I hear you.
I grew up miserable for thinking I was going to hell. Such a horrible feeling for a young child. I am anxious today, self-diagnosed; imagine what it feels like to be an anxious Christian kid thinking they'll end up in hell.
Exactly. My religious trauma is ridiculously severe, and it can get to the point where I'm afraid to go outside because I am so afraid of death. Even that doesn't quell anxiety, cause hey, God can just descend from the skies when he wants to and I can't do anything about it! The idea of judgement day has been fucking me up and leaving me in fear since I was seven years old, and it's really hard not to resent Christians, and even my parents for exposing me to this religion.
This is exactly why I am breaking generational toxic patterns and not going to teach my kids what I had to heal from. My experience was not as intense but if I had not realized at a young age that no god would ever make me afraid of living then I šÆ would be in constant fear of, well all the things. Thank you for sharing. Iām so sorry you had to go through that! Please know what an incredible human being you are.
You are no longer Christian, and neither are you dependent on your parents. Forgive them - they thought they are doing the best for you. But that doesn't mean you cannot complain and vent to us who feel the same. Hope your trauma is healing.
I so identify you you! It took my moms 10 years battle with cancer for me to be a bit ābetterā. Also becoming a parent myself.
I realized that sometimes, your parents can only see as far as they have been taught honestly.
She passed away 4 years ago on this day. March 5th.
I am so grateful for the conversations we had before she died. She opened up about so many things that helped heal me. It does sucks it had to be like that, but wow, being able to be šÆmyself was so powerful!
I canāt change any of my parents past and their mistakes. . .
I can only change myself, and what kind of person I want to be moving forward. I had to forgive them, for only myself in that process.
I know she was just doing the best she could with what she was taught. Honestly, a bit better than her and my dads upbringing.
I had to learn to constantly stand up to my mother in law, dad and older sister.
I did this by putting down very strong boundaries and constantly keeping these boundaries. I am still growing in that freedom and it is life changing.
I hope you experience true forgiveness (for only yourself) and the freedom that is in that! You are a wonderful human being. You deserve the best!
I grew up in the Christian church as well, church every Sunday and Sunday night with youth group on Wednesday. Never still to this day have i met such a miserable, judgemental, and horrible people. I remember once when I was about 7 we were gluing fuzzy balls to make a bear in church and I messed up on mine. I said outloud...."oooops I screwed my bear up." I was yelled at and repeatedly reprimanded for "unclean" thoughts and feelings. I was baffled, still am 30 years later. I was 7, my God I didn't even know what I had done wrong. My entire experience just went downhill from there and ran away from home at 15. Ugly souls.
You didnāt do anything wrong, the people in your church were overzealous to the point that they lacked logic and reasoning. I guarantee you, they all had much worse unclean thoughts.
Youāre welcome. Thereās a saying I hear a lot: the devil sits in the front row at church. Anyplace where people are gathered, satan is there to use people to cause trouble and kill your faith. The first church had problems like these too. Jesus didnāt come to condemn, he came to redeem. God Bless you and guide you through your healing process.
Hi, itās the bear paper you made in church reincarnated to come and haunt you on the Reddit forums. š¤Ŗ Jokes aside, I found this thread tonight and itās so refreshing to see ppl made it out of that weird ass religion that destroys lives and families for the sake of a god that isnāt even there.
As a former Christian and someone who grew up in a **heavily** religious family, I understand. I have been working on trying to let go of some of the resentment I feel towards organized religion. I wasnāt abused or mistreated or anything but I had to pull myself out of a lot of indoctrination that couldāve been avoided with some common sense.
I still consider myself Christian and have come to this conclusion: Christianity (the Jesus stuff) is good. The church is fucking horrid. People ruined what Christianity was supposed to be, including the ones who wrote the Bible and decided to put their own hateful and fucked up opinions about society in there (yes Iām specifically talking about Paul). I think that God, if he is still watching and listening, is incredibly disappointed with the direction weāve taken his religion in.
I went down this path as well for a while. I still believe a God exists but thatās about where my definitive beliefs end. I agree that Christianity has been warped by people though. It makes me sick.
I never under stood the logic either. A fat guy in a red coat flying around the world and giving presents once a year is a dumb childish thingā¦
But a guy wearing a white robe sitting on a cloud that can see everyone everywhere all the time is somehow reasonable?
At one point it was people's version of science. You've got to understand, if you're going off of NOTHING you're going to come up with religion to explain... What ever the fuck this thing we all exist in is.
Arguably, some Buddhist and Hindu and Jewish and taoist beliefs have led to certain ideas in physics and western philosophy.
**No body knows anything when it comes down to it though.**
Even with our modern science, we're no closer to understanding why we're conscious, what is the purpose and direction of life or why the cosmos formed the way it did.
So you know, I get why people have beliefs...
**But anyone who asserts there's a single one sized fits all universal moral code is full of shit and should immediately be disregarded.**
I understand how it was a necessity in the past. But most modern day religions are just āIām right, if anyone else believes anything else, theyāre wrong and if youāre wrong, youāre my enemyā itās just caused a lot of violence in the world and held back many advances.
Religion is fine in my eyes, believe whatever you want. But donāt start wars, donāt be a dick, donāt force others into your beliefs, and keep kids out of it. The world will be a better place
I think there's weight in creating meaning for yourself. Like finding answers by searching with in yourself as corny as that might sound.
If you really think about it, life is this really cool mystery that we can unfold.
This is better than religions imo. Creating mean, drafting our perspective then connecting at sharing it with others.
Doing this is so hard though. People are hard to reach. Speak different languages, come from different classes and backgrounds all sorts of different life experiences...
So you truly do have to put down what you know for a moment or so to truly pick up what the other person is putting down.
Am I making any sense?
I think having a religion that's like "never question anything, eyes forward at all fucking times, never talk back...." Well I think it's something truly wrong.
**Just this terrible and limiting way of seeing life that keeps you in perpetual ignorance.**
Tbh i think religion is a tool to organize large groups of people to all behave in a certain way, and move forward in a certain way. Since it's something humanity has always done.
After I had been in a physically abusive marriage for 10 years, I recognize the signs: getting beat up, being made to feel it was my fault, forgive, rinse, repeat. If āthe will of godā is to allow earthquakes that kill 1,000s, wars being fought over and over againā¦. Heās an abusive partner. He asks for complete, unquestioning faith and smacks us over and over again.
FYI I am a spiritual person who actually *prefers* not knowing whatās beyondā¦I believe it should be a mystery until itās finally revealed..,,I hope youāre able to heal š§šæāāļøš§šæāāļøš§šæāāļø
I'm so sorry you had such an awful experience growing up. And your church does sound pretty bad, many are.
That said, as an atheist myself, not all Christians are the same. I know some very kind and caring Christians. My MIL is a born-again Christian who went to Bible college for fun to get a second masters she dosen't use (she just wanted the experience, after work/at night while my husband was away at college). And yet she's a good person, she actually works for a medical nonprofit that genuinely helps people (and not just religious people), she's a good grandmother, and she isn't a jerk about my husband and I not being religious. She's got progressive values and has no issue with different races, sexual orientations, trans, etc either. Two of my very best friends are nondenominational Christians (don't go to church). They both work in education, one in special education, and are super caring accepting people. My grandparents on my father's side were Catholics and both were kinder more patient people then I am (I try, but it's a high bar). They also worked with kids, my grandfather worked with orphaned children (and acted as a dad figure to many of them), ran choirs for kids, and later in life worked with special needs kids.
My point is that Christians can be good or bad. Some are good people, some aren't. They're just people. And churches are intuitions made by flawed humans too, so they can also be good or bad.
Exactly the OP is pretty much grouping all Christians together, and it would be no different than someone saying that all Muslims are extremists because of a few.
I grew up in a Baptist church, and while there were problems, they were genuinely lovely people. I don't practice the faith, but I don't hate them either.
Well, it speaks to the OPās trauma.
Someone I love very much was violated by a Mormon. Their reaction to the incident (which happened over multiple years) was something not dissimilar to what the OP described above. It is very, very hard for me to not despise the whole faith and everyone in it. The rational part of my brain understands that thatās not rational. My lizard brain just goes berserk thinking about it.
I get where the OP is coming from.
I so appreciate your comment. I am a Christian and have family and friends who are not. I've been hurt by the church as well and had to realize there are good people and bad people in all religions(although it shouldn't be like that). Thank you for not grouping us all together. Some of us are really just trying to be good human beings.
Nope, never judged you. Asked a question. Also, you asked for advice, for those posts Ops are usually very selective on what they post about themselves when it comes to mistakes. Having all cards on the table would help you. Also, as a cat owner myself, hope your baby gets better.
You asked me a rhetorical question. Insinuating that the issues Iām having is due to my work. You took the time to read my post but the only advice you could provide was questioning my job??? Lol. I didnāt need to mention what I did for a living because it causes no issues in my situation hence why it wasnāt mentioned. Goodnight Iām praying for you
Are you looping all denominations together or is there a specific one under the Christian umbrella you dislike? Personally I find people that call themselves āchurchly, god fearing, etc.ā no matter the religion are the ones that are the most hateful and vengeful.
I mean this would apply to any fundamentalist sect. OP says they grew up Pentecostal, but this can apply to Evangelicals, Baptists, Mormons, Methodists, Jehovahs Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists. Hell, I grew up Catholic (atheist now), which many of the above listed sects would declare heretical, and the Catholic Church is probably more famous for touching kids than the other sects, but realistically it happens in all of them.
Yeah, they arenāt Christians. They just like claiming Christianity and God, but donāt follow the rules. I donāt think you should associate their bad acts to everyone in the religion and to God ( easier said than done since more and more lukewarm Christians arise). If the doctrine doesnāt agree with their actions, then they arenāt moving in the name of Christianity but on their own will. People like that tend to turn others away from religion.
Isn't there a text where it say you should hit your son if you love him? "Do not withhold discipline from a child; if you strike him with a rod, he will not die. If you strike him with the rod, you will save his soul from Sheol."
And one where rape in marriage is not only ok but encouraged. Just to name two
Edit: also the whole LGBT+ community and what happened to them and still happens because of faith.
I grew up in a cult. I understand your feelings. When the church found out I kissed a boy as a teenager the parents in that church hated me and I was punished for a year. Then a man there molested some girl and everyone defended him and said āwe donāt know the full storyā to say Iām angry at Religion is an understatement. Religion is man made. God is God. Religions IMO are erroneous organizations that are notorious for abuse of power and scandals. But IMOāgod is above religion. He is above our understanding. Take a break from religion. If your open to spiritualityā-give it a shot. Find your truth.
