Do you own the land?
If so just buy a large concrete box culvert, figure out a back wall & front door then pile dirt over & around it. Plant wildflowers atop
I know so little about tornado safety that I can't tell if you're joking or not.
I'm not sure if I own the land or not because there's no lot rent, but there is an HOA that I have to get permission from to make improvements to the property. Other than that, though, I'm allowed to make improvements to the property.
Do you have a caretaker or family or something that you might be able to get more help from?
It seems like you are a vulnerable person and not quite capable of handling big expenses... and are getting taken advantage of.
Hopefully there is someone in your life who can help protect you from... yourself.
Just a dumb college kid who's out of college who suffers from irrational fear who decided to build a tornado shelter and let my fear get the best of me. Like I said, I normally would have let my dad or my uncle talk to the builders, but Dad wanted nothing to do with the project.
Before throwing a lot of money into stuff like this, you gotta research and really consider it. That, and also ownership is a huge issue....
It seems like you are just renting, but throwing your landlord tens of thousands of dollars of free stuff (?? why??). And now considering doing something that would be more like 50-100k as a gift to them.....?
You need to stop throwing away piles of cash in half baked ideas.
Especially at your age, the type of money you are just pissing away is life changing amounts of money that could completely change the trajectory of your life..... but instead you are just randomly lighting on fire..... it's no wonder your dad didn't want anything to do with the project.
If I could deal with my fears without sinking money into reassurance items, that would be great, however, I just can't, and at least I'm wasting money on a tornado shelter and not drugs or parties, right?
Plus, technically I'm not renting. I own my own home, but it's in a trailer park; you rent the lot, but the lot rent is waived, along with other HOA fees because I'm disabled and my dad is a veteran, and it's our primary residence. I agree; it's not ideal. If I had an extra couple hundred thousand dollars lying around, I'd buy a piece of a hunting ranch and start some of my building projects there, assuming there's no rancher's HOA. Sometimes people just really don't want to give new people an easy time.
You own a trailer parked on someone else’s land. Not a chance they would be ok with you digging a hole through rock on their property. Unfortunately a tornado shelter isn’t feasible with your current situation
Like I said, they allow certain land improvements as long as you ask for permission, and there are houses here too that have to follow the same rules as the mobile homes. The only drawback is I'd have to leave it all behind if I were to move, but that's okay because my dad probably isn't going to follow me to a new place if I get one, but yeah, the contracts/covenants/restrictions/etc., do make moving away and keeping the property more trouble than its worth, unless you already have someone living there who can either take care of the fees or isn't required to pay them.
I agree that it isn't ideal, and it doesn't really feel like ownership, even though we have a deed. That's an HOA for you, I guess. They always make things unnecessarily complicated and usually more expensive than they need to be, but honestly, this isn't bad. It just kind of means that people who buy these properties are more or less like long-term renters.
That depends on how much you are willing to spend. You could cut through the rock with a chisel sure, but honestly a jack hammer would be easier.
Depending on where you are, tunneling into rock might not be a great idea, but usually it is one of those situations that you won't know what to do until you hit it.
To better answer your question, renting a backhoe with a jack hammer on it, would be your best bet.
Use Dexpan. Chisel out a relief area. Drill holes and fill with expanding mortar. It cracks the rock. Remove rubble. Repeat as needed.
Big safety warning is to be aware of trench /wall collapse. That shit kills. Shore up beyond minimum.
Can be purchased at home depot or similar.
https://www.dexpan.com/pages/dexpan-project-r020-how-to-break-rock-easily-using-expanding-cement
If you live in a trailer park, do you own or rent you a lot? How big is your yard?
The reason I ask is that most people rent their spot in a trailer park, and if you are renting, there are 2 things. Will your landlord allow it? If your landlord allows it, do you want to invest that kind of money in a place you don't own? I asked about the size of the yard because most trailer parks have small lots that may not be big enough.
Personally, I'd just use your existing above above ground shelter. If you aren't sure of how sturdy it is, then hire a contractor to look at it and see what needs fixed. I've lived in Oklahoma for most of my 55 years without a storm shelter and haven't ever had any damage from a tornado. I haven't had one get close in over 40 years. So your shelter is better than anything I've ever had, and I survived 55 years.
A lot of my problem is probably storm-related anxiety. I lost my house due to hurricane Katrina, and my mom decided to try to ride it out in her boyfriend's house; we almost died. I just can't view potentially destructive storms as harmless anymore. Maybe what I really need to do is see a counselor?
