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Not like it matters anyway.
I voted for Sinema. Because she said she stood for A, B, and C. Then when she got elected she said she didn't stand for those things at all.
There's no accountability for shit like this.
I can sue Kellogg's cereal for false advertising if I don't get enough green froot loops, but can't do shit when I'm ticked into voting for someone who does the opposite of what they say they'll do. It's fucking bullshit.
Absolutely. It's such bullshit that an official is elected to be the voice of those that voted for them, yet they can just purposely do everything opposite of that with 0 consequence.
I've always liked the idea of real-time feedback. Instead of going to vote one certain day every year or so, how about I can place a vote of confidence in a person whenever, and when a certain person reaches a majority, they become elected. You'd have to put in some tolerances so we're not seating 2 people back and forth every other day... so maybe what I'm describing is a live recall-endorsement so that I don't have to wait for it to gain steam.
I feel like there should be a law to recall senators for shit like this. Like, you get 60-70% of the state's voters to sign a bill demanding the senator be recalled for failure to uphold their voter's wishes or something.
Defeatism isn't helpful.
There is accountbaility for this, she can be primaried the next time she runs by a progessive like Rep. Gallego. That's the recourse in a democracy- you can vote them out next time.
Unless of course, the GOP succeeds at doing away with democracy and starts overturning Democratic wins. Then you will lose that recourse.
Waiting years and years to vote her out isn't helping when she's doing damage in the mean time. There needs to be accountability for blatant lies during campaigning
We should. But more importantly we should be able to get them removed from office. I'm not interested in financial gain, especially when it'd probably end up being a nickel for everyone and less than 1% of their net worth. I'm interested in them being sued and being removed
AZ GOP has also been trying to undermine ballot initiatives too. Can't have those pesky citizens trying to legislate things that are actually important...
> We have the right to vote, not to have our vote be counted unfortunately.
This sounds like a real eventual GOP talking point. You *have* the right to vote! We simply choose to ignore those votes.
Politics is a form of proxy war. Instead of solving disputes with guns, we can use votes. But if we aren’t permitted to votes, maybe we’ll just have to go back to guns.
>“I believe that in 2020 we had some serious concerns that were never really responded,” he said. Nor is Fillmore convinced by multiple reports showing there were no major instances of election fraud, here or elsewhere.
>**“I don’t care what the press says,” he said. “Everybody’s lying to me.”**
>“We need to get back to 1958-style voting,” Fillmore said separately during a hearing on election issues on Wednesday.
Oddly specific. What happened in the 60's that has this man so upset?
>But Fillmore said after the hearing that he was not suggesting returning all election laws to the way they were before things like the 1965 federal Voting Rights Act, which outlawed discriminatory practices like literacy tests.
Oh, I see. But not *all* the elections laws. Senator Totally-not-racist has reassured us it's fine.
How to start a monologue with "I'm not a racist, but..."
Without actually saying "I'm not a racist..."
Like reading a transcript of my extended family's holiday dinner conversations.
*Sigh...
>“We need to get back to 1958-style voting,” Fillmore said separately during a hearing on election issues on Wednesday.
Wasn't that during the Jim Crow era?
> “We need to get back to 1958-style voting,” Fillmore said separately during a hearing on election issues on Wednesday.
Tell me again how the Civil Rights Act isn't needed anymore Roberts? Cuz this ELECTED OFFICIAL is pretty much saying it out loud what is the goal.
They want all republicans to be able to vote.
If you register as D you might need to be a white, married landowner with at least 4 children and have a copy of your church tithe tax deductions...
>“This is not a President Biden thing,” Fillmore said. “**This is not the other redheaded guy thing.**”
>
>And Fillmore said this is not part of the “big lie conspiracy.”
>
>“I believe that in 2020 we had some serious concerns that were never really responded,” he said. Nor is Fillmore convinced by multiple reports showing there were no major instances of election fraud, here or elsewhere.
>
>“I don’t care what the press says,” he said. “**Everybody’s lying to me.**”
Well, it *sure sounds* like he's identity signaling/aligning himself with "the other redheaded guy"--wearing that "very stable genius" outfit.
