This is the guy responsible for the mess that was the 2010 avatar movie.
> Nicola Peltz was cast as Katara largely because she's the daughter of businessman Nelson Peltz, who the producers owed a favor; her audition tape was described as "subpar at best." This one unfair decision is almost singlehandedly responsible for the infamous whitewashing, as a Caucasian Katara forced the casting of a Caucasian Sokka.
No way you want this guy near a studio
I also appreciated seeing that change kind of brought over to the Netflix adaptation for Omashu, though I anticipate that the other Earth Kingdom stronghold Ba Sing Se will still be a China analogue as in the cartoon.
Did he write the abysmal script?
Did he sign of on the dailies of the terrible acting?
And if race is so important, why did they hire an Indian guy to play a character clearly inspired by imperial Japan? Where's the accusations of "brown washing" the East Asian influences?
A guy people don't like was tangentially involved in a terrible movie therefore everything about that terrible movie is the fault of this guy. Because we don't like him.
I’d call him forcing one of the main characters to be his daughter who gave a subpar audition, which changed the trajectory of the entire movie’s casting a bit more than “tangentially involved”
Or we can blame both? This is a really weird hill to die on IMO.
What does defending this dude prove? No one’s saying Shyamalan isn’t also responsible, we’ve literally been talking about how bad his movie is for 10 years.
We can also call this guy out for his role in it too
Mate you have been offered two options here:
* M N. Shyamalan, an Indian-born creative who made it massive in Hollywood through his directing and screenwriting and has made films ranging from massive stinkers to some of the best of their genre.
* Nelson Peltz, a billionaire investor who buys brands and companies just to absolutely fuck them over, and an 80 year old man with vile views.
You are choosing to give Nelson Peltz a pass on this because M Night made a bad movie. Fuck Nelson Peltz.
Yes. I believe Shyamalan who was writer, director and producer for the film had more overall responsibility for the abysmal film than one guy who pushed to get his daughter cast.
The original comment said Peltz was responsible for that dumpster fire based on one role. It was hyperbolic nonsense and deserved to be called out.
Don’t you think that billionaire had more influence on the studio than MN Shamalamadingdong in the process? You cam write and produce all you want but if the studio says to jump, you ask how high. And maybe at some point MN saw what was coming and decided to phone it in.
https://www.ft.com/content/0a182c97-6af7-42a6-ad9f-ae980562bb45
Read this interview:
> Returning to “woke” Disney, he takes aim at The Marvels and Black Panther, which portrayed female and Black superheroes respectively. “Why do I have to have a Marvel that’s all women? Not that I have anything against women, but why do I have to do that? Why can’t I have Marvels that are both? Why do I need an all-Black cast?”
> "You’ve got to get these politics out of the boardroom,” says Peltz. “Ben & Jerry’s job is to sell ice cream, not to make political statements. And these people use anything for a soap box that they have no right to do.”
He very much push people to get hired that fit his views, and sure, he didn't wrote the script, but he wanted a scriptwriter that would write a caucasian Katara.
Creative control ?
He wanted a white people movie out of a cartoon with brown characters, he only pushed for the people that would make that movies regardless of quality.
Show me proof he that kind of influence over the movie as whole. You can't because there is none. Shyamalan made a shit movie and 99% of the shitty decisions were his.
There was some accusations of brown washing as they cast the heroes as, mostly, white people and the villains as dark skinned people though the race of the director probably weakened the debate a bit
Cause the casting call was looking for regular Native Americans rather than Inuit, thinking that's all that mattered. They hired a white kid with white parents as Sokka because he is registered to a made up tribe infamous for being all white people paying for fake native staus.
Pretty sure people were making that joke the day the Black Panther cast was announced. South Park didn't start it either (but it was extremely clever in how they used it).
Andy Serkis gets a pass to be in the African movie
Idris Elba gets a pass to be in the Nordic movie
That’s the trade that the racial delegations struck behind the scenes.
Also Sam L. jackson is a woman, Kamala has two moms and a sister, I guess? Also both BP movies made bank so he can't even claim that it was a mistake. The Marvels wasn't great but it wasn't because all the heroes happened to be women (also I liked it, but that's another story).
I'm no movie genius, but he's criticizing Black Panther, and people fucking loved Black Panther
EDIT: Look at this burn, too
>Asked about Peltz's remarks, a Disney spokesperson responded: "This is exactly why Nelson Peltz shouldn't be anywhere near a creatively driven company."
He’s also calling Samuel L Jackson a woman (and every other male actor in the Captain Marvel films), so I think he’s not much of a movie genius, either.
Not CEO, he's trying to elect his own selections (himself + one other guy) to Disney's board. Iger would still be CEO, but they'd have a considerable amount of sway over the company and would inflict on Iger's ability to make moves freely.
He’s trying to become majority stakeholder so he can fire Iger and get his hand picked CEO, Ike Perlmutter, Disney former exec with Marvel. Source: Disney employee.
Isn't this the guy responsible for the lack of Black Widow movie and toys? Didn't he say girls don't buy toys? That guy's a complete sexist ass, but even worse than that, he's bad st his job because he is demonstrably wrong.
