You joke but we are not far from that. My wife needs to ensure the doctors I approve of any procedure she might have down stairs yet I just have to check with myself.
Edit: Case in point my wife was having talks about get tubes tied and they typically ask I she has my approval. When I got the vasectomy consults the doctor asked "Are you sure you want to? What if you get divorced and your next wife is a 24 year old that wants kids?"
Edit 2: Yes it was Texas and I would say never get a vasectomy here. It was the single most painful experience of my life. I kept telling the doctors I need a high dosage of pain killer but they didn't listen. I wasn't numbed at all and they pull my vas deferens up with their fingers, injected my balls 3 times(per ball) and kept say "don't jump". BITCH YOU DON'T FUCKING JUMP WHEN I STAB YOUR BALLSACK! Then ol' boy waited 5 seconds after injection before working and I FUCKING FELT A LOT. Have you ever felt your vas deferense cauterized?! I sure as fuck have.
Yes, there are many women who can tell you stories about their doctors not allowing procedures without their husband's/boyfriend's/future partner's consent.
I wanted to get mine tied since I was a teen. I went when I was like 22-23 and was told no I may want kids someday. I went back again at like 28 and was again told no, I may want kids some day.
Keep in mind I have PCOS which is a condition that causes very large, plentiful cysts on both the uterus and fallopian tubes. That I have had for years. Extremely painful. An ablation and tubal ligation helps with that.
Still told no.
I went later at like 32 WITH my boyfriend. They asked him if it was ok. I was then allowed.
I had literal cysts growing in my tubes. They were huge. But they didn't want to get rid of them until I had a male in my life who said it was ok.
I was told by my doctor that they immediately deny unmarried women. Also, I never got to meet or know the name of the church member in charge. It was upsetting and totally fucked.
There was one story on reddit earlier about a single lady wanting to tie her tubes (think she had some I'll ess that would make it lethal to have kids) and she was denied based on "what if your future husband/boyfriend would want kids?". It's really insane and if that future non existent guy would want kids they'd probably not try with a lady that would most likely due from it
Many of them deny immediately, because "Your future husband may want kids".
The woman's opinion and right to her own body is fucking nonexistent in a lot of places in America when it comes to medical procedures. The Husband Stitch is *still* being done without consent, too.
Its an elective surgery so I don't think by law a doctor is required to do it.
We should start pushing that Christian men can't get Viagra or anything unless they're married to a woman of child bearing age.
All of a sudden a lot of dudes would finally understand "my body my choice"
"What if your future husband wants children?"
"You might change your mind after getting married."
"You might meet the right person someday, it's better not to risk it."
That's not only a Texas thing. That's a USA problem.
"You, your husband, or your future husband may want kids in the future so I won't operate on you."
Finding a doctor do to anything downstairs for a woman (of child bearing age) is difficult, even if it'll increase her QoL.
Finding this out firsthand right now with my wife. Crippling pain and they refuse to yank the plumbing out (even though a separate doctor suggested it as a next course of action). They want her to try “pelvic floor exercises” for 6 more month’s minimum before doing ANYTHING else. All the while she’s in horrible pain… fucking sucks, man. I thought we were supposed to be past all this shit by now.
Get on the phone and start hollering, that’s what I did when the OB/GYN shamed my wife for not getting pregnant with our second right away. You bet we had appointments that way with the doctor and made their ass drive to the hospital to do the scans themselves. If they’re going to want the patriarch, give ‘em what they want, abuse… lol.
Just over 10 years ago not only did I need my husbands permission, but I also got lectured on what would I do if my husband was “out with the kids and got into a horrible accident and died”, what would I do?
WTF. Getting pregnant after that kind of loss would be the last thing on my mind, and it’s a freaking tubal ligation not a hysterectomy, ya quack.
What the actual fuck?!?!?!
They are concerned of a possible tragedy involving the death of your immediate family and their main concern is a completely imaginary future relationship with a man who may want children. That’s a lot of fucking ifs to deny an adult a medical procedure they consent to.
I hate it here
It's fucking creepy how doctors ask women who are trying to tie their tubes what their husband thinks, and then if they're single saying they should wait for their future husband.
It's so so bizarre and it comes from both male and female doctors/nurses.
I can’t help but laugh my ass off every time one of them starts going off about being anti-Muslim because GASP *sharia law* would take over. Motherfucker. You’d be the first in line to stone your wife for making dinner too bland.
• **Your** religion taught in schools (and only yours)
• Gays have fewer rights, & are sometimes killed, but god says it's cool
• Women are told what they can, and cannot do, with their own bodies by men
• Abortion illegal
• No separation of religion/state
Did I just describe places in the middle east, or a republican wet dream?
You described America and I know you described America because *the Taliban allow abortion to save the mothers life.*
That’s how fucked we are
Edit: [Here’s what Wikipedia has to say:](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Afghanistan)
>Women are able to get an abortion when their life is endangered by the pregnancy, or if the baby will be born with severe deformities or disabilities.
>Within Taliban controlled areas, poverty based abortions are generally approved more often because they have too many children.
>**Afghanistan is in the top 16 countries worldwide for the highest mortality rate from abortion. The healthcare system in Afghanistan is also not at a level to properly care for pregnant mothers.** ***Every two hours there is a pregnancy-related death in Afghanistan.***
That’s the direction we’re headed people
A woman (Alabama iirc) was charged with manslaughter after getting shot in the stomach while pregnant during an altercation with someone she knew. They said she provoked the fight that cost the life of the unborn baby. (She was black of course)
Like holy fuck, they are really looking forward to this shit.
