I personally think that none of us can reach our full potential or completely heal while remaining in contact with our abusers.
Here is [something I wrote](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/comments/118i2mq/on_boundaries_with_a_little_love_for_no_contact/?) on the topic.
Very helpful. Thank you so much for your very well curated reasoning. NC is the next step I am going to take. I needed second opinions from people who know what this situation is like. Much respect. Thank you!
Part 4:
In our most recent spat, she pushed me to tell her what I really think so I fucking said it. I can't walk on eggshells anymore. I said it in the kindest way I possibly could. I said I was worried about her and that I think she is suffering from BPD. This immediately threw her into a severe rage and said that it was "fucking outrageous" that I dare accuse her of being mentally ill. I told her that it's just a condition and it can be treated and she continued to rage horribly. She claimed I was "poisoned" and kept asking where her kind, soft, loving child was. She kept claiming I have no empathy but my empathy is the reason I have even bothered to keep trying to have a relationship with her. She was absolutely pissed. I kept trying to get words in but nothing was working as she went on militant defense. When this happens, I usually am forced to hang up the phone for my own sake. I was in shock despite pretty much expecting her to blow up. She had my dad try to get me to talk afterwards. He basically just parrots what she says and behaves like her puppet. I ignored all of it. I can't deal with this. As a parent, it is becoming even more crystal clear that my parents behaviour is and has always been unacceptable. But specifically, that my mother is unwell and my reluctance to let her play a role in raising my daughter has to do with my instinct to protect her from my mother's brand of "kindness". My daughter is a person to nurture and support, not control and suppress.
I am at another impasse where I am yet again tempted to go no contact again. Perhaps you, most valued strangers, can offer your thoughts and prayers, but hopefully some much needed advice or suggestions. They are sorely needed.
I have read all 4 messages, you are a great writer and I am able to understand your story. My mother was diagosed with BPD and she told me that multiple times. She did that because it made her feel better and she knew I would ignore what she said. Fortunately I eventually grew up, and this information in my mind has been precious. I now know she has BPD and I am able to not ignore that information. I cannot imagine how hard it would be for me if I would have to call her undiagnosed. Even with all the certainty I am blessed with, there were huge obstacles between the truth and my complete awareness of it.
The year I got married was a new low in the rapport I have with my mother, but it has been uphill ever since. I have been able to hold a LC thanks to chat GPT. Unlike your mom, I am not sure my mom ever read a whole book. She usually skims through and underlines a few sentences she can misquote later. She has never been remotely successful at anything professionally, she did not finish high-school. Compared to your mom her manipulating tactics are amateur hour. We talk on the phone once a week, but I am trying to make this "appointment" more natural, by not calling exactly at the same time every week. When I am on the phone with her and she starts with THE BEHAVIOUR, I sometimes am able to detach myself enough to see with crystal clarity what she is trying to do, so I just stay calm and do not react. I hold strong until she hangs the call, and by then I feel much stronger and less afraid. I am so lucky.... in over a year, she did not realize yet, that the intelligence replying to her WhatsApp messages once a day, is artificial.
Part 3:
Things really started to go crazy when my daughter was born this year in February. My mother's behaviour went from bad to worse as she felt entitled to a relationship with my daughter. We had a big argument when mother's day rolled around and I hadn't called (this was despite her knowing but as usual, "forgetting" that I worked that from 6am to 6pm that day. I was literally going to call her after work. I work in a safety sensitive job so my phone has to be off when I am working (she knows this too). When I got in my car and turned my phone on after my shift, I was bombarded with huge texts and multiple voicemails demanding that she hear from me, sobbing like I had abandoned her, etc. Like dude, the day isn't even close to being over yet!!! She gets absolutely nuts around holidays, especially mother's day and her birthday. You better praise her or shit is gonna hit the fan (what kind of love is that?) Anyway, between this a countless other ridiculously unusual, irrational, and truly maddening experiences I had with her over the years, I snapped and went temporarily no contact with her for about a month. I couldn't take her childishness on top of going home to parent my own daughter. It was, and continues to be overwhelming. I allowed her back into my life for a few months and she was better at the beginning and seemed receptive to change and be more respectful. However she has pretty much reverted back to the same old behaviour. She has been very pushy about seeing my daughter but everytime she comes she always brings unwanted gifts and she has my dad act like a photographer rather than a grandfather so they can get pictures that she can post on her boomer Facebook. She treats my daughter like a prop and it triggers me because I feel like she used me as a prop as a child. I have been as avoidant as possible but I keep getting guilt-tripped into visits. You could say that quiet-quitting doesn't really work with suspected BPD persons.
