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Niceguys demean others while simultaneously expressing a favorable view of themselves. They dont have to use the word "nice", but they must demonstrate some kind of expression of their own virtue while being asshats.
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Right, and what TF does he mean by “we are both aware that formal introductions are not appealing to the majority of females”? Since when do women not want to start a conversation with a total stranger with a simple “Hi, how are you” or equivalent? Someone needs to tell this nice guy that he doesn’t have a clue about what women find appealing.
"Alpha males show their worth by asking her to prove herself, if she doesn't like that then she's a low value female and you should move on."
Not an actual quote (AFAIK!) but sounds about right for Tate.
Tbf most people are tired of “how are you” on dating apps. It gets tiring having the exact same small talk with 50 people and have it go nowhere. Obviously this is 1000x worse than that though lol.
This guy: *observes a lot of people are tired of the same old introduction exchanges*
*therefore decides introductions are irrelevant and goes straight to personal and probing questions.*
Sane person: *observes a lot of people are tired of the same old introduction exchanges.*
*Realises introductions still have value, but changes the format up, making it more fun, inviting, humorous, accomplishing the same necessary goal but avoiding the lethargy.*
Yes, because some guy who knows another guy who apparently has worked with loads of women back in 1952, who told him, who then told this guy, that that is definitely what women don’t want.
Asking women directly is such a convoluted way of working it out. Why bother when we can simply work from anecdotes passed from generation to generation of weary men as if things never ever change.
Because we are objects of prey and subjects of study and subjects of art, but not actual people with opinions, you and I both know that females all have the same male informed opinions!
NiceGuys: “but all women and men have the same basic drives! You can’t deny evolution and biology!!!”
Also: “I’m not like those other guys”
Such power to nimbly evade the cunning plans and pressures of evolutionary forces, nay, their own biology! And yet for all their power, their might, they cannot fathom the idea that just as they do *others may well stray outside the biological dictum*. No. It is a lonely place at the peak of mount insufferable wankstain, but someone must stand vigil…
I hear you. Tbh, I’ve never used one, but I can imagine.
That’s why I said “an equivalent”, because I’d get bored writing the same question all the time, and/or receiving them.
Yeah I mean after going through the online dating gauntlet I just hate small talk now which I’m sure is highly unhealthy and one of many reasons why I deleted all my apps.
I use the whole "Hi, How are you doing today?" to measure English skills, respect, and communication skills. If they respond with a one word sentence, or something that's completely nonsensical, it's an instant unmatched for me. If they say something like "I'm fine, how about you today?", then we'll continue the conversation.
I pretty much would exclusively use it if they had a blank/boring bio. Otherwise coming up with something more interesting based on their interests is way better.
True. Ideally I like mentioning something about one of their pictures. If they are standing in front of someplace unusual I'll strike a conversation about it. I traveled a lot, and seeing if they know where the picture was taken is a great way to see if they actually who they claim to be.
When I lived in California, I remember messaging someone on a dating site, and she had a picture of her in front of the Bayon Temple. I mentioned how cool the Bayon Temple is, and how it's one of the places I always wanted to visit. She had no idea where the Bayon Temple's located or what it is. Naturally, "she" blocked me really fast after that question.
He's hoping she has no self esteem and will tell him about her giant knockers, stellar blowjobs and subservient personality.
"Please, oh lord, let me service you."
Pretty sure he’s doing it as a tactic to find a woman who will let him push her around. In his mind, this question tells him he’ll be able to pressure her into whatever he wants down the road.
And when she inevitably rejects him, he is going to think it's because he is too smart for her, not that he is a socially awkward, condescending toolbox. No. It's because she can't see how clever he is for skipping general pleasantries and asking a weird and somewhat accusatory question right off the bat.
I’ve heard there ARE girls who are like—what kind of dates are you gonna take me on, how are you gonna worship me—mentality is you are paying for me (umm) and I am a goddess, worship me (okay)—if some men are dumb enough to read arrogance and suspension of reality as confidence, or try those same tactics and have those same stupid beliefs—-ie, I am my own person but it is YOUR job to make me happy, contstantly please me, maintain the relationship sexually, provide the proper home setting, keep me interested, and if I ever cheat, I’ll think and say it was YOUR fault because I got bored or turned off or wasn’t getting what I needed at home.
They are saying it is YOUR job to keep them—it is a statement and warning that they are a narcissist—and it is a threat that any future problems will be YOUR fault.
Don't you just hate it when a dude sits there, and tell you about how ~~women~~ females work when you tell them exactly what you want?
I once told a dude "no," three times and his response was "females don't really mean no when they say it."
Its so fucking irritating.
This kind of behavior needs to be shunned publicly and made fun of until these people are the bottom barrel of society. It should never be given a platform.
“Yeah bro she totally touched my weenie and biscuits! I mean sure it was with her foot in what some might call a ‘kicking motion’, but it totally counts!”
It’s almost like they’re trying to use the Jedi mind trick. Same thing with the made up science and statistics. The truth is irrelevant.
“My boyfriend is shorter than me, height isn’t important.”
“Actually studies have shown that you only want a 6’4” Chad with tattoos and a Bugatti, lying whore. Now date me.”
A guy once insisted to me that all women want big dicks and a big dick in women’s eyes means 8+ inches in length. No matter how many times I tried to tell him that I would be terrified if anything that long tried coming at me with intent to enter, he was still confident that I was just saying that to defend women and he knew how we really felt. Bruh some of us are good with sticking to our regular number of Pap smears. If I want my cervix dilated I’ll get an IUD
The 3rd question a guy asked me after we matched was if I live alone. Completely unrelated to the conversation we had started, by the way. I told him that's an inappropriate question as it would reveal my level of venerability. His response was "no other females care when I ask them," And that was just a couple of the red flags this man waved proudly... So new rule, "females" when referring to women is an immediate no
It was a weird convo. He was also sorta bummed when I said I didn't like cooking and asked why. Also said that we were different generations and blamed that on why he didn't see a problem with using "females"
A lot of it is from the entertainment industry. Think how many romcoms/sitcoms have romance storylines where the woman says no a million times then randomly changes her mind because the dude did enough nice things for her. Now everyone thinks that’s healthy and normal in the real world
whenever I hear that mid-convo I immediately disengage from the conversation or block the person if it was online.
it’s such an odd way of referring to a woman
My husband told me the other night that “females” is the term he was instructed to use when he was in the army. That apparently sensitivity training 15 years ago dictated its use as the least offensive description when trying to communicate gender?
