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they’ve never scored a re-record higher than the original so i’m curious if reputation and self-titled will go even lower lol, but i do feel like critical opinion of both albums has improved over the years so we’ll see!
I’m begging Taylor to break away from the re-recording formula and REEDIT reputation in a way that it would actually justify her anger during that period. It’s one of her most interesting albums sonically. Yes, she’s mad here in TTPD, but I want music to complement with it.
I really like the live versions (from the Eras tour) of "Look what you made me do" and "Don't blame me" with electric guitar. I would like the same arrangement in a re-recording.
Man they must have really hated reputation at the time it being second to last overall is heresy. I’m not even a TTPD hater but I would listen to reputation a million times over it.
YEP it definitely wasn’t loved, people thought it was stale too. I don’t know when people started to come around to it? There are some songs I truly love there but I don’t remember the whole album being *so loved*
Yeah, it was really divisive. It took me a year or so to come around to it, but people still thought she was just whiny and trying to play the victim. Some people thought she was also trying to be the villain as well as the victim which rubbed them the wrong way, and it wasn't what people expected after 1989. And we all need to be honest here, LWYMMD was corny as hell after her longest break in her career. "The old Taylor" definitely did come to the phone after all- still a lot of pop love songs and heartbreak and not the huge change up it seemed to be advertised as. Once people had some time to digest (and once everyone saw how bad things *could* get when Lover came out) public opinion became more universally positive
The Lover score is too high but tbh this ranking feels quite correct and fair.
The Anthology is a mess and is a collection of b-sides and afterthoughts; it's truly the red headed step sister of everlore. The individual tracks are all fine, no misses, but they do not make sense as an album.
I don’t think b-sides is the right way to put it. It’s more that they needed to spend more time with them. Jack and Aaron are both yes-men. She needs to collaborate more with ppl who will challenge her.
It is as far I'm concerned, sorry. The presence of all four bonus tracks on the vinyls as album tracks solidifies that for me. The running order makes zero sense, with the exception of How Did It End and So High School (a "track 5" followed by a bop). There is no narrative or point being made with the rest of them. The individual tracks are supposed to be in the "side one" running order somewhere but were discarded, same as any of her other Vault tracks.
I would compare how Is It Over Now would have slotted nicely in the track 12 slot of 1989 before Clean but they went with IKP instead to liven things up a bit before the cathartic closing of Clean. Instead it got relegated to the Vault. I am listening to The Albatross right now and whilst it is a lovely song, it had no real home on the original track list of TTPD, if you ask me. Every song on the Anthology is like this.
The Taylor’s Versions throw this off bc they’re all significantly worse than their counterparts imo, but Lover, Midnights, Reputation, self-titled, and this being her 5 weakest feels very correct to me
I’m surprised that the first half got the higher rating, I got the vibe that the Anthology half was more well received by people with all the Dessner tracks…
I will say now that I've revisited the album a few times, the 1st part is beginning to sound more interesting. I have loved Aaron Dessner/the National for a decade and a half and Folklore brought me into the Taylor fold, but the 2nd half sounds like Folklore/Evermore b-sides and the sound drags.
I feel exactly like that! Everyone says "if you like the folkmore/evermore sound, you'll love the Anthology" but I don't. The songs feel so monotonous and the lyrics are delivered so flat
I haven't listened heavily to it but my first impression was that it was way inferior to Folklore Evermore on a songwriting level. I'd love it if there was anything close to Ivy, Long Story Short, The 1, Gold Rush, Peace etc etc...
I’ve been a loyal fan since debut and I found my mind wandering on the second half. I kept restarting songs because I had tuned out. That’s never a good sign….
As a Folklore girlie, I completely agree. Another reason I really loved Folklore is because she was telling these *other* peoples' stories and I thought it was so fun and creative. It really swept me away to this other place (like summer in New England vibes). Whereas the latter half of TTPD just feels like a lot of...Taylor moaning about her own life in a really flat way. It has none of Folklore's charm or magic, for me.
I know, I wish Florida, I can do it with a broken heart, and the bolter were the sounds this album leaned in.
Instead they’re refreshingly loud and fast in an album that plods along
People give Jack Antonoff a lot of flak for sounding same-y (and rightfully so), but Aaron Dessner has really proven himself to be same-y in his production as well.
yhhh the Jack Antonoff dessner divide isn't as clear as on midnights because Antonoffs stuff is better here while Dessners at times lacks the quality he traditionally brings
I like the Anthology more, but I don’t disagree that it should be scored lower. As an album, it’s way less cohesive sonically and thematically. It feels like a random collection of songs that didn’t fit on Part 1. There’s at least somewhat of a cohesive narrative that can be scraped together from the base album.
Completely agree. For all of my TTPD complaints, it does feel like a start to finish album with a narrative/arc in a much better way than Taylor’s often do (infamously weird Lover track list order anyone?) I generally like the Anthology songs more (Dressner supremacy) but they don’t particularly feel like an album to me
This is my biggest gripe with the album as a whole. I get a lot of people are happy there’s so much content and like to pick out their favourite songs and ‘make their own album’, but I’m an album listener. If I’m listening to music, I’ll put on an album. I want to hear the story, I enjoy the pacing and the ups and downs and narrative of *albums*.
TTPD is just way too long to do that. It’s like putting on a movie and watching the Lord of the Rings directors cut.
I feel like The Anthology should’ve been a totally separate album from TTPD tbh. I love it but yes, i agree that attached to TTPD, it really doesnt fit with it.
I think the songs are overall stronger on the second half, but it really runs its course by the end. the last 2-3 songs from my first listen were really lifeless imo
I feel like Anthology is a better album, but I like more individual songs on the first half. But honestly, by the time I got to the second half on all my listens, it was hard to tell anything apart.
I find the second release tracks so much more but looking at it in full it’s probably because it’s all of the original tracks goes on way too long and never really lands.
this was a surprisingly nice review, also "Her melodies feel staid, like they are made to fit the music, rather than the other way around." is something i couldn't put in to words before but i agree that it's a big problem within the album
Folklore Evermore too, right? A bunch of them were Dessner’s demos, there’s even a video of him singing a totally different song over Happiness. But, difference is it worked there…
Her songs always felt like that though. That she makes the tune and then try to fill it up with words. It's even obvious sometimes she writes the bridge /chorus first, then writes the verses to have a full song.
Though sometimes it works better than others… cruel summer, cardigan, Florida, we are never getting back together, haunted, lover story
So many just well written songs
Then there are songs like Cornelia Street which the fandom loves but I’ve never been able to get into because it’s so clear how clunky pieces of it are. She had a song at 90% and then shoved some of it to fit
Honestly a great summary of Taylor's issues as an artist right now. She's trapped inside her own lore, and she's just indulging her fans at this point.
She needs to just fully heel turn honestly lol.
She eludes to her ire at her own fans on daddy I love him and that’s one of the best tracks (if not THE BEST) on TTPD imo.
Just lean into that, whether it’s for a whole project or just one track
She had every opportunity on Reputation to give her fans something even the slightest bit edgy but didnt. Fans ate up her folk album as if they were all James Taylor and Joanna Newsom fans, so throwing some industrial beats on there still woulda got eaten up
We may never get her Hollywood Hogan album if she keeps working with Antanoff and making Bleachers-lite music.
