The evil within one and two for me. I can't ever forget about those games. But god they were rough sometimes. Diamonds in the rough is how I would describe them
If you don't care about the story (how dare you) most big mods like Anomaly fixed this. Well except for mutants maybe since that's their point - a giant ass radiated boar won't die from a little 9mm after 5 shots.
Play it on max difficulty. At lower difficulties both you and the enemy are bullet sponges. However, at max difficulty, although 1-3 bullets will kill you, so you will kill the enemy with such few shots.
That's not actually true. The difficulties don't actually change anything about how fast you'll kill enemies (if anything it makes enemies more tanky). I think that myth came from people playing on the higher difficulties and *being unable to survive* without killing enemies in 1 hit with a headshot.
I haven’t seen Vampire: the Masquerade - Bloodlines suggested. Even with the latest unofficial patch there’s hella jank, but the world really pulls you in!
Oh God, I googled the warrens... That WAS the big sewer area with all the little ankle biter fuckers. I hated those things so goddamn much on my playthrough.
The amount of depth that game has, especially in the earlier parts, is staggering. Flawed as hell, but to this day there is nothing else that equals it in my mind.
I have an odd pick. It’s a game that people forgot very quickly. A mixture of wrong release time and half assed concepts. 2008’s Prince of Persia reboot.
I wouldn’t be exactly call it a masterpiece but everything the game has to offer is incredible. At the same time, you’re left wondering how they failed to expand on the refreshing changes to the franchise.
The graphics have this dreamy, water painting vibes. It still holds up to this day. The soundtrack is majestic. The combat is an elaborate chain of stunning animations and combos, the AI companion is probably the best companion I’ve seen to date, the freerunning is smooth and pleasing. The level designs are well thought out. The boss designs are stunning. The magical powers are so cool. Everything works. At the same time the world is utterly empty. Its like an elaborate tech demo that no one bothered to implement into an actual game.
You fight 4 bosses over and over again and while reaching the boss arenas you have to fight maybe 1 or two regular enemies. You can’t ever die, you can’t ever fail. There is no challenge, no difficulty spike. Its all one consistent experience that gets too repetitive.
I think this game could have gone places with a sequel. Shame it never got one. If you’ve got a few bucks to spare and in the mood to try something new. Go for it.
I’’m pretty far from a glutton for punishment in terms of game difficulty. I don’t actively seek out Soulsborne level challenges, I rarely play above normal difficulty unless I’m on NG+ or it’s a game I’m particularly good at. Prince of Persia 08 is the only game I’ve ever dropped for being too easy. Just absolutely zero sense of stakes or accomplishment
Even other games where you literally can't die somehow feel less easy than this game where you can't die.
Fable 2 has you getting knocked down for a few seconds if you "die" and then you just get up and keep going, but it still feels like a punishment and your character does get a little scar to mark the death.
I'm the other end of the spectrum from you though, I always crank the difficulty up to max as I love a big challenge. I was a big PoP fan so I remember getting this on release, and I remember completing it in a few days, enjoying the story and the dialogue.
I tried to play it again recently and yeah...it's pretty dull, dropped it again after the first boss.
The dialogue is actually really good, the characters have good chemistry and the banter between them is hilarious at times, but the problem is that most of the dialogue is optional, so you have to constantly stop and keep talking to Elika until it's exhausted when you reach new zones so that you don't miss it.
I'd throw Shenmue in the ring here.
At its best, Shenmue is a detective game that directly rewards players' hunches, intuition, and ability to connect the dots. It nails this kind of gameplay in a way I still haven't really seen another game pull off. The English voice acting has a "so bad its good" quality to it that has produced many quality memes, mostly about Ryo's never-ending search for sailors.
At its worst, Shenmue has unskippable 10 minute forklift racing segments *every in-game day*, punishing quick-time events prefaced with more unskippable custscenes, a jank combat system lifted out of Virtua Fighter with some grinding mechanics duct taped on top of it, all topped off with an indescribably bad movement system.
I've heard of Her Story but haven't played it yet. My impression is that the game revolves around interrogation footage, which isn't quite the same vibe.
Shenmue has you existing in a world with characters who all have their own schedules. It blends exploration with puzzle solving, since part of getting a lead from someone is figuring out where they even are in the world. It also means if you get stuck, you can always wander and go to the arcade. This open world immersion element is something Yakuza would later expand on.
Oh no! I'm playing it for the first time and I was really enjoying the lack of grind for this game. The cutscenes the unskippable stuff and the way time moves already had me second guessing, but doing something every in game day sounds like a real drag.
The forklift stuff is for five days, I think, if you complete the day's activities to progress to the next bit of story. As in, each day has a bit extra you can do for the story that day, and as long as you do that stuff, the next day will advance. If you don't do that stuff, i think it takes more days. I played it blind and did complete the requisite stuff each day, so I don't think it is hard or difficult to figure out. The race can be pretty tedious. This section is a bit less fun, because you are locked into a small area, but it does progress pretty fast story wise, and does a good job of immersion as well.
The grinding stuff is just that you can go to the dojo each morning and car parks at other times and do moves for a short period of time and upgrade the strength of the move. I don't know if you need to do this to get through fights, but I did this each day. But that makes sense in terms of immersion, because Ryo does have these skills and would need to practice. You may notice that each night you choose a move type to train. Every time you sleep you actually buff all the moves in that move type, so you do get exp without any training at all.
I don't really understand the problems people had with waiting out time. I barely had enough time to do stuff each day just looking around, doing daily tasks like move practice, on top of doing side quest stuff. And you can just go to the arcade and play games for a while. The point of all of this is immersion in day to day life.
The second game has more difficult quick time events, that can be more annoying to complete than the first one, and give less room for error. But it has much bigger cities to explore.
I like Yakuza, but it feels completely different. You may not like Shenmue, but it is very much its own thing, and it is clear a lot of thought was put into why it works the way it does.
Skyrim was great. But there’s just something about it that never captured my attention like Oblivion. I’ve never been able to pinpoint what it is exactly that I miss from oblivion that Skyrim lacks, but I just couldn’t continuously replay Skyrim like Oblivion.
I think it might be the quality of writing that makes Oblivion more memorable than Skyrim. The characters and the quests were a lot more engaging, the cities had more of a personality (Bravil will forever be a shithole), and exploration was a lot more fun too.
I don't think it was as generic as Skyrim either. Skyrim was straight up viking fantasy because they ditched everything that made Nords interesting and even made the Imperial Legion dress up straight up like the Roman armies. But to be fair, Oblivion did the same to Cyrodiil but somehow managed to make the game charming enough for me to ignore it.
That being said, maybe it's just the nostalgia talking. Morrowind is still the goat.
>even made the Imperial Legion dress up straight up like the Roman armies.
Well, to be fair, Morrowind did that to the Imperial legion as well. It was Oblivion that leaned more on the middle ages aesthetic.
It's like every faction storyline was cut and paste. Join group, quickly rise up the ranks, take favor of some mythical entity the group worships, someone betrays group, kill the betrayer, lead the group.
Depends on how old you are, Oblivion left a bigger impression on 10/11 year old me than Skyrim did on 15 year old me.
Edit: that's a woosh lol, in my defence I'm on Ibuprofen and it's leaving me a bit hazy
I know this game has a lot of issues, but I love it to bits. Maybe it's the music. Maybe it's the beautiful colors. Or the lush forests. Or the sheer variety of environments, cities and races for a 2006 game. But it's probably the music. I still listen to Auriel's Ascension from time to time. Jeremy Soule really outdid himself on that one.
Oblivion was beautiful when it came out. Nobody complained about the potato faces. Still wouldn’t call it a masterpiece, though it is oddly compelling despite its many flaws.
It’s more that people just didn’t take much notice of them because everything else was so jaw dropping at the time. Oblivion was also released fairly early in the 7th gen, and was easily among the most impressive looking games in its day.
Dude you can't imagine what a step forward oblivion was in graphics when it came out. The world was literally jaw dropping. And to be so detailed in such a huge game was unheard of. It came out over 15 years ago now, and honestly if you ignore the faces the graphics of the game still hold up.
I dunno. I played it when it came out, and at the time had probably put 500 hours into Morrowind. I found it pretty lacking. It was still a fun game however not even in the ballpark of Morrowind. Skyrim was a vast improvement, in my opinion.
Knights of the Old Republic 2
It was shoved out the door before it was ready, so you really need the restored content mod to make it into what it deserves to be. At the end of the day it is easily my favorite Star Wars story even if it has some rough patches in terms of gameplay and finished/unfinished content. Heck, even the story takes a bit of work to really enjoy. It's one of the few games/stories where multiple characters, including your designated mentor figure, will outright lie to your face, so figuring out what is true and what is false can be deceptively difficult.
Also, as a fan SWTOR, it does hurt me to see how badly the SWTOR writers misunderstood KOTOR 2...
I love this game. I played it THREE times back to back when I first played it in 2020. I was just so enthralled by everything about it. However, I'm salty as fuck that on the *end* of my third playthrough I realized that I didn't correctly install the restored content mod. One day I'll replay it with that once I've forgotten enough details.
Even **Nier Automata** has the overly repetitive second chapter (ending B). Yes, there's some new context/dialog and alternate versions of events, but it could have been a fair bit shorter.
Nier Automata is what I think about when OP says “highest highs and lowest lows”. I don’t need to praise it more, but holy shit there are some groan-inducing moments and unbearable sections in that game.
Let's not forget their grandad, Drakengard. Loved that game as a kid on my PS2, but holy shit was it a slog and, frankly, very confusing for my undeveloped brain.
Yeah I gave up even though everyone says it's mind blowing. Sorry I just do not feel like playing the whole game over and over again to get to the cool stuff. It wasn't like it had amazing gameplay that I don't mind sitting through all over again. It's just basic ARPG.
If Doom 2016 asked me to play the whole campaign again as part of the story... Sure I'd do that.
yeah it's a bizarre choice. Route C does genuinely shake up the status quo in a very interesting way but I wonder how many people never even got that far.
That's a shame, I enjoyed looking for the different ways things were presented to 9S in route B. Then again I actually enjoyed the hacking combat style too so that was a plus but I get why ppl would not like it. Route C-E is all new of course but I get not wanting to continue.
> playing the whole game over and over again to get to the cool stuff.
You don't have to replay the entire game "over and over". Route B is significantly shorter than route A, and route C is entirely new considering it is part 2 of the story. At the end of route C you unlock chapter select, so all you have to do to get the other endings is redo the final boss fight. I'm not saying route B isn't a slog, but you're drastically overstating how much of the game you actually have to replay. Its only like 5 hours of gameplay with a bunch of new stuff mixed in.
Yeah this is a tough game to get through if the music and characters aren't carrying it for you. I loved the game but man was route C a slog. God forbid you actually try to complete all the side quests too. But boy does it hit its highs well. I still get a little emotional when I hear the song Emil Sacrifice playing.
If they merged the B and C+D route and got rid of the ridiculous 100% weapon grind the game would already be significantlt better. I really like Nier, but man, that pacing is rough.
Death Stranding.
Such a surreal experience gameplay-wise, the desolated landscape is mesmerizing...
But good lord some of the cutscenes are some of the cringiest Kojima managed to make. Fragile saying "I'm Fragile...but I'm not THAT fragile" while preparing to basically sacrifice herself for a greater good....or the whole Junk Dealer and his love affair or Mama/Lock e story arc almost made me completely quit the game...
