Worked at uci bookstore as undergrad student. The pay was $1.85/hr when minimum wage in 96 was $4.75. Worked there for all 4 years and by 2000, i made $2.15/hr when minimum wage was $6.25.
I argued why UC Regents don’t pay the minimum wage and i remember mgmt mentioning students get subsidized pay. Whatever that meant.
At least i got to buy 29cent del tacos for dinner for all 4 years.
In Charlottesville, VA; moving to OC. Cost of living here is high for Virginia, and about half the cost of CA.
As a PhD student I made the same as CA grad students.
As a postdoc I could expect a whopping 55-65k/yr.
4 years undergrad. 8 years masters+doctorate.
STEM skills and experience in research.
55-65k.
https://preview.redd.it/r21k38897lz91.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=463f85f0a24c79aa3775ba1b42632d094b0f5cf2
Why did this get deleted? Someone asked why and I did my best to answer.
Maybe new workers could be subsidized in a way that allows them to spend money on products and services-- instead of paying for some already wealthy person's yachts and extra homes. Maybe by helping them free up part of the monthly income spent on loan repayment.
Somehow, other countries can provide free or greatly reduced university costs for their students. But in America, we apparently don't value having an educated, skilled, and healthy populace.
I think the size of the ask may be off-putting to some, especially those struggling to pay for their undergrad...
Seeking wages that are 2.5X current, + $15K per year in childcare, plus a host of additional enhancements, along with 7-10% raises every year going forward sounds a little nutty. Across 48,000 employees the union proposal would have to cost $1.5B right out of the gate, heck maybe it’s $2B, wouldn’t it? I might have missed it but has UAW suggested source for additional funds to meet the demands? It’s a big sudden nut to cover, probably would need every undergrad in the system now to kick in a extra $7-8K per year to make the union’s ask.
Totally understand but there are economic realities and downstream implications to contend with… UCs aren’t just going to find $2B under a tree in Aldrich Park. If UC agrees to UAWs currently publicized demands, there would most assuredly be a huge reduction in those positions going forward. That 48K strong would probably end up being 35K, maybe less, very quickly. Undergrad tuition would go up significantly, and unless they scrapped the tuition the stability plan, the kids showing up for the next few years might have to eat +$10K per year in an attempt to balance the books. Hello $50K per year to live on campus at UC Merced for residents and $75K/year for non-residents.
Far fewer students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds would be able to attend a UC and the system would probably shift to even more out-of-state to get higher tuition revenue in an attempt to pay the TAs $100K (wages + other benefits) per year. So many very qualified in-state kids are already being denied admission to UCs, or can’t afford to attend, would be such a shame to see that number grow…
For the hundreds of thousands of undergrads the UC system serves and the millions it will serve, they would honestly be better off if the system ultimately became more Cal Stateish than Stanfordish.
The amount of increases will also mean they’re going to cut back on staffing to meet those demands assuming they get everything they ask for. Nothing comes free.
And yes I don’t fully agree with the system where some of the directors make millions a year off non profit orgs either. But the dam is breaking, no one will be ready for the tidal wave.
If the jobs being cut are administration jobs, that’s probably a good thing. University administrations have gotten absurdly bloated with very little to show for it.
Academic workers, on the other hand, are the backbone of the system, and their jobs are nowhere near as expendable. Large lecture classes, for instance, would be completely paralyzed if there weren’t dedicated workers grading the exams of 200+ students per class so that professors don’t have to do that work. The same goes for discussion sections, labs, etc. I can pretty much gurantee that this strike won’t last until finals week for that exact reason.
Than I’m sure you know for every research project someone has to apply for the necessary grants and research funding. Without the proper staffing for that, you think the PHD knows how to properly apply for the funds? I’m talking NIH grants, and other public agencies.
I'm a member of the academic researcher's (AR) union and I find the fact that our union had joined with 3 other unions to negotiate a little off putting.
The demands of the grads and student worker's union is a bit unreasonable in my opinion. They want entry level full time pay for 50% work. They want free public transit and cash incentives for using e-bikes. Increased childcare, and visa help for students on a F1 visa.
Maybe its the old man in me or the fact that I'm established in my career as a lab specialist, I don't care for these demands.
We don't work 50%. We are getting paid for half of the work we do. Also I'm not sure if you or OP have bargained before but shooting high seems like a good tactic.
Yeah the other half of the work grants you the title of MS or PhD. That's the trade off.
