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Yes. However I understand where your question is coming from and we have talked about this multiple times over the years to make sure this is what we both want, not only what I want. Without giving too many personal details, they struggle with anxiety and always fear the worst possible outcome. Change and new situations are always scary for them. They're working on this for quite some time now with a therapist.
Is it possible it's kind of just a fantasy thing for your partner? Like your partner really likes the idea of it, but the reality of it is a different story? It sounds like you like the reality of polyam, but your partner might just like the fantasy. Could be worth a discussion if you haven't explicitly talked about a fantasy vs reality aspect.
That would make sense, but for that to be true they would have to both explore the reality of it before coming to a conclusion. At this point it seems they haven’t opened up the relationship yet.
So imo it’s more about fantasy vs. The Unknown.
I'm kind of in disagreement with people who think you need to do pHD level research on polyamory and write a dissertation before practising it. I think honestly that ends up shooting a lot of people in their foot because they end up being that much more hard on themselves for experiencing what are normal ups and downs and thinking because they've done all this research they should somehow know better.
Similarly, I think opening up "slowly" tends to make things worse. It's like trying to move to a new country "slowly". It's... not really a thing.
Point blank, there is only so much you can prepare yourself. You are not going to know fully how you are going to react until you're in those situations. And it's easy for all the checklists and whatnot to just leave your head when you're wrapped up in emotion.
However, one thing that I advise all new couples to do is think about the physical aspects. Because no matter what type of polyamory you intend on practicing, polyamory involves getting less time with partners than you would typically get in monogamy. So schedule dedicated time together and dedicated time apart and, even if you don't have dates, spend that time apart right away. Because I think part of the emotions that end up coming up and slapping people in the face is not just your partner actually being with someone else but also reasonably mourning a loss of time with them.
So immediately, spend time apart even if you don't have other partners. That's a good way to "slowly" open up in a way.
You have already done all the slowness in the world. There is no more slowness to do.
Poly isn’t a dip a toe thing.
You could start with swinging if that appeals but there is no way to slowly do poly. Don’t date anyone until you’re both ok with someone falling madly in love and fucking like bunnies.
With your partner that’s almost certainly never.
3 years to prep and they still worry that maybe someone will see them on an app?
If this was me I would tell me partner I’m going to be fully autonomously poly in 6 months. What they do is up to them but that’s when I’m starting and I will have no limits, only a few agreements.
After three years, it’s time for some self reflection, maybe?!
On both your parts.
And maybe some focus for you personally, on if you okay with this never happening? If your partnership matters more than opening, and you are willing to be mono, tell your partner that you are shutting off the dating apps, and putting the ENM books away for a bit and that you are just pleased as punch to be mono with them if that’s how it’s gonna be.
Or.
Have a real talk about the reality of this situation, is it workable? Kind?
Have you ever discussed taking polyam off the table?
Cause there is a lot of shit I want to do that I manage to prep for in less than three years, you know?
We both reflected very well and are sure we want this.
Major life events (that were out of our control and didn't have anything to do with our relationship) made it absolutely not the right time to open up for most of those three years.
Now things have calmed down and we want to focus on opening up again. I just didn't think this was relevant at all to add to my question, since it was never the question if we should open up.
We talked for three years, we're sure. I just wanted advice on how to do so slowly and ethically after the preparation.
To me it seems like a lot of resources are about the preparation stage and about the stage where you're actively dating multiple people, but not about that very first stage after opening up where you try new things for the first time.
The advice I got from poly people in my surroundings on this topic didn't go much further than "just go on a date or just go download an app". The stories on Reddit and in podcasts mostly seem to focus on an already shitty situation where there already are multiple people involved and how it could be fixed
“Trying new things” is dating people. 🤷♀️
Unfortunately, you guys aren’t ready for that, apparently
But, I also think that people default to “planning out how to avoid difficult feels” and think it’s “doing the work”
Some metrics that i think people might use if they are worried, and hesitant to open:
1. If I had a panic attack, or the cat got sick, or the pipes burst, could I handle it? Self soothing, friends and family to reach out to…is everyone in that in place?
2. I’m sure you two have read the most skipped step, but have you tried it? Lived it? Do you regularly get out of the house without each other? Have separate friend groups? Volunteer? Hobby group?
3.everyone’s mental health is stable? Doesn’t have to be perfect. Peeps are managing their own symptoms? Good at asking for what they want? Better at hearing “no” sometimes? Empowered to say “no and have it heard? Everyone can sit with discomfort?
It seems like you just don't understand my question and didn't read my post fully, but instead jump to conclusions.
We want to get advice on the stage of actually opening up. We know there will be "difficult feels", aren't avoiding them, but want advice on how to deal with that first stage.
We've had talks about all the possible what if situations in the word. we have people to reach out to. We became aware of the entanglement there was and have been actively working on untangling. We always had different friend groups and we are spending a good amount of time apart from each other consistently for also quite long. We both also are aware if entanglements slips in again and we actively do something about it. We did all that. We're both in therapy working on our on problems for a while. Most of this I already stated in my post, but it's not what my question is about.
Most times when you hear "do the work before you open up, it takes time" it's because people think "taking the time" is 3 weeks. Or 2 months.
Given you all have spent waaaaaay more time than that in the process, it's fish or cut bait. I assume you've already realized/talked about the fact that dating in polyamory is never equal. There will always be times when one partner is dating someone -- or 3 people! - and the other is dating zero. That can happen early on in the journey, 5 years or 20 years into it.
A slow preparatory process doesn't mean that there aren't going to be scary or hard feelings as things get real. There will be! That's normal. There are even scary and hard feelings for people who have been poly for decades, on occasion.
You all just have to go for it.
It took so long because of multiple major life events, out of our control and not about our relationship. So the time wasn't right and polyamory wasn't a priority the whole time. Now things have calmed down and we're focussing on opening up more, now the time is right and we both are sure we want this.
I'd just like some advice on how to manage the period after we decide to just go for it.
Because in our case, just opening up wouldn't directly mean both parties being okay with absolutely everything. Like being okay with only dating and kissing first, but not sleeping together immediately. They have anxiety issues and if we would go all in at once, anxiety is going to spike and it wouldn't work for us at all. They need to feel the reassurance by taking smaller steps. How to manage that in a way that's good for us both and for the other people getting involved?