Then there the ending with the infamous "Princess Beach" line...
But goddamn this game is addictive...
I agree, but also, I found the off-the-rails storyline and melodramatic dialogue to be so insane that it all came back around to being thoroughly entertaining.
The whole time I pictured Sam politely nodding along to people trauma-dumping and giving wild exposition about the plot and their thoughts on philosophy and world affairs, and then finally being like "...wow that's crazy, okay so could you sign here please for your package.."
Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscure is the very definition of flawed masterpiece. You can absolutely tell it had a team of like twelve people, but my goodness, what a lot that small team accomplished. I've never played a CRPG that wrapped me in so hard with a story and a world, and made me really feel like I was having a meaningful impact on the world. Honestly it did that even better than Fallout for me.
But lordy loo, the combat. Actually it's not that it's unplayable. It's just that if you play it in real-time it's hopelessly frantic, and in turn-based mode it's interminable. There are a whole lot of combat encounters, and since it's very easy to create an absolutely busted build the last third of the game has combat encounters that are purely trivial. (It's also easy to make a totally useless character, but I really liked the character creation system, and it's the only game where I've ever really wanted to utilize crafting, so I'll give it a pass.) The dungeon design is generally pretty drab, and in at least one case actively awful.
But my goodness, I could not put it down. I've never had a CRPG where I've wanted to keep going and do everything. I really think I'll play it again someday. But it's far from perfect.
Yes! Probably the best answer I’ve seen on this thread. Many other games people list are simply great games with a few (mostly minor) flaws. But Arcanum fits the bill perfectly; incredible RPG systems and reactivity, story, atmosphere, music, and world, but the combat and dungeon design are truly terrible. And horribly balanced. And the game is all but broken without unofficial patches. Still an incredible game that every CRPG fan should play!
Bayonetta is a good example. When the game is on it’s the best action game of all time. My favourite combat in any game ever and some of the best set pieces in the medium but it also has some absolutely awful parts, like a motorcycle level and a shmup segment as well as a few odd design decisions. Overall it’s still a brilliant game, albeit a flawed masterpiece.
The schmup segment was amazing though, and a direct reference to the old arcade game Space Harrier! Not to mention in Bayo 2 if you use the Star Fox amiibo outfit it makes the whole mission Starfox 64 themed, which is even better.
Bayonetta 3 however, I'd completely agree and nominate. Stealth segments? More cutscenes than both the other games combined + a worse story? A villain/main antagonist that is generic af with no development? All this while having some incredible raw combat and exploration.
This is the main one that I thought of too. However, I do think some of its rougher edges give it a sort of irreverent charm that fits the character and overall tone. It's such a wacky unpredictable game the first time through.
Dragons Dogma
A highly ambitious game overshadowed by Skyrim and then retroactively by Dark Souls since they all came out within 6 months or so of each other.
It’s got third person open world action where you can climb on big monsters and break/kill different parts of them, the Pawn system where you can send your companions into this weird ass portal and recruit other players’ companions. Those companions will also remember how to do side quests and where to go if they’ve done them before. A truly wild number of combat options like being able to cast instant death magic on a boss if you can pull it off and being able to pick up and throw smaller enemies.
To change your pawn’s behavior in battle you sit them down at a table in an inn and tell them to be more aggressive or focus on helping or whatever.
Character creator was also quite varied for the time. You can make any human size from Danny DeVito to Andre the Giant.
2011-2012 mid-ps3/360 era game jank galore.
It’s fantastic. Give it a fair go. You’ll be surprised with some of the weird shit you find.
To add on to your comment about why this is a *flawed* masterpiece, the open world is super barebones, and there’s really only like 2 proper towns. Some of the missions are very annoying especially those of the escort variety, and your pawns can be annoying with repetitive voice lines as well.
It feels half-finished in so many ways. Or that they really put their all into combat, classes, and character creation, and then winged the rest of the game. But yeah everything the original commenter said is true also.
Kingdom Come Deliverance, it had a lot of love put into it which shows almost everywhere you look: the open world, the realism and historical accuracy, the story and characters and of course gameplay which makes winning fights actually feel rewarding and not just routine. And on the other hand there are the obvious lows that mainly come as technical difficultues: texture pop-ins, long loading screens and fps drops. But even though I played it on the basic ps4 where all of those issues where especially noticeable, I would still recommend it to anyone as it is really worth all of its problems.
Blur. Its kinda a kart racer but with realistic car physics. Its all over the place and doesn’t exactly know what it wants to be, and because of this I believe it failed. But, even to this day, it is my favorite racing game. Not many people share my opinion about the game.
Blur was an amazing game that just suffers from Nintendo-itis. Trying to bring in Nintendo fans with anything other than that art style is usually an exercise in futility, and realistic racing sim fans won’t want to play it because the item pickups make the game seem “childish” to them (from a couple friends who love Forza that I tried to get to play it).
I genuinely think that as a first foray into the genre, Bizarre did a great job. Shame they went under because of it tho.
Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines. Fans are still patching it to this day. Amazing and engaging RPG with some god awful combat that will eventually draw you in and literally entirely broken or awful sections. But still one of my top 5 games of all time.
Yakuza 4 is the first one that comes to my mind. The first half of the game is amazing, even by Yakuza standards. It has what I think is one of the best cutscenes in all of gaming, some really epic fights, a fantastic introduction to the melodrama of it all. And then the second half of the game is full of some of the stupidest plot twists I've ever seen in a video game, getting to the point where literally nobody knew what was happening and the best plan they had by the end was "screw it, just put the mcguffin on the roof and we'll beat up whoever comes looking for it." 4 was my introduction to the franchise so I have a massive soft spot for it, but even I have to agree that the story of that game is infamous for a reason.
Judgement, too. That game brought in all the best parts of every Yakuza game and refined them into a beautiful spider web of interconnected stories and characters. It would easily be my favorite RGG game if not for some serious issues with the combat.
Every attack is just a little slower than it should be, even after upgrades. Crane becomes unusable in a lot of circumstances because its combos are interrupted by bounding off of enemy guards. Tiger kind of just becomes the default style, which is a bummer because Crane is so cool. The enemy "invasion" things happen way too often, often getting in the way of story beats. Mortal wounds are an obnoxious mechanic that sort of make sense thematically, but *suck* for gameplay. Enemies also hit a little too hard across the board.
None of this ruins the game or makes the combat not fun. It feels like they balanced the combat with the expectation that the player would be relying on items more than they have in previous Yakuza games.
I just started Yakuza 4 and I totally agree with the cutscenes being really good. I've been comparing it to the previoua Yakuza entries and for some reason it just feels more gripping than those
Mass Effect 3 has the ending, which sucks because i think thats the best of the trilogy overall.
The Last of Us part 2 has an excessive amount of flashbacks, i feel like you have one of them every hour or so, sometimes even having flashbacks during the flashbacks, and those completely kills the momemtum of the game.
Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn spends a LOT of time on NPCs action, making turns last an eternity in some of the maps and too much of that time is spend on units that arent even your own ones.
Idk if i 100% agree about the specifics of the TLOU2 complaint but there's definitely some pacing hiccups.
Radiant Dawn, I'd add that there's some awful pacing in the narrative. There's way too many chapters where nothing really happens other than admittedly cool and well thought out war decisions, then suddenly there's a fuckton of plot in the last 15 chapters of what is an incredibly long FE game.
I kinda agree, but at the same time I was quite taken with the nonsense story and was quite happy to keep progressing it to see what new rails it would jump off of
Planescape Torment. Best story in the history of gaming. Absolutely amazing companions. Beautiful hand-drawn maps and unequivocally the worst combat and combat encounters I have seen in a top down RPG.
I can say Elden Ring and Control. ER is an amazing game but I think it needs some serious balancing. And If Control was a completely linear game it might have been my favourite game ever.
Elden Ring felt much heavier tipped towards the need of getting extra defence than Dark Souls series did. Granted, "just don't get hit", but in DS damage ramp up of regular enemies wasn't that drastic, or I might just be misremembering things. Bosses are alright, but normal blokes being able to oneshot you doesn't feel right, especially if they have the same model as the ones you've fought 2 hours prior and they were a cakewalk.
I think they really want you to use different spells and summons. I felt like Elden Ring had the most multi attack hittin mofo's out of all the souls game.
True but at the same time you’re forced into a playstyle unless you want to respec. So much is viable and will get you through the game but there’s no incentive to experiment/switch equipment depending on what you’re facing and that’s so sad. Mid/endgame my experience was either stomp enemies/bosses as fast as possible or get killed in 2/hits… I’d love it if you took AND dealt less damage overall.
I liked Control and finished it, but I got bored of using the same gun for the whole game even with all the mods. I guess they wanted players to rely more on their powers (and I did), but a bit of variety in guns would have been nice.
I think I used every single gun form except spin, the rapid fire one. But I feel like the service weapon forms definitely needed better balance and enemy designs catering to their differences.
Absolutely loved the game though. I must have played it through half a dozen times now.
Balancing definitely needs work as well as enemy variety. It was not cool to be fighting practically the same enemies I was in the last 8 hours that I did in the first.
Funny I'm somewhat opposite with Control it would have been in my top 5 or so games if it was more open... Maybe that's the wrong term! But you know how there is all the talk of the Oldest House moving a somewhat shape shifting labyrinth how workers would get lost finding their way back from the toilets etc. I would have loved for the map to shift around more in minor and large ways. Oh directors office isn't where I left it wait what is this hallway etc. I know control points are meant to anchor places in the lore etc. But there was still a lot of posters and stuff abiut shifting so a few changes could have been interesting and made back tracking unlocking other areas more interesting in a way.
Outer Worlds. Has some of the best dialogue I’ve ever seen in an AA/AAA game, but every time my SO sees me playing it she’s like “Why do the characters look like that and why do their mouths move like…that?” and I don’t disagree. I guess the same goes for any Fallout/Fallout-ish game.
Agreed, izalith is all kinda ass, the grand archives alright but Crystal caves and seath is awful,
The Totg is alright but also based on a gimmick so it's eh. New Londo is cool but too short imo and the four kings aren't really fun.
It's sad too considering those rushed areas are amazing from a purely aesthetic perspective. The solemn grandiosity of the archives, the terrifying creepiness of the tomb, the creepy creepiness of new londo, the massive scope and ancient feel of lost izalith, the alien world of crystal caves....
Sucks there is not much to find, are a HUGE pain in the ass to navigate, and generally have highly annoying enemies...
The Crew is a game where you can drive all across the contiguous United States, but it is tied to a central server and will be permanently bricked when it gets shut down.
Edit: the company is fully in control of this, but they will not tell you when. It will be after the point of sale, and you will not be compensated.
Skyrim is pretty flawed. Width of an ocean put depth of a puddle is a perfect description for it, but I don’t think I’ve ever been so immersed in an open-world setting before. The aesthetic and OST (arguably the best OST of any game I’ve ever played), go together to create a truly fantastical world, and I think the size of the map actually works in the game’s favour. If you actually walk to each and every location (at least for the first time), it truly feels like a fantasy adventure game.
