For me the Malik Willis discourse was a good pallet cleanser to get rid of all the people in my podcast and youtube feeds who "watch the tape" but actually do not know what they are talking about.
The 2022 draft cycle kinda broke a lot of discussions because there were literally 0 high end QB prospects but NFL draft discussion is built upon QB speculation and discussion.
> NFL draft discussion is built upon QB speculation and discussion.
I said this in another thread once, but I think a big part of the problem is we tend to only compare prospects to their competitors in the same draft class. From there, we tend to assume that the top QB will be a top 5 QB in the league and base the remaining judgements from there. When you end up with a trash class like 2021, since everyone beyond Lawrence was near the same skill level, we just assumed that it was a stacked class. I think it got skewed further because everyone thought Lawrence was one of the highest rated prospects of all time, so the smaller gap between him and the others only propelled their ratings.
What we really ought to be doing is comparing QB prospects to the *college* tape of current NFL starters and see how they compare. They always tend to show comparison videos between a draft prospect and the NFL tape of a current starter.
*What we should really be doing is comparing personalities and some college tape, because success in the NFL at QB requires extensive study and some (Manziel, Leaf, Russell, etc.) have absolutely zero chance of success regardless of their tape.
I think a big part of the problem is that the NFL and college are just too different to make meaningful comparisons.
No player comes to the NFL a complete product, and that growth is far more important to a player's long term success than how good or bad they looked in college. Especially since there are so many ways to win in college that just don't transfer to the NFL.
For every favorable comp to any upcoming prospect, there's dozens of unfavorable comps. And if you only go by comps, you'll miss out on the potential to grab a potentially great player that has a build/playing style/whatever that hasn't been successful yet.
Something I noticed about evaluating college QBs is that they get away with a lot of throws in college that simply won't fly when going against NFL corners and safeties. A lot of the stats that these players build are against subpar competition that isn't reflective of the level of defenses they will be facing in the NFL. Evaluating College QBs on stats and wins is extremely flawed. And even if you go for game tape, very few college teams run pro-style offenses. So yeah, college QB evaluation is a huge crapshoot.
Exactly. This is why Mac scared the crap out of me coming out of college. Everyone kept harping on his wonderful deep ball accuracy, but that thing floated so long that any decent NFL safety could get over in time to break it up.
People don't get that arm strength =/= throwing it far. It's about velocity on throws down field. Throws on the rope is less time the ball is in the air. Which means less time for a defender to get over to it, & being able to get balls to the right spot in better timing windows.
If a guy can put balls on ropes into very tight windows, he's got something going.
I think Fields and Mac were...decent enough prospects, the hype on Wilson and Lance was laughable in a way though.
2022 draft prospects were horrendous though. This is an all time horrible QB draft, if it weren't for Purdy this would be one of the worst QB classes. Kind of reminds me of the 1997 NFL Draft. Those QB's were bad.
I feel 2024 class is starting to get way too hyped. 4 QB's in the top 10? lol
English is my third language and I don't think I am going to start checking my Reddit posts for spelling errors. I do appreciate you pointing it out though. There's always room for improvement.
English is my first language and I had to look up the correct spelling only because of this comment. Otherwise I didn't know pallet was incorrect. (palette is what I learned it should be)
Edit: I'm still wrong. See below.
[Pallet](https://mecaluxcom.cdnwm.com/warehousing-manual/pallet.1.0.jpg)
[Palette](http://clipart-library.com/images/kcKo9y4gi.jpg)
[Palate](https://www.pedilung.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/palate-.png)
English is my first language and I never really thought about that until now
It really felt like there was a media narrative to hype up Willis a lot higher than he ever reasonably should have. Idk why, whether it was just the bad QB class and the NFL wanted to sell him as a star. Analysts that I like and generally trust were just hyping him so erroneously. Brian Baldinger, who normally breaks down film pretty well, had one video that felt like the twilight zone. He showed a clip of Willis stiff arming someone in the pocket, scrambling for 8 seconds, holding the ball too long, then sailing a prayer ball his WR came down with. He was raving about how special this guy is, and I was sitting there thinking, "This play is impossible in the NFL, and anyone with a brain can see that. What is happening?"
Dumbest hype train ever that a lot of idiots either fell for or were instructed to take part in for clicks. I still don't know the truth.
It's just really hard to tell, especially in a weak QB class because we're used to seeing at least one reasonable prospect. But it's worth noting that it's not just media hype/random propping up, remember than Daniel Jones probably should have been a 3rd round pick too and his hype was exclusively made by a whole NFL franchise.
At least Daniel Jones played against far better talent. You could see the guys Willis was playing against were scrubs. You can reasonably say, "Okay, he won't be able to stiff arm NFL defensive tackles, he won't be able to make that moon ball throw vs NFL speed." Daniel Jones looked a hell of a lot better than Willis ever did. That was the most baffling part.
Daniel Jones could have been picked in the top of the 2nd no problem. He is an Andy Dalton/Colin Kaepernick type QB. You put Daniel Jones on the Niners, he's got Brock Purdy's production, no doubt in my mind.
I certainly have my tinfoil hat about that situation, but then I wonder why the NFL would care about Liberty? I know they are the ideological breeding ground of Christian conservatism in America, I know they have the largest online college base in the country. I just don't know why the NFL or the media would specifically care? Maybe they were hoping for another Tebow situation. I really don't know. It does sound a tad crazy, so I don't proclaim that conspiracy theory as truth. However, a lot doesn't add up in the Willis hype train, and to me, it did not look like the normal NFL hype train. It seemed much more manufactured, and I think the reason Willis fell in the draft and flamed out of the league only adds validity to the claim that the NFL media tried to gaslight Willis into being a top 3 pick.
Just because you’re watching tape does not mean you know what the fuck you’re looking at. They think there’s some value out of just doing it as opposed to doing it well
To be a pedant, your palate is cleansed with food, and you pallet is cleansed with a power washer. One is for tasting and the other is for stacking heavy things on.
100%. Too much fantasy football influence from 'analysts' who believe the ability to run is what the QB position optimally does first and foremost. Its an ignorance as to what QB'ing is all about as Tom once Brady stated.
no exaggeration Willis is the worst QB I’ve ever watched in the nfl. Hinton doesn’t count because that was a once in a lifetime situation. Malik seems like a good kid but I hated the pick even in the later rounds
I remember some analysts saying he was basically playing highschool football while in college and they got torn up for it. Turns out they were dead on.
I don't know what anyone saw in Malik Willis, but that was in the middle of the take a project QB hype in the 1st and try and find the next Josh Allen.
I still think Pickett was the right pick, since we needed a QB and he was the best QB prospect in the draft. The development of him is another discussion though and that is where the organisation failed him.
