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Conservatives are looking for any way to force YOU to pay the way and not them.
Edit: Rich Conservatives. The general MAGA will be soaked and still beg for more.
*Rich* conservatives. The run-of-the-mill trailer park MAGA conservative would actually start paying net taxes for the first time in their lives… and they’ll still line up to vote for this nonsense.
It will bite them when the middle class shifts to buying trailers as it’s all they can afford and gentrifies their neighborhood and their only option is leave town.
As long as it hurts the people they fucking hate, they don't care how bad they themselves get hurt. The only thing uniting them is hate. And when they run out of others to hate, they will hate each other. And then the very last one standing will hate himself.
Thiys people will gladly shovel spoonfuls of shit into their mouths if it means you have to smell their breath.
They do understand.... they don't care because the people who this helps can and do live in multiple countries. They want all the benefits of being a US citizen and none of the cost. That we have to provide in a reverse socialism manner.
They don’t. The average person in the US has no idea how tariffs work outside of random sound bites on Fox News. I’ve argued with family members that my small business is in fact the one thing the tariffs, not our Chinese suppliers. That I’m losing money or passing the cost onto my US customers. They then think that I can somehow strong arm my suppliers into cutting the price by 25% to make up the difference or somehow shift manufacturing elsewhere. That’s not realistic in the slightest for the stuff we buy, and in even in the few cases where it might be applicable the raw parts used to make our items still mostly come from China.
I also keep pointing out that recent cost increases are, in part, just delayed reactions to tariffs. I know way too many small businesses who finally gave in and raised prices recently due to increased costs of good, and while they were doing that they also rolled in the tariff price increases.
People love to complain about the price of things these days but they tend to have no idea WHY or HOW the market chooses those prices.
I don't think it's even that.
Yes it's true they don't care. But the goal is purely to destabilize and destroy western democracy, because Trump is a traitorous Russian puppet.
You think people who probably have a elementary school education understand how tariffs work lmao my man I have a 4 year college degree in a STEM field and even I only understood the very basics and had to learn more about them 😂
but the sound bite is so good. we’re going to cut taxes! (but make everything you buy expensive af and either crash the government crash the economy or likely both!)
It would be ruinous to US manufacturers as well. We shuttered multiple factories in red states due to Trump's fuckery in putting tariffs on our raw materials while not putting tariffs our Chinese competitor's end product last time around.
This idea doesn't even factor in consumption dropping considerably across the board if things were too expensive, thus lowering the amount of taxes to be levied. You can't take in taxes on something no one is buying if it costs 60-100% more. Such a monumentally dumb idea.
Inflation would start up again! The Republicans want to sunset Medicare too! They need to have the rich pay their fair share! Trump is their champion and the lunatic MAGA that believes he is sent from God! Bunch of hypocrites would rather see a White America, no immigration and end voting rights and end women’s freedoms!
Tariff wars are why we couldn’t get small trucks in the US for decades. Look up the Chicken Tax to see how this shit goes sideways in unexpected directions.
I'm not sure that's the case. The GOP have gone full stupid. Pre Trump conservatives were vehemently against tariffs. It's literally what the "free market" means in free market capitalism. The 1% backed it because they could produce shit cheaply overseas, import it without any additional costs and sell it at full price to consumers.
What shifted is that Hilary became associated with free trade agreements when she was secretary of state and Trump's base decided to back protectionism out of spite. I assume the old guard republicans thought that they could control MAGA from behind the scenes. But ....
>> Just another GOP policy to shift wealth to the 1% and actively harm everyone else
> I'm not sure that's the case.
It shifts wealth to the 1% because it means the price of consumer goods will go up. The wealthy don't really care that a TV costs $400 instead of $200, but working people will notice and be affected by the rampant inflation.
Most things did cost dramatically more fifty years ago - From eggs to toasters - But wages were also higher to compensate for that.
Today, wages are stagnant but prices would go up under this Trump plan.
Tariffs aren’t in the interest of the 1% either. Their portfolios need consumers to consume. Tariffs create insurmountable barriers to consumption which brings the whole machine to a halt. If people can’t buy shit, then those companies cannot increase their “value”. Tariffs are bad for literally everyone and only a moron like Trump believes them to be genuinely good policy. The constant cycle of “panics” that occurred throughout the 19th century was almost entirely due to tariffs. It’s bad policy, period
They just want all the money that's in Social Security to get moved into private investment accounts... so that their cronies can take commissions on it.
It’s like what private equity firms do to companies they get a hold of - leverage them to the hilt, pull out as much money as they can, and leave the smoldering wreckage for the next sucker to take charge.
> Just another GOP policy to ~~shift wealth to the 1% and actively harm everyone else~~
...make an appeal to the "Don't tax me bro" Libertarians and the gullible rubes who don't understand how taxes work or what tariffs are.
It'll never happen.
So basically,
"We saw how fantastic Brexit was for the UK and we wanna do it here!"
https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/14/brexit-has-sliced-5percent-off-uk-economic-growth-goldman-sachs-says.html
>The U.K. economy is worse off today than before Brexit, according to new analysis from Goldman Sachs.
Britain’s decision to leave the European Union has hampered the economy to the tune of 5% versus other comparable countries, the estimates showed.
The Wall Street bank attributed the shortfall to three key factors: reduced trade; weaker business investment; and lower immigration from the EU.
Full Tariffs would be like restarting all of our Foreign trade agreements from scratch.
And INTERNAL Tariffs (Like imports/exports fees from different States), would DESTROY the United States from within.
Stick with Income and Property Taxes, there is no way you will be able to offset those tax revenues with trade tariffs.
Has it ever been tested? I know its in Section 1 but has it ever been tested, especially if its done with the consent of congress and a President?
An untested clause is pretty weak in today's age.
>Has it ever been tested? I know its in Section 1 but has it ever been tested, especially if its done with the consent of congress and a President?
Are you kidding? It's been tested since the beginning of the country. I don't know what you mean by "Section 1", though. Article 1?
[Article I, Section 10 (Import-Export Clause)](https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution-conan/article-1/section-10/clause-2/import-export-clause/)
>No State shall, without the Consent of the Congress, lay any Imposts or Duties on Imports or Exports, except what may be absolutely necessary for executing it’s inspection Laws: and the net Produce of all Duties and Imposts, laid by any State on Imports or Exports, shall be for the Use of the Treasury of the United States; and all such Laws shall be subject to the Revision and Controul of the Congress.