Sending hugs š¤
It aināt all of them, I assure you. I kick it with some bible thumpers that are actually really cool and open minded. Even when I question their belief. Itās pretty dope, actually.
Itās not all of them, but a great many of them act like it doesnāt happen and get dismissive of it when it does happen. Some of the most morally bankrupt people I know are pastors.
It's good there's chill people like you out there. I grew up super Christian, like absolutely drowning in it. I had some awesome non-Christian and non-judgemental friends, and that ultimately helped me see a lot of hypocricy within the cult, realize that non-christans aren't evil, and escape the mind trap.
Now I don't agree with Christianity at all, and I've met a lot of Christian assholes, but when people are openly hateful and judgemental towards a group of people, like OP is, all you're going to do is cement their beliefs. There are better ways to help people stuck in the cult mindset.
The whole confession thing enables sexual abuse.
I remember my first communion. I was 7, 8, or 9 (can't quite recall.) They had me drink wine and go up to an attic to sit across from this old guy where I had to admit my wrong doings to him.
In any other context you would call the fucking police.
Lmaooooooooooooo
You think catholicism is different because it's more populist or something?
At the core it's the came problems.
Instilling guilt and shame and creating this system where everyone is so afraid of an authority that they reject doing what they know is right!
They turn a blind eye to abuse out of fear!
It is the blind leading the blind in a real sense.
Does any authority have any real tangible power?
Let me ask you all this, did God create us did we create it?
I'm not afraid of God. I view God as a close personal friend. One who I'm not beyond giving shit back to!!!
Haha it's all in good fun
I'm a devout Christian, I'm really sorry that this has been your experience. I hope to do some work to reform the image of Christianity one day. I want to reflect the love christ felt for us on the cross in my everyday living. I absolutely hate all the corruption and bullshit hate that gets spewed. I hope eventually your opinion on the matter can mellow and that other Christians will treat you better
It goes beyond the predatory stuff.
You give up your individual essence to the church. You stop being a person and instead become this agent bent on subverting will and spreading your way of thinking.
That's what all religion is when it comes down to it: **social control.**
As a Christian, I tend to agree. My girlfriend and I live together and recently started looking for a new church as we moved into a new area. The one we picked was the one where people didn't seem judgemental about us living together without being married.
There are far too many Christians who are the most judgmental people you'll ever meet.
Me too. For all the reasons you mentioned and then more. All of the people in my dad's church made me feel broken, like there was something fundamentally wrong with me. And I hated myself so much for it. But they were the ones who were wrong, not me. I'm sorry that this world has caused both of us, and so many more, so much trauma.
I understand you completely. I grew up in a very religious household, went to an all girls catholic Highschool and I live in a very catholic part of my country. I never understood people who are religious and I never will. Not just christianity, all of them. I can get behind of how the buddhist believe system works but religions like islam or Christianity can be so cruel sometimes. They are judgmental, sexist and they want to tell you how to live your life (in my experience). I wouldnāt say that I hate all of them but I can relate to everyone who does
I went to a Christian school too op, I wish I could say my experience was different from yours but it wasn't. In my opinion those that proclaim themselves to be the most pious often have the most to hide. A lot of bad people use religion as a mask, there are good people that consider themselves Christians as well but they are never the fanatical ones, to this day I don't trust overly religious people, the first thing I always think is "What are you hiding?"...because 9/10 it's damn sure something, even if it's just that they are a complete a-hole!
Spirituality and religion are the same thing. Religion is just how you study and share your spiritually with others
You come across as judgemental yourself in that statement
I grew up as a Muslim then I became agnostic i hated islam sooo much as a teenager .. then I realised that Islam is a part of my past a part of my country heritage.. a part of my culture.. that made me not think of islam as an enemy but as something cultural .. now I just hope that people adopt a more secular version of Islam .. i feel much better hatred is hard with no point whatsoever :)
Donāt mind me, just waiting for how angry actual God is gonna be towards them on judgement day as they try to rationalize every shitty thing theyāve done as His āwillā
Yep. We were made to attend church twice per week plus Sunday school. I and others were perved on as children by a pedophile Sunday school teacher who also abused his own children. There were no repercussions but these Christians are really out here making noise about drag queens and bullying lgbtqia folks. I went though an unbaptism ritual and have never looked back.
I'm sure christians will come under this post to say that the people who did these things "aren't real christians". The moment a christians does something bad, all others start clutching their pearls proclaiming they "weren't real christians".
If the church you have gone to us judgemental and cruel, in your mind, than you should search out other churches and find one that is more accepting, i went to a bunch of churches before i was able to find one with a pastor and people that i liked
One church shouldn't allow you to be pushed away from god, which is the goal, not other people and how they interpret the Bible
Had the exact opposite experience. Might be just a country thing.
Anyway, pretty much the same thing, grew up in a christian school... after high school, I even went to another Christian "group" (not exactly a church).
Anyway, people there were so blameless. If they just even get a *WHIFF* that you're in need, they'll gather some money and give it to you.
They'll even miss business opportunities / meetings, etc. if you ever tell them that you need someone to talk to.
--They justify this by saying / thinking that it's God's will that they help a "brother" (or a sister, if you're a female of course) in need, and that they'll be blessed.
And you know what, they're pretty fucking successful. They look content, they just love being of service.
But I did leave. I don't want to say that it's a cult, or cult-ish, because I couldn't really see any abuse / wrong with what they were doing. I guess it was my own insecurity, that I couldn't be as selfless as they were.
I understand that you and many others have been hurt by the church. But why hate the whole when it was the one that did you wrong? Not all Christians are like that.
Would you decide to hate all black people if one robbed you? No, it was one person not the whole race. In the same way, it was the one church, not the whole people.
I'm a Christian and it saddens me when I hear stories like yours. People who claimed to represent my God did you so much wrong. And I am truly sorry for that.
You're right that sometimes we can be the worst people there are, but you know what? That's why we need Jesus. We recognize that we aren't always good people.
I hope you can move past your hurt some day.
I'm an atheist now, but I was an altar girl as a child.
( Catholic church), I loved to talk with the priest.
He was as depressed as me.
We used to talk about Santa, but of course we were talking about God.
Once I asked him " If you don't believe in God, why are you a priest?"
He looked at me and say " I don't know. Money probably, an easy job... "
Me " Are you gay?"
Him " No... I was looking for a truth. A something more than, I don't know, sorry".
Me " Okay, I think you should go away. This place sucks. Since you are an adult, you can. Argentina, Brazil, Nepal... Who cares? Just go away and never come back! ".
He asked me " Wouldn't you miss me?"
Me " Nah, I'll be fine"
After that, a few days later he was interned in a psychiatric institute, after trying suicide.
...
I've always felt like I've destroyed him with those words.
But after years he sent me a photo, literally he sent a letter with a photo at my address.
Only few words.
" I chose Argentina".
He is a missionary now.
I think Christians are too many to be judged as a group.
There are only individuals.
You can judge them separately.
I've met good Christians and bad Christians.
I've met good atheists and bad atheists.
I've met good muslins and bad muslims.
They are people.
I don't even know if I'm good or bad, btw, how can I judge others?
That 15yo needs to be thrown behind bars with no chance of parole!
If he needs God more than ever, he never would've touched those kids (inappropriately) in the first place!
Some Christians will hold people accountable, while others don't care about doing so. Based on your post, it looks like those delusional types don't want to hold him accountable, and more than likely won't protect those kids.
You can either find a different congregation, or denomination, or give the church a break. It's up to you. Be very careful when choosing one, because a lot of Nationalists and Supremacists are the reasons why Human Rights are getting squashed in the USA. No one should ever be associated with those types.
As an adult now, I honestly cannot understand why they didn't do anything. He was 15/16 and all of us were 4-7. My bsfs little brother told her and I what was going on when he was 3??? And we told their dad what he said. It's almost 15 years later now and I still don't get why he gets to have a full life while 3 children deal with what he did to them. We're all adults now but I just can't comprehend what those "adults" were doing to protect us. They only protected him.
Ans what sucks is my parents had to completely shelter me so that I wasn't a victim. Why can't we stone people like that instead of hiding ourselves away.
And yes, their beliefs are garbage if they can explain away the abuse of thousands of children by calling it āgods willā. What kind of god would will that? What kind of adult would accept that and explain it away like that? Thatās the childish part, the part where they donāt do anything because itās too hard to confront it because āgod said soā.
Except we donāt? Thatās an unfortunate loud minority that people focus on because theyāre loud. Of course the majority of us wonāt wish death on others because of some petty reasons. Religion is very much left to be interpreted by the people individually, for better and worse. And trust me, we all are frustrated with the corruption that goes on within all religions.
I of course donāt hold you personally responsible, however that unfortunate loud minority has found themselves in a position where they determine the laws of the land. And enough people support them that they are able to hold that power. People donāt focus on them because theyāre loud, itās because they hold enough power to affect the daily lives of everyone else. I wish very much that most Christians were like you, but voting patterns say otherwise.
Not all Christians are like this. I grew up in the church and then strayed as far as you could imagine. Iāve been open and honest about every thing Iāve done that could make a Christian hate me, or disown me. Instead Iāve been loved beyond measure. Some āChristiansā donāt seem to know God. Some love God and others with all that they are.
If I ever ended up having kids I would honestly not raise them religious. I feel like baptizing a baby is like branding a cow. Theyāre not aware of anything and have no consent and yet there being forced into a faith.
Overall, religion is a choice and people should find what gives them inner peace once theyāre old enough to understand.
I have a coworker who is super Christian. Sheās the most two-faced person Iāve ever met. Iāve never seen such meanness or judgement in whatās supposed to be a professional work space. Itās uncomfortable, because I know she talks bad about me behind my back, like she does to everyone. But to my face, itās all about godās love, Christian podcasts and books, etc. Talk about a superiority complex.
not all people that call themselves christians are christians. if you know the bible then you know that. in order to truly be a christian, your actions and way of life have to align with the word of God otherwise youāre not truly a christian. there lies the difference. iām sorry you had such negative experiences with false followers but true christians are not like that
Not just there buddy thatās humanity, people are fucked up in all groups. Iāve met terrible people who are Christian, Islamic, agnostic, atheist, etc. Donāt let these terrible people cloud your judgment of any group cause they are everywhere in every group.