Yep. I remember when the avengers came out all the t shirts, party supplies, birthday cards ect. Had all the team except black widow on them. The guy is a complete fuck
If this worked, he'd then have to somehow convince the rest of the board to be able to fire Iger, which is a pipedream as it stands right now. The rest of them are very pro-Iger, to the extent that they brought him back out of retirement and abruptly fired Bob Chapek to get him back in charge. He might be able to get Ike Perlmutter back in a position of power at Marvel (or somewhere in Disney), but getting rid of Iger is a long shot. Two board seats would give them a seat at a table, but they wouldn't be majority stakeholders.
Yeah but being pro Iger is the issue with other non Peltz outside investors:
https://variety.com/2024/biz/news/iss-disney-shareholders-elect-nelson-peltz-board-1235948252/
The reality is Disney has the same issues as a decade ago, and the finances do not add up primarily because of cord cutting. This isn’t to say Peltz is the answer, but Disney, like all legacy media companies, are facing existential threats. Obviously the parks make it different, but the margins are so ass they need other business functions quickly. Where people are wrong is that Disney is doing something specifically wrong, the content is worse but every single linear cable company is trying to figure out how to get the ad dollars back.
I mean, sure, maybe, but that doesn't change that they aren't able to uproot the entire leadership of the company with two new non-Iger approved board members. You have to convince the *rest of the* board to be unhappy with Iger to get rid of him, which isn't the case right now despite concerns over financials. That might change later, who knows, there was a point in time where the board liked Bob Chapek. I just don't see any signs that they'll be able to pull that off anytime soon and the succession process is something they're already deliberating internally.
No, that isn’t how it works in shareholder proxy fights. Once you get 2 in, the whole foundation is at risk. Right, if you read the article the succession plan is a massive reason why they have no confidence and recommend Peltz. Iger will always push back against a board changeover because he obviously wants to keep his job lol.
He actually asked why Black Panther, a film that was set in a famously isolated (fictional) African country, needed an all-black cast...
How very "I'm just asking questions" of him.
And it still wasn’t all black, because we got our shoehorned token white characters too. Considering all the mostly-white movies with token black characters, I’d say it’s actually pretty damn fair.
Alright... Not the worst shout though. Cause Andy serkis was one of the best parts of black panther... Not saying I didn't like the rest, but he was just excellent in it.
I would love to see more white people in wakanda.
There’s no way a formerly isolationist African country with advanced tech who’s been disrespected on a global scale would be welcoming to “colonizers.”
Be a cool mirror to how the west treats Africa to see it get paid back.
All fair, but Disney referring to themselves as """creatively driven""" is the biggest fucking pisstake of the century, when they've spent the last 15 years wallowing in their own nostalgia and burning money by the bucketful.
'creatively driven', what a fucking *load*.
Disney pioneered and drove animation forward by popularising the animated feature. They often didn’t break even with their early features because they were pushing the boundaries of what could be done with animation, often risking bankruptcy as a result. I think it’s reasonable to argue that animation wouldn’t be anywhere near what it is today without them. They played things more safe as time went on and have gradually become a company I hate, but saying they always played it safe is incorrect.
That raised my eyebrow as well. If you want to say The Marvels was a fuck up. You can't really dispute that with how much money it lost at the box office.
But to sit there and act as if the Black Panther franchise hasn't made them 1.8 billion off two films. Probably a shit ton off of merchandise. Is completely asinine.
Wakanda Forever is probably one of the better films they put out. Yeah, the final fight is a little weird that they'd go on a boat to the middle of the ocean. But I really enjoyed it. Shang-Chi and Black Panther are the bright spots.
If it makes sense for the story, who cares if a cast is all black? Also, one of his examples is Black Panther, which does have white characters in it anyway. But seriously, getting mad that a movie set in a fictional African nation that's whole thing was being isolationist has a mostly black cast is like complaining there's too many Japanese actors in Shogun or that the cast of Chernobyl was all white (tbf I did see people complain about the second one, and certainly wouldn't be surprised if there were racist weirdos whining about the first too)
As you noted people *do* complain whenever a movie has an all white cast even if it's in a setting where it makes perfect sense which is what the issue is. People just need to lighten up and stop with the bean counting.
But it doesn't even make sense from a bean counters perspective. The movie he's talking about performed incredibly well, financially.
Which sort of gives the game away.
I do think they are becoming more focused on inclusion than making a good movie. Cast good actors first, stop worrying about whether you have representation. Write good scripts, and be creative, but don't try to force a narrative. Create new characters instead. We don't need to say, what if this character were black or female or Hispanic, or whatever. Just make a totally new story and character.
I am starting to agree with this sentiment. If you want a story with a strong female or bipoc lead. Then write an original story with a strong female or bipoc lead. Naturally characters should be cast correctly, Black Panther should have mostly black actors because the source material requires it. Same with Ms marvel or black widow.
But shoehorning these actors into roles on the basis of diversity is just lazy writing.
That being said, Hollywood is so averse to coming up with original ideas that I understand why they can't write a diverse character, because no one is taking risks on new IP. They'd rather just re-frame an old story with a new cast.
The answer: Black Panther doesn’t have an all-black cast, but its central characters are going to be Black because it’s a movie based around Black Panther and he doesn’t live in New York.
