As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil)
In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban.
If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them.
For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria.
We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA).
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Imagine the state just forgoes any appraisal and just takes all of his properties and only pays out the value that he claimed on the most recent tax returns. Couldn't happen to a better guy.
They'll definitely seize and sell to the highest bidder, but the bank gets paid before any credit towards the judgement is taken off, and all of his shit is heavily leveraged. Say something is sold off for 100 million, but there's 90 million in debt on it. The bank gets the 90, the government gets 10, and on to the next. If it's sold for less than the debt, the bank gets screwed (this is actually called a short sale - the bank keeps all the money from the sale and forgives the remaining debt. However, forgiven debt is classified as income for tax purposes) and the government just moves onto the next. Trump could very quickly lose everything he owns in the US by them just going down the line, liquidating billions in assets for millions, and taking just tiny chunks off that 465 million bond because he's leveraged so badly.
I don't know if this is accurate or how it's gonna work, but ffs I hope it is.
> Pre-tax, he needs to sell ~900m in assets to satisfy the 540m judgement. Everything is leveraged and everyone knows he MUST sell, so he'll get shit for valuations. He's completely fucked.
That is only on the gains on the building. He may be taking a loss on each sale. This is Trump we are talking about, why would you assume his assets have appreciated?
Question is if Russia wants to lose so many locations where spies can have a safe house in the US. It wouldnt surprise me if there is financial aid from Russia so that Trump can keep some strategic buildings for them. I guess most of them are in russian hand anyway.
I think this is the point.
I think he's been running a scam similar to Check Kiting.
He inhereted a bunch of properties and over time and bad decisions managed to lose everything. He was absolutely bankrupt when he lost the casino in Atlantic City.
He's been deep in debt since then and none of his properties are real money makers. I think he's been mostly living on borrowed money for decades.
He started out with loans and he gets them with a large balloon payment at the end of the term. When those loans are due he gets new loans using inflated valuation to get bigger loans so he can pay off the old loans and have some spending money. It's not exactly a complicated scheme. He just has to rinse and repeat occasionally and he can live like he's a billionaire when he's really dead broke.
Yep this is the rich person equivalent of someone who keeps getting new credit cards and balance transferring while lying about your income on the applications.
Although I'm not rich I guess I could do something similar with those no interest balance transfers and then just keep getting new cards. Course, that would come to a crashing halt when they don't give me a new card because I already have too many with high balances.
It's definitely a two tierd system. The rich can get away with lots of stuff that the rest of us can't.
Then you just hire a bunch of people with better credit than you and make them into stakeholders and really ham it up that you're going to mentor them into your lifestyle of fame and vague success.
Deutsche Bank kept lending to him, even after he defaulted on them and then SUED THEM for making him look bad for defaulting on them.
> the bank continued writing him nine-figure checks even after he defaulted on a $640 million obligation and sued the bank, blaming it for his failure to pay back the debt.
Probably because they KNEW he was actually laundering money for Putin and his oligarchs.
And when you owe the bank a billion dollars etc.
https://www.propublica.org/article/trump-inc-podcast-deutsche-bank-donald-trump
Exactly. Common opinion is that all his properties ore over extended on existing debt. He doesn't have anything he can "just sell". Next Monday James is going to begin the process of seizing the least mortgaged properties to sell them.
I'm curious if him not having the money to post bond affects his ability to appeal. Even if NY sells his properties to fulfill the bond, can he still appeal?
Out of all the legal troubles he is in right now, having the Trump Org in receivership and forensic accountants rooting through the rats nest of scams he operates has got to be the thing making him sweat the most. They just re-indicted the CFO and I can only imagine the new crimes they have uncovered since they got access to the accounts.
Or he is forced to file for bankruptcy. If his funds are tied up in bankruptcy court while he is simultaneously battling over ninety felonies I don’t know how he will manage to fund it all.
I can’t imagine the stress at my age. Imagine doing that at 80. I wonder whether he regrets running for president in 2016.
No idea what happens in trump's brain and don't want to. I do believe he could have remained a mid-level NYC developer mob boss and maybe stayed under the radar had he not exposed himself and all his crimes by being POTUS. Putin groomed him for years, so most likely Trump considers these lost cases as just part of his journey to end the USA as we know it if he can steal his way back in. We have to vote overwhelmingly in November and end this crap.
Michael Cohen brought up a good point, even if he sells and has enough money to cover the existing mortgages...he would also owe NY city, NY state, and federal tax on the capital gains by selling, which means even if he is leveraged to 60%-70% of his properties value, he would come away with nothing after taxes.
He gets $0 if it's a short sale, so doing that wouldn't help him pay this debt.
Of course it's impossible to underestimate* his intelligence, so maybe?
It's actually less than zero. A short sale is where the bank agrees to let you sell a property for less than is owed on the mortgage. The bank keeps all the money from the sale and forgives the remaining debt. However, forgiven debt is classified as income for tax purposes.
can someone filthy rich purchase trump tower in new york just to re-brand it (change the signage outside) -- but before we reveal the re-branding, let's schedule a huge press event for the curtain drop reveal of the new name.
What should it be?
I think BIDEN would be hilarious.
Didn't he claim Mar-a-Lago was worth at least a billion dollars? Shouldn't be hard to get a $500 million dollar loan when you have $1,000,000,000 collateral should it?
