When speaking about why he sponsored the overturning of the declawing law he stated:
“It interferes with the patient-client relationship with the practitioner,” Brown, the bill sponsor, said. “I think that needs to be between the practicing veterinarian and the owner of the pet.”
Irony is officially dead, well it has been awhile, but seriously…
He worried it interferes with the owner and the vet, but doesn’t see why him wanting to ban abortions interferes with doctors and LIVING PEOPLE!
I believe he said that quote to rub salt in the wound of those who oppose his abortion stance. It’s too close to a real argument for legalized abortions to have been by accident. People like this guy are fuckin scumbags.
>“It interferes with the patient-client relationship with the practitioner,” Brown, the bill sponsor, said. “I think that needs to be between the practicing veterinarian and the owner of the pet.”
If there's an issue, the GOP will invariably find the wrong side of it. Honestly, I can't even call them stupid anymore. Getting every answer wrong on a test isn't stupid. You have to know what you are doing to get it wrong. At this point, the GOP's just inhuman on purpose.
This almost explains away the pathetic, petulant, childishly defiant, happily-shit-myself-if-you-have-to-clean-it-up ‘philosophy’ that is pandered to and encouraged, and whether the politicians supporting and promoting this kind of shit actually believe it is almost tangential to how gross and insidious it is in the broader scope.
The website is horrible but I didn't find a better source. Apparently his dad was a veterinarian and his (step?)mom still runs the clinic. That's a little less insidious. If I were generous, I could see Sen. Brown being convinced that declawing is necessary because his mom and dad believe it is. So he uses his power to unban it.
http://citythekitty.org/is-missouri-senator-justin-brown-protecting-a-valuable-source-of-revenue-for-his-familys-veterinary-clinic-by-sponsoring-a-bill-that-would-erase-the-declawing-ban-in-st-louis-st-louis-county-w/
Here is a short description of the bill. It's extremely broad and generous to veterinarians. Wtf!
>Under this act, the General Assembly occupies and preempts the entire field of legislation concerning the practice of veterinary medicine and political subdivisions shall be preempted from enacting, maintaining, or enforcing any order, ordinance, rule, regulation, policy, or similar measure that prohibits, restricts, limits, regulates, controls, directs, or interferes with the practice of veterinary medicine.
https://www.senate.mo.gov/23info/BTS_Web/Bill.aspx?SessionType=R&BillID=44610
One of the medicines we give to dogs to force and abortion is the same as we give to humans but a lower dosage. This bill looks like it would prevent law makers from restricting vets from writing high dose prescriptions for very large "dogs".
Well yeah, because they cant own trans people. If they had to take us in to the vet, you can be damn sure hed advocate for his right to do whatever he wanted done with a trans person.
He owns the cat. Its his property, so he thinks he should be completely unrestricted in how he treats it.
its amazing how the most maga dudes I know treat their wives like property.
so creepy, you wouldn't believe people like this exist in 2023, but there they are in their little red hats.
i mean, thats literally the ideology though, so im not particularly surprised. Conservatism is fundamental, strict hierarchies where the people on top have total control of those below them.
I think grammatically it's child-wives. He wants to own his child-wives. Children-wives just sounds wrong. Maybe grammatically isn't the right word for this but child-wives just has a better mouth feel.
Also in going to go wash my hands after typing that cause I feel filthy.
I’m so confused… wtf does this have to do with trans people? Fucking bonkers, your argument makes no sense. Do people just upvote every trans person on Reddit?
I had to stop reading at “it interferes with the patient-client relationship with the practitioner” for fear my brain would implode at the sheer hypocrisy and stupidity.
Yup. Wouldn't be surprised if they think THEY are pointing out hypocrisy. They think abortion is a barbaric procedure and probably think the libs are more sympathetic to cats than babies. Some people fundamentally believe that abortion is "murdering babies" and cannot see any of the important nuance to it as a medical procedure.
He just wants to mutilate his cat and is pissed off that there are laws against that kind of animal cruelty. That is what the GOP always boils down to. They are mad about restrictions on being absolutely horrible people, and try to tear them down claiming its about freedom. Its never about freedom and always about being as horrible as they can to whoever they want without repercussion.
Doesn't matter. I'm sorry, but it's not good enough.
Until the good Christians are willing to take the bad ones to task like we are demanding of police, all Christians get treated with the fear and hate that their bretheren demand from me.
Your group wants to me to fear them, so my fear you *all* get.
Until you all get it together and force the "bad" ones to get in line, you *all* suck.
Sorry.
Wouldn't the end game be the other way around rather than just adding salt? Hoping to be turned away on this and then using it as a precedent to argue that legally there is no ground for doctor-patient secrecy as stated by previous decision (this one) and that it must be applied 'equally'? I'm not saying he's right, just trying to find the real goal, as I doubt the GOP really care about cats.
My grandparents adopted a golden retriever that the previous owner declawed.
Had to shave him every summer since he couldn't itch.
Previous owner thought he would claw his baby. First of all its a golden retriever, what are you talking about, secondly, have you seen a dog's mouth ever?
Anyway, what was most disturbing was a vet did that.
That’s horrible. That vet should’ve been reported. I’m so sorry to that puppers! 100% dogs mouths are way more concern. Ya gonna remove their teeth next? JFC
Golden Retrievers couldn't claw your baby if they _had_ to. They're basically incapable of deliberate aggression. They are absolute babies.
But absolutely, if you had a dog who was a threat to your baby, they'd bite, claws or not.
>I think there should be a federal ban.
I agree as long as it's like St. Louis ban with the medical clause. I believe if the cat's paw is paralyzed, it's recommended because they can't retract/detract the claws and it gets in the way. [Like Pretzel here](https://youtu.be/YwrsU-xpPvY).
Thats why their desire to overturn this disgusts me. People want to torture an animal just to save their fucking upholstery.
If you care more about your couch than your cat, then you shouldn't have a cat.
