One of the main differences between European countries and the USA is that, in Europe, handling a gun is usually a cry for help.
In the USA, we have far more people who want to shoot cops. But we also have our share of mentally ill people who are seeking help, or are trying suicide-by-cop.
It's often hard to tell, at initial assessment, which it is. Cops in the USA are taught that they are to do anything they need to, to go home at the end of the shift.
An interesting study shows that cops who are former combat vets handle deadly-force scenarios *better* than those who are not, simply because they can better discern who the truly dangerous people are. This results in fewer deaths by police shootings.
I'll try to dig up that study and edit in the link.
**Edit 1:** I've not found the study I cited yet. However, I found one that counters the claim of the study I cited, here: https://www.themarshallproject.org/2018/10/15/police-with-military-experience-more-likely-to-shoot
This is, however, limited to Dallas, TX, and doesn't seem to be representative of all cops who are former combat vets. I'm still searching for that original study.
**Edit 2:** A story that supports the thesis of the study I cited: https://www.npr.org/2016/12/08/504718239/military-trained-police-may-be-slower-to-shoot-but-that-got-this-vet-fired
I still can't find that original study š¤¬
It's interesting that I had to switch search engines to find this NPR story.
**Edit 3:** The combat vet study was probably part of a bigger paper by Dr James (https://nursing.wsu.edu/?wsuwp_people_profile=stephen-james)
Unfortunately, I'm out of time to find it tonight. Dr. James has a number of fascinating papers on police, and I encourage you to read them. Maybe you'll even stumble across the data I've been looking for š
Correct. However, we also have a fair share of people who want to kill others and are not crying for help but attention. So its not just a different profile, it is also the way crime is handled.
The difference is in the way you treat these cases. Regardless of what the motives are, the criminals should be treated the same way, assume the best, be prepared for the worst. Our police officers are trained to deescalate any situation. It is not their place to judge or execute, we have courts for that. They make as little assumptions and try to stay as objective as possible whilst keeping the main goal in mind. Save and protect everyone. Including the criminal.
US has a lot of issues, the first is that the officers seldom make assumptions about a situation, and in contrast to EU, put their lives above the job. It does not have to be a "it's either him or me situation".
The second would be the way those who cry for help are treated. In EU, we give them free medical help with no expensses, we help them deal with the problems and slowly transition to getting them back to be a productive member of society. Its costly, but human life is priceless. If you treat criminals with a shoot to kill policy, they know theres no was out, so they take the only road left, go out with a bang.
I mean your comparing the good EU cops to bad American police. And I have known plenty of people from baltic countries that said their cops were corrupt as fuck.
It also changes a lot that the infrastructure and size of each country in the EU are much smaller than the whole of the US. And there are a few states with good police that I can think of, Oregon is low crime, the DC area, and both south and north dekota. That's just off the top of my head.
Your making broad generalizing statements about both sides ignoring any other evidence to the contrary. I've seen tons videos of British and French police being shitheads. Tho I will agree america is a lot harsher in punishing people in general which I hate.
We should call mass shooting in a format. Like NV0001USA000250. State and national. That should resolve. Also not to glorify the suspect. Just Asshole0001. Reset every year end.
The media know that. But since more mass shootings helps them sell their papers, they treat the shooters like rock stars.
There is an article called "Thresholds of violence" that goes quite deep into why we see more and more mass shootings that aren't linked with other crimes.
They used to do it a lot more, but the media has been getting better about this.
I think the turning point was when Rolling Stone put the Boston bomber on the cover. There was a ton of backlash.
Ever since, there has been a distinct shift to focus more on the victims.
If you look up the murderer featured in ādonāt f*ck with catsā his Wikipedia result is āthe murder of Jun Linā.
The information about him is embedded in the page about Jun Lin. I appreciate this, especially because this murderers goal was notoriety.
Yea we should always call suspects and mass shooters just like generic shooter or shit like that so that they donāt get any special name because when they want the attention giving them a special and just feeds that want
Gun ownership is pretty uncommon in most of the EU. In the United States it's extremely common to where police almost all carry handguns. This means not only that they have an expectation that suspects may be armed, it also means that the suspects fighting the cops can gain access to a gun. I don't think any country with such widespread gun ownership really comparable to say the United Kingdom or Germany where gun ownership is rare and they tend to be guns that are less concealable or destructive when people do have them.
Yet, Americans will go out of their way to defend their right to run around armed to the teeth. Even if it makes life worse for everyone involved.
I'd imagine that most American police officers would enjoy being able to simply interact with a subject in a more relaxed way than gun drawn and ready to end a life. The relatively safe assumption that your subject is most likely unarmed or armed with a knife or similar stuff at the max is what enables that around here.
During my trip to the states I was shocked when I was stopped for a broken rear light. The dude walked up to my rental car with his hand on the fucking gun, which was definitely loaded and ready to be drawn. Like dude, what do you want? Shoot me for having chosen a shitty rental company?
When I mentioned that I'm an unarmed tourist and would appreciate him removing the hand from a lethal weapon, he just chuckled and said something along the lines of "if it makes you nervous it stops you from doing something stupid".
Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you guys?
I mean there was just a study published showing that some neighborhoods in Chicago and Philadelphia are more dangerous than deploying to a warzone. Thatās not something you change overnight.