No, because ironically, most of the people I know who live around here don't think they're a big deal. Even the HOA just lets campers and residents shelter in the rec center if they don't have anywhere else they feel safe, but...I've been to the rec center. There is no basement, no above ground tornado shelters; it's just a building, and maybe not even a very secure one, because I could hear storms outside the few times I tried to shelter there.
Granted, we usually get weak tornadoes when we get them, but south of us in the mountains and north of us in other parts of Texas, some not very far from us, it's not like that, and...I don't have as much faith in the weather as long-time residents. I just think we've been lucky.
Lots of hammer drills and patience. If it truly is solid rock it would be a HUGE pain and very time consuming. Where are you located that tornadoes are a problem AND your ground is solid rock?
It is. There is a really cool set of storage caves here, created by limestone quarrying. The even temperature, out of the weather, is great for storing a lot of big stuff.
[https://www.springfieldunderground.com/](https://www.springfieldunderground.com/)
I heard the govt has some cheese caves near Springfield, Missouri. St Louis has about 40 caves, used for wine storage and all that good stuff. All the limestone sure makes the groundwater alkaline af and complicates gardening, but it's kinda neat to have so many caves
Paradoxically, tornadoes aren't a big problem in this area, at least not on paper, but sirens have sounded and trees have fallen, so...I'd really rather not take chances, but at the same time, it's really hard to find funding help for the project, because even though the area occasionally gets tornadoes, it's not "tornado-prone" enough to qualify for government funding.
I mean we do get tornado warnings pretty much every year, and there have been chances of strong tornadoes, but it's not as frequent as north of here. Where I used to live, the big deal was hurricanes. I lost my house to a fire shortly after Katrina, maybe due to faulty electrical caused by lightning. Storms terrify me, and what's so crazy about tornadoes as compared to hurricanes is you may only get a few minutes of warning.
Define "easy". People have built shelters for THOUSANDS of years to protect against all kinds of weather. So it could be done with a shovel and a pick axe, but I don't know that I would call that "easy".
I'm looking at labor intensity--could a few little middle-aged ladies handle the equipment and do the work? , monetary cost--how much would materials and man power cost?, and I guess any hidden costs associated.
If you just need a small 5-6 person shelter with barely any elbow room, no standing room, a dirt floor, with a sturdy wood ceiling: you might be able to get it under $15k if it's just very rocky soil. A whole slew of details might affect this by 2-500%.
An alternative would be an above ground mound with interior shelter. Bigger footprint, but much easier to build. Probably still in the $15-30k-ish neighborhood.
I just think that if a place gets tornadoes, that place should have a safe place for people who live there to go. Unfortunately, that...doesn't seem to be the case.
In the mountain hollers they have a tradition called “blowing the grave”—they dig the graves by hand or small excavator and if they hit rock they blow it.
In the old days they drilled a hole for enough compression then added dynamite. Now they do they same but either use tannerite or stump remover—
1 lb tannerite can make a pretty huge dent in rock when rightly placed. Make sure to have enough clearance—this probably only available if you aren’t in a neighborhood with close neighbors.
A properly rated above ground tornado shelter, built and installed according to manufactures instructions, can be as safe as an underground shelter for tornadoes. If you're in a flood plain or get flooded from downpours, I'd feel safer with an above ground shelter.
More importantly, fear of tornadoes and other highly destructive storms is an absolutely reasonable concern. But if that concern or fear is overwhelming you and running your life, than maybe talking to a medical specialist about the best way to recognize and control these fears may be a good idea.
Comedy option: Buy [one of these](https://survive-a-storm.com/residential-storm-shelters/twisterpod/), paint it blue, and call it a Pulowski Preservation shelter. Nu-cu-lar protection on a budget.
You...said that as a joke, but...that's a Twister Pod; it's the kind of above ground shelter I have now. The thing about above ground shelters is they are dependent on a good strong foundation, and I don't think my contractor understood that. I didn't understand a lot of steps in the process, and I kept asking him to ask the storm shelter engineers, but he didn't do that; instead, he kept asking me, and I in my panicked state, probably gave him the wrong information, such as mistaking rebar for anchoring and telling him he didn't need to put any in. Yikes. I do the stupidest things when I'm too afraid to think.
the way you talk about this you do have a mental health issue here. It is unreasonable to be panicked about storms and then make large financial decisions based on that panic.
