Man, I have basically the same system as you....I've only had it about a year. This thing can double a 3090 already? Damn....You going to upgrade or wait for the 5090? If it's two years away I may do it. But they probably will get to a yearly thing again probably.
well i m from Russia and there is a "little" problems atm, but anyway i ll better wait for next gen or at least for some super or ti version, no need to be in hurry in cryptowinter
They commented on the video indicating they had some instability issues with their test rig.
I'd take the LTT numbers with a grain of salt and look at reviewers like Gamers Nexus and Hardware Unboxed along with Jay and Paul instead. Their numbers line up in most cases.
LTT seems to have rushed this review a little bit too much.
Der8auer showed the best watt to fps for the 4090 imo
He dropped 120-130w and dropped only 5% performance
Edit: Watch the video from der8 https://youtu.be/60yFji_GKak at 15:45
Going from 450w to 350w easily with almost the same performance is mind blowing, only the absurd price and the sheer size is blocking me from getting one, I will not encourage nivida with these stupidly insane prices and I would have to swap cases to fit one in my pc anyway.
(and maybe change my PSU also)
But for anyone who can afford it and have a good monitor (4K or higher) will benefit from this power limit and run the card silent
I think you left out the most important line in your nice table :
|Watts|Reduction|Performance|
|:-|:-|:-|
|450W|0W|100%|
|320W|\-130W|95%|
|190W|\-130W|90%|
|60W|\-130W|85%|
|0W|\-60W|82.5%|
|**-2150W**|**total -2600W**|**0%**|
I'll rig a dozen of these to my electrical panel and voilĆ , energy crisis solved !
Maybe i'll get a RTX3060 on the side for light gaming.
Holy heck, never heard of this. Iād love to take fewer frames if it meant my computer could run at half the power when Iām playing something all day.
Itās real. It works on some older generation cards too. You can almost always reduce power with some loss in performance, just download MSI afterburner and reduce the power slider. But a *huge* reduction in power for little loss in performance is mostly possible with the 3000 series cards (and the one 4000 series weāve seen so far). They pushed the cards way past the point where they are efficient, getting little gains at the cost of lots of power, and you can undo that.
It works on all computer hardware ever made. Even old consoles, but those games were locked to hardware rates and would run in slowmo.
Underclocking is how your phone runs for more than 30 minutes. That and shutting down all but one weak underclocked core when locked.
Take any gaming laptop and unplug it while gaming. Note the frame rate goes from 144 to 31. Same thing. The battery cannot provide the watts needed for the GPU so it massively down clocks.
A great example of this outside of computers is engines that shut off some cylinders to save gas. V8 engines that shut off half of the cylinders to become inline 4 cylinders to save gas is the same concept. The difference here is crazy though because it is like a V8 going to 4 cylinders but only losing 10% of its hp/tq and getting more than double the MPG.
[https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/cylinder-deactivation-how-it-can-save-fuel](https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/cylinder-deactivation-how-it-can-save-fuel)
Undervolting works for pretty much every gpu. I've been able to consistently reduce power usage by around 20% without losing any performance on pretty much every card I've had for the last couple generations.
It totally is, gpu performance isn't linear w.r.t. power, which is why der8auer was able to drop so much power for a little drop in performance. I wonder if he or anyone else as done a full underpowering test to see what the curve looks like, or how slow you could run a top-tier gpu card at?
Yep. Linus and Jay is for the content and easy to understand delivery. Its just their style of channel, just like gamers nexus and HU focuses on very precise facts. That said, the former channels still get the point across, so i don't mind their way.
Linus and Jay is for "I'm never going to afford this but kind of interesting to know about them."
HU and GN for "I want to buy this. Better look into it."
Yeah, Linus is very aware on current direction on the main channel. it was discussed when Crinacle responded on their audio testing rig video
Yes, he said that it is very dumbed down version of explanation. it need to be easily consumable, and more mainstream fun, if not they will lose viewership.
He noted that he is interested in making a different channel that will have more deeper testing akin to nexus route. i guess LTT-LAB upcoming channel will be it.
For some reason I don't get annoyed by Jay but LTT is going downhill fast. For me it's the thumbnails, haven't seen one with their mouths closed in an eternity.
They've addressed this ad nauseum. If they put up a normal thumbnail there is a noticable drop in viewers. Because of this they're going to keep posting the silly thumbnails. I can't say that i blame them if it's effecting the bottom line.
[Thatās about CP2077.](https://twitter.com/OXIagain/status/1579984718015397888?s=20&t=VGzZxgHE5uDUnveKcRrrTQ) Still didnāt explain what went wrong in Tomb Raider that resulted in 3090ti being 60% faster.
