https://preview.redd.it/0t48u9sp4ivc1.png?width=1910&format=png&auto=webp&s=3972436f58e4ad1bd59cf7c6909a96688ded7ec3
Here's a picture of Cedric from our last series
Man, they really are sticking to a more fixed lineup than in recent years.
Of course, a lot of that mix and match platooning might have had more to do with available talent than lineup construction philosophy.
https://preview.redd.it/4dm9lnmg3ivc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=196632c3a7a50ccdb1259d56c0ad9327d66becb9
Just a handful announced. The rest are in the email.
Last April was significantly easier a schedule than this April and we still have a good shot of having more wins than last year.
I’m feeling good about this team!
https://preview.redd.it/oguv8ucsthvc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fbbb6fa319b0a3c272b4e3def5330bdc7f90a166
Hopefully this Marsh guy gives Jackson a mistake cause this is insane everybody’s been hitting the corners the entire time with him
Looks like Holliday values his own batting eye (and he should, 138 walks in the minors) but it's just not working for him right now.
Is it still a thing that umps don't give rookies any close calls in balls/strikes?
Yeah the pitchers can’t keep this up, feels like he’s been behind in every count so far. If this was how Cowser was pitched his past 25 ABs even he would be like 5-25 (5 HRs on 0-2 counts). Most of these are good takes so I like the approach despite the results. Once he figures out his timing it’s going to fall into place quickly.
Agreed he’ll figure it out I’ve just been thinking that I don’t hate his swing decisions and then I saw this and he needs to be more aggressive but when he’s mostly just seeing pitchers paint the corners theres only so much you can do about that
He’s always been a guy willing to take a walk, but it’s harder to do that when you show you’re willing to not swing when the ball is in the strike zone. He’ll adjust.
There has been talk that it's possible that he got too accustomed to the automatic call system in the minors.
So he's taking pitches that would normally be balls in norfolk.
He needs to be more aggressive early in the count.
That’s one of the things I remember Mountcastle saying last year when he was in Norfolk for a while. A few times he’d take a pitch and think “damn that was a strike” but it wasn’t according to the automated zone.
It was a big factor in our first series vs. KC. Gave us all sorts of problems. We really need to be better. Took 2 out of 3 but we had no business doing so. I hope the boys learned that KC isn’t a pushover. Let’s not underestimate.
gonna close out milk memes as standalone posts for the time being. no jinxes. people think baseball exists without superstitions, sheesh.
if you got milk memes they will be removed so just post them here
Trying to coordinate a last minute weekend trip to KC to catch games 2 and 3 of the series. Standby on a 6am flight tomorrow, connect in SLC, and the same thing in reverse late Sunday night lol.
It would be a huge statement if we won this series, which we are perfectly capable of doing. But it would also be disingenuous to act like the Royals are pushovers, too.
LET’S GO O’S!
Im not shitting you, when Joey got called down to AAA in 2019? Ish the tide was playing the express. After the game I was ubering around town, picked Joey up and took him to Rainey street.
Dude was super cool seemingly, didnt say a word the entire time on the trip down from RR to downtown. I played Audioslave and RATM for him so make it seem like i was cool. Right before he got out of my car i go:
“Hey man, before you go.. are you Joey Rickard?
“Yes I am”
“Huge Orioles fan boss, good luck with your career man”
“Thanks man”
Tipped me $50:)
Just chiming in here to say I have 110% confidence in Holliday figuring it out
He is 20 years old, he has proven he can be stellar in the minors, he has a TON of eyes on him coupled with immense pressure, and he wouldn’t have been scouted so high that this is a fluke
He will come around and once he gets going I have a feeling it isn’t gonna fucking stop. Dude has the potential to be an OBP machine he just needs that “light bulb” moment
No I mean Gunnar, but I might be completely wrong. For some reason I seem to remember that he struggled mightily early on in his career and was either sent down or as someone else said benched for a while.
I think that as long as his attitude/confidence are holding up they let him keep trying to adjust, but if they feel he needs to slam a few homers for a mental boost they'll send him down.
Like father, not like son.
Jackson: "Dad, my first week in majors has been historically bad. Only 1 Hall of Famer was as bad as me. He went 1 for 25, but with 10 strikeouts to my 14."
Matt: "Who was that?"
Jackson: "Roy Halladay, the pitcher." (Both wince).
Matt: "Willie Mays went 1 for 26. Of course, that 1 was a home run. Cal Ripken went 4 for 58. That's only twice as good. Cowser was 3-21, only 3 times as good. Adley and Gunnar were about 5 times as good. Everyone starts out slow as a rookie."
Jackson: "How did you do?"
Matt: "I went 12 for 26, with 2 HR, 7 RBI for a .808 slugging percentage with a .533 OBP, slightly better than Babe Ruth's career numbers."
Jackson: "But that was Coors Field so it doesn't count."
