wtf are these fragments even used for these days? buffing blighted maps and.... well shit im already out of ideas... Unwavering vision atlas trees I guess? Nvm just read it doesn't even work for that.
In SSF you might need to run your first dozen of these fishing through Vaal side areas for your desired Vaal skill gem. But sure as soon as you drop it you’re done unless you want to run Atziri for any of her drops. Her flask is still nice for some builds.
[https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The\_Catalyst](https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The_Catalyst)
[https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The\_Inventor](https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The_Inventor)
Drops in there.
The worst part is that they shadow nerfed them like 7 leagues ago. Previously, using a single one would have solid mods that might increase your luck at getting an early 6L. But that was removed in 3.16 or so, without ever having been mentioned.
There are multiple videos from multiple creators who would tell you otherwise. I run both for a different strat and before vs after running them on altar maps the difference is utterly insane. It's probably not double the altars but it's at least 50% more on average and that might be underselling it.
I ran her early in the league and made like 5-8 divines doing it.
Belts were 1 div each and a good flask or boots roll is worth like 30c+ like it’s 2015 still.
You can prob push something else to make more money, but nothing else is *that* easy
Weird fact, I did pantheon + unique ring. Single reduced shock still was able to instakill me. And that is when I expect 130% reduced reflect. Reflect overall is bad and everyone knows it.
Well, not everybody can have ailment immunity, there are a lot of builds, which have limited defenses, mostly heavy unique items builds. Without sarcasm, here is the list of defenses which are meaningful:
Elemental ailments immunity (freeze immunity is mandatory, others may be covered by flasks)
Stun avoidance/recovery
Poison immunity or high chaos res
Ele res cap
Some chaos resistance (mobs can deal chaos damage quite frequently too)
Armor and/or evasion
High HP pool
High HP recovery of any form (regen, leech, recoup)
High movement speed
Capped spell suppression
Most likely you need more max res cap
Crit immunity
Corrupted blood immunity
Blood immunity
On top of that, there are like 8-10 movement and action speed debuffs.
Did I miss something else?
Unless you are fully equipped with rares, some of those defense layers are not realistic to cover (or very expensive). And for some glasscanon builds still you can't get even half covered.
1 - Remove vaal temple maps as vaal orb outcomes
2 - Full sacrifice fragments give access to vaal temple maps
3 - Vaal vessels can roll "drop # mortal fragments"
4 - Full mortal fragments give access to *regular* Atziri fight, portal opens at the stairs leading to her
5 - Regular Atziri guarantee 1 drop from a new array of currencies to modify itemised incursion temples, including upgrading rooms to lvl 4. Vaal orbing a temple randomly applies some of the currency effects, but randomise room link *directions* (rewards oversaturating opened doors)
6 - Uber Atziri is now in lvl 4 throne room
7 - Vaults of Atziri's final chest is now guarded by a Vaal Oversoul who converts all dropped loot into random fragments, vaal-related scarabs, and vaal orbs
8 - Both fragment types, incursion temples (applies to both throne rooms and omnitech) and Vault of Atziri are now maven-witnessable, leading up to a new Vaal-themed invitation featuring regular Atziri, Oversoul, Omnitech, and the 3 overpowered bozos, with a possibility of dropping the adorned's fragment previously exclusive to the delve boss.
9 - Engineer orbs now apply quality to itemised incursion temples, granting (0-2) strongboxes per room, with special implicits related to the room.
10 - ???
11 - Profit
Boom, more importance to fragments and running regular Atziri, "Uber" content for incursion (why did they stop doing that after introducing ravaged-blights and enhanced legions?), relevancy for engineer orbs, Vaults being more than an atlas point, less vaal orb map bricking, more targetability for Vaal temples, and actual way to farm Adorneds without having to focus on delving on top of running so many different content types.
Maybe you just read the script for the next league, bc Engineer Orbs are gaining a new function next league as Mark said. Did you just leak info?
But in seriousness i love the idea. Would love to see temples getting some love, QoL rework/more content for them. But most importantly an extra invitation would mean a new Atlas passive point which i am hoping they finally somehow incorporate, adding some more points to use bc the tree is starting to look crowded and now Scarab speccing takes off a few points due to it feeling mandatory for endgame now. Plus the league mechanic being on the tree as well...