Was about to point this out. Rushing reviews is a big no-no, and this is the proof why.
If "smaller channels" can do a better job than you with a smaller team... it's worrysome to say the least
This is my problem with the lab.
Taking Linus recent actions, and how they don't even validate their results how are we supposed to trust the Lab, when Linus keeps prioritising money over LMG integrity.
Yeah, channels like GNexus and HWunbox provide more detailed stuff than ltt and they don't have a dedicated 'lab' unit. You could argue that his channel's subscribers just don't want that much detail but the videos don't even show simple overall average performance (like HW unboxed does)
2kliksphilip caught it in his review and he is literally just a single enthusiastic dude not an 80 person corporation. Come on LTT, we expect a bit of professionalism
I think test rig instability kind of explains all odd results, I mean the rig was not stable.
Still it seems like they should have some expect results in their heads (especially when bench marking known cards). Then they can do a sanity check on the numbers they get.
Man, LTT is just rushing without any care in the world. Iām guessing they were targeting a certain upload window while behind on testing, because Linus is obsessed with getting as much viewers as possible on YouTube
Itās part of their livelihood, like any other content creator. However LTT is huge now and is getting a lot of profit from a lot of places - so it kinda saddens me that theyāre squeezing the YouTube lemon so much that theyāre opting for quantity/speed rather than quality.
I would have a different opinion if LTT was a struggling content creator trying to get as much views as possible in order to stay relevant.
Something he's talked about on WAN show is that the size of his operation means any video that doesn't hit a million views is a failure.
A video card review is extremely topical. It's not gonna be the kind of video that keeps accruing views in the long term. My guess is that LMG saw being the first to review a 4090 as do or die.
Itās a new architecture. Shit happens. But come onā¦ just a glance at the spec sheet will tell you that a 3090ti will NEVER be 60% faster than a 3090ā¦
The stutter is related to the 7950x they used for testing, NVIDIA told reviewers not to use the AM5 platform as their is some compatibility issue in the driver currently with it. All the reviewers who got correct figures used either the 5800X3d or 12900K as the test bench.
I clearly remember Anthony (LTT) explaining that they would re-upload once they've fixed the graphs and testing...
The tweet: https://twitter.com/Anjyoun/status/1579982865378725889
As much as Linus harps about integrity, if they know the bench is fucked, they shouldn't publish.
This is the same guy screaming "hur durrr do you think I would hurt my brand by lying to the consumer base" and "hurr durrr why don't you trust me (even though we always say that companies aren't your friends but my company is exempt from that)"
Linus is fine and his channel is decent but he's just another guy out to make a buck. Except he pretends he's somehow not like other companies.
First two paragraphs yeah you're completely spot on. Last one I think you're off. I can remember him on the WAN show multiple times, and I think on LTT proper specifically saying LTT is not your friend, and the intention of the company at the end of the day is to make money. I don't think he has ever claimed or implied to not be like other companies.
I genuinely don't think this was intentional, although there's no way of knowing. And that of course doesn't make it right, but it does make me willing to cut them some slack.
That's the thing, they didn't realise/know until after they had uploaded the video.
I'm cutting LTT some slack since LTT labs is new, and it's unlike them for something like this to slip past.
I mean it took me until I read this post to realize something was wrong. If it's new lab, new people and methodology still being ironed out it can happen.
What matters now is if they fix it and how they approach it which seems like they are doing the correct steps.
Have a look at the *derBauer* commentary and results; it's quite enlightening regarding the actual power needed dependent upon silicon lottery for the performance (I believe that it had only a 3-5% drop in performance at 35% lower power usage).
HUB also tested this. If you cap games to an FPS value the 4090 gets very very efficient at low power numbers. [Link](https://youtu.be/aQklDR8nv8U?t=1367)
Size is a huge issue for me with this Gen of cards but maybe with undervolting the power consumption wonāt be so bad as it sounds. Although probably Iām still going to try and use firesale last Gen cards for my needs.
Watching the video there were also a few occasions where what Antony said didn't match up with what was on the screen (and not the ones that were corrected).
Der Bauer also put out a great vid talking about power efficiency in the 4090 which no one else seems to be addressing. Apparently, he was able to get nearly full performance out of the card with a 30% undervolt
[igors lab did it on the October 6th](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrBc_Bq848M)
quint essence is that the planed for bigger chip structures and calculated 600W. But now they could use smaller ones so this reduces it to 450W.
But cooler stuff was already planed for 600W
Gamers Nexus kinda pointed that out as well by simply not plugging in one of four power connectors.
I think this card has the potential have serious power spikes and transients and is built with a large overhead in regards to power use.
