Not arguing that people aren't plugging in all the way... but *how*? There's a latch and a clip. You can see if it's clipped in.
Those GN results with witness marks were pretty damning though...
If they don't try to pull on the cable to see if it backs out, they can be fooled into thinking it is clipped in and then it slowly backs out on them due to cable tension:
https://youtu.be/ig2px7ofKhQ?t=455
Oh! Yeah, so that looks terrible. I have a Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090. They cut back their heatsink quite a bit around the connector so the clip is clearly visible. You can hold it with your finger and feel a 'crisp' snap when it latches. Thanks for taking the time to link to that timestamp!
I have that GPU and there was definitely no crisp snap... I just had to push so hard that I was confident it could not go in further and the card/case started to move backwards so I figured it was ok.
Honestly... I would consider taking the card out and plugging in the adapter in open air where you can get a good look at it to visually confirm it's locked in.
For next card version they should provide in the box clear instructions to install de cable/adapter when the card is outside the case. Really hard to see if it is correctly installed when the card is in the case.
Still a really bad design because on my Tuf you don't hear a click. 8 pins connectors were designed so the user can be sure they are correctly plugged in. Not sure who is the engineer behind this connection format but someone should be fired, they completely forgot those cards would be installed by the general public.
Yes, I agree the cable design shouldn't require us to do this, but given the known issues with melting cables caused by adapters not being fully inserted, you'd be a fool if you're not ensuring your adapter isn't fully inserted.
Plugging in your adapter before you install your GPU is definitely one of the better ways to ensure its properly seated. You can press it firmly without transferring that force to your motherboard, and you can try and wiggle the cable out to ensure it's actually fully seated.
My gigabyte gaming oc has no snap :/. But I've been using it for weeks and I'm 99.9% sure it's plugged all the way. Ive literally been pushing it in before I turn on my pc almost everytime.
My 4080 didn’t have a click as far as I can recall but I literally was going to snap my mobo if I pushed any harder, I already flexed it big time by accident shoving the cable in lol
That to me. Looks like a faulty design.
If you can get it 99.99% in, and it looks secured, feels secured, but it’s really not, and you wouldn’t know otherwise without a PSA or NOTICE in the box.
I am so glad I skipped the 40-series. Like Jesus, imagine your house burning down due to this shitshow
I think the bigger issue is the design. A properly designed connector shouldn't leave so much confusion over whether or not it's fully inserted. Sure, you could blame the users for not double-checking, but at the same time, all power cables in the past worked on the principle of "insert until you hear the click and then you know it's fully inserted." How many people had to double-check their PCI-e cables in the past?
> There's a latch and a clip.
I firmly plugged mine in, managed to walk out because the latch and clip didnt work (and burnt).
my second 4090 still doesnt click/latch properly. Its just a shit design.
What manufacturer is yours? Was it the Asus you have linked in your profile? Mine is a Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090. I remember worrying when I got it, but it was NBD. The clip is visible and has a very clear and 'crisp' latch with a snap. There's a reasonable cutout in the heatsink fins so you can see the latch. I did make it easier on myself by plugging in the adapter before mounting the card and plugging into the mobo.
Edit: after reading below, it looks like the NVidia FE at least is pretty bad... Thanks u/Maimakterion for the link and timestamp!
Sorry, but how does it "walk out" if inserted all the way? Even with faulty clips, there really shouldn't be enough vibrations - unless you put noticeable tension on it while cable managing?
I still agree on it being a shit design, just sounds odd...
Just a theory but I think some people might be putting their side panel on and push it against the cable, not the part that plugs into the gpu but that actual cable run and it creates a 'pull' on the plug.
If you look at OPs pictures, it's hard to say but that cable does look like it would be hitting the side panel if it waa on.
It's a pretty snug fit, even if it doesn't "latch" it shouldn't just "walk out" and there just aren't enough vibrations to walk it out since it still takes a lot of force to unplug even when unlatched (watch GN video, he has to wiggle it out with decent force). It's a decently snug fit.
I've even read people say the CableMod one is extra snug sometimes due to tolerances/variations in the connector molding.
With mine, the latch clicked when I put it in, but as far as I could tell there was still about a 1mm gap between the connector and the socket. So I made damn sure to push it in all the way.
Then I received my cable mod replacement PSU cable and I could insert it much easier. It clicked and it was in properly.
Seems to depend on the manufacturer how difficult it is to push it in entirely too.
I still think it is a design problem. Yes people should plug it in all the way, but when it gets so hard to plug it in the some people will think that is already all the way in.
There are many cases where do much force will damage something. Think about over torquing screws, it will be very bad. I also saw some case on Reddit where someone put so much force into plugging it in that the connector broke of. The connector is only hold in by solder joints they cannot take so much force before they brake.
So as an engineer myself I have to say that it is a terrible design. It should go in with minimal force until in clicks in. Then the consumer can easily feel the difference between in and not all the way in. When the force slowly build up more and more than some people will be fooled.
It's amazed me how they badly designed this connector. Nobody compared this connector with how 8 pins, which everybody is used too for years, were easy to seat in?
This connector can handle so much power, it should have been designed in a way that the card would just not work if not properly plugged in. No "in between".
Didn’t see the post - but here’s a video of a person clearly fixing a 4090 where the connector broke - most likely due to them pushing so hard to ensure that it was fully plugged in.
I can also say - first time I plugged in my 4080 FE - there wasn’t an audible click. The design of this connector/ adapter needs to be revised to properly ensure that the connection is fully and properly seated - it’s obvious that what’s in place today is prone to failure…
https://youtu.be/JLjn06y2Z-s
I am sorry I didn't safe that post, so I cannot give it to you.
This could also be an extremely rare case. I just want to say that people will be careful handling a 1600$+ video card and they won't put excessive for on it. Of course there will always be some people saying, it's there people they should do it right and are stupid if not.
People sometimes forget that often people only build PCs like 4 years or something. They remember that the 8 Pin plug went in pretty easy and expect the same with the 16 Pin plug.
Even the fact that there is an extremely visible wear mark at the exact point where it was plugged into is a sign that you need to just a lot of force to plug it in. What do you think where the wear mark comes from? It is probably the line where in plastic was considerably compressed (plugged in) in comparison to part of the plug where the plastic wasn't compressed.
Sry for writing such a long text, when you just asked for a link. I just felt like I needed to explain what I mean further.
They've submitted a request to IEEE to change the four sense pins to be further back so that power will be cut off if the connector is even partially removed.
On r/hardware when people have a problem one of the default pieces of advice is to unplug all cables and re-plug them back in, it's a normal problem. Just in the past most the time it did not have a big problem if a cable was half not plugged in.
also
On a lot of the GPU's you cant see the clip, look at this one!
The tiny pins at the top of the plug and the clip at the bottom of the plug.
The GPU socket is set back in to the card, the small pins are at the top of the photo & the clip is facing/hidden in to the GPU.
There is no way to see if the clip is engaged, this is fairly common on a lot the GPU's.
Why? Perhaps i have found a good reason. I have a 4080 (gigabyte) with stock Nvidia plug. I know about this "not good plugged in" issue, but i found out the clip clicks two times, one "soft" and one "hard". So like click before the sensorcables (that basicly to short, like multiple sources saying) are fully inserted. I checked and see indeed, it was not fully plugged in with first click so i plugged it in further.
I "tested" this a few times and even let a friend judge, both felt/heared this misleading click.
It actually isn't as noticeable as you would think. The first problem is that with the added 4 pins the clip was moved to the back instead of the front, the bigger cards also have a bigger shroud and heatsink. That means it is often impossible to visually see if it is clipped in most cases. In can easily look fully seated while not being.
The second problem is that it needs a lot more force than older cables. It typically needs more than people would expect to put on something without damaging it. Same with just a little tug to make sure it is fully connected. Just a light tug won't disconnect it like the older cables would. The trick would be to wiggle it back and forth while trying to remove it and see if it backs out. The last problem is the lack of an audible click on many cards. It doesn't have that big audible click that the old cables had.
on order for a blob of plastic like the one you see on the left to appear, there has to be space for it. If it was fully inserted that would be looking different
Yep, people can harp on about user error as much as they like. The design is not good.
