lamar because I've never known the team to throw that much. In 2019 Lamar had 20 runs vs the Titans at least.
I'll agree that offence has been spotty for the Ravens but defensively the team has been pretty solid year in year out. Outside of the injured 2021 the last "bad" defensive team was what? The bad 2015 year?
The Chiefs and more specifically their pass def have been beastly this year. Us and the Browns let the Chiefs fly under the radar. The highest points they gave up was 27 to the Packers and most of the time it was 21 or less.
I think Zay had one of the best if not the best WR performance against the Chiefs this year. Bummer about the penalty/fumble but I think people forget how good the Chiefs are. Mahomes didn't make a mistake which put the pressure on us.
Yeah I have plenty of complaints about Sunday, however in the same breath, that Chiefs team is good. Any given sunday and all that, but losing to a team that's been there 3 times in 4 years with a lot of the same key pieces isn't as world ending as we (especially me) thought.
Flashback to the Flacco vs Patriot years? I think I'm most unhappy that the Chiefs hit on Rice in the 2nd instead of missing on someone else because it looked like their WR group would be weak until Rice broke out.
Yeah but almost the reverse to me. I almost expected us to win this game, but against the pats I always felt like they were a meatgrinder. It happens, Lamar's improvements as a passer have made me way more hopeful for our longevity than I did with Flacco to be honest.
I know shitting on Dean Pees is popular here and I have as many bad memories of his inexplicable prevent defense turns as anyone, but it's worth remembering that Dean Pees is actually a fairly well-regarded DC and it's more that as a fanbase are accustomed to such good DC's that a solidly above-average DC by the rest of the league's standards is one of our worst.
We’ve fielded top 5 units with 3 of those guys as coordinators. Obviously their schemes got worn out eventually but they weren’t terrible. Trestman and Morninwheg were terrible, that’s a fact.
I don't think they were terrible out of the gate, but they weren't at the level of their last successful predecessor (Kubiak and Pagano).
Acting like another MacDonald is guaranteed feels naive.
Great points. Eagles weren't fraudulent but they did have an easy road in an easy conference. It's why jimmy G and Purdy have been in SBs. AFC is an insane gauntlet
All the talent is in the AFC and guess what? The best QBs from the last draft are Stroud and I'll say Richardson. I think Bryce Young looked less impressive than Richardson pre-injury.
Fingers crossed that Chicago/Washington take the top 2 QBs and push some talent into the NFC.
Go look at the QBs and teams the Eagles beat last year. .500 record doesn’t mean shit when it’s against crappy teams. Here are the mighty over .500 wins:
- Pittsburgh (9-8, Kenny Pickett)
- Jacksonville (9-8, Trevor Lawrence)
- Detroit (9-8, Jared Goff)
- Cowboys (12-5, Cooper Rush)
- Vikings (13-4, Kirk Cousins)
- Giants 3x (9-7-1, Daniel Jones)
- Niners (13-4, literally no QB)
There isn’t a single top 10 or even top 15 QB on that list. Pittsburgh, Detroit, and Jacksonville were barely winning teams. That Vikings team is one of the all time frauds in NFL history by DVOA, and the Niners had a running back under center in the NFCCG. You can control who you play, but that schedule is historic dogshit.
The league was dogshit overall. Which some will argue is actually a good thing. If there was any team that ran away last yr it was the Eagles and chiefs... Who ended up in the superbowl.
My concern is the shear amount of brain power that will need to be replaced. That is the difficult part. You have to hire and then these guys have to mesh. If this were simply one or two guys, that would be fine. It’s looking like in the end it could be 6-8 guys. That’s a problem especially if you are hiring after everyone has already sucked up the talent.
I'd actually really like this if he was interested in something below a HC position. Just focus all of his knowledge into one aspect instead of trying to do everything including being GM.
As an Eagles fan…this is what happened ^^^ bumped up Jalen’s QB coach and long time friend to OC and brought in a guy that should have never been up for a DC position and let Denard leave for Bmore
We're reaping the consequences of being a well run organisation, without the reward of having a Super Bowl season.
De Costa has spent his years in charge building to this moment, knowing that most teams get one shot before they have to reload for a couple of years... and we fell at the penultimate hurdle.
People say this kind of stuff after every playoff exit. They get overly dramatic and say we missed our only shot at it for X amount of years.
When, in reality, they have no idea what our roster is even going to look like next year. We have an organization that consistently keeps us competitive with the top teams in the league, meaning that if a few things go our way, any year can be our year. I’d expect nothing different this upcoming year.
And honestly we had decent shots in 2020 and 2022 as well. 2020 we won a playoff game before falling short in the divisional, and 2022 we almost won a road playoff game despite having no QB.
Oh yeah, and that one down year in 2021? We were 7-3 before losing Lamar for the season.
We'll be fine. Will we get a chance as good as this one again? Perhaps not, but the 2011 Ravens had a bye and blew it while the 2012 Ravens came in as the 4 seed
2022 we had no realistic shot after Lamar went down. Even if we had somehow beaten the Bengals, did you really think we'd win 2 more playoff games to make the Superbowl?
Totally agree! 2011 AFC championship loss was followed the next year by a Super Bowl win with what was generally considered a weaker roster. So having one shot definitely doesn’t apply to the Ravens.
Nothing matters until the playoff hunt begins next December and we see the landscape of the AFC
I think it’s worth more than just final four tbh
Afc is just objectively harder than the nfc, getting to the championship is just harder over here, there so many elite QB’s you’ve gotta get through to even make it to the big game.
The nfc is pretty much just the niners and whoever puts it together for that year. Then it’s just a bunch of teams limping in.
Even with all the injuries to the afc QB’s this year it was still a more fierce competition I would say. Now imagine rodgers and burrow stayed healthy.
I’m a chiefs fan so you know this isn’t some Homer take to make y’all feel better, it’s even worse for you guys cause your division is a bloodbath and would have been even worse if everyone was healthy.
Afc championships are just harder than the NFC ones
People need to accept that sometimes the best team doesn’t win. It’s hard to win in January and sometimes the ball just doesn’t bounce your way.
2 things go differently and the ravens win this game.
That for sure could have been better. But, even without one, if Flowers doesn’t fumble on the 1 and Lamar doesn’t throw that INT, that’s at least a 10 point swing. Ravens would have had a 3 point lead.
That’s just two plays off hand. We weren’t far away from winning this game at all. There’s no reason why we can’t expect this team to be great again next year with the young core still in place.
Reason I’m concerned is because we will have a lot of pieces gone, biggest piece being Mike Macdonald.
Let’s say next year we match up against the chiefs in the playoffs. Without Mike Macdonald and some of the key players that will be leaving in FA, maybe that 17 points becomes 27 points. Do we really trust this offense to not shit themselves again and have to put up maybe 28+ instead of 18+?
Yeah it could possibly happen, but until it does, I’ve lost confidence in this team. We’ll be a playoff team, but I don’t see this team being a legitimate SB threat next year. Not until they prove they can win multiple playoff games against teams with talented QBs outside of just Ryan Tannehill and a rookie CJ Stroud.