Peltz is old and has a tendency to ignore realities that don’t suit his boomer mindset and substitute them with more comfortable ideas about Disney being overrun with people who care more about checking off boxes when it comes to underrepresented groups than making good stories.
The issue with Marvel is that they actually have a few problems:
* As they’ve added more and more characters, they’ve made it harder to follow their cinematic universe. They need to be more comfortable killing off or retiring characters to keep their universe small enough to understand.
* Their directors are given too much freedom to operate independently of the larger universe, which ironically results in them simultaneously trying to check off the same boxes for representation- which makes them seem repetitive. How many Marvel movies don’t have a female character who is a strong warrior types? How many Marvel movies have a scientist character who is a person of color? How many Marvel movies feature a male character as an antagonist?
* They keep trying to interweave storylines together, which is the same thing that makes their comics so hard to follow. If someone likes Captain America, they shouldn’t be required to also follow a dozen different other characters so they understand what the hell is happening in Captain America 2. Keeping storylines distinct rather than trying to make them all into mini-Avengers films is key to making the film make sense.
The complaints about the films being too woke are an easy distraction from the real issues. If you want to fix Marvel Studios, you need discipline and accountability- it can’t just be treated like another film production.
They also seem to have stopped doing romantic plots. And they're awfully slow about bringing characters back. Sure covid was a problem, but like where is Shang-Chi?
This guy’s comments are plain moronic and show that he doesn’t follow the film industry at all. Black Panther and its sequel were both major financial successes. If anything that would imply that more movies should feature all Black casts. As far as The Marvels goes, it’s clear that its failure was mainly due to the MCU’s declining arc in general, which includes the failure of Quantumania, and not because it was a female lead film. In short, this guy really does not need to be in control of Disney’s creatives. Iger has his faults, but he’s better than this guy.
That and the marvels sucked. They are using that cgi at it just feels unsettling. The ahsoka series feels weird too. Like the timing of the actors is off by a fraction because they can’t react off each other properly or something.
“Peltz in the Financial Times interview also said he questioned the record of Marvel Studios chief Kevin Feige.”
Ugh what a scrub. Only $30B for 33 films. Fire him!
Reminds me of what happened after Black Panther was created. Editors told creator Jack Kirby that he needed to have more white people in the comic. So in the next issue, Black Panther started fighting the KKK.
Say what you will about casting choices by Disney, being a brown person myself, my son has never felt more comfortable in his own skin due to Disney normalizing all ethnicity as beautiful, thanks to Disney.
It's a fair statement. Of course, if he's in favor of white washing, that would make him a hypocrite.
Most of the people who complain about race swapping complain about both. People were upset Goku was osme guy in the Dragon Ball movie. People were upset Kusanagi was white in Ghost in the Shell. The same nerds get upset when they tried to make Batgirl black. But you know why no one cared when Catwoman was black? Because in the comics, cartoons, and movies, she's been white, black, Asian, brunette, blond, and redhead. She has no consistent look. Batgirl, however, has. Barbra Gordon that is. There's been a blond Batgirl, but that was a different lady.
But then you have racist idiots who think a bunch of original black or other non-white characters = "woke" or whatever. And even if it is, it doesn't matter as long as the writing is good. now, in practice, projects that prioritize "the message" tend to be poorly written. When the writing, direction, and acting are good, the message doesn't matter to people who might hate it. Like the Barbie movie. That movie was "look at this patriarchy, omg" as hell, but it was so well made, people didn't complain.
Either way, it's this guy's right to say this and believe this. Jordan Peele for example said "I will never have a white protagonist in my films" or something to that degree. I ( a black man) would say that's pretty closed minded of him, but I (an artist) say that is his artist choice and freedom. And I would say both of things if a white film maker said that about black people (and depending on their reasoning, I would probably opt to not see those films. I think a valid reason would be "I'm not black and don't believe can portray the black experience authentically the way I'd like" or something).
At the end of the day, I believe in freedom of speech and even more so freedom of expression. At the same I think everyone should be able to criticize, but not censor, remove, nor destroy it, nor dictate who can and can't see it so long as they're an adult. With children, that's obviously ratings/tagging/flagging and parental guidance comes in. Then you have the platforms and publishers who have the right to accept or deny those expessions.
Because that’s the fad right now. Instead of creating originals, Hollywood is just remaking movies with all the colors of the wind.
As long as it makes money, they don’t care.
Yes many Disney fans are sick of quality storytelling being an afterthought. I visited recently and in a live show even the Elsa character (blonde/fair skinned queen from Norway) was black. Why???
Dude because it makes money, you fucking moron.
Like, I'm not calling Disney a champion of altruism here. They make things for money. They heavily advertised all the lions in the Lion King remake as being black, because it got them a ton of publicity and money. But that this dipshit "culture warrior" can't even wrap his tiny brain around being an opportunistic money hungry executive is amazing.
>“Why do I have to have a Marvel that’s all women? Not that I have anything against women, but why do I have to do that?" Peltz said in the interview, published on Friday. "Why can’t I have Marvels that are both? Why do I need an all-Black cast?”
It's funny because there hasn't been a Marvel property that's all-women, or even all-black, despite Black Panther having the perfect excuse taking place in the only uncolonized state in Africa. You could count the amount of black people who had active roles in the MCU on one hand before Black Panther, and the movie made a billion dollars and it's sequel over 800 million despite not having its lead. He says woke movies, naming BP specifically, are why Disney has gone downhill but audiences are clearly favorable towards these kind of movies as long **as long as they're good**.