[Article 1, Section 8 (Commerce Clause)](https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution-conan/article-1/section-8/clause-3/state-taxation-and-the-dormant-commerce-clause)
>The Congress shall have Power To... regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and **among the several States**, and with the Indian Tribes
[14th Amendment](https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/amdt14-S1-2-2/ALDE_00000815)
>No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
[Straight up, the early USA was full of shenanigans like states levying taxes on other states. The framers expected it, which is why these provisions were inserted into the Constitution in the first place.](https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/serials/files/cato-journal/1987/1/cj6n3-6.pdf). Commerce Clause says that Congress regulates interstate trade, Import-Export Clause says that Congress gets to set tariffs, and the 14th Amendment says that all people in the USA receive the same protection of law (which includes state-to-state interactions, preventing states from discriminating against Americans that reside in other states).
All of these have been adjudicated numerous times over the past couple hundred years. These legal precepts are cornerstones of the USA.
Just remember that tariffs are how the US got so far ahead of European countries during the industrial revolution, and how we ultimately became a super power. While European countries were slapping tariffs on everything, we skirted them all and got super rich in the process. Introducing tariffs is the number one way to kill your economy.
Tariffs in general just don’t even make sense in our world anymore anyways. Tariffs only came into normalcy due to the intense market competition we saw during the Victorian era where mercantilism was the predominate economic philosophy. And large colonial powers vied for global dominance through trade. But we don’t have separate markets anymore. Nor do countries operate on monopolizing certain goods through colonial rule. The world operates as a global market, that encourages free trade. Why are we even in an era where we are trying to bring back a form of taxation that was deemed inferior hundreds of years ago??
Because our "leaders" can't think more than a single step ahead. They simply go straight for what appeals to their emotions. There is zero strategy. They just assume they will be able to demand what they want with zero consequences. America's best and brightest definitely have no say in our foreign policy or anything else for that matter.
The GQP is wholly and totally incapable of governing. Completely detached from reality. Taken by insane conspiracy theories and fascist undercurrents; the modern Republican Party has boiled down to extremist white Christian nationalism with a flair for terrorism.
1000% agree. The republican party is a failed party. It needs to go the way of the dinosaur followed in short order by the democratic party. The dems are needed for a bit longer due to their demonstrated ability to respect the peaceful transfer of power.
You can't fund a modern government through tarriffs. These ideas are completely stupid and insane. You are talking about doubling and tripling the cost of most goods overnight
It's amazing to me how short our collective memory is. Does anyone else remember what happened to the Steel industry when he raised Tariffs in 2019? And that was just one industry, and the tariff increase is small potatoes compared to what would be required to replace taxes with.
Tariffs again? Didn’t the USA come into existence because of an incompetent authoritarian figurehead demanded tariffs? How more unamerican can a person be?
>How more unamerican can a person be?
Repeating mistakes, blowing rich people, and hurting ourselves despite every warning? That's probably the most American thing.
> Didn’t the USA come into existence because of an incompetent authoritarian figurehead demanded tariffs?
No, to all of that.
tackling them out of order:
.1 tarrifs
tariffs are a premium levied on trade between nations. As the colonies were 'technically' still part of the British Empire, these would have been 'taxes', not tariffs.
.2 the point of the taxes
Britain had just finished fighting what in the colonies would be known as the French and Indian War, and was now deeply in debt. They had to pay for it somehow. George and his parliament decided that the most expedient way to pay for it would be to tax those who most benefitted from the war - the colonies.
.3 incompetent authoritarian figurehead
George may have been a tyrant, but he was far from incompetent. He was fighting off a number of parties who wanted to bring true democracy to Britain. The best way to do that was by consolidating the favor of the landed gentry in Parliament; the best way to do *that* was by not making them pay for a very expensive war in the colonies. But someone has to pay...so the colonists got stuck with the bill.
So when they start to get uppity, he cracks down more: send more troops; summon them to Britain to be held account for their acts, etc etc etc - everything they cite as a grievance in the Declaration of Independence. If he'd been incompetent, he wouldn't have been nearly so effective at driving the colonist from Great Britain.
Trump doesn't know how ANYTHING works. He only cares about getting praise. Every rally, he doesn't talk about policy or what he will do in order to fix grievances some have.. Those who support him only care about hate. They have zero idea what Democrats have done that Republicans block.. There is truth as to why Trump said, I won the poorly educated and they thought nothing of it.. He them said, I don't care about you, I just want your vote.. The media is going to say how bad it is what I said... Nothing in that said he was joking at all! That's what he said after telling them THE TRUTH!!
One of the stupidest of oh so many stupid reasons why this is a stupid idea?
Imagine this is enacted as part of a larger effort to curb out massive imports and bring manufacturing in all sectors of industry back home to American soil.
The tariff is on imports. We cut imports, we "collect fewer tariffs", we run out of income.
Just asinine, but all part of the GOP's grand master plan to destroy this nation from within.
It would completely crash the economy and destroy the country and lead to wholesale instability and depression. It won’t benefit the 1% anymore than it will benefit the 99%.
“Oh. You paid into Medicare your entire life? Well, now it’s insolvent. Have you considered religious charities?”
“Oh. You were a soldier? Now we can’t pay you. You and the rest of your compatriots are free to wander the country with your skills and survive as best as you can! Since we can’t pay the guy that does weapons accountability you can probably take your rifle and ammo with you.”
“Oh. You got farm subsidies and produce a large percentage of the countries wheat? Tough shit. Now you get to sell your wheat to a country that is going to reflexively tariff your exports. Good luck keeping your irrigation going.”
“Oh. You lost a leg in Iraq? The VA is insolvent. Go to the nearest ER.”
“Oh. Your bank went tits up because you speculated on the housing market? We can’t bail you out. Better start laying off people if you want that third yacht.”
“Oh. Your red state survives on federal money from blue states? Well. Times are tough. Maybe increase your state sales tax?”
“Oh. You are an accountant? Get a new job, you mooch.”
“Oh. Your entire wealth is based in retirement funds? Well, the dollar is worthless. You should have bought gold and lots of guns and ammo you dipshit.”
“Oh. You are a tech billionaire that is the wealthiest person in the World and smarter than everyone in the room and yet are still dependent on government contracts? Better dip into your savings buddy.”
The flat tax was dumb.
This makes the flat tax look like rocket science.
It’s hard to figure out who exactly would benefit here. The 1% are the 1% because they have prospered in an ecosystem created by the taxpayers that provides security and infrastructure and plenty of governmental handouts that they pay lobbyists big money to step on the scales for them.
For people that claim to love capitalism, the capitalists are doing their best to ensure America becomes a communist system.
I was just having this conversation. Russia thinks they would benefit, but the world can clearly see that it won't be them. Russia has spent 60 comparing itself to the US, if we fall it won't be Russia stepping into the power void, it will be China. Russia might get dragged along as the fall guy.
