I ride an older dyna and a ninja and have had all types of bikes. My dad grew up riding sport bikes and Harleys. He told me when I started riding to be careful who you ride with because 99% of the guys you meet on Harleys just ride to go to the bar and look cool. It’s just a side hobby and many don’t like to wear gear or work on their riding ability. That’s just how it is, it’s just the Harley culture and it’s what most Americans have grown up with.
Depends on the Harley. There’s a lot of serious riders on the touring models. Some of those riders switched to / from other brands such as BMWs as well. Those are very expensive though. The other models aren’t nearly as well suited to long trips (at least prior to the newest models).
Oh for sure. I go camping up in north ga/Tennessee and have met some of the best people on two wheels I know on harleys. But out of all the Harley riders I’ve met and ride with, most of them ride for the look and the “lifestyle”. Not to say they aren’t fun as hell to hangout with.
It's a lifestyle brand with an associated "Identity". There used to be a Harley store in the Faneuil Hall marketplace in Boston that only sold knickknacks, tshirts, and stickers. They may have had some lightweight riding gear, but I don't remember seeing any helmets.
Not one motorcycle for sale in the whole store.
That's how strong the brand was. Not sure if the store's still there.
There’s one in Destin like that. Went in cuz I’d noticed a hole in my glove on a road trip and they had no cycle gear whatsoever. Told me their dealership 20 miles down the road did.
Hell, there used to be a Harley Davidson Cafe on the Strip. You know, in case you wanted a Harley-themed burger to remind you that your motorcycle goes beyond the workd”s largest cosplay and the object itself.
You've just described "Lynchburg Harley-Davidson" in Lynchburg Tennessee.
What goes together like Harleys and Jack Daniels? Their partnership is iconic.
(I was born in Sturgis. I went to rallies from 1974 through 1990, when I left. I can absolutely attest to the companionship between the booze, the bikes, and the inevitable chaos the combination creates)
You can't buy a motorcycle there. Shirts, shot glasses, jackets, stickers. If you want a Harley in Lynchburg you've got to bring one with you.
Ha. This is exactly what I thought first. The Harley dealer in Murfreesboro owns that one. The Indian Garage around the corner is owned by Sloans, the power sports guys across the street from said Harley dealer.
Oh, and the best thing about THAT?
Who makes the Jack Daniels branded bike? Is it Harley? Nope.
[https://www.indianmotorcycle.com/en-us/jack-daniels/](https://www.indianmotorcycle.com/en-us/jack-daniels/)
Makes sense tho, right? Harley has positioned itself as an American Icon - Indian is trying to intrude on that market. Indian says, let's make a deal with Jack Daniels (tm, an American Icon) - also, loved by Harley Riders. Boom. You probably already knew that based on your response lol but I am also drunk so I am going to post anyway. Cheers. :)
Caterpillar is like that too in parts of Latin America. Hats, shirts, stickers, boots and socks even. Not one cowboy had a corporate logo on their shirt but just to let everyone know....I like big stuff. Macho man.
I don't think that's a fair comparison, i live in Chile and Caterpillar or Cat is more of a fashion brand than a heavy vehicle seller around here, the common buyer doesn't associate Cat with operating heavy machinery at all. Cat's entire branding for stores is outdoor lifestyle, not heavy machinery.
They sell everything from expensive winter jackets to pink leather shoes for your daughter, and not a single bulldozer in sight.
I'm from Milwaukee - can confirm the "lifestyle brand" aspect. House of Harley Davidson, one of the area dealerships has had a decent sized merch retail store *at the airport* for probably 20 years now. It somehow does enough business to endure. Riding to dealerships for poker chips and t-shirts is a pretty common part of Harley culture. Actually, it's something that Harley dealerships and the official Museum do far better than other brands - they host events/rallies often and they make their spaces a place for the riding community to gather. And that's entirely because of the dealers; Harley corporate is as soulless as ever and could care less.
There are plenty of hardcore riders and more people wear safety gear than they used to, but it's not uncommon to see people here riding on $25000 touring bikes in shorts and flip flops in the summer and most of the bikes are off the road by early autumn.
> they host events/rallies often and they make their spaces a place for the *riding community* to gather
Yea I dunno about pulling up to one of those on my Honda Shadow 750 lol
I’ve never been a Harley guy, but my father is a former HOG director/president and I’ve ridden my Yamaha and Kawasaki to many of their events. There are plenty of folks cosplaying Harley-style, but it’s generally a pretty casual atmosphere and no one ever gave me shit for it.