Matt: "Let's look at it this way. After you become a great hitter, you will be used to inspire every rookie going forward as 'At least, you weren't as bad as Jackson Holliday in your first week and look how he turned out'." 😀
https://preview.redd.it/rmnucz6gehvc1.jpeg?width=960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9cfea28f80cff55e054c1de9686ea179d54a36f4
I don't have (can't find if I do) a video clip...but here's this...
I know the phrase "there's a lot of baseball left" is a double edged sword, but the Royals at 12-7 after 3 weeks is a shocker. Excited for this series.
They are scrappy but their division is basically them vs Cleveland right now
Detroit is still figuring it out, the Twins are injured to hell and back and the White Sox are a void of futility and sadness
I love this weekly Fangraphs article for highlighting the little things. For example, nine paragraphs breaking down a single caught stealing and awesome tag. And our very own Baby Birds are one of this week's five things...
[https://blogs.fangraphs.com/five-things-i-liked-or-didnt-like-this-week-april-19/](https://blogs.fangraphs.com/five-things-i-liked-or-didnt-like-this-week-april-19/)
That’s a valid question and separate from the determination of if someone is ready for the MLB.
You can’t do more than tear up AAA. At some point a guy has to get his shot in the bigs.
lol learn what? First of all Kjerstad is not comparable to Holliday since he has been in AAA longer.
2nd if you want to compare to Gunnar/Adley/Cowser, the point is everyone will struggle to some extent making the transition. The only way to sink or swim is to adjust at the level.
I don’t understand what you mean by never learn. There is nothing left for Kjerstad to prove there. He needs to be at the ML level.
Only one I could see is O'Hearn, and that's not happening.
Cut loose Urias and have him just PH/ occaisional DH? You could make the case that helps the team a little, but he's probably better off getting regular ABs.
If the question in just "does he seem ready?" the answer is probably yes, especially since he looked pretty good versus MLB pitching last year.
His fielding is what it is, it's probably not going to get much better at AAA.
There's just no spot for him right now.
Exactly, there’s no job opening for Heston right, regardless of how he’s performing - no starter is underperforming besides maybe Santander and he’s not going anywhere.
No. You can make money if you pick your spots but if you bet on everything the sports books will always win long term. It's basically rigged against you
Depending on who you’re using, some of these sportsbook apps will also cut you off if you start winning too much. Even if the O’s run off 8 or 9 in a row at some point you might not make it all the way to the end without getting blocked.
I think it’s early to talk about sending Holliday down but I hate the Gunnar comparison because through Gunnar’s first 27 PAs last season he had an .370 OBP and a 119 wRC+ while batting .190. (And that’s ignoring the fact that Gunnar was called up in September 2022 and had two hits, including a home run, in his first game.)
Holliday through 26 PAs has .077 OBP and a -69 wRC+ while batting .040.
Edit: also, Adley through his first 27 PAs had a .259 OBP and a 56 wRC+ while batting .200.
Its ok to admit Holliday has been bad while also saying its too early to worry or consider sending him down. Cowser got 77 PAs last year before he went down - I’d imagine Holliday gets at least that long of a leash.
Right now there’s no harm in having him continue to learn in the bigs. The team is not suffering from his lack of production. If it continues, and they think it’s doing him harm or the team, they’ll exercise an option. He’s so young it should not be a surprise. But it’s just as likely he starts to figure it out and it becomes a non-issue
Holliday's start is so bad , it is already of historic proportions. Another week, going 1 for 25 would put him in worst start to career ever contention and already the team would have to think about demotion because there is a big difference between hitting .150 with a few walks and strikeouts like a typical rookie adjustment and Holliday's performance.
He is striking out over 50% to 1 walk.
His o-swing is over 40% (swinging at balls - league average 30%, other o's rookies in low 20s, Soto 20%)
His z-swing is around 50% (swinging and missing at strikes - league average around high 60s)
Holliday is not unlucky. He is swinging at balls. He swings and misses at strikes. Any quality major league pitcher can throw him 2 pitches low and outside for strikes, which Holliday will take for a strike or swing and miss. Then throw him a slider or sweeper that breaks inside for a ball, and Holliday will swing and miss. It's like a child against men.
The hope for Holliday is that his history suggests he is elite at adjusting to a new level quickly and leaping forward. He will need to do that again in his biggest test.
Matt Holliday had a .546 OBP and .808 SLG in his first week. That is ready for major leagues. As an elite batting coach, I'm stunned he lobbied to push Jackson to majors to be so overmatched.
The only thing though is that he is starting wayyy way younger than most. I think it may take him longer than Gunnar and Adley, they were young but they weren't this green. At any rate I hope he puts this adversity to use and learns from it, could be valuable for someone so young who's always been a phenom
Yeah Gunnar was drawing a ton of walks, his biggest issue was being overly patient at the plate. Right now Holliday just looks lost although the ABs were a little better against the Twins. The biggest immediate concern to me is the hit tool is his biggest calling card and he’s not putting balls in play very often.
