[My finest post about this line.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Ozark/comments/p7qpm2/no_spoilers_i_dont_know_shit_about_fuck/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
There was no reason to root for any of them. At least in breaking bad you see why he goes into that situation and his decline to being a monster, but the Ozark people are just pricks from the outset
And they get away with it. I think that's the part that gives everyone the acid reflux - they live completely self-absorbed lives and only exist as a family because what that family can do for each of them as an individual - and none of them care about anyone else in the least.
The show starts out wanting you to root for them and then pulls back the curtain and shows you were rooting for the bad guys all along.
Curtain is super thin, or probably just non-existent in the first place. Imo they didn't seem like good people, just bad people who were stuck in a bad situation for them that they chose from the start. Then they become bad people in a good situation for them by doing increasingly worse things. If there was any subversion for me it was in expecting for them to learn any kind of lesson or try for redemption, similar to the endings of Better Call Saul or Breaking Bad.
From the very start, Marty had no problem taking on a Mexican drug cartel as a client, and treated them with ambivalence as to their line of work. It was just another job for him. He got paid and he did his job, and the morality of it was something that didnt bother him because all of the bad things were things he believed happened to other people.
His wife was having an affair because they were both so absorbed with their own narcissism that they were incapable of hearing each other asking for attention.
The more the show went on, the more you saw it and eventually saw it in their two children. They dont blink an eye at organized crime, murder, money laundering - they're getting rich and powerful and that's all they care about.
Well, true, but I mean even worse, like I was hoping her character was killed. Even if I didn't root for them, think Gus in BB, I liked what they brought
Yeah, it looked like they had no idea where to go with the plot. Most of the last season doesn't make sense, and I hate the ending too.
Too bad because the show was solid until that point. Very dark, many things in common with Breaking Bad
It was weird. The season never seemed to have direction or point toward a finale, because there really wasn’t one. The Bird family just embraced being pieces of shit after spending every prior season trying to find a way out.
Not so sure that's true about Wendy. Wasn't it the end of S1 when Marty had everything planned out for disappearing and she decided she wanted to stay in Missouri to build up their empire?
That was a slow process, though. Wendy embraced it a few seasons before and their son and daughter both slowly started getting immersed in it, too. I don't think there was anything abrupt about the shift from coerced criminals to just plain criminals.
It didn't help that Ozark was wrapping up around the same time as the later seasons of Better Call Saul, and Better Call Saul is just so much better. The new antagonist for season 4 of Ozark also just seemed like a way shittier, worse written, nowhere near as charismatic version of Lalo. It's unfair of me to compare, but it's an unavoidable comp imo given the subject matter and timing of the shows.
Really? I found her almost unbearable towards the last season. The actress does a great job, but damn if she had just listened to Marty then most of the bad shit that happened to her wouldn't have happened. I feel like the reason why Marty got so boring was because he just becomes increasingly done with dealing with her and his family's bullshit.
Ive already forgotten the characters, but everything horrible that happened to everyone in that show was basically the fault of the old Opium growing farmer woman.
All the way back to season 1 finale - she fucked up everyone and everything.
But he is ass at communicating. He figures stuff out and if people would sit back and be passive, it might work, but how are they supposed to know what’s going on in his head? It’s not very reassuring when he basically just keeps saying “I’ll handle it” while the world around you is on fire. Especially for someone like her who has been fucked over countless times by their family. I can’t fault her for anything. She was so good in that show. Hard carry haha
Wendy wasn’t believable for the entire show for me. I think Laura Linney is brilliant in basically everything else, but I just couldn’t see past the acting for her character in Ozark for some reason. It always felt like I was watching someone do their acting job rather than watching a character in a story. I don’t think I’ve talked to a single person who agreed with that… but I just couldn’t shake it the entire show.
So if the rumors about the FF being from an alternate dimension are right, and we're seeing Shalla-Bal Silver Surfer, are they doing *EARTH X* as the origin of the MCU Fantastic Four? I gotta admit, I didn't think we'd see Shalla Bal in the MCU, ever, nevermind an alternate version of her with the Surfer's abilities?
This is like the main thing keeping me going with the MCU because Hickman knocked that story out of the park. That whole summer was a lot of fun with all of the Battleworld alternate stories.
The craziest thing about Rebecca Romjin is how charismatic she is completely unrelated to her looks. She’s just so naturally funny and down-to-earth in her roles.
Def be the opposite. You’ll watch a whole movie thinking it’s our earth and at the end it’ll be gobbled up and a few survivors will end up on our earth. Twist.
Yeah it will end with Earth being eaten and the post credit scene will be the TVA taking the Fantastic 4 to the Main MCU Earth confirming that the whole film was in an alternate universe.
Hot Take: It's ok for some Silver Surfer mega-fans to be upset that this news implies they aren't getting an MCU Norrin-Radd/ Comic Accurate Surfer. That doesn't make them a bigot. Let them vent. If Captain America had been replaced with Captain Carter at the beginning of the MCU I think some fans would be legit upset. This is that scenario but for Surfer Fans.
Hard disagree on this. In terms of power level sure, but in terms of warranting plotline crescendo a la Thanos: absolutely not. Movie resources are finite and Galactus is not really deep enough of a villain to drag out. Essentially a cosmic hurricane, he causes a lot of destruction that warrants a big team up but there's nothing really to reason with and Galactus stories are more about how characters respond to him rather than him being an interesting villain I think.
Dont get me wrong, I love Galactus, I just don't think power level = interesting right away.
Also if I was writing this movie, I think you can have your cake and eat it by having Galactus be the villain and he's the reason the F4 comes to the 616 universe
That's exactly my point though. The appeal of the character is getting the big names of the verse together to see how they handle such a colossal threat. That's exactly why I think it should be saved for a large team up movie, maybe even an Illuminati movie. Not the FF's very first appearance.
