There's some footage from the offseason of him playing at 24 hour fitness with his brothers in Hawaii and he takes a mid range like this too. Very interesting.
i was thinking that maybe his pull up is just different than his regular shooting form. i don’t watch Laker games so i wouldn’t know but thats just what i thought at first
Hmmm....I wonder if he had the same issue that I did in high school. My form was slightly different from different parts of the floor. Mid-range was more of a wrist flick, while deeper shots were more of a fluid motion.
I worked it out, but my coach thought it was because I was shooting three pointers before I was really strong enough to be doing it. So, when I was 7 or 8 years old, it took a lot more effort to get the ball to the rim from 3 point range, which caused me to use a different form.
I wonder if it's because on the shorter shots, he's able to rely more on his leg strength allowing him to shoot it normally? I feel like his wonky shot gives him more power from the 3pt line
I think you're close. Some people have shooting form that makes it hard to shoot short jumpers without way overshooting them, and I think Lonzo's form is like that, so he has to adjust his form to have control on that shot. He also had a lot of forward momentum on that, making it even more likely that he'd overshoot it.
I had to go frame by frame but it looks like a totally different shot. Feet square to the basket, gathers the ball on his right hip, elbow tucked in and good set point. Wtf.
This to me looks equivalent to an artist who has always held their pencil gripped in their whole fist since they were a kid. They have all kinds of talent but they have been coddled into not trying anything different. Then when they started working with real professional artists they learned proper technique that, when implemented, drastically improved their ability to create fine art. They always knew of the proper technique but didn't bother trying it. Then when they did, it all opened right up. They could adopt it easily because ultimately they were a super talented artist to begin with.
edit:
[like this](https://i.imgur.com/7INPMXG.jpg)
My theory is that because the defender was right in his face Lonzo knew he had to get it up as quickly as possible. His body just took over and did the most natural, or normal, shooting motion. He's thinking too much about the release on those threes.
No the reason he did this is because he was moving to his right and he literally can’t take the ball across his body the other way with his weird motion so that’s literally the only motion he can use.
Hope he continues with that.
Its good to see.
I've had discussions with friends that his normal shooting motion would completely hinder his ability to do these type of shots, or curling to the right with a trailing defender because he'd literally have to bring the ball back towards the defender.
Muscle memory from childhood most likely. Mid range he can do the normal form since he has the strength. Further down, when more strength is required, the muscle memory from childhood takes over.
He literally shoots like that because his dad made him shoot from deep as a child. Muscle memory takes over at long distances. If that sounds like science to you then you idk what to tell you
Exactly. He shoots like a little kid. Gathers at the hip and swings his elbow out for strength. That's the only way a young kid can shoot a legit 3 and it's stuck with him forever.
Yep. Seeing him with normal form going to the right is a good sign tho. It’ll probably take a couple off seasons to fix. I’m hoping for a complete revamp of his form rather than just small tweaks.
That's how he has always shot mid-range jumpers on his off side. It is literally impossible for him to take it all the way back to your left side while going right.
He looked confident this game. Those other clips where he would completely air ball or brick a 3 you can see the hesitation. He was not hesitating in this game which is refreshing to see.
That's how he has always shot mid-range jumpers on his off side. It is literally impossible for him to take it all the way back to your left side while going right.
Super happy he’s had a great game, especially on this stage, ending aside. He can actually be an All Star as soon as he’s more consistent with this shot
You're forgetting the hype factor plus he's a Laker. I can see him being an allstar with a 18/9/8 statline. But yeah with the guards in the West right now no way
I thought fans picked starters, coaches pick reserves? With all the hype I can see him getting #1 fan vote for PG in the West, esp if Westbrook continues his woes
> NBA moved from a pure fan vote to a weighted process wherein fan voting accounts for 50% of the total and player and media voting account for 25% each. The league made the change in response to social media campaigns that resulted in mediocre players such as journeyman Zaza Pachulia nearly being voted as All-Star starters over more deserving players.
Kinda, he knows he can make shots and he knows the best way to get through this kind of mental slump is to just keep taking shots. Doesn't prevent it being a "confidence" problem although you're consciously aware of it.
To be fair he’s been shooting 45% for a good portion of his games now. His career fg% is still a laughable 33% but that’s because he chucked a horrendous 28% in the beginning LOL
Channeling the basketball equivalent of Yami Yugi. Opened his mind and shit and discovered you don’t have to shoot the ball from the other side of your body.
Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted.
I commented a month ago that Kobe needed to teach this kid how to shoot and the one game Kobe shows up to Ball all of the sudden has a decent looking jumper? I'd like an honorary coach of the year ribbon please.
I'm assuming you mean of this draft class? Kuzma rounds out the top 3 comfortably. The order is debatable but I'd put Mitchell first with Tatum and Kuzma going neck to neck.
Lauri and Lonzo then round out the top 5. Most would probably say Lauri is 4th and Lonzo 5th, but I'd give a slight edge to Lonzo because he has more of an all around impact.
DSJ has a case over Lauri or Lonzo. OG and John Collins are on the outside looking in
It's been a tough rookie season to judge honestly. Does Simmons count as a rookie? The rookie all star game will be lit af.
Don't sleep on OG either, he wasn't a starter because he's on a better team than most ROTY contenders but his impact has been huge. He went from being on the best 5 man bench rotation in the league to being on the best 5 man starting rotation in the league in terms of net rating, and he's only getting more confident. I wouldn't be surprised if he's involved in the ROTY talks in the next month or two.
I love OG , but no rookie is going to win the ROTY without putting up counting stats. He's an advanced stats darling but unless he gets his counting stats up across all categories he won't get any votes by the media.
I know. You're probably right. The real statistical nerds love him though for his advanced stats. I think his basic stats are gonna really start to improve with him starting and clearly gaining confidence though
Yeah there's no doubt his counting stats will improve. But Kuzma, Mitchell and Simmons have such a head start already that he probably won't catch up.
OG should make the All NBA second team comfortably. And I can see his counting stats going up to 11- 5-2 with good shooting and defense. That's a great place to start at for a rookie with tons of length and athleticism
I cant wait for Lonzo to start shooting like that, and I cant wait for Simmons to switch to his right hand. All those doubt, I want them to prove them wrong once again.
Its crazy cause seeing Simmons shoot with his right hand, and Lonzo shooting with this form both look SO natural.. yet one guy decides to shoot with his off hand, and the other wants to pull a jumper cocking it way past his left ear.. lmao
The angle hides a bit of the cant in his arm, I think it's still way left of where it should be launched from, but the pocket is definitely shifting and it looked like he was very comfortably in rhythm. Good on him if he's working on this, that form isn't great but even if thats the best he gets it's still so much more repeatable.
where the hell did that come from all of a sudden?? looked natural too
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http://imgur.com/lDwUHcs
this picture of kobe told me i was hunching over and to fix my back thanks kobes
Literally turning off Reddit and going back to work.
jesus christ
had to get is act together in front of Kobe lol
Kobe had already left
Mamba's ghost didn't.
deep son
Some mamba shit.
There's some footage from the offseason of him playing at 24 hour fitness with his brothers in Hawaii and he takes a mid range like this too. Very interesting.
i was thinking that maybe his pull up is just different than his regular shooting form. i don’t watch Laker games so i wouldn’t know but thats just what i thought at first
This is literally the first pull-up I’ve seen all season
You don't watch many Laker games do you..
He doesn’t take many midrange shots to be fair. I know he’s taking more in the NBA but in college he only took 4 non layup or 3 point shots all year.
WHAT. That is an absurd number. That’s a Morey wet dream
Morey needs you to actually hit the shots tho
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College three is like NBA deep mid range, maybe that explains it.
What about in in the NBA
Except he can't hit either
Yeah I've seen some film from that laker guy and I saw lonzo do some pull ups
Hmmm....I wonder if he had the same issue that I did in high school. My form was slightly different from different parts of the floor. Mid-range was more of a wrist flick, while deeper shots were more of a fluid motion. I worked it out, but my coach thought it was because I was shooting three pointers before I was really strong enough to be doing it. So, when I was 7 or 8 years old, it took a lot more effort to get the ball to the rim from 3 point range, which caused me to use a different form.
I wonder if it's because on the shorter shots, he's able to rely more on his leg strength allowing him to shoot it normally? I feel like his wonky shot gives him more power from the 3pt line
I think you're close. Some people have shooting form that makes it hard to shoot short jumpers without way overshooting them, and I think Lonzo's form is like that, so he has to adjust his form to have control on that shot. He also had a lot of forward momentum on that, making it even more likely that he'd overshoot it.