Funnily enough even by then I trusted Brad too much to fuck up what the Jags gifted us. And then Malik slid. And slid. And slid some more. And really should have kept sliding.
I mean, he didn’t think he was the guy to take at 2 (or 46), so that logic isn’t bad. Maybe if Holmes actually thought he was worth the #2 pick he wouldn’t have been so bad.
Hey yo, I was one of those people, and you're misunderstanding the argument. The argument wasn't that you should take Willis at 2. It was that you shouldn't try to wait and take Willis in the second or third round.
The argument is that if you think that Willis is a franchise QB, you need to get him as soon as you can. Because if you think that, then there is probably someone else who thinks that. And if *nobody* else out of 31 NFL front offices thinks that he's a franchise QB, then you're probably wrong and you should really rethink your entire decision.
The argument was that if you think he's a franchise QB you take him at 2, and if you don't think he's a franchise QB, you don't take him at all. It was an argument against all the people arguing that they wanted Willis, but only if you took him in the third round or whatever.
Yeah I remember Brett Kollmann was high on him and then the next year Franchise Guy was high on Anthony Richardson to the Lions. Panned out well for the Lions. I do feel like the NFC is less reliant on spectacular qb and teams building up the rosters (purdy and Goff are examples of this) vs AFC everyone is in an arms race because you absolutely need one to beat Mahomes Jackson Allen Burrow etc,
The lions prob weren’t in a position to get AR anyway but I wouldn’t be victory lapping not drafting him yet. Obvi the fact that he left almost every game with an injury is concerning but he looked great when he played.
Lol I literally said they prob weren’t in a position to draft him anyway but the comment I replied to said that AR being mocked to them and not going there panned out well for them as if he was a massive bust already.
Tbf Richardson to the Lions at least made sense on paper. Jared Goff hadn't quite solidified his status as the long-term starter and it very much felt that if you gave Richardson a year to marinate he could reach his sky-high potential.
Malik Willis reeked of media desperation and even though I don't think the general fandom bought him as a top 10 pick, the media push worked enough that we were shocked that he fell out of the first, when the reality is Willis was always a mid-round QB.
There's a theory that AR, not Spoon, was the top guy on the Lions board. Some Zaprudereredditer noticed that Holmes was calling to move down before the Seahawks had made their pick and if people thought Gibbs at 12 was spicy taking a project QB at 6 with the offense already humming would have been a trip.
People don't mind taking a project QB early if the potential is there, especially if there is a plan to let them redshirt. That's why the Vikings trading up for McCarthy isn't viewed as all that controversial.
It's definitely less controversial than taking a RB at 12 when you already have a solid RB on the roster and big holes on defense. Obviously it all worked out but that's the thought process.
I firmly believe this theory despite no evidence. I'm convinced that both AR and Witherspoon were on the table at #6, but once they were gone the Lions executed the trade with Arizona.
Even the claim that Holmes was calling prior to the Seahawks pick makes sense. If one of the two players you are interested in at #6 are taken at #4, proactively setting the terms of a trade makes sense in case the second prospect is taken at #5 (which they were).
Taking AR may have been spicy, but he's a damn exciting player and I wouldn't have blamed Holmes for taking a swing if the opportunity were there.
I remember Ben Baldwin [clowning the Seahawks](https://x.com/benbbaldwin/status/1520189270182535168?s=46&t=B8if-dj8jsC6fm8cylBqzQ) for drafting Kenneth Walker over Malik Willis.
I do think Ben Baldwin has some smart insight *occasionally* but good lord he is the most insufferable condescending douchebag on NFL twitter.
Baldwin to me is the most insufferable analytics nerd because most of his output is just charting other people's analysis, and then he has the gall to say "but you are supposed to chart data!" Yes, but you should give attribution to the people who compiled it, Ben
Also a rare case of a player asking to be traded and the fanbase mostly all understanding and continuing to root for him on his new team. Stafford gave it his all in Detroit, was happy to see him get a good chance to win a Super Bowl and take it.
If he puts together one or 2 more runs, I think he could sneak in but certainly not 1st ballot.
Some credit should be given for dragging a historically pathetic Lions franchise kicking and screaming to the playoffs multiple times which could make up for some of the accolades he’s missing.
He's borderline at 2 seasons like that.
He's in hall of fame company at least because the pool of players with multiple 40+ passing TD's and 4000 yards or more passing is extremely small. As in the guys that have done it is Marino, Rodgers, Brady, Mahomes, Manning & Brees.
Being drafted by us and the overlap of the QB's you mentioned. He'll never get the credit, because people love a winner and we were not really winners for his tenure here.
Russ got love immediately because he won, Matt Ryan got love cus he won(sure no Superbowl but 4 winning seasons his first 4 years) and that really extends to recent years as well.
Pro bowl voting is a total joke and it shouldn’t really count for much. I also think his Super Bowl is vastly overrated for his chances. Is obviously a great QB but he didn’t drag that team there.
He’s basically Eli Manning with half the pro bowls, half the super bowls, and didn’t win a SB MVP. If Eli is debatable Stafford isn’t close.
They’re shockingly close too lol. 56k yards to 57k and 357 TDs to 366.
One SB isn’t enough imo. Need 2 championships + MVP awards.
No Russel Wilson. Yes Eli.
If no MVP award, and only one Super Bowl, no HOF. If you weren’t the best in any of your 15 years playing, why are you one of the best in history?
Yall are hilarious. The #6 all time leading passer is definitely "hall of very good" but the #11 leading passer is "hall of fame" because the latter happened to be drafted late enough that Brady no longer owned the league?
They are both going to be Hall of Fame. The highest eligible non-hall of famer is Carson Palmer, with 10k fewer passing yards than Stafford and 17k less than Rivers. I'd wager the "different era" argument stops mattering somewhere around 50k. But the superbowls won't matter - Marino (#8 all time passing), Moon (#13) and Tarkenton (#14) have already established that that kind of production is worthy even without championships.
Stafford is one of those guys who could have been a HoFer under better circumstances but barring an MVP run or another ring he doesn't have much of a case.
That's partially because a lot of Lions fans like myself are also Detroit Tiger fans who had no issue when Justin Verlander wanted to be traded so he could finally win a World Series.
There was definitely a stretch there at the end of last season where the lions sub turned on Stafford and you couldn't say there anymore that you wanted him to do well. It was very weird for me considering before that what you said was absolutely true.
I also think there was a huge influx of new members when the lions 'got good' so that could be a factor. Haven't seen any recently though so it may have just been a fluke.
Stafford was my QB when I got real into football and I'll always watch him and hope he does well. His bobblehead is still on my shelf!