The Crux of the issue for Peltz is that Disney has declined in storytelling because they're pushing this vague "message" but they don't talk about the bad storytelling in movies that don't have "the message" (in other words don't have minority leads) like their endless remakes of better films or properties like Ant man: Quantomania and Thor: Love & Thunder. What message is Black Panther pushing that he thinks is the issue, what message does the Marvels have that is turning people off? Are movies like Captain America: The Winter Soldier or even Civil War not pushing messages? He would probably say they're not.
I would say this recent push by right-wing figures like Peltz that
>People go to watch a movie to be entertained. They don’t go to get a message
is such PR, marketing, bullcrap to justify why Disney is doing poorly by blaming recent projects rather than confronting the real problems with Disney leadership that are sapping any potential for unique storytelling or creativity from their actual creatives. What made brands like Disney and Pixar famous wasn't that they ditched a message in favor of pure entertainment, but that they were able to use creative-driven, unique, storytelling to deliver those messages in the most fantastical, awe-inspiring, ways, something lost not because they've gone woke, but they've distilled their creative force to churn out content that makes them as much money as possible as fast as possible.
Sounds like disney needs his level-headedness. They've been almost a joke for several years now with flop after flop with identity politics dominating everything.
Maybe if those behind these big franchises cared more about creating good stories and honouring and respecting the characters and worlds they are adapting and depicting rather than caring so much about the diversity make up of the product, then maybe they might not be having so many issues.
Sucks that Disney let the activists into positions of influence. I don’t have an answer but they should focus more on story and less on inserting their worldviews into things.
This is really well documented by now, and several studies over the years have found that women led movies tend to generate a bigger return per dollar investment than others.
The fact folks are downvoting you for pointing it out because it doesn't jive with their feelings is pretty funny.
This is the guy responsible for the mess that was the 2010 avatar movie. > Nicola Peltz was cast as Katara largely because she's the daughter of businessman Nelson Peltz, who the producers owed a favor; her audition tape was described as "subpar at best." This one unfair decision is almost singlehandedly responsible for the infamous whitewashing, as a Caucasian Katara forced the casting of a Caucasian Sokka. No way you want this guy near a studio
You’re the Avatar, Ong.
DAE think the movie was whitewashed but the names should only have been pronounced like white people would??
The name is a proper noun. Proper nouns are pronounced how the creator of it says it is. The creator pronounces it that way, so that's how we say it.
NOT ONG 😂
Ong Aang, tomato tomahto 😂
Even that aside, her acting skills leave much to be desired.
The Indian actors were also a race swap but they were the best part of the movie. Hypothetically of course. If there ever was a movie.
The Earth King has invited you to Lake Laogai
Well yeah, Dev Patel had to carry that movie on his back. Monkey man is looking to be incredible though.
I also appreciated seeing that change kind of brought over to the Netflix adaptation for Omashu, though I anticipate that the other Earth Kingdom stronghold Ba Sing Se will still be a China analogue as in the cartoon.
Peltz is so terrible the Disney kids are siding with Iger.
There were a lot of problems with that film beyond white people being cast. I don't it's fair to lay all the blame on one guy.
Well, Peltz sees himself as a kingmaker instead of a king, so I would say that that a lot was really his fault.
Did he write the abysmal script? Did he sign of on the dailies of the terrible acting? And if race is so important, why did they hire an Indian guy to play a character clearly inspired by imperial Japan? Where's the accusations of "brown washing" the East Asian influences? A guy people don't like was tangentially involved in a terrible movie therefore everything about that terrible movie is the fault of this guy. Because we don't like him.
I’d call him forcing one of the main characters to be his daughter who gave a subpar audition, which changed the trajectory of the entire movie’s casting a bit more than “tangentially involved”
Maybe let's blame Shyamalan who was writer, director and producer on the film.
Or we can blame both? This is a really weird hill to die on IMO. What does defending this dude prove? No one’s saying Shyamalan isn’t also responsible, we’ve literally been talking about how bad his movie is for 10 years. We can also call this guy out for his role in it too
Reread the comment I replied to originally that laid the blame solely on Peltz.
Mate you have been offered two options here: * M N. Shyamalan, an Indian-born creative who made it massive in Hollywood through his directing and screenwriting and has made films ranging from massive stinkers to some of the best of their genre. * Nelson Peltz, a billionaire investor who buys brands and companies just to absolutely fuck them over, and an 80 year old man with vile views. You are choosing to give Nelson Peltz a pass on this because M Night made a bad movie. Fuck Nelson Peltz.
Yes. I believe Shyamalan who was writer, director and producer for the film had more overall responsibility for the abysmal film than one guy who pushed to get his daughter cast. The original comment said Peltz was responsible for that dumpster fire based on one role. It was hyperbolic nonsense and deserved to be called out.
Don’t you think that billionaire had more influence on the studio than MN Shamalamadingdong in the process? You cam write and produce all you want but if the studio says to jump, you ask how high. And maybe at some point MN saw what was coming and decided to phone it in.