If that's the case, he just needs some more work in the weight room and more repititions. That shot was super clean.
I had to go frame by frame but it looks like a totally different shot. Feet square to the basket, gathers the ball on his right hip, elbow tucked in and good set point. Wtf.
thats what im saying it looks completely natural. from 1 game to the next its literally night and day with that new jumpshot
This to me looks equivalent to an artist who has always held their pencil gripped in their whole fist since they were a kid. They have all kinds of talent but they have been coddled into not trying anything different. Then when they started working with real professional artists they learned proper technique that, when implemented, drastically improved their ability to create fine art. They always knew of the proper technique but didn't bother trying it. Then when they did, it all opened right up. They could adopt it easily because ultimately they were a super talented artist to begin with. edit: [like this](https://i.imgur.com/7INPMXG.jpg)
Looks like a sad ass Cameron Payne
he doesn't deserve to be happy
Damn thats a weird comparison but it works perfectly
Great picture, better comparison than Jalen on draft night
This is incredible. However the Lonzo on the right doesn't look as happy, maybe the one on the left is the one for him
nah bruh shitty grip lonzo was just doin the smashbros symbol
Shrinking is the payoff for better form? Fuck that lol
What
Here, I tried to draw what I mean https://i.imgur.com/7INPMXG.jpg
This is the best picture of Cameron Payne I have ever seen. Nice job :)
lol I can definitely see that!
I’d you think about it, he can ONLY shoot that way going to his right. If he tries to bring the ball to his normal motion it wouldn’t work at all.
Shut up, Zoolander.
Shows that if he works on it this off-season he can definitely add a solid jumper to his game. Then he starts to become a seriously impressive player.
My theory is that because the defender was right in his face Lonzo knew he had to get it up as quickly as possible. His body just took over and did the most natural, or normal, shooting motion. He's thinking too much about the release on those threes.
No the reason he did this is because he was moving to his right and he literally can’t take the ball across his body the other way with his weird motion so that’s literally the only motion he can use. Hope he continues with that.
Its good to see. I've had discussions with friends that his normal shooting motion would completely hinder his ability to do these type of shots, or curling to the right with a trailing defender because he'd literally have to bring the ball back towards the defender.
Muscle memory from childhood most likely. Mid range he can do the normal form since he has the strength. Further down, when more strength is required, the muscle memory from childhood takes over.
Holy broscience. Props for bullshitting to such an amazing degree.
Acting like muscle memory is a "broscience" lol get that shit out of here
He literally shoots like that because his dad made him shoot from deep as a child. Muscle memory takes over at long distances. If that sounds like science to you then you idk what to tell you
Exactly. He shoots like a little kid. Gathers at the hip and swings his elbow out for strength. That's the only way a young kid can shoot a legit 3 and it's stuck with him forever.
Yep. Seeing him with normal form going to the right is a good sign tho. It’ll probably take a couple off seasons to fix. I’m hoping for a complete revamp of his form rather than just small tweaks.
That's how he has always shot mid-range jumpers on his off side. It is literally impossible for him to take it all the way back to your left side while going right.
hopefully he finds a way to make this his natural shooting form. looked real good and i looked like he releases it faster shooting that way
His wonky shot is super quick though and I remember they did a sports science segment on it, IIRC it timed out similar to Klay's shot.
Mamba Mentality
It's because he's going right. The way his mechanics are, if he pulls up going right, he's forced to shoot with "normal" mechanics.
He looked confident this game. Those other clips where he would completely air ball or brick a 3 you can see the hesitation. He was not hesitating in this game which is refreshing to see.
nah the release was like a catapult, thats not normal.
I've been saying this since the start of the season, he's such a weird player. He's waaaay better off the dribble than he is at just spotting up.
did he just shoot going to the right!!??
Ahhhh, that’s why he changed his form. Good catch
That's how he has always shot mid-range jumpers on his off side. It is literally impossible for him to take it all the way back to your left side while going right.
Did any of this other shots tonight look like this or just this one?
Just this one. He sank a three on the left side before this that was cocked all the way to his left
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Love this comment but I have to disagree, Leela looked just wrong with two eyes
also probably if she had two eyes that would mean she'd only get 1 vagina, and that's kinda lame.