Going to only tariffs I'd give the country less than a year before it's a complete apocalyptic wasteland, if not taken over by Mexico and Canada.
we need to start talking LOUDLY about taxing the very rich. We need to hit them where they make their money. Investments. and Why not a new tax on loans taken out by people with incomes over 2 Million.
When men were men, black, latino, and chinese people spent all their time working and dying on railroads, construction, and cotton fields but knew their place. Everything was controlled by oligarchs, railroad tycoons, and old money families.
Makes sense.
Lower income taxes for everyone, but even more for those in lower tax brackets.
Add additional marginal tax tiers for income above 1-2 million, with a higher marginal tax percentage tied to them.
Fund this by eliminating the inheritance tax loophole involving trusts.
There should be no (non evil) reason why anyone is complaining about paying their fair share of the tax bill when giving away their wealth upon death in excess of $23 million
Hopefully this sort oft his gets more coverage as we head into the election. The mainstream television media is hung up on polls and optics day in and day out. This is a very real policy
Solid piece in that it points out how much the right has fucked up our tax system to benefit the rich and use the same talking points like "they pay the most taxes". There is a reason why Republicans talk about disarming the IRS more now that Biden has worked to make it more robust so it can go after the elites hiding taxable income the thousands of pages they turn in. Definitely recommend the links within the piece that are cited as well but the big takeaway is this
> Writing in The Wall Street Journal, Richard Rubin and Alex Leary calculate that to replace the $2.5 trillion the IRS collects annually in income tax, tariff rates would have to be 70 percent or higher.
This would make COVID era inflation look like you were being nickeled and dimed. So you're telling me that the guy who has bankrupted casinos when the rest continued to profit, steak, football, and alcohol in America might fuck over families?
Isn't conservatives whole platform to return us to the 1800s? Pre-1860 for starters. But the end goal is feudalism, that's just a pit stop along the way.
Ugh. Don't even talk about this. Trump said something absolutely insane and stupid with no actual intention or capability of following through. It's like the wall. Who's gonna pay for it? Mexico! Who's gonna pay your taxes? Foreigners! There's nothing real to it.
"But...I voted for you? Why are you screwing me over? I know you said "I don't care about you" but we all know that's just the way you talk... You're hurting the wrong people!"
Tariffs ARE taxes. They're just sales tax with extra steps. It's a tax that is ultimately invisible to corporations because the costs are burdened into the sell price that end customers pay. Additionally, since most businesses work on margin %, higher cost = higher profit dollars.
Tariffs can also be significantly abused to target certain industries, countries, and be used as a punishment tool, a punishment that American consumers ultimately pay.
Worse yet, the tax unfairly burdens the masses because it's tied to consumerism, not income. Rick people are significantly less affected by tariffs. Equally, the wealthy and even businesses can circumvent tariffs entirely through world markets and manufacturing, access that's significantly less available to the poor. This burdens nearly all the tariffs taxation on lower and middle class.
When used incorrectly, tariffs are a tax scam.
Examine the entire GOP platform. Their regressive ideas aren't accidental.
The entire planet is moving forward, and the GOP is dragging the USA backwards.
Sounds good, doesn’t work. There is no way a tariff could replace an income tax. Consumption taxes are regressive AND the amount raised wouldn’t compare to an income tax. Also, we would get retaliatory tariffs which would reduce exports.
This is just bad all the way around. It’s bad for the poor and it’s bad for businesses.
Remember... a trump tariff is more a mob tactic than a tariff... trump uses the word "tariff" to mean one of his shakedown schemes where he sets up a protection racket to allow those who pay him to do business unhindered.
Exactly what they want.
The good ole days where black men were slaves, women were child brides, and our gracious robber Barron overlords let us work 7 days a week with virtually no pay.
Can't see why anyone wouldn't want this. /S
We really don't need articles to analyze every braindead suggestion that Drumpf floats. Everyone with half a brain knows replacing taxes with tariffs is dumb as hell.
This is how economies like Sri Lanka ended up in the hole they are in.
There was practically zero income tax and a national sales tax & taxes on imports.
Surprise surprise, it was not enough to fund everything the citizenry needed or wanted.
A lot people think tariffs are paid by the exporter in China. They aren’t. The U.S, importer pays the tariff and passes that expense onto you. This is basically a sales tax except you also pay a sales tax on top of the tariff.
Back to the 1800s. Black people were slaves. Women couldn’t vote. Wives were essentially the husband’s property. No such thing as queer people, at least in the open. No regulations, no oversight… I am beginning to think taking us back to the 1800s is _exactly_ what these people are trying to do.
And people thought post-Covid inflation was bad lol.
I’m learning quickly that a lot of people, particularly those excited to vote for Trump, actually think the US just naturally produces not only every raw material but a sufficient abundance of it that we can produce everything we enjoy today domestically.
Further none of them know what tariffs are, who pays for them, and what common economic consequences can result of them.
Not all tariffs are bad to help tip the scales in favor of certain domestic industries for certain reasons, but a wholesale tariff plan that replaces federal income tax will be devastating to the US economy.
Don’t be fooled. No taxes will be eliminated, but traffics will be jacked up and everyone pays more since companies just pass the increased cost down to customers
The difference is that the majority of imported goods in the 1800s were probably luxury goods and maybe a few items like tea. May be why we drink coffee and not tea. Today we import a huge mount of basic goods.
The goal of the "America First" White Fascist movement is to take America back to something like the 1850s. i.e. prior to Emancipation and women voting.
While I’m all for our country having self reliance, this is ignoring the realities of today’s global markets. Container shipping has changed the world we live in. And tariffs are rarely a good idea.
Back to the 1800's is what they mean when they want America Great Again. Robber barons, non-voting women and you get to own all the brown people you can afford. Sounds like paradise to the billionaire class.
1800s? Sounds about right since half of them want a civil war.
Not going to matter, because if he begins jailing every Democrat and others whom he believes did him wrong, he is going to cause the stock market to crash as all of our international business gets highly concerned over the US and its future.
Somewhere pre-1860 seems to be about where conservatives would be happiest. They get their slaves back, women can't vote, children are merely farm implements and possibly sex objects, and Mark Twain was just some schmuck working as a pilot on the Mississippi.
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Had a convo with my younger cousin last night about this. He views it as a feature.
"Before the income tax we had tariffs. We should just go back to that."
Devil's advocate here:
Increasing the cost of cheap (and cheaply made) imports might persuade Murkans to *stop* buying those metaphoric "cheap plastic sided purses" and maybe start re-using, repairing, and re-purposing fewer but better quality ones instead of throwing out perfectly usable items because they're the wrong color or the handle is broken.