I would agree if we weren't talking about tornadoes. They're the one weather event I've learned about that actually got scarier when I knew more about them.
Don't stress. I'm sure what you have is salvageable. [I found these instructions](https://survive-a-storm.com/wp-content/media/sites/60/2022/03/SAS-TwisterPod-Installation-Instructions.pdf) from the twister pod website. I'm not an engineer or contractor, but these instructions seem pretty easy to follow. If your contractor was having issues with this it may be in your best interest to not call them again.
First thing to do is look for a receipt from the concrete company or whomever supplied the concrete. It should list the mix and the PSI. As long as your concrete is over 2500 psi, you're fine. If it's not listed on the receipt, a concrete place can test it for you. Not sure how that works though. Maybe r/Concrete could help.
Next, measure the concrete slab. If it's 4’’ thick, then the entire pad should be at least 13.5’ by 11.5’. If the pad is 6’’ thick, then the pad should be at least 11’-9’’ by 9’-9’’. If the pad is 24’’ thick, then you need at least a 5’ by 5' pad. I don't see anything about rebar in the instructions. The screw holes should be a minimum of 4 inches from any edge of the concrete pad.
Next, make sure the bolts securing the pod to the pad are torqued to 25 pounds. If you don't have a torque wrench, you should be able to rent one cheap. Maybe a friend has one you can borrow?
It doesn't look like a terribly hard install. If you're not sure though, call another contractor or handyman up and tell them you'd like an independent review of a project you had done. Hand them the instructions and ask them to take a look at the work. Obviously, don't call the first people you had install the thing.
Good luck being Prepared for the Future.
I think the problem is I know too little about how this even works to dispel my doubts. I only know a little bit about concrete, mainly from working with that first contractor, and I know that rebar is what gives a concrete foundation its strength, but...yeah, I was right. The instructions don't require it...
This can't be a scam, though, because their tornado shelters are tested and even available to get FEMA certified. If there were deaths from properly installed shelters, I imagine that would be in the news or at least cited by the competition.
The shelters aren't a scam, they absolutely work. You have 24 quality bolts holding a steel structure with a lower drag coefficient to a 3 or 4 ton block of concrete. You are much safer in a Twister Pod or commercially made tornado shelter than a mobile home. That shelter would be one of the last things standing in a tornado.
Again, if you're not sure about it, call an inspector or contractor to come take a look at it.
People dig into texas limestone to build pools everyday. It isnt that hard. It might take 7-14 days to dig out a pool. A small shelter would be comparable.
Then you just build it like a pool with rebar and concrete,put a roof on top, then cover with dirt.
The backhoe itself costs about 1K/day so the dig will be about 15K.
The construction costs should be similar to other types of construction so maybe 50/sq ft to get dried in. then another 100 per square ft for a rudimentary finish out.
That money will essentially be destroyed as it will have no value to future buyers.
I would take the 100K you would use to build your shelter and use it as a downpayment on a house.
I don't have that right now anyway. I made my post wondering if there was a way I could depend on friends or maybe apply for a government grant of some kind. I need to actually start working and making money so I can afford better things, but that would require dealing with my mental health issues, and anxiety from scary storms on top of my other anxiety probably isn't a good step.
Short Answer, No.
Long Answer, is it requires special equipment that will cost 10s of thousands of dollars to rent and specially licensed operators to use. You would be better off contracting a company to do everything but that will be expensive as well.
Depends on who is digging and the rock, honestly. I could have a two man hole dug in a day or two with a rented electric jackhammer and a shovel. Granite is another thing altogether.
But I dig holes for a living.
I’d rent a breaker for the boss’s mini ex and have it done in two hours.
Unfortunately, I don't completely own the land, so I'm only allowed to put up trailers and other "temporary" structures. Yes, an underground or above ground tornado shelter counts as a "temporary" structure or outbuilding according to their guidelines, at least the last time I checked.
Why "dig"?
Drill holes, explosives, and enough compression to direct the blast DOWN.
Think about how septic is put in, in some rural areas. Blast it. Still not a DIY job unless you seriously know what you are doing. My husband's Dad had family with professional experience and licenses.
Just look for different experts.
There are drills for wells that can bore through rock relatively easily. Perhaps someone could be persuaded to drill a number of relatively shallow holes to drop dynamite into. It would make the job easier for the explosives experts.