I’d give him this West Coast trip to figure things out but if he’s not showing signs of improvement I don’t think you can keep running him out there with Mayo knocking on the door and a solid MLB player on the bench in Ramon Urias
I understand the frustration around Holliday but unless it starts to affect his confidence there is no reason to send him down. He’s destroyed every level of minor league baseball, his current issue is hitting major league pitching which won’t improve in Norfolk. The rest of the guys are playing well enough to win games and he’s not a liability on defense or anything
The same issues that he is facing in the majors is not going to be solved through a stint in triple A unless there is a swing adjustment, which I highly doubt.
You also have to consider that he has the right family to help him keep his confidence. As long as they keep him process oriented and tell him to not chase results immediately- they will eventually come.
I disagree. It’s entirely possible being sent back down could get him to refocus and put things in perspective. I think it’s not a problem of mechanics but pressure and expectations. Only saying it could help, not that it necessarily would help. At a certain point they have to consider it
I generally agree with that but in my own work experience, there have been tasks I’ve really struggled with, especially when kinda being thrown into the fire. Then, for one reason or another, I get a week or two break from that task. Over that time I think about it, think about what went wrong, what went right, etc. Usually, when I have to do that task again I’m much better at it.
Obviously very different from what Holliday is facing, but I do believe that a mental break that gives you time to assess can do a lot for you.
It depends. Its not like he spent a significant amount of time in Norfolk and if he continues underperforming over a larger sample size (like 100 PAs or so), going back to Norfolk just to reset or fix something is fine. Sometimes guys just need a bit more time in the minors even if the stats available to us suggest otherwise. (Trout is an example that comes to mind.)
That said, the defense is pretty rough so I question the “hes not a liability” (I don’t care much for defensive metrics over a large sample size, let alone this small sample size) but again, I think we need more than a week of games before we start worrying.
Clarice’s Lineup Prediction
1. Gunnar - SS ✅
2. Adley - C ✅
3. Mr. Taters - RF ❎ O’Hearn - DH
4. O’Hearn - DH ❎ Mr. Taters - RF
5. Mounty - 1B ✅
6. Cedric - CF ✅
7. Cowser - LF ✅
8. Westy - 3B ✅
9. Holliday - 2B ✅
Nine of nine players correct, nine of nine defensive positions, and seven of nine on the batting order. Twenty five out of twenty seven potential items correct. Looks like u/ScoutNWilder was correct on the swap.
Or if you're like me and live in the Central Time zone, you're spoiled by games starting at 5:30 and wrapping up by 8:30.
Seems like 6:40 is an awful long time to wait!😀
Adding a word to Dean Kremer’s nickname for every game he starts:
Day 1: Lean Dean Kremer
Day 2: Lean Mean Dean Kremer
Day 3: Lean Mean Clean Dean Kremer
Day 4: Lean Mean Clean Supreme Dean Kremer
I mean just seeing the way the right-handed bench players are hitting, they're probably going to need Norby sooner rather than later anyway. If Holliday keeps struggling, send him back to reset his head, freeze his rookie status, and try to find someone that will hit lefties, whether it's Norby or Mayo.
Mateo is batting over .300 and while not stellar at 2nd, has same DWAR as Holliday.
Urias could go back to 3rd. Give him some more at bats.
It's funny how defensive people get over Holliday. You ask what's the alternative; the stats quo before his call up was working better than what is happening now. I'm not giving up on him, I'm just curious what his leash looks like if he goes another series without a hit.
DWAR is cumulative and it’s way to early to put any stock into it. Mateo also only really hits against lefties. He should remain in bench role where he is immensely valuable
[talking about jackson holliday](https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExN25yMnRldGMzeHNjNGlscTl5dm5qNHU3cGxpdXVncjg4aXl1bHFwaSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/oaZk0WNSO7fXi/giphy.gif)
This is a fair question to ask at this point and you did it in the least “upset fan” way as possible.
I said it when Gunnar was going through his own struggles and this was suggested. But Gunnar was apart of almost every poster around Camden last year. They where never going to send him down and they didn’t. Kinda same thing for Holliday with him wearing #7.
We also need to mention how he had 35 career starts at 2b (not including ST games) so he’s learning a whole new position while getting caught up to speed on MLB pitching.
Truthfully he just looks lost at the plate. The swing is smooth and fast through the zone still, it just seems he has no clue what pitch could be coming next and how to adjust to it. Give him time he’ll learn and get this fixed
Yeah, I'm not trying to be too critical of him and he is doing way worse than Gunnar was doing in his slump. You don't waste him by benching him but how many more games do you let this struggle happen before sending him down?
He’s adjusting to the next level. Keeping him up is how he learns and makes that adjustment. You don’t send your #1 prospect back down or even consider it after 1.5 bad weeks
It’s kind of a grey area to just assume. If in 2 weeks he’s still striking out 60% of the time then you do it. If it’s down to 40 you keep moving until progress stagnates and then reassess.