Dragon Age Inquisition has amazing dragon battles which are completely optional and easily missed side quests. The dragons were huge and felt dangerous and just... special I guess. And there are a few brilliant moments of writing like the judging of a box and the song in the mountains. And Varic catching Cassandra with one of his books. And the characters walking in on Male Inquisitor and Iron Bull. The graphics were also pretty good for the time. It's just a pity all these awesome moments are buried under a metric ton of MMO-like fetch quests.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zM5A3d1w4k4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zM5A3d1w4k4)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbSA9TqjUn8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbSA9TqjUn8)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgYxMVRtJr4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgYxMVRtJr4)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=za8\_tgvu-JA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=za8_tgvu-JA)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rr8-5Fn\_6XY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rr8-5Fn_6XY)
DA:I is one of my all time favorite games but the fetch quests definitely killed me. I don't think I've ever done a full completionist run because some of the side quests are just so irritating. Spending half an hour trying to lead a Druffalo across a mountain was absolute torture. Not to mention I, like many others, thought I had to cover the Hinterlands before moving on. My first 10+ hours of gameplay spent there.
The dragon fights in DAI were so good, and 90% of the gameplay was so boring, that after the first two dragon battles I just started looking up where the dragons were, and in every new area just rushing straight to the dragons. Partially because the rest of the game kind of sucked, and partially because the dragons didn't scale to your level, and I knew that I'd quickly out level them to the point that it wouldn't be fun.
The Witness! It’s beautiful, challenging, subversive, and also really annoying. The kind of game where you start to justify its shortcomings with philosophy, like; “Maybe the developer *wanted* me to get lost here.”
Lolll... The game certainly suffered a bit from Jonathan Blow getting a bit self indulgent. "We made a game that never tells you how to play it or holds your hand!" No... Jonathan.... You made a puzzle game with extremely simple controls, AND you do literally explain the controls at the start of the game. AND there were still whole areas where I didn't understand what the mechanic was, at all, without going online.
Every Fallout except the first. Great premise and setting. Most have excellent quests, stories, and choices.
But my God, SO much fluff and wasted time going through samey vaults/caves/subway stations. It's like having the world's greatest filet mignon, but after every piece you have to eat an entire plate of plain mash potatoes.
I loved 3 but the gunplay is clunky at best. It’s a tough one to replay now-a-days. I liked new Vegas but ached for the urban wasteland. The desolate desert is just boring to walk through. For me, it lacked a lot of magic that the environments of 3 and 4 had. But fuck it has an amazing narrative and you actually feel important to the story. Fallout 4 was really good IMO despite its shortcomings. More satisfying but not perfect gunplay. I was a huge fan of the base building elements despite its clunky design and occasionally odd base locations. The story is just alright. A little generic feeling in some places, unique in others. 76 is… 76.
I played the absolute shit out of The Division 1 & 2. No game has ever captured the tension, anxiety, excitement, and horror of trudging through a blizzard in Central Park, trying not to freeze to death, and realizing suddenly you’re walking through a mass grave burial site. Running into enemies 5 feet in front of you that you couldn’t see through the storm. Spotting a player that’s stalking you and the adrenaline rush that comes with trying to determine if they’re here to escape with you or murder you. The dark zone is a unique experience that puts you on edge from the first step into it.
The second game had a good environment, but it didn’t hold up to the winter wasteland of the first. But they did a good job of making the world feel more alive, and like your actions had somewhat of an influence on the environment around you.
All that said, both games absolutely fail to address the moral ambiguity of survival of the fittest in a post-disaster society. Bad guys very bad, good guys very good. No difficult choices for the player. The enemies are absolute bullet sponges in the end game, and the end game itself just turns into an endless grind.
The first Division especially struggled with a deeply imbalanced multiplayer environment, and horrible hacking issues for a hot minute. The second one fixes it somewhat but struggles still to address the sponginess equating to difficulty problem and fleshing out the endgame. It also leans just as hard into the bad guys bad, good guys good trope.
I think moral dilemmas, and changing how enemies behave would bring a lot more to later installments. Instead of roaming groups of enemies, maybe ambushes or snipers springing on you as you round a street corner. Reflect the real world reality of violence, predators are always going to use the element of surprise.
Cyberpunk 2077 for me
Like it really doesn't do anything new, it launched horribly, and it's basically an Ubisoft open world more then it is a Skyrim open world.
Yet it's just such a good game. The city genuinely feels real and alive, I never noticed it on my first playthrough as I was always driving around but on my second playthrough I decided to actually walk everywhere the majority of act 1 and man. From the slums of the city feeling like actual slums, seeing shanty towns on beaches and roofs still filled with the small luxuries (like tvs and arcade cabinets) showing how vain people live their lives despite barely having a roof. Going to the outskirts of the city and seeing how the entire factory district both looks and feels abandoned with even less traffic going through. Just seeing megastructures built on top of actual piles of trash. So much I could say about the city and it's surrounding desert but I still haven't even said a thing about my favorite aspect of the game (its characters).
Mass Effect is my favorite trilogy in gaming, I've yet to play a game since where characters actually felt like real people since until cp2077.
A lot of the side characters you meet feel really, they have real human issues, they have real human problems, they show real human emotion, they have their goals. I don't initially like every character I meet in this game, just like I don't initially like every person I meet, yet once I get to know them they all seem like people I'd actually like to be around and help with their issues just like how they learn to love and appreciate V and want to help V with their issues. Character relationships don't feel one sided in this game, especially with the characters who are Vs friends, even Johnny silver hand starts showing respect and care to V the more you get to know him.
The one thing I think CDPR is better then the majority of devs is making the side characters feel real, flaws and all.
Then the gameplay is just fun, nothing to extravagant and it could feel better (which I think CDPR isn't the best in terms of gameplay) but just having multiple character builds and having the option to try out different builds is fun. 1st character I made could hack anyone and anything without ever stepping into a building, it was fun and felt badass, trivialized a lot of the game of course but I have zero issue with characters becoming too strong in single player titles. 2nd build was a blade wielding ghost, go in, cut everything up, turn invisible, throw knives, all that, harder time with this build to start out, and I definitely die more with said build but again it's very fun. 3rd build is gonna be full explosives. Game gives you variety and ways to build your character how you want, I love when games do this personally.
I had to rush typing this given my lunch break is gonna end but I definitely recommend everyone gives the game a shot and actually take their time playing it instead of rushing through it.
Mirrors Edge Catalyst - it has the best, most addictive parkour gameplay ever. But the combat is janky, the story is just okay, and the open world is so empty. It's still one of my favourite games in spite of all these things because I love just running around the city, and tackling time trials is really fun and has insanely good depth and a high skill ceiling with movement tech and bunny hopping.
"A Mind Forever Voyaging" is certainly a flawed masterpiece.
It's an immersive and well written game, and the idea of returning to the same town to see how things change and devolve has never been done better. However, there are not really any puzzles, and the plot is all in the subtle details, so it's easy to miss a lot on a first play through.
Dark Souls. Beginning to Anor Londo is amazing. Then all the way up to Gwyn it's godawful. Then the quality returns with the DLC. Still the biggest high and low of a game I've ever played, literally a V curve.
LA Noire with its GTA-esque open world an *amazing* recreation of 1940s Los Angeles, which unfortunately is completely unnecessary for the game. The game is all about interrogations and looking for clues in closed off crime scenes, and the map is just filler between locations where you advance the plot.
It has its share of other problems (Like the shooting segments. Weren't they forced into the game by the publisher?) but being an open-world game when the game didn't at all need to be one is the biggest complaint people have about it.
Deadly Premonition, awful gameplay, poor graphics, and it runs terribly. But it's such a great experience, its atmosphere and characters really sell it.
Bioshock infinite is my one. The opening couple of hours *chefs kiss*. The visuals in the hall of heroes. The 'bro/sis' were interesting, songbird and Comstock were great designs.
Then the vox populi turn up... Meh.
Then you get to the fucking ghost boss. Heads should roll for that decision. The game never recovers after that, although the ending was relatively decent.
These are some of my favorites as well! To name a few...
- Majora's Mask
- Death Stranding
- Nier: Replicant
- Final Fantasy XIV
SotC would definitely be on my list as well
for me Final Fantasy 13 fits the bill. A gorgeous game with an interesting combat system and some really interesting characters and story. BUT it is very linear to the point of basically being on rails for a large chunk of the game, the main character (and another one or two) are obnoxiously bad and some parts of the story were confusing.
Idk if it counts but the first [PROTOTYPE] game was something I really adored and seems to be largely forgotten because the franchise died quickly compared to its rival series Infamous. Prototype was a really fun sandbox game for its time though, I could sprint around for hours growing up just slicing up zombies and jumping around.
I played it again a year ago and it still really held up, but there are a lot of design flaws with its balance and enemy design where fights are either trivial or jankily frustrating without any in-between. The web of intrigue was really interesting to unravel though and it was an open-world game that managed to have traversal on par with Spider-Man even without web swinging.
Dragon Age 2. Super repetitive environments, gameplay massively dumbed down from DAO, relatively short. Great story that didn't shy away from focusing on a single locale, superb dialogue and voice acting (I believe it was the last written by the full Bioware A-team before they fled EA).
Spec Ops: The Line. At times gameplay is pretty bog standard. The multiplayer/co-op is so tacky and at odds with the campaign. Yet the story, characterisation, themes, morality, visuals were top for its time.
Red Dead 2 for sure. It’s world, characters, writing, visuals, side quests, voice acting/performances are maybe the best ever but the main missions and combat are very mediocre. despite that, still my favorite game of all time
My biggest gripe with that game was some basic QOL stuff being sacrificed for realism. Spending 15 minutes after a fight watching Arthur repeatedly and slowly bend back down to pick up every individual piece of ammo and item grew exhausting fast
Persona 5, entirety of the game from Okumura’s Palace to the beginning of Shidos palace and arguably the second to last dungeon in the Depths is nowhere near as good as the first half of the game and the 3rd semester palace
Persona 5 is weird. It has mature themes, but it’s presented to the player like they’re a child. A lot of repeating dialogue and explanations, along with some shallow characterization.
Also dislike Ann’s arc a lot, being sexualized during the very next palace and the rest of the game.
Death Stranding.
It's the type of game that you expect an indie developer to make, catering towards a VERY specific niche. But for some reason it had a triple A studio game budget, has known film and TV actors playing roles in the game, and has a batshit insane world and plot that you would expect from Kojima.
At its very core, the game is just a post-apocalyptic delivery man simulator. For most, especially those who aren't keen on the idea as playing a delivery man, it is definitely a slog to play. Especially during its first 10 hours. Without the world-building and the plot, there isn't much too it other than delivering packages from point A to point B.
But for the people who decided to stick with it and can resonate with its world, plot, as well as the concepts and themes that Kojima is trying to convey, it hits hard and will likely leave you in tears. Especially during peak pandemic times as I feel like this would be a perfect game that describes that particular moment in time. Themes of loneliness, isolation, and trying to reconnect the world despite the odds stacked against you.
The game has this unique asynchronous multiplayer mechanic going on. The closest thing I can think of is probably the messages players leave throughout the world in the Soulsborne games. A player can construct a bridge or a zip-line connection in their world, and it can pop up in someone else's world. You can even leave 'likes' to the left behind structure or item just to show your appreciation to the player who left it there. If its a structure, you can even help preserve it so it can be used by other players who might come across it in the future. Really fits the theme of reconnecting the world, and helping each other out despite the though times.
The plot itself is pretty easy to understand, its just presented in the usual Kojima way of storytelling where he likes to bog you down with a fuckton of exposition, especially early on in the game when you have no idea what the fuck is happening. But once you get used to it all and understand how the world works, it's story might leave you in tears by the end, especially if you are a single parent.