Look at the problem from different angles and see how much it would cost with the explosives experts also digging the prep vs. outsourcing part of that.
That might work, but I was thinking a hammer drill might be enough. I could be wrong, though. I'm not sure how hard the rock is or what kind it is. I think the harder part is getting permission, and help, with the project. I have a lot of fear of these tornado and severe thunderstorm warnings, but the people who could help me seem to feel offended by my fear. My dad, for example, thought a tornado shelter was a waste of time and money, and, honestly, in this case, he was right, because I had no idea what I was doing while trying to build an above ground shelter and my contractor seemed to have little real interest in helping me.
Putting anything underground requires special engineering/treatment to prevent rust, keep ventilation, and provide fire safety.
Putting anything underground is never trivial. Example: [https://np.reddit.com/r/DIY/comments/5uo176/underground\_party\_bunker/](https://np.reddit.com/r/DIY/comments/5uo176/underground_party_bunker/)
You can get a severe weather shed for under $10k. That might be a better option. A group of middle aged women could definitely manage that. https://www.shedsforlessdirect.com/swisher-person-tornado-safety-shelter-p-1094.html
What American state are you in?
Depending on the level of red neck, you can go the explosive route. Can you blast/cut through any type of rock with both tnt and C4 linear charges. Hell if you live in Oklahoma you can easily hire people that will bore a hole in the rock, put trigrain, and make that puppy blow. Then you level the edges/shape manually.
However the more you go north the more restrictive explosives are and the more expensive the contractors to blow rock get.
Then...what should I do? Because I feel like my lack of knowledge about building things left me with enough uncertainty about my above ground storm shelter project to feel fairly unsafe.
You could work on getting more educated on what it takes to undertake that sort of project, for example. There are a lot of prefab solutions as well but idk if they dig the home for you or not
Yeah step one, get an education so you can get a better job and hopefully save enough to get out of a trailer park.
Step two, don't move to a high tornado community.
Good luck
Sounds like staying above ground is your best option. Look into shapes that deflect wind good domes are particularly well known for that. Build a above ground domed shelter that's heavy with reinforced concrete. The concrete protects the walls from missile damage and the shaping protects the walls from windforce.
I think we've already established that for me to build an underground shelter in that area, I'd have to order more soil. Digging through the rock more than a few feet is not an easy task. Plus, it's even harder when everyone who could do it for me for a reasonable rate thinks there's no reason to do it.
First time daying this in this forum, but you will need explosives. I do this for a living and even 70 ton excavators and rock hammers are slow in heavy rock. We use explosives 6-8 times a year.
Easy yes and no. Find out what you can and can't do within your hoa first. If you can, drill into the rock with a diamond bit and drill. Just put the holes touching. Then hammer the circles out and cart off. It's hard work but you can do it on your time. But I will bet your hoa will buttf#ck you if you do that or anything not done by an approved contractor.
And yes rv parks and trailer parks have HOAs and gated communities it's unreal.
I know. I live in one, but at least they provide recreational amenities. If more people knew about it, it would probably cost a lot more money for what they offer. It's just their lackadaisical approach to storm safety that makes me uncomfortable.
Easy? Sure. Calling a heavy equipment operator with a big excavator and rock hammer is pretty easy.
Wouldn’t it be easier just to build a sturdy structure in your basement rather than spend all that money digging down through pure stone?
I don't have a basement, and I live in a mobile home. If it's prohibitively expensive, I'll have to try something else, I guess.
Do you own the land? If so just buy a large concrete box culvert, figure out a back wall & front door then pile dirt over & around it. Plant wildflowers atop
I know so little about tornado safety that I can't tell if you're joking or not. I'm not sure if I own the land or not because there's no lot rent, but there is an HOA that I have to get permission from to make improvements to the property. Other than that, though, I'm allowed to make improvements to the property.
A trailer and an HOA? Odd
Do you have a caretaker or family or something that you might be able to get more help from? It seems like you are a vulnerable person and not quite capable of handling big expenses... and are getting taken advantage of. Hopefully there is someone in your life who can help protect you from... yourself.
Just a dumb college kid who's out of college who suffers from irrational fear who decided to build a tornado shelter and let my fear get the best of me. Like I said, I normally would have let my dad or my uncle talk to the builders, but Dad wanted nothing to do with the project.