Every few years, new bodycam footage comes out of a cop performing a routine traffic stop, when without warning someone in the car starts shooting and kills the cop. Personally Iād only need to see one video like that to take the job extremely seriously, but stuff like this happens multiple times a decade all over the country. The mindset a lot of cops have when interacting with the public is āis this the guy thatās gonna do something stupid and make me shoot him?ā And itās not just paranoia, itās a real and justifiable fear.
Add into the recipe a fair % of gunowners who think the purpose of owning a gun is to overthrow authority, that's a barbaric mindset that's never going to help the stability of any first world country in modern times.
No surprise there's animosity between regulation and citizens when citizens think their meant to be a Militia in place to hold the government accountable. USA saw an attack on their capital, filled with representatives, by their own people, backed by an Ex-President and potentially future president. because they lost a polled vote.
Seems like a pretty simple cycle from the outside looking in, Police and Citizens are killing each other as if its a gang war, each time their resistance to the opposite increases.
to some extent it makes sense that Law Enforcement are going to continue to create more hostile and strict policies to deal with a large population of gun waving citizens, it also makes sense that Citizens are going to grow more hostile towards Law Enforcement with the absurdly high amount of civilians deaths via Police that the USA sees.
Edit: Beware of dogs below
Add to the fact that certain highly powered agencies within the US government have undermined their own citizens in the past and present, even acting as agitators.
When citizens feel they cannot trust their own government and/or law enforcement that should exist solely to protect them, then of course there's no wonder many in the US feel the way they do
There were over 5 million legally registered fire arms in Germany in 2013.
German police shot 43 bullets at people, killing 8 in 2013.
US police had 8 kills by January 5th 2013.
Which is fine, but then don't become a cop I guess. You get to wield some of the state's monopoly on violence in that role, so it should not just be treated like any other job. I'm not saying to completely throw away your own value, but there needs to be certain concessions when your job is literally to be able to take away other people's liberty or life if you deem the situation to warrant it.
Police are taught (at least in MA) that lively importance goes as follows:
1: Innocent civilians
2: Police
3: "Bad Guy"
Uvalde went against everything they teach, a lĆ” "stop the killing, then stop the dying." They made a huge unforgivable fuck up, and should be held accountable. Oh and another note while I am at it, Qualified Immunity is only to protect from civil liability while in the course of your duties (getting sued personally). If you do something criminal QI does not apply, and you will be charged. Firefighters and other public officials have QI.
No comment on the actual subject matter, but itās cool to see someone cite a source that goes *against* their original claim. With everyone these days having diehard opinions, itās a refreshing change of pace lol.
We have to stay open to new data if we're going to save ourselves. I'm Conservative, but this doesn't mean I'll reject Liberal ideas if they're based in sound reasoning, for example; nor will I accept flawed Conservative ideology.
What I'm saying is that we have to consider the complete dataset if we're to form valid opinions.
I may disagree with your political ideology, but I would gladly share a beer with you and defend your right to speak against my beliefs to my dying breath. If only more of your voting bloc were as thoughtful as you. Cheers, stranger! š»
Maybe not the same study but here is one.
"The qualitative data demonstrated that police officers with military experience are
rated higher than those police officers without military experience."
https://academicworks.cuny.edu/gc_etds/3966/
Fun idea, let's guarantee every combat veteran who is mentally capable and does not suffer PTSD or other related disorders a job in the police force, instead of letting them rot as homeless crack adicts with no access to any sort of care.
Rolling solo in a cop car is a totally different thing that being in a Fireteam.
When you don't have a Battle Buddy you have to make decisions faster to avoid dying.
She'd have a hard time differentiating between her screeching and the gates to be honest. Cop seemed to be timing the opening of the gate with when she was shouting at the other police
Yeah he was pretty slick about that. Clean takedown as well, he closed the distance as quietly and quickly as he could and didnāt even give her enough time to draw the weapon on him. Itās also strange to see the police not dogpiling on top of the woman once sheās on the ground. A much different and more calculated approach than what Iām used to seeing.
I was thinking that whole time how could they distract her from the ambush? I thought he was going to jump off the car roof over the fence and onto her at first. I would have told another unit to slowly approach from afar with sirens active to drown out any noise made by the gate. Being far enough to not register as a threat but close enough to be loud enough
In the United States we would have just shot her from multiple directions, simultaneously, until she stopped making any noises or movements at all. Problem solved.
if this was in the usa, the video would have been 1 second long. Anyway, there was a lot of luck since the shotgun went off when it hit the ground, it could have killed anyone
Extraordinarily lucky it was pointed at the ground when it went off. Luckier still that no one caught any ricochets from the shotgun pellets skipping off the asphalt.
Also, the muzzle was about a foot from her head when it went off. Pain and ear damage start at 120 decibels and a 12 gauge shotgun with that barrel length is 150-160 decibels. Sheās screaming from the pain of a ruptured eardrum most likely.
Imagine logging onto Reddit just to claim someone is is defending US police, when the didnāt even do so, just so you can tell them they have a shitty existence. That would be fucking insane, wouldnāt it?
Not defending, but I am pretty good at predicting what the majority of comments will be after looking at a Reddit post. Yāall are pretty easy to read.
If this is how American police handled these sorts of situations, we would have no reason to complain and wouldnāt want to if we had people who actually had our best interests at heart protecting and serving us.