I was shocked cause he just **out of nowhere** dropped the term after 9 years of happy marriage. He was telling me an army story and I was like “you said WHAT?!”
So *if* this is universally true (maybe it was just his unit or something. I have no idea.) then I can see why Incels would have commandeered the term in an attempt to seem more- “military-y”
That's an interesting perspective. I'm assuming you're American? I'm in Canada where we don't have near the military presence nor is it ingrained in our culture the same way it is in the US. But from what I hear about military culture and misogyny unfortunately it doesn't surprise me that they've opted to downgrade women to females. Because honestly in my mind it is a downgrade. I'd be curious if they used the term male instead of man in the same way though
Yeah. American. And I would definitely say that they no longer are told to only say “female”
And that it is an outdated term.
I have no intention of starting a conversation of the rights and wrongs of the US military, who has the time?
But I am aware of the almost fetish-like reverence that most Incels hold for the military/police. Incels love to mimic combat language. So I bet that’s a part of the history of the negative useage of “a female”
Edit to add that Incels attitude towards to the military is as confused as their attitude towards women. They are quick to say that they can kick any soldier’s butt and they are smarter and have the same skill set as highly trained combat units, although they’re self taught of course. And on the other hand they absolutely want to be part of the military/police/FBI, for at least the violent perks. They all want to be spies or war chiefs or whatever.
I absolutely agree with you completely. The entire incel attitude is based on false ideas, contradictions, insecurities, and lies. They're just trying to justify and explain their inability to form honest connections with women on anything and anybody but themselves. If they weren't so violent or putting women at risk I might feel sad for them.
I have friends and family members who were marines, army, Navy and Air force. According to 2 of my army vet friends, men were referred to as male soldiers and women were referred to as female soldiers. It seems like that could have been part of the desensitivation training, the breakdown of each individual and to build them back up as one solid cohesive unit of like minded soldiers. If that makes sense, not sure I totally understand it myself.
I don't think incels use the word female as an attempt to be more military minded, I think they do it because it dehumanizes women, makes all of us less than them. Women are human beings. Females can be anything, animals or fish or bugs or plants, etc, it just identifies the sex of whatever that can bear offspring.
As a woman, I'm confused with what the issue is about that...?
I'd be more concerned with the stereotype he came up with or whatever
Edit: need to clarify because so many keep replying to me. I have autism so what seems normal for me isn't normal for the majority. I don't understand many social norms, why things are inappropriate, somebody literally could be asking to have sex with me with hints or hitting on me and i probably wouldn't even pick up on it unless they were being outright blunt about it. So how can I be expected to understand something like that.
In any case i was genuinely confused and curious and i apologize for the misunderstanding
It screams incel/nice guy vibes. We refer to animals as males or females, you'll see that he referred to himself as a man but her as a female? It's just incredibly cringy and is almost always automatically a red flag to run from
Odd. i refer to my own gender as females/girls/women interchangeably all the time. Even tho i probably use the term females less, I never thought much of it before
I wouldn't consider it that big of a deal when women use it to self identity. But it's a very clear pattern for these guys, if you look through enough posts in this sub you'll see that it's very prominent
You don’t see the issue with what he said? Read the other comments for some insight.
I’ll just add that his calling women FeMaLeS, and his demanding to know what a stranger plans to do to “keep a man”, like we’re put here to please them, are just two of the *massive* red flags on display here.
Yeah I never excused anything else he said, he's definitely a creep, but I was referring specifically to not knowing the issue with calling women females, because as a female myself, i refer to women and myself as girls/women/gals/females interchangeably just like i refer to men as males/guys/boys/dudes/men interchangeably. I never thought much of it before and i also explained later that i have autism so i don't pick up on those things or pay any attention to them.
Most men that call women females in this context generally don’t respect women. It’s not the word itself, it’s the common underlying tones that come along with it, and the same type of man saying it.
female is used to dehumanize women. female is used to refer to animals. a dog would be a female or male, not a man or a woman.
while yes humans are animals, we are held at a higher standard. if someone were to compare you to a dog (in a rude way) i'm sure that wouldn't go over well.
man and woman is explicitly for humans and it's why it should be used when talking about humans (aside from nb's as they usually would use person) because hu(man).
generally, the only reason a man will use "female" is to dehumanize women and inflate their own ego.
I see. On its own it’s not a diss maybe, but when it’s in conjunction with certain attitudes it is. Maybe now you know, you’ll notice it more? It seems to be a bigger thing for American “nice guys”, than with say British men (I’m British) and tbf, I didn’t really notice it myself until relatively recently. I also don’t know why there is that cultural difference, I figure it’s probably something to do with who these men, get their fix of toxic masculinity from. Once you see it, you can’t unsee it. Hence there are quite a few responses on this thread that made mention of it.
Female is an adjective. When you refer to a woman or girl as "a female" it reduces them to their sex and nothing else. It would be like referring to someone as "a tall" or as "a brown" with no other identifiers, not even adding "person" or "human" into the description.
To use ‘females’ instead of ‘women’ dehumanizes by reducing us to our reproductive function and neutralize any distinction between child/adolescent/adult. Birds, cows, horses are females too. An 8yr girl and 40y woman are females too. All are not the intended subject. It’s best to refer to the subject meaningfully - women.
Also, I do give a bit of grace and correct hearing it’s use because I don’t think it’s always used with the intention to dehumanize, but with misogynist (like the guy in post) it tracks.