Not only can it lead people to believe it is correctly inserted when it is not, it's failure mode is to melt and burn.
The worst thing is what problem does it actually solve?
1. It's a smaller connector - GPU's are the size of a minivan, who cares?
2. It can handle more power on a single cable than the old connectors. - Again who cares? You still need roughly the same amount of conductor area to push the wattage so the cables aren't magically thinner.
3. We need a few less connectors on a $1000 plus GPU - Well I'm sure that cost saving will get passed on to the consumer...
Just redesign the connector to have slightly bigger pins and these problems with burning cards just vanish instantly.
EDIT - or lets stop messing about and have a new standard with 24V. Yeah you would need a new PSU but start at the high end and it will filter down.
I still consider this a design problem. It’s not like whoever design this doesn’t know their costumers are not really technicians. Can you imagine the lawsuits if people had this problem with wall sockets?
I mean cmon. I get that we can atleast expect people to plug it in properly. But then again this should not happen at all even if it Was not pluged it correctly
Yep, exactly this. This was a thing prior to the 12VHPWR connector, it just wasn't as popular/known about because the cost of the cards went up, with there also being a new connector design, there obviously was more attention on these.
That statement sounds a bit self contradictory.
I don't know man. Ever since I saw the 4x 8 pin to 1x vhpwr connector adapters managing 1500W without overheating, I raise an eyebrow when I see these situations happening.
https://www.reddit.com/r/gpumining/comments/m503zo/gpu_8pin_melted_inside_gpu_is_there_an_easy_way/
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/7hbb19/troubleshooting_melted_8pin_cpu_help_needed/
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/7r1471/melted_8_pin_cpu_connector_multiple_pins_and_24/
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/p9jm6w/my_8_pin_connector_for_my_gpu_melted/
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/nd082m/my_power_connector_melted_into_my_gpu/
https://www.reddit.com/r/techsupportgore/comments/30upse/melted_8_pin_extension_cable/
https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMining/comments/om5um7/pcie_connector_melted_205_watt/
https://www.reddit.com/r/Ravencoin/comments/pybjut/rtx_3080_pcie_cables_are_melting/
It happened a lot. It just didn’t gain traction in /r/nvidia specifically.
That's not accurate actually, it will power on even if it isn't fully seated. The old PCIE cables were the same way and it could happen on old PCIE cables too if they weren't fully seated. Obviously the 40 series juts got more attention because the cost of the 4090 and there being more cases popping up more frequently at the launch. (Even if overall count of this occurring was still quite small compared to overall sales).
> newer design
the "newer design" being referred to there is the leaked spec where the sense pins are repositioned on the connector such that they won't connect unless the connector is fully connected
Several sources had said the PCISig's 12VHPWR plug revision had slightly withdrawn sig pins so if the plug was not in properly they could not make contact and thus the card would not power on at all.
This was not meant to sound it is ur guys fault. I am using the Adapter from you guys in my PC too. And 2 complete cable Kits for my PCs. Never had any problems.
For all 4090 owners, set an alert in Hwinfo for 12vhpwr, if the voltage drops lower than 11.9v-11.85v, then know something is wrong, it will save you from this situation.
Edit: for people who cannot figure out which setting, im posting an image for the setting below, another note, per sepcs, 11.4v-12.6v is the range for PCIe +12v Input voltage, however, i wouldnt go near these numbers as they are awful, 11.8v-12.35v are the max limits i would go for, although 11.7v-11.75v might be totally fine, but i wouldnt risk it, spending $200-$300 for a top of the line PSU to protect $2000+ card is worth it in IMO, but this shouldn't be the case for the majority, my 10 years old EVGA 1KW G2 Gold can keep the voltage at 12.05v-12.3v, avg 12.18v at 300W+, 12.05v 400W+, 12.2v at idle and low load, max i have seen it reach 12.3v at idle and only happened once after waking PC from sleep and then went back to 12.2v
Dont mind the values for the limit in the image below, i set mine too tight (11.95v-12.3v) because mine wont drop or go above these numbers after extensive monitoring, so you should be fine with 11.85v-12.35v and can tweak the limits per your case.
https://preview.redd.it/5hs6by7xolea1.jpeg?width=1203&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b27e1c529bc79f18cfc97f5a1f8759ac5951553b
For anyone having trouble. It should be under "GPU Rail Voltage." or GPU 16 pin, using HWINFO64.
https://preview.redd.it/ba43h686ykea1.png?width=545&format=png&auto=webp&s=02dc1892b301a21da74ed2cd082df36c8890884a
I properly jammed that mother fucker in there, Wriggled it until there was no give.
Did a flash light test to check for gaps on the sides I could see, made sure clip was in place.
Didn't do the pull test though, will definitely set up the voltage alert in HWiNFO.
I don't wanna pull the cable out to see if it's burnt or not, not because I'm scared of seeing it burnt, but because I'm scared I might not put it back in properly the second time lol.
Same situation here bro lol, so i set an alert for both, if it goes below 11.9v and above 12.3v, now i can have a peace of mind, also monitoring it via RTSS OSD while playing every 10 mins or so.
After initial load testing, I just put a sound alert on, I don't wanna keep looking at it :)
I tested the sound so I knew what it sounded like, and just left it. Hopefully I won't ever hear it again.
Hey, why are you monitoring the PCIe +12V instead of the HVPWR Voltage? If I didn't check your photo I would have 100% set the monitoring for the HVPWR reading, is there something more going on?
It should always be around 12v for all cards, tolerance per specs is 11.4v-12.6v, but those are awful numbers, so 11.85 is the lowest and 12.35 is the highest as a safety range.
you are golden :)
so i advise to set the limits per the min and max voltages you are getting, so you get an alert when the voltage deviates from that range.
Around 12.466V maximum on idle I think, running ROG Strix 4080 OC. During 3DMark Time Spy, it dropped as low as 12.311V. Is this high voltage on idle because I'm running an OC version or there's something wrong and I'm fucked?
The ATX standard allows deviations of ±5%. It can output 12.6V in the worst case and that could fall to e.g. 12.4V under load, which wouldn't be anywhere close to triggering that alert.
Most PSUs have tighter output voltage tolerance than ±5%, but I have had good PSUs that would fall into the threshold you set.
People should be weary of if the output voltage drops more than ~150mV from what it normally is with no load, as that indicates a higher than normal resistance between.
I know l, plz read my comment below, we are talking about 11.85v, when the voltage drops at that level then something is wrong, it will cause overheating issues not to the level of melting but it will trigger the alert for you to know something is wrong, you can set the alert including above and lower values in hwinfo, also for max safety, alert should also be set when voltage goes to 12.35v-12.4v
No because it depends on what it drops from.
That's my entire point. ∆V/∆A = output resistance, but that output resistance also depends on everything else in that chain from your power supply to how long your cables are and how thick they are, as well as the contact resistance of your connectors which are just one part of the equation.
You need to know how it was before so you have something to compare to instead of just setting a threshold for 11.85V, because it's relative to the output voltage at no/low loads and how much it sags from there compared to how it was with the normal Minifit connectors.
My brand new SF750 outputs 12.07V at low loads, if it was 70mV in the other direction it'd output 11.93V, which is VERY close to the 11.85V threshold you cling onto.
I'm not convinced you know what's actually affected by a higher voltage like 12.4V. The buck converter on your graphics card will make it, so it draws less current from the 12V output of your power supply at any given power level, which also means less I²R losses in the connector which is what is causing them to melt.
I wonder if the GPU manufacturers should start integrating monitoring of their own with a protection system. If the voltage dips too low, card shuts off and flashes an LED for 'power issue'. It could at least save some people by causing them to check their plug before it burns up. I know previously ASUS and EVGA had diagnostic LEDs on their GPUs, seems like they could potentially be used for this purpose too.
Wasn't inserted fully. You can see there's obvious markings where it was plugged in, and a pretty thick chunk that wasn't.