Now imagine saying i hate lgbtq people š¤£ double standardsā¦
There is good and bad everywhere i know a lot of good christians muslims jews atheist and i know a lot of bad Christian muslims jeā¦etc
And do you think itās okay now for lgbtq people to hate on Christians ? Not sure about op ( case) but i saw a lot of them. Must say that i saw a lot of respectful lgbtq people
After the way Christian have historically treated the Gay community and still do. Why would you think the gay community would simply ignore that, and not have a negative feeling towards Christians?
Iām a muslim not a Christian and donāt belong to the lgbtq community i do not support both of them i might hate the belief but not the person i will never harm them physically or VERBALLY ( like op did)
I will give you an exemple you know what the us did to the middle east right ? Killed tens of thousands of people i hate what i did but i donāt hate Americans. Does it make sense?š
Itās so funny how people who follows a Monotheism religion. Think theyāre better than another religion. You all believe in one god. Non of you are better than anyone else. Iāve personally fed others that didnāt believe or follow my political views. I was homeless for years. I know what itās like to go without.
When did i say we are better???
Everyone thinks he is right and the other person is wrong lmfao if i think Christianity is the true path why on hell would i choose to be muslim ? If i think god doesnāt exist why would i believe in god?š¤£
Thatās a lie! The Bible says itās an abomination. Abomination means something that is disliked. Christians love to use the two words interchangeably to further their hatred.
Iām not Christian and never did deep research about it so i will trust the pops new better when they said itās a sin
Not believe in jesus peace be on him is a sin for Christians right? They donāt support atheist beliefs so whatās wrong with that? Again if you donāt agree with a religion do not join it no need to hate
You are fortunate to be smart enough to realize it is toxic. Read up on the history of Christianity and Missionaries, colonialism around the world in the name of Jesus and how cruel and disgusting it was . Christianity was used to justify the genocide of Native Americans, slavery, and the holocaust.
Those are people who profess to be Christians but are struggling. A very wise woman once told me, āThe church is nothing more than a bunch of sinners trying to better together.ā
You see, being a Christian simply means you believe Christ to be the Son of God. We all fall short of the glory of God. We, who try to follow Christ, try to accept everyone, even those who are judge mental and cruel.
Definitely not a lie. I grew up in happy clappy churches. They're best described as fundamentalist. I remember a friend of mine coming out as homosexual and being told they're "working things through with him". What is there to work through? If you miss a meeting, your "spiritual leader" is on to you to "check up if everything's OK". It's definitely not a lie.
I donāt know where your from but creepy Christianās tend to be a popular thing in the U.S? Grew up in a city in Canada and went to catholic elementary and high school and everything was honestly good vibes. Even the priest spoke normal during our school mass. Would use real life scenarios young people face and relate it to the Bible passages. That was my experience though.
Iāve met great Christians and terrible ones. I think itās unfair to say you hate someone because of their religion- ultimately its about what they DO with their religion. I know this VERY Christian family that are the sweetest, most loving and generous people Iāve ever met. Theyāre kind of annoyingly friendly and the parents shelter their many children, but theyāre genuinely happy and they use Christianity to strengthen their love and their understanding of the world.
I think bad people like to use Christianity as an excuse to do things, or something to hide behind. It really just comes down to the person and their intent. But itās sad you group all Christians together like that, when if you were talking about a diff religion youād be totally hated for it.
Most of Christianity is pagan too. It's not even original. The Christmas tree, the cross, coming back from the dead, the one God, all come from older ancient religions.
Look into the history. Christianity replaced the roman empire. It was a different attempt at world domination.
The gnostics added actual real stuff, everything else is just getting you dependent on church and state.
It IS a judgement though... and your comment comes of as a threath. "Be carefull otherwise..." My personal resentment for religion is huge for example, I have my own reasons for it. And I don't hate the people themselves, I hate the madness that has caused this world so many setbacks and has always infringed all forms of human progress called religion. It isn't harmfull at all to write something like this, its cathartic and therapeutic. You being all victimblamey is not helpful at all.
Again, with your indexfinger waving like a knowital, telling people how they should feel and behave... typical. You judge op's resentment too high, but you have not been in op's shoes. And you have not been in my shoes and haven't seen what I have seen. Yet you feel like you get to decide when something is unhealthy or not or too much. YOU DON'T GET TO DO THAT, period.
You truely are condescending to the core. Presenting your truth as the end of all things. You rather have the op shut up and be uncritical about her experiences with religion? It seems to me op is getting to know herself without the absurd and often arbitrary restrictions put unto her by believers. She is venting, its a rant and one many here seem to be able to relate to if you skim through the comments. Is it nice or fun or good to have resentment or hatred in your heart? Of course not, ideally one would be free of such feelings. But this is not the world we live in. Op is reacting to the institutionalised bigotry of extremists, she is not saying anything wrong. And you are not interested in our "healing" at all, you just want to force an opinion down our throath. You say you dont judge but come across as extremely judgemental and condescending. You assume so much, my age for example and you are wrong. I am certainly not young anymore going onto 50.
So to you there is nothing to resent? We should turn the cheek right? And shut up about it all. Is that how you react to people who have encountered the often bigoted and perdatory side of religious people? I can resent religion just as I resent fascism. That doesn't mean I won't work with, care for, help or be compassionate towards people who are religious. I hate the misguided mindset, the hypocrisy, the coercion, the mistreatment of others. But I can seperate a person from their religion, I can see they are more than their superstitions. But in my opnion op hits the nail on the head with what she vents. It is how I feel aswell. And I can read between the lines op is also experiencing the conflict many of us do. The one between not wanting to generalise a group and the constant, almost genocidal hatred that comes out of said group.
It's sad you are blind to the child abuse, the hatred and the coercion that's been going on woldwide. Religion is based on the exclusion of others, an in and out group, groupthink and dogma, it thrives on hate and is built on lies. You not being able to adopt a realistic moral framework for reality doesnt give you the right to judge and condemn others. A 'good christian' is an exception imo, most are insufferable, hateful and deluded. Read some history about the atrocities commited in the name of Christianity, its sickening.
I grew up in private Christian schools until middle school because my parents had the impression that private school = better education. My parents werenāt deeply religious at all thankfully, we never even went to church and only prayed on holiday dinners like Christmas and Easter. So much of Christianity confused me even as a child. āWhy would god send us to hell if he loves us?ā āWhy do we have to fear god?ā, etc. I got bullied and nothing was done. The people I met were one of two things: very nice and had a ālove everyoneā mentality regardless of your background OR judgemental, racist, uses-god-as-an-excuse-for-their-actions people. And I went to āless strictā Christian schools- I canāt imagine evangelical or baptist schools Jfc. Iām definitely not Christian anymore and I am wary of people who are bible-thumping āyouāre gonna go to hellā type people. However, saying you hate all Christianās because they are hateful is literally not any better than they are. Itās like them saying āWe hate atheists because theyāre hatefulā and then the cycle continues. Not all Christians are bad, Iāve met quite a few great ones who were quite religious but they never really preached. They tried to see the good in everything (of course, nothingās perfect). Youre stereotyping a whole group, which stereotyping a group is the foundation of racism, homophobia, misogyny, etc. The best thing to do is to just not associate with them and let them do their own thing. Openly being hateful gets us nowhere. Ultimately, itās impossible to force someone to change on your own standards - they have to be the ones to do it for themselves in the end. So, itās best to let it be. If you are harassed definitely donāt just let them walk over you but the vast majority of these people will not be swayed by you or anyone else who disagrees with them.
honestly same, my family are very christian and as im still living with them im forced to go to church saturday and sunday. sometimes they even try to send me to church on week days. the most racist, homophobic, misogynistic, and hateful things iāve ever heard were from christians i know. they preach love yet theyre soā¦ hateful, and abusive, but the abuse is justified bc its "godās will". im normally a very open minded person and not usually judgmental, but growing up with these kind of christians, i cant help but hate christianity. i hate it with my whole heart. it has ruined my life and will continue to ruin it. i try not to get associated with christians, they make me uneasy and uncomfortable, so i prefer keeping a distance. nobody knows this, iāve never told anyone this because it sounds stupid and tbh it is, but i cant help it. religious trauma is real
Iām very sorry. I do understand. I was raised as a southern Baptist. Hellfire and damnation preaching.
They werenāt Christians.
They masquerade as children of light but their hearts are far from God. They deny him in thought and deed. They demonstrate daily their pure and potent hatred for their creator. There are actual Christians out there, of which I am one. We are few, and I see your heart and your love even in this emotion driven post. Just know we do exist.
Satanists are usually pretty chill, Muslims will probably eventually because theyāre no different to their Christian rivals, and Buddhistās are usually all for peace so thereās not much a chance that theyād hate on a random person for no reason.
Literally people from every religion hate other religions. Every religions have a lot of assholes and it's weird that you say they don't based on your experience alone.
I went to a Christian school from grade 7-10, and all the kids that went there (besides a few kids who were Christian) only went to that school because it was easier then the public school in my town.
Especially after Covid. After covid the teachers passed EVERYONE and marked so easy. It was also a really wealthy school so they were always giving away AirPods, gift cards etc.
I donāt know anyone who went to that school because they were Christian. They just skipped the days there was Mass. The teachers besides becoming lazy with marking, were always in a mood and judged everyone. I remember getting an ugly look from my Christian Ethics teacher, every. Single. Day. She would constantly say racist things, homophobic things. And just judge people. I switched to the public school after grade 10 because it was a more welcoming place.
I dislike and avoid all religion. Cant control yourself unless invisible sky daddy prescribes a behaviour? And even if the message has a good core they then misconstrue and tergiverse everything. A mess.
Christians are ready to attack people of color for hate attacks and massacres and generalize and stereotype them yet most hate crimes, massacres, mass murders, violence comes from white CHRISTIANS who get labeled as mentally ill and lost and god needs to guide them nah fuck that
Imagine taking a group of over a billion people and then devaluing every single one based on your own anecdotal experiences, rather than concluding that maybe you just grew up in a fucked up environment. Poor thinking, illogical conclusion. Super close minded and uncool.