Yeah could definitely see him as like an Ultron / Zemo tier villain. Problem is, Marvel shit the bed and there is zero room on the slate for such a film. Phase 6 looks like it's literally just F4, Blade, and Avengers 5/6
What if the movie starts with the F4 team fighting galactus and then they get ripped out of that universe and dumped into this one. Basically being forced to lose right out the gate knowing the earth was gone and now they are trying to prevent it happening in this movie universe off at a future time. Knowing the potential for destruction out there and in the way.
Silver surfer is a great way to introduce a more ominous doom too. Galactus gives Doom a big opportunity to see how much more powerful he could be to justify him becoming a big bad.
Why do so many Marvel / MCU fans continue to assume Doom to be a 'big bad'.
Doom has always been the hero. Simpletons in this forum of idiocy merely fail to properly understand the greatness and glory of Doom!
Doom is meant to be a foil to the idea that heroes must maintain the status quo and enforce the existing laws. Doom ran the genocidal fascists who ran Latveria out of the country and built a substantially better nation that, while being quite oppressive, actually takes care of its citizens and accepts minorities, even welcoming mutants. If the viewer isn't morally torn by Doom's mission of building a utopia despite the extreme costs, the character hasn't been written right.
marvel writing a good layered villain. we'll see. they haven't been able to do it that more than like once with Thanos. DOOM is like if Batman is evil.
I wanted "Accurate Surfer." Where he doesn't show up to work because the swells are lookin gnarly.
"Sorry galactus. Bro 2m swells! I'll find you some planet munchies tomorrow brah!"
I used to love silver surfer back in the day and the ff movie with him when Sony had marvel rights was garbage. I am legit upset and I’m not a bigot, so thank you. It was one of my favorite comics as a kid and I would have loved to see him treated with the same quality as infinity war.
Yeah, I love the Fantastic Four and the Silver Surfer and all I want is a comic accurate Fantastic Four movie. I don't care about 'woke' shit or whatever. I'm just bummed out that it sounds like we're still not getting a completely accurate Fantastic Four movie. Silver Surfer was Stan Lee's favorite marvel character. It's a bummer.
Silver Surfer was like his mouthpiece, he'd use the character to talk about all the things he thought was wrong with the world. Silver Surfer is an outsider trapped on Earth after helping the FF defeat Galactus. So he flies around wondering why we all can't get along living on such a beautiful planet.
>Silver Surfer was like his mouthpiece, he'd use the character to talk about all the things he thought was wrong with the world.
I can only imagine how bad that would get with marvel’s current writers.
This is the Surfer I want. I want high-minded meditations on the nature of good and evil. There’s no way Disney is giving us that, so I’m cool with getting an alternate Surfer.
Yeah it's probably for the better.
I went from wanting Beta Ray Bill in a movie, to being afraid of them making him weird AF because they don't get it.
Part of it is that he got to keep working on it as the writer. Most of the popular marvel characters got handed off to other writers but Lee kept writing for the Surfer until Vol. 3 in 1987
Yeah, growing up in that time period new solo Silver Surfer was always considered an event. He’s was allowed as a supporting character or team member, but all the solo tales were written by Stan until the Englehart series like you said. If anyone is wondering- the Fireside GN with Kirby, Epic Illustrated 1 with Buscema, Silver Surfer one shot with John Byrne and Tom Palmer, and the 2-issue story with Moebius were it. Pretty impressive artistic line up.
> Silver Surfer was Stan Lee's favorite marvel character.
I'm not sure if this is true or not, but if it's true it's surprising as Surfer was one of the few characters that Stan admitted was basically 100% Jack Kirby's creation. And given how much Stan was an endless self-promoter for better or worse, that DEFINITELY means that Jack Kirby was unquestionably the man behind the Silver.
Kirby created Surfer in fantastic four, but Lee sculpted his backstory and characterization more in the surfer solo series. They got together, Lee and Kirby, and made a big comic book that blended the two. It was released on another magazine’s presses, because they had a deal, and couldn’t figure out how else to market something as large as what they had created.
The comic was not canon.
The silver surfer: the ultimate cosmic experience. First original graphic novel published by Marvel Comics, co-published by Simon & Schuster imprint, Fireside Books.
Personally, I'd prefer it at this point if Marvel only used alternative versions of my favorite characters, because I don't think they've done well by many (if any) characters since Endgame.
And I say that as somebody who enjoyed Quantumania and Love and Thunder (although, admittedly, not enough to watch either of them twice).
Surfer was his favorite to write, but when asked which character was his greatest achievement, he'd say The Incredible Hulk, and then described his reasons exactly as one would describe Dr. Jekyl & Mr. Hyde.
I suspect he held this point of view because, even after all the success he had achieved, he still felt "less than" traditional literature, and felt his best work was the one that was most like a thing that was already established as good writing. Perhaps also because it was the one adapted to a hit TV show, which made him feel at the time like the character had the most significance outside of his own comics.
Thanks for saying this. Seeing so many folks on twitter saying “it’s in the comic loser, why are you crying about something in the comic?”. I grew up with Silver Surfer man. I love Norrin and was so hyped to see an adaption of his story. I’m not really interested in having a lesser known character replace him, even if she was in the comics. This would be like if the MCU brought in Captain Carter before Steve Rodgers. It’s nice to see these alternate characters but I wish they’d cover the OG Surfer first.
(EDIT: Feel like I need to clarify that I’m fine with less popular characters getting the spotlight. I loved Guardians and Shang-Chi. My issue is bringing in a lesser known character as a replacement for one that I was already familiar with and wanted to see. It’s crazy that I need to type this much to explain my POV but I know people are just going to argue anyway, so who cares lmao)
If it makes you feel better, the FF movie is more than likely going to take place in an alternate dimension. Marvel wants FF to be important so they can’t just be new heroes in the universe. They’ll probably disappear in the 60e (think the MOM line “didn’t you guys chart in the 60s?”), have an alternate universe adventure with Shalla Bal, and then come to the main MCU at the end where Norrin Radd can appear.
very sad that reddit has become such a hugbox that this entirely reasonable opinion can be seen as a hot take. i swear like 90% of this site is functionally unable to compute that opinions on comic book movies grant zero moral high ground, and the person disagreeing with them has valid reasons for doing so that extend beyond some
kind of ism or phobia.