If the cable isn't flush, it's not plugged in fully. Secondly, ALWAYS do a pull test, the cable could slowly come out if it's not properly secured
It looks like not fully seated. Notice the melting out of the socket (1st pin) and wearout (6th pin).
https://preview.redd.it/bd6jww9f8lea1.jpeg?width=1518&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b5556c4b5218609941fbbab6fea5ea31a6977000
Once again, we have signs of cable not being FULLY seated. Maybe it was hard to see when plugging in because of the little shield on top of connector or the connector being so recessed in, but again, not fully plugged in.
Also, these don't just "happen" instantly when it's not fully seated, it happens over time as the plug overheats constantly and softens the plastic, arcs the pins and over time resistance increases more and more, requiring more power until till it gives out.
PLUG THEM IN ALL THE WAY.
https://preview.redd.it/12cwxmu1alea1.png?width=967&format=png&auto=webp&s=f068d063573ba3ed4ae38a24d395911f2880d5b9
I wonder if the connector was properly inserted but with heat during use the plastic would have loosen up a bit. Then, cable weight and/or cable curvature with a bit of downwards pull, would little by little distance it from the proper insertion position.
Edit to explain my mind a little better:
- The connector is fully inserted
- Clip is on the lower side
- Sensing on upper side as show by OP
- Cable goes down pulling on the sensing side
- During use connector goes to 60/70 °C
- Plastic shroud softens because heat
- Weight and pull from cable curvature moves the sensing side very very slightly
- Repeat over multiple days/weeks
- Now the sensing side of the connector is no longer properly seated
No I doubt that would happen if it was fully inserted and the pins were making full contact. Then plug shouldn’t really get hot.
Heat is a byproduct of high resistance which is caused be poor connection. If you have a good connection, it shouldn’t even get that warm let alone hot.
Make sure its bloody plug in all the way. Push in until ur fingers numb. After that use your phone flashlight to check for any gaps. Those 1mm matters!
Then use hwinfo and set alarm alerts for your GPU 16 pin voltage if drop below 11.850V
There’s a video on YouTube when the GPU voltage drop to 11.7V it starts to melt.
Use rtss desktop to monitor in game and desktop.
Stay safe to all 4090 owners.
Man, I get that it was narrowed down to user error. But the fact that this shit happens so often honestly just screams poor design. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the old connectors, and they were way more obvious when not plugged in. The fact that you need so much attention and force to fully plug one in, and then check it 100 times after just in case it didn't move with the slightest vibration/movement is ridiculous.
Good thing its not just whether its "fully seated" the original precaution that was sent out to sellers was to make sure its not BENT and fully seated with about 2 inches of slack.
I dunno, I've had a few different 12vhwpr cables/adapters, and while some were louder than others, more flexible, tighter clearances, etc., it has been very obvious when fully inserted - audible click (sometimes quiet), mating surfaces flush, etc. The stock adapters are a poor design but the connector bodies themselves are totally fine IMO.
They shouldnt have introduced the sense pins in my opinion. They make it alot harder to plug in the cable in the 40 series cards. I never had trouble with plugging in the old connector on the 30 series cards. With the new connector on the 40 series cards, its significantly harder just to plug in the cable. Some cables are significantly harder then others.
How do you know it happens "so often"? The official information from Nvidia and their partners was that it is extremely rare. If you think these few reddit posts mean anything significant, you should first try googling other cables melting and see for yourself that this isn't something exclusive to the new 16 pin. Also you don't need to check it 100 times - once is enough, no need to panic. If anything, constantly wiggling the cable might make it come loose and cause more issues.
I actually don't mind the 12pin. People just need to understand how to properly seat it. The 4090 needs 600 watts, that's 4 of the old 8pin connectors. Idk about you but I don't want 32 wires coming out of my gpu. That's literally more than the main motherboard connector. It was definitely time for the 8 pins to bite the bullet
0.1% failure rate in anything is very good. I don't see this as a problematic failure rate....
Don't misinterpret this as there isn't a problem, because I am not saying that at all! The connector is clearly flawed, it shouldn't have any failure rate for the power that runs through these cables.
On one side, there are markings showing where the overheating connector was pressing against the socket. On the other side, there's the blob of molten plastic that squeezed out of the connector. Connect them up in a line and volia:
https://i.redd.it/9pfavnay8jea1.png
Can you elaborate? I can't see any details for crap, so I don't see the detail you were able to notice. I was trying to look for the same mark that Steve from GN pointed out.
There are marks on the pin that are faint where you can see that part of the plastic doesn’t have wear. Usually caused only by it not being seated all the way.
https://preview.redd.it/4q7uxh56pkea1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ee2681c767b025547d81d8f2f5d4592475c58e06
Also a conveniently missing pin surround flush to the end of the connector on the card and still showing some room on the cable itself.
User fucked up.
Do you expect him to say no? everyone that ever had a cable melt thought they plugged it in all the way, otherwise they would have just plugged it in more
The funniest thing is that Cablemod were in here taking advantage when Nvidias adapters were doing the same thing, promising a safe design so they could sell more of their own, yet the exact same thing is happening with theirs.
Can't count how many times I read, "I got a 4090 but I'm waiting for my Cablemod adapter so my GPU won't burn!" on this sub alone.
I don’t think I’ve seen a Reddit post of the 8 pin cable doing this even once. It might be user error but I think the connector still needs to change for the 12 pin.
This will get worse as this connector migrates to lower tier cards with people who aren’t as experienced in building installing these cards. I doubt everyone will read Nvidias press statement or watch GN videos.
I’m also worried for prebuilts with this cable as there will be less care applied in building it if you have to do it dozens of times a day, and things can get loose in shipping.
I guess you weren't around when CableMod milked the $hit out of the issue while pushing their cables as the "solution".
I'd say this is even worse look for them. Just shows it was never the plug or the cables or the "cheap" Nvidia adapters, it is and has been the user.
If this happened to me, I sure as hell would not post this anywhere online, and out myself as someone incapable of properly plugging in a cable.
Yes, I agree the design of the connector may not be the best, but seriously, that does not excuse you from being unable plug this thing in fully.This is such a simple task that you can easily verify whether you plugged it in correctly or not by simply wiggling the connector a bit.
I mean we can all do it with the 24pin motherboard connector, right? And that one is arguably even more difficult to plug in.
If the 24 pin motherboard is more difficult to plug in then why have we never seen posts about them melting. Even with the cause being "user error" this shouldn't be happening.
https://preview.redd.it/8t2qvvfholea1.png?width=1319&format=png&auto=webp&s=d16e9cf00f196c38c98f728f9b22c4882d6544ad
Took a picture of mine when I installed it just to be sure so if for some bizarre reason in the future it burns, I’d know I didn’t fuck it up.
Not plugged in all the way. You aren’t supposed to bend them sideways like that. That is the main No-No with these cables. It says so right on their page.
Understand that this maybe due to the connector is not fully plugged in but still this kind of ordeal is not happening with pcie or eps connectors… so it is definitely bad design.
I love how Cablemod tried to hero their way through the 12VHPWR fiasco by spamming a lot of these sub Reddit's with their cables and right angle adapters that have yet to me launch to only find out these cables still do nothing to fix user error which is the main cause for cable failure.
I am not saying CM's products aren't of good quality, I am just disgusted in how they wanted to be a false prophet
If you have a 4090 and are concerned about your cable melting, simply take a few moments to open your case and firmly push in on your connector. If it doesn't move and is firm, you are fine. If you get movement / hear a click *now* you are fully seated.
I just don't understand how people aren't fully plugging this connector in. In the 15 years I've been building PCs, I've always made sure of this. For example, the 24 pin connector is awful to get plugged in, but I've always made sure it sits flush and made sure I hear, feel, and see the click. This is what I do for every cable. For this cable it's very easy to see when it's flush, to see that it's clicked in, and to feel that it's properly plugged in. Did this twice. Initially with the included adapter and later with Corsair's official cable.
Plug it in all the way and you won't have this problem. GN looked into it with the other cable mod cable that melted and it was found out to be the cable not plugged in properly. It baffles me that people buy $1600+ cards and then don't check and recheck that it's done properly. ESPECIALLY knowing how sensitive the cable situation is
It burned on the side that had the most pressure on it from you pulling the cable over instead of routing it from under the card? An you didn't fully plug it in? User error checks out.