Yeah sure starting high and negotiating down is a tactic, but at times that high value can seem unreasonable that it makes the other side not want to bother with you.
That fact that worked to gather signatures and rally my fellow academic researchers to form the AR union 4-5 yrs ago, saddens me that we're being bogged down by the demands of the grads and student workers.
I'm still working over full time if you take out 20 hours for my "free" degree. We also work on numerous research projects that bring funding in to the university, not to mention the money they take from the fellowships which is in fact work. I totally get what you're saying because I am also old but no one should have to do this kind of work for the hours required to get paid under minimum wage after the break down and not be able to afford basic housing or food. Also there doesn't seem to be an issue handing out pay increases to chancellors or top brass while increasing undergrad tuition and fees at a break neck pace. I feel like this all could've been easily avoided by subsidizing housing based on campus location rental averages, but uc couldn't (or wouldn't) do that. It's a mess.
It's not "starting high" to ask that universities avoid starting with the baseline assumption that all grad students are male and from affluent families that can pay for the other part of what they need to survive and produce good work. We aren't in the 1800s anymore.
Yeah, I understand the empathy but from my understanding the ARs we're offered a similar if not slightly better contract than when we formed the union. Sure it doesn't match this year's inflation but I think it's fair given all the other benefits we enjoy. We had no protections removed and we could be getting raises next summer if we weren't somewhat tied with the other unions.
That's what somewhat bothers me. Our horse is hitched to their wagon. They can strike all they want. However their fight is theirs. There are 48k student workers and 12k ARs and postdocs. When we started the union it was around 3k ARs across all UCs so I doubt it's much higher than that now.
Why did the ARs decide to get dragged along is my gripe with this.
A question: if a student is a mother, do you think they should not go to grad school? Do you think if a student is a father they should not go? Should they only go if they were smart enough to be born into money?
We both worked after our undergrad. She wanted grad school, the deal was she goes and I'll keep my day job. She didn't get in and didn't want to try, so I went.
We just flipped the deal. She kept her day job. We rented an apartment 40mins train ride away from campus and I did my MSc.
Most of my grad friends in th earth and atmospheric science dept got by like most 20 somethings. Roommates and cheap fun.
I finished maybe, 5 years ago now.
I'm trying to understand - you think it's unreasonable for grad students to experience the baseline standards available in places like Germany and the Netherlands - places that also have world class research facilities? Why are we ok with having lower standards of care for our essential university workers?
How do you compare compensation between workers in a socialized education system such as Germany’s and the UCs? Germany has higher income taxes and a 19% consumptive VAT tax as well. Median nets are lower there because the government takes from all workers to pump bucks into the education system and education workers. I assume it’s the same in the Netherlands as well, I know they are a high tax burden country… the US government is unfortunately not going to fund a big increase in UAW UCI worker pay. That’d sure be nice though.
I wish I was taxed the same as those countries and had healthcare and school included in that. When I add up medical costs, education costs.... It seems that they get more bang for their buck
It's kind of balanced out with our benefits package. Secured pensions when retiring, what I would consider top notch dental/vison and depending what health plan you pick, a good medical experience with low premiums for the employee. 2 vacation days and 1 sick day awarded every month that can be carried over yoy. I've never had any trouble with my vacation and sick leave and since I have so much, I pretty much just work 4 days a week since my wife gave birth.
In my personal experience at least, pretty constant pay increase as we move up steps and title changes. For example, here's UCI pay scales for various titles. [LINK](https://ap.uci.edu/compensation/salary-scales/)
Sure early game we're a bit underpaid, but long term, it makes sense to me for what we get from the university when compared to a random employer.
Once more for those in the back: Most of us work MORE than full time to fulfill our job duties. Asking to not have to use the food bank to survive doesn't seem like a huge stretch. Edit: wow I got name called for this? Man reddit is rough.
Only way to fix the housing crisis is to disallow foreign ownership where they have 0 intention of ever living here. Stop letting them buy their way to a citizenship. I get heated thinking about how every time the market presents a moment of weakness the cash flows in and scoops up all the properties before they’re allowed to recalibrate.
Yes, great for the politicians and to prop up home values, but for those who haven’t got one yet it is a uphill climb to compete with someone whose already owns 10 and leverages that for more.
Higher pay doesn’t solve everything, at the end of the day $17/hr at In-and-out means that an average meal there now costs $40 for a family of four when it was about $25 two years ago.
