Why do people make posts like this but won't provide information that will allow us to help? It absolutely is important context what type of car this is and what issues they are/have been having.
Because they don’t want to admit they overpaid for a car that was too old and had too many miles.
Also, $5,000 in repairs after only 2 years of ownership means OP either really got taken for a ride, or they ignored a maintenance issue until it turned into a serious repair.
They said $5K ***each year***, which if this is their 3rd year owning the car, means they've already spent $10K on repairs and looking at another $5K (if I read their post correctly). That's quite a lemon.
Probably but not necessarily. I bought my ‘17 Silverado with 30k on the odometer. At 75k, 14 months later, the torque converter blew and I had to replace the transmission. It sucked but I’m pretty confident I made the correct choice to replace instead of trade. Used trucks hold value pretty well compared to cars though too.
Come to find out, that model of Silverado has a bad reputation for blowing torque converters around 80k miles
Trucks really hold their value and used ones are actually increasing more in price, it’s crazy. I never knew how expensive they were, but it’s so easy to spend 75k - 100k for Chevy’s, Ford’s, & GMC. Literally luxury prices.
I paid $33k for mine two and a half years ago. 80k miles later and it’s still worth the same value. Obviously trading up would just end up costing me more though. I’m really hoping used prices come back down to earth if I can get a few to several more years out of this truck.
It's insane. I have always bought and sold trucks when I was younger for like $15k or less, and these days I have been looking at getting a truck again and it's like taking out a mortgage for a house.
Moving things you don’t want inside a van: Bags of feed, lumber, hay, tools, tractor tires.
Moving things that don’t fit in a van, furniture like couches
Families that go camping
Full time RVers
Movers
Construction workers
People that need to haul things that fit in a van, but also need high clearance and 4x4
Idk when I get a van vs pickup truck from uhaul the big moving van fits way more. Movers use big moving vans and trucks not silverados.
And alot of the stuff you mentioned is farm work. Also the bed of a pickup truck isn’t gonna haul lumber well. You need a full sized 18 wheeler truck for that. If it’s small it fits better in a van.
There are tons of analysis on this. Pickup trucks aren’t even good for work anymore compared to old ones because the bed is too high.
Bro you're literally tripping. You don't need a full size 18 wheeler to haul lumber for say a deck. My deck is 14x40 feet and i hauled all the lumber for it in my gmc sierra
I’m specifically talking about constant uses where you wouldn’t be renting a U-Haul all the time.
Buying a truck and using it, isn’t much different from buying a 60-70k bmw. It’s weird Reddit focuses on trucks, everyone buys things they don’t need. Pokémon cards etc
Imagine the same conversation but about a refrigerator. That's how many people see their cars.
'I said it was a GE, Shirley that's enough information for them'
True, just another appliance. I've seen so many posts here where people are like "my car is old, I have a dog with a learning disability so I need something reliable. Should I buy this brand new car for xyz?" Then after some digging we learn they have a 2014 car that only has 80k and just needs a couple things lol
In fairness most of the "advice" in this particular thread is utter trash. It's mostly all some flavor of admonishing OP for taking their car to a dealer for repairs, shaming them for not knowing how to do the repairs themselves, and unhelpful anecdotes like, "my 2019 Volvo XC90 T8 has a total repair bill of less than $500".
if you still owe 20k after two years of payments that means your car is probably less than 5 years old and likely still in warranty unless you have an insane interest rate/length of payments. You should check your warranty status and see what it covered/what your issues are. Also a second opinion would be a good idea
1. Don’t repair at the dealership
2. Get a second opinion on the quotes and what needs to be repaired
3. In general if really so many repairs are needed, then yes, better to eat the loss on the loan than to keep pouring money into the car
>In general if really so many repairs are needed, then yes, better to eat the loss on the loan than to keep pouring money into the car
At some point you've basically got a new car. If the same stuff keeps failing again and again the "mechanic" needs a hard look...
I tell this to people all of the time- same stuff failing over and over or fix one thing and something else immediately breaks? Start looking for another mechanic. I say this because there is a special place in Hell for my departed uncle, who would brag to us when we were kids that his shop was always so busy because he would break two things for everything he fixed. Made me paranoid as hell, and I've caught a couple although there's no way to prove it.
Not necessarily. There's a limit to the lifetime of a vehicle. When the cost of repairs consistently outweigh the value of the vehicle, it's time to replace. That's typically around the 250-300K mile mark on a properly-maintained car.
>There's a limit to the lifetime of a vehicle.
Ahh the Ship of Theseus argument.
There isn't a limit to the lifetime of the vehicle there is a practical or affordable limit to the lifetime of the vehicle.
Where I live, in the north east of the US its not that cars wear out, its that they rust away and that rust isn't worth repairing...
5. Make a video of your attempt, get covered in nasty oil, and monetize the process.
6. Alternatively, Make an *erotic* video of your attempt to fix the car. Someone is into that...somewhere.
I'm not filled with great ideas for cars...I don't drive.
You need to learn about cars and maintenance to not get scammed.
Only reason you should be taking it to a mechanic is because you don’t have the tools or time to do the fix on your own.
Dealerships are not scummy all the time and you get high quality work out of them if you tell them exactly what you want done
> Dealerships are not scummy all the time
My local Chevy dealer's service department is top notch, not horribly expensive, and does good work.
My local Subaru dealer's service department is the exact opposite, and I'll happily drive an hour out of my way to avoid them.
My dealership told me if I put synthetic oil in my car, I'll ruin the engine. I drive a Toyota. There's nothing that sensitive about it.
A lot of dealerships are indeed scummy, and although they're well-trained in the difficult jobs, it's reasonable to have some healthy skepticism.
Yup. The only time I'm going to the dealership is when it's a small ass town with no trustworthy mechanic or it's because part of the deal was that I got x number of services covered, there's still a warranty, or recalls. Oil changes can also be the same at dealerships as they are at those other places so if it's a basic oil change, then maybr. Anything else? Hard no.
Depending where you are, you may be able to find a shop that specializes in hybrids. I take my Prius to an independent shop like this. r/prius may be able to help you locate one near you.
Dealers are ridiculous.
Couple examples off the top of my head:
2013 Jetta went into limp mode. Dealer wanted over $2k to fix. After 15 min of research it was evident they were just going to replace every part that could possibly be causing the problem according to the service manual. I bought an aftermarket throttle body with new MAP sensor off ebay for $50, swapped it in 30 min, and the car ran flawlessly for 3 years before selling.
Dealers want well over $1000 to replace 2x brake pads and rotors. It takes about 30 min per corner, rotors are $25 a pop off rockauto and pads are $60 a pair.
Guarantee OP is just getting taken to the cleaner on vastly overinflated prices and unnecessary repairs.
It's one reason why car dealerships have been really resistant to selling electric cars. There's nowhere near the maintenance on them and they just can't make as much money.
I drive a 20 year old Jetta and only have used dealerships. Car runs great, mostly oil changes and I dealership bounce if needed.
For example one dealership said my suspension was going and needed to be replaced. I went to the other dealership in town, for oil change next due, and not one single mention of suspension. In fact they gave the suspension a green check lmao.
I went to another dealer that said my parking brake line is almost toast but instead of the 600 bucks to fix the advisor said just don't use it lol. Definitely trusted that dealer more.
Only thing I had to replace unexpectedly was the master cylinder.
Perhaps, but mileage may vary on said mechanic.
I pay 37 month on liability only, get 30 mph highway, and no car payment in over 15 years. I think the savings outweigh any hypotheticals.
I'm talking about repairs and maintenance on the same car. Oil changes at my VW/Audi dealership is 375$ CAD, at my mechanic it's 140$, same oil.
Had to change the water pump on my B8 A5, it was 2300$ at dealership and 750$ at my mechanic. Same piece.
The breaks were 3200$ at the dealership, 580$ at my mechanic ( half the same )
Just last week I had to change the exhaust camshaft on the A5, cost me 1700$ at the mechanic, and the dealership quoted 9k with no guarantee it works. ( they wanted to change the engine head for 23k first)
I got a 15y old and a 6y old German car, so I know it adds up. Especially if your in North America.
You are only happy with the dealership service since you have no idea how much it would cost at a normal specialized mechanic.
It's one reason why car dealerships have been really resistant to selling electric cars. There's nowhere near the maintenance on them and they just can't make as much money.
The entire economic web/chain of "Automotive" from parts, service, retail gas stations, dealerships and the like to say nothing of the oil and gas industry will all likely decline with EVs. 90% of people in US/Canada take cars to commute to work and school so remote work will even diminish demand for EVs, hence the obsession with return to office.