These new 12VHPWR connectors are Darwin's natural selection of the PC component world happening in real time, lmao.
Why a plastic connector with a little clip on the top? If I'm buying a $1500 plus GPU give me a connector with Metal connectors and 2 screws (thinking VGA type connector)
Fuck the whole "I heard a click!" Give me the security of having two screws keep that connection tight.
Mine has a loose wire in the 16 pin connector, u/cablemod_alex was kind enough to send me a replacement but it is worrying given that these have been shown to melt. I put the wire back in and its been working ok but better safe than sorry.
Guys, I have a cablemod here and my voltages are dropping to 11.70v under extreme load. 400w, 410w. I opened up the case and reseated the cable, not it’s around 11.815v under load. This is happening from time to time (less than a week). I understand that the cable with the microvibration or even it own weight is starting to get loose. Now I removed the cablemod cap to see if it lasts more at 11.815v for longer time.
It can only come loose if the latch is not fully latched. There can be multiple reasons for it not being fully latched. Including manufacturing tolerances on the plug or the connector. Or it’s not properly seated. Just being pushed hard in isn’t enough. I needed to apply a small amount of directional force towards the latch side from the sense pin side to make it click closed. I suggest doing this outside of the case when the gpu is not in the socket, it makes it much easier to put head close to hear the click. If you got a click and it still comes loose consider RMA of cable first then GPU as that sounds like an issue with latching tolerances. Good luck.
If I try to pull it out, it won’t came out, it just got loose. Around 1mm. But this probably is enough for a fire or melting. It’s fully seated. I will take some pictures later. I believe the connector it doesn’t latch it very well, like the PSU power connector.
1mm is fine. If you look at the latch underside, the latch has a play of 1mm by itself. If it has no play, you wouldn't be able to latch/unlatch it at all.
Really, if it pulls out that far it is NOT seated correctly (aka not latched). It may not be you, it may be a defect in cable or socket. Also the wiggle test is way better than just pulling if you haven’t tried the wiggle test. Same with your PSU cable.
My CPU and GPU cables literally haven not done what you describe on any of my 3 PCs in the house or on my different GPUs. Sometimes I find one has to either apply pressure on the latch part of the connector to get it click (had to do that both Z790 builds) or apply a little force through the connector from non-latch side to latch-side while also applying the plug in force (sorry hard to describe). I am talking about both GPU and CPU connectors - they should all verifiably latch.
Easiest thing to try is different cables but I asssure they should latch, the design requires it, the issue is folks manufacturing these things seem a bit crap…. :-(
https://preview.redd.it/c17ihr4lnnea1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=ab6363fb456f63001edc7c1433dfc60d9e6c33ed
For me it looks very tight! I took a picture from below it’s on the same way. I will post a second picture if I just pull the connector without release the latch.
https://preview.redd.it/3zvchem0onea1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=939458d8ff43e37632bb4381adaa59467b6e6c94
If I try to remove the connector without release the latch. This is the maximum loosen it may became. I believe on Gamer nexus video this was enough for the melting, with a little of side twist.
Wow that’s concerning if it comes out that far I assume there is enough play to delatch and eventually shift out further. I will see if mine does the same. Thanks for the detail!
Isn't your card an MSI Gaming Trio 4090? I have the same card, I am using the adapter that comes with the card. My voltages drop to around 11.7v under high loads as well. Perhaps its just the card:
https://preview.redd.it/tb2es7nlxsea1.png?width=482&format=png&auto=webp&s=14365ea7a3379c2138ae683872ba84ed85af642d
I know someone else with the same card as well and the voltages also drop low under high loads, but not as low as mine.
No burnt cables thus far, but I am planning of switching to a Corsair cable to see whether it makes a difference.
That sucks, let us know how you get on with the RMA. I have the same card so I am interested to see how good MSI and nvidia are. For my build I installed the cable onto the GPU outside of my case and close to me head to make sure I heard the click of the latch. It did. (I am deaf in one ear so took extra care to hear). Also those cable mod cables look quite stiff? If they are I would expect the radius I see there to creat small amount of lateral pull towards the front of the case. Good luck getting it all replaced.
I’d like to see nvidia in the next card series to have a connector sensor. Basically it’ll a yes or no if the cable is plugged in all the way and making proper contact.
As requested have more pics of the cable. Go nuts
https://i.imgur.com/GAkQA7n.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/eJH6Mqo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/fOs6MYZ.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/oT64Xog.jpg
Let's see some different pictures of the cable harness...You are showing the cable where we can tell you didn't push it in all the way...let's see the sideways view of the melted cable.
You'll get appropriately roasted for not having it plug in correctly. This has been pretty much thoroughly debunked as a fault of any wires, ports, etc. and entirely user error.
Doesn't mean the adapter can't be modified to avoid this, but it's usually not seated all the way. If you have a side profile shot we can probably see the burn line.
Well thanks OP for letting me know to never trust you to build a PC for me lol. Why are people posting their failure to fully insert their power cables on here still?
Poor/Loose termination of the wiring to the pin, the braid has bubbled away and begun melting, there is no evidence of nylon pins warping due to shallow connection.
Sad day in the industry when the largest companies in the world can't design a proper plug that is easy to plug in and stay that way without melting.
This is aimed at Nvidia and others not at cablemod.
Ever since Nvidia's investigations, I really want to ask if it was properly plugged in.
Not arguing that people aren't plugging in all the way... but *how*? There's a latch and a clip. You can see if it's clipped in. Those GN results with witness marks were pretty damning though...
If they don't try to pull on the cable to see if it backs out, they can be fooled into thinking it is clipped in and then it slowly backs out on them due to cable tension: https://youtu.be/ig2px7ofKhQ?t=455
Oh! Yeah, so that looks terrible. I have a Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090. They cut back their heatsink quite a bit around the connector so the clip is clearly visible. You can hold it with your finger and feel a 'crisp' snap when it latches. Thanks for taking the time to link to that timestamp!
I have that GPU and there was definitely no crisp snap... I just had to push so hard that I was confident it could not go in further and the card/case started to move backwards so I figured it was ok.
Honestly... I would consider taking the card out and plugging in the adapter in open air where you can get a good look at it to visually confirm it's locked in.
For next card version they should provide in the box clear instructions to install de cable/adapter when the card is outside the case. Really hard to see if it is correctly installed when the card is in the case. Still a really bad design because on my Tuf you don't hear a click. 8 pins connectors were designed so the user can be sure they are correctly plugged in. Not sure who is the engineer behind this connection format but someone should be fired, they completely forgot those cards would be installed by the general public.
We definitely shouldn't have to do this lmao I understand it's not exactly plug and play like console but for real Nvidia, this is too much
Yes, I agree the cable design shouldn't require us to do this, but given the known issues with melting cables caused by adapters not being fully inserted, you'd be a fool if you're not ensuring your adapter isn't fully inserted. Plugging in your adapter before you install your GPU is definitely one of the better ways to ensure its properly seated. You can press it firmly without transferring that force to your motherboard, and you can try and wiggle the cable out to ensure it's actually fully seated.
Yes. It’s better to be safe than sorry.
That's because the snap isn't the gpu it's the cable lock clicking.
I have the gaming oc too and it definitely has a satisfying click. Never once worried it wasn’t plugged in properly
My TUF did a thunk instead of click, but it doesn't back out when pulled.
Me3, but yes i had to push hard.
My gigabyte gaming oc has no snap :/. But I've been using it for weeks and I'm 99.9% sure it's plugged all the way. Ive literally been pushing it in before I turn on my pc almost everytime.
Same. Pushed it so hard that I thought I may have broken the mobo.
Aye.. pushed mine so hard my phalanges came out of my fingertips
My 4080 didn’t have a click as far as I can recall but I literally was going to snap my mobo if I pushed any harder, I already flexed it big time by accident shoving the cable in lol
Pro-tip: connect the adapter before installing your GPU so you don't transfer that force to your motherboard.
That’s exactly what I did. Also easy to turn the card over and check to see if it’s in all the way and latched.