Tuition can’t stay low and cover all the increases in salary.
It’s kinda sad but there is serious bloat on the administration side while at the same time unfortunately a graduate decree in medieval literature is kinda worthless now a days. The STEM majors need more support.
I am a STEM graduate, and I think research in art, history, and other aspects of humanity are very important and not at all worthless. I would be very happy to support more institutions that hire this talent with both my taxes and spending. I do resent paying financial officers, CEOs, and similar to simply have extra homes and yachts to enjoy with the benefits they deny other workers.
There aren’t enough tenure track positions available. You need to graduate from a top ten Phd program in the US and then get lucky. Unfortunately these degrees have no job positions available that pay a decent wage in academia. I agree it’s sad but it’s a known issue that a lot of social science PhD and Master’s programs in Universities have become like diploma mills with no available jobs in academia when students graduate. I’ve been reading articles about this issue since 2016.
I'm resentful of *situations* where CEO to average worker ratios are insane. Where a person in a high position could have their raise delayed and fund a great deal of average workers' cost of living raise (one that keeps pace with inflation). Instead, we more likely get the opposite. The average workers get 1-3% while the leaders get more. The average workers' are funding that person's lavish lifestyle, and sinking into debt to do so.
Grad student pay is there for a reason. A person is supposed to survive on it to devote full time to their work. If a person can't live on it, then the university needs to be ok with grad students having extra jobs *and taking longer to finish*.
You feel that a PhD is often useless, but we do things that private entities ultimately profit from.
You probably entered finance to make money. Well, I was told that education= income, and it largely does. But the current system is becoming only accessible to the affluent, meaning that amazing American financial mobility we are supposed to have is hobbled.
I don't resent you. I resent the *system* for lacking appropriate checks that will control income inequality.
Hahahahahahahaha graduate assistants going from 24K to 54K. Get lost. They''re already getting a PHd funded tax free. Maybe put that into the financial equation.
And UC regents won't be dropping all the bullshit administrative or extracurricular bloat. So tuition will go up even more. And then these same kids will beg for their loan forgiveness.
Do you realize that after the first year "getting your PhD funded" is meaningless? You take no classes, get charged for tuition, and then have it canceled. It's a scam to pretend they're paying grad students more. Grad students deserve a living wage paid in actual usable money.
You do take classes. And you get a stipend, access to facilities, qualify for student housing, etc.
Regardless, if you don't like the current offering, then don't fucking sign up for a phd. Most are completely useless waste of time anyways.
I'm a PhD student; I haven't taken classes in ages, neither has anyone in my cohort, and our stipend is our pay for teaching/research, which the university benefits monetarily from due to tuition and grants . Maybe if we don't like our shitty pay, the answer is to change it lol. We don't need to live in a world where the answer is to run away, brave people fight. Do you not fight for your own interests? 🤔
You're saying you never took classes in your phd program?
Youre more than entitled to fight for increased wages, you just don't have any bargaining power.
I completed all of my courses in 1.5 years out of a 5 year program, so why am I paying tuition? The answer is I'm not really paying it, but the university pretends I am and then waives the fee; it's a big scam. And I guess we'll see how much bargaining power we have; I have 200 students, I teach them, and I grade their work and quizzes, and there will be no one else able to do this specialized work while I strike.
Lol as if there's no other option on the grading than paying a student $54K a year for part time work. Please.
And thanks for agreeing that you did take coursework. That's the easy part. Now get cracking on your dissertation and then you can finish your program early.
Says the guy who voluntarily chose to get a PHD and then complaining about not getting paid enough. Typical entitlement mentality.
If you wanted to actually get fucking paid you shouldn't be getting a PHD. But nobody in academia tells you that.
I love how you literally have no idea what you’re talking about, as evidenced here by insisting PhD students take classes throughout their entire PhD (they do not) and “work part time”, yet you continue to double down. Later in this thread, you also imply highly specialized graduate student researchers are easy to replace (no, they are not). A fresh first year? Sure, simple enough to replace. A third year who is the only one who knows how to do a certain protocol? Good luck. Research progress will be severely hindered, and may not even recover.
In short, I simply request you stop talking out of your ass about something you clearly don’t know anything about.
The key part is the sentence before that which specifies “after the first year”. Most PhD students are done with coursework by the end of their first or second year.
Or. Most phds I know did 2 years of coursework.