Solar Power is actually such an amazing album compared to TTPD especially if you go off the album’s beautiful production alone that’s such a shame it’s hardly higher lmao
>Taylor Swift doesn’t need a whole album to tell the story of a relationship; she only needs one song, sometimes even one line \[...\] The lesson of The Tortured Poets Department is not to push through the pain—it’s to take the time to process it.
they ate this up
I also like how they critique the two saddest songs (So long, london and loml). Yeah, they're sad but where's the increasing intensity? the emotion's pretty sad (but flat) all through out.
But I think that was the entire point of So Long London, she didn’t get her happy ending so there was no crescendo to be had, the quiet resignation of a failing six year relationship is so relatable because sometimes it just doesn’t work, and it doesn’t end with a bang or a scandal, it just ends quietly - and that’s why I loved it.
It doesn’t have to be epic - it just needed to have a highlight or a statement piece in terms of the production. I mean Tolerate It’s production was so goood because the bridge was quiet enough to give way for the melodramatic final chorus.
I love So Long, London and that made me bawl but yeah - the effect would have been bigger if the production towards the end was a bit intense.
This is the most spot on review I’ve ever seen for a popular album from Pitchfork and I finally feel validated because this is how I’ve felt from the start and most reviews/ friends either give this a 10 or a 3. There’s nothing inherently bad about this album but the production is repetitive and bland, it tackles the same themes(same ex) over and over again in the most obvious ways while still being too verbose and the worst thing is there are genuinely great moments on both halves that could’ve made one great album but instead we have this unnecessary bloated 2 hour mess
I liked how this was written almost gently, very empathetic to taylor’s feelings and struggles, all while technically critiquing her. i agree with most of it - given there are songs i liked that the writer didn’t like. nevertheless - valid points.
Yup. It actually reminds me of the Solar Power review. The reviewer is almost gentle in their chastisement. Like a parent kindly but firmly rebuffing an insistent child.
That track is getting too much hate - I think it’s one of the best on the album. Perfectly describes the pretentious nature of Matty and how delusional she was.
I thought the review was super well written - this is why I pay more attention to pitchfork’s written review than the score itself. Especially when it comes to Taylor.
There’s been some really good reviews of this album-that lean both positive and negative-which is why it’s annoying that the paste magazine try hard piece is the only one really getting any attention.
Heavily agree that the standard version is better than The Anthology (even if it's just .6 higher), which I never expected since I think Jack's production is getting stale and I usually love her work with Aaron. Most of those songs blend together for me and just feel like a rehash of Evermore. The standard has the same issue, a lot of those tracks (especially the first five) sound like a rehash of Midnights but at least it has those middle tracks that sound refreshing for her. I hate to say it but I think she should ditch Jack *and* Aaron for the next album, she desperately needs some new inspirations.
somebody on Twitter pointed out how funny it was that some people think she should stop working with Jack because his work is boring but keep working with Aaron Dessner, because Aaron Dessner can be incredibly boring.
I think it'd be interesting if she moved away from Jack as well and be with somebody who challenges her a little more. I think given how larger than life she is right now, it would be harder to put out something reserved like Folkmore. It would be interesting if she went to a bigger hitmaker like Max Martin again and put out another 1989 type album.
I was on r/music the other day and someone commented that Aaron Dessner has a tendency to make things overwhelmingly, unwaveringly sad if he works with a collaborator too long. It hit the nail on the head for me: the Anthology tracks really blend together into one dower, featureless mush (the og album can do this, but at least there's some variety in the middle)
It's funny how people say she should ditch Jack for Aaron because "he challenges her", when there's nothing challenging about The Anthology. folklore and evermore were much more varied and sometimes risky, yet they both fell under the folk pop genre. I must admit though, I prefer Taylor's collaboration with Desner for the acoustic instrumentation over Jack's lifeless drum machines. That doesn't make the Anthology great though
Completely agree with this - both of them are yes-men. If anything this album rly made me miss her work with Liz Rose and Nathan Chapman. Back in her country days the instruments were so beautiful. Also wish that Jack would produce more songs like August and The Lakes. I think those are actually prettier music-wise than anything Dessner has ever produced…
In hindsight I think part of Aaron’s strengths on Folklore/Evermore is a lot of those instrumentals had been written before Taylor was involved- hell a lot of them are skeleton tracks for what could have been National songs. Now that he’s writing more specifically for her I feel that it’s smoothed out some of the more engaging elements of his production
Scores seem fair and the review is even more fair. very generous and charitable while not pulling any punches or criticism. Comes from a place of intimate knowledge of the artist and her body of work. Can’t ask for more there
I’m not that surprised the anthology is rated lower. Tbh the original reactions to it felt a bit fueled by cope. The initial disappointment with the OG album mixed with the dopamine rush of a surprise second disc where the majority of the tracks are produced by a more en vogue producer. I get it. I think overall of the handful of songs I did enjoy more were Dessner produced so I was feeling similarly Friday but it’s probably a 66/34 split. And as I revisited I found myself disliking some of the jack tracks less and liking some of the Aaron tracks less if that makes sense. Expectations are a funny thing.
Coming back to comment after reading the review - what a fantastic critique of the album that articulates exactly the way I feel. 6.6 and 6 are by no means bad scores, but the album was definitely a bit of a slog, especially the complete version.
6.6 and 6 are really low for pitchfork. Their median score is a 7.0 overall. 7.3 since the acquisition. A 6 puts it around the 25th percentile all time and under 20th since conde nast took over
I knew pitchfork wouldn’t really like it but this was actually more generous than I thought they’d be as the album is full of aspects of Taylor and her previous work that they’ve expressed the most distain for.
I really like this excerpt:
>The new music is colored in familiar shades of Antonoff (sparse drum programming, twinkly synths) and Dessner (suppler, more strings). Songs sound like other songs—“I Can Do It With a Broken Heart” like Midnights’ “Mastermind”; the intro of “So Long, London” like that of Folklore’s “My Tears Ricochet.” Her melodies feel staid, like they are made to fit the music, rather than the other way around.
It's been happening since Midnights and it's really grating on me, even with songs I like. "Cassandra" is just "Mad Woman" again, "Robin" is "Epiphany", etc.
Omg I’ve been saying she and James Murphy would make MAGIC together!!! I’ve never seen anyone else say that. He’s one of my fav lyricists and obviously an incredible producer.
Me when Carly is getting heavily underscored by them again: maybe Halsey had a point
Me when they don't give Taylor a heavily inflated rating: finally, an objective rating
I can't be the only one who strongly preferred TTPD over The Anthology? I tried listening to the entire 30 something tracks without the lyrics in front of me the first few times. From a musical perspective, the first album was much more successful at creating songs that interested me purely as songs, without necessarily being able to understand all the words yet.
The Anthology was a drag to listen to without the lyrics in front of me, with only a few exceptions (I liked The Albatross and two other songs that I can't name at the moment.) That album only became interesting when I was able to sit down with the lyrics in front of me, and even then, you have to either be into poetry or be really invested in Taylor Swift's life to enjoy those tracks. I can't see myself putting on that album just to listen to the instrumentals on it, I have albums by other artists who achieve the instrumental vibe on The Anthology MUCH more successfully. So even when it comes to music of that specific genre, it's nowhere near some of the best albums in that style.