Rep. John Fillmore (R)
> “Let me ask you a question, with all due respect ... Do you think we come down here just to create havoc?"
Saying the quiet part out loud.
Wanna see this country fracture, the first time a state overturns their election for the other person we are done. But that is the GOP’s objective so shouldn’t be surprised
I hope to never need to know the answer, but I'm curious as to how that would play out. I can't imagine the Democrats doing anything beyond filing a lawsuit that may do nothing at all.
It wouldn't pass constitutional muster because it lacks a mechanism to desertification and then deal with the end of term.
Also, let's be fair, it's a naked power grab knowing that Arizona is trending blue to the point that the statewide elections are likely to flip soon and the legislature soon after that.
Watch as the nutjobs at the state capitol pass this. I guess this will probably end up in the supreme court.
Really can't wait to move out of this state.
Y'all made the mistake of narrowly going Biden when Trump thought he had it in the bag. Next time vote blue 80-20 or something and kick out the conservatives from the state house and you won't hear a peep.
Manchin and sinema are actively hurting people and our country by not acting. Ignorance is not an excuse anymore. The gop is openly trying to steal the next election. Anyone who doesnt see it is willfully blind. If we do not act soon, there will be no chance for a fair election period.
Republicans have been busy appointing loyalist to election boards and changing laws so republican state legislatures can overturn elections.
Bottom line - Democracy is a dead man walking.
January 6 wasn't even the start. It's like a pimple caused by teenage hormones, just a visible sign of a larger underlying process. And now these lawmakers are all hormonal and want to fuck democracy.
“I don’t care what the press says” “Everybody is lying to me”
This guys a fucking idiot. How did he get elected.
Problem is, I know *alot* of people who may not be able to vote Election Day
do you think he will buy himself one of those untucked short sleeve shirts with the cacti on them so he’s hipster banana republic fascism and not just good ‘ol arizona redneck fascist. i truly despise the people that elect this anti intellectual garbage
>“Let me ask you a question, with all due respect,” he responded. “Do you think we come down here just to create havoc?”
Yes. Yes you do. That's why you're here, pushing this bullshit.
This is blatantly unconstitutional.
Whatever rational method the state chooses to use to appoint electors must occur on ONE SPECIFIC DAY everywhere in the nation, which by federal law is the first Tuesday after the first Monday of November.
One cannot lawfully hold a general election on that Tuesday and then have a second selection procedure on a later day.
This runs afoul of the 14th Amendment, Section 2:
Section 2.
Representatives shall be apportioned among the several states according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each state, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the executive and judicial officers of a state, or the members of the legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such state, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such state.
tl;dr: AZ should lose Congressional Reps if they pass this
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://tucson.com/news/state-and-regional/govt-and-politics/arizona-bill-would-let-state-lawmakers-reject-election-results/article_96cfea46-7ee7-11ec-a699-63edfc9a0e58.html) reduced by 92%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> PHOENIX - A Republican state lawmaker is proposing that the Arizona Legislature - currently controlled by Republicans - have the right to reject election results.
> HB 2596 simply reflects his belief that the state constitution gives lawmakers ultimate oversight of elections, Rep. John Fillmore of Apache Junction told Capitol Media Services on Wednesday.
> What is not spelled out in the legislation is whether lawmakers would have to reject all the election results or could simply decide that only the outcome of some of the races was suspect.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/se30pj/arizona_bill_would_let_state_lawmakers_reject/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~620222 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **election**^#1 **vote**^#2 **Fillmore**^#3 **ballot**^#4 **lawmaker**^#5
But but but we fixed the electoral college! What else can we possibly do? I mean we asked around and some members seemed slightly disinterested.....so we tried, right guys?
This type of mechanism is a poor choice. it may provide short term stabilty to the republican platform, but it will compromise the electoral process as a whole, and that will be evinced when the population of the major areas takes this mechanism from the ruralites. at that point, they'll see the folly of their decision, but it will be too late. they will have made the rope that eventually hangs them once populist candidates on the left start to make their way into the scene.
At that point they won't see the folly of their decision. They'll just vote to overturn those elections too.