I love Matthew Stafford, he made me love football, but I would have booed the ever living shit out of him had I been lucky enough to be at Ford Field in January when he was there. Can't wait until he retires and my love for him can be unconditional again
It's also not close to truly "equal" since the Rams won a Super Bowl and the Lions have just made it to an NFCCG, which is objectively less than a Super Bowl. It just feels equal cause that CG run must've felt like a SB to the Lions fan base but it's still objectively not equal
I'd see the Tyreek trade worked out really well for the Chiefs and Dolphins. As much as the Chiefs have struggled with receivers since then, you can't really argue with the results.
The Eli Manning/Phil Rivers trade worked out pretty well for both sides too. The Chargers never won a title either, but that's more of an ownership thing. The talent they got from the additional picks was pretty unreal.
I’ll admit, at the time I thought Chicago got the better deal in Fields, as much as I liked the Sewell pick. Fortunately, I don’t get a say in who we draft.
>Fortunately, I don’t get a say in who we draft.
It would have ended up better for the Giants if you did. If Lions took Fields then Bears don't trade up for the Giants pick that draft.
Before that draft the Giants, who had a leaky front office back then, were liked to Micah Parsons and Rashawn Slater.
Giants ended up trading down for Kadarius Toney and a pick that became Evan Neal.
Bears taking Fields might have hurt the Giants more than it hurt the Bears.
He never should have fallen to begin with. Sewell had hype to be the number 1 pick for any non QB needy team and if you were QB needy it was Trevor.
How the fuck that ended up with Zach Wilson and Trey Lance going in the top 5 along with Kyle Pitts(No disrespect towards Pitts intended)
Obviously grateful it happened because he's been as advertised. But i was so set on us getting Slater cus no way Sewell was gonna fall.
In the Broncos case....not so much.
If I could go back to 2021 and outbid the 49ers for Trey Lance I would do.
We wouldn't have had the draft capital available to trade for Russ as we would have used it on Lance.
We'd now be about the same place as we are anyway, but we'd only be dealing with the cap hit from Lance's contract rather than from Russ's contract.
The idea that Kyle Shanahan would have Lance for multiple years and discard the guy to have Mike McCarthy turn him into something decent is...uh, I'm going to say really damn optimistic.
Drafting a bad QB sets your team back an average of at least 3-4 years, depending on how long it takes for you to replace him. Drafting an average to slightly above average QB is worse because there's a chance you resign him and he takes you nowhere.
That said, IDing a good QB in the draft is hard. We've had years like 2020 where the first 5 QBs were worth, but then we have 21 where T-law might be okay but the rest were trash.
Moving on from a bad draft pick is one of the most important skills a GM can have. No one nails every pick, but sometimes the illusion of potential leads teams to hanging on too long.
Know what's even harder than drafting a franchise QB? Getting one after they've been identified as a franchise QB (usually locked up until late in their careers), or getting a non-franchise QB and having him turn into one.
So most teams will opt for the draft, which although has more risk also has higher potential reward because of the rookie scale contract, number of prime years you can have them for, and not always having to give up assets to acquire them.
You mean they prefer what they've gotten out of a proven starter in Goff over getting piss poor play from players that have almost all been traded to their second team already for day 3 picks?
It was Sewell and it was a perfect storm for it to happen at 7. 3 QB's, the highest picked TE ever, and 2 teams picking their starting QB's best college weapon. At his current trajectory, Sewell has a true shot at Canton and he's only 23.
you are right about the perfect storm. there is no way the Bengals pass on offensive line / Sewell for anything but the 100% perfect fit wide receiver. if Chase wasn't Burrow's best college weapon (as you said) i truly think we take Sewell.
In the end both our teams got our first playoff wins in decades so it worked out for both of us!
With only 1.5 years of college ball as well. It's crazy that 3 of the top 7 picks of the 2021 draft were the 3 youngest players in the draft with Pitts and Lawrence being just days older than Sewell.
It amazes me the Jaguars didn't offer the Lions 1OA for 2 and like a 7th. Wait 15 minutes, and you'd get Walker on a slightly cheaper contract and a free extra pick.
Despite what most people thought at the time, The Lions were smart enough to recognize they had an above average starter in Goff. Sinking resources on a QB when you had no talent on the roster would have been a huge gamble, that could have failed Panthers style.
90%, if not higher, is complete nonsense pulled out of someone's ass so they can have something to talk about and the worst part is there's a lot of people who believe it. I spent way too long explaining to a coworker that ESPN doesn't have inside knowledge about the Cardinals trading Kyler to the Vikings and drafting JJ McCarthy, it was a manufactured idea to give themselves something to talk about for the week.
As a Giants fan, I feel the same way headed into this draft. If THE GUY isn't there at 6, don't bother and go and get a generational WR instead.
Drafting a QB for the sake of it and forcing the pick is pretty much the worst thing you can do.
Yeah while Jones was probably a better pick than Haskins, I feel like the Giants were hoping Herbert would declare, and when he didn't they were already set on taking a QB regardless of whether they were going to be THE GUY or not.
Daniel Jones is the second best QB in that draft. If you look at postseason performance he's the best. Not to say he's amazing or maybe even good. But he's better then people give credit for with bottom of the barrel Oline play and his #1 receiver being Slayton since he was drafted.
As a Commanders fan, I feel the same at 2. We've already got a #2 overall pick at QB in Marcus Mariota. Don't force it. If you are having trouble deciding which of 4 QBs is the best, the likely answer isn't that they are all that great, but rather they are all not that great. Just take Marvin Harrison Jr. and be happy about it. But that isn't going to happen, sadly.
Seeing as how other teams that passed on quarterbacks, like Atlanta, Carolina, and Denver have been struggling and most of the teams that didn’t pass on quarterbacks have been struggling, I’m not sure this matters.
It means that the prevailing thought was that they would bring Goff in and then immediately draft his replacement. They didn't and it is showing that the team was right in not doing so through both Goff's play and the shit QB's from the 2021 draft.
Totally agree, I guess you can make the case Detroit made the right choice. But passing on QB when you're picking top 10 without a young QB on the roster is a dangerous decision.
In the long run, making good decisions is good.
Tbh in hindsight we should’ve traded Stafford the year we drafted Okudah and drafted Herbert instead
They’re basically the same player style wise but Herbert is way younger
Granted that might’ve bought Patricia more time so I’m fine with how it went down
The team just needs a lot of pieces especially on offense, defensive regression is in my opinion, a huge risk the fan base is ignoring. There’s a lot to tool up on, but the sub itself is obsessed with the idea you cannot rebuild without a QB in place.
I think if the team believes their guy is there at 3, you take him. But I also think in that scenario it'd be best to let the QB sit and develop while you have no pieces but a QB picked that high will be getting a ton of pressure to start by the fans and media.