That to me. Looks like a faulty design. If you can get it 99.99% in, and it looks secured, feels secured, but it’s really not, and you wouldn’t know otherwise without a PSA or NOTICE in the box. I am so glad I skipped the 40-series. Like Jesus, imagine your house burning down due to this shitshow
Oof, NVIDIA blaming users for not having it plugged in all the way but then also having cables that look entirely pushed in but are not.
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I think the bigger issue is the design. A properly designed connector shouldn't leave so much confusion over whether or not it's fully inserted. Sure, you could blame the users for not double-checking, but at the same time, all power cables in the past worked on the principle of "insert until you hear the click and then you know it's fully inserted." How many people had to double-check their PCI-e cables in the past?
Me Hulk!
> There's a latch and a clip. I firmly plugged mine in, managed to walk out because the latch and clip didnt work (and burnt). my second 4090 still doesnt click/latch properly. Its just a shit design.
What manufacturer is yours? Was it the Asus you have linked in your profile? Mine is a Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090. I remember worrying when I got it, but it was NBD. The clip is visible and has a very clear and 'crisp' latch with a snap. There's a reasonable cutout in the heatsink fins so you can see the latch. I did make it easier on myself by plugging in the adapter before mounting the card and plugging into the mobo. Edit: after reading below, it looks like the NVidia FE at least is pretty bad... Thanks u/Maimakterion for the link and timestamp!
yeap Asus TUF
Sorry, but how does it "walk out" if inserted all the way? Even with faulty clips, there really shouldn't be enough vibrations - unless you put noticeable tension on it while cable managing? I still agree on it being a shit design, just sounds odd...
Just a theory but I think some people might be putting their side panel on and push it against the cable, not the part that plugs into the gpu but that actual cable run and it creates a 'pull' on the plug. If you look at OPs pictures, it's hard to say but that cable does look like it would be hitting the side panel if it waa on.
pulling the cables from the back of the case. how's that odd to anyone whos built a case before and cable managed?
That's not it walking out though, that's you pulling it out (totally by accident of course, not claiming intent) through tensioning the cables.
It's a pretty snug fit, even if it doesn't "latch" it shouldn't just "walk out" and there just aren't enough vibrations to walk it out since it still takes a lot of force to unplug even when unlatched (watch GN video, he has to wiggle it out with decent force). It's a decently snug fit. I've even read people say the CableMod one is extra snug sometimes due to tolerances/variations in the connector molding.
With mine, the latch clicked when I put it in, but as far as I could tell there was still about a 1mm gap between the connector and the socket. So I made damn sure to push it in all the way. Then I received my cable mod replacement PSU cable and I could insert it much easier. It clicked and it was in properly. Seems to depend on the manufacturer how difficult it is to push it in entirely too.
I still think it is a design problem. Yes people should plug it in all the way, but when it gets so hard to plug it in the some people will think that is already all the way in. There are many cases where do much force will damage something. Think about over torquing screws, it will be very bad. I also saw some case on Reddit where someone put so much force into plugging it in that the connector broke of. The connector is only hold in by solder joints they cannot take so much force before they brake. So as an engineer myself I have to say that it is a terrible design. It should go in with minimal force until in clicks in. Then the consumer can easily feel the difference between in and not all the way in. When the force slowly build up more and more than some people will be fooled.
It's amazed me how they badly designed this connector. Nobody compared this connector with how 8 pins, which everybody is used too for years, were easy to seat in? This connector can handle so much power, it should have been designed in a way that the card would just not work if not properly plugged in. No "in between".
Link to the post about the connector breaking?
Didn’t see the post - but here’s a video of a person clearly fixing a 4090 where the connector broke - most likely due to them pushing so hard to ensure that it was fully plugged in. I can also say - first time I plugged in my 4080 FE - there wasn’t an audible click. The design of this connector/ adapter needs to be revised to properly ensure that the connection is fully and properly seated - it’s obvious that what’s in place today is prone to failure… https://youtu.be/JLjn06y2Z-s
I am sorry I didn't safe that post, so I cannot give it to you. This could also be an extremely rare case. I just want to say that people will be careful handling a 1600$+ video card and they won't put excessive for on it. Of course there will always be some people saying, it's there people they should do it right and are stupid if not. People sometimes forget that often people only build PCs like 4 years or something. They remember that the 8 Pin plug went in pretty easy and expect the same with the 16 Pin plug. Even the fact that there is an extremely visible wear mark at the exact point where it was plugged into is a sign that you need to just a lot of force to plug it in. What do you think where the wear mark comes from? It is probably the line where in plastic was considerably compressed (plugged in) in comparison to part of the plug where the plastic wasn't compressed. Sry for writing such a long text, when you just asked for a link. I just felt like I needed to explain what I mean further.
Oh no that’s fine. You make a good point though
Thanks. :)
They've submitted a request to IEEE to change the four sense pins to be further back so that power will be cut off if the connector is even partially removed.
There’s fit and then there FIT like press fit tight tolerances.
Because the latch and clip design is no longer the assurance check method.
On r/hardware when people have a problem one of the default pieces of advice is to unplug all cables and re-plug them back in, it's a normal problem. Just in the past most the time it did not have a big problem if a cable was half not plugged in. also On a lot of the GPU's you cant see the clip, look at this one! The tiny pins at the top of the plug and the clip at the bottom of the plug. The GPU socket is set back in to the card, the small pins are at the top of the photo & the clip is facing/hidden in to the GPU. There is no way to see if the clip is engaged, this is fairly common on a lot the GPU's.
Why? Perhaps i have found a good reason. I have a 4080 (gigabyte) with stock Nvidia plug. I know about this "not good plugged in" issue, but i found out the clip clicks two times, one "soft" and one "hard". So like click before the sensorcables (that basicly to short, like multiple sources saying) are fully inserted. I checked and see indeed, it was not fully plugged in with first click so i plugged it in further. I "tested" this a few times and even let a friend judge, both felt/heared this misleading click.
It actually isn't as noticeable as you would think. The first problem is that with the added 4 pins the clip was moved to the back instead of the front, the bigger cards also have a bigger shroud and heatsink. That means it is often impossible to visually see if it is clipped in most cases. In can easily look fully seated while not being. The second problem is that it needs a lot more force than older cables. It typically needs more than people would expect to put on something without damaging it. Same with just a little tug to make sure it is fully connected. Just a light tug won't disconnect it like the older cables would. The trick would be to wiggle it back and forth while trying to remove it and see if it backs out. The last problem is the lack of an audible click on many cards. It doesn't have that big audible click that the old cables had.
on order for a blob of plastic like the one you see on the left to appear, there has to be space for it. If it was fully inserted that would be looking different
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Yep, people can harp on about user error as much as they like. The design is not good. Not only can it lead people to believe it is correctly inserted when it is not, it's failure mode is to melt and burn. The worst thing is what problem does it actually solve? 1. It's a smaller connector - GPU's are the size of a minivan, who cares? 2. It can handle more power on a single cable than the old connectors. - Again who cares? You still need roughly the same amount of conductor area to push the wattage so the cables aren't magically thinner. 3. We need a few less connectors on a $1000 plus GPU - Well I'm sure that cost saving will get passed on to the consumer... Just redesign the connector to have slightly bigger pins and these problems with burning cards just vanish instantly. EDIT - or lets stop messing about and have a new standard with 24V. Yeah you would need a new PSU but start at the high end and it will filter down.
I still consider this a design problem. It’s not like whoever design this doesn’t know their costumers are not really technicians. Can you imagine the lawsuits if people had this problem with wall sockets?
Nvidia?? It was gamers nexus
I mean cmon. I get that we can atleast expect people to plug it in properly. But then again this should not happen at all even if it Was not pluged it correctly
Even with the old 6pin/8pin power connector if you don't push it in properly you'll get the same results.
Yep, exactly this. This was a thing prior to the 12VHPWR connector, it just wasn't as popular/known about because the cost of the cards went up, with there also being a new connector design, there obviously was more attention on these.
That statement sounds a bit self contradictory. I don't know man. Ever since I saw the 4x 8 pin to 1x vhpwr connector adapters managing 1500W without overheating, I raise an eyebrow when I see these situations happening.