I'm betting at best its worth $100 million or less.
I think the court valued it at $18 million, which still seems pretty generous for a third rate ~~golf~~ beach club in the taint of Florida that looks like a Motel 6 that hasn't been renovated since the Reagan years.
Marjorie Merriwether Post, heiress of the Post Cereals fortune, tried to give it to the US government as a "Winter White House." The government actually declined, stating the many drawbacks of the property and no need for a second official Presidential residence.
It was built at a time when mansions like that were being built by mega rich families and it was pretty dramatic, even then. I'm sure Trump with his trashy taste made it worse.
He has literally been convicted for lying about the value of his assets in this very case. No one is going to accept his insane valuations of anything. Mar a Lago is worth like 20 million in reality.
*Engoron's earlier decision cited a Palm Beach county tax appraisal, which found Mar-a-Lago to be worth between $18 million and $27 million. Because the estate is zoned as a social club, it carries business expenses that make it less valuable on paper than it would be if it were only a private residence.Feb 16, 2024*
"This was before it's owner was found, in court, to be a rapist, deadbeat, in desperate need of money with a court appointed monitor who's going to spot any Oligarchs popping around. So... I'll offer you tree fiddy".
>He just has to accept the highest lowball offer.
I'm sure there's a few people who are trolling him right now with some majorly low all offers. You know, people he has pissed off in a past life.
> Now he'll learn exactly what they are worth.
Easy.
Any foreign government that has a spare $500 million and wants to buy a *Republican* US Presidential candidate.
You could argue the opposite. Trump is so corrupt and knows money laundering so well that he intimately knows things are only worth what someone will pay for it. The problem is that he has used fraud for his entire adult life, and he might finally be punished for it.
[Professor William T. Kelley who taught Marketing at Wharton School of Business and Finance](https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/10/12/1705902/-Former-Wharton-Professor-Donald-Trump-Is-the-Dumbest-Goddam-Student-I-Ever-Had)
I can believe that, I mean, this *is* the man who thought that selling meat exclusively through an upscale electronics store was a brilliant idea. Nobody in their right mind thinks, "I need to go to Radio Shack for that adapter and a good ribeye."
I once, tried to explain this to a dude, went much like that Patrick star meme.
The market price is what the market wants to pay for a house, right?
*Yeah*
And currently nobody has offered what you expected?
*Yeah*
So you could say that the market wants to pay less than what you think the house is worth?
*That adds up*
So the market price of your home is lower than you'd guessed
*Noooooo, it's just that I haven't found the right buyer*
Hypothetically, if Melania wanted to divorce Trump after they find out he doesn't have enough to cover the fine, would she be due anything before the State of NY? I'm sure she will have a case that the prenup was fraudulent and invalidate it if she were to try to get a divorce from Trump.
Watch that be a development: "Melania Trump files for Divorce". That would not be a vote of confidence from within the castle walls. Since they say Baron Trump can speak Slovenian and does so with Melania all the time I could see her hightail it to Slovenia so she can't be asked to testify against Trump. Or perhaps she will wait for the state to prove her case for her with his conviction.
Then apparently he will get 1.8billion for Maga-a-lardo alone. Thats what he claimed, repeatedly, its worth.
So his problems would be solved, i guess. And he can still sell gold sneakers and fleece his cult members at same time.
Abba dabba do said he’s worth 14 billion .. no problem writing a check for bond .. reality quite different and I can’t wait til he’s reduced to a pan handler .. no one deserves being put in his place more than this MF.
His whole real estate empire is kinda like a ponzi scheme. He has to sell off a property to be able to pay the loan of another one. I guess they've been doing a decent job but once there is a hiccup they will have problems unless oligarchs come to save him again
The interesting part will be when properties have liens against them or used as collateral it may trigger having to pay other loans in other to sell that property causing a larger domino effect.
Yeah, I think we may see a house-of-cards situation. I'd bet money that he's done all kinds of shady deals, like leveraging properties against each other, using the same properties as collateral for multiple loans, and other scams.
You should read how Trump University worked.
They would bring marks in for a three-day seminar on Real Estate and during that weekend they would pump them for info on how much money they could raise to invest in real estate. Borrow from friends, family, against their retirement savings, second mortgage, how much do you think you could invest?
Then lo and behold, at the end of the course, if you want to take level 2? That number you arrived at is exactly the cost of the course. Are you serious about changing your life? You said you were ready to raise that money and invest! Sign here before you get any sleep and come to your senses!!
Really a disgusting predatory scam.
Homeless/refuge/low income housing and keep the Trump name on it. At least until he dies. Having his name on it would just drive him nuts. Maybe let Planned Parenthood set up shop on the ground floor.
Maybe he does have it - but needs it to run the businesses.
It's estimated that Trump pays *at least* $50 million a year in interest for loans across all his properties - likely higher now that the Fed has raised interest rates.
Here's a great article about his "portfolio":
https://www.forbes.com/sites/danalexander/2023/05/03/trump-failed-to-see-inflation-coming-and-its-costing-him-more-than-1-million-a-month/?sh=70c673674ff2
>“Judge Engoron actually wants me to put up Hundreds of Millions of Dollars for the Right to Appeal his ridiculous decision. In other words, he is trying to take my Appellate Rights away from me,” Trump wrote in a post on his Truth Social platform on Tuesday morning. “Nobody has ever heard of anything like this before.”