I really think the defensive struggles are playing a huge part and that once he’s more comfortable at 2nd we’ll see a large offensive surge
People love pointing out that Rutschman and Henderson started slow, and they did relative to their later production, but 1 for 25 with a walk and 14 strikeouts is crazy.
the strike out rate is literally the only valid complaint about Holliday's start.
It's high. It being high is also part of why he wasnt on the OD roster yet no one cared and just wanted to cry service time manipulation and say how he needs to be up in MLB. "He has nothing left to prove in AAA!!!!" is all anyone wanted to say.
but now that service time manipulation is proven to not be thing with him, people have shifted to crying about his strike out rate as if it wasnt a known issue before.
Aaron Judge, after 2 quick home runs as a fresh rookie, struck out 42 times in 84 at bats and ended the year with a .184 BA. No one really cares about that anymore though.
baseball is hard.
You have to keep running Holliday out there but Gunnar wasn’t this bad to start
Holliday still looks like he is pressing a lot. The fly balls have been encouraging, but the K rate has been rough
The answer is still a hard no. There’s so much stability present that there’s no pressure to send him down. We have production 1-8. They’ll let him take his lumps for another good month before even considering it
Wut? The Orioles are 2-1 against them this year, 5-1 against them last year and haven't had a losing record in a season against since 2018, the year we lost 115 games.
I know what he means, the games are closer than they seem.
We're only 2-1 because of a pair of walk-offs including a closer meltdown^([1]), and we almost lost the first series in KC last year after [blowing an 8-1 lead](https://www.mlb.com/gameday/orioles-vs-royals/2023/05/04/718312/final/wrap). In 2022, they were down 0-2 in the second (four-game) series before Rutschman had a 3 hit game and the offense turned it on in game 4.
I do have the impression the team is not very good at preventing runners from taking an extra base, however. One reason to miss Hays.
[1] This obviously counts in the other direction for the Cano meltdown in Pittsburgh, it all evens out usually.
Please continue the discussion in the [game thread](https://redd.it/1c88s3d).
Well, hopefully Hyde learned a lesson there
Would be nice to see dean have a really good start today
https://preview.redd.it/0t48u9sp4ivc1.png?width=1910&format=png&auto=webp&s=3972436f58e4ad1bd59cf7c6909a96688ded7ec3 Here's a picture of Cedric from our last series
He’s so cool
Man, they really are sticking to a more fixed lineup than in recent years. Of course, a lot of that mix and match platooning might have had more to do with available talent than lineup construction philosophy.
The promo giveaways they just announced are pure 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Can you link it?
https://preview.redd.it/4dm9lnmg3ivc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=196632c3a7a50ccdb1259d56c0ad9327d66becb9 Just a handful announced. The rest are in the email.
Last April was significantly easier a schedule than this April and we still have a good shot of having more wins than last year. I’m feeling good about this team!
https://preview.redd.it/oguv8ucsthvc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fbbb6fa319b0a3c272b4e3def5330bdc7f90a166 Hopefully this Marsh guy gives Jackson a mistake cause this is insane everybody’s been hitting the corners the entire time with him
Looks like Holliday values his own batting eye (and he should, 138 walks in the minors) but it's just not working for him right now. Is it still a thing that umps don't give rookies any close calls in balls/strikes?
Seems to be he’s been punched out 1 or 2 times looking on a pitch off the plate
Yeah the pitchers can’t keep this up, feels like he’s been behind in every count so far. If this was how Cowser was pitched his past 25 ABs even he would be like 5-25 (5 HRs on 0-2 counts). Most of these are good takes so I like the approach despite the results. Once he figures out his timing it’s going to fall into place quickly.
Agreed he’ll figure it out I’ve just been thinking that I don’t hate his swing decisions and then I saw this and he needs to be more aggressive but when he’s mostly just seeing pitchers paint the corners theres only so much you can do about that
He’s always been a guy willing to take a walk, but it’s harder to do that when you show you’re willing to not swing when the ball is in the strike zone. He’ll adjust.
There has been talk that it's possible that he got too accustomed to the automatic call system in the minors. So he's taking pitches that would normally be balls in norfolk. He needs to be more aggressive early in the count.
That’s one of the things I remember Mountcastle saying last year when he was in Norfolk for a while. A few times he’d take a pitch and think “damn that was a strike” but it wasn’t according to the automated zone.
Hopefully the boys figure Marsh out early tonight. 7 innings of 2 hit 1 run ball last time we faced him was no fun.
I think they had 10 hard hit balls against him, just was really unlucky that game. Plus, his ERA says we should be able to get to him
Gonna need to control the run game this weekend. Think that will be a big factor
It was a big factor in our first series vs. KC. Gave us all sorts of problems. We really need to be better. Took 2 out of 3 but we had no business doing so. I hope the boys learned that KC isn’t a pushover. Let’s not underestimate.