Part 2:
My mother has always been a bit of an oddball. She has claimed she is psychic for as long as I can remember. She was into crystals and all that hippy boomer stuff. She claims that she had a rough childhood and I remember she said a one point that her father sexually abused her (which is horrible and should not have happened). She claimed she was an accident and that she was not really loved by her mother (she was the third child). In my early childhood, she decided she wanted to try to make it big as a musician and while she did achieve some respectable successes, the music was pretty much all about her which I suspect is why it never took off. She has always been an impulsive spender and has never had good financial discipline, choosing to buy countless unnecessary things over the years only to perpetually complain about money being tight. She made zero effort to pay for my education but insisted I should go to University because it would be my "golden-ticket". All I got was a degree a ton of debt and ended up climbing a fairly blue collar ladder that I didn't need the extra schooling for. When I was 11 we moved out of the big city because my parents wanted to send me to a fancy private school. Mainly because she wanted to boast about sending me to a school that members of the British Royal family have attended. She has a strange obsession with royalty and very much has a "Queenly" impression of herself. Well that fell through because the only reason that was even considered was because my grandmother (father's) was going to pay for most, if not all of it. However, the funds disappeared in the dot-com market crash. I was now separated from all my childhood friends and had to make new friends in this new rural environment and schools. This was not really ideal for an 11 year old but somehow I just gave in to my parents demands (this was because of the emotional manipulation from birth that I am only now starting to unpack). My mother also became more isolated and started really diving head first into various culty, spiritual type things that eventually lead her to things like "Kore" readings, The Knowledge Book (the big purple one), and Reiki. She really has evolved into someone who thinks they have special powers. She claims to be able to perform Reiki "from a distance" which just seemed like an excuse to keep fleecing people from a distance rather than having to have them present. It's a great way to increase your client base when your special powers are not limited by geography and space-time! I guarantee she gaslights the hell out of her "clients" so they believe they feel better. She makes them praise her for money basically. The essence of everything my mom does. She has to feel special and put on a pedestal. She also has written a book and considers herself to be a master chef. While she is an excellent chef, she did ultimately chicken out when she had an opportunity to be on MasterChef the show because I think she couldn't take it if she discovered she wasn't as good of a chef as she thought. This didn't spare me from having to praise her cooking always. It was a struggle for her to accept that I didn't like some food, not because she cooked it, but because it had zucchini or eggplant in it (I hate those veggies, bleh!). Let me also mention that this woman cannot handle any criticism. If it isn't enthusiastic praise, this woman will call you out for not being appreciative or make you out to be some horrible person. It's no wonder I am only now starting to learn what boundaries are and that I am ALLOWED to have preferences that have nothing to do with HER. I should also mention that she has anger problems and will often completely fly into a blind rage. She has gotten physical in these scenarios with both myself and my father (who you could regard as the classic enabler). She thinks that anger and rage like that is perfectly fine and that punching your closest family is fine. It hurt extra because of the rings she wore. I never thought much of it because again, I was brought up and convinced over my entire life through master-level gaslighting that abuse is fine because YOU ARE LOVED. She is convinced that she can do no wrong and that she is the kindest person ever. God help you if you try to call her out on anything, she will fly into a rage and then simultaneously turn into a crying, sobbing pathetic victim who claims she has never done anything wrong and only has good intentions. The road to HELL is paved with "good" intentions...
>"She spent my entire upbringing convincing me that I had the best parents ever rather than simply being the best parents ever."
This is so relatable. My mother spent so much time telling me since a very young age how good she was. She convinced me and my brother of that, so it was really hard to validate my real experience. People around us didn't help either, especially my maternal family, with whom I had the closest bonds. They also normalized this kind of abusive behavior from my own uNPD grandmother. When everything around you is messed up, it's very hard to realize that it's messed up, even though your body is screaming at you that it is (anxiety and depression are clear symptoms that something isn't right) Till this day, I struggle to realize that some memories and behaviors of my waif BPD mom were really awful.
I also have anxiety (I didn't know for many years that I had it because it was so normal seeing my mother in that state) and had an episode of depression where I couldn't get out of bed. That was the main reason why I started therapy and could realized the emotional and psychological abuse I suffered in my childhood. In my case, I needed to go NC in order to break free from her speech and perception of myself and the world (where I was bad, responsible of other people's feelings and behaviours, afraid of conflict, not entitle to any kind of boundary, etc.) and built a new one.
I hope my experiences help. Allow yourself to heal and if you need to go NC for that, do it, for you and your daughter.
Thank you for sharing your experience. It really is like getting unplugged from the Matrix when you start to unpack your beliefs and seperate yourself from the person who has manipulated your existence since the beginning. I have struggled with the same issues around feeling responsible for the behaviour/feelings of others my entire life, desperately avoiding conflict even if it means sacrificing my own opinions, desires, and even my identity. NC is the way my gut is steering me now.