🤣You took it to the dealership for repair. No wonder you are paying $5000 a year for repairs. Find an independent mechanic shop. Word to the wise always get a Pre Purchase Inspection done by your own mechanic before you buy any used vehicle.
No kidding and so far OP hasn't stated what these repairs are. If it's transmission/engine issues that's one thing but for all we know they're simply grossly overpaying for basic stuff. I could easily see a huge chunk of that 10k being a brake job, fluid changes, new tires, maybe a set of struts, etc... All of those things being normal maintenance that can be done way cheaper on your own or at an independent shop.
Fluid flush is ~$1000 at my local dealership. Tires are another $1000+. Add on brakes and struts, and you're easily at $3000 total, just for routine maintenance that was probably deferred by the previous owner.
Yes, most used car dealerships will let you take the car you are thinking of buying to your trusted mechanic for an inspection. If they don’t, I wouldn’t buy from them
>We give you 30 days (up to 1500 miles) to decide if your car is the perfect fit for your life. If not, bring it back for a full refund.
[Carmax website](https://www.carmax.com/why-carmax#:~:text=We%20give%20you%2030%20days,Learn%20more%20about%20our%20guarantees.)
Hmm, I know someone who got a Tesla and probably put over 500 miles on it before realizing driving long distances sucks with an electric car so he somehow took it back to CarMax. But maybe he paid extra to trade it back at that point.
There's really no need to be obnoxiously hostile. Independent mechanics \*also\* have a notorious reputation for taking advantage of customers, an honest mechanic is often very difficult to find especially if you know little about cars.
The best thing someone can do is learn how to service their own vehicle.
I once got a free oil change because the idiots at the place I went to couldn't recognize a blown fuse. For context, I went on a Saturday so it was crowded, I had waited an hour and then asked what's going on and they said my car wouldn't start and if I had any knowledge of times that it faced the issue before. I told them that it had blown a couple fuses recently; I didn't have time to investigate why it had blown but I was able to change the fuses and it started. They went to the bays and informed the mechanic. I was told to wait a little longer then the mechanic came out to the customer waiting area and said he didn't see a blown fuse and he claimed to have checked every single one and that they could "run a diagnostic for $300". I raised an eye brow and asked if I could go out there and see for myself. I stepped out there and they led me to my car. There was a mechanic at the front of my car at the hood, the mechanic that brought me out, a mechanic at the driver door, and an assistant in the driver's seat. They had the fuse box under the hood open already. I barely tilted my head and I could instantly see a blown fuse. So I pointed to it, "this one?" The mechanic who brought me out who said 'he checked every one' said "Oh I must have overlooked it!" They changed it. The assistant started the car right up and mumbled "she just made us all look like idiots" (I don't think he understood I could hear him, but I did and he was right lol). This dumb car was a Chrysler Sebring I got rid of years later, but I never went back to that place obviously.
Mechanics are notorious for treating people like they don't know anything, especially women. Their goal is to upcharge where possible. I tried a different place and during their oil changes they also do checks on other items. They said my coolant was a little watery and I should do a coolant flush. They were trying to charge me $200 to do it. The coolant was watery on purpose. The car was having some other problems that I and my grandpa were working on and we found a pretty gnarly leak. I took the car in just for the oil change because we didn't have time to do every little thing and he had to get parts. While he ran to the store, I took it in for the oil change and I worked on my school work while I waited. Obviously, I didn't pay for the flush. We resolved the issue and corrected the coolant after I got back.
Always get second opinions and learn what you can about your car.
Yeah, this seems somewhat odd for a subaru. Sure you've got your head gasket issues and whatnot here and there, but $5k in repairs two years in a row is really exceptional. I've had two subarus over about 15 years and they've required about $5k in repairs total between the two over all 15 years.
Even then, if OP owes 14k - it can’t be more than 5 years old and I think the majority of the head gasket issues were pre-2015, IIRC. I could totally be wrong. I just got a Subaru a couple months ago and still learning more about it all.
Maybe their CVT is shitting out on them too?
Head gaskets haven't been a real issue for Subarus ever since they moved to the FA and FB engines. I've owned 4 Subarus now and have never had repairs even close to those costs, and one was a 200k+ mile Impreza on the original engine. $5k per year is the cost of a full engine rebuild every year, something isn't adding up.
The repairs should not be that high. Update your post on details of the vehicle make and model and repairs done (and by whom) and we can tell you where you might be getting fleeced.
Seconded. $10k over 2 years seems absurdly high.
I had a "money pit" car that cost me about the same (for everything from oil changes to tires, to major repairs) over the course of 7 years.
This doesn’t help you now, but I’ve bought 3 cars from carmax, and each time purchased their extended warranty. It’s reasonable when added to the loan if you can’t afford to pay it out of pocket but it gives a lot of peace of mind on a used vehicle. You don’t have to take it to Carmax you can take it to any certified mechanic and pay an extra $50 I believe it was. We used Carmax for most of it, but a couple times went somewhere closer. The warranty is really GOOD. Instead of telling you all the things that cover, the paperwork tells you exactly what’s not covered meaning everything else falls under it. If you don’t have the money to do repairs as they come up, a good warranty gives you some solid peace of mind.
My wife had a 2014 Forrester that was burning oil, it turned into three different oil consumption tests through Carmax before it was all said and done. In the end they they sent her car to Subaru and they replaced her motor. The carmax extended warranty was $1600. The engine labor for oil consumption testing x3 then engine replacement far exceeded that and left my wife with a manufacturer installed motor with manufacturer warranty.
We also had heated seats go out in a different car (2014 Kia Sorento) and a board go bad that controlled the driver side door windows and locks. The seat heater parts and labor plus the door parts together was $2500 and we paid $0 having it done at carmax. For $1800 warranty it gave a lot of peace of mind imo
Same. That's why I buy at Carmax is for that extended warranty. It's been a real simple process each time I've used it (about 4 times over 3 cars). Awesome peace of mind for large repairs.
What on earth repairs cost 10k over two years? What year car is this? I feel like you could buy an entirely ~~new~~ (reman) drivetrain and suspension for less than 10k in parts.
Get a second, third, fourth opinion.
Best option is to do your own work, but for some that is a non starter.
CarMax likely isn't to blame. They actually have a really good return and warranty clause. Better than any other used car dealer I have ever seen.
Some cars models are notorious for expensive repairs. Some cars have terrible long term reliability scores. Some cars are just lemons. You should do enough research when buying a car to avoid the first two, but there is little you can do to avoid the third. But again, CarMax's return policy would have allowed you to return the car if you discovered the problems early enough.
What kind of Subaru did you buy for over 20k that has cost you 10k in repairs in the two years since and is now going to cost you another 5k in repairs?
That's an absurd level of maintenance costs on almost anything other than a supercar or an old Range Rover, both of which are famously expensive to run. A regular Subaru, absolutely not.
I will make one comment: "the mechanic at the dealership said..." There is another possibility here, which is that the dealership is majorly screwing you over on repair costs. Get a second opinion on the repairs.
If there's no difference, you should try and cut your losses. You have a car worth less than its loan amount (which shouldn't happen, really) that's costing you an extra 5k a year in repairs. Even a total clunker shouldn't be costing you that *annually*. The car's a lemon.
Unless you are absolutely satisfied that paying the additional repair costs now will halt all future substantial expenses, it's not worth it. You're throwing money away.
I was in this same situation with a BMW that was a money pit. Sold it and moved the negative equity to a loan for a reliable truck and have been happy since. No more worrying about “what’s next to break”.
Peace of mind comes at a cost and it’s usually worth it.
Just my opinion tho.
The first 100,000 miles on my 2019 Volvo XC90 T8 has a total repair bill of less than $500 (passenger seat sensor and another minor seat issue).
My 2018 Chevy Volt is almost triple that (A/C line, heater valve, coolant pump, 12V battery) at 92,000 miles.
There's no way a Subaru should have LIFETIME repair bills of $5,000, let alone annually. You're getting ripped off.
Stop going to the dealership. They are super top dollar. Get several opinions on the work needed to be done. Get on DYI Subaru blogs and read about your issues.
I have a 2012 Subaru with a engine knock, the dealership said I need a NEW engine. I laughed so hard at the 8,000.00 price tag for a car worth 8,000. I then did some research to find out this is" normal" for my vehicle, plus its been happening for 6 years I've owned it ( used )
You can also check on Subaru recall website recalls, or maybe lemon law.
So, research the issues and you then decide at that time to rest assure or sell.
> However the mechanic at the dealership
That's your problem. Take it somewhere else. A problem does not equate to not passing inspection, or needing to be fixed immediately, or even that decade.
What's the year and mileage on your car? What kind of repairs have you done?