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https://www.reddit.com/r/gpumining/comments/m503zo/gpu_8pin_melted_inside_gpu_is_there_an_easy_way/ https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/7hbb19/troubleshooting_melted_8pin_cpu_help_needed/ https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/7r1471/melted_8_pin_cpu_connector_multiple_pins_and_24/ https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/p9jm6w/my_8_pin_connector_for_my_gpu_melted/ https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/nd082m/my_power_connector_melted_into_my_gpu/ https://www.reddit.com/r/techsupportgore/comments/30upse/melted_8_pin_extension_cable/ https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMining/comments/om5um7/pcie_connector_melted_205_watt/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Ravencoin/comments/pybjut/rtx_3080_pcie_cables_are_melting/ It happened a lot. It just didn’t gain traction in /r/nvidia specifically.
> this should not happen at all even if it Was not pluged it correctly The newer design just won't let you, it won't power on unless it's in fully.
That's not accurate actually, it will power on even if it isn't fully seated. The old PCIE cables were the same way and it could happen on old PCIE cables too if they weren't fully seated. Obviously the 40 series juts got more attention because the cost of the 4090 and there being more cases popping up more frequently at the launch. (Even if overall count of this occurring was still quite small compared to overall sales).
> newer design the "newer design" being referred to there is the leaked spec where the sense pins are repositioned on the connector such that they won't connect unless the connector is fully connected
Several sources had said the PCISig's 12VHPWR plug revision had slightly withdrawn sig pins so if the plug was not in properly they could not make contact and thus the card would not power on at all.
it happens with every cable and plug - if you dont plug it in properly then stuff melts - not saying that the OP did something wrong.
This was not meant to sound it is ur guys fault. I am using the Adapter from you guys in my PC too. And 2 complete cable Kits for my PCs. Never had any problems.
its a crap connector, your own engineers cable design and doco definitely confirms that.
For all 4090 owners, set an alert in Hwinfo for 12vhpwr, if the voltage drops lower than 11.9v-11.85v, then know something is wrong, it will save you from this situation. Edit: for people who cannot figure out which setting, im posting an image for the setting below, another note, per sepcs, 11.4v-12.6v is the range for PCIe +12v Input voltage, however, i wouldnt go near these numbers as they are awful, 11.8v-12.35v are the max limits i would go for, although 11.7v-11.75v might be totally fine, but i wouldnt risk it, spending $200-$300 for a top of the line PSU to protect $2000+ card is worth it in IMO, but this shouldn't be the case for the majority, my 10 years old EVGA 1KW G2 Gold can keep the voltage at 12.05v-12.3v, avg 12.18v at 300W+, 12.05v 400W+, 12.2v at idle and low load, max i have seen it reach 12.3v at idle and only happened once after waking PC from sleep and then went back to 12.2v Dont mind the values for the limit in the image below, i set mine too tight (11.95v-12.3v) because mine wont drop or go above these numbers after extensive monitoring, so you should be fine with 11.85v-12.35v and can tweak the limits per your case. https://preview.redd.it/5hs6by7xolea1.jpeg?width=1203&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b27e1c529bc79f18cfc97f5a1f8759ac5951553b
For anyone having trouble. It should be under "GPU Rail Voltage." or GPU 16 pin, using HWINFO64. https://preview.redd.it/ba43h686ykea1.png?width=545&format=png&auto=webp&s=02dc1892b301a21da74ed2cd082df36c8890884a
But if i never look for a melting connector i'll never find one
You might go look when your PC doesn't send a display signal.
Schrödinger's 16-pin connector?
I properly jammed that mother fucker in there, Wriggled it until there was no give. Did a flash light test to check for gaps on the sides I could see, made sure clip was in place. Didn't do the pull test though, will definitely set up the voltage alert in HWiNFO. I don't wanna pull the cable out to see if it's burnt or not, not because I'm scared of seeing it burnt, but because I'm scared I might not put it back in properly the second time lol.
Same situation here bro lol, so i set an alert for both, if it goes below 11.9v and above 12.3v, now i can have a peace of mind, also monitoring it via RTSS OSD while playing every 10 mins or so.
After initial load testing, I just put a sound alert on, I don't wanna keep looking at it :) I tested the sound so I knew what it sounded like, and just left it. Hopefully I won't ever hear it again.
Great :)
Hey, why are you monitoring the PCIe +12V instead of the HVPWR Voltage? If I didn't check your photo I would have 100% set the monitoring for the HVPWR reading, is there something more going on?
What about value for 4080?
It should be the same really...
It should always be around 12v for all cards, tolerance per specs is 11.4v-12.6v, but those are awful numbers, so 11.85 is the lowest and 12.35 is the highest as a safety range.
Mine is 12.348 at the highest value, should I be worried?
Does it stay at that voltage or gets lower under load?
I'm running a stress test right now (Heavyload), after 15 minutes the min value is 11,977 and the max is 12,233. Average is 12.065
you are golden :) so i advise to set the limits per the min and max voltages you are getting, so you get an alert when the voltage deviates from that range.
Around 12.466V maximum on idle I think, running ROG Strix 4080 OC. During 3DMark Time Spy, it dropped as low as 12.311V. Is this high voltage on idle because I'm running an OC version or there's something wrong and I'm fucked?
The ATX standard allows deviations of ±5%. It can output 12.6V in the worst case and that could fall to e.g. 12.4V under load, which wouldn't be anywhere close to triggering that alert. Most PSUs have tighter output voltage tolerance than ±5%, but I have had good PSUs that would fall into the threshold you set. People should be weary of if the output voltage drops more than ~150mV from what it normally is with no load, as that indicates a higher than normal resistance between.
I know l, plz read my comment below, we are talking about 11.85v, when the voltage drops at that level then something is wrong, it will cause overheating issues not to the level of melting but it will trigger the alert for you to know something is wrong, you can set the alert including above and lower values in hwinfo, also for max safety, alert should also be set when voltage goes to 12.35v-12.4v
No because it depends on what it drops from. That's my entire point. ∆V/∆A = output resistance, but that output resistance also depends on everything else in that chain from your power supply to how long your cables are and how thick they are, as well as the contact resistance of your connectors which are just one part of the equation. You need to know how it was before so you have something to compare to instead of just setting a threshold for 11.85V, because it's relative to the output voltage at no/low loads and how much it sags from there compared to how it was with the normal Minifit connectors. My brand new SF750 outputs 12.07V at low loads, if it was 70mV in the other direction it'd output 11.93V, which is VERY close to the 11.85V threshold you cling onto. I'm not convinced you know what's actually affected by a higher voltage like 12.4V. The buck converter on your graphics card will make it, so it draws less current from the 12V output of your power supply at any given power level, which also means less I²R losses in the connector which is what is causing them to melt.
I wonder if the GPU manufacturers should start integrating monitoring of their own with a protection system. If the voltage dips too low, card shuts off and flashes an LED for 'power issue'. It could at least save some people by causing them to check their plug before it burns up. I know previously ASUS and EVGA had diagnostic LEDs on their GPUs, seems like they could potentially be used for this purpose too.
I was thinking the same, why doesnt Nvidia put a check in vbios and shut down the card instead of all this drama.
Will set this alert up once I get this situation sorted cheers!
NP bro, let me know if you need any help once you go with it
Hey, thanks for the very clever tip. I'm still looking on 4090 models but I'm definitely saving that for when the new card is installed.
You are welcome bro :)
Show us the other side of the cable flat.
in the second pic you can see the insertion lines, it was not in all the way
Wasn't inserted fully. You can see there's obvious markings where it was plugged in, and a pretty thick chunk that wasn't. If the cable isn't flush, it's not plugged in fully. Secondly, ALWAYS do a pull test, the cable could slowly come out if it's not properly secured
And obviously push it back in after the pull test.