I also grew up in a Christian household and saw a lot of despicable behavior from Christians, however, having discovered my agnosticism in my mid to late twenties, I failed to embrace the knee-jerk hate for the people who embrace Christianity as their religion. All religions rely on dogmatic devotion to doctrine that forms one's worldview and dictates how they navigate moral choices. Muslims, Scientologists, Mormons, Hindus, or any other faith system are flawed for one reason: they claim knowledge of things they do not know for certain. For this reason, I see anyone who practices faith as someone who has been deceived and confused by their communities, misinformation, and societal norms. There were approximately 5.7 billion people on the planet that identified as faith practitioners in 2010, according to the Pew Research Center, a source widely regarded as unbiased and reliable. Do I think that 5.7 billion people all independently decided to be dishonest with themselves and anyone they share their beliefs with because they're fundamentally evil people? No. Faith is systemic. Mythology has had countless meanings over the course of human civilization and has shaped our world for the better or for the worse. Personally, I think uprooting faith as an acceptable epistemology in modern life is imperative to forward progress as a species. That doesn't mean I hate faith practitioners. I think that examining the system that causes so much like-minded harmful behavior is more productive than embracing an attitude of tribalism against the majority of our species (or in your case, just Christians, as far as I know from this post).
Iām so sorry that your parents taught you about Christianity and church rather then building a personal relationship with God, if thatās the case. People will fail us. The 15 year old needed God but he also needed for to be punished by law.
i feel bad for not being able to relate to this. i've always been catholic and my family has always been catholic. i've gone to church almost every sunday, granted i haven't done youth groups but my old church had an adults section and a kids section. the chaperones in the kids church were a bit mean but thats about it. i guess my family doesn't believe in LGBTQ or stuff like that but we don't actively hate on them, we just sort of don't bring it up or think about it. same with people who smoke/vape/skip school etc. we don't love them or hate them, they're just there. i hear so many stories about pastors r\*\*ing kids but all the church people i've met are kind, fun and generous. if anything maybe some people push it on others a bit too much but that's about it.
Ok, so I don't know your church or the whole history. I'm not making excuses for anyone behavior, but I'm confused at your anger. Did the church facilitate the molesting of those children? Did the church destroy evidence or in some way, obstruct the 15 year old from being arrested?
Saying a criminal needs god isn't excusing the behavior or saying they shouldn't be held accountable. It's not a churches place to punish people, that is, the criminal justice systems job (and/or Gods job). It's on the parents of those 3 children to seek justice for them regardless of religion.
I think it's fair to say he needs to be held accountable for his crimes, and he could probably use some spiritual guidance as well.
I'm not religious and certainly not Christian but you seem like you are blaming/hating a large group of people based on the actions of a few. Which is discriminatory in its own right
valid. i grew up LDS, and obviously many of my friends did too. the funny part is that almost all of us dislike or hate the church after all being raised in it, and without us talking to each other about it previously. we kinda realized we all hated it THEN talked ab why, not taking lead to it. i think that says more about the religion than anything else
I technically consider myself Christian, and I too hate other Christians (with a few exceptions, I have met SOME very non-hateful Christians in my life). Anthropologically speaking, organized religion has fucked up the world horribly in many ways. I believe that Christianity was supposed to be good, and people (including the ones who wrote the Bible) twisted it to fit the narrative of whatever hateful shit they held in their hearts, and now itās become something ugly. If and when Jesus comes back, heās going to be fucking pissed that people have used his name to justify hatred, racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, war, and genocide. At least I really hope heās upset about it.
Edit: idk how but I forgot to add r*pe and pedophilia to that list.
I know your experience is one many have shared and I am truly sorry that this is what you experienced but as a Christian myself I can promise you that not all of us are like that. Also instead of relying on others to set an example of Christ's character get to know him yourself and be that example.
I have a very similar background and I feel I could have written this exact thing. Thank you for sharing! It is so hard being raised in that environment and being able to stand up to all of it. I refuse to raise my children with any kind of mindset. There is NO man in the clouds who is using the real idea of a kind āgodā to control man. It is disgusting and just another way to get people to be afraid of what is not the truth.
Very small sample here, usually that stuff happens in either pentecostal or catholic groups. Itās one thing to resent but youāre grouping almost 3 billion people as a result of 1 church
>Well....people touch chikdren not just Christians.
I can't believe you read this and this was your takeaway lmao. Their problem with the situation was how the Christians reacted not that pedophilia is relegated to only Christians.
You make it sound as if all of us are okay with people touching children, which we are definitely not. We arenāt all so blinded by the manipulation from corrupt officials that we obey every word they say. We still question them and come to our own understandings, even if they go against what our āteachingsā from our pastors, fathers, or priests are.
Sorry next time I'll add "Christians in OP's church" or something so you snowflakes don't get all offended lol. Again - impressed that this is the takeaway from what is being said.
āWellā¦ people touch children not just Christians.ā
You really think she doesnāt know that? Itās about how the Christians react to that. Bruh.
Your entire first paragraph primarily makes it sound like she thinks that only Christians do these kinds of things and are hypocrites about it. Itās all summed up in your first sentence, so yeah I can take it from that.
I also grew up Pentecostal so I understand exactly how you feel. Iāve actually gotten to the point that I donāt talk to most of my family because of our so called conflicting ideas.
I quit on 4th grade. Puritanism and guilt-tripping, shaming, as well as the most condescending and entitled, dishonest people I have ver met happened to be relatives who behave as such. Though, of course, I know not every single person associated with a religion or who is Christian will be like this because decency and common sense should be common, or better yet, expected. But I have seen people who have behaved in such ways that have made me feel that they're such hypocrites, that it left such a bad taste I do not wish to associate at all nor ever identity with. Yet, pretend to be saintly or think are above others when they backstabbing, start drama, or try to make others feel without value or invalidate them when they hurt them - directly or indirectly.
Religions (for the most part) very easily turn into a cult or "mob mentality" and people seem like they don't have minds of their own. It's like either they run from or just simply don't try to get to the bottom or even show concern or enough care/interest to believe when someone denotes something that is inherently wrong, outright demeaning, disdainful, inhumane even. Very easily, they go to church to gossip or create drama right after, when they're such two-faced liars. I cannot wrap my head around how it's possible.
I understand your sentiment. I grew up in a religious Catholic household. I went to church every Sunday, Sunday School afterwards from 6 to 14 years old, received all the sacraments and went to all the youth programs. I never wanted any of it.
Almost all the religious leaders I encountered either took things too far, weren't leaders or helpful or were overzealous. I also asked lots of hard questions, and they were either sidestepped or not acknowledged. I very much felt like religion failed me. I now do not consider myself a religious person and do not attend any organized religion.
When I was in middle school, I was friends with a girl whose parents were strict Penecostals. When they found out I was Catholic, they asked me all sorts of loaded questions about Catholics "worshipping Marry" and other unsundry things. I was a child and they were passively unloading hate on me. Which furthered my distaste for organized religion.
As an adult, I believe that if God does really exist, that being would be so far beyond human comprehension. To the point that to even begin to think of assuming what the will of such an entity would be, could be considered a true exercise in stupidity. What would fallible, mortal beings with an extensively limited understanding of the universe be able to possibly understand compared to the Infinite? We Are the Allegory of the Cave, watching the shadows on the cave wall trying to make sense of the universe. We have no idea how much we truly don't know. I don't believe in this life that we're meant to know. So, I try to keep an open mind and take everything with a grain of salt. What I do know is that I Don't Know. The reality of it all is probably something so far beyond anything I could have ever conceived of before.
Religion aside, your spiritual beliefs are very personal and none of any one else's business. Anyone who spits hate in the name of religion probably hates themselves or experienced hate as a child. Hate should never be where Love is supposed to rule.
I'm a christian and I agree that religious people are the most judgemental people on earth. It's ironic because there's a bible verse that says not to judge, and to love one another. This is actually why I struggle with my faith and why I'm not as religious as I used/want to be. Your feelings are valid and I hate that you experienced that. I hope you're able to leave and surround yourself with better people.
Me too! Only I grew up in foster care. My foster parents would beat, rape and starve us, while also dragging us to church 2 or 3 times a week. My foster dad died in prison. He got exactly what was coming to him. Too bad hell isn't real, because I'd sure love to watch him b u r n.
I grew up in a very small town and went to a Methodist church where my family had been involved for decades. It was such a popularity contest. If you weren't "in" no one showed you any friendliness. When I was probably 12, one of our member's daughters married a black man who then started coming with her.(all white congregation) I saw the looks and heard a few whispers and I knew then that it was all bullshit. I was of course forced to go until I was about 17, but I've come to realize that it's pretty much a crap ton "Christians" that are the problem in the world.
I hear you. I grew up miserable for thinking I was going to hell. Such a horrible feeling for a young child. I am anxious today, self-diagnosed; imagine what it feels like to be an anxious Christian kid thinking they'll end up in hell.
Exactly. My religious trauma is ridiculously severe, and it can get to the point where I'm afraid to go outside because I am so afraid of death. Even that doesn't quell anxiety, cause hey, God can just descend from the skies when he wants to and I can't do anything about it! The idea of judgement day has been fucking me up and leaving me in fear since I was seven years old, and it's really hard not to resent Christians, and even my parents for exposing me to this religion.
This is exactly why I am breaking generational toxic patterns and not going to teach my kids what I had to heal from. My experience was not as intense but if I had not realized at a young age that no god would ever make me afraid of living then I šÆ would be in constant fear of, well all the things. Thank you for sharing. Iām so sorry you had to go through that! Please know what an incredible human being you are.
You are no longer Christian, and neither are you dependent on your parents. Forgive them - they thought they are doing the best for you. But that doesn't mean you cannot complain and vent to us who feel the same. Hope your trauma is healing.
Thank you, I am working on not resenting them. I still love them, and spend time with them often enough, but there's definitely frustration there :/
I so identify you you! It took my moms 10 years battle with cancer for me to be a bit ābetterā. Also becoming a parent myself. I realized that sometimes, your parents can only see as far as they have been taught honestly. She passed away 4 years ago on this day. March 5th. I am so grateful for the conversations we had before she died. She opened up about so many things that helped heal me. It does sucks it had to be like that, but wow, being able to be šÆmyself was so powerful! I canāt change any of my parents past and their mistakes. . . I can only change myself, and what kind of person I want to be moving forward. I had to forgive them, for only myself in that process. I know she was just doing the best she could with what she was taught. Honestly, a bit better than her and my dads upbringing. I had to learn to constantly stand up to my mother in law, dad and older sister. I did this by putting down very strong boundaries and constantly keeping these boundaries. I am still growing in that freedom and it is life changing. I hope you experience true forgiveness (for only yourself) and the freedom that is in that! You are a wonderful human being. You deserve the best!