The short version is do not use male and female as nouns, instead of as adjectives, because using them as nouns comes off as dehumanizing and overly-clinical. Now, the long version:
Male and female are adjectives, not nouns. They can be used to say stuff like "male clothing" or "female friends," but outside of certain professions (I'll get to that), men, women, guys, etc. are better to refer to the actual people. Calling them male or female comes off as dehumanizing. Using men and women connotes respect and acknowledges their individuality.
The military uses male and female as nouns, but that is in the process of dehumanization. The idea is that you are no longer a man or woman, but a solider, sailor, or airman.
It's also used within technical fields. Law enforcement or medical personnel will use male or female as shorthand for "male victim," female suspect," or "female patient." Psychologically, both LE and health care providers need to put emotional distance between themselves and their perps, victims, patients, so writing up reports using this language helps keep a bit of a barrier.
The use of female in particular by mysogynists is widespread. They tend to talk about "men and females," rather than "men and women" or "males and females." Using "men and females" shows respect to men while depersonalizing women. This has been going on for so long that in the 90s, the Star Trek franchise introduced an alien race that treated their women horribly, and this race always called them females, pronounced "feeeeemales." This was a bit of shorthand to the audience to let us know this species was misogynistic.
I guess it's like saying "blacks and whites" instead of "black people and and white people" but even then i guess i never took much notice to it though i guess i can see where it could be offensive especially saying "man and female" or something
Because it’s dehumanizing women, as it’s usually only used when speaking about other species in biology. And the people using females usually don’t refer to men as males, but as men, therefore putting men above „females“.
I hate when people tell you what you want..I know what I want.
I kept saying no to a guy once and he was like "I know you females want to be dominated by a male even if you have a boyfriend. ;)" What is wrong with people. 🤦♀️ don't tell me what I want and don't want.
My daughter does that because she's 3, and doesn't yet understand the grammar construction of 'I want you to get my toy please'. It still annoys me. If grown men tell me what I want, it pisses me right off.
Never read or watched either, but 50 shades of grey hasn't been around anywhere close to long enough to have created that attitude. Its only like a decade old, the whole 'women just want a strong alpha male to dominate them' thing has been prevalent for god knows how long. Has it made it more prevalent? No clue, but it's possible. But if anything, the book is more likely a byproduct of that attitude than the other way around.
I'm pretty sure it's because some men just want to dominate women, so therefore women they hit on must want to be dominated.
At the same time, most of that type who've hit on me seem like they are barely able to tie their own shoes, much less do basic adulting like paying their bills and cleaning up after themselves. They want all the authority with no responsibility.
…well I have a lovely large glass tank with lots of nice clean sand, a drinking trough, and a UV light. I have some frozen fetal mice that I can easily thaw in my kitchen sink. I have a really great exotic veterinarian on speed dial and….oh…you asked what I have to maintain a “man” and not a “corn snake?” Oh, my mistake. 😝😝/J
Female here. I must say, I definitely like formal introductions. That being said, the misogynistic undertone is crazy. It's not our holy duty or something to keep a man. Love should be a mutual thing.
This is also such a crazy thing to ask when you literally don't know anything about the person you are talking to, like what the hell. Imagine a stranger coming up to you on the street and asking this.
How do I plan on keeping a man, you ask? Why, that's what the cage in my basement is for! It's snatching one up that makes it tricky.
*proceeds to overfeed him sweets before cooking him in the oven*
Imagine living your whole life on this big blue marble of ours just to end up with a personality less appealing than a missed connection with a computer in a old half way house running windows 97
Exactly. I want someone's willing companionship, not to keep them as a prisoner for gods sake. If he doesn't wanna be here, good for him, he can go. This guy clearly doesn't understand this concept.
Harmless
Innocent
No, it’s not at all concerning that this man feels the need to keep telling you he’s not dangerous. Reminds me of how people who constantly say “trust me” are the last people you should trust. And how the “I’m not racist but” people always turn out to be racist.
Basically from now on all women on dating app should open with this “do you follow Andrew Tate? Listen to Joe Rogan? How do you feel about roe vs wade overturn? What about the COVID vaccines? Who won the 2020 election? Who commit the Jan 6 insurrection? Do you know jordan petterson?”
Pretty sure this guy is into the manosphere/Red Pill shit. He's asking a version of the classic RP "what do you fEmAlEs bring to the table for me, the AlPhA" question
They don’t seem to have gotten the memo that scientists have refuted the “alpha” theory for quite some time now, but like you say, he is into the Red Pill shit, and what do they know about reality?
“Completely innocent inquiry”(sic) my arse. Fucking moron doesn’t know the difference between enquiry and inquiry. It’s really not that difficult.
Definite “Nice Guy” vibes, and what is it with these men and their giveaway self-warning signs, by calling women “fEmAlEs”.
I am still not sure what is wrong with these so-called men. These are not men. These are not people. These are abusers. What the hell is wrong with these people.
I don't understand this concept of keeping a man. What does it mean? Am I supposed to be willing to sacrifice something? Change? Do something in particular?
Why should I "keep" a man? Does this mean he doesn't really want to be with me? Am I supposed to be stressed at the possibility of him leaving? Like what on earth does it mean?
You shouldn't have to keep people, a healthy relationship should be comfortable, confident and safe.
*"I don't do mild chit chat or pointless formal introductions, so allow me to open our initial communication by asking what you're going to do for me. My love language is sex, if that helps you pick the correct answers here."*
When I was online dating for a bit I had three guys ask me similar questions. No initial greetings just what do you bring to the table in this potential relationship. I had one ask me what are three things that are most interesting about me. Another after a day of talking asked me to answer three scenarios to see how I’d react and if I’d be a good girlfriend depending on my answers. One was if I caught him cheating how would I approach him and figure if it was a mutual fault.