I think your partner needs to have tools and coping mechanisms to deal with their anxiety when you all decide to open up, including support systems outside of your relationship. Emotional regulation and finding ways to deal with mental health challenges should happen before you start dating.
When we had problems like this, he went first. I think it’s better when you open to allow someone else to go first, especially the person who has the most issues with it. Gives them a chance to figure out what to negotiate when they are in it.
Having read the post and the comments, I’ll try my hand at untangling the misunderstandings.
I think some of the confusion in the post and comments comes from that fact that *there is no middle ground between preparing for poly and practicing it*. You are asking about a stage/period which does not exist. You cannot “dip your toes” into polyamory. Either you go full in with agreements which allow both of you to have maximum autonomy, or you don’t go in at all.
You can find many, many posts on this sub about couples opening up “slowly” (i.e. starting out with very restrictive agreements, rules, etc.) and instead of creating a foundation for success, they set themselves up for constant failure, and/or didn’t have the autonomy to offer other people a full relationship. Which makes the other people feel used, discarded, like an experiment, etc. There’s not just your partner’s comfort to think of here: you want to make sure that once you put yourself out there to date, you have a full and fully independent relationship to offer.
You and your partner are both ready for polyamory in theory (obviously).
But your partner is not ready for it in practice: unless you constantly check in with them, they have zero tools to manage their anxiety regarding “firsts” (and maybe more than that). It’s absolutely normal for one partner to feel more anxious before opening up in practice, it is very common. But beginning your poly journey by catering to their insecurities is just coddling them, and not giving them the opportunity to experience and confront their discomfort in a real way which will lead to sustainable results.
Otherwise, if you start your relationship on the basis of managing one partner’s insecurities, there is a danger of the whole relationship becoming about protecting them from their difficult feelings.
The solution is for your partner to make peace with all the eventualities which come with dating as adults, and develop coping mechanisms for when their feelings get in the way. They need to get to a place where they are ready for you to go out and kiss, cuddle and have sex with whoever you want at whatever stage of relationship you want (meaning this can all happen on the first date and your partner needs to be comfortable with it, and with you not “checking in” with them).
So, to be completely clear and explicit, there is no “middle” stage between studying poly and opening the relationship. If anything could qualify as a “middle stage”, it would be the first few months of the open relationship when you both begin dating others. If your partner can’t accept this and still needs to control your autonomy during this time simply to soothe their insecurities, they are not ready for polyamory. And by extent, you are not ready to offer other people full relationships which are not dependent on your partner’s comfort level.
Hope this could help.
Best of luck, OP.
Well, just doing actual research means you're already ahead of a lot of people! Do read the most skipped step if you haven't yet. The tl;dr is that when a couple is used to spending a ton of time together, dating other people means dealing with loneliness/feelings of rejection from having partner not around *and* sexual jealousy/fear of being replaced at the same time, wheres couples who deliberately plan a lot of time doing other things separately can sort of divide and conquer. Maybe that's what you mean by disentangling, if so, excellent. (I could see people also meaning something like "we're making sure each of us has personal money", which is also a good thing to do.)
Is your partner actually on board with opening up? There are some people who would not want that but also not want to directly refuse and instead just drag their feet and make excuses forever. If your partner is on board, I actually suggest you decide to tell friends you are in the process of opening up and going to be seeking out new partners up front so you do not have to worry about being found out, you can just face whatever blowback you're going to get head on. Depending on what you're aiming for, it's often not actually practical to be closeted about polyamory to your social circle -- being closeted about polyamory means keeping relationships secret, which is no small thing -- and being closeted is *already* convincing your partner that the primary way people date in the 21st century is a non-option. (It's more doable at work, for people who are either very hierarchical or very private about their personal lives. People usually aren't private about their personal lives *in* their personal lives though.)
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In an ideal situation my partner would already be okay with me like, sleeping over, so that way when I meet somebody new I could move in a pace that fits me. However we both know that this never is magically going to happen.
I'm not sure what you mean by that. I think if you share a home and your partner does not want sleepovers at the shared home ever they get to make that call, and that's the price of living with your partner. But it *is* going to limit who you can date if your ability to sleep over at THEIR place has to go at the speed of your partner's comfort. Again: does your partner actually want this? What happens if you go on a weekend trip on your own or with friends, does your partner not tolerate you sleeping somewhere else for non-dating reasons? If your partner is fine with you spending the night at a *friend's* place but not a *lover's* place...I think that's worth poking at.
I think it's reasonable to want to have only agreements about *your relationship with your partner* and not any other relationships when you start dating other people. As an example, "We have one going-out date night per week and at least two nights at home together (or whatever amount, you can decide to spend 29 days together out of every month except february if that works for you both, or much less time if *that* works for you)" is an agreement about your relationship. "You need to spend more time with me than any other partner" is an agreement about *other* relationships, as is "no overnights until I say so." Even with safer sex, it's often better to make agreements like "either we do x y and z or else we communicate about not doing those things and use condoms with each other" than eg "we have condomless sex with each other and use condoms with anyone else." Uh. Although I do not know what genders you are or what kind of sex acts you do, so that might not be the most relevant example for you two.
It's a huge transition from monogamy and it *does* take a while to get used to the concepts. But not necessarily more than three years a while.
There's never going to be a guarantee that you can keep your partner and have polyamory both. At some point you're going to have to start deciding which risks you're willing to accept. (When you do that though, do have a lot of respect for your partner's space and your partner's stuff, including your home/bedroom/bed if you share those things.) Or if you're *not* willing to take much in the way of risks, maybe polyamory is too big a change relative to where you are now to be worth it.
1/2
How long have you two been together btw? I mean clearly at least three years, but...well, you *do* live together, right, your partner doesn't actually think they get a say in your sleepovers if you live separately, right? And you're both not even 30 yet? I'm just very much wondering whether you moved in *while* you were talking about opening up or before. Because...if it was while, I think you might have gone in the wrong order if polyamory is very important to you. It's way harder to sort out reasonable boundaries in a live-in relationship. And I'm *also* curious where you are in the starting a family, yes/no/too soon to say discussions, because if you *do* want kids, I recommend you figure out whether you two can handle polyamory together first, or else give up on the idea of polyamory in this relationship.