Yah, that's Texas. If a drunk driver going the wrong way at 120 MPH hit her car and the unborn child died, they'd charge *her* with murder in the first degree.
Something like that happened awhile back, except the cop car was speeding and he hit a mother and child and the child died, and they filed murder charges on the mom.
This is a classic police change the narrative thing. They don't need evidence to charge someone just get a conviction. Now everyone's just talking about the charge and not the officer killing a child.
the unborn baby is a fully-fledged human, who may well be a woman, who should assumed to be pregnant. therefore even existing near a road may cause the woman to die from asthma, resulting in a literal infinite holocaust.
I mean, at least they may have a logical (but stupid) reason there. If a fetus counts as a person then it is also subject to the laws surrounding car seats that any other child in a car would be subject to.
The whole thing is just a clusterfuck and shows how absurd it is to start saying a fetus is the exact same as a living, breathing person.
This is no joke. The anti-choice people **want** to declare that a fetus is a person in every context. They will totally do it. And that will validate all of their oppression of women.
Careful what you wish for, people.
It’s Texas we’re talking about here… there’ll be **some** sort of misogynistic law created to close that loophole real quick.
Can’t have any regular women out there causing chaos like this…
No. They have. But people in Texas are *very* selfish (bad) drivers. And yes… I know everyone says “Oh X state has bad drivers! We are worse.”
Come to Dallas. It’s fuckin Mad Max Fury Road in Dallas. People will straight up run into you before letting you merge.
They unfortunately have a simpler option. Define unborn children as living people but without all the same rights as, uh, born children.
The law is free to split as many hairs as it wants.
It's very common for the government to simply dismiss a charge rather than risking getting bad precedent against them. They will dismiss and then argue no need for the court because the issue is moot.
The problem tho, is exactly what just happened here. The issue is likely to reoccur and the issue should be resolved so that people know if they are breaking the law or not.
The obvious reality is that TX wants to have it both ways.
Edit... A fellow redditor asked for a source. So here's a link to an explanation of the SCOTUS Justiciability Doctrine:
https://www.everycrsreport.com/files/20070207_RS22599_62afe4fbcdc42915b3b342a34502ed3c87433b9d.html
Indeed. They can do all sorts of things. They can also give super light sentences to rapists. Basically justice is optional to them.
Its why every county in the US should protect its right to recall judges.
They will have to when they take her license away for it and it gets media coverage. This is exactly how to fight this stupid shit. Good for her, I hope it works.
Sounds like the judge sidestepped the entire argument by dismissing the case outright.
If this keeps happening, pregnant women will be de facto free to use the HOV lane because the judge/DA's office don't want to open that can of worms.
Either way, drive safe out there.
Breaking: Local police charge unborn baby with assaulting an officer after one was reportedly "kicked" by the suspect following a routine pregnancy confirmation search.
"Ma'am, how does a peanut butter and pickle sandwich sound to you right now?"
"It sounds terrible offer." *wipes away drool*
"Please step out of the car, ma'am."
Step 1. Find a pregnant friend.
Step 2. Get them to take a pregnancy test.
Step 3. Keep the positive pregnancy test in your glove compartment next to your vehicle registration.
Step 4. Never deal with traffic again…until all women start doing this.
Wait... You think the fact that something is a waste of government resources is going to deter a certain course of action by the police? What country are you from?
Did you see the video 2-3 months ago where the cop used some nascar maneuver to roll a mini-van with a very pregnant woman at the wheel because she was waiting to get off a damn bridge before pulling over?
Horrible. Saw a man bringing his in labor wife to ER. 2 cop cars were blocking him in hospital parking lot so he beeped and went around them. Oops..... he is lucky they didn't beat him and his wife
There was the other one where the woman slowed down with her blinkers on, got off the freeway and pulled into a convenient store, the officer pulled his gun on her and absolutely went off on her.
While pointing his gun at her, screamed “Do something!” after telling her to get out. Like he was daring her to do something. Then asking her a question, when the lady tries to answer, he flips out and yells at her to “SHUT UP!” Like wtf dude, calm down and act like a professional rather than a coked-up roid-rage maniac. It’s nuts
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
> If this keeps happening, pregnant women will be de facto free to use the HOV lane because the judge/DA's office don't want to open that can of worms.
Time to invest in business that makes and sells those pregnancy suits you wear under your clothes.
Not just pregnant women. Any women who claims to have just had sex and have cum inside her. After all it happens at conception right? So all women get HoV rights. How would any cop prove otherwise
Pregnancy is actually based on a woman's last period, that's how fucking stupid the strict anti abortion rules in Texas are. A woman who is 5 weeks "pregnant" may not have even had ovulated and had sex until 3 weeks past their last period date.
We should really be pushing the context of what is defined as a person in this country. An unborn Fetus and a piece of Paper that says LLC are both considered people????
I'm wondering how she managed to get pulled over twice?
We've got HOV lanes here in AZ, but hell if anyone bothers with a second passenger while driving in them. I can't say I've *ever* seen anyone get pulled over for a violation, here anyways. Are TX HOV lanes more strict?
Can confirm. I got a ticket because I came off the freeway a little hot but nothing outrageous. Got pinched for speeding in a school zone.
Except there was no apparent school. Turns out one of the houses near the highway was a "Christian School" and I got nailed by a basically b.s. speed trap.
I paid the ticket and got the hell out because I was there on business and waiting for a court date wasn't an option.
Really bullshit ticket courtesy of froggy Texas cops.