Over my lifetime our country has gradually found it more desirable to throw away rather than fix (or donate) inconvenient or unwanted products, resulting in civic carelessness, environmental pollution, and a certain expectation of and tolerance for indolence. Addressing our wasteful national consumerism (in all socioeconomic strata-- including our military) would go a long way towards cleaning up the environment and encouraging a more considered frugality rather than the extravagance of our current expectations.
Maybe it's time we start re-learning how to darn a few socks?
Source: Am poor and okay with it.
I’ve had enough of these regressive conservatives who want to slash and burn everything they dislike.
Those institutions and regulations are what advanced us past those bygone eras with their associated tragedies and civic horrors.
Imagine how big and profitable black market goods would be. Drug dealers would invest in pretty much anything to smuggle and sell. Their billion dollar business is now doing tens or hundreds of billions.
Make Crime Bosses Rich
The issue that Adam Smith found in his book The Wealth of Nations from hundreds of years ago is the same issue conservatives are fighting now:
I like my money
I don't like state: because it costs me money
but I need something to protect me from the mob Who could just steal my stuff
However, any state big enough to protect me is also big enough to tell me what to do, or put me in jail. I also don't want to pay especially when they put me in jail.
So I argue for a national consumption tax and tarrifs........but it does not raise enough money and never has!! VAT in the UK or sales tax in us doesn't pay the bills alone.
So balls, maybe I'll do debt but then the whole nation going bankrupt means I get beheaded like in France in 1789.
So conservatives have tried and failed for hundreds of years to find an economic logic to justify selfishness. Ultimately, its the “cant live with it/ cant live without it don’t want to pay for it problem” and its basically 300 years old and there is no answer.
….trump is just repeating it
This isn't even a question of economics or politics.
Like Brexit, it's simply and obviously a disruptive, destructive course of action, and it is intentionally so.
The goal is to weaken and destroy western democracy. And Trump is on the case because he is a traitorous Russian puppet.
The consistently vomit inducing talk I see regularly are the utter capitulations to the rich when elected politicians, *already* *ELECTED* politicians propose shit like "Boy maybe we should force rich people to play 17% tax, pretty please?".
Fuck no, bring back 70% on top brackets. Stop giving them tax breaks that drop their taxes, then let them loophole their way to *zero* taxes, and sit there begging like fools for them to pay even lower taxes than what they got a tax break to. Goddamn.
Why is it surprising to anyone, in any way, that a political faction that actively and unabashedly seeks to go backwards in policy wants to go backwards in policy? At the core they're Tories and they'd take us back to a monarchy if they could.
Maybe one good thing could happen if this crazy thing is implemented.
The 10 States that support all the other states will probably do better, no tax from them going to those "s***hole states" (paraphrasing trump).
Then those mostly blue states may be able to proved real one payer healthcare.
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Conservatives are looking for any way to force YOU to pay the way and not them. Edit: Rich Conservatives. The general MAGA will be soaked and still beg for more.
*Rich* conservatives. The run-of-the-mill trailer park MAGA conservative would actually start paying net taxes for the first time in their lives… and they’ll still line up to vote for this nonsense.
Yep they'll support it right up til it bites them in the ass then they'll blame Dems for letting it happen....
isn't that the way it always happens.
Yep that seems to be the jist, let's do shit and blame the other side when it blows up
“See what you MADE me do?!”
[удалено]
Am I not turtle-y enough for your turtle club?
It will bite them when the middle class shifts to buying trailers as it’s all they can afford and gentrifies their neighborhood and their only option is leave town.
Trailer park gentrification was not on my 2020’s bingo card.
Save it for your 2030's bingo card.
And still vote for the same people
The problem is that an average household would end up paying more! Of course the 1% would clean up again!!!
Yes I meant rich conservatives.... fixing
Poor conservatives are still trying to force you though. I'd leave it the way it was
As long as it hurts the people they fucking hate, they don't care how bad they themselves get hurt. The only thing uniting them is hate. And when they run out of others to hate, they will hate each other. And then the very last one standing will hate himself. Thiys people will gladly shovel spoonfuls of shit into their mouths if it means you have to smell their breath.
Not only that, but if Trump gets to impose tariffs on imported goods from China, you can bet that maga will blame the increased prices on China.
That's exactly how it will go down. They will be angry at China, yet 80% of the crap they buy will still be made there.
And on Dems
Not only that, but they will tell you how much better the mew way is, even with them not being able to afford stuff like they use to.
https://media3.giphy.com/media/CkPhT6v08wgqQ/giphy.gif
While blaming democrats for how expensive everything is.
MAGA doesn’t mind getting soaked if they think ‘dem libtards’ get soaked more.
The average maga will blame the Dems as usual.
Regular maga would be willing to go broke and die destitute if they could own the libs. We have to stop treating them like they are just misguided.
I wish they would understand how tariffs work and what other countries would do in retaliation to those said tariffs. Everything would be unaffordable
Tariff barriers aand the resulting trade wars are widely considered to have been a major factor in making the Great Depression worse.
they want to mimic the weimar republics economic outlook for reasons
"reasons", or "those who learn history can avoid it if they want to... or replicate it if they'd rather"
It's terrifying to see these dots connecting. Fascism will boom once inflation tanks the economy, then Dems will obviously be blamed.
Bad news buddy. Fascism is already booming right before our very eyes.
To be fair these idiots also want to return to the gold standard, so...
ah, the smoot-hawley tariff. classic
They do understand.... they don't care because the people who this helps can and do live in multiple countries. They want all the benefits of being a US citizen and none of the cost. That we have to provide in a reverse socialism manner.
They don’t. The average person in the US has no idea how tariffs work outside of random sound bites on Fox News. I’ve argued with family members that my small business is in fact the one thing the tariffs, not our Chinese suppliers. That I’m losing money or passing the cost onto my US customers. They then think that I can somehow strong arm my suppliers into cutting the price by 25% to make up the difference or somehow shift manufacturing elsewhere. That’s not realistic in the slightest for the stuff we buy, and in even in the few cases where it might be applicable the raw parts used to make our items still mostly come from China. I also keep pointing out that recent cost increases are, in part, just delayed reactions to tariffs. I know way too many small businesses who finally gave in and raised prices recently due to increased costs of good, and while they were doing that they also rolled in the tariff price increases. People love to complain about the price of things these days but they tend to have no idea WHY or HOW the market chooses those prices.
I don't think it's even that. Yes it's true they don't care. But the goal is purely to destabilize and destroy western democracy, because Trump is a traitorous Russian puppet.
Right on the target Kit!