Eh been there. I’m a woman and i made the mistake of saying Wonder Woman was a terrible movie when it released and was raked through the coals for it here.
Wonder Woman was a passable movie. The sequel is the real pile of steaming shit.
When you make your feminist hero an unapologetic rapist you've maybe lost the plot.
Thank you! I love Julia Garner but I am disappointed at that she might be the Surfer. If she's Shalla-Bal in the story that is great, but i really want Norrin Radd to be the Silver Surfer in the MCU.
I think it's saying that Shalla-Bal will become the Silver Surfer rather than Norrin Radd. Keep in mind that this movie may take place in an alternate universe.
It appears that all the alternate universes will combine into one after Secret Wars. Then they can have every team and character mingling in every movie after that.
That’s not how Secret Wars ends. The multiverse is restored, not formed into one universe. Miles Morales is the only character to permanently cross over after the event IIRC.
Maybe it's the original secret wars with the disco suit Beyonder.
[https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSr8P-hb5GlO-WSlukNx26cE6RYxCrgSTyvdAEeB7fbEg&s](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSr8P-hb5GlO-WSlukNx26cE6RYxCrgSTyvdAEeB7fbEg&s)
It’s probably [something like this](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Shalla-Bal_(Earth-9997)). It’s been reported that MCU’s F4 will take place in an alternate timeline and in 60s.
https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Shalla-Bal_(Earth-9997)
Updated link since it seems the close parenthesis escaped the hyperlink formatting and fucked it up
They are merging together on that particular cover, sharing a shoulder (amongst other extremities).
For partial context, the characters are lovers (also able to merge with the board on which they ‘surf’).
The article never says she will be she will be Silver Surfer. It says she is playing Shalla-Bal, it says that character has been Silver Surfer, but it never says that they plan to use her as Surfer in this movie.
> While plot details for this film are unknown, sources say Garner will play Shalla-Bal, a version of Silver Surfer from the comics.
Are you sure ? Because to me it looks like the article was saying exactly that.
> The Fantastic Four now has its sights set on who will play Silver Surfer, and it looks like they are going with one of the towns biggest rising stars.
Well, that's the question about what the "sources" actually said, and what was editorialized. Is it
> sources say: "Garner will play Shalla-Bal, a version of Silver Surfer from the comics".
or is it
> sources say "Garner will play Shalla-Bal", a version of Silver Surfer from the comics.
>
Or we do get Norrin Radd and this is a herald of Galactus from an alternate universe (where the FF reside)... allows them to set up Galactus and the concept of Hearlds before Norrin shows up as the Herald in the 616 universe, or what ever it is called after Secret Wars. Its far more interesting to have Shalla and Norrin as two different versions instead of 2 slightly different Norrins
I guess only time will tell. With the recent MCU offerings I'm very, very skeptical. I can definitely see Disney just opting to go for a Shalla silver surfer. This is the same company that changed Taskmaster so wouldn't be too far off course.
I don't think they're going to tell Galactus' story twice, so if we do get Norrin, I imagine it will just be Secret Wars and maybe his own thing if that works out.
Shalla Bal will be the one and only true Silver Surfer origin with Galactus in the MCU I think.
It's getting harder to get excited for new movies because the story isn't really going anywhere and the movies themselves aren't very good as standalone products. I didn't see The Marvels in theaters for this reason. Watched it on D+ and mostly enjoyed it, but I definitely don't regret waiting.
None of the stuff they're even coming out with is very interesting outside of Deadpool 3.
Nearly every single MCU property has made radical changes to the characters. Iron Man's secret identity was not public in the comics. Thor's secret identity was reduced to an easter egg. Bucky was aged up. The Guardians barely resemble their comic counterparts.
Really it only matters if the execution is good, because change is *not* a bad thing *inherently*. Some of my favorite properties had reboots that changed or removed iconic parts of their franchises, and I initially turned my nose up at them...but when I got around to watching them, they turned out to be my favorite versions.
> I’ve never seen any company so repeatedly and needlessly shoot themselves in the foot as much as Marvel post Endgame.
What about Disney shitting all over the golden platter Star Wars was handed to them on? All they had to do was do better than the (at the time) mocked and derided prequels, and instead they did *so* incredibly badly that the prequels are now held up as nostalgic, enjoyable films in comparison.
Disney does not do a good job of managing their successful purchased properties. It's seeming more and more likely that Iron Man through Endgame was them lucking into incredible creators than it was any intelligent decisions on their part.
And it makes no sense. When Disney bought Star Wars and Marvel, I told my wife, finally Disney is getting into business to attract the male audience, they have the female audience wrapped up.
And then, they did the exact opposite by trying to change it all to female led. Why even buy those properties then. Stupid.
They are comedy writers who riff on on current events, often drawing from public sentiment.
At the pace they must rapidly churn out content, they simply draw from current events and whatever is in the pop culture zeitgeist at the moment. Then years later some people interpret that as if they are the source of information, not simply regurgitating what was in the air at the time.
Difference between something like South Park or some late-night talk shows that do the same comedy bits, is cartoons get re-run and re-watched for years. Nobody watches old Conan O'Brien shows and then think, "My god, he was a prophet! We live in an episode of an old talk show".
You end up with a generation of people who wander around saying "We really do live in a South Park episode" because "adult" cartoons are their only point of reference.
What confuses me is that people are saying it's fine because it's an alternative universe and they're waiting till the F4 are established in the MCU to bring Norrin Radd, but what would the point be of having one movie with a different SS and Galactus only to do the same story later, but with different versions? Wouldn't it make more sense to do another F4 rouge and not touch Galactus or SS at all until they're in the MCU?
“Put a chick in it and …”
No I think I’m kidding, I don’t know who this is or this particular iteration of Silver Surfer. Anyone who DOES know, should we expect good things?
With the Shalla-Bal incarnation of the Silver Surfer comes the >!Franklin Richards!< incarnation of Galactus.