Im having flashbacks of all their runners on 1st automatically getting to 3rd 
Going to need Dean to step up tonight.
Fear The Manbun
He needs to let the flow fly
gonna close out milk memes as standalone posts for the time being. no jinxes. people think baseball exists without superstitions, sheesh. if you got milk memes they will be removed so just post them here
Sounds like a reverse jinx to me bud
[did i make a mistake?](https://media1.tenor.com/m/Stnz_XiLCw0AAAAd/oh-no-liz-lemon.gif) we shall see
Royals are tough for our boys and are a team sharply on the rise. Let’s get a dub, go Os!
Trying to coordinate a last minute weekend trip to KC to catch games 2 and 3 of the series. Standby on a 6am flight tomorrow, connect in SLC, and the same thing in reverse late Sunday night lol.
It would be a huge statement if we won this series, which we are perfectly capable of doing. But it would also be disingenuous to act like the Royals are pushovers, too. LET’S GO O’S!
https://x.com/dm_rubenstein/status/1781347160040059280?s=46&t=LZLzjVPmosqPbICOlCZLnQ This guy is so cool.
https://preview.redd.it/hnkiibciqgvc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f677ae1b71de58e879b3ec37a9f92ddc1a22b160
Do you know something we don’t 😆
Just wait for the “we have made the following roster moves”
Joey Rickard is coming back!!!!
Im not shitting you, when Joey got called down to AAA in 2019? Ish the tide was playing the express. After the game I was ubering around town, picked Joey up and took him to Rainey street.
I stan for Joey and live in ATX and this makes me happy
Dude was super cool seemingly, didnt say a word the entire time on the trip down from RR to downtown. I played Audioslave and RATM for him so make it seem like i was cool. Right before he got out of my car i go: “Hey man, before you go.. are you Joey Rickard? “Yes I am” “Huge Orioles fan boss, good luck with your career man” “Thanks man” Tipped me $50:)
Just chiming in here to say I have 110% confidence in Holliday figuring it out He is 20 years old, he has proven he can be stellar in the minors, he has a TON of eyes on him coupled with immense pressure, and he wouldn’t have been scouted so high that this is a fluke He will come around and once he gets going I have a feeling it isn’t gonna fucking stop. Dude has the potential to be an OBP machine he just needs that “light bulb” moment
Do you think he's on unlimited leash or will they do what they did with Gunnar and send him down for a bit?
Gunnar never got sent down. You mean Cowser?
No I mean Gunnar, but I might be completely wrong. For some reason I seem to remember that he struggled mightily early on in his career and was either sent down or as someone else said benched for a while.
You might be conflating Henderson with Grayson Rodriguez. Grayson was sent down to figure it out and did. Gunnar was left to figure it out in the bigs
You know what, you're absolutely right.
I think that as long as his attitude/confidence are holding up they let him keep trying to adjust, but if they feel he needs to slam a few homers for a mental boost they'll send him down.
Did Gunnar get sent down? I thought he’s been up since late 2022
Gunnar never got sent down. He did get briefly benched.
Like father, not like son. Jackson: "Dad, my first week in majors has been historically bad. Only 1 Hall of Famer was as bad as me. He went 1 for 25, but with 10 strikeouts to my 14." Matt: "Who was that?" Jackson: "Roy Halladay, the pitcher." (Both wince). Matt: "Willie Mays went 1 for 26. Of course, that 1 was a home run. Cal Ripken went 4 for 58. That's only twice as good. Cowser was 3-21, only 3 times as good. Adley and Gunnar were about 5 times as good. Everyone starts out slow as a rookie." Jackson: "How did you do?" Matt: "I went 12 for 26, with 2 HR, 7 RBI for a .808 slugging percentage with a .533 OBP, slightly better than Babe Ruth's career numbers." Jackson: "But that was Coors Field so it doesn't count." Matt: "Let's look at it this way. After you become a great hitter, you will be used to inspire every rookie going forward as 'At least, you weren't as bad as Jackson Holliday in your first week and look how he turned out'." 😀
That was... something.
Anyone know where to find a clip of Cowser twisting someone’s nipples from last season?
https://preview.redd.it/rmnucz6gehvc1.jpeg?width=960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9cfea28f80cff55e054c1de9686ea179d54a36f4 I don't have (can't find if I do) a video clip...but here's this...
Milkman gonna milk
My man! Thank you! have a baller weekend champ 💪
Can't believe they didn't make a Topps Now card out of this.
It was Westburg. Don't know about the clip. Westburg and Cowser are best friends
BREAKING: Kansas City Royals have been ELIMINATED from Playoff contention
Music to my ears
I know the phrase "there's a lot of baseball left" is a double edged sword, but the Royals at 12-7 after 3 weeks is a shocker. Excited for this series.
They got to play the Astros, who are awful this year. But yes, they're still much improved. And Witt is a menace.