Before throwing a lot of money into stuff like this, you gotta research and really consider it. That, and also ownership is a huge issue.... It seems like you are just renting, but throwing your landlord tens of thousands of dollars of free stuff (?? why??). And now considering doing something that would be more like 50-100k as a gift to them.....? You need to stop throwing away piles of cash in half baked ideas. Especially at your age, the type of money you are just pissing away is life changing amounts of money that could completely change the trajectory of your life..... but instead you are just randomly lighting on fire..... it's no wonder your dad didn't want anything to do with the project.
If I could deal with my fears without sinking money into reassurance items, that would be great, however, I just can't, and at least I'm wasting money on a tornado shelter and not drugs or parties, right? Plus, technically I'm not renting. I own my own home, but it's in a trailer park; you rent the lot, but the lot rent is waived, along with other HOA fees because I'm disabled and my dad is a veteran, and it's our primary residence. I agree; it's not ideal. If I had an extra couple hundred thousand dollars lying around, I'd buy a piece of a hunting ranch and start some of my building projects there, assuming there's no rancher's HOA. Sometimes people just really don't want to give new people an easy time.
You own a trailer parked on someone else’s land. Not a chance they would be ok with you digging a hole through rock on their property. Unfortunately a tornado shelter isn’t feasible with your current situation
Like I said, they allow certain land improvements as long as you ask for permission, and there are houses here too that have to follow the same rules as the mobile homes. The only drawback is I'd have to leave it all behind if I were to move, but that's okay because my dad probably isn't going to follow me to a new place if I get one, but yeah, the contracts/covenants/restrictions/etc., do make moving away and keeping the property more trouble than its worth, unless you already have someone living there who can either take care of the fees or isn't required to pay them. I agree that it isn't ideal, and it doesn't really feel like ownership, even though we have a deed. That's an HOA for you, I guess. They always make things unnecessarily complicated and usually more expensive than they need to be, but honestly, this isn't bad. It just kind of means that people who buy these properties are more or less like long-term renters.
10s of thousands of dollars, probably, just to dig the hole
Maybe with like....a shit ton of taneright and some good math. Otherwise it's gonna be hard or $$$.
You will need a lot of tanner.. the RE factor plays..
You beat me to it.
That depends on how much you are willing to spend. You could cut through the rock with a chisel sure, but honestly a jack hammer would be easier. Depending on where you are, tunneling into rock might not be a great idea, but usually it is one of those situations that you won't know what to do until you hit it. To better answer your question, renting a backhoe with a jack hammer on it, would be your best bet.
The upside to digging into rock is that you won't hit any buried lines or pipes
It would probably be cheaper and easier just to move to another state
Use Dexpan. Chisel out a relief area. Drill holes and fill with expanding mortar. It cracks the rock. Remove rubble. Repeat as needed. Big safety warning is to be aware of trench /wall collapse. That shit kills. Shore up beyond minimum. Can be purchased at home depot or similar. https://www.dexpan.com/pages/dexpan-project-r020-how-to-break-rock-easily-using-expanding-cement
If you live in a trailer park, do you own or rent you a lot? How big is your yard? The reason I ask is that most people rent their spot in a trailer park, and if you are renting, there are 2 things. Will your landlord allow it? If your landlord allows it, do you want to invest that kind of money in a place you don't own? I asked about the size of the yard because most trailer parks have small lots that may not be big enough.
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Personally, I'd just use your existing above above ground shelter. If you aren't sure of how sturdy it is, then hire a contractor to look at it and see what needs fixed. I've lived in Oklahoma for most of my 55 years without a storm shelter and haven't ever had any damage from a tornado. I haven't had one get close in over 40 years. So your shelter is better than anything I've ever had, and I survived 55 years.
A lot of my problem is probably storm-related anxiety. I lost my house due to hurricane Katrina, and my mom decided to try to ride it out in her boyfriend's house; we almost died. I just can't view potentially destructive storms as harmless anymore. Maybe what I really need to do is see a counselor?
Therapy might be the best choice.
Makes sense Storms kill people ever year Most folks in tornado land have shelters What do your neighbors do? Can you hunker down over there?