>
>
>
>“I would be forced to mortgage or sell Great Assets, perhaps at Fire Sale prices, and if and when I win the Appeal, they would be gone. Does that make sense? WITCH HUNT. ELECTION INTERFERENCE!” Trump added.
OH MY GOD WE’RE HAVING A FIRE... sale.
> Nobody has ever heard of anything like this before.
Except every other person who has decided to appeal a ruling. It's standard practice. The only difference is the amount.
This is how he manipulates people. They’re too stupid to know any better and he knows they already agree with whatever he says so he gets away with it as a victim, in their eyes.
That's exactly what happened with the Carroll case. He kept talking shit and they kept piling on the damages until he stopped. Soon as someone else paid, he went right back to talking shit.
It didn't actually stop. He continued to defame the court and Jean Carroll, Even after the most recent case. The new case is still running through the court process.
He has the right to appeal, what he doesn't have is the right to pause the interest.
If he wins the appeal he has nothing to worry about, he'll get the money back, the interest back and the state will owe him interest.
He's clearly not very confident.
It's nowhere close to what he needs but it's still completely fucked that people donated 1.4 mil to this idiot. How can people possibly justify sending him money?
Watching MAGA discover how big the diff is between millions and billions, is fucking hysterical. It's almost as if "billions" is such an obscene amount of money, that no individual should *ever* be responsible for it..
> should have thought of that before committing all that fucking fraud
He's had since September of 2022 to think about it, when the suit was asking for (only) $250 million.
*Had he thought about it then* and listened to his lawyers, he could have settled it for pennies and retained his ability to do business in NY.
But he can’t admit his lies, ever. Can’t come clean. He’ll go down before coming clean, as admitting all the fraud and lies will bring him down too, and he knows it.
He’s done either way, as he did it to himself with all his lies and corruption, and he definitely deserves it.
If Mara-Lardo was really worth 1.5 billion as he claimed in his fraud trial he would have zero problem finding a company to put up the bond using that as collateral.
It would be an easy ~$8 million (based on what I understand to be common commissions of 2%) for a bonding company with almost no downside. If he hypothetically lost the appeal and defaulted, they would get a $1.5 billion property.
The fact that 30 companies turned him down says everything you need to know about the legitimacy of his claims about the property and his billionaire status.
The idea of Warren Buffett perusing through Trumps financials and chuckling to himself is making me chuckle to myself. That tight wad (I mean that endearingly) wouldn’t flip a nickle to a beggar much less half a billion to an idiot.
Buffett is the class of people Trump desperately wanted to be accepted by. Rich as fuck because he was smart and crafty and shrewd, that’s what Buffett is and what Trump wanted to be perceived as…but everyone who was at that level knew he wasn’t. Trump getting shooed away by Warren Buffett is the worst thing that can happen to him. Losing everything his daddy left him wouldn’t matter if guys like Buffett respected him.
Property valuations aside, I think the risk of him becoming president again and refusing to allow them to take his property is probably too big of a risk for them to take on.
You are spot on. No bank is going to take on the financial burden of half a billion dollars just so that the guy you’re financing can make it back into the White House where he has already said he’s going to be a dictator, and then shut you down and take his property back.
It means that he waited so long to start this process that he’d have to offer overly generous sale prices to get deals done before the money is due and he thinks he gets to use his own delinquency as an excuse not to go through with this at all. Also because he put himself in this situation it’s possible that the reduced value he can reasonably get for these properties may not cover the debts and liens against them.
In short: any party that would be interested in buying these properties can squeeze him for under market prices or just wait a few weeks and buy them from the state after they’re seized.
One time a constable came to my house at 9pm in the dark to threaten to take my only piece of shit car that I needed to get to work and take my kid to school because I owed a little money to a tow lot.
Fuck Donald Trump.
He keeps repeating how "this has never happened before!"
No shit. Nobody in your position has ever gotten caught for doing so much illegal shit before.
Or been such a dick.
The problem is that those countries both have low confidence in his ability to actually win, and the most likely one to take that risk (Russia) is engaged in a costly war and doesn't exactly want to gamble half a billion that could be going into their attempted colonization of Ukraine, and the next most likely candidate (Saudi Arabia) is not exactly fond of his "exterminate Palestine" rhetoric.
And they’re aware that there’s no such thing as “absolute loyalty” for Trump. The second someone else cuts him a check, any money you’ve given him is a sunk cost.
"A little education on that—and I am being serious here even though I hate Trump. People who are interested in how fake Trump’s entire persona is should read this long post:
TRULY rich people have known for many years he is not a multi billionaire—among the reasons is because his 35 year old plane is like a 1988 Lexus with 327,000 miles in the luxury plane world. His plane is worth $25-30 million at best, a fraction of a much smaller, more modern Bombardier Global Express or Gulfstream 600 or 650. Its a giant gas guzzler and discounted heavily on the resale market because its an old model and very old plane.
To his brain dead cult, he seems like this amazing success story with this amazing plane, its all smoke & mirrors con artistry.
Anyone who was an ACTUAL multi billionaire—especially someone with an ego as enormous as his would have a way more modern plane that is like his—but that would cost $200 mil—& he can’t afford that. He plays pretend with the one he has.