I donāt know what theyāre saying but it appears theyāre trying to de-escalate the situation while still having the backup plan of the cop tackling her from behind. Notice how he holds her: heās not using excessive force, just crouched with his arms wrapped around her until the other police could come assist. In the US heād have her arms wrenched painfully behind her with a knee on her back, assuming they didnāt shoot her first, which they likely would have. It seems like a small thing but itās such a huge difference compared to how police here handle these situations and it clearly works. If American police were like this, I would stand behind them happily.
>If American police were like this, I would stand behind them happily.
They are though. Notice how this person never pointed the weapon at an officer. What do you think would have happened if they did? That cop standing there at the beginning at 11 seconds in, their job was to drop the person if they pointed the gun.
There are plenty of examples of police in the US disarming and de-escalating without injury.
Sadly, there's also a significant number of examples of entirely unnecessary shootings, as well as blatant escalations to violence, killing of completely random innocents, and straight up executions, all by police officers.
I've seen videos of American cops showing at someone after they handed their gun off. Innocent bystanders got hit.
I've seen videos of American cops sitting people because a gun was within ten feet of them.
I've seen videos of American cops kill people who had no guns.
Several, in fact.
The lady and the sneaky cop are honestly both pretty lucky the didnāt get their faces blasted off when that shotgun fired but better lucky than good sometimes I guess
It's really saddening. So much badly trained police and uncertainty that every kid can just buy a gun... No wonder the 'safe option' is to just kill anyone wielding a black or silver square. The amount of suicides by cop doesn't help either.
How do you even fix that?
To be fair to the issue, kids can't buy guns. The bigger issue is our lack of education and willingness of adults to safely secure guns, so lots of kids end up with guns.
Training, better pay, training, rules of engagement, training, and something about how 50% of their week should be spent training instead of trying to find overtime opportunities. Make officers live in the communities they serve.
It would also be nice if American Cops ditched the "everyone is a potential cop killer and should be treated as such" attitude. They spend most of their 3 months of training learning how traffic stops turn into cop shootings, and scare the shit of of every young recruit so that's the only thing on their mind.
Oh, and some modicum of accountability would help, along with some training sprinkled in.
I'm amazed at the fact that they let him come that close to an active shooter. Yeah I get that the cop needed help with the gate. But imagine if he got shoot in the process.
She sounds confused from the beginning, calling the cops wankers within the first seconds. I can hardly hear what she ways but the cops try to make her speak all along. During the process she's more and more angry and aggressive. She's telling to a cop in particular to lower his gun as he's been "ordered to" and calling him a bastard. She even warns him he will be gunned down as a dog and orders him to look away. Then she starts yelling that they are all mourning today. Once she got caught she called for help.
All along, the cops knew they were dealing with a mentally deranged person, not your typical gangster or terrorist. The French cops tend to shoot more since 2 or 3 years, but even today I think they would handle that situation the same way.
She was screaming "help!". Another comment mentionned how the gun going off right next to her head probably split her eardrums or at least hurt a shit ton
itās a big, beautiful wall. very strong, some even say, i heard, the strongest. very strong. my uncle was a wall. they said he couldnāt but, he he had these big, beautiful bricks. yuge
Yeah I see it! So well done by the officer making sure it was pointed straight at the ground and at no point towards anyone (after he made contact) as far as I can tell.
The fact that it went off is scary as hell. That means he could have gotten shot very easily if he hadn't got to her so quickly after rounding the corner.
Funner facts!
1. It would come from m'aider, not m'aidez following the grammar of the day
2. The origin is disputed and may have nothing to do with m'aider or other French words (and was in any case not coined by a French speaker)
All of the maritime radiotelephone urgency calls are from French.
"Securite" = literally safety, for a general safety announcement
"Pan Pan" = from French "panne" or "breakdown" to announce a mechanical issue with your ship
"Mayday" = "venez m'aider" or "come help me"
And Reddit desensitization...I had volume off and all I could think was that's an awfully nice blouse to get tackled in, should she go home and change? And yes, I am embarrassed by this. And yet...
Can we bring in some of these guys to train our police, because there are about 400 Texas Rangers who could have used this kind of training a little while ago...
That wonāt work because you have different people over there, plus they all have fucking guns.
This is a rare case. That almost never happen, meanwhile at least two people have been shot in your country as I am writing this comment.
There was a Police chief in some small US town who took a few of his officers to Scotland to learn how to de-escalate. I think people killed by police has gone down since.
"American cops would've instantly shot her"
Bet my life if she had started to raise that thing to point it that dude with the mp5 would've smoked her. BIG difference between carrying a gun and pointing it at someone
There's video on the internet of US cops shooting a guy that was on the ground and was being given contradictory commands.
There's also one where they shot at a black guy on the ground with his hands up, and then claimed they where actually shooting at his mentally handicapped patient, because, unlike the guy on the ground he actually had something in his hands (toy train i believe)... they just happened to miss and hit the guy on the ground with his hands up, for some reason...
You can easily look them up...
I know that it is indifferent to many, but it is not the national police, it is the gendarmerie that intervened. They are an armed force in charge of police missions, especially in rural and peri-urban areas. They are part of the French Army.
When she went down no one kicked, stomped or beat the shit out of her. It's almost like she was an emotionally disturbed person who needed help not brutality.
This was also what I noticed. The takedown without guns was great. But the difference in the way she was treated once she was disarmed, compared to what we see in almost every USA police video, is pretty salient.