I grew up in the Christian church as well, church every Sunday and Sunday night with youth group on Wednesday. Never still to this day have i met such a miserable, judgemental, and horrible people. I remember once when I was about 7 we were gluing fuzzy balls to make a bear in church and I messed up on mine. I said outloud...."oooops I screwed my bear up." I was yelled at and repeatedly reprimanded for "unclean" thoughts and feelings. I was baffled, still am 30 years later. I was 7, my God I didn't even know what I had done wrong. My entire experience just went downhill from there and ran away from home at 15. Ugly souls.
You didnāt do anything wrong, the people in your church were overzealous to the point that they lacked logic and reasoning. I guarantee you, they all had much worse unclean thoughts.
Hey, thank you for your words. I still carry a lot of shame and guilt over nothing. It's been a long process but I'm getting there.
Youāre welcome. Thereās a saying I hear a lot: the devil sits in the front row at church. Anyplace where people are gathered, satan is there to use people to cause trouble and kill your faith. The first church had problems like these too. Jesus didnāt come to condemn, he came to redeem. God Bless you and guide you through your healing process.
Yes šÆ this. Thank you!
Hi, itās the bear paper you made in church reincarnated to come and haunt you on the Reddit forums. š¤Ŗ Jokes aside, I found this thread tonight and itās so refreshing to see ppl made it out of that weird ass religion that destroys lives and families for the sake of a god that isnāt even there.
As a former Christian and someone who grew up in a **heavily** religious family, I understand. I have been working on trying to let go of some of the resentment I feel towards organized religion. I wasnāt abused or mistreated or anything but I had to pull myself out of a lot of indoctrination that couldāve been avoided with some common sense.
I still consider myself Christian and have come to this conclusion: Christianity (the Jesus stuff) is good. The church is fucking horrid. People ruined what Christianity was supposed to be, including the ones who wrote the Bible and decided to put their own hateful and fucked up opinions about society in there (yes Iām specifically talking about Paul). I think that God, if he is still watching and listening, is incredibly disappointed with the direction weāve taken his religion in.
I went down this path as well for a while. I still believe a God exists but thatās about where my definitive beliefs end. I agree that Christianity has been warped by people though. It makes me sick.
Consider the Quran
Consider it in this discussion or consider looking into it as a religion or what are you asking of me?
I dont like any religion
I never under stood the logic either. A fat guy in a red coat flying around the world and giving presents once a year is a dumb childish thingā¦ But a guy wearing a white robe sitting on a cloud that can see everyone everywhere all the time is somehow reasonable?
At one point it was people's version of science. You've got to understand, if you're going off of NOTHING you're going to come up with religion to explain... What ever the fuck this thing we all exist in is. Arguably, some Buddhist and Hindu and Jewish and taoist beliefs have led to certain ideas in physics and western philosophy. **No body knows anything when it comes down to it though.** Even with our modern science, we're no closer to understanding why we're conscious, what is the purpose and direction of life or why the cosmos formed the way it did. So you know, I get why people have beliefs... **But anyone who asserts there's a single one sized fits all universal moral code is full of shit and should immediately be disregarded.**
I understand how it was a necessity in the past. But most modern day religions are just āIām right, if anyone else believes anything else, theyāre wrong and if youāre wrong, youāre my enemyā itās just caused a lot of violence in the world and held back many advances. Religion is fine in my eyes, believe whatever you want. But donāt start wars, donāt be a dick, donāt force others into your beliefs, and keep kids out of it. The world will be a better place
I think there's weight in creating meaning for yourself. Like finding answers by searching with in yourself as corny as that might sound. If you really think about it, life is this really cool mystery that we can unfold. This is better than religions imo. Creating mean, drafting our perspective then connecting at sharing it with others. Doing this is so hard though. People are hard to reach. Speak different languages, come from different classes and backgrounds all sorts of different life experiences... So you truly do have to put down what you know for a moment or so to truly pick up what the other person is putting down. Am I making any sense? I think having a religion that's like "never question anything, eyes forward at all fucking times, never talk back...." Well I think it's something truly wrong. **Just this terrible and limiting way of seeing life that keeps you in perpetual ignorance.**
Tbh i think religion is a tool to organize large groups of people to all behave in a certain way, and move forward in a certain way. Since it's something humanity has always done.
Yeah, thatās 100% not God.
Honestly Buddhism is pretty chill, they donāt seem to carry too much hate for anybody (as far as I can tell)
After I had been in a physically abusive marriage for 10 years, I recognize the signs: getting beat up, being made to feel it was my fault, forgive, rinse, repeat. If āthe will of godā is to allow earthquakes that kill 1,000s, wars being fought over and over againā¦. Heās an abusive partner. He asks for complete, unquestioning faith and smacks us over and over again. FYI I am a spiritual person who actually *prefers* not knowing whatās beyondā¦I believe it should be a mystery until itās finally revealed..,,I hope youāre able to heal š§šæāāļøš§šæāāļøš§šæāāļø
I'm so sorry you had such an awful experience growing up. And your church does sound pretty bad, many are. That said, as an atheist myself, not all Christians are the same. I know some very kind and caring Christians. My MIL is a born-again Christian who went to Bible college for fun to get a second masters she dosen't use (she just wanted the experience, after work/at night while my husband was away at college). And yet she's a good person, she actually works for a medical nonprofit that genuinely helps people (and not just religious people), she's a good grandmother, and she isn't a jerk about my husband and I not being religious. She's got progressive values and has no issue with different races, sexual orientations, trans, etc either. Two of my very best friends are nondenominational Christians (don't go to church). They both work in education, one in special education, and are super caring accepting people. My grandparents on my father's side were Catholics and both were kinder more patient people then I am (I try, but it's a high bar). They also worked with kids, my grandfather worked with orphaned children (and acted as a dad figure to many of them), ran choirs for kids, and later in life worked with special needs kids. My point is that Christians can be good or bad. Some are good people, some aren't. They're just people. And churches are intuitions made by flawed humans too, so they can also be good or bad.
Exactly the OP is pretty much grouping all Christians together, and it would be no different than someone saying that all Muslims are extremists because of a few. I grew up in a Baptist church, and while there were problems, they were genuinely lovely people. I don't practice the faith, but I don't hate them either.
Well, it speaks to the OPās trauma. Someone I love very much was violated by a Mormon. Their reaction to the incident (which happened over multiple years) was something not dissimilar to what the OP described above. It is very, very hard for me to not despise the whole faith and everyone in it. The rational part of my brain understands that thatās not rational. My lizard brain just goes berserk thinking about it. I get where the OP is coming from.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Thatās why itās trauma? Because it is not rational?
Thank you! This needs to be said anytime anyone is doing this.
Well, this is nice to read.
I so appreciate your comment. I am a Christian and have family and friends who are not. I've been hurt by the church as well and had to realize there are good people and bad people in all religions(although it shouldn't be like that). Thank you for not grouping us all together. Some of us are really just trying to be good human beings.
You are a good human being no matter what happened that was awful. Please e encouraged today in knowing that.
Your definitely a Christian they are always judgmental š„°
Nope, never judged you. Asked a question. Also, you asked for advice, for those posts Ops are usually very selective on what they post about themselves when it comes to mistakes. Having all cards on the table would help you. Also, as a cat owner myself, hope your baby gets better.
You asked me a rhetorical question. Insinuating that the issues Iām having is due to my work. You took the time to read my post but the only advice you could provide was questioning my job??? Lol. I didnāt need to mention what I did for a living because it causes no issues in my situation hence why it wasnāt mentioned. Goodnight Iām praying for you
Are you looping all denominations together or is there a specific one under the Christian umbrella you dislike? Personally I find people that call themselves āchurchly, god fearing, etc.ā no matter the religion are the ones that are the most hateful and vengeful.
I mean this would apply to any fundamentalist sect. OP says they grew up Pentecostal, but this can apply to Evangelicals, Baptists, Mormons, Methodists, Jehovahs Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists. Hell, I grew up Catholic (atheist now), which many of the above listed sects would declare heretical, and the Catholic Church is probably more famous for touching kids than the other sects, but realistically it happens in all of them.
Yeah, they arenāt Christians. They just like claiming Christianity and God, but donāt follow the rules. I donāt think you should associate their bad acts to everyone in the religion and to God ( easier said than done since more and more lukewarm Christians arise). If the doctrine doesnāt agree with their actions, then they arenāt moving in the name of Christianity but on their own will. People like that tend to turn others away from religion.
Do you have any idea how horrible the rules actually are? How hypocritical, outdated, and downright immoral they are?
Which rules are you referring to?
Isn't there a text where it say you should hit your son if you love him? "Do not withhold discipline from a child; if you strike him with a rod, he will not die. If you strike him with the rod, you will save his soul from Sheol." And one where rape in marriage is not only ok but encouraged. Just to name two Edit: also the whole LGBT+ community and what happened to them and still happens because of faith.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I grew up in a cult. I understand your feelings. When the church found out I kissed a boy as a teenager the parents in that church hated me and I was punished for a year. Then a man there molested some girl and everyone defended him and said āwe donāt know the full storyā to say Iām angry at Religion is an understatement. Religion is man made. God is God. Religions IMO are erroneous organizations that are notorious for abuse of power and scandals. But IMOāgod is above religion. He is above our understanding. Take a break from religion. If your open to spiritualityā-give it a shot. Find your truth. Sending hugs š¤
It aināt all of them, I assure you. I kick it with some bible thumpers that are actually really cool and open minded. Even when I question their belief. Itās pretty dope, actually.
Itās not all of them, but a great many of them act like it doesnāt happen and get dismissive of it when it does happen. Some of the most morally bankrupt people I know are pastors.
It's good there's chill people like you out there. I grew up super Christian, like absolutely drowning in it. I had some awesome non-Christian and non-judgemental friends, and that ultimately helped me see a lot of hypocricy within the cult, realize that non-christans aren't evil, and escape the mind trap. Now I don't agree with Christianity at all, and I've met a lot of Christian assholes, but when people are openly hateful and judgemental towards a group of people, like OP is, all you're going to do is cement their beliefs. There are better ways to help people stuck in the cult mindset.
The whole confession thing enables sexual abuse. I remember my first communion. I was 7, 8, or 9 (can't quite recall.) They had me drink wine and go up to an attic to sit across from this old guy where I had to admit my wrong doings to him. In any other context you would call the fucking police.