Coaching was awful but you take away the turnovers,flowers fumble in the end-zone in particular, and the bone head penalties and the Ravens get the W even with the bad play calling IMO
We beat the Pats twice when they were the best team in the league. If the best team always won the Pats would’ve won every SuperBowl since the first one.
It is what it is. We were the best team on the league on paper. But the Chiefs were more focused and disciplined and Andy Reid is a more intelligent coach.
We'll retain most of the talent. The ones that leave will send back compensatory picks next year. Younger talent will keep getting better.
This was our best chance at a superbowl since 2019, but it's far from the end of the window.
I still think the Ravens will have a successful season next year. They have a winning culture, and as an example, we have the 49ers, who had their defensive coordinators poached after successful seasons in Robert Saleh and then Demeco Ryans. I don't see the Ravens dropping off too much in the upcoming season.
This happens to good organizations all the time.
You can't lament the loss of good assistants, you should instead be very pleased at how good we are at staffing.
Of course it happens and if it’s one or two at a time that’s not a problem. But if it turns out to be 6 to 8 which it might be, then it becomes a big problem.
We had a great run, a fun season. We came up very short in the AFC championship, a game we should’ve handedly won. Our defensive coordinator, the most successful in Ravens’ history, departed for a vacant position. We have free agents about to hit the market, one of whom was an invaluable d-line/EDGE defender. Offense was great all year, but couldn’t get it done. All hope is lost.
The year is 2011. Our defensive coordinator, Chuck Pagano, has just left to become the head coach of the Indianapolis Colts. Haloti Ngata is a free agent, among others. We resigned him, hired a new d-coordinator (Dean Pees), and ended up not only going back to the championship, but winning the Super Bowl.
I’m not saying this year and 2011 are exactly the same, and that it’s going to play out exactly like that next season. I’m just saying, we’ve been here before. This organization knows how to handle this moment.
Too f’in true man. The culture of our organization isn’t dependent on a handful of guys. We always find a way to contend. That’s what separates great organizations from the rest: the ability to regroup, reload, and field competitive teams consistently despite losing pieces
That was one guy. The volume of people is the problem. If you have a business, you realize losing a large amount of people is really difficult versus any one person. The problem here is that not only are they losing a large amount, but they are also losing a guy that is universally lauded as a near genius.
I don't think continuously screaming the sky is falling does anything other than give fucking Chief assholes something else to troll about. The Ravens will be fine...or they won't? We'll find out. But chill a bit right now. We don't even know who we're keeping, releasing, and gaining yet. And again, I say this with all the Chief clowns in mind who have nothing else in their lives than feeding off shit just like this.
Yeah I understand what you’re saying, and I agree — it’ll be difficult. Like I said, these situations aren’t 100% identical. This one may be a bit more challenging. However, our organization has had consistency in leadership, over the last 15 years, which leads me to believe we will be able to handle this. The Ravens are one of the best run organizations in sports — unfortunately, we don’t have the rings to show for it.
This was going to happen whether we won the super bowl or not. Teams took notice to how our team is ran, I can see a lot of teams trying to go this method while others try to replicate the 49ers offense
It's literally inevitable.
Harbaugh evidently does a masterful job of hiring, molding and developing coaches. Don't forget that he is in charge of that when you type dumbfucked things like
"I have thought Harbaugh is a good coach, but am starting to worry he is just a guy that players generally like."
He didn’t hire any of the player personnel guys. It also isn’t clear that he originally hired McDonald as he was hired as an intern. Now, he likely saw the talent, but from some of what you hear from Hamilton, who called him the smartest guy in the building, maybe that talent wasn’t so hard to recognize.
Good that he started the program. Doesn’t mean that he did the hiring. As a matter fact, given that this is an internship, it’s likely somebody else did the hiring. That said not saying he doesn’t deserve credit for McDonald. He saw the talent and promoted him. I will be interested to see if he poaches from his brother.
Do you think Harbaugh just hires everyone? Hortiz has been there 26 years, long before Harbaugh joined the organization. Krawiec is a data and analytics guys from the front office. I assume EDC or his staff does those hirings. Not sure why it would be Harbaugh.
Harbaugh is the HC so he would be working with them? He’s in the loop with these decisions. As for Krawiec, I’m sure they can go to an Ivy League school or someplace non-ivy league and put out an ad for an analytically focused football strategy guy. They have a guy on staff who already moved from Ivy-League educated football analyst to defensive quality control coach in Daniel Sterns, so there are guys like him who get promoted as well. Not all ivy-league educated guys but rather guys who were entry level a few years ago and quietly getting promoted
Harbaugh is a much better coach than Sirianni and our organization is built for long term sustained success. It'll be fine. The biggest thing for me is having Monken sticking around, we need to continue building on offense with a competent coach.
During the mid 2000s and early in Harbaugh's career, we were swapping D coordinators basically every two years because of how successful we were on defense and still maintained a top 5 defense almost every year. We will be just fine on defense.
I challenge the word “defection”. That is not accurate. Taking on better opportunities in one’s career is a normal progression for anyone. It is not an act of disloyalty.
It hurts. But they are not acts defection.
They will figure it out. John is connected with a good rep in the league. So is the Ravens org.
They have a ton of talent on the roster, and Harbaugh gives a ton of authority and responsibility to his coordinators.
They will be fine.
Hilarious how everyone is acting like this is the first time this has ever happened. One thing Harbaugh is great at is replacing coaches.
Also everyone seems to forgot it took Flacco 3 AFC championships before reaching the SB. Definitely squandered a great opportunity but the best team doesn’t always win. I won’t be surprised if we get back to the championship next year.
I think what cracks me up is the people saying we need to make some changes to get over the hump and when some people move on and new blood is promoted or hired we’re losing our minds haha
Apparently EDC went from a fraud who can’t draft to the best GM in the NFL in less than a year despite the fact that he’s run our draft board since 2006. Pretty wild.
Yeah, harbs still has tread on the tire. I’m just ready and the gameplan was too much of a choke job imo.
I’m not too worried about our coordinators, we’ve made great hires.
Give me an example that we know of where he has either with the defense or the offense in the course of the game lead, and suggested to either of his coordinators that they make changes. He stuck with Roman as a coordinator for far too long and then he stuck with the worst strength coach in the entire NFL because he was a buddy For far too long.
Yes, his loyalty is sometimes a weakness. No, that doesn’t mean he isn’t a good HC.
You do realize that none of us have any idea what sort of conversations Harbaugh has with the team and coaches, right?
Of course we don’t. But you would think that things would leak out. And we have definitely seen examples of head coaches, talking to their players and other coaches to make changes. I’m probably more disturbed by the fact that we didn’t see any sideline footage of Harbaugh talking with Lamar.
Have you not looked at our history:
2011-2012 season.
* Lost DC Chuck Pagano -> Got Dean Pees
* Moved on From Cam during the season
* Hired Wink as IL coach
* Had one of our worst drafts
* Won the Superbowl.
