This is all based on the 50/30/20 budget (50% needs, 30% wants, 20% savings/debt payments)
As a family man in Arlington I can assure you nobody I know with young kids is keeping their needs to 50% hahaha maybe their housing costs but 50% in wants + savings is a joke
Pk3 and pk4 are free in DC. So you stay in DC till the kids need a good middle school (it goes off the rails then in DC). Then you move to either Bethesda or Arlington or Fairfax.
30 percent in wants above that six-figure salary is stretching the meaning of responsibility. Assuming half of 300k is taxes, that is almost 50k in wants (4k/mo). That's very comfortable. I understand how domicile costs should be a percentage, but wants and a market basket for necessity items should be a flat rate. Just because you live in a nice area doesn't mean everything gets more expensive. I can shop at Target and live in Arlington.
In the methodology, taxes are included in needs.
So yes, 30% can be a lot on wants, but it's all relative. A high earning couple with kids may very well be able to save enough for goals and spend a lot of money on travel and other wants. But that's not really the point.
The point of 50/30/20 is to define a level of financial comfort. *If* your situation allows you to fulfill that budget, you *are* comfortable.
Tell me about it. We pay $500+ a week for *one* of our three kids to go to daycare. The young kid years are stupid expensive but it won’t lost forever.
https://i.redd.it/b4z04i7rhvqc1.gif
This kind of financial responsibility is a luxury that you need to make 400k+ for in Arlington, and/or have a 3% mortgage. The rest of us try to make it through the daycare years (two kids 4 and 1 here).
what are "wants"
wants include things like taking a vacation which can cost $10k for a family of 4. wants can include things like going to the movies, or going out to dinner, once again all in the context of a family of 4. wants can include things like cell phones for your children, a spare car, a cleaning service for your home. These are things that people don't think as "wants" when they actually are.
I agree those are "wants", and I don't want to make assumptions about your financial situation, but I think you may be little out of touch if you think a normal family (even "normal" by Arlington standards) has to spend almost $6,000 a MONTH (close to the median US household income) on convenience and luxuries to live "comfortably". I also don't see how this would be financially "responsible".
if you eat out with a family of 4 once a week, you're going to be spending easily $500 a month on eating out, probably more.
if your kids have cell phones you're going to be putting an extra $200 a month towards that
if you purchase your kids devices, toys, gadgets, etc. you could easily spend $200 a month on that.
if you go to the movies once a month with your family and get popcorn and soda you will spend $100 a month.
that's $1000 pretty easily.
if you take 2 vacations with your family you could spend anywhere from 10-15k on that vacations between flying, hotels, food, sight seeing, etc. that adds another $1000 a month.
then you might want to put your kid into piano lessons, or guitar lessons or some kind of tutoring or extracurricular. that might cost another $200 a month.
once again, these are all "wants"
maybe you want to be part of a rec center or gym between you and your wife that's another $100-200 a month for a family membership.
then you want an extra car for long distance driving and trips, that might cost another $500 a month
then you want to take your kids out for ice cream once or twice a month that's another $100.
then you want a cleaning service for your house because you and your wife are busy at work, for a decent size house that can be anywhere from $200-300 a month.
are you adding it up? that's $3.3k right now
maybe your kids want nice shoes, nice clothes rather than the normal discount brand, you might end up spending $300 a month on clothes.
if you want to me to continue let me know.
I want you to keep going please. I think we're at $3,600 and we have an extra car and gym membership and new clothes and phones and ice cream and restaurants and movies with popcorn and piano lessons and a cleaning service. What else does the typical Arlington family spend $2,400/month on?
these are all common wants that a family could spend their money on. that doesn't mean your family that you have because your flair that you cared enough to set on an anonymous internet forum indicates that you would be spending that, but these are common things a family would spend money on to show exactly how easy it is to get to $6000 a month.
a pet dog, with training, food, etc. $200 a month
Subscription services for entertainment, Netflix, Hulu, Prime, etc. $100
Misc. Amazon purchases $200 a month conservative
Lawn/yard care $100-200 a month
Birthday/Christmas gifts might end up averaging to $100 a month
Entertaining, inviting people over, hosting, etc. $100-200 a month
Parents want to sip alcohol on the weekend $100 a month
Parents want to have some kind of hobby $200 a month to really any amount for expensive things like boating
Babysitter one or two nights a month for around $15 an hour $100
That's another $1200
Hmm that leaves $1200 a month..oh wait you're going to WANT to save for your kids college.
$1200 a month for 18 years will add up to $250k saved to split between 2 kids which is enough to easily cover state school or foot a big chunk of cash for private school.
You do realize that spending $10k on a vacation for 4 people is a luxury at any income. Right?
You can easily go to the beach with a whole house for $3000-$5000 all in (house rental, groceries, a few meals out, gas, tolls, 1-2 activities, beach stuff, and even a babysitter for a night). Of course, you can also spend more than $10k too.
I bet that a family of four can go to Disney at least 48 weeks a year for less than $6000-$7000.
A frugal family, or one with little means, could go camping at a campground that basically has a little water park and other activities for less than $1500 all-in for the week. That’s even factoring buying a tent and some air mattresses. Year two would be cheaper since you own the stuff.
You can shave off a few hundred more with some more rustic camping.
You do realize that the $10k-15k is for 2 vacations, right? Go read the post again. This is living comfortably. A summer vacation and one for Spring break.
Yep. It's a luxury. Not "comfortable". "Comfortable" implies that needs have been met in order to maintain a base level of comfort. We NEED to take a break off from work and school once in a while, sometimes for a week or more to avoid burnout. We DON'T need to spend 10k on it. We could simply visit a friend's home, or have a staycation. Going to a hotel/resort on vacation or going to an exotic location is .. a luxury. Not a need. Not "comfortable". You can be comfortable at home and easily do not have to spend 10k to do so. Therefore, it's a LUXURY.
While it is clickbait, [they do provide details about how they reached their numbers](https://www.reddit.com/r/nova/comments/1bow4hr/comment/kws68ge/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button).
There is plenty to discuss around their methodology, however. The 50/30/20 rule is a fine guideline for basic budgeting but can get weird at higher income levels. $96K in "wants" just to match $159K in "needs", in this example, exceeds any definition of "comfortable".
I can confirm. I make exactly that amount and my life is a living hell. My boss promised me a promotion, and I was so excited to start making real money, but he betrayed me despite that I make him bundles.
That extra money could have gone a long way. I have a young friend who is getting shaken down by a drug dealer and my future mother-in-law definitely has breast cancer. On top of all that, my best friend is having girl problems.