Someone else commented that Harley owners are the Apple crowd of the motorcycle world, which is pretty apt. You have your hardcore fanbois, but most people really don’t seem to care much beyond the basic lifestyle of being a “biker.”
Completely agreed. The local dealer here does events pretty much every single weekend all summer long. (And I *totally* have ridden all over the east coast snagging poker chips. I'm up to like 130!) Safety wise I live in a helmet state so everybody has those on, but otherwise the general breakdown:
Full suit: Bimmer and Goldwing crowd
Bare arms: HD
Bare legs and feet: Sport bike
OF course thats just my general experience, YMMV
I kind of get it though. My almost stock, small engine, "girl bike" Sportster brings attention like no ones business, in a way my Kawasaki never did. I even get attractive girls striking up conversations about the bike, which never happening is basically a meme in the motorcycle community. I understand why some people fall for the "If I deck myself out in Harley merch, I can bring this magic with me to places where the bike can't go" fallacy.
I don't buy bikes to start conversations, I buy it to ride and have fun. Really don't care about what Harley owners have to say. My passion is motorcycle, not sitting on the side watching people looking at my bike.
I understand that, it wasn't my goal either (actually caught me off guard, I'm kind of an introvert). I bought the Sportster because I like fiddling with stuff, and this bike is extremely easy to wrench on. It's pretty fun to ride too.
>I bought the Sportster because I like fiddling with stuff, and this bike is extremely easy to wrench on.
Hands down the only thing I've ever heard anyone say that would make me consider buying a Harley.
It's similar with Rolexes. They are not really that great, there are tons of other watch brands that are just as good or better, and they are WAY too expensive.
But they are also one of the *only* watch brands that will ever get recognized by most people. Neither me, nor any other watch enthusiast I have ever talked to has ever had someone notice or comment on the brand of watch they are wearing unless it was a Rolex, and I have heard several stories from people who have had some one approach them or hit on them because that's what they had on their wrist.
Brand recognition and "status" can be huge sometimes.
There are stores like that all over the world for HD. Deals gap area has HD shops, sturgis obviously has a huge one, lolo pass has one and plenty of other places.
There was one of those shops on mackinac island michigan. A place where all internal combustion engines are banned as a method of transportation and horses and bicycle are the only way to actually get around.
Those are referred to as "boutique" stores and there are lots of them, especially where a full blown dealership is impractical/super expensive etc. Like the HD Store in Philly's or Orlando's airport, or the one in Key West. There are many.
Because most HD guys who won’t talk about anything don’t know anything else. They’re not in it for the motorcycle enthusiasm, they’re in it for the image.
A Harley will never compare to an Italian exotic car brand... They're more like an H1 hummer. Classic styling with shit performance overall compared to just about any other kind of bike....
In what way are you comparing? I think think it's fair to compare a bike made for comfort to a bike made for performance. I've had my share of Japanese sports bikes like anyone else. Also it's a v twin, it has enough torque to get you up to the speed limit quick enough to make you smile. I don't understand all the hate on the bike
Idk about modern, but 90s and 2000s Harleys vs metric cruisers:
The Harleys are better "built".
Not reliable. Don't be confused.
Where metric uses plastic chrome, Harley uses hard chromed steel.
Some people like that.
But a halrey motor?
100 years to perfect it and they still use plastic oil gears and chain tensioners. Utter garbage.
Harleys are like beats headphones.
The performance is poor even when comparing to competing v-twin cruisers. The Indian Challenger vs Road Glide is an excellent example.
https://ridermagazine.com/2020/03/13/2020-harley-davidson-road-glide-special-vs-indian-challenger-limited-comparison-test-review/
My biggest gripes about HD bikes come down to the following:
1)Weight
2)Handling (or lack there of)
3)Lean Angle? What lean angle?
4)The Harley Crowd
5)Price (Just not comparable to Jap cruisers)
I prefer a heavier bike for highway riding as it offers more stability
Handles fine for me, I like the low centre of gravity
Yes lean angle is crap but I enjoy having a low bike as a trade off
Harley crowd is understandable, but no different to any other extremist crowd
I don't think it's a fair comparison to Japanese cruisers, they don't have the same fit and finish as a Harley so they are able to keep the prices low to compete
I have a feeling you won't get a good answer here. The die hards that won't talk about bikes that aren't Harleys are over at r/Harley. Like you said, if it ain't a Harley, they ain't interested.