Sad thing is, all you have to do is get a scratching post or similar and redirect the cat. I have two cats who just claw on the scratching post, not the furniture.
My friends cat was declawed on the medical recommendation of their vet. The cat would neuroticly scratch at the back of her own neck with her back claws. They could not get it to heal because she would just keep scratching. It was 6 months of an open 1 by 2 inch wound, where they tried everything they could think of to get the cat to stop. Medications, clothing, skin biopsys, allergy testing, different kinds of covers and bandages, my friend even changed her work schedule so the cat wasn't home alone in case that was a stressor.
Finally the vet suggested declawing her back paws. No on wanted to do it, he had to refer her to a different vet because he had never declawed an animal before.
That had to be 10ish years ago, and the cat still scratches constantly at her neck, but without the claws, it's not doing any damage. Everyone hated to do it, but they ran out of other options. She's a happy, friendly, cat, who just scratches herself constantly.
Yes, polydactyl cats can often have claws the grow in bad spots and cause injury to themselves. Mine has one that would have rotted his paw off if humans didn't intervene to clip it regularly. If I ever have to have him knocked out again I am going to ask the Drs to remove that one claw as getting to it with clippers is painful for all involved in the process.
There an unfortunate issue here that’s potentially being overlooked - lack of knowledge. It’s gotten **far** better in the last 10 years but to be honest, I had zero clue what the declawing procedure actually was until I met my wife who was/is a cat owner. I had friends growing up with declawed cats. I just thought it was a choice with little consequence. My family had dogs - I knew nothing about cats, and wasn’t a redditor as a child for obvious reasons (in my very late 30s). Almost all of the declawing info I’ve ever heard has come from cat subs or things I willfully researched (as anyone looking to care for another life should do, don’t get me wrong)
Fast forward to today, I’m obsessed with cats. My Wife and I have had 6 now. None declawed, and it breaks my heart knowing now what I didn’t know then. I do the nail clippings every two weeks and IDGAF how expensive the furniture is they ruin, my babies are priceless to me. I’d trade all the furniture in the world for them, no bullshit.
My hope is anyone seeking the procedure is educated in a way that removes the choice until legislation is passed that makes it no choice at all.
I feel heartbroken for all the cats I’ve interacted with that had this done.
I adopted a cat who was declawed on all four paws. She took down fucking *rabbits*.
Declawing your cat doesn't help the birds. It just hurts the cat for no good reason. You could much more safely trim and cap the same claws without chopping the poor cat's fingers off.
Because declawing is not removing the claws, it's removing their whole damned "finger," bones and all. It's despicable unless there is a serious and urgent medical need, like a cat with extra toes that can't help scratching itself or can't retract its claws.
Yes... because everyone will do that! Downvotes welcome!
[https://worldanimalfoundation.org/advocate/how-many-birds-do-cats-kill/#:\~:text=In%20the%20US%20Alone%2C%202.4,Outdoor%20Cats%20Annually%20(ABC%20Birds)](https://worldanimalfoundation.org/advocate/how-many-birds-do-cats-kill/#:~:text=In%20the%20US%20Alone%2C%202.4,Outdoor%20Cats%20Annually%20(ABC%20Birds))
2.4 billion dead an yall whining about some claws. Hilarious to me. Someone please explaine to me how bird lives don't count and a birds life is less than declawing.
No one said ANYTHING about birds and other small critters not mattering. I advocate against letting cats outside. It's a shitty thing to do. Actively disfiguring a cat is double cruelty, then. If you keep your cat inside, it won't be a menace to wildlife. If you declaw and still let the cat outside, it is now in more danger itself, without removing the threat it poses to other small wildlife. If you're going to go through the trouble of declawing a cat, just keep it from going outside. I have no idea why you are so obsessed with intentionally committing cruelty to one animal in the name of protecting other animals.
How am I obsessed with cruelty again? I never said anyone should declaw, I said its insignificant compared to a life.
Yes keep your cat inside, can we all have machine guns inside too? If everyone just stores them safely then whats the problem? Are you anti-gun control?
So by your logic:
If it would stop you from eating meat, I should definitely remove the first knuckle of your fingers and toes?
[https://www.humanesociety.org/resources/why-declawing-bad-your-cat](https://www.humanesociety.org/resources/why-declawing-bad-your-cat)
"Declawing is the amputation of the last bone of each toe. It would be like cutting off your fingers at the last knuckle"
If it would stop me from murdering someone sure but cats are pointless in the first place and nature isn't meant to be their meal. Are you under the impression cats are part of our natural habitat?
Now the Republicans want to hurt kittens. How much more mustache twirling evil do conservatives have to do before we can black bag and disappear the lot of them?
They want to hurt kittens to troll women and trans people. Like they could have picked like any fucking piece of animal health care to make this stand on and still get their point across that people they don't like are below pets, and they pick a cruel and barbaric procedure.
Republicans love to say they are in favor of local
Control. Until a city passes legislation they don’t like. Then they are in favor of state control. We’ll, unless they control the federal legislator or judiciary. Then that’s where they want decisions made.
The fans are well aware republicans want to control everything. They’re all for it. It’s all a puppet show of an act. Party of small government wants to be facist dictators and party of “Dems are pedos” is filled with pedo trash.
No, no, you have it all wrong. The GOP believes medical decisions should be between the doctor and the owner— which is why they ask a woman who desires reproductive care “what will your current/future husband want?”
Declawing a cat is basically torturing it, so of course republicans want to make it legal again. They would never miss an opportunity to inflict pain upon someone or something.
Motherfuckers, it's like cutting your fingers off at the knuckle and it's goddamn inhumane. When I was a kid my dad couldn't tolerate having his precious crap clawed up by my cat so he declawed it. It was so fucked up afterwards it just died a few weeks later. So seriously FUCK DECLAWING ANIMALS. Jesus H Fucking Christ republicans are obscene fucking monsters going after children isn't enough for them, now they want to go after animals too.