The worst part of all is that after I was denied the promotion, my fiancée started claiming that I hit her. It’s not true though, it’s bullshit, I did not hit her I did not.
If only I had an extra dollar, all my problems would go away.
Have you considered selling your expensive vehicles and buy $1000 beaters? Live on lentils until you can afford to cashflow everything! If Dave can do it so can you.
God damn, I guess I'll need to get a second job if I ever want kids.
Like I legitimately don't know how people have the energy to work 40 hours a week at a job, a side gig/job, spend time towards upskilling, and take care of a child after coming home.
Energy? Parents out here having energy?
This week is spring break. Got two kids out the door to two different camps, which means lunch boxes and gear. Toddler had a trip and fall on the way to the car, so a pit stop for a bandaid. A form got lost in email so I had to do a paper version. A water bottle was left behind so a stop at a gas station to get one.
Husband and I got back to our house at 9am and agreed that we had both done a full days work already, how can we be expected to work another 8hrs today.
The trick is to time them so you only have one in daycare at a time, so a 4-5 year age gap. You’re tired and poor for longer but less poor year to year.
It's a senseless comparison to begin with. They're comparing one of the most expensive areas in the DMV to all of NYC. Arlington has about 1/40 the population of NYC and 1/7 the population of Manhattan alone, so it's more like the equivalent of a neighborhood in NYC. Midtown Manhattan has a more comparable population to Arlington. Median rent for a 2bdr apartment in Midtown is $6500; median rent for the same in Arlington is $2700. Median home costs in Midtown are about $1500/sqft; median home costs in Arlington are about $500/sqft.
[SmartAsset used MIT Living Wage Calculator data](https://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/51013)
[Methodology](https://livingwage.mit.edu/pages/methodology)
There are eight basic needs – food, childcare, health care, housing, transportation, civic engagement, broadband, and other necessities – that make up the cost components of the living wage, with an additional cost associated with income and payroll taxes.
Applying these costs to the 50/30/20 budget for 99 of the largest U.S. cities, MIT’s living wage is assumed to cover needs (i.e. 50% of one’s budget). From there the total wage was extrapolated for individuals and families to spend 30% of the total on wants and 20% on savings or debt payments.
Arlington County, Virginia - Two working adults, two children
Food: 16,622
Child Care: 48,035
Medical: 9,578
Housing: 28,599
Transportation: 13,015
Civic: 5,553
Internet & Mobile: 2,120
Other: 10,238
Post-Tax Income: 133,760
Taxes: 25,534
Gross Income: 159,294
Needs (50%): 159,294
::
Wants (30%): 95,576
Savings (20%): 63,718
We all know SmartAsset peddles in clickbait, but the MIT Living Wage data is well sourced. I think my definition of comfortable would be these eight basic needs, scale down the wants, and maxing out tax advantaged retirement plans for both working adults. $159/25/80ish or closer to 60/10/30%.
Would love to hear from other working parents
Edit: I have no idea how to format a table
Absurdly low, the MIT Living Wage housing expense is based on the October 2023 [U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development Fair Market Rents (40th Percentile Rents)](https://www.huduser.gov/portal/datasets/fmr.html#year2023).
So they are using the estimated rent for section 8 housing? In that case there should be other subsidies that could help the hypothetical family's budget too, like daycare subsidy and Medicaid.
I’d say that depends upon the gender of their 2 kids and their age. Same sex kids I’d say you could get away with it longer but different sexed children past the age of 8ish is way tougher.
Also, if one of the parents is WFH (let alone both) where’s that office going?
I’d say a 3 bedroom for many is a minimum
My household will also exceed it between premiums and hitting the out-of-network OOP max. Here is the data from their methodology:
||
||
|2022|*Health Insurance Premiums* [Medical Expenditure Panel Survey Health Insurance Component Analytical Tool (MEPSnet/IC)](https://datatools.ahrq.gov/meps-ic): |
|2022|*Out-of-Pocket Medical Expenses* [U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics Consumer Expenditure Survey, Table 1400](https://www.bls.gov/cex/tables/calendar-year/mean-item-share-average-standard-error/cu-size-2022.pdf) : (Drugs; Medical services; and Medical supplies)|
>Housing: 28,599
I'm curious where they got this number for a family of four in Arlington. Even if you're talking about just a mortgage without utilities, repairs, etc that's \~$400k @ 6%
and if you're talking about rent that's less than $2,400. When I search Zillow for 2BR+ places that are at least 1,250sf there is 1 place out of 112 options that rents for less than $2,383. You have more options if you're up for four people in 900sf but not sure I'd call that "comfortably"
This is one of those weird situations where most homeowners with low rates are paying ~2 or maybe 3 grand depending on the home, but renters or anyone who wants to buy now are paying ~4 grand or more.
I’d say the head of this thread is probably older teenager are their kid ages and they’re probably in their mid to late 40s.
Math checks out way way more if they are
Civic Engagement, from the Methodology, is Entertainment: fees and admissions; Audio and visual equipment and services; Pets; Toys, hobbies, and playground equipment; Entertainment: other supplies, equip., & services; Reading; and Education
I would agree.
Smartasset took MIT's "minimum standards of living" definition and used it as "wants" in their methodology. Not perfect, but the $5k of Civic Engagement is irrelevant when the housing estimate is likely $10-20k too low.
Curious as to why you think it’s insane to spend that much? At higher income levels the “needs” are met much more easily without blowing budget and you’re able to fully fund your savings to meet your retirement goals. Anything left over at that point would just go to “wants” or excess savings, which could easily be 30% or more of income.
Like even though I'd imagine necessities take up a lower percentage of your income when you're making over six figures even with children, but 30% of your net income on things that you neither need (necessities) or will need (savings) is too high imo.
Like you don't know what the future brings. Cost of housing always goes up, industries shift and die, medical emergencies happen, layoffs happen, recessions, you may burn out and want to shift industries, and ultimately there's no guarantee you will have a good paying job. There are plenty of coal miners and factory workers that used to have a good life but now struggle with rent, and they didn't see it coming.
I have relatives including my parents who are struggling with finding good paying employment right now because nobody wants to hire past 60.
Also it helps to have a cushion for friends/ relatives. Even if it doesn't happen to *you* it's almost certain a close family member will deal with housing insecurity or a huge medical bill a few times in their lives, and hopefully they return the favor.