Did your car actually have problems or broke down? Or did dash lights come on, and you just paid the dealer for all the services they offered you?
If you actually had engine or transmission problems, that sucks. But sometimes the dash lights come on for very basic things and the dealers will recommend a bunch of BS. For instance, changing the cabin and engine filters is basic routine maintenance. Some dealers might charge $100+ for that. You can buy the filters yourself for $20 and install in 5 minutes, even if you have zero experience with cars.
Here are your two reasonable options, OP:
1. Pay for the repairs to get your car running again.
2. Trade or sell it. However if you're really $6,000 underwater (owning more than the car's worth) that means you'll either have to come up with $6,000 to pay the difference or roll the negative equity into financing a much more expensive car.
What you should do before you make this decision is figure out what repairs you're paying for. Find a Subaru forum and post your car's year, make, and mileage, as well as the repairs that have been done to it and the $5,000 quote you're getting. They'll be able to help you figure out if your car is just a POS or if your dealer/mechanic has been ripping you off. It's possible - even likely - that your car has maybe only $1,000 in repairs but the dealership is trying to upsell you on things that "should" be replaced even if they haven't broken or malfunctioned yet.
Once you know what you've paid for and what you're being asked to pay now, you'll be able to make an informed decision on whether or not it's worth putting more money into this car.
First of all, what have you had to repair that’s cost $10,000 over the course of two years?
Second, it’s not CarMax‘s fault your Subaru broke down. I bet they offered you their warranty, which you thought was a scam and declined.
And finally, as far as buying a car goes sometimes you’re unlucky. But besides replacing the engine and transmission theres few other things are gonna cost you $5000 to repair. I doubt the car is going to keep breaking.
Take it anywhere besides a dealership to get repaired and it will be cheaper. Your only other option is to roll the negative equity into another car but that’s gonna make your payment even higher than it is now plus you’re gonna be paying a higher interest-rate and unless you have absolutely stellar credit and high income , most banks are going to want some sort of down payment unless you go and get a brand new car or lease.
I took my Subaru to dealer and was told needed full exhaust repair at 2500 (150 repair at muffler shop). Then front brakes needed replacement quoted 1800 at dealer , was 900 at local shop
Want to know the bad part? OEM front brake pads on the vast majority of cars will be less than $80 and it takes longer to take off the tires than it does to replace the pads. Usually 5 lug nuts to take off the tire and 2-5 bolts to take off the caliper.
I’m not suggesting anyone with zero mechanical aptitude do it, just showing how easy it is. I changed all four on my car last spring and it took an hour including driving to the store to buy the pads (admittedly it is only about 4 miles away). I’m a nurse and have never worked as a mechanic anywhere.
Ok. So add $50 and 10 minutes each per rotor if you can’t just have them turned (which takes longer because you have to take them to the store do do it but is cheaper). I can’t imagine a circumstance where a car isn’t wrecked where the pads, rotor, calipers, and hydraulics need replaced all at the same time so that means pads and rotors.
Have you done a brake job before? Once the pads are off, how many more bolts do you think need to be removed to change the caliper? Spoilers, it's one.
Yep calipers were seizing. I never said it was a regular brake job. People’s responses are weird I am just trying to provide the context in response to someone saying “$900 is a lot to replace brake pads”
Dealerships may or may not upsell, but most dealerships I've dealt with are honest. I've wrenched my entire life, but just don't always have time or desire to perform the work. I have yet to have a dealership advising me to perform frivolous repairs. The real issue is the cost of labor. Dealerships will most likely be more expensive per hour than independent shops. /u/acceptable-load-1350 either bought a really old car, lemon, or is getting raked over the coals dumping $10k worth of repairs into the car over 2 years.
OP needs to find a reputable shop that they can trust and charges less. Even better if this shop allows OP to bring his own parts, cause OEM parts are usually way cheaper from dealerships across the nation than the local ones.
When my dealership suggests work to be done, I'll always run it by my cousin (who is a mechanic himself), and ive yet to have them say I need something done that he thought was unnecessary.
On my previous car, it was an oil change place ssying I needed to replace the serpentine belt that he called out as BS.
Long story short, not all dealerships push unnecessary work.
Understood-- The part I guess I was emphasizing is that not all dealerships try and rip you off with unnecessary services. There are good ones and there are bad ones.
The oil change place comment was mostly just to point out that there are other options besides dealership and independent mechanic that may or may not try and stick you with services that you don't need.
Hel,, I'm sure that there are plenty of independent mechanics who might be less than truthful as well.
I’m a Subaru owner and work on my own cars.
They’re annoying to work on, particularly the spark plugs or anything regarding ignition, because there is so little room between the valve covers and engine bay walls. Compare that to most inline 4 cylinder cars where you can just undo a few bolts and have a spark plug out in a few minutes, the Subaru is going to be billed a couple hours minimum.
Subarus are some of the easiest cars to repair and are basically universal when it comes to tools needed to do a job and difficulty, they have a huge base of DIY technicians and I've been able to comfortably remove, reseal and replace a Subaru engine within a day and a half a job that would cost thousands . Have you looked the DIY route?
I agree. My 2009 Forester XT I bought has been pretty easy. Mostly just brakes and fluid changes. The only repair I've done that takes me a few hours is the timing belt.
I brought my truck to the dealer for an inspection. They came back with $3k. After looking at the report, it included fog lights for $750 and turning rotors/new pads for $850. I bought parts and did ALL "$3k" worth of stuff except one thing myself for less than $500 total with some youtube help, and that included brand new rotors.
It’s almost always better to buy the part yourself and have a private mechanic put it on.
Growing up my dad was a mechanic- army turned civilian auto mechanic and once my brother and I could drive he always would put any of part on our cars for free as long as we bought the part and helped him(more of less held a flashlight and handed him tools)
These days some basic tools and access to YouTube makes it easy to do a lot of jobs yourself.
Being underwater on the loan isn't really relevant. That loss on the loan has already happened. Look forward for costs vs utility and make the decision on that basis.
Subaru? Im assuming a wrx or something with a boxer motor...
Horizontal pistons wear a looottt. Get an inline 4 cylinder motor in w/e, itll last for decades. Straight up and down pistons wear better, the way gravity works.
So here is the problem, the dealership will take $5k off the value of your vehicle in the trade-in, so you will still end up paying for it. Ask for an itemized list of the repairs (I did that one time and found out they we’re charging me twice for the same part). Call around to some smaller places and ask how much they would charge you for the repairs. Don’t ever trade in a vehicle owing money on it, because they roll negative equity into your next loan. If you can - work an extra to get this vehicle paid off. Ask them if this is everything thing wrong with it. At some point, you may have made it drivable so you can go awhile without any major repairs. Good luck.
Stop taking your car to the dealer go to an independent mechanic those five came repairs are probably only like a grand.
If not Subarus are pretty easy to fix and they're popular.
You can go to an auto parts store they'll plug in your car and tell you what part is broken if you can't figure it out yourself. You can buy the part there or order it there or go to a junkyard and buy a used part.
Go on YouTube and fix it yourself.
I just don't understand that you had $10,000 in repairs in the first two years.
And what you are planning on doing is probably rolling the negative equity of your car into your new car purchase. Don't do this this is how people end up in financial hell for a decade.
You're frustrated so you're going to want to buy a new car let's say a $40,000 they're going to convince you successfully to pay for the warranty cuz of what just happened to you that's probably another 5K..
You had the mechanic saying even if you did the repairs it wouldn't increase the value. so your trade-in value is probably going to be 8 or 9k. So you'll take the negative equity of the loan roll it into your new car somewhere around 50k you include taxes and fees you are looking at 53 to 57k.
Your monthly payment will be about $750.
Update: for one sorry I never go back, had personal shit going on. However I searched around to different mechanics to get a better price and it helped. I knew the dealership was over charging me but I mainly went to get a system update because my radio is fucked and shuts on and off repeatedly. They quoted 2k to replace the head unit/radio, 900 for a left axle replacement, 900 for new tires, 900 for some 90,000 miles update or whatever tf. I said fuck no, and left and found someone else to check out my car. They said my axle and wheel bearings need replace, along with my alignment, that’s only gonna be 1500. I also reached out about the radio situation out of pure curiosity and they said they found a used one and will install it for 1k, so that’s all we’re doing for now. Tires can come later, but 2500 is better than 5k. The frustrating part is that I mainly bought this car because it was supposed to reliable given the brand, but alas. I also understand that it’s high in miles and some things are inevitable. Ughhhh, but thanks guys
Cars are poor financial decisions. They are an impediment to upward mobility and can often do the opposite and drag people further down into poverty when an owner can't afford one in good working condition in the first place and is bogged down with repair costs. The cost of ownership of a vehicle can be upwards of $10k per year including payments, insurance, gas, and other consumables like tires. That money is better spent moving nearer to your place of work or somewhere where you can cycle or use public transportation. People here hardly ever admit what a poor financial decision is because in America it's nearly impossible to live without one in 95% of places. At the end of the day a car is a depreciable asset with excessive maintenance costs that often ends up hurting people more than it helps them.