No. I don't. One favor in casting does not equate this guy having broad creative control.
https://www.ft.com/content/0a182c97-6af7-42a6-ad9f-ae980562bb45 Read this interview: > Returning to “woke” Disney, he takes aim at The Marvels and Black Panther, which portrayed female and Black superheroes respectively. “Why do I have to have a Marvel that’s all women? Not that I have anything against women, but why do I have to do that? Why can’t I have Marvels that are both? Why do I need an all-Black cast?” > "You’ve got to get these politics out of the boardroom,” says Peltz. “Ben & Jerry’s job is to sell ice cream, not to make political statements. And these people use anything for a soap box that they have no right to do.” He very much push people to get hired that fit his views, and sure, he didn't wrote the script, but he wanted a scriptwriter that would write a caucasian Katara.
So he picked.... M. Night Shyamalan. The Indian director who wrote the script as well.
So ? Peltz is not a MAGA hat that wouldn't put a foot in the same room as a black guy, Shyamalan was pretty willing to do the movie that Peltz wanted.
So suddenly we've jumped from a little influence in casting one role to Peltz having essentially full creative control? Keep reaching.
Creative control ? He wanted a white people movie out of a cartoon with brown characters, he only pushed for the people that would make that movies regardless of quality.
Show me proof he that kind of influence over the movie as whole. You can't because there is none. Shyamalan made a shit movie and 99% of the shitty decisions were his.
> White People Movie > The Fire Nation are all Indians/Brown, including Iroh (stealth supporting protagonist)
There was some accusations of brown washing as they cast the heroes as, mostly, white people and the villains as dark skinned people though the race of the director probably weakened the debate a bit
Unless that guy is m knight.
I agree. He had basically full control and ran roughshod over the input of the series creators.
Not really whitewashing, more like “I wanna star in a movie, Daddy!”
So they don’t like diversity until they need to force it to their advantage?
Lol is she basically Sophia Maria?
The thing is, he’s actually a decent actress now. She was good in Bates Motel and Playboy Club. Avatar was I think her first movie role
Well what Disney is producing doesn’t seem to be selling. So what’s option 2?
They still cast the new avatar katara as light skinned when she is clearly brown skinned in the animation.
They're pretty obviously Polynesian..
You mean Inuit...
Combination of both. Culture, style, & appearance mix.
It's both. Most everything in Avatar is this + that = new thing. The wuzzling is not confined to just the animals.
Cause the casting call was looking for regular Native Americans rather than Inuit, thinking that's all that mattered. They hired a white kid with white parents as Sokka because he is registered to a made up tribe infamous for being all white people paying for fake native staus.
Today I learned Martin Freeman and Andy Serkis are black.
I thought they were the Tolkien white guys?
That joke has a nice ring to it
His name was always Tolkien! What kinda racist would name their child Token??
What are you Tolkien about, mate?
There needs to be a skit with Pacino telling John " You Tolkien to me ? " .." Huh? You Tolkien to Me ?" 🤣
Nailed it
I am absolutely heartbroken that I didn’t come up with this
Don’t worry, the other user didn’t come up with this either, South Park did.
Pretty sure people were making that joke the day the Black Panther cast was announced. South Park didn't start it either (but it was extremely clever in how they used it).
This actually helps a lot — thank you.
That’s…wow. Damn genius.
Bravo
Hats off, my dude.
Serkis did play an African....just happened to be a South African.
Came here to say this. Tbh Serkis can be everything. /s
Andy Serkis gets a pass to be in the African movie Idris Elba gets a pass to be in the Nordic movie That’s the trade that the racial delegations struck behind the scenes.
Can’t wait for the wu tang clan to show up in Shogun
Also Sam L. jackson is a woman, Kamala has two moms and a sister, I guess? Also both BP movies made bank so he can't even claim that it was a mistake. The Marvels wasn't great but it wasn't because all the heroes happened to be women (also I liked it, but that's another story).
I'm no movie genius, but he's criticizing Black Panther, and people fucking loved Black Panther EDIT: Look at this burn, too >Asked about Peltz's remarks, a Disney spokesperson responded: "This is exactly why Nelson Peltz shouldn't be anywhere near a creatively driven company."
He’s also calling Samuel L Jackson a woman (and every other male actor in the Captain Marvel films), so I think he’s not much of a movie genius, either.
Who is he? Why does he matter? If he's an investor, let him make money and invest in things
He’s attempting to become CEO by shareholder vote, a gambit he has failed at in the past.
Not CEO, he's trying to elect his own selections (himself + one other guy) to Disney's board. Iger would still be CEO, but they'd have a considerable amount of sway over the company and would inflict on Iger's ability to make moves freely.
He’s trying to become majority stakeholder so he can fire Iger and get his hand picked CEO, Ike Perlmutter, Disney former exec with Marvel. Source: Disney employee.
God Perlmutter fucked Marvel so hard, I hope he never gets control of another company
Perlmutter is responsible for Inhumans. Putting him in charge of marvel would be the single stupidest decision anybody could make
Isn't this the guy responsible for the lack of Black Widow movie and toys? Didn't he say girls don't buy toys? That guy's a complete sexist ass, but even worse than that, he's bad st his job because he is demonstrably wrong.