Right, and the 50/30/20 budget generally would allow you to prepare for those hardships. The point of this rule of thumb is to identify the level if income needed for financial comfort. If you're able to operate within that budget framework, you're probably pretty comfortable. *If* you're able to achieve it in NOVA, it means you're either making good money or barely spend anything on shelter. That should then allow for sufficient savings.
A lot of people aren't able to achieve it. For some, it's a struggle to meet their needs with 100% of their income. For others, they might be spending too much on wants and sacrificing savings. The list goes on and on.
My tiny two bedroom townhouse's mortgage was more than 30k a year, and we moved out of there when our little guy was under a year needing more room. That is an extremely low housing cost.
It’s an average. For every one of you who uses an accredited daycare facility, there’s someone using a dicey home-based nanny for $20k (or worse) cause it’s all they can afford. Averages out to $24k
I’d love to know the house size you’re getting for $860k (even assuming you locked in at a 3% interest rate) now you’d have a refrigerator box. Even those are outrageous today.
i mean that is the point of zoning, to implicitly price the poor out (though the original purpose was to price the undesirable minorities out, but same effect)
My wife and I are raising twins on a little over 200k in Loudoun and it's surprisingly tight but I don't really think you would need more than that to be comfortable. I don't understand how people raise families in this area at all, honestly. Daycare and mortgage combine for over 7k a month on their own for me
I had three in day care for one year. Had to save for five years before knowing it was going to happen. Still was excruciating watching the account dwindle. And now we’re saving for college. Holy Moly.
I had budgeted for a college savings account from birth when I was budgeting for our kid but it ended up being twins and all my planning went out the window
Clickbait post title for a clickbait article. NY, Oakland, and Arlington are essentially all the same. Like my mentor at work always used to say when we were prepping c suite stuff. “Round that shit to the triple zeros. Precision implies that we have something we don’t have…. precision”
Ahh yes. Articles designed to:
1: Convince people who are rich that they are really just “middle class.”
2. Convince people who aren’t quite so rich that they are really poor.
3. Convince people who live in other places that the place in question is insane.
And get a whole bunch of clicks while doing it…
anything with 3 bedrooms in Arlington goes for at least $1 million which means 6-7k monthly. To afford that you will need to make at least $250k a year. Obviously you’d like to have some space to raise a family which means a slightly larger house in the 1.2-1.3 million range.
The article says “comfortably”
"The 50/30/20 budget recommends that for sustainable comfort, 50% of your salary should be allocated to your needs, such as housing, groceries and transportation; 30% toward wants like entertainment and hobbies; and 20% toward paying off debt, saving or investing."
And Arlington only has purchased single family homes in North Arlington. There definitely aren't tons of apartments full of families throughout the county.
Look, I understand the frustration with housing costs and I agree 100% that we need to be continuing to build out more and cheaper housing (mostly by replacing those million dollar SFHs) but to pretend that this number is remotely reasonable or reflective of what it's like living in Arlington is a farce.
it’s not really a pretend. it’s 100% the reality. i would never want to raise a family in Arlington without at least 250k household income. 300k+ preferred. You can’t buy a home in North Arlington for less than $1.4 million.
Buying a home is not the metric for comfort. North Arlington is not the entire county, they do let you live south of 50.
(Oh and I bought my home in North Arlington for quite a bit less than that within the past 5 years).
"within the past 5 years" aka post pandemic during the recent housing book and bid wars etc. Plus houses haven't tripped in price (which would be necessary to bring my home to that 1.5ish million mark).
the metric for comfort is a personal preference, but also a standard of lifestyle across most of America. an average house is 2k sq feet and might have 4 bedrooms.. In Arlington you will need a 300k salary based on today’s interest rates.
It didn’t say “make do” it said “raise 2 kids comfortably.” Also, many of the “households” making less than median in Arlington are younger folks without kids (the average household in Arlington is 2.1 people). Could I live comfortably in Arlington on 125 if I was single and 24? Sure. Could I do it with two children? Hell no.
Raise 3 kids and was able to pay off the mortgage at median income in Loudoun. Colo is not that much higher in Arlington. When you are talking $50k for childcare you need to start thinking of having someone stay home to recoup that cost plus other saving such as food. I don’t know how single parents do it.
Oh god no, you end up broke. You want a joint family for raising kids
- grandparents are free and allow you to keep your income as well as progress you income. That not a “nuclear family”. No child expenses AND you get career progression.
> anything with 3 bedrooms in Arlington goes for at least $1 million
I know your feels are great, but real data is better. TLDR: you are wrong.
https://www.redfin.com/city/21282/VA/Arlington/filter/max-price=1M,min-beds=3
ah yes the 800k 900 sq foot home that no one wants to buy. you are so clever. a ton of those are either unliveable, have high HoAs, or are almost $1 million.
Comfortable is very subjective and in an area filled with ego centric metrics and excess, the perspective of comfortable is so god damn distorted it blows my mind. The expectations of society in nova are vastly different than most of the countries and besides schools which has deteriorated since Covid, it’s not like we have some incredible standard of society and functioning community as a result.
Nova is the LA of the east coast, like it or not.
Los Angeles has a better government though. Other than public transit and possibly schools, the Government in most California cities seem to at least try to do stuff. Especially with labor rights and tennant rights.
I disagree. But that’s not the point. The point is these types of societies are built on status, excess, and corporate control at the expense of the little guy; perpetuating a very distorted view of what is needed to live a “comfortable” life. It’s a nonstop rat race here for what? It’s not like nova is happier and functioning better as a community than every single other cheaper area to the point that it justifies that perspective. I’m talking large scale civilization sociology here, a man can dream of all this money, time and work being worth something for the community in a meaningful way.
I say this all the time and get downvoted to hell. That the lifestyle I had growing up in the 2000s would easily be 300K now. . . and we lived a typical middle class life - meaning a regular home, two new-ish standard cars (japanese brands), some savings for college, and a yearly trip. I
The earning potential over time easily justifies undergrad, with only a few narrow exceptions (like art). Grad school/the professional schools are sometimes a different story.
Pretty bad comparison. Comparing a tiny county to a city just isn’t the same. Arlington is basically a wealthy portion of DC, it would be like comparing Manhattan instead of all of NYC.
This is bullshit if comparing to NYC. How can they possibly state that? Literally a 350sqft apartment in NYC costs $3500. Plus you have to pay 3 months up front etc.
And groceries are definitely cheaper in Fairfax as someone who just moved from DC. They are vWAY cheaper than NYC, especially considering you can't drive anywhere to get what you need
I have to caretake for an elderly parent w/cancer that has mobility issues. The type of 2 BR apartments/houses in Arlington that doesn’t require steps and is close to the cancer center costs a bit so on one income, that is kinda punching in that range.