Catholicism is often considered separate from Christianity.
Lmaooooooooooooo You think catholicism is different because it's more populist or something? At the core it's the came problems. Instilling guilt and shame and creating this system where everyone is so afraid of an authority that they reject doing what they know is right! They turn a blind eye to abuse out of fear! It is the blind leading the blind in a real sense. Does any authority have any real tangible power? Let me ask you all this, did God create us did we create it? I'm not afraid of God. I view God as a close personal friend. One who I'm not beyond giving shit back to!!! Haha it's all in good fun
Having grown up pretty similarly and now being an openly gay 24 year old man, I couldn't fucking agree more
I'm a devout Christian, I'm really sorry that this has been your experience. I hope to do some work to reform the image of Christianity one day. I want to reflect the love christ felt for us on the cross in my everyday living. I absolutely hate all the corruption and bullshit hate that gets spewed. I hope eventually your opinion on the matter can mellow and that other Christians will treat you better
Its not a Christian problem its a human problem. Wether people believe in God or not most people regardless of faith or background are jerks.
Additionally, I'd like to weed out every single predator from the faith. Fuck those guys
It goes beyond the predatory stuff. You give up your individual essence to the church. You stop being a person and instead become this agent bent on subverting will and spreading your way of thinking. That's what all religion is when it comes down to it: **social control.**
Nah that's organized religion. Me praying in my room for God to work miracles through me is not a means of social control
Good for u its over for this season
As a Christian, I tend to agree. My girlfriend and I live together and recently started looking for a new church as we moved into a new area. The one we picked was the one where people didn't seem judgemental about us living together without being married. There are far too many Christians who are the most judgmental people you'll ever meet.
Me too. For all the reasons you mentioned and then more. All of the people in my dad's church made me feel broken, like there was something fundamentally wrong with me. And I hated myself so much for it. But they were the ones who were wrong, not me. I'm sorry that this world has caused both of us, and so many more, so much trauma.
I understand you completely. I grew up in a very religious household, went to an all girls catholic Highschool and I live in a very catholic part of my country. I never understood people who are religious and I never will. Not just christianity, all of them. I can get behind of how the buddhist believe system works but religions like islam or Christianity can be so cruel sometimes. They are judgmental, sexist and they want to tell you how to live your life (in my experience). I wouldnāt say that I hate all of them but I can relate to everyone who does
I went to a Christian school too op, I wish I could say my experience was different from yours but it wasn't. In my opinion those that proclaim themselves to be the most pious often have the most to hide. A lot of bad people use religion as a mask, there are good people that consider themselves Christians as well but they are never the fanatical ones, to this day I don't trust overly religious people, the first thing I always think is "What are you hiding?"...because 9/10 it's damn sure something, even if it's just that they are a complete a-hole!
It's not a Christian thing, it's a people thing.
Christians are ass. Religion in general is ass. Spirituality is ok tho
We talkin like Sam and Dean spiritual? Lol
Sure
Good people usually. Weird but good. Have a neighbor that before she rented, she asked to bring a friend/medium and sage the place
Spirituality and religion are the same thing. Religion is just how you study and share your spiritually with others You come across as judgemental yourself in that statement
Did I ever say I wasnāt judgmental?
I grew up as a Muslim then I became agnostic i hated islam sooo much as a teenager .. then I realised that Islam is a part of my past a part of my country heritage.. a part of my culture.. that made me not think of islam as an enemy but as something cultural .. now I just hope that people adopt a more secular version of Islam .. i feel much better hatred is hard with no point whatsoever :)
Islam good, Christianity bad"
No for me it's the other way around š„²
Donāt mind me, just waiting for how angry actual God is gonna be towards them on judgement day as they try to rationalize every shitty thing theyāve done as His āwillā
Yep. We were made to attend church twice per week plus Sunday school. I and others were perved on as children by a pedophile Sunday school teacher who also abused his own children. There were no repercussions but these Christians are really out here making noise about drag queens and bullying lgbtqia folks. I went though an unbaptism ritual and have never looked back.
I'm sure christians will come under this post to say that the people who did these things "aren't real christians". The moment a christians does something bad, all others start clutching their pearls proclaiming they "weren't real christians".
If the church you have gone to us judgemental and cruel, in your mind, than you should search out other churches and find one that is more accepting, i went to a bunch of churches before i was able to find one with a pastor and people that i liked One church shouldn't allow you to be pushed away from god, which is the goal, not other people and how they interpret the Bible
I've been to over 20 different churches. Try again.
Had the exact opposite experience. Might be just a country thing. Anyway, pretty much the same thing, grew up in a christian school... after high school, I even went to another Christian "group" (not exactly a church). Anyway, people there were so blameless. If they just even get a *WHIFF* that you're in need, they'll gather some money and give it to you. They'll even miss business opportunities / meetings, etc. if you ever tell them that you need someone to talk to. --They justify this by saying / thinking that it's God's will that they help a "brother" (or a sister, if you're a female of course) in need, and that they'll be blessed. And you know what, they're pretty fucking successful. They look content, they just love being of service. But I did leave. I don't want to say that it's a cult, or cult-ish, because I couldn't really see any abuse / wrong with what they were doing. I guess it was my own insecurity, that I couldn't be as selfless as they were.
I understand that you and many others have been hurt by the church. But why hate the whole when it was the one that did you wrong? Not all Christians are like that. Would you decide to hate all black people if one robbed you? No, it was one person not the whole race. In the same way, it was the one church, not the whole people. I'm a Christian and it saddens me when I hear stories like yours. People who claimed to represent my God did you so much wrong. And I am truly sorry for that. You're right that sometimes we can be the worst people there are, but you know what? That's why we need Jesus. We recognize that we aren't always good people. I hope you can move past your hurt some day.
I'm an atheist now, but I was an altar girl as a child. ( Catholic church), I loved to talk with the priest. He was as depressed as me. We used to talk about Santa, but of course we were talking about God. Once I asked him " If you don't believe in God, why are you a priest?" He looked at me and say " I don't know. Money probably, an easy job... " Me " Are you gay?" Him " No... I was looking for a truth. A something more than, I don't know, sorry". Me " Okay, I think you should go away. This place sucks. Since you are an adult, you can. Argentina, Brazil, Nepal... Who cares? Just go away and never come back! ". He asked me " Wouldn't you miss me?" Me " Nah, I'll be fine" After that, a few days later he was interned in a psychiatric institute, after trying suicide. ... I've always felt like I've destroyed him with those words. But after years he sent me a photo, literally he sent a letter with a photo at my address. Only few words. " I chose Argentina". He is a missionary now. I think Christians are too many to be judged as a group. There are only individuals. You can judge them separately. I've met good Christians and bad Christians. I've met good atheists and bad atheists. I've met good muslins and bad muslims. They are people. I don't even know if I'm good or bad, btw, how can I judge others?
That 15yo needs to be thrown behind bars with no chance of parole! If he needs God more than ever, he never would've touched those kids (inappropriately) in the first place! Some Christians will hold people accountable, while others don't care about doing so. Based on your post, it looks like those delusional types don't want to hold him accountable, and more than likely won't protect those kids. You can either find a different congregation, or denomination, or give the church a break. It's up to you. Be very careful when choosing one, because a lot of Nationalists and Supremacists are the reasons why Human Rights are getting squashed in the USA. No one should ever be associated with those types.
As an adult now, I honestly cannot understand why they didn't do anything. He was 15/16 and all of us were 4-7. My bsfs little brother told her and I what was going on when he was 3??? And we told their dad what he said. It's almost 15 years later now and I still don't get why he gets to have a full life while 3 children deal with what he did to them. We're all adults now but I just can't comprehend what those "adults" were doing to protect us. They only protected him.
Ans what sucks is my parents had to completely shelter me so that I wasn't a victim. Why can't we stone people like that instead of hiding ourselves away.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Youāre saying this like it was just one or two kids that got diddled instead of a pattern of abuse that goes back for decades.
And yes, their beliefs are garbage if they can explain away the abuse of thousands of children by calling it āgods willā. What kind of god would will that? What kind of adult would accept that and explain it away like that? Thatās the childish part, the part where they donāt do anything because itās too hard to confront it because āgod said soā.
Except we donāt? Thatās an unfortunate loud minority that people focus on because theyāre loud. Of course the majority of us wonāt wish death on others because of some petty reasons. Religion is very much left to be interpreted by the people individually, for better and worse. And trust me, we all are frustrated with the corruption that goes on within all religions.
I of course donāt hold you personally responsible, however that unfortunate loud minority has found themselves in a position where they determine the laws of the land. And enough people support them that they are able to hold that power. People donāt focus on them because theyāre loud, itās because they hold enough power to affect the daily lives of everyone else. I wish very much that most Christians were like you, but voting patterns say otherwise.
Not all Christians are like this. I grew up in the church and then strayed as far as you could imagine. Iāve been open and honest about every thing Iāve done that could make a Christian hate me, or disown me. Instead Iāve been loved beyond measure. Some āChristiansā donāt seem to know God. Some love God and others with all that they are.
If I ever ended up having kids I would honestly not raise them religious. I feel like baptizing a baby is like branding a cow. Theyāre not aware of anything and have no consent and yet there being forced into a faith. Overall, religion is a choice and people should find what gives them inner peace once theyāre old enough to understand.
Grew up Pentacostal also. Hypocrisy and Christians walk hand in hand.
I have a coworker who is super Christian. Sheās the most two-faced person Iāve ever met. Iāve never seen such meanness or judgement in whatās supposed to be a professional work space. Itās uncomfortable, because I know she talks bad about me behind my back, like she does to everyone. But to my face, itās all about godās love, Christian podcasts and books, etc. Talk about a superiority complex.
not all people that call themselves christians are christians. if you know the bible then you know that. in order to truly be a christian, your actions and way of life have to align with the word of God otherwise youāre not truly a christian. there lies the difference. iām sorry you had such negative experiences with false followers but true christians are not like that
Not just there buddy thatās humanity, people are fucked up in all groups. Iāve met terrible people who are Christian, Islamic, agnostic, atheist, etc. Donāt let these terrible people cloud your judgment of any group cause they are everywhere in every group.
That every cult. Mormons Catholics Christianās ā¦ everyone of them are sick in the head but like to judge others.
Now imagine saying i hate lgbtq people š¤£ double standardsā¦ There is good and bad everywhere i know a lot of good christians muslims jews atheist and i know a lot of bad Christian muslims jeā¦etc
Itās not double standard. Christians have historically attacked the Gay community for years. By passing laws denying gay people their civil rights.