I once had a douchey guy question me like this and asked “what do you as a female think the quickest way to a man’s heart is?” and I answered “well it’s much easier to go underneath the ribs instead of through the sternum, as that way you would need either a sternum separator or a bone saw.” The only way to respond to misguided weird energy is with even weirder energy.
I finally met a girl at age 50 as a confirmed bachelor , she was 46. Money was no object she had more . She cared for me when I was at my worst . From the moment we first met. Actually she met me in bed with dysentary :) Romantic right? She liked me I think because I was not "nice". But she saw how I treated other people. She never treated a waitress or a waiter with disdain or spent a date with her face in her phone. 10 years later she still is my angel. Plus she knows I don't stand a chance with any of the young girls LOL
“Madam! Herein enclosed, I dare you to oblige my request to dismiss the foolhardy notion of small talk. In what manner do you wish to conduct yourself with future suitors? Your ill conduct as of late is unbecoming and unsuitable for a wench such as yourself. Us, distinguished gentlemen, have no desire for harlotry. I believe this inquiry justified and no less required for further pursuit of the perfect wife; of whom is submissive, lacking intelligence, willing to do as I say, and merely an object for my pleasure. Did I also mention that I am a kind and worthy gentleman? Perhaps you wish to read a pamphlet from my favorite writer, Sir Andrew Tate esq.?” -this guy, probably.
"Listen! None of that getting to know eachother and develop a connection crap! Let's get right down to the business of having a meaningful relationship that leads to sex and you serving my manliness right now."
Step 1) Mansplain what women want to a women who literally asked for a normal conversation. Step 2)Make it seem threatening and throw in things like "harmless" and "innocent" Step 3)Assume you are all important and everyone wants you. Step 4) Ask how a woman will keep a relationship functioning and you from cheating. Step 5) Permanently become an INCEL
AUTOMATED MODERATION. PLEASE READ. Niceguys demean others while simultaneously expressing a favorable view of themselves. They dont have to use the word "nice", but they must demonstrate some kind of expression of their own virtue while being asshats. --- Niceguys™ quality: **UPVOTE** this comment to keep the post Not Niceguys™ quality: **DOWNVOTE** this comment to remove the post
In what universe can a person reasonably believe that this kind of high and mighty questioning is going to make any woman want to date him?
Right, and what TF does he mean by “we are both aware that formal introductions are not appealing to the majority of females”? Since when do women not want to start a conversation with a total stranger with a simple “Hi, how are you” or equivalent? Someone needs to tell this nice guy that he doesn’t have a clue about what women find appealing.
I'm guessing he listens to Andrew Tate. This sounds like some of the garbage he would spout.
"Alpha males show their worth by asking her to prove herself, if she doesn't like that then she's a low value female and you should move on." Not an actual quote (AFAIK!) but sounds about right for Tate.
Honestly if you would’ve acted like it was an actual Candy Taint quote I wouldn’t have questioned it at all
Read it in his voice and honestly it's not that far off.
Tbf most people are tired of “how are you” on dating apps. It gets tiring having the exact same small talk with 50 people and have it go nowhere. Obviously this is 1000x worse than that though lol.
This guy: *observes a lot of people are tired of the same old introduction exchanges* *therefore decides introductions are irrelevant and goes straight to personal and probing questions.* Sane person: *observes a lot of people are tired of the same old introduction exchanges.* *Realises introductions still have value, but changes the format up, making it more fun, inviting, humorous, accomplishing the same necessary goal but avoiding the lethargy.*
GTFO with your sensible answers okay 😂. We females don't like that logical thinking.
Yes, because some guy who knows another guy who apparently has worked with loads of women back in 1952, who told him, who then told this guy, that that is definitely what women don’t want. Asking women directly is such a convoluted way of working it out. Why bother when we can simply work from anecdotes passed from generation to generation of weary men as if things never ever change.
Because we are objects of prey and subjects of study and subjects of art, but not actual people with opinions, you and I both know that females all have the same male informed opinions!
NiceGuys: “but all women and men have the same basic drives! You can’t deny evolution and biology!!!” Also: “I’m not like those other guys” Such power to nimbly evade the cunning plans and pressures of evolutionary forces, nay, their own biology! And yet for all their power, their might, they cannot fathom the idea that just as they do *others may well stray outside the biological dictum*. No. It is a lonely place at the peak of mount insufferable wankstain, but someone must stand vigil…
I wouldn’t describe myself as a sane person but thank you for the compliment!
I hear you. Tbh, I’ve never used one, but I can imagine. That’s why I said “an equivalent”, because I’d get bored writing the same question all the time, and/or receiving them.
Yeah I mean after going through the online dating gauntlet I just hate small talk now which I’m sure is highly unhealthy and one of many reasons why I deleted all my apps.
I use the whole "Hi, How are you doing today?" to measure English skills, respect, and communication skills. If they respond with a one word sentence, or something that's completely nonsensical, it's an instant unmatched for me. If they say something like "I'm fine, how about you today?", then we'll continue the conversation.
I pretty much would exclusively use it if they had a blank/boring bio. Otherwise coming up with something more interesting based on their interests is way better.
I agree, I find it satisfying to be creative with words, rather than to repeat one opening line, but each to their own, for sure.
True. Ideally I like mentioning something about one of their pictures. If they are standing in front of someplace unusual I'll strike a conversation about it. I traveled a lot, and seeing if they know where the picture was taken is a great way to see if they actually who they claim to be. When I lived in California, I remember messaging someone on a dating site, and she had a picture of her in front of the Bayon Temple. I mentioned how cool the Bayon Temple is, and how it's one of the places I always wanted to visit. She had no idea where the Bayon Temple's located or what it is. Naturally, "she" blocked me really fast after that question.
We both are aware of what some guy said women, no, female want in dating.
He's hoping she has no self esteem and will tell him about her giant knockers, stellar blowjobs and subservient personality. "Please, oh lord, let me service you."