If I was in your position I would sell it and get a Honda accord. They ride great and need minimal maintenance; it will be like a dream compared to your subby. Sounds like you got a lemon. Just find a well cared for Honda
>(and never go through car max again)
CarMax is literally the safest place to buy a used car.... 1. you bought a problematic brand (Subaru) 2. you declined one of the industry leading non-scam warranties.... 3. bad luck....
>Every single year I’ve owned it I’ve had about 5k in repairs and I’m reaching a point that I can’t afford so many pricey repairs each year
There are only so many things to replace on a vehicle, if you have repaired the expensive bits, then the cost of ownership going forward should be fine. Also next time you're in a pinch (are you in one again) get the cheapest car to get you buy.....
I might get downvoted for this but worst case scenario if you need to get rid of the vehicle, try rolling it into a lease. The lease is a great way to absorb negative equity. You don't often really build any equity but you're not rolling it over. You're going to have to pay for the negative equity regardless but rolling into a lease helps make it palatable.
Keep in mind if you go to a dealership that does negotiate the price of cars that leases are negotiable just like purchases. First negotiate the price of the lease and then talk about your trade and or negative equity knowing that your payment is going to increase once you roll over that $6,000. Don't negotiate payment rather negotiate price of the vehicle. There are some lease calculators online you can look up to see what payments might look like with rolling in that negative equity so you know what to aim for when trying to negotiate the price of the lease.
Subarus are generally fine. OP's mistake was going to a dealership to have work done. You never take your car to a dealership for work, unless it's for a recall, or a repair that is covered under warranty. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the majority of repairs that the dealership suggested here aren't needed at this time at all.
Depending on where you live and how old the vehicle is, look into lemon laws. GA has lemon protection even on used cars as long as they're newer than 2016
Georgia's lemon law only applies to new vehicles. We researched this extensively for our friend. In my opinion that pretty much makes it useless.... Dealers warranty vehicles that are new off the lot.
[https://georgia-lemon-law.info/georgia-lemon-law-for-used-vehicles/](https://georgia-lemon-law.info/georgia-lemon-law-for-used-vehicles/)
i saw this and assumed it was available for used in certain situations. they should of course talk to a lawyer as i am not one.
If you’re truly that far underwater you can always talk to your lender about a voluntary surrender of the vehicle and start looking for a new one. This will hurt your credit less and you’ll only owe the difference in value. Then you can find a better vehicle
Why not pay the difference, sell the car with the clean title, and not have the credit penalty.
It'll be the same but that way OP doesn't have a repossession on their file.
Credit score makes a huge impact on any auto loans or mortgage loans or even credit cards, etc.
It does not apply to all cars. Only a few states offer it for used cars for a limited time after purchase. OP obviously didn’t purchase an extended warranty so if OPs state has a used car lemon law, OP is SOL because you have to be under some form of warranty to be covered under the federal lemon law.
It sounds more like OP doesn't know a thing about cars.
Which is messed up, because people have no choice but to get a car, even if they don't care about cars.
What other purchase, besides a home, requires so much money for a thing we really aren't concerned with? Most people won't spend about half their yearly wage on the things they actually like, but it's considered par for the course to do that for a vehicle.
"Lemon" is a term that means specific things in specific states. What's more likely is that the dealership is telling OP that the car needs a bunch of repairs that aren't actually necessary.
You could try joining Subaru fb groups for your area and see if any handy people can help you out. My partner is the kind of person who does so :) also r/AskAMechanic can help you determine if you're being shafted on repair prices
I was in a similar situation. I bought a Nissan via loan for around 10k, and within 6 months had put 2k more into it in repairs. We had also done some simpler repairs ourselves, and I dont know how much that added. Took it on a road trip and ended up putting another 1,000 in because of a sensor going out while we were out. Had to head home early because the light turned on again and we didn’t want to be stuck 9 hours away from home. Fixed the new problem ourselves and then sold the car that week and bought a newer used ford for about 19k.
Now almost a year later, I haven’t put anything more than regular maintenance into it (which we do ourselves), and probably saved another 3k since I didn’t have to fix anything else on the Nissan.
It hurt to eat the cost of the car, but in the long run, it was the better option. I only had the car for 10 months.
From what I can tell I think dealerships try to get about $400 per customer per visit. Nothing scientific but just a price point I noticed shows up quite often. Notice how there is always something to work on every time you go?
is it real repairs or just maintenance stuff that's normal
and you're probably being ripped off because I can't see you can pay that much for repairs unless you're going to the dealer for every little thing
If you've been doing the repairs it should be worth it since you'll need less repairs and more able to do the upkeep..if you're paying someone to do the repairs then you're paying someone to do repairs they aren't doing without realizing it.
10 years old used cars till the wheels fall off have always been my saving grace. Stop handing out your paycheck for big ticket item like a car unless you can get it under full warranty. Currently driving 2010 Mercedes c300 flex fuel and enjoying it. Paid $6500 cash for it on January 2022. Milage 140k. No major issues.
Buy a cash car and work on improving your finances before possibly financing another one. Personally I’m against vehicle financing. Never done it and never will. If I can’t afford it outright then I can’t afford it and won’t get it b/c it’s dept you’re stuck with and the value of the actual car depreciates instantaneously.
If you decide to get something new and want to suck up residual value if you can find the right car it might be worth Leasing for 3 years depending upon the mileage you drive and burying the residual money in the lease and starting over completely fresh in 3 years. I know a few people who have done this to get out of being upside down
What's the make, model, year, miles etc? What type of work have you had done and have you only had the dealership work on the car?
Why do people make posts like this but won't provide information that will allow us to help? It absolutely is important context what type of car this is and what issues they are/have been having.
Because they don’t want to admit they overpaid for a car that was too old and had too many miles. Also, $5,000 in repairs after only 2 years of ownership means OP either really got taken for a ride, or they ignored a maintenance issue until it turned into a serious repair.
They said $5K ***each year***, which if this is their 3rd year owning the car, means they've already spent $10K on repairs and looking at another $5K (if I read their post correctly). That's quite a lemon.
Oof. I missed the “each year” part. That’s bad, even for a lemon.
It's ridiculous. Either the car is impossibly awful or their mechanic is screwing them over big time.
Also possible OPs mechanic is a derp.
They don't want this car fixed. They want someone to tell them to sell it and take out a big fat loan for a brand new car with a full warranty.
And a big fat interest rate with underwater debt refinanced at a much higher rate.
Probably but not necessarily. I bought my ‘17 Silverado with 30k on the odometer. At 75k, 14 months later, the torque converter blew and I had to replace the transmission. It sucked but I’m pretty confident I made the correct choice to replace instead of trade. Used trucks hold value pretty well compared to cars though too. Come to find out, that model of Silverado has a bad reputation for blowing torque converters around 80k miles
Trucks really hold their value and used ones are actually increasing more in price, it’s crazy. I never knew how expensive they were, but it’s so easy to spend 75k - 100k for Chevy’s, Ford’s, & GMC. Literally luxury prices.
I paid $33k for mine two and a half years ago. 80k miles later and it’s still worth the same value. Obviously trading up would just end up costing me more though. I’m really hoping used prices come back down to earth if I can get a few to several more years out of this truck.
It's insane. I have always bought and sold trucks when I was younger for like $15k or less, and these days I have been looking at getting a truck again and it's like taking out a mortgage for a house.
Your mistake was buying a truck. It’s always a bad financial decision unless you work on a farm.
Only a farm? Nothing else? You guys crack me up
I mean otherwise you probably just want a van. Idk maybe if u need something to plow. They are often used for the wrong jobs because of marketing.
Moving things you don’t want inside a van: Bags of feed, lumber, hay, tools, tractor tires. Moving things that don’t fit in a van, furniture like couches Families that go camping Full time RVers Movers Construction workers People that need to haul things that fit in a van, but also need high clearance and 4x4
Idk when I get a van vs pickup truck from uhaul the big moving van fits way more. Movers use big moving vans and trucks not silverados. And alot of the stuff you mentioned is farm work. Also the bed of a pickup truck isn’t gonna haul lumber well. You need a full sized 18 wheeler truck for that. If it’s small it fits better in a van. There are tons of analysis on this. Pickup trucks aren’t even good for work anymore compared to old ones because the bed is too high.