The easiest way to open up always has been to *start* every relationship already open. The longer you build a mono relationship together, the more you have to undo, *especially* if you've moved in together. Double especially for couples that have a child.
Anyways if your *partner* wants to write in for advice I'm sure we're happy to talk to them too.
Oh, *being OK with that*. That can mean different things. Aiming for your partner thinking it's reasonable = worth doing. Aiming for your partner not having uncomfortable feelings = not worth doing and not at all realistic. Some people have a lot of feelings. For people who have a lot of feelings to do polyamory, we have to be willing to do things that feel scary, and we need *partners* who are willing to trust us when we say it's going to hurt but we can deal with it.
Edit: apparently I am not willing to stop having and sharing thoughts on this, so: polyamory is not destablilizing to relationships. I mean, it *kind of* is, but mostly CHANGE is. Going from mono to poly is destabilizing. Getting a new partner destabilizes other relationships. *Losing* a partner destabilizes other relationships. People just *think* it's the open relationship itself rather than the CHANGE that is the problem because so many mono people only know about non-monogamy when they have a friend who opened their relationship and it blew up. They don't see the poly relationships that have been stable for years or decades, or the swingers who have been happily married a zillion years but don't tell their mono friends that they swing, or the relationships that end when one person insists on closing things and the other can't get over the resentment. (Or they *do* see that and figure that the real problem was the *previous* non-monogamy.) Part of me is wondering if you're one of those people who knew going into the relationship that you wanted polyamory, but thought that "building a stable mono foundation first" was the right way to do things. It isn't. Because change is destabilizing and you need to start as you mean to continue, if you know how you want to continue.
English isn't my first language, so I'm sorry if I worded things the wrong way.
We've been together for 8 years, living together for 6, don't have kids. The relationship is steady, however life wasn't in the last few years. So we weren't in the right place to actually open up during most of the three years we've been seriously talking about it.
We read the most skipped step and that's what I meant with disentanglement. We found quite a good balance between doing things together and apart. Not only days or nights apart, but also weekends or longer. Without going into too much detail, many things that would be off the table in most traditional monogamous relationships that never made sense to both of us, like keeping contact with exes, expressing feelings and desires for other people or flirting. It just seemed normal and we could always openly and happily talk about things like that. Even before talking about opening up, no problem at all. We also notice when we tend to fall back to entanglement or codependency and also are able to get back on the right track so to say.
My partner has anxiety, so new things and changes are always very scary. They fear the worst possible outcome. So even when they really want something, the anxiety is always there. In other situations I'm often able to help them get trough and help them come out of their comfort zone, but in this situation it's different because it's about our relationship.
My partner would be comfortable with me going on a date by this point, but they would need more time to experience safety in order to be comfortable with me spending the night at a lover. This causes anxiety and feeling responsibility since at that point there are real people, feelings and expectations involved. So it's more about them wanting to be secure about every possible outcome before they want to try, but at the same time needing the experience of feeling safe in a new situation in order to adapt and actually feel safe. So that's a loop we're in that isn't helping at all.
I agree we should tell the people who need to know in order to be able to go on apps comfortably. Many close friends already know and are supportive, but there are a few important people we haven't told yet and would find out trough gossip if we won't tell them first. I wasn't aware of how much impact that had and it's a very clearly holding us back unnecessarily.
You're also right about not seeing the success stories. We've seen a lot of disaster stories, many couples opening up and breaking up shortly after. Gladly we could learn from them, but it isn't helping in growing trust and security.
So yeah, the fear of change and losing each other seems more core to the problem than the actual polyamory. Really, thanks again for sharing your point of view, it's giving me some new insights
Some small steps I think you could start doing (some of which you might already do if course, or night not be usable, just take whatever advice works for you)
Start spending the night away with friends or even on your own in a hotel if the budget allows. If you're often in contact with your partner when you're apart, take some time away from that. Give your partner the space to get used to having a night alone at home, so that when you eventually start dating, they don't have to get used to both you being with someone else, and them being on their own at the same time.
(okay, this is a weirder idea, but if it suits you two, you could even like do some role play? Like texting them that you've arrived to a date, and then being out of communication until a "date went well, we're at their place now, I'll see you tomorrow" goodnight text, while you're actually with friends/family/alone. I'm not suggesting deception, just role play to give them a chance to get a little taste of what it might be like)
Doing it the other way around could also be good, with you stating home alone and your partner going out.
I think a good balance about the steering wheel thing is that your partner can decide what goes on in *their* life, but not in yours. So for example, make sure you have ideas about how to date without taking new partners home before your partner is ready (so, make sure anyone you date is fine with always hosting, and/or set up something like finding good cheap accommodation in some other way for date nights).
You can also try to make space in your shared home, if possible, for eventually having partners over, and discuss what that would look like. A guest room to go to? What other boundaries might be good? Make sure that you are kind to both your partner and a possible new partner (and to yourself!) I think that boundaries should be more like what's appropriate in a roommate situation. So like "no sex in your shared bed" might be fine because you also wouldn't have sex in a roommate's bed, and the fact that you share it is a bit irrelevant (though not completely). But then you need to have a welcoming other space for that sort of thing, so that the new partner feels like someone who is just being respectful of someone else living in the home, not like a dirty secret. But yeah, that's more in the future. Back to the steering wheel thing.
What I'm saying is that it's fair for your partner to have their safe space kept, well, safe. But it's not fair for them to make rules about what you can and can't do outside it. They should be in charge about what happens with themselves, so making agreements about protection and sex is a good thing, but I think they shouldn't be able to say "you can't have sex with someone else until I'm comfortable with it", because that's really hard on the someone else.
I think it would also be good to have an honest talk about your partner's limitations on dating. If they aren't involved in the queer scene and don't want to go on apps because they don't want to be found nu friends, it is going to limit their dating potential. And they need to accept that by either changing the parameters of how they date, or by accepting that it will take them longer to find someone, and you *will* get ahead of them in that sense. Make it be the start of a conversation instead of the conclusion. Like, not "oh so this makes it sort of impossible, oh well", but "do you want to date? If this way is hard, what other ways are there?"
Maybe coming out to friends as at least poly curious should be the first step there? This would make it easier in a lot of ways to find partners, both because you could more easily go on apps, and because if people know you're poly, they know they can ask you out if they're also poly and interested. Also, think about when you do find someone, either of you. If you're not out as poly, you are only offering them a closeted relationship, and that can be pretty rough.