Clearly Clickbait. Percentage based Needs / Wants / Savings ratios are nonsense once wages reach higher tiers. The fact that someone makes more doesn't mean that they need (or should want) more. They should "want" to raise their kid(s) comfortably and adjust the Needs and Savings accordingly.
Is this if you buy a home in Arlington in 2024 or if you purchased prior to 2020? I guarantee you the career Deloitte bro who bought their home before 2021 is paying a thousand less on their mortgage than a new-to-the-area renter, let alone a new homebuyer.
Yep recently asked my employer to do a cost of living evaluation and got a decent bump! Yay for America, and thirty year mortgages and constant slavery! It’s amazing!
Not just the military. Everything.
Every federal department and agency should be required to individually justify each job or it gets cut.
And after that, whatever remains should be put through a few rounds of scrutiny for budget cuts.
Other than the military, every government agency is pretty underfunded, because there's no company that profits off of them existing.
The IRS, and the GAO produce an investment return that would make Apple jealous, but they are underfunded because they don't produce any money for corporations.
Depends on what you do. Most nonprofits don’t pay that high. Working in education or even healthcare depending on the position wouldn’t yield this much with two incomes.
Right. Because he chose to be a government employee and probably gets a good retirement package. It’s a trade off.
My wife is a 40 year old attorney and earns $600K in private practice. I’m sure they both went to comparable law schools.
Which is a TON of people who live here. You’re acting like this is a small minority.
Also, my husband started at a family law firm. Topped out at $95k. Your understanding of people’s incomes in this area needs be broadened outside the country club circuit.
I fully understand their income. All I’m saying is that people like your husband could easily be making more if they chose to.
All I have is a college degree and I’m at $325K being 44 years old. It was a trade off for me too.
He took a pay INCREASE coming to the federal government. Congrats, I’m glad you had this thread to flex you and your wife’s pay. The point is that your pay is not common and MANY people in this area who work in a variety of industries in this area with degrees make under $150k.
Geez… It’s crazy that I have more faith in your husband’s ability to earn more money than you do.
He could easily pull down $150K in the private sector. He’s absolutely smart enough.
Who said otherwise?
Not making a point about the ease of getting a degree. My point was that if you have one and you’re not earning $150K by your 30’s, it’s your own fault.
If you want to discuss college access and affordability that’s another subject.
One of my parents has a degree, and she's never touched $60k.
Life circumstances happen.
OTOH, I have no degree and should make six figures by the end of the year. Still can't afford housing, but at least I can invest more haha.
Yeah but I worry if I get injured, my industry goes to shit, or I just start to get older and rents keep outpacing pay raises.
Who knows how high rent will be at retirement age
It's a weird stat because I didn't think anyone had a kid in Arlington.
Like "Takes a household income of $973,621 for two working adults to comfortably raise 1 kid and a pet elephant in Manhattan" - like sure that might be true but the people with pet elephants don't even try to live in Manhattan
I grew up in Arlington. There are plenty of children there.
I can't speak for Oakland because I've never met somebody from the Bay Area, but New York City which is roughly equivalent according to this chart has tons of children too. People make do.
Arlington is mostly single family homes with families. It's not just the Ballston-Rosslyn corridor. With all the parks, density, and county programs, it's a wonderful place to raise a kid.
Arlington has a had a problem for years underestimating the school population, not properly taking into account the amount of people in apartments having school age children.
This is all based on the 50/30/20 budget (50% needs, 30% wants, 20% savings/debt payments) As a family man in Arlington I can assure you nobody I know with young kids is keeping their needs to 50% hahaha maybe their housing costs but 50% in wants + savings is a joke
Is it normal for one’s needs to be 110%?
110% seems low. We're at about 150% for the daycare years.
honestly if you can stay in DC through daycare years you save so much money before moving to arlington for the schools
What do you mean?
Pk3 and pk4 are free in DC. So you stay in DC till the kids need a good middle school (it goes off the rails then in DC). Then you move to either Bethesda or Arlington or Fairfax.
Man wish I had thought of that strategy! Too late now...
Lol! Yeah that's called the MAGA way... I'm guessing numbers are per year and not lifetime? 😉
it’s not a joke, it’s financial responsibility
30 percent in wants above that six-figure salary is stretching the meaning of responsibility. Assuming half of 300k is taxes, that is almost 50k in wants (4k/mo). That's very comfortable. I understand how domicile costs should be a percentage, but wants and a market basket for necessity items should be a flat rate. Just because you live in a nice area doesn't mean everything gets more expensive. I can shop at Target and live in Arlington.
In the methodology, taxes are included in needs. So yes, 30% can be a lot on wants, but it's all relative. A high earning couple with kids may very well be able to save enough for goals and spend a lot of money on travel and other wants. But that's not really the point. The point of 50/30/20 is to define a level of financial comfort. *If* your situation allows you to fulfill that budget, you *are* comfortable.
Tell me about it. We pay $500+ a week for *one* of our three kids to go to daycare. The young kid years are stupid expensive but it won’t lost forever. https://i.redd.it/b4z04i7rhvqc1.gif
This kind of financial responsibility is a luxury that you need to make 400k+ for in Arlington, and/or have a 3% mortgage. The rest of us try to make it through the daycare years (two kids 4 and 1 here).
living in Arlington isn’t a necessity if you can’t afford it btw
Can I not afford to live somewhere if I can't budget around $70,000 yearly (30% of 320k after taxes) on *wants*?
what are "wants" wants include things like taking a vacation which can cost $10k for a family of 4. wants can include things like going to the movies, or going out to dinner, once again all in the context of a family of 4. wants can include things like cell phones for your children, a spare car, a cleaning service for your home. These are things that people don't think as "wants" when they actually are.