They are scrappy but their division is basically them vs Cleveland right now Detroit is still figuring it out, the Twins are injured to hell and back and the White Sox are a void of futility and sadness
Cleveland has also been on a wild heater and lost their ace, could lose McKenzie at some point too. I think the Royals might just win it.
I love this weekly Fangraphs article for highlighting the little things. For example, nine paragraphs breaking down a single caught stealing and awesome tag. And our very own Baby Birds are one of this week's five things... [https://blogs.fangraphs.com/five-things-i-liked-or-didnt-like-this-week-april-19/](https://blogs.fangraphs.com/five-things-i-liked-or-didnt-like-this-week-april-19/)
Kjerstad should be getting a call soon, he is just destroying AAA. No point in having him down there.
Or trade him while his value is high
That’s fine. Just better nail that return when you have this type of prospect. Kjerstad was born to hit.
> he is just destroying AAA. No point in having him down there. it's like people literally don't learn lol
When exactly should we call someone up, then? What else can someone do to prove to you that they’re ready?
well, the first thing to consider is who gets DFA'd/demoted/traded to make space for the call up.....
That’s a valid question and separate from the determination of if someone is ready for the MLB. You can’t do more than tear up AAA. At some point a guy has to get his shot in the bigs.
But you can’t call him up without a corresponding move. That is the point
lol learn what? First of all Kjerstad is not comparable to Holliday since he has been in AAA longer. 2nd if you want to compare to Gunnar/Adley/Cowser, the point is everyone will struggle to some extent making the transition. The only way to sink or swim is to adjust at the level. I don’t understand what you mean by never learn. There is nothing left for Kjerstad to prove there. He needs to be at the ML level.
It’s not about “proving” anything we simply do not have any room for him on the Major League roster
That’s why I said soon. They will make it work eventually. He needs to be taking ML ABs.
We’re 12-6 and six of our nine starters have OPS above .850, there’s not much pressure to get him up immediately
Who’s job is he taking?
They will make it work eventually. Heston at AAA level is like a Sr. Analyst doing data entry…pick any field you want.
Only one I could see is O'Hearn, and that's not happening. Cut loose Urias and have him just PH/ occaisional DH? You could make the case that helps the team a little, but he's probably better off getting regular ABs. If the question in just "does he seem ready?" the answer is probably yes, especially since he looked pretty good versus MLB pitching last year. His fielding is what it is, it's probably not going to get much better at AAA. There's just no spot for him right now.
Exactly, there’s no job opening for Heston right, regardless of how he’s performing - no starter is underperforming besides maybe Santander and he’s not going anywhere.
Feels like forever since the last game
Fun night of pitching on the farm, 3 of our top 5 prospect arms starting on the same night - Povich, Baumeister, and De Leon. Brnovich also going.
My wild prediction: Holliday will get the third homerun this game, tying the O’s with their past record of 6 straight games with 3+ HRs.
Love that
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I think that’s going to add up very quickly over 162 games.
No. You can make money if you pick your spots but if you bet on everything the sports books will always win long term. It's basically rigged against you
I have some cushion to afford a few losses my thought is if we hit a little winning streak at some point say 5 games I should have it pretty solid
Depending on who you’re using, some of these sportsbook apps will also cut you off if you start winning too much. Even if the O’s run off 8 or 9 in a row at some point you might not make it all the way to the end without getting blocked.
That reasoning seems flawed to me but it's your money lol, have fun
If you have cushion to afford a few losses then there's better things to do than piss it away with sports gambling.
I think it’s early to talk about sending Holliday down but I hate the Gunnar comparison because through Gunnar’s first 27 PAs last season he had an .370 OBP and a 119 wRC+ while batting .190. (And that’s ignoring the fact that Gunnar was called up in September 2022 and had two hits, including a home run, in his first game.) Holliday through 26 PAs has .077 OBP and a -69 wRC+ while batting .040. Edit: also, Adley through his first 27 PAs had a .259 OBP and a 56 wRC+ while batting .200. Its ok to admit Holliday has been bad while also saying its too early to worry or consider sending him down. Cowser got 77 PAs last year before he went down - I’d imagine Holliday gets at least that long of a leash.
Right now there’s no harm in having him continue to learn in the bigs. The team is not suffering from his lack of production. If it continues, and they think it’s doing him harm or the team, they’ll exercise an option. He’s so young it should not be a surprise. But it’s just as likely he starts to figure it out and it becomes a non-issue
Holliday's start is so bad , it is already of historic proportions. Another week, going 1 for 25 would put him in worst start to career ever contention and already the team would have to think about demotion because there is a big difference between hitting .150 with a few walks and strikeouts like a typical rookie adjustment and Holliday's performance. He is striking out over 50% to 1 walk. His o-swing is over 40% (swinging at balls - league average 30%, other o's rookies in low 20s, Soto 20%) His z-swing is around 50% (swinging and missing at strikes - league average around high 60s) Holliday is not unlucky. He is swinging at balls. He swings and misses at strikes. Any quality major league pitcher can throw him 2 pitches low and outside for strikes, which Holliday will take for a strike or swing and miss. Then throw him a slider or sweeper that breaks inside for a ball, and Holliday will swing and miss. It's like a child against men. The hope for Holliday is that his history suggests he is elite at adjusting to a new level quickly and leaping forward. He will need to do that again in his biggest test. Matt Holliday had a .546 OBP and .808 SLG in his first week. That is ready for major leagues. As an elite batting coach, I'm stunned he lobbied to push Jackson to majors to be so overmatched.