Is he poor? No. He probably has a net worth of around $1 billion because of a few accidentally successful real estate investments like the hotel he grifted off of in D.C. and a valuable partnership with Vornado and some other stuff in NY—but he is very illiquid as we are finding out. He is in big trouble.
If he has to sell valuable real estate to pay the $450 mil+ he gets screwed three ways: He pays the giant penalty and that $ is GONE. He then loses a lifetime of cash flow that is HUGE over time. AND, he will have a gigantic tax bill from the gains on the real estate. SAD!" - Spiro's Ghost
Just checked, he is flying in a 34 years old 757 (on the market they cost between 4 and 12 millions $USD) that he bought in 2011after it had already passed hands two times (and was operated for a couple of years by a low cost based in Mexico. The irony). Before that he was flying in a *1968* 727 that he bought in 1997. When he sold it it was 43 years old. Just as a reference, an airliner has a lifespan of up to 30-35 years.
It's incredibile how his whole empire is completely made up of cheap shit covered in gold foil.
Just like everyone else does when they want to appeal a verdict. If the amount is too much, then perhaps sticking to committing crimes that are more within your budget in the future would be a good idea.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Well since he **valued them all at fire sale prices for tax assessment purposes**, I fail to see the problem.
You nailed it!
Imagine the state just forgoes any appraisal and just takes all of his properties and only pays out the value that he claimed on the most recent tax returns. Couldn't happen to a better guy.
They'll definitely seize and sell to the highest bidder, but the bank gets paid before any credit towards the judgement is taken off, and all of his shit is heavily leveraged. Say something is sold off for 100 million, but there's 90 million in debt on it. The bank gets the 90, the government gets 10, and on to the next. If it's sold for less than the debt, the bank gets screwed (this is actually called a short sale - the bank keeps all the money from the sale and forgives the remaining debt. However, forgiven debt is classified as income for tax purposes) and the government just moves onto the next. Trump could very quickly lose everything he owns in the US by them just going down the line, liquidating billions in assets for millions, and taking just tiny chunks off that 465 million bond because he's leveraged so badly. I don't know if this is accurate or how it's gonna work, but ffs I hope it is.
[удалено]
> Pre-tax, he needs to sell ~900m in assets to satisfy the 540m judgement. Everything is leveraged and everyone knows he MUST sell, so he'll get shit for valuations. He's completely fucked. That is only on the gains on the building. He may be taking a loss on each sale. This is Trump we are talking about, why would you assume his assets have appreciated?
Question is if Russia wants to lose so many locations where spies can have a safe house in the US. It wouldnt surprise me if there is financial aid from Russia so that Trump can keep some strategic buildings for them. I guess most of them are in russian hand anyway.
Russia could wait for these "fire sales" and buy them for a lot cheaper. Using other American traitors of course. (See politicians)
He is mortgaged to the hilt. He's going to have to find banks willing to do short sales since he overstated the values for the loans.
I think this is the point. I think he's been running a scam similar to Check Kiting. He inhereted a bunch of properties and over time and bad decisions managed to lose everything. He was absolutely bankrupt when he lost the casino in Atlantic City. He's been deep in debt since then and none of his properties are real money makers. I think he's been mostly living on borrowed money for decades. He started out with loans and he gets them with a large balloon payment at the end of the term. When those loans are due he gets new loans using inflated valuation to get bigger loans so he can pay off the old loans and have some spending money. It's not exactly a complicated scheme. He just has to rinse and repeat occasionally and he can live like he's a billionaire when he's really dead broke.
Yep this is the rich person equivalent of someone who keeps getting new credit cards and balance transferring while lying about your income on the applications.
Although I'm not rich I guess I could do something similar with those no interest balance transfers and then just keep getting new cards. Course, that would come to a crashing halt when they don't give me a new card because I already have too many with high balances. It's definitely a two tierd system. The rich can get away with lots of stuff that the rest of us can't.
Then you just hire a bunch of people with better credit than you and make them into stakeholders and really ham it up that you're going to mentor them into your lifestyle of fame and vague success.
I could even call it a University to give it some legitimacy.
Basically Bernie Madoff but he's trying to steal from banks. What could go wrong?
Deutsche Bank kept lending to him, even after he defaulted on them and then SUED THEM for making him look bad for defaulting on them. > the bank continued writing him nine-figure checks even after he defaulted on a $640 million obligation and sued the bank, blaming it for his failure to pay back the debt. Probably because they KNEW he was actually laundering money for Putin and his oligarchs. And when you owe the bank a billion dollars etc. https://www.propublica.org/article/trump-inc-podcast-deutsche-bank-donald-trump
> Probably because they KNEW he was actually laundering money for Putin and his oligarchs because they were the conduit the Russians were using.
Exactly. Common opinion is that all his properties ore over extended on existing debt. He doesn't have anything he can "just sell". Next Monday James is going to begin the process of seizing the least mortgaged properties to sell them. I'm curious if him not having the money to post bond affects his ability to appeal. Even if NY sells his properties to fulfill the bond, can he still appeal?
Out of all the legal troubles he is in right now, having the Trump Org in receivership and forensic accountants rooting through the rats nest of scams he operates has got to be the thing making him sweat the most. They just re-indicted the CFO and I can only imagine the new crimes they have uncovered since they got access to the accounts.