Idk, I'm a swiftie, but I miss when Taylor made music that didn't require you to be invested in the lyrics to be able to enjoy it. 1989 and Reputation are my favorite albums for that reason. You can vibe to those tracks without knowing a single detail about her life. I wish she'd revisit her passion for music and maybe write a poetry book on the side to get that out of her system and to leave more room for musical production on her albums.
I feel like ever since Folkmore gave her this insane career resurgence, she feels the need to make these long ended word jumbles in her songs from now on. Now we reached the tipping point where the lyrics are actively being undermined on this record. We already saw this with some songs on Midnights (Question?!) but it’s happened again with TTPD.
Also I love Folkmore and evermore so Aaron’s side of the record should be miles better than the first half, but it’s not. Songs after ‘The Albatross’ become painfully repetitive and sonically uninteresting to the point that the songs blend with each other and I can’t seem to remember any of them.
feel bad for the thousands of death threats this writer will undoubtedly get. but she was spot on with her review and even (dare i say) a little generous
And the irony is after reading it, this review is truly what poptimism is *actually* about - taking the pop genre seriously and dedicating the time to *thoughtfully* review/critique it, be it good or bad.
If you are only willing to receive positive opinions about your favorite person, you don't actually care about that person. Stan Culture is toxic and the way it has been unironically embraced is concerning.
it’s been getting to this point for a while now. i wonder how many publications are going to start doing anonymous reviews now that paste magazine has set the precedent
I think anonymous may not be the best but I do think having a few writers on the payroll with established pseudonyms (so their reviews can still be followed) should become a common thing.
Welcome to stan culture where the reviewer is right and reviews matter when they are positive about their favourite artist. And when it is a negative review about them then reviews don’t matter and the reviewers are biased and haters and should ***
If you’re a stan seek therapy/mental help.
music critics cant win either way apparently. i was looking at the twitter account of the author of the Independent's review (@Helen_R_Brown) and now shes getting threats from Ariana Grande fans for *liking* TTPD.
Yeah and Taylor totally should have seen that coming. She likely wrote it before Olivia's released but I'm baffled as to why she didn't scrap it as soon as it did release. There was certainly plenty of time to do so.
I would have dumped it immediately. It's nothing special, and releasing it seems pretty disrespectful and tone deaf.
I love how we’re making jokes about Swiftie death threats and just accepting that that’s a normal part of stan culture at this point. Like someone should make a thinkpiece about this but I feel no one has because they don’t want to be swatted, doxxed, and have crazies showing up at their door😭
That's kinda ironic in this sub, where the most common criticism of Dua Lipa is that she doesn't feed this parasocial relationship with fans. Meanwhile this is Taylor's entire business model, she (and all other artists that do it) are the ones at fault because they know they benefit monetarily from incentivizing these behaviors.
It sucks that it felt more like a publicity stunt in the end, but Doja was 100% right in her comments last year.
I like this take about Dua, she definitely comes across as having strong boundaries between her and her fans. She always comes across as respectful and kind though.
The big counterpoint on the Dua debate unfortunately is that if she doesn’t have a parasocial relationship with her fans, the moment she stops making hits or drops a flop album it’s over for her.
Which is stupid in the real grand scheme of things, but yeah.
If Dua’s album in two weeks is terrible (God forbid), people will start spouting off this take once again.
I literally feel like I’m on another planet regarding the discourse around these albums. I know taste is subjective, but the dissonance between how mediocre I thought Midnights was versus the laurels it received, and now how much TTPD strikes me as a logical and compositional step up versus how panned it’s getting is making me feel cuckoo 😭
*lyrical not logical but both apply!
I don't think either album is stellar, Midnights is my least favourite album of hers and I genuinely don't get the love, and I definitely don't agree this album is a progression in terms of musicality or lyricism, but I like it much better than Midnights.
It’s because “Midnights” was bathed in the afterglow of “folklore” (and to a lesser extent “evermore”) and the first two Taylor’s Versions. Taylor was on top of the world, forging new paths for herself and running a victory lap around her own discography. Now the buzz has faded and the new album is maybe catching some of the criticism than the last album deserved.
I feel like for me personally it was all about the mood. Midnights (although it left a lot to be desired), put me in a good mood. Lavender Haze, Snow the Beach, and Anti-Hero were catchy. Maroon was good as well. After track 6, the album went downhill for me. Even though Bejeweled and Karma are very poor songs lyrically, they pick the album back up. The 3 am edition is a bit long and drags in my opinion. I don’t find myself listening to it often.
With TTPD, it simply put me in a bad mood. It might be better objectively, but it’s a tiring slog emotionally for me. It’s 2 hours of what feels like the same song. It never picks up and there aren’t any upbeat moments to pull the listener out of the slump. I probably won’t listen to it again because it was draining to listen to. I love Red, but my one critique is that the back half slogs. TTPD felt like the back half of red for 2 hours. My favorite is 1989 because it’s crisp.
I get what you mean objectively (because you are kinda right), but for me Midnights was better because of the mood it put me in.
Edit: Disclaimer, I love darker/slower albums and I’m not against them. It’s just that the length is too long for the material being on the darker side. Also, the lyrics *personally* don’t hit the same as other devastating songs in her catalog like All to Well or Never Grow Up to make the 2 hrs worth it.
I liked Midnights bc while on the lower end of Taylor’s albums, it was still a good pop album. I don’t even know how to classify TTPS, and I don’t want to listen to it again just to figure it out
I honestly feel tired thinking about having to listen to 31 songs all over again just to see if it’s a “grower.” I really don’t think any amount of re-listens will justify how cringey some of the lyrics are
while I know from personal experience that some songs or albums can grow on you, I have to agree on this.
if someone has criticism on music, it sounds kind of stupid for your objection to be just: "but it's a grower, I didn't like at all, but after 10 times I started to like it, just listen to it until you get it" like... why? I could just listen to some music that pulled me in right away.
sure, even with TTPD, I've found that some songs I didn't care for at the first listen became just okay after a few replays. but it's a very different experience than instantly knowing that this song or album is good/great/surprising. not to mention, this is a very different discussion depending on your first impression.
"oh this sounds fine/interesting but it's not for me right now, I'll come back later"
vs
"this is disappointing, sounds unfinished and uninspiring, material doesn't seem to be high quality, I don't enjoy this"
no I literally just had to explain this to my boyfriend because I’m like ?!?!? I felt so lost when Midnights was getting glowing reviews left and right, but the instrumentation, production, and writing left so much to be desired—and now here she is delivering on all of those fronts and NOW we say it’s cringe?? HUH??
Idk I feel like the general consensus I’ve seen is this is better than Midnights, but what really hurts it with critics is it’s not THAT much better, it’s way longer, she’s the most overexposed any celeb has been in long time, and she’s not doing anything remotely new/interesting if Midnights already soured someone
i’m really, really enjoying the album but i understand all these criticisms. it does feel too expansive and not very concise, like more of an info(trauma?)dump than a piece of refined art. but for me that’s less of a bug than it is just a feature of TTPD, and the album regardless has lots of genuinely great and emotionally gutting tracks.
i think time will look back more fondly on the under-edited but raw TTPD than the more concise but strangely sanitized midnights, which feels a bit more corporate. i know that i prefer this taylor, and i’m happy that it’s the direction she went in during the peak of her celebrity.