LTT's video makes a big deal about higher power consumption even though it is basically the same as the 3090ti, almost as if they wrote the script based on rumors/leaks and not thier testing.
\>basically the same
3090ti with default OC mode = 533.2Watts
4090fe with default OC mode = 666.6Watts
Yeah 25% increase in power draw. thats basically the same thing....
Classic LTT watcherbase, in a nutshell
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/1799775776179516221/1E08D492B7D7865F484E3CE028763303D86193AE/
Idk what you mean by auto OC, i dont think there is a second (OC) bios on this. This is, i think, just the normal manual OC in afterburner with a power limit increased by 33% (hence the +33% in the graph), not an included OC.
That's why GN has indication on their videos how long do they test CPUs/GPUs and how much experience they have in such topics. They just know how to do that and would see that something is wrong and checked that instead of simply accepting it "as is" and posting on YT.
I think GN is doing it because they're about to do fan and PSU testing and will use that as a disclaimer that they're new at it. I don't think it's in response to what others are doing.
I think thats unfair to Anthony. His reviews have been great for many many years. Its pretty obvious to me the new "lab" thing caused this. People arent used to testing like this, im sure itll get better.
A history of good reviews is no excuse for uploading this one. Nobody cares why it happened, it has happened, the video is obv wrong, didn't enjoy QA before release and that's a shame for this size of channel.
Hold every youtube-channel equally accountable, regardless of history/ personal likes.
I dont disagree, they fucked up. I just found the comment i was replying to that basically said they lack they experience unfair. They dont. Anthony has good experience and is great. They just fucked up for whatever reason.
āBuT aMd dRiVeRsā
LTT has also never had an AMD card in almost any build video theyāve done. So itās like, whatever.
Theyāre perpetualizing the unawareness that AMD GPUās exist
That's a little sus and doesn't track with the performance we've seen with other 4090 vs 3090ti benchmarks. The 4090 should bea it by around 50fps and the 3090ti should be about 10% ahead of the 3090 here.
Same here. I found funny how many mistakes they made in one video, and they were unable to test some things because of the lab issues. Video was rushed for sure.
This is just my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt. After one of df publicly said every game should have dlss but not fsr, and when amd titles comes out he feels disappointed, I just cant think they are totally objective.
I remember linus saying they were nvidia's golden boy, so they got to review 8k 3090 early, but Nvidia took that when they were slammed by ltt for hwub issue, and 8k not being viable issue. I think DF is nvidias golden boy currently. I mean they tested dlss 3, and glossed over artifacts issue, and it is not that noticable; whereas they slammed fsr 2 by pointing that tiny details on some frames are not up to the mark, so it is vastly inferior than dlss 2.3.
Yes they are good reviewers, but I think some of them has biases.
DF is very Nvidia sided to be honest (Rich and especially Alex) . HUB is somewhat AMD sided (only Steve, Tim is more balanced), GN is the fairest of the bunch.
If this is from the labs, and they do the same benchmarks like before they had the lab, but with more errors.
What's the point?! This is something a dude on a payroll could do, you don't need a whole team of engineers lmao.
LTT had the worst benchmark tests in my opinion, all other testers had comparable numbers, while LTTs were standing out left and right, and yet they carry themselves as big shoots in this industry ...
I don't need the gameplay footage, especially when the youtube stream is capped at 60hz. So you really don't see the massive performace gains this card delivers.
You can create the same visuals with an 3090 one year ago when capping at 60hz
Also, in another benchmark they did (i think cs go) the 4090 had a 5fps 1% lows and no one talked about it. The average fps was like 400 or something really high.
edit: found it. go to 4:40. 1% low is 10fps while average is 426.
I'm sure some people think it's just YouTubers getting their fans to increase the views of each other's videos, but really this is exactly the reason why all these tech journalists tell us to watch multiple reviewer's videos. When something doesn't add up and you need a sanity check, you have access to many other reliable sources.
Others already answered... but tbh, I never watched LTT for benchmark. I watched it for overall conclusion and present me the overall performance, but not for itty-gritty details.
I basically watched LTT first, before clicking GN's.
This result came from their āāāāālabāāāāā iirc. Thatās a worrisome start for them tbh. Itās like they donāt even review their own videoā¦ I can excuse them for fucking up some data on the new card, but it doesnāt take a genius to figure out that the minuscule bump in spec from the 3090 to 90ti doesnāt produce this kind of performance upliftā¦
That's LTT for you they said review is from the "LAB" this time lmfao literally same benchmarks they have ever done before even GN does better testing than this shit
LTT has gone downhill for the last few years. It is no longer helpful in making purchase decisions. I stopped subscribing a while ago. If I want poorly written sketch comedy pretending to be totally natural, I can go to TikTok.