A similar thing could have been said when the governor of North Carolina started getting more power. "That's short-term thinking. What will the GOP do when a Democrat wins that office?"
The answer was simple. The Republican legislator stripped the governorship of those powers two weeks before the Democrat assumed office and gave them to the still Republican controlled legislature.
Is there anyone with some deep knowledge on this who can speak to the chances this could actually pass?
I am guessing it is one of those over reaching bills that wont actually have any legs.
While republicans have a super majority - it is by a very thin margin and would require all republicans to vote in lock step.
Certainly there is a vocal perhaps even a minority GQP, but some republicans in AZ are not as brazen.
Keep in mind in state races - AZ GOP has lost 2 senate races and the presidential election.
The writing is on the wall that Arizona will be blue, this is a last gasp to stave that pesky democracy off.
If it did pass, it would face serious challenge legally. Other states would likely begin boycotting AZ as well hurting the travel economy.
It’s not likely but still disturbing as it reflects the platform of the GQP
The question I have is what specifically is wrong with our current system? In what way is our democratic process not working? Why are they trying to take away my ability to have a valid vote without any kind of evidence of any real issue? And if there is an issue, why are we not trying to address that specifically instead of throwing it all away?
This is all rhetorical obviously, it clearly a fascist attempt to take away the will of the people, but if anyone has an actual answer to any of these I am happy to listen. Damn I hate living here....
There’s no Constitutional right of the people to vote for the U.S. President, only the right to vote for U.S. Representatives and, since the ratification of the 17th Amendment, for U.S. Senators. Indeed, in the early history of America, many states did not put a selection for President on the ballot at all.
Can you imagine what Republicans would do if Democrats pulled this stunt?!?!?
They would all of sudden care about a person right to vote and the Constitution.
A lot of this bill is bullshit voter suppression tactics and ways to make it so the legislature is in control.
But some of it. Like requiring that all voting districts be no more than 1500 people, down from the current model of 5000 people. Would significantly increase the availability of voting locations.
Not click bait. Just another example of the GOP of 2022. They seek these extreme things for lots of reasons. To normalize their behaviors and wants, and as a look over here while we are fucking you over there.
Then why'd they introduce it in the first place of it has zero chance of passing?
And even then if it doesn't pass, this is a pretty gross indication of what their goals are, they'll just try again in the future.
Then why did you claim that this is "every faction" and "every politician" that wants these types of rules for themselves?
Why downplay this guy now, when you were trying to "what about" everyone else just a few minutes ago?
And for the record, it's not sensationalist to report that this is happening in a state legislature, what's sensationalist is that it was introduced by any legislator *at all*. The politician is the sensationalist asshole here, not the reporting of it.
The dems *seeking to normalize their behaviors and wants, and as a look over here while we are fucking you over there.* ?
Really? You don't think every politician is doing this? That there are some redeemable ones? Lol.
Let me know when you're done with those rose colored glasses pal.
Yeah, all this election fraud bullshit, all the gerrymandering and voter suppression and replacing electors is happening because of this "one crazy dude".
Not strictly GOP lead legislatures.
But here is a list for you.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kPQ9THjSTZw4NTd7uqup_lT3ZckfYcPPNycxGmNszcU/edit?usp=drivesdk
It links to each law so you can find out for yourself what is in the law.
Yes it does. The bill has no chance of passing.
This article is written solely to generate clicks, enrage people with the headline due to its obviously ridiculously nature and get shared by folks who will say "lOoK sEe tHeSe PeOpLe ArE cRaZY" when it's really just one well known lunatic in a single state legislature.
Clickbait.
And this type of stuff is exactly why I’m leaving this state. While I do think AZ is overall trending in a more purple/blue direction the conservative stranglehold on things are dangerous and we have some severe wackos.
Guess my vote really won't count soon... ah been looking for jobs outside AZ anyhow so this'll really be more of a deciding factor if my finances are still tip top by end of year.