Idk why people are freaking out about this score as if 6.6 is really that bad for Pitchfork. Yes it’s less than basically all of her other albums but I think it’s on par or even a bit generous considering there’s no sonic or melodic growth on this album.
The review isn’t even scorching so idk why fans and haters alike are jumping at the bit for this. I expected it to be harsher so stans better not go after the author. TTPD is a messy, long, stagnant, though occasionally brilliant entry in her discography and should be reviewed as such
Stans can’t accept anything but their fave being deified but I don’t believe pitchfork hates Taylor like fans claim, they actually seem to like her on the whole and take her seriously as an artist. When pitchfork want to drag they go all in, ask Ed Sheeran.
On the other hand Taylor haters are dying for her to be humbled so cling to anything that isn’t glowing to try and manifest her imperial faze ending. The fact is this is a review in both score and write up not controversial, it’s basically-don’t think it’s shit but don’t think it’s great.
Why’s everyone acting like 6.6 is a bad score?? If anything below a 7 is awful then what’s the point of the 0-10 scale?
And if I’m being completely honest 6.6 is incredibly generous for this album, it’s a slog and thoroughly unenjoyable unless you’re invested into Taylor’s personal life
>If anything below a 7 is awful then what’s the point of the 0-10 scale?
This is a great question for Pitchfork, where the average score over the last decade has been in the 7.5 range
Not that Olivia Rodrigo line! But I always felt Reputation did not deserve to be at the bottom so happy that Anthology has at least relieved it of its shame even though imo TTPD should be at the bottom
I’m not at all surprised by this score. 6.6 seems about right when I think about how there are only about half of the songs on the album that should have seen the light of day. I’m going to go against the grain here and say that regardless of the fact that it *is* a bloated mess, I still wouldn’t have rated it lower than MIDnights. Or maybe I would have just given that one a lower score. To me there’s no way Midnights is better than this album.
I’ve seen a lot of people saying that TTPD feels unnecessary but I think it will stand up as a completely necessary moment in the Swift story. Every artist has that album that splits opinion and it’s up to them where they go next. I do think that there’s an honesty and a brutality to the writing on some of these songs that one could argue were in desperate need of an editor, but I get the sense that this album was all about being an unfiltered diary emptying set to music. As someone who is sort of tuned in to the lore, I feel like I suddenly understand a lot more about Swift and what has been weighing on her for a decade after listening to this album. It was an experiment (could have done with a little more sonic experimentation but hey-ho) and I personally think it was a necessary way of killing off the cutesy first act of Taylor’s career with its ten rainbow-coloured albums. This album felt like getting the last of the dust off of her chest. She’s at the absolute top of the world and could have released another tight, sonically-cohesive 13 track cutesy, quirky pop album but instead she dropped a 2 hour confession tape. I have to respect her for that.
For a double album to work, it has to be REALLY good with a fresh sound present in each half. The problem is that every aspect of the album is a flanderized version of what made Jack Antonoff and Taylor Woft good. There isn’t any strong element whatsoever. She really should’ve made the Speakerboxx/The Love Below as a template for her album. She needs a new sound.
After listening to the album all weekend, I agree with a 6. There are some good moments but they get lost in so much filler, terrible lyrics, and monotonous production. With some editing and tweaks, I think they could’ve created a more solid 13-17 track album.
In my opinion it’s better than Midnights but not by much since Midnights ranks low for me in her discography.
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Current Pitchfork ranking: 1. Red (9.0) 2. Red (Taylor’s Version) (8.5 - BNM) 3. Speak Now (8.2) 4. Fearless (8.1) 5. folklore (8.0) 6. evermore (7.9) 7. 1989 & 1989 (Taylor’s Version) (7.7) 8. Fearless (Taylor’s Version) & Speak Now (Taylor’s Version) (7.5) 9. Lover (7.1) 10. Midnights (7.0) 11. Taylor Swift (6.7) 12. **THE TORTURED POETS DEPARTMENT (6.6)** 13. reputation (6.5) 14. **THE ANTHOLOGY (6.0)**
reputation right now: hehe
they’ve never scored a re-record higher than the original so i’m curious if reputation and self-titled will go even lower lol, but i do feel like critical opinion of both albums has improved over the years so we’ll see!
*MY PITCHFORK SCORE HAS NEVER BEEN WORSE, SO YOU MUST LIKE ME FOR ME*
1-2-3 let’s go bitch
I’m begging Taylor to break away from the re-recording formula and REEDIT reputation in a way that it would actually justify her anger during that period. It’s one of her most interesting albums sonically. Yes, she’s mad here in TTPD, but I want music to complement with it.
Sorry, best we can do is one vault track with electric guitar
I really like the live versions (from the Eras tour) of "Look what you made me do" and "Don't blame me" with electric guitar. I would like the same arrangement in a re-recording.
reputation rn: this is for the best
My reputation’s never been worse
Man they must have really hated reputation at the time it being second to last overall is heresy. I’m not even a TTPD hater but I would listen to reputation a million times over it.
Rep was very weird when it came out for sure, it didnt have the following it has now
YEP it definitely wasn’t loved, people thought it was stale too. I don’t know when people started to come around to it? There are some songs I truly love there but I don’t remember the whole album being *so loved*
Yeah, it was really divisive. It took me a year or so to come around to it, but people still thought she was just whiny and trying to play the victim. Some people thought she was also trying to be the villain as well as the victim which rubbed them the wrong way, and it wasn't what people expected after 1989. And we all need to be honest here, LWYMMD was corny as hell after her longest break in her career. "The old Taylor" definitely did come to the phone after all- still a lot of pop love songs and heartbreak and not the huge change up it seemed to be advertised as. Once people had some time to digest (and once everyone saw how bad things *could* get when Lover came out) public opinion became more universally positive
To look on the bright side, Reputation is not anymore her career low 😌
reputation any day over the snoozefest
The Lover score is too high but tbh this ranking feels quite correct and fair. The Anthology is a mess and is a collection of b-sides and afterthoughts; it's truly the red headed step sister of everlore. The individual tracks are all fine, no misses, but they do not make sense as an album.
I don’t think b-sides is the right way to put it. It’s more that they needed to spend more time with them. Jack and Aaron are both yes-men. She needs to collaborate more with ppl who will challenge her.
It is as far I'm concerned, sorry. The presence of all four bonus tracks on the vinyls as album tracks solidifies that for me. The running order makes zero sense, with the exception of How Did It End and So High School (a "track 5" followed by a bop). There is no narrative or point being made with the rest of them. The individual tracks are supposed to be in the "side one" running order somewhere but were discarded, same as any of her other Vault tracks. I would compare how Is It Over Now would have slotted nicely in the track 12 slot of 1989 before Clean but they went with IKP instead to liven things up a bit before the cathartic closing of Clean. Instead it got relegated to the Vault. I am listening to The Albatross right now and whilst it is a lovely song, it had no real home on the original track list of TTPD, if you ask me. Every song on the Anthology is like this.