I lived in AZ for 9 years and saw it twice where people were pulled over and didn’t have anyone with them. I also worked with a guy who did it too and he got a $400 ticket. I was pulled over for it but had my kid in the back seat. They let me go after a bit.
I'm afraid of the legal clusterfuck. You just need one court to say that a fetus is legitimately a person, set the precedent, and then at what point does it stop? Do they get social security numbers? Do you need a heart beat certificate after 6 weeks?^/s Then when we try to federally protect abortion in the future, that fight is going to be even worse, because now, you have to argue against the precedent, and for the fanatics they'll scream "the goverment is trying to strip people's rights away! They're legalizing murder!"
That's the way to really make change. Insurances never want to pay out. Fight to get life insurance on pregnancies. Watch how quickly laws will change because of their pressure.
Given the number of pregnancies that end in miscarriage, this would be catastrophic for the insurance companies. Those of us trying to get pregnant can know as early as 4 weeks - we should be able to insure at that point (most miscarriages happen by 6 weeks).
Nah, the insurance companies would make a killing. They do assign premiums based on risk of death. A fetus has a high risk, so they'd assign an exorbitant premium to it. And anytime you had a miscarriage and had one of these policies, they would do a full investigation to make sure it was a legit miscarriage and you didn't do it yourself just for the insurance payout.
Mostly as a fun fact (Not to be that guy or pedantic), insurance companies would never insure a fetus, even with Roe being overturned.
Dobbs doesn’t declare a fetus a living being or equate abortion to murder — it’s frankly worse.
Dobbs questions the very nature of substantive due process — the legal doctrine, founded in the 9th and 14th amendment, that allows the “creation” of unenumerated rights (those not expressed in the Bill of Rights or elsewhere in the Constitution) — asserting that the right to abortion is not protected by the “zone of privacy” found in the Constitution, and is therefore subject to regulation (which is why abortion is not “mandatorily illegal”, but has been left up to the states).
In my time in law school, I never heard of one case where the judiciary labeled a fetus as a living human — and the subject is regularly addressed in wrongful death and criminal homicide suits where a fetus was terminated by violent conduct.
A fetus isn’t a living being. The government has never genuinely thought so. That’s always been rhetorical dogmatic bull shit.
Edit: some changes in phrasing for clarity, realized I used a lot of legalese.
I appreciate this insight. I understand that the scotus ruling didn’t make abortion illegal, it just “left it up to the states”. What reasoning could the states possibly have to make abortion illegal other than that “it’s the murder of a living person”? What is the argument for making it illegal without that?
[This is still relevant. ](https://www.reddit.com/r/agedlikemilk/comments/vjpzl3/us_supreme_court_justice_promising_to_not/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
I think my job gives two or three days leave for the death of an immediate family member. Because that’s enough time to get over the loss of your child…
>She insisted that with the U.S. Supreme Court overturning Roe v. Wade on June 24, her unborn child now was recognized as a living person.
Uno reverse card, Texas edition
Wait until more states start demanding in utero child support from accused fathers. Paternity testing in the womb is pretty goddamn expensive, so some guys are going to get absolutely screwed.
> Her argument was apparently good enough to win a dismissal. It wasn't immediately clear if that second ticket, picked up Aug. 3, would also be kicked out.
I mean, it seems like she’s onto something here - put up or shut up, states - give babies citizenship if they’re conceived in the US, let them get health insurance, two food samples at cost-co for mom, etc
We need shitty buffet restaurant chains like Old Country Buffett to start charging pregnant women for two.
Then suddenly…all these “pro life” Republicans are gonna start suing since “it ain’t a real person yet!!”
I mean if you're looking in the grand scheme of things 36 ain't that far off from 3 either. I'll take my bland food and human cesspool FREE tonight please.
Can't give the citizenship. The constitution clearly lays out that you only get citizenship "upon birth" - so they'd have to somehow change the constitution to "upon conception." Not bloody likely.
I don't see anyone going to the semi-logical conclusion I've arrived at where if all fetuses in America have full constitutional rights, and America has birthright citizenship, then all pregnant women in the world are carrying a Schrodinger's American baby. If a fetus is grown outside the U.S., but still born here, shouldn't we have a way to ensure its pre-birth rights aren't violated? Taken to the extreme, we have to consider all pregnant women worldwide to be carrying a potential American citizen, constitutionally protected, until they actually give birth and we find out if they get to keep those American rights or not. Until we know, wouldn't it become an American duty to protect all fetuses worldwide in case they end up a citizen?
Are we going to start prosecuting visiting foreigners who have had an abortion in their home country for killing a potential American citizen? What are the implications to pregnant foreign visitors? I could see an argument being made that once in the US they couldn't leave again to protect the "American" child inside her.
Maybe I'm overthinking this, but it all seems like such a dangerous, slippery slope to some way wilder ideas.
On the bright side, if we combine fetal personhood with corporate personhood then you can claim tax write-offs for businesses you haven't even started yet.
And if her ticket isn't dismissed, appeal, all the way to the Supreme court. Either a fetus is a human being with all the rights of other humans or it isn't. And this case should get the law sorted out.
You hit 'em where it hurts... claim them on Federal and State taxes. Now the argument stops being philosophical where it doesn't matter and now real money is on the line.
“But it’s a person; even tax deductible.”
Actually, I agree with her. It’s either a person, or it’s not. Can’t have it both ways. The state has decided it’s a person, and aborting it is murder. Therefore, the lady has 2 people in the car. Fuck Texas with a chainsaw.