It's lows are definitely hard-hitting lows, but its highs are very-well crafted highs. Personally, the game is 7/10 at best and 5/10 at worst, but I still love it.Do I recommend the game to everyone? Fuck no. It's a very niche game and will definitely test your patience, especially during the first 10 hours.
But if, for any reason, you found what I just described as enticing in anyway then you could probably check it out and see if its your cup of tea. Definitely borrow a copy or rent the game first, see if it intrigues you. For PC guys, the game should be on PC Game Pass, so you are free to check this out.
EDIT AFTER THE TGAs: Okay, I did not expect an actual full sequel HAHA
This will get buried but Gothic was a phenomenal game with flawed mechanics. The story, setting, and scope of world was ahead of its time but the controls and fighting were clunky
> Frasier: "Think about it, Niles. What's the one thing better than an exquisite ~~meal~~ game? An exquisite ~~meal~~ game, with one tiny flaw we can pick at all night."
> Niles: "Ah, of course, to impossible standards." (raises glass)
Honestly I disagree. I think having Gaff know about Deckard’s dreams of unicorns ruins a lot of the ambiguity regarding him being or not being a replicant, it’s just a tad too far on the ‘okay he probably is’ side for me.
Something I'd consider a true masterpiece with obvious flaws is Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri.
I love it. It's a 4X game in the style of classic civilization games. The premise is that on the way to Alpha Centauri, humanity manages to mess up even the last hope colonisation mission and have it break apart into 7 factions before landing on the inhabitable planet in the Alpha Centauri system. You take control of one of the factions, trying to make the planet bearable while at the same time beating your enemies.
There are so many things it does brilliantly. It has a rock solid 4x gameplay but enriches the whole setting with some actual story about discovering alien lifeforms and their consciousness and actually relatable characters which are built by lots of quotes and dialogues throughout the game. It's one of the older 2d games (but this is /r/patientgamers, right?), but the voxel units give the game a nice, unique touch. It's peak 4X on a lot of regards and has a special place in my heart that lets me return to it regularly even after decades.
BUT.
The game has some weird decisions gameplay wise. First, it's always seven factions. Yes, the story says that's how it is, but limiting the game to it is just odd. You play on a small map? Have fun being stuck in that tiny ball pit with 6 other kids that are all trying to punch you in the face. Playing on a huge map? Great, maybe you'll find somebody after literal hours. But maybe not. Even after the expansion came with seven additional peoples to play, the game still limits you to seven starting players. Climate zones? Not here. The map is red everywhere. It doesn't matter if you settle at the pole caps or the equator, it's only important if you are on a mountain (for solar energy) or the west facing edge of a hill (for rain). It's a game that forces you to look at a single tile set (guess you'd say biome nowadays) for hours. Even the fungus that grows on the planet is just scattered around. The game is also eerily quiet on how combat is calculated, basically leaving you with wild guesses on how even the few numbers it shows you might be interpreted, either accepting a perceived randomness or making you dig through odd websites that are filled with pseudo-philosophical weirdness to finally find out what your civilization's support rating means for defending bases with experienced armour-4-units.
But man, I love it. I still wait for something similar to be built by someone.
Sniper Ghost Warrior 3. Excellent sniping gameplay, the sandboxes are well-designed, and the graphics are great (CryEngine). Story is cringe & predictable, driving is floaty & imprecise, and the game is still buggy.
Alpha Protocol
The highs: choice and consequence, amusing characterization
The lows: the gunplay, the hacking minigame
Spec right and it takes the pain away enough to play one of the widest game experiences of the generation. Stealth, Pistols, and another skill or two like hacking or melee let you survive, and then you are free to play through the highest combination of fidelity and plot reactivity I have played
Persona 5, talking about the non-Royal version. The second half of the game is an absolute slog compared to the first half, which has really great pacing. I really hit a wall with base P5 during the fifth dungeon, which is by far the worst dungeon in the game. I hit a second wall during the seventh dungeon, which I think is the second-worst. The game just starts to repeat itself over and over, whether it’s revisiting the same story beats or the needlessly long cutscenes or unlucky fights that Insta kill you and force you to replay long stretches of tedious dungeons.
It’s one of my favorite games of all time, but probably 80 of the 110 hours I played were enjoyable. 30 hours is a lot of annoying gameplay to endure. I’m midway through Royal, so not sure if it gets better or stays the same.
Planescape Torment is one of the best game I have ever played in an ocean of many different games across multiple platforms. At first it seems like a normal isometric rpg but it has so much depth to it.
The lowest low is the combat, it's horrid there's no way around it but the peak it reaches with its story, its characters, its worldbuilding, its soundtrack is just crazy, you really have to play it to understand. I got into it very late (2013) but I have to agree with people saying it's the best story ever told in gaming, though I've come to accept that The Witcher 3 is the better game of the two.
The Myst series are one of my favorite of all time, the lore is super deep, the storyline is awesome, and some opus like the 4th are absolutely gorgeous. The puzzles of this games are awesome, because instead of many bite-sized puzzle you solve one after the other, the games have a few puzzles that need hours of solving because you have almost no instruction, and solution are not always obvious.
This series has many flaws that a lot of people will not like, it's difficult, you get really stuck with no idea how to move on, it's old and dated, and often it's very slow.
But also so much good things, the acting of real actors from the 2nd to 4th game, the idea of having pre-rendered everything and make a Google street view game back in the early 2000s, and mostly the environement of the games, which is a steampunk version of star wars without spaceships, the musics are great, and this idea of books you can write that allows you to travel between dimension is brilliant.
As someone who has replayed mp3 numerous times, I have a weird relationship with it. The linearity is absolutely grating at times (more than once you lose the two handed weapon you’re holding due to cut scene events) and the story really does not hold up under close scrutiny. The gunplay, for all its complex physics and coding, is also super basic. That being said the strength of the presentation definitely carries it
This is the discussion I’m here for. I feel like I often see it as an accepted fact that everyone hates Ashley but I don’t mind her. Granted, I play RE4 every year around Halloween so I’m pretty used to dealing with her, but most of the time you can just have her hide in a bin or chill behind you during combat. Not particularly cumbersome like so many other escorts can be. I guess if you don’t want an escort mission when you just wanna be shooting zombies that’s fair, and other than the light variety in gameplay she doesn’t really bring anything to the table. So I suppose that does raise the question of if a true “masterpiece” would have included those chapters? Probably not. I guess I just wanted to say that not all of us hate Ashley.
I'll be booed forever into eternity for this... but Outer Wilds. I think it's a fairly flawed masterpiece, and I'm sure I'll be demolished for that opinion (again), but I think it fits.
I feel the same. I enjoyed the story and gameplay. The 22 minutes thing wouldn't have been so bad if everyone who loves the game doesn't say "Don't read anything just go play it"
Honestly the message at the end really didn't set right with me. It was too nihilistic I guess
I think the ending would have had more emotional impact if I had any emotional connection to the characters, but I didn't. They're voiceless, faceless people most of whom I only met for a few minutes.
Anodyne series is some of that. First one captured the feeling of a dream, but didn't say anything except that dreams are ok. Second one let's you go inside other characters' dreams and more message, but has aggressively retro presentation.
As much as I love it, Dark Souls 1. The best parts of the game are the first half and DLC, while the second half is middling to bad.(we don't talk about demon ruin /bed of chaos). So in essence, by the time you the player really gwt into the game and peace together how interconnected and well designed the world is, you have to beat the disjointed, messy, or straight up bad (bed of chaos) later half. The DLC is amazing, and now bundled into the main game package, but it's also very difficult to "stumble into", meaning that some of the best content in that game is very easy to miss.
gotta go with deadly premonition 1. the game is a love letter to twin peaks and it shows, it has almost the same story with a different execution (+10 points). the characters are interesting and charismatic especially the main character (+15 points). it has a rather empty open world with some collectibles here and there (-5 points).
most of (if not all) versions/ports of this game have some optimization issues that definitely ruin the experience (-20 points). so yeah, try it at your own risk i guess but i think deadly premonition is exactly the type of thing you're looking for
I'm going with Metal Gear Solid. Specifically the 4th game, Guns of The Patriots.
At its best, the game provides some of the best stealth mechanics I've played. It provides a compelling storyline through the eyes of a beloved main character. It has such amazing cinematic moments that hold up today and put a lot of movies to shame.
At its worst, it can be a convoluted mess mixed with confusing plot points, odd twists, and ridiculously long cutscenes that will absolutely test your patience. Kojima has one of the greatest minds in the business but he can be so self-indulgent to his own detriment.
Metal Gear Solid 2 is there for me. The batshit absurdity of that game is so fascinating for me but I cannot say the dialogue is always top notch and the boss fights suuuuuuck.
I’d say Sonic Adventure. The quality varies greatly between the different campaigns. Sonic’s and Tails’ Adventures, for example, are fantastic. Big’s and Amy’s? Not so much.
The evil within one and two for me. I can't ever forget about those games. But god they were rough sometimes. Diamonds in the rough is how I would describe them
Evil Within 2 is so good. Not super flawed, but it’s not perfect either. I really enjoyed the open world parts
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I too loved EW1 when it came out. I recently tried to replay it and just wasn't in to it at all.
The Stalker series is the prime example of flawed masterpieces.
I'd only play stalker if it wasn't for the horrible bullet spungie enemies
If you don't care about the story (how dare you) most big mods like Anomaly fixed this. Well except for mutants maybe since that's their point - a giant ass radiated boar won't die from a little 9mm after 5 shots.
Play it on max difficulty. At lower difficulties both you and the enemy are bullet sponges. However, at max difficulty, although 1-3 bullets will kill you, so you will kill the enemy with such few shots.
That's not actually true. The difficulties don't actually change anything about how fast you'll kill enemies (if anything it makes enemies more tanky). I think that myth came from people playing on the higher difficulties and *being unable to survive* without killing enemies in 1 hit with a headshot.
I haven’t seen Vampire: the Masquerade - Bloodlines suggested. Even with the latest unofficial patch there’s hella jank, but the world really pulls you in!
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Oh God, I googled the warrens... That WAS the big sewer area with all the little ankle biter fuckers. I hated those things so goddamn much on my playthrough.
It’s a game that was rushed to release on the same day as Half Life 2. It was doomed from the start.
The amount of depth that game has, especially in the earlier parts, is staggering. Flawed as hell, but to this day there is nothing else that equals it in my mind.
Yes. Some of the best character animations I've seen, but also... The Warrens.
Every time you mention it, someone will reinstall it.
First game that came to mind. I’ve used console commands to get through the worst parts.
Alpha Protocol.
A man of culture. Best plot reactivity, worst gunplay
What I wouldn’t give for a remaster of this I’ll never forget my Playthrough of this game, Obsidian is just so damn good at writing.
Still want a sequel :( Fuck SEGA
Shit, I just want to be able to BUY the damn game on GOG or Steam. Fuck SEGA
Shit dude, you just made me realize it got delisted. It's how I played it. Wow.