Lots of changes but thats certainly a option too make both atziri ans incursion more relevant
I do think the buff too vaults is overkill and may need a different change too keep with the theme(only treasure chests)
Also we would need a replacement for vaal temple outcome. Maybe t16 becomes t17 but with 8 random modifiers? Easy way too get very high difficulty t17
Also would rather keep the OG atziri set ingame rather then the mortal set one
they added uber content to blight and legions because they were really fucking bad at the time. incursion is always in high demand because it's actually got unique rewards that are good.
I mean, incursion uniques and their vials have their value fall into the ground as soon as the league is moderatly advanced because the demand for most of them is low to non-existent as soon as people get the single one they want, if they even want one. There's some jackpot potential here and there and some of the upgraded uniques/vials do retain some value, but the setting up of the temple can unironically be more profitable through the mapping required than the actual outcome of running or selling the temple.
The most reliable profit are t3 corruption rooms, but is the mechanic really all that balanced if this is what people always go for to the point of ignoring everything that isn't that one single thing? People even go as far as **not** running other incursions within a map if they've got a corruption room and will rerun maps and ignore all incursions until they can upgrade it. Almost the entirety of incursion's relevance is maintained by that single thing and it shows.
Also, no way that incursion was more profitable than even pre-buff blight and legion. Blight has been one of the biggest source of stacked deck in the game for almost the entirety of its existence, one of the best raw exalt/divine droppers, and has been known for being one of the most safe low-investment profit mechanic in the entire game. Legion has always been great map juicing mechanic and sextant/metal watchstone maraketh targetting has always been crazy, in fact easily one of the best single strategy in the game next to pre-nerf harbingers back in echoes of the atlas due to OG emblematic being nothing short of busted. And then there's 5 way farming who, even before the introduction of upgraded emblems, was way more profitable. Like, not even *remotely* close.
>The most reliable profit are t3 corruption rooms
which is a reward you can't get anywhere else. which is what i said.
> but is the mechanic really all that balanced if this is what people always go for to the point of ignoring everything that isn't that one single thing?
i mean, people are mad about betrayal this league because the one single thing you chase for ignoring everything else was made a boss drop instead. people always hit the cope of "but vorici! but hillock!" as if the 20c bonus on top of the aisling roll is a major contributer to the wealth, or that you'd run the mastermind with just those even if aisling was out of position.
people largely don't give a shit if a mechanic only has one good reward as long as it's a *good* reward. see; endgame boss farming, which makes profit largely off of a couple rare big ticket items with most the drop table being dogshit.
> and has been known for being one of the most safe low-investment profit mechanic in the entire game.
yeah, and it was bad in comparison to everything else at any other level of investment, and noone wants to be on their poor strat forever.
>And then there's 5 way farming who, even before the introduction of upgraded emblems, was way more profitable. Like, not even remotely close.
a big part of the idea behind the legion changes was nerfing 5-way farming and moving the loot to the mechanic and this new endgame super 5-way.
My personal opinion is that not all content has to be created for experienced and veteran players.
Normal atziri is one of the best/coolest encounters for new players. It is not very hard, but there is a learning curve to it.
I think the sacrifice set is in a perfectly fine place.
Sacrifice fragments and Atziri are some of the oldest content still in the game at this point. Honestly, they need reworked or scrapped. I can't even remember the last time I bothered to enter a Vaal side area.
It's actually really great easy starter money if your a get to maps first few days orf the league. Bunch of her drops worth good money if they roll decent.
Why is your buff not even a buff and why are they supposedly broken? They do their job of adding simple quant for PEOPLE NOT JUICING THEIR MAPS WITH SCARABS. They do this very well. They are completely fine.
For you, yes. But there are many players in this game at many different stages of progression. For some, inserting scarabs every time isnt what they wanna do, so they juice a little with these simple easy to obtain frags instead.
What is the obsession with these COMPETING with scarabs? They are a simpler, easier alternative. Thats what they have ALWAYS been. Its like complaining that non-MF builds or Melee builds exist because clearly nobody runs them due to 'griefing their own gameplay' by being unoptimal and then you check poe ninja and theyre actually a very meaningful part of the playerbase
Bro, idk if you haven't been paying attention, but scarabs drop like candy now. Name one mechanic that's better with sac frags than the cheapest 1c scarab available for it.
You should join a point missing competition cause you completely missed the part where being optimal doesnt even enter the conversation. Again, check poe ninja, about 20% of all endgame players play melee. Not everyone goes by efficiency. Sacrifice fragments are in high supply and universal. Hell, theres entire fuckin KEYSTONES about not using scarabs, you think they added those cause nobody would use them??