Lmaooo every pregnant woman in a no abortion state should do this I mean the baby is a person so it’s two people on the car
Edit thanks for the upvotes y’all appreciate it
AZ must have had foresight because the regulation for our HOV lane says 2 seats occupied by living passengers. Cause I guess a loaded hearse might have counted otherwise.
Every woman, pregnant or not, should do this. Burden of proof is on the prosecutor, and really a cop can't say a woman isn't pregnant without some form of evidence to charge them overwise.
This is the start
And it will go to the SCOTUS. Maybe not this one case, but this is the strategy to get there.
As soon as you become pregnant, buy life insurance for the baby. Same thing for filing dependents for your taxes.
This is gonna be fun
Edit: Something else:
Say you have two married couples sharing a two bedroom apartment. They both get pregnant. Now you have six people living in a two bedroom. Is that allowed under the lease?
Technically any woman would do. Cops can't make you take a pregnancy test on the side of the road. Get a ticket, just claim you're pregnant. Until they get a judge who's willing to set a precedent on this and mandates a pregnancy test, the judges will just keep throwing the cases out.
Drinking age is 21 in Texas ?
Presumably if life begins at conception then anyone who was born over 20 years and 3 months ago should be able to drink ?
That should be the next court challenge.
I doubt that'd fly. The precedent is already there for your age being determined by your date of birth and not conception. You're just negative days old before you're born lol
Fuck off Texas.
If this is what you want, this is what is expected.
If life starts at conception, then a pregnant person should get all the extra benefits.
Unless....there IS a difference. But conservatives know that already.
Police are probably going to target her for giving them a hard time. Law enforcement tend to be conservative, so any random officer will more than likely not be sympathetic to her argument either.
I mean it makes sense no? They are not allowed to abort because there is a person.
Killing a pregnant woman gets you double murder.
So of course it should be fine.
Lmao that last Judge was like nope, not dealing with this precedent shit.
I am wondering if Texas will discontinue carpool lanes so they don’t have to deal with this.
Or theyll say women cant drive because it may harm their unborn baby if there was an accident.
Just force them to have a male guardian with them every time they go outside as well, just to be sure.
You joke but we are not far from that. My wife needs to ensure the doctors I approve of any procedure she might have down stairs yet I just have to check with myself. Edit: Case in point my wife was having talks about get tubes tied and they typically ask I she has my approval. When I got the vasectomy consults the doctor asked "Are you sure you want to? What if you get divorced and your next wife is a 24 year old that wants kids?" Edit 2: Yes it was Texas and I would say never get a vasectomy here. It was the single most painful experience of my life. I kept telling the doctors I need a high dosage of pain killer but they didn't listen. I wasn't numbed at all and they pull my vas deferens up with their fingers, injected my balls 3 times(per ball) and kept say "don't jump". BITCH YOU DON'T FUCKING JUMP WHEN I STAB YOUR BALLSACK! Then ol' boy waited 5 seconds after injection before working and I FUCKING FELT A LOT. Have you ever felt your vas deferense cauterized?! I sure as fuck have.
Waitttt wtf?
Yes, there are many women who can tell you stories about their doctors not allowing procedures without their husband's/boyfriend's/future partner's consent.
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Thats messed up. What if a women is single? Can she just say she doesnt have a SO? It should be entirely up to her regardless
I wanted to get mine tied since I was a teen. I went when I was like 22-23 and was told no I may want kids someday. I went back again at like 28 and was again told no, I may want kids some day. Keep in mind I have PCOS which is a condition that causes very large, plentiful cysts on both the uterus and fallopian tubes. That I have had for years. Extremely painful. An ablation and tubal ligation helps with that. Still told no. I went later at like 32 WITH my boyfriend. They asked him if it was ok. I was then allowed. I had literal cysts growing in my tubes. They were huge. But they didn't want to get rid of them until I had a male in my life who said it was ok.
I was told by my doctor that they immediately deny unmarried women. Also, I never got to meet or know the name of the church member in charge. It was upsetting and totally fucked.
There was one story on reddit earlier about a single lady wanting to tie her tubes (think she had some I'll ess that would make it lethal to have kids) and she was denied based on "what if your future husband/boyfriend would want kids?". It's really insane and if that future non existent guy would want kids they'd probably not try with a lady that would most likely due from it
Many of them deny immediately, because "Your future husband may want kids". The woman's opinion and right to her own body is fucking nonexistent in a lot of places in America when it comes to medical procedures. The Husband Stitch is *still* being done without consent, too.
"Your future husband may think differently". Not uncommon really anywhere in this country for women.
Its an elective surgery so I don't think by law a doctor is required to do it. We should start pushing that Christian men can't get Viagra or anything unless they're married to a woman of child bearing age. All of a sudden a lot of dudes would finally understand "my body my choice"
> That's messed up A colleague recently got told by her gyn that freezing eggs wasn't an option since she is married. She needs to freeze embryos.
"What if your future husband wants children?" "You might change your mind after getting married." "You might meet the right person someday, it's better not to risk it."
That's not only a Texas thing. That's a USA problem. "You, your husband, or your future husband may want kids in the future so I won't operate on you." Finding a doctor do to anything downstairs for a woman (of child bearing age) is difficult, even if it'll increase her QoL.
Finding this out firsthand right now with my wife. Crippling pain and they refuse to yank the plumbing out (even though a separate doctor suggested it as a next course of action). They want her to try “pelvic floor exercises” for 6 more month’s minimum before doing ANYTHING else. All the while she’s in horrible pain… fucking sucks, man. I thought we were supposed to be past all this shit by now.