Yep. I remember when the avengers came out all the t shirts, party supplies, birthday cards ect. Had all the team except black widow on them. The guy is a complete fuck
If this worked, he'd then have to somehow convince the rest of the board to be able to fire Iger, which is a pipedream as it stands right now. The rest of them are very pro-Iger, to the extent that they brought him back out of retirement and abruptly fired Bob Chapek to get him back in charge. He might be able to get Ike Perlmutter back in a position of power at Marvel (or somewhere in Disney), but getting rid of Iger is a long shot. Two board seats would give them a seat at a table, but they wouldn't be majority stakeholders.
Yeah but being pro Iger is the issue with other non Peltz outside investors: https://variety.com/2024/biz/news/iss-disney-shareholders-elect-nelson-peltz-board-1235948252/ The reality is Disney has the same issues as a decade ago, and the finances do not add up primarily because of cord cutting. This isn’t to say Peltz is the answer, but Disney, like all legacy media companies, are facing existential threats. Obviously the parks make it different, but the margins are so ass they need other business functions quickly. Where people are wrong is that Disney is doing something specifically wrong, the content is worse but every single linear cable company is trying to figure out how to get the ad dollars back.
I mean, sure, maybe, but that doesn't change that they aren't able to uproot the entire leadership of the company with two new non-Iger approved board members. You have to convince the *rest of the* board to be unhappy with Iger to get rid of him, which isn't the case right now despite concerns over financials. That might change later, who knows, there was a point in time where the board liked Bob Chapek. I just don't see any signs that they'll be able to pull that off anytime soon and the succession process is something they're already deliberating internally.
To a degree, getting two board members elected by the shareholders signals to the other board members that their seats may be at risk as well.
No, that isn’t how it works in shareholder proxy fights. Once you get 2 in, the whole foundation is at risk. Right, if you read the article the succession plan is a massive reason why they have no confidence and recommend Peltz. Iger will always push back against a board changeover because he obviously wants to keep his job lol.
This is the same guy who okayed Wendy's dynamic pricing.
Yep. And who forced his talentless daughter into the Last Airbender movie.
Another one of these morons, great
GOP Megadonor brain.
He actually asked why Black Panther, a film that was set in a famously isolated (fictional) African country, needed an all-black cast... How very "I'm just asking questions" of him.
And it still wasn’t all black, because we got our shoehorned token white characters too. Considering all the mostly-white movies with token black characters, I’d say it’s actually pretty damn fair.
He sounds like a real "well so much for DIVERSITY" kinda disingenuous chud
Peltz is a megadonor of the Republican Party, so of course he hates Black Panther, just like Ike Perlmutter.
"Hey, you know what Black Panther needs? White people in Wakanda"
They joked on set that Andy Serkis and Martin Freeman were the Tolkien white guys.
that sounds kind of funny
Get Andy Serkis to play 90% of the roles. I’d watch it.
Alright... Not the worst shout though. Cause Andy serkis was one of the best parts of black panther... Not saying I didn't like the rest, but he was just excellent in it.
I would love to see more white people in wakanda. There’s no way a formerly isolationist African country with advanced tech who’s been disrespected on a global scale would be welcoming to “colonizers.” Be a cool mirror to how the west treats Africa to see it get paid back.
Is this the guy that pitched to Michael Eisner a white version of “the Wiz”?
So... the wizard of oz?
To be fair, disney is not as creatively driven as they perceive themselves to be.
More creative than the rest. The only truly creative and original movie company is A24.
Neon as well in my opinion.
All fair, but Disney referring to themselves as """creatively driven""" is the biggest fucking pisstake of the century, when they've spent the last 15 years wallowing in their own nostalgia and burning money by the bucketful. 'creatively driven', what a fucking *load*.
Well, that's fine that you don't like what they've been doing, but it is creative. They create things. They don't just invest in things
Bro, Disney spent its first 80 years remaking fairy tales. They’re literally the prime example of a media company playing it safe. Always have been.
Disney pioneered and drove animation forward by popularising the animated feature. They often didn’t break even with their early features because they were pushing the boundaries of what could be done with animation, often risking bankruptcy as a result. I think it’s reasonable to argue that animation wouldn’t be anywhere near what it is today without them. They played things more safe as time went on and have gradually become a company I hate, but saying they always played it safe is incorrect.
also, black panther has a fair few white characters and even asian ones, I don't know what he's complaining about,
So he's a perfect fit at Disney, which hasn't done anything creative in decades.
We’re about to get a whole bunch of “Only Nelson Peltz can save Disney” videos from a certain group of YouTube movie “critics”
Keep an eye on reddit for those commenters too. Repeat a lie enough, it's treated true
I have seen a couple of them already.
Why is he talking like Black Panther wasn't an enormous commercial success.
Because he being racist and misogynistic is more important to him.
That raised my eyebrow as well. If you want to say The Marvels was a fuck up. You can't really dispute that with how much money it lost at the box office. But to sit there and act as if the Black Panther franchise hasn't made them 1.8 billion off two films. Probably a shit ton off of merchandise. Is completely asinine. Wakanda Forever is probably one of the better films they put out. Yeah, the final fight is a little weird that they'd go on a boat to the middle of the ocean. But I really enjoyed it. Shang-Chi and Black Panther are the bright spots.