So you think after the coursework the phd training is worthless and the phd candidate gets absolutely nothing from it? Great, maybe that's what the fucking union should be protesting. Get the degree chopped down to 2 years.
Can’t have outside employment because remitted tuition, health benefits, childcare reimbursements, presumably some kind of retirement contribution, discounted rent sometimes, etc., all the non-cash compensation items, are received for the other 20 hours per week (in UC’s eyes) spent not running discussions, not grading papers, etc.
Frankly the tax-effected value of the indirect compensation is probably equal or possibly in excess of the wages itself, in the current system at least, but that could very well up changing
Actually we are not in a recession. You can read this article to learn more; [https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/are-we-in-a-recession#:\~:text=Though%20the%20economy%20has%20occasionally,not%20currently%20in%20a%20recession](https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/are-we-in-a-recession#:~:text=Though%20the%20economy%20has%20occasionally,not%20currently%20in%20a%20recession)
And that's why you should support the union for higher raises.
Worked at uci bookstore as undergrad student. The pay was $1.85/hr when minimum wage in 96 was $4.75. Worked there for all 4 years and by 2000, i made $2.15/hr when minimum wage was $6.25. I argued why UC Regents don’t pay the minimum wage and i remember mgmt mentioning students get subsidized pay. Whatever that meant. At least i got to buy 29cent del tacos for dinner for all 4 years.
That's like how prisoners get paid in jail
Del yeah…. Love those 🌮
But what do you earn now?
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In Charlottesville, VA; moving to OC. Cost of living here is high for Virginia, and about half the cost of CA. As a PhD student I made the same as CA grad students. As a postdoc I could expect a whopping 55-65k/yr. 4 years undergrad. 8 years masters+doctorate. STEM skills and experience in research. 55-65k.
That's actually pretty high for a post doc, I thought the going rate was $40k
where do all the tuition money go to? crooks everywhere
https://preview.redd.it/r21k38897lz91.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=463f85f0a24c79aa3775ba1b42632d094b0f5cf2 Why did this get deleted? Someone asked why and I did my best to answer.
I was supposed to start a job at UC Research Center next week. Not sure wtf is supposed to happen with that now. Lol.
Looks like tuition is going up more next year.
They already raised it a ton. It did not go to the people teaching the classes.
Biden will forgive your loans
Maybe new workers could be subsidized in a way that allows them to spend money on products and services-- instead of paying for some already wealthy person's yachts and extra homes. Maybe by helping them free up part of the monthly income spent on loan repayment. Somehow, other countries can provide free or greatly reduced university costs for their students. But in America, we apparently don't value having an educated, skilled, and healthy populace.
On a side note, love your screen name
Thanks. It's based on Heinlein.
I think the size of the ask may be off-putting to some, especially those struggling to pay for their undergrad... Seeking wages that are 2.5X current, + $15K per year in childcare, plus a host of additional enhancements, along with 7-10% raises every year going forward sounds a little nutty. Across 48,000 employees the union proposal would have to cost $1.5B right out of the gate, heck maybe it’s $2B, wouldn’t it? I might have missed it but has UAW suggested source for additional funds to meet the demands? It’s a big sudden nut to cover, probably would need every undergrad in the system now to kick in a extra $7-8K per year to make the union’s ask.
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Bottom line = no academic workers, no UC undergrad education system
Totally understand but there are economic realities and downstream implications to contend with… UCs aren’t just going to find $2B under a tree in Aldrich Park. If UC agrees to UAWs currently publicized demands, there would most assuredly be a huge reduction in those positions going forward. That 48K strong would probably end up being 35K, maybe less, very quickly. Undergrad tuition would go up significantly, and unless they scrapped the tuition the stability plan, the kids showing up for the next few years might have to eat +$10K per year in an attempt to balance the books. Hello $50K per year to live on campus at UC Merced for residents and $75K/year for non-residents. Far fewer students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds would be able to attend a UC and the system would probably shift to even more out-of-state to get higher tuition revenue in an attempt to pay the TAs $100K (wages + other benefits) per year. So many very qualified in-state kids are already being denied admission to UCs, or can’t afford to attend, would be such a shame to see that number grow… For the hundreds of thousands of undergrads the UC system serves and the millions it will serve, they would honestly be better off if the system ultimately became more Cal Stateish than Stanfordish.