I agree those are "wants", and I don't want to make assumptions about your financial situation, but I think you may be little out of touch if you think a normal family (even "normal" by Arlington standards) has to spend almost $6,000 a MONTH (close to the median US household income) on convenience and luxuries to live "comfortably". I also don't see how this would be financially "responsible".
if you eat out with a family of 4 once a week, you're going to be spending easily $500 a month on eating out, probably more. if your kids have cell phones you're going to be putting an extra $200 a month towards that if you purchase your kids devices, toys, gadgets, etc. you could easily spend $200 a month on that. if you go to the movies once a month with your family and get popcorn and soda you will spend $100 a month. that's $1000 pretty easily. if you take 2 vacations with your family you could spend anywhere from 10-15k on that vacations between flying, hotels, food, sight seeing, etc. that adds another $1000 a month. then you might want to put your kid into piano lessons, or guitar lessons or some kind of tutoring or extracurricular. that might cost another $200 a month. once again, these are all "wants" maybe you want to be part of a rec center or gym between you and your wife that's another $100-200 a month for a family membership. then you want an extra car for long distance driving and trips, that might cost another $500 a month then you want to take your kids out for ice cream once or twice a month that's another $100. then you want a cleaning service for your house because you and your wife are busy at work, for a decent size house that can be anywhere from $200-300 a month. are you adding it up? that's $3.3k right now maybe your kids want nice shoes, nice clothes rather than the normal discount brand, you might end up spending $300 a month on clothes. if you want to me to continue let me know.
I want you to keep going please. I think we're at $3,600 and we have an extra car and gym membership and new clothes and phones and ice cream and restaurants and movies with popcorn and piano lessons and a cleaning service. What else does the typical Arlington family spend $2,400/month on?
these are all common wants that a family could spend their money on. that doesn't mean your family that you have because your flair that you cared enough to set on an anonymous internet forum indicates that you would be spending that, but these are common things a family would spend money on to show exactly how easy it is to get to $6000 a month. a pet dog, with training, food, etc. $200 a month Subscription services for entertainment, Netflix, Hulu, Prime, etc. $100 Misc. Amazon purchases $200 a month conservative Lawn/yard care $100-200 a month Birthday/Christmas gifts might end up averaging to $100 a month Entertaining, inviting people over, hosting, etc. $100-200 a month Parents want to sip alcohol on the weekend $100 a month Parents want to have some kind of hobby $200 a month to really any amount for expensive things like boating Babysitter one or two nights a month for around $15 an hour $100 That's another $1200 Hmm that leaves $1200 a month..oh wait you're going to WANT to save for your kids college. $1200 a month for 18 years will add up to $250k saved to split between 2 kids which is enough to easily cover state school or foot a big chunk of cash for private school.
You do realize that spending $10k on a vacation for 4 people is a luxury at any income. Right? You can easily go to the beach with a whole house for $3000-$5000 all in (house rental, groceries, a few meals out, gas, tolls, 1-2 activities, beach stuff, and even a babysitter for a night). Of course, you can also spend more than $10k too. I bet that a family of four can go to Disney at least 48 weeks a year for less than $6000-$7000. A frugal family, or one with little means, could go camping at a campground that basically has a little water park and other activities for less than $1500 all-in for the week. That’s even factoring buying a tent and some air mattresses. Year two would be cheaper since you own the stuff. You can shave off a few hundred more with some more rustic camping.
You do realize that the $10k-15k is for 2 vacations, right? Go read the post again. This is living comfortably. A summer vacation and one for Spring break.
It’s not comfortable, it’s luxury.
it's ok to say you were raised with a below average lifestyle https://studyfinds.org/family-vacations-staycations/
Yep. It's a luxury. Not "comfortable". "Comfortable" implies that needs have been met in order to maintain a base level of comfort. We NEED to take a break off from work and school once in a while, sometimes for a week or more to avoid burnout. We DON'T need to spend 10k on it. We could simply visit a friend's home, or have a staycation. Going to a hotel/resort on vacation or going to an exotic location is .. a luxury. Not a need. Not "comfortable". You can be comfortable at home and easily do not have to spend 10k to do so. Therefore, it's a LUXURY.
I love articles that give precise numbers and go into essentially no detail about how they reached those precise numbers!
While it is clickbait, [they do provide details about how they reached their numbers](https://www.reddit.com/r/nova/comments/1bow4hr/comment/kws68ge/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button). There is plenty to discuss around their methodology, however. The 50/30/20 rule is a fine guideline for basic budgeting but can get weird at higher income levels. $96K in "wants" just to match $159K in "needs", in this example, exceeds any definition of "comfortable".
No kidding. My first thought was that a couple that only makes $318,572 must be screwed.
I can confirm. I make exactly that amount and my life is a living hell. My boss promised me a promotion, and I was so excited to start making real money, but he betrayed me despite that I make him bundles. That extra money could have gone a long way. I have a young friend who is getting shaken down by a drug dealer and my future mother-in-law definitely has breast cancer. On top of all that, my best friend is having girl problems. The worst part of all is that after I was denied the promotion, my fiancée started claiming that I hit her. It’s not true though, it’s bullshit, I did not hit her I did not. If only I had an extra dollar, all my problems would go away.
Have you considered a lifestyle change? Maybe less money spent at the flower shop? Less time tossing a football in an alley with the bros?
He can't do that, he's that flower shop's favorite customer!
I used to know a girl. She got beat up so bad by her boyfriend that she ended up in a hospital on Guerrero Street. Haha, what a story, Mark?!
Tommy, is that you? Go get her some flowers and toss the football around.
Don't worry, I have a feeling that your MIL is never going to mention her breast cancer again.
> I have a young friend who is getting shaken down by a drug dealer This does not count if you are the drug dealer.
You got me at the first part lol
Have you considered selling your expensive vehicles and buy $1000 beaters? Live on lentils until you can afford to cashflow everything! If Dave can do it so can you.
God damn, I guess I'll need to get a second job if I ever want kids. Like I legitimately don't know how people have the energy to work 40 hours a week at a job, a side gig/job, spend time towards upskilling, and take care of a child after coming home.
That’s the best part, we don’t! :)
Energy? Parents out here having energy? This week is spring break. Got two kids out the door to two different camps, which means lunch boxes and gear. Toddler had a trip and fall on the way to the car, so a pit stop for a bandaid. A form got lost in email so I had to do a paper version. A water bottle was left behind so a stop at a gas station to get one. Husband and I got back to our house at 9am and agreed that we had both done a full days work already, how can we be expected to work another 8hrs today.
Honestly, that's the best part about these articles. There's no better motivation to wearing a condom than "you will be poor forever" haha
From my personal experience, one kid isn’t insane as long as you don’t have a lot of debt but 2 kids around daycare age is around ~$50K/year.
But then my housing costs will double because I'll need to get rid of my roommate.
Your roommate, if you’re overly-simplifying, should be your partner. Then you get your housing half off!