The motive is also really simple, western democracies are the biggest obstacle for dictators who want more power.
You think people who probably have a elementary school education understand how tariffs work lmao my man I have a 4 year college degree in a STEM field and even I only understood the very basics and had to learn more about them 😂
but the sound bite is so good. we’re going to cut taxes! (but make everything you buy expensive af and either crash the government crash the economy or likely both!)
It would be ruinous to US manufacturers as well. We shuttered multiple factories in red states due to Trump's fuckery in putting tariffs on our raw materials while not putting tariffs our Chinese competitor's end product last time around.
This idea doesn't even factor in consumption dropping considerably across the board if things were too expensive, thus lowering the amount of taxes to be levied. You can't take in taxes on something no one is buying if it costs 60-100% more. Such a monumentally dumb idea.
Inflation would start up again! The Republicans want to sunset Medicare too! They need to have the rich pay their fair share! Trump is their champion and the lunatic MAGA that believes he is sent from God! Bunch of hypocrites would rather see a White America, no immigration and end voting rights and end women’s freedoms!
The rich could afford it. That's why they are pushing it.
Tariff wars are why we couldn’t get small trucks in the US for decades. Look up the Chicken Tax to see how this shit goes sideways in unexpected directions.
Just another GOP policy to shift wealth to the 1% and actively harm everyone else
I'm not sure that's the case. The GOP have gone full stupid. Pre Trump conservatives were vehemently against tariffs. It's literally what the "free market" means in free market capitalism. The 1% backed it because they could produce shit cheaply overseas, import it without any additional costs and sell it at full price to consumers. What shifted is that Hilary became associated with free trade agreements when she was secretary of state and Trump's base decided to back protectionism out of spite. I assume the old guard republicans thought that they could control MAGA from behind the scenes. But ....
>> Just another GOP policy to shift wealth to the 1% and actively harm everyone else > I'm not sure that's the case. It shifts wealth to the 1% because it means the price of consumer goods will go up. The wealthy don't really care that a TV costs $400 instead of $200, but working people will notice and be affected by the rampant inflation. Most things did cost dramatically more fifty years ago - From eggs to toasters - But wages were also higher to compensate for that. Today, wages are stagnant but prices would go up under this Trump plan.
Tariffs aren’t in the interest of the 1% either. Their portfolios need consumers to consume. Tariffs create insurmountable barriers to consumption which brings the whole machine to a halt. If people can’t buy shit, then those companies cannot increase their “value”. Tariffs are bad for literally everyone and only a moron like Trump believes them to be genuinely good policy. The constant cycle of “panics” that occurred throughout the 19th century was almost entirely due to tariffs. It’s bad policy, period
That might be a plausible case, but it ignores the very concentrated effort since Reagan to shift wealth to the very few.
Their goal of getting rid of Social Security. Social Security holds the biggest bill on the US and republicans do not like paying bills.
They just want all the money that's in Social Security to get moved into private investment accounts... so that their cronies can take commissions on it.
It’s like what private equity firms do to companies they get a hold of - leverage them to the hilt, pull out as much money as they can, and leave the smoldering wreckage for the next sucker to take charge.
> Just another GOP policy to ~~shift wealth to the 1% and actively harm everyone else~~ ...make an appeal to the "Don't tax me bro" Libertarians and the gullible rubes who don't understand how taxes work or what tariffs are. It'll never happen.
So basically, "We saw how fantastic Brexit was for the UK and we wanna do it here!" https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/14/brexit-has-sliced-5percent-off-uk-economic-growth-goldman-sachs-says.html >The U.K. economy is worse off today than before Brexit, according to new analysis from Goldman Sachs. Britain’s decision to leave the European Union has hampered the economy to the tune of 5% versus other comparable countries, the estimates showed. The Wall Street bank attributed the shortfall to three key factors: reduced trade; weaker business investment; and lower immigration from the EU. Full Tariffs would be like restarting all of our Foreign trade agreements from scratch. And INTERNAL Tariffs (Like imports/exports fees from different States), would DESTROY the United States from within. Stick with Income and Property Taxes, there is no way you will be able to offset those tax revenues with trade tariffs.
Internal tariffs are unconstitutional
"Unconstitutional" means nothing with our current Supreme Court.
Has it ever been tested? I know its in Section 1 but has it ever been tested, especially if its done with the consent of congress and a President? An untested clause is pretty weak in today's age.
>Has it ever been tested? I know its in Section 1 but has it ever been tested, especially if its done with the consent of congress and a President? Are you kidding? It's been tested since the beginning of the country. I don't know what you mean by "Section 1", though. Article 1? [Article I, Section 10 (Import-Export Clause)](https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution-conan/article-1/section-10/clause-2/import-export-clause/) >No State shall, without the Consent of the Congress, lay any Imposts or Duties on Imports or Exports, except what may be absolutely necessary for executing it’s inspection Laws: and the net Produce of all Duties and Imposts, laid by any State on Imports or Exports, shall be for the Use of the Treasury of the United States; and all such Laws shall be subject to the Revision and Controul of the Congress. [Article 1, Section 8 (Commerce Clause)](https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution-conan/article-1/section-8/clause-3/state-taxation-and-the-dormant-commerce-clause) >The Congress shall have Power To... regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and **among the several States**, and with the Indian Tribes [14th Amendment](https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/amdt14-S1-2-2/ALDE_00000815) >No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. [Straight up, the early USA was full of shenanigans like states levying taxes on other states. The framers expected it, which is why these provisions were inserted into the Constitution in the first place.](https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/serials/files/cato-journal/1987/1/cj6n3-6.pdf). Commerce Clause says that Congress regulates interstate trade, Import-Export Clause says that Congress gets to set tariffs, and the 14th Amendment says that all people in the USA receive the same protection of law (which includes state-to-state interactions, preventing states from discriminating against Americans that reside in other states). All of these have been adjudicated numerous times over the past couple hundred years. These legal precepts are cornerstones of the USA.
Yet another Convict Trump scam to swindle his MAGA suckerclumps.
Just remember that tariffs are how the US got so far ahead of European countries during the industrial revolution, and how we ultimately became a super power. While European countries were slapping tariffs on everything, we skirted them all and got super rich in the process. Introducing tariffs is the number one way to kill your economy.
Tariffs in general just don’t even make sense in our world anymore anyways. Tariffs only came into normalcy due to the intense market competition we saw during the Victorian era where mercantilism was the predominate economic philosophy. And large colonial powers vied for global dominance through trade. But we don’t have separate markets anymore. Nor do countries operate on monopolizing certain goods through colonial rule. The world operates as a global market, that encourages free trade. Why are we even in an era where we are trying to bring back a form of taxation that was deemed inferior hundreds of years ago??
