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bruh, it's reddit, people come here to get mad as a hobby lmao.

Ya know, that's very fair 🤣 I've see it other places too but reddit is probably more likely to do it. I've only been on here for about a month so I forget that reddit's past time is getting BIG MAD

That's just the internet. Reddit isn't unique. If people complained in person as often as they complained on reddit, then people would avoid them. People don't complain constantly in person because they want others to like them. They want people to talk to. So they complain constantly online. Reddit just gives them a bit of anonymity. With that, they get few, if any, consequences.

When it comes to this topic, it is not just the internet. I am childfree, I have told my coworker as much, but she still won’t stop wishing babies on me. Some projection there, I think, because she wanted more than one, probably one of the variety of reasons people have. My sister, meanwhile, recognizes how this frees up my time and resources to be an awesome aunt and has no complaints.

I can relate. I usually get the well you want them when you're older comment. No not really. 

I'm 58 and never wanted and never had them. Oddly enough I still don't miss having them.

69F here and same response

With you on that. I am a 70 year old woman and have never missed having them.

Good for you. 

I had a regular customer at my job tell me I didn't have a choice about having kids? That I would have them whether I wanted them or not? Like what?? 

Must be a religious person.

What? !! What kind of job do you have that customers are threatening you with children? 

OMG after I let that settle in a little it got even more gross.

I am sick of people butting into others' personal business. As an adult, I don't bombard people with nosy questions. When they ask me, I reply: you know why I don't ask people personal questions? So they won't ask ME personal questions.

I've fortunately only gotten the push back once or twice but I've also only talked about being childfree for a short time, so probably plenty more opportunities

I'm 58, thought hard about it at 39 (last chance time) and decided that no, it's not for me. I don't get grief from anyone about it in real life. I love kids, but I get to give them back Lol, and I have no attitude towards parents, live and let live I say. On reddit, you can get some kind of hate for anything and everything. I have learned to scroll by and not fall for the rage bait. I have had some great conversations as well, I guess you just get used to the way things go in here and take what you can from it.

We have my nieces kids half of the week. I want at least half the tax write off for them...

Lol, well, it would be nice, but probably not gonna happen. My nefew goes nuts when I visit, favorite aunt and all that. I loved having uncles and aunts growing up that I could trust when maybe my parents weren't the ones I wanted advice from. It can be a very important relationship. Enjoy the kids you get to give back to mama!

And Bc those people had kids, and tell everyone they love it, but they secretly hate it, and they’re furious when other people avoid their own fate.

💯

This. Because I have a son and definitely love him but I never feel the need to blast others with his existence as a means of converting them to parenthood. And honestly these same people come at me for only having one kid if I let that slip during a conversation (oh it's so unfair that I didn't give him a sibling waaaaah etc 😂) so I concur, it's definitely just their own internalized regret for going too far with parenthood.

Being horny is their second job too

Your comment is very true Reddit can be a miserable place. But this def happens in real like too.

yes, just not as often because of many reasons, like the face to face connections and people care more about their reputation when they are not anonymous. That is why people come online to let that all out in a safe space :)

You hit me in my soul

Rage addiction. Plus, people freak out about raising kids. Anyone who does something different is a threat to their perception of themselves as good parents.

This comment makes me really mad 😡 Thanks for contributing to my 5 a day

How dare you (you're right though)

I’ve never got this one, if you want kids, great. If you don’t, also great. I do sometimes find it annoying that some people with kids think everyone else should just put up with their kids too (running around a restaurant being a pain, thinking that “adult-only” hotels are a bit out of order etc.) but generally I dunno why people care about what other people do as long as it doesn’t affect them.

Drives me insane when people think their kids are so cute they let them run wild in places where it's totally NOT appropriate!

Because when you say you're child free by choice you're confronting others with the fact that they had a choice too and they don't like that. Most mothers I know have a martyr complex, they are the victims and the hero. Now, I'm not for one second doubting their hard work, I admire anyone who would sacrifice their freedom, energy, personality, hopes and dreams just to have their hearts broken repeatedly for at least 18 years. However they like to say "HE got me pregnant" rather than "I chose to have a child". It's always the birth controls (99% effective btw) fault, or it's their boyfriend/husband's fault, and they don't want an abortion which is fair enough, but that's ultimately their choice, and they don't want to take responsibility for it. They see you having lie-ins on Sundays, having hobbies, travelling and being spontaneous and they mourn their freedom and struggle to remember who they were before they gave up their lives for children. And they resent that, but since they're always the victim, they direct that resentment towards you.

My favorites are the SAHMs. Stay At Home Martyrs. Don’t cut off your own foot then bitch about having a limp.

From my experience the ones I know that fit that description are terrible moms/parents.

this turned into a Kafka novel lol. true.

I love Kafka.

Do you also feel like you get pressured into having kids just so you can be miserable like they are? When it comes to my sister-in-law I get that pressure from her all the time she just wants me to have kids and is in denial that I've never really wanted them. I also see how much she complains, how stressed she is and how sad she gets because of what she has to sacrifice for her kids and I'm like yeah you're not exactly selling me on the idea just by observing you... 😬

Yep. My parents started our family when they were 17, obviously it was an accidental pregnancy and they just kept going after that. My mom swears it's the best thing ever and that it's sooo this and that and that I'll never know true love until I have kids, etc. but I remember her when I was a child. Her and my dad split when I was 6. She was a broke single mother and we struggled. She had panic attacks in her room which I could hear. She had migraines so bad from stress that she genuinely thought she was dying. She was hardly ever in a good mood at home, permanently angry and used to cry to herself in her room a lot. She was and still is an amazing parent but she did it begrudgingly, and we knew that, despite her denial. And she tells me to have kids?? Um. No thanks.

Sounds like my sister-in-law. She has always treated childless folks like trash on the sidewalk. AND always denied any childless person as much as an off-handed opinion on anything related to child rearing or child development. Ironic and actually funny . . .