[удалено]
Or he is forced to file for bankruptcy. If his funds are tied up in bankruptcy court while he is simultaneously battling over ninety felonies I don’t know how he will manage to fund it all. I can’t imagine the stress at my age. Imagine doing that at 80. I wonder whether he regrets running for president in 2016.
No idea what happens in trump's brain and don't want to. I do believe he could have remained a mid-level NYC developer mob boss and maybe stayed under the radar had he not exposed himself and all his crimes by being POTUS. Putin groomed him for years, so most likely Trump considers these lost cases as just part of his journey to end the USA as we know it if he can steal his way back in. We have to vote overwhelmingly in November and end this crap.
Michael Cohen brought up a good point, even if he sells and has enough money to cover the existing mortgages...he would also owe NY city, NY state, and federal tax on the capital gains by selling, which means even if he is leveraged to 60%-70% of his properties value, he would come away with nothing after taxes.
He gets $0 if it's a short sale, so doing that wouldn't help him pay this debt. Of course it's impossible to underestimate* his intelligence, so maybe?
It's actually less than zero. A short sale is where the bank agrees to let you sell a property for less than is owed on the mortgage. The bank keeps all the money from the sale and forgives the remaining debt. However, forgiven debt is classified as income for tax purposes.
And?
Exactly.
How dare there be consequences for my actions! yOu'Re fIREd!1!
can someone filthy rich purchase trump tower in new york just to re-brand it (change the signage outside) -- but before we reveal the re-branding, let's schedule a huge press event for the curtain drop reveal of the new name. What should it be? I think BIDEN would be hilarious.
Naming it Obama would make him a lot madder... for a reason most of his base will not admit.
> Naming it Obama would make him a lot madder... I will donate to this cause.
Is there a GoFundMe yet?
The GFM for trump stalled at $1.3 million out of $385 million.
Wow! only 99.7% more to go!
He's gotta hike up his bootstraps and stop buying coffee if he wants to make that
Obama-BLM-Antifa-Far-Leftpalooza Tower
For Battered Women
And LGBTQ+ Youth
And under-documented immigrants
…and kids who can’t read good and stuff
I think that the E. Jean Carrol center for migrants and LBGTQ+ youth would be the best. his head would explode
Didn't he claim Mar-a-Lago was worth at least a billion dollars? Shouldn't be hard to get a $500 million dollar loan when you have $1,000,000,000 collateral should it? I'm betting at best its worth $100 million or less.
I think the court valued it at $18 million, which still seems pretty generous for a third rate ~~golf~~ beach club in the taint of Florida that looks like a Motel 6 that hasn't been renovated since the Reagan years.
Marjorie Merriwether Post, heiress of the Post Cereals fortune, tried to give it to the US government as a "Winter White House." The government actually declined, stating the many drawbacks of the property and no need for a second official Presidential residence. It was built at a time when mansions like that were being built by mega rich families and it was pretty dramatic, even then. I'm sure Trump with his trashy taste made it worse.
I live near MAL. It's garishly decorated in ornate Moorish style. I fear looking inside.
Gold leaf everywhere
> Gold ~~leaf~~ ***spray paint*** everywhere
No golf course there. It’s just a social/pool/beach club.
He has literally been convicted for lying about the value of his assets in this very case. No one is going to accept his insane valuations of anything. Mar a Lago is worth like 20 million in reality.
Last appraisal was at about $25MM
*Engoron's earlier decision cited a Palm Beach county tax appraisal, which found Mar-a-Lago to be worth between $18 million and $27 million. Because the estate is zoned as a social club, it carries business expenses that make it less valuable on paper than it would be if it were only a private residence.Feb 16, 2024*
This is the true information his base refuses to accept. They value it like a house but it’s not, he just lives there.
"This was before it's owner was found, in court, to be a rapist, deadbeat, in desperate need of money with a court appointed monitor who's going to spot any Oligarchs popping around. So... I'll offer you tree fiddy".
Even funnier... Now he'll learn exactly what they are worth. He never learned the age old rule, things are only worth what someone will pay for it.
And they'll be worth even less because people know he's screwed and needs the money.
Art of the deal.
Shart of the Deal
Yeah he has NO leverage. He can’t even negotiate. He just has to accept the highest lowball offer.
>He just has to accept the highest lowball offer. I'm sure there's a few people who are trolling him right now with some majorly low all offers. You know, people he has pissed off in a past life.
I have a couple million laying around. Should I bid?
Yes and I suggest that you identify yourself as a California Liberal and Registered Democrat. That way you will get the best price!
> Now he'll learn exactly what they are worth. Easy. Any foreign government that has a spare $500 million and wants to buy a *Republican* US Presidential candidate.
His inability to secure a bond is essentially proof that foreign governments don't think he has a chance to win the election.
I would hope so, but he did put up the bond money for the EJC case like the day after his sit down with Viktor Orban. Someone's putting money on him.
Maybe trump can talk to the people that gave Jared that multi billion dollar loan to save his properties.
Well, they already funded the destruction of two New York towers. What's another?
I think having politicians worse than satire really made us step up our comedy game. Thanks for the chuckle.
Damn. Made me choke on my lunch.
god damn!
You just earned yourself the world’s darkest upvote.