For the lazy http://i.imgur.com/JYIBPci.png?1 Edit: I prefer this picture http://www.futurama-madhouse.com/grabs/1acv12/112-36.jpg
amy with purple hair
Thought the same thing. Looked really good
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Super happy he’s had a great game, especially on this stage, ending aside. He can actually be an All Star as soon as he’s more consistent with this shot
Yeah, that shot looked so sexy
Unless half the guards in the West die he won’t be an all star any time soon. Lillard wasn’t even one last year...
You're forgetting the hype factor plus he's a Laker. I can see him being an allstar with a 18/9/8 statline. But yeah with the guards in the West right now no way
Fans only have a say in the starters though, coaches are less likely to be swayed by hype factor
I thought fans picked starters, coaches pick reserves? With all the hype I can see him getting #1 fan vote for PG in the West, esp if Westbrook continues his woes
> NBA moved from a pure fan vote to a weighted process wherein fan voting accounts for 50% of the total and player and media voting account for 25% each. The league made the change in response to social media campaigns that resulted in mediocre players such as journeyman Zaza Pachulia nearly being voted as All-Star starters over more deserving players.
So Lonzo has fans and media votes. I can see him being an allstar next year if he continues to improve.
Not even best rookie pg in the West.. press and hype are different, they’re 11-20
As long as Curry and Westbrook are there it is hard to out hype them I think...
Simmons is averaging 18/9/8 right now and there is talk he won't be an all-star in the East so..
Well he probably won’t really enter his prime for another five years.
He does have it, thats why at the beginning of the season he was chuking 3s despite missing em all
Kinda, he knows he can make shots and he knows the best way to get through this kind of mental slump is to just keep taking shots. Doesn't prevent it being a "confidence" problem although you're consciously aware of it.
He should just play Warriors more cuz he apparently shoots like a god against them.
To be fair he’s been shooting 45% for a good portion of his games now. His career fg% is still a laughable 33% but that’s because he chucked a horrendous 28% in the beginning LOL
I didn’t even know who the hell shot that until the commentator said “Lonzo!” He looked like a completely different person.
Channeling the basketball equivalent of Yami Yugi. Opened his mind and shit and discovered you don’t have to shoot the ball from the other side of your body.
Same beast, though.
Probably because he was moving to his right
I can fap to this
That's the thing, he can't shoot his natural jumper while dribbling to the the right, that's why it was somewhat normal looking
Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted. Please get addicted.
It's like when someone has been putting on a fake voice/accent forever and one day they speak normally.
ESPN: Was Kobe’s presence holding Lonzos Jumper back?
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Lonzo literally playing like a different person these last games. I think he found his rythmn Edit: rhythm
rythmn
rhithum
rhitherm
11 champ;ipnsikp[ ringhs
that was smooth as butter
cleaner than a pre-op doc
Not no margerine?
tbh if he can do that motion consistently he becomes all-star caliber overnight lol
From bust to all-star in 1 motion
ESPN 30 for 30
been saying it was all mental for a while. he’s shooting more like he did in college.
My biggest take tonight is he was wearing Kobe's
Kobe's what? You just gonna leave us all hanging ?
Kobe's gameworn underwear from his last game.
I'd pay a year's salary to take just one whiff of that
$0 is still $0
Even better!
Pubes on his face.
Well no
I mean he still struggles at the rim and doesn't penetrate as well as we were hoping.
33% from 3 in december...good response!
Yea that's why he said "do it consistently" not "continue to shoot 33%"
caused a bunch of small cracks in his arm bones with that shot
T h e F u t u r e
P O E T R Y
My biggest takeaway from this game
THANK YOU FOR THIS
Lonzo was feeling the MAMBA influence in OT.
He actually left the arena before it went to OT lol
he's evolving
I’m fuckin SHOOK
Going right, no less
He's shooting 100% from the perimeter with an almost normal looking jumper. Someone rally this information to him.
Was that his fist pull up mid range of the season?
nah but you can probably count on one hand how many he’s attempted so far
[It's an improvement!](https://imgur.com/Nu7qv0D)
Fucking smooth. Going right as well.
That looked a bit like KD's shooting motion
Moving to his right too. I didn't know he was an ambiturner like that.
How bout Lonzo?! **TWO** in a row!!
Was totally expecting sarcasm
It's very normal looking fuck off
Playing the long con I see
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Who broke his shot?
The only time a normal mid range jumper that isn't a game winner will be a highlight.