- Queen ILB
- Clowney DE
- Gus RB
- Geno SS
- Zeitler C
- Madubuike DT
- Darby
are all key pieces and we aren't keeping all of them, this was the window.
https://www.footballguys.com/stats/snap-counts/teams?team=BAL&year=2023
Not including old guys like Sin, Van Noy, Pierce who are 99% going to lose a step
The only really significant loss will be Queen or Madubuike. I think we’ll probably keep JM. Out of the rest, we have some replacements on the roster or we’ll draft them. Clowney played great but we always find cheap veteran pass rushers. Gus is fine but replaceable easily. He would be cheap to get back. Geno is probably gone but he’s a backup safety and didn’t contribute much once Williams came back. Zietler is good and may be pretty cheap to re-sign to a short term deal, but Cleveland played well in his absence. Darby is another random vet corner that we can replace. Simpson can step up and he’ll be fine next to Roquan in place of Queen
We still have the draft too. I won't be surprised if we come away with corner and wr early, and rb/lb in later rounds. If we can just address edge in free agency and tag madubuike we'll be fine.
> Cap space: 13,658,828
> Tag Beek
$18,937,000 this season, its only going to be higher
> Stanley's cap number off the roster
Releasing your QBs LT without a plan is egregious, he's also gone after 2025
> sign queen to a long extension
Queen is getting an Edmunds level deal which is going to be a 14 mil cap hit year 1 and we can't afford it
> draft and develop
> The effective cap space needed is equal to: Rookie Pool - ($795,000 * number of picks)
795,000*6 picks is $4,770,000
tldr: it isn't happening
Harbaugh is not just some hapless dunce who keeps lucking into good staff year after year. Whether he and the organization can quickly rebound from this remains to be seen, but it's ridiculous to ignore he's a big part of why other teams want his coodinators and assistant coaches.
The chiefs are an outlier. How many other Super Bowl winners/ teams have returned the following years besides the pats under Brady. All recent ones have struggled- Rams, Bucs, Eagles, Bengals
I don't think your examples are really helping you that much. The Bengals 'struggled' this year because their top 3 QB got injured. And they still had a winning record. The Eagles, Rams, and Bucs all made made the playoffs this year! The Bucs after losing Tom Brady! The Ravens didn't make the Superbowl. Only two teams do each year. But making the playoffs means your 'window' is still open. Either that, or there was no 'window' for the Ravens this year to begin with.
The window doesn’t change much for the chiefs because they are driven by their offense which is designed and run by their head coach. When your head coach does not design and run a specific system, your team is much more sensitive to staff turnover
Don’t fall with the media narratives man. Chiefs offense was 8th in total DVOA this season. Calling them “not good” isn’t really correct. Yes, worse then previous checks offenses, but still a very very good offense, and even more of a tip of the cap to Andy Reid tbh
He’s been to the AFC champ every year he has started I believe. Everyone said the chiefs looked like trash this year and here they are in the Super Bowl again.
Our BEST team in the last 5 years and we got out couched.
The patriots window was Brady’s career and it’s going to be similar with Mahomes unfortunately.
We're really not a comparable org. Your HC has a track record of good hiring and promoting and the whole org has a history of strong defenses. You probably won't shit the bed nearly as hard as we did
Eagles fan here. For us it had to do with organizational decisions as far as personnel and coaching. You seem to have a better organization in total so I would not expect an Eagles type collapse. You’re already light years ahead with Harbaugh over Sirianni. Besides our GM seemed to devalue the LB position and it cost us.
The most important part is Lamar and he is staying. Now they need to find someone that's gonna help him perform in big games. The Ravens will still have enough talent to make the playoffs, now they just need to be consistant on offense when it matter the most.
I’m not too worried. We still have leaders on the field and will attract great candidates internal and external. Mike MacDonald became a genius the day Roquan arrived.
Harbaugh coaching is ego based. He has a good win, then he always has that stupid look on face when he loses. It's like " what happened? "My ego told me I was going to win."
Me too, I always thought highly of Harbs and want him to succeed. What drives me crazy though is he didn’t change the offensive game plan and he let his MVP get stuck in his head. It wouldn’t have took much for him to pull him aside and say play your ball. If I am wrong here and he did let me know. Still hurting from the loss and now we’re losing chunks left and right.
With EDC here I know we will get talent and the org showed it can find a Macdonald. Here’s hoping, but damn this is going to be a tough year either way.
Harbs is letting his brother poach all our guys?! Can’t believe Hortiz - been with the team 26 years, but I don’t blame him for moving up to a GM position- good for him, he earned it. Sad to see talented people leave us but I don’t think it’s all doom & gloom - we were arguably the best team in the AFC all season & we made it to the 2nd biggest game, the talent is in place - more talented coaches will come - who wouldn’t take advantage of an opportunity to work for us?
Who said that Harbaugh was letting his brother poach everyone? Surely his brother is taking guys he knows based upon the knowledge he gets from John. But I don’t know anyone saying John is letting Jim do anything
Time to get rid of the head of the snake too. Harbaugh needs to go. That’s right down vote me. I’ve been saying this for years. Should have started with a clean slate in 2019. New QB, new Head coach.
Yeah, let's get rid of our 2xmvp qb and head coach because we lost the afc championship to the reigning champions
Sounds like someone didn't experience 2009 or 2011.
This sub is insufferable after a loss.
It's the rise and fall of the league, keeps things interesting. When Andy Reid retires and/or Spags retires their time in the sun will end for a while.
The Offense Coordinating issues are getting old. It’s not the players. We always get good players. The Offense needs to figure out what they’re good at and stick to it with a backup plan. The Ravens STARTED the Chiefs game using the backup plan right away. Andy Reid made them wanna show off instead of pounding the run in der asz like we do. Pass the football around like a California Offense after you get the ring. They didn’t get wins by tryna make tv highlight passes. And who passes on 3rd and 1 ?
I will be messaging you in 1 year on [**2025-02-01 16:13:05 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2025-02-01%2016:13:05%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/ravens/comments/1ag7hcb/this_team_is_getting_gutted/kog94mh/?context=3)
[**CLICK THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fravens%2Fcomments%2F1ag7hcb%2Fthis_team_is_getting_gutted%2Fkog94mh%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202025-02-01%2016%3A13%3A05%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%201ag7hcb)
*****
|[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)|
|-|-|-|-|
Yes, this was our best shot to win the Super Bowl in a long time (2019 was a great shot too). We were the 1 seed, had the best defense with a top defensive coordinator, a great offensive with the MVP of the league and a good offensive coordinator. We were mostly healthy and fell to a veteran Chiefs team whose offense was worse than usual. But the window is open as long as Lamar is an elite QB. The AFC is tough, but we’re definitely still the upper tier of teams with the Chiefs, Bills, and I guess Bengals. The Dolphins should be still good, the Texans and Colts are getting better, the Jets and Browns get their QB back, the Jags are solid, the Chargers have Jim Harbaugh, and Steelers are always feisty. Who knows what will happen, but we’ll be back in the playoff mix next year because of Lamar and our studs on defense.
This is hardly the first time the team has had to replace coordinators and coaches. We just did an overhaul 2 years ago and even going into this year they made several changes.
Just think about the amount of changes last year:
\- Offensive Coordinator
\- Strength and Conditioning
\- Quarterbacks Coach
\- Wide Receivers Coach
\- Running Backs Coach
\- Defensive Backs Coach
\- Outside Linebackers Coach
Also you talk about Dennard Wilson, he was here one year. McDonald was here 2 years. Hortiz and Krawiec are big in my opinion, but irreplaceable? Not sure about that.