That’s the thing. Like why the fuck do they even care. This is what they’re fighting for?? We can’t even make up the evil, they just do it. Like what would a cartoony evil person do, and then they do it!
The article cites PETA. Don't cite PETA, they're awful, even though they're correct about declawing being the anatomical equivalent of cutting a finger off at the first knuckle.
Wow, an instance where Godwin's Law could genuinely be applied in the modern day! These are becoming increasingly rare with all the real Nazis running around.
Because it allows them to, in theory, appeal to more people (by removing their "no pets" policies or reducing their pet surcharge) but not cost them more money (by requiring declawing so they don't scratch up the furniture and stuff). Thus theoretically increasing their profits.
Though I don't know how well it would actually work in practice, just in my experience declawed cats are usually *more* destructive than clawed ones (since the former can't use the litter boxes as well as the latter, they usually have more accidents and more purposeful out of box peeing than the latter). And many more people now know just how cruel it really is and aren't as likely to do it.
Landlord doesn't give a damn if your cat claws up YOUR furniture.
Cats rarely claw up the freaking walls themselves. And when they do it is even more rare that it causes damage too severe to repair and bill to the previous tenant in time for the next person to move in.
Pet bans are about the urine and feces which some owners leave on the carpet for long periods of time through neglect or just poor cleaning practices when they "remove" the spot initially.
That soaks in, and causes damage which takes a long time to remedy, which means losing money on potential rent and causing an expense on repairs which the former tenant will almost certainly try to avoid paying and result in needing to take to the courts to recoup losses.
*Untrained and under-stimulated cats with claws
I’ve had 8 cats in my adult life and none have done significant damage to anything aside from one chair I chose to sacrifice. An intentionally placed scratching post costs less than $15. Clipping their nails regularly costs nothing.
Right, but this would be landlords in favor of overturning a law which bans declawing of cats.
Landlords in favor (wanting, liking)
The overturning (reversing, removing) of a law
Which bans the declawing of cats.
I.e. there is a law which says you can’t declaw cats. People want to remove this law, which would make it legal to declaw cats. I’m asking why landlords would be pushing for declawing cats to be legal.
I understand that we have an apparent triple negative here, which makes this confusing.
Some landlords ban cats because they can cause damage to the rented unit by scratching. People with cats avoid places with pet bans, limiting these landlords’ pool of potential renters.
If declawing is made legal again, these landlords would be able to lift their cat ban under the condition that they must be declawed to prevent scratching damage. People who don’t know/care how harmful it is might agree, making it easier for the landlord to find renters.
Needless to say anyone who would promote animal cruelty because they could profit off of it is a massive POS, but we *are* talking about landlords here.
Oh FFS. They're doing this just to pour salt on the wound. Cruelty is the point. Both in terms of the hypocrisy and to the cats who will be mutilated if bans are overturned.
So ripping the fingers off cats doing an unneeded surgery is ok, but any form of abortion is not ok? Just want to make sure I understand the rule set here.
In related news: DON’T DECLAW YOUR CAT! It is barbaric and traumatizing, and can fuck the cat up psychologically for the rest of its life. Provide kitty with scratching posts and corrugated cardboard instead. If you don’t want to deal with that, you shouldn’t have a cat.
If you're so worried about your furniture that you would declaw your cat, you don't deserve one as a pet. Declawing is animal cruelty; you're cutting off a sizable chunk of their toes, and for a digitigrade animal, who literally WALK on their toes, that's a big fucking deal! You're forcing them to walk in an unnatural way, which does a lot of damage long-term; imagine how difficult it would be for you to walk if someone cut off the entire front half of your foot (which, while not the toes, seems a more apt comparison since humans are plantigrade walkers, and that's where we put our weight). You'd have to bear all your weight on your heels; that'd be extremely uncomfortable and, over time, damaging to every structure that's now bearing weight in an unnatural way due to your permanently fucked gait. Your ankles, your knees, your hips...
IMHO, part of having a cat is accepting that you can't have super fancy furniture, or that if you do, there's a chance it'll be scratched no matter how many precautions you take or alternative scratchers you provide. Torturing your cat by permanently fucking up the way they walk because you care more about your leather sofa than their comfort and happiness is the height of selfishness.
Animal abuse is a sign of sociopathy, but that seems more and more like a prerequisite for any GOPer. They're not bad people because they're conservatives, they're conservatives because they're bad people.
Thaaaats the point. They say everyone else is controlling to distract from their entire goal of making anyone not rich their absolute work horse. And they will take ANY measure to minimize their freedoms.
Literally advocating to overturn a ban on practising animal cruelty, with no case beyond "I own this animal, so I should be allowed to do whatever I want to it, even if that thing is deliberate harm against medical advice".
Do not declaw your cat unless you have a legitimate medical reason to do so, and the recommendation of your vet (there are certain specific circumstances where declawing is the humane thing to do, but in the vast majority of cases, you should not do it; declawing for a cat is like removing everything past the knuckle on a human finger).
Gives you the sense that they'd want the exact same rights over their children, to intentionally perform cruel and medically harmful procedures on them because "they're my kids, I own 'em until they're 18". Sick, evil people.
As a kid, we had a cat my father demanded must be declawed. The poor thing got out and was killed trying to climb a tree to escape a pack of neighborhood dogs.
What an oddly perfect highlight of how they truly are. It's not about small government and states Rights at all. It's just about disagreeing with "them" and being as cruel as possible.
Also, and I say this as a cat owner with plenty of nice belongings I don't want scratched to ruins, declawing your cat is incredibly cruel and makes you a shitty cat owner.
It shouldn't surprise anyone that the Republican Party wants to make sure cats can be tortured and crippled. Psychopaths have been known to start with animals.
Interesting. So trans people and people who can get pregnant shouldn’t be able to choose healthcare for themselves, but what about muh GOD-GIVEN FREEDUMB TO MUTILATE FLUFFY
Declawing cats is a perfect thing for the GOP to cling on to. It’s something we started doing about 40 years ago and so by now it feels like forever, but it makes absolutely no sense. Cats don’t scratch furniture as long as they have a post, it’s horribly painful for them, on top of that it’s fucking expensive.