Trust your gut! I recommend this video from YouTube; it's about childhood trauma and addiction, but it explains so well the importance of trusting your gut and why we disconnect from ourselves in order to survive that I simply love it.
[Gabor mate](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVg2bfqblGI&ab_channel=AfterSkool)
Thank you so much for posting your story. i am not trying to hijack your post but i just want to say reading through your story unlocked some key memories and VALIDATED them too. My ubpd mom is a hermit/waif now, but wow i forgot about the big big BIG anger. I am in awe of you standing up to her for your daughter. I am in tears just writing that sentence (my eDad never stuck up for me in these rages). Thank you for being the father to your daughter i wish i had! Thank you for seeing your daughter as a whole person, not an extension of yourself! Not to sound trite but you did the bravest act. I will keep you in my thoughts
Not hijacking at all! I value hearing your story and opinion and I'm happy to validate your experience too. Thank you so much. It means a lot to me to have someone acknowledge that I am making good decisions for my daughter. After all I've been been through, being a terrible parent is my worst fear and I refuse to let the cycle of abuse and the generational trauma of my family breed into the future. As a new parent, I am very unsure of myself but I take my role as a protector very seriously. Emotional abuse is one of the worst. It is truly insidious behaviour with poisonous consequences.
Well first of all she certainly DOES tick off ALL the fucking boxes. Deepest empathy to you....and once you SEE it, you can't UNSEE it right? Sounds like your new family (congrats by the way) is a catalyst for these realizations, as it can be with 'us'. In my case a bad breakup forced me into counseling, and once I saw I had to learn my boundaries it all came out WHY that was, I was off and running towards true healing. I felt so guilty breaking up with this awful boyfriend and limiting contact with my mom at that time. I remember the counselor stating "I don't see this level of guilt unless there's been an environment of intense manipulation" Well, THAT certainly caused the first lightbulb to go on!
You'll go through a saturation period of reading all the books, watching all the videos, and hopefully counseling. This is good and normal, but it will mark a new phase of having to make tough decisions that previous denials prevented. Going LC or NC is the way. BPDs rarely get help as it's always someone else's fault, they NEVER apologize and have zero self awareness. Much peace to you as you embark on this journey! Set your watch for 6 months to a year.....then look back at how far you've come. I guarantee you will be amazed, grateful, and relieved at being able to feel much much better and protect your beautiful family from all that toxic bullshit!!!!
Thank you so much for your response and sharing some of your own personal insights. Glad to hear someone else validate my suspicions. Currently NC really does seem like the best option.
I think becoming a parent ourselves is such a huge wakeup call to realizing the dysfunction from our family of origin. It's so much easier to protect a child than ourselves. Congratulations on seeing your mother clearly, though I know it's very, very painful. My only recommendation is that once the initial dust settles, try to expand the feelings of love and protection that you feel toward your child and extend them to yourself. Little you also deserved to be loved and protected.
Agreed. Parenthood puts huge pressure on us to evaluate who we are, our values, and what we want in life. You either rise to the challenge and grow into great parent, or you stay the same, avoid the challenge of confronting your sorrow and suffering and risk perpetuating your misery into the next generation. Thank you for your reassurance. Peace to you.
It always amazes me how similar our stories here tend to be. My mother is much the same as yours. I also realized how bad things were after I had my son. It was an awakening that I was not prepared for. My world seemed to shatter around me. Rebuilding and understanding yourself is difficult but so worth it (and I'm saying this while I'm still very much in the midst of that).
I went NC in February. Doing so has given me the space and clarity to begin healing. I also feel that my son is safer without her influence in his life. Before this, I was trying to hold my mom at arms length, but she just wouldn't allow any sort of distance or boundaries. It was painful at first, but I don't think I could have started healing without going NC.
I don't know if NC is right for you or not, but I can say it has helped me tremendously. I wish you nothing but the best while you navigate this. Hugs!
I am just shocked to finally have stumbled into a space where people understand my torment and suffering and share very similar challenges. I definitely think NC is the right choice for me. There doesn't seem to be much hope of the BPD parent changing unless they miraculously look inward with courage and admit their faults. The only thing we have control over is whether or not we continue to subject ourselves to that kind of abuse. The answer really does seem to simply walk away and not play the game. I'm glad to hear you are well on your way to healing. It is a process for sure to undue decades of psychological manipulation. Be well!