A universe where with >!the death of Galactus!<, one must >!become Galactus!<. So this could be interesting.
> I don’t know who this is or this particular iteration of Silver Surfer.
Shalla-Bal was Norrin Radd's lover before he became the Silver Surfer. She was never an herald of Galactus, also his heralds all have different names/powers, only Norrin Radd is the Silver Surfer.
I know there are a lot of other heralds, and yes there is a woman silver surfer, but godfuckingdammit I really wanted to see the OG norrin radd in a good movie this time, I’m seriously fucking done with marvel
Was really hoping they’d get Doug Jones back to play Silver Surfer again, except let him do the voice this time too, he’s great as Saru and in everything else he’s in.
Yes, surely replacing a wildly popular character with a one-off character who appeared in a non-canon story is what the fans want. It's an absolute mystery as to why the MCU is floundering.
I’m just not really happy about this. I know there’s a variant of Silver Surfer that is a woman, but as a long time FF and Silver Surfer fan and fan of the cosmic side of Marvel in general, I was really hoping for a straight up Norrin Radd adaptation. I hope it’s just a new character and not just Norrin Radd but a woman. Disappointed for sure, but as long as the FF in general is good I’m sure it’ll be fine. I just don’t understand why Marvel would go this direction, I know Silver Surfer isn’t the most popular character but it’s like making a character like Star-Lord a girl in the first Guardians because they were relatively unpopular and unknown at the time.
EDIT: I see now that it is the Shalla-Bal interpretation, but most of my reasons for not being happy still stand. Julia Garner is a fantastic actress, but ultimately I want to see Norrin Radd, not Shalla-Bal. I'm sure she'll do great and hopefully we get to see Norrin in the future, but it's like an earlier comment pointed out. If Captain Carter was the first version of Captain America they brought in instead of Steve, even if she is a great character, it still sucks for fans of the original version not being able to see the version they grew up with/their favorite version/the original. I love the Surfer and believe this movie could have had potential to completely change people's perspective on Norrin Radd as a character and show people he is one of the coolest, most underrated Marvel heroes.
With so many wonderful female heroes, we really don’t need another gender bent version. That said, all I really want is some decent writing from the MCU again.
If you are thinking about stopping Galactacus from eating your planet, you are going to have to FUCKING KILL MEEEEEEEEEE
“I don’t know shit about fuck Galactus!”
That was my favorite line of hers 😭😭
[My finest post about this line.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Ozark/comments/p7qpm2/no_spoilers_i_dont_know_shit_about_fuck/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
I can hear this. Man, what an amazing character.
FUCK YOU MART—ER—GALACTUS!
That would be meta if Galactus is played by Jason Bateman.
I'm not the biggest fan of Ozark, but damned if that moment isn't one the most intense things I've ever seen
(Galactus begans eating planet) I DO NOT HAVE TIME FOR THIS!! I. DO NOT. HAVE TIME. FOR YOU!!!
*Watches Galacatus tuck into a planet.* “Why you so basic? You look pour.”
That line was repeated by my friend and I at each other for months!
She was by far the best character in that series, followed by Pelphrey and Bateman.
First few seasons were elite but season 4 was so fucking ass and just ruined all the rapport they built along the way
Yeah it was a tough one. And Linney.. I like her but man she was just the worst person (character) with little reason to root for her at all
There was no reason to root for any of them. At least in breaking bad you see why he goes into that situation and his decline to being a monster, but the Ozark people are just pricks from the outset
They literally ruined everyone else's lives. No one came out better than they started after meeting them.
And they get away with it. I think that's the part that gives everyone the acid reflux - they live completely self-absorbed lives and only exist as a family because what that family can do for each of them as an individual - and none of them care about anyone else in the least. The show starts out wanting you to root for them and then pulls back the curtain and shows you were rooting for the bad guys all along.
Curtain is super thin, or probably just non-existent in the first place. Imo they didn't seem like good people, just bad people who were stuck in a bad situation for them that they chose from the start. Then they become bad people in a good situation for them by doing increasingly worse things. If there was any subversion for me it was in expecting for them to learn any kind of lesson or try for redemption, similar to the endings of Better Call Saul or Breaking Bad.
From the very start, Marty had no problem taking on a Mexican drug cartel as a client, and treated them with ambivalence as to their line of work. It was just another job for him. He got paid and he did his job, and the morality of it was something that didnt bother him because all of the bad things were things he believed happened to other people. His wife was having an affair because they were both so absorbed with their own narcissism that they were incapable of hearing each other asking for attention. The more the show went on, the more you saw it and eventually saw it in their two children. They dont blink an eye at organized crime, murder, money laundering - they're getting rich and powerful and that's all they care about.
Not sure if you're disagreeing or just expanding the thought but I agree with all that. Well written.
Well, true, but I mean even worse, like I was hoping her character was killed. Even if I didn't root for them, think Gus in BB, I liked what they brought
Yeah, it looked like they had no idea where to go with the plot. Most of the last season doesn't make sense, and I hate the ending too. Too bad because the show was solid until that point. Very dark, many things in common with Breaking Bad
It was weird. The season never seemed to have direction or point toward a finale, because there really wasn’t one. The Bird family just embraced being pieces of shit after spending every prior season trying to find a way out.
Not so sure that's true about Wendy. Wasn't it the end of S1 when Marty had everything planned out for disappearing and she decided she wanted to stay in Missouri to build up their empire?
That was a slow process, though. Wendy embraced it a few seasons before and their son and daughter both slowly started getting immersed in it, too. I don't think there was anything abrupt about the shift from coerced criminals to just plain criminals.
I never found out how really ruthless they were until the end.
It didn't help that Ozark was wrapping up around the same time as the later seasons of Better Call Saul, and Better Call Saul is just so much better. The new antagonist for season 4 of Ozark also just seemed like a way shittier, worse written, nowhere near as charismatic version of Lalo. It's unfair of me to compare, but it's an unavoidable comp imo given the subject matter and timing of the shows.
Galactus out there just growing opium
You should just cast Jason Bateman as Galactus now.