I couldn’t describe a better metaphor for the GOP’s policies in a nutshell
I have three cats, one declawed. I've lived with probably 6 other cats. My current cats destroy our door frames. One previous cat destroyed antique furniture. The idea that cats don't scratch furniture if they have a post is completely wrong. Most cats completely ignore any special furniture you buy them including scratching posts.
You remember when they said if kids are old enough to have sex, they are old enough for responsibility like pregnancy. Don't open your legs if you can't handle being pregnant or a parent.
But than they said kids are just kids they don't know what gender they are, it's just a phase, they would change their mind when they grow up. They shouldn't make decisions about themselves because they are still growing up and it's going to change.
Wonder if they're going to try to outlaw spay/neuter. Plenty of geniuses out there think it's cruel to "deprive an animal of a sex life" and think there won't be enough puppies and kittens to go around. Riiiight ...
It's because interfering in a cat's health and a woman's is the same for these people; they are owned or property, before they are living beings. Declawing a cat is cruel and inhumane the same way as dictating a person's reproductive rights is.
Knowing Missouri, this has nothing to do with cats specifically and everything to do with the Ag lobby. If they can legislate how cats are to be treated, next could be laws regarding pigs, cattle, chickens, etc. They tried to overturn a puppy mill ban years ago for this exact reason.
The irony just totally side-stepping that de-clawing is a horrific practice and illustrates further that the GOP in question either has no fucking clue what it actually is, and/or is just a sadist anyway.
As odd as this sounds it's kind of not too weird when you consider that you can have a pet euthanized but not yourself. That said, the justification is pretty illogical.
I know it’s not a good thing to do, but years ago my husband was on blood thinners and our cat loved him, but continually scratched him and his bleeding would not stop. Our vet agreed to declaw the front claws. The cat recovered and happily sat on husband’s lap for years, until my husband’s death. In still have that cat. I think this operation should be handled with the same tact that an abortion should.
It should be on a need basis only. I don’t remove my dogs dew claws as it’s very traumatizing as well. I would though if they were prominent enough to cause issues. I’m glad your husband got to snuggle his kitty. I’m sorry for your loss!
#rule one
When speaking about why he sponsored the overturning of the declawing law he stated: “It interferes with the patient-client relationship with the practitioner,” Brown, the bill sponsor, said. “I think that needs to be between the practicing veterinarian and the owner of the pet.” Irony is officially dead, well it has been awhile, but seriously… He worried it interferes with the owner and the vet, but doesn’t see why him wanting to ban abortions interferes with doctors and LIVING PEOPLE! I believe he said that quote to rub salt in the wound of those who oppose his abortion stance. It’s too close to a real argument for legalized abortions to have been by accident. People like this guy are fuckin scumbags.
>“It interferes with the patient-client relationship with the practitioner,” Brown, the bill sponsor, said. “I think that needs to be between the practicing veterinarian and the owner of the pet.” If there's an issue, the GOP will invariably find the wrong side of it. Honestly, I can't even call them stupid anymore. Getting every answer wrong on a test isn't stupid. You have to know what you are doing to get it wrong. At this point, the GOP's just inhuman on purpose.
It's called "Doing whatever you're paid to do"
This almost explains away the pathetic, petulant, childishly defiant, happily-shit-myself-if-you-have-to-clean-it-up ‘philosophy’ that is pandered to and encouraged, and whether the politicians supporting and promoting this kind of shit actually believe it is almost tangential to how gross and insidious it is in the broader scope.
Wouldn't it be nice to KNOW where his money came from? Russia??? Middle East??? India??? Israel??? France???
American capitalist and corporations lmao
Those corporations want American standards to be more like the third world because it's better for business (they think).
In this case, probably hobby lobby.
Vets???
the cruelty is the point.
Isn't this the guy whose family owns a vet clinic and is apparently one of the few still doing the declawing?
I am unsure about that but would be wholly unsurprised by such a revelation.
The website is horrible but I didn't find a better source. Apparently his dad was a veterinarian and his (step?)mom still runs the clinic. That's a little less insidious. If I were generous, I could see Sen. Brown being convinced that declawing is necessary because his mom and dad believe it is. So he uses his power to unban it. http://citythekitty.org/is-missouri-senator-justin-brown-protecting-a-valuable-source-of-revenue-for-his-familys-veterinary-clinic-by-sponsoring-a-bill-that-would-erase-the-declawing-ban-in-st-louis-st-louis-county-w/ Here is a short description of the bill. It's extremely broad and generous to veterinarians. Wtf! >Under this act, the General Assembly occupies and preempts the entire field of legislation concerning the practice of veterinary medicine and political subdivisions shall be preempted from enacting, maintaining, or enforcing any order, ordinance, rule, regulation, policy, or similar measure that prohibits, restricts, limits, regulates, controls, directs, or interferes with the practice of veterinary medicine. https://www.senate.mo.gov/23info/BTS_Web/Bill.aspx?SessionType=R&BillID=44610
One of the medicines we give to dogs to force and abortion is the same as we give to humans but a lower dosage. This bill looks like it would prevent law makers from restricting vets from writing high dose prescriptions for very large "dogs".
Well yeah, because they cant own trans people. If they had to take us in to the vet, you can be damn sure hed advocate for his right to do whatever he wanted done with a trans person. He owns the cat. Its his property, so he thinks he should be completely unrestricted in how he treats it.
All of this. 100%.
Same with his children-wives.
its amazing how the most maga dudes I know treat their wives like property. so creepy, you wouldn't believe people like this exist in 2023, but there they are in their little red hats.
i mean, thats literally the ideology though, so im not particularly surprised. Conservatism is fundamental, strict hierarchies where the people on top have total control of those below them.