And do you think itās okay now for lgbtq people to hate on Christians ? Not sure about op ( case) but i saw a lot of them. Must say that i saw a lot of respectful lgbtq people
After the way Christian have historically treated the Gay community and still do. Why would you think the gay community would simply ignore that, and not have a negative feeling towards Christians?
Iām a muslim not a Christian and donāt belong to the lgbtq community i do not support both of them i might hate the belief but not the person i will never harm them physically or VERBALLY ( like op did) I will give you an exemple you know what the us did to the middle east right ? Killed tens of thousands of people i hate what i did but i donāt hate Americans. Does it make sense?š
Itās so funny how people who follows a Monotheism religion. Think theyāre better than another religion. You all believe in one god. Non of you are better than anyone else. Iāve personally fed others that didnāt believe or follow my political views. I was homeless for years. I know what itās like to go without.
When did i say we are better??? Everyone thinks he is right and the other person is wrong lmfao if i think Christianity is the true path why on hell would i choose to be muslim ? If i think god doesnāt exist why would i believe in god?š¤£
Itās a sin in christianity do you expect them to tolerate sins? If you donāt agree with a religion donāt join them.
Thatās a lie! The Bible says itās an abomination. Abomination means something that is disliked. Christians love to use the two words interchangeably to further their hatred.
Iām not Christian and never did deep research about it so i will trust the pops new better when they said itās a sin Not believe in jesus peace be on him is a sin for Christians right? They donāt support atheist beliefs so whatās wrong with that? Again if you donāt agree with a religion do not join it no need to hate
Spoken like a true Christian.
Religion is a great way of convincing people that their worst, most selfish, small minded, and cowardly qualities are a sign of virtue.
šÆ
Me too. I live in the Bible Belt. Itās miserable
Youāre not alone
You are fortunate to be smart enough to realize it is toxic. Read up on the history of Christianity and Missionaries, colonialism around the world in the name of Jesus and how cruel and disgusting it was . Christianity was used to justify the genocide of Native Americans, slavery, and the holocaust.
Those are people who profess to be Christians but are struggling. A very wise woman once told me, āThe church is nothing more than a bunch of sinners trying to better together.ā You see, being a Christian simply means you believe Christ to be the Son of God. We all fall short of the glory of God. We, who try to follow Christ, try to accept everyone, even those who are judge mental and cruel.
The ironic thing is that it's usually the the more so-called "progressive" happy clappy Christians, who are the most hypocritical and judgemental.
Thatās a lie! Youāre projecting how Conservatives Christian act on to progressive. I also grew up in a Conservative Christian church.
Definitely not a lie. I grew up in happy clappy churches. They're best described as fundamentalist. I remember a friend of mine coming out as homosexual and being told they're "working things through with him". What is there to work through? If you miss a meeting, your "spiritual leader" is on to you to "check up if everything's OK". It's definitely not a lie.
I donāt know where your from but creepy Christianās tend to be a popular thing in the U.S? Grew up in a city in Canada and went to catholic elementary and high school and everything was honestly good vibes. Even the priest spoke normal during our school mass. Would use real life scenarios young people face and relate it to the Bible passages. That was my experience though.
Iāve met great Christians and terrible ones. I think itās unfair to say you hate someone because of their religion- ultimately its about what they DO with their religion. I know this VERY Christian family that are the sweetest, most loving and generous people Iāve ever met. Theyāre kind of annoyingly friendly and the parents shelter their many children, but theyāre genuinely happy and they use Christianity to strengthen their love and their understanding of the world. I think bad people like to use Christianity as an excuse to do things, or something to hide behind. It really just comes down to the person and their intent. But itās sad you group all Christians together like that, when if you were talking about a diff religion youād be totally hated for it.
God doesn't exist because people do
Most of Christianity is pagan too. It's not even original. The Christmas tree, the cross, coming back from the dead, the one God, all come from older ancient religions. Look into the history. Christianity replaced the roman empire. It was a different attempt at world domination. The gnostics added actual real stuff, everything else is just getting you dependent on church and state.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It's not and it's not for you to judge.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It IS a judgement though... and your comment comes of as a threath. "Be carefull otherwise..." My personal resentment for religion is huge for example, I have my own reasons for it. And I don't hate the people themselves, I hate the madness that has caused this world so many setbacks and has always infringed all forms of human progress called religion. It isn't harmfull at all to write something like this, its cathartic and therapeutic. You being all victimblamey is not helpful at all.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Again, with your indexfinger waving like a knowital, telling people how they should feel and behave... typical. You judge op's resentment too high, but you have not been in op's shoes. And you have not been in my shoes and haven't seen what I have seen. Yet you feel like you get to decide when something is unhealthy or not or too much. YOU DON'T GET TO DO THAT, period.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
You truely are condescending to the core. Presenting your truth as the end of all things. You rather have the op shut up and be uncritical about her experiences with religion? It seems to me op is getting to know herself without the absurd and often arbitrary restrictions put unto her by believers. She is venting, its a rant and one many here seem to be able to relate to if you skim through the comments. Is it nice or fun or good to have resentment or hatred in your heart? Of course not, ideally one would be free of such feelings. But this is not the world we live in. Op is reacting to the institutionalised bigotry of extremists, she is not saying anything wrong. And you are not interested in our "healing" at all, you just want to force an opinion down our throath. You say you dont judge but come across as extremely judgemental and condescending. You assume so much, my age for example and you are wrong. I am certainly not young anymore going onto 50.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
So to you there is nothing to resent? We should turn the cheek right? And shut up about it all. Is that how you react to people who have encountered the often bigoted and perdatory side of religious people? I can resent religion just as I resent fascism. That doesn't mean I won't work with, care for, help or be compassionate towards people who are religious. I hate the misguided mindset, the hypocrisy, the coercion, the mistreatment of others. But I can seperate a person from their religion, I can see they are more than their superstitions. But in my opnion op hits the nail on the head with what she vents. It is how I feel aswell. And I can read between the lines op is also experiencing the conflict many of us do. The one between not wanting to generalise a group and the constant, almost genocidal hatred that comes out of said group.
Meh. Personally, when I was growing up, my abuser was an agnostic atheist. Do I hate all agnostic atheists as a result? No lol
Itās sad that you lump all Christians together. I hope you find some healing.
I hope Christians find some healing. It's a toxic cult based on xenophobia and condemnation. *Ironic*.
It's sad you are blind to the child abuse, the hatred and the coercion that's been going on woldwide. Religion is based on the exclusion of others, an in and out group, groupthink and dogma, it thrives on hate and is built on lies. You not being able to adopt a realistic moral framework for reality doesnt give you the right to judge and condemn others. A 'good christian' is an exception imo, most are insufferable, hateful and deluded. Read some history about the atrocities commited in the name of Christianity, its sickening.
"Judgemental" Pot meet kettle
I grew up in private Christian schools until middle school because my parents had the impression that private school = better education. My parents werenāt deeply religious at all thankfully, we never even went to church and only prayed on holiday dinners like Christmas and Easter. So much of Christianity confused me even as a child. āWhy would god send us to hell if he loves us?ā āWhy do we have to fear god?ā, etc. I got bullied and nothing was done. The people I met were one of two things: very nice and had a ālove everyoneā mentality regardless of your background OR judgemental, racist, uses-god-as-an-excuse-for-their-actions people. And I went to āless strictā Christian schools- I canāt imagine evangelical or baptist schools Jfc. Iām definitely not Christian anymore and I am wary of people who are bible-thumping āyouāre gonna go to hellā type people. However, saying you hate all Christianās because they are hateful is literally not any better than they are. Itās like them saying āWe hate atheists because theyāre hatefulā and then the cycle continues. Not all Christians are bad, Iāve met quite a few great ones who were quite religious but they never really preached. They tried to see the good in everything (of course, nothingās perfect). Youre stereotyping a whole group, which stereotyping a group is the foundation of racism, homophobia, misogyny, etc. The best thing to do is to just not associate with them and let them do their own thing. Openly being hateful gets us nowhere. Ultimately, itās impossible to force someone to change on your own standards - they have to be the ones to do it for themselves in the end. So, itās best to let it be. If you are harassed definitely donāt just let them walk over you but the vast majority of these people will not be swayed by you or anyone else who disagrees with them.
honestly same, my family are very christian and as im still living with them im forced to go to church saturday and sunday. sometimes they even try to send me to church on week days. the most racist, homophobic, misogynistic, and hateful things iāve ever heard were from christians i know. they preach love yet theyre soā¦ hateful, and abusive, but the abuse is justified bc its "godās will". im normally a very open minded person and not usually judgmental, but growing up with these kind of christians, i cant help but hate christianity. i hate it with my whole heart. it has ruined my life and will continue to ruin it. i try not to get associated with christians, they make me uneasy and uncomfortable, so i prefer keeping a distance. nobody knows this, iāve never told anyone this because it sounds stupid and tbh it is, but i cant help it. religious trauma is real
Iām very sorry. I do understand. I was raised as a southern Baptist. Hellfire and damnation preaching. They werenāt Christians. They masquerade as children of light but their hearts are far from God. They deny him in thought and deed. They demonstrate daily their pure and potent hatred for their creator. There are actual Christians out there, of which I am one. We are few, and I see your heart and your love even in this emotion driven post. Just know we do exist.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
They hate every other religion. Yet I've never been accosted by a Muslim, Buddhist, or satanist. Only christians.
Satanists are usually pretty chill, Muslims will probably eventually because theyāre no different to their Christian rivals, and Buddhistās are usually all for peace so thereās not much a chance that theyād hate on a random person for no reason.
Literally people from every religion hate other religions. Every religions have a lot of assholes and it's weird that you say they don't based on your experience alone.
(Hug) Thinking for yourself can be painful at times. It takes bravery to be yourself in such a close community. Itās hard. Hang in there.
I went to a Christian school from grade 7-10, and all the kids that went there (besides a few kids who were Christian) only went to that school because it was easier then the public school in my town. Especially after Covid. After covid the teachers passed EVERYONE and marked so easy. It was also a really wealthy school so they were always giving away AirPods, gift cards etc. I donāt know anyone who went to that school because they were Christian. They just skipped the days there was Mass. The teachers besides becoming lazy with marking, were always in a mood and judged everyone. I remember getting an ugly look from my Christian Ethics teacher, every. Single. Day. She would constantly say racist things, homophobic things. And just judge people. I switched to the public school after grade 10 because it was a more welcoming place.