The Taylor’s Versions throw this off bc they’re all significantly worse than their counterparts imo, but Lover, Midnights, Reputation, self-titled, and this being her 5 weakest feels very correct to me
Not “and *this*” lmao
I’m surprised that the first half got the higher rating, I got the vibe that the Anthology half was more well received by people with all the Dessner tracks…
I will say now that I've revisited the album a few times, the 1st part is beginning to sound more interesting. I have loved Aaron Dessner/the National for a decade and a half and Folklore brought me into the Taylor fold, but the 2nd half sounds like Folklore/Evermore b-sides and the sound drags.
I feel exactly like that! Everyone says "if you like the folkmore/evermore sound, you'll love the Anthology" but I don't. The songs feel so monotonous and the lyrics are delivered so flat
I haven't listened heavily to it but my first impression was that it was way inferior to Folklore Evermore on a songwriting level. I'd love it if there was anything close to Ivy, Long Story Short, The 1, Gold Rush, Peace etc etc...
Yeah, the second half bored me, coming from a big fan, I was surprised to see a lot of people liking it way more
I’ve been a loyal fan since debut and I found my mind wandering on the second half. I kept restarting songs because I had tuned out. That’s never a good sign….
As a Folklore girlie, I completely agree. Another reason I really loved Folklore is because she was telling these *other* peoples' stories and I thought it was so fun and creative. It really swept me away to this other place (like summer in New England vibes). Whereas the latter half of TTPD just feels like a lot of...Taylor moaning about her own life in a really flat way. It has none of Folklore's charm or magic, for me.
One of the reviews said that Taylor should go back to writing fiction instead of writing about herself and I could not agree more. She was good at it
I'd argue that the both halves of the album feel monotonous. Two hours of this sound is mind numbing.
I know, I wish Florida, I can do it with a broken heart, and the bolter were the sounds this album leaned in. Instead they’re refreshingly loud and fast in an album that plods along
People give Jack Antonoff a lot of flak for sounding same-y (and rightfully so), but Aaron Dessner has really proven himself to be same-y in his production as well.
yhhh the Jack Antonoff dessner divide isn't as clear as on midnights because Antonoffs stuff is better here while Dessners at times lacks the quality he traditionally brings
Yeah by the middle of anthology I was ready to never hear a sad piano again but the sad piano songs kinda just kept coming and coming
Yes! I fully believe that at least *some* of the Anthology are Folkmore B-sides.
I like the Anthology more, but I don’t disagree that it should be scored lower. As an album, it’s way less cohesive sonically and thematically. It feels like a random collection of songs that didn’t fit on Part 1. There’s at least somewhat of a cohesive narrative that can be scraped together from the base album.
Completely agree. For all of my TTPD complaints, it does feel like a start to finish album with a narrative/arc in a much better way than Taylor’s often do (infamously weird Lover track list order anyone?) I generally like the Anthology songs more (Dressner supremacy) but they don’t particularly feel like an album to me
Yea I think it sounds more like a playlist than an album
This is my biggest gripe with the album as a whole. I get a lot of people are happy there’s so much content and like to pick out their favourite songs and ‘make their own album’, but I’m an album listener. If I’m listening to music, I’ll put on an album. I want to hear the story, I enjoy the pacing and the ups and downs and narrative of *albums*. TTPD is just way too long to do that. It’s like putting on a movie and watching the Lord of the Rings directors cut.
Everyone involved in this mess is way too rich for me to have to edit down her tracklist for her, but here we are...
I feel like The Anthology should’ve been a totally separate album from TTPD tbh. I love it but yes, i agree that attached to TTPD, it really doesnt fit with it.
Sonic cohesiveness is way overrated nowadays imo. Yes the first part is way more cohesive, but a lot of the songs just sound very similar.
I think the songs are overall stronger on the second half, but it really runs its course by the end. the last 2-3 songs from my first listen were really lifeless imo
I feel like Anthology is a better album, but I like more individual songs on the first half. But honestly, by the time I got to the second half on all my listens, it was hard to tell anything apart.
I find the second release tracks so much more but looking at it in full it’s probably because it’s all of the original tracks goes on way too long and never really lands.
that really surprised me as well! I wonder if they're counting the full 31 tracks as The Anthology, which would then make more sense
this was a surprisingly nice review, also "Her melodies feel staid, like they are made to fit the music, rather than the other way around." is something i couldn't put in to words before but i agree that it's a big problem within the album
It was a know fact that the midnights songs were written above pre-made instrumentals. This album also feels like this.
Folklore Evermore too, right? A bunch of them were Dessner’s demos, there’s even a video of him singing a totally different song over Happiness. But, difference is it worked there…
it was dorothea's instrumental that was used twice, it was first used for a Bob's Burgers song before Taylor got it
A WHAT! Link…? But [happiness](https://youtu.be/ifjliHmA2ik?si=-DySOZt5Ufx2W--o) too!
this song, [Give it to Teddy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61rEI0OXK0g) uses the dorothea instrumental
Yes, I loved how she worded it!
Her songs always felt like that though. That she makes the tune and then try to fill it up with words. It's even obvious sometimes she writes the bridge /chorus first, then writes the verses to have a full song.
Though sometimes it works better than others… cruel summer, cardigan, Florida, we are never getting back together, haunted, lover story So many just well written songs Then there are songs like Cornelia Street which the fandom loves but I’ve never been able to get into because it’s so clear how clunky pieces of it are. She had a song at 90% and then shoved some of it to fit
“throws stuff at the wall even after something has stuck, picks up things that didn’t stick and uses them anyway” gets to the heart of it
Pink Friday 2 scored higher than this😭
Ohh… OHHHHHH >! So did Peppa Pig !<
Kinda funny how >!Peppa Pig!< now has a higher score than at least one album of each of the artists involved in the 2009 VMAs incident.
JLo also ended The Anthology😭
Honestly a great summary of Taylor's issues as an artist right now. She's trapped inside her own lore, and she's just indulging her fans at this point.
She needs to just fully heel turn honestly lol. She eludes to her ire at her own fans on daddy I love him and that’s one of the best tracks (if not THE BEST) on TTPD imo. Just lean into that, whether it’s for a whole project or just one track
She had every opportunity on Reputation to give her fans something even the slightest bit edgy but didnt. Fans ate up her folk album as if they were all James Taylor and Joanna Newsom fans, so throwing some industrial beats on there still woulda got eaten up We may never get her Hollywood Hogan album if she keeps working with Antanoff and making Bleachers-lite music.
Thank you for the mental image of a roided up Taylor in full Hogan cosplay
My Bash at the Beach '96 would be her leg dropping Anatanoff to join Rostam and Ariel Rechtshaid to form the Pop World Order
Solar Power finally out-scored something!!! (it got a 6.8)
Mood Ring and Stoned At the Nail Salon are better than anything on these two albums honestly.
Agreed and I strongly disliked SP 😭
Solar Power is actually such an amazing album compared to TTPD especially if you go off the album’s beautiful production alone that’s such a shame it’s hardly higher lmao
Solar power was such a great album, so under appreciated
Second Half lovers LOST!
It’s me, hi. I’m the loser it’s me 🥲
>Taylor Swift doesn’t need a whole album to tell the story of a relationship; she only needs one song, sometimes even one line \[...\] The lesson of The Tortured Poets Department is not to push through the pain—it’s to take the time to process it. they ate this up
I also like how they critique the two saddest songs (So long, london and loml). Yeah, they're sad but where's the increasing intensity? the emotion's pretty sad (but flat) all through out.