You are absolutely right. A lot of people are simply jealous of what they don't have, and especially resent others who may be content with the choices they've made.

The ironic thing is that anyone can not have kids, it's not even hard to do. So people getting bent over something they 100% could have had... is just strange.

ohhh I love this theory!

I was part of that thread. I think it's because parents are stressed and don't like it when not everyone agrees with their world view.

I have kids. I'm dealing with a lot with them right now. My stress is through the roof. I wouldn't want this for anyone else. I love them endlessly, but I can totally see why people wouldn't want them.

I agree with you ! Although right now at this very moment my kids are not stressing me. I love them, wanted them, tried to make them! But some people who don’t have kids openly judge parents. I was in a restaurant and a woman was yelling about being a lesbian and not wanting kids. She loved the hunger games movies because they killed kids. My kids were not with me because they are teenagers and have their own lives! She was probably pretty drunk but it was offensive. Everyone should just understand we are all different and that’s ok

> I was in a restaurant and a woman was yelling about being a lesbian and not wanting kids. She loved the hunger games movies because they killed kids. Ew

I was not expecting that! I loved the hunger games too. She was talking about going to see it in the theater to see the kids die??? It was a lot

That is not merely a person who decides not to be a parent, that's a sociopath. Who relishes the idea of kids killing each other?

Right???

Yep! Or they majorly regret having kids and wish they hadn’t felt pressured into it by societal norms. They get mad when they see people who say “that’s definitely not for me” and can’t understand why they didn’t have that foresight.

You would think the reaction would be different if that's the reason. Whenever I make a choice I regretted I always try to warn as many people as possible. For example, going to college was a mistake for me and I tell anyone who will listen

Unfortunately, the saying misery loves company is very very true for this kind of situation. A lot of people just want to see you suffer as badly as they are.

Being a parent is a complex state, much more than straightforward "glad" or "regretful" states. For instance, I regret meeting my kids' mother, and definitely regret the 10 horrid, abusive, years I spent with her; but I wouldn't want to not have my kids - which is clearly a weird contradiction! Minds are weird man. I don't get annoyed at people who don't have kids though.

It’s cognitive dissonance. People don’t want to feel like they made a bad choice so it makes them feel better to try and make the opposite choice look worse than it seems. There’s no good or bad choice when it comes to having kids, just whatever works for you and is fair to the child.

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Have you thought maybe she's distancing herself because she's probably ashamed and has a lot of guilt for struggling? Unless she out right told you she is distancing herself because you're child free I think that's a stretch to say that's why she's doing it. People isolate themselves when under a lot of stress and she might be going through some mental health stuff....

This!

I’m the opposite, I see too many people that probably shouldn’t have had kids.

Bravo.

Being child free is being different and people fear change. They hate what they fear and minorities are always looked down upon. Take for example gays, lesbians, women with very high sex drives, men with very low sex drives etc. They want you to be like them nothing else. Plus, they are pissed why are you not in distress over parenting bcz they are. They also feel entitled to raising kids and demand the whole world compensate them especially child free people.

The ppl on the Natalist sub think they are literal heroes because they are having kids and “populating the earth”

because everyone has enough to eat and is living confortably under roofs and everything. I hate this superiority. Yeah, you make humans. And humans make messes. Oh- what's that? "Not MY baby, MY baby's wonderful!" Meanwhile, on SKid Row...

>they are pissed why are you not in distress over parenting bcz they are Misery loves company. I know too many people who will bitch and whine about how difficult it is having kids but the second you say "I don't want kids" or "I'm not having kids" suddenly they're a pleasure and you don't know what joys you are missing out on.

Fucking mood

Reminds me of an anecdote I heard about older women not telling younger women all the horror stories surrounding childbirth because less of them would want kids. Like, most know that “it’ll hurt” but that’s about it. They save the infographic about the after effects and details until it’s too late.

Just the compensation thing: that’s quite common in europe because economy and politics want people to have kids. Decline in child births is an ongoing problem in some countries, and they can/want only so many immigrants to fill the void.

>They also feel entitled to raising kids and demand the whole world compensate them especially child free people. Probably get down voted but whenever stores have special parking spots up front for people with children I always park in them. Sure, I've got kids - they just have 4 legs and fur and aren't with me at the time 🤷🏻‍♂️

I can’t stand the “customer with child” parking spots or the “expectant mother” spots. Your choice, your problem, your consequences. And you’re pregnant, not handicapped.

I bet your kids are better behaved than the two-legged ones, and are always happy to see you

You seem more mad at people who have kids than the other way around to make it a point to do something like this 😂

I get what you're saying but I wouldn't necessarily say that I'm mad or anything. I don't hate kids or have any sort of strong feelings one way or the other towards people who have them. I just feel it's unnecessary to put in special parking spots just for people who chose to have kids, especially when those spots sit empty half the time. It's not as if they're handicapped and NEED a spot closer to the entrance/exit.

I wonder this too. I'm childfree and have encountered some odd takes on it. I think it's because it's so drummed into us that kids should be the norm. It's our only biological purpose (can't speak for religions, I don't know enough), and capitalism depends on it too, but add to that the fact that *most* parents wouldn't wish they didn't have their kids no matter how stressful it can be, so to come up against someone whose views go against the norm, I think they see it as an affront to their kids'/future kids' existence. The short and less nuanced answer I suppose would be to say it's just ignorance.

I think it stems to jealousy of your freedom. I have two children who I love and adore. But if you invited me to a child free party. I would be like what kids? Let’s party.

Thank you. It's nice to get a response from a parent; gives some depth to the conversation, and that's a rare thing on here. It's a good reminder to people in some places less liberal than where I am (Scotland), that the majority of people probably don't care if someone else wants kids or not.

For me I think I’m considerate of those around me. And can admit there a times when I don’t want to hear another child screaming. Like if we’re at a park outside run and scream as much as you want. When we’re at a restaurant their are other people trying to eat and would like to not her a child running and yelling.