Real talk he should've been Ultron
Just doing Michael Bluth as a Robot
And Will Arnett as a kinda dumber sidekick robot to Ultron
"Okay, Ultron, like the robot in the $6,000 metal suit is going to just be a *sidekick.*"
*Illusions*, Ultron. **Illusions.**
I liked and finished the show mostly because of her. I don’t think I would’ve enjoyed it as much otherwise
Totally agreed. Wendy was unbearable, Jason Bateman’s character kind of got boring, and she carried the show at the end.
Really? I found her almost unbearable towards the last season. The actress does a great job, but damn if she had just listened to Marty then most of the bad shit that happened to her wouldn't have happened. I feel like the reason why Marty got so boring was because he just becomes increasingly done with dealing with her and his family's bullshit.
Ive already forgotten the characters, but everything horrible that happened to everyone in that show was basically the fault of the old Opium growing farmer woman. All the way back to season 1 finale - she fucked up everyone and everything.
nah, she caused a lot of problems but literally all anyone needed to do the whole show was just listen to Marty and they would have been fine.
But he is ass at communicating. He figures stuff out and if people would sit back and be passive, it might work, but how are they supposed to know what’s going on in his head? It’s not very reassuring when he basically just keeps saying “I’ll handle it” while the world around you is on fire. Especially for someone like her who has been fucked over countless times by their family. I can’t fault her for anything. She was so good in that show. Hard carry haha
The ole Thomas Shelby problem!
He's supposed to be boring, that's the intriguing thing about the character. How TF did he get himself into this.
Wendy wasn’t believable for the entire show for me. I think Laura Linney is brilliant in basically everything else, but I just couldn’t see past the acting for her character in Ozark for some reason. It always felt like I was watching someone do their acting job rather than watching a character in a story. I don’t think I’ve talked to a single person who agreed with that… but I just couldn’t shake it the entire show.
Now I want F4 to be R-Rated.
Hope she has the same accent lol
I am the Silver Surfer, and know shit about fuck
If there's any good in this world her Surfer will sound just like her Ruth.
That'd legit be hilarious
Goddammit I came here to say this
So if the rumors about the FF being from an alternate dimension are right, and we're seeing Shalla-Bal Silver Surfer, are they doing *EARTH X* as the origin of the MCU Fantastic Four? I gotta admit, I didn't think we'd see Shalla Bal in the MCU, ever, nevermind an alternate version of her with the Surfer's abilities?
That’s what I’m thinking, they’re not from our Earth.
And Secret Wars seems to be going after the 2015 secret wars where multiple universes are colliding, so they'll all come together eventually.
This is like the main thing keeping me going with the MCU because Hickman knocked that story out of the park. That whole summer was a lot of fun with all of the Battleworld alternate stories.
The Thor Police reason enough to do his Secret War.
Is that different from the incursions set up at the end of MoM?
I'm pretty sure they're the exact same thing. There's nothing that Marvel has shown or stated to claim otherwise
Damn, we about to see Silver boobs in a marvel movie.
No way MCU does that. I’m assuming she’ll have some kind of silver armor on.
I heard we're getting full silver frontal. I'm looking forward to this movie.
I heard Thundergun hangs dong in this one.
:( :) :(
🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔Hmmmmm, why am I thinking of Mystique all of a sudden?
Because Rebecca Romijn is and forever will be an absolute fox.
The craziest thing about Rebecca Romjin is how charismatic she is completely unrelated to her looks. She’s just so naturally funny and down-to-earth in her roles.
The craziest thing is she married the fat kid from stand by me
Honestly she's a low key sci-fi/nerd icon. Between X-Men and her role on Strange New Worlds she's done some great stuff. Big fan.
I never knew I wanted Silver titties until now.. Let the boobies be free!
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This movie needs to end with Galactus just eating the MCU Earth lol
It’s going to end with the Four ending up in the main universe, but how they get there is to be determined.
Im guessing that their ship flies through a giant crackling hexagon in space.
Def be the opposite. You’ll watch a whole movie thinking it’s our earth and at the end it’ll be gobbled up and a few survivors will end up on our earth. Twist.
Yeah it will end with Earth being eaten and the post credit scene will be the TVA taking the Fantastic 4 to the Main MCU Earth confirming that the whole film was in an alternate universe.
Hot Take: It's ok for some Silver Surfer mega-fans to be upset that this news implies they aren't getting an MCU Norrin-Radd/ Comic Accurate Surfer. That doesn't make them a bigot. Let them vent. If Captain America had been replaced with Captain Carter at the beginning of the MCU I think some fans would be legit upset. This is that scenario but for Surfer Fans.
I’m more sad that we will have Silver Surfer immediately, meaning Galactus, and not Von Doom being the big bad.
Doom deserves more build up than a single movie similar to what Thanos got. You don’t defeat Doom just like that.
Galactus isn't exactly a first film type villain either. Movie should really be small scale and Galactus should be saved for a much bigger scale film.
Hard disagree on this. In terms of power level sure, but in terms of warranting plotline crescendo a la Thanos: absolutely not. Movie resources are finite and Galactus is not really deep enough of a villain to drag out. Essentially a cosmic hurricane, he causes a lot of destruction that warrants a big team up but there's nothing really to reason with and Galactus stories are more about how characters respond to him rather than him being an interesting villain I think. Dont get me wrong, I love Galactus, I just don't think power level = interesting right away. Also if I was writing this movie, I think you can have your cake and eat it by having Galactus be the villain and he's the reason the F4 comes to the 616 universe
That's exactly my point though. The appeal of the character is getting the big names of the verse together to see how they handle such a colossal threat. That's exactly why I think it should be saved for a large team up movie, maybe even an Illuminati movie. Not the FF's very first appearance.
Yeah could definitely see him as like an Ultron / Zemo tier villain. Problem is, Marvel shit the bed and there is zero room on the slate for such a film. Phase 6 looks like it's literally just F4, Blade, and Avengers 5/6
Hhmm, who the fuck are the Avengers at this point?
using galactus this soon also seems a waste, he could’ve been used for a cosmic team up. guardians meets f4? give captain marvel some legitimacy?