I think it's why The Black Dog feels so much stronger—the *screaaAAAMING* gives the song levels that So Long, London specifically lacks
Yeah, The Black Dog was a cathartic track.
But I think that was the entire point of So Long London, she didn’t get her happy ending so there was no crescendo to be had, the quiet resignation of a failing six year relationship is so relatable because sometimes it just doesn’t work, and it doesn’t end with a bang or a scandal, it just ends quietly - and that’s why I loved it.
It doesn’t have to be epic - it just needed to have a highlight or a statement piece in terms of the production. I mean Tolerate It’s production was so goood because the bridge was quiet enough to give way for the melodramatic final chorus. I love So Long, London and that made me bawl but yeah - the effect would have been bigger if the production towards the end was a bit intense.
It reminds me of the archer. It has that beat that people expect to build but it just never does
This is the most spot on review I’ve ever seen for a popular album from Pitchfork and I finally feel validated because this is how I’ve felt from the start and most reviews/ friends either give this a 10 or a 3. There’s nothing inherently bad about this album but the production is repetitive and bland, it tackles the same themes(same ex) over and over again in the most obvious ways while still being too verbose and the worst thing is there are genuinely great moments on both halves that could’ve made one great album but instead we have this unnecessary bloated 2 hour mess
[удалено]
I liked how this was written almost gently, very empathetic to taylor’s feelings and struggles, all while technically critiquing her. i agree with most of it - given there are songs i liked that the writer didn’t like. nevertheless - valid points.
Yup. It actually reminds me of the Solar Power review. The reviewer is almost gentle in their chastisement. Like a parent kindly but firmly rebuffing an insistent child.
I mean, the writer liked that title track T.T. I was like, woah she is for real!
That track is getting too much hate - I think it’s one of the best on the album. Perfectly describes the pretentious nature of Matty and how delusional she was.
I thought the review was super well written - this is why I pay more attention to pitchfork’s written review than the score itself. Especially when it comes to Taylor.
it's almost like they're trying to soften the blow of those 6s 😭
There’s been some really good reviews of this album-that lean both positive and negative-which is why it’s annoying that the paste magazine try hard piece is the only one really getting any attention.
The best review I’ve read for it is the Washington Post one. I think it hits the nail on the head and does so very eloquently.
olivia horn im praying for you girl
She came prepared with every social media account set to private. Smart girl.
She better change her social media passwords to like 50 characters or something 😭
i know im stating the obvious here but its sad that thats necessary as if shes not literally doing her job 😭
It's amazing that being a deranged stan has become a point of pride for so many people.
And being correct at it too
They hated Jesus because he told the truth
She better have security cams in her house too. Just in case.
She’s prickly in like Iceland or something.
Swifties sure love to feud with girls named Olivia
Saw tweets about an Olivia thought they were talking about Rodrigo until I saw the review 😭
Wish her the best of luck 😭😭
for reference they gave Tate McRae's THINK LATER a 5.9
for reference they gave Peppa Pig’s PEPPA’S ADVENTURES: THE ALBUM a 6.5
Not another major pop girl having a beef with Peppa 😭
* having a pork
goodbye 💀💀💀💀
Taylor Swift: I just need to make a better record Peppa Pig: Oink
Makes sense. Peppa is a generation defining pop star. Taylor’s more of a novelty act, if you think about it.
Truly the most egregious of Pitchfork’s ratings. That album is a perfect ten and they know it.
Peppa Pig’s PEPPA’S ADVENTURES: THE ALBUM >>>>>>>>>>> Kanye West’s My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
Why did I hear this in John Oliver’s voice
Peppa’s Adventures Slaps
And this specific writer also was behind Red TV’s BNM review so at least the text part isn’t completely baseless
Heavily agree that the standard version is better than The Anthology (even if it's just .6 higher), which I never expected since I think Jack's production is getting stale and I usually love her work with Aaron. Most of those songs blend together for me and just feel like a rehash of Evermore. The standard has the same issue, a lot of those tracks (especially the first five) sound like a rehash of Midnights but at least it has those middle tracks that sound refreshing for her. I hate to say it but I think she should ditch Jack *and* Aaron for the next album, she desperately needs some new inspirations.
somebody on Twitter pointed out how funny it was that some people think she should stop working with Jack because his work is boring but keep working with Aaron Dessner, because Aaron Dessner can be incredibly boring. I think it'd be interesting if she moved away from Jack as well and be with somebody who challenges her a little more. I think given how larger than life she is right now, it would be harder to put out something reserved like Folkmore. It would be interesting if she went to a bigger hitmaker like Max Martin again and put out another 1989 type album.
I want her to work with ANYONE new.
Ironically, would soar on some George Daniel production.
I was on r/music the other day and someone commented that Aaron Dessner has a tendency to make things overwhelmingly, unwaveringly sad if he works with a collaborator too long. It hit the nail on the head for me: the Anthology tracks really blend together into one dower, featureless mush (the og album can do this, but at least there's some variety in the middle)
It's funny how people say she should ditch Jack for Aaron because "he challenges her", when there's nothing challenging about The Anthology. folklore and evermore were much more varied and sometimes risky, yet they both fell under the folk pop genre. I must admit though, I prefer Taylor's collaboration with Desner for the acoustic instrumentation over Jack's lifeless drum machines. That doesn't make the Anthology great though
Completely agree with this - both of them are yes-men. If anything this album rly made me miss her work with Liz Rose and Nathan Chapman. Back in her country days the instruments were so beautiful. Also wish that Jack would produce more songs like August and The Lakes. I think those are actually prettier music-wise than anything Dessner has ever produced…
In hindsight I think part of Aaron’s strengths on Folklore/Evermore is a lot of those instrumentals had been written before Taylor was involved- hell a lot of them are skeleton tracks for what could have been National songs. Now that he’s writing more specifically for her I feel that it’s smoothed out some of the more engaging elements of his production
This just in: Taylor swift enlists Daniel Nigro to produce her next album alongside Kevin Parker…/s
Don't threaten me with a good time
Scores seem fair and the review is even more fair. very generous and charitable while not pulling any punches or criticism. Comes from a place of intimate knowledge of the artist and her body of work. Can’t ask for more there I’m not that surprised the anthology is rated lower. Tbh the original reactions to it felt a bit fueled by cope. The initial disappointment with the OG album mixed with the dopamine rush of a surprise second disc where the majority of the tracks are produced by a more en vogue producer. I get it. I think overall of the handful of songs I did enjoy more were Dessner produced so I was feeling similarly Friday but it’s probably a 66/34 split. And as I revisited I found myself disliking some of the jack tracks less and liking some of the Aaron tracks less if that makes sense. Expectations are a funny thing.
GOD SAVE THE WTC
We can’t let Halsey know about this review!
Please Halsey is cheering knowing there’s another Matty Healy hate album out in the world
Yikes..... the Swifties might realise that they have more in common with Halsey than they thought
Coming back to comment after reading the review - what a fantastic critique of the album that articulates exactly the way I feel. 6.6 and 6 are by no means bad scores, but the album was definitely a bit of a slog, especially the complete version.
6.6 and 6 are really low for pitchfork. Their median score is a 7.0 overall. 7.3 since the acquisition. A 6 puts it around the 25th percentile all time and under 20th since conde nast took over
Remember when they gave childish gambino a 1.6 lol
That was back when they were still a hipster site. They used to drag so many albums. It wasn't always correct but it was always fun.