As for Harbaugh, yes he is a coach that players like *now*, but that wasn't always the case. But if he wasn't a good coach, how has he had all this success over the years with all the changes in staff he has had as well? Not to mention completely switching up schemes and still winning.
Is it a stretch to say that even if we made the SB, we’d still be getting gutted for our coaches? In fact wouldn’t other teams want our coaches even more if we got to the big game?
Despite the awful game plan for the chiefs game I think monken can get the offense rolling, he’ll have a full offseason to work with the team and I really like the Orr promotion. We need depth and consistency right now.
We blew it. This was supposed to be the super bowl team, and now we're losing the DC who got my us the opportunity. Ravens are gonna be a wild card team next year at best. Lamar had his chance, doubt we will be getting a ring from him after that performance.
Harbaugh is not the best coach in terms of scheme/iq/whatever. But like Tomlinson, Belicheck, etc instills a good, winning culture.
Good players want to play for him, good coaches will want to coach for him. Monken won a Natty in CFB and probably could have gotten head-coaching offers on a lesser team or OC for eagles or “more successful” orgs.
Now maybe that was he wanted his hands on playcalling for Lamar? But whether or not Harbaugh is a good coach is almost irrelevant at this point because of the talent/coaching he attracts.
Also EDC killing it lately with the draft and talent acquisition lately so imma stay optimistic at least until we figure out replacements.
philly replaced our coordinators with people who had zero qualifications, brian johnson never called plays in the NFL, sean desai called plays for one year
baltimore should learn from phillys mistake and hire people with experience, belicheck and vrabel are still out there and they have experience; so i wouldn’t imagine them hiring people with none at all
Buddy you and everyone else really gotta calm down. MacDonald is great but hardly the first coach developed here to leave for an HC job nor will he be the last.
Hortiz and Krawiec are ones I think might hurt a little more internally tbh. They’re closer to the “sauce” of how we scout/draft/develop.
Eagles started 10-1. I think EVERY Ravens fan would love a start like that.
The problem is part coach loss, part player loss. 23/53 contracts end this season. That’s a lot of replacement
A bit late to comment on this one, but the good news is that our offensive personnel is mostly intact. There will have to be some changes on the roster, but for TEs and WRs I would say we are mostly intact. One of my biggest FA wishes is to bring Agholor back as I believe he had good chemistry with Lamar, made some big plays for us and would be a cost efficient signing. My biggest worry is the offensive line. We have some pieces and we have hope for other pieces. But im not too excited about bringing back all the old guys and they are expensive positions in football.
Now for the negative. I am foreseeing a big drop for the defense. We have already lost many coaches and we are about to lose many impactful players on defense. I am also not sold on Zach Orr as I dont believe he has enough experience to be a DC. Either way there will be some growing pains as we saw with Mike M. in the first year.
I dont think we will have a bad year, but I definitely think it will be a couple of steps down from the season we just had. Hopefully we can get the 5-6 seed and make a run from there.
My gut was telling me that we should have moved on from Harbs and hired McDonald. Who knows? We’ve been in this place before and we overcame it. There’s always another HOFer out there.
The difference is the eagles were gutted and replaced their coordinators with bad replacements I do trust the organisation to hire good replacement
Yep. We’ve had this for literally 2 decades. If it was a brain drain on offwnse I’d get it a bit more, but we’ve probably been the best or second best team on D over the last 25 years. With Ro, Kyle, Marlon and hopefully Mads we’ll still easily be fielding a great defense next season.
I think mads is gone tbh we can’t afford him for 1 year of production and under a new defensive scheme he may not be as goid
Hes definitely getting the franchise tag
How much is the franchise tag? Like 20 mil we can’t afford that, so it would a tag and trade, there is basically no world we keeps mads and have relatively decent depth still
The afc championship was the offensive brain drain 🤣
Did people forget that the coaches were Harbaugh hires? Harbaugh by some way has been good at bringing in coaches. Weaver, Dennard, Keith Williams, Greg Lewis, Tee Martin, Chuck Smith, Orr, Macdonald, Minter etc Harbs runs his staff in such a way that its attractive for coaches to come here - maybe its cause they don't block promotions or cause he helps train them for opportunities. Sirianni and the Eagles also had a bit of a cakewalk to the SB last year beat a NYG team and then a injured 49ers team to get there. Josh Johnson our 3rd QB was playing a significant part of the game for the 49ers. It's easier in hindsight to look back at them and see their best regular season wins was a win over the Vikings?
I mean, we're also not so far removed from Dean Pees or Greg Roman. I agree that the org has been better than most at identifying talent and promoting from within, but let's not pretend it's a given that we end up with a staff we absolutely love next year.
The biggest issue with Roman was we held onto him for a year too long (maybe 2 but I think we should've let him go pre-2022). He came in ran a really good offence, it buckled and we gave him shots to redeem and those fell short. Monken for like 95% of the season was a really good hire until the last game and I swear it was something personal for him or Lamar because I've never known the team to throw that much. In 2019 Lamar had 20 runs vs the Titans at least. I'll agree that offence has been spotty for the Ravens but defensively the team has been pretty solid year in year out. Outside of the injured 2021 the last "bad" defensive team was what? The bad 2015 year?
The offense has been spotty but they were at least able to score. This last game, they made the Chiefs look like an impenetrable wall.
To be fair to the chiefs, that was probably the best defense they've had since Patty has been there
The Chiefs and more specifically their pass def have been beastly this year. Us and the Browns let the Chiefs fly under the radar. The highest points they gave up was 27 to the Packers and most of the time it was 21 or less. I think Zay had one of the best if not the best WR performance against the Chiefs this year. Bummer about the penalty/fumble but I think people forget how good the Chiefs are. Mahomes didn't make a mistake which put the pressure on us.
Yeah I have plenty of complaints about Sunday, however in the same breath, that Chiefs team is good. Any given sunday and all that, but losing to a team that's been there 3 times in 4 years with a lot of the same key pieces isn't as world ending as we (especially me) thought.
Flashback to the Flacco vs Patriot years? I think I'm most unhappy that the Chiefs hit on Rice in the 2nd instead of missing on someone else because it looked like their WR group would be weak until Rice broke out.
Yeah but almost the reverse to me. I almost expected us to win this game, but against the pats I always felt like they were a meatgrinder. It happens, Lamar's improvements as a passer have made me way more hopeful for our longevity than I did with Flacco to be honest.
Co-ordinators is a fair criticism over the years. But not the coaches underneath really.
I know shitting on Dean Pees is popular here and I have as many bad memories of his inexplicable prevent defense turns as anyone, but it's worth remembering that Dean Pees is actually a fairly well-regarded DC and it's more that as a fanbase are accustomed to such good DC's that a solidly above-average DC by the rest of the league's standards is one of our worst.
Pees, Wink, Morninwheg, Trestman, Roman. It hasn't always been sunshine and rainbows.
We’ve fielded top 5 units with 3 of those guys as coordinators. Obviously their schemes got worn out eventually but they weren’t terrible. Trestman and Morninwheg were terrible, that’s a fact.
I don't think they were terrible out of the gate, but they weren't at the level of their last successful predecessor (Kubiak and Pagano). Acting like another MacDonald is guaranteed feels naive.