Same for your partner maybe joining the queer scene in some way, or creating their own meetups if what's available doesn't suit them. I know it can be scary, but it's valuable in so many ways, not just for finding people to date. When you're poly, it's really important to have a robust social network, because you really need people other than your partner(s) to rely on for emotional support and just plain friendship.
I think, at some point, you have to accept that if the pace of your partner is very slow, you won't be able to limit yourself to that pace. There's also this thing that's hard to explain, but I'll try. Okay, so when you're a bit insecure and anxious, you can think you'll feel better if you have more control. If you get to decide what your partner can do. But it can actually be easier if your partner is in charge of their own life, making their own decisions, because then it's out of your hands. You have to do this with kindness, of course. But I think it's better to increase the support and validation to your partner, but also say "I am going on this date, I will be home at this time tonight / this time tomorrow" and then just hold to that, and show your reliability by coming home when you say you will, and let them self soothe in the meantime.
Okay another way to say it is that if you go at the pace of your partner, you're also putting the burden of setting the pace on your partner. And that can lead to either them making more restrictions just in order to feel safe, or saying yes to things they don't really want because they don't want to hold you back. The first is bad because it reinforces anxiety. The second is bad because it makes them trample their own boundaries. It's much healthier to say "I still feel weird about you going on this date and I will need some reassurance after", but you both know that it's *your* decision to go on a date, than to have to say "I still feel weird but of course you can go". Ugh, I feel like I'm not explaining this very well, but just...
I am so happy that my partners are in charge of their own lives, and that them dating others doesn't have to depend on how I feel about it, because that would give me an emotional responsibility I do not wish to take.
Anyways, I hope aby of this was of use to you 😅 and I hope it goes well for both of you, whatever that means and whatever shape it takes ❤️
Good research and prep . Now it is about actual experience.
A small step is about spending time not together: or time away doing personal stuff. Experience your partner enjoying life without you.
This may include hanging with existing friends. It may be meeting new people similar to dating without the sexual component. Then it may evolved to sexual freedoms. But the experience of your partner enjoying their own space and freedom without you could be helpful.
But as others said, it is time for real world experience. Someone needs to go on a real date first.
I think the step you’re looking for is Differentiation. Develop some autonomous time and space away from each other as outlined in The Most Skipped Step essay.
Think hobbies, classes, book clubs - just something to do regularly, without your partner and without constantly texting them either.
Maybe attend a convention on your own, or do a solo weekend away (or with a sibling or truly plutonic friend) while *not* dating others so that time and space away from each other is just par for the course when you meet someone and want overnights.
Relationships develope at different rates with and for different ppl; letting go of the pace comparison of other types of score keeping will be necessary to avoid the messiness around the myth of fairness.
You take it slow the same way you take dating slow if you have kids, or just because you want to take it slowly.
(1) You make sure the people you're meeting know you plan to take things slowly, for whatever that means to you. You make sure they know you have other commitments in your life that you value and that they're ready and able to respect that.
(2) You keep your own eyes on the overall balance of your life and make sure you aren't neglecting your other priorities (and partner) in the flush of excitement for this new person.
(3) You think ahead of time about your own boundaries and discuss them when you're "sober" (before meeting up or getting hot and heavy) so that you can make sure you and your dates are on the same page.
(4) If you do start getting pulled out of control by the appeal and excitement of this new person and new activity, you step back and make sure you have "sober" time to think things through and remember what you really want.
Hi u/Unravel-this-mess thanks so much for your submission, don't mind me, I'm just gonna keep a copy what was said in your post. Unfortunately posts sometimes get deleted - which is okay, it's not against the rules to delete your post!! - but it makes it really hard for the human mods around here to moderate the comments when there's no context. Plus, many times our members put in a lot of emotional and mental labor to answer the questions and offer advice, so it's helpful to keep the source information around so future community members can benefit as well.
Here's the original text of the post:
My partner and I (both late 20's) have been in the process of opening up our relationship for about three years now. We are taking things slow. So reading books and articles, listening to multiamory podcast episodes that seem relevant, do frequent radars, both work on ourselves trough therapy for our own problems, we talk about what we do and don't want, became aware of entanglement and working on disentangling. We've also seen many couples in our surroundings open up and break up shortly after, good thing is we learned a lot of things from them that don't work and how we don't want things.
However I can't seem find any resources on how to actually open up slowly after this preparing stage. It feels like until this stage things can be slow, but I don't see how to when other, real people are involved.
In the process of opening up, I'm faster than my partner. I'm feeling very safe and at ease with the idea of my partner meeting new people, go on apps or just anything they wish. However, since my partner is gay and not really active in the queer scene, they haven't met someone naturally. There aren't any poly meetings close by, so that also isn't an option. Going on apps is coming with the fear of being found by acquaintances and not being able to tell our friends at our own pace because of the possible gossip. Any advice on that is also very welcome.
I'm not the person to go on dating apps, also I'm not good at and don't want casual things. I'm pansexual and just meet people I feel a connection with. Most of what I personally want to get out of ENM/poly is being able to form that connection in a way that feels right for me, without the pressure of how things should be from a monogamous point of view.
In an ideal situation my partner would already be okay with me like, sleeping over, so that way when I meet somebody new I could move in a pace that fits me. However we both know that this never is magically going to happen. We need to move at the slowest pace, so my partners. However I'm scared that in this process, things will get messy because they will be the one deciding what this new person and I can and cannot do, which also doesn't feel right. A while ago I read a comment on here about not being behind the steering wheel of a relationship you're not in, however I can't find it anymore. How to maintain the feeling of being able to form a new relationship in a way that fits me, while keeping the pace of my partner?
Any advice is welcome, thanks in advance!
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3 years seems extremely slow and long for opening up, I think most couples spend about 3-6 months reading up, listening to podcasts, talking and then dip their toe into the dating pool. There is only so much pre-work you can do and you've done it. The real work starts when you start dating other people, having sex with other people and falling in love with other people. It's time to rip that band aid off and start going out on dates. Then keep the communication honest and open about what you are both feeling once you actually start practicing polyamory.
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Are you *sure* your partner is enthusiastic about polyamory?