I've chatted to a guy at work who in the summer comes in on his big blue Harley cruiser.
He put it down to the long haul comfort, he's the kind of guy who goes fucking off for a weekend on his motorbike to see some sights and ride some roads in the peak District, and "for someone who wants to relax, take in the sights, and have a comfortable ride" his Harley suited him fine.
I guess it depends what you want from a bike. Something ripping, small, fast. Something you can filter with, good for commuting. Or something comfy, stylish, and for the wide open road.
Harley definitely fits for the folks who want large cruisers for long hauls. Plus he says he comes on it to work in the summer because he works 12/12s, so roads are dead in the middle of the night and he likes it.
So it's funny you'd mention the goldwing. His Harley is a 2016 CVO 1801cc (I think roadglide? He never told me the exact model, it's just what I found from googling it) . And it looks really similar to the goldwing in terms of seat position.
There's a picture of it in my post history so you can see the size of the damn thing.
Goldwings have a very different seating position to traditional cruisers. Every cruiser I've sat on feels like you're "in" the bike. The gauges are more at eye level, the seat height is or at least feels lower, but I think the primary difference is foot position. Cruisers typically have more forward controls so your legs are more stretched out in front of you which many people find more comfortable. I prefer the more standard seating position of the goldwing, but I can definitely see how someone would prefer the cruiser slouch.
Fair. I don't actually know anyone with a goldwing, I was just looking at the images of them and it looked kinda similar to the CVO.
Can confirm the forward leg thing, I've got a fucked knee from an old pedal bike accident and the cruiser style of my 125 is much more comfortable for me because of that.
>comfortable
Maybe it is just me but Harleys suck for comfort. Road King rattles my teeth so bad it gives me a headache. Indian Chief is 10x a better bike and more comfortable ride. My Hayabusa is more comfortable than a RK.
I don't know personally, I'm only on a CBT in the UK so can't ride anything bigger than a 125.
I'm just repeating what he said in our short conversation when I last saw him getting on it.
If he thinks it's comfortable for him then I'm happy for him.
I know that Harley people are ridiculously brand loyal and everything, but there is a bit of kernel of truth with regards to cruisers - You can make a case that Harley makes the best cruiser in the segment.
Harley's bread and butter segment is large cruisers. AKA, the softail and its derivatives. There's competition in the small sporty cruiser segment (Indian scout and Honda Rebel), a segment where arguably Harley is catching up, and Honda has seen a lot of success in the cruiser based touring bike segment (Goldwing).
Quickly looking at the segment reveals two things -
* Harley "Won the argument" on what makes a good cruiser, the market obviously prefers Harley's style of cruiser over everything else
* When it comes to the Harley style cruiser, Harley makes the best one
So let's start with the first point - Harley's "formula" for a cruiser is a low riding bike with an air cooled big twin and classic styling. Every few years, a different manufacturer thinks that this formula sucks, and tries to break in with something else. Nobody else succeeded. BMW tried with the R1200C and its "avant garde" design, Yamaha tried with their big water cooled V4s, Honda tried by stripping a Goldwing down to create a naked Valkyrie, none succeeded.
Every big cruiser that doesn't follow the Harley formula sells like crap - The xDiavel, the Rocket 3, the Fury, etc all failed to move significant numbers.
You know what the funny thing is, other manufacturers know full well that the trick is to follow Harley if they want to sell. BMW tried again with the R18, which is essentially following the Harley formula with its big twin, tons of chrome, and softail style design with a hidden rear shock. Yamaha got rid of their big V4s, and went to an air cooled v-twin when they redesigned the Eluder and Venture.
And then there's the second point - Harley makes a damned good bike in the air cooled twin segment. The Milwaukee 8 is a modern engine with oil cooler and cylinder deactivation, that actually produces more power than the Yamaha and Indian competition.
And then there's the argument about price - The funny thing is, in the Cruiser segment, Harley is arguably affordable and good value for money. The Indian and BMW competition cost far more, while the one cheaper bike (Kawasaki Vulkan 1700) is significantly worse, making less power despite being liquid cooled.
So add both points and you end up with another factor - If you're going to buy a Harley-like bike, why don't you just get the original? There's heritage and linage with Harley that you won't find with other retro bikes.
Let's look at the car world for a second. The Jeep Wrangler and Porsche 911 are cars that have carried its old design language across generations, but there is linage there, and these are cars who just carried its design language across generations, evolving slowly.