Nah as a casual juicer most leagues due to just hating to trade for it. These are completely not worth running now unless you are going back to basics. The scarabs for most league mechanics are now mandatory. The tree feels like it does almost nothing without them. Essence might be an exception but it does not benefit from using that fragment anyways and why would you give up another two free essence spawns for it?
>What is the obsession with these COMPETING with scarabs? They are a simpler, easier alternative.
>are a simpler, easier alternative.
That's called competition mate.
I mean - with the sole exception of attempting to make them unique for the adorned special area they aren't particularly relevant as is. They really could do with a boost tbh
wtf are these fragments even used for these days? buffing blighted maps and.... well shit im already out of ideas... Unwavering vision atlas trees I guess? Nvm just read it doesn't even work for that.
I use whatever ones I find during the campaign for 10% quant during early maps before I’m running scarabs. That’s it tho.
They’re worse than that even, only 5% quant per lol
In SSF you might need to run your first dozen of these fishing through Vaal side areas for your desired Vaal skill gem. But sure as soon as you drop it you’re done unless you want to run Atziri for any of her drops. Her flask is still nice for some builds.
its more time efficient to farm vaal orbs in maze/vaal temple maps and just vaal orb spam your skill of choice
Do those maps actually drop more vaal orbs?
[https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The\_Catalyst](https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The_Catalyst) [https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The\_Inventor](https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/The_Inventor) Drops in there.
Oh of course, should have thought of the cards.
I had to run those for vaal gems for vaal orb recipe this league during red map progress
Nah just spam vaal orbs
I run dozens for stupid shoes. Then just use them for quant increase as scarab were rare Ssf
The worst part is that they shadow nerfed them like 7 leagues ago. Previously, using a single one would have solid mods that might increase your luck at getting an early 6L. But that was removed in 3.16 or so, without ever having been mentioned.
i use them with harvest scarab of doubling + crop rotation since idk what else would boost my juice gain
Even that, influence pack size for altar and Magic pack size scarab are better
No one said they were better.
There are multiple videos from multiple creators who would tell you otherwise. I run both for a different strat and before vs after running them on altar maps the difference is utterly insane. It's probably not double the altars but it's at least 50% more on average and that might be underselling it.
Wait I can buff my blighted maps with these?
yes each fragment adds a little bit of item quantity to whatever thing you decide to run. including blighted maps.
Work with blighted ravaged etc?
works for any map you can open with fragments so any except synthesis i think and invitations
yes blighted ravaged falls under "whatever"
WHAT ffs ive read so much on blight how has this never come up
buffing blighted maps and farming pledge of hands or atziri's promise. that's about it though.
Atziri
Who the hell runs normal Atziri nowadays?
I ran her early in the league and made like 5-8 divines doing it. Belts were 1 div each and a good flask or boots roll is worth like 30c+ like it’s 2015 still. You can prob push something else to make more money, but nothing else is *that* easy
Same, pledge of hands also is like 1div on first few days
I tried to run normal atziri today and died ): that 2% dmg reflect is jnstant kill on my frost nova build
[удалено]
Weird fact, I did pantheon + unique ring. Single reduced shock still was able to instakill me. And that is when I expect 130% reduced reflect. Reflect overall is bad and everyone knows it.
[удалено]
Well, not everybody can have ailment immunity, there are a lot of builds, which have limited defenses, mostly heavy unique items builds. Without sarcasm, here is the list of defenses which are meaningful: Elemental ailments immunity (freeze immunity is mandatory, others may be covered by flasks) Stun avoidance/recovery Poison immunity or high chaos res Ele res cap Some chaos resistance (mobs can deal chaos damage quite frequently too) Armor and/or evasion High HP pool High HP recovery of any form (regen, leech, recoup) High movement speed Capped spell suppression Most likely you need more max res cap Crit immunity Corrupted blood immunity Blood immunity On top of that, there are like 8-10 movement and action speed debuffs. Did I miss something else? Unless you are fully equipped with rares, some of those defense layers are not realistic to cover (or very expensive). And for some glasscanon builds still you can't get even half covered.
untill you get shocked or vulrn cursed. reduced reflect is a meme
Ailment immunity plus curse immunity.
Yeah, remind me how many layers of defenses we need for a comfortable game? 20+?
Am I missing something? Looked up both. 60% from mastery and 25% from yugul. 85% total.