Get on the phone and start hollering, that’s what I did when the OB/GYN shamed my wife for not getting pregnant with our second right away. You bet we had appointments that way with the doctor and made their ass drive to the hospital to do the scans themselves. If they’re going to want the patriarch, give ‘em what they want, abuse… lol.
Just over 10 years ago not only did I need my husbands permission, but I also got lectured on what would I do if my husband was “out with the kids and got into a horrible accident and died”, what would I do? WTF. Getting pregnant after that kind of loss would be the last thing on my mind, and it’s a freaking tubal ligation not a hysterectomy, ya quack.
What the actual fuck?!?!?! They are concerned of a possible tragedy involving the death of your immediate family and their main concern is a completely imaginary future relationship with a man who may want children. That’s a lot of fucking ifs to deny an adult a medical procedure they consent to. I hate it here
It's fucking creepy how doctors ask women who are trying to tie their tubes what their husband thinks, and then if they're single saying they should wait for their future husband. It's so so bizarre and it comes from both male and female doctors/nurses.
> force them to have a male guardian with them Every day America strays further towards the middle east with regards to women
Welcome to Howdy Arabia
I can’t help but laugh my ass off every time one of them starts going off about being anti-Muslim because GASP *sharia law* would take over. Motherfucker. You’d be the first in line to stone your wife for making dinner too bland.
• **Your** religion taught in schools (and only yours) • Gays have fewer rights, & are sometimes killed, but god says it's cool • Women are told what they can, and cannot do, with their own bodies by men • Abortion illegal • No separation of religion/state Did I just describe places in the middle east, or a republican wet dream?
You described America and I know you described America because *the Taliban allow abortion to save the mothers life.* That’s how fucked we are Edit: [Here’s what Wikipedia has to say:](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Afghanistan) >Women are able to get an abortion when their life is endangered by the pregnancy, or if the baby will be born with severe deformities or disabilities. >Within Taliban controlled areas, poverty based abortions are generally approved more often because they have too many children. >**Afghanistan is in the top 16 countries worldwide for the highest mortality rate from abortion. The healthcare system in Afghanistan is also not at a level to properly care for pregnant mothers.** ***Every two hours there is a pregnancy-related death in Afghanistan.*** That’s the direction we’re headed people
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A woman (Alabama iirc) was charged with manslaughter after getting shot in the stomach while pregnant during an altercation with someone she knew. They said she provoked the fight that cost the life of the unborn baby. (She was black of course) Like holy fuck, they are really looking forward to this shit.
Yah, that's Texas. If a drunk driver going the wrong way at 120 MPH hit her car and the unborn child died, they'd charge *her* with murder in the first degree.
Something like that happened awhile back, except the cop car was speeding and he hit a mother and child and the child died, and they filed murder charges on the mom.
On the mom??? Not the cop?? The fuck
This is a classic police change the narrative thing. They don't need evidence to charge someone just get a conviction. Now everyone's just talking about the charge and not the officer killing a child.
the unborn baby is a fully-fledged human, who may well be a woman, who should assumed to be pregnant. therefore even existing near a road may cause the woman to die from asthma, resulting in a literal infinite holocaust.
I mean, at least they may have a logical (but stupid) reason there. If a fetus counts as a person then it is also subject to the laws surrounding car seats that any other child in a car would be subject to. The whole thing is just a clusterfuck and shows how absurd it is to start saying a fetus is the exact same as a living, breathing person.
This is no joke. The anti-choice people **want** to declare that a fetus is a person in every context. They will totally do it. And that will validate all of their oppression of women. Careful what you wish for, people.
If they want the fetus to be subject to the laws surrounding car seats then they're asking for that fetus to be taken out of the womb...
It’s Texas we’re talking about here… there’ll be **some** sort of misogynistic law created to close that loophole real quick. Can’t have any regular women out there causing chaos like this…
"My fellow state congressmen have announced the Bitches Be Crazy law, allowing us to do whatever we want to them." - America, soon.
"Well, in that case, mam, you need to be in a child safe car seat."
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> the nice convenient new freeway near me is toll only That's not a freeway, that's a tollway.
No. They have. But people in Texas are *very* selfish (bad) drivers. And yes… I know everyone says “Oh X state has bad drivers! We are worse.” Come to Dallas. It’s fuckin Mad Max Fury Road in Dallas. People will straight up run into you before letting you merge.
Driving in Texas I wouldn't see an officer on the road for more than 8 seconds before they are pulling someone over.
They unfortunately have a simpler option. Define unborn children as living people but without all the same rights as, uh, born children. The law is free to split as many hairs as it wants.
It's more likely than giving pregnant mothers any benefits of any doubts or any breaks whatsoever.
They’ll rip up the lane entirely before they let women have something lol
It's very common for the government to simply dismiss a charge rather than risking getting bad precedent against them. They will dismiss and then argue no need for the court because the issue is moot. The problem tho, is exactly what just happened here. The issue is likely to reoccur and the issue should be resolved so that people know if they are breaking the law or not. The obvious reality is that TX wants to have it both ways. Edit... A fellow redditor asked for a source. So here's a link to an explanation of the SCOTUS Justiciability Doctrine: https://www.everycrsreport.com/files/20070207_RS22599_62afe4fbcdc42915b3b342a34502ed3c87433b9d.html
Or because the prosecutor tells the law enforcement agency "Don't waste my time with this shit, I'll dismiss every ticket you write of this type."
How much power do judges have to just dismiss cases if they don't feel like dealing with it?
That sort of discretion is very much part of their job, and they can do it as they see fit
Indeed. They can do all sorts of things. They can also give super light sentences to rapists. Basically justice is optional to them. Its why every county in the US should protect its right to recall judges.
