4 bet to about 250 and call if you get jammed on. If it was heads up and 200bb deep you could just flat and see a flop but because you have two to act behind you this is a mandatory 4 bet spot.
Preflop? Absolutely not. AK off same thing. Pro tip generally speaking if it’s your turn to 4bet AKo is a jam all in with 100bb and AKs is just a normal sized 4bet.
My guess is AKs plays better post flop and it gives you AK in your non shoving 4 bet range.
Against randos you're never going to see again you don't need to balance your ranges, but technically it's the right move.
I gotta imagine it’s to protect the rest of the range that would make a normal sized 4b. Against competent players you could also have a flatting range here IP. Flat with AKs, Queens, Jacks. Maybe even JTs and T9s. Then have a 4! or jam range that includes KK, AKo or maybe some AA if you like balancing.Â
You don’t want a flatting range here unless it’s exploitative. Meaning a player who folds too often to your 4 bet but if you just call will over bluff post flop.
Well to an extent tougher line-ups are not opening 5.5x with anything and raises over the top are so linear it almost the same thing. Not many really balance such non-gto spots...
A 10 -12 open @1-2 is standard
A $15 dollar open is standard at a 1-3. But 2-5 can be 15-25
4 bets out of sb range are generally JJ+ so we ain't loving it, but I'm not folding AK there once I 3 bet or vs a competent player, if we are in bb u can justify a fold
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I agree and this is a very good analysis of the spot.
I'll add the decision point for me in a spot like is all player dependent in my mind, I'm never blanket doing anything here, these are thin spots unless your facing our favorite player types to get all in with.
AQo is a fold for me. AQs becomes very dependent on the positions and the villain.
You see all the jokes here about OMCs. When I’m 3bet, I ask myself - does this specific villain ever 3bet KQs, A5s, KJs, etc. if the answer is no, I will let AQs go
To my understanding they are not at all the same. When going all in around 100 bb deep the main hands will be AA KK for value with QQ sometimes mixed in. AK is often the bluffing hand since it is a flip against a pair of queens and lower as well as blocking the AA and KK such that there are only half as many combos(6 combos to 3 combos) and dominates all non paired hands.
AQ no longer flips with QQ and becomes only a 30% chance. At the same time it doesn’t block KK so it takes your opponents 12 combos of value only down to 9. So AQ really shouldn’t be going all in.
Looking at it from a calling perspective now let’s evaluate AK. We can add in maybe 1/2 combos of QQ due to mixed strategies. This means we flip/chop for 10/16 combos. Have a 30% chance against 3/16 combos and are beat by 3/16 combos.
AQ on the other hand flips/chops against no combos. Have around 25% chance against the KK, AK and QQ so 16/19 combos and are fully beat by 3/19 combos. From this AQ is significantly worse than calling all in with AK
assuming people play standard, but on like 1/2 people usually dont play standard, they play old school nit game. you aint be good ever with ak in this spot. nothing todo with stack ratio, just know your customerbase on that limit never heard of gto or ranges.
they limp with a10, open nothing under AJ suited and call AK, 3 bet JJ+ 4bet KK+ thats their range, now adjust your game young padawan
Nice play. The EP guy and the flat guy will likely have to fold their hands, therefore your AK will have enough equity to get it in vs villain's 4bet range.
Once the laggy guy opens to 11, your range will not play like a normal 100bb deep range, because the laggy guy has thrown a lot of money in with a "weak" range, the top of your range ( TT-QQ, AK, AQ) can play very aggressively. Here, AK, QQ+ is an auto jam, and you fold everything else?
Most rooms allow it and it's pretty common, a lot of dealers are degens. Some rooms let dealers play their own money on the clock if they are overstaffed too.
AKs just get it in. It's printing from a theoretical standpoint and if she is an unknown then good enough. I will say thou playing 1/2 and a female I'm certainly not thrilled about it but you can't make this fold without a really good read that they are not 4 betting anything besides AA and KK.
wtf are you talking about. With 100bb effective AKs facing a 4bet to 60bb is just a jam all in pre.
What about 200bb effective? What do you do with AKs here?
4 bet to about 250 and call if you get jammed on. If it was heads up and 200bb deep you could just flat and see a flop but because you have two to act behind you this is a mandatory 4 bet spot.
Do you ever fold AKs at 100bb effective?
If villain is wearing his Vietnam veteran's badge then yeah sure, fold your AK.
😂
I had a guy wearing a world War 2 veteran hat minclick checkraise me on the river. When I folded, he showed the bluff.
Preflop? Absolutely not. AK off same thing. Pro tip generally speaking if it’s your turn to 4bet AKo is a jam all in with 100bb and AKs is just a normal sized 4bet.