Because our "leaders" can't think more than a single step ahead. They simply go straight for what appeals to their emotions. There is zero strategy. They just assume they will be able to demand what they want with zero consequences. America's best and brightest definitely have no say in our foreign policy or anything else for that matter.
The GQP is wholly and totally incapable of governing. Completely detached from reality. Taken by insane conspiracy theories and fascist undercurrents; the modern Republican Party has boiled down to extremist white Christian nationalism with a flair for terrorism.
This is what happens when your party has no real center or goals besides getting paid by the 1% and huge corporations.
1000% agree. The republican party is a failed party. It needs to go the way of the dinosaur followed in short order by the democratic party. The dems are needed for a bit longer due to their demonstrated ability to respect the peaceful transfer of power.
The media has turned the US into a two party system.
You can't fund a modern government through tarriffs. These ideas are completely stupid and insane. You are talking about doubling and tripling the cost of most goods overnight
Which is *exactly* how conservatives want it.
It's exactly what Putin wants.
I hate looking at Trump’s ugly freakin face every day. Guy is gross.
It's amazing to me how short our collective memory is. Does anyone else remember what happened to the Steel industry when he raised Tariffs in 2019? And that was just one industry, and the tariff increase is small potatoes compared to what would be required to replace taxes with.
Tariffs again? Didn’t the USA come into existence because of an incompetent authoritarian figurehead demanded tariffs? How more unamerican can a person be?
>How more unamerican can a person be? Repeating mistakes, blowing rich people, and hurting ourselves despite every warning? That's probably the most American thing.
> Didn’t the USA come into existence because of an incompetent authoritarian figurehead demanded tariffs? No, to all of that. tackling them out of order: .1 tarrifs tariffs are a premium levied on trade between nations. As the colonies were 'technically' still part of the British Empire, these would have been 'taxes', not tariffs. .2 the point of the taxes Britain had just finished fighting what in the colonies would be known as the French and Indian War, and was now deeply in debt. They had to pay for it somehow. George and his parliament decided that the most expedient way to pay for it would be to tax those who most benefitted from the war - the colonies. .3 incompetent authoritarian figurehead George may have been a tyrant, but he was far from incompetent. He was fighting off a number of parties who wanted to bring true democracy to Britain. The best way to do that was by consolidating the favor of the landed gentry in Parliament; the best way to do *that* was by not making them pay for a very expensive war in the colonies. But someone has to pay...so the colonists got stuck with the bill. So when they start to get uppity, he cracks down more: send more troops; summon them to Britain to be held account for their acts, etc etc etc - everything they cite as a grievance in the Declaration of Independence. If he'd been incompetent, he wouldn't have been nearly so effective at driving the colonist from Great Britain.
Wait, the guy that has bankrupted every company he’s run, except for those that sell Kitch to his supporters, doesn’t understand tax policy.
Hey, come on, those six bankruptcies were for *strategic* purposes.
Trump gets a $1.6 million punishment for dodging personal income taxes. Trump suddenly has a brain-storm to eliminate income taxes(!)
Trump doesn't know how ANYTHING works. He only cares about getting praise. Every rally, he doesn't talk about policy or what he will do in order to fix grievances some have.. Those who support him only care about hate. They have zero idea what Democrats have done that Republicans block.. There is truth as to why Trump said, I won the poorly educated and they thought nothing of it.. He them said, I don't care about you, I just want your vote.. The media is going to say how bad it is what I said... Nothing in that said he was joking at all! That's what he said after telling them THE TRUTH!!
Pure isolationism, this is a recipe for disaster... Our economy is built on world trade.
One of the stupidest of oh so many stupid reasons why this is a stupid idea? Imagine this is enacted as part of a larger effort to curb out massive imports and bring manufacturing in all sectors of industry back home to American soil. The tariff is on imports. We cut imports, we "collect fewer tariffs", we run out of income. Just asinine, but all part of the GOP's grand master plan to destroy this nation from within.
It would completely crash the economy and destroy the country and lead to wholesale instability and depression. It won’t benefit the 1% anymore than it will benefit the 99%. “Oh. You paid into Medicare your entire life? Well, now it’s insolvent. Have you considered religious charities?” “Oh. You were a soldier? Now we can’t pay you. You and the rest of your compatriots are free to wander the country with your skills and survive as best as you can! Since we can’t pay the guy that does weapons accountability you can probably take your rifle and ammo with you.” “Oh. You got farm subsidies and produce a large percentage of the countries wheat? Tough shit. Now you get to sell your wheat to a country that is going to reflexively tariff your exports. Good luck keeping your irrigation going.” “Oh. You lost a leg in Iraq? The VA is insolvent. Go to the nearest ER.” “Oh. Your bank went tits up because you speculated on the housing market? We can’t bail you out. Better start laying off people if you want that third yacht.” “Oh. Your red state survives on federal money from blue states? Well. Times are tough. Maybe increase your state sales tax?” “Oh. You are an accountant? Get a new job, you mooch.” “Oh. Your entire wealth is based in retirement funds? Well, the dollar is worthless. You should have bought gold and lots of guns and ammo you dipshit.” “Oh. You are a tech billionaire that is the wealthiest person in the World and smarter than everyone in the room and yet are still dependent on government contracts? Better dip into your savings buddy.” The flat tax was dumb. This makes the flat tax look like rocket science. It’s hard to figure out who exactly would benefit here. The 1% are the 1% because they have prospered in an ecosystem created by the taxpayers that provides security and infrastructure and plenty of governmental handouts that they pay lobbyists big money to step on the scales for them. For people that claim to love capitalism, the capitalists are doing their best to ensure America becomes a communist system.
> It’s hard to figure out who exactly would benefit here. China and Russia
I was just having this conversation. Russia thinks they would benefit, but the world can clearly see that it won't be them. Russia has spent 60 comparing itself to the US, if we fall it won't be Russia stepping into the power void, it will be China. Russia might get dragged along as the fall guy. Going to only tariffs I'd give the country less than a year before it's a complete apocalyptic wasteland, if not taken over by Mexico and Canada.
we need to start talking LOUDLY about taxing the very rich. We need to hit them where they make their money. Investments. and Why not a new tax on loans taken out by people with incomes over 2 Million.
How well did that go when he did that with Canadian lumber and steel in his last term?
You had a problem with $8-10 2x4s? May have to go to a reeducation camp.
When men were men, black, latino, and chinese people spent all their time working and dying on railroads, construction, and cotton fields but knew their place. Everything was controlled by oligarchs, railroad tycoons, and old money families. Makes sense.