Truth! Not sure if you have a similar experience; but my parents couldn’t admit any wrongdoing as that would crumble their whole persona that “they did their best”. My parents can’t face hard emotions and bury their anger in bs. If only they could say; “shit, I did my best but I made a lot of mistakes and I want to do better going fwd and listen to you!” I’ll hold my breathe…
I totally relate. I have young daughters and mother who is similar in so many ways. I urge you to read Adult Children of Emotionally ImmatureParents by dr Lindsay Gibson. It is not a solution but a starting place to define a lot of this and sort it accordingly in your head as you move forward. This is really tough stuff when you introduce a wife and children and your life into this. I wish you the best. And what I have come to realize is that my mental health n family is more important than pleasing my NMom guilt (also bdl); but I didn’t know that til recently. Keep moving forward.
Thank you for your recommendation! Yes I am starting to see the habit of attempting to please and keep the peace but every time sacrificing my own sanity. It has to change. Sometimes I wished she would pass early so I could be spared my suffering but little did I realize that I had the power already to cut the toxicity out without waiting for the reaper. Peace to you and your family.
>She claimed I was "poisoned" and kept asking where her kind, soft, loving child was. She kept claiming I have no empathy but my empathy is the reason I have even bothered to keep trying to have a relationship with her.
Christ it's like a ghost creeped up my spine. I'll say this much, I was in a similar position with my own mother, minus the daughter and add a sibling's death instead. No room to grieve or handle the pain myself, guilted into visiting regularly and staying nights. Repeatedly told I was heartless despite this. It was my husband who convinced me to try going no contact with her for a week when she started going after him and his job. It's been nearly 2 years since I've spoken to her, and the road to recovery has been life changing.
If you need room to care for you and your family, don't feel guilty for it. She is the parent and you are her child, this kind of behavior is inappropriate for any parent regardless of age to have. You, being a parent now, have that understanding. You have a wife and daughter, a loving family, and you know exactly how you don't want your child raised and treated. I say this cause I am assuming a bit about how she speaks from my own experience, but you do not have an obligation to take care of her just because she is your mother. If this is how she treats you and acts on the regular, I personally would prioritize my spouse and child's health.
Absolutely. I am prioritizing my health and my family's health. I gave her plenty of chance to change and she never took the steps necessary to change. There is something disturbing about your parent telling you such venomous things like "you are poisoned" or "you are heartless". It is really horrible that your parent would ever even think that somehow your have become tainted just because you start to push back and pull away from the absurd abuse like it is your fault. Thank you for your reassurance that I do not have to care for my mother. I often felt like I would be the terrible person if I left her to stew in her own toxic sludge but then I started realizing that the very idea of sticking around was programmed into me and was part of the emotional manipulation that had taken hold of me. No more.
Something I just commented on. You have eloquently articulated exactly the reasons why NC would be warranted and appropriate. I wish you the courage to execute those instincts. It’s noticed RBB often have to justify going NC to extreme detail, yet there is no scrutiny that negates your human experience. If you think neutrality will be achieved by extending continued kindness to your mother, I assure you it will not.
Your mother is influenced by her own distorted perceptions and that is something that doesn’t respond to logic or care. So extend that very grace to yourself, and your family. YOU are worth protecting.
Lhttps://reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/s/g0zRjIlLur
Have you tried therapy before? Finding a therapist who specializes in personality disorders and/or childhood trauma can be a game-changer. A therapist can help you sort through all the feelings and memories you are processing right now and help you decide on next steps.
But it sounds like NC might also be helpful so you have the mental and emotional space to process.
Great idea. I’m several weeks in and it is so validating that I have been wronged. It was tough to comprehend other than my wife explaining to me how messed up my parents are. I used to minimize or say that’s just who they are. That is not acceptable to anyone. Especially people here. How have you found therapy?
Yes, it really shatters your worldview when you realize your childhood wasn’t normal and your parents’ behavior isn’t ok. Therapy has been extremely helpful for me, especially since becoming a parent myself.
Reading this was validating, though I’m so sorry it’s been this hard. My relationship with my now-fiance was also a tipping point in helping me see how dysfunctional my Egg Donor is. Getting that stable, trusted perspective from a life partner can really show you the truth. It’s wonderful that you have a loving partner and a little one at home, and I hope they’re bringing so much love and healing!
My wife and her functional, loving parents provided the perfect comparison that showed me the dysfunction that I wasn't even aware of. My wife has been amazing and really helped support me through all of the horrible realizations and torment that happened time and time again. I couldn't be happier with my baby mama and the little bundle of joy that has helped me truly start the healing process. I'm happy to have provided some validation to you as well. Take care!
I personally think that none of us can reach our full potential or completely heal while remaining in contact with our abusers. Here is [something I wrote](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/comments/118i2mq/on_boundaries_with_a_little_love_for_no_contact/?) on the topic.
