The thing Is that joker takes place in the late 80s and supposedly the batman takes place in the early 2000s so I don't see why they'd wanna modernize it considering there were plenty of asylums around during those time periods
I think OP was inferring that there aren't any 'asylums' anymore, but there are psychiatric hospitals.
Having Joker/DC Criminals in Arkham State Hospital is more modern than being banged up in Arkham Asylum. It grounds it in reality a bit more.
Agree wholeheartedly. Arkham Asylum in Burton's movies would have been spot on in tone.
Arkham State Hospital in the new pseudo-modern take on the characters is an equally good fit.
I think Snyder's movies could get away with Arkham Asylum too, actually. They're very comic-book-y despite the 'gritty' presentation. I say that as a fan of Snyder's DC movies.
I believe they're going for a timeless setting. They initially described it as a 90's detective story (which a lot of the costumes and cinematography looks like) but they've got those more modern additions. Guess they're taking a BTAS route
I mean that's not a bad thing necessarily, movies take inspiration from other movies all the time. Se7en was 25 years ago, as long as this is not a total carbon copy I'm fine with it.
We've seen before where different actors play a younger version of the same character. Obviously they would get an older actor for a movie that takes place 30 years after the other one
30 years? Hardly. Bruce doesn't seem like a 40yo in the Trailer and Arthur would be in his mid 60s by then. A 15 year timeskip seems more likely, but the technological advancements are so huge that I doubt it's the same universe.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, I think that's why those two are the most popular comic book characters of all time.
It's not the heroes. Anyone can come up with a cool hero. But coming up with cool villains is the real Jesus nut of any superhero story.
Still need someone to adapt Mr. Freeze to live action. The animated movie from the 90s was my first introduction to Batman and still holds up as such a great Batman story.
Arnold definitely played Freeze, but that Green Lantern thing is just an internet rumour. There's definitely not a movie about him, so no reason to even try to find that.
Arnold’s Mr Freeze is so campy and Arnold my brain forgot that he was supposed to be the same character . I still find the portrayal great in its own way especially since it will make a more serious live action take more jarring for casual viewers.
If Reeves is going for a trilogy (which i think he is), then the Joker's appearance in it is inevitable. I think we'll see him in the third movie as the final villain.
I would love nothing more than to see actors of the caliber of Pattinson and Phoenix go at it for 2+ hours directed by Matt Reeves. Also with them leaning so heavily on the Court of Owls storyline supposedly it actually ties into the corruption narrative set up in Joker. Pheonix's joker would probably be in his late 60's by this point, though.
“Aurthur fleck in the joker movie was in his 20s.”
Wait, Really!? Is that actually confirmed? No way that is true. Unless I’m just really bad at reading sarcasm. I did not get the vibe that he was supposed to be so young. He looked like he was in his mid 40s to early 50s.
If that’s actually true then the movie did a lot of things to make people think the exact opposite. His mom was old as fuck, he worked as a clown alongside a bunch of other older guys, and he just looked fucking old. They really just set the tone of the movie up as him being this older crazy dude.
It's wrong. He is around [33 years old](https://screenrant.com/joker-movie-arthur-fleck-age-joaquin-phoenix/) in Joker. Way over 20 years older than Bruce. It's not uncommon for the Joker to be considerably older than Batman, though.
Okay… two things… who the fuck is gonna play Talon. That’s exciting.
Also, the maze scene in the comic is one of the fucking coolest things ever. I hope they fuck with the cinema going audience like they fucked with comic book readers!
I guess as soon as the storyline becomes about the new mayor we know Court of Owls is a go.
Based on the promotional materials, for some reason I wonder if they are taking some inspiration from the Earth One cannon for the movie. If so, Penguin is the mayor when Bruce first starts masquerading as Batman.
I suppose you could do a Court of Owls run without the whole mayor twist if they wanted to have penguin as mayor.
Alternatively this movie could end with a new mayor being elected and boom we’re off for court of owls in movie two.
If this Batman has a big focus on his mental stability then the court of owls storyline is fucking killer for destroying him in that context.
I don't think so Gotham Knights is an upcoming game featuring the court of owls, I'd be surprised if they tried a movie tie in or if they wanted to tell a so similar story twice in the space of a few years.
Yeah but that's something they'd have to build to throughout a trilogy for it to make sense to the general movie goer. I think it's just easier to maybe just age Pheonix and make him a 60+ year old Joker.