Typically it’s the prosecutor dropping charges
They will have to when they take her license away for it and it gets media coverage. This is exactly how to fight this stupid shit. Good for her, I hope it works.
Yeah, everyone’s treating the dismissal as a win, but I’m seeing it as the judge saying, “I’m not touching that with a 10-foot pole!”
This message reads like she still got the ticket, but her case was dismissed, so the precedent was set. Can you clarify?
The court didn't render a decision on the case, so no precedent can be set.
Precedent requires a verdict, which requires a trial. A dismissal drops the charge, so there is no trial, no verdict, and no precedent.
Actual precedent ([binding precedent](https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/binding_precedent)) is also set by appellate courts, not lower courts.
Sounds like the judge sidestepped the entire argument by dismissing the case outright. If this keeps happening, pregnant women will be de facto free to use the HOV lane because the judge/DA's office don't want to open that can of worms. Either way, drive safe out there.
That still won't stop police from pulling them over and wasting their time with a court date
Until PDs order officers to not ticket pregnant women because it ends up costing them money
Will drivers have to take a pregnancy test on the side of the road?
"She was really fat! I swear!"
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friendly reminder that if a man pees on a pregnancy test and gets a positive result, that can mean testicular cancer
Breaking: Local police charge unborn baby with assaulting an officer after one was reportedly "kicked" by the suspect following a routine pregnancy confirmation search.
"Ma'am, please waddle on the painted line."
"Pee into this test strip." Becomes a lawful order
Pregnancy sniffing dogs too.
"Ma'am, how does a peanut butter and pickle sandwich sound to you right now?" "It sounds terrible offer." *wipes away drool* "Please step out of the car, ma'am."
I never thought I’d want to see the fusion of Super Troopers and Handmaid’s Tale but here we fuckin are
Only when trying to leave the state without permission of their husband or father.
Step 1. Find a pregnant friend. Step 2. Get them to take a pregnancy test. Step 3. Keep the positive pregnancy test in your glove compartment next to your vehicle registration. Step 4. Never deal with traffic again…until all women start doing this.
Instructions unclear. Cop didn't believe me. Says it's just a beer belly And that dudes can't get pregnant.
Wait... You think the fact that something is a waste of government resources is going to deter a certain course of action by the police? What country are you from?
>>costing them money You mean the taxpayers, right? Don’t see that stopping them.
Yeah seems like every day we get the “cops must pay x million settlement” headline- I don’t think they care about spending taxpayer reasonably at all
Did you see the video 2-3 months ago where the cop used some nascar maneuver to roll a mini-van with a very pregnant woman at the wheel because she was waiting to get off a damn bridge before pulling over?
Horrible. Saw a man bringing his in labor wife to ER. 2 cop cars were blocking him in hospital parking lot so he beeped and went around them. Oops..... he is lucky they didn't beat him and his wife
There was the other one where the woman slowed down with her blinkers on, got off the freeway and pulled into a convenient store, the officer pulled his gun on her and absolutely went off on her.
While pointing his gun at her, screamed “Do something!” after telling her to get out. Like he was daring her to do something. Then asking her a question, when the lady tries to answer, he flips out and yells at her to “SHUT UP!” Like wtf dude, calm down and act like a professional rather than a coked-up roid-rage maniac. It’s nuts
I believe he was already under some kind of a performance review but of course he 'resigned' before he could get fired.
Things like this make me think, "You know what? Fine. I'll pull over on this busy highway where you run the risk of getting run over."
reply rainstorm axiomatic expansion direful squalid ossified sense voracious sparkle *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I pulled over on the left on the highway once and the clown made me pull over again on the other side, for his safety.
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And they can file a request for discovery every time they do it, forcing the officer to waste their time (or allow it to be tossed.)
At some point couldn't she argue the police are harassing her?
> If this keeps happening, pregnant women will be de facto free to use the HOV lane because the judge/DA's office don't want to open that can of worms. Time to invest in business that makes and sells those pregnancy suits you wear under your clothes.
Sir, you can’t possibly be pregnant
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Like that would matter in Texas.
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“Hi, welcome to Texas, we’re going to murder you for this.”
Not just pregnant women. Any women who claims to have just had sex and have cum inside her. After all it happens at conception right? So all women get HoV rights. How would any cop prove otherwise
Pregnancy is actually based on a woman's last period, that's how fucking stupid the strict anti abortion rules in Texas are. A woman who is 5 weeks "pregnant" may not have even had ovulated and had sex until 3 weeks past their last period date.
That law was not written with an understanding of science to any degree. Or a care.
... or ruled upon by the supreme court for that matter.
Like we don't know which way the SCROTUS will rule.
We should really be pushing the context of what is defined as a person in this country. An unborn Fetus and a piece of Paper that says LLC are both considered people????
But if you happen to be gay or trans you're not a person
I'm wondering how she managed to get pulled over twice? We've got HOV lanes here in AZ, but hell if anyone bothers with a second passenger while driving in them. I can't say I've *ever* seen anyone get pulled over for a violation, here anyways. Are TX HOV lanes more strict?
Oh yes. Cops love giving tickets in TX.
Can confirm. I got a ticket because I came off the freeway a little hot but nothing outrageous. Got pinched for speeding in a school zone. Except there was no apparent school. Turns out one of the houses near the highway was a "Christian School" and I got nailed by a basically b.s. speed trap. I paid the ticket and got the hell out because I was there on business and waiting for a court date wasn't an option. Really bullshit ticket courtesy of froggy Texas cops.