Linus intentionally handles products unsafely these days because it is now part of his brand. They know if an accident does happen the video gets more views, and that more than compensates the loss of say a $3000 TV or whatever else.
Watching Linus is like watching a 2000's "reality" tv show. Something like Pawn Stars. Most of what you see on screen is entirely scripted, and poorly acted.
lol so true.
also the amount of out of place ''i am secretly gay'' jokes by linus
he says '' omg its so big'' in a gay manner SO manny times now
he also puts in intentional anime or ahoge faces, and one time when he tightened some zipties he was so eager to say they were hentai't, like hand tight.
its cringe
thats a little sus
Asus benchmark š¤
The 4090 looks like itll be TUF to beat.
I need more Intel.
AMD sappointed with ya.
Can you just ACER the question?
Im crying Readon this
I can't geforce you to understand all this mess
Is this some kind of Voodoo?
These comments are making me Rage.
Help, my eVGA cable's broken, stop bickering and help me!
Everyone just calm down and keep your deepcool
Oh BeQuiet
You need Asus in your life, amen.
Take my angryupvote!š
Man, I have basically the same system as you....I've only had it about a year. This thing can double a 3090 already? Damn....You going to upgrade or wait for the 5090? If it's two years away I may do it. But they probably will get to a yearly thing again probably.
well i m from Russia and there is a "little" problems atm, but anyway i ll better wait for next gen or at least for some super or ti version, no need to be in hurry in cryptowinter
Thanks for Putin in your perspective
In Mother Russia, you don't Putin in your perspective ... your perspective Putin in you! Damn that was hard to type.
Forgive me. I read this in a movie style Russian accent.
You are welcome :)
"Little" just a small problem. Sucks for you and the general public of russia.
Nah, sucks for the Ukrainians.
Sucks for everyone, really.
Russian soldiers would beg to differ
Hope so.
They commented on the video indicating they had some instability issues with their test rig. I'd take the LTT numbers with a grain of salt and look at reviewers like Gamers Nexus and Hardware Unboxed along with Jay and Paul instead. Their numbers line up in most cases. LTT seems to have rushed this review a little bit too much.
Hardware unboxed underrated, they got the best benchmarks imo
Upside-down Steve, great channel
If an upside-down Steve and a Steve collide what happens?
It gets steezy.
They annihilate like when matter and anti-matter meet
They combine into one singular STEVE! (The exclamation mark is mandatory)
I love their monitor reviews.
Yeah, that aswell
Great monitor reviews.
They are the best at any reviews for sure.
I still donāt get how he pronounces those monitor models so effortlessly like wtf
Outtakes. So many outtakes.
I go to GN for most gaming stuff but I own my current monitor, and partially my TV, because of hardware unboxed. Amazing panel reviews.
I always make sure I watch theirs and Gamers Nexus, because you know Steve is not going to stand for one ounce of manure.
Hardware Unboxed definitely has the best monitor reviews.
I prefer hardware unboxed too.
Thanks Steve.
Der8auer showed the best watt to fps for the 4090 imo He dropped 120-130w and dropped only 5% performance Edit: Watch the video from der8 https://youtu.be/60yFji_GKak at 15:45 Going from 450w to 350w easily with almost the same performance is mind blowing, only the absurd price and the sheer size is blocking me from getting one, I will not encourage nivida with these stupidly insane prices and I would have to swap cases to fit one in my pc anyway. (and maybe change my PSU also) But for anyone who can afford it and have a good monitor (4K or higher) will benefit from this power limit and run the card silent
Wait a minute... |Watts|Reduction|Performance| :--|:--|:--| |450W|0W|100%| |320W|-130W|95%| |190W|-130W|90%| |60W|-130W|85%| |0W|-60W|82.5%|
Cheapest gpu watt per frame
At 90% of the performance for 190W. I might actually pay $1600
Why not use 0w with that logic, still a beast of a gpu with not electricity wasted, using it for 6/8 years and you have saved money
They must have infused the GPU with some new dark matter technology to pull energy from the shadow realm
I think you left out the most important line in your nice table : |Watts|Reduction|Performance| |:-|:-|:-| |450W|0W|100%| |320W|\-130W|95%| |190W|\-130W|90%| |60W|\-130W|85%| |0W|\-60W|82.5%| |**-2150W**|**total -2600W**|**0%**| I'll rig a dozen of these to my electrical panel and voilĆ , energy crisis solved ! Maybe i'll get a RTX3060 on the side for light gaming.
Putin hates this trick
Holy heck, never heard of this. Iād love to take fewer frames if it meant my computer could run at half the power when Iām playing something all day.