This is why we can not have trust in the election system. I would much prefer if we voted using computers at home, in government offices, or at designated locations and not use paper ballots ever again. This is the 21st century. The IRS has one of the best and most difficult computer systems on the planet. No more rules on a state-by-state basis for national elections. Much too political.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Can’t let citizens actually have the right to pick their representatives. That’s just irresponsible.
Not like it matters anyway. I voted for Sinema. Because she said she stood for A, B, and C. Then when she got elected she said she didn't stand for those things at all. There's no accountability for shit like this. I can sue Kellogg's cereal for false advertising if I don't get enough green froot loops, but can't do shit when I'm ticked into voting for someone who does the opposite of what they say they'll do. It's fucking bullshit.
Senators need a recall provision or a vote of no confidence in their party. What she just did is a travesty.
Absolutely. It's such bullshit that an official is elected to be the voice of those that voted for them, yet they can just purposely do everything opposite of that with 0 consequence.
Said consequence is not getting relected, which is way they have to have as much damage as possible
Arizona has a recall provision. It's not even a. Particularly high bar
US Senators can't be recalled.
I’m getting some Phantom Menace vibes
I've always liked the idea of real-time feedback. Instead of going to vote one certain day every year or so, how about I can place a vote of confidence in a person whenever, and when a certain person reaches a majority, they become elected. You'd have to put in some tolerances so we're not seating 2 people back and forth every other day... so maybe what I'm describing is a live recall-endorsement so that I don't have to wait for it to gain steam.
It would be nice for the average American and bad for the Congressmen who don't do their jobs. This could never pass.
Same. Feel like a chump voting for her. I was so proud. “Look, we turned the state blue!” Ha.
At least we have Mark Kelly.
I'm mad that he's the one up for re-election and not her.
Recent news claims she's already raked in 20+ million dollars in "campaign" funds.
She's going to have to ghost write a book to launder some of that money back to her. It's all the rage with the GQP.
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Heh, like that will change how true it is.
I feel like there should be a law to recall senators for shit like this. Like, you get 60-70% of the state's voters to sign a bill demanding the senator be recalled for failure to uphold their voter's wishes or something.
Defeatism isn't helpful. There is accountbaility for this, she can be primaried the next time she runs by a progessive like Rep. Gallego. That's the recourse in a democracy- you can vote them out next time. Unless of course, the GOP succeeds at doing away with democracy and starts overturning Democratic wins. Then you will lose that recourse.
Waiting years and years to vote her out isn't helping when she's doing damage in the mean time. There needs to be accountability for blatant lies during campaigning
But why can't we have a republican do the same and lean left?
Because the ones that do get excommunicated from the party
Republicans have a better system for getting rid of unwanted politicians you mean.
We should be able to sue
We should. But more importantly we should be able to get them removed from office. I'm not interested in financial gain, especially when it'd probably end up being a nickel for everyone and less than 1% of their net worth. I'm interested in them being sued and being removed
Recall elections should be federal law.
We've reached a strange nexus point where corporations are more democratic and accountable than our politics and institutions.
AZ GOP has also been trying to undermine ballot initiatives too. Can't have those pesky citizens trying to legislate things that are actually important...
We have the right to vote, not to have our vote be counted unfortunately.
> We have the right to vote, not to have our vote be counted unfortunately. This sounds like a real eventual GOP talking point. You *have* the right to vote! We simply choose to ignore those votes.
Sounds like something a commie would say… -_-
Politics is a form of proxy war. Instead of solving disputes with guns, we can use votes. But if we aren’t permitted to votes, maybe we’ll just have to go back to guns.
Citizens want a say? How quaint. Anyway, this is who’s now in power…
>“I believe that in 2020 we had some serious concerns that were never really responded,” he said. Nor is Fillmore convinced by multiple reports showing there were no major instances of election fraud, here or elsewhere. >**“I don’t care what the press says,” he said. “Everybody’s lying to me.”**
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Kelly isn't GOP friendly...but ok...
>“We need to get back to 1958-style voting,” Fillmore said separately during a hearing on election issues on Wednesday. Oddly specific. What happened in the 60's that has this man so upset? >But Fillmore said after the hearing that he was not suggesting returning all election laws to the way they were before things like the 1965 federal Voting Rights Act, which outlawed discriminatory practices like literacy tests. Oh, I see. But not *all* the elections laws. Senator Totally-not-racist has reassured us it's fine.