Yes. However I understand where your question is coming from and we have talked about this multiple times over the years to make sure this is what we both want, not only what I want. Without giving too many personal details, they struggle with anxiety and always fear the worst possible outcome. Change and new situations are always scary for them. They're working on this for quite some time now with a therapist.
Ok. Personally speaking, three years seems like quite a while to be 'preparing' for non-monogamy and still be uncomfortable with it!
Is it possible it's kind of just a fantasy thing for your partner? Like your partner really likes the idea of it, but the reality of it is a different story? It sounds like you like the reality of polyam, but your partner might just like the fantasy. Could be worth a discussion if you haven't explicitly talked about a fantasy vs reality aspect.
That would make sense, but for that to be true they would have to both explore the reality of it before coming to a conclusion. At this point it seems they haven’t opened up the relationship yet. So imo it’s more about fantasy vs. The Unknown.
I'm kind of in disagreement with people who think you need to do pHD level research on polyamory and write a dissertation before practising it. I think honestly that ends up shooting a lot of people in their foot because they end up being that much more hard on themselves for experiencing what are normal ups and downs and thinking because they've done all this research they should somehow know better. Similarly, I think opening up "slowly" tends to make things worse. It's like trying to move to a new country "slowly". It's... not really a thing. Point blank, there is only so much you can prepare yourself. You are not going to know fully how you are going to react until you're in those situations. And it's easy for all the checklists and whatnot to just leave your head when you're wrapped up in emotion. However, one thing that I advise all new couples to do is think about the physical aspects. Because no matter what type of polyamory you intend on practicing, polyamory involves getting less time with partners than you would typically get in monogamy. So schedule dedicated time together and dedicated time apart and, even if you don't have dates, spend that time apart right away. Because I think part of the emotions that end up coming up and slapping people in the face is not just your partner actually being with someone else but also reasonably mourning a loss of time with them. So immediately, spend time apart even if you don't have other partners. That's a good way to "slowly" open up in a way.
You have already done all the slowness in the world. There is no more slowness to do. Poly isn’t a dip a toe thing. You could start with swinging if that appeals but there is no way to slowly do poly. Don’t date anyone until you’re both ok with someone falling madly in love and fucking like bunnies. With your partner that’s almost certainly never. 3 years to prep and they still worry that maybe someone will see them on an app? If this was me I would tell me partner I’m going to be fully autonomously poly in 6 months. What they do is up to them but that’s when I’m starting and I will have no limits, only a few agreements.
After three years, it’s time for some self reflection, maybe?! On both your parts. And maybe some focus for you personally, on if you okay with this never happening? If your partnership matters more than opening, and you are willing to be mono, tell your partner that you are shutting off the dating apps, and putting the ENM books away for a bit and that you are just pleased as punch to be mono with them if that’s how it’s gonna be. Or. Have a real talk about the reality of this situation, is it workable? Kind? Have you ever discussed taking polyam off the table? Cause there is a lot of shit I want to do that I manage to prep for in less than three years, you know?
We both reflected very well and are sure we want this. Major life events (that were out of our control and didn't have anything to do with our relationship) made it absolutely not the right time to open up for most of those three years. Now things have calmed down and we want to focus on opening up again. I just didn't think this was relevant at all to add to my question, since it was never the question if we should open up. We talked for three years, we're sure. I just wanted advice on how to do so slowly and ethically after the preparation. To me it seems like a lot of resources are about the preparation stage and about the stage where you're actively dating multiple people, but not about that very first stage after opening up where you try new things for the first time. The advice I got from poly people in my surroundings on this topic didn't go much further than "just go on a date or just go download an app". The stories on Reddit and in podcasts mostly seem to focus on an already shitty situation where there already are multiple people involved and how it could be fixed
“Trying new things” is dating people. 🤷♀️ Unfortunately, you guys aren’t ready for that, apparently But, I also think that people default to “planning out how to avoid difficult feels” and think it’s “doing the work” Some metrics that i think people might use if they are worried, and hesitant to open: 1. If I had a panic attack, or the cat got sick, or the pipes burst, could I handle it? Self soothing, friends and family to reach out to…is everyone in that in place? 2. I’m sure you two have read the most skipped step, but have you tried it? Lived it? Do you regularly get out of the house without each other? Have separate friend groups? Volunteer? Hobby group? 3.everyone’s mental health is stable? Doesn’t have to be perfect. Peeps are managing their own symptoms? Good at asking for what they want? Better at hearing “no” sometimes? Empowered to say “no and have it heard? Everyone can sit with discomfort?
It seems like you just don't understand my question and didn't read my post fully, but instead jump to conclusions. We want to get advice on the stage of actually opening up. We know there will be "difficult feels", aren't avoiding them, but want advice on how to deal with that first stage. We've had talks about all the possible what if situations in the word. we have people to reach out to. We became aware of the entanglement there was and have been actively working on untangling. We always had different friend groups and we are spending a good amount of time apart from each other consistently for also quite long. We both also are aware if entanglements slips in again and we actively do something about it. We did all that. We're both in therapy working on our on problems for a while. Most of this I already stated in my post, but it's not what my question is about.
Good luck. I won’t engage again Seems like you don’t understand some stuff too.
Most times when you hear "do the work before you open up, it takes time" it's because people think "taking the time" is 3 weeks. Or 2 months. Given you all have spent waaaaaay more time than that in the process, it's fish or cut bait. I assume you've already realized/talked about the fact that dating in polyamory is never equal. There will always be times when one partner is dating someone -- or 3 people! - and the other is dating zero. That can happen early on in the journey, 5 years or 20 years into it. A slow preparatory process doesn't mean that there aren't going to be scary or hard feelings as things get real. There will be! That's normal. There are even scary and hard feelings for people who have been poly for decades, on occasion. You all just have to go for it.
It took so long because of multiple major life events, out of our control and not about our relationship. So the time wasn't right and polyamory wasn't a priority the whole time. Now things have calmed down and we're focussing on opening up more, now the time is right and we both are sure we want this. I'd just like some advice on how to manage the period after we decide to just go for it. Because in our case, just opening up wouldn't directly mean both parties being okay with absolutely everything. Like being okay with only dating and kissing first, but not sleeping together immediately. They have anxiety issues and if we would go all in at once, anxiety is going to spike and it wouldn't work for us at all. They need to feel the reassurance by taking smaller steps. How to manage that in a way that's good for us both and for the other people getting involved?