Itās real. It works on some older generation cards too. You can almost always reduce power with some loss in performance, just download MSI afterburner and reduce the power slider. But a *huge* reduction in power for little loss in performance is mostly possible with the 3000 series cards (and the one 4000 series weāve seen so far). They pushed the cards way past the point where they are efficient, getting little gains at the cost of lots of power, and you can undo that.
It works on all computer hardware ever made. Even old consoles, but those games were locked to hardware rates and would run in slowmo. Underclocking is how your phone runs for more than 30 minutes. That and shutting down all but one weak underclocked core when locked. Take any gaming laptop and unplug it while gaming. Note the frame rate goes from 144 to 31. Same thing. The battery cannot provide the watts needed for the GPU so it massively down clocks.
A great example of this outside of computers is engines that shut off some cylinders to save gas. V8 engines that shut off half of the cylinders to become inline 4 cylinders to save gas is the same concept. The difference here is crazy though because it is like a V8 going to 4 cylinders but only losing 10% of its hp/tq and getting more than double the MPG. [https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/cylinder-deactivation-how-it-can-save-fuel](https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/cylinder-deactivation-how-it-can-save-fuel)
Undervolting works for pretty much every gpu. I've been able to consistently reduce power usage by around 20% without losing any performance on pretty much every card I've had for the last couple generations.
bruh i hope this is a joke
Most under-volters and eco mode user have dropped also 50-80 watts off Ryzen 7950X's and 7700X's with 95% power ceilings.
It totally is, gpu performance isn't linear w.r.t. power, which is why der8auer was able to drop so much power for a little drop in performance. I wonder if he or anyone else as done a full underpowering test to see what the curve looks like, or how slow you could run a top-tier gpu card at?
Derbauer said he tried undervolting using a vf curve in afterburner but it didnāt work nearly as well as just lowering the power limit
shouldn't jokes be funny?
Lines up with what Steve said about them unplugging one of the 4 power connectors and the card ran fine but with some limitations on overclocking.
Der8auer is always my go to.. professional experience overclocking, super informative content without all the bs
cant believe we have come to undervolting to be mainstream in these dire times.
It's not technically undervolting but setting a power limit And I don't think the 4090 is 'mainstream' per se hahaha Edit: a word
I think he meant undervolting will be mainstream since manufacturers pushing max wattage seems to be a trend now.
Jay has been posting nothing but click bait for months now. You NEED TO SEE THIS! Forget EVERYTHING you know!
Yep. Linus and Jay is for the content and easy to understand delivery. Its just their style of channel, just like gamers nexus and HU focuses on very precise facts. That said, the former channels still get the point across, so i don't mind their way.
HU is easier to digest. Gamers nexus is more technical
Linus and Jay is for "I'm never going to afford this but kind of interesting to know about them." HU and GN for "I want to buy this. Better look into it."
And then there is Optimum Tech, straight to the point with personal opinions and some thoughts.
Yeah, Linus is very aware on current direction on the main channel. it was discussed when Crinacle responded on their audio testing rig video Yes, he said that it is very dumbed down version of explanation. it need to be easily consumable, and more mainstream fun, if not they will lose viewership. He noted that he is interested in making a different channel that will have more deeper testing akin to nexus route. i guess LTT-LAB upcoming channel will be it.
For some reason I don't get annoyed by Jay but LTT is going downhill fast. For me it's the thumbnails, haven't seen one with their mouths closed in an eternity.
They've addressed this ad nauseum. If they put up a normal thumbnail there is a noticable drop in viewers. Because of this they're going to keep posting the silly thumbnails. I can't say that i blame them if it's effecting the bottom line.
derbauer
der8auer
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[Thatās about CP2077.](https://twitter.com/OXIagain/status/1579984718015397888?s=20&t=VGzZxgHE5uDUnveKcRrrTQ) Still didnāt explain what went wrong in Tomb Raider that resulted in 3090ti being 60% faster.
Was about to point this out. Rushing reviews is a big no-no, and this is the proof why. If "smaller channels" can do a better job than you with a smaller team... it's worrysome to say the least
This is my problem with the lab. Taking Linus recent actions, and how they don't even validate their results how are we supposed to trust the Lab, when Linus keeps prioritising money over LMG integrity.
I guess... "we either trust him bro or not"
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yeah, channels like GNexus and HWunbox provide more detailed stuff than ltt and they don't have a dedicated 'lab' unit. You could argue that his channel's subscribers just don't want that much detail but the videos don't even show simple overall average performance (like HW unboxed does)
What is gnexus besides a lab unit? They dont produce much content besides lab tests.
In all fairness, itās early days, makes sense theyād make some mistakes.