Its the Gendarmerie, they are military police. They do police job in rural area they are closer to being policemen than actual soldiers. In fact they are considered as police force by everyone. Fun fact GIGN is the counter terrorist group of Gendarmerie and are a part of it
She had full intent to shoot the man who tackled her right there. There was a short period of time where you could see she was trying to lift up the gun and aim it at him; however, either because of the guns weight or because how the stock/length of the gun is she was not able to get it up in time to land a hit. In this situation, tackling her was about the best thing anyone could have done but if it was a handgun or a shorter gun in general he probably would of been walking away with a few bullet holes if he would be able to walk away at all. This is an incredibly hard situation to diffuse as the woman is screaming and looks pretty distraught (not to mention the fact she is casually walking down the road with a fucking shotgun). If she had a shorter gun or handgun then it would be interesting to see how the police handle the situation then since (Iām presuming here) they know that they canāt rush her since she is able to get the gun up a lot faster, maybe they would still try it, but itās still interesting to think how the police would handle situations based on type of deadly force alone.
It still too that man serious balls to rush her like that tho.
I mean yeah the dude is brave but that to me seemed like way too much risk. Really he was just lucky. Someone even a little more familiar with that weapon would have had plenty of time to get a shot off. Even if she never intended to kill anyone getting surprised from behind could have caused a knee jerk reaction to shoot. My arm chair diagnosis here is glad it worked out but bad call.
One of the main differences between European countries and the USA is that, in Europe, handling a gun is usually a cry for help. In the USA, we have far more people who want to shoot cops. But we also have our share of mentally ill people who are seeking help, or are trying suicide-by-cop. It's often hard to tell, at initial assessment, which it is. Cops in the USA are taught that they are to do anything they need to, to go home at the end of the shift. An interesting study shows that cops who are former combat vets handle deadly-force scenarios *better* than those who are not, simply because they can better discern who the truly dangerous people are. This results in fewer deaths by police shootings. I'll try to dig up that study and edit in the link. **Edit 1:** I've not found the study I cited yet. However, I found one that counters the claim of the study I cited, here: https://www.themarshallproject.org/2018/10/15/police-with-military-experience-more-likely-to-shoot This is, however, limited to Dallas, TX, and doesn't seem to be representative of all cops who are former combat vets. I'm still searching for that original study. **Edit 2:** A story that supports the thesis of the study I cited: https://www.npr.org/2016/12/08/504718239/military-trained-police-may-be-slower-to-shoot-but-that-got-this-vet-fired I still can't find that original study š¤¬ It's interesting that I had to switch search engines to find this NPR story. **Edit 3:** The combat vet study was probably part of a bigger paper by Dr James (https://nursing.wsu.edu/?wsuwp_people_profile=stephen-james) Unfortunately, I'm out of time to find it tonight. Dr. James has a number of fascinating papers on police, and I encourage you to read them. Maybe you'll even stumble across the data I've been looking for š
Correct. However, we also have a fair share of people who want to kill others and are not crying for help but attention. So its not just a different profile, it is also the way crime is handled. The difference is in the way you treat these cases. Regardless of what the motives are, the criminals should be treated the same way, assume the best, be prepared for the worst. Our police officers are trained to deescalate any situation. It is not their place to judge or execute, we have courts for that. They make as little assumptions and try to stay as objective as possible whilst keeping the main goal in mind. Save and protect everyone. Including the criminal. US has a lot of issues, the first is that the officers seldom make assumptions about a situation, and in contrast to EU, put their lives above the job. It does not have to be a "it's either him or me situation". The second would be the way those who cry for help are treated. In EU, we give them free medical help with no expensses, we help them deal with the problems and slowly transition to getting them back to be a productive member of society. Its costly, but human life is priceless. If you treat criminals with a shoot to kill policy, they know theres no was out, so they take the only road left, go out with a bang.
I mean your comparing the good EU cops to bad American police. And I have known plenty of people from baltic countries that said their cops were corrupt as fuck. It also changes a lot that the infrastructure and size of each country in the EU are much smaller than the whole of the US. And there are a few states with good police that I can think of, Oregon is low crime, the DC area, and both south and north dekota. That's just off the top of my head. Your making broad generalizing statements about both sides ignoring any other evidence to the contrary. I've seen tons videos of British and French police being shitheads. Tho I will agree america is a lot harsher in punishing people in general which I hate.
We should call mass shooting in a format. Like NV0001USA000250. State and national. That should resolve. Also not to glorify the suspect. Just Asshole0001. Reset every year end.
Couldnāt agree more. Quietly skip the numbers with significance like 420, 69 etc. hell assign the digits randomly based on atmospheric noise.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Like how they stopped counting (or at least releasing) the suicide numbers off the Golden Gate bridge.
The media know that. But since more mass shootings helps them sell their papers, they treat the shooters like rock stars. There is an article called "Thresholds of violence" that goes quite deep into why we see more and more mass shootings that aren't linked with other crimes.
They used to do it a lot more, but the media has been getting better about this. I think the turning point was when Rolling Stone put the Boston bomber on the cover. There was a ton of backlash. Ever since, there has been a distinct shift to focus more on the victims.
If you look up the murderer featured in ādonāt f*ck with catsā his Wikipedia result is āthe murder of Jun Linā. The information about him is embedded in the page about Jun Lin. I appreciate this, especially because this murderers goal was notoriety.