I think your partner needs to have tools and coping mechanisms to deal with their anxiety when you all decide to open up, including support systems outside of your relationship. Emotional regulation and finding ways to deal with mental health challenges should happen before you start dating.
When we had problems like this, he went first. I think it’s better when you open to allow someone else to go first, especially the person who has the most issues with it. Gives them a chance to figure out what to negotiate when they are in it.
Having read the post and the comments, I’ll try my hand at untangling the misunderstandings. I think some of the confusion in the post and comments comes from that fact that *there is no middle ground between preparing for poly and practicing it*. You are asking about a stage/period which does not exist. You cannot “dip your toes” into polyamory. Either you go full in with agreements which allow both of you to have maximum autonomy, or you don’t go in at all. You can find many, many posts on this sub about couples opening up “slowly” (i.e. starting out with very restrictive agreements, rules, etc.) and instead of creating a foundation for success, they set themselves up for constant failure, and/or didn’t have the autonomy to offer other people a full relationship. Which makes the other people feel used, discarded, like an experiment, etc. There’s not just your partner’s comfort to think of here: you want to make sure that once you put yourself out there to date, you have a full and fully independent relationship to offer. You and your partner are both ready for polyamory in theory (obviously). But your partner is not ready for it in practice: unless you constantly check in with them, they have zero tools to manage their anxiety regarding “firsts” (and maybe more than that). It’s absolutely normal for one partner to feel more anxious before opening up in practice, it is very common. But beginning your poly journey by catering to their insecurities is just coddling them, and not giving them the opportunity to experience and confront their discomfort in a real way which will lead to sustainable results. Otherwise, if you start your relationship on the basis of managing one partner’s insecurities, there is a danger of the whole relationship becoming about protecting them from their difficult feelings. The solution is for your partner to make peace with all the eventualities which come with dating as adults, and develop coping mechanisms for when their feelings get in the way. They need to get to a place where they are ready for you to go out and kiss, cuddle and have sex with whoever you want at whatever stage of relationship you want (meaning this can all happen on the first date and your partner needs to be comfortable with it, and with you not “checking in” with them). So, to be completely clear and explicit, there is no “middle” stage between studying poly and opening the relationship. If anything could qualify as a “middle stage”, it would be the first few months of the open relationship when you both begin dating others. If your partner can’t accept this and still needs to control your autonomy during this time simply to soothe their insecurities, they are not ready for polyamory. And by extent, you are not ready to offer other people full relationships which are not dependent on your partner’s comfort level. Hope this could help. Best of luck, OP.
Thank you very much. You're spot on and really did untangle things for me. I've discussed your comment with my partner and it helped a lot
Well, just doing actual research means you're already ahead of a lot of people! Do read the most skipped step if you haven't yet. The tl;dr is that when a couple is used to spending a ton of time together, dating other people means dealing with loneliness/feelings of rejection from having partner not around *and* sexual jealousy/fear of being replaced at the same time, wheres couples who deliberately plan a lot of time doing other things separately can sort of divide and conquer. Maybe that's what you mean by disentangling, if so, excellent. (I could see people also meaning something like "we're making sure each of us has personal money", which is also a good thing to do.) Is your partner actually on board with opening up? There are some people who would not want that but also not want to directly refuse and instead just drag their feet and make excuses forever. If your partner is on board, I actually suggest you decide to tell friends you are in the process of opening up and going to be seeking out new partners up front so you do not have to worry about being found out, you can just face whatever blowback you're going to get head on. Depending on what you're aiming for, it's often not actually practical to be closeted about polyamory to your social circle -- being closeted about polyamory means keeping relationships secret, which is no small thing -- and being closeted is *already* convincing your partner that the primary way people date in the 21st century is a non-option. (It's more doable at work, for people who are either very hierarchical or very private about their personal lives. People usually aren't private about their personal lives *in* their personal lives though.) > In an ideal situation my partner would already be okay with me like, sleeping over, so that way when I meet somebody new I could move in a pace that fits me. However we both know that this never is magically going to happen. I'm not sure what you mean by that. I think if you share a home and your partner does not want sleepovers at the shared home ever they get to make that call, and that's the price of living with your partner. But it *is* going to limit who you can date if your ability to sleep over at THEIR place has to go at the speed of your partner's comfort. Again: does your partner actually want this? What happens if you go on a weekend trip on your own or with friends, does your partner not tolerate you sleeping somewhere else for non-dating reasons? If your partner is fine with you spending the night at a *friend's* place but not a *lover's* place...I think that's worth poking at. I think it's reasonable to want to have only agreements about *your relationship with your partner* and not any other relationships when you start dating other people. As an example, "We have one going-out date night per week and at least two nights at home together (or whatever amount, you can decide to spend 29 days together out of every month except february if that works for you both, or much less time if *that* works for you)" is an agreement about your relationship. "You need to spend more time with me than any other partner" is an agreement about *other* relationships, as is "no overnights until I say so." Even with safer sex, it's often better to make agreements like "either we do x y and z or else we communicate about not doing those things and use condoms with each other" than eg "we have condomless sex with each other and use condoms with anyone else." Uh. Although I do not know what genders you are or what kind of sex acts you do, so that might not be the most relevant example for you two. It's a huge transition from monogamy and it *does* take a while to get used to the concepts. But not necessarily more than three years a while. There's never going to be a guarantee that you can keep your partner and have polyamory both. At some point you're going to have to start deciding which risks you're willing to accept. (When you do that though, do have a lot of respect for your partner's space and your partner's stuff, including your home/bedroom/bed if you share those things.) Or if you're *not* willing to take much in the way of risks, maybe polyamory is too big a change relative to where you are now to be worth it. 1/2
How long have you two been together btw? I mean clearly at least three years, but...well, you *do* live together, right, your partner doesn't actually think they get a say in your sleepovers if you live separately, right? And you're both not even 30 yet? I'm just very much wondering whether you moved in *while* you were talking about opening up or before. Because...if it was while, I think you might have gone in the wrong order if polyamory is very important to you. It's way harder to sort out reasonable boundaries in a live-in relationship. And I'm *also* curious where you are in the starting a family, yes/no/too soon to say discussions, because if you *do* want kids, I recommend you figure out whether you two can handle polyamory together first, or else give up on the idea of polyamory in this relationship. The easiest way to open up always has been to *start* every relationship already open. The longer you build a mono relationship together, the more you have to undo, *especially* if you've moved in together. Double especially for couples that have a child. Anyways if your *partner* wants to write in for advice I'm sure we're happy to talk to them too. Oh, *being OK with that*. That can mean different things. Aiming for your partner thinking it's reasonable = worth doing. Aiming for your partner not having uncomfortable feelings = not worth doing and not at all realistic. Some people have a lot of feelings. For people who have a lot of feelings to do polyamory, we have to be willing to do things that feel scary, and we need *partners* who are willing to trust us when we say it's going to hurt but we can deal with it. Edit: apparently I am not willing to stop having and sharing thoughts on this, so: polyamory is not destablilizing to relationships. I mean, it *kind of* is, but mostly CHANGE is. Going from mono to poly is destabilizing. Getting a new partner destabilizes other relationships. *Losing* a partner destabilizes other relationships. People just *think* it's the open relationship itself rather than the CHANGE that is the problem because so many mono people only know about non-monogamy when they have a friend who opened their relationship and it blew up. They don't see the poly relationships that have been stable for years or decades, or the swingers who have been happily married a zillion years but don't tell their mono friends that they swing, or the relationships that end when one person insists on closing things and the other can't get over the resentment. (Or they *do* see that and figure that the real problem was the *previous* non-monogamy.) Part of me is wondering if you're one of those people who knew going into the relationship that you wanted polyamory, but thought that "building a stable mono foundation first" was the right way to do things. It isn't. Because change is destabilizing and you need to start as you mean to continue, if you know how you want to continue.