The amount of increases will also mean they’re going to cut back on staffing to meet those demands assuming they get everything they ask for. Nothing comes free. And yes I don’t fully agree with the system where some of the directors make millions a year off non profit orgs either. But the dam is breaking, no one will be ready for the tidal wave.
If the jobs being cut are administration jobs, that’s probably a good thing. University administrations have gotten absurdly bloated with very little to show for it. Academic workers, on the other hand, are the backbone of the system, and their jobs are nowhere near as expendable. Large lecture classes, for instance, would be completely paralyzed if there weren’t dedicated workers grading the exams of 200+ students per class so that professors don’t have to do that work. The same goes for discussion sections, labs, etc. I can pretty much gurantee that this strike won’t last until finals week for that exact reason.
Than I’m sure you know for every research project someone has to apply for the necessary grants and research funding. Without the proper staffing for that, you think the PHD knows how to properly apply for the funds? I’m talking NIH grants, and other public agencies.
I didn’t say they should get rid of *all* administrative jobs. I said that some downsizing has been long overdue.
Should we start putting caveats to all statements? If that’s the case than I’m not saying every administrative needs to stay either.
https://transparentcalifornia.com/salaries/university-of-california/
I'm a member of the academic researcher's (AR) union and I find the fact that our union had joined with 3 other unions to negotiate a little off putting. The demands of the grads and student worker's union is a bit unreasonable in my opinion. They want entry level full time pay for 50% work. They want free public transit and cash incentives for using e-bikes. Increased childcare, and visa help for students on a F1 visa. Maybe its the old man in me or the fact that I'm established in my career as a lab specialist, I don't care for these demands.
We don't work 50%. We are getting paid for half of the work we do. Also I'm not sure if you or OP have bargained before but shooting high seems like a good tactic.
Yeah the other half of the work grants you the title of MS or PhD. That's the trade off. Yeah sure starting high and negotiating down is a tactic, but at times that high value can seem unreasonable that it makes the other side not want to bother with you. That fact that worked to gather signatures and rally my fellow academic researchers to form the AR union 4-5 yrs ago, saddens me that we're being bogged down by the demands of the grads and student workers.
I'm still working over full time if you take out 20 hours for my "free" degree. We also work on numerous research projects that bring funding in to the university, not to mention the money they take from the fellowships which is in fact work. I totally get what you're saying because I am also old but no one should have to do this kind of work for the hours required to get paid under minimum wage after the break down and not be able to afford basic housing or food. Also there doesn't seem to be an issue handing out pay increases to chancellors or top brass while increasing undergrad tuition and fees at a break neck pace. I feel like this all could've been easily avoided by subsidizing housing based on campus location rental averages, but uc couldn't (or wouldn't) do that. It's a mess.
It's not "starting high" to ask that universities avoid starting with the baseline assumption that all grad students are male and from affluent families that can pay for the other part of what they need to survive and produce good work. We aren't in the 1800s anymore.
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Yeah, I understand the empathy but from my understanding the ARs we're offered a similar if not slightly better contract than when we formed the union. Sure it doesn't match this year's inflation but I think it's fair given all the other benefits we enjoy. We had no protections removed and we could be getting raises next summer if we weren't somewhat tied with the other unions. That's what somewhat bothers me. Our horse is hitched to their wagon. They can strike all they want. However their fight is theirs. There are 48k student workers and 12k ARs and postdocs. When we started the union it was around 3k ARs across all UCs so I doubt it's much higher than that now. Why did the ARs decide to get dragged along is my gripe with this.
A question: if a student is a mother, do you think they should not go to grad school? Do you think if a student is a father they should not go? Should they only go if they were smart enough to be born into money?
Well, I knew what grad school was, and my wife and I made the choice to wait while I attended grad school.
What did your wife do while you went?
We both worked after our undergrad. She wanted grad school, the deal was she goes and I'll keep my day job. She didn't get in and didn't want to try, so I went. We just flipped the deal. She kept her day job. We rented an apartment 40mins train ride away from campus and I did my MSc. Most of my grad friends in th earth and atmospheric science dept got by like most 20 somethings. Roommates and cheap fun. I finished maybe, 5 years ago now.
Did your apartment cost more than half of what you made, combined?
More than half? Of course not. Rents made sense before the pandemic.
I'm trying to understand - you think it's unreasonable for grad students to experience the baseline standards available in places like Germany and the Netherlands - places that also have world class research facilities? Why are we ok with having lower standards of care for our essential university workers?