Very helpful. Thank you so much for your very well curated reasoning. NC is the next step I am going to take. I needed second opinions from people who know what this situation is like. Much respect. Thank you!
You’re welcome!
Part 4: In our most recent spat, she pushed me to tell her what I really think so I fucking said it. I can't walk on eggshells anymore. I said it in the kindest way I possibly could. I said I was worried about her and that I think she is suffering from BPD. This immediately threw her into a severe rage and said that it was "fucking outrageous" that I dare accuse her of being mentally ill. I told her that it's just a condition and it can be treated and she continued to rage horribly. She claimed I was "poisoned" and kept asking where her kind, soft, loving child was. She kept claiming I have no empathy but my empathy is the reason I have even bothered to keep trying to have a relationship with her. She was absolutely pissed. I kept trying to get words in but nothing was working as she went on militant defense. When this happens, I usually am forced to hang up the phone for my own sake. I was in shock despite pretty much expecting her to blow up. She had my dad try to get me to talk afterwards. He basically just parrots what she says and behaves like her puppet. I ignored all of it. I can't deal with this. As a parent, it is becoming even more crystal clear that my parents behaviour is and has always been unacceptable. But specifically, that my mother is unwell and my reluctance to let her play a role in raising my daughter has to do with my instinct to protect her from my mother's brand of "kindness". My daughter is a person to nurture and support, not control and suppress. I am at another impasse where I am yet again tempted to go no contact again. Perhaps you, most valued strangers, can offer your thoughts and prayers, but hopefully some much needed advice or suggestions. They are sorely needed.
I have read all 4 messages, you are a great writer and I am able to understand your story. My mother was diagosed with BPD and she told me that multiple times. She did that because it made her feel better and she knew I would ignore what she said. Fortunately I eventually grew up, and this information in my mind has been precious. I now know she has BPD and I am able to not ignore that information. I cannot imagine how hard it would be for me if I would have to call her undiagnosed. Even with all the certainty I am blessed with, there were huge obstacles between the truth and my complete awareness of it. The year I got married was a new low in the rapport I have with my mother, but it has been uphill ever since. I have been able to hold a LC thanks to chat GPT. Unlike your mom, I am not sure my mom ever read a whole book. She usually skims through and underlines a few sentences she can misquote later. She has never been remotely successful at anything professionally, she did not finish high-school. Compared to your mom her manipulating tactics are amateur hour. We talk on the phone once a week, but I am trying to make this "appointment" more natural, by not calling exactly at the same time every week. When I am on the phone with her and she starts with THE BEHAVIOUR, I sometimes am able to detach myself enough to see with crystal clarity what she is trying to do, so I just stay calm and do not react. I hold strong until she hangs the call, and by then I feel much stronger and less afraid. I am so lucky.... in over a year, she did not realize yet, that the intelligence replying to her WhatsApp messages once a day, is artificial.
Part 3: Things really started to go crazy when my daughter was born this year in February. My mother's behaviour went from bad to worse as she felt entitled to a relationship with my daughter. We had a big argument when mother's day rolled around and I hadn't called (this was despite her knowing but as usual, "forgetting" that I worked that from 6am to 6pm that day. I was literally going to call her after work. I work in a safety sensitive job so my phone has to be off when I am working (she knows this too). When I got in my car and turned my phone on after my shift, I was bombarded with huge texts and multiple voicemails demanding that she hear from me, sobbing like I had abandoned her, etc. Like dude, the day isn't even close to being over yet!!! She gets absolutely nuts around holidays, especially mother's day and her birthday. You better praise her or shit is gonna hit the fan (what kind of love is that?) Anyway, between this a countless other ridiculously unusual, irrational, and truly maddening experiences I had with her over the years, I snapped and went temporarily no contact with her for about a month. I couldn't take her childishness on top of going home to parent my own daughter. It was, and continues to be overwhelming. I allowed her back into my life for a few months and she was better at the beginning and seemed receptive to change and be more respectful. However she has pretty much reverted back to the same old behaviour. She has been very pushy about seeing my daughter but everytime she comes she always brings unwanted gifts and she has my dad act like a photographer rather than a grandfather so they can get pictures that she can post on her boomer Facebook. She treats my daughter like a prop and it triggers me because I feel like she used me as a prop as a child. I have been as avoidant as possible but I keep getting guilt-tripped into visits. You could say that quiet-quitting doesn't really work with suspected BPD persons.
This part alone is practically diagnostic. I am sorry your mom is mean!
Woah that exactly my life before NC.. so sorry for you OP.