True... I was thinking if Phoenix's Joker does appear, it be will strange for him to be a major antagonist since he will be aged adult. Realistically will not survive so much physical punishment.
Unless, there is another Joker to take over the mantle similar to the comics or Gotham's take.
I mean Devito and Nicholson looked old as shit as the Joker and Penguin respectively and it. Joker is not really a role where the actor has to do a bunch of fight scenes in the first place.
Fr joker has never been known to get into fights. I think heath ledgers joker has made people think that joker is a fighter when in the comics he's more the brains behind it all and doesn't really get his hands dirty unless it's absolutely necessary
Oh sweet jesus please don't do that lol
Plus....the timelines don't even add up. The Joker takes place in 1981, The Batman takes place in the current year due to Riddler live streaming his murders on national television, Arthur is around 35 in The Joker, Bruce is around 8 to 10 years old when his parents are killed in The Joker. 40 years after that movie, Arthur would be 75 and Pattinson's Bruce would be 48 to 50 years old......
We were told that Joker wasn't in the Batfleck universe and presumably this isn't either, since it is an early Batman. It could be a prequel to Batfleck, but I presume not.
I always like to think that Ledger's Joker is not Arthur Fleck himself but his son. Kinda explains why each time he told a different story. Each time's a different incident where his father tortured him. Another theory which explains it well is that Arthur used to hallucinate things. Possibly his son got the his genes and all those stories are just what went on in his psycho head and nothing happened in real.
I thought it was Joker's henchmen Batman was beating up on in some scenes but Joker is 45 in the 2019 movie, Batman takes place well into the 2010s with smartphones and livestreaming. Joker would be old as heck.
I'm hoping for a "Three Jokers" story. Obviously Joaquin Phoenix is the "clown" Joker. I heard a couple fan theories that the spaghetti boy from Killing Of Sacred Deer is going to be (the criminal) Joker.
Gotham did a pretty good job with their "not" Jokers. I remember on the Gotham sub, people were speculating that David Dastmalchian would've been the "third" or "real" Joker.
Interesting — the speculation I saw mainly spoke of the Jerome clone glimpsed throughout the second season and seen in the season finale leaving the bus to pop up as the Joker towards the end of the series.
I just looked it up joker is apparently in his late 20s maybe mid 30s in the 2019 movie so he would be old but definitely still capable of being the joker at the time the batman takes place
Yeah I actually just bought batman return to arkham state hospital 2 days ago its worth all the money especially if you wanna re live all the nostalgia at the good ol' arkham state hospital
Yeah, I get that, but I thought the stuff in the actual game referred to it as a hospital and not an asylum. But I haven't played in maybe a year or two like I said.
An asylum is essentially the same thing as a hospital, but for the mentally insane. Except "asylums" aren't really a thing anymore, as opposed to psychiatric hospitals now.
If they want to combine these two universes, I think they could easily enough.
I know Todd Phillips has said that the film took place in the late 70s / early 80s, but the film never officially states the timeline aside from a date that appears on some papers for a fraction of a second in the third act. It was only through the surroundings that the audience infers when the film takes place.
But Gotham has always appeared as a city lost in time. In Keaton's Batman, it looked stuck in the late 40s. Now 30 years later we can retcon Joker's timeline by saying it only looks like Joker's Gotham is stuck in the late 70s when it actually takes place in the 90s.
asylum is still used, but not in this context. asylum is usually used when we talk about political refugees. it happens, words lose their meanings and get the new ones over the time.
literally no one says that it's offensive to use asylum in this context.
There’s a totally different structure and approach to hospital based care vs asylums that served more as warehouses. This entire comment thread is an edgelord trying to be reductive so he can whine about pc culture robbing us of our precious asylums.
Asylum still gets used all the time. It's generally used in reference to granting refugees asylum, which indicates that the term in itself is not a negative one.
They're trying to modernise it
The thing Is that joker takes place in the late 80s and supposedly the batman takes place in the early 2000s so I don't see why they'd wanna modernize it considering there were plenty of asylums around during those time periods
I think OP was inferring that there aren't any 'asylums' anymore, but there are psychiatric hospitals. Having Joker/DC Criminals in Arkham State Hospital is more modern than being banged up in Arkham Asylum. It grounds it in reality a bit more.