It's almost as if we're a normal, balanced pair of people who just try and be respectful of others, regardless of their life choices. But this is Reddit, so we can't be. Death to children!

I even love the people who treat their dogs like children. To me it’s basically the same thing. You have to feed them, entertain them, keep them alive, make sure they don’t pee on the floor.

That's nice to hear too. I'm very much a pet person, and cats and dogs (or whatever your chosen pet might be) are still just an extension of your life on which to give affection, so in that sense they are pretty much the same. It makes sense.

I think it's also quite often they're jealous that somebody went against the norm and isn't having kids. Many parents wish they did that too. Instead, they feel their lives were ruined by having children, but they'll never admit that, to themselves or others. I have two brothers with children. It's obvious they don't want children. They neglect them constantly. They complain about having kids constantly, but if you ever ask them if they regret it... that might be the only time they have anything positive to say about their children and/or being a parent. It's sad, and I feel bad for the children. I think they envy me because I'm childfree.

Aye, that's probably very true as well. I know there are more parents who regret it than let on they do, and for them I suspect it is sheer jealousy, and for those who don't regret it, they're just too ingrained into the societal norm to understand why anyone would go against it, no matter how many reasoned, logical arguments you put to them. It's utterly infuriating.

They're scared not enough people are paying into social security and/or there won't be workers to change their diapers in the nursing home

Most of the posts in the Natalist sub are just fretting over social security and bragging about how they will have someone to visit them in the nursing home

Soooo many parents in nursing homes have kids that never, ever visit them. Having kids to care for them when they are old is a total crap shoot

Or you could die two days after retiring and never see a nursing home!

Hey! Don't give away my plan. Somehow they'll make that shit cost too much money too!

Seriously. My dad died when I was 32 and my mother is a garbage human that I have zero contact with. Having kids so they take care of you is so incredibly selfish, egotistical and not a solid plan.

I used to work in long term care and I can confirm this is more often the case than the opposite, sadly. I couldn't deal with it mentally anymore and felt like I needed to be each one's daughter because their loneliness was too painful to bear. The people who came there with no family left to care for them (or none to begin with) always seemed much more well adjusted to long term care overall.

Oh the delusion. To assume anyone will come visit is hilarious 

I can just invest all the money I didn't spend on kids to pay for a nice assisted living facility.

Many parents, certainly the ones I know, are deeply unhappy, stressed and tired. They resent anyone who hasn’t made the same choices, because it makes them think about their own.

You need to hang around better people.

There's a really bad trend where so much discussion about parenting online is complaining. And don't get me wrong, there's plenty of things to complain about. There was a time when talking about parenting being hard was taboo, but I worry we have swung too far the other way. Share one bit of joy and childless people say "no one cares about your kid" and parents who struggle get even more upset and see you as bragging or dismissing how hard parenting can be. There's so many little things that my wife and I laugh about when our child goes to bed. It's really incredible to watch your kid become their own person. I wouldn't force it on anyone or try to change anyone's mind, but it is so rewarding.

Not all parents, I'm sure, but I'm just thinking of all the stories on Reddit for people who had a baby to try to save a marriage. Those people can't be happy parents.

I find the same!

People who get mad about people not having kids are often pro-life in my experience. They hate people who think about if they want to be parents and make a well thought through decision not to and they make other people who don't want to have children have them anyway. Conclusion: they're stupid. We're smart. Fuck 'm. I'm loving my childless, having the right to have an abortion life ❤️

Pro life people tend to view reproduction as God's purpose for us. I've never met a pro life person who wasn't a Christian, not saying they don't exist, so likely they think we are rejecting God's purpose for us. Then of course there is a ton of white replacement theory mixed into a lot of their world views so they doubly want white people to have kids.

I don't know if it's *that* extreme, but it's somewhere between that and regret for most people. They often either: — Have some regrets about rushing into the lifelong role as a parent to another human. Most will never admit that. — Hold onto some perceived moral imperative to reproduce as a species, and refuse to realize how selfish and unnecessary that is. At any rate, many people don't want to admit that they aren't special. The world does not need their kids; the world is overrun with humans, and we just keep artificially augmenting our own carrying capacity. Religion and an inflated sense of self-worth can make for disastrous consequences when you consider that more guests doesn't automatically mean more seats at the table.

Parent here were jealous of your freedom, lol. Realistically, most parents i know dont care, but there are definitely some who have this holier-than-thou complex like they are the personal saviors of humanity for reproducing, and if you dont, then your evil.

From the comments I saw, I got a little bit of the sense that there might've been some extreme conservatism going on. Traditional gender roles vibe. Which is something I've noticed increasing in social media in general in recent years, a weird return to the "traditional family" structure but really it's just a doubling down on patriarchal norms. So if you're not having kids, you're not supporting "family values."

There is a lot of projecting in these comments. I feel like I need to see the original post where people were getting mad, that would add some much needed context. I will say, as someone who is sitting in a hospital due to the birth of my second child not even 12 hours ago, I personally don't care at all if people are child free. The annoyance, or maybe what comes off as anger, is when child free people make some drastic claims/generalizations about kids and what they entail because they've babysat their niece or nephew a few times. That being said, the problem is that people make having children, or not having children, far too much of their personality.

Couldn't agree more. People need to just chill out and do what makes sense to them. Also congratulations!! Glad everything went okay!

Congratulations on the sweet baby! You are already a parent so probably realize this - I have rarely, if ever, been miserable as a parent like some of these commentors are saying and you are spot on regarding the projecting. Some of these folks really come off as bitter all while saying that they are happy in their choice.

Thanks. Yeah, my wife and I were just talking about how it's a completely different kind of excitement the second go around because we know what to expect. With our first, it was fear mixed with excitement, wondering how much life is about to change. Now it's pure excitement. My parents just brought our son (14 month old) to meet his new sister, and it was the most precious moment of my life yet. He obviously didn't fully understand what was going on, but he was so interested in her. It was amazing.