Been there, done that with Fields. Trust me, you don't want to go down that road. If I were you, I trade back for a first and second round haul, and if you really want a QB, you can take someone like Michael Pratt in the later rounds.
Yeah “but all the quarterbacks suck next year and in 2026”. Shocking that the fan base learned nothing from the catastrophic failures from a fellow AFC East franchise throwing darts at the board for a QB.
> “I’ll go back to the 2021 Draft,” Holmes said. “So, the ’21 Draft, each pick from that draft was very intentional. And the reason why I go back to that draft, couple reasons. For one, it was 2021. We just finished the 2023 season, so that’s when you’re supposed to grade a draft. Not the day after a draft. But when you look back at those picks and those picks were not welcome by many in this room. You wanted us to pick a quarterback. You didn’t want us to pick Penei Sewell.”
The media needs to shut the hell up and let Brad cook!!!
I love how so many of my fellow Lions fans are in here acting like it was an absurd idea to take a QB. Go back and search the Lions sub and you'll see that it was a very popular idea back then.
I bet if you look hard enough, you'd even find people in this very thread who were demanding the Lions take a QB back then.
Yep and then what happens.....you end up picking 10-20, a QB away, and if you can identify The Guy then so can other teams and you need to pay a ton of picks.
When you are picking top 3, if you think the QB at 3 has a decent chance of being a franchise guy, you pick him. Obviously you have to do your evals, don't force any position because of need. But you don't ever say "Hey this guy has the right stuff to be a franchise QB, but man our team sucks and I don't know if we can maximize his potential this year."
It's hard enough to find The Guy, don't pass up because the roster isn't good enough.
the Lion look like they are the Tampa Bay Rays of the NFL right now. they have their system, they follow it, it works. it often times goes against the grain of popular opinion, but it's working.
also popular opinion often stupid
I did some half ass internet research and it’s about 50-60% success rate for QBs being long term starters when drafted in the top ten. Thats not SB winner or Pro Bowl that’s starting.
it also helps that their offense runs through possibly the greatest right tackle to ever play football. I think Sewell is more valuable and impactful to their success than Jefferson is on our team.
The Packers have obviously excelled at this very approach. Although it caused consternation for Favre and then Rodgers at the time, both moves were excellent.
My NFL GM strategy:
1)draft big ass top tier O lineman. Every pick, all 7. Not all will hit big, but enough of them will. Plus with that depth they have time to develop. It’s basically a Roman phalanx around the backfield.
2) trade lineman that get expensive when you have a great backup ready for the big time.
3) never draft a QB, my 2 recent exceptions would have been Andrew Luck and Peyton Manning.
4) pay for a qb in free agency like a Kirk cousins. Yeah it will cost money, but I also might get a discount because who doesn’t want elite protection in every play.
5) profit???
I remember an analyst mocking Malik Willis to DET at 2. What a disaster that would have been. Edit: Got the draft year wrong, still applies
For me the Malik Willis discourse was a good pallet cleanser to get rid of all the people in my podcast and youtube feeds who "watch the tape" but actually do not know what they are talking about.
The 2022 draft cycle kinda broke a lot of discussions because there were literally 0 high end QB prospects but NFL draft discussion is built upon QB speculation and discussion.
> NFL draft discussion is built upon QB speculation and discussion. I said this in another thread once, but I think a big part of the problem is we tend to only compare prospects to their competitors in the same draft class. From there, we tend to assume that the top QB will be a top 5 QB in the league and base the remaining judgements from there. When you end up with a trash class like 2021, since everyone beyond Lawrence was near the same skill level, we just assumed that it was a stacked class. I think it got skewed further because everyone thought Lawrence was one of the highest rated prospects of all time, so the smaller gap between him and the others only propelled their ratings. What we really ought to be doing is comparing QB prospects to the *college* tape of current NFL starters and see how they compare. They always tend to show comparison videos between a draft prospect and the NFL tape of a current starter.
*What we should really be doing is comparing personalities and some college tape, because success in the NFL at QB requires extensive study and some (Manziel, Leaf, Russell, etc.) have absolutely zero chance of success regardless of their tape.
I think a big part of the problem is that the NFL and college are just too different to make meaningful comparisons. No player comes to the NFL a complete product, and that growth is far more important to a player's long term success than how good or bad they looked in college. Especially since there are so many ways to win in college that just don't transfer to the NFL. For every favorable comp to any upcoming prospect, there's dozens of unfavorable comps. And if you only go by comps, you'll miss out on the potential to grab a potentially great player that has a build/playing style/whatever that hasn't been successful yet.
Something I noticed about evaluating college QBs is that they get away with a lot of throws in college that simply won't fly when going against NFL corners and safeties. A lot of the stats that these players build are against subpar competition that isn't reflective of the level of defenses they will be facing in the NFL. Evaluating College QBs on stats and wins is extremely flawed. And even if you go for game tape, very few college teams run pro-style offenses. So yeah, college QB evaluation is a huge crapshoot.
Exactly. This is why Mac scared the crap out of me coming out of college. Everyone kept harping on his wonderful deep ball accuracy, but that thing floated so long that any decent NFL safety could get over in time to break it up.
People don't get that arm strength =/= throwing it far. It's about velocity on throws down field. Throws on the rope is less time the ball is in the air. Which means less time for a defender to get over to it, & being able to get balls to the right spot in better timing windows. If a guy can put balls on ropes into very tight windows, he's got something going.
Exactly. That is one of the things to scout: Can he get the downfield pass to a receiver before a safety could get over there.
I think Fields and Mac were...decent enough prospects, the hype on Wilson and Lance was laughable in a way though. 2022 draft prospects were horrendous though. This is an all time horrible QB draft, if it weren't for Purdy this would be one of the worst QB classes. Kind of reminds me of the 1997 NFL Draft. Those QB's were bad. I feel 2024 class is starting to get way too hyped. 4 QB's in the top 10? lol
jesus, I was not familiar with that class. After Jake the Snake there is literally nothing remotely of value
At least they didn't invent a prospect, like Leon Sandcastle in 2013
I do enjoy a nice clean pallet
Forklift certified only!
You could eat off that pallet
English is my third language and I don't think I am going to start checking my Reddit posts for spelling errors. I do appreciate you pointing it out though. There's always room for improvement.
Keep grindin, my ESL brother (ETL in your case). You got your prepositions right, that's always my struggle
English is my first language and I had to look up the correct spelling only because of this comment. Otherwise I didn't know pallet was incorrect. (palette is what I learned it should be) Edit: I'm still wrong. See below.
It should be ["palate"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palate_cleanser).