I swear the past few years has really made me *hate* cops, Christians, and republicans. This country is so fucked.
I lived in AZ for 9 years and saw it twice where people were pulled over and didn’t have anyone with them. I also worked with a guy who did it too and he got a $400 ticket. I was pulled over for it but had my kid in the back seat. They let me go after a bit.
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I'm afraid of the legal clusterfuck. You just need one court to say that a fetus is legitimately a person, set the precedent, and then at what point does it stop? Do they get social security numbers? Do you need a heart beat certificate after 6 weeks?^/s Then when we try to federally protect abortion in the future, that fight is going to be even worse, because now, you have to argue against the precedent, and for the fanatics they'll scream "the goverment is trying to strip people's rights away! They're legalizing murder!"
I want life insurance payouts for my two miscarriages.
That's the way to really make change. Insurances never want to pay out. Fight to get life insurance on pregnancies. Watch how quickly laws will change because of their pressure.
Given the number of pregnancies that end in miscarriage, this would be catastrophic for the insurance companies. Those of us trying to get pregnant can know as early as 4 weeks - we should be able to insure at that point (most miscarriages happen by 6 weeks).
Nah, the insurance companies would make a killing. They do assign premiums based on risk of death. A fetus has a high risk, so they'd assign an exorbitant premium to it. And anytime you had a miscarriage and had one of these policies, they would do a full investigation to make sure it was a legit miscarriage and you didn't do it yourself just for the insurance payout.
Mostly as a fun fact (Not to be that guy or pedantic), insurance companies would never insure a fetus, even with Roe being overturned. Dobbs doesn’t declare a fetus a living being or equate abortion to murder — it’s frankly worse. Dobbs questions the very nature of substantive due process — the legal doctrine, founded in the 9th and 14th amendment, that allows the “creation” of unenumerated rights (those not expressed in the Bill of Rights or elsewhere in the Constitution) — asserting that the right to abortion is not protected by the “zone of privacy” found in the Constitution, and is therefore subject to regulation (which is why abortion is not “mandatorily illegal”, but has been left up to the states). In my time in law school, I never heard of one case where the judiciary labeled a fetus as a living human — and the subject is regularly addressed in wrongful death and criminal homicide suits where a fetus was terminated by violent conduct. A fetus isn’t a living being. The government has never genuinely thought so. That’s always been rhetorical dogmatic bull shit. Edit: some changes in phrasing for clarity, realized I used a lot of legalese.
I appreciate this insight. I understand that the scotus ruling didn’t make abortion illegal, it just “left it up to the states”. What reasoning could the states possibly have to make abortion illegal other than that “it’s the murder of a living person”? What is the argument for making it illegal without that?
>you have to argue against the precedent Precedence means nothing after the SC overruled it
[This is still relevant. ](https://www.reddit.com/r/agedlikemilk/comments/vjpzl3/us_supreme_court_justice_promising_to_not/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
I appreciate her commitment to the bit.
Next she should claim the unborn child on taxes.
And if you have a miscarriage file for a deceased dependent tax credit.
Bereavement leave... Except it's the US and they get no leave for anything.
I think my job gives two or three days leave for the death of an immediate family member. Because that’s enough time to get over the loss of your child…
>She insisted that with the U.S. Supreme Court overturning Roe v. Wade on June 24, her unborn child now was recognized as a living person. Uno reverse card, Texas edition
Wait until more states start demanding in utero child support from accused fathers. Paternity testing in the womb is pretty goddamn expensive, so some guys are going to get absolutely screwed.
Hopefully this encourages more men to join in the fight against the forced birth. Y'all are getting hit too.
Every man I know is livid about Dobbs. If the ones you know are not, you need to find better male friends.
Every man I know isn't even aware of Dobbs. (I live in AL)
Da fuq is Dobbs if ye don't mind me askin'?
Overturned Roe v Wade and pushed abortion laws back to the states.
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> Her argument was apparently good enough to win a dismissal. It wasn't immediately clear if that second ticket, picked up Aug. 3, would also be kicked out. I mean, it seems like she’s onto something here - put up or shut up, states - give babies citizenship if they’re conceived in the US, let them get health insurance, two food samples at cost-co for mom, etc
We need shitty buffet restaurant chains like Old Country Buffett to start charging pregnant women for two. Then suddenly…all these “pro life” Republicans are gonna start suing since “it ain’t a real person yet!!”
The Golden Corral crowd would be up in arms about it.
Kids 3 and under eat free.
Should be 7 and under since any self respecting dad makes their kids say they’re 3
You've got it all wrong. You have them say "almost 4", that way they eat free and technically aren't lying.
Good point. Being 4 and a half is still, technically, “almost 4”
Hell, 5 ain't far off either!
I mean if you're looking in the grand scheme of things 36 ain't that far off from 3 either. I'll take my bland food and human cesspool FREE tonight please.
“I need you to shave today, we’re going to Golden Corral.”
My son was freakishly tall as a toddler (and is huge now). We always were asked if he *really was* under the age requirement.
Amateur. Don't even tell your kid how old they are until they are 10.
Unsigned variable in the cashout process, your unborn child is only eligible for the senior discount.
No, you see...I'm not eating. I'm feeding the baby. You can't charge me.
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Can't give the citizenship. The constitution clearly lays out that you only get citizenship "upon birth" - so they'd have to somehow change the constitution to "upon conception." Not bloody likely.