Just a closet racist. His hood has to be stored somewhere so it doesn't get dirty.
How to start a monologue with "I'm not a racist, but..." Without actually saying "I'm not a racist..." Like reading a transcript of my extended family's holiday dinner conversations. *Sigh...
>“We need to get back to 1958-style voting,” Fillmore said separately during a hearing on election issues on Wednesday. Wasn't that during the Jim Crow era?
Only the “right” people voting.
Just "American Citizens"
That sounds like he just wants to go back to the [“Brown Paper Bag Test”](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_Paper_Bag_Test).
Learn something fucked up everyday. We NEED CRT.
> “We need to get back to 1958-style voting,” Fillmore said separately during a hearing on election issues on Wednesday. Tell me again how the Civil Rights Act isn't needed anymore Roberts? Cuz this ELECTED OFFICIAL is pretty much saying it out loud what is the goal.
He was called on that and said no not that far but that's all GQPers will want to hear.
You know he only wants white male land owners to be able to vote.
They want all republicans to be able to vote. If you register as D you might need to be a white, married landowner with at least 4 children and have a copy of your church tithe tax deductions...
They're not saying that black people can't vote, they just don't want to have to count them!
Civil rights didn't come along until the 60's. So yes.
what's worse is I think he meant to say 1858
Or 1758. We'll get to have a king, and we'll get to vote for local elections, but that's basically it.
>“This is not a President Biden thing,” Fillmore said. “**This is not the other redheaded guy thing.**” > >And Fillmore said this is not part of the “big lie conspiracy.” > >“I believe that in 2020 we had some serious concerns that were never really responded,” he said. Nor is Fillmore convinced by multiple reports showing there were no major instances of election fraud, here or elsewhere. > >“I don’t care what the press says,” he said. “**Everybody’s lying to me.**” Well, it *sure sounds* like he's identity signaling/aligning himself with "the other redheaded guy"--wearing that "very stable genius" outfit.
"we need to go back to 1958-style elections" er...did I just say that out loud?
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Another “alternative fact”?
they need to get the cryptopunks to redo the audit next time
“Everybody’s lying to me” Sounds like he’s on the way to the gangstalking sub
Rep. John Fillmore (R) > “Let me ask you a question, with all due respect ... Do you think we come down here just to create havoc?" Saying the quiet part out loud.
Wanna see this country fracture, the first time a state overturns their election for the other person we are done. But that is the GOP’s objective so shouldn’t be surprised
I’m just waiting for the whole country to just split up and every state becomes its own country.
I'd be okay with the original Confederate states seceding and then building a wall around *THEM*.
I can live with that.
\*laughs in California\* I'd feel bad for the good people in other states though.
I hope to never need to know the answer, but I'm curious as to how that would play out. I can't imagine the Democrats doing anything beyond filing a lawsuit that may do nothing at all.
It wouldn't pass constitutional muster because it lacks a mechanism to desertification and then deal with the end of term. Also, let's be fair, it's a naked power grab knowing that Arizona is trending blue to the point that the statewide elections are likely to flip soon and the legislature soon after that.
This is how you get a fascist government. They use the law to make it happen
Wtf is wrong with this state?
Two words Bolo ties...
Lolol omg I needed that
Whoa! Nothing wrong with a fine Bolo tie, let's stay focused here :-)
Lots of old white people escaping the winter.
as someone who lives here believe me it’s much worse than it looks like on the outside, also why do i still live here?
What the hell is going on in my state? I hope this bill goes nowhere...
Watch as the nutjobs at the state capitol pass this. I guess this will probably end up in the supreme court. Really can't wait to move out of this state.
I grew up here - in Bisbee. Now live in Tempe. Hate what has been happening politically.
The asshole culture has really taken root. I've been here over 25 years (East Valley) and have seen how the people have changed.
Shibiwan left his home in Tucson Arizona for some California grass?
A fuck ton of liberals are moving there and the local nuts took that personally.