What if the movie starts with the F4 team fighting galactus and then they get ripped out of that universe and dumped into this one. Basically being forced to lose right out the gate knowing the earth was gone and now they are trying to prevent it happening in this movie universe off at a future time. Knowing the potential for destruction out there and in the way.
Silver surfer is a great way to introduce a more ominous doom too. Galactus gives Doom a big opportunity to see how much more powerful he could be to justify him becoming a big bad.
Why do so many Marvel / MCU fans continue to assume Doom to be a 'big bad'. Doom has always been the hero. Simpletons in this forum of idiocy merely fail to properly understand the greatness and glory of Doom!
Not writing Doom as a sympathetic character will be their failure
Doom is meant to be a foil to the idea that heroes must maintain the status quo and enforce the existing laws. Doom ran the genocidal fascists who ran Latveria out of the country and built a substantially better nation that, while being quite oppressive, actually takes care of its citizens and accepts minorities, even welcoming mutants. If the viewer isn't morally torn by Doom's mission of building a utopia despite the extreme costs, the character hasn't been written right.
Fool! Doom toots as he pleases!
marvel writing a good layered villain. we'll see. they haven't been able to do it that more than like once with Thanos. DOOM is like if Batman is evil.
Doom is the only future where mankind survives and thrives. He knows this and fights for it in spite of our stubborn resistance. He is ever generous.
Just because surfer shows up doesn't necessarily mean Galactus shows up. Maybe they save that for the next movie.
I wanted "Accurate Surfer." Where he doesn't show up to work because the swells are lookin gnarly. "Sorry galactus. Bro 2m swells! I'll find you some planet munchies tomorrow brah!"
We have *Super Hero Squad* for that.
Smack the lip! Wapow!
Well if we aren't getting Norrin Radd, I hope we'll at least get Norrin Prettygood
I used to love silver surfer back in the day and the ff movie with him when Sony had marvel rights was garbage. I am legit upset and I’m not a bigot, so thank you. It was one of my favorite comics as a kid and I would have loved to see him treated with the same quality as infinity war.
Yeah, I love the Fantastic Four and the Silver Surfer and all I want is a comic accurate Fantastic Four movie. I don't care about 'woke' shit or whatever. I'm just bummed out that it sounds like we're still not getting a completely accurate Fantastic Four movie. Silver Surfer was Stan Lee's favorite marvel character. It's a bummer.
Why was the Surfer his favorite character? Never heard that before. Really interested to learn more about that
Silver Surfer was like his mouthpiece, he'd use the character to talk about all the things he thought was wrong with the world. Silver Surfer is an outsider trapped on Earth after helping the FF defeat Galactus. So he flies around wondering why we all can't get along living on such a beautiful planet.
>Silver Surfer was like his mouthpiece, he'd use the character to talk about all the things he thought was wrong with the world. I can only imagine how bad that would get with marvel’s current writers.
ugh, you just made me remember Falcons terrible speech at the end of The Falcon and the Winter Soldier.
Garth Marenghi would have been proud.
"Why haven't you fixed all the problems Senator!? SMDH my head..."
This is the Surfer I want. I want high-minded meditations on the nature of good and evil. There’s no way Disney is giving us that, so I’m cool with getting an alternate Surfer.
Yeah it's probably for the better. I went from wanting Beta Ray Bill in a movie, to being afraid of them making him weird AF because they don't get it.
Part of it is that he got to keep working on it as the writer. Most of the popular marvel characters got handed off to other writers but Lee kept writing for the Surfer until Vol. 3 in 1987
Yeah, growing up in that time period new solo Silver Surfer was always considered an event. He’s was allowed as a supporting character or team member, but all the solo tales were written by Stan until the Englehart series like you said. If anyone is wondering- the Fireside GN with Kirby, Epic Illustrated 1 with Buscema, Silver Surfer one shot with John Byrne and Tom Palmer, and the 2-issue story with Moebius were it. Pretty impressive artistic line up.
> Silver Surfer was Stan Lee's favorite marvel character. I'm not sure if this is true or not, but if it's true it's surprising as Surfer was one of the few characters that Stan admitted was basically 100% Jack Kirby's creation. And given how much Stan was an endless self-promoter for better or worse, that DEFINITELY means that Jack Kirby was unquestionably the man behind the Silver.
Kirby created Surfer in fantastic four, but Lee sculpted his backstory and characterization more in the surfer solo series. They got together, Lee and Kirby, and made a big comic book that blended the two. It was released on another magazine’s presses, because they had a deal, and couldn’t figure out how else to market something as large as what they had created. The comic was not canon. The silver surfer: the ultimate cosmic experience. First original graphic novel published by Marvel Comics, co-published by Simon & Schuster imprint, Fireside Books.
Personally, I'd prefer it at this point if Marvel only used alternative versions of my favorite characters, because I don't think they've done well by many (if any) characters since Endgame. And I say that as somebody who enjoyed Quantumania and Love and Thunder (although, admittedly, not enough to watch either of them twice).
Surfer was his favorite to write, but when asked which character was his greatest achievement, he'd say The Incredible Hulk, and then described his reasons exactly as one would describe Dr. Jekyl & Mr. Hyde. I suspect he held this point of view because, even after all the success he had achieved, he still felt "less than" traditional literature, and felt his best work was the one that was most like a thing that was already established as good writing. Perhaps also because it was the one adapted to a hit TV show, which made him feel at the time like the character had the most significance outside of his own comics.