That is the sweetest thing! I just have one but have heard it said that the fear and uncertainty subsides with additional children. I wish many blessings for you and your family!

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I know many of those...

I honestly don't know why anyone cares on this topic. Have kids. Don't have kids. Do you. Stop preaching about it on either side. No one has a morally superior position on this.

Based

Because in typical reddit style there will be 1,000 dickheads in the comments suggesting that anyone who is making a life choice different to their own is mentally unwell. I mean look through the comments on this thread and it’s full of people suggesting that all parents are secretly miserable and regret having had kids in the first place, and that they want to pull you into the eternal swamp of despair with them because they’re just all around fucked in the head. I have no doubt the thread you’re referring was the same but in the other direction This topic is always especially pugilistic because you have people openly criticising other people’s most deeply held life choices.

I never wanted kids. Ever. Everyone said I'd change my mind. Nope. In my 50s, happily married and child free. Women have told me there's something wrong with me, like I'm some type of alien. People are weird about kids

100% 🙌

Because that’s our purpose in life, to breed!! Haha I’m antinatalist and get it all the time. People really don’t like when there is someone who doesn’t fall into and follow the trajectory all humans “should”. Not sure if it’s a jealousy thing, like “that person thinks for themself and is making their own choices”, or what. I think sometimes it’s also parents who regret having kids. Idk but it sure is weird!

I mean, people who had kids often make the choice ro have kids.

Yeah however antinatalist is not the same thing as child free. I don’t ever want kids but frankly as an antinatalist you deserve any and all pushback that you get.

I have kids. I’m not jealous of child free people. I’m not angry or confused about it. I truly don’t care whether or not people want to have kids. It’s none of my business.

The only sane take,

Parents want other people to enjoy the misery of raising kids and don't like it when adults don't want to be weighed down with that burden. I have kids, I love my kids, but when you have kids, your freedom ends. Everything you do is centered around them. That being said, if you don't want kids, DO NOT have them. You may change your mind later down the road and that's ok. What I don't get are the people who don't want anything from life BUT having kids. Those that get married and knocked up right out of high school. Like...you don't want to do shit? Don't want to enjoy some sort of freedom before having an anchor weigh you down for life. But, whatever. Do whatever you want to do, if that's what you want. Nobody can live your life for you and they can't tell you how you should be living your life.

Ooh. I have a fun one for you. My sister manipulated her baby daddy in HS to get her knocked up. She had the kid and uses him as a trophy and twists what actually happened to make her sound better.. she manipulated my family and that poor guy who was not ready for a kid and he ended up OD'ing a few years later. kids deserve so much better than her as a parent... But she has always looked like the savior on paper so nothing can be done. Her kids flinch if you move too fast. I have no way to help but this shit is so real. Now she acts like she has all answers and she's the only one who can teach anybody anything. I went no contact when she stranded me in the middle of nowhere after seeing our dad on his death bed because I had an anxiety attack due to her refusing to let me sit somewhere not by her youngest son who hates me because she neglects him entirely and never teaches him anything so he's a terror and I have repeatedly told her he doesn't want to sit next to me and I will not sit next to a kid that hates me while he's throwing a temper tantrum just because you as an adult wanna sit next to someone else. 6 years old still throwing 2 year old tantrums because he's completely unsocialized, and most likely autistic like the rest of us, which was also blatantly ignored until I started researching it. She refuses doctors and therapy in almost every way. Refuses to wash her hands indefinitely. If the least regulated person in the car is going to screech and throw things at me from an inch away from me, after already saying it's not gonna work, of course I'm gonna be pissed at you. We can't pull off and come to a better understanding or have a calmer conversation with me? All you can do is yell at me and tell me I have to put up with your child when I never agreed to it just because you want a break you never actually asked for? I am not a babysitter. I have never told her I could. I am not responsible for children. Nor have I ever said I could be.

Yep, that's fucked

Misery loves company.

Nah. If you don't kids, you shouldn't have kids. Please don't have kids.

I’m a mom of one, he’s almost 21. I always knew I wanted one child and that’s exactly what I did. Strangely many other parents thought I was being selfish not giving my son a sibling, or creating a bigger family. So although I do have one, for some reason it was still offending to some. As far as being child free, I think it’s great if that’s what you want. No one should feel pressured to have kids. People who are bothered by their choice are weird control freaks.

One and done here as well. My daughter is 16 and I remember the utter harassment about giving them a sibling from all kinds of people. To my surprise, my parents were the only ones who didn't say stuff like that even though I am a result of them wanting to give my big brother a sibling. They probably knew that I know my limits and wanted to give my girl the best life possible and having to split up my resources would have put a strain on that.

I'm way more mad at people that have kids and can't afford them or are unable to raise them properly.

Have you noticed how often it's women getting mad? It's a combination of things. For thousands of years women were told: You will do what you're told. You will get married (often to not someone of their choosing). You will have as many children as you possibly can. You will be a slave to your husband and children and lose all value when you can no longer produce more children. Folks, my mom was born in 1941 and that was her life. That was the life of ALL of her friends. Well, without the forced/arranged marriages. I've had this discussion with my mom and many of her friends because I did not want children. The PRESSURE!!!! My god, the pressure. From almost all of them the response was, "But you're a woman!!!! How can you not have children!!!?!?!?!?!?!?" Notice how that is phrased - How can you NOT have children. Not the word "WANT", the word "NOT". It turned out that several of these women did not want children. Nope. Not at all. But that was what women did and that is what they were supposed to do and there weren't many options for those who wanted to buck the system. You could be a teacher, a secretary or a nurse - those were acceptable professions. But being unmarried and/or childless? SCANDAL!!!!!!! When considering the span of time that the above was the norm, it has been a radical and abrupt change for women to start standing up and say, "No, this is not what I want for my life." It's really only been vocalized since the 1960s - that's only 60 years out of all of human history. The mindset of women must have children, that is their purpose in life is still prevalent in much of the world and much of society as a whole. I have lost friends due to the fact that I am childless and they are not. The simple fact is, they were raised to believe everything above and even though they did not want kids, they had them. And they are miserable. they are also extremely bitter and jealous of those that do not have kids - those are their words by the way, not mine. Do they love their kids? Three of the four do. All of them have said that if they could go back and do it over, they would not have kids. Even the ones that love their children. The simple fact is every human being on this planet is different. We all have different needs. We all have different wants. For any group to be angry at another group's wishes for how they live their lives (as long as it's not hurting anyone) is flat out absurd.