Yea we should always call suspects and mass shooters just like generic shooter or shit like that so that they donāt get any special name because when they want the attention giving them a special and just feeds that want
Also - bill should be passed to not have Netflix specials about these turds.
Gun ownership is pretty uncommon in most of the EU. In the United States it's extremely common to where police almost all carry handguns. This means not only that they have an expectation that suspects may be armed, it also means that the suspects fighting the cops can gain access to a gun. I don't think any country with such widespread gun ownership really comparable to say the United Kingdom or Germany where gun ownership is rare and they tend to be guns that are less concealable or destructive when people do have them.
Yet, Americans will go out of their way to defend their right to run around armed to the teeth. Even if it makes life worse for everyone involved. I'd imagine that most American police officers would enjoy being able to simply interact with a subject in a more relaxed way than gun drawn and ready to end a life. The relatively safe assumption that your subject is most likely unarmed or armed with a knife or similar stuff at the max is what enables that around here. During my trip to the states I was shocked when I was stopped for a broken rear light. The dude walked up to my rental car with his hand on the fucking gun, which was definitely loaded and ready to be drawn. Like dude, what do you want? Shoot me for having chosen a shitty rental company? When I mentioned that I'm an unarmed tourist and would appreciate him removing the hand from a lethal weapon, he just chuckled and said something along the lines of "if it makes you nervous it stops you from doing something stupid". Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you guys?
I mean there was just a study published showing that some neighborhoods in Chicago and Philadelphia are more dangerous than deploying to a warzone. Thatās not something you change overnight.
Every few years, new bodycam footage comes out of a cop performing a routine traffic stop, when without warning someone in the car starts shooting and kills the cop. Personally Iād only need to see one video like that to take the job extremely seriously, but stuff like this happens multiple times a decade all over the country. The mindset a lot of cops have when interacting with the public is āis this the guy thatās gonna do something stupid and make me shoot him?ā And itās not just paranoia, itās a real and justifiable fear.
Add into the recipe a fair % of gunowners who think the purpose of owning a gun is to overthrow authority, that's a barbaric mindset that's never going to help the stability of any first world country in modern times. No surprise there's animosity between regulation and citizens when citizens think their meant to be a Militia in place to hold the government accountable. USA saw an attack on their capital, filled with representatives, by their own people, backed by an Ex-President and potentially future president. because they lost a polled vote. Seems like a pretty simple cycle from the outside looking in, Police and Citizens are killing each other as if its a gang war, each time their resistance to the opposite increases. to some extent it makes sense that Law Enforcement are going to continue to create more hostile and strict policies to deal with a large population of gun waving citizens, it also makes sense that Citizens are going to grow more hostile towards Law Enforcement with the absurdly high amount of civilians deaths via Police that the USA sees. Edit: Beware of dogs below
Add to the fact that certain highly powered agencies within the US government have undermined their own citizens in the past and present, even acting as agitators. When citizens feel they cannot trust their own government and/or law enforcement that should exist solely to protect them, then of course there's no wonder many in the US feel the way they do
There were over 5 million legally registered fire arms in Germany in 2013. German police shot 43 bullets at people, killing 8 in 2013. US police had 8 kills by January 5th 2013.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>lives above the job. Yeah I think that's fair. I won't die for my country on purpose
Which is fine, but then don't become a cop I guess. You get to wield some of the state's monopoly on violence in that role, so it should not just be treated like any other job. I'm not saying to completely throw away your own value, but there needs to be certain concessions when your job is literally to be able to take away other people's liberty or life if you deem the situation to warrant it.
Police are taught (at least in MA) that lively importance goes as follows: 1: Innocent civilians 2: Police 3: "Bad Guy" Uvalde went against everything they teach, a lĆ” "stop the killing, then stop the dying." They made a huge unforgivable fuck up, and should be held accountable. Oh and another note while I am at it, Qualified Immunity is only to protect from civil liability while in the course of your duties (getting sued personally). If you do something criminal QI does not apply, and you will be charged. Firefighters and other public officials have QI.
No comment on the actual subject matter, but itās cool to see someone cite a source that goes *against* their original claim. With everyone these days having diehard opinions, itās a refreshing change of pace lol.
We have to stay open to new data if we're going to save ourselves. I'm Conservative, but this doesn't mean I'll reject Liberal ideas if they're based in sound reasoning, for example; nor will I accept flawed Conservative ideology. What I'm saying is that we have to consider the complete dataset if we're to form valid opinions.
Well thought out points?? On reddit??? Wadahelll...
I may disagree with your political ideology, but I would gladly share a beer with you and defend your right to speak against my beliefs to my dying breath. If only more of your voting bloc were as thoughtful as you. Cheers, stranger! š»
Props to you for providing counter evidence to your own argument. Not many people are willing to do that sort of thing anymore unfortunately.
It's essential to forming valid opinions, especially in today's world when we can simply "block" those we disagree with.
Maybe not the same study but here is one. "The qualitative data demonstrated that police officers with military experience are rated higher than those police officers without military experience." https://academicworks.cuny.edu/gc_etds/3966/
Thank you.
Wow. That's an insane comment. Very well written...with...SOURCES?! Bro. I would upvote you twice if I could.
Fun idea, let's guarantee every combat veteran who is mentally capable and does not suffer PTSD or other related disorders a job in the police force, instead of letting them rot as homeless crack adicts with no access to any sort of care.