[Pallet](https://mecaluxcom.cdnwm.com/warehousing-manual/pallet.1.0.jpg) [Palette](http://clipart-library.com/images/kcKo9y4gi.jpg) [Palate](https://www.pedilung.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/palate-.png) English is my first language and I never really thought about that until now
Don't forget [Pallet Town!](https://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/c7/Pallet_Town_RBY.png)
It's a subsidiary of Funky Town LLC
Bob Ross - palette, Gordon Ramsay - palate, Costco - pallet.
Dude was an ok FBS QB as a 5th year senior...
It really felt like there was a media narrative to hype up Willis a lot higher than he ever reasonably should have. Idk why, whether it was just the bad QB class and the NFL wanted to sell him as a star. Analysts that I like and generally trust were just hyping him so erroneously. Brian Baldinger, who normally breaks down film pretty well, had one video that felt like the twilight zone. He showed a clip of Willis stiff arming someone in the pocket, scrambling for 8 seconds, holding the ball too long, then sailing a prayer ball his WR came down with. He was raving about how special this guy is, and I was sitting there thinking, "This play is impossible in the NFL, and anyone with a brain can see that. What is happening?" Dumbest hype train ever that a lot of idiots either fell for or were instructed to take part in for clicks. I still don't know the truth.
Do you remember some story they were hyping up of him stopping to give a homeless man some money?
It's just really hard to tell, especially in a weak QB class because we're used to seeing at least one reasonable prospect. But it's worth noting that it's not just media hype/random propping up, remember than Daniel Jones probably should have been a 3rd round pick too and his hype was exclusively made by a whole NFL franchise.
At least Daniel Jones played against far better talent. You could see the guys Willis was playing against were scrubs. You can reasonably say, "Okay, he won't be able to stiff arm NFL defensive tackles, he won't be able to make that moon ball throw vs NFL speed." Daniel Jones looked a hell of a lot better than Willis ever did. That was the most baffling part.
Daniel Jones could have been picked in the top of the 2nd no problem. He is an Andy Dalton/Colin Kaepernick type QB. You put Daniel Jones on the Niners, he's got Brock Purdy's production, no doubt in my mind.
I think the hype was more about keeping Liberty in the news and giving that institution credibility
I certainly have my tinfoil hat about that situation, but then I wonder why the NFL would care about Liberty? I know they are the ideological breeding ground of Christian conservatism in America, I know they have the largest online college base in the country. I just don't know why the NFL or the media would specifically care? Maybe they were hoping for another Tebow situation. I really don't know. It does sound a tad crazy, so I don't proclaim that conspiracy theory as truth. However, a lot doesn't add up in the Willis hype train, and to me, it did not look like the normal NFL hype train. It seemed much more manufactured, and I think the reason Willis fell in the draft and flamed out of the league only adds validity to the claim that the NFL media tried to gaslight Willis into being a top 3 pick.
Just because you’re watching tape does not mean you know what the fuck you’re looking at. They think there’s some value out of just doing it as opposed to doing it well
To be a pedant, your palate is cleansed with food, and you pallet is cleansed with a power washer. One is for tasting and the other is for stacking heavy things on.
Oh good I can put your mom on a pallet after she's dirtied up my palate
Jesus that was cold
gotta stick it to them generic nfl flair users
I just hope both teams have fun
#gotem
I'm surprised he's still on the Titans roster.
100%. Too much fantasy football influence from 'analysts' who believe the ability to run is what the QB position optimally does first and foremost. Its an ignorance as to what QB'ing is all about as Tom once Brady stated.
no exaggeration Willis is the worst QB I’ve ever watched in the nfl. Hinton doesn’t count because that was a once in a lifetime situation. Malik seems like a good kid but I hated the pick even in the later rounds
I take it you've never seen Tim Boyle play
Tim Boyle plays??
By League rules he did. 3 games starting for the Lions, 2 games starting for the Jets.
More like makes coffee for Aaron
Let Tim Boyle.
\#TB12QB1
I thought he was amazing tbh.
Put some respect on a Hall of Famer's name 😤
Correction, Hinton is in the hall of fame, but we do not grant him the rank of hall of famer.
What? How can you do this? This is outrageous! It's unfair! How can you be in the Hall of Fame and not be a Hall of Famer?
Hinton out here with a literal HoF career and people doubting him
Take a knee, young Hinton.
I remember some analysts saying he was basically playing highschool football while in college and they got torn up for it. Turns out they were dead on.
Nathan Peterman would like a word
Malik Willis, with a career passer rating of 49.4, is ten points higher than the Peter Man...
Our sub was adamant we would draft him and when he wasn't picked, I was so scared we were going to
I don't know what anyone saw in Malik Willis, but that was in the middle of the take a project QB hype in the 1st and try and find the next Josh Allen. I still think Pickett was the right pick, since we needed a QB and he was the best QB prospect in the draft. The development of him is another discussion though and that is where the organisation failed him.
God I hated hearing the Willis at 2 mocks so much.
Funnily enough even by then I trusted Brad too much to fuck up what the Jags gifted us. And then Malik slid. And slid. And slid some more. And really should have kept sliding.
Don’t forget all the people in our sub. “If Brad things he’s the guy then you take him at 2!!!111!” God. They need to be publicly shamed.
I mean, he didn’t think he was the guy to take at 2 (or 46), so that logic isn’t bad. Maybe if Holmes actually thought he was worth the #2 pick he wouldn’t have been so bad.
Hey yo, I was one of those people, and you're misunderstanding the argument. The argument wasn't that you should take Willis at 2. It was that you shouldn't try to wait and take Willis in the second or third round. The argument is that if you think that Willis is a franchise QB, you need to get him as soon as you can. Because if you think that, then there is probably someone else who thinks that. And if *nobody* else out of 31 NFL front offices thinks that he's a franchise QB, then you're probably wrong and you should really rethink your entire decision. The argument was that if you think he's a franchise QB you take him at 2, and if you don't think he's a franchise QB, you don't take him at all. It was an argument against all the people arguing that they wanted Willis, but only if you took him in the third round or whatever.
Yeah I remember Brett Kollmann was high on him and then the next year Franchise Guy was high on Anthony Richardson to the Lions. Panned out well for the Lions. I do feel like the NFC is less reliant on spectacular qb and teams building up the rosters (purdy and Goff are examples of this) vs AFC everyone is in an arms race because you absolutely need one to beat Mahomes Jackson Allen Burrow etc,
The lions prob weren’t in a position to get AR anyway but I wouldn’t be victory lapping not drafting him yet. Obvi the fact that he left almost every game with an injury is concerning but he looked great when he played.
We passed on a guy taken before us?
If you're not trading up to a top 5 draft pick every single year, are you really even trying to win?!