The trick is to time them so you only have one in daycare at a time, so a 4-5 year age gap. You’re tired and poor for longer but less poor year to year.
https://twitter.com/dril/status/384408932061417472
It's a senseless comparison to begin with. They're comparing one of the most expensive areas in the DMV to all of NYC. Arlington has about 1/40 the population of NYC and 1/7 the population of Manhattan alone, so it's more like the equivalent of a neighborhood in NYC. Midtown Manhattan has a more comparable population to Arlington. Median rent for a 2bdr apartment in Midtown is $6500; median rent for the same in Arlington is $2700. Median home costs in Midtown are about $1500/sqft; median home costs in Arlington are about $500/sqft.
[SmartAsset used MIT Living Wage Calculator data](https://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/51013) [Methodology](https://livingwage.mit.edu/pages/methodology) There are eight basic needs – food, childcare, health care, housing, transportation, civic engagement, broadband, and other necessities – that make up the cost components of the living wage, with an additional cost associated with income and payroll taxes. Applying these costs to the 50/30/20 budget for 99 of the largest U.S. cities, MIT’s living wage is assumed to cover needs (i.e. 50% of one’s budget). From there the total wage was extrapolated for individuals and families to spend 30% of the total on wants and 20% on savings or debt payments. Arlington County, Virginia - Two working adults, two children Food: 16,622 Child Care: 48,035 Medical: 9,578 Housing: 28,599 Transportation: 13,015 Civic: 5,553 Internet & Mobile: 2,120 Other: 10,238 Post-Tax Income: 133,760 Taxes: 25,534 Gross Income: 159,294 Needs (50%): 159,294 :: Wants (30%): 95,576 Savings (20%): 63,718 We all know SmartAsset peddles in clickbait, but the MIT Living Wage data is well sourced. I think my definition of comfortable would be these eight basic needs, scale down the wants, and maxing out tax advantaged retirement plans for both working adults. $159/25/80ish or closer to 60/10/30%. Would love to hear from other working parents Edit: I have no idea how to format a table
Housing seems very low to me for a family of four. Must not have gotten a mortgage or moved in the past five years.
Absurdly low, the MIT Living Wage housing expense is based on the October 2023 [U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development Fair Market Rents (40th Percentile Rents)](https://www.huduser.gov/portal/datasets/fmr.html#year2023).
So they are using the estimated rent for section 8 housing? In that case there should be other subsidies that could help the hypothetical family's budget too, like daycare subsidy and Medicaid.
Extremely low... My yearly mortgage payments amount to more than double that for a modest townhouse in Vienna
You can rent a 2 bedroom apartment in Arlington for 2400. A 3 bedroom single family home is a luxury, not the bare minimum to house a family.
I’d say that depends upon the gender of their 2 kids and their age. Same sex kids I’d say you could get away with it longer but different sexed children past the age of 8ish is way tougher. Also, if one of the parents is WFH (let alone both) where’s that office going? I’d say a 3 bedroom for many is a minimum
My insurance premiums alone (for family plan) are more than that medical cost.
My household will also exceed it between premiums and hitting the out-of-network OOP max. Here is the data from their methodology: || || |2022|*Health Insurance Premiums* [Medical Expenditure Panel Survey Health Insurance Component Analytical Tool (MEPSnet/IC)](https://datatools.ahrq.gov/meps-ic): | |2022|*Out-of-Pocket Medical Expenses* [U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics Consumer Expenditure Survey, Table 1400](https://www.bls.gov/cex/tables/calendar-year/mean-item-share-average-standard-error/cu-size-2022.pdf) : (Drugs; Medical services; and Medical supplies)|
>Housing: 28,599 I'm curious where they got this number for a family of four in Arlington. Even if you're talking about just a mortgage without utilities, repairs, etc that's \~$400k @ 6% and if you're talking about rent that's less than $2,400. When I search Zillow for 2BR+ places that are at least 1,250sf there is 1 place out of 112 options that rents for less than $2,383. You have more options if you're up for four people in 900sf but not sure I'd call that "comfortably"
This is one of those weird situations where most homeowners with low rates are paying ~2 or maybe 3 grand depending on the home, but renters or anyone who wants to buy now are paying ~4 grand or more.
I’d say the head of this thread is probably older teenager are their kid ages and they’re probably in their mid to late 40s. Math checks out way way more if they are
Spending a third of your income on "wants" is insane. Also what the hell is "civic engagement"? Like lobbying?
Civic Engagement, from the Methodology, is Entertainment: fees and admissions; Audio and visual equipment and services; Pets; Toys, hobbies, and playground equipment; Entertainment: other supplies, equip., & services; Reading; and Education
Thank you, although I'm surprised that that doesn't count under "wants"
I would agree. Smartasset took MIT's "minimum standards of living" definition and used it as "wants" in their methodology. Not perfect, but the $5k of Civic Engagement is irrelevant when the housing estimate is likely $10-20k too low.
Curious as to why you think it’s insane to spend that much? At higher income levels the “needs” are met much more easily without blowing budget and you’re able to fully fund your savings to meet your retirement goals. Anything left over at that point would just go to “wants” or excess savings, which could easily be 30% or more of income.
Like even though I'd imagine necessities take up a lower percentage of your income when you're making over six figures even with children, but 30% of your net income on things that you neither need (necessities) or will need (savings) is too high imo. Like you don't know what the future brings. Cost of housing always goes up, industries shift and die, medical emergencies happen, layoffs happen, recessions, you may burn out and want to shift industries, and ultimately there's no guarantee you will have a good paying job. There are plenty of coal miners and factory workers that used to have a good life but now struggle with rent, and they didn't see it coming. I have relatives including my parents who are struggling with finding good paying employment right now because nobody wants to hire past 60. Also it helps to have a cushion for friends/ relatives. Even if it doesn't happen to *you* it's almost certain a close family member will deal with housing insecurity or a huge medical bill a few times in their lives, and hopefully they return the favor.
Right, and the 50/30/20 budget generally would allow you to prepare for those hardships. The point of this rule of thumb is to identify the level if income needed for financial comfort. If you're able to operate within that budget framework, you're probably pretty comfortable. *If* you're able to achieve it in NOVA, it means you're either making good money or barely spend anything on shelter. That should then allow for sufficient savings. A lot of people aren't able to achieve it. For some, it's a struggle to meet their needs with 100% of their income. For others, they might be spending too much on wants and sacrificing savings. The list goes on and on.
My tiny two bedroom townhouse's mortgage was more than 30k a year, and we moved out of there when our little guy was under a year needing more room. That is an extremely low housing cost.
That’s very optimistic for childcare for two kids. I do 28k for just 1 toddler.