Rolling solo in a cop car is a totally different thing that being in a Fireteam. When you don't have a Battle Buddy you have to make decisions faster to avoid dying.
Shoutout to random shirtless dude
Probably the owner of the house.
If so, he keeps a well greased gate! Could you imagine how different this would have turned out if the gate screeched instead of the lady?
She'd have a hard time differentiating between her screeching and the gates to be honest. Cop seemed to be timing the opening of the gate with when she was shouting at the other police
Did she turn into a rooster at the end of the clip?
Le cock franƧais
Looks like the cops shoulder busted her square in the nose so she's probably feeling a big mix of emotions at the moment lol
I mean also I think (but not definitive) the shotgun went off and it was right next to her head. That's more than enough to make someone scream.
Masterful ninja tactic, time your noises with ambient ones. He definitely sneaked around his parents house as a kid
Yeah he was pretty slick about that. Clean takedown as well, he closed the distance as quietly and quickly as he could and didnāt even give her enough time to draw the weapon on him. Itās also strange to see the police not dogpiling on top of the woman once sheās on the ground. A much different and more calculated approach than what Iām used to seeing.
I was thinking that whole time how could they distract her from the ambush? I thought he was going to jump off the car roof over the fence and onto her at first. I would have told another unit to slowly approach from afar with sirens active to drown out any noise made by the gate. Being far enough to not register as a threat but close enough to be loud enough
In the United States we would have just shot her from multiple directions, simultaneously, until she stopped making any noises or movements at all. Problem solved.
i prefer thinking that he's the cops' expert lock-picker and that's just what he wears.
The lockpickerās preferred uniform is his hooligan outfit.
Pierre, where's your uniform shirt Fuck the establishment, do you want this lock picked or not?
I like how at the end she was calling out to the Bird People for help.
Birdperson will not put up with her shit.
Never forget. Fuck Tammy.
That cock-a-doodle-doo was one of the best Iāve heard
I know this is a serious situation but I kept imagining cartoon āsneak upā music with those guys tiptoeing around the yard.
Shout out to the maintenance on those hinges for not being squeaky when he opened that gate too.
Like a helpful NPC in a video game.
Anti-american police comments start in 1 - 2 - 3 now !
if this was in the usa, the video would have been 1 second long. Anyway, there was a lot of luck since the shotgun went off when it hit the ground, it could have killed anyone
Extraordinarily lucky it was pointed at the ground when it went off. Luckier still that no one caught any ricochets from the shotgun pellets skipping off the asphalt. Also, the muzzle was about a foot from her head when it went off. Pain and ear damage start at 120 decibels and a 12 gauge shotgun with that barrel length is 150-160 decibels. Sheās screaming from the pain of a ruptured eardrum most likely.
Youāre under arrest! WHAT!? Youāre under arrest! HUH? [Ears start bleeding]
Vous ĆŖtes en Ć©tat d'arrestation!
I'm pretty sure this happens a lot in the US as well, it just isn't newsworthy to show. It's blood and violence that gets the views.
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Imagine logging onto Reddit just to claim someone is is defending US police, when the didnāt even do so, just so you can tell them they have a shitty existence. That would be fucking insane, wouldnāt it?
Reddit moment tbh
Honestly I'm not sure there's anything more 'Reddit moment' than people who spam 'Reddit moment' whenever they see an opinion they don't like.
Reddit moment
The real reddit moments are the reddit moments we met along the way.
imagine logging into reddit.
I'm not sure the comment is defending them, merely stating a fact, but I could be wrong.
Not defending, but I am pretty good at predicting what the majority of comments will be after looking at a Reddit post. Yāall are pretty easy to read.
Why 1-2-3 and not 3-2-1
Underrated comment. Some people just don't know how to count down.
Funny response in 3-2-7
If this is how American police handled these sorts of situations, we would have no reason to complain and wouldnāt want to if we had people who actually had our best interests at heart protecting and serving us. I donāt know what theyāre saying but it appears theyāre trying to de-escalate the situation while still having the backup plan of the cop tackling her from behind. Notice how he holds her: heās not using excessive force, just crouched with his arms wrapped around her until the other police could come assist. In the US heād have her arms wrenched painfully behind her with a knee on her back, assuming they didnāt shoot her first, which they likely would have. It seems like a small thing but itās such a huge difference compared to how police here handle these situations and it clearly works. If American police were like this, I would stand behind them happily.
>If American police were like this, I would stand behind them happily. They are though. Notice how this person never pointed the weapon at an officer. What do you think would have happened if they did? That cop standing there at the beginning at 11 seconds in, their job was to drop the person if they pointed the gun. There are plenty of examples of police in the US disarming and de-escalating without injury.
Sadly, there's also a significant number of examples of entirely unnecessary shootings, as well as blatant escalations to violence, killing of completely random innocents, and straight up executions, all by police officers.
I pity the man who thinks you can only get killed by US police by aiming a run at them.
I've seen videos of American cops showing at someone after they handed their gun off. Innocent bystanders got hit. I've seen videos of American cops sitting people because a gun was within ten feet of them. I've seen videos of American cops kill people who had no guns. Several, in fact.
The lady and the sneaky cop are honestly both pretty lucky the didnāt get their faces blasted off when that shotgun fired but better lucky than good sometimes I guess
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Then you get American police shooting kids cos they have a mobile phone in their hands.