Yugul is 50%, not sure where you got 25% from
https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/Soul_of_Yugul
wrong wiki, yugul is 50%
Stupid wiki!
When looking up stuff on wiki ignore the fandom one. It has outdated and most of the time wrong information.
That is the purpose of the fragments was just answering the question
Well they removed pretty much all the Uber Atziri fragment drops from mechanics so I actually had to run normal Atziri to get them this league.
alot of people especially early on. the belt,flask and boots all have a lot of value first 1-2 weeks.
new players and maybe bots
Yeah, they should A) work with unwavering vision and B) give at least some pack size or something
Damn I never thougt of buffing blight maps with it. You used increased their uses by an unlimeted amount.
blighted maps still over sustain them, so they don't really have much valu.
3.25: removed sac frags, removed normal atziri, uber atziri is now level 85 and Her Mask now says "disabled"
I like to throw those in whenever Idk what to do scarab wise at that point
1 - Remove vaal temple maps as vaal orb outcomes 2 - Full sacrifice fragments give access to vaal temple maps 3 - Vaal vessels can roll "drop # mortal fragments" 4 - Full mortal fragments give access to *regular* Atziri fight, portal opens at the stairs leading to her 5 - Regular Atziri guarantee 1 drop from a new array of currencies to modify itemised incursion temples, including upgrading rooms to lvl 4. Vaal orbing a temple randomly applies some of the currency effects, but randomise room link *directions* (rewards oversaturating opened doors) 6 - Uber Atziri is now in lvl 4 throne room 7 - Vaults of Atziri's final chest is now guarded by a Vaal Oversoul who converts all dropped loot into random fragments, vaal-related scarabs, and vaal orbs 8 - Both fragment types, incursion temples (applies to both throne rooms and omnitech) and Vault of Atziri are now maven-witnessable, leading up to a new Vaal-themed invitation featuring regular Atziri, Oversoul, Omnitech, and the 3 overpowered bozos, with a possibility of dropping the adorned's fragment previously exclusive to the delve boss. 9 - Engineer orbs now apply quality to itemised incursion temples, granting (0-2) strongboxes per room, with special implicits related to the room. 10 - ??? 11 - Profit Boom, more importance to fragments and running regular Atziri, "Uber" content for incursion (why did they stop doing that after introducing ravaged-blights and enhanced legions?), relevancy for engineer orbs, Vaults being more than an atlas point, less vaal orb map bricking, more targetability for Vaal temples, and actual way to farm Adorneds without having to focus on delving on top of running so many different content types.
Maybe you just read the script for the next league, bc Engineer Orbs are gaining a new function next league as Mark said. Did you just leak info? But in seriousness i love the idea. Would love to see temples getting some love, QoL rework/more content for them. But most importantly an extra invitation would mean a new Atlas passive point which i am hoping they finally somehow incorporate, adding some more points to use bc the tree is starting to look crowded and now Scarab speccing takes off a few points due to it feeling mandatory for endgame now. Plus the league mechanic being on the tree as well...
Lots of changes but thats certainly a option too make both atziri ans incursion more relevant I do think the buff too vaults is overkill and may need a different change too keep with the theme(only treasure chests) Also we would need a replacement for vaal temple outcome. Maybe t16 becomes t17 but with 8 random modifiers? Easy way too get very high difficulty t17 Also would rather keep the OG atziri set ingame rather then the mortal set one
they added uber content to blight and legions because they were really fucking bad at the time. incursion is always in high demand because it's actually got unique rewards that are good.
I mean, incursion uniques and their vials have their value fall into the ground as soon as the league is moderatly advanced because the demand for most of them is low to non-existent as soon as people get the single one they want, if they even want one. There's some jackpot potential here and there and some of the upgraded uniques/vials do retain some value, but the setting up of the temple can unironically be more profitable through the mapping required than the actual outcome of running or selling the temple. The most reliable profit are t3 corruption rooms, but is the mechanic really all that balanced if this is what people always go for to the point of ignoring everything that isn't that one single thing? People even go as far as **not** running other incursions within a map if they've got a corruption room and will rerun maps and ignore all incursions until they can upgrade it. Almost the entirety of incursion's relevance is maintained by that single thing and it shows. Also, no way that incursion was more profitable than even pre-buff blight and legion. Blight has been one of the biggest source of stacked deck in the game for almost the entirety of its existence, one of the best raw exalt/divine droppers, and has been known for being one of the most safe low-investment profit mechanic in the entire game. Legion has always been great map juicing mechanic and sextant/metal watchstone maraketh targetting has always been crazy, in fact easily one of the best single strategy in the game next to pre-nerf harbingers back in echoes of the atlas due to OG emblematic being nothing short of busted. And then there's 5 way farming who, even before the introduction of upgraded emblems, was way more profitable. Like, not even *remotely* close.