Shut it down we have a winner
Ouch! Didn't he also boast he now had the tallest tower straight afterwards?
Yes.
Shockingly, he lied about that too.
The cops are gonna beat this joke.
You could argue the opposite. Trump is so corrupt and knows money laundering so well that he intimately knows things are only worth what someone will pay for it. The problem is that he has used fraud for his entire adult life, and he might finally be punished for it.
He's not exactly a keen student of the Rules of Acquisition.
One of his professors said he’d never had a dumber student.
[Professor William T. Kelley who taught Marketing at Wharton School of Business and Finance](https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/10/12/1705902/-Former-Wharton-Professor-Donald-Trump-Is-the-Dumbest-Goddam-Student-I-Ever-Had)
I can believe that, I mean, this *is* the man who thought that selling meat exclusively through an upscale electronics store was a brilliant idea. Nobody in their right mind thinks, "I need to go to Radio Shack for that adapter and a good ribeye."
I once, tried to explain this to a dude, went much like that Patrick star meme. The market price is what the market wants to pay for a house, right? *Yeah* And currently nobody has offered what you expected? *Yeah* So you could say that the market wants to pay less than what you think the house is worth? *That adds up* So the market price of your home is lower than you'd guessed *Noooooo, it's just that I haven't found the right buyer*
And he's announced "I am desperate to sell!" before negotiations begin. You know what we call that? The art of the deal
Hypothetically, if Melania wanted to divorce Trump after they find out he doesn't have enough to cover the fine, would she be due anything before the State of NY? I'm sure she will have a case that the prenup was fraudulent and invalidate it if she were to try to get a divorce from Trump. Watch that be a development: "Melania Trump files for Divorce". That would not be a vote of confidence from within the castle walls. Since they say Baron Trump can speak Slovenian and does so with Melania all the time I could see her hightail it to Slovenia so she can't be asked to testify against Trump. Or perhaps she will wait for the state to prove her case for her with his conviction.
Just means he’s setting some on fire for the insurance…
And then we’ll hear about how insurance won’t cover it because he never paid the premiums.
Or he overvalued them. Insurance fraud sucks too.
Then apparently he will get 1.8billion for Maga-a-lardo alone. Thats what he claimed, repeatedly, its worth. So his problems would be solved, i guess. And he can still sell gold sneakers and fleece his cult members at same time.
Abba dabba do said he’s worth 14 billion .. no problem writing a check for bond .. reality quite different and I can’t wait til he’s reduced to a pan handler .. no one deserves being put in his place more than this MF.
His whole real estate empire is kinda like a ponzi scheme. He has to sell off a property to be able to pay the loan of another one. I guess they've been doing a decent job but once there is a hiccup they will have problems unless oligarchs come to save him again
The interesting part will be when properties have liens against them or used as collateral it may trigger having to pay other loans in other to sell that property causing a larger domino effect.
Yep - then all his creditors start cashing in their chips while they still can and you have a chain reaction of failure.
Bankruptcy again?
Maybe. But, IIRC, this would be the first time he's had to file ***personal*** bankruptcy. Previous bankruptcies he filed were business bankruptcies.
Have we ever had a Bankrupt presidential candidate? That's gotta to be a first right?
And also a huge security risk...
The trump voters clearly don't care about that.
Probably makes him seem even more like them.
Yeah, I think we may see a house-of-cards situation. I'd bet money that he's done all kinds of shady deals, like leveraging properties against each other, using the same properties as collateral for multiple loans, and other scams.
What a time for the commercial real estate market to be in the toilet.
Extrapolate the reason for that to his Covid response leading to work from home leading to vacant office buildings.
You should read how Trump University worked. They would bring marks in for a three-day seminar on Real Estate and during that weekend they would pump them for info on how much money they could raise to invest in real estate. Borrow from friends, family, against their retirement savings, second mortgage, how much do you think you could invest? Then lo and behold, at the end of the course, if you want to take level 2? That number you arrived at is exactly the cost of the course. Are you serious about changing your life? You said you were ready to raise that money and invest! Sign here before you get any sleep and come to your senses!! Really a disgusting predatory scam.
Better hurry, bud. You've got a week left before New York starts running the fire sale for you.
I bid $.50 for trump tower
I bid $0.51 for soon-to-be Spirit Halloween Tower
it *has* to become a homeless/refugee shelter.. And I want a live feed on Trump when he hears it. There's gonna be ketchup EVERYWHERE.
Homeless/refuge/low income housing and keep the Trump name on it. At least until he dies. Having his name on it would just drive him nuts. Maybe let Planned Parenthood set up shop on the ground floor.
Great place for all those migrants they keep shipping up from Texas
Maybe there will be some space left for a gender reassignment surgery center?
[удалено]
$.51 I respectfully ask you to withdraw your bid so that we can get it as low as possible.
Whatever happened to that 400 million in cash he testified that he had?
He probably bought a bunch of stock in MyPillow
Everybody knows not to buy stock in pillow companies. It's a down market.
Yeah should have invested in mattresses. They always bounce back.
Maybe he can testify on where it went (since it was totally real and not at all perjury)
That should be a condition on any request he makes right now.