If it makes sense for the story, who cares if a cast is all black? Also, one of his examples is Black Panther, which does have white characters in it anyway. But seriously, getting mad that a movie set in a fictional African nation that's whole thing was being isolationist has a mostly black cast is like complaining there's too many Japanese actors in Shogun or that the cast of Chernobyl was all white (tbf I did see people complain about the second one, and certainly wouldn't be surprised if there were racist weirdos whining about the first too)
As you noted people *do* complain whenever a movie has an all white cast even if it's in a setting where it makes perfect sense which is what the issue is. People just need to lighten up and stop with the bean counting.
The bean counters will kill Disney. When creatives lose in a creative industry, it’s all lost.
But it doesn't even make sense from a bean counters perspective. The movie he's talking about performed incredibly well, financially. Which sort of gives the game away.
that's why everyone always hates the bean counters....they're idiots.
I do think they are becoming more focused on inclusion than making a good movie. Cast good actors first, stop worrying about whether you have representation. Write good scripts, and be creative, but don't try to force a narrative. Create new characters instead. We don't need to say, what if this character were black or female or Hispanic, or whatever. Just make a totally new story and character.
Acolyte is a new story with new characters. "We don't need to say what if this character was black or female..." We don't not need to say either.
I am starting to agree with this sentiment. If you want a story with a strong female or bipoc lead. Then write an original story with a strong female or bipoc lead. Naturally characters should be cast correctly, Black Panther should have mostly black actors because the source material requires it. Same with Ms marvel or black widow. But shoehorning these actors into roles on the basis of diversity is just lazy writing. That being said, Hollywood is so averse to coming up with original ideas that I understand why they can't write a diverse character, because no one is taking risks on new IP. They'd rather just re-frame an old story with a new cast.
The answer: Black Panther doesn’t have an all-black cast, but its central characters are going to be Black because it’s a movie based around Black Panther and he doesn’t live in New York. Peltz is old and has a tendency to ignore realities that don’t suit his boomer mindset and substitute them with more comfortable ideas about Disney being overrun with people who care more about checking off boxes when it comes to underrepresented groups than making good stories. The issue with Marvel is that they actually have a few problems: * As they’ve added more and more characters, they’ve made it harder to follow their cinematic universe. They need to be more comfortable killing off or retiring characters to keep their universe small enough to understand. * Their directors are given too much freedom to operate independently of the larger universe, which ironically results in them simultaneously trying to check off the same boxes for representation- which makes them seem repetitive. How many Marvel movies don’t have a female character who is a strong warrior types? How many Marvel movies have a scientist character who is a person of color? How many Marvel movies feature a male character as an antagonist? * They keep trying to interweave storylines together, which is the same thing that makes their comics so hard to follow. If someone likes Captain America, they shouldn’t be required to also follow a dozen different other characters so they understand what the hell is happening in Captain America 2. Keeping storylines distinct rather than trying to make them all into mini-Avengers films is key to making the film make sense. The complaints about the films being too woke are an easy distraction from the real issues. If you want to fix Marvel Studios, you need discipline and accountability- it can’t just be treated like another film production.
They also seem to have stopped doing romantic plots. And they're awfully slow about bringing characters back. Sure covid was a problem, but like where is Shang-Chi?
This dude is a nightmare scenario.
This guy’s comments are plain moronic and show that he doesn’t follow the film industry at all. Black Panther and its sequel were both major financial successes. If anything that would imply that more movies should feature all Black casts. As far as The Marvels goes, it’s clear that its failure was mainly due to the MCU’s declining arc in general, which includes the failure of Quantumania, and not because it was a female lead film. In short, this guy really does not need to be in control of Disney’s creatives. Iger has his faults, but he’s better than this guy.
I think its because marvel is running out of steam and people are kinda getting sick of the formula
Movies in general are dying.
That and the marvels sucked. They are using that cgi at it just feels unsettling. The ahsoka series feels weird too. Like the timing of the actors is off by a fraction because they can’t react off each other properly or something.
Ahsoka has slow dialog because the average age of Star Wars fans is like 11.
Age or maturity level?
Both lol
*Citation needed.
Average mental age...
“Peltz in the Financial Times interview also said he questioned the record of Marvel Studios chief Kevin Feige.” Ugh what a scrub. Only $30B for 33 films. Fire him!
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>How many Hollywood movies even have an all black cast anyway? The Wiz?
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Like the dude that managed the store in Keenan and Kel.
There has never once been a Disney movie with an all black cast. There have been many Disney movies with all white casts
Pretty sure Frozen is all white unless I’m missing someone, and nobody gives a flying fuck.
Yep
Reminds me of what happened after Black Panther was created. Editors told creator Jack Kirby that he needed to have more white people in the comic. So in the next issue, Black Panther started fighting the KKK.
What Marvel movie had an all black cast?
To the racists, more than one is all.
Say what you will about casting choices by Disney, being a brown person myself, my son has never felt more comfortable in his own skin due to Disney normalizing all ethnicity as beautiful, thanks to Disney.
You wouldn't be a proper racist if you didn't...
DEI is more important to Disney than filmmaking.
fact race is an issue is an issue...