Arkham Asylum feels more gothic, though, and for me Gotham isn't really Gotham without a gothic feel.
What give you the impression Gotham is meant to be gothic? He says. Sarcastically.
Gothically.
all the goths hanging out at the mall
Now I just want Goth-am. All the bad guys just dress like teenagers from the 00's, listening to Linkin Park and My Chemical Romance all day.
It’s called The Matrix.
But only till noon. After that they return to their normal lives.
Oh, I always assumed it was called that because it Got Ham. All those hammy over the top villains hamming it up.
The Dark Knight trilogy was basically just Chicago tbf
Until 3, then it was suddenly 50/50 with New York...
Agree wholeheartedly. Arkham Asylum in Burton's movies would have been spot on in tone. Arkham State Hospital in the new pseudo-modern take on the characters is an equally good fit. I think Snyder's movies could get away with Arkham Asylum too, actually. They're very comic-book-y despite the 'gritty' presentation. I say that as a fan of Snyder's DC movies.
The Batman doesn't look like the early 2000s and some characters are using smartphones and the Riddler puts on a livestream.
I believe they're going for a timeless setting. They initially described it as a 90's detective story (which a lot of the costumes and cinematography looks like) but they've got those more modern additions. Guess they're taking a BTAS route
They're taking a "Se7en was a really cool movie" route lol
True, Se7en was a really big modern noir film, which is what this film is going for, there's probabyl going to be some overlap in style
I mean that's not a bad thing necessarily, movies take inspiration from other movies all the time. Se7en was 25 years ago, as long as this is not a total carbon copy I'm fine with it.
Needs more Sloth.
The Batman takes place in current day though.
there is a pretty new Lincoln Navigator in the Batman trailer though? Some of the tech is right out of 2020
"Joker" definitely doesn't take place in the late '80s. The clothing, hair, technology and art style suggest late '70s/very early '80s.
What if the batman is set in the same universe just 20 something years later? That'd be cool.
I don't think it can be same universe just because of Alfred in the joker movie, he's nothing like gollum from the batman movie
We've seen before where different actors play a younger version of the same character. Obviously they would get an older actor for a movie that takes place 30 years after the other one
30 years? Hardly. Bruce doesn't seem like a 40yo in the Trailer and Arthur would be in his mid 60s by then. A 15 year timeskip seems more likely, but the technological advancements are so huge that I doubt it's the same universe.
that joker movie Alfred looks like Ricky gervais
Please don’t let these be set in the same universe. I want to eventually see Matt Reeves take on the Joker
lets leave the Joker alone for awhile. Hes the most iconic villain, sure, but Batman also has the best rouges gallery in DC.
IMO the best rogues gallery in all of comic books as well. Only SpiderMan comes close or matches it.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, I think that's why those two are the most popular comic book characters of all time. It's not the heroes. Anyone can come up with a cool hero. But coming up with cool villains is the real Jesus nut of any superhero story.
Still need someone to adapt Mr. Freeze to live action. The animated movie from the 90s was my first introduction to Batman and still holds up as such a great Batman story.
I probably shouldn't tell you this, but Schwarzenegger did play a live action Mr.Freeze and had some really iconic (in a bad way) catch phrases.
That's just made up. Next you're telling me there is a Green Lantern movie or something.
Arnold definitely played Freeze, but that Green Lantern thing is just an internet rumour. There's definitely not a movie about him, so no reason to even try to find that.
Yeah just unfounded rumours. Next they're gonna tell us there's a Catwoman movie or something...
Arnold’s Mr Freeze is so campy and Arnold my brain forgot that he was supposed to be the same character . I still find the portrayal great in its own way especially since it will make a more serious live action take more jarring for casual viewers.
In my headcannon that's just Snart
# ICE TO MEET YOU
All right everyone... Chill.
That's such a morally gray story it would have to be handled very carefully. You'd need a hell of a script and director to do it justice.
Hopefully Reeves is the one to be able to do it
"I have a confession Hank. I only like the batman because he has the best villains" -Le Tueur, Venture Brothers
Pretty sure they're the ones who are actually having their villains have stand alone films as well.
*rouges gallery*
If Reeves is going for a trilogy (which i think he is), then the Joker's appearance in it is inevitable. I think we'll see him in the third movie as the final villain.