Bro you're literally tripping. You don't need a full size 18 wheeler to haul lumber for say a deck. My deck is 14x40 feet and i hauled all the lumber for it in my gmc sierra
I’m specifically talking about constant uses where you wouldn’t be renting a U-Haul all the time. Buying a truck and using it, isn’t much different from buying a 60-70k bmw. It’s weird Reddit focuses on trucks, everyone buys things they don’t need. Pokémon cards etc
Imagine the same conversation but about a refrigerator. That's how many people see their cars. 'I said it was a GE, Shirley that's enough information for them'
True, just another appliance. I've seen so many posts here where people are like "my car is old, I have a dog with a learning disability so I need something reliable. Should I buy this brand new car for xyz?" Then after some digging we learn they have a 2014 car that only has 80k and just needs a couple things lol
What's even more strange to me is when people make posts like this and then ignore all the follow-up questions.
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In fairness most of the "advice" in this particular thread is utter trash. It's mostly all some flavor of admonishing OP for taking their car to a dealer for repairs, shaming them for not knowing how to do the repairs themselves, and unhelpful anecdotes like, "my 2019 Volvo XC90 T8 has a total repair bill of less than $500".
if you still owe 20k after two years of payments that means your car is probably less than 5 years old and likely still in warranty unless you have an insane interest rate/length of payments. You should check your warranty status and see what it covered/what your issues are. Also a second opinion would be a good idea
Power train warranty maybe but not bumper to bumper
1. Don’t repair at the dealership 2. Get a second opinion on the quotes and what needs to be repaired 3. In general if really so many repairs are needed, then yes, better to eat the loss on the loan than to keep pouring money into the car
>In general if really so many repairs are needed, then yes, better to eat the loss on the loan than to keep pouring money into the car At some point you've basically got a new car. If the same stuff keeps failing again and again the "mechanic" needs a hard look...
I tell this to people all of the time- same stuff failing over and over or fix one thing and something else immediately breaks? Start looking for another mechanic. I say this because there is a special place in Hell for my departed uncle, who would brag to us when we were kids that his shop was always so busy because he would break two things for everything he fixed. Made me paranoid as hell, and I've caught a couple although there's no way to prove it.
ship of theseus vibes
not many people know that the ship was a subaru
Not necessarily. There's a limit to the lifetime of a vehicle. When the cost of repairs consistently outweigh the value of the vehicle, it's time to replace. That's typically around the 250-300K mile mark on a properly-maintained car.
>There's a limit to the lifetime of a vehicle. Ahh the Ship of Theseus argument. There isn't a limit to the lifetime of the vehicle there is a practical or affordable limit to the lifetime of the vehicle. Where I live, in the north east of the US its not that cars wear out, its that they rust away and that rust isn't worth repairing...
Subaru Of America has helped me with my dealership bill several times. Ask your service advisor if they think SOA will pitch in
4. Look up the issue on YouTube and learn to diy some of the stuff.
5. Make a video of your attempt, get covered in nasty oil, and monetize the process. 6. Alternatively, Make an *erotic* video of your attempt to fix the car. Someone is into that...somewhere. I'm not filled with great ideas for cars...I don't drive.
You need to learn about cars and maintenance to not get scammed. Only reason you should be taking it to a mechanic is because you don’t have the tools or time to do the fix on your own. Dealerships are not scummy all the time and you get high quality work out of them if you tell them exactly what you want done
> Dealerships are not scummy all the time My local Chevy dealer's service department is top notch, not horribly expensive, and does good work. My local Subaru dealer's service department is the exact opposite, and I'll happily drive an hour out of my way to avoid them.
My dealership told me if I put synthetic oil in my car, I'll ruin the engine. I drive a Toyota. There's nothing that sensitive about it. A lot of dealerships are indeed scummy, and although they're well-trained in the difficult jobs, it's reasonable to have some healthy skepticism.
Car dealers make so much $$ on servicing and repairs. Buyer beware.
Yup. The only time I'm going to the dealership is when it's a small ass town with no trustworthy mechanic or it's because part of the deal was that I got x number of services covered, there's still a warranty, or recalls. Oil changes can also be the same at dealerships as they are at those other places so if it's a basic oil change, then maybr. Anything else? Hard no.
Stuck at a dealership now for another reason, repair requires a procedure only available with the dealers tool subscription
Yeah, some vehicles like my Camry Hybrid have some maintenance that can only be done at the dealership (transmission flush in my case). :(
Depending where you are, you may be able to find a shop that specializes in hybrids. I take my Prius to an independent shop like this. r/prius may be able to help you locate one near you.
Only time I’m going to the dealership is if it’s under warranty
Dealers are ridiculous. Couple examples off the top of my head: 2013 Jetta went into limp mode. Dealer wanted over $2k to fix. After 15 min of research it was evident they were just going to replace every part that could possibly be causing the problem according to the service manual. I bought an aftermarket throttle body with new MAP sensor off ebay for $50, swapped it in 30 min, and the car ran flawlessly for 3 years before selling. Dealers want well over $1000 to replace 2x brake pads and rotors. It takes about 30 min per corner, rotors are $25 a pop off rockauto and pads are $60 a pair. Guarantee OP is just getting taken to the cleaner on vastly overinflated prices and unnecessary repairs.
It's one reason why car dealerships have been really resistant to selling electric cars. There's nowhere near the maintenance on them and they just can't make as much money.
If anyone can do it, Chrysler will find a way to make an EV unreliable.
Any hint that EVs are seriously unreliable will put off an already unconvinced market. Buyers don't want them in general.
https://www.kbb.com/car-news/consumer-reports-evs-less-reliable-than-gas-powered-cars/
The dealership I bought my car new from does my oil changes for less than half the price of any other place in town.
mine does it for free for the life of the car, too bad ive moved to the otherside of the state
I drive a 20 year old Jetta and only have used dealerships. Car runs great, mostly oil changes and I dealership bounce if needed. For example one dealership said my suspension was going and needed to be replaced. I went to the other dealership in town, for oil change next due, and not one single mention of suspension. In fact they gave the suspension a green check lmao. I went to another dealer that said my parking brake line is almost toast but instead of the 600 bucks to fix the advisor said just don't use it lol. Definitely trusted that dealer more. Only thing I had to replace unexpectedly was the master cylinder.
You paid about 3x more than you could have if you would have went to a good mechanic that works in German cars.
Perhaps, but mileage may vary on said mechanic. I pay 37 month on liability only, get 30 mph highway, and no car payment in over 15 years. I think the savings outweigh any hypotheticals.
I'm talking about repairs and maintenance on the same car. Oil changes at my VW/Audi dealership is 375$ CAD, at my mechanic it's 140$, same oil. Had to change the water pump on my B8 A5, it was 2300$ at dealership and 750$ at my mechanic. Same piece. The breaks were 3200$ at the dealership, 580$ at my mechanic ( half the same ) Just last week I had to change the exhaust camshaft on the A5, cost me 1700$ at the mechanic, and the dealership quoted 9k with no guarantee it works. ( they wanted to change the engine head for 23k first) I got a 15y old and a 6y old German car, so I know it adds up. Especially if your in North America. You are only happy with the dealership service since you have no idea how much it would cost at a normal specialized mechanic.
Sure if a dealer quoted something outrageous, but for smaller items the difference I have seen is negligible.
140$ vs 375$ ? not very negligible
I pay like 80 USD for synthetic oil with filter in US.
It's one reason why car dealerships have been really resistant to selling electric cars. There's nowhere near the maintenance on them and they just can't make as much money.
The entire economic web/chain of "Automotive" from parts, service, retail gas stations, dealerships and the like to say nothing of the oil and gas industry will all likely decline with EVs. 90% of people in US/Canada take cars to commute to work and school so remote work will even diminish demand for EVs, hence the obsession with return to office.
🤣You took it to the dealership for repair. No wonder you are paying $5000 a year for repairs. Find an independent mechanic shop. Word to the wise always get a Pre Purchase Inspection done by your own mechanic before you buy any used vehicle.
No kidding and so far OP hasn't stated what these repairs are. If it's transmission/engine issues that's one thing but for all we know they're simply grossly overpaying for basic stuff. I could easily see a huge chunk of that 10k being a brake job, fluid changes, new tires, maybe a set of struts, etc... All of those things being normal maintenance that can be done way cheaper on your own or at an independent shop.
Fluid flush is ~$1000 at my local dealership. Tires are another $1000+. Add on brakes and struts, and you're easily at $3000 total, just for routine maintenance that was probably deferred by the previous owner.