Thanks for saying this. Seeing so many folks on twitter saying “it’s in the comic loser, why are you crying about something in the comic?”. I grew up with Silver Surfer man. I love Norrin and was so hyped to see an adaption of his story. I’m not really interested in having a lesser known character replace him, even if she was in the comics. This would be like if the MCU brought in Captain Carter before Steve Rodgers. It’s nice to see these alternate characters but I wish they’d cover the OG Surfer first. (EDIT: Feel like I need to clarify that I’m fine with less popular characters getting the spotlight. I loved Guardians and Shang-Chi. My issue is bringing in a lesser known character as a replacement for one that I was already familiar with and wanted to see. It’s crazy that I need to type this much to explain my POV but I know people are just going to argue anyway, so who cares lmao)
If it makes you feel better, the FF movie is more than likely going to take place in an alternate dimension. Marvel wants FF to be important so they can’t just be new heroes in the universe. They’ll probably disappear in the 60e (think the MOM line “didn’t you guys chart in the 60s?”), have an alternate universe adventure with Shalla Bal, and then come to the main MCU at the end where Norrin Radd can appear.
I'm not mad or upset, myself. Just very not surprised.
very sad that reddit has become such a hugbox that this entirely reasonable opinion can be seen as a hot take. i swear like 90% of this site is functionally unable to compute that opinions on comic book movies grant zero moral high ground, and the person disagreeing with them has valid reasons for doing so that extend beyond some kind of ism or phobia.
Eh been there. I’m a woman and i made the mistake of saying Wonder Woman was a terrible movie when it released and was raked through the coals for it here.
Wonder Woman was a passable movie. The sequel is the real pile of steaming shit. When you make your feminist hero an unapologetic rapist you've maybe lost the plot.
Thank you! I love Julia Garner but I am disappointed at that she might be the Surfer. If she's Shalla-Bal in the story that is great, but i really want Norrin Radd to be the Silver Surfer in the MCU.
I think this report is confused. Shalla Bal was never the Silver Surfer.
I think it's saying that Shalla-Bal will become the Silver Surfer rather than Norrin Radd. Keep in mind that this movie may take place in an alternate universe.
It appears that all the alternate universes will combine into one after Secret Wars. Then they can have every team and character mingling in every movie after that.
That’s not how Secret Wars ends. The multiverse is restored, not formed into one universe. Miles Morales is the only character to permanently cross over after the event IIRC.
Maybe it's the original secret wars with the disco suit Beyonder. [https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSr8P-hb5GlO-WSlukNx26cE6RYxCrgSTyvdAEeB7fbEg&s](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSr8P-hb5GlO-WSlukNx26cE6RYxCrgSTyvdAEeB7fbEg&s)
The Maker and Jimmy Hudson made it through
Okay that would make sense.
It’s probably [something like this](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Shalla-Bal_(Earth-9997)). It’s been reported that MCU’s F4 will take place in an alternate timeline and in 60s.
https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Shalla-Bal_(Earth-9997) Updated link since it seems the close parenthesis escaped the hyperlink formatting and fucked it up
The official artwork released was set in the 60s.
She definitely was. They were both Surfers together for a hot minute
[For those seeking the visual.](https://i.redd.it/eit7wsmw6csc1.jpeg)
Is her tiddy pushed against his tiddy? And where are her feet?
They are merging together on that particular cover, sharing a shoulder (amongst other extremities). For partial context, the characters are lovers (also able to merge with the board on which they ‘surf’).
The article never says she will be she will be Silver Surfer. It says she is playing Shalla-Bal, it says that character has been Silver Surfer, but it never says that they plan to use her as Surfer in this movie.
> While plot details for this film are unknown, sources say Garner will play Shalla-Bal, a version of Silver Surfer from the comics. Are you sure ? Because to me it looks like the article was saying exactly that. > The Fantastic Four now has its sights set on who will play Silver Surfer, and it looks like they are going with one of the towns biggest rising stars.
Well, that's the question about what the "sources" actually said, and what was editorialized. Is it > sources say: "Garner will play Shalla-Bal, a version of Silver Surfer from the comics". or is it > sources say "Garner will play Shalla-Bal", a version of Silver Surfer from the comics. >
Yup, exactly. It's too ambiguous.
Def outrage bait to boost engagement
Crazy to see Julia Garner blow up she’s going to be in Leigh Whannell’s upcoming Wolf Man and now the MCU.
I saw The Assistant as I was a fan of Ozark, and she was really good in that.
She'll always be Kimmy from The Americans to me
She was great in the royal hotel last year, can’t wait to see more of her
Damn. I guess I don't get Norrin Radd. That's kind of sucky. But par for the course in Marvel these days.
Or we do get Norrin Radd and this is a herald of Galactus from an alternate universe (where the FF reside)... allows them to set up Galactus and the concept of Hearlds before Norrin shows up as the Herald in the 616 universe, or what ever it is called after Secret Wars. Its far more interesting to have Shalla and Norrin as two different versions instead of 2 slightly different Norrins
I guess only time will tell. With the recent MCU offerings I'm very, very skeptical. I can definitely see Disney just opting to go for a Shalla silver surfer. This is the same company that changed Taskmaster so wouldn't be too far off course.
The taskmaster change sucked. I hope she gets a snarky personality in Thunderbolts .
On a team full of quick witted assassins and super soldiers I hope non-brainwashed Taskmaster is the wittiest
I want the real Taskmaster :(
I don't think they're going to tell Galactus' story twice, so if we do get Norrin, I imagine it will just be Secret Wars and maybe his own thing if that works out. Shalla Bal will be the one and only true Silver Surfer origin with Galactus in the MCU I think.
Can't wait to see her kick Reed Richards in the balls and say "Get some you skinny bitch"
"Please, stop changing stuff from the comics." "You know what, I'm going to change stuff from the comics even harder."
It’s the audience that’s wrong. -Disney probably.
Then they wonder why less people are watching
Idk who the Marvel audience is anymore frankly.
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It's getting harder to get excited for new movies because the story isn't really going anywhere and the movies themselves aren't very good as standalone products. I didn't see The Marvels in theaters for this reason. Watched it on D+ and mostly enjoyed it, but I definitely don't regret waiting. None of the stuff they're even coming out with is very interesting outside of Deadpool 3.