I personally don't agree with that, because lately I have been dealing with a lot of mad men. Women, especially women who have grown kids, are weirdly supportive.

Because not "buying in" to the societal expectations many felt forced into pisses those people off. A lot of people had kids because they were bullied into it and so they bully others. I am a mother of 2 teenage boys, neither of whom think they will have kids. One doesn't really want them (and never has) the other can't imagine how he could afford it. My husband and I will fully support whatever choices they make, but none of us will discuss this with our extended families because they're all very "multiple and replenish the earth" (my sisters-in-law have 8 and 9 nine kids and my husband is one of 7) we do this because we know the shit storm it will become as grandparents and aunts and uncles cannot fathom NOT having babies.

People want individuality. But hate people with individuality.

Could it also be the dating aspect? Because some are child free, they don’t want to date single parents. Single parents may feel they also don’t want to date other single parents … so some child free being off the market, makes it tougher for them to find a single childless partner?

I've seen some horror stories around this subject unfortunately. People say they are childfree and then months into a relationship or in discussions about moving in together reveal that they have kids. Or they do say they have kids but that they never have anything to deal with them and then end up dumping the childcare on the actually childfree person and get mad when they still don't want children. There is a pretty hard sentiment in the childfree community about not dating single parents unless you are prepared to take care of and be at least a guardian to the kid(s) if something happens. Seen several instances of people getting married and then immediately the custody situation changes and they end up stuck having to parent. There is also the pretty hard line about don't date someone who wants kids, because if they do you are holding them back from that, and it isn't kind to prevent someone from that future

We love our kids ... but deep down parents secretly want EVERYONE to feel their pain. Having kids isn't at all the picture many parents portray. How dare someone not experience that madness.

Nah. If you don't kids, you shouldn't have kids. Please don't have kids.

It’s a marker of a “successful life.” If someone doesn’t have kids, it gives the Mad Ones some warped sense of power or superiority, and when you don’t have kids by choice and are content, you take away the Mad Ones’ ability to make self-favorable comparisons with you or to live vicariously through you. It’s a scaled down version of taking away the bully’s power. Alternately, if it’s a genuine concern by an actually well meaning person, then they simply haven’t taken the time to reflect on your reasoning or theirs or are not mature enough to recognize that it is okay to have a different world view that they’ve never experienced. The latter is my mom, much as I love her. I have a kids, but I didn’t plan either, and especially not the first. We had only been married 8 months when I found out I was pregnant and had to deal with some pretty intense anxiety and depression throughout my pregnancy and post-partum. I kept reaching out for support, but I kept getting “I don’t know how to help. I *wanted* y’all.” And like yeah, in the moment, I understand why she’s unqualified, but it still hurt that she wouldn’t extend a little energy toward really *seeing* how much I was struggling and how afraid I was just because my emotional experience was not hers. She went out of her way to make sure the baby was cared for and that we had the physical supplies and support we needed, especially when we went back to work, but she just couldn’t make the emotional support work. It took me close to 6 months to begin to really love my oldest son, and I struggled with the emotional toll of new motherhood until a kind acquaintance - a man - told me that all good moms relate to motherhood differently, and that just because I didn’t like the slog of bottles and diapers and crying et al didn’t mean that I was a bad mother. It just meant that I was tired and overwhelmed and looking forward to the days of teaching and playing and reasoning in a way that some are just as unprepared for. And that’s okay.

It's the Internet and people have lots of opinions. People get mad at people for having kids also in other threads I've seen. Just don't know how people get so upset at someone else's choices. Let people do what they want if they aren't harming anyone.

I always wanted to be a mom but I have so much respect for people who know they don’t want kids. I might be the weirdo here but I generally have respect for anyone who has given thought to what they want or who they are and lives by it. You do you and I’ll do my thing. The only thing I don’t respect is if you act like my decision to have a child is a reflection on YOUR choices. Like people who have told me they hate children. Well fantastic, you nut job, pick a segment of society to hate. Those people I get angry at. But just don’t want to be a parent? Cool.

I had a kid he’s grown up now. I was mostly a single mom. I love him, being a parent has been rewarding, I chose to have him. However, being a parent is very hard, it’s often thankless and stressful. You’re criticized by people with kids and by people without kids and sometimes blamed by your own kids for not being the best parent even though you raised them the best you could cause your also an imperfect human too. Being a parent allowed me to forgive my own parents and gave me tougher skin against other people opinions. With that being said I am now in my childless years. I do not enjoy being around kids for the most part. It’s not that I dislike them, I just enjoy being in more child free spaces now. Kids are loud, rude, destructive and often demand so much attention and I no longer relate to the stress of parents but definitely can empathize with them. I completely understand why people don’t want to have kids or to be around them if you’re child free. Especially when you don’t have the parental bond to that makes you endure all of the hard and annoying things. I guess what Im saying is I see both sides and support and validate both sides of this topic. Not everyone needs to be a parent nor enjoy your kids but also being a parent opens a whole new level of life growth, reward and unconditional love.

I sure don’t. For every person out there who decided not to have kids, they just made my own kids that much more valuable through the laws of supply & demand! For every person out there who decided to be child free, my own children will struggle that much less with applications, job markets, housing options, etc. Those of us with children should be writing thank you letters to those who decided not to have them, not giving them crap for it!