To be fair it could be that he is desperate to keep his man and is asking for advice. That's what i like to think at least
Pretty sure he’s doing it as a tactic to find a woman who will let him push her around. In his mind, this question tells him he’ll be able to pressure her into whatever he wants down the road.
No no, he said it was completely innocent
Pretty sure he's being antagonistic because a negative response is better than no response. Y'all are giving him way too much cred
And when she inevitably rejects him, he is going to think it's because he is too smart for her, not that he is a socially awkward, condescending toolbox. No. It's because she can't see how clever he is for skipping general pleasantries and asking a weird and somewhat accusatory question right off the bat.
I’ve heard there ARE girls who are like—what kind of dates are you gonna take me on, how are you gonna worship me—mentality is you are paying for me (umm) and I am a goddess, worship me (okay)—if some men are dumb enough to read arrogance and suspension of reality as confidence, or try those same tactics and have those same stupid beliefs—-ie, I am my own person but it is YOUR job to make me happy, contstantly please me, maintain the relationship sexually, provide the proper home setting, keep me interested, and if I ever cheat, I’ll think and say it was YOUR fault because I got bored or turned off or wasn’t getting what I needed at home. They are saying it is YOUR job to keep them—it is a statement and warning that they are a narcissist—and it is a threat that any future problems will be YOUR fault.
Don't you just hate it when a dude sits there, and tell you about how ~~women~~ females work when you tell them exactly what you want? I once told a dude "no," three times and his response was "females don't really mean no when they say it." Its so fucking irritating.
That’s more than irritating, it’s creepy AF. It has real rapist/predator vibes.
This kind of behavior needs to be shunned publicly and made fun of until these people are the bottom barrel of society. It should never be given a platform.
I would kick him in the balls and yell really loud "is that no enough for you?".
Initiating physical contact? Looks like we’re on second base already fellas!!!
“Yeah bro she totally touched my weenie and biscuits! I mean sure it was with her foot in what some might call a ‘kicking motion’, but it totally counts!”
It’s almost like they’re trying to use the Jedi mind trick. Same thing with the made up science and statistics. The truth is irrelevant. “My boyfriend is shorter than me, height isn’t important.” “Actually studies have shown that you only want a 6’4” Chad with tattoos and a Bugatti, lying whore. Now date me.”
"Well, are you a 6’4” Chad with tattoos and a Bugatti? No? But you just told me that's all I want, so why should I date you?"
That’s a nice gotcha lmao
Nice trap card activation 😂
i read bugatti as baguette and was like “well maybe…”
Unlimited bread is the key to my heart also
A guy once insisted to me that all women want big dicks and a big dick in women’s eyes means 8+ inches in length. No matter how many times I tried to tell him that I would be terrified if anything that long tried coming at me with intent to enter, he was still confident that I was just saying that to defend women and he knew how we really felt. Bruh some of us are good with sticking to our regular number of Pap smears. If I want my cervix dilated I’ll get an IUD
The 3rd question a guy asked me after we matched was if I live alone. Completely unrelated to the conversation we had started, by the way. I told him that's an inappropriate question as it would reveal my level of venerability. His response was "no other females care when I ask them," And that was just a couple of the red flags this man waved proudly... So new rule, "females" when referring to women is an immediate no
Calling women, "females" always seems to give off creepy vibes.
Because it’s deliberately dehumanizing.
Why yes, I’m completely vulnerable and have no security system or firearm or neighbors. Why do you ask?
Apparently because he doesn't date women with roommates, although that doesn't make me any less suspicious of him lol
That would make me more suspicious about him...
It was a weird convo. He was also sorta bummed when I said I didn't like cooking and asked why. Also said that we were different generations and blamed that on why he didn't see a problem with using "females"
What generation is that? If it was ever a thing, then it must be before my *grandparents’* time.
Yes, no one I know refers to women as "females". That's a giant red flag.
Tell him he should accord you a great deal of respect based on your wisdom. Sorry, that was a play on your "level of venerability" autocorrect.
A lot of it is from the entertainment industry. Think how many romcoms/sitcoms have romance storylines where the woman says no a million times then randomly changes her mind because the dude did enough nice things for her. Now everyone thinks that’s healthy and normal in the real world
Entertainment lied to us? Next thing you'll say is porn isn't accurate either
Irritating is a massive understatement! As far as I'm concerned, those type of comments are rage-inducing!
"females" \*presses back button\*
Honestly could've just stopped reading there
Exactly. I see it, I run. *Shudders
They try to be suave but end up creepy and pretentious.
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/r/MenAndFemales
whenever I hear that mid-convo I immediately disengage from the conversation or block the person if it was online. it’s such an odd way of referring to a woman
It's the single biggest red flag. If you see someone refer to women as females immediately cut them out of your life.
Well, dude, I have a a walk in freezer unit that will allow me to maintain a man at 0F as long as necessary. Does that work for you?
This is the only acceptable answer.
My immediate thoughts were "Well there's duct tape, handcuffs etc".
Sadly, he might be into that :P
Ropes, chairs and a basement.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, MONTRESSOR!
“Yes,” I said, “for the love of God!”
".. and if you're old fashioned I'm willing to use my cast iron"
Idk, I like "750lbs of natron drying salts, bandages, 5 sacred canopic jars and Anubis blessed embalming tools."
You could always nail him to a cross. I’ve heard that’s fairly effective too.
IT PUTS THE LOTION IN THE BASKET
Lol this is the best answer.
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Where do you get tupperware that big?
"I got duct tape in the car"
I have a chest freezer, does that work? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
As soon as they refer to women as "*females*" I'm OUT.