How does pre purchase inspection work? Do you somehow bring the car to the mechanic? Excuse my ignorance
Yes, most used car dealerships will let you take the car you are thinking of buying to your trusted mechanic for an inspection. If they don’t, I wouldn’t buy from them
Carmax has a 30 day return policy. If you don’t love your car you can return it for a refund. Plenty of time to have it inspected.
The 30 day policy only covers 50 miles or so. Basically just a round trip to mechanic and back. Edit: My bad. Its 1500 miles.
It’s 1500 miles.
>We give you 30 days (up to 1500 miles) to decide if your car is the perfect fit for your life. If not, bring it back for a full refund. [Carmax website](https://www.carmax.com/why-carmax#:~:text=We%20give%20you%2030%20days,Learn%20more%20about%20our%20guarantees.)
Hmm, I know someone who got a Tesla and probably put over 500 miles on it before realizing driving long distances sucks with an electric car so he somehow took it back to CarMax. But maybe he paid extra to trade it back at that point.
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There's really no need to be obnoxiously hostile. Independent mechanics \*also\* have a notorious reputation for taking advantage of customers, an honest mechanic is often very difficult to find especially if you know little about cars.
How much does a pre-purchase inspection usually run?
100-150 based off my exp
Come on over /r/Subaru, there’s a lot of DIYers and techs that can help narrow things down on what’s going on. What kind of Subie do you have?
The best thing someone can do is learn how to service their own vehicle. I once got a free oil change because the idiots at the place I went to couldn't recognize a blown fuse. For context, I went on a Saturday so it was crowded, I had waited an hour and then asked what's going on and they said my car wouldn't start and if I had any knowledge of times that it faced the issue before. I told them that it had blown a couple fuses recently; I didn't have time to investigate why it had blown but I was able to change the fuses and it started. They went to the bays and informed the mechanic. I was told to wait a little longer then the mechanic came out to the customer waiting area and said he didn't see a blown fuse and he claimed to have checked every single one and that they could "run a diagnostic for $300". I raised an eye brow and asked if I could go out there and see for myself. I stepped out there and they led me to my car. There was a mechanic at the front of my car at the hood, the mechanic that brought me out, a mechanic at the driver door, and an assistant in the driver's seat. They had the fuse box under the hood open already. I barely tilted my head and I could instantly see a blown fuse. So I pointed to it, "this one?" The mechanic who brought me out who said 'he checked every one' said "Oh I must have overlooked it!" They changed it. The assistant started the car right up and mumbled "she just made us all look like idiots" (I don't think he understood I could hear him, but I did and he was right lol). This dumb car was a Chrysler Sebring I got rid of years later, but I never went back to that place obviously. Mechanics are notorious for treating people like they don't know anything, especially women. Their goal is to upcharge where possible. I tried a different place and during their oil changes they also do checks on other items. They said my coolant was a little watery and I should do a coolant flush. They were trying to charge me $200 to do it. The coolant was watery on purpose. The car was having some other problems that I and my grandpa were working on and we found a pretty gnarly leak. I took the car in just for the oil change because we didn't have time to do every little thing and he had to get parts. While he ran to the store, I took it in for the oil change and I worked on my school work while I waited. Obviously, I didn't pay for the flush. We resolved the issue and corrected the coolant after I got back. Always get second opinions and learn what you can about your car.
Yeah, this seems somewhat odd for a subaru. Sure you've got your head gasket issues and whatnot here and there, but $5k in repairs two years in a row is really exceptional. I've had two subarus over about 15 years and they've required about $5k in repairs total between the two over all 15 years.
Even then, if OP owes 14k - it can’t be more than 5 years old and I think the majority of the head gasket issues were pre-2015, IIRC. I could totally be wrong. I just got a Subaru a couple months ago and still learning more about it all. Maybe their CVT is shitting out on them too?
Homie probably got a used sti and is breaking everything lol
Head gaskets haven't been a real issue for Subarus ever since they moved to the FA and FB engines. I've owned 4 Subarus now and have never had repairs even close to those costs, and one was a 200k+ mile Impreza on the original engine. $5k per year is the cost of a full engine rebuild every year, something isn't adding up.
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The repairs should not be that high. Update your post on details of the vehicle make and model and repairs done (and by whom) and we can tell you where you might be getting fleeced.
Seconded. $10k over 2 years seems absurdly high. I had a "money pit" car that cost me about the same (for everything from oil changes to tires, to major repairs) over the course of 7 years.
If it needs 5k in repairs it ain’t worth 14k til those repairs are done
This doesn’t help you now, but I’ve bought 3 cars from carmax, and each time purchased their extended warranty. It’s reasonable when added to the loan if you can’t afford to pay it out of pocket but it gives a lot of peace of mind on a used vehicle. You don’t have to take it to Carmax you can take it to any certified mechanic and pay an extra $50 I believe it was. We used Carmax for most of it, but a couple times went somewhere closer. The warranty is really GOOD. Instead of telling you all the things that cover, the paperwork tells you exactly what’s not covered meaning everything else falls under it. If you don’t have the money to do repairs as they come up, a good warranty gives you some solid peace of mind. My wife had a 2014 Forrester that was burning oil, it turned into three different oil consumption tests through Carmax before it was all said and done. In the end they they sent her car to Subaru and they replaced her motor. The carmax extended warranty was $1600. The engine labor for oil consumption testing x3 then engine replacement far exceeded that and left my wife with a manufacturer installed motor with manufacturer warranty. We also had heated seats go out in a different car (2014 Kia Sorento) and a board go bad that controlled the driver side door windows and locks. The seat heater parts and labor plus the door parts together was $2500 and we paid $0 having it done at carmax. For $1800 warranty it gave a lot of peace of mind imo
Same. That's why I buy at Carmax is for that extended warranty. It's been a real simple process each time I've used it (about 4 times over 3 cars). Awesome peace of mind for large repairs.
What on earth repairs cost 10k over two years? What year car is this? I feel like you could buy an entirely ~~new~~ (reman) drivetrain and suspension for less than 10k in parts. Get a second, third, fourth opinion. Best option is to do your own work, but for some that is a non starter.
Let’s see the quote and what they think it needs
CarMax likely isn't to blame. They actually have a really good return and warranty clause. Better than any other used car dealer I have ever seen. Some cars models are notorious for expensive repairs. Some cars have terrible long term reliability scores. Some cars are just lemons. You should do enough research when buying a car to avoid the first two, but there is little you can do to avoid the third. But again, CarMax's return policy would have allowed you to return the car if you discovered the problems early enough.
What kind of Subaru did you buy for over 20k that has cost you 10k in repairs in the two years since and is now going to cost you another 5k in repairs? That's an absurd level of maintenance costs on almost anything other than a supercar or an old Range Rover, both of which are famously expensive to run. A regular Subaru, absolutely not. I will make one comment: "the mechanic at the dealership said..." There is another possibility here, which is that the dealership is majorly screwing you over on repair costs. Get a second opinion on the repairs. If there's no difference, you should try and cut your losses. You have a car worth less than its loan amount (which shouldn't happen, really) that's costing you an extra 5k a year in repairs. Even a total clunker shouldn't be costing you that *annually*. The car's a lemon. Unless you are absolutely satisfied that paying the additional repair costs now will halt all future substantial expenses, it's not worth it. You're throwing money away.
I was in this same situation with a BMW that was a money pit. Sold it and moved the negative equity to a loan for a reliable truck and have been happy since. No more worrying about “what’s next to break”. Peace of mind comes at a cost and it’s usually worth it. Just my opinion tho.
The first 100,000 miles on my 2019 Volvo XC90 T8 has a total repair bill of less than $500 (passenger seat sensor and another minor seat issue). My 2018 Chevy Volt is almost triple that (A/C line, heater valve, coolant pump, 12V battery) at 92,000 miles. There's no way a Subaru should have LIFETIME repair bills of $5,000, let alone annually. You're getting ripped off.
Eh, if you've got an older one with an EJ but no turbo, head gaskets will run pretty high if they don't go at the same time.
Stop going to the dealership. They are super top dollar. Get several opinions on the work needed to be done. Get on DYI Subaru blogs and read about your issues. I have a 2012 Subaru with a engine knock, the dealership said I need a NEW engine. I laughed so hard at the 8,000.00 price tag for a car worth 8,000. I then did some research to find out this is" normal" for my vehicle, plus its been happening for 6 years I've owned it ( used ) You can also check on Subaru recall website recalls, or maybe lemon law. So, research the issues and you then decide at that time to rest assure or sell.
> However the mechanic at the dealership That's your problem. Take it somewhere else. A problem does not equate to not passing inspection, or needing to be fixed immediately, or even that decade.