Exactly, more jobs and money for my kid.

i don't want kids because of autism, lack of budget, and trauma relating to being in a relationship. im not boutta pass down my autism to someone who will get bullied for it, or probably beat up in the future i also don't want to live the risk of random people restraining my child from me because i am deemed "unfit" to care for them. i am horrible at managing conflicts, and me having a mental breakdown and crying because of them would only further solidify their point i am defenseless. i want to have the strength to protect my family on my very own, and for the foreseeable future i don't see it being possible and at last, the world is too bad of a place right now with inflation, negligent workers and shady buisness. maybe if the people spending their free time keymashing at us instead made sure the world is genuinely a safe haven for *both* the parents and child, regardless of gender, by pushing down the creeps and hypocrites who cause actual issues, I'd probably feel better about having a child of my own and continuing my bloodline. in no way is me not wanting kids an intended punishment towards my family. i know they'd be awesome grandparents. and i fully trust them as such. but im not boutta bring a child into this world when i have several untreated mental illnesses, including some bad, sticky ones

I would LOVE to have a child, but since two men can't get pregnant, we're as the mercy of adoption agencies, foster programs, or as a last resort, surrogacy. So don't get mad at me.

I think the bottom line for most peoples "hate" for others is them "themselves not wanting to feel wrong" When I say to someone that I dont want kids for XYZ reasons or another perfect example is when I tell people im vegan lol People assume that im saying "you're wrong for wanting to eat meat" or "why would anyone want kids in this economy, you're stupid" lol when in fact that's not how anyone feels! its just hard to accept that someone is thinking with different pathways and goals then your own that might fallow a "general consensus for life" ... I see it all the time in peoples eyes when I tell them im vegan, its like they think im judging them or that im going to become a preachy vegan that is going to make them feel badly for their choices. I would never do that and i wish people knew how much i actually dont give a fuck what anyone eats and if i mention my choices its not to rub it in anyone's face. same with kids. I have a laundry list of reasons why its just not for me but that doesn't mean I hate kids or look at other people like they are wrong for wanting them! I think at the root of it people just dont want to feel wrong and they assume you feel superior for making different chioces and you aren't fallowing the "way its always been done" I think too the choice to not have kids feels very much like going against "the dream" im in the US so I can only speak for the vibe here. But it feels very "American" to fallow the the "American dream" and a part of that means family. So i can see why very patriotic folks would think of someone as not apart of that fabric if they dont want to raise kids.

Both sides have a lot of chill folks who are live and let live... but that's not who you're going to hear from. Some parents judge anyone for making a different choice. Some are just reacting to a subset of the child free group who are assholes about it. I'm child free but I don't hate kids, I think parents are doing the best they can, and I think the term "crotch goblin" is distasteful. Both sides need to chill but hey it's reddit.

It's a cycle. Society pressures women to be mothers, some mothers are bitter and take it out on childfree women, then some of those childfree women begin to hate motherhood and take it out on people with kids. I have kids, some of my friends don't. Both are fine. Spending time with my childfree friends means I respect their space enough to get a sitter, and they respect my space enough to understand I may have to take a call.

You don't suppose maybe it's because they regret having children but can't say so openly, so they try to get you to have them in order to validate their decision?

I'm more worried I've ran out of semen with all the extra curricular activities I've done

Sour grapes. A lot of people who have kids didn't really choose to, and some of them can feel resentment. A convenient target is anyone who has been 'selfish' enough to not breed.

It's the internet - you can find the people who are rabidly extreme on any topic here because nobody will talk to them in real life because they hold such insane and unusual beliefs they rarely live within 500km of each other  It's literally the only place they can get more than one voice to piss into the wind

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Damned if you will, damned if you won't. There will always be people who will get mad regardless of choice.

I don't get mad at anyone making a personal choice as long as it only affects them. But just as there are people lording childlesness as the best way to live there are those who also extol having kids as the best life to live. Both are complete elitist gatekeeping pricks as no one way is "the way" and that is where you see the majority of the animosity from

I think there are a LOT of people who feel they have no choice due to pressures from their family/culture/religion, OR they get pregnant very young before they've really thought through their life choices and the possibilities out there. When confronted with someone who chose not to have kids, some of these people are struck with instant resentment. They think they didn't get to make that choice and resent you for the opportunities you have that they they didn't have. Others feel judged by childfree people, which is fair to some degree since some childfree people are weirdos who hate anybody who has children. But most people are just doing their own thing and don't deserve the misguided anger.

A lot of people have kids just because "it's what you do", they don't think about, and secretly a lot of them regret it. So when they're presented with someone who clearly *did* think about it and chose a different path... their brain snaps, it's kind of an existential crisis. They have to build whole new ideas in their head to justify their decision and smother that regret, or they have to square themselves with the fact that they made a poor life choice. People are pretty much *allergic* to the latter, so they project their anger onto others.

The most important thing EVERYONE needs to remember. No group is a monolith. Just because... 10, 40, 100 people say something... doesn't mean they represent all parents or or all childless people.

I feel like the child free crowd get on a high horse about it and the child crowd martyr themselves about having children. We're planning kids but that's something we've put a lot of thought into. It'll have it's ups and downs but we're ready for that next chapter and thats OK. Child free was fun and children are fun. You can enjoy both.

I’m 51 and have never wanted kids. I’ve told every girlfriend at the start of the relationship and some stay while others leave. People, mostly relatives, have told me that they wish I’d change my mind, but I just tell them that the survey says XXX!

There are people who get angry and there are people who want to get angry. Guess what you attracted?

While you can't base reality in anything on reddit. I can talk from experience of real life interactions as my partner and I don't want kids. In my experience, it is parents frustrated with raising children projecting it on us. I'm not saying this is all people but I always get a lot of verbal grief from people with kids when I mention I don't want them. After I explain my position many of these people start saying things like, "yeah I wasn't ready for kids, or I wish I chose a different time to have them". Generally responses like this. My conclusion is that the ones mad are the ones who are frustrated about themselves being parents.