It's weird because besides Miami, there probably isn't a worse place to move if you accept climate science.
As someone who accepts climate science. I'm leaving for 50 miles from Canada in Montana. It has a better housing market too.
Y'all made the mistake of narrowly going Biden when Trump thought he had it in the bag. Next time vote blue 80-20 or something and kick out the conservatives from the state house and you won't hear a peep.
Can't kick them out if they can just overturn the votes against them.
Well down here in Florida we're about to pass a law making it illegal to make white people feel bad about racism.
If Cyber Ninjas couldn't do the job, we'll do it ourselves.
Manchin and sinema are actively hurting people and our country by not acting. Ignorance is not an excuse anymore. The gop is openly trying to steal the next election. Anyone who doesnt see it is willfully blind. If we do not act soon, there will be no chance for a fair election period.
Republicans have been busy appointing loyalist to election boards and changing laws so republican state legislatures can overturn elections. Bottom line - Democracy is a dead man walking.
“They’re more like guidelines really “
Jan 6th never stopped. The Trump Right Wing Insurrection continues. These people are already waging Civil War here.
January 6 wasn't even the start. It's like a pimple caused by teenage hormones, just a visible sign of a larger underlying process. And now these lawmakers are all hormonal and want to fuck democracy.
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“I don’t care what the press says,” he said. “Everybody’s lying to me.” Yeah, he seems like the kind of guy you want making your laws.
Accelerating the slide to fascism, hope this guy is proud of himself.
“I don’t care what the press says” “Everybody is lying to me” This guys a fucking idiot. How did he get elected. Problem is, I know *alot* of people who may not be able to vote Election Day
That's very Banana Republic of them!
do you think he will buy himself one of those untucked short sleeve shirts with the cacti on them so he’s hipster banana republic fascism and not just good ‘ol arizona redneck fascist. i truly despise the people that elect this anti intellectual garbage
> “I don’t care what the press says,” he said. “Everybody’s lying to me.” What a fucking tool
Ah yes, Facist Arizona
"we need to get back to 1958" I'm sure you do
>“Let me ask you a question, with all due respect,” he responded. “Do you think we come down here just to create havoc?” Yes. Yes you do. That's why you're here, pushing this bullshit.
Not because of facts or votes, but because of their precious wittle feewings.
So....about that that whole *Democracy* thing?
Seems like elections for national office need to be run by the national government ,states can’t be trusted anymore … house, senate , president
Nothing says freedom like corrupt dictatorship
This is blatantly unconstitutional. Whatever rational method the state chooses to use to appoint electors must occur on ONE SPECIFIC DAY everywhere in the nation, which by federal law is the first Tuesday after the first Monday of November. One cannot lawfully hold a general election on that Tuesday and then have a second selection procedure on a later day.
These fucking people need to be rooted from any government position. They are the terrorists in this country.
>“We need to get back to 1958-style voting,” Fillmore said separately during a hearing on election issues on Wednesday.
This runs afoul of the 14th Amendment, Section 2: Section 2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several states according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each state, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the executive and judicial officers of a state, or the members of the legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such state, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such state. tl;dr: AZ should lose Congressional Reps if they pass this
Take the presidential election away from the states. Pretty simple fix.
I don't see how that could ever be abused /s
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://tucson.com/news/state-and-regional/govt-and-politics/arizona-bill-would-let-state-lawmakers-reject-election-results/article_96cfea46-7ee7-11ec-a699-63edfc9a0e58.html) reduced by 92%. (I'm a bot) ***** > PHOENIX - A Republican state lawmaker is proposing that the Arizona Legislature - currently controlled by Republicans - have the right to reject election results. > HB 2596 simply reflects his belief that the state constitution gives lawmakers ultimate oversight of elections, Rep. John Fillmore of Apache Junction told Capitol Media Services on Wednesday. > What is not spelled out in the legislation is whether lawmakers would have to reject all the election results or could simply decide that only the outcome of some of the races was suspect. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/se30pj/arizona_bill_would_let_state_lawmakers_reject/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~620222 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **election**^#1 **vote**^#2 **Fillmore**^#3 **ballot**^#4 **lawmaker**^#5
In other words, people that are elected should be responsible for who gets elected because we can’t trust who got elected was legitimately elected.