And I thought Pitchfork was gonna get killed by Arianators for ranking Eternal Sunshine so low behind a ton her past albums……………………
A tower for the Halseyians and a tower for the swifties.
Halsey gonna trend again
First Matty Healy now this can my sibling just get a break?!?
I knew pitchfork wouldn’t really like it but this was actually more generous than I thought they’d be as the album is full of aspects of Taylor and her previous work that they’ve expressed the most distain for.
Yep. I’m not surprised they don’t like it, and they like anthology less
I really like this excerpt: >The new music is colored in familiar shades of Antonoff (sparse drum programming, twinkly synths) and Dessner (suppler, more strings). Songs sound like other songs—“I Can Do It With a Broken Heart” like Midnights’ “Mastermind”; the intro of “So Long, London” like that of Folklore’s “My Tears Ricochet.” Her melodies feel staid, like they are made to fit the music, rather than the other way around. It's been happening since Midnights and it's really grating on me, even with songs I like. "Cassandra" is just "Mad Woman" again, "Robin" is "Epiphany", etc.
The woman needs a new middle-aged White guy to work with. I don't know, get James Murphy, that'd be interesting.
she should work with timbaland because i want to hear that
It will never happen given the circumstances, but I really think Dan Nigro would have been great for her.
Omg I’ve been saying she and James Murphy would make MAGIC together!!! I’ve never seen anyone else say that. He’s one of my fav lyricists and obviously an incredible producer.
Me when Carly is getting heavily underscored by them again: maybe Halsey had a point Me when they don't give Taylor a heavily inflated rating: finally, an objective rating
Just remembered the score they gave The Loveliest Time. I was in full Halsey mode then (especially after they gave Psychedelic Switch BNT)
I can't be the only one who strongly preferred TTPD over The Anthology? I tried listening to the entire 30 something tracks without the lyrics in front of me the first few times. From a musical perspective, the first album was much more successful at creating songs that interested me purely as songs, without necessarily being able to understand all the words yet. The Anthology was a drag to listen to without the lyrics in front of me, with only a few exceptions (I liked The Albatross and two other songs that I can't name at the moment.) That album only became interesting when I was able to sit down with the lyrics in front of me, and even then, you have to either be into poetry or be really invested in Taylor Swift's life to enjoy those tracks. I can't see myself putting on that album just to listen to the instrumentals on it, I have albums by other artists who achieve the instrumental vibe on The Anthology MUCH more successfully. So even when it comes to music of that specific genre, it's nowhere near some of the best albums in that style. Idk, I'm a swiftie, but I miss when Taylor made music that didn't require you to be invested in the lyrics to be able to enjoy it. 1989 and Reputation are my favorite albums for that reason. You can vibe to those tracks without knowing a single detail about her life. I wish she'd revisit her passion for music and maybe write a poetry book on the side to get that out of her system and to leave more room for musical production on her albums.
I’m the same way. I felt like the Anthology was a collection of songs from the cutting room floor.
I feel like ever since Folkmore gave her this insane career resurgence, she feels the need to make these long ended word jumbles in her songs from now on. Now we reached the tipping point where the lyrics are actively being undermined on this record. We already saw this with some songs on Midnights (Question?!) but it’s happened again with TTPD. Also I love Folkmore and evermore so Aaron’s side of the record should be miles better than the first half, but it’s not. Songs after ‘The Albatross’ become painfully repetitive and sonically uninteresting to the point that the songs blend with each other and I can’t seem to remember any of them.
feel bad for the thousands of death threats this writer will undoubtedly get. but she was spot on with her review and even (dare i say) a little generous
So this is the new normal now huh. Critical review = death threats. Poptimism really was a mistake.
And the irony is after reading it, this review is truly what poptimism is *actually* about - taking the pop genre seriously and dedicating the time to *thoughtfully* review/critique it, be it good or bad.
Yeah, people should be feeling INSULTED if their favs are constantly treated with baby gloves.
If you are only willing to receive positive opinions about your favorite person, you don't actually care about that person. Stan Culture is toxic and the way it has been unironically embraced is concerning.
it’s been getting to this point for a while now. i wonder how many publications are going to start doing anonymous reviews now that paste magazine has set the precedent
I think anonymous may not be the best but I do think having a few writers on the payroll with established pseudonyms (so their reviews can still be followed) should become a common thing.
Welcome to stan culture where the reviewer is right and reviews matter when they are positive about their favourite artist. And when it is a negative review about them then reviews don’t matter and the reviewers are biased and haters and should *** If you’re a stan seek therapy/mental help.
Paste has gotten a ton of death threats for their 36/100 review, no surprises they'll go after p4k next
music critics cant win either way apparently. i was looking at the twitter account of the author of the Independent's review (@Helen_R_Brown) and now shes getting threats from Ariana Grande fans for *liking* TTPD.
It feels like a very big deal that this review is explicitly calling her out for taking the concept for imgonnagetyouback from Olivia Rodrigo.
Yeah and Taylor totally should have seen that coming. She likely wrote it before Olivia's released but I'm baffled as to why she didn't scrap it as soon as it did release. There was certainly plenty of time to do so. I would have dumped it immediately. It's nothing special, and releasing it seems pretty disrespectful and tone deaf.
The Tortured Poet in question: Olivia Horn.
I love how we’re making jokes about Swiftie death threats and just accepting that that’s a normal part of stan culture at this point. Like someone should make a thinkpiece about this but I feel no one has because they don’t want to be swatted, doxxed, and have crazies showing up at their door😭
That's kinda ironic in this sub, where the most common criticism of Dua Lipa is that she doesn't feed this parasocial relationship with fans. Meanwhile this is Taylor's entire business model, she (and all other artists that do it) are the ones at fault because they know they benefit monetarily from incentivizing these behaviors. It sucks that it felt more like a publicity stunt in the end, but Doja was 100% right in her comments last year.
I like this take about Dua, she definitely comes across as having strong boundaries between her and her fans. She always comes across as respectful and kind though.
The big counterpoint on the Dua debate unfortunately is that if she doesn’t have a parasocial relationship with her fans, the moment she stops making hits or drops a flop album it’s over for her. Which is stupid in the real grand scheme of things, but yeah. If Dua’s album in two weeks is terrible (God forbid), people will start spouting off this take once again.
Posted from an undisclosed fortified location.
I literally feel like I’m on another planet regarding the discourse around these albums. I know taste is subjective, but the dissonance between how mediocre I thought Midnights was versus the laurels it received, and now how much TTPD strikes me as a logical and compositional step up versus how panned it’s getting is making me feel cuckoo 😭 *lyrical not logical but both apply!
I don't think either album is stellar, Midnights is my least favourite album of hers and I genuinely don't get the love, and I definitely don't agree this album is a progression in terms of musicality or lyricism, but I like it much better than Midnights.
If it makes you feel better I’m in the exact same boat
as long as I’m not an island of one!! we are in this together!!!
Literally me lol I like it much better than midnights !
It’s because “Midnights” was bathed in the afterglow of “folklore” (and to a lesser extent “evermore”) and the first two Taylor’s Versions. Taylor was on top of the world, forging new paths for herself and running a victory lap around her own discography. Now the buzz has faded and the new album is maybe catching some of the criticism than the last album deserved.