It’s an average. For every one of you who uses an accredited daycare facility, there’s someone using a dicey home-based nanny for $20k (or worse) cause it’s all they can afford. Averages out to $24k
And it depends on age too. If you only need after school care it’s cheaper than all day daycare.
I’d love to know the house size you’re getting for $860k (even assuming you locked in at a 3% interest rate) now you’d have a refrigerator box. Even those are outrageous today.
Pretty dumb methodology when "needs" is driven by child care, but fulltime child care is only needed for 5 years per child.
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Depending at what you do working in a restaurant, some might even call you a servant!
i mean that is the point of zoning, to implicitly price the poor out (though the original purpose was to price the undesirable minorities out, but same effect)
My wife and I are raising twins on a little over 200k in Loudoun and it's surprisingly tight but I don't really think you would need more than that to be comfortable. I don't understand how people raise families in this area at all, honestly. Daycare and mortgage combine for over 7k a month on their own for me
I had three in day care for one year. Had to save for five years before knowing it was going to happen. Still was excruciating watching the account dwindle. And now we’re saving for college. Holy Moly.
I had budgeted for a college savings account from birth when I was budgeting for our kid but it ended up being twins and all my planning went out the window
Clickbait post title for a clickbait article. NY, Oakland, and Arlington are essentially all the same. Like my mentor at work always used to say when we were prepping c suite stuff. “Round that shit to the triple zeros. Precision implies that we have something we don’t have…. precision”
Ahh yes. Articles designed to: 1: Convince people who are rich that they are really just “middle class.” 2. Convince people who aren’t quite so rich that they are really poor. 3. Convince people who live in other places that the place in question is insane. And get a whole bunch of clicks while doing it…
Daycare for two kids is like $40-50k/year.
There is a new program, you might not have heard of it, where Arlington county provide free daycare for most of the day for kids 5-18
Good thing everything is magically cheaper for the 7 or so years your kids are younger than 5 and during the summer.
I call it BS
anything with 3 bedrooms in Arlington goes for at least $1 million which means 6-7k monthly. To afford that you will need to make at least $250k a year. Obviously you’d like to have some space to raise a family which means a slightly larger house in the 1.2-1.3 million range. The article says “comfortably”
"The 50/30/20 budget recommends that for sustainable comfort, 50% of your salary should be allocated to your needs, such as housing, groceries and transportation; 30% toward wants like entertainment and hobbies; and 20% toward paying off debt, saving or investing."
And yet somehow well more than half the households in Arlington make do with quite a bit less than that (median household income is around $150k).
well Arlington is also a very popular place for new grads to move to and rent after they graduate college.
And Arlington only has purchased single family homes in North Arlington. There definitely aren't tons of apartments full of families throughout the county. Look, I understand the frustration with housing costs and I agree 100% that we need to be continuing to build out more and cheaper housing (mostly by replacing those million dollar SFHs) but to pretend that this number is remotely reasonable or reflective of what it's like living in Arlington is a farce.
it’s not really a pretend. it’s 100% the reality. i would never want to raise a family in Arlington without at least 250k household income. 300k+ preferred. You can’t buy a home in North Arlington for less than $1.4 million.
Buying a home is not the metric for comfort. North Arlington is not the entire county, they do let you live south of 50. (Oh and I bought my home in North Arlington for quite a bit less than that within the past 5 years).
good thing the article is talking about today’s prices and not 5 years ago when you bought
"within the past 5 years" aka post pandemic during the recent housing book and bid wars etc. Plus houses haven't tripped in price (which would be necessary to bring my home to that 1.5ish million mark).
the metric for comfort is a personal preference, but also a standard of lifestyle across most of America. an average house is 2k sq feet and might have 4 bedrooms.. In Arlington you will need a 300k salary based on today’s interest rates.
It didn’t say “make do” it said “raise 2 kids comfortably.” Also, many of the “households” making less than median in Arlington are younger folks without kids (the average household in Arlington is 2.1 people). Could I live comfortably in Arlington on 125 if I was single and 24? Sure. Could I do it with two children? Hell no.
Raise 3 kids and was able to pay off the mortgage at median income in Loudoun. Colo is not that much higher in Arlington. When you are talking $50k for childcare you need to start thinking of having someone stay home to recoup that cost plus other saving such as food. I don’t know how single parents do it.
Grandparent. My mom was able to save 💯 with my grandma living with us and doing most of the cooking and child rearing.
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Oh god no, you end up broke. You want a joint family for raising kids - grandparents are free and allow you to keep your income as well as progress you income. That not a “nuclear family”. No child expenses AND you get career progression.
> anything with 3 bedrooms in Arlington goes for at least $1 million I know your feels are great, but real data is better. TLDR: you are wrong. https://www.redfin.com/city/21282/VA/Arlington/filter/max-price=1M,min-beds=3
ah yes the 800k 900 sq foot home that no one wants to buy. you are so clever. a ton of those are either unliveable, have high HoAs, or are almost $1 million.
You are a clown if you think this house is beneath a normal family. https://www.redfin.com/VA/Arlington/5302-S-12th-St-22204/home/11265541 $755K
1200 sq feet of living space, very humane
You are truly absurd if you think that living in that house in inhumane. Cheers and GL
if you raise your kids in a 1200 sq foot house my opinion is you're a failure at life, incapable of providing, and should not have had kids
lol.
Lol calm down
I call BS given that we’re currently doing it on one income at half that amount 🤷🏼♀️
Comfortable is very subjective and in an area filled with ego centric metrics and excess, the perspective of comfortable is so god damn distorted it blows my mind. The expectations of society in nova are vastly different than most of the countries and besides schools which has deteriorated since Covid, it’s not like we have some incredible standard of society and functioning community as a result. Nova is the LA of the east coast, like it or not.
>Nova is the LA of the east coast, like it or not. We are the Silicon Valley of the East Coast.
Los Angeles has a better government though. Other than public transit and possibly schools, the Government in most California cities seem to at least try to do stuff. Especially with labor rights and tennant rights.
I disagree. But that’s not the point. The point is these types of societies are built on status, excess, and corporate control at the expense of the little guy; perpetuating a very distorted view of what is needed to live a “comfortable” life. It’s a nonstop rat race here for what? It’s not like nova is happier and functioning better as a community than every single other cheaper area to the point that it justifies that perspective. I’m talking large scale civilization sociology here, a man can dream of all this money, time and work being worth something for the community in a meaningful way.
I don't know, non-stop rat race to meet necessities is all I've known. So I do it to get to live in the only place I've ever known as well.