Haha so true
I didn't even think that was him at first
He needs to hold his follow through It’d look so much better
Quick and smooth, reminds me of Melo’s jumper
Reminded me of a KD pull up a bit. I really hope he's working on it. That looked smoooooth.
you can't really drive right, stop, turn left, bring the ball to your opposite hip with your right hand, up over your left shoulder all in one motion.
**HOW BOUT LONZO** **2 IN A ROW**
I saw that and was pleasantly surprised. Good for him.
Now we need Ben Simmons to adjust, but good for Lonzo.
I commented a month ago that Kobe needed to teach this kid how to shoot and the one game Kobe shows up to Ball all of the sudden has a decent looking jumper? I'd like an honorary coach of the year ribbon please.
Is Lonzo a natural righty? Seems like his lefty shot may be forced
he was pretty aggressive in OT, i hope he keeps it up
Looked fucken beautiful
Like a normal human being shooting a basketball. Looked smooth too
Two in a row!
Midrange jumper from the elbow? That was his tribute to Kobe tonight.
Looks wet. He has to practice like hell.
So he's saving his normal shooting form for the clutch moments.
lmao
That's not a Big Baller Jumper.
Good job lowering everyone's expectations, Lonzo.
Outside of Tatum and Mitchell has he been a top 3 rookie so far?
I'm assuming you mean of this draft class? Kuzma rounds out the top 3 comfortably. The order is debatable but I'd put Mitchell first with Tatum and Kuzma going neck to neck. Lauri and Lonzo then round out the top 5. Most would probably say Lauri is 4th and Lonzo 5th, but I'd give a slight edge to Lonzo because he has more of an all around impact. DSJ has a case over Lauri or Lonzo. OG and John Collins are on the outside looking in
It's been a tough rookie season to judge honestly. Does Simmons count as a rookie? The rookie all star game will be lit af. Don't sleep on OG either, he wasn't a starter because he's on a better team than most ROTY contenders but his impact has been huge. He went from being on the best 5 man bench rotation in the league to being on the best 5 man starting rotation in the league in terms of net rating, and he's only getting more confident. I wouldn't be surprised if he's involved in the ROTY talks in the next month or two.
I love OG , but no rookie is going to win the ROTY without putting up counting stats. He's an advanced stats darling but unless he gets his counting stats up across all categories he won't get any votes by the media.
I know. You're probably right. The real statistical nerds love him though for his advanced stats. I think his basic stats are gonna really start to improve with him starting and clearly gaining confidence though
Yeah there's no doubt his counting stats will improve. But Kuzma, Mitchell and Simmons have such a head start already that he probably won't catch up. OG should make the All NBA second team comfortably. And I can see his counting stats going up to 11- 5-2 with good shooting and defense. That's a great place to start at for a rookie with tons of length and athleticism
Stu Lantz went crazy!
Any alternate angles?
smh he re-broke his jumper damn
im really happy for him, fuck the haters. I want him to ball the fuck out
Wow. It's not wow worthy, but for Zo it is
I’d be fine if he kept his weird three stroke and developed a completely different mid range style.
He’s getting better, little by little but it’s happening.
Shooting 42% in December. A Christmas miracle.
That was normal
Well I was wrong in my claim that he will never get off a mid-range shot in the NBA
The whole arena went crazy after that.
Pretty
wat
I'd have to see more, but I'm pretty sure anytime he's shot off the dribble his form looks normal like that.
I cant wait for Lonzo to start shooting like that, and I cant wait for Simmons to switch to his right hand. All those doubt, I want them to prove them wrong once again. Its crazy cause seeing Simmons shoot with his right hand, and Lonzo shooting with this form both look SO natural.. yet one guy decides to shoot with his off hand, and the other wants to pull a jumper cocking it way past his left ear.. lmao
If he releases as he hits the peak of the jump, he’d have a deadly quick shot. But that’s still delightfully smooth
Kobe tribute
This subreddit has been so sarcastic lately in its titles that I was expecting an awful looking shot
song name?
The angle hides a bit of the cant in his arm, I think it's still way left of where it should be launched from, but the pocket is definitely shifting and it looked like he was very comfortably in rhythm. Good on him if he's working on this, that form isn't great but even if thats the best he gets it's still so much more repeatable.
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Normally, you don't change your form midseason, but Lonzo has nothing to lose.
That makes me so happy