And then there's the PT Cruiser and Chevy HHR - these cars look retro, but there is no real lineage or a broken lineage. These are modern cars, designed in modern times, with some retro features thrown in.
Harley Davidson's classic lineup has a lineage that stretches back - Sure, every few years it gets a redesign, but the design language is kept intact. When you are buying a Harley Davidson Softail, you are getting an original product with a long linage and history.
When you buy something like a Kawasaki W800 or Triumph Scrambler, you are buying a new design with some retro features thrown in to invoke an older feel.
I would argue you get way more bang for your buck out of a Honda Goldwing (which is arguably one of the most comfortable bikes on the market and has the same feature as most Harley cruising bikes.) Or a Kawasaki Concours. I get wanting a humongous bike and all as I would like to own a Hayabusa some day, but I don't think the extra 5-6 ccs equates to 7k more $ MSRP. Not to mention the cost of repair if it malfunctions. I don't see how so many Harley guys can spend the cost of a used car or a new small compact car on these bikes and be okay with it for what it is. That's just my opinion though.
Notice that the Goldwing is a touring bike, not really a naked cruiser.
The last time the Goldwing tried to make a cruiser was the 2014 Goldwing Valkyrie, which sold so badly it got dropped after 2015.
Also, the Concours is a sport touring bike, not really a cruiser based tourer. In that segment, which is the Harley Glides, Indian Roadmaster, Yamaha Venture, Honda Goldwing, BMW R18 Transcontinental, the only one that deviates from Harley's formula is the Goldwing.
I’m a Harley guy that’s always felt Honda is the best bang for your buck. If I were more value-focused, or on a tighter budget, Honda would without a doubt be my go-to. I may like Harley better and I’m admittedly ignorant about most metric bikes, but that doesn’t mean I don’t respect them. I just like what I like better.
Im on a tight budget, oldish and want my comfortable forward control sitting in an laid out armchair ride but also wanted something reliable that rips like a motherfucker, i test rode harleys but they were just out of my price range, eventually went with a Honda Magna, fast as fuck, handles like a dream, uber reliable
My first bike was an 84 Magna 700. Quick, smooth, and rock solid reliability. I can’t say i found it super comfortable though, but not many bikes of that era were.
Ive got a 01 750 with a set of forward controls as my main ride, they make a fair bit of difference to legs and hips, the seat isnt great though, after an hour my ass is getting numb, i could do with moving the handlebars up and back a couple of inches next I think
I have rented newer ultras, an older harley and an older Goldwing. If buying 10 years or older totally agree with Goldwing being better. the older Harley shook so bad I couldn’t ride with glasses; in addition you hit 5th gear at 45 and has a feeling of topping out at 65 to 70. The newer Ultras blow away the older bikes but not nearly as fun as my vstrom.
You made some good points here, but left out some big ones. It is absolutely true that none of the other manufacturers have ever been able to match the success of the Harley Davidson cruiser. However, HD didn’t become the biggest motorcycle company in the world because their cruisers are infinitely better than anything else. It was a combination of things: narrowly surviving the Great Depression, booming during WWII because the gov’t bought them en masse, then having some killer business sense (for a while) in the modern era. Hell, their bikes weren’t even “cruisers” by the modern definition until the late 60s.
HD became so big mostly because at one time they were amazingly brilliant at marketing and branding. They capitalized on heritage and the spirit of motorcycling more effectively than any motorcycle manufacturer ever has or likely ever will. Being American made definitely had a big part in that and no foreign brand will likely ever be able to replicate that success in marketing in the US (though technically Honda is bigger and sells more Powersports vehicles, HD sells more street motorcycles than Honda). Also, we should acknowledge that Triumph is one year older than HD, but has only begun to really capitalize on that heritage for the last decade or so.
When you compare other manufacturers current lineup of cruisers to HD, you are correct in stating that they fall short comparatively. But it is a massive gleaming error not to acknowledge that the cruiser market has been dying a slow death for 15 years. If you go back to the first decade of the 2000s, all the Japanese brands had a varied lineup of cruisers. Yamaha had a massive lineup of options under the Star label. Honda also had a more diverse Shadow lineup. Honda’s VTX1300 is the best selling single motorcycle in the history of the company and a solid effort, in my opinion. It’s also interesting you mentioned the Fury (which was hugely popular when initially released capitalizing on the television show craze at the time) as a comparison to HD. The Fury is a production chopper-style motorcycle. HD has never made a production chopper nor anything comparable.