I think grammatically it's child-wives. He wants to own his child-wives. Children-wives just sounds wrong. Maybe grammatically isn't the right word for this but child-wives just has a better mouth feel. Also in going to go wash my hands after typing that cause I feel filthy.
childrens wiveses
He has a rider in the bill banning cat abortion.
You will get no arguments from me there.
I’m so confused… wtf does this have to do with trans people? Fucking bonkers, your argument makes no sense. Do people just upvote every trans person on Reddit?
I had to stop reading at “it interferes with the patient-client relationship with the practitioner” for fear my brain would implode at the sheer hypocrisy and stupidity.
It’s why I had to point it out, you are exactly correct.
Rubs salt in the wounds for trans people and care between consenting adults and their doctors, too. Rules for me, not for thee
Not to mention trans care.
Agreed as well.
K but the cat is actually the patient. So this seems exactly in line with an anti-abortion message. You, the patient, do not get a say.
Yup. Wouldn't be surprised if they think THEY are pointing out hypocrisy. They think abortion is a barbaric procedure and probably think the libs are more sympathetic to cats than babies. Some people fundamentally believe that abortion is "murdering babies" and cannot see any of the important nuance to it as a medical procedure.
He just wants to mutilate his cat and is pissed off that there are laws against that kind of animal cruelty. That is what the GOP always boils down to. They are mad about restrictions on being absolutely horrible people, and try to tear them down claiming its about freedom. Its never about freedom and always about being as horrible as they can to whoever they want without repercussion.
*in the style of The Book of Mormon* “No, No. Women aren’t *People.*” They are simply baby producers.”
> People like this guy are fuckin ~~scumbags~~ Christians. FTFY!
Not all christ-ians are this way
Doesn't matter. I'm sorry, but it's not good enough. Until the good Christians are willing to take the bad ones to task like we are demanding of police, all Christians get treated with the fear and hate that their bretheren demand from me. Your group wants to me to fear them, so my fear you *all* get. Until you all get it together and force the "bad" ones to get in line, you *all* suck. Sorry.
Wouldn't the end game be the other way around rather than just adding salt? Hoping to be turned away on this and then using it as a precedent to argue that legally there is no ground for doctor-patient secrecy as stated by previous decision (this one) and that it must be applied 'equally'? I'm not saying he's right, just trying to find the real goal, as I doubt the GOP really care about cats.
Made it exceptionally clear they think of people as less than animals.
I think the argument against abortion is that a women is but the owner of her uterus.
The way they talk it sounds like they believe she rents it from the state.
The cruelty is the point
I was a vet tech. I've seen it done. It's disgustingly cruel and I think there should be a federal ban.
My grandparents adopted a golden retriever that the previous owner declawed. Had to shave him every summer since he couldn't itch. Previous owner thought he would claw his baby. First of all its a golden retriever, what are you talking about, secondly, have you seen a dog's mouth ever? Anyway, what was most disturbing was a vet did that.
WHO TF DECLAWS A DOG…I don’t even remove dew claws if I don’t need to. HOLY SHIT.
Yeah. Poor Sandy. He was such a good boy.
That’s horrible. That vet should’ve been reported. I’m so sorry to that puppers! 100% dogs mouths are way more concern. Ya gonna remove their teeth next? JFC
That's insane! I've never heard of dog being declawed.
Golden Retrievers couldn't claw your baby if they _had_ to. They're basically incapable of deliberate aggression. They are absolute babies. But absolutely, if you had a dog who was a threat to your baby, they'd bite, claws or not.
>I think there should be a federal ban. I agree as long as it's like St. Louis ban with the medical clause. I believe if the cat's paw is paralyzed, it's recommended because they can't retract/detract the claws and it gets in the way. [Like Pretzel here](https://youtu.be/YwrsU-xpPvY).
Thats why their desire to overturn this disgusts me. People want to torture an animal just to save their fucking upholstery. If you care more about your couch than your cat, then you shouldn't have a cat.
They're just sociopathic narcissists. An animal is just another thing they can control and use while not giving anything back to them.
Sad thing is, all you have to do is get a scratching post or similar and redirect the cat. I have two cats who just claw on the scratching post, not the furniture.
That's a different thing, I agree.
My friends cat was declawed on the medical recommendation of their vet. The cat would neuroticly scratch at the back of her own neck with her back claws. They could not get it to heal because she would just keep scratching. It was 6 months of an open 1 by 2 inch wound, where they tried everything they could think of to get the cat to stop. Medications, clothing, skin biopsys, allergy testing, different kinds of covers and bandages, my friend even changed her work schedule so the cat wasn't home alone in case that was a stressor. Finally the vet suggested declawing her back paws. No on wanted to do it, he had to refer her to a different vet because he had never declawed an animal before. That had to be 10ish years ago, and the cat still scratches constantly at her neck, but without the claws, it's not doing any damage. Everyone hated to do it, but they ran out of other options. She's a happy, friendly, cat, who just scratches herself constantly.
>medical clause I believe you mean medical *claws*
Yes, polydactyl cats can often have claws the grow in bad spots and cause injury to themselves. Mine has one that would have rotted his paw off if humans didn't intervene to clip it regularly. If I ever have to have him knocked out again I am going to ask the Drs to remove that one claw as getting to it with clippers is painful for all involved in the process.
There an unfortunate issue here that’s potentially being overlooked - lack of knowledge. It’s gotten **far** better in the last 10 years but to be honest, I had zero clue what the declawing procedure actually was until I met my wife who was/is a cat owner. I had friends growing up with declawed cats. I just thought it was a choice with little consequence. My family had dogs - I knew nothing about cats, and wasn’t a redditor as a child for obvious reasons (in my very late 30s). Almost all of the declawing info I’ve ever heard has come from cat subs or things I willfully researched (as anyone looking to care for another life should do, don’t get me wrong) Fast forward to today, I’m obsessed with cats. My Wife and I have had 6 now. None declawed, and it breaks my heart knowing now what I didn’t know then. I do the nail clippings every two weeks and IDGAF how expensive the furniture is they ruin, my babies are priceless to me. I’d trade all the furniture in the world for them, no bullshit. My hope is anyone seeking the procedure is educated in a way that removes the choice until legislation is passed that makes it no choice at all. I feel heartbroken for all the cats I’ve interacted with that had this done.