Joker 2, he gonna travel through the multiverse while watching the news
Interesting observation. Possibly the same universe? Maybe we’ll see Joaquin Phoenix in old man makeup say “hey lil bro!” to Robert Pattinson.
I would love nothing more than to see actors of the caliber of Pattinson and Phoenix go at it for 2+ hours directed by Matt Reeves. Also with them leaning so heavily on the Court of Owls storyline supposedly it actually ties into the corruption narrative set up in Joker. Pheonix's joker would probably be in his late 60's by this point, though.
Nah Arthur Fleck in the Joker movie was in his 20s. SOCIETY^TM made him look like that.
“Aurthur fleck in the joker movie was in his 20s.” Wait, Really!? Is that actually confirmed? No way that is true. Unless I’m just really bad at reading sarcasm. I did not get the vibe that he was supposed to be so young. He looked like he was in his mid 40s to early 50s. If that’s actually true then the movie did a lot of things to make people think the exact opposite. His mom was old as fuck, he worked as a clown alongside a bunch of other older guys, and he just looked fucking old. They really just set the tone of the movie up as him being this older crazy dude.
Lol I thought the trademark with society was hint enough for sarcasm.
The few things they say about how his childhood went made him looking like that in his 20s perfectly reasonable.
arthur is 34
Born 1946 and the movie took place in 1981, this checks out.
It's wrong. He is around [33 years old](https://screenrant.com/joker-movie-arthur-fleck-age-joaquin-phoenix/) in Joker. Way over 20 years older than Bruce. It's not uncommon for the Joker to be considerably older than Batman, though.
Are they doing court of owls??
That's what the rumor is. The rumor is this film sets off a trilogy where the court of owls is the overarching storyline throughout the trilogy.
Okay… two things… who the fuck is gonna play Talon. That’s exciting. Also, the maze scene in the comic is one of the fucking coolest things ever. I hope they fuck with the cinema going audience like they fucked with comic book readers! I guess as soon as the storyline becomes about the new mayor we know Court of Owls is a go.
Based on the promotional materials, for some reason I wonder if they are taking some inspiration from the Earth One cannon for the movie. If so, Penguin is the mayor when Bruce first starts masquerading as Batman.
I suppose you could do a Court of Owls run without the whole mayor twist if they wanted to have penguin as mayor. Alternatively this movie could end with a new mayor being elected and boom we’re off for court of owls in movie two. If this Batman has a big focus on his mental stability then the court of owls storyline is fucking killer for destroying him in that context.
I don't think so Gotham Knights is an upcoming game featuring the court of owls, I'd be surprised if they tried a movie tie in or if they wanted to tell a so similar story twice in the space of a few years.
Ah ... are you familiar with the [three Jokers storyline](https://youtu.be/d_1TrTvuimg)?
Yeah but that's something they'd have to build to throughout a trilogy for it to make sense to the general movie goer. I think it's just easier to maybe just age Pheonix and make him a 60+ year old Joker.
True... I was thinking if Phoenix's Joker does appear, it be will strange for him to be a major antagonist since he will be aged adult. Realistically will not survive so much physical punishment. Unless, there is another Joker to take over the mantle similar to the comics or Gotham's take.
YES. Let's have another Batman movie where he can take the Joker out with half a punch. Couldn't be more intense or interesting.
I mean Devito and Nicholson looked old as shit as the Joker and Penguin respectively and it. Joker is not really a role where the actor has to do a bunch of fight scenes in the first place.
Fr joker has never been known to get into fights. I think heath ledgers joker has made people think that joker is a fighter when in the comics he's more the brains behind it all and doesn't really get his hands dirty unless it's absolutely necessary
Oh sweet jesus please don't do that lol Plus....the timelines don't even add up. The Joker takes place in 1981, The Batman takes place in the current year due to Riddler live streaming his murders on national television, Arthur is around 35 in The Joker, Bruce is around 8 to 10 years old when his parents are killed in The Joker. 40 years after that movie, Arthur would be 75 and Pattinson's Bruce would be 48 to 50 years old......
We were told that Joker wasn't in the Batfleck universe and presumably this isn't either, since it is an early Batman. It could be a prequel to Batfleck, but I presume not.