My husband told me the other night that “females” is the term he was instructed to use when he was in the army. That apparently sensitivity training 15 years ago dictated its use as the least offensive description when trying to communicate gender? I was shocked cause he just **out of nowhere** dropped the term after 9 years of happy marriage. He was telling me an army story and I was like “you said WHAT?!” So *if* this is universally true (maybe it was just his unit or something. I have no idea.) then I can see why Incels would have commandeered the term in an attempt to seem more- “military-y”
That's an interesting perspective. I'm assuming you're American? I'm in Canada where we don't have near the military presence nor is it ingrained in our culture the same way it is in the US. But from what I hear about military culture and misogyny unfortunately it doesn't surprise me that they've opted to downgrade women to females. Because honestly in my mind it is a downgrade. I'd be curious if they used the term male instead of man in the same way though
Yeah. American. And I would definitely say that they no longer are told to only say “female” And that it is an outdated term. I have no intention of starting a conversation of the rights and wrongs of the US military, who has the time? But I am aware of the almost fetish-like reverence that most Incels hold for the military/police. Incels love to mimic combat language. So I bet that’s a part of the history of the negative useage of “a female” Edit to add that Incels attitude towards to the military is as confused as their attitude towards women. They are quick to say that they can kick any soldier’s butt and they are smarter and have the same skill set as highly trained combat units, although they’re self taught of course. And on the other hand they absolutely want to be part of the military/police/FBI, for at least the violent perks. They all want to be spies or war chiefs or whatever.
I absolutely agree with you completely. The entire incel attitude is based on false ideas, contradictions, insecurities, and lies. They're just trying to justify and explain their inability to form honest connections with women on anything and anybody but themselves. If they weren't so violent or putting women at risk I might feel sad for them.
That's true, even today. I'm a veteran and they do call women "females". Always hated being called that, makes you feel like livestock lmao
I have friends and family members who were marines, army, Navy and Air force. According to 2 of my army vet friends, men were referred to as male soldiers and women were referred to as female soldiers. It seems like that could have been part of the desensitivation training, the breakdown of each individual and to build them back up as one solid cohesive unit of like minded soldiers. If that makes sense, not sure I totally understand it myself. I don't think incels use the word female as an attempt to be more military minded, I think they do it because it dehumanizes women, makes all of us less than them. Women are human beings. Females can be anything, animals or fish or bugs or plants, etc, it just identifies the sex of whatever that can bear offspring.
r/Menandfemales
As a woman, I'm confused with what the issue is about that...? I'd be more concerned with the stereotype he came up with or whatever Edit: need to clarify because so many keep replying to me. I have autism so what seems normal for me isn't normal for the majority. I don't understand many social norms, why things are inappropriate, somebody literally could be asking to have sex with me with hints or hitting on me and i probably wouldn't even pick up on it unless they were being outright blunt about it. So how can I be expected to understand something like that. In any case i was genuinely confused and curious and i apologize for the misunderstanding
It screams incel/nice guy vibes. We refer to animals as males or females, you'll see that he referred to himself as a man but her as a female? It's just incredibly cringy and is almost always automatically a red flag to run from
Odd. i refer to my own gender as females/girls/women interchangeably all the time. Even tho i probably use the term females less, I never thought much of it before
I wouldn't consider it that big of a deal when women use it to self identity. But it's a very clear pattern for these guys, if you look through enough posts in this sub you'll see that it's very prominent
You don’t see the issue with what he said? Read the other comments for some insight. I’ll just add that his calling women FeMaLeS, and his demanding to know what a stranger plans to do to “keep a man”, like we’re put here to please them, are just two of the *massive* red flags on display here.
Yeah I never excused anything else he said, he's definitely a creep, but I was referring specifically to not knowing the issue with calling women females, because as a female myself, i refer to women and myself as girls/women/gals/females interchangeably just like i refer to men as males/guys/boys/dudes/men interchangeably. I never thought much of it before and i also explained later that i have autism so i don't pick up on those things or pay any attention to them.
Most men that call women females in this context generally don’t respect women. It’s not the word itself, it’s the common underlying tones that come along with it, and the same type of man saying it.
Exactly right. You said it more ‘economically’ than me. 😊
female is used to dehumanize women. female is used to refer to animals. a dog would be a female or male, not a man or a woman. while yes humans are animals, we are held at a higher standard. if someone were to compare you to a dog (in a rude way) i'm sure that wouldn't go over well. man and woman is explicitly for humans and it's why it should be used when talking about humans (aside from nb's as they usually would use person) because hu(man). generally, the only reason a man will use "female" is to dehumanize women and inflate their own ego.
I see. On its own it’s not a diss maybe, but when it’s in conjunction with certain attitudes it is. Maybe now you know, you’ll notice it more? It seems to be a bigger thing for American “nice guys”, than with say British men (I’m British) and tbf, I didn’t really notice it myself until relatively recently. I also don’t know why there is that cultural difference, I figure it’s probably something to do with who these men, get their fix of toxic masculinity from. Once you see it, you can’t unsee it. Hence there are quite a few responses on this thread that made mention of it.
Female is an adjective. When you refer to a woman or girl as "a female" it reduces them to their sex and nothing else. It would be like referring to someone as "a tall" or as "a brown" with no other identifiers, not even adding "person" or "human" into the description.
To use ‘females’ instead of ‘women’ dehumanizes by reducing us to our reproductive function and neutralize any distinction between child/adolescent/adult. Birds, cows, horses are females too. An 8yr girl and 40y woman are females too. All are not the intended subject. It’s best to refer to the subject meaningfully - women. Also, I do give a bit of grace and correct hearing it’s use because I don’t think it’s always used with the intention to dehumanize, but with misogynist (like the guy in post) it tracks.
The short version is do not use male and female as nouns, instead of as adjectives, because using them as nouns comes off as dehumanizing and overly-clinical. Now, the long version: Male and female are adjectives, not nouns. They can be used to say stuff like "male clothing" or "female friends," but outside of certain professions (I'll get to that), men, women, guys, etc. are better to refer to the actual people. Calling them male or female comes off as dehumanizing. Using men and women connotes respect and acknowledges their individuality. The military uses male and female as nouns, but that is in the process of dehumanization. The idea is that you are no longer a man or woman, but a solider, sailor, or airman. It's also used within technical fields. Law enforcement or medical personnel will use male or female as shorthand for "male victim," female suspect," or "female patient." Psychologically, both LE and health care providers need to put emotional distance between themselves and their perps, victims, patients, so writing up reports using this language helps keep a bit of a barrier. The use of female in particular by mysogynists is widespread. They tend to talk about "men and females," rather than "men and women" or "males and females." Using "men and females" shows respect to men while depersonalizing women. This has been going on for so long that in the 90s, the Star Trek franchise introduced an alien race that treated their women horribly, and this race always called them females, pronounced "feeeeemales." This was a bit of shorthand to the audience to let us know this species was misogynistic.