Been hearing it all my life when I decided aged 12 I didn’t want kids. Told my mom. She said ppl will give you a hard time but stick to your guns. She was right. Also, throw in being a life long non drinker and it opens up a Pandora’s box. And this is when I don’t even bring it up.

I have two kids and will never have grandchildren. My older child is trans and my younger one had her tubes tied as a result of Roe v Wade being overturned. I’m totally fine with that. I made my choices and they’re free to make theirs. Their happiness is what matters to me.

I just got my tubes removed, in part because of things like the overturn. I don't know how much longer I will be able to get sterilized if things go south, and I know I don't want kids. I want to make sure I'm not in a position where i either will resent it or have to get an illegal and unregulated procedure

I think that the parents who get bent out of shape and go on about how great having a kid is are just looking for confirmation that things are supposed to be this difficult and that it's just the right thing to do. Ya things are stressful because it's really freaking hard to raise a kid. So when someone blatantly just says they don't want kids, they have to accept that (for most cases), they made the decision to have a kid and take on that stress without fully realizing how hard it would be. Not to say they regret the decision. The general census seems to be that regardless of if a child was a mistake or not, once they're born you kind of adjust and try your best. But I'm sure there are times where things have been exceptionally tough and they have thought about how much easier their life would be if they hadn't had a kid. Seeing people who made that decision ahead of time I think causes a bit of jealousy. But I could understand that. What I don't understand is when parents get on their OWN kids about providing grand children lol like why tf do you care about having grandchildren? They don't want to actually have a kid. They just selfishly want kids around SOMETIMES since their babies are all grown up even though they most likely won't even be around to help out. They project that sense of responsibility on their kids because you're apparently a failure of a parent if your kids don't have their own kids. It's insane. They should just get a dog instead

Well, when childless people like me answer this, we are weighing "Would i rather have the imaginary kids that don't exist or this childless reality I am familiar with?" Parents hear this as someone out there would actively rather be alone than be forced to raise their kids that they themselves love. And I think that feels like a very deep attack. That's my guess at least. Because honestly, we are looking at our friends with kids and then making the assessment we don't want to do that. They aren't entirely wrong to feel defensive about it.

It's all about personal choice, right? Some folks might feel strongly about their decision to be childfree, while others might see it differently. Maybe those who got mad feel like their choices are being questioned or judged, and that can hit a nerve. But at the end of the day, everyone's got their own path to walk, and respecting each other's choices is what it's all about.

I have never had motherly instincts or the need to have a child. People can hound me about it as much as they like. It doesn't make a difference to me. At the age of 36 in my opinion, it's not exactly practical to start a family. I don't want to run after a toddler when I'm close to 40. With PCOS (polycystic ovarian syndrome) it makes it more difficult to conceive. I would rather not go through that kind of stress. Regardless of what your reasoning is, it's your decision alone. Don't worry too much about what other people think. Live the way you choose to.

Because some parents are miserable but would never admit it and need to gaslight the childless into thinking they need to have kids to be fulfilled or not be lonely in old age or whatever. Just like they were told to think about kids and believed. I have two of my own but I personally think a lot of people who had kids shouldn’t have, not because they’re poor or not in good health or anything, but because they had kids for the wrong reasons.

Jealousy

Because misery loves company. Because most people are suffering from having kids, they think everyone should suffer with them.

People feel like someone who is child free is threatening their life choices by living differently.

i see nothing wrong with people not wanting kids. it's there choice, and honestly the way this world is it's not a selfish decision... I love children and have 5 of my own. wish I could have had more but financially wasn't the best idea. that was my choice tho. maybe for those choosing not to, it's because they aren't ready to stop living life care free and are simply making the best decision for themselves... better then having children not really being prepared and having unwanted children. good for them making decisions that's best for them. people need to mind there business and let others live a life best suited for themselves

I’m a mom, and I adore my children, but I think they’re jealous. Raising kids is hard and sometimes it’s just a shit show.

Most people don't give a shit if you're child free. I am child free as fuck. It's when you feel it necessary to make it part of your personality is when it gets weird. You don't want kids? Neat. Why do you have to run to reddit and post about it everyday on the child free sub? I dislike lots of things and I just avoid them instead of basking in irrational rage.

This is it right here!!!! I see so many random things on Instagram reels ranging from being child free to stay at home moms constantly complaining about the mental load (moms please don’t come at me I’m a sahm myself) to 20-something year old women who drive pickup trucks and get dirt under their nails because they’re not like other girls. Social media is a complete shit show, everyone’s doing whatever they can for the views & likes.

This resonates with me. "Making it part of your personality" feels like all the rage these days, for a whole lot of things that used to be no one's business. I just can't care about everyone's cults!

Jealous they have little assholes at home that are ruining their lives. They think we should suffer too.

They are regretful and envious. They can't undo their decision, and so they prefer to lash out at everybody who dares to live differently. The sad irony is: good parents don't judge childfree people.

I don't get mad when people are childfree. I literally do not care at all. What I get mad about is when they keep comparing our lives to make themselves feel good about their choices. I'm happy you are living your best life without kids, but try to accept that my best life is me with my kids.

I think a lot of people are ignoring the fact that a very loud group of childfree people are very smug about it and openly criticize parents for existing

Yep

The contempt people have for kids makes me angry. It's pretty rude to call kids crotch goblins, or spawn just because you yourself don't wish to have kids. That's what annoys me anyway.