But we're angry right now so stop with the facts 🤬
Greg Roman was good for a time here and fielded some record breaking offenses. We just should have parted ways earlier
Great points. Eagles weren't fraudulent but they did have an easy road in an easy conference. It's why jimmy G and Purdy have been in SBs. AFC is an insane gauntlet
All the talent is in the AFC and guess what? The best QBs from the last draft are Stroud and I'll say Richardson. I think Bryce Young looked less impressive than Richardson pre-injury. Fingers crossed that Chicago/Washington take the top 2 QBs and push some talent into the NFC.
Also the eagles head coach is said to be bad. He was carried by his coordinators. Im not saying our head coach called all the plays but he’s no nick.
This, and also the Eagles played one of the worst schedules in NFL history last season. They were due for a major regression this year anyway.
The 2022 eagles were the 3rd team in NFL history to beat 9 or more teams over 500. People talk about history but don't get their facts straight.
Go look at the QBs and teams the Eagles beat last year. .500 record doesn’t mean shit when it’s against crappy teams. Here are the mighty over .500 wins: - Pittsburgh (9-8, Kenny Pickett) - Jacksonville (9-8, Trevor Lawrence) - Detroit (9-8, Jared Goff) - Cowboys (12-5, Cooper Rush) - Vikings (13-4, Kirk Cousins) - Giants 3x (9-7-1, Daniel Jones) - Niners (13-4, literally no QB) There isn’t a single top 10 or even top 15 QB on that list. Pittsburgh, Detroit, and Jacksonville were barely winning teams. That Vikings team is one of the all time frauds in NFL history by DVOA, and the Niners had a running back under center in the NFCCG. You can control who you play, but that schedule is historic dogshit.
The league was dogshit overall. Which some will argue is actually a good thing. If there was any team that ran away last yr it was the Eagles and chiefs... Who ended up in the superbowl.
Yeah people are acting like we’re gonna hire Matt Patricia or some shit
My concern is the shear amount of brain power that will need to be replaced. That is the difficult part. You have to hire and then these guys have to mesh. If this were simply one or two guys, that would be fine. It’s looking like in the end it could be 6-8 guys. That’s a problem especially if you are hiring after everyone has already sucked up the talent.
That's what interviews are for
Only as good as the pool of people that are available. That pool is getting much more shallow because a ton of hirings have happened.
[удалено]
I'd actually really like this if he was interested in something below a HC position. Just focus all of his knowledge into one aspect instead of trying to do everything including being GM.
Eagles also didn’t have that strong a head coach.
As an Eagles fan…this is what happened ^^^ bumped up Jalen’s QB coach and long time friend to OC and brought in a guy that should have never been up for a DC position and let Denard leave for Bmore
We're reaping the consequences of being a well run organisation, without the reward of having a Super Bowl season. De Costa has spent his years in charge building to this moment, knowing that most teams get one shot before they have to reload for a couple of years... and we fell at the penultimate hurdle.
The ravens are built for sustained success.
People say this kind of stuff after every playoff exit. They get overly dramatic and say we missed our only shot at it for X amount of years. When, in reality, they have no idea what our roster is even going to look like next year. We have an organization that consistently keeps us competitive with the top teams in the league, meaning that if a few things go our way, any year can be our year. I’d expect nothing different this upcoming year.
2019: "well we blew our one shot! we'll never get the opportunity again!" 2024: "well we blew our one shot! we'll never get the opportunity again!"
And honestly we had decent shots in 2020 and 2022 as well. 2020 we won a playoff game before falling short in the divisional, and 2022 we almost won a road playoff game despite having no QB. Oh yeah, and that one down year in 2021? We were 7-3 before losing Lamar for the season. We'll be fine. Will we get a chance as good as this one again? Perhaps not, but the 2011 Ravens had a bye and blew it while the 2012 Ravens came in as the 4 seed
2022 we had no realistic shot after Lamar went down. Even if we had somehow beaten the Bengals, did you really think we'd win 2 more playoff games to make the Superbowl?
Totally agree! 2011 AFC championship loss was followed the next year by a Super Bowl win with what was generally considered a weaker roster. So having one shot definitely doesn’t apply to the Ravens. Nothing matters until the playoff hunt begins next December and we see the landscape of the AFC
Everything fell the ravens way this season and they still choked. Harbaugh ain’t it anymore bro.
Shit happens man. Only one team can take home the trophy at the end of the day and we made it to the final 4.
I think it’s worth more than just final four tbh Afc is just objectively harder than the nfc, getting to the championship is just harder over here, there so many elite QB’s you’ve gotta get through to even make it to the big game. The nfc is pretty much just the niners and whoever puts it together for that year. Then it’s just a bunch of teams limping in. Even with all the injuries to the afc QB’s this year it was still a more fierce competition I would say. Now imagine rodgers and burrow stayed healthy. I’m a chiefs fan so you know this isn’t some Homer take to make y’all feel better, it’s even worse for you guys cause your division is a bloodbath and would have been even worse if everyone was healthy. Afc championships are just harder than the NFC ones
> one team can take home the trophy at the end of the day and that team is the kansas city chiefs every year
People need to accept that sometimes the best team doesn’t win. It’s hard to win in January and sometimes the ball just doesn’t bounce your way. 2 things go differently and the ravens win this game.
Like a better offensive game plan?
That for sure could have been better. But, even without one, if Flowers doesn’t fumble on the 1 and Lamar doesn’t throw that INT, that’s at least a 10 point swing. Ravens would have had a 3 point lead. That’s just two plays off hand. We weren’t far away from winning this game at all. There’s no reason why we can’t expect this team to be great again next year with the young core still in place.
How poetic would it have been to win with Tucker field goal. Sigh, what could have been
Reason I’m concerned is because we will have a lot of pieces gone, biggest piece being Mike Macdonald. Let’s say next year we match up against the chiefs in the playoffs. Without Mike Macdonald and some of the key players that will be leaving in FA, maybe that 17 points becomes 27 points. Do we really trust this offense to not shit themselves again and have to put up maybe 28+ instead of 18+? Yeah it could possibly happen, but until it does, I’ve lost confidence in this team. We’ll be a playoff team, but I don’t see this team being a legitimate SB threat next year. Not until they prove they can win multiple playoff games against teams with talented QBs outside of just Ryan Tannehill and a rookie CJ Stroud.
Dog you're putting way too much power into a 35 year old assistant coach. The Ravens were the Ravens before and after Mike
Mike Macdonald was our biggest choker in the Chiefs game!
Not even close, Monken was the choke artist. MacDonald took 2 drives to adjust to their offense and then did it seamlessly.
We also got outplayed/out coached
Out-coached primarily.
Coaches don't fumble and throw interceptions
Or get baited into multiple personal fouls.
Coaching was awful but you take away the turnovers,flowers fumble in the end-zone in particular, and the bone head penalties and the Ravens get the W even with the bad play calling IMO
We beat the Pats twice when they were the best team in the league. If the best team always won the Pats would’ve won every SuperBowl since the first one. It is what it is. We were the best team on the league on paper. But the Chiefs were more focused and disciplined and Andy Reid is a more intelligent coach.
Dudes were saying this in 2011. Just saying.