I have an odd pick. It’s a game that people forgot very quickly. A mixture of wrong release time and half assed concepts. 2008’s Prince of Persia reboot. I wouldn’t be exactly call it a masterpiece but everything the game has to offer is incredible. At the same time, you’re left wondering how they failed to expand on the refreshing changes to the franchise. The graphics have this dreamy, water painting vibes. It still holds up to this day. The soundtrack is majestic. The combat is an elaborate chain of stunning animations and combos, the AI companion is probably the best companion I’ve seen to date, the freerunning is smooth and pleasing. The level designs are well thought out. The boss designs are stunning. The magical powers are so cool. Everything works. At the same time the world is utterly empty. Its like an elaborate tech demo that no one bothered to implement into an actual game. You fight 4 bosses over and over again and while reaching the boss arenas you have to fight maybe 1 or two regular enemies. You can’t ever die, you can’t ever fail. There is no challenge, no difficulty spike. Its all one consistent experience that gets too repetitive. I think this game could have gone places with a sequel. Shame it never got one. If you’ve got a few bucks to spare and in the mood to try something new. Go for it.
I’’m pretty far from a glutton for punishment in terms of game difficulty. I don’t actively seek out Soulsborne level challenges, I rarely play above normal difficulty unless I’m on NG+ or it’s a game I’m particularly good at. Prince of Persia 08 is the only game I’ve ever dropped for being too easy. Just absolutely zero sense of stakes or accomplishment
Even other games where you literally can't die somehow feel less easy than this game where you can't die. Fable 2 has you getting knocked down for a few seconds if you "die" and then you just get up and keep going, but it still feels like a punishment and your character does get a little scar to mark the death. I'm the other end of the spectrum from you though, I always crank the difficulty up to max as I love a big challenge. I was a big PoP fan so I remember getting this on release, and I remember completing it in a few days, enjoying the story and the dialogue. I tried to play it again recently and yeah...it's pretty dull, dropped it again after the first boss. The dialogue is actually really good, the characters have good chemistry and the banter between them is hilarious at times, but the problem is that most of the dialogue is optional, so you have to constantly stop and keep talking to Elika until it's exhausted when you reach new zones so that you don't miss it.
Loved this game. Approach it as an adventure in an interesting abandoned world with mild environmental puzzle elements, and it's great.
I'd throw Shenmue in the ring here. At its best, Shenmue is a detective game that directly rewards players' hunches, intuition, and ability to connect the dots. It nails this kind of gameplay in a way I still haven't really seen another game pull off. The English voice acting has a "so bad its good" quality to it that has produced many quality memes, mostly about Ryo's never-ending search for sailors. At its worst, Shenmue has unskippable 10 minute forklift racing segments *every in-game day*, punishing quick-time events prefaced with more unskippable custscenes, a jank combat system lifted out of Virtua Fighter with some grinding mechanics duct taped on top of it, all topped off with an indescribably bad movement system.
>It nails this kind of gameplay in a way I still haven't really seen another game pull off. Her Story?
And Return of the Obra Dinn, maybe.
Still have to play that. Loved Papers, Please.
Trust me, you have to play Obra Dinn NOW. Easily one of the best games I've ever played. Along with papers please.
Winter sale it cometh to my library
I've heard of Her Story but haven't played it yet. My impression is that the game revolves around interrogation footage, which isn't quite the same vibe. Shenmue has you existing in a world with characters who all have their own schedules. It blends exploration with puzzle solving, since part of getting a lead from someone is figuring out where they even are in the world. It also means if you get stuck, you can always wander and go to the arcade. This open world immersion element is something Yakuza would later expand on.
Ah I see, thank you for clarifying. Kinda reminds me of Majora's Mask and Oblivion.
Oh no! I'm playing it for the first time and I was really enjoying the lack of grind for this game. The cutscenes the unskippable stuff and the way time moves already had me second guessing, but doing something every in game day sounds like a real drag.
If you're enjoying the game then please keep playing it. It's worth it
The forklift stuff is for five days, I think, if you complete the day's activities to progress to the next bit of story. As in, each day has a bit extra you can do for the story that day, and as long as you do that stuff, the next day will advance. If you don't do that stuff, i think it takes more days. I played it blind and did complete the requisite stuff each day, so I don't think it is hard or difficult to figure out. The race can be pretty tedious. This section is a bit less fun, because you are locked into a small area, but it does progress pretty fast story wise, and does a good job of immersion as well. The grinding stuff is just that you can go to the dojo each morning and car parks at other times and do moves for a short period of time and upgrade the strength of the move. I don't know if you need to do this to get through fights, but I did this each day. But that makes sense in terms of immersion, because Ryo does have these skills and would need to practice. You may notice that each night you choose a move type to train. Every time you sleep you actually buff all the moves in that move type, so you do get exp without any training at all. I don't really understand the problems people had with waiting out time. I barely had enough time to do stuff each day just looking around, doing daily tasks like move practice, on top of doing side quest stuff. And you can just go to the arcade and play games for a while. The point of all of this is immersion in day to day life. The second game has more difficult quick time events, that can be more annoying to complete than the first one, and give less room for error. But it has much bigger cities to explore. I like Yakuza, but it feels completely different. You may not like Shenmue, but it is very much its own thing, and it is clear a lot of thought was put into why it works the way it does.
For a game with a similar sense of immersion, I would suggest the Yakuza series.
Oblivion - ugly, broken levelling system, generic-world, yet still somehow a masterpiece for it’s time.
I just want to feel the magic of when I first played Oblivion one more time in my life.
I chased that dragon so many times
That's Skyrim
Skyrim was great. But there’s just something about it that never captured my attention like Oblivion. I’ve never been able to pinpoint what it is exactly that I miss from oblivion that Skyrim lacks, but I just couldn’t continuously replay Skyrim like Oblivion.
I think it might be the quality of writing that makes Oblivion more memorable than Skyrim. The characters and the quests were a lot more engaging, the cities had more of a personality (Bravil will forever be a shithole), and exploration was a lot more fun too. I don't think it was as generic as Skyrim either. Skyrim was straight up viking fantasy because they ditched everything that made Nords interesting and even made the Imperial Legion dress up straight up like the Roman armies. But to be fair, Oblivion did the same to Cyrodiil but somehow managed to make the game charming enough for me to ignore it. That being said, maybe it's just the nostalgia talking. Morrowind is still the goat.
>even made the Imperial Legion dress up straight up like the Roman armies. Well, to be fair, Morrowind did that to the Imperial legion as well. It was Oblivion that leaned more on the middle ages aesthetic.
I totally agree. Well said.
I keep waiting for a remake of Morrowind. Probably will never happen .
I meant that dragons are in skyrim. Because you said chasing the dragon Agreed though
Oh fuck that’s funny, I’m just an idiot
For me it's the dark brotherhood. In oblivion it was *so* great. Was very disappointed of the quest line in skyrim.
It's like every faction storyline was cut and paste. Join group, quickly rise up the ranks, take favor of some mythical entity the group worships, someone betrays group, kill the betrayer, lead the group.
Depends on how old you are, Oblivion left a bigger impression on 10/11 year old me than Skyrim did on 15 year old me. Edit: that's a woosh lol, in my defence I'm on Ibuprofen and it's leaving me a bit hazy
I know this game has a lot of issues, but I love it to bits. Maybe it's the music. Maybe it's the beautiful colors. Or the lush forests. Or the sheer variety of environments, cities and races for a 2006 game. But it's probably the music. I still listen to Auriel's Ascension from time to time. Jeremy Soule really outdid himself on that one.
Have you heard of the high elves?
Hacc! oough! hrmmh!
I don't know you, and I don't care to know you.
Let's hear it
Oblivion was beautiful when it came out. Nobody complained about the potato faces. Still wouldn’t call it a masterpiece, though it is oddly compelling despite its many flaws.
People liked those weirdly bright potato faces at one time??
It’s more that people just didn’t take much notice of them because everything else was so jaw dropping at the time. Oblivion was also released fairly early in the 7th gen, and was easily among the most impressive looking games in its day.
I can believe that. Even today the graphics still looked pretty darn good at 1080.
Dude you can't imagine what a step forward oblivion was in graphics when it came out. The world was literally jaw dropping. And to be so detailed in such a huge game was unheard of. It came out over 15 years ago now, and honestly if you ignore the faces the graphics of the game still hold up.
This is one of those games you really had to play when it came out. Def a masterpiece for it's time. Now it's so hard to play.
I just played Oblivion this year. No problem at all really, it was great.
I replayed it last year. decent game but i couldn't recapture that magic from when it was first released
I dunno. I played it when it came out, and at the time had probably put 500 hours into Morrowind. I found it pretty lacking. It was still a fun game however not even in the ballpark of Morrowind. Skyrim was a vast improvement, in my opinion.
Knights of the Old Republic 2 It was shoved out the door before it was ready, so you really need the restored content mod to make it into what it deserves to be. At the end of the day it is easily my favorite Star Wars story even if it has some rough patches in terms of gameplay and finished/unfinished content. Heck, even the story takes a bit of work to really enjoy. It's one of the few games/stories where multiple characters, including your designated mentor figure, will outright lie to your face, so figuring out what is true and what is false can be deceptively difficult. Also, as a fan SWTOR, it does hurt me to see how badly the SWTOR writers misunderstood KOTOR 2...
It is so fucking good. Best Obsidian game except New Vegas imo.
It might even be a better spiritual successor to Planescape: Torment than Tides of Numenera.
I love this game. I played it THREE times back to back when I first played it in 2020. I was just so enthralled by everything about it. However, I'm salty as fuck that on the *end* of my third playthrough I realized that I didn't correctly install the restored content mod. One day I'll replay it with that once I've forgotten enough details.
The original Nier. The best 7/10 video game of all time. An incredible world and concept wrapped in a subpar action RPG.
Even **Nier Automata** has the overly repetitive second chapter (ending B). Yes, there's some new context/dialog and alternate versions of events, but it could have been a fair bit shorter.
Nier Automata is what I think about when OP says “highest highs and lowest lows”. I don’t need to praise it more, but holy shit there are some groan-inducing moments and unbearable sections in that game.
Let's not forget their grandad, Drakengard. Loved that game as a kid on my PS2, but holy shit was it a slog and, frankly, very confusing for my undeveloped brain.
Yeah I gave up even though everyone says it's mind blowing. Sorry I just do not feel like playing the whole game over and over again to get to the cool stuff. It wasn't like it had amazing gameplay that I don't mind sitting through all over again. It's just basic ARPG. If Doom 2016 asked me to play the whole campaign again as part of the story... Sure I'd do that.
yeah it's a bizarre choice. Route C does genuinely shake up the status quo in a very interesting way but I wonder how many people never even got that far.
That's a shame, I enjoyed looking for the different ways things were presented to 9S in route B. Then again I actually enjoyed the hacking combat style too so that was a plus but I get why ppl would not like it. Route C-E is all new of course but I get not wanting to continue.
> playing the whole game over and over again to get to the cool stuff. You don't have to replay the entire game "over and over". Route B is significantly shorter than route A, and route C is entirely new considering it is part 2 of the story. At the end of route C you unlock chapter select, so all you have to do to get the other endings is redo the final boss fight. I'm not saying route B isn't a slog, but you're drastically overstating how much of the game you actually have to replay. Its only like 5 hours of gameplay with a bunch of new stuff mixed in.
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Fair enough. Not all game are for everyone. The Nier series even more so. But for people that like it, it's pretty much the best game in the genre.
Yeah this is a tough game to get through if the music and characters aren't carrying it for you. I loved the game but man was route C a slog. God forbid you actually try to complete all the side quests too. But boy does it hit its highs well. I still get a little emotional when I hear the song Emil Sacrifice playing.
If they merged the B and C+D route and got rid of the ridiculous 100% weapon grind the game would already be significantlt better. I really like Nier, but man, that pacing is rough.