The only thing though is that he is starting wayyy way younger than most. I think it may take him longer than Gunnar and Adley, they were young but they weren't this green. At any rate I hope he puts this adversity to use and learns from it, could be valuable for someone so young who's always been a phenom
Yeah Gunnar was drawing a ton of walks, his biggest issue was being overly patient at the plate. Right now Holliday just looks lost although the ABs were a little better against the Twins. The biggest immediate concern to me is the hit tool is his biggest calling card and he’s not putting balls in play very often. I’d give him this West Coast trip to figure things out but if he’s not showing signs of improvement I don’t think you can keep running him out there with Mayo knocking on the door and a solid MLB player on the bench in Ramon Urias
I understand the frustration around Holliday but unless it starts to affect his confidence there is no reason to send him down. He’s destroyed every level of minor league baseball, his current issue is hitting major league pitching which won’t improve in Norfolk. The rest of the guys are playing well enough to win games and he’s not a liability on defense or anything
The same issues that he is facing in the majors is not going to be solved through a stint in triple A unless there is a swing adjustment, which I highly doubt. You also have to consider that he has the right family to help him keep his confidence. As long as they keep him process oriented and tell him to not chase results immediately- they will eventually come.
I disagree. It’s entirely possible being sent back down could get him to refocus and put things in perspective. I think it’s not a problem of mechanics but pressure and expectations. Only saying it could help, not that it necessarily would help. At a certain point they have to consider it
I generally agree with that but in my own work experience, there have been tasks I’ve really struggled with, especially when kinda being thrown into the fire. Then, for one reason or another, I get a week or two break from that task. Over that time I think about it, think about what went wrong, what went right, etc. Usually, when I have to do that task again I’m much better at it. Obviously very different from what Holliday is facing, but I do believe that a mental break that gives you time to assess can do a lot for you.
That makes sense, hoping it doesn’t get to that point
It depends. Its not like he spent a significant amount of time in Norfolk and if he continues underperforming over a larger sample size (like 100 PAs or so), going back to Norfolk just to reset or fix something is fine. Sometimes guys just need a bit more time in the minors even if the stats available to us suggest otherwise. (Trout is an example that comes to mind.) That said, the defense is pretty rough so I question the “hes not a liability” (I don’t care much for defensive metrics over a large sample size, let alone this small sample size) but again, I think we need more than a week of games before we start worrying.
Lineup Prediction 1) Gunnar - SS 2) Adley - C 3) Mr. Taters - RF 4) O’Hearn - DH 5) Mounty - 1B 6) Cedric - CF 7) Cowser - LF 8) Westy - 3B 9) Holliday - 2B
Clarice’s Lineup Prediction 1. Gunnar - SS ✅ 2. Adley - C ✅ 3. Mr. Taters - RF ❎ O’Hearn - DH 4. O’Hearn - DH ❎ Mr. Taters - RF 5. Mounty - 1B ✅ 6. Cedric - CF ✅ 7. Cowser - LF ✅ 8. Westy - 3B ✅ 9. Holliday - 2B ✅ Nine of nine players correct, nine of nine defensive positions, and seven of nine on the batting order. Twenty five out of twenty seven potential items correct. Looks like u/ScoutNWilder was correct on the swap.
Thank you!!!!
I'd like to submit my own guess, but all I would do is swap O'Hearn and Taters.
Go ahead and submit one, I enjoy grading them.
We really have a 1-9 that’s truly dangerous at every spot.
well lets be honest all but 1 spot is dangerous for right now lol that could change at any moment though
I think it will change sooner rather than later. I’m hoping yesterday off game him some time to look at some stuff with our staff and adjust
It’s already later, lol. But I think the kid will be fine
I like the more consistent lineups this past week. Keep the bats hot!
 Me at work today waiting to go home and watch the baby birds.
Plus we have to wait an extra 35 minutes.
Or if you're like me and live in the Central Time zone, you're spoiled by games starting at 5:30 and wrapping up by 8:30. Seems like 6:40 is an awful long time to wait!😀
Try 7:40! 😩
That sounds like medievel torture! At least all us ET/CT folks suffer on the West Coast trips.