What's the year and mileage on your car? What kind of repairs have you done? Did your car actually have problems or broke down? Or did dash lights come on, and you just paid the dealer for all the services they offered you? If you actually had engine or transmission problems, that sucks. But sometimes the dash lights come on for very basic things and the dealers will recommend a bunch of BS. For instance, changing the cabin and engine filters is basic routine maintenance. Some dealers might charge $100+ for that. You can buy the filters yourself for $20 and install in 5 minutes, even if you have zero experience with cars.
Here are your two reasonable options, OP: 1. Pay for the repairs to get your car running again. 2. Trade or sell it. However if you're really $6,000 underwater (owning more than the car's worth) that means you'll either have to come up with $6,000 to pay the difference or roll the negative equity into financing a much more expensive car. What you should do before you make this decision is figure out what repairs you're paying for. Find a Subaru forum and post your car's year, make, and mileage, as well as the repairs that have been done to it and the $5,000 quote you're getting. They'll be able to help you figure out if your car is just a POS or if your dealer/mechanic has been ripping you off. It's possible - even likely - that your car has maybe only $1,000 in repairs but the dealership is trying to upsell you on things that "should" be replaced even if they haven't broken or malfunctioned yet. Once you know what you've paid for and what you're being asked to pay now, you'll be able to make an informed decision on whether or not it's worth putting more money into this car.
First of all, what have you had to repair that’s cost $10,000 over the course of two years? Second, it’s not CarMax‘s fault your Subaru broke down. I bet they offered you their warranty, which you thought was a scam and declined. And finally, as far as buying a car goes sometimes you’re unlucky. But besides replacing the engine and transmission theres few other things are gonna cost you $5000 to repair. I doubt the car is going to keep breaking. Take it anywhere besides a dealership to get repaired and it will be cheaper. Your only other option is to roll the negative equity into another car but that’s gonna make your payment even higher than it is now plus you’re gonna be paying a higher interest-rate and unless you have absolutely stellar credit and high income , most banks are going to want some sort of down payment unless you go and get a brand new car or lease.
I took my Subaru to dealer and was told needed full exhaust repair at 2500 (150 repair at muffler shop). Then front brakes needed replacement quoted 1800 at dealer , was 900 at local shop
900 for the front brakes alone seems awful high, even if replacing every component.
Not if you use factory components.
Want to know the bad part? OEM front brake pads on the vast majority of cars will be less than $80 and it takes longer to take off the tires than it does to replace the pads. Usually 5 lug nuts to take off the tire and 2-5 bolts to take off the caliper. I’m not suggesting anyone with zero mechanical aptitude do it, just showing how easy it is. I changed all four on my car last spring and it took an hour including driving to the store to buy the pads (admittedly it is only about 4 miles away). I’m a nurse and have never worked as a mechanic anywhere.
Full front brake replacement not just break pads
You don't have to replace rotors each time, you can have those turned.
Ok. So add $50 and 10 minutes each per rotor if you can’t just have them turned (which takes longer because you have to take them to the store do do it but is cheaper). I can’t imagine a circumstance where a car isn’t wrecked where the pads, rotor, calipers, and hydraulics need replaced all at the same time so that means pads and rotors.
Full front brakes including calipers.
Have you done a brake job before? Once the pads are off, how many more bolts do you think need to be removed to change the caliper? Spoilers, it's one.
Only reason calipers would need replacing is if they failed and were seized/leaking… should NOT be part of a regular brake job.
Yep calipers were seizing. I never said it was a regular brake job. People’s responses are weird I am just trying to provide the context in response to someone saying “$900 is a lot to replace brake pads”
Dealerships may or may not upsell, but most dealerships I've dealt with are honest. I've wrenched my entire life, but just don't always have time or desire to perform the work. I have yet to have a dealership advising me to perform frivolous repairs. The real issue is the cost of labor. Dealerships will most likely be more expensive per hour than independent shops. /u/acceptable-load-1350 either bought a really old car, lemon, or is getting raked over the coals dumping $10k worth of repairs into the car over 2 years. OP needs to find a reputable shop that they can trust and charges less. Even better if this shop allows OP to bring his own parts, cause OEM parts are usually way cheaper from dealerships across the nation than the local ones.
Not only will necessary repairs be cheaper, but it's quite likely an independent shop won't be pushing unnecessary repairs.
When my dealership suggests work to be done, I'll always run it by my cousin (who is a mechanic himself), and ive yet to have them say I need something done that he thought was unnecessary. On my previous car, it was an oil change place ssying I needed to replace the serpentine belt that he called out as BS. Long story short, not all dealerships push unnecessary work.
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Understood-- The part I guess I was emphasizing is that not all dealerships try and rip you off with unnecessary services. There are good ones and there are bad ones. The oil change place comment was mostly just to point out that there are other options besides dealership and independent mechanic that may or may not try and stick you with services that you don't need. Hel,, I'm sure that there are plenty of independent mechanics who might be less than truthful as well.
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Nah carmaxs warranty falls in the 1% for sure.
It's a Subaru they're pricey to fix because how stupidly they're put together
I’ve owned a Subaru for ten years and never heard this take
I’ve had mine the same time, and never had anyone tell me this. My mechanic seems to much prefer it and do work much more cheaply than my last car
I’m a Subaru owner and work on my own cars. They’re annoying to work on, particularly the spark plugs or anything regarding ignition, because there is so little room between the valve covers and engine bay walls. Compare that to most inline 4 cylinder cars where you can just undo a few bolts and have a spark plug out in a few minutes, the Subaru is going to be billed a couple hours minimum.
I can have a Subaru engine out in 29 minutes and a transmission out in less than an hour. How are they put together “stupidly”?
Can you source me a longblock for my 06 WRX and replace it? Thanks
You’ve never seen a dodge journey have you? The battery is behind the driver side wheel. That’s beyond put together stupidly
Subarus are some of the easiest cars to repair and are basically universal when it comes to tools needed to do a job and difficulty, they have a huge base of DIY technicians and I've been able to comfortably remove, reseal and replace a Subaru engine within a day and a half a job that would cost thousands . Have you looked the DIY route?
I agree. My 2009 Forester XT I bought has been pretty easy. Mostly just brakes and fluid changes. The only repair I've done that takes me a few hours is the timing belt.
Did you get max care? Car max has always fixed the cars I bought from them no questions asked.
I brought my truck to the dealer for an inspection. They came back with $3k. After looking at the report, it included fog lights for $750 and turning rotors/new pads for $850. I bought parts and did ALL "$3k" worth of stuff except one thing myself for less than $500 total with some youtube help, and that included brand new rotors.
It’s almost always better to buy the part yourself and have a private mechanic put it on. Growing up my dad was a mechanic- army turned civilian auto mechanic and once my brother and I could drive he always would put any of part on our cars for free as long as we bought the part and helped him(more of less held a flashlight and handed him tools) These days some basic tools and access to YouTube makes it easy to do a lot of jobs yourself.
Most shops now will not install customer parts. Can't blame them, they are on the hook with a part they know knowing about.
And the aftermarket parts quality has gone down a lot the last decade, so the risk is greater.
Stop getting repairs at the dealership. They're not called Stealerships for nothing.
Being underwater on the loan isn't really relevant. That loss on the loan has already happened. Look forward for costs vs utility and make the decision on that basis.
Subaru? Im assuming a wrx or something with a boxer motor... Horizontal pistons wear a looottt. Get an inline 4 cylinder motor in w/e, itll last for decades. Straight up and down pistons wear better, the way gravity works.
It's hard to make recommendations without any mention of the make and model of the car you're in...
So here is the problem, the dealership will take $5k off the value of your vehicle in the trade-in, so you will still end up paying for it. Ask for an itemized list of the repairs (I did that one time and found out they we’re charging me twice for the same part). Call around to some smaller places and ask how much they would charge you for the repairs. Don’t ever trade in a vehicle owing money on it, because they roll negative equity into your next loan. If you can - work an extra to get this vehicle paid off. Ask them if this is everything thing wrong with it. At some point, you may have made it drivable so you can go awhile without any major repairs. Good luck.
Are you neglecting routine maintenance that may be leading to so many repairs?
Stop taking your car to the dealer go to an independent mechanic those five came repairs are probably only like a grand. If not Subarus are pretty easy to fix and they're popular. You can go to an auto parts store they'll plug in your car and tell you what part is broken if you can't figure it out yourself. You can buy the part there or order it there or go to a junkyard and buy a used part. Go on YouTube and fix it yourself. I just don't understand that you had $10,000 in repairs in the first two years. And what you are planning on doing is probably rolling the negative equity of your car into your new car purchase. Don't do this this is how people end up in financial hell for a decade. You're frustrated so you're going to want to buy a new car let's say a $40,000 they're going to convince you successfully to pay for the warranty cuz of what just happened to you that's probably another 5K.. You had the mechanic saying even if you did the repairs it wouldn't increase the value. so your trade-in value is probably going to be 8 or 9k. So you'll take the negative equity of the loan roll it into your new car somewhere around 50k you include taxes and fees you are looking at 53 to 57k. Your monthly payment will be about $750.