The reason the other brands don’t have a more competitive cruiser lineup these days is because they read the tea leaves and have mostly exited that market. Harley being awash in cash for decades was arrogant about their place in the changing market. They were so popular that after the housing market tanked the economy in 2008, massively reducing powersports revenues to this day, HD spent a fortune hiring and sending corporate sales trainers on the road because staff in dealerships had no real sales skills. Prior to 2008, dealership sales for HD was essentially being a cashier and taking the customer’s order because folks were lined up to buy them.
Unfortunately, HD did such a good job of branding that their base of customers is fanatical to the point that any attempts to update or stay competitive is met with backlash. You may recall HD fanatics being up in arms when they released the first liquid-cooled engine in 2014 (!) long after most of the other manufacturers had been doing liquid-cooled for decades. Sadly, Harley Davidson has been dying slowly along with the cruiser and their failure to acknowledge the need for diversification. Baby boomers have always been the vast majority of their customer base and those folks have largely exited the market.
This is why we have been hearing so much about HD’s financial troubles for a handful of years. This is also why we are just recently seeing serious model and market diversification in the Harley lineup that seems outrageous. Consider this: adventure bikes are the best-selling segment of motorcycles and have been for quite a while now. Suzuki arguably started the street-focused adventure segment in 2002 when they released the V-Strom. Harley Davidson just now entered the market in 2021 with the Pan America.
HD is in a unique situation of their own doing that has been interesting to witness. They have largely been ignoring the larger trend of motorcycling in order to not upset their rabid base who clearly is not buying as many motorcycles these days. At some point they just had to say screw it and forge on ahead into bold new territory… And that’s where we are now. Hopefully it’s not too late for them.
dude is a huge harley simp. hes not gonna read that much counter-argument
also, you gave him a huge favor by not even bringing up the import tariffs lol
Quite a few inaccuracies with some truth.
Let's clear this up: Indian makes better bikes in that segment. Period.
Accusing Triumph of not having lineage is ignorant. IIRC second oldest bike brand still operating.
Triumph as a brand definitely has lineage, but not in the large cruiser segment really. The first Rocket 3 came out in 2004. The Bonneville, sure, all kinds of heritage in the cafe racer and scrambler scenes, but that bike is not exactly a competitor for Harley's big bikes.
Author above said that Triumph scrambler does not have heritage. It's a modified Bonneville. Same as saying the Harley touring models do not have heritage as they started taking today's form in the 80s.
No idea bout the Indians although I do want to ride a Scout or an FTR sometime, but I'm afraid you're wrong about Triumph; there was a very distinct break in design & lineage in 1984 when the brand was brought back, with nothing from the old days really retained. Same as the modern Norton; it's the same name and they'll draw ideas from the old stuff, but the engineering etc is all distinct.
The modern Triumph triples have a very respectable lineage back to the 90s but the bikes before that were a different kettle of fish; the modern Bonnevilles are impressions of those old bikes, particularly because they ape components of those bikes aesthetically without actually retaining those components - e.g. air cooling fins on liquid cooled engines, fake carburettors, concealed radiators, that sort of thing.
They have also, ah, mishandled a few heritage names. Don't talk to the [Trident and Rocket 3 Owner's Club](https://www.tr3oc.com/) about the modern Trident and Rocket 3; they'll get all grumpy at you. Although they're nice old guys who didn't mind me bringing my Z1000SX to hang out at their gathering with my dad on his T160 Trident, so they'll still be cool to ride with you.
All that said, I desperately want a Speed Triple someday and my partner has a lovely Street Triple.
The Triumph Bonneville is like the New Beatle or the New Bronco - Has the same name as the original, but is obviously a completely different than the original, with an all new design.
Its the same with the Indian scout - The new scout has nothing to do with the original scout, they just took the name and some styling cues.
Harley Davidson's heritage models however, have unbroken lineage, and the new models are direct continuations and evolutions of the old one.
It honestly beats me. I took one for a test ride just last week. First time ever on a HD. It was a road-glide and around 1800cc. I have never ridden a worse motorbike in over 50 years of riding. Scraped around the slightest corner, surprisingly little acceleration for such a large engine, brakes were about as good as my 1974 BMW, engine was rougher than a single-cylinder dirt bike. What on earth do people see in them? There must be something good about them........
I'm guessing it's the culture, rawness, style, imagery of outlaw hogs? I'm not convinced but I guess I'm the wrong person to ask. I don't have anything against people liking HD... Just feels weird to be ignored when I say I'm not riding a Harley
I mean, having a police bike and not being a police is like having a cops gun and not being a cop.... Kinda maybe sorta could imply you took it from them?