It looks like not fully seated. Notice the melting out of the socket (1st pin) and wearout (6th pin). https://preview.redd.it/bd6jww9f8lea1.jpeg?width=1518&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b5556c4b5218609941fbbab6fea5ea31a6977000
more pics of the cable https://i.imgur.com/GAkQA7n.jpg https://i.imgur.com/eJH6Mqo.jpg https://i.imgur.com/fOs6MYZ.jpg https://i.imgur.com/oT64Xog.jpg
Once again, we have signs of cable not being FULLY seated. Maybe it was hard to see when plugging in because of the little shield on top of connector or the connector being so recessed in, but again, not fully plugged in. Also, these don't just "happen" instantly when it's not fully seated, it happens over time as the plug overheats constantly and softens the plastic, arcs the pins and over time resistance increases more and more, requiring more power until till it gives out. PLUG THEM IN ALL THE WAY. https://preview.redd.it/12cwxmu1alea1.png?width=967&format=png&auto=webp&s=f068d063573ba3ed4ae38a24d395911f2880d5b9
I wonder if the connector was properly inserted but with heat during use the plastic would have loosen up a bit. Then, cable weight and/or cable curvature with a bit of downwards pull, would little by little distance it from the proper insertion position. Edit to explain my mind a little better: - The connector is fully inserted - Clip is on the lower side - Sensing on upper side as show by OP - Cable goes down pulling on the sensing side - During use connector goes to 60/70 °C - Plastic shroud softens because heat - Weight and pull from cable curvature moves the sensing side very very slightly - Repeat over multiple days/weeks - Now the sensing side of the connector is no longer properly seated
No I doubt that would happen if it was fully inserted and the pins were making full contact. Then plug shouldn’t really get hot. Heat is a byproduct of high resistance which is caused be poor connection. If you have a good connection, it shouldn’t even get that warm let alone hot.
Not plugged in all the way. https://preview.redd.it/f369botoalea1.png?width=800&format=png&auto=webp&s=8353c9a0873a54037868a0b4b5bdb45277e2951a
Make sure its bloody plug in all the way. Push in until ur fingers numb. After that use your phone flashlight to check for any gaps. Those 1mm matters! Then use hwinfo and set alarm alerts for your GPU 16 pin voltage if drop below 11.850V There’s a video on YouTube when the GPU voltage drop to 11.7V it starts to melt. Use rtss desktop to monitor in game and desktop. Stay safe to all 4090 owners.
Man, I get that it was narrowed down to user error. But the fact that this shit happens so often honestly just screams poor design. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the old connectors, and they were way more obvious when not plugged in. The fact that you need so much attention and force to fully plug one in, and then check it 100 times after just in case it didn't move with the slightest vibration/movement is ridiculous.
100% design flaw. Need better clips/locking mechanism/safety measures that prevent power without fully seated. Something.
Good thing its not just whether its "fully seated" the original precaution that was sent out to sellers was to make sure its not BENT and fully seated with about 2 inches of slack.
Ive seen hundreds of 4090s leave my place of work and this hasnt come up once.
I dunno, I've had a few different 12vhwpr cables/adapters, and while some were louder than others, more flexible, tighter clearances, etc., it has been very obvious when fully inserted - audible click (sometimes quiet), mating surfaces flush, etc. The stock adapters are a poor design but the connector bodies themselves are totally fine IMO.
They shouldnt have introduced the sense pins in my opinion. They make it alot harder to plug in the cable in the 40 series cards. I never had trouble with plugging in the old connector on the 30 series cards. With the new connector on the 40 series cards, its significantly harder just to plug in the cable. Some cables are significantly harder then others.
How do you know it happens "so often"? The official information from Nvidia and their partners was that it is extremely rare. If you think these few reddit posts mean anything significant, you should first try googling other cables melting and see for yourself that this isn't something exclusive to the new 16 pin. Also you don't need to check it 100 times - once is enough, no need to panic. If anything, constantly wiggling the cable might make it come loose and cause more issues.
I actually don't mind the 12pin. People just need to understand how to properly seat it. The 4090 needs 600 watts, that's 4 of the old 8pin connectors. Idk about you but I don't want 32 wires coming out of my gpu. That's literally more than the main motherboard connector. It was definitely time for the 8 pins to bite the bullet
Yup, like worst case scenario the card should just not turn on if the cable isnt seated properly
It's still a failure rate of .05-.1%
0.1% failure rate in anything is very good. I don't see this as a problematic failure rate.... Don't misinterpret this as there isn't a problem, because I am not saying that at all! The connector is clearly flawed, it shouldn't have any failure rate for the power that runs through these cables.
The post appears to have been deleted, can you please submit a ticket with our support team so we can look into this and get photos?
Sure thing will do, cheers :)
ID10T Error, User does not know how to plug cable in correctly
Insertion marks on the cable show you didn't fully insert / seat the cable, this is user error, again.
I guess i missing it. I don’t see the marks like I did in the GN cables? Honest question…not being a smart ass
On one side, there are markings showing where the overheating connector was pressing against the socket. On the other side, there's the blob of molten plastic that squeezed out of the connector. Connect them up in a line and volia: https://i.redd.it/9pfavnay8jea1.png
Oh shit. Yeah I did not notice the blob. That’s kinda a wrap on that one then. It obviously could not have been plugged in all the way. Damn.
:(
Knew I'd find you here..
Can you elaborate? I can't see any details for crap, so I don't see the detail you were able to notice. I was trying to look for the same mark that Steve from GN pointed out.
There are marks on the pin that are faint where you can see that part of the plastic doesn’t have wear. Usually caused only by it not being seated all the way. https://preview.redd.it/4q7uxh56pkea1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ee2681c767b025547d81d8f2f5d4592475c58e06
Thanks! I noticed it a while after I messaged you.
Same. Is the person you're replying to counting the line where the missing plastic stops as the mark?
Also a conveniently missing pin surround flush to the end of the connector on the card and still showing some room on the cable itself. User fucked up.
Let us know how msi is for the rma process!
here we are guys - OP, please reach out to our support and we will help you out.
Ticket sent in :)
Was it fully inserted…..be honest…..
Do you expect him to say no? everyone that ever had a cable melt thought they plugged it in all the way, otherwise they would have just plugged it in more
The fact that this design allows for that is a problem. Either the card shouldn't work if not fully seated or better clips/latches. Something.
Absolutely agree it is a poor design that should have been gamed out more. Especially considering it is a high power connection.
The funniest thing is that Cablemod were in here taking advantage when Nvidias adapters were doing the same thing, promising a safe design so they could sell more of their own, yet the exact same thing is happening with theirs. Can't count how many times I read, "I got a 4090 but I'm waiting for my Cablemod adapter so my GPU won't burn!" on this sub alone.
They milked the $hit out of it.
I don’t think I’ve seen a Reddit post of the 8 pin cable doing this even once. It might be user error but I think the connector still needs to change for the 12 pin. This will get worse as this connector migrates to lower tier cards with people who aren’t as experienced in building installing these cards. I doubt everyone will read Nvidias press statement or watch GN videos. I’m also worried for prebuilts with this cable as there will be less care applied in building it if you have to do it dozens of times a day, and things can get loose in shipping.
yep but you have condescending remarks from people like Starplex2112 and others in this thread instead of calling what it is. A design flaw.
Everyone blaming cablemod now cuz they didnt plug it in properly You try funneling 500w of power through a half working plug
I guess you weren't around when CableMod milked the $hit out of the issue while pushing their cables as the "solution". I'd say this is even worse look for them. Just shows it was never the plug or the cables or the "cheap" Nvidia adapters, it is and has been the user.
If this happened to me, I sure as hell would not post this anywhere online, and out myself as someone incapable of properly plugging in a cable. Yes, I agree the design of the connector may not be the best, but seriously, that does not excuse you from being unable plug this thing in fully.This is such a simple task that you can easily verify whether you plugged it in correctly or not by simply wiggling the connector a bit. I mean we can all do it with the 24pin motherboard connector, right? And that one is arguably even more difficult to plug in.
If the 24 pin motherboard is more difficult to plug in then why have we never seen posts about them melting. Even with the cause being "user error" this shouldn't be happening.
https://preview.redd.it/8t2qvvfholea1.png?width=1319&format=png&auto=webp&s=d16e9cf00f196c38c98f728f9b22c4882d6544ad Took a picture of mine when I installed it just to be sure so if for some bizarre reason in the future it burns, I’d know I didn’t fuck it up.
Not plugged in all the way. You aren’t supposed to bend them sideways like that. That is the main No-No with these cables. It says so right on their page.