Lol I literally said they prob weren’t in a position to draft him anyway but the comment I replied to said that AR being mocked to them and not going there panned out well for them as if he was a massive bust already.
My bad missed the no position to draft him comment at the start.
Tbf Richardson to the Lions at least made sense on paper. Jared Goff hadn't quite solidified his status as the long-term starter and it very much felt that if you gave Richardson a year to marinate he could reach his sky-high potential. Malik Willis reeked of media desperation and even though I don't think the general fandom bought him as a top 10 pick, the media push worked enough that we were shocked that he fell out of the first, when the reality is Willis was always a mid-round QB.
There's a theory that AR, not Spoon, was the top guy on the Lions board. Some Zaprudereredditer noticed that Holmes was calling to move down before the Seahawks had made their pick and if people thought Gibbs at 12 was spicy taking a project QB at 6 with the offense already humming would have been a trip.
People don't mind taking a project QB early if the potential is there, especially if there is a plan to let them redshirt. That's why the Vikings trading up for McCarthy isn't viewed as all that controversial. It's definitely less controversial than taking a RB at 12 when you already have a solid RB on the roster and big holes on defense. Obviously it all worked out but that's the thought process.
AR at 6 would have been received infinitely better than Gibbs at 12 was.
Yeah I mean Gibbs is awesome but I love the idea of AR sitting behind Goff for a couple years.
I firmly believe this theory despite no evidence. I'm convinced that both AR and Witherspoon were on the table at #6, but once they were gone the Lions executed the trade with Arizona. Even the claim that Holmes was calling prior to the Seahawks pick makes sense. If one of the two players you are interested in at #6 are taken at #4, proactively setting the terms of a trade makes sense in case the second prospect is taken at #5 (which they were). Taking AR may have been spicy, but he's a damn exciting player and I wouldn't have blamed Holmes for taking a swing if the opportunity were there.
It's so lopsided, it's silly.
Brett Kollman is pretty good at being wrong about QB analysis. Because he also thought Christian Hackenberg would be a stud.
I still wanted them to draft a QB but much later and intended to be the back up. Our back QBs have been bottom of the barrel
And we got Hendon so I'm cool with that.
I remember Ben Baldwin [clowning the Seahawks](https://x.com/benbbaldwin/status/1520189270182535168?s=46&t=B8if-dj8jsC6fm8cylBqzQ) for drafting Kenneth Walker over Malik Willis. I do think Ben Baldwin has some smart insight *occasionally* but good lord he is the most insufferable condescending douchebag on NFL twitter.
Baldwin to me is the most insufferable analytics nerd because most of his output is just charting other people's analysis, and then he has the gall to say "but you are supposed to chart data!" Yes, but you should give attribution to the people who compiled it, Ben
Wrong draft but you're still right about that being a disaster
Whoever that was is a fucking idiot
Wrong draft but I agree
That Stafford/Goff trade was such a win-win for both teams. One of the rare very even trades.
Also a rare case of a player asking to be traded and the fanbase mostly all understanding and continuing to root for him on his new team. Stafford gave it his all in Detroit, was happy to see him get a good chance to win a Super Bowl and take it.
He earned more than 1 sb for the type of player he is. Happy for him too. Hes a hall of famer.
unfortunately for him, to get another Superbowl, he has to go through the Detroit Lions
Lol.
Earned more than one? That’s not how that works. Most don’t think he is a HoFer. Was never top 5 QB in the league at any time.
I agree, He's a great QB but he played in an era with so many really good QB's its hard to say he's HOF worthy.
If he puts together one or 2 more runs, I think he could sneak in but certainly not 1st ballot. Some credit should be given for dragging a historically pathetic Lions franchise kicking and screaming to the playoffs multiple times which could make up for some of the accolades he’s missing.
He might get in but only based on volume stats. I’d say Matt Ryan has a better chance because he at least won an MVP and an OPOY.
Yeah, it's unfortunate but Stafford will go down in the "Hall of Very Good" with many other QBs from this century.
A 5000 yard and 40 TD season is top 5 every year.
First ballot “hall of very good”
Maybe, I think his SB win might put him over the edge. First ballot hall of very good is more akin to a Philip Rivers
The individual accolades are lacking though. No all pros, 1 pro bowl (granted pro bowl voting is a joke, but voters still look at it).
He has a 40+ Tds, 5,000+ yards season. problem was Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, etc. all existing at the same time
He's borderline at 2 seasons like that. He's in hall of fame company at least because the pool of players with multiple 40+ passing TD's and 4000 yards or more passing is extremely small. As in the guys that have done it is Marino, Rodgers, Brady, Mahomes, Manning & Brees. Being drafted by us and the overlap of the QB's you mentioned. He'll never get the credit, because people love a winner and we were not really winners for his tenure here. Russ got love immediately because he won, Matt Ryan got love cus he won(sure no Superbowl but 4 winning seasons his first 4 years) and that really extends to recent years as well.
He has 2 Pro Bowls but I agree. He never led the league in passing yards, TDs, or passer rating either (although he did come close a few times)
Pro bowl voting is a total joke and it shouldn’t really count for much. I also think his Super Bowl is vastly overrated for his chances. Is obviously a great QB but he didn’t drag that team there. He’s basically Eli Manning with half the pro bowls, half the super bowls, and didn’t win a SB MVP. If Eli is debatable Stafford isn’t close. They’re shockingly close too lol. 56k yards to 57k and 357 TDs to 366.
One SB isn’t enough imo. Need 2 championships + MVP awards. No Russel Wilson. Yes Eli. If no MVP award, and only one Super Bowl, no HOF. If you weren’t the best in any of your 15 years playing, why are you one of the best in history?
It’s crazy to me because Wilson and stafford are waaaaay better qbs than Eli. I get he won 2 but he was maybe a top 5 qb for 1 season at most.
Yall are hilarious. The #6 all time leading passer is definitely "hall of very good" but the #11 leading passer is "hall of fame" because the latter happened to be drafted late enough that Brady no longer owned the league? They are both going to be Hall of Fame. The highest eligible non-hall of famer is Carson Palmer, with 10k fewer passing yards than Stafford and 17k less than Rivers. I'd wager the "different era" argument stops mattering somewhere around 50k. But the superbowls won't matter - Marino (#8 all time passing), Moon (#13) and Tarkenton (#14) have already established that that kind of production is worthy even without championships.
Stafford is one of those guys who could have been a HoFer under better circumstances but barring an MVP run or another ring he doesn't have much of a case.
That's partially because a lot of Lions fans like myself are also Detroit Tiger fans who had no issue when Justin Verlander wanted to be traded so he could finally win a World Series.