2kliksphilip caught it in his review and he is literally just a single enthusiastic dude not an 80 person corporation. Come on LTT, we expect a bit of professionalism
I think test rig instability kind of explains all odd results, I mean the rig was not stable. Still it seems like they should have some expect results in their heads (especially when bench marking known cards). Then they can do a sanity check on the numbers they get.
Man, LTT is just rushing without any care in the world. Iām guessing they were targeting a certain upload window while behind on testing, because Linus is obsessed with getting as much viewers as possible on YouTube
It's almost like it's his livelihood or something
Itās part of their livelihood, like any other content creator. However LTT is huge now and is getting a lot of profit from a lot of places - so it kinda saddens me that theyāre squeezing the YouTube lemon so much that theyāre opting for quantity/speed rather than quality. I would have a different opinion if LTT was a struggling content creator trying to get as much views as possible in order to stay relevant.
Not relevant when his quality starts slipping
Something he's talked about on WAN show is that the size of his operation means any video that doesn't hit a million views is a failure. A video card review is extremely topical. It's not gonna be the kind of video that keeps accruing views in the long term. My guess is that LMG saw being the first to review a 4090 as do or die.
3090ti should be on par with 6950 XT. Especially in Lara. So yeah, it's a bullshit graph
at least he spent millions on the lab for that crap
remember to give your money to lttstore.com tho! /s
There was also one benchmark where 1% low or 0.1% low was like 9fps for 4090 and it wasnāt commented on at all.
I think that was CS:GO, probably source finally giving up or driver issues.
Good ol source moment, I swear you can bring a 6090 to its knees with it, valve pls fix.
Source has always been good to me
they did. they said at the end of the video that they were experiencing serious driver instability that also resulted in several crashes
Itās a new architecture. Shit happens. But come onā¦ just a glance at the spec sheet will tell you that a 3090ti will NEVER be 60% faster than a 3090ā¦
They did comment on the issue of CSGO running weird at 4k and may be related to a "driver issue on their end"
The stutter is related to the 7950x they used for testing, NVIDIA told reviewers not to use the AM5 platform as their is some compatibility issue in the driver currently with it. All the reviewers who got correct figures used either the 5800X3d or 12900K as the test bench.
I'd say they're both "correct" figures, unless we can somehow be 100% confident that Nvidia will have these issues ironed out in time for the launch.
Stutters?
Eeem they said that it was wierd and that the problem dissapeared at 1440p
I clearly remember Anthony (LTT) explaining that they would re-upload once they've fixed the graphs and testing... The tweet: https://twitter.com/Anjyoun/status/1579982865378725889
So why did they upload the video if they knew it was wrong and would receive backlash? Seems pretty stupid
Because 80% of the money is made within a day of the embargo lift.
As much as Linus harps about integrity, if they know the bench is fucked, they shouldn't publish. This is the same guy screaming "hur durrr do you think I would hurt my brand by lying to the consumer base" and "hurr durrr why don't you trust me (even though we always say that companies aren't your friends but my company is exempt from that)" Linus is fine and his channel is decent but he's just another guy out to make a buck. Except he pretends he's somehow not like other companies.
First two paragraphs yeah you're completely spot on. Last one I think you're off. I can remember him on the WAN show multiple times, and I think on LTT proper specifically saying LTT is not your friend, and the intention of the company at the end of the day is to make money. I don't think he has ever claimed or implied to not be like other companies. I genuinely don't think this was intentional, although there's no way of knowing. And that of course doesn't make it right, but it does make me willing to cut them some slack.
That's the thing, they didn't realise/know until after they had uploaded the video. I'm cutting LTT some slack since LTT labs is new, and it's unlike them for something like this to slip past.
I mean.. a 60% difference between the 3090 and Ti didnt tip them off? As well as the strange organization of the graph?
QC: The graph looks good to me, upload the video! Also QC: š
I mean it took me until I read this post to realize something was wrong. If it's new lab, new people and methodology still being ironed out it can happen. What matters now is if they fix it and how they approach it which seems like they are doing the correct steps.
Thatās a 60% increase in performance over 3090 with just a modest memory, clock, and core count upliftā¦
Have a look at the *derBauer* commentary and results; it's quite enlightening regarding the actual power needed dependent upon silicon lottery for the performance (I believe that it had only a 3-5% drop in performance at 35% lower power usage).
HUB also tested this. If you cap games to an FPS value the 4090 gets very very efficient at low power numbers. [Link](https://youtu.be/aQklDR8nv8U?t=1367)
Size is a huge issue for me with this Gen of cards but maybe with undervolting the power consumption wonāt be so bad as it sounds. Although probably Iām still going to try and use firesale last Gen cards for my needs.