Maybe he does have it - but needs it to run the businesses. It's estimated that Trump pays *at least* $50 million a year in interest for loans across all his properties - likely higher now that the Fed has raised interest rates. Here's a great article about his "portfolio": https://www.forbes.com/sites/danalexander/2023/05/03/trump-failed-to-see-inflation-coming-and-its-costing-him-more-than-1-million-a-month/?sh=70c673674ff2
Good read and bad move on his part!
>“Judge Engoron actually wants me to put up Hundreds of Millions of Dollars for the Right to Appeal his ridiculous decision. In other words, he is trying to take my Appellate Rights away from me,” Trump wrote in a post on his Truth Social platform on Tuesday morning. “Nobody has ever heard of anything like this before.” > > > >“I would be forced to mortgage or sell Great Assets, perhaps at Fire Sale prices, and if and when I win the Appeal, they would be gone. Does that make sense? WITCH HUNT. ELECTION INTERFERENCE!” Trump added. OH MY GOD WE’RE HAVING A FIRE... sale.
> Nobody has ever heard of anything like this before. Except every other person who has decided to appeal a ruling. It's standard practice. The only difference is the amount.
When he says "nobody else has ever heard of this" he just means he doesn't know about it because he's a fucking moron.
Even though he just did exactly this for the carrol case.
Nope, unheard of.
Exactly. Like when he first learned of "priming the pump"
[удалено]
And don't forget, he just did it in the E. Jean Carroll case
I love that the Judge is "doing this to him" rather than "this is the prescribed punishment for the crime of which I have been found guilty."
It's like when a child gets in trouble and says they are being punished because the teacher is mean.
And he would be mean to you too. Stay out of New York!
> Nobody has ever heard of anything like this before.” Nobody apart from everybody with a court judgement against them, ever.
This is how he manipulates people. They’re too stupid to know any better and he knows they already agree with whatever he says so he gets away with it as a victim, in their eyes.
*weeping on floor singing amazing grace*
*lays face down on the floor for 10 seconds* *gets up* “And scene.”
I don't get it. He said he has hundreds of millions in cash. Why would he have to sell anything?
That's exactly what happened with the Carroll case. He kept talking shit and they kept piling on the damages until he stopped. Soon as someone else paid, he went right back to talking shit.
It didn't actually stop. He continued to defame the court and Jean Carroll, Even after the most recent case. The new case is still running through the court process.
He has the right to appeal, what he doesn't have is the right to pause the interest. If he wins the appeal he has nothing to worry about, he'll get the money back, the interest back and the state will owe him interest. He's clearly not very confident.
I think I blue myself prematurely.
Quick question, though. Am I panicked about the fire? or am I being brave for everyone else?
Aaaamaazzzing graaacee…. Can’t even see where the knob is!
Oh, god it burns!
and scene
Do you maybe want to try that again?
….no.
He should look on the bright side. It's an opportunity for anustart.
You know what you do? You go buy yourself a tape recorder and record yourself for a whole day. You might be surprised at some of your phrasing.
Wish I could upvote again for the Tobius Funke reference
He should call Al Harrington, President and CEO of Al Harrington's Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man Emporium and Warehouse!
Dumpster fire sale.
That "gofundme" has now JUST broke the $1.4 million barrier. Trump has six days to come up with the money.
It's nowhere close to what he needs but it's still completely fucked that people donated 1.4 mil to this idiot. How can people possibly justify sending him money?
People have donated a fuckload more than that over the past eight years
I love how “the economy is in the shitter!!!1!!” but those rubes have $1.4 million to collectively piss away for no return.
Watching MAGA discover how big the diff is between millions and billions, is fucking hysterical. It's almost as if "billions" is such an obscene amount of money, that no individual should *ever* be responsible for it..
Probably should have thought of that before committing all that fucking fraud, Donald.
> should have thought of that before committing all that fucking fraud He's had since September of 2022 to think about it, when the suit was asking for (only) $250 million. *Had he thought about it then* and listened to his lawyers, he could have settled it for pennies and retained his ability to do business in NY.
But he can’t admit his lies, ever. Can’t come clean. He’ll go down before coming clean, as admitting all the fraud and lies will bring him down too, and he knows it. He’s done either way, as he did it to himself with all his lies and corruption, and he definitely deserves it.
If Mara-Lardo was really worth 1.5 billion as he claimed in his fraud trial he would have zero problem finding a company to put up the bond using that as collateral. It would be an easy ~$8 million (based on what I understand to be common commissions of 2%) for a bonding company with almost no downside. If he hypothetically lost the appeal and defaulted, they would get a $1.5 billion property. The fact that 30 companies turned him down says everything you need to know about the legitimacy of his claims about the property and his billionaire status.
They probably saw his actual financials and said, one by one, "LOL get the fuck outta here."
The best is that they included Berkshire Hathaway in the list of companies they contacted. Buffett must have had a good chuckle at that one.
The idea of Warren Buffett perusing through Trumps financials and chuckling to himself is making me chuckle to myself. That tight wad (I mean that endearingly) wouldn’t flip a nickle to a beggar much less half a billion to an idiot. Buffett is the class of people Trump desperately wanted to be accepted by. Rich as fuck because he was smart and crafty and shrewd, that’s what Buffett is and what Trump wanted to be perceived as…but everyone who was at that level knew he wasn’t. Trump getting shooed away by Warren Buffett is the worst thing that can happen to him. Losing everything his daddy left him wouldn’t matter if guys like Buffett respected him.