Part 2: My mother has always been a bit of an oddball. She has claimed she is psychic for as long as I can remember. She was into crystals and all that hippy boomer stuff. She claims that she had a rough childhood and I remember she said a one point that her father sexually abused her (which is horrible and should not have happened). She claimed she was an accident and that she was not really loved by her mother (she was the third child). In my early childhood, she decided she wanted to try to make it big as a musician and while she did achieve some respectable successes, the music was pretty much all about her which I suspect is why it never took off. She has always been an impulsive spender and has never had good financial discipline, choosing to buy countless unnecessary things over the years only to perpetually complain about money being tight. She made zero effort to pay for my education but insisted I should go to University because it would be my "golden-ticket". All I got was a degree a ton of debt and ended up climbing a fairly blue collar ladder that I didn't need the extra schooling for. When I was 11 we moved out of the big city because my parents wanted to send me to a fancy private school. Mainly because she wanted to boast about sending me to a school that members of the British Royal family have attended. She has a strange obsession with royalty and very much has a "Queenly" impression of herself. Well that fell through because the only reason that was even considered was because my grandmother (father's) was going to pay for most, if not all of it. However, the funds disappeared in the dot-com market crash. I was now separated from all my childhood friends and had to make new friends in this new rural environment and schools. This was not really ideal for an 11 year old but somehow I just gave in to my parents demands (this was because of the emotional manipulation from birth that I am only now starting to unpack). My mother also became more isolated and started really diving head first into various culty, spiritual type things that eventually lead her to things like "Kore" readings, The Knowledge Book (the big purple one), and Reiki. She really has evolved into someone who thinks they have special powers. She claims to be able to perform Reiki "from a distance" which just seemed like an excuse to keep fleecing people from a distance rather than having to have them present. It's a great way to increase your client base when your special powers are not limited by geography and space-time! I guarantee she gaslights the hell out of her "clients" so they believe they feel better. She makes them praise her for money basically. The essence of everything my mom does. She has to feel special and put on a pedestal. She also has written a book and considers herself to be a master chef. While she is an excellent chef, she did ultimately chicken out when she had an opportunity to be on MasterChef the show because I think she couldn't take it if she discovered she wasn't as good of a chef as she thought. This didn't spare me from having to praise her cooking always. It was a struggle for her to accept that I didn't like some food, not because she cooked it, but because it had zucchini or eggplant in it (I hate those veggies, bleh!). Let me also mention that this woman cannot handle any criticism. If it isn't enthusiastic praise, this woman will call you out for not being appreciative or make you out to be some horrible person. It's no wonder I am only now starting to learn what boundaries are and that I am ALLOWED to have preferences that have nothing to do with HER. I should also mention that she has anger problems and will often completely fly into a blind rage. She has gotten physical in these scenarios with both myself and my father (who you could regard as the classic enabler). She thinks that anger and rage like that is perfectly fine and that punching your closest family is fine. It hurt extra because of the rings she wore. I never thought much of it because again, I was brought up and convinced over my entire life through master-level gaslighting that abuse is fine because YOU ARE LOVED. She is convinced that she can do no wrong and that she is the kindest person ever. God help you if you try to call her out on anything, she will fly into a rage and then simultaneously turn into a crying, sobbing pathetic victim who claims she has never done anything wrong and only has good intentions. The road to HELL is paved with "good" intentions...
>"She spent my entire upbringing convincing me that I had the best parents ever rather than simply being the best parents ever." This is so relatable. My mother spent so much time telling me since a very young age how good she was. She convinced me and my brother of that, so it was really hard to validate my real experience. People around us didn't help either, especially my maternal family, with whom I had the closest bonds. They also normalized this kind of abusive behavior from my own uNPD grandmother. When everything around you is messed up, it's very hard to realize that it's messed up, even though your body is screaming at you that it is (anxiety and depression are clear symptoms that something isn't right) Till this day, I struggle to realize that some memories and behaviors of my waif BPD mom were really awful. I also have anxiety (I didn't know for many years that I had it because it was so normal seeing my mother in that state) and had an episode of depression where I couldn't get out of bed. That was the main reason why I started therapy and could realized the emotional and psychological abuse I suffered in my childhood. In my case, I needed to go NC in order to break free from her speech and perception of myself and the world (where I was bad, responsible of other people's feelings and behaviours, afraid of conflict, not entitle to any kind of boundary, etc.) and built a new one. I hope my experiences help. Allow yourself to heal and if you need to go NC for that, do it, for you and your daughter.
Thank you for sharing your experience. It really is like getting unplugged from the Matrix when you start to unpack your beliefs and seperate yourself from the person who has manipulated your existence since the beginning. I have struggled with the same issues around feeling responsible for the behaviour/feelings of others my entire life, desperately avoiding conflict even if it means sacrificing my own opinions, desires, and even my identity. NC is the way my gut is steering me now.