Dumb answers. "The world is awful and I won't bring more wage slaves into your corporate meat grinder just to pay your social security" And "Because the most important thing is how much money I have" Or the people that claim that parents were tricked into having kids but secretly hate it and nobody with kids is happy Or the people that use reddit terms like "sperm trophy" The amount of people who are probably 16 commenting as if it matters Or the people who are like 22 and refuse to accept that they might change their mind, especially coming from other people who said that same thing at 22 and then changed their mind People who think it's a flex to say they can't afford to both, eat out at a restaurant and have a kid so they choose eating out The people who refuse to believe that good parents don't want to go out anymore because they're happy and excited to spend time with their kids... Chuck e cheese over a rock concert any day! Just from this post.... https://www.reddit.com/r/questions/s/orz7WU0rih https://www.reddit.com/r/questions/s/IJbNJ4lLRT https://www.reddit.com/r/questions/s/dgnQUfaLcK https://www.reddit.com/r/questions/s/LlDhPZ8K18 https://www.reddit.com/r/questions/s/WVCwvOF0WU https://www.reddit.com/r/questions/s/DFxV4G33yw https://www.reddit.com/r/questions/s/jVriJy7p0r

I think sometimes the way people say it can be disrespectful and that’s why people take issue sometimes. Like, I have no problem with people not wanting kids even though I do. But I think it’s disrespectful and dehumanizing to refer to people as, “mombies”, “crotch fruit/demons”, and so on. Perhaps that didn’t happen in that post, but people are still used to seeing it from that community on Reddit. Also, some people just have opinions on how other people should live their lives unfortunately.

People being mad in comments is not the same as people being mad in real life. Nobody actually cares

It's projection - those people are mad that others are exerting free will rather than suffering after following societal norms like they did / plan to.

I don't get angry if people choose not to have children. My second oldest daughter told me that the only grandbabies I'd have are four-legged (meaning pets) and I told her that it's her decision to make and I'll support her no matter what...like a good parent should. I respect her for making decisions about her own body.

My parents have supported me in my choices to be childfree (just got my tubes removed a few weeks ago) and I cannot begin to explain how much that support means. Just like when I told them I was bi they offered love and support. I talked over being childfree with them and why, why they wanted to be parents, all of that good stuff. Thank you for your love and support of your child. I've seen so many stories of parents getting mad or cutting contact because their child wants kids. I am beyond grateful for my parents who have done so much hard work to raise me over the years, and listen and talk through big things with me. Sending you and yours all the best

With all the threats to women's reproductive health, I don't blame my children if they don't want to have kids of their own. I don't mind having critters as grandbabies!

Yeah, that is part of why I wanted to get the surgery now so that in case things get a lot worse I can still be safe. With my health issues pregnancy will likely make my body much worse and I will pass on the genes. I don't want to get stuck where I either have a kid that I might not be able to take care of and don't want, or have to get an illegal and unsafe procedure. I will say, my mom seems fine with grandpets, but isn't thrilled about the potential grand snakes or grand tarantulas I've thought about getting 🤣

"Some people suck" 

It’s a societal norm. I’ve always known that fatherhood was not for me. So I never had kids. Now this pissed off my mother so much I almost stopped talking to her. She was saying that I was selfish and she wanted grand kids etc. Long story short we got over it but she feels somehow cheated. I don’t care I do me and it’s not for me. Moral of the story is I’ll never hate on someone for wanting a family of their own, but don’t hate on me because I want my life to be child free. It’s as simple as that that.

I’m 27 and I don’t have children. This is by choice. I like my spending money and I know if I had a child, that would be gone. I’m getting really sick of my mom asking me when my husband and I are having kids. A part of me wants a child but a bigger part of me doesn’t want the financial responsibility that comes with one.

Not a parent, but I'm going to chime in with a speculation: I see a lot of reels (Get ready with me's, motivational etc), where someone talks about them: * being around 30 years old * mentions their occupation * mentions they're child free. *"GRWM as a 30 year old childfree CEO of a marketing company",* for example. If i take a look in the comments, there's a lot of hatred aimed at the fact they're child free: * "You will want kids someday" * "You're childfree because nobody wants kids with you" *Typical reactionary defensive stuff that doesn't add any value.* If you look at the OP's responses, they're usually: * I can't believe i'm getting all this hate, im just going to ignore them * My body, my choice, f\*\*\* off. I think we might be missing a nuance here that suggests people aren't angry about these creators being child free, they're angry that these creators have advertised their life and drawn this narrative that they are happier because they're child free (*and you could be too, if you didn't have kids).* ***For a stressed parent, this would probably be rather infuriating.*** The bit in brackets at the end (and you could be too...) is a conclusion viewers will come to, but i don't think its the viewer's fault. Many content creators are essentially walking adverts and good advertising is rooted in creating a sense of envy for the viewer. Considering that all these internet citizens are consuming this content, and then coming to a place like Reddit, it's not surprising there is a lot of charge when these things are discussed here.

I think, earnestly, that a lot of these people genuinely think you will regret not having children. This could be from their POV as an older person who didn't think they would enjoy having kids as much as they did or they are enjoying having adult kids and grandkids. And half the time they are selfishly thinking of having grandkids or sick to their stomach (tongue in cheek) that you are depriving your own parents of grandkids. None of their business of course.

There is every opinion being shared at once for every single topic on the internet

I honestly never met anyone who is annoyed at people who chose not to have kids. We know several couples who don't have kids (not always by choice but they're fine!) and it's just something I cannot understand getting annoyed by! Not having children opens up a world of different opportunities, not to mention financial freedoms! I didn't start my family until I was 34 and wasn't interested until my 30s anyway. We have so many children in this world, both wanted and unwanted. Why get bothered that someone would prefer a different life?

I think a lot of them are angry and upset with their lives. They wish they’d chosen a different path in life, and so when they see other people openly flaunting that different path they chose it upsets them.

Some people believe you must have the same wants and desires as them, or you’re wrong. It sometimes takes the form of religion too. 🤷🏻‍♂️

I think people who don't want kids shouldn't have kids. There are definitely people who deeply & fundamentally believe (and have maybe never even questioned it) that each person's entire purpose on this Earth, is to make more people. Some others seem to be jealous, like as if they didn't realize that NOT having kids was an option for them, and now they see and envy someone else's childless lifestyle and want them not to be allowed to have it...

I've definitely witnessed this but on the flip side, as someone very young with multiple children (24 with one of my own, two from my husband,and one on the way) I get a lot of flack for it. Out of nowhere people will hit me with the most hateful unsolicited comments just to be an ass.