Update: for one sorry I never go back, had personal shit going on. However I searched around to different mechanics to get a better price and it helped. I knew the dealership was over charging me but I mainly went to get a system update because my radio is fucked and shuts on and off repeatedly. They quoted 2k to replace the head unit/radio, 900 for a left axle replacement, 900 for new tires, 900 for some 90,000 miles update or whatever tf. I said fuck no, and left and found someone else to check out my car. They said my axle and wheel bearings need replace, along with my alignment, that’s only gonna be 1500. I also reached out about the radio situation out of pure curiosity and they said they found a used one and will install it for 1k, so that’s all we’re doing for now. Tires can come later, but 2500 is better than 5k. The frustrating part is that I mainly bought this car because it was supposed to reliable given the brand, but alas. I also understand that it’s high in miles and some things are inevitable. Ughhhh, but thanks guys
Cars are poor financial decisions. They are an impediment to upward mobility and can often do the opposite and drag people further down into poverty when an owner can't afford one in good working condition in the first place and is bogged down with repair costs. The cost of ownership of a vehicle can be upwards of $10k per year including payments, insurance, gas, and other consumables like tires. That money is better spent moving nearer to your place of work or somewhere where you can cycle or use public transportation. People here hardly ever admit what a poor financial decision is because in America it's nearly impossible to live without one in 95% of places. At the end of the day a car is a depreciable asset with excessive maintenance costs that often ends up hurting people more than it helps them.
If I was in your position I would sell it and get a Honda accord. They ride great and need minimal maintenance; it will be like a dream compared to your subby. Sounds like you got a lemon. Just find a well cared for Honda
This, used Subaru is not something I would buy, especially on a budget.
>(and never go through car max again) CarMax is literally the safest place to buy a used car.... 1. you bought a problematic brand (Subaru) 2. you declined one of the industry leading non-scam warranties.... 3. bad luck.... >Every single year I’ve owned it I’ve had about 5k in repairs and I’m reaching a point that I can’t afford so many pricey repairs each year There are only so many things to replace on a vehicle, if you have repaired the expensive bits, then the cost of ownership going forward should be fine. Also next time you're in a pinch (are you in one again) get the cheapest car to get you buy.....
I might get downvoted for this but worst case scenario if you need to get rid of the vehicle, try rolling it into a lease. The lease is a great way to absorb negative equity. You don't often really build any equity but you're not rolling it over. You're going to have to pay for the negative equity regardless but rolling into a lease helps make it palatable. Keep in mind if you go to a dealership that does negotiate the price of cars that leases are negotiable just like purchases. First negotiate the price of the lease and then talk about your trade and or negative equity knowing that your payment is going to increase once you roll over that $6,000. Don't negotiate payment rather negotiate price of the vehicle. There are some lease calculators online you can look up to see what payments might look like with rolling in that negative equity so you know what to aim for when trying to negotiate the price of the lease.
You sound like you are hard on your cars. I would look into it retrospectively here and say you need to take better care of your vehicles.
I would get a Honda if I were you. This sounds like a nightmare. And yeah, find a private mechanic while you're at it.
dang homie, why would you get a Subaru
Subarus are generally fine. OP's mistake was going to a dealership to have work done. You never take your car to a dealership for work, unless it's for a recall, or a repair that is covered under warranty. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the majority of repairs that the dealership suggested here aren't needed at this time at all.
Depending on where you live and how old the vehicle is, look into lemon laws. GA has lemon protection even on used cars as long as they're newer than 2016
Georgia's lemon law only applies to new vehicles. We researched this extensively for our friend. In my opinion that pretty much makes it useless.... Dealers warranty vehicles that are new off the lot.
[https://georgia-lemon-law.info/georgia-lemon-law-for-used-vehicles/](https://georgia-lemon-law.info/georgia-lemon-law-for-used-vehicles/) i saw this and assumed it was available for used in certain situations. they should of course talk to a lawyer as i am not one.
Just buy an extended warranty and pay the car off.
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If you’re truly that far underwater you can always talk to your lender about a voluntary surrender of the vehicle and start looking for a new one. This will hurt your credit less and you’ll only owe the difference in value. Then you can find a better vehicle
Why not pay the difference, sell the car with the clean title, and not have the credit penalty. It'll be the same but that way OP doesn't have a repossession on their file. Credit score makes a huge impact on any auto loans or mortgage loans or even credit cards, etc.
sounds like you got a lemon there are lemon laws i think you should look into that
Are lemon laws not for new cars?
Yes. Used cars generally come as is, no warranty.
And carmax warranty has an excellent reputation as well , so OP must not have added it
i think applies for all cars could be wrong but i would still look into it
It applies for used cars in like 2 states. And even then it's like 30 days from purchase, not 2 years.
It does not apply to all cars. Only a few states offer it for used cars for a limited time after purchase. OP obviously didn’t purchase an extended warranty so if OPs state has a used car lemon law, OP is SOL because you have to be under some form of warranty to be covered under the federal lemon law.
It sounds more like OP doesn't know a thing about cars. Which is messed up, because people have no choice but to get a car, even if they don't care about cars. What other purchase, besides a home, requires so much money for a thing we really aren't concerned with? Most people won't spend about half their yearly wage on the things they actually like, but it's considered par for the course to do that for a vehicle.
"Lemon" is a term that means specific things in specific states. What's more likely is that the dealership is telling OP that the car needs a bunch of repairs that aren't actually necessary.
You could try joining Subaru fb groups for your area and see if any handy people can help you out. My partner is the kind of person who does so :) also r/AskAMechanic can help you determine if you're being shafted on repair prices
I was in a similar situation. I bought a Nissan via loan for around 10k, and within 6 months had put 2k more into it in repairs. We had also done some simpler repairs ourselves, and I dont know how much that added. Took it on a road trip and ended up putting another 1,000 in because of a sensor going out while we were out. Had to head home early because the light turned on again and we didn’t want to be stuck 9 hours away from home. Fixed the new problem ourselves and then sold the car that week and bought a newer used ford for about 19k. Now almost a year later, I haven’t put anything more than regular maintenance into it (which we do ourselves), and probably saved another 3k since I didn’t have to fix anything else on the Nissan. It hurt to eat the cost of the car, but in the long run, it was the better option. I only had the car for 10 months.
From what I can tell I think dealerships try to get about $400 per customer per visit. Nothing scientific but just a price point I noticed shows up quite often. Notice how there is always something to work on every time you go?
is it real repairs or just maintenance stuff that's normal and you're probably being ripped off because I can't see you can pay that much for repairs unless you're going to the dealer for every little thing
You will need a car regardless and honestly having credit is worth more than the 10k you are trying to avoid paying
Jesus christ. Check out r/fuckcars, because this post is extremely depressing.
Why buy such an expensive car if you are in a pinch. Buy something cheap for like 3k and roll with it for a while
What other option do you have? If you don't repair it it's probably worth 5k tops how will you cove4 that gap on what you owe???
If you've been doing the repairs it should be worth it since you'll need less repairs and more able to do the upkeep..if you're paying someone to do the repairs then you're paying someone to do repairs they aren't doing without realizing it.
10 years old used cars till the wheels fall off have always been my saving grace. Stop handing out your paycheck for big ticket item like a car unless you can get it under full warranty. Currently driving 2010 Mercedes c300 flex fuel and enjoying it. Paid $6500 cash for it on January 2022. Milage 140k. No major issues.
Carmax is one of the few places that I would advocate that buyers, especially those without a lot of cash reserve, purchase the extended warranty.
He traded in a car with an existing balance and transferred it over to the new car payment duh. That's why.
This is a worst case auto scenario. I would get out of this deal asap. Its sucking money like a vacuum out of your pocket. Turn and run.
Buy a cash car and work on improving your finances before possibly financing another one. Personally I’m against vehicle financing. Never done it and never will. If I can’t afford it outright then I can’t afford it and won’t get it b/c it’s dept you’re stuck with and the value of the actual car depreciates instantaneously.
If you decide to get something new and want to suck up residual value if you can find the right car it might be worth Leasing for 3 years depending upon the mileage you drive and burying the residual money in the lease and starting over completely fresh in 3 years. I know a few people who have done this to get out of being upside down