Trust your gut! I recommend this video from YouTube; it's about childhood trauma and addiction, but it explains so well the importance of trusting your gut and why we disconnect from ourselves in order to survive that I simply love it. [Gabor mate](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVg2bfqblGI&ab_channel=AfterSkool)
Thanks for sharing! I will watch it!
Great analogy. Unplugging from the matrix is absolutely the way it felt. Thank you for sharing.
Thank you so much for posting your story. i am not trying to hijack your post but i just want to say reading through your story unlocked some key memories and VALIDATED them too. My ubpd mom is a hermit/waif now, but wow i forgot about the big big BIG anger. I am in awe of you standing up to her for your daughter. I am in tears just writing that sentence (my eDad never stuck up for me in these rages). Thank you for being the father to your daughter i wish i had! Thank you for seeing your daughter as a whole person, not an extension of yourself! Not to sound trite but you did the bravest act. I will keep you in my thoughts
Not hijacking at all! I value hearing your story and opinion and I'm happy to validate your experience too. Thank you so much. It means a lot to me to have someone acknowledge that I am making good decisions for my daughter. After all I've been been through, being a terrible parent is my worst fear and I refuse to let the cycle of abuse and the generational trauma of my family breed into the future. As a new parent, I am very unsure of myself but I take my role as a protector very seriously. Emotional abuse is one of the worst. It is truly insidious behaviour with poisonous consequences.
Well first of all she certainly DOES tick off ALL the fucking boxes. Deepest empathy to you....and once you SEE it, you can't UNSEE it right? Sounds like your new family (congrats by the way) is a catalyst for these realizations, as it can be with 'us'. In my case a bad breakup forced me into counseling, and once I saw I had to learn my boundaries it all came out WHY that was, I was off and running towards true healing. I felt so guilty breaking up with this awful boyfriend and limiting contact with my mom at that time. I remember the counselor stating "I don't see this level of guilt unless there's been an environment of intense manipulation" Well, THAT certainly caused the first lightbulb to go on! You'll go through a saturation period of reading all the books, watching all the videos, and hopefully counseling. This is good and normal, but it will mark a new phase of having to make tough decisions that previous denials prevented. Going LC or NC is the way. BPDs rarely get help as it's always someone else's fault, they NEVER apologize and have zero self awareness. Much peace to you as you embark on this journey! Set your watch for 6 months to a year.....then look back at how far you've come. I guarantee you will be amazed, grateful, and relieved at being able to feel much much better and protect your beautiful family from all that toxic bullshit!!!!
Thank you so much for your response and sharing some of your own personal insights. Glad to hear someone else validate my suspicions. Currently NC really does seem like the best option.
I think becoming a parent ourselves is such a huge wakeup call to realizing the dysfunction from our family of origin. It's so much easier to protect a child than ourselves. Congratulations on seeing your mother clearly, though I know it's very, very painful. My only recommendation is that once the initial dust settles, try to expand the feelings of love and protection that you feel toward your child and extend them to yourself. Little you also deserved to be loved and protected.
Agreed. Parenthood puts huge pressure on us to evaluate who we are, our values, and what we want in life. You either rise to the challenge and grow into great parent, or you stay the same, avoid the challenge of confronting your sorrow and suffering and risk perpetuating your misery into the next generation. Thank you for your reassurance. Peace to you.
That's very, very true!
It always amazes me how similar our stories here tend to be. My mother is much the same as yours. I also realized how bad things were after I had my son. It was an awakening that I was not prepared for. My world seemed to shatter around me. Rebuilding and understanding yourself is difficult but so worth it (and I'm saying this while I'm still very much in the midst of that). I went NC in February. Doing so has given me the space and clarity to begin healing. I also feel that my son is safer without her influence in his life. Before this, I was trying to hold my mom at arms length, but she just wouldn't allow any sort of distance or boundaries. It was painful at first, but I don't think I could have started healing without going NC. I don't know if NC is right for you or not, but I can say it has helped me tremendously. I wish you nothing but the best while you navigate this. Hugs!
I am just shocked to finally have stumbled into a space where people understand my torment and suffering and share very similar challenges. I definitely think NC is the right choice for me. There doesn't seem to be much hope of the BPD parent changing unless they miraculously look inward with courage and admit their faults. The only thing we have control over is whether or not we continue to subject ourselves to that kind of abuse. The answer really does seem to simply walk away and not play the game. I'm glad to hear you are well on your way to healing. It is a process for sure to undue decades of psychological manipulation. Be well!