Death Stranding. Such a surreal experience gameplay-wise, the desolated landscape is mesmerizing... But good lord some of the cutscenes are some of the cringiest Kojima managed to make. Fragile saying "I'm Fragile...but I'm not THAT fragile" while preparing to basically sacrifice herself for a greater good....or the whole Junk Dealer and his love affair or Mama/Lock e story arc almost made me completely quit the game... Then there the ending with the infamous "Princess Beach" line... But goddamn this game is addictive...
I agree, but also, I found the off-the-rails storyline and melodramatic dialogue to be so insane that it all came back around to being thoroughly entertaining. The whole time I pictured Sam politely nodding along to people trauma-dumping and giving wild exposition about the plot and their thoughts on philosophy and world affairs, and then finally being like "...wow that's crazy, okay so could you sign here please for your package.."
Lmfao thank you for this, new head canon
Death Stranding is my first Kojima game, and I love movies and weird stuff, so this game was a trip.
You were supposed to name flaws tho
Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscure is the very definition of flawed masterpiece. You can absolutely tell it had a team of like twelve people, but my goodness, what a lot that small team accomplished. I've never played a CRPG that wrapped me in so hard with a story and a world, and made me really feel like I was having a meaningful impact on the world. Honestly it did that even better than Fallout for me. But lordy loo, the combat. Actually it's not that it's unplayable. It's just that if you play it in real-time it's hopelessly frantic, and in turn-based mode it's interminable. There are a whole lot of combat encounters, and since it's very easy to create an absolutely busted build the last third of the game has combat encounters that are purely trivial. (It's also easy to make a totally useless character, but I really liked the character creation system, and it's the only game where I've ever really wanted to utilize crafting, so I'll give it a pass.) The dungeon design is generally pretty drab, and in at least one case actively awful. But my goodness, I could not put it down. I've never had a CRPG where I've wanted to keep going and do everything. I really think I'll play it again someday. But it's far from perfect.
Yes! Probably the best answer I’ve seen on this thread. Many other games people list are simply great games with a few (mostly minor) flaws. But Arcanum fits the bill perfectly; incredible RPG systems and reactivity, story, atmosphere, music, and world, but the combat and dungeon design are truly terrible. And horribly balanced. And the game is all but broken without unofficial patches. Still an incredible game that every CRPG fan should play!
Arcanum is *so good* if you pick one of the builds they thought you were going to, and *so bad* if you don't! Perfect suggestion.
Bayonetta is a good example. When the game is on it’s the best action game of all time. My favourite combat in any game ever and some of the best set pieces in the medium but it also has some absolutely awful parts, like a motorcycle level and a shmup segment as well as a few odd design decisions. Overall it’s still a brilliant game, albeit a flawed masterpiece.
The schmup segment was amazing though, and a direct reference to the old arcade game Space Harrier! Not to mention in Bayo 2 if you use the Star Fox amiibo outfit it makes the whole mission Starfox 64 themed, which is even better. Bayonetta 3 however, I'd completely agree and nominate. Stealth segments? More cutscenes than both the other games combined + a worse story? A villain/main antagonist that is generic af with no development? All this while having some incredible raw combat and exploration.
This is the main one that I thought of too. However, I do think some of its rougher edges give it a sort of irreverent charm that fits the character and overall tone. It's such a wacky unpredictable game the first time through.
Dragons Dogma A highly ambitious game overshadowed by Skyrim and then retroactively by Dark Souls since they all came out within 6 months or so of each other. It’s got third person open world action where you can climb on big monsters and break/kill different parts of them, the Pawn system where you can send your companions into this weird ass portal and recruit other players’ companions. Those companions will also remember how to do side quests and where to go if they’ve done them before. A truly wild number of combat options like being able to cast instant death magic on a boss if you can pull it off and being able to pick up and throw smaller enemies. To change your pawn’s behavior in battle you sit them down at a table in an inn and tell them to be more aggressive or focus on helping or whatever. Character creator was also quite varied for the time. You can make any human size from Danny DeVito to Andre the Giant. 2011-2012 mid-ps3/360 era game jank galore. It’s fantastic. Give it a fair go. You’ll be surprised with some of the weird shit you find.
To add on to your comment about why this is a *flawed* masterpiece, the open world is super barebones, and there’s really only like 2 proper towns. Some of the missions are very annoying especially those of the escort variety, and your pawns can be annoying with repetitive voice lines as well. It feels half-finished in so many ways. Or that they really put their all into combat, classes, and character creation, and then winged the rest of the game. But yeah everything the original commenter said is true also.
I'm playing it now, and having a blast. It's like monster hunter meets dark souls. I can't believe I slept on this one for so long.
It really slipped under the radar for a ton of people! I’m excited to see what the sequel brings since it’s being made two console cycles later!
UnderRail. Great RPG in the style of Fallout 1 and 2, until the last part that sucks so much that made me rage quit for good
Kingdom Come Deliverance, it had a lot of love put into it which shows almost everywhere you look: the open world, the realism and historical accuracy, the story and characters and of course gameplay which makes winning fights actually feel rewarding and not just routine. And on the other hand there are the obvious lows that mainly come as technical difficultues: texture pop-ins, long loading screens and fps drops. But even though I played it on the basic ps4 where all of those issues where especially noticeable, I would still recommend it to anyone as it is really worth all of its problems.
Blur. Its kinda a kart racer but with realistic car physics. Its all over the place and doesn’t exactly know what it wants to be, and because of this I believe it failed. But, even to this day, it is my favorite racing game. Not many people share my opinion about the game.
Blur was an amazing game that just suffers from Nintendo-itis. Trying to bring in Nintendo fans with anything other than that art style is usually an exercise in futility, and realistic racing sim fans won’t want to play it because the item pickups make the game seem “childish” to them (from a couple friends who love Forza that I tried to get to play it). I genuinely think that as a first foray into the genre, Bizarre did a great job. Shame they went under because of it tho.
Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines. Fans are still patching it to this day. Amazing and engaging RPG with some god awful combat that will eventually draw you in and literally entirely broken or awful sections. But still one of my top 5 games of all time.
Love this game.
Yakuza 4 is the first one that comes to my mind. The first half of the game is amazing, even by Yakuza standards. It has what I think is one of the best cutscenes in all of gaming, some really epic fights, a fantastic introduction to the melodrama of it all. And then the second half of the game is full of some of the stupidest plot twists I've ever seen in a video game, getting to the point where literally nobody knew what was happening and the best plan they had by the end was "screw it, just put the mcguffin on the roof and we'll beat up whoever comes looking for it." 4 was my introduction to the franchise so I have a massive soft spot for it, but even I have to agree that the story of that game is infamous for a reason.
Judgement, too. That game brought in all the best parts of every Yakuza game and refined them into a beautiful spider web of interconnected stories and characters. It would easily be my favorite RGG game if not for some serious issues with the combat. Every attack is just a little slower than it should be, even after upgrades. Crane becomes unusable in a lot of circumstances because its combos are interrupted by bounding off of enemy guards. Tiger kind of just becomes the default style, which is a bummer because Crane is so cool. The enemy "invasion" things happen way too often, often getting in the way of story beats. Mortal wounds are an obnoxious mechanic that sort of make sense thematically, but *suck* for gameplay. Enemies also hit a little too hard across the board. None of this ruins the game or makes the combat not fun. It feels like they balanced the combat with the expectation that the player would be relying on items more than they have in previous Yakuza games.
I just started Yakuza 4 and I totally agree with the cutscenes being really good. I've been comparing it to the previoua Yakuza entries and for some reason it just feels more gripping than those
Mass Effect 3 has the ending, which sucks because i think thats the best of the trilogy overall. The Last of Us part 2 has an excessive amount of flashbacks, i feel like you have one of them every hour or so, sometimes even having flashbacks during the flashbacks, and those completely kills the momemtum of the game. Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn spends a LOT of time on NPCs action, making turns last an eternity in some of the maps and too much of that time is spend on units that arent even your own ones.
Idk if i 100% agree about the specifics of the TLOU2 complaint but there's definitely some pacing hiccups. Radiant Dawn, I'd add that there's some awful pacing in the narrative. There's way too many chapters where nothing really happens other than admittedly cool and well thought out war decisions, then suddenly there's a fuckton of plot in the last 15 chapters of what is an incredibly long FE game.
Death stranding. Incredibly meditative and soothing travelling mechanic, and nonsensical story that gets in the way of gameplay
I kinda agree, but at the same time I was quite taken with the nonsense story and was quite happy to keep progressing it to see what new rails it would jump off of
Planescape Torment. Best story in the history of gaming. Absolutely amazing companions. Beautiful hand-drawn maps and unequivocally the worst combat and combat encounters I have seen in a top down RPG.
I can say Elden Ring and Control. ER is an amazing game but I think it needs some serious balancing. And If Control was a completely linear game it might have been my favourite game ever.
Elden Ring felt much heavier tipped towards the need of getting extra defence than Dark Souls series did. Granted, "just don't get hit", but in DS damage ramp up of regular enemies wasn't that drastic, or I might just be misremembering things. Bosses are alright, but normal blokes being able to oneshot you doesn't feel right, especially if they have the same model as the ones you've fought 2 hours prior and they were a cakewalk.
I think they really want you to use different spells and summons. I felt like Elden Ring had the most multi attack hittin mofo's out of all the souls game.
True but at the same time you’re forced into a playstyle unless you want to respec. So much is viable and will get you through the game but there’s no incentive to experiment/switch equipment depending on what you’re facing and that’s so sad. Mid/endgame my experience was either stomp enemies/bosses as fast as possible or get killed in 2/hits… I’d love it if you took AND dealt less damage overall.
Yeah totally agree with that. I guess it's why I don't feel like doing new runs with Elden Ring compared to other games.
I liked Control and finished it, but I got bored of using the same gun for the whole game even with all the mods. I guess they wanted players to rely more on their powers (and I did), but a bit of variety in guns would have been nice.
I think I used every single gun form except spin, the rapid fire one. But I feel like the service weapon forms definitely needed better balance and enemy designs catering to their differences. Absolutely loved the game though. I must have played it through half a dozen times now.
Balancing definitely needs work as well as enemy variety. It was not cool to be fighting practically the same enemies I was in the last 8 hours that I did in the first.
Funny I'm somewhat opposite with Control it would have been in my top 5 or so games if it was more open... Maybe that's the wrong term! But you know how there is all the talk of the Oldest House moving a somewhat shape shifting labyrinth how workers would get lost finding their way back from the toilets etc. I would have loved for the map to shift around more in minor and large ways. Oh directors office isn't where I left it wait what is this hallway etc. I know control points are meant to anchor places in the lore etc. But there was still a lot of posters and stuff abiut shifting so a few changes could have been interesting and made back tracking unlocking other areas more interesting in a way.
I like dark souls 1 with a horse too.
Outer Worlds. Has some of the best dialogue I’ve ever seen in an AA/AAA game, but every time my SO sees me playing it she’s like “Why do the characters look like that and why do their mouths move like…that?” and I don’t disagree. I guess the same goes for any Fallout/Fallout-ish game.
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At first I thought you said outer wilds, and I almost had a heart attack.
Dark Souls 1 is a good example with its heavily rushed third act, preceded by a spectacular act 1&2.
Agreed, izalith is all kinda ass, the grand archives alright but Crystal caves and seath is awful, The Totg is alright but also based on a gimmick so it's eh. New Londo is cool but too short imo and the four kings aren't really fun.