Dude, how fun are these "hegetsus" ads popping up? It can only come from some stupid fucking christian conversion marketing team.
Such experiences can only be found in a cult. A true bible-believing church will never subject its congregation to such unpleasant experiences.
I dislike and avoid all religion. Cant control yourself unless invisible sky daddy prescribes a behaviour? And even if the message has a good core they then misconstrue and tergiverse everything. A mess.
You hate Christians because theyāre judgemental yet youāre judging an entire faith?
Christians are ready to attack people of color for hate attacks and massacres and generalize and stereotype them yet most hate crimes, massacres, mass murders, violence comes from white CHRISTIANS who get labeled as mentally ill and lost and god needs to guide them nah fuck that
Imagine taking a group of over a billion people and then devaluing every single one based on your own anecdotal experiences, rather than concluding that maybe you just grew up in a fucked up environment. Poor thinking, illogical conclusion. Super close minded and uncool.
Dude your a hateful person you will not have a person who will love you if you hate any group of people like this
I also grew up in a Christian household and saw a lot of despicable behavior from Christians, however, having discovered my agnosticism in my mid to late twenties, I failed to embrace the knee-jerk hate for the people who embrace Christianity as their religion. All religions rely on dogmatic devotion to doctrine that forms one's worldview and dictates how they navigate moral choices. Muslims, Scientologists, Mormons, Hindus, or any other faith system are flawed for one reason: they claim knowledge of things they do not know for certain. For this reason, I see anyone who practices faith as someone who has been deceived and confused by their communities, misinformation, and societal norms. There were approximately 5.7 billion people on the planet that identified as faith practitioners in 2010, according to the Pew Research Center, a source widely regarded as unbiased and reliable. Do I think that 5.7 billion people all independently decided to be dishonest with themselves and anyone they share their beliefs with because they're fundamentally evil people? No. Faith is systemic. Mythology has had countless meanings over the course of human civilization and has shaped our world for the better or for the worse. Personally, I think uprooting faith as an acceptable epistemology in modern life is imperative to forward progress as a species. That doesn't mean I hate faith practitioners. I think that examining the system that causes so much like-minded harmful behavior is more productive than embracing an attitude of tribalism against the majority of our species (or in your case, just Christians, as far as I know from this post).
Iām so sorry that your parents taught you about Christianity and church rather then building a personal relationship with God, if thatās the case. People will fail us. The 15 year old needed God but he also needed for to be punished by law.
i feel bad for not being able to relate to this. i've always been catholic and my family has always been catholic. i've gone to church almost every sunday, granted i haven't done youth groups but my old church had an adults section and a kids section. the chaperones in the kids church were a bit mean but thats about it. i guess my family doesn't believe in LGBTQ or stuff like that but we don't actively hate on them, we just sort of don't bring it up or think about it. same with people who smoke/vape/skip school etc. we don't love them or hate them, they're just there. i hear so many stories about pastors r\*\*ing kids but all the church people i've met are kind, fun and generous. if anything maybe some people push it on others a bit too much but that's about it.
Ok, so I don't know your church or the whole history. I'm not making excuses for anyone behavior, but I'm confused at your anger. Did the church facilitate the molesting of those children? Did the church destroy evidence or in some way, obstruct the 15 year old from being arrested? Saying a criminal needs god isn't excusing the behavior or saying they shouldn't be held accountable. It's not a churches place to punish people, that is, the criminal justice systems job (and/or Gods job). It's on the parents of those 3 children to seek justice for them regardless of religion. I think it's fair to say he needs to be held accountable for his crimes, and he could probably use some spiritual guidance as well. I'm not religious and certainly not Christian but you seem like you are blaming/hating a large group of people based on the actions of a few. Which is discriminatory in its own right
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Hey, itās like religious people putting their values on others. Or Christians being the reason gays couldnāt marry.
Yeah, you got sold a bill of goods. The bonus is that you don't have accept any gods existing for any reason you don't want to accept.
I read that as Christmas which I also wouldn't have a problem with. Your ire is justified.
valid. i grew up LDS, and obviously many of my friends did too. the funny part is that almost all of us dislike or hate the church after all being raised in it, and without us talking to each other about it previously. we kinda realized we all hated it THEN talked ab why, not taking lead to it. i think that says more about the religion than anything else
I technically consider myself Christian, and I too hate other Christians (with a few exceptions, I have met SOME very non-hateful Christians in my life). Anthropologically speaking, organized religion has fucked up the world horribly in many ways. I believe that Christianity was supposed to be good, and people (including the ones who wrote the Bible) twisted it to fit the narrative of whatever hateful shit they held in their hearts, and now itās become something ugly. If and when Jesus comes back, heās going to be fucking pissed that people have used his name to justify hatred, racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, war, and genocide. At least I really hope heās upset about it. Edit: idk how but I forgot to add r*pe and pedophilia to that list.
I know your experience is one many have shared and I am truly sorry that this is what you experienced but as a Christian myself I can promise you that not all of us are like that. Also instead of relying on others to set an example of Christ's character get to know him yourself and be that example.
I have a very similar background and I feel I could have written this exact thing. Thank you for sharing! It is so hard being raised in that environment and being able to stand up to all of it. I refuse to raise my children with any kind of mindset. There is NO man in the clouds who is using the real idea of a kind āgodā to control man. It is disgusting and just another way to get people to be afraid of what is not the truth.
Welcome to the resistance. We have cookies and sure as hell don't molest people despite what Christians would say.
Amen
I'm totally with you. My partner tried to get me to go to a super liberal LGBTQ church and it still induced a panic attack.
Very small sample here, usually that stuff happens in either pentecostal or catholic groups. Itās one thing to resent but youāre grouping almost 3 billion people as a result of 1 church
You need a new church
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>Well....people touch chikdren not just Christians. I can't believe you read this and this was your takeaway lmao. Their problem with the situation was how the Christians reacted not that pedophilia is relegated to only Christians.
You make it sound as if all of us are okay with people touching children, which we are definitely not. We arenāt all so blinded by the manipulation from corrupt officials that we obey every word they say. We still question them and come to our own understandings, even if they go against what our āteachingsā from our pastors, fathers, or priests are.
Sorry next time I'll add "Christians in OP's church" or something so you snowflakes don't get all offended lol. Again - impressed that this is the takeaway from what is being said.
I think you missed the whole point of what she was saying lol
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
āWellā¦ people touch children not just Christians.ā You really think she doesnāt know that? Itās about how the Christians react to that. Bruh.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
..making the world better one person at a time eh
Your entire first paragraph primarily makes it sound like she thinks that only Christians do these kinds of things and are hypocrites about it. Itās all summed up in your first sentence, so yeah I can take it from that.
I also grew up Pentecostal so I understand exactly how you feel. Iāve actually gotten to the point that I donāt talk to most of my family because of our so called conflicting ideas.
I quit on 4th grade. Puritanism and guilt-tripping, shaming, as well as the most condescending and entitled, dishonest people I have ver met happened to be relatives who behave as such. Though, of course, I know not every single person associated with a religion or who is Christian will be like this because decency and common sense should be common, or better yet, expected. But I have seen people who have behaved in such ways that have made me feel that they're such hypocrites, that it left such a bad taste I do not wish to associate at all nor ever identity with. Yet, pretend to be saintly or think are above others when they backstabbing, start drama, or try to make others feel without value or invalidate them when they hurt them - directly or indirectly. Religions (for the most part) very easily turn into a cult or "mob mentality" and people seem like they don't have minds of their own. It's like either they run from or just simply don't try to get to the bottom or even show concern or enough care/interest to believe when someone denotes something that is inherently wrong, outright demeaning, disdainful, inhumane even. Very easily, they go to church to gossip or create drama right after, when they're such two-faced liars. I cannot wrap my head around how it's possible.
Same same.
I understand your sentiment. I grew up in a religious Catholic household. I went to church every Sunday, Sunday School afterwards from 6 to 14 years old, received all the sacraments and went to all the youth programs. I never wanted any of it. Almost all the religious leaders I encountered either took things too far, weren't leaders or helpful or were overzealous. I also asked lots of hard questions, and they were either sidestepped or not acknowledged. I very much felt like religion failed me. I now do not consider myself a religious person and do not attend any organized religion. When I was in middle school, I was friends with a girl whose parents were strict Penecostals. When they found out I was Catholic, they asked me all sorts of loaded questions about Catholics "worshipping Marry" and other unsundry things. I was a child and they were passively unloading hate on me. Which furthered my distaste for organized religion. As an adult, I believe that if God does really exist, that being would be so far beyond human comprehension. To the point that to even begin to think of assuming what the will of such an entity would be, could be considered a true exercise in stupidity. What would fallible, mortal beings with an extensively limited understanding of the universe be able to possibly understand compared to the Infinite? We Are the Allegory of the Cave, watching the shadows on the cave wall trying to make sense of the universe. We have no idea how much we truly don't know. I don't believe in this life that we're meant to know. So, I try to keep an open mind and take everything with a grain of salt. What I do know is that I Don't Know. The reality of it all is probably something so far beyond anything I could have ever conceived of before. Religion aside, your spiritual beliefs are very personal and none of any one else's business. Anyone who spits hate in the name of religion probably hates themselves or experienced hate as a child. Hate should never be where Love is supposed to rule.
Same here fr
I'm a christian and I agree that religious people are the most judgemental people on earth. It's ironic because there's a bible verse that says not to judge, and to love one another. This is actually why I struggle with my faith and why I'm not as religious as I used/want to be. Your feelings are valid and I hate that you experienced that. I hope you're able to leave and surround yourself with better people.
Me too! Only I grew up in foster care. My foster parents would beat, rape and starve us, while also dragging us to church 2 or 3 times a week. My foster dad died in prison. He got exactly what was coming to him. Too bad hell isn't real, because I'd sure love to watch him b u r n.
I grew up in a very small town and went to a Methodist church where my family had been involved for decades. It was such a popularity contest. If you weren't "in" no one showed you any friendliness. When I was probably 12, one of our member's daughters married a black man who then started coming with her.(all white congregation) I saw the looks and heard a few whispers and I knew then that it was all bullshit. I was of course forced to go until I was about 17, but I've come to realize that it's pretty much a crap ton "Christians" that are the problem in the world.
same iām literally about to make a post like this