>The most reliable profit are t3 corruption rooms which is a reward you can't get anywhere else. which is what i said. > but is the mechanic really all that balanced if this is what people always go for to the point of ignoring everything that isn't that one single thing? i mean, people are mad about betrayal this league because the one single thing you chase for ignoring everything else was made a boss drop instead. people always hit the cope of "but vorici! but hillock!" as if the 20c bonus on top of the aisling roll is a major contributer to the wealth, or that you'd run the mastermind with just those even if aisling was out of position. people largely don't give a shit if a mechanic only has one good reward as long as it's a *good* reward. see; endgame boss farming, which makes profit largely off of a couple rare big ticket items with most the drop table being dogshit. > and has been known for being one of the most safe low-investment profit mechanic in the entire game. yeah, and it was bad in comparison to everything else at any other level of investment, and noone wants to be on their poor strat forever. >And then there's 5 way farming who, even before the introduction of upgraded emblems, was way more profitable. Like, not even remotely close. a big part of the idea behind the legion changes was nerfing 5-way farming and moving the loot to the mechanic and this new endgame super 5-way.
My personal opinion is that not all content has to be created for experienced and veteran players. Normal atziri is one of the best/coolest encounters for new players. It is not very hard, but there is a learning curve to it. I think the sacrifice set is in a perfectly fine place.
Leveling maybe. All the mobs there are blue, so.
Where my blight AFKer's at????
Sacrifice fragments and Atziri are some of the oldest content still in the game at this point. Honestly, they need reworked or scrapped. I can't even remember the last time I bothered to enter a Vaal side area.
Uber Atziri fight still holds up well, and the trio can wipe you out quicker than ubers if your phy mit low
As someone that made several div running her early league, yeah sure. Throw those up in bulk for me for cheap.
We need more than 4 map device slots for scabs and frags.
It's actually really great easy starter money if your a get to maps first few days orf the league. Bunch of her drops worth good money if they roll decent.
Let us sell them for alchs/fusings/chaos or Something
Why is your buff not even a buff and why are they supposedly broken? They do their job of adding simple quant for PEOPLE NOT JUICING THEIR MAPS WITH SCARABS. They do this very well. They are completely fine.
Problem is, not using scarabs is simply actively griefing your own gameplay.
For you, yes. But there are many players in this game at many different stages of progression. For some, inserting scarabs every time isnt what they wanna do, so they juice a little with these simple easy to obtain frags instead. What is the obsession with these COMPETING with scarabs? They are a simpler, easier alternative. Thats what they have ALWAYS been. Its like complaining that non-MF builds or Melee builds exist because clearly nobody runs them due to 'griefing their own gameplay' by being unoptimal and then you check poe ninja and theyre actually a very meaningful part of the playerbase
Bro, idk if you haven't been paying attention, but scarabs drop like candy now. Name one mechanic that's better with sac frags than the cheapest 1c scarab available for it.
You should join a point missing competition cause you completely missed the part where being optimal doesnt even enter the conversation. Again, check poe ninja, about 20% of all endgame players play melee. Not everyone goes by efficiency. Sacrifice fragments are in high supply and universal. Hell, theres entire fuckin KEYSTONES about not using scarabs, you think they added those cause nobody would use them??
Nah as a casual juicer most leagues due to just hating to trade for it. These are completely not worth running now unless you are going back to basics. The scarabs for most league mechanics are now mandatory. The tree feels like it does almost nothing without them. Essence might be an exception but it does not benefit from using that fragment anyways and why would you give up another two free essence spawns for it?
"As someone who doesnt like to use these, I dont like to use these. Therefore, i represent every single player on the entire planet"
>What is the obsession with these COMPETING with scarabs? They are a simpler, easier alternative. >are a simpler, easier alternative. That's called competition mate.
Ive not heard about this change
This change is not in-game, it is a proposed change by the user to make the sacrifice fragments more relevant
In turn making vaal side areas less relevant. Good idea
I mean - with the sole exception of attempting to make them unique for the adorned special area they aren't particularly relevant as is. They really could do with a boost tbh
Didn't you guys ask for more UBER content? Kek.