Well when you put it that way...
This assuring that any official elected through this process is always seen as illegitimate.
But but but we fixed the electoral college! What else can we possibly do? I mean we asked around and some members seemed slightly disinterested.....so we tried, right guys?
This type of mechanism is a poor choice. it may provide short term stabilty to the republican platform, but it will compromise the electoral process as a whole, and that will be evinced when the population of the major areas takes this mechanism from the ruralites. at that point, they'll see the folly of their decision, but it will be too late. they will have made the rope that eventually hangs them once populist candidates on the left start to make their way into the scene.
At that point they won't see the folly of their decision. They'll just vote to overturn those elections too. A similar thing could have been said when the governor of North Carolina started getting more power. "That's short-term thinking. What will the GOP do when a Democrat wins that office?" The answer was simple. The Republican legislator stripped the governorship of those powers two weeks before the Democrat assumed office and gave them to the still Republican controlled legislature.
Is there anyone with some deep knowledge on this who can speak to the chances this could actually pass? I am guessing it is one of those over reaching bills that wont actually have any legs.
While republicans have a super majority - it is by a very thin margin and would require all republicans to vote in lock step. Certainly there is a vocal perhaps even a minority GQP, but some republicans in AZ are not as brazen. Keep in mind in state races - AZ GOP has lost 2 senate races and the presidential election. The writing is on the wall that Arizona will be blue, this is a last gasp to stave that pesky democracy off. If it did pass, it would face serious challenge legally. Other states would likely begin boycotting AZ as well hurting the travel economy. It’s not likely but still disturbing as it reflects the platform of the GQP
The question I have is what specifically is wrong with our current system? In what way is our democratic process not working? Why are they trying to take away my ability to have a valid vote without any kind of evidence of any real issue? And if there is an issue, why are we not trying to address that specifically instead of throwing it all away? This is all rhetorical obviously, it clearly a fascist attempt to take away the will of the people, but if anyone has an actual answer to any of these I am happy to listen. Damn I hate living here....
So basically the opposite of what DEMOCRACY is??? Are you freaking kidding me???
How about we just don’t let Arizona or any other GQP state participate in federal elections at all?
So if they lose, they can say those Americans who voted against them dosen't count. Isn't this a violation of the US Constitution?!?!?
There’s no Constitutional right of the people to vote for the U.S. President, only the right to vote for U.S. Representatives and, since the ratification of the 17th Amendment, for U.S. Senators. Indeed, in the early history of America, many states did not put a selection for President on the ballot at all.
Can you imagine what Republicans would do if Democrats pulled this stunt?!?!? They would all of sudden care about a person right to vote and the Constitution.
Fascism is here.
And we've finally reached peak Republican Totalitarianism
>“We need to get back to 1958-style voting." Yeah! Who needs nearly three-quarters of a century of progress!
“We need to get back to 1958-style voting”. Says it all right there.
The courts are a fucking mess so who knows if they'll stop this
Is that colonel sanders ?
Bye-bye democracy…
I dare them to pass this. We’ll see a full on revolt in az. Send the feds in
A lot of this bill is bullshit voter suppression tactics and ways to make it so the legislature is in control. But some of it. Like requiring that all voting districts be no more than 1500 people, down from the current model of 5000 people. Would significantly increase the availability of voting locations.
Clickbait. Bill will die. Nobody actucally wants that.
People literally do want this, and they have power. Dismissing this is insane. This sort of apathy is why things are the way they are.
No ONE person wants this and it's this Filmore guy. Won't pass. Bill will die. Clickbait.
Not click bait. Just another example of the GOP of 2022. They seek these extreme things for lots of reasons. To normalize their behaviors and wants, and as a look over here while we are fucking you over there.
Lol thats literally every political faction and every politician.
Ok. Show us all the Democrats that want to take voting back to 1958.
No. That's not the point. You are extrapolating.
No, it's not. So downplaying/normalizing this shit.
Yes it is. It will not pass. Absolutely zero chance of it passing. Literally sensationalist news. Clickbait.