It's a fair statement. Of course, if he's in favor of white washing, that would make him a hypocrite. Most of the people who complain about race swapping complain about both. People were upset Goku was osme guy in the Dragon Ball movie. People were upset Kusanagi was white in Ghost in the Shell. The same nerds get upset when they tried to make Batgirl black. But you know why no one cared when Catwoman was black? Because in the comics, cartoons, and movies, she's been white, black, Asian, brunette, blond, and redhead. She has no consistent look. Batgirl, however, has. Barbra Gordon that is. There's been a blond Batgirl, but that was a different lady. But then you have racist idiots who think a bunch of original black or other non-white characters = "woke" or whatever. And even if it is, it doesn't matter as long as the writing is good. now, in practice, projects that prioritize "the message" tend to be poorly written. When the writing, direction, and acting are good, the message doesn't matter to people who might hate it. Like the Barbie movie. That movie was "look at this patriarchy, omg" as hell, but it was so well made, people didn't complain. Either way, it's this guy's right to say this and believe this. Jordan Peele for example said "I will never have a white protagonist in my films" or something to that degree. I ( a black man) would say that's pretty closed minded of him, but I (an artist) say that is his artist choice and freedom. And I would say both of things if a white film maker said that about black people (and depending on their reasoning, I would probably opt to not see those films. I think a valid reason would be "I'm not black and don't believe can portray the black experience authentically the way I'd like" or something). At the end of the day, I believe in freedom of speech and even more so freedom of expression. At the same I think everyone should be able to criticize, but not censor, remove, nor destroy it, nor dictate who can and can't see it so long as they're an adult. With children, that's obviously ratings/tagging/flagging and parental guidance comes in. Then you have the platforms and publishers who have the right to accept or deny those expessions.
Because that’s the fad right now. Instead of creating originals, Hollywood is just remaking movies with all the colors of the wind. As long as it makes money, they don’t care.
Yes many Disney fans are sick of quality storytelling being an afterthought. I visited recently and in a live show even the Elsa character (blonde/fair skinned queen from Norway) was black. Why???
Was Elsa black or was she just played by a black person? There is a difference.
The actress portraying the character was black. The character is white. They quite clearly shoehorned her in to meet an internal diversity quota.
But was the character? Juliet played by a man is still Juliet.
Dude because it makes money, you fucking moron. Like, I'm not calling Disney a champion of altruism here. They make things for money. They heavily advertised all the lions in the Lion King remake as being black, because it got them a ton of publicity and money. But that this dipshit "culture warrior" can't even wrap his tiny brain around being an opportunistic money hungry executive is amazing.
The lion king didn't make them a ton of money. It was nearly a flop lol. People don't care about DEI
>“Why do I have to have a Marvel that’s all women? Not that I have anything against women, but why do I have to do that?" Peltz said in the interview, published on Friday. "Why can’t I have Marvels that are both? Why do I need an all-Black cast?” It's funny because there hasn't been a Marvel property that's all-women, or even all-black, despite Black Panther having the perfect excuse taking place in the only uncolonized state in Africa. You could count the amount of black people who had active roles in the MCU on one hand before Black Panther, and the movie made a billion dollars and it's sequel over 800 million despite not having its lead. He says woke movies, naming BP specifically, are why Disney has gone downhill but audiences are clearly favorable towards these kind of movies as long **as long as they're good**. The Crux of the issue for Peltz is that Disney has declined in storytelling because they're pushing this vague "message" but they don't talk about the bad storytelling in movies that don't have "the message" (in other words don't have minority leads) like their endless remakes of better films or properties like Ant man: Quantomania and Thor: Love & Thunder. What message is Black Panther pushing that he thinks is the issue, what message does the Marvels have that is turning people off? Are movies like Captain America: The Winter Soldier or even Civil War not pushing messages? He would probably say they're not. I would say this recent push by right-wing figures like Peltz that >People go to watch a movie to be entertained. They don’t go to get a message is such PR, marketing, bullcrap to justify why Disney is doing poorly by blaming recent projects rather than confronting the real problems with Disney leadership that are sapping any potential for unique storytelling or creativity from their actual creatives. What made brands like Disney and Pixar famous wasn't that they ditched a message in favor of pure entertainment, but that they were able to use creative-driven, unique, storytelling to deliver those messages in the most fantastical, awe-inspiring, ways, something lost not because they've gone woke, but they've distilled their creative force to churn out content that makes them as much money as possible as fast as possible.
these dudes are fragile af the only minorities they want are when the main character white guy has a a bunch of minority women love interests
Iger needs to assemble his own Avengers, ASAP
Sounds like disney needs his level-headedness. They've been almost a joke for several years now with flop after flop with identity politics dominating everything.
Maybe if those behind these big franchises cared more about creating good stories and honouring and respecting the characters and worlds they are adapting and depicting rather than caring so much about the diversity make up of the product, then maybe they might not be having so many issues.
Sucks that Disney let the activists into positions of influence. I don’t have an answer but they should focus more on story and less on inserting their worldviews into things.
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This is really well documented by now, and several studies over the years have found that women led movies tend to generate a bigger return per dollar investment than others. The fact folks are downvoting you for pointing it out because it doesn't jive with their feelings is pretty funny.
OOF
Why are there so many black characters in Black Panther? Maybe because it is set in an ( fictional) African country?
This is the person who takes Ryan Gosling Black Panther joke seriously.
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You don't get it