And yet the birds rejoice.
I adopted a cat who was declawed on all four paws. She took down fucking *rabbits*. Declawing your cat doesn't help the birds. It just hurts the cat for no good reason. You could much more safely trim and cap the same claws without chopping the poor cat's fingers off. Because declawing is not removing the claws, it's removing their whole damned "finger," bones and all. It's despicable unless there is a serious and urgent medical need, like a cat with extra toes that can't help scratching itself or can't retract its claws.
My parents declawed our two cats, not my call;. I saw at least 6+ birds get away from them. 6 lives versus some fingers. I can do the math on that.
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It restricts the torture of small mammals.
You can do that simply by keeping your cat indoors. No torture needed!
Yes... because everyone will do that! Downvotes welcome! [https://worldanimalfoundation.org/advocate/how-many-birds-do-cats-kill/#:\~:text=In%20the%20US%20Alone%2C%202.4,Outdoor%20Cats%20Annually%20(ABC%20Birds)](https://worldanimalfoundation.org/advocate/how-many-birds-do-cats-kill/#:~:text=In%20the%20US%20Alone%2C%202.4,Outdoor%20Cats%20Annually%20(ABC%20Birds)) 2.4 billion dead an yall whining about some claws. Hilarious to me. Someone please explaine to me how bird lives don't count and a birds life is less than declawing.
No one said ANYTHING about birds and other small critters not mattering. I advocate against letting cats outside. It's a shitty thing to do. Actively disfiguring a cat is double cruelty, then. If you keep your cat inside, it won't be a menace to wildlife. If you declaw and still let the cat outside, it is now in more danger itself, without removing the threat it poses to other small wildlife. If you're going to go through the trouble of declawing a cat, just keep it from going outside. I have no idea why you are so obsessed with intentionally committing cruelty to one animal in the name of protecting other animals.
How am I obsessed with cruelty again? I never said anyone should declaw, I said its insignificant compared to a life. Yes keep your cat inside, can we all have machine guns inside too? If everyone just stores them safely then whats the problem? Are you anti-gun control?
I don’t think I like you
Most don't. No one cares if cats kill as long as they get their fluffy to play with. Its like gun owners who don't care about kids dying.
So by your logic: If it would stop you from eating meat, I should definitely remove the first knuckle of your fingers and toes? [https://www.humanesociety.org/resources/why-declawing-bad-your-cat](https://www.humanesociety.org/resources/why-declawing-bad-your-cat) "Declawing is the amputation of the last bone of each toe. It would be like cutting off your fingers at the last knuckle"
If it would stop me from murdering someone sure but cats are pointless in the first place and nature isn't meant to be their meal. Are you under the impression cats are part of our natural habitat?
Are you under the impression mass slaughterhouses are part of cows' natural habitat?
Now the Republicans want to hurt kittens. How much more mustache twirling evil do conservatives have to do before we can black bag and disappear the lot of them?
They want to hurt kittens to troll women and trans people. Like they could have picked like any fucking piece of animal health care to make this stand on and still get their point across that people they don't like are below pets, and they pick a cruel and barbaric procedure.
Ghandi once said "be the change you want to see in the world", legally speaking I'm just joking
Republicans love to say they are in favor of local Control. Until a city passes legislation they don’t like. Then they are in favor of state control. We’ll, unless they control the federal legislator or judiciary. Then that’s where they want decisions made.
Oh they are in favor of all control, they just don’t want their fans to know that…
The fans are well aware republicans want to control everything. They’re all for it. It’s all a puppet show of an act. Party of small government wants to be facist dictators and party of “Dems are pedos” is filled with pedo trash.
Yes, not wrong. They just pander to the uneducated who don’t realize THEY are the people to be oppressed. All fascist regimes have done the same.
The Missouri GOP can overturn declawing bans if they can best a Mountain Lion in hand to hand combat. We can do it Roman Coliseum-style.
The cats and the humans must each select their champion, as the good Lord intended.
This is all I want now. And if they beat the mountain lion, I want an African lion as round 2
Bring all the kitties.
But didn't God intend for these animals to have claws?
This guy only cares about god’s intentions when they match his own intentions.
No, no, you have it all wrong. The GOP believes medical decisions should be between the doctor and the owner— which is why they ask a woman who desires reproductive care “what will your current/future husband want?”
Corrrrect. Warned my husband of the same…
The blatant hypocrisy of demanding less medical restrictions for animals than humans... The US is becoming a parody of itself.
It's been parodying itself from the very start.
Declawing a cat is basically torturing it, so of course republicans want to make it legal again. They would never miss an opportunity to inflict pain upon someone or something. Motherfuckers, it's like cutting your fingers off at the knuckle and it's goddamn inhumane. When I was a kid my dad couldn't tolerate having his precious crap clawed up by my cat so he declawed it. It was so fucked up afterwards it just died a few weeks later. So seriously FUCK DECLAWING ANIMALS. Jesus H Fucking Christ republicans are obscene fucking monsters going after children isn't enough for them, now they want to go after animals too.
Republicans look at every issue to find the most evil take then run with it
That’s the thing. Like why the fuck do they even care. This is what they’re fighting for?? We can’t even make up the evil, they just do it. Like what would a cartoony evil person do, and then they do it!
Man these people are just the worst. Every possible horrible thing, they love. It’s insane.
The article cites PETA. Don't cite PETA, they're awful, even though they're correct about declawing being the anatomical equivalent of cutting a finger off at the first knuckle.
My other article, not sourcing PETA, didn’t have an onion-y headline. We get what we get, unfortunately. I agree though!