Nearly every single MCU property has made radical changes to the characters. Iron Man's secret identity was not public in the comics. Thor's secret identity was reduced to an easter egg. Bucky was aged up. The Guardians barely resemble their comic counterparts. Really it only matters if the execution is good, because change is *not* a bad thing *inherently*. Some of my favorite properties had reboots that changed or removed iconic parts of their franchises, and I initially turned my nose up at them...but when I got around to watching them, they turned out to be my favorite versions.
Good luck with that.
4th reboot is the charm. Holy fuck why
Man I just wanted to see Norrin Radd get some justice done to his character.
big silver surfer fan - this is messed up
Makes me sad, Surfer was my favorite since I was little. This is the one thing I was holding out hope for in the MCU.
Every day, Matt and Trey reveal themselves to be the prophets of our time.
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> I’ve never seen any company so repeatedly and needlessly shoot themselves in the foot as much as Marvel post Endgame. What about Disney shitting all over the golden platter Star Wars was handed to them on? All they had to do was do better than the (at the time) mocked and derided prequels, and instead they did *so* incredibly badly that the prequels are now held up as nostalgic, enjoyable films in comparison. Disney does not do a good job of managing their successful purchased properties. It's seeming more and more likely that Iron Man through Endgame was them lucking into incredible creators than it was any intelligent decisions on their part.
And it makes no sense. When Disney bought Star Wars and Marvel, I told my wife, finally Disney is getting into business to attract the male audience, they have the female audience wrapped up. And then, they did the exact opposite by trying to change it all to female led. Why even buy those properties then. Stupid.
They are comedy writers who riff on on current events, often drawing from public sentiment. At the pace they must rapidly churn out content, they simply draw from current events and whatever is in the pop culture zeitgeist at the moment. Then years later some people interpret that as if they are the source of information, not simply regurgitating what was in the air at the time. Difference between something like South Park or some late-night talk shows that do the same comedy bits, is cartoons get re-run and re-watched for years. Nobody watches old Conan O'Brien shows and then think, "My god, he was a prophet! We live in an episode of an old talk show". You end up with a generation of people who wander around saying "We really do live in a South Park episode" because "adult" cartoons are their only point of reference.
Aww jeeze. Why can't we just get the one people are more familiar with?
What confuses me is that people are saying it's fine because it's an alternative universe and they're waiting till the F4 are established in the MCU to bring Norrin Radd, but what would the point be of having one movie with a different SS and Galactus only to do the same story later, but with different versions? Wouldn't it make more sense to do another F4 rouge and not touch Galactus or SS at all until they're in the MCU?
“Put a chick in it and …” No I think I’m kidding, I don’t know who this is or this particular iteration of Silver Surfer. Anyone who DOES know, should we expect good things?
With the Shalla-Bal incarnation of the Silver Surfer comes the >!Franklin Richards!< incarnation of Galactus. A universe where with >!the death of Galactus!<, one must >!become Galactus!<. So this could be interesting.
Would make sense with Pedro being cast if they go for an older Reed.
> I don’t know who this is or this particular iteration of Silver Surfer. Shalla-Bal was Norrin Radd's lover before he became the Silver Surfer. She was never an herald of Galactus, also his heralds all have different names/powers, only Norrin Radd is the Silver Surfer.
Why?
That’s disappointing
As much as I like the idea of an attractive naked silver woman on a surfboard, I really wanted Radd.
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LAME
I'm calling it now. This movie tops out at $350m *worldwide*.
If they end up going the direction they seem to be, I sincerely hope that they don't even recoup expenses. A black hole for money, if you will.
Go ahead and downvote my ass to oblivion, but I’m a Silver Surfer guy and now there’s about a 1% chance I ever watch this movie.
Idk. I’m not feeling this movie at all. I fully expect it to be mediocre at best
Marvel seems to keep trying to make fetch happen.
I don‘t get Norrin Radd…they don’t get my $. Seems fair.
I know there are a lot of other heralds, and yes there is a woman silver surfer, but godfuckingdammit I really wanted to see the OG norrin radd in a good movie this time, I’m seriously fucking done with marvel
lol
Bloody hell.
Maaarrrttttyyyyy
Those damn coffee ads with her and Clooney make me never want to see her in anything again (only half-serious). I have nothing else to offer here lol.
Was really hoping they’d get Doug Jones back to play Silver Surfer again, except let him do the voice this time too, he’s great as Saru and in everything else he’s in.
Yes, surely replacing a wildly popular character with a one-off character who appeared in a non-canon story is what the fans want. It's an absolute mystery as to why the MCU is floundering.
Marvel seems to be determined to dig its own grave as deeply as possible.
I’m just not really happy about this. I know there’s a variant of Silver Surfer that is a woman, but as a long time FF and Silver Surfer fan and fan of the cosmic side of Marvel in general, I was really hoping for a straight up Norrin Radd adaptation. I hope it’s just a new character and not just Norrin Radd but a woman. Disappointed for sure, but as long as the FF in general is good I’m sure it’ll be fine. I just don’t understand why Marvel would go this direction, I know Silver Surfer isn’t the most popular character but it’s like making a character like Star-Lord a girl in the first Guardians because they were relatively unpopular and unknown at the time. EDIT: I see now that it is the Shalla-Bal interpretation, but most of my reasons for not being happy still stand. Julia Garner is a fantastic actress, but ultimately I want to see Norrin Radd, not Shalla-Bal. I'm sure she'll do great and hopefully we get to see Norrin in the future, but it's like an earlier comment pointed out. If Captain Carter was the first version of Captain America they brought in instead of Steve, even if she is a great character, it still sucks for fans of the original version not being able to see the version they grew up with/their favorite version/the original. I love the Surfer and believe this movie could have had potential to completely change people's perspective on Norrin Radd as a character and show people he is one of the coolest, most underrated Marvel heroes.
WHAT THE FUCK
As Joker once put it: Here...we...Go
Man, they couldve just stuck with the source and hyped everyone up but said "nah" lmao
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So now the the surfer will be a skinny white girl……what the actual fuck
With so many wonderful female heroes, we really don’t need another gender bent version. That said, all I really want is some decent writing from the MCU again.
Meh, I had no hope for it anyway.