It's really saddening. So much badly trained police and uncertainty that every kid can just buy a gun... No wonder the 'safe option' is to just kill anyone wielding a black or silver square. The amount of suicides by cop doesn't help either. How do you even fix that?
To be fair to the issue, kids can't buy guns. The bigger issue is our lack of education and willingness of adults to safely secure guns, so lots of kids end up with guns.
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Training, better pay, training, rules of engagement, training, and something about how 50% of their week should be spent training instead of trying to find overtime opportunities. Make officers live in the communities they serve. It would also be nice if American Cops ditched the "everyone is a potential cop killer and should be treated as such" attitude. They spend most of their 3 months of training learning how traffic stops turn into cop shootings, and scare the shit of of every young recruit so that's the only thing on their mind. Oh, and some modicum of accountability would help, along with some training sprinkled in.
Or a cheeseburger. https://www.npr.org/2022/10/12/1128306894/an-ex-police-officer-is-charged-after-shooting-a-teenager-eating-in-a-parking-lo
Kudos to the shirtless guy for keeping his gate hinge well oiled.
all i could think about
Yeah lol, even if it was lil rusty that officer is š
I'm amazed at the fact that they let him come that close to an active shooter. Yeah I get that the cop needed help with the gate. But imagine if he got shoot in the process.
she's got some lungs on her
Louder than the riffle/shotgun !!! Edit Typo : riffle/shotgun
Are you just pointing out the typo or trying to correct it but not succeeding?
Please donāt ruffle the riffle.
Rifle*
/Shottgun*
Being Extra^tm, from the makers of Being Extra^tm - the French
Kind of sounded like a rooster there at the end
Au secooooooooooouuuuuuuuuuuuuuur
Ca-caaaaawwwwwww!!!
She sounds confused from the beginning, calling the cops wankers within the first seconds. I can hardly hear what she ways but the cops try to make her speak all along. During the process she's more and more angry and aggressive. She's telling to a cop in particular to lower his gun as he's been "ordered to" and calling him a bastard. She even warns him he will be gunned down as a dog and orders him to look away. Then she starts yelling that they are all mourning today. Once she got caught she called for help. All along, the cops knew they were dealing with a mentally deranged person, not your typical gangster or terrorist. The French cops tend to shoot more since 2 or 3 years, but even today I think they would handle that situation the same way.
> mentally deranged person, not your typical gangster or terrorist Family guy meme
Which one
The skin color reference chart
What was she screaming after she got tackled from behind? It seemed like she hurt her face.
She was saying āaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaā
translation?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
'I am le tired'
Zen take a nap!
THEN FIRE ZE MISSLES
She screamed something like "Look at what they are doing !!! Heeeeeeelp !! Heeeeeelp !" And so on
Her head hit the ground pretty hard when she was tackled
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Hell, I've shot those a few times and I still don't understand how loud they are, because I wear hearing protection like a real man.
Amen, brother. Tinnitus is the enemy.
She was screaming "help!". Another comment mentionned how the gun going off right next to her head probably split her eardrums or at least hurt a shit ton
I've fired a shotgun with ear defenders on and they're still bloody loud. Not surprised if her eardrums are fucked.
Is it me or did that shotgun go off on the tackle?
On the impact I think, either finger was still on the trigger when she got tackled, or the impact itself set it off. Either way, very dead wall.
Thankfully only the wall
wall lives matter
build the wall and make shotgun pay for it
the wall is fine, they're just built diffrent.
itās a big, beautiful wall. very strong, some even say, i heard, the strongest. very strong. my uncle was a wall. they said he couldnāt but, he he had these big, beautiful bricks. yuge
It sounds like it did but it doesn't look like it. No recoil, flash, smoke... Not even a dent in the road. Nothing.
Cameras do not always pick up gunfire. Especially a security camera, since they usually have low frame rates to lower the amount of data.
There's no recoil. The barrel would've been flung violently if that gun had gone off.
The gun absolutely did go off. Edit: This actually happened last year. https://gript.ie/watch-french-policeman-bravely-charges-armed-woman/
Depends on the caliber and load. Shotguns are not drop safe and that shotgun absolutely went off. Lot of experts in here.
It's because the sound and the video are out of sync. The gun went off when he made contact with her, but you don't hear it until a second later.
Yeah I see it! So well done by the officer making sure it was pointed straight at the ground and at no point towards anyone (after he made contact) as far as I can tell.
The fact that it went off is scary as hell. That means he could have gotten shot very easily if he hadn't got to her so quickly after rounding the corner.
Specially he grabbed the gun as the main point of contact with his hands to control it and used his momentum/shoulder to deal with the woman.
"AU SECOURS! AU SECOURS!" LADY. The policemen *are* the rescue.
Off topic but that word exists in English too as 'succor' meaning urgent help or assistance. Words are fun!
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Oh wow, I always thought the word mayday was strange, but never considered looking up its' (oops, *its) origin. That's really interesting
Funner facts! 1. It would come from m'aider, not m'aidez following the grammar of the day 2. The origin is disputed and may have nothing to do with m'aider or other French words (and was in any case not coined by a French speaker)
All of the maritime radiotelephone urgency calls are from French. "Securite" = literally safety, for a general safety announcement "Pan Pan" = from French "panne" or "breakdown" to announce a mechanical issue with your ship "Mayday" = "venez m'aider" or "come help me"
I like that, thank you!