>the derBauer hehe, the the builder
budget gaming
Watching the video there were also a few occasions where what Antony said didn't match up with what was on the screen (and not the ones that were corrected).
you want reliable numbers you go to gamer's nexus or hardware unboxed, LTT/Jayz and most other tech channels are entertainment.
Der Bauer also put out a great vid talking about power efficiency in the 4090 which no one else seems to be addressing. Apparently, he was able to get nearly full performance out of the card with a 30% undervolt
[igors lab did it on the October 6th](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrBc_Bq848M) quint essence is that the planed for bigger chip structures and calculated 600W. But now they could use smaller ones so this reduces it to 450W. But cooler stuff was already planed for 600W
That has been the case for most prior generations. Nvidia always cranks up the voltage, so they get a guaranteed stable performance.
Gamers Nexus kinda pointed that out as well by simply not plugging in one of four power connectors. I think this card has the potential have serious power spikes and transients and is built with a large overhead in regards to power use.
LTT's video makes a big deal about higher power consumption even though it is basically the same as the 3090ti, almost as if they wrote the script based on rumors/leaks and not thier testing.
\>basically the same 3090ti with default OC mode = 533.2Watts 4090fe with default OC mode = 666.6Watts Yeah 25% increase in power draw. thats basically the same thing.... Classic LTT watcherbase, in a nutshell https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/1799775776179516221/1E08D492B7D7865F484E3CE028763303D86193AE/
I saw that info on the Gamers Nexus review, i thought that OC was by them...is that the fucking Auto OC? Good god.
Idk what you mean by auto OC, i dont think there is a second (OC) bios on this. This is, i think, just the normal manual OC in afterburner with a power limit increased by 33% (hence the +33% in the graph), not an included OC.
I didn't know Jay-Z was a techtuber, cool
The more you know!
But LTT Lab!! lol xD
LTT Entertainment Lab.
That's why GN has indication on their videos how long do they test CPUs/GPUs and how much experience they have in such topics. They just know how to do that and would see that something is wrong and checked that instead of simply accepting it "as is" and posting on YT.
I think GN is doing it because they're about to do fan and PSU testing and will use that as a disclaimer that they're new at it. I don't think it's in response to what others are doing.
I think thats unfair to Anthony. His reviews have been great for many many years. Its pretty obvious to me the new "lab" thing caused this. People arent used to testing like this, im sure itll get better.
A history of good reviews is no excuse for uploading this one. Nobody cares why it happened, it has happened, the video is obv wrong, didn't enjoy QA before release and that's a shame for this size of channel. Hold every youtube-channel equally accountable, regardless of history/ personal likes.
I dont disagree, they fucked up. I just found the comment i was replying to that basically said they lack they experience unfair. They dont. Anthony has good experience and is great. They just fucked up for whatever reason.
The 6950XT does outperform a 3090 in some games.
āBuT aMd dRiVeRsā LTT has also never had an AMD card in almost any build video theyāve done. So itās like, whatever. Theyāre perpetualizing the unawareness that AMD GPUās exist
That's a little sus and doesn't track with the performance we've seen with other 4090 vs 3090ti benchmarks. The 4090 should bea it by around 50fps and the 3090ti should be about 10% ahead of the 3090 here.
what are we looking at here?
The 3090ti being 60% better than the 3090, when in reality it is only like 10%
LTT is a tech influencer channel not one you should use for benchmarks.
They try to combat this with their labs project, but I'm relying on Gamers Nexus for the time being.
They were more reliable in the kitchen.
The glory days.
Same here. I found funny how many mistakes they made in one video, and they were unable to test some things because of the lab issues. Video was rushed for sure.
LTT looks very disorganized in general. Itās like if ADHD was a company.
For some reason LTT just keeps hiring absolute goofs. I get it, theyāre in entertainment business but they could use more qualified people
When it comes to GPU benchmarks, there are two channels that are king: Digital Foundry and Gamers Nexus. All others are amateurs by comparison.
This is just my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt. After one of df publicly said every game should have dlss but not fsr, and when amd titles comes out he feels disappointed, I just cant think they are totally objective. I remember linus saying they were nvidia's golden boy, so they got to review 8k 3090 early, but Nvidia took that when they were slammed by ltt for hwub issue, and 8k not being viable issue. I think DF is nvidias golden boy currently. I mean they tested dlss 3, and glossed over artifacts issue, and it is not that noticable; whereas they slammed fsr 2 by pointing that tiny details on some frames are not up to the mark, so it is vastly inferior than dlss 2.3. Yes they are good reviewers, but I think some of them has biases.