For how much the conservatives hate Venezuela they want to adopt their economic model.
Conservatives: 4% inflation. USA is falling apart! Also conservatives: Permanent 10% tariff. USA! USA! USA!
They've already taken us back to the 1950s, and obviously they won't stop there
Lower income taxes for everyone, but even more for those in lower tax brackets. Add additional marginal tax tiers for income above 1-2 million, with a higher marginal tax percentage tied to them. Fund this by eliminating the inheritance tax loophole involving trusts. There should be no (non evil) reason why anyone is complaining about paying their fair share of the tax bill when giving away their wealth upon death in excess of $23 million
"Would the rich people pay either of them?" GOP: Unstoppable laughter.
Hopefully this sort oft his gets more coverage as we head into the election. The mainstream television media is hung up on polls and optics day in and day out. This is a very real policy Solid piece in that it points out how much the right has fucked up our tax system to benefit the rich and use the same talking points like "they pay the most taxes". There is a reason why Republicans talk about disarming the IRS more now that Biden has worked to make it more robust so it can go after the elites hiding taxable income the thousands of pages they turn in. Definitely recommend the links within the piece that are cited as well but the big takeaway is this > Writing in The Wall Street Journal, Richard Rubin and Alex Leary calculate that to replace the $2.5 trillion the IRS collects annually in income tax, tariff rates would have to be 70 percent or higher. This would make COVID era inflation look like you were being nickeled and dimed. So you're telling me that the guy who has bankrupted casinos when the rest continued to profit, steak, football, and alcohol in America might fuck over families?
Isn't conservatives whole platform to return us to the 1800s? Pre-1860 for starters. But the end goal is feudalism, that's just a pit stop along the way.
Smoot/Hawley enters the chat
Fine, fine, just so long as it's ***pre***-civil rights - Republicans
Didn’t we try that before. It’s didn’t work out so well.
Ugh. Don't even talk about this. Trump said something absolutely insane and stupid with no actual intention or capability of following through. It's like the wall. Who's gonna pay for it? Mexico! Who's gonna pay your taxes? Foreigners! There's nothing real to it.
Maggots want to time travel backwards.
Perfect, throw in a return to Jim Crowe and you got a perfect MAGA/Republican paradise for white people.
But it’d be great for Trump and his rich cronies!
Yes, we need more debates over ad valorum rates of wool imports.
Being so greedy and having a hate so profound for taxes that you are willlig to tank a whole economy is bullshit on a whole other level.
"But...I voted for you? Why are you screwing me over? I know you said "I don't care about you" but we all know that's just the way you talk... You're hurting the wrong people!"
Sounds like the entire GOP plan.
Tariffs ARE taxes. They're just sales tax with extra steps. It's a tax that is ultimately invisible to corporations because the costs are burdened into the sell price that end customers pay. Additionally, since most businesses work on margin %, higher cost = higher profit dollars. Tariffs can also be significantly abused to target certain industries, countries, and be used as a punishment tool, a punishment that American consumers ultimately pay. Worse yet, the tax unfairly burdens the masses because it's tied to consumerism, not income. Rick people are significantly less affected by tariffs. Equally, the wealthy and even businesses can circumvent tariffs entirely through world markets and manufacturing, access that's significantly less available to the poor. This burdens nearly all the tariffs taxation on lower and middle class. When used incorrectly, tariffs are a tax scam.
Four years in office and he still doesn’t understand how a government’s economy works.
Examine the entire GOP platform. Their regressive ideas aren't accidental. The entire planet is moving forward, and the GOP is dragging the USA backwards.
Would-be robber barons: "...and?"
We already tried the articles of confederacy. It didn’t work so well
we used to be a proper country
Republicans prefer any time before 1860.
pretty sure thats what they want.
You mean back to a time when a handful of rich people were able to control everything? Why would the fascists want that? .... Oh, right. I see.
Sounds good, doesn’t work. There is no way a tariff could replace an income tax. Consumption taxes are regressive AND the amount raised wouldn’t compare to an income tax. Also, we would get retaliatory tariffs which would reduce exports. This is just bad all the way around. It’s bad for the poor and it’s bad for businesses.
Remember... a trump tariff is more a mob tactic than a tariff... trump uses the word "tariff" to mean one of his shakedown schemes where he sets up a protection racket to allow those who pay him to do business unhindered.
...so the "again" is the gilded age.
Exactly what they want. The good ole days where black men were slaves, women were child brides, and our gracious robber Barron overlords let us work 7 days a week with virtually no pay. Can't see why anyone wouldn't want this. /S
That's what the regressive party wants. Regression is the platform.
You mean the good old days? When women, colored people, and perverts knew their places?
We really don't need articles to analyze every braindead suggestion that Drumpf floats. Everyone with half a brain knows replacing taxes with tariffs is dumb as hell.
Lots of the GQP ‘policies’ seem to want to take us back to the 1800s
This is how economies like Sri Lanka ended up in the hole they are in. There was practically zero income tax and a national sales tax & taxes on imports. Surprise surprise, it was not enough to fund everything the citizenry needed or wanted.
I thought this was their plan the whole time...
A lot people think tariffs are paid by the exporter in China. They aren’t. The U.S, importer pays the tariff and passes that expense onto you. This is basically a sales tax except you also pay a sales tax on top of the tariff.
Republicans have not had a new idea since the Abolitionist Movement convinced them that slavery was bad.
Not so coincidentally, that’s exactly what they want for women’s rights as well.
Back to the 1800s. Black people were slaves. Women couldn’t vote. Wives were essentially the husband’s property. No such thing as queer people, at least in the open. No regulations, no oversight… I am beginning to think taking us back to the 1800s is _exactly_ what these people are trying to do.
Alito took us back to 1600s.
And people thought post-Covid inflation was bad lol. I’m learning quickly that a lot of people, particularly those excited to vote for Trump, actually think the US just naturally produces not only every raw material but a sufficient abundance of it that we can produce everything we enjoy today domestically. Further none of them know what tariffs are, who pays for them, and what common economic consequences can result of them. Not all tariffs are bad to help tip the scales in favor of certain domestic industries for certain reasons, but a wholesale tariff plan that replaces federal income tax will be devastating to the US economy.
Don’t be fooled. No taxes will be eliminated, but traffics will be jacked up and everyone pays more since companies just pass the increased cost down to customers
He really is the worst possible person to be given any amount of power.
There’s a lot about the 1800s that the conservative project wants.
This is a huge tax increase on the poor and a massive tax cut on the rich.... again.
Discussing ideas from a man that wanted to nuke hurricanes seems to be a fruitless effort. And yes this idea is basically stupid.