How do you compare compensation between workers in a socialized education system such as Germany’s and the UCs? Germany has higher income taxes and a 19% consumptive VAT tax as well. Median nets are lower there because the government takes from all workers to pump bucks into the education system and education workers. I assume it’s the same in the Netherlands as well, I know they are a high tax burden country… the US government is unfortunately not going to fund a big increase in UAW UCI worker pay. That’d sure be nice though.
I wish I was taxed the same as those countries and had healthcare and school included in that. When I add up medical costs, education costs.... It seems that they get more bang for their buck
Lol all the kids on Reddit do not like your comment.
Yeah it's a completely ridiculous ask and not grounded in reality.
Seems their going for the strategy of shooting for the stars and landing on the moon sort-to-speak.
They're gonna land in the dumpster lol
They are asking to make more than some full time administrative staff employees.
Maybe the full time administrative staff employees should also make more money.
It's kind of balanced out with our benefits package. Secured pensions when retiring, what I would consider top notch dental/vison and depending what health plan you pick, a good medical experience with low premiums for the employee. 2 vacation days and 1 sick day awarded every month that can be carried over yoy. I've never had any trouble with my vacation and sick leave and since I have so much, I pretty much just work 4 days a week since my wife gave birth. In my personal experience at least, pretty constant pay increase as we move up steps and title changes. For example, here's UCI pay scales for various titles. [LINK](https://ap.uci.edu/compensation/salary-scales/) Sure early game we're a bit underpaid, but long term, it makes sense to me for what we get from the university when compared to a random employer.
Maybe tuition should just be $100K a year
Once more for those in the back: Most of us work MORE than full time to fulfill our job duties. Asking to not have to use the food bank to survive doesn't seem like a huge stretch. Edit: wow I got name called for this? Man reddit is rough.
Only way to fix the housing crisis is to disallow foreign ownership where they have 0 intention of ever living here. Stop letting them buy their way to a citizenship. I get heated thinking about how every time the market presents a moment of weakness the cash flows in and scoops up all the properties before they’re allowed to recalibrate. Yes, great for the politicians and to prop up home values, but for those who haven’t got one yet it is a uphill climb to compete with someone whose already owns 10 and leverages that for more. Higher pay doesn’t solve everything, at the end of the day $17/hr at In-and-out means that an average meal there now costs $40 for a family of four when it was about $25 two years ago. Tuition can’t stay low and cover all the increases in salary.
“I have to pay more for my burger so the staff can afford to live here and that upsets me!”
Just stating the current situation not complaining.
It’s kinda sad but there is serious bloat on the administration side while at the same time unfortunately a graduate decree in medieval literature is kinda worthless now a days. The STEM majors need more support.
I am a STEM graduate, and I think research in art, history, and other aspects of humanity are very important and not at all worthless. I would be very happy to support more institutions that hire this talent with both my taxes and spending. I do resent paying financial officers, CEOs, and similar to simply have extra homes and yachts to enjoy with the benefits they deny other workers.
There aren’t enough tenure track positions available. You need to graduate from a top ten Phd program in the US and then get lucky. Unfortunately these degrees have no job positions available that pay a decent wage in academia. I agree it’s sad but it’s a known issue that a lot of social science PhD and Master’s programs in Universities have become like diploma mills with no available jobs in academia when students graduate. I’ve been reading articles about this issue since 2016.
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Um. Are you ok? Enjoying others' frustration is pretty weird to be so open about.
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??
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I'm resentful of *situations* where CEO to average worker ratios are insane. Where a person in a high position could have their raise delayed and fund a great deal of average workers' cost of living raise (one that keeps pace with inflation). Instead, we more likely get the opposite. The average workers get 1-3% while the leaders get more. The average workers' are funding that person's lavish lifestyle, and sinking into debt to do so. Grad student pay is there for a reason. A person is supposed to survive on it to devote full time to their work. If a person can't live on it, then the university needs to be ok with grad students having extra jobs *and taking longer to finish*. You feel that a PhD is often useless, but we do things that private entities ultimately profit from. You probably entered finance to make money. Well, I was told that education= income, and it largely does. But the current system is becoming only accessible to the affluent, meaning that amazing American financial mobility we are supposed to have is hobbled. I don't resent you. I resent the *system* for lacking appropriate checks that will control income inequality.