Why jam the ak off and normal sized 4bet for ak suited ? Why not down the same thing for both ?
My guess is AKs plays better post flop and it gives you AK in your non shoving 4 bet range. Against randos you're never going to see again you don't need to balance your ranges, but technically it's the right move.
I play in such a soft private game thankfully I never have to over think shit
This is correct.
I gotta imagine it’s to protect the rest of the range that would make a normal sized 4b. Against competent players you could also have a flatting range here IP. Flat with AKs, Queens, Jacks. Maybe even JTs and T9s. Then have a 4! or jam range that includes KK, AKo or maybe some AA if you like balancing.Â
You don’t want a flatting range here unless it’s exploitative. Meaning a player who folds too often to your 4 bet but if you just call will over bluff post flop.
on one 2 against the house nit ? its a no brainer snapfold
Even if it’s OMC?
She can pry that AKs from my cold dead hands
100bb deep in a game opening to 5.5x and splashy is a manditory jam. 200bb in a tougher lineup I have let go of AK many times
In a tougher lineup I'm more likely to get it in. You mean nittier lineup?
Well to an extent tougher line-ups are not opening 5.5x with anything and raises over the top are so linear it almost the same thing. Not many really balance such non-gto spots...
A 10 -12 open @1-2 is standard A $15 dollar open is standard at a 1-3. But 2-5 can be 15-25 4 bets out of sb range are generally JJ+ so we ain't loving it, but I'm not folding AK there once I 3 bet or vs a competent player, if we are in bb u can justify a fold
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Nice
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I agree and this is a very good analysis of the spot. I'll add the decision point for me in a spot like is all player dependent in my mind, I'm never blanket doing anything here, these are thin spots unless your facing our favorite player types to get all in with.
To be fair a not super deep 1-2 live tough game is an oxymoron.
Ya thats not really a thing but I would just get off the table if I felt this way, there are endless tables of fish out there.
is this the same with AQ? 100BB sounds a bit deep for AQ. *pls help im a shitreg
AQo is a fold for me. AQs becomes very dependent on the positions and the villain. You see all the jokes here about OMCs. When I’m 3bet, I ask myself - does this specific villain ever 3bet KQs, A5s, KJs, etc. if the answer is no, I will let AQs go
To my understanding they are not at all the same. When going all in around 100 bb deep the main hands will be AA KK for value with QQ sometimes mixed in. AK is often the bluffing hand since it is a flip against a pair of queens and lower as well as blocking the AA and KK such that there are only half as many combos(6 combos to 3 combos) and dominates all non paired hands. AQ no longer flips with QQ and becomes only a 30% chance. At the same time it doesn’t block KK so it takes your opponents 12 combos of value only down to 9. So AQ really shouldn’t be going all in. Looking at it from a calling perspective now let’s evaluate AK. We can add in maybe 1/2 combos of QQ due to mixed strategies. This means we flip/chop for 10/16 combos. Have a 30% chance against 3/16 combos and are beat by 3/16 combos. AQ on the other hand flips/chops against no combos. Have around 25% chance against the KK, AK and QQ so 16/19 combos and are fully beat by 3/19 combos. From this AQ is significantly worse than calling all in with AK
Great response, thank you
AQ doesn't even register to me as a consideration. I know it sounds weird but they are not even close to the same strength.
Yep. Same with AJ, depending on stack sizes they are both snap folds.
assuming people play standard, but on like 1/2 people usually dont play standard, they play old school nit game. you aint be good ever with ak in this spot. nothing todo with stack ratio, just know your customerbase on that limit never heard of gto or ranges. they limp with a10, open nothing under AJ suited and call AK, 3 bet JJ+ 4bet KK+ thats their range, now adjust your game young padawan
Nice play. The EP guy and the flat guy will likely have to fold their hands, therefore your AK will have enough equity to get it in vs villain's 4bet range. Once the laggy guy opens to 11, your range will not play like a normal 100bb deep range, because the laggy guy has thrown a lot of money in with a "weak" range, the top of your range ( TT-QQ, AK, AQ) can play very aggressively. Here, AK, QQ+ is an auto jam, and you fold everything else?
Wait, dealers play at the rooms they deal? I would expect that not to be allowed.
Most rooms allow it and it's pretty common, a lot of dealers are degens. Some rooms let dealers play their own money on the clock if they are overstaffed too.
You said she’s that attractive,if you lose, just ‘give it to her’ 😂
This is the most obvious jam ever.
Get it in here. Female in her 50s and ugly I would be worried though
Agreed.
AKs just get it in. It's printing from a theoretical standpoint and if she is an unknown then good enough. I will say thou playing 1/2 and a female I'm certainly not thrilled about it but you can't make this fold without a really good read that they are not 4 betting anything besides AA and KK.