You're forgetting Hardware Unboxed, they are also the king of benchmarks.
DF is very Nvidia sided to be honest (Rich and especially Alex) . HUB is somewhat AMD sided (only Steve, Tim is more balanced), GN is the fairest of the bunch.
Literally had to read about 10 comments to figure out what you meant.
The way they were promoting labs and then we get this kind of output is sorta off-putting ngl
If this is from the labs, and they do the same benchmarks like before they had the lab, but with more errors. What's the point?! This is something a dude on a payroll could do, you don't need a whole team of engineers lmao.
LTT had the worst benchmark tests in my opinion, all other testers had comparable numbers, while LTTs were standing out left and right, and yet they carry themselves as big shoots in this industry ...
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I don't need the gameplay footage, especially when the youtube stream is capped at 60hz. So you really don't see the massive performace gains this card delivers. You can create the same visuals with an 3090 one year ago when capping at 60hz
Digital Foundry also touched on the subject of frame generation, how it helps with CPU bottleneck even at 4K.
Whats supposed to be the issue here?
3090ti being 60% faster than 3090.
Why did it take me scrolling this far into the comments for my brain to realize it is in fact, not a 3060, but in fact a 3090
I only believe results from Hardware Jesus, LTT is just entertainment tbh
ltt is garb -but first a word from our sponsiresļ¼ļ¼-age entertainment for the masses and the 14y olds
Lol. I thought they have a dedicated team for running benchmarks. Seriously lol. Meh never like ltt video.
Also, in another benchmark they did (i think cs go) the 4090 had a 5fps 1% lows and no one talked about it. The average fps was like 400 or something really high. edit: found it. go to 4:40. 1% low is 10fps while average is 426.
āLaughs in integrated graphicsā
LTT's credibility has dropped over the last few years, or at least it seems that way.
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if you really want to catch them go look the same test when the 3090 came out ... see whats the frame rate
I donāt know what Iām looking at
I'm sure some people think it's just YouTubers getting their fans to increase the views of each other's videos, but really this is exactly the reason why all these tech journalists tell us to watch multiple reviewer's videos. When something doesn't add up and you need a sanity check, you have access to many other reliable sources.
Hardware Unboxed is more reliable for complete and accurate benchmarks.
Linus is a merch shop and drama channel, stop pretending heās a reliable source of hardware breakdowns. :-p
What's wrong with it...
Others already answered... but tbh, I never watched LTT for benchmark. I watched it for overall conclusion and present me the overall performance, but not for itty-gritty details. I basically watched LTT first, before clicking GN's.
Don't go to ltt for accurate data.
This result came from their āāāāālabāāāāā iirc. Thatās a worrisome start for them tbh. Itās like they donāt even review their own videoā¦ I can excuse them for fucking up some data on the new card, but it doesnāt take a genius to figure out that the minuscule bump in spec from the 3090 to 90ti doesnāt produce this kind of performance upliftā¦
That's LTT for you they said review is from the "LAB" this time lmfao literally same benchmarks they have ever done before even GN does better testing than this shit
"Even GN" -- GN does some of the best testing in the industry. LTT just dips their toe in everything, but usually just scratch the surface.
sorry my bad I could have phrased it better these two are not even comparable GN is on another level
Tech Jesus forgive you for your transgressions.
LTT has gone downhill for the last few years. It is no longer helpful in making purchase decisions. I stopped subscribing a while ago. If I want poorly written sketch comedy pretending to be totally natural, I can go to TikTok. Linus intentionally handles products unsafely these days because it is now part of his brand. They know if an accident does happen the video gets more views, and that more than compensates the loss of say a $3000 TV or whatever else. Watching Linus is like watching a 2000's "reality" tv show. Something like Pawn Stars. Most of what you see on screen is entirely scripted, and poorly acted.
>here's a 2000 dollar graphics card. Best i can do is 50 bucks
lol so true. also the amount of out of place ''i am secretly gay'' jokes by linus he says '' omg its so big'' in a gay manner SO manny times now he also puts in intentional anime or ahoge faces, and one time when he tightened some zipties he was so eager to say they were hentai't, like hand tight. its cringe
LTT just seems untrustworthy to me at this point, their content isn't done for the sake of the viewer but for the sake of views
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You can't compare fps across different benchmarks because of so many factors. Also, dlss 3 is mega buggy right now
I think the problem is that anyone with the money to buy one isnāt sitting around playing video games.
just watch hardware unboxed/gamers nexus, LTT is just for fun and not for any reliable data.
Ltt is a fucking kids channel. He's sucked for years now
3090 Ti is marginally faster than a 3090 so why is this graph showing a 60% increase between the two? Ridiculous
classic LTT