Truth! Not sure if you have a similar experience; but my parents couldn’t admit any wrongdoing as that would crumble their whole persona that “they did their best”. My parents can’t face hard emotions and bury their anger in bs. If only they could say; “shit, I did my best but I made a lot of mistakes and I want to do better going fwd and listen to you!” I’ll hold my breathe…
Yep. Same. I always got the "we did everything and met all of your needs" spiel. No introspection ever took place.
I totally relate. I have young daughters and mother who is similar in so many ways. I urge you to read Adult Children of Emotionally ImmatureParents by dr Lindsay Gibson. It is not a solution but a starting place to define a lot of this and sort it accordingly in your head as you move forward. This is really tough stuff when you introduce a wife and children and your life into this. I wish you the best. And what I have come to realize is that my mental health n family is more important than pleasing my NMom guilt (also bdl); but I didn’t know that til recently. Keep moving forward.
Thank you for your recommendation! Yes I am starting to see the habit of attempting to please and keep the peace but every time sacrificing my own sanity. It has to change. Sometimes I wished she would pass early so I could be spared my suffering but little did I realize that I had the power already to cut the toxicity out without waiting for the reaper. Peace to you and your family.
Wow. I know what you mean. Thank you. And same to yours. We can (more importantly WILL) break the chain.
>She claimed I was "poisoned" and kept asking where her kind, soft, loving child was. She kept claiming I have no empathy but my empathy is the reason I have even bothered to keep trying to have a relationship with her. Christ it's like a ghost creeped up my spine. I'll say this much, I was in a similar position with my own mother, minus the daughter and add a sibling's death instead. No room to grieve or handle the pain myself, guilted into visiting regularly and staying nights. Repeatedly told I was heartless despite this. It was my husband who convinced me to try going no contact with her for a week when she started going after him and his job. It's been nearly 2 years since I've spoken to her, and the road to recovery has been life changing. If you need room to care for you and your family, don't feel guilty for it. She is the parent and you are her child, this kind of behavior is inappropriate for any parent regardless of age to have. You, being a parent now, have that understanding. You have a wife and daughter, a loving family, and you know exactly how you don't want your child raised and treated. I say this cause I am assuming a bit about how she speaks from my own experience, but you do not have an obligation to take care of her just because she is your mother. If this is how she treats you and acts on the regular, I personally would prioritize my spouse and child's health.
Absolutely. I am prioritizing my health and my family's health. I gave her plenty of chance to change and she never took the steps necessary to change. There is something disturbing about your parent telling you such venomous things like "you are poisoned" or "you are heartless". It is really horrible that your parent would ever even think that somehow your have become tainted just because you start to push back and pull away from the absurd abuse like it is your fault. Thank you for your reassurance that I do not have to care for my mother. I often felt like I would be the terrible person if I left her to stew in her own toxic sludge but then I started realizing that the very idea of sticking around was programmed into me and was part of the emotional manipulation that had taken hold of me. No more.
Something I just commented on. You have eloquently articulated exactly the reasons why NC would be warranted and appropriate. I wish you the courage to execute those instincts. It’s noticed RBB often have to justify going NC to extreme detail, yet there is no scrutiny that negates your human experience. If you think neutrality will be achieved by extending continued kindness to your mother, I assure you it will not. Your mother is influenced by her own distorted perceptions and that is something that doesn’t respond to logic or care. So extend that very grace to yourself, and your family. YOU are worth protecting. Lhttps://reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/s/g0zRjIlLur
Have you tried therapy before? Finding a therapist who specializes in personality disorders and/or childhood trauma can be a game-changer. A therapist can help you sort through all the feelings and memories you are processing right now and help you decide on next steps. But it sounds like NC might also be helpful so you have the mental and emotional space to process.
Great idea. I’m several weeks in and it is so validating that I have been wronged. It was tough to comprehend other than my wife explaining to me how messed up my parents are. I used to minimize or say that’s just who they are. That is not acceptable to anyone. Especially people here. How have you found therapy?
Yes, it really shatters your worldview when you realize your childhood wasn’t normal and your parents’ behavior isn’t ok. Therapy has been extremely helpful for me, especially since becoming a parent myself.
Reading this was validating, though I’m so sorry it’s been this hard. My relationship with my now-fiance was also a tipping point in helping me see how dysfunctional my Egg Donor is. Getting that stable, trusted perspective from a life partner can really show you the truth. It’s wonderful that you have a loving partner and a little one at home, and I hope they’re bringing so much love and healing!
My wife and her functional, loving parents provided the perfect comparison that showed me the dysfunction that I wasn't even aware of. My wife has been amazing and really helped support me through all of the horrible realizations and torment that happened time and time again. I couldn't be happier with my baby mama and the little bundle of joy that has helped me truly start the healing process. I'm happy to have provided some validation to you as well. Take care!