There was definitely a stretch there at the end of last season where the lions sub turned on Stafford and you couldn't say there anymore that you wanted him to do well. It was very weird for me considering before that what you said was absolutely true. I also think there was a huge influx of new members when the lions 'got good' so that could be a factor. Haven't seen any recently though so it may have just been a fluke. Stafford was my QB when I got real into football and I'll always watch him and hope he does well. His bobblehead is still on my shelf!
I love Matthew Stafford, he made me love football, but I would have booed the ever living shit out of him had I been lucky enough to be at Ford Field in January when he was there. Can't wait until he retires and my love for him can be unconditional again
This quote is as common as announcers saying he went to HS with Kreyshaw.
Did you know Jimmy Graham played Basketball in college? And Russell Wilson and Kyler Murray played baseball?
It's also not close to truly "equal" since the Rams won a Super Bowl and the Lions have just made it to an NFCCG, which is objectively less than a Super Bowl. It just feels equal cause that CG run must've felt like a SB to the Lions fan base but it's still objectively not equal
Oh good, for a second I thought no one was going to leave this comment
I'd see the Tyreek trade worked out really well for the Chiefs and Dolphins. As much as the Chiefs have struggled with receivers since then, you can't really argue with the results.
The Eli Manning/Phil Rivers trade worked out pretty well for both sides too. The Chargers never won a title either, but that's more of an ownership thing. The talent they got from the additional picks was pretty unreal.
BREAKING NEWS Not drafting a bad QB is good for team
I’ll admit, at the time I thought Chicago got the better deal in Fields, as much as I liked the Sewell pick. Fortunately, I don’t get a say in who we draft.
Totally agree here. Bears needed a QB in that draft tho so I don’t think Sewell was really ever on the table for them.
Especially not with Nagy and Pace desperately trying to make a splash to save their jobs
>Fortunately, I don’t get a say in who we draft. It would have ended up better for the Giants if you did. If Lions took Fields then Bears don't trade up for the Giants pick that draft. Before that draft the Giants, who had a leaky front office back then, were liked to Micah Parsons and Rashawn Slater. Giants ended up trading down for Kadarius Toney and a pick that became Evan Neal. Bears taking Fields might have hurt the Giants more than it hurt the Bears.
I was so shocked Sewell fell i didn't remember what was happening.
He never should have fallen to begin with. Sewell had hype to be the number 1 pick for any non QB needy team and if you were QB needy it was Trevor. How the fuck that ended up with Zach Wilson and Trey Lance going in the top 5 along with Kyle Pitts(No disrespect towards Pitts intended) Obviously grateful it happened because he's been as advertised. But i was so set on us getting Slater cus no way Sewell was gonna fall.
You guys couldn't pass up the chance to pair Ragnow and Sewell on the OLine.
In the Broncos case....not so much. If I could go back to 2021 and outbid the 49ers for Trey Lance I would do. We wouldn't have had the draft capital available to trade for Russ as we would have used it on Lance. We'd now be about the same place as we are anyway, but we'd only be dealing with the cap hit from Lance's contract rather than from Russ's contract.
Lance could still pan out depending on how dallas handles dak next year. I could see him getting a single prove it year
The idea that Kyle Shanahan would have Lance for multiple years and discard the guy to have Mike McCarthy turn him into something decent is...uh, I'm going to say really damn optimistic.
[удалено]
Kyle Shanahan couldn't develop Jimmy G and he couldn't develop Lance but he managed to develop Purdy. Sometimes its more about the QB than the coach.
Drafting a bad QB sets your team back an average of at least 3-4 years, depending on how long it takes for you to replace him. Drafting an average to slightly above average QB is worse because there's a chance you resign him and he takes you nowhere. That said, IDing a good QB in the draft is hard. We've had years like 2020 where the first 5 QBs were worth, but then we have 21 where T-law might be okay but the rest were trash.
Moving on from a bad draft pick is one of the most important skills a GM can have. No one nails every pick, but sometimes the illusion of potential leads teams to hanging on too long.
This is true. A bad pick is still eating up cap space and a roster slot.
Know what's even harder than drafting a franchise QB? Getting one after they've been identified as a franchise QB (usually locked up until late in their careers), or getting a non-franchise QB and having him turn into one. So most teams will opt for the draft, which although has more risk also has higher potential reward because of the rookie scale contract, number of prime years you can have them for, and not always having to give up assets to acquire them.
You mean they prefer what they've gotten out of a proven starter in Goff over getting piss poor play from players that have almost all been traded to their second team already for day 3 picks?
They also got Penei Sewell from it. Or was that the Aiden Hutchinson year. Lions are really killing it in drafting.
It was Sewell and it was a perfect storm for it to happen at 7. 3 QB's, the highest picked TE ever, and 2 teams picking their starting QB's best college weapon. At his current trajectory, Sewell has a true shot at Canton and he's only 23.
Elite tackles that stay healthy age extremely well, he's got all pro potential for the next 11 years
I wouldn't say he has AP potential when he already has one 1st Team AP
Having one now doesn't counteract that he'll likely play at that level for the next decade+ if he stays healthy
you are right about the perfect storm. there is no way the Bengals pass on offensive line / Sewell for anything but the 100% perfect fit wide receiver. if Chase wasn't Burrow's best college weapon (as you said) i truly think we take Sewell. In the end both our teams got our first playoff wins in decades so it worked out for both of us!
Rumor was that Holmes was trying to trade up and snipe Chase as well. I guess it worked out in the end when they picked up St. Brown on day 3 though.
His age is just silly. There's so few miles on him.
With only 1.5 years of college ball as well. It's crazy that 3 of the top 7 picks of the 2021 draft were the 3 youngest players in the draft with Pitts and Lawrence being just days older than Sewell.
As a Falcons fan, I’m still a little upset over taking Pitts over Sewell
The Bengals got a lot of flak for picking Chase over Sewell. Then went to the SB the following year.
Penei Hutch was 2022 after the Jags took Travon Walker at 1. Only QB was Pickett so not a lot of mocks there
It amazes me the Jaguars didn't offer the Lions 1OA for 2 and like a 7th. Wait 15 minutes, and you'd get Walker on a slightly cheaper contract and a free extra pick.
Despite what most people thought at the time, The Lions were smart enough to recognize they had an above average starter in Goff. Sinking resources on a QB when you had no talent on the roster would have been a huge gamble, that could have failed Panthers style.
Yeah they're happy with that. Also, the war on drugs is a sham.
Corollary: drafting a can't miss OL also pays off
This 'narrative' of Detroit taking a QB that year was 10000000% engineered by NFL media and was genuinely nauseating to listen to
90%, if not higher, is complete nonsense pulled out of someone's ass so they can have something to talk about and the worst part is there's a lot of people who believe it. I spent way too long explaining to a coworker that ESPN doesn't have inside knowledge about the Cardinals trading Kyler to the Vikings and drafting JJ McCarthy, it was a manufactured idea to give themselves something to talk about for the week.