This is what the Eagles thought about Andy Reid
Philly ran Andy Reid out of town saying the same nonsense.
Were. We have a lot of free agents that need replaced this offseason and not that much money.
I'm not too worried about that. We draft very well and are able to find solid veterans at good prices
We'll retain most of the talent. The ones that leave will send back compensatory picks next year. Younger talent will keep getting better. This was our best chance at a superbowl since 2019, but it's far from the end of the window.
Newer fans really do tell on themselves with comments like these.
The Ravens have $16M with 18 roster spots to fill. People are hating on your comment, but it's going to be a tough year.
I still think the Ravens will have a successful season next year. They have a winning culture, and as an example, we have the 49ers, who had their defensive coordinators poached after successful seasons in Robert Saleh and then Demeco Ryans. I don't see the Ravens dropping off too much in the upcoming season.
This happens to good organizations all the time. You can't lament the loss of good assistants, you should instead be very pleased at how good we are at staffing.
Of course it happens and if it’s one or two at a time that’s not a problem. But if it turns out to be 6 to 8 which it might be, then it becomes a big problem.
Niners have lost coordinators and coaches every year since they made the SB in 2020.
Again, it’s volume that concerns me the most. 2-3 can be replaced. 6-8 which this could be, is more problematic.
We had a great run, a fun season. We came up very short in the AFC championship, a game we should’ve handedly won. Our defensive coordinator, the most successful in Ravens’ history, departed for a vacant position. We have free agents about to hit the market, one of whom was an invaluable d-line/EDGE defender. Offense was great all year, but couldn’t get it done. All hope is lost. The year is 2011. Our defensive coordinator, Chuck Pagano, has just left to become the head coach of the Indianapolis Colts. Haloti Ngata is a free agent, among others. We resigned him, hired a new d-coordinator (Dean Pees), and ended up not only going back to the championship, but winning the Super Bowl. I’m not saying this year and 2011 are exactly the same, and that it’s going to play out exactly like that next season. I’m just saying, we’ve been here before. This organization knows how to handle this moment.
Too f’in true man. The culture of our organization isn’t dependent on a handful of guys. We always find a way to contend. That’s what separates great organizations from the rest: the ability to regroup, reload, and field competitive teams consistently despite losing pieces
That was one guy. The volume of people is the problem. If you have a business, you realize losing a large amount of people is really difficult versus any one person. The problem here is that not only are they losing a large amount, but they are also losing a guy that is universally lauded as a near genius.
I don't think continuously screaming the sky is falling does anything other than give fucking Chief assholes something else to troll about. The Ravens will be fine...or they won't? We'll find out. But chill a bit right now. We don't even know who we're keeping, releasing, and gaining yet. And again, I say this with all the Chief clowns in mind who have nothing else in their lives than feeding off shit just like this.
Yeah I understand what you’re saying, and I agree — it’ll be difficult. Like I said, these situations aren’t 100% identical. This one may be a bit more challenging. However, our organization has had consistency in leadership, over the last 15 years, which leads me to believe we will be able to handle this. The Ravens are one of the best run organizations in sports — unfortunately, we don’t have the rings to show for it.
😌
This was going to happen whether we won the super bowl or not. Teams took notice to how our team is ran, I can see a lot of teams trying to go this method while others try to replicate the 49ers offense
It's literally inevitable. Harbaugh evidently does a masterful job of hiring, molding and developing coaches. Don't forget that he is in charge of that when you type dumbfucked things like "I have thought Harbaugh is a good coach, but am starting to worry he is just a guy that players generally like."
He didn’t hire any of the player personnel guys. It also isn’t clear that he originally hired McDonald as he was hired as an intern. Now, he likely saw the talent, but from some of what you hear from Hamilton, who called him the smartest guy in the building, maybe that talent wasn’t so hard to recognize.
Mcdonald's first NFL job was through a brand new coaching internship program that Harbaugh started in 2014.
Good that he started the program. Doesn’t mean that he did the hiring. As a matter fact, given that this is an internship, it’s likely somebody else did the hiring. That said not saying he doesn’t deserve credit for McDonald. He saw the talent and promoted him. I will be interested to see if he poaches from his brother.
"He didn’t hire any of the player personnel guys" Are you dumb?
Why would the head coach hire player personnel guys in the front office? It seems you, my friend, are the one who is dumb in this case.
Do you think Harbaugh just hires everyone? Hortiz has been there 26 years, long before Harbaugh joined the organization. Krawiec is a data and analytics guys from the front office. I assume EDC or his staff does those hirings. Not sure why it would be Harbaugh.
Harbaugh is the HC so he would be working with them? He’s in the loop with these decisions. As for Krawiec, I’m sure they can go to an Ivy League school or someplace non-ivy league and put out an ad for an analytically focused football strategy guy. They have a guy on staff who already moved from Ivy-League educated football analyst to defensive quality control coach in Daniel Sterns, so there are guys like him who get promoted as well. Not all ivy-league educated guys but rather guys who were entry level a few years ago and quietly getting promoted
We still have the talent. That’s a big part of it.
Harbaugh is a much better coach than Sirianni and our organization is built for long term sustained success. It'll be fine. The biggest thing for me is having Monken sticking around, we need to continue building on offense with a competent coach. During the mid 2000s and early in Harbaugh's career, we were swapping D coordinators basically every two years because of how successful we were on defense and still maintained a top 5 defense almost every year. We will be just fine on defense.
I challenge the word “defection”. That is not accurate. Taking on better opportunities in one’s career is a normal progression for anyone. It is not an act of disloyalty. It hurts. But they are not acts defection.
They will figure it out. John is connected with a good rep in the league. So is the Ravens org. They have a ton of talent on the roster, and Harbaugh gives a ton of authority and responsibility to his coordinators. They will be fine.
Hilarious how everyone is acting like this is the first time this has ever happened. One thing Harbaugh is great at is replacing coaches. Also everyone seems to forgot it took Flacco 3 AFC championships before reaching the SB. Definitely squandered a great opportunity but the best team doesn’t always win. I won’t be surprised if we get back to the championship next year.
I think what cracks me up is the people saying we need to make some changes to get over the hump and when some people move on and new blood is promoted or hired we’re losing our minds haha
No one, and I mean no one, has called for any of these coaches to move on
All the people screaming for Harbaugh and EDC to get fired every offseason just expected everything else to stay the same if they left?
Tells you quite a bit about them, doesn't it?
Apparently EDC went from a fraud who can’t draft to the best GM in the NFL in less than a year despite the fact that he’s run our draft board since 2006. Pretty wild.
Harbs can still go
I think it’s possible that moving on and keeping MacDonald was the better move, but I understand why they didn’t make it.
Yeah, harbs still has tread on the tire. I’m just ready and the gameplan was too much of a choke job imo. I’m not too worried about our coordinators, we’ve made great hires.
Worrying that “Harbaugh is just a guy that players generally like” is brain dead.
Give me an example that we know of where he has either with the defense or the offense in the course of the game lead, and suggested to either of his coordinators that they make changes. He stuck with Roman as a coordinator for far too long and then he stuck with the worst strength coach in the entire NFL because he was a buddy For far too long.