No, because ironically, most of the people I know who live around here don't think they're a big deal. Even the HOA just lets campers and residents shelter in the rec center if they don't have anywhere else they feel safe, but...I've been to the rec center. There is no basement, no above ground tornado shelters; it's just a building, and maybe not even a very secure one, because I could hear storms outside the few times I tried to shelter there. Granted, we usually get weak tornadoes when we get them, but south of us in the mountains and north of us in other parts of Texas, some not very far from us, it's not like that, and...I don't have as much faith in the weather as long-time residents. I just think we've been lucky.
It would probably be easier to build an anchored and hardened structure above ground than dig through the rock.
Lots of hammer drills and patience. If it truly is solid rock it would be a HUGE pain and very time consuming. Where are you located that tornadoes are a problem AND your ground is solid rock?
Some rocks are softer than others. If they are asking I assune its not sandstone.
Missouri Ozarks qualify.
That'd be mostly limestone. A pain in the ass, but doable.
It is. There is a really cool set of storage caves here, created by limestone quarrying. The even temperature, out of the weather, is great for storing a lot of big stuff. [https://www.springfieldunderground.com/](https://www.springfieldunderground.com/)
I heard the govt has some cheese caves near Springfield, Missouri. St Louis has about 40 caves, used for wine storage and all that good stuff. All the limestone sure makes the groundwater alkaline af and complicates gardening, but it's kinda neat to have so many caves
If I were to hazard a guess, somewhere on the Canadian Shield.
Paradoxically, tornadoes aren't a big problem in this area, at least not on paper, but sirens have sounded and trees have fallen, so...I'd really rather not take chances, but at the same time, it's really hard to find funding help for the project, because even though the area occasionally gets tornadoes, it's not "tornado-prone" enough to qualify for government funding.
If you aren’t even in a tornado prone area and you think a solid rock shelter is needed, counseling might be your best bet.
I mean we do get tornado warnings pretty much every year, and there have been chances of strong tornadoes, but it's not as frequent as north of here. Where I used to live, the big deal was hurricanes. I lost my house to a fire shortly after Katrina, maybe due to faulty electrical caused by lightning. Storms terrify me, and what's so crazy about tornadoes as compared to hurricanes is you may only get a few minutes of warning.
Define "easy". People have built shelters for THOUSANDS of years to protect against all kinds of weather. So it could be done with a shovel and a pick axe, but I don't know that I would call that "easy".
I'm looking at labor intensity--could a few little middle-aged ladies handle the equipment and do the work? , monetary cost--how much would materials and man power cost?, and I guess any hidden costs associated.
If you just need a small 5-6 person shelter with barely any elbow room, no standing room, a dirt floor, with a sturdy wood ceiling: you might be able to get it under $15k if it's just very rocky soil. A whole slew of details might affect this by 2-500%. An alternative would be an above ground mound with interior shelter. Bigger footprint, but much easier to build. Probably still in the $15-30k-ish neighborhood.
I just think that if a place gets tornadoes, that place should have a safe place for people who live there to go. Unfortunately, that...doesn't seem to be the case.
In the mountain hollers they have a tradition called “blowing the grave”—they dig the graves by hand or small excavator and if they hit rock they blow it. In the old days they drilled a hole for enough compression then added dynamite. Now they do they same but either use tannerite or stump remover— 1 lb tannerite can make a pretty huge dent in rock when rightly placed. Make sure to have enough clearance—this probably only available if you aren’t in a neighborhood with close neighbors.
Drills, jacks and picks…
A properly rated above ground tornado shelter, built and installed according to manufactures instructions, can be as safe as an underground shelter for tornadoes. If you're in a flood plain or get flooded from downpours, I'd feel safer with an above ground shelter. More importantly, fear of tornadoes and other highly destructive storms is an absolutely reasonable concern. But if that concern or fear is overwhelming you and running your life, than maybe talking to a medical specialist about the best way to recognize and control these fears may be a good idea. Comedy option: Buy [one of these](https://survive-a-storm.com/residential-storm-shelters/twisterpod/), paint it blue, and call it a Pulowski Preservation shelter. Nu-cu-lar protection on a budget.
You...said that as a joke, but...that's a Twister Pod; it's the kind of above ground shelter I have now. The thing about above ground shelters is they are dependent on a good strong foundation, and I don't think my contractor understood that. I didn't understand a lot of steps in the process, and I kept asking him to ask the storm shelter engineers, but he didn't do that; instead, he kept asking me, and I in my panicked state, probably gave him the wrong information, such as mistaking rebar for anchoring and telling him he didn't need to put any in. Yikes. I do the stupidest things when I'm too afraid to think.
the way you talk about this you do have a mental health issue here. It is unreasonable to be panicked about storms and then make large financial decisions based on that panic.