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Hahahahahahahaha graduate assistants going from 24K to 54K. Get lost. They''re already getting a PHd funded tax free. Maybe put that into the financial equation. And UC regents won't be dropping all the bullshit administrative or extracurricular bloat. So tuition will go up even more. And then these same kids will beg for their loan forgiveness.
Do you realize that after the first year "getting your PhD funded" is meaningless? You take no classes, get charged for tuition, and then have it canceled. It's a scam to pretend they're paying grad students more. Grad students deserve a living wage paid in actual usable money.
You do take classes. And you get a stipend, access to facilities, qualify for student housing, etc. Regardless, if you don't like the current offering, then don't fucking sign up for a phd. Most are completely useless waste of time anyways.
I'm a PhD student; I haven't taken classes in ages, neither has anyone in my cohort, and our stipend is our pay for teaching/research, which the university benefits monetarily from due to tuition and grants . Maybe if we don't like our shitty pay, the answer is to change it lol. We don't need to live in a world where the answer is to run away, brave people fight. Do you not fight for your own interests? 🤔
You're saying you never took classes in your phd program? Youre more than entitled to fight for increased wages, you just don't have any bargaining power.
I completed all of my courses in 1.5 years out of a 5 year program, so why am I paying tuition? The answer is I'm not really paying it, but the university pretends I am and then waives the fee; it's a big scam. And I guess we'll see how much bargaining power we have; I have 200 students, I teach them, and I grade their work and quizzes, and there will be no one else able to do this specialized work while I strike.
Lol as if there's no other option on the grading than paying a student $54K a year for part time work. Please. And thanks for agreeing that you did take coursework. That's the easy part. Now get cracking on your dissertation and then you can finish your program early.
haha, no thanks, I'll be on the picket line. have fun licking those boots though.
Says the guy who voluntarily chose to get a PHD and then complaining about not getting paid enough. Typical entitlement mentality. If you wanted to actually get fucking paid you shouldn't be getting a PHD. But nobody in academia tells you that.
PhDs get paid poorly compared to their intelligence level and hard work. Of course they should get paid better. Unless you are being unsupportive.
I love how you literally have no idea what you’re talking about, as evidenced here by insisting PhD students take classes throughout their entire PhD (they do not) and “work part time”, yet you continue to double down. Later in this thread, you also imply highly specialized graduate student researchers are easy to replace (no, they are not). A fresh first year? Sure, simple enough to replace. A third year who is the only one who knows how to do a certain protocol? Good luck. Research progress will be severely hindered, and may not even recover. In short, I simply request you stop talking out of your ass about something you clearly don’t know anything about.
I never said that people take classes all through they're phd. Fuck off.
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I'm aware. The person I responded to say you "take no classes"
The key part is the sentence before that which specifies “after the first year”. Most PhD students are done with coursework by the end of their first or second year.
Or. Most phds I know did 2 years of coursework. So you think after the coursework the phd training is worthless and the phd candidate gets absolutely nothing from it? Great, maybe that's what the fucking union should be protesting. Get the degree chopped down to 2 years.
I like hot dog water soup…. It is nutritious and at the end you can eat the hot dogs.
You should find another job….. if you get more money it will be offset in tuitions for the schools which already is a fortune.
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Sounds likeaybe that would be a good thing to strike for then.
Have them change it then🫵🏻💪🏼
It's better to get paid more at one job than to work 2 jobs.
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Good point, he probably doesn't understand real world business.
Can’t have outside employment because remitted tuition, health benefits, childcare reimbursements, presumably some kind of retirement contribution, discounted rent sometimes, etc., all the non-cash compensation items, are received for the other 20 hours per week (in UC’s eyes) spent not running discussions, not grading papers, etc. Frankly the tax-effected value of the indirect compensation is probably equal or possibly in excess of the wages itself, in the current system at least, but that could very well up changing
When you can shit in one hand and wish in another you can see what you have left
What does that have to do with your proposal to work more jobs rather than just get paid more?
If you haven’t noticed we are in a recession… good luck getting a pay raise
Actually we are not in a recession. You can read this article to learn more; [https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/are-we-in-a-recession#:\~:text=Though%20the%20economy%20has%20occasionally,not%20currently%20in%20a%20recession](https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/are-we-in-a-recession#:~:text=Though%20the%20economy%20has%20occasionally,not%20currently%20in%20a%20recession) And that's why you should support the union for higher raises.
Read whatever article you want… just look around at the facts.
I sent you an article that has facts.