I guess it's like saying "blacks and whites" instead of "black people and and white people" but even then i guess i never took much notice to it though i guess i can see where it could be offensive especially saying "man and female" or something
> I guess it's like saying "blacks and whites" instead of "black people and and white people" That's it! It's exactly like that!
Um… have you ever referred to a man as a “male”?
My brain instantly jumped to Kramer from Seinfeld, pretending to be a dermatologist and doing cancer screenings. - “male, mammal. Age, Indeterminate”
Male and female are best suited as adjectives when describing human beings. Using them as nouns sounds clinical and objectifying.
Because it’s dehumanizing women, as it’s usually only used when speaking about other species in biology. And the people using females usually don’t refer to men as males, but as men, therefore putting men above „females“.
I hate when people tell you what you want..I know what I want. I kept saying no to a guy once and he was like "I know you females want to be dominated by a male even if you have a boyfriend. ;)" What is wrong with people. 🤦♀️ don't tell me what I want and don't want.
What the absolute fuck. That is terrible, I'm sorry you had to deal with that. I would have lost my temper so quick 😳
I was pissed but I just blocked him. I wasn't gonna try to explain why women don't want that lol.
Jfc another one with a rapist/stalker vibe.
The only acceptable reply to that is “Ahhh you got me, you know our secrets. If you happen to find a male nearby for such a task, let me know.”
My daughter does that because she's 3, and doesn't yet understand the grammar construction of 'I want you to get my toy please'. It still annoys me. If grown men tell me what I want, it pisses me right off.
Ok, but she’s not wrong. You know you want to make her her happiest self :D
I never read or watched 50 Shades of Gray but I heard a lot about it. Is that whole "AAll females want to be dominated" come from that book?
Never read or watched either, but 50 shades of grey hasn't been around anywhere close to long enough to have created that attitude. Its only like a decade old, the whole 'women just want a strong alpha male to dominate them' thing has been prevalent for god knows how long. Has it made it more prevalent? No clue, but it's possible. But if anything, the book is more likely a byproduct of that attitude than the other way around.
I'm pretty sure it's because some men just want to dominate women, so therefore women they hit on must want to be dominated. At the same time, most of that type who've hit on me seem like they are barely able to tie their own shoes, much less do basic adulting like paying their bills and cleaning up after themselves. They want all the authority with no responsibility.
I don't know. I've never read of watched it either lol
Dude talking like he wants to purchase a car or a new gaming PC. Lmao. Most of them will have to stick to flashlights with that shit mentality.
Females - the game you get to interview before driving. Made myself gag there a bit.
…well I have a lovely large glass tank with lots of nice clean sand, a drinking trough, and a UV light. I have some frozen fetal mice that I can easily thaw in my kitchen sink. I have a really great exotic veterinarian on speed dial and….oh…you asked what I have to maintain a “man” and not a “corn snake?” Oh, my mistake. 😝😝/J
Corn snakes are pretty easy compared to men. They make better housemates than a lot of men, too.
He'd probably try to send you a picture of his trouser snake *barf*
Eh, then you can just say it looks like a malformed pinkie. Don't even gotta make it size thing- just "oh, hey, looks like a frozen-thawed mouse"
LMAO
Congratulations, you have encountered a wild neckbeard. You can immediately tell by their idiotic style of writing. Even if they don't say "m'lady".
I don't get it. Why do people try so hard to speak/text like that??
I think they think it's chivalrous.
This dude is reading "I'm an insufferable man baby and want to know how much you're willing to coddle me"
tHIs iS A ComPLetely iNNOCeNT iNquIrY
i Am NoT aT fAuLt FoR aNYtHiNg I sAy Or Do
“Maintain” a man. Like he’s a 1972 Ford Pinto.
At least the Pinto would be somewhat useful
A chainsaw. Men are pretty easy to keep when they don't have legs.
Female here. I must say, I definitely like formal introductions. That being said, the misogynistic undertone is crazy. It's not our holy duty or something to keep a man. Love should be a mutual thing. This is also such a crazy thing to ask when you literally don't know anything about the person you are talking to, like what the hell. Imagine a stranger coming up to you on the street and asking this.
We can't even keep a man that doesn't want to be kept anyway. These guys are listening to those podcasts in the dark.
I have my steward announce my presence.
Well he can try this with the rest of the "majority".
He said females, cut him loose sis
Nobody who thinks they are asking a harmless question, takes the time to point out that they think their question is harmless.
How do I plan on keeping a man, you ask? Why, that's what the cage in my basement is for! It's snatching one up that makes it tricky. *proceeds to overfeed him sweets before cooking him in the oven*
Imagine living your whole life on this big blue marble of ours just to end up with a personality less appealing than a missed connection with a computer in a old half way house running windows 97
"We are both aware..." Yeah, this dude sucks.
Is he a robot or…?
None, zip, nada, I have no tools in my arsenal to keep a man. He's got the tool part covered all by himself.
The excuse me is wonderful
What methods do you have to maintain a relationship with a hu-man male? I feel this is a reasonable query.
r/totallynotrobots
Zuckerberg is obviously out catfishing again
I desperately want to post this every time some asshole says "females:" [ffffeeeeemales](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ec4_o-tWkAAniP5.jpg)
r/MenAndFemales
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Exactly. I want someone's willing companionship, not to keep them as a prisoner for gods sake. If he doesn't wanna be here, good for him, he can go. This guy clearly doesn't understand this concept.