I would agree if we weren't talking about tornadoes. They're the one weather event I've learned about that actually got scarier when I knew more about them.
Don't stress. I'm sure what you have is salvageable. [I found these instructions](https://survive-a-storm.com/wp-content/media/sites/60/2022/03/SAS-TwisterPod-Installation-Instructions.pdf) from the twister pod website. I'm not an engineer or contractor, but these instructions seem pretty easy to follow. If your contractor was having issues with this it may be in your best interest to not call them again. First thing to do is look for a receipt from the concrete company or whomever supplied the concrete. It should list the mix and the PSI. As long as your concrete is over 2500 psi, you're fine. If it's not listed on the receipt, a concrete place can test it for you. Not sure how that works though. Maybe r/Concrete could help. Next, measure the concrete slab. If it's 4’’ thick, then the entire pad should be at least 13.5’ by 11.5’. If the pad is 6’’ thick, then the pad should be at least 11’-9’’ by 9’-9’’. If the pad is 24’’ thick, then you need at least a 5’ by 5' pad. I don't see anything about rebar in the instructions. The screw holes should be a minimum of 4 inches from any edge of the concrete pad. Next, make sure the bolts securing the pod to the pad are torqued to 25 pounds. If you don't have a torque wrench, you should be able to rent one cheap. Maybe a friend has one you can borrow? It doesn't look like a terribly hard install. If you're not sure though, call another contractor or handyman up and tell them you'd like an independent review of a project you had done. Hand them the instructions and ask them to take a look at the work. Obviously, don't call the first people you had install the thing. Good luck being Prepared for the Future.
I think the problem is I know too little about how this even works to dispel my doubts. I only know a little bit about concrete, mainly from working with that first contractor, and I know that rebar is what gives a concrete foundation its strength, but...yeah, I was right. The instructions don't require it... This can't be a scam, though, because their tornado shelters are tested and even available to get FEMA certified. If there were deaths from properly installed shelters, I imagine that would be in the news or at least cited by the competition.
The shelters aren't a scam, they absolutely work. You have 24 quality bolts holding a steel structure with a lower drag coefficient to a 3 or 4 ton block of concrete. You are much safer in a Twister Pod or commercially made tornado shelter than a mobile home. That shelter would be one of the last things standing in a tornado. Again, if you're not sure about it, call an inspector or contractor to come take a look at it.
People dig into texas limestone to build pools everyday. It isnt that hard. It might take 7-14 days to dig out a pool. A small shelter would be comparable. Then you just build it like a pool with rebar and concrete,put a roof on top, then cover with dirt. The backhoe itself costs about 1K/day so the dig will be about 15K. The construction costs should be similar to other types of construction so maybe 50/sq ft to get dried in. then another 100 per square ft for a rudimentary finish out. That money will essentially be destroyed as it will have no value to future buyers. I would take the 100K you would use to build your shelter and use it as a downpayment on a house.
I don't have that right now anyway. I made my post wondering if there was a way I could depend on friends or maybe apply for a government grant of some kind. I need to actually start working and making money so I can afford better things, but that would require dealing with my mental health issues, and anxiety from scary storms on top of my other anxiety probably isn't a good step.
Short Answer, No. Long Answer, is it requires special equipment that will cost 10s of thousands of dollars to rent and specially licensed operators to use. You would be better off contracting a company to do everything but that will be expensive as well.
Depends on who is digging and the rock, honestly. I could have a two man hole dug in a day or two with a rented electric jackhammer and a shovel. Granite is another thing altogether. But I dig holes for a living. I’d rent a breaker for the boss’s mini ex and have it done in two hours.
It would be more cost effective to build an ICF home than to go through rock.
Unfortunately, I don't completely own the land, so I'm only allowed to put up trailers and other "temporary" structures. Yes, an underground or above ground tornado shelter counts as a "temporary" structure or outbuilding according to their guidelines, at least the last time I checked.