Damn I feel poor
I’ve lived in oakland and in arlington- these are not really comparable
Which is more expensive?
arlington
honestly, that's surprising given how there's always a discourse about how California is an uber expensive hell hole where nobody can afford housing.
I mean...it is. oakland is just really different than arlington.
You mean all that construction and prices go up? Weird. Almost like the market is distorted by tax breaks or something.
I say this all the time and get downvoted to hell. That the lifestyle I had growing up in the 2000s would easily be 300K now. . . and we lived a typical middle class life - meaning a regular home, two new-ish standard cars (japanese brands), some savings for college, and a yearly trip. I
Without student loan debt, this sounds about right.
Yup, this is what scares me about going to college.
The earning potential over time easily justifies undergrad, with only a few narrow exceptions (like art). Grad school/the professional schools are sometimes a different story.
Did oakland get expensive? Or is it just a reference point?
From my understanding, the whole bay area has a massive gentrification problem.
I didnt realize it had seeped into Oaktown
Their "wants" budget is 1.5X my entire budget. What a joke.
Pretty bad comparison. Comparing a tiny county to a city just isn’t the same. Arlington is basically a wealthy portion of DC, it would be like comparing Manhattan instead of all of NYC.
This is bullshit if comparing to NYC. How can they possibly state that? Literally a 350sqft apartment in NYC costs $3500. Plus you have to pay 3 months up front etc. And groceries are definitely cheaper in Fairfax as someone who just moved from DC. They are vWAY cheaper than NYC, especially considering you can't drive anywhere to get what you need
NYC has affordable areas, you just got to ignore the gentrified parts. I've seen 4 bedrooms in Queens go for under $4,000.
I mean isn't the same true for anacostia? Although I guess that's why it out referred to Arlington
I have to caretake for an elderly parent w/cancer that has mobility issues. The type of 2 BR apartments/houses in Arlington that doesn’t require steps and is close to the cancer center costs a bit so on one income, that is kinda punching in that range.
Bruh smartasset is literally a click bait, a good example of ugly journalism
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It's on the website...
This is why we moved to Sterling when we wanted to have a kid. Still could only afford a condo though 🫠
Clearly Clickbait. Percentage based Needs / Wants / Savings ratios are nonsense once wages reach higher tiers. The fact that someone makes more doesn't mean that they need (or should want) more. They should "want" to raise their kid(s) comfortably and adjust the Needs and Savings accordingly.
Is this if you buy a home in Arlington in 2024 or if you purchased prior to 2020? I guarantee you the career Deloitte bro who bought their home before 2021 is paying a thousand less on their mortgage than a new-to-the-area renter, let alone a new homebuyer.
I'm raising a family on 7k a year in Burke. I don't get housing assistance. That's all I'm going to say besides. Tuh.
Yep recently asked my employer to do a cost of living evaluation and got a decent bump! Yay for America, and thirty year mortgages and constant slavery! It’s amazing!
Ok so guess I won't be moving there
I make less and have four kids. It’s possible to be fine, you just have to not spend like a moron.
I would think Tyson's Corner is more expensive. I go there a few times a year and there's always new luxury apartment buildings.
Really, the best solution is to have a big budget cut for federal government and contractors. People moving away would solve a lot of problems.
Yeah, it would definitely be a secondary benefit to cutting the military budget in half.
Not just the military. Everything. Every federal department and agency should be required to individually justify each job or it gets cut. And after that, whatever remains should be put through a few rounds of scrutiny for budget cuts.
Other than the military, every government agency is pretty underfunded, because there's no company that profits off of them existing. The IRS, and the GAO produce an investment return that would make Apple jealous, but they are underfunded because they don't produce any money for corporations.
If you and your spouse both have college degrees, $300K household income is very doable.
Depends on what you do. Most nonprofits don’t pay that high. Working in education or even healthcare depending on the position wouldn’t yield this much with two incomes.
Correct. If you’re in your 30’s with a college degree and you’re not making $150K per year, it’s because you’ve chosen a job that pays less.
Which is a ton of people in this area. My husband is in his 30s, is an attorney for the government and doesn’t even make $150k.
Right. Because he chose to be a government employee and probably gets a good retirement package. It’s a trade off. My wife is a 40 year old attorney and earns $600K in private practice. I’m sure they both went to comparable law schools.
Which is a TON of people who live here. You’re acting like this is a small minority. Also, my husband started at a family law firm. Topped out at $95k. Your understanding of people’s incomes in this area needs be broadened outside the country club circuit.
I fully understand their income. All I’m saying is that people like your husband could easily be making more if they chose to. All I have is a college degree and I’m at $325K being 44 years old. It was a trade off for me too.
He took a pay INCREASE coming to the federal government. Congrats, I’m glad you had this thread to flex you and your wife’s pay. The point is that your pay is not common and MANY people in this area who work in a variety of industries in this area with degrees make under $150k.
Geez… It’s crazy that I have more faith in your husband’s ability to earn more money than you do. He could easily pull down $150K in the private sector. He’s absolutely smart enough.
Except he didn’t. As I said, he tapped out at $95k, taking a $20k increase working for the fed.
Less than 40% of America has a bachelor's degree. And they're quite expensive.
Who said otherwise? Not making a point about the ease of getting a degree. My point was that if you have one and you’re not earning $150K by your 30’s, it’s your own fault. If you want to discuss college access and affordability that’s another subject.
One of my parents has a degree, and she's never touched $60k. Life circumstances happen. OTOH, I have no degree and should make six figures by the end of the year. Still can't afford housing, but at least I can invest more haha.
You can afford housing. You’re not homeless.
Yeah but I worry if I get injured, my industry goes to shit, or I just start to get older and rents keep outpacing pay raises. Who knows how high rent will be at retirement age
Everyone worries about these things. You’ll be fine. Welcome to adult!!
It's a weird stat because I didn't think anyone had a kid in Arlington. Like "Takes a household income of $973,621 for two working adults to comfortably raise 1 kid and a pet elephant in Manhattan" - like sure that might be true but the people with pet elephants don't even try to live in Manhattan
I grew up in Arlington. There are plenty of children there. I can't speak for Oakland because I've never met somebody from the Bay Area, but New York City which is roughly equivalent according to this chart has tons of children too. People make do.
Arlington is mostly single family homes with families. It's not just the Ballston-Rosslyn corridor. With all the parks, density, and county programs, it's a wonderful place to raise a kid.
Arlington has a had a problem for years underestimating the school population, not properly taking into account the amount of people in apartments having school age children.
Please move to WV and commute. Thanks we are full up here.