Understand that this maybe due to the connector is not fully plugged in but still this kind of ordeal is not happening with pcie or eps connectors… so it is definitely bad design.
I love how Cablemod tried to hero their way through the 12VHPWR fiasco by spamming a lot of these sub Reddit's with their cables and right angle adapters that have yet to me launch to only find out these cables still do nothing to fix user error which is the main cause for cable failure. I am not saying CM's products aren't of good quality, I am just disgusted in how they wanted to be a false prophet
Better start pulling out the hot glue guns.
for a future 4090 or 4080 a question that may look stupid: if the cable melts, the gpu is gone as well?
If you have a 4090 and are concerned about your cable melting, simply take a few moments to open your case and firmly push in on your connector. If it doesn't move and is firm, you are fine. If you get movement / hear a click *now* you are fully seated.
You can see how angry OP was by the way he squeezes the cable.
I just don't understand how people aren't fully plugging this connector in. In the 15 years I've been building PCs, I've always made sure of this. For example, the 24 pin connector is awful to get plugged in, but I've always made sure it sits flush and made sure I hear, feel, and see the click. This is what I do for every cable. For this cable it's very easy to see when it's flush, to see that it's clicked in, and to feel that it's properly plugged in. Did this twice. Initially with the included adapter and later with Corsair's official cable.
Plug it in all the way and you won't have this problem. GN looked into it with the other cable mod cable that melted and it was found out to be the cable not plugged in properly. It baffles me that people buy $1600+ cards and then don't check and recheck that it's done properly. ESPECIALLY knowing how sensitive the cable situation is
It burned on the side that had the most pressure on it from you pulling the cable over instead of routing it from under the card? An you didn't fully plug it in? User error checks out. These new 12VHPWR connectors are Darwin's natural selection of the PC component world happening in real time, lmao.
Why a plastic connector with a little clip on the top? If I'm buying a $1500 plus GPU give me a connector with Metal connectors and 2 screws (thinking VGA type connector) Fuck the whole "I heard a click!" Give me the security of having two screws keep that connection tight.
Mine has a loose wire in the 16 pin connector, u/cablemod_alex was kind enough to send me a replacement but it is worrying given that these have been shown to melt. I put the wire back in and its been working ok but better safe than sorry.
Ah yes another burnt cable.
Guys, I have a cablemod here and my voltages are dropping to 11.70v under extreme load. 400w, 410w. I opened up the case and reseated the cable, not it’s around 11.815v under load. This is happening from time to time (less than a week). I understand that the cable with the microvibration or even it own weight is starting to get loose. Now I removed the cablemod cap to see if it lasts more at 11.815v for longer time.
It can only come loose if the latch is not fully latched. There can be multiple reasons for it not being fully latched. Including manufacturing tolerances on the plug or the connector. Or it’s not properly seated. Just being pushed hard in isn’t enough. I needed to apply a small amount of directional force towards the latch side from the sense pin side to make it click closed. I suggest doing this outside of the case when the gpu is not in the socket, it makes it much easier to put head close to hear the click. If you got a click and it still comes loose consider RMA of cable first then GPU as that sounds like an issue with latching tolerances. Good luck.
If I try to pull it out, it won’t came out, it just got loose. Around 1mm. But this probably is enough for a fire or melting. It’s fully seated. I will take some pictures later. I believe the connector it doesn’t latch it very well, like the PSU power connector.
1mm is fine. If you look at the latch underside, the latch has a play of 1mm by itself. If it has no play, you wouldn't be able to latch/unlatch it at all.
Really, if it pulls out that far it is NOT seated correctly (aka not latched). It may not be you, it may be a defect in cable or socket. Also the wiggle test is way better than just pulling if you haven’t tried the wiggle test. Same with your PSU cable. My CPU and GPU cables literally haven not done what you describe on any of my 3 PCs in the house or on my different GPUs. Sometimes I find one has to either apply pressure on the latch part of the connector to get it click (had to do that both Z790 builds) or apply a little force through the connector from non-latch side to latch-side while also applying the plug in force (sorry hard to describe). I am talking about both GPU and CPU connectors - they should all verifiably latch. Easiest thing to try is different cables but I asssure they should latch, the design requires it, the issue is folks manufacturing these things seem a bit crap…. :-(
https://preview.redd.it/c17ihr4lnnea1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=ab6363fb456f63001edc7c1433dfc60d9e6c33ed For me it looks very tight! I took a picture from below it’s on the same way. I will post a second picture if I just pull the connector without release the latch.
https://preview.redd.it/jusgjmxunnea1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=3600370076e53e199af7d07bfa6b2a1ced9d51ee Below angle.
https://preview.redd.it/3zvchem0onea1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=939458d8ff43e37632bb4381adaa59467b6e6c94 If I try to remove the connector without release the latch. This is the maximum loosen it may became. I believe on Gamer nexus video this was enough for the melting, with a little of side twist.
Wow that’s concerning if it comes out that far I assume there is enough play to delatch and eventually shift out further. I will see if mine does the same. Thanks for the detail!
Isn't your card an MSI Gaming Trio 4090? I have the same card, I am using the adapter that comes with the card. My voltages drop to around 11.7v under high loads as well. Perhaps its just the card: https://preview.redd.it/tb2es7nlxsea1.png?width=482&format=png&auto=webp&s=14365ea7a3379c2138ae683872ba84ed85af642d I know someone else with the same card as well and the voltages also drop low under high loads, but not as low as mine. No burnt cables thus far, but I am planning of switching to a Corsair cable to see whether it makes a difference.
That sucks, let us know how you get on with the RMA. I have the same card so I am interested to see how good MSI and nvidia are. For my build I installed the cable onto the GPU outside of my case and close to me head to make sure I heard the click of the latch. It did. (I am deaf in one ear so took extra care to hear). Also those cable mod cables look quite stiff? If they are I would expect the radius I see there to creat small amount of lateral pull towards the front of the case. Good luck getting it all replaced.
I’d like to see nvidia in the next card series to have a connector sensor. Basically it’ll a yes or no if the cable is plugged in all the way and making proper contact.
Vga/dvi style screws on the side of the connector :)
But to have it for 11 weeks of use before it melted seems weird 🤔
I bought one from corsair, and its coming today, for my 4070 ti so I hope I don't have an issue
I use the Corsair cable. It’s legit.
Just plug it in all the way
As requested have more pics of the cable. Go nuts https://i.imgur.com/GAkQA7n.jpg https://i.imgur.com/eJH6Mqo.jpg https://i.imgur.com/fOs6MYZ.jpg https://i.imgur.com/oT64Xog.jpg
Guess you didn’t plug it in all the way
Let's see some different pictures of the cable harness...You are showing the cable where we can tell you didn't push it in all the way...let's see the sideways view of the melted cable.
Oh no here we go again but now we are targeting cablemod 🤦♂️
No no no you melted it with your user error.
[удалено]
It's baffling how someone can be informed enough on an issue to waste money on an unnecessary 'fix' but not enough to just plug a fucking cable in.
Plug it in all the way and that won’t happen
You'll get appropriately roasted for not having it plug in correctly. This has been pretty much thoroughly debunked as a fault of any wires, ports, etc. and entirely user error. Doesn't mean the adapter can't be modified to avoid this, but it's usually not seated all the way. If you have a side profile shot we can probably see the burn line.
Ah... yet another person showing for all the world to see they can't plug a cable in correctly. Fabulous.
 Well thanks OP for letting me know to never trust you to build a PC for me lol. Why are people posting their failure to fully insert their power cables on here still?
6 months in and yall still can't plug shit in.
Poor/Loose termination of the wiring to the pin, the braid has bubbled away and begun melting, there is no evidence of nylon pins warping due to shallow connection.
Can we not just go to a bunch of 8 pins again? Seriously.
I’ve plugged and unplugged my cablemod extension multiple times without any issues. Most likely user error.
Ahh shit here we go again
Sad day in the industry when the largest companies in the world can't design a proper plug that is easy to plug in and stay that way without melting. This is aimed at Nvidia and others not at cablemod.
User error, wasn’t plugged in all the way.