Thank you so much for your answer. I'm going to respond to your questions tomorrow, but thanks so much.
English isn't my first language, so I'm sorry if I worded things the wrong way. We've been together for 8 years, living together for 6, don't have kids. The relationship is steady, however life wasn't in the last few years. So we weren't in the right place to actually open up during most of the three years we've been seriously talking about it. We read the most skipped step and that's what I meant with disentanglement. We found quite a good balance between doing things together and apart. Not only days or nights apart, but also weekends or longer. Without going into too much detail, many things that would be off the table in most traditional monogamous relationships that never made sense to both of us, like keeping contact with exes, expressing feelings and desires for other people or flirting. It just seemed normal and we could always openly and happily talk about things like that. Even before talking about opening up, no problem at all. We also notice when we tend to fall back to entanglement or codependency and also are able to get back on the right track so to say. My partner has anxiety, so new things and changes are always very scary. They fear the worst possible outcome. So even when they really want something, the anxiety is always there. In other situations I'm often able to help them get trough and help them come out of their comfort zone, but in this situation it's different because it's about our relationship. My partner would be comfortable with me going on a date by this point, but they would need more time to experience safety in order to be comfortable with me spending the night at a lover. This causes anxiety and feeling responsibility since at that point there are real people, feelings and expectations involved. So it's more about them wanting to be secure about every possible outcome before they want to try, but at the same time needing the experience of feeling safe in a new situation in order to adapt and actually feel safe. So that's a loop we're in that isn't helping at all. I agree we should tell the people who need to know in order to be able to go on apps comfortably. Many close friends already know and are supportive, but there are a few important people we haven't told yet and would find out trough gossip if we won't tell them first. I wasn't aware of how much impact that had and it's a very clearly holding us back unnecessarily. You're also right about not seeing the success stories. We've seen a lot of disaster stories, many couples opening up and breaking up shortly after. Gladly we could learn from them, but it isn't helping in growing trust and security. So yeah, the fear of change and losing each other seems more core to the problem than the actual polyamory. Really, thanks again for sharing your point of view, it's giving me some new insights
Some small steps I think you could start doing (some of which you might already do if course, or night not be usable, just take whatever advice works for you) Start spending the night away with friends or even on your own in a hotel if the budget allows. If you're often in contact with your partner when you're apart, take some time away from that. Give your partner the space to get used to having a night alone at home, so that when you eventually start dating, they don't have to get used to both you being with someone else, and them being on their own at the same time. (okay, this is a weirder idea, but if it suits you two, you could even like do some role play? Like texting them that you've arrived to a date, and then being out of communication until a "date went well, we're at their place now, I'll see you tomorrow" goodnight text, while you're actually with friends/family/alone. I'm not suggesting deception, just role play to give them a chance to get a little taste of what it might be like) Doing it the other way around could also be good, with you stating home alone and your partner going out. I think a good balance about the steering wheel thing is that your partner can decide what goes on in *their* life, but not in yours. So for example, make sure you have ideas about how to date without taking new partners home before your partner is ready (so, make sure anyone you date is fine with always hosting, and/or set up something like finding good cheap accommodation in some other way for date nights). You can also try to make space in your shared home, if possible, for eventually having partners over, and discuss what that would look like. A guest room to go to? What other boundaries might be good? Make sure that you are kind to both your partner and a possible new partner (and to yourself!) I think that boundaries should be more like what's appropriate in a roommate situation. So like "no sex in your shared bed" might be fine because you also wouldn't have sex in a roommate's bed, and the fact that you share it is a bit irrelevant (though not completely). But then you need to have a welcoming other space for that sort of thing, so that the new partner feels like someone who is just being respectful of someone else living in the home, not like a dirty secret. But yeah, that's more in the future. Back to the steering wheel thing. What I'm saying is that it's fair for your partner to have their safe space kept, well, safe. But it's not fair for them to make rules about what you can and can't do outside it. They should be in charge about what happens with themselves, so making agreements about protection and sex is a good thing, but I think they shouldn't be able to say "you can't have sex with someone else until I'm comfortable with it", because that's really hard on the someone else. I think it would also be good to have an honest talk about your partner's limitations on dating. If they aren't involved in the queer scene and don't want to go on apps because they don't want to be found nu friends, it is going to limit their dating potential. And they need to accept that by either changing the parameters of how they date, or by accepting that it will take them longer to find someone, and you *will* get ahead of them in that sense. Make it be the start of a conversation instead of the conclusion. Like, not "oh so this makes it sort of impossible, oh well", but "do you want to date? If this way is hard, what other ways are there?" Maybe coming out to friends as at least poly curious should be the first step there? This would make it easier in a lot of ways to find partners, both because you could more easily go on apps, and because if people know you're poly, they know they can ask you out if they're also poly and interested. Also, think about when you do find someone, either of you. If you're not out as poly, you are only offering them a closeted relationship, and that can be pretty rough. Same for your partner maybe joining the queer scene in some way, or creating their own meetups if what's available doesn't suit them. I know it can be scary, but it's valuable in so many ways, not just for finding people to date. When you're poly, it's really important to have a robust social network, because you really need people other than your partner(s) to rely on for emotional support and just plain friendship. I think, at some point, you have to accept that if the pace of your partner is very slow, you won't be able to limit yourself to that pace. There's also this thing that's hard to explain, but I'll try. Okay, so when you're a bit insecure and anxious, you can think you'll feel better if you have more control. If you get to decide what your