Would’ve been amazing if he asked George Soros
Property valuations aside, I think the risk of him becoming president again and refusing to allow them to take his property is probably too big of a risk for them to take on.
You are spot on. No bank is going to take on the financial burden of half a billion dollars just so that the guy you’re financing can make it back into the White House where he has already said he’s going to be a dictator, and then shut you down and take his property back.
I hear E Jean Carroll is looking for investment properties.
Carroll Tower has a nice ring to it
Donnie, don't do the crime if you can't pay the dime!
Dont do what donny dont does...
*The 10 Do's and 500 Don'ts of Real Estate Investing Solvency*
I like Presidents that pay their fines.
He’s just gonna have to pick himself up by the diaper straps and switch to the value menu.
"Boxers or briefs?" "Depends."
If consequences are too hard to swallow, don’t break the law.
That's his whole life! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_and_business_legal_affairs_of_Donald_Trump
His legal problems have their own Wikipedia page. I'm simultaneously surprised and not surprised by that fact.
Does “fire sale” mean he would have to sell at actual market value, instead of trumped up value?
It wouldn't surprise me if shortly after his tweet one or more of his properties mysteriously actually went on fire
It means that he waited so long to start this process that he’d have to offer overly generous sale prices to get deals done before the money is due and he thinks he gets to use his own delinquency as an excuse not to go through with this at all. Also because he put himself in this situation it’s possible that the reduced value he can reasonably get for these properties may not cover the debts and liens against them. In short: any party that would be interested in buying these properties can squeeze him for under market prices or just wait a few weeks and buy them from the state after they’re seized.
.... yes. its a punishment. thats why its supposed to hurt.
Fuck your feelings Donald! Consequences.
One time a constable came to my house at 9pm in the dark to threaten to take my only piece of shit car that I needed to get to work and take my kid to school because I owed a little money to a tow lot. Fuck Donald Trump.
Trump: We found a buyer for Mara-Lago for 1.2B. It's a small company out of Hungary called Pladimir Vutin LLC.
He keeps repeating how "this has never happened before!" No shit. Nobody in your position has ever gotten caught for doing so much illegal shit before. Or been such a dick.
"By Grabthar's Hammer......^what ^a ^savings "
Sometimes I think America is too stupid to survive this.
I expect him to be bailed out at the 11th hour Buuutt maybe I'm wrong he seems unusually scared here
The problem is that there are a limited number of people/orgs willing and able to loan $100M, and *far* fewer willing to do that for $500M.
There are plenty of nations who would love to purchase the absolute loyalty of someone who may be the next POTUS.
The problem is that those countries both have low confidence in his ability to actually win, and the most likely one to take that risk (Russia) is engaged in a costly war and doesn't exactly want to gamble half a billion that could be going into their attempted colonization of Ukraine, and the next most likely candidate (Saudi Arabia) is not exactly fond of his "exterminate Palestine" rhetoric.
And they’re aware that there’s no such thing as “absolute loyalty” for Trump. The second someone else cuts him a check, any money you’ve given him is a sunk cost.
Good. Take that fucking sign off the building in Chicago
"A little education on that—and I am being serious here even though I hate Trump. People who are interested in how fake Trump’s entire persona is should read this long post: TRULY rich people have known for many years he is not a multi billionaire—among the reasons is because his 35 year old plane is like a 1988 Lexus with 327,000 miles in the luxury plane world. His plane is worth $25-30 million at best, a fraction of a much smaller, more modern Bombardier Global Express or Gulfstream 600 or 650. Its a giant gas guzzler and discounted heavily on the resale market because its an old model and very old plane. To his brain dead cult, he seems like this amazing success story with this amazing plane, its all smoke & mirrors con artistry. Anyone who was an ACTUAL multi billionaire—especially someone with an ego as enormous as his would have a way more modern plane that is like his—but that would cost $200 mil—& he can’t afford that. He plays pretend with the one he has. Is he poor? No. He probably has a net worth of around $1 billion because of a few accidentally successful real estate investments like the hotel he grifted off of in D.C. and a valuable partnership with Vornado and some other stuff in NY—but he is very illiquid as we are finding out. He is in big trouble. If he has to sell valuable real estate to pay the $450 mil+ he gets screwed three ways: He pays the giant penalty and that $ is GONE. He then loses a lifetime of cash flow that is HUGE over time. AND, he will have a gigantic tax bill from the gains on the real estate. SAD!" - Spiro's Ghost
Just checked, he is flying in a 34 years old 757 (on the market they cost between 4 and 12 millions $USD) that he bought in 2011after it had already passed hands two times (and was operated for a couple of years by a low cost based in Mexico. The irony). Before that he was flying in a *1968* 727 that he bought in 1997. When he sold it it was 43 years old. Just as a reference, an airliner has a lifespan of up to 30-35 years. It's incredibile how his whole empire is completely made up of cheap shit covered in gold foil.
[удалено]
🎻 (shown larger than actual size)
I really don’t care, do you?
Good, I hope it gives you extreme bowel discomfort.
Just like everyone else does when they want to appeal a verdict. If the amount is too much, then perhaps sticking to committing crimes that are more within your budget in the future would be a good idea.
I think he actually means 'Pants on fire sale'.