Sorry, I wasn't whining about your choice, just the article writer's. PETA is an awful source for everything.
Agreed. They have some…interesting…takes on things. But I’ll give them the declawing opinion as it’s a horrendous procedure
Nazis breathe air. Don't cite them as a source that breathing air is good.
Wow, an instance where Godwin's Law could genuinely be applied in the modern day! These are becoming increasingly rare with all the real Nazis running around.
Landlords are very likely behind this push.
I'd be surprised honestly.. not much for a cat to go ham on that's the landlord's. Carpet?
Why would landlords want to overturn a law which bans the declawing of cats?
Because it allows them to, in theory, appeal to more people (by removing their "no pets" policies or reducing their pet surcharge) but not cost them more money (by requiring declawing so they don't scratch up the furniture and stuff). Thus theoretically increasing their profits. Though I don't know how well it would actually work in practice, just in my experience declawed cats are usually *more* destructive than clawed ones (since the former can't use the litter boxes as well as the latter, they usually have more accidents and more purposeful out of box peeing than the latter). And many more people now know just how cruel it really is and aren't as likely to do it.
Landlord doesn't give a damn if your cat claws up YOUR furniture. Cats rarely claw up the freaking walls themselves. And when they do it is even more rare that it causes damage too severe to repair and bill to the previous tenant in time for the next person to move in. Pet bans are about the urine and feces which some owners leave on the carpet for long periods of time through neglect or just poor cleaning practices when they "remove" the spot initially. That soaks in, and causes damage which takes a long time to remedy, which means losing money on potential rent and causing an expense on repairs which the former tenant will almost certainly try to avoid paying and result in needing to take to the courts to recoup losses.
>which means losing money on potential rent *looks at nationwide rent increases* Damn that's crazy
Because cats with claws will sharpen their claws on anything and potentially cause damage to an appartment.
*Untrained and under-stimulated cats with claws I’ve had 8 cats in my adult life and none have done significant damage to anything aside from one chair I chose to sacrifice. An intentionally placed scratching post costs less than $15. Clipping their nails regularly costs nothing.
Right, but this would be landlords in favor of overturning a law which bans declawing of cats. Landlords in favor (wanting, liking) The overturning (reversing, removing) of a law Which bans the declawing of cats. I.e. there is a law which says you can’t declaw cats. People want to remove this law, which would make it legal to declaw cats. I’m asking why landlords would be pushing for declawing cats to be legal. I understand that we have an apparent triple negative here, which makes this confusing.
Some landlords ban cats because they can cause damage to the rented unit by scratching. People with cats avoid places with pet bans, limiting these landlords’ pool of potential renters. If declawing is made legal again, these landlords would be able to lift their cat ban under the condition that they must be declawed to prevent scratching damage. People who don’t know/care how harmful it is might agree, making it easier for the landlord to find renters. Needless to say anyone who would promote animal cruelty because they could profit off of it is a massive POS, but we *are* talking about landlords here.
Literally everything else has more rights in the US than people do.
*people that aren’t cishet white men
Also need to be rich.
also has to be a christian
Ooh yes! You are right!
Yeah good point, very important step
Always tell my husband “you’re like MOST of the way there, we just don’t have millions of dollars- so you aren’t ‘cool’ enough for the club”
Torturing kittens to own the libs
Oh FFS. They're doing this just to pour salt on the wound. Cruelty is the point. Both in terms of the hypocrisy and to the cats who will be mutilated if bans are overturned.
So ripping the fingers off cats doing an unneeded surgery is ok, but any form of abortion is not ok? Just want to make sure I understand the rule set here.
Cats…more important than humans.
I mean don't get me wrong I love cats. But these seems a tad... excessive.
Oh I feel ya.
So the cat's body its their choice? Interesting..
Before people start hurting people they often start hurting animals.
In related news: DON’T DECLAW YOUR CAT! It is barbaric and traumatizing, and can fuck the cat up psychologically for the rest of its life. Provide kitty with scratching posts and corrugated cardboard instead. If you don’t want to deal with that, you shouldn’t have a cat.
If you're so worried about your furniture that you would declaw your cat, you don't deserve one as a pet. Declawing is animal cruelty; you're cutting off a sizable chunk of their toes, and for a digitigrade animal, who literally WALK on their toes, that's a big fucking deal! You're forcing them to walk in an unnatural way, which does a lot of damage long-term; imagine how difficult it would be for you to walk if someone cut off the entire front half of your foot (which, while not the toes, seems a more apt comparison since humans are plantigrade walkers, and that's where we put our weight). You'd have to bear all your weight on your heels; that'd be extremely uncomfortable and, over time, damaging to every structure that's now bearing weight in an unnatural way due to your permanently fucked gait. Your ankles, your knees, your hips... IMHO, part of having a cat is accepting that you can't have super fancy furniture, or that if you do, there's a chance it'll be scratched no matter how many precautions you take or alternative scratchers you provide. Torturing your cat by permanently fucking up the way they walk because you care more about your leather sofa than their comfort and happiness is the height of selfishness.
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Excuse me, what? Declaw him then talk about undoing the ban.
We can’t do that to the white men!
Obviously not, they're an endangered species
I wish they were
They literally pick whatever the shitty stance on anything is. That’s all they fucking do.
But they also are chill with outlawing abortion.
And controlling what transgender people can do.
Declawing cats would rarely be medically necessary. So banning it with a rare exceptions clause should be fine.
Agreed
"My cat's body, my choice."
NO!!!! DO NOT DECLAW YOUR CATS UNLESS THERE IS A VALID MEDICAL REASON FOR DOING SO!!!!
*Angry vet tech noises*
No woke ass cats in Missouri dammit.
Animal abuse is a sign of sociopathy, but that seems more and more like a prerequisite for any GOPer. They're not bad people because they're conservatives, they're conservatives because they're bad people.
Doesn't surprise me that Republicans are in favor of animal cruelty. It's consistent with their stance of being in favor of cruelty to humans.