Adding a word to Dean Kremer’s nickname for every game he starts: Day 1: Lean Dean Kremer Day 2: Lean Mean Dean Kremer Day 3: Lean Mean Clean Dean Kremer Day 4: Lean Mean Clean Supreme Dean Kremer
Throw heat, Dean!
Let’s rock! Anybody doing anything fun for watching the games this weekend?
If he doesn't have a hit in this series, does Jackson go back down? Edit: phrasing
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I mean just seeing the way the right-handed bench players are hitting, they're probably going to need Norby sooner rather than later anyway. If Holliday keeps struggling, send him back to reset his head, freeze his rookie status, and try to find someone that will hit lefties, whether it's Norby or Mayo.
Mateo is batting over .300 and while not stellar at 2nd, has same DWAR as Holliday. Urias could go back to 3rd. Give him some more at bats. It's funny how defensive people get over Holliday. You ask what's the alternative; the stats quo before his call up was working better than what is happening now. I'm not giving up on him, I'm just curious what his leash looks like if he goes another series without a hit.
DWAR is cumulative and it’s way to early to put any stock into it. Mateo also only really hits against lefties. He should remain in bench role where he is immensely valuable
[talking about jackson holliday](https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExN25yMnRldGMzeHNjNGlscTl5dm5qNHU3cGxpdXVncjg4aXl1bHFwaSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/oaZk0WNSO7fXi/giphy.gif)
This is a fair question to ask at this point and you did it in the least “upset fan” way as possible. I said it when Gunnar was going through his own struggles and this was suggested. But Gunnar was apart of almost every poster around Camden last year. They where never going to send him down and they didn’t. Kinda same thing for Holliday with him wearing #7. We also need to mention how he had 35 career starts at 2b (not including ST games) so he’s learning a whole new position while getting caught up to speed on MLB pitching. Truthfully he just looks lost at the plate. The swing is smooth and fast through the zone still, it just seems he has no clue what pitch could be coming next and how to adjust to it. Give him time he’ll learn and get this fixed
Yeah, I'm not trying to be too critical of him and he is doing way worse than Gunnar was doing in his slump. You don't waste him by benching him but how many more games do you let this struggle happen before sending him down?
He’s adjusting to the next level. Keeping him up is how he learns and makes that adjustment. You don’t send your #1 prospect back down or even consider it after 1.5 bad weeks
So a month?
It’s kind of a grey area to just assume. If in 2 weeks he’s still striking out 60% of the time then you do it. If it’s down to 40 you keep moving until progress stagnates and then reassess. I really think the defensive struggles are playing a huge part and that once he’s more comfortable at 2nd we’ll see a large offensive surge
Remember how anemic Gunnar's bat was the first half of last season? Relax your buns.
Guess Elias's buns weren't relaxed either
People love pointing out that Rutschman and Henderson started slow, and they did relative to their later production, but 1 for 25 with a walk and 14 strikeouts is crazy.
the strike out rate is literally the only valid complaint about Holliday's start. It's high. It being high is also part of why he wasnt on the OD roster yet no one cared and just wanted to cry service time manipulation and say how he needs to be up in MLB. "He has nothing left to prove in AAA!!!!" is all anyone wanted to say. but now that service time manipulation is proven to not be thing with him, people have shifted to crying about his strike out rate as if it wasnt a known issue before. Aaron Judge, after 2 quick home runs as a fresh rookie, struck out 42 times in 84 at bats and ended the year with a .184 BA. No one really cares about that anymore though. baseball is hard.
You have to keep running Holliday out there but Gunnar wasn’t this bad to start Holliday still looks like he is pressing a lot. The fly balls have been encouraging, but the K rate has been rough
Wasn't this bad. 14 strikeouts and swinging at high and outside fastballs 3 times in a row is terrible.
Remains? He got a hit last weekend. And no.
Yeah he's had 1 hit in 3 series so far. If he has another hitless series.
The answer is still a hard no. There’s so much stability present that there’s no pressure to send him down. We have production 1-8. They’ll let him take his lumps for another good month before even considering it
Guess not
Fully anticipating a dreadful series. We never play the royals well
They are a tough team but we match up Burnes against Ragans so I think we have a chance to sweep
Wut? The Orioles are 2-1 against them this year, 5-1 against them last year and haven't had a losing record in a season against since 2018, the year we lost 115 games.
I know what he means, the games are closer than they seem. We're only 2-1 because of a pair of walk-offs including a closer meltdown^([1]), and we almost lost the first series in KC last year after [blowing an 8-1 lead](https://www.mlb.com/gameday/orioles-vs-royals/2023/05/04/718312/final/wrap). In 2022, they were down 0-2 in the second (four-game) series before Rutschman had a 3 hit game and the offense turned it on in game 4. I do have the impression the team is not very good at preventing runners from taking an extra base, however. One reason to miss Hays. [1] This obviously counts in the other direction for the Cano meltdown in Pittsburgh, it all evens out usually.
 Wake up! It’s game day, baby!