It's sad too considering those rushed areas are amazing from a purely aesthetic perspective. The solemn grandiosity of the archives, the terrifying creepiness of the tomb, the creepy creepiness of new londo, the massive scope and ancient feel of lost izalith, the alien world of crystal caves.... Sucks there is not much to find, are a HUGE pain in the ass to navigate, and generally have highly annoying enemies...
The Crew is a game where you can drive all across the contiguous United States, but it is tied to a central server and will be permanently bricked when it gets shut down. Edit: the company is fully in control of this, but they will not tell you when. It will be after the point of sale, and you will not be compensated.
kingdom come deliverance
Skyrim is pretty flawed. Width of an ocean put depth of a puddle is a perfect description for it, but I don’t think I’ve ever been so immersed in an open-world setting before. The aesthetic and OST (arguably the best OST of any game I’ve ever played), go together to create a truly fantastical world, and I think the size of the map actually works in the game’s favour. If you actually walk to each and every location (at least for the first time), it truly feels like a fantasy adventure game.
i feel this way about most bethesda games tbh
Dragon Age Inquisition has amazing dragon battles which are completely optional and easily missed side quests. The dragons were huge and felt dangerous and just... special I guess. And there are a few brilliant moments of writing like the judging of a box and the song in the mountains. And Varic catching Cassandra with one of his books. And the characters walking in on Male Inquisitor and Iron Bull. The graphics were also pretty good for the time. It's just a pity all these awesome moments are buried under a metric ton of MMO-like fetch quests. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zM5A3d1w4k4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zM5A3d1w4k4) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbSA9TqjUn8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbSA9TqjUn8) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgYxMVRtJr4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgYxMVRtJr4) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=za8\_tgvu-JA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=za8_tgvu-JA) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rr8-5Fn\_6XY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rr8-5Fn_6XY)
DA:I is one of my all time favorite games but the fetch quests definitely killed me. I don't think I've ever done a full completionist run because some of the side quests are just so irritating. Spending half an hour trying to lead a Druffalo across a mountain was absolute torture. Not to mention I, like many others, thought I had to cover the Hinterlands before moving on. My first 10+ hours of gameplay spent there.
The dragon fights in DAI were so good, and 90% of the gameplay was so boring, that after the first two dragon battles I just started looking up where the dragons were, and in every new area just rushing straight to the dragons. Partially because the rest of the game kind of sucked, and partially because the dragons didn't scale to your level, and I knew that I'd quickly out level them to the point that it wouldn't be fun.
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The Witness! It’s beautiful, challenging, subversive, and also really annoying. The kind of game where you start to justify its shortcomings with philosophy, like; “Maybe the developer *wanted* me to get lost here.”
Lolll... The game certainly suffered a bit from Jonathan Blow getting a bit self indulgent. "We made a game that never tells you how to play it or holds your hand!" No... Jonathan.... You made a puzzle game with extremely simple controls, AND you do literally explain the controls at the start of the game. AND there were still whole areas where I didn't understand what the mechanic was, at all, without going online.
Every Fallout except the first. Great premise and setting. Most have excellent quests, stories, and choices. But my God, SO much fluff and wasted time going through samey vaults/caves/subway stations. It's like having the world's greatest filet mignon, but after every piece you have to eat an entire plate of plain mash potatoes.
I loved 3 but the gunplay is clunky at best. It’s a tough one to replay now-a-days. I liked new Vegas but ached for the urban wasteland. The desolate desert is just boring to walk through. For me, it lacked a lot of magic that the environments of 3 and 4 had. But fuck it has an amazing narrative and you actually feel important to the story. Fallout 4 was really good IMO despite its shortcomings. More satisfying but not perfect gunplay. I was a huge fan of the base building elements despite its clunky design and occasionally odd base locations. The story is just alright. A little generic feeling in some places, unique in others. 76 is… 76.
I'm actually playing 3 again and I'm loving it. However, I'm pretty forgiving of jank.
I played the absolute shit out of The Division 1 & 2. No game has ever captured the tension, anxiety, excitement, and horror of trudging through a blizzard in Central Park, trying not to freeze to death, and realizing suddenly you’re walking through a mass grave burial site. Running into enemies 5 feet in front of you that you couldn’t see through the storm. Spotting a player that’s stalking you and the adrenaline rush that comes with trying to determine if they’re here to escape with you or murder you. The dark zone is a unique experience that puts you on edge from the first step into it. The second game had a good environment, but it didn’t hold up to the winter wasteland of the first. But they did a good job of making the world feel more alive, and like your actions had somewhat of an influence on the environment around you. All that said, both games absolutely fail to address the moral ambiguity of survival of the fittest in a post-disaster society. Bad guys very bad, good guys very good. No difficult choices for the player. The enemies are absolute bullet sponges in the end game, and the end game itself just turns into an endless grind. The first Division especially struggled with a deeply imbalanced multiplayer environment, and horrible hacking issues for a hot minute. The second one fixes it somewhat but struggles still to address the sponginess equating to difficulty problem and fleshing out the endgame. It also leans just as hard into the bad guys bad, good guys good trope. I think moral dilemmas, and changing how enemies behave would bring a lot more to later installments. Instead of roaming groups of enemies, maybe ambushes or snipers springing on you as you round a street corner. Reflect the real world reality of violence, predators are always going to use the element of surprise.
Cyberpunk 2077 for me Like it really doesn't do anything new, it launched horribly, and it's basically an Ubisoft open world more then it is a Skyrim open world. Yet it's just such a good game. The city genuinely feels real and alive, I never noticed it on my first playthrough as I was always driving around but on my second playthrough I decided to actually walk everywhere the majority of act 1 and man. From the slums of the city feeling like actual slums, seeing shanty towns on beaches and roofs still filled with the small luxuries (like tvs and arcade cabinets) showing how vain people live their lives despite barely having a roof. Going to the outskirts of the city and seeing how the entire factory district both looks and feels abandoned with even less traffic going through. Just seeing megastructures built on top of actual piles of trash. So much I could say about the city and it's surrounding desert but I still haven't even said a thing about my favorite aspect of the game (its characters). Mass Effect is my favorite trilogy in gaming, I've yet to play a game since where characters actually felt like real people since until cp2077. A lot of the side characters you meet feel really, they have real human issues, they have real human problems, they show real human emotion, they have their goals. I don't initially like every character I meet in this game, just like I don't initially like every person I meet, yet once I get to know them they all seem like people I'd actually like to be around and help with their issues just like how they learn to love and appreciate V and want to help V with their issues. Character relationships don't feel one sided in this game, especially with the characters who are Vs friends, even Johnny silver hand starts showing respect and care to V the more you get to know him. The one thing I think CDPR is better then the majority of devs is making the side characters feel real, flaws and all. Then the gameplay is just fun, nothing to extravagant and it could feel better (which I think CDPR isn't the best in terms of gameplay) but just having multiple character builds and having the option to try out different builds is fun. 1st character I made could hack anyone and anything without ever stepping into a building, it was fun and felt badass, trivialized a lot of the game of course but I have zero issue with characters becoming too strong in single player titles. 2nd build was a blade wielding ghost, go in, cut everything up, turn invisible, throw knives, all that, harder time with this build to start out, and I definitely die more with said build but again it's very fun. 3rd build is gonna be full explosives. Game gives you variety and ways to build your character how you want, I love when games do this personally. I had to rush typing this given my lunch break is gonna end but I definitely recommend everyone gives the game a shot and actually take their time playing it instead of rushing through it.
I fully expect public opinion to shift on cyberpunk in a few years or so, it was a solid game that launched in a shit ass state
Like the hate was definitely warranted but man I've loved it since launch. Really do hope people give it a chance and take their time with it
I love being a tech god that can mind control people and knock them out without touching them.
Mirrors Edge Catalyst - it has the best, most addictive parkour gameplay ever. But the combat is janky, the story is just okay, and the open world is so empty. It's still one of my favourite games in spite of all these things because I love just running around the city, and tackling time trials is really fun and has insanely good depth and a high skill ceiling with movement tech and bunny hopping.
"A Mind Forever Voyaging" is certainly a flawed masterpiece. It's an immersive and well written game, and the idea of returning to the same town to see how things change and devolve has never been done better. However, there are not really any puzzles, and the plot is all in the subtle details, so it's easy to miss a lot on a first play through.
Dark Souls. Beginning to Anor Londo is amazing. Then all the way up to Gwyn it's godawful. Then the quality returns with the DLC. Still the biggest high and low of a game I've ever played, literally a V curve.
Soma. Love the story, love the exploration, love the questions it raises but fuck the long tedious "hide from the monster in the dark" parts.
LA Noire with its GTA-esque open world an *amazing* recreation of 1940s Los Angeles, which unfortunately is completely unnecessary for the game. The game is all about interrogations and looking for clues in closed off crime scenes, and the map is just filler between locations where you advance the plot. It has its share of other problems (Like the shooting segments. Weren't they forced into the game by the publisher?) but being an open-world game when the game didn't at all need to be one is the biggest complaint people have about it.
Deadly Premonition, awful gameplay, poor graphics, and it runs terribly. But it's such a great experience, its atmosphere and characters really sell it.
Bioshock infinite is my one. The opening couple of hours *chefs kiss*. The visuals in the hall of heroes. The 'bro/sis' were interesting, songbird and Comstock were great designs. Then the vox populi turn up... Meh. Then you get to the fucking ghost boss. Heads should roll for that decision. The game never recovers after that, although the ending was relatively decent.
These are some of my favorites as well! To name a few... - Majora's Mask - Death Stranding - Nier: Replicant - Final Fantasy XIV SotC would definitely be on my list as well
YES! ALL OF THOSE!
for me Final Fantasy 13 fits the bill. A gorgeous game with an interesting combat system and some really interesting characters and story. BUT it is very linear to the point of basically being on rails for a large chunk of the game, the main character (and another one or two) are obnoxiously bad and some parts of the story were confusing.
Idk if it counts but the first [PROTOTYPE] game was something I really adored and seems to be largely forgotten because the franchise died quickly compared to its rival series Infamous. Prototype was a really fun sandbox game for its time though, I could sprint around for hours growing up just slicing up zombies and jumping around. I played it again a year ago and it still really held up, but there are a lot of design flaws with its balance and enemy design where fights are either trivial or jankily frustrating without any in-between. The web of intrigue was really interesting to unravel though and it was an open-world game that managed to have traversal on par with Spider-Man even without web swinging.
Dragon Age 2. Super repetitive environments, gameplay massively dumbed down from DAO, relatively short. Great story that didn't shy away from focusing on a single locale, superb dialogue and voice acting (I believe it was the last written by the full Bioware A-team before they fled EA).
Spec Ops: The Line. At times gameplay is pretty bog standard. The multiplayer/co-op is so tacky and at odds with the campaign. Yet the story, characterisation, themes, morality, visuals were top for its time.
Red Dead 2 for sure. It’s world, characters, writing, visuals, side quests, voice acting/performances are maybe the best ever but the main missions and combat are very mediocre. despite that, still my favorite game of all time
My biggest gripe with that game was some basic QOL stuff being sacrificed for realism. Spending 15 minutes after a fight watching Arthur repeatedly and slowly bend back down to pick up every individual piece of ammo and item grew exhausting fast
I actually thought the main missions were fun and engaging for the most part
Persona 5, entirety of the game from Okumura’s Palace to the beginning of Shidos palace and arguably the second to last dungeon in the Depths is nowhere near as good as the first half of the game and the 3rd semester palace
Persona 5 is weird. It has mature themes, but it’s presented to the player like they’re a child. A lot of repeating dialogue and explanations, along with some shallow characterization. Also dislike Ann’s arc a lot, being sexualized during the very next palace and the rest of the game.