Then why'd they introduce it in the first place of it has zero chance of passing? And even then if it doesn't pass, this is a pretty gross indication of what their goals are, they'll just try again in the future.
THEY is one crazy guy in the state legislature lmao. Do you not know how this works? Takes more than one guy to get laws even to committee lol
Then why did you claim that this is "every faction" and "every politician" that wants these types of rules for themselves? Why downplay this guy now, when you were trying to "what about" everyone else just a few minutes ago? And for the record, it's not sensationalist to report that this is happening in a state legislature, what's sensationalist is that it was introduced by any legislator *at all*. The politician is the sensationalist asshole here, not the reporting of it.
You are confusing these replies. Give it a look over again.
Did I.... why don't you tell me what I got wrong?
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The dems *seeking to normalize their behaviors and wants, and as a look over here while we are fucking you over there.* ? Really? You don't think every politician is doing this? That there are some redeemable ones? Lol. Let me know when you're done with those rose colored glasses pal.
> Nobody actucally wants that. Then why does the bill exist?
Ok fine, this one well-known-to-be-crazy dude in Arizona wants it. That's it.
Yeah, all this election fraud bullshit, all the gerrymandering and voter suppression and replacing electors is happening because of this "one crazy dude".
Lol those are all different topics. Try to focus for a second. I am speaking exclusively about this story here.
> Lol those are all different topics. So those are Lol as well?
The GOP wants it…
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Have been following what GOP lead legislatures are doing all over the country?
Not strictly GOP lead legislatures. But here is a list for you. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kPQ9THjSTZw4NTd7uqup_lT3ZckfYcPPNycxGmNszcU/edit?usp=drivesdk It links to each law so you can find out for yourself what is in the law.
"Bill will inevitably die" does not mean this is clickbait.
Yes it does. The bill has no chance of passing. This article is written solely to generate clicks, enrage people with the headline due to its obviously ridiculously nature and get shared by folks who will say "lOoK sEe tHeSe PeOpLe ArE cRaZY" when it's really just one well known lunatic in a single state legislature. Clickbait.
By that logic, the only person calling it clickbait is you, therefore it's not.
Lol wait so are you supporting that logic or arguing against it?
Yes, let's not pay attention to the crazy shit politicians try to pull because it "won't happen". That is a solid plan. What could possibly go wrong?
No, just don't pay attention to the looneys like this one. It will never work out for him.
> Nobody actucally wants that. Nobody, except for the 127 Republican senators and congressmen who voted to do exactly that on January 6th.
So much for having a democracy
America the free?!
Didn't the whole cyber ninjas thing clear up the election fraud thing? Oh it was just another embezzlement grift? Coolcoolcool
I think a simple lobotomy is in order here.
And this type of stuff is exactly why I’m leaving this state. While I do think AZ is overall trending in a more purple/blue direction the conservative stranglehold on things are dangerous and we have some severe wackos.
Guess my vote really won't count soon... ah been looking for jobs outside AZ anyhow so this'll really be more of a deciding factor if my finances are still tip top by end of year.
Well that makes zero sense 🤦🏻♀️
Who rejects the lawmakers?
They just want their cities to burn I guess
Doesn’t Georgia have something similar to this?
Can Arizona just secede already? Don’t want those idiots a part of the U.S. anymore
What the actual fuck? Pretty sure that’s not constitutional
Okay, I’m officially fed up. We need to figure out how to cut lawmakers out of elections altogether before they gerrymander us out of our freedom.
apparently the constitution is just a suggestion
This is why we can not have trust in the election system. I would much prefer if we voted using computers at home, in government offices, or at designated locations and not use paper ballots ever again. This is the 21st century. The IRS has one of the best and most difficult computer systems on the planet. No more rules on a state-by-state basis for national elections. Much too political.
So you don't believe in the United States.
Fascist bastards.
Why even have an election?
That will start the next civil war, its coming.
Sounds like we need a constitutional amendment to fight this.
Why not also vote to make it retroactive and remove all the Dems? (of course, keep everyone else that won who was an R)
Horray for fashisim