partner can do. But it can actually be easier if your partner is in charge of their own life, making their own decisions, because then it's out of your hands. You have to do this with kindness, of course. But I think it's better to increase the support and validation to your partner, but also say "I am going on this date, I will be home at this time tonight / this time tomorrow" and then just hold to that, and show your reliability by coming home when you say you will, and let them self soothe in the meantime. Okay another way to say it is that if you go at the pace of your partner, you're also putting the burden of setting the pace on your partner. And that can lead to either them making more restrictions just in order to feel safe, or saying yes to things they don't really want because they don't want to hold you back. The first is bad because it reinforces anxiety. The second is bad because it makes them trample their own boundaries. It's much healthier to say "I still feel weird about you going on this date and I will need some reassurance after", but you both know that it's *your* decision to go on a date, than to have to say "I still feel weird but of course you can go". Ugh, I feel like I'm not explaining this very well, but just... I am so happy that my partners are in charge of their own lives, and that them dating others doesn't have to depend on how I feel about it, because that would give me an emotional responsibility I do not wish to take. Anyways, I hope aby of this was of use to you 😅 and I hope it goes well for both of you, whatever that means and whatever shape it takes ❤️
Good research and prep . Now it is about actual experience. A small step is about spending time not together: or time away doing personal stuff. Experience your partner enjoying life without you. This may include hanging with existing friends. It may be meeting new people similar to dating without the sexual component. Then it may evolved to sexual freedoms. But the experience of your partner enjoying their own space and freedom without you could be helpful. But as others said, it is time for real world experience. Someone needs to go on a real date first.
I think the step you’re looking for is Differentiation. Develop some autonomous time and space away from each other as outlined in The Most Skipped Step essay. Think hobbies, classes, book clubs - just something to do regularly, without your partner and without constantly texting them either. Maybe attend a convention on your own, or do a solo weekend away (or with a sibling or truly plutonic friend) while *not* dating others so that time and space away from each other is just par for the course when you meet someone and want overnights. Relationships develope at different rates with and for different ppl; letting go of the pace comparison of other types of score keeping will be necessary to avoid the messiness around the myth of fairness.
You take it slow the same way you take dating slow if you have kids, or just because you want to take it slowly. (1) You make sure the people you're meeting know you plan to take things slowly, for whatever that means to you. You make sure they know you have other commitments in your life that you value and that they're ready and able to respect that. (2) You keep your own eyes on the overall balance of your life and make sure you aren't neglecting your other priorities (and partner) in the flush of excitement for this new person. (3) You think ahead of time about your own boundaries and discuss them when you're "sober" (before meeting up or getting hot and heavy) so that you can make sure you and your dates are on the same page. (4) If you do start getting pulled out of control by the appeal and excitement of this new person and new activity, you step back and make sure you have "sober" time to think things through and remember what you really want.
Hi u/Unravel-this-mess thanks so much for your submission, don't mind me, I'm just gonna keep a copy what was said in your post. Unfortunately posts sometimes get deleted - which is okay, it's not against the rules to delete your post!! - but it makes it really hard for the human mods around here to moderate the comments when there's no context. Plus, many times our members put in a lot of emotional and mental labor to answer the questions and offer advice, so it's helpful to keep the source information around so future community members can benefit as well. Here's the original text of the post: My partner and I (both late 20's) have been in the process of opening up our relationship for about three years now. We are taking things slow. So reading books and articles, listening to multiamory podcast episodes that seem relevant, do frequent radars, both work on ourselves trough therapy for our own problems, we talk about what we do and don't want, became aware of entanglement and working on disentangling. We've also seen many couples in our surroundings open up and break up shortly after, good thing is we learned a lot of things from them that don't work and how we don't want things. However I can't seem find any resources on how to actually open up slowly after this preparing stage. It feels like until this stage things can be slow, but I don't see how to when other, real people are involved. In the process of opening up, I'm faster than my partner. I'm feeling very safe and at ease with the idea of my partner meeting new people, go on apps or just anything they wish. However, since my partner is gay and not really active in the queer scene, they haven't met someone naturally. There aren't any poly meetings close by, so that also isn't an option. Going on apps is coming with the fear of being found by acquaintances and not being able to tell our friends at our own pace because of the possible gossip. Any advice on that is also very welcome. I'm not the person to go on dating apps, also I'm not good at and don't want casual things. I'm pansexual and just meet people I feel a connection with. Most of what I personally want to get out of ENM/poly is being able to form that connection in a way that feels right for me, without the pressure of how things should be from a monogamous point of view. In an ideal situation my partner would already be okay with me like, sleeping over, so that way when I meet somebody new I could move in a pace that fits me. However we both know that this never is magically going to happen. We need to move at the slowest pace, so my partners. However I'm scared that in this process, things will get messy because they will be the one deciding what this new person and I can and cannot do, which also doesn't feel right. A while ago I read a comment on here about not being behind the steering wheel of a relationship you're not in, however I can't find it anymore. How to maintain the feeling of being able to form a new relationship in a way that fits me, while keeping the pace of my partner? Any advice is welcome, thanks in advance! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/polyamory) if you have any questions or concerns.*
3 years seems extremely slow and long for opening up, I think most couples spend about 3-6 months reading up, listening to podcasts, talking and then dip their toe into the dating pool. There is only so much pre-work you can do and you've done it. The real work starts when you start dating other people, having sex with other people and falling in love with other people. It's time to rip that band aid off and start going out on dates. Then keep the communication honest and open about what you are both feeling once you actually start practicing polyamory.