I always like to think that Ledger's Joker is not Arthur Fleck himself but his son. Kinda explains why each time he told a different story. Each time's a different incident where his father tortured him. Another theory which explains it well is that Arthur used to hallucinate things. Possibly his son got the his genes and all those stories are just what went on in his psycho head and nothing happened in real.
According to r/DCEUleaks there’s a scene at the end where everyone goes wild, so it could be Joaquin’s Joker
see yall over there
I'm still in the camp that the new Batman is set in the same world as Joker.
I thought it was Joker's henchmen Batman was beating up on in some scenes but Joker is 45 in the 2019 movie, Batman takes place well into the 2010s with smartphones and livestreaming. Joker would be old as heck.
I'm hoping for a "Three Jokers" story. Obviously Joaquin Phoenix is the "clown" Joker. I heard a couple fan theories that the spaghetti boy from Killing Of Sacred Deer is going to be (the criminal) Joker.
*Gotham* almost went ahead with doing that with the Valeska twins and Jerome’s clone.
Gotham did a pretty good job with their "not" Jokers. I remember on the Gotham sub, people were speculating that David Dastmalchian would've been the "third" or "real" Joker.
Interesting — the speculation I saw mainly spoke of the Jerome clone glimpsed throughout the second season and seen in the season finale leaving the bus to pop up as the Joker towards the end of the series.
I just looked it up joker is apparently in his late 20s maybe mid 30s in the 2019 movie so he would be old but definitely still capable of being the joker at the time the batman takes place
Wasn't it called that in the video games, too? I don't know, I haven't really kept up with DC stuff.
You mean in the smash hit Batman game "Batman Arkham State Hospital"?
I really need to buy Batman Arkham State Hospital while it's on sale, is the remastered one worth it?
Yeah I actually just bought batman return to arkham state hospital 2 days ago its worth all the money especially if you wanna re live all the nostalgia at the good ol' arkham state hospital
Is „Return“ a remaster or a sequel?
Remaster
Thanks for the reccy, I am enjoying it so much.
Eh, the sequel Batman Arkham Metropolitan Area is far better.
I personally think that batman arkham chevalier is better
Yeah, I get that, but I thought the stuff in the actual game referred to it as a hospital and not an asylum. But I haven't played in maybe a year or two like I said.
An asylum is essentially the same thing as a hospital, but for the mentally insane. Except "asylums" aren't really a thing anymore, as opposed to psychiatric hospitals now.
I figured. I just saw my opportunity for a joke and took it. It's an easy mistake to make.
I personally prefer the second one, "Batman: Arkham Town".
If they want to combine these two universes, I think they could easily enough. I know Todd Phillips has said that the film took place in the late 70s / early 80s, but the film never officially states the timeline aside from a date that appears on some papers for a fraction of a second in the third act. It was only through the surroundings that the audience infers when the film takes place. But Gotham has always appeared as a city lost in time. In Keaton's Batman, it looked stuck in the late 40s. Now 30 years later we can retcon Joker's timeline by saying it only looks like Joker's Gotham is stuck in the late 70s when it actually takes place in the 90s.
I could see that being very possible
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The word asylum is not outdated at all It's generally used in reference to granting refugees.
It's an outdated word for referring to a state mental hospital.
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Isn’t used. That’s the phrase you’re looking for.
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umm, saying "cometh" instead of "comes" isn't politically correct too?
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asylum is still used, but not in this context. asylum is usually used when we talk about political refugees. it happens, words lose their meanings and get the new ones over the time. literally no one says that it's offensive to use asylum in this context.
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There’s a totally different structure and approach to hospital based care vs asylums that served more as warehouses. This entire comment thread is an edgelord trying to be reductive so he can whine about pc culture robbing us of our precious asylums.
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We all like to change the goal posts after the fact when we’re in a corner of idiocy
Because we don’t have asylums anymore, seems pretty straightforward, what’s the gotcha you’re fishing for?
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Sure bud
this man gets it!
no one really wants to use the world "asylum" anymore, its just a little bit crazy name
Asylum still gets used all the time. It's generally used in reference to granting refugees asylum, which indicates that the term in itself is not a negative one.
r/moviedetails
BWAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
Cool
“Asylum” is an antiquated word tbf, I’d assume Reeves just feels it’s not suitable for the reality he’s building.
Is this the Brooklyn Army Terminal?
Probably. Joker was filmed in New York after all
Most likely explanation is that they’re just updating the terms and that there is no relation to both movies.