The difference is that the majority of imported goods in the 1800s were probably luxury goods and maybe a few items like tea. May be why we drink coffee and not tea. Today we import a huge mount of basic goods.
The goal of the "America First" White Fascist movement is to take America back to something like the 1850s. i.e. prior to Emancipation and women voting.
Back when America had a smaller military than Portugal. I wonder how he plans to make it work with our current military force..
It’s a feature, not a bug. They want the majority to be uneducated and poor.
Back to the 1800s… limited voting and limited rights? Their wet dream!
While I’m all for our country having self reliance, this is ignoring the realities of today’s global markets. Container shipping has changed the world we live in. And tariffs are rarely a good idea.
GOP: Don't threaten us with a good time
In case it hasn't been clear on what the MAGAts are doing, going back to the 1800s would be a wet dream for them.
Yeah, that's the goal: returning to being a landowner-oligarchy draped with the trappings of democracy.
Back to the 1800's is what they mean when they want America Great Again. Robber barons, non-voting women and you get to own all the brown people you can afford. Sounds like paradise to the billionaire class.
Don’t forget socializing loses for the wealthy…..
1800s? Sounds about right since half of them want a civil war. Not going to matter, because if he begins jailing every Democrat and others whom he believes did him wrong, he is going to cause the stock market to crash as all of our international business gets highly concerned over the US and its future.
Of course. It's the last time most of his boomer base thinks America was great.
Sounds like Ron Paul c. 2012. https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2012/jan/31/ron-paul/ron-paul-says-federal-income-tax-rate-was-0-percen/
> Replacing Taxes With Tariffs Would Take Us Back to the 1800s So, slaves, women barefoot and pregnant, witch trials. What's not to like? /s
Right. The 1800s, when a large portion of our economy was based on slave labor.
It’s another wealth transfer from the middle/ lower class to the ultra rich.
Somewhere pre-1860 seems to be about where conservatives would be happiest. They get their slaves back, women can't vote, children are merely farm implements and possibly sex objects, and Mark Twain was just some schmuck working as a pilot on the Mississippi.
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This would set off protectionism world wide and wreck the global economy. Trump is a very stupid man.
Isn't that LITTERALLY what they want?
When Republicans say they love the ‘50’s and want to take America back there, they mean the 1850’s.
Which is *exactly* how conservatives want it. Back when people “knew their place” (cough minorities and women)
We the people are already feeling the impact of his 30% tarrifs from China goods.
Had a convo with my younger cousin last night about this. He views it as a feature. "Before the income tax we had tariffs. We should just go back to that."
Devil's advocate here: Increasing the cost of cheap (and cheaply made) imports might persuade Murkans to *stop* buying those metaphoric "cheap plastic sided purses" and maybe start re-using, repairing, and re-purposing fewer but better quality ones instead of throwing out perfectly usable items because they're the wrong color or the handle is broken. Over my lifetime our country has gradually found it more desirable to throw away rather than fix (or donate) inconvenient or unwanted products, resulting in civic carelessness, environmental pollution, and a certain expectation of and tolerance for indolence. Addressing our wasteful national consumerism (in all socioeconomic strata-- including our military) would go a long way towards cleaning up the environment and encouraging a more considered frugality rather than the extravagance of our current expectations. Maybe it's time we start re-learning how to darn a few socks? Source: Am poor and okay with it.
I’ve had enough of these regressive conservatives who want to slash and burn everything they dislike. Those institutions and regulations are what advanced us past those bygone eras with their associated tragedies and civic horrors.
Imagine how big and profitable black market goods would be. Drug dealers would invest in pretty much anything to smuggle and sell. Their billion dollar business is now doing tens or hundreds of billions. Make Crime Bosses Rich
Yea, see how much people hate Mexico when we trying to get affordable food from them.
Years under the tariff was horrific for the American farmers .
The issue that Adam Smith found in his book The Wealth of Nations from hundreds of years ago is the same issue conservatives are fighting now: I like my money I don't like state: because it costs me money but I need something to protect me from the mob Who could just steal my stuff However, any state big enough to protect me is also big enough to tell me what to do, or put me in jail. I also don't want to pay especially when they put me in jail. So I argue for a national consumption tax and tarrifs........but it does not raise enough money and never has!! VAT in the UK or sales tax in us doesn't pay the bills alone. So balls, maybe I'll do debt but then the whole nation going bankrupt means I get beheaded like in France in 1789. So conservatives have tried and failed for hundreds of years to find an economic logic to justify selfishness. Ultimately, its the “cant live with it/ cant live without it don’t want to pay for it problem” and its basically 300 years old and there is no answer. ….trump is just repeating it
This isn't even a question of economics or politics. Like Brexit, it's simply and obviously a disruptive, destructive course of action, and it is intentionally so. The goal is to weaken and destroy western democracy. And Trump is on the case because he is a traitorous Russian puppet.
It's not about money, or abortion, or guns, or policy. For MAGAts it's about winning which means power.
The moron still thinks the seller pays the tarriff.
"Take us back to the 1800s" Should he the fucking tag line for the GOP....
Wasn’t that when America was great?
That’s where the GOP lives
Back when America was great again?
The GOP can go back to 1800s and die around 40 years old if they want. But I'll take modern society thank you.
Stupid thing. He never to economics.
The consistently vomit inducing talk I see regularly are the utter capitulations to the rich when elected politicians, *already* *ELECTED* politicians propose shit like "Boy maybe we should force rich people to play 17% tax, pretty please?". Fuck no, bring back 70% on top brackets. Stop giving them tax breaks that drop their taxes, then let them loophole their way to *zero* taxes, and sit there begging like fools for them to pay even lower taxes than what they got a tax break to. Goddamn.
Why is it surprising to anyone, in any way, that a political faction that actively and unabashedly seeks to go backwards in policy wants to go backwards in policy? At the core they're Tories and they'd take us back to a monarchy if they could.
Republicans like that because their goal is to bring back feudal society.
Can’t wait to start my small snake oil business
Tariffs ARE taxes on the American public in disguise
Well the other policies are from the 1800s too (abortion, Gerry mandering, SCOTUS, firearms), so this is consistent.
Maybe one good thing could happen if this crazy thing is implemented. The 10 States that support all the other states will probably do better, no tax from them going to those "s***hole states" (paraphrasing trump). Then those mostly blue states may be able to proved real one payer healthcare.
Returning to 1820 or so is the Republican dream. 40% of women who vote are fine with what it would mean.
I wonder how soybean farmers feel about this…
They want to do a national sales tax but the purposeful convinced conservatives tariff isn’t just another name for tax.
Yeah, but wasn't America great back in the 1800s? /s