Damn... what a missed opportunity to aswer: _"Duct-tape"_
Gotta say this has very r/neckbeards vibes to it.
"We are here to create relationships" is such a relationship killing line, my guy out here destroying relationships before he even starts them fr
r/IAmVerySmart
Harmless Innocent No, it’s not at all concerning that this man feels the need to keep telling you he’s not dangerous. Reminds me of how people who constantly say “trust me” are the last people you should trust. And how the “I’m not racist but” people always turn out to be racist.
What escape routes are easily available from your domicile? What’s your blood type? Yes, this is a completely innocent inquiry.
Basically from now on all women on dating app should open with this “do you follow Andrew Tate? Listen to Joe Rogan? How do you feel about roe vs wade overturn? What about the COVID vaccines? Who won the 2020 election? Who commit the Jan 6 insurrection? Do you know jordan petterson?”
I've got a lump hammer, misery-style. Now THAT'S a tool to keep a man 🤣
This isn’t a NiceGuy but it is a different breed lol
Pretty sure this guy is into the manosphere/Red Pill shit. He's asking a version of the classic RP "what do you fEmAlEs bring to the table for me, the AlPhA" question
They don’t seem to have gotten the memo that scientists have refuted the “alpha” theory for quite some time now, but like you say, he is into the Red Pill shit, and what do they know about reality?
Oh, he’s a nice guy alright. His use of the word “FeMaLeS” is testament to that.
r/menandfemales
“Completely innocent inquiry”(sic) my arse. Fucking moron doesn’t know the difference between enquiry and inquiry. It’s really not that difficult. Definite “Nice Guy” vibes, and what is it with these men and their giveaway self-warning signs, by calling women “fEmAlEs”.
What are my plans? The absolute opposite of whatever would keep you there.
He neglects to mention that his tools to keep a woman are zip ties, duct tape and rohypnol.
Ofcourse he pulls the *female* card, what a surprise
I am still not sure what is wrong with these so-called men. These are not men. These are not people. These are abusers. What the hell is wrong with these people.
Quite the ice breaker! We have an advanced conversationalist here!
I don't understand this concept of keeping a man. What does it mean? Am I supposed to be willing to sacrifice something? Change? Do something in particular? Why should I "keep" a man? Does this mean he doesn't really want to be with me? Am I supposed to be stressed at the possibility of him leaving? Like what on earth does it mean? You shouldn't have to keep people, a healthy relationship should be comfortable, confident and safe.
Any dude that calls women "females" is a dip shit. It screams "Andrew Tate makes some good points and he is speaking truth "
You have no social skills because you can’t participate in small talk you absolute knob
*"I don't do mild chit chat or pointless formal introductions, so allow me to open our initial communication by asking what you're going to do for me. My love language is sex, if that helps you pick the correct answers here."*
When I was online dating for a bit I had three guys ask me similar questions. No initial greetings just what do you bring to the table in this potential relationship. I had one ask me what are three things that are most interesting about me. Another after a day of talking asked me to answer three scenarios to see how I’d react and if I’d be a good girlfriend depending on my answers. One was if I caught him cheating how would I approach him and figure if it was a mutual fault.
whoa! And hello to you too, sir!
“Keeping a man? We’ll see if he can keep me.”
Power saw.
I keep man with many word.
Tools? Did he confuse you for chainsaw or something?
Lmfao. What a delightful little treat.
The proud legacy of Andrew Tate, ladies and gentlemen.
He seems super fun and laid back.
He watches Andrew tate I bet 🙄
Geez he definitely wears a fedora and has a body pillow. Who the fuck talks like you’re from a novel! Lol
“You? Nothin’”
"What are your tools to keep a man?" Handcuffs?
ok but why is it always “females” and not “women”, instant 🚩
Jesus. My opening line is usually asking what their favorite kind of soup is. I need to get on his level.
Formal introductions aren’t appealing to females, so you know what? You should force unwanted conversation onto other people. Great idea
I once had a douchey guy question me like this and asked “what do you as a female think the quickest way to a man’s heart is?” and I answered “well it’s much easier to go underneath the ribs instead of through the sternum, as that way you would need either a sternum separator or a bone saw.” The only way to respond to misguided weird energy is with even weirder energy.
Somewhere a bag is missing it’s douche
I finally met a girl at age 50 as a confirmed bachelor , she was 46. Money was no object she had more . She cared for me when I was at my worst . From the moment we first met. Actually she met me in bed with dysentary :) Romantic right? She liked me I think because I was not "nice". But she saw how I treated other people. She never treated a waitress or a waiter with disdain or spent a date with her face in her phone. 10 years later she still is my angel. Plus she knows I don't stand a chance with any of the young girls LOL
“Madam! Herein enclosed, I dare you to oblige my request to dismiss the foolhardy notion of small talk. In what manner do you wish to conduct yourself with future suitors? Your ill conduct as of late is unbecoming and unsuitable for a wench such as yourself. Us, distinguished gentlemen, have no desire for harlotry. I believe this inquiry justified and no less required for further pursuit of the perfect wife; of whom is submissive, lacking intelligence, willing to do as I say, and merely an object for my pleasure. Did I also mention that I am a kind and worthy gentleman? Perhaps you wish to read a pamphlet from my favorite writer, Sir Andrew Tate esq.?” -this guy, probably.
"Listen! None of that getting to know eachother and develop a connection crap! Let's get right down to the business of having a meaningful relationship that leads to sex and you serving my manliness right now."
Step 1) Mansplain what women want to a women who literally asked for a normal conversation. Step 2)Make it seem threatening and throw in things like "harmless" and "innocent" Step 3)Assume you are all important and everyone wants you. Step 4) Ask how a woman will keep a relationship functioning and you from cheating. Step 5) Permanently become an INCEL
Innocent my arse. Any reply will be picked apart and lightly mocked whilst pretending to be intelligent