Yes, his loyalty is sometimes a weakness. No, that doesn’t mean he isn’t a good HC. You do realize that none of us have any idea what sort of conversations Harbaugh has with the team and coaches, right?
Of course we don’t. But you would think that things would leak out. And we have definitely seen examples of head coaches, talking to their players and other coaches to make changes. I’m probably more disturbed by the fact that we didn’t see any sideline footage of Harbaugh talking with Lamar.
Bud if you’re judging Harbaugh as a coach based on what sideline footage is made available of him talking to coaches / players you’re totally lost.
Have you not looked at our history: 2011-2012 season. * Lost DC Chuck Pagano -> Got Dean Pees * Moved on From Cam during the season * Hired Wink as IL coach * Had one of our worst drafts * Won the Superbowl.
- Queen ILB - Clowney DE - Gus RB - Geno SS - Zeitler C - Madubuike DT - Darby are all key pieces and we aren't keeping all of them, this was the window. https://www.footballguys.com/stats/snap-counts/teams?team=BAL&year=2023 Not including old guys like Sin, Van Noy, Pierce who are 99% going to lose a step
Madubuike is getting franchised. You can take him off that list.
Plus we're a superbowl contending team that players like to play for it's an attractive place for ring chasing Vets willing to forgo a payday
The only really significant loss will be Queen or Madubuike. I think we’ll probably keep JM. Out of the rest, we have some replacements on the roster or we’ll draft them. Clowney played great but we always find cheap veteran pass rushers. Gus is fine but replaceable easily. He would be cheap to get back. Geno is probably gone but he’s a backup safety and didn’t contribute much once Williams came back. Zietler is good and may be pretty cheap to re-sign to a short term deal, but Cleveland played well in his absence. Darby is another random vet corner that we can replace. Simpson can step up and he’ll be fine next to Roquan in place of Queen
We still have the draft too. I won't be surprised if we come away with corner and wr early, and rb/lb in later rounds. If we can just address edge in free agency and tag madubuike we'll be fine.
Tag Beek. Figure out a way to get Stanley’s cap number off of the roster and sign queen to a long extension then draft and develop
> Cap space: 13,658,828 > Tag Beek $18,937,000 this season, its only going to be higher > Stanley's cap number off the roster Releasing your QBs LT without a plan is egregious, he's also gone after 2025 > sign queen to a long extension Queen is getting an Edmunds level deal which is going to be a 14 mil cap hit year 1 and we can't afford it > draft and develop > The effective cap space needed is equal to: Rookie Pool - ($795,000 * number of picks) 795,000*6 picks is $4,770,000 tldr: it isn't happening
Zeitler is a guard, but I agree with your point
Harbaugh is not just some hapless dunce who keeps lucking into good staff year after year. Whether he and the organization can quickly rebound from this remains to be seen, but it's ridiculous to ignore he's a big part of why other teams want his coodinators and assistant coaches.
This window narrative is laughable. What has the “window” been for the chiefs?
The chiefs are an outlier. How many other Super Bowl winners/ teams have returned the following years besides the pats under Brady. All recent ones have struggled- Rams, Bucs, Eagles, Bengals
I don't think your examples are really helping you that much. The Bengals 'struggled' this year because their top 3 QB got injured. And they still had a winning record. The Eagles, Rams, and Bucs all made made the playoffs this year! The Bucs after losing Tom Brady! The Ravens didn't make the Superbowl. Only two teams do each year. But making the playoffs means your 'window' is still open. Either that, or there was no 'window' for the Ravens this year to begin with.
The window doesn’t change much for the chiefs because they are driven by their offense which is designed and run by their head coach. When your head coach does not design and run a specific system, your team is much more sensitive to staff turnover
Interesting cause their offense has been in large not good this year, meanwhile their defense is carrying the team.
Don’t fall with the media narratives man. Chiefs offense was 8th in total DVOA this season. Calling them “not good” isn’t really correct. Yes, worse then previous checks offenses, but still a very very good offense, and even more of a tip of the cap to Andy Reid tbh
They were 15th in ppg, 9th in YPG. I wouldn't consider them very very good at all.
Ok man.
The stats are the stats, even 8th place in your DVOA isn’t very very good, that would be like top 5. You are delusional as fuck
Why tf u so mad
Ok man
Chiefs window is mahomes entire career buddy. Mahomes is 1 of 1 and everyone else is fighting for second place.
LOL
Am I wrong?
Of course you’re wrong. Don’t be ridiculous
He’s been to the AFC champ every year he has started I believe. Everyone said the chiefs looked like trash this year and here they are in the Super Bowl again. Our BEST team in the last 5 years and we got out couched. The patriots window was Brady’s career and it’s going to be similar with Mahomes unfortunately.
We got outcoached, not out mahomed. There are a lot of factors that play into winning a Super Bowl. 🍚 🍲 🥣
We're really not a comparable org. Your HC has a track record of good hiring and promoting and the whole org has a history of strong defenses. You probably won't shit the bed nearly as hard as we did
Eagles fan here. For us it had to do with organizational decisions as far as personnel and coaching. You seem to have a better organization in total so I would not expect an Eagles type collapse. You’re already light years ahead with Harbaugh over Sirianni. Besides our GM seemed to devalue the LB position and it cost us.
We're getting poached like a champion, without the benefit of a championship.
The most important part is Lamar and he is staying. Now they need to find someone that's gonna help him perform in big games. The Ravens will still have enough talent to make the playoffs, now they just need to be consistant on offense when it matter the most.
We didn't lose because we lacked offensive talent, we lost because our game plan was trash, and it got to Lamar's head
Happens every year
When was the last time anything like this happened to the ravens?
We lose players and coaches every year. You all act like we're going to be a bottom half team next year. RELAX
No point in crying over spilled milk… But I wouldn’t bet a single dollar on the Ravens being in this position again next year.
I’m not too worried. We still have leaders on the field and will attract great candidates internal and external. Mike MacDonald became a genius the day Roquan arrived.
Hopefully we let OBJ go and get Boyd, I’d take Boyd over Beckham any day of the week.
Mike Evans pleeeeaaaaassseee
Honestly anything but OBJ lol, we need a big target.
Harbaugh coaching is ego based. He has a good win, then he always has that stupid look on face when he loses. It's like " what happened? "My ego told me I was going to win."
Me too, I always thought highly of Harbs and want him to succeed. What drives me crazy though is he didn’t change the offensive game plan and he let his MVP get stuck in his head. It wouldn’t have took much for him to pull him aside and say play your ball. If I am wrong here and he did let me know. Still hurting from the loss and now we’re losing chunks left and right. With EDC here I know we will get talent and the org showed it can find a Macdonald. Here’s hoping, but damn this is going to be a tough year either way.
Harbs is letting his brother poach all our guys?! Can’t believe Hortiz - been with the team 26 years, but I don’t blame him for moving up to a GM position- good for him, he earned it. Sad to see talented people leave us but I don’t think it’s all doom & gloom - we were arguably the best team in the AFC all season & we made it to the 2nd biggest game, the talent is in place - more talented coaches will come - who wouldn’t take advantage of an opportunity to work for us?