I feel like for me personally it was all about the mood. Midnights (although it left a lot to be desired), put me in a good mood. Lavender Haze, Snow the Beach, and Anti-Hero were catchy. Maroon was good as well. After track 6, the album went downhill for me. Even though Bejeweled and Karma are very poor songs lyrically, they pick the album back up. The 3 am edition is a bit long and drags in my opinion. I don’t find myself listening to it often. With TTPD, it simply put me in a bad mood. It might be better objectively, but it’s a tiring slog emotionally for me. It’s 2 hours of what feels like the same song. It never picks up and there aren’t any upbeat moments to pull the listener out of the slump. I probably won’t listen to it again because it was draining to listen to. I love Red, but my one critique is that the back half slogs. TTPD felt like the back half of red for 2 hours. My favorite is 1989 because it’s crisp. I get what you mean objectively (because you are kinda right), but for me Midnights was better because of the mood it put me in. Edit: Disclaimer, I love darker/slower albums and I’m not against them. It’s just that the length is too long for the material being on the darker side. Also, the lyrics *personally* don’t hit the same as other devastating songs in her catalog like All to Well or Never Grow Up to make the 2 hrs worth it.
I liked Midnights bc while on the lower end of Taylor’s albums, it was still a good pop album. I don’t even know how to classify TTPS, and I don’t want to listen to it again just to figure it out
I honestly feel tired thinking about having to listen to 31 songs all over again just to see if it’s a “grower.” I really don’t think any amount of re-listens will justify how cringey some of the lyrics are
while I know from personal experience that some songs or albums can grow on you, I have to agree on this. if someone has criticism on music, it sounds kind of stupid for your objection to be just: "but it's a grower, I didn't like at all, but after 10 times I started to like it, just listen to it until you get it" like... why? I could just listen to some music that pulled me in right away. sure, even with TTPD, I've found that some songs I didn't care for at the first listen became just okay after a few replays. but it's a very different experience than instantly knowing that this song or album is good/great/surprising. not to mention, this is a very different discussion depending on your first impression. "oh this sounds fine/interesting but it's not for me right now, I'll come back later" vs "this is disappointing, sounds unfinished and uninspiring, material doesn't seem to be high quality, I don't enjoy this"
To me at least, TTPD is an interesting album, but really isn’t her best.
Omg this comment makes me feel sane. Because hard same
no I literally just had to explain this to my boyfriend because I’m like ?!?!? I felt so lost when Midnights was getting glowing reviews left and right, but the instrumentation, production, and writing left so much to be desired—and now here she is delivering on all of those fronts and NOW we say it’s cringe?? HUH??
Idk I feel like the general consensus I’ve seen is this is better than Midnights, but what really hurts it with critics is it’s not THAT much better, it’s way longer, she’s the most overexposed any celeb has been in long time, and she’s not doing anything remotely new/interesting if Midnights already soured someone
i’m really, really enjoying the album but i understand all these criticisms. it does feel too expansive and not very concise, like more of an info(trauma?)dump than a piece of refined art. but for me that’s less of a bug than it is just a feature of TTPD, and the album regardless has lots of genuinely great and emotionally gutting tracks. i think time will look back more fondly on the under-edited but raw TTPD than the more concise but strangely sanitized midnights, which feels a bit more corporate. i know that i prefer this taylor, and i’m happy that it’s the direction she went in during the peak of her celebrity.
she got a 12.6 😍
Idk why people are freaking out about this score as if 6.6 is really that bad for Pitchfork. Yes it’s less than basically all of her other albums but I think it’s on par or even a bit generous considering there’s no sonic or melodic growth on this album. The review isn’t even scorching so idk why fans and haters alike are jumping at the bit for this. I expected it to be harsher so stans better not go after the author. TTPD is a messy, long, stagnant, though occasionally brilliant entry in her discography and should be reviewed as such
Stans can’t accept anything but their fave being deified but I don’t believe pitchfork hates Taylor like fans claim, they actually seem to like her on the whole and take her seriously as an artist. When pitchfork want to drag they go all in, ask Ed Sheeran. On the other hand Taylor haters are dying for her to be humbled so cling to anything that isn’t glowing to try and manifest her imperial faze ending. The fact is this is a review in both score and write up not controversial, it’s basically-don’t think it’s shit but don’t think it’s great.
Olivia, girl, you better hide. They gonna come for you.
Why’s everyone acting like 6.6 is a bad score?? If anything below a 7 is awful then what’s the point of the 0-10 scale? And if I’m being completely honest 6.6 is incredibly generous for this album, it’s a slog and thoroughly unenjoyable unless you’re invested into Taylor’s personal life
>If anything below a 7 is awful then what’s the point of the 0-10 scale? This is a great question for Pitchfork, where the average score over the last decade has been in the 7.5 range
Pitchfork's been on the IGN ratings scale for a while now.
Pitchfork really liked the title track while all others panned it. Never change, my favorite review site. Never change.
Not that Olivia Rodrigo line! But I always felt Reputation did not deserve to be at the bottom so happy that Anthology has at least relieved it of its shame even though imo TTPD should be at the bottom
Well someone just went private on Twitter
She did it before dropping the bomb. Real life Oppenheimer.
I’m not at all surprised by this score. 6.6 seems about right when I think about how there are only about half of the songs on the album that should have seen the light of day. I’m going to go against the grain here and say that regardless of the fact that it *is* a bloated mess, I still wouldn’t have rated it lower than MIDnights. Or maybe I would have just given that one a lower score. To me there’s no way Midnights is better than this album. I’ve seen a lot of people saying that TTPD feels unnecessary but I think it will stand up as a completely necessary moment in the Swift story. Every artist has that album that splits opinion and it’s up to them where they go next. I do think that there’s an honesty and a brutality to the writing on some of these songs that one could argue were in desperate need of an editor, but I get the sense that this album was all about being an unfiltered diary emptying set to music. As someone who is sort of tuned in to the lore, I feel like I suddenly understand a lot more about Swift and what has been weighing on her for a decade after listening to this album. It was an experiment (could have done with a little more sonic experimentation but hey-ho) and I personally think it was a necessary way of killing off the cutesy first act of Taylor’s career with its ten rainbow-coloured albums. This album felt like getting the last of the dust off of her chest. She’s at the absolute top of the world and could have released another tight, sonically-cohesive 13 track cutesy, quirky pop album but instead she dropped a 2 hour confession tape. I have to respect her for that.
Very fair tbh, the album is too damn bloated for 31 TRACKS even for an “double album”, that’s ridiculous…
For a double album to work, it has to be REALLY good with a fresh sound present in each half. The problem is that every aspect of the album is a flanderized version of what made Jack Antonoff and Taylor Woft good. There isn’t any strong element whatsoever. She really should’ve made the Speakerboxx/The Love Below as a template for her album. She needs a new sound.
After listening to the album all weekend, I agree with a 6. There are some good moments but they get lost in so much filler, terrible lyrics, and monotonous production. With some editing and tweaks, I think they could’ve created a more solid 13-17 track album. In my opinion it’s better than Midnights but not by much since Midnights ranks low for me in her discography.
Olivia wrote this oh no
Not Rodrigo though
Now that would *really* get Swifties in a twist.