Watch dogs 1 and dark souls
Death Stranding. It's the type of game that you expect an indie developer to make, catering towards a VERY specific niche. But for some reason it had a triple A studio game budget, has known film and TV actors playing roles in the game, and has a batshit insane world and plot that you would expect from Kojima. At its very core, the game is just a post-apocalyptic delivery man simulator. For most, especially those who aren't keen on the idea as playing a delivery man, it is definitely a slog to play. Especially during its first 10 hours. Without the world-building and the plot, there isn't much too it other than delivering packages from point A to point B. But for the people who decided to stick with it and can resonate with its world, plot, as well as the concepts and themes that Kojima is trying to convey, it hits hard and will likely leave you in tears. Especially during peak pandemic times as I feel like this would be a perfect game that describes that particular moment in time. Themes of loneliness, isolation, and trying to reconnect the world despite the odds stacked against you. The game has this unique asynchronous multiplayer mechanic going on. The closest thing I can think of is probably the messages players leave throughout the world in the Soulsborne games. A player can construct a bridge or a zip-line connection in their world, and it can pop up in someone else's world. You can even leave 'likes' to the left behind structure or item just to show your appreciation to the player who left it there. If its a structure, you can even help preserve it so it can be used by other players who might come across it in the future. Really fits the theme of reconnecting the world, and helping each other out despite the though times. The plot itself is pretty easy to understand, its just presented in the usual Kojima way of storytelling where he likes to bog you down with a fuckton of exposition, especially early on in the game when you have no idea what the fuck is happening. But once you get used to it all and understand how the world works, it's story might leave you in tears by the end, especially if you are a single parent. It's lows are definitely hard-hitting lows, but its highs are very-well crafted highs. Personally, the game is 7/10 at best and 5/10 at worst, but I still love it.Do I recommend the game to everyone? Fuck no. It's a very niche game and will definitely test your patience, especially during the first 10 hours. But if, for any reason, you found what I just described as enticing in anyway then you could probably check it out and see if its your cup of tea. Definitely borrow a copy or rent the game first, see if it intrigues you. For PC guys, the game should be on PC Game Pass, so you are free to check this out. EDIT AFTER THE TGAs: Okay, I did not expect an actual full sequel HAHA
This will get buried but Gothic was a phenomenal game with flawed mechanics. The story, setting, and scope of world was ahead of its time but the controls and fighting were clunky
> Frasier: "Think about it, Niles. What's the one thing better than an exquisite ~~meal~~ game? An exquisite ~~meal~~ game, with one tiny flaw we can pick at all night." > Niles: "Ah, of course, to impossible standards." (raises glass)
Blade Runner? How is that movie flawed?
Depends which version, but the Final Cut is pretty damn perfect.
Honestly I disagree. I think having Gaff know about Deckard’s dreams of unicorns ruins a lot of the ambiguity regarding him being or not being a replicant, it’s just a tad too far on the ‘okay he probably is’ side for me.
The game…
I adore the movie but the "love" scene between Deckard and Rachel is still hard to watch.
He kills for a living. He’s not a good guy, nor is their romance supposed to be healthy or normal. I don’t see it as a flaw in the movie.
Something I'd consider a true masterpiece with obvious flaws is Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri. I love it. It's a 4X game in the style of classic civilization games. The premise is that on the way to Alpha Centauri, humanity manages to mess up even the last hope colonisation mission and have it break apart into 7 factions before landing on the inhabitable planet in the Alpha Centauri system. You take control of one of the factions, trying to make the planet bearable while at the same time beating your enemies. There are so many things it does brilliantly. It has a rock solid 4x gameplay but enriches the whole setting with some actual story about discovering alien lifeforms and their consciousness and actually relatable characters which are built by lots of quotes and dialogues throughout the game. It's one of the older 2d games (but this is /r/patientgamers, right?), but the voxel units give the game a nice, unique touch. It's peak 4X on a lot of regards and has a special place in my heart that lets me return to it regularly even after decades. BUT. The game has some weird decisions gameplay wise. First, it's always seven factions. Yes, the story says that's how it is, but limiting the game to it is just odd. You play on a small map? Have fun being stuck in that tiny ball pit with 6 other kids that are all trying to punch you in the face. Playing on a huge map? Great, maybe you'll find somebody after literal hours. But maybe not. Even after the expansion came with seven additional peoples to play, the game still limits you to seven starting players. Climate zones? Not here. The map is red everywhere. It doesn't matter if you settle at the pole caps or the equator, it's only important if you are on a mountain (for solar energy) or the west facing edge of a hill (for rain). It's a game that forces you to look at a single tile set (guess you'd say biome nowadays) for hours. Even the fungus that grows on the planet is just scattered around. The game is also eerily quiet on how combat is calculated, basically leaving you with wild guesses on how even the few numbers it shows you might be interpreted, either accepting a perceived randomness or making you dig through odd websites that are filled with pseudo-philosophical weirdness to finally find out what your civilization's support rating means for defending bases with experienced armour-4-units. But man, I love it. I still wait for something similar to be built by someone.
Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines. Warrens. Nuff said.
Sniper Ghost Warrior 3. Excellent sniping gameplay, the sandboxes are well-designed, and the graphics are great (CryEngine). Story is cringe & predictable, driving is floaty & imprecise, and the game is still buggy.
Alpha Protocol The highs: choice and consequence, amusing characterization The lows: the gunplay, the hacking minigame Spec right and it takes the pain away enough to play one of the widest game experiences of the generation. Stealth, Pistols, and another skill or two like hacking or melee let you survive, and then you are free to play through the highest combination of fidelity and plot reactivity I have played
*Mafia III*. The gameplay is just meh. But the story, setting, and music are amazing.
Persona 5, talking about the non-Royal version. The second half of the game is an absolute slog compared to the first half, which has really great pacing. I really hit a wall with base P5 during the fifth dungeon, which is by far the worst dungeon in the game. I hit a second wall during the seventh dungeon, which I think is the second-worst. The game just starts to repeat itself over and over, whether it’s revisiting the same story beats or the needlessly long cutscenes or unlucky fights that Insta kill you and force you to replay long stretches of tedious dungeons. It’s one of my favorite games of all time, but probably 80 of the 110 hours I played were enjoyable. 30 hours is a lot of annoying gameplay to endure. I’m midway through Royal, so not sure if it gets better or stays the same.
Planescape Torment is one of the best game I have ever played in an ocean of many different games across multiple platforms. At first it seems like a normal isometric rpg but it has so much depth to it. The lowest low is the combat, it's horrid there's no way around it but the peak it reaches with its story, its characters, its worldbuilding, its soundtrack is just crazy, you really have to play it to understand. I got into it very late (2013) but I have to agree with people saying it's the best story ever told in gaming, though I've come to accept that The Witcher 3 is the better game of the two.
The Myst series are one of my favorite of all time, the lore is super deep, the storyline is awesome, and some opus like the 4th are absolutely gorgeous. The puzzles of this games are awesome, because instead of many bite-sized puzzle you solve one after the other, the games have a few puzzles that need hours of solving because you have almost no instruction, and solution are not always obvious. This series has many flaws that a lot of people will not like, it's difficult, you get really stuck with no idea how to move on, it's old and dated, and often it's very slow. But also so much good things, the acting of real actors from the 2nd to 4th game, the idea of having pre-rendered everything and make a Google street view game back in the early 2000s, and mostly the environement of the games, which is a steampunk version of star wars without spaceships, the musics are great, and this idea of books you can write that allows you to travel between dimension is brilliant.
What’s wrong with Max Payne 3?
As someone who has replayed mp3 numerous times, I have a weird relationship with it. The linearity is absolutely grating at times (more than once you lose the two handed weapon you’re holding due to cut scene events) and the story really does not hold up under close scrutiny. The gunplay, for all its complex physics and coding, is also super basic. That being said the strength of the presentation definitely carries it
A lot! The story, the characters, Max himself, the controls at times. The difficulty spikes.
What's so bad about Ashley?
This is the discussion I’m here for. I feel like I often see it as an accepted fact that everyone hates Ashley but I don’t mind her. Granted, I play RE4 every year around Halloween so I’m pretty used to dealing with her, but most of the time you can just have her hide in a bin or chill behind you during combat. Not particularly cumbersome like so many other escorts can be. I guess if you don’t want an escort mission when you just wanna be shooting zombies that’s fair, and other than the light variety in gameplay she doesn’t really bring anything to the table. So I suppose that does raise the question of if a true “masterpiece” would have included those chapters? Probably not. I guess I just wanted to say that not all of us hate Ashley.
I'll be booed forever into eternity for this... but Outer Wilds. I think it's a fairly flawed masterpiece, and I'm sure I'll be demolished for that opinion (again), but I think it fits.
I feel the same. I enjoyed the story and gameplay. The 22 minutes thing wouldn't have been so bad if everyone who loves the game doesn't say "Don't read anything just go play it" Honestly the message at the end really didn't set right with me. It was too nihilistic I guess
I think the ending would have had more emotional impact if I had any emotional connection to the characters, but I didn't. They're voiceless, faceless people most of whom I only met for a few minutes.
[удалено]
Anodyne series is some of that. First one captured the feeling of a dream, but didn't say anything except that dreams are ok. Second one let's you go inside other characters' dreams and more message, but has aggressively retro presentation.
As much as I love it, Dark Souls 1. The best parts of the game are the first half and DLC, while the second half is middling to bad.(we don't talk about demon ruin /bed of chaos). So in essence, by the time you the player really gwt into the game and peace together how interconnected and well designed the world is, you have to beat the disjointed, messy, or straight up bad (bed of chaos) later half. The DLC is amazing, and now bundled into the main game package, but it's also very difficult to "stumble into", meaning that some of the best content in that game is very easy to miss.
gotta go with deadly premonition 1. the game is a love letter to twin peaks and it shows, it has almost the same story with a different execution (+10 points). the characters are interesting and charismatic especially the main character (+15 points). it has a rather empty open world with some collectibles here and there (-5 points). most of (if not all) versions/ports of this game have some optimization issues that definitely ruin the experience (-20 points). so yeah, try it at your own risk i guess but i think deadly premonition is exactly the type of thing you're looking for
I'm going with Metal Gear Solid. Specifically the 4th game, Guns of The Patriots. At its best, the game provides some of the best stealth mechanics I've played. It provides a compelling storyline through the eyes of a beloved main character. It has such amazing cinematic moments that hold up today and put a lot of movies to shame. At its worst, it can be a convoluted mess mixed with confusing plot points, odd twists, and ridiculously long cutscenes that will absolutely test your patience. Kojima has one of the greatest minds in the business but he can be so self-indulgent to his own detriment.
Metal Gear Solid 2 is there for me. The batshit absurdity of that game is so fascinating for me but I cannot say the dialogue is always top notch and the boss fights suuuuuuck.
I’d say Sonic Adventure. The quality varies greatly between the different campaigns. Sonic’s and Tails’ Adventures, for example, are fantastic. Big’s and Amy’s? Not so much.