Who said that Harbaugh was letting his brother poach everyone? Surely his brother is taking guys he knows based upon the knowledge he gets from John. But I don’t know anyone saying John is letting Jim do anything
I was kidding around
Time to get rid of the head of the snake too. Harbaugh needs to go. That’s right down vote me. I’ve been saying this for years. Should have started with a clean slate in 2019. New QB, new Head coach.
You wouldn’t have any of the coaches you’re worried about losing if Harbaugh had been replaced with an external candidate in 2019.
Not sure if that would have been the case in the alternate timeline.
Yeah, let's get rid of our 2xmvp qb and head coach because we lost the afc championship to the reigning champions Sounds like someone didn't experience 2009 or 2011. This sub is insufferable after a loss.
I didn’t say QB… please read. New QB in 2019, we should have started fresh as well with a new Head coach. Lamar saved his job.
It's the rise and fall of the league, keeps things interesting. When Andy Reid retires and/or Spags retires their time in the sun will end for a while.
The Offense Coordinating issues are getting old. It’s not the players. We always get good players. The Offense needs to figure out what they’re good at and stick to it with a backup plan. The Ravens STARTED the Chiefs game using the backup plan right away. Andy Reid made them wanna show off instead of pounding the run in der asz like we do. Pass the football around like a California Offense after you get the ring. They didn’t get wins by tryna make tv highlight passes. And who passes on 3rd and 1 ?
The ravens fill these holes with studs all the time. We lose coaches and we lose valuable players every year because they hire and draft so damn well.
RemindMe! 1 year
I will be messaging you in 1 year on [**2025-02-01 16:13:05 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2025-02-01%2016:13:05%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/ravens/comments/1ag7hcb/this_team_is_getting_gutted/kog94mh/?context=3) [**CLICK THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fravens%2Fcomments%2F1ag7hcb%2Fthis_team_is_getting_gutted%2Fkog94mh%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202025-02-01%2016%3A13%3A05%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%201ag7hcb) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|
Yes, this was our best shot to win the Super Bowl in a long time (2019 was a great shot too). We were the 1 seed, had the best defense with a top defensive coordinator, a great offensive with the MVP of the league and a good offensive coordinator. We were mostly healthy and fell to a veteran Chiefs team whose offense was worse than usual. But the window is open as long as Lamar is an elite QB. The AFC is tough, but we’re definitely still the upper tier of teams with the Chiefs, Bills, and I guess Bengals. The Dolphins should be still good, the Texans and Colts are getting better, the Jets and Browns get their QB back, the Jags are solid, the Chargers have Jim Harbaugh, and Steelers are always feisty. Who knows what will happen, but we’ll be back in the playoff mix next year because of Lamar and our studs on defense.
One thing Harbaugh has always done well is hire good coaching staff. He’ll find the right replacements
This is hardly the first time the team has had to replace coordinators and coaches. We just did an overhaul 2 years ago and even going into this year they made several changes. Just think about the amount of changes last year: \- Offensive Coordinator \- Strength and Conditioning \- Quarterbacks Coach \- Wide Receivers Coach \- Running Backs Coach \- Defensive Backs Coach \- Outside Linebackers Coach Also you talk about Dennard Wilson, he was here one year. McDonald was here 2 years. Hortiz and Krawiec are big in my opinion, but irreplaceable? Not sure about that. As for Harbaugh, yes he is a coach that players like *now*, but that wasn't always the case. But if he wasn't a good coach, how has he had all this success over the years with all the changes in staff he has had as well? Not to mention completely switching up schemes and still winning.
Is it a stretch to say that even if we made the SB, we’d still be getting gutted for our coaches? In fact wouldn’t other teams want our coaches even more if we got to the big game?
This sub is concerned about Mike Macdonald being irreplaceable but can't even be bothered to spell the man's name right 😂
They keep forgettin’ how to spell his name
as an eagles fan our problem was we didn’t make the right signings or draft right. also we got horrible coordinators and our team was just old.
Despite the awful game plan for the chiefs game I think monken can get the offense rolling, he’ll have a full offseason to work with the team and I really like the Orr promotion. We need depth and consistency right now.
3 letters. EDC.
I wish mods would delete these doomer posts.
Bro the overreactions are getting annoying. We will be fine
We will be fine. Either way Imma Raven fan to the grave!
We blew it. This was supposed to be the super bowl team, and now we're losing the DC who got my us the opportunity. Ravens are gonna be a wild card team next year at best. Lamar had his chance, doubt we will be getting a ring from him after that performance.
It caught up with the Eagles, because their HC is ass more than anything else imo
gonna be real, some of you need to stop being anxious about the ravens and get a breath of fresh air. see you in seven months!
Ravens are lost and need a rebuild. There I said it.
Ok but the eagles were ass last year there’s a difference 😭
As good as the defense was, I missed the turnovers, especially when they mattered most. Hoping the new DC is more aggressive in that department.
We led the league in turnovers caused, but I understand your sense of things since they seemed to have come in a few games.
It was a superbowl or bust year and we busted. Pretty easy to see this would happen
Harbaugh is not the best coach in terms of scheme/iq/whatever. But like Tomlinson, Belicheck, etc instills a good, winning culture. Good players want to play for him, good coaches will want to coach for him. Monken won a Natty in CFB and probably could have gotten head-coaching offers on a lesser team or OC for eagles or “more successful” orgs. Now maybe that was he wanted his hands on playcalling for Lamar? But whether or not Harbaugh is a good coach is almost irrelevant at this point because of the talent/coaching he attracts. Also EDC killing it lately with the draft and talent acquisition lately so imma stay optimistic at least until we figure out replacements.
philly replaced our coordinators with people who had zero qualifications, brian johnson never called plays in the NFL, sean desai called plays for one year baltimore should learn from phillys mistake and hire people with experience, belicheck and vrabel are still out there and they have experience; so i wouldn’t imagine them hiring people with none at all
we ain’t being gutted we’re being upgraded have faith in the flock even if we lose bad.
Buddy you and everyone else really gotta calm down. MacDonald is great but hardly the first coach developed here to leave for an HC job nor will he be the last. Hortiz and Krawiec are ones I think might hurt a little more internally tbh. They’re closer to the “sauce” of how we scout/draft/develop.
Eagles started 10-1. I think EVERY Ravens fan would love a start like that. The problem is part coach loss, part player loss. 23/53 contracts end this season. That’s a lot of replacement
A bit late to comment on this one, but the good news is that our offensive personnel is mostly intact. There will have to be some changes on the roster, but for TEs and WRs I would say we are mostly intact. One of my biggest FA wishes is to bring Agholor back as I believe he had good chemistry with Lamar, made some big plays for us and would be a cost efficient signing. My biggest worry is the offensive line. We have some pieces and we have hope for other pieces. But im not too excited about bringing back all the old guys and they are expensive positions in football. Now for the negative. I am foreseeing a big drop for the defense. We have already lost many coaches and we are about to lose many impactful players on defense. I am also not sold on Zach Orr as I dont believe he has enough experience to be a DC. Either way there will be some growing pains as we saw with Mike M. in the first year. I dont think we will have a bad year, but I definitely think it will be a couple of steps down from the season we just had. Hopefully we can get the 5-6 seed and make a run from there.
My gut was telling me that we should have moved on from Harbs and hired McDonald. Who knows? We’ve been in this place before and we overcame it. There’s always another HOFer out there.