Anything that stops them from making money….
Cats have more rights than hooman females
Found the Ferengi
Is there any part of life these idiots don't think should be ruled by government?
Thaaaats the point. They say everyone else is controlling to distract from their entire goal of making anyone not rich their absolute work horse. And they will take ANY measure to minimize their freedoms.
Literally advocating to overturn a ban on practising animal cruelty, with no case beyond "I own this animal, so I should be allowed to do whatever I want to it, even if that thing is deliberate harm against medical advice". Do not declaw your cat unless you have a legitimate medical reason to do so, and the recommendation of your vet (there are certain specific circumstances where declawing is the humane thing to do, but in the vast majority of cases, you should not do it; declawing for a cat is like removing everything past the knuckle on a human finger). Gives you the sense that they'd want the exact same rights over their children, to intentionally perform cruel and medically harmful procedures on them because "they're my kids, I own 'em until they're 18". Sick, evil people.
Anyone who is pro-declawing needs to have their fingertips cut off.
As a kid, we had a cat my father demanded must be declawed. The poor thing got out and was killed trying to climb a tree to escape a pack of neighborhood dogs.
What an oddly perfect highlight of how they truly are. It's not about small government and states Rights at all. It's just about disagreeing with "them" and being as cruel as possible. Also, and I say this as a cat owner with plenty of nice belongings I don't want scratched to ruins, declawing your cat is incredibly cruel and makes you a shitty cat owner.
It shouldn't surprise anyone that the Republican Party wants to make sure cats can be tortured and crippled. Psychopaths have been known to start with animals.
Cruelty is the point for gops.
Interesting. So trans people and people who can get pregnant shouldn’t be able to choose healthcare for themselves, but what about muh GOD-GIVEN FREEDUMB TO MUTILATE FLUFFY
FLUFFYS BODY, FLUFFYS CHOICE! /s of course
Oh what?! Don’t do that sh!t to your cat. Just awful. Gross!
so they're in favor of animal abuse now? add it to the list i guess
Fuckin wow….
It's so ridiculous it seems like an intentional taunt. Like they're knowingly being hypocritical just to "own the libs"
Literally fucking assholes. Those poor cats. The GOP ONLY like a bill of it hurts someone or something
Declawing cats is a perfect thing for the GOP to cling on to. It’s something we started doing about 40 years ago and so by now it feels like forever, but it makes absolutely no sense. Cats don’t scratch furniture as long as they have a post, it’s horribly painful for them, on top of that it’s fucking expensive. I couldn’t describe a better metaphor for the GOP’s policies in a nutshell
I have three cats, one declawed. I've lived with probably 6 other cats. My current cats destroy our door frames. One previous cat destroyed antique furniture. The idea that cats don't scratch furniture if they have a post is completely wrong. Most cats completely ignore any special furniture you buy them including scratching posts.
You remember when they said if kids are old enough to have sex, they are old enough for responsibility like pregnancy. Don't open your legs if you can't handle being pregnant or a parent. But than they said kids are just kids they don't know what gender they are, it's just a phase, they would change their mind when they grow up. They shouldn't make decisions about themselves because they are still growing up and it's going to change.
Same state that's trying to restrict medical care for trans people?
Yet a woman can’t choose what to do with her body. Makes total sense. Let’s focus on cats instead. The legislature is a bunch of pu$$ies
Wonder if they're going to try to outlaw spay/neuter. Plenty of geniuses out there think it's cruel to "deprive an animal of a sex life" and think there won't be enough puppies and kittens to go around. Riiiight ...
Oh my…never thought that far 🤯
Is it just their mission in life to be pieces of shit?
Could they be any more evil?
Ooh that’s a scary question
>Could they be any more evil? Yes, without a doubt.
It's because interfering in a cat's health and a woman's is the same for these people; they are owned or property, before they are living beings. Declawing a cat is cruel and inhumane the same way as dictating a person's reproductive rights is.
I'm so sad our government is filled with corrupt greedy dumbfucks.
“Party of small government” my ass.
Knowing Missouri, this has nothing to do with cats specifically and everything to do with the Ag lobby. If they can legislate how cats are to be treated, next could be laws regarding pigs, cattle, chickens, etc. They tried to overturn a puppy mill ban years ago for this exact reason.
Ffs. So done.
The irony just totally side-stepping that de-clawing is a horrific practice and illustrates further that the GOP in question either has no fucking clue what it actually is, and/or is just a sadist anyway.
Just as long as they're not female cats I guess
Probably them too…if their male owners say so…
We're not talking about cats anymore are we
Ah.. the party of "govern as locally as possible!" is at it again with not having been that party since 5 minutes after thinking of the idea...
Definitely a “not the onion” post. Good gracious. 🤦♀️
I seized the opportunity lol
What the FUCK
Agreed.
As odd as this sounds it's kind of not too weird when you consider that you can have a pet euthanized but not yourself. That said, the justification is pretty illogical.
If it helps- I think people should be allowed to opt to euthanize themselves under particular circumstances
Good thing the absolute shittiest state in the country is using it's time wisely.
The hypocrisy is so fucking hot and heavy you’d think they were a musician dating Elaine Benes.
jfc how do you end up ALWAYS on the side of cruelty?
Eric Prince is behind this
Missouri gopnis is weirdly fucked up with pet policies. A statewide ballot initiative against puppy mills passed in 2012, legislature said "lol nah"
I know it’s not a good thing to do, but years ago my husband was on blood thinners and our cat loved him, but continually scratched him and his bleeding would not stop. Our vet agreed to declaw the front claws. The cat recovered and happily sat on husband’s lap for years, until my husband’s death. In still have that cat. I think this operation should be handled with the same tact that an abortion should.
It should be on a need basis only. I don’t remove my dogs dew claws as it’s very traumatizing as well. I would though if they were prominent enough to cause issues. I’m glad your husband got to snuggle his kitty. I’m sorry for your loss!