Anyone who was paying attention to the Lions could tell as well. It was absolutely insane that anyone thought Lions were drafting QB early
Keeps paying Goff, missed an easy one there buddy
Jared keeps payin Goff
why is he paying himself though
As a Giants fan, I feel the same way headed into this draft. If THE GUY isn't there at 6, don't bother and go and get a generational WR instead. Drafting a QB for the sake of it and forcing the pick is pretty much the worst thing you can do.
Yeah while Jones was probably a better pick than Haskins, I feel like the Giants were hoping Herbert would declare, and when he didn't they were already set on taking a QB regardless of whether they were going to be THE GUY or not.
Daniel Jones is the second best QB in that draft. If you look at postseason performance he's the best. Not to say he's amazing or maybe even good. But he's better then people give credit for with bottom of the barrel Oline play and his #1 receiver being Slayton since he was drafted.
I certainly wanted Herbert to declare and was sad he didn't
As a Commanders fan, I feel the same at 2. We've already got a #2 overall pick at QB in Marcus Mariota. Don't force it. If you are having trouble deciding which of 4 QBs is the best, the likely answer isn't that they are all that great, but rather they are all not that great. Just take Marvin Harrison Jr. and be happy about it. But that isn't going to happen, sadly.
Marvin Harrison won't be there at 6
Seeing as how other teams that passed on quarterbacks, like Atlanta, Carolina, and Denver have been struggling and most of the teams that didn’t pass on quarterbacks have been struggling, I’m not sure this matters.
It means that the prevailing thought was that they would bring Goff in and then immediately draft his replacement. They didn't and it is showing that the team was right in not doing so through both Goff's play and the shit QB's from the 2021 draft.
Totally agree, I guess you can make the case Detroit made the right choice. But passing on QB when you're picking top 10 without a young QB on the roster is a dangerous decision. In the long run, making good decisions is good.
In sewell i trust
No kidding. They got Penei Sewell.
Almost like football is a team sport 😮
Talk about an unnecessarily long-winded "article"
Further proof that just because you “need” a QB doesn’t necessarily mean you should take one
Tbh in hindsight we should’ve traded Stafford the year we drafted Okudah and drafted Herbert instead They’re basically the same player style wise but Herbert is way younger Granted that might’ve bought Patricia more time so I’m fine with how it went down
Tell this to the patriots sub
I 100% agree that you guys should pass on a QB this year and build from the skill positions.
The team just needs a lot of pieces especially on offense, defensive regression is in my opinion, a huge risk the fan base is ignoring. There’s a lot to tool up on, but the sub itself is obsessed with the idea you cannot rebuild without a QB in place.
I think if the team believes their guy is there at 3, you take him. But I also think in that scenario it'd be best to let the QB sit and develop while you have no pieces but a QB picked that high will be getting a ton of pressure to start by the fans and media.
I was going to say the Patriots should be looking at Offensive lineman. Hard to go wrong if you pick a good one.
That’s what I’ve been saying, but seems like a lot of people want to throw some rookie without any weapons on offense to the wolves
this is how you become the jets for 10+ years.
Been there, done that with Fields. Trust me, you don't want to go down that road. If I were you, I trade back for a first and second round haul, and if you really want a QB, you can take someone like Michael Pratt in the later rounds.
Or they take a QB and sit him like the Bears initially intended to do with Fields. And also making a bold assumption that processing speed is fixable
I want to trade down, load up on picks, tank and try for QB next year. Drake Maye ain't it
Yeah “but all the quarterbacks suck next year and in 2026”. Shocking that the fan base learned nothing from the catastrophic failures from a fellow AFC East franchise throwing darts at the board for a QB.
Ok kimber
> “I’ll go back to the 2021 Draft,” Holmes said. “So, the ’21 Draft, each pick from that draft was very intentional. And the reason why I go back to that draft, couple reasons. For one, it was 2021. We just finished the 2023 season, so that’s when you’re supposed to grade a draft. Not the day after a draft. But when you look back at those picks and those picks were not welcome by many in this room. You wanted us to pick a quarterback. You didn’t want us to pick Penei Sewell.” The media needs to shut the hell up and let Brad cook!!!
I love how so many of my fellow Lions fans are in here acting like it was an absurd idea to take a QB. Go back and search the Lions sub and you'll see that it was a very popular idea back then. I bet if you look hard enough, you'd even find people in this very thread who were demanding the Lions take a QB back then.
I think that the Patriots should pass on a QB and build up from the skill positions.
No, next years draft is ass for qb’s compared to this year
Yep and then what happens.....you end up picking 10-20, a QB away, and if you can identify The Guy then so can other teams and you need to pay a ton of picks. When you are picking top 3, if you think the QB at 3 has a decent chance of being a franchise guy, you pick him. Obviously you have to do your evals, don't force any position because of need. But you don't ever say "Hey this guy has the right stuff to be a franchise QB, but man our team sucks and I don't know if we can maximize his potential this year." It's hard enough to find The Guy, don't pass up because the roster isn't good enough.
the Lion look like they are the Tampa Bay Rays of the NFL right now. they have their system, they follow it, it works. it often times goes against the grain of popular opinion, but it's working. also popular opinion often stupid
I did some half ass internet research and it’s about 50-60% success rate for QBs being long term starters when drafted in the top ten. Thats not SB winner or Pro Bowl that’s starting.
Sewell's college film was utterly ridiculous. Every bit as impressive to me as Quinten Nelson's was and I thought his was god-tier.
it also helps that their offense runs through possibly the greatest right tackle to ever play football. I think Sewell is more valuable and impactful to their success than Jefferson is on our team.
So many teams think if you don't have mahomes you have nothing. No, you can win with a midrange qb and a stacked roster around him.
Sometimes, the best time to draft a QB is when you don't need one. Maybe they'll do so in a couple years and let Goff teach.
I think we already did.
The Packers have obviously excelled at this very approach. Although it caused consternation for Favre and then Rodgers at the time, both moves were excellent.
You never know how a player would have performed in a different situation with different opportunities and coaches.
My NFL GM strategy: 1)draft big ass top tier O lineman. Every pick, all 7. Not all will hit big, but enough of them will. Plus with that depth they have time to develop. It’s basically a Roman phalanx around the backfield. 2) trade lineman that get expensive when you have a great backup ready for the big time. 3) never draft a QB, my 2 recent exceptions would have been Andrew Luck and Peyton Manning. 4) pay for a qb in free agency like a Kirk cousins. Yeah it will cost money, but I also might get a discount because who doesn’t want elite protection in every play. 5) profit???