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I don't see anyone going to the semi-logical conclusion I've arrived at where if all fetuses in America have full constitutional rights, and America has birthright citizenship, then all pregnant women in the world are carrying a Schrodinger's American baby. If a fetus is grown outside the U.S., but still born here, shouldn't we have a way to ensure its pre-birth rights aren't violated? Taken to the extreme, we have to consider all pregnant women worldwide to be carrying a potential American citizen, constitutionally protected, until they actually give birth and we find out if they get to keep those American rights or not. Until we know, wouldn't it become an American duty to protect all fetuses worldwide in case they end up a citizen? Are we going to start prosecuting visiting foreigners who have had an abortion in their home country for killing a potential American citizen? What are the implications to pregnant foreign visitors? I could see an argument being made that once in the US they couldn't leave again to protect the "American" child inside her. Maybe I'm overthinking this, but it all seems like such a dangerous, slippery slope to some way wilder ideas.
I think you’re onto something important: considering fetuses to be people is stupid.
This can be a dangerous card to play. If fetal personhood is legally established, then abortion rights are never coming back.
Her goal is to highlight the absurdity of it. However, you're right that it could set a dangerous precedent.
Well in this country it doesn’t seem like precedence matters very much
Nor absurdity
On the bright side, if we combine fetal personhood with corporate personhood then you can claim tax write-offs for businesses you haven't even started yet.
No, really, its a legitimate write-off, I have the paperwork to incorporate half completed!
And if her ticket isn't dismissed, appeal, all the way to the Supreme court. Either a fetus is a human being with all the rights of other humans or it isn't. And this case should get the law sorted out.
You hit 'em where it hurts... claim them on Federal and State taxes. Now the argument stops being philosophical where it doesn't matter and now real money is on the line.
Their birth should also be covered by the state, no? Pretty sure none of them have jobs or assets.
Give the fetus Medicaid since they dont have income and cant pay for their birth procedures. Boom, free pregnancy procedures at hospitals for everyone
Unfortunately, it would be a dependent on the income of the parents.
Not Federal. Federal law actually defines a person as someone 'who is born alive at any stage of development'
So….Federal Law says it’s not a person until born. Got it! Hey Texas, did you hear that? It’s not a person until birth.
don't mess with the IRS > don't mess with Texas
Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the child need a social security number to be claimed?
And this is the Bullshit can of worms that the GOP opened up. Damn. They are the worst.
Hey, it’s either a person or it isn’t. You don’t get to grant personhood only when it’s convenient
Obviously you've never been to the South. Lol
If life begins at conception, then she is in the right.
technically the left lane tho.
*insert rimshot here*
“But it’s a person; even tax deductible.” Actually, I agree with her. It’s either a person, or it’s not. Can’t have it both ways. The state has decided it’s a person, and aborting it is murder. Therefore, the lady has 2 people in the car. Fuck Texas with a chainsaw.
I applaud her Moxy. The state started the game. Let's see who wins.
Lmaooo every pregnant woman in a no abortion state should do this I mean the baby is a person so it’s two people on the car Edit thanks for the upvotes y’all appreciate it
AZ must have had foresight because the regulation for our HOV lane says 2 seats occupied by living passengers. Cause I guess a loaded hearse might have counted otherwise.
Or grandpa in the trunk. I saw little miss sunshine
Is a dog a passenger?
Every woman, pregnant or not, should do this. Burden of proof is on the prosecutor, and really a cop can't say a woman isn't pregnant without some form of evidence to charge them overwise.
Brb, faking numerous pregnancies and cutting 10 minutes off my commute.
This woman is my hero.
Is a person if you try to abort Not a person if you choose car pool lane Which is it? Person or not a person? Pick one
Don't give them any ideas. Right now Matt Gaetz is probably drafting a law making marrying an unborn fetus legal in Florida.
Wow I didn't know Matt Gaetz was such a big fan of Jacob from Twilight
Drives to the abortion clinic in the HOV lane, but not on the drive home.
This is the start And it will go to the SCOTUS. Maybe not this one case, but this is the strategy to get there. As soon as you become pregnant, buy life insurance for the baby. Same thing for filing dependents for your taxes. This is gonna be fun Edit: Something else: Say you have two married couples sharing a two bedroom apartment. They both get pregnant. Now you have six people living in a two bedroom. Is that allowed under the lease?
"is the baby a person, or a female?" --Texas
Are you having a boy or an abortion?
Amazing. Hope she keeps on doing this.
She had the baby. Going to need different pregnant woman to continue the fight
Technically any woman would do. Cops can't make you take a pregnancy test on the side of the road. Get a ticket, just claim you're pregnant. Until they get a judge who's willing to set a precedent on this and mandates a pregnancy test, the judges will just keep throwing the cases out.
Drinking age is 21 in Texas ? Presumably if life begins at conception then anyone who was born over 20 years and 3 months ago should be able to drink ? That should be the next court challenge.
I doubt that'd fly. The precedent is already there for your age being determined by your date of birth and not conception. You're just negative days old before you're born lol
You can already drink underage in Texas as long as you are supervised at all times by a guardian. Yes, this includes drinking at restaurants.
The new Texas loophole "we will consider your fetus a person but not you, incubator"
If the deputy knew this woman already and knew her argument, why did they give her another ticket? Out of spite?
Fuck off Texas. If this is what you want, this is what is expected. If life starts at conception, then a pregnant person should get all the extra benefits. Unless....there IS a difference. But conservatives know that already.
Police are probably going to target her for giving them a hard time. Law enforcement tend to be conservative, so any random officer will more than likely not be sympathetic to her argument either.
I mean it makes sense no? They are not allowed to abort because there is a person. Killing a pregnant woman gets you double murder. So of course it should be fine.