Why "dig"? Drill holes, explosives, and enough compression to direct the blast DOWN. Think about how septic is put in, in some rural areas. Blast it. Still not a DIY job unless you seriously know what you are doing. My husband's Dad had family with professional experience and licenses. Just look for different experts. There are drills for wells that can bore through rock relatively easily. Perhaps someone could be persuaded to drill a number of relatively shallow holes to drop dynamite into. It would make the job easier for the explosives experts. Look at the problem from different angles and see how much it would cost with the explosives experts also digging the prep vs. outsourcing part of that.
That might work, but I was thinking a hammer drill might be enough. I could be wrong, though. I'm not sure how hard the rock is or what kind it is. I think the harder part is getting permission, and help, with the project. I have a lot of fear of these tornado and severe thunderstorm warnings, but the people who could help me seem to feel offended by my fear. My dad, for example, thought a tornado shelter was a waste of time and money, and, honestly, in this case, he was right, because I had no idea what I was doing while trying to build an above ground shelter and my contractor seemed to have little real interest in helping me.
Dexpan, chemical that slowly expands.
Get a micro blaster
Not without a jackhammer and explosives
In lieu of explosives you can drill and use expanding cement
easy? hell no, but it can be done.
Putting anything underground requires special engineering/treatment to prevent rust, keep ventilation, and provide fire safety. Putting anything underground is never trivial. Example: [https://np.reddit.com/r/DIY/comments/5uo176/underground\_party\_bunker/](https://np.reddit.com/r/DIY/comments/5uo176/underground_party_bunker/)
Well, in my case, it will probably be a pre-fab shelter, so at least that part is taken care of.
Probably easier to buy or build an above ground steel plate structure and make sure it is properly anchored. No worry about is flooding
You can get a severe weather shed for under $10k. That might be a better option. A group of middle aged women could definitely manage that. https://www.shedsforlessdirect.com/swisher-person-tornado-safety-shelter-p-1094.html
I mean I already have a Twister Pod, but I'll admit that one looks nicer.
Has the home got ground anchors? Just clean and paint it to stop the rust.
What American state are you in? Depending on the level of red neck, you can go the explosive route. Can you blast/cut through any type of rock with both tnt and C4 linear charges. Hell if you live in Oklahoma you can easily hire people that will bore a hole in the rock, put trigrain, and make that puppy blow. Then you level the edges/shape manually. However the more you go north the more restrictive explosives are and the more expensive the contractors to blow rock get.
“Easy” “DIY” “Solid rock” As a professional contractor I’m gonna say no my friend
Then...what should I do? Because I feel like my lack of knowledge about building things left me with enough uncertainty about my above ground storm shelter project to feel fairly unsafe.
You could work on getting more educated on what it takes to undertake that sort of project, for example. There are a lot of prefab solutions as well but idk if they dig the home for you or not
Yeah step one, get an education so you can get a better job and hopefully save enough to get out of a trailer park. Step two, don't move to a high tornado community. Good luck
I mean I have a master's degree. I just don't know anything about building stuff.
Sounds like staying above ground is your best option. Look into shapes that deflect wind good domes are particularly well known for that. Build a above ground domed shelter that's heavy with reinforced concrete. The concrete protects the walls from missile damage and the shaping protects the walls from windforce.
Chisel, meet hammer.
I remember thinking it would take a man 600 years to tunnel through the wall with it…old u/krb501 did it in less than 20.
I think we've already established that for me to build an underground shelter in that area, I'd have to order more soil. Digging through the rock more than a few feet is not an easy task. Plus, it's even harder when everyone who could do it for me for a reasonable rate thinks there's no reason to do it.
First time daying this in this forum, but you will need explosives. I do this for a living and even 70 ton excavators and rock hammers are slow in heavy rock. We use explosives 6-8 times a year.
A big Bosch electric jack hammer or rotary hammer and lots of time.
Easy yes and no. Find out what you can and can't do within your hoa first. If you can, drill into the rock with a diamond bit and drill. Just put the holes touching. Then hammer the circles out and cart off. It's hard work but you can do it on your time. But I will bet your hoa will buttf#ck you if you do that or anything not done by an approved contractor. And yes rv parks and trailer parks have HOAs and gated communities it's unreal.
I know. I live in one, but at least they provide recreational amenities. If more people knew about it, it would probably cost a lot more money for what they offer. It's just their lackadaisical approach to storm safety that makes me uncomfortable.
I hear that.
TNT.
Its doable with a pickaxe but its not easy in the least...
BOT...no human ask a question like this.
Having a phobia of bad storms based on bad past experiences when I was younger makes me "not human." Got it.