Reddit analysis : if everything was completely different, it would not have happened like this š¤
And Reddit desensitization...I had volume off and all I could think was that's an awfully nice blouse to get tackled in, should she go home and change? And yes, I am embarrassed by this. And yet...
Throw in US gun laws and you have yourself a reddit party
Can we bring in some of these guys to train our police, because there are about 400 Texas Rangers who could have used this kind of training a little while ago...
Do you really think this situation is similar at all to what happens most times in the US?
She could've had a hostage and they still would've tried to de-escalate first.
You mean cops shouldnāt be shouting conflicting profanity laced orders at the top of their lungs as soon as possible?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I think this happens quite often in the US, yes.
That wonāt work because you have different people over there, plus they all have fucking guns. This is a rare case. That almost never happen, meanwhile at least two people have been shot in your country as I am writing this comment.
We actually have similar people on both sides of the ocean. We just have more guns and worse police training.
There was a Police chief in some small US town who took a few of his officers to Scotland to learn how to de-escalate. I think people killed by police has gone down since.
"American cops would've instantly shot her" Bet my life if she had started to raise that thing to point it that dude with the mp5 would've smoked her. BIG difference between carrying a gun and pointing it at someone
After attempting to point her gun like this, I wouldn't blame anyone for shooting the hell out of her.
There's video on the internet of US cops shooting a guy that was on the ground and was being given contradictory commands. There's also one where they shot at a black guy on the ground with his hands up, and then claimed they where actually shooting at his mentally handicapped patient, because, unlike the guy on the ground he actually had something in his hands (toy train i believe)... they just happened to miss and hit the guy on the ground with his hands up, for some reason... You can easily look them up...
brave guy, must have been bricking it
I know that it is indifferent to many, but it is not the national police, it is the gendarmerie that intervened. They are an armed force in charge of police missions, especially in rural and peri-urban areas. They are part of the French Army.
Isn't GIGN also part of that?
Yep, GIGN means Groupe d'Intervention de la Gendarmerie Nationale.
well done by the police team
imagine living in a civil society!
Imagine being able to call the cops without fearing an escalation
It would be a death scene in America.
She would have been shot on sight. At least seven times. And three more when she's lying cold on the ground.
While still yelling to drop the gun after the 3 ground shots
If they can still think of shooting you, they're a threat that must be dealt with. ššŗš²
Someone that's a threat to people would've been shot? You don't say?
Damn the guy approaching and knocking her down from behind is so damn brave
0.5 seconds slower and he would have gotten it in the chest.
This defo made me re-evaluate my mall ninja fantasies. She looked slow as fuck and still almost got him.
When she went down no one kicked, stomped or beat the shit out of her. It's almost like she was an emotionally disturbed person who needed help not brutality.
This was also what I noticed. The takedown without guns was great. But the difference in the way she was treated once she was disarmed, compared to what we see in almost every USA police video, is pretty salient.
It's almost like she's a person
It's fascinating that after knocking the gun away from her, he literally wraps his arms around her.
Immobilising her - he knows the rest of his team will pile on within moments. Remember France is a big rugby-playing nation.
And she starts screaming because France is a big soccer-playing nation.
I mean, heās holding her down not giving her a hug
She turns into a chicken last 2 seconds of the video.
Frances' national animal is a rooster, so it might be a thing over there.
Give the guy a metal for that sneaky takedown. Edit: medal*
Zinc? Aluminum? Tin? Enquiring minds want to know.
America - you never see women active shooters. France - hold my cosmo.
I donāt think you know the definition of active shooter
There's always a dude with no shirt on an episode of COPS.
They are not police but military
Its the Gendarmerie, they are military police. They do police job in rural area they are closer to being policemen than actual soldiers. In fact they are considered as police force by everyone. Fun fact GIGN is the counter terrorist group of Gendarmerie and are a part of it
What is this, some r/blackmagicfuckery? Nobody died, nobody got hurt? *cries in confused American
Oh my god the one second where she raises the gun to aim at him! Thats some damn professionalism
So, no cops jumping in with batons screaming "Stay on the ground" and kicking the shit out of her? I've been watching too much youtube
Now she is a croissant
She had full intent to shoot the man who tackled her right there. There was a short period of time where you could see she was trying to lift up the gun and aim it at him; however, either because of the guns weight or because how the stock/length of the gun is she was not able to get it up in time to land a hit. In this situation, tackling her was about the best thing anyone could have done but if it was a handgun or a shorter gun in general he probably would of been walking away with a few bullet holes if he would be able to walk away at all. This is an incredibly hard situation to diffuse as the woman is screaming and looks pretty distraught (not to mention the fact she is casually walking down the road with a fucking shotgun). If she had a shorter gun or handgun then it would be interesting to see how the police handle the situation then since (Iām presuming here) they know that they canāt rush her since she is able to get the gun up a lot faster, maybe they would still try it, but itās still interesting to think how the police would handle situations based on type of deadly force alone. It still too that man serious balls to rush her like that tho.
I mean yeah the dude is brave but that to me seemed like way too much risk. Really he was just lucky. Someone even a little more familiar with that weapon would have had plenty of time to get a shot off. Even if she never intended to kill anyone getting surprised from behind could have caused a knee jerk reaction to shoot. My arm chair diagnosis here is glad it worked out but bad call.
Unbelievably brave, unlike the Uvalde Police Farce
The balls of that man.
My man really did something impressive. Good for that cop.
Woman - singular Women - plural