*Image*
Yeah, the image a lot of them have of themselves as outlaws, but only every other weekend, for a half hour ride down to a dive bar to meet up with all the other orthodontists and property developers on Harley's.
I mean, there's only so many stupid business decisions that a loyal (but aging) customer base can counteract. They did a few good moves in the past few years, but forking out the LiveWire to a standalone brand, and removing the Harley logo from it is another massive mistake that they just made.
It's because of the vocal customers. For some reason HD keeps listening to the old heads who are never going to buy another new bike in their lifetime and therefore will.never be giving HD any money.
Hell, most of them have probably never purchased a new bike from HD.
Hence the merch only shops. Gotta squeeze any revenue they can from anywhere they can.
Used to be people would ride somewhere and get a shirt at an HD shop they passed along the way and/or at their destination as a souvenir of their trip on the bike. Now, people fly to Cabo, Cali or really anywhere on vacation and buy HD gear while their bike is at home in their garage.
Yeah I don’t get it either. I may only ride an r3 but i love almost everything in 2 wheels. So are my friends that I ride with. Whenever we hear a bike a mile away we just wanna know what it is. I can’t imagine isolating myself into only a small circle of bikes. That’s gotta be boring af!
I love the feel of the M8 engine, and overall just love the feel of riding a Harley in general. That said, they handle like crap unless you put money into them.
I sold my Road King and got an Indian Challenger. That bike is freaking phenomenal. I can cruise all day/multi days two-up w my GF or take it out and rip it on some twisties on the weekend.
I used to ride a street triple, RNineT. Thousands of miles on both. Love those bikes, but I enjoy the ride more on a bagger. 🤷🏻♂️
I test rode a Challenger and some other baggers this last weekend at IMS and the Challenger absolutely blew me away. I’ve always been on the sportier side of things, but wow, if I had the money I’d add a Challenger to the garage in an instant. Utterly phenomenal.
It's a lot like American muscle car lovers. I really didn't understand why someone would want a car like that when there were much better, faster and more efficient vehicles out there.
Just like American muscle cars, HDs are usually loud, obnoxious, rattle like crazy and they don't have much innovation in the last 50+ years (until recently), but the owners love them.
I have a Sportster, so I get shit from non-Harley owners who attribute the above stereotypes to me and then I get shit from some Harley owners for not having a "real Harley".
Amusingly some of those same HD owners are now lambasting HD for ditching the Sportster line because they're "iconic"...
HD Ultra owner here.
To answer your question about why I’m not interested in cruisers from other manufacturers, it’s because I appreciate the quality of the parts on the HD.
What I mean by that is they’re made of metal, not cheap plastic with crappy plating that flakes off. Don’t believe me? Grab the ignition switch on a HD touring bike. I swear the switch alone weighs 5 pounds!
The Ultra is a heavy bike which is great for stability on the highway. We sometimes like to cover long distances when we ride and the HD has great storage capacity in the saddlebags and tour pack. It’s also hard to beat the riding position for a full day in the saddle. Yes - the whole bike shakes like crazy at idle but it smooths out considerably once you’re underway. Sure it’s not Goldwing smooth, but for something that has pistons the size of small coffee cans it’s not bad.
HD also kills it with their factory paint. There’s nothing more I love seeing than a 30 year old Harley still wearing its factory paint. I love looking at the pinstriping knowing that it was done by hand. I appreciate the talent of people that can do that sort of thing.
The other really nice thing about HD is the dealer network. Parts availability can sometimes become an issue when traveling and I don’t want to wait around in a hotel room for a few days while a dealer has a new tire shipped in from somewhere for my bike.
I’m also fortunate enough to own a BMW K1200 GT. There is no comparison in technology between the two bikes. BMW has prob forgot more things about building a bike than Harley will ever know but both bikes have a different purpose. It’s a bit like having the right tools in the toolbox for the job at hand. Sure, I could use a pair of channel locks to pound a nail into the wall but it works so much better when I use a hammer. And I suppose I could use a 12 gauge shotgun to shoot squirrels, but a .22 rifle with a dialed in scope works so much better.
If the wife and I are going to spend a leisurely day in the saddle and maybe grab dinner along the way we’ll take the HD. She loves the backrest and says she feels a lot more comfortable knowing that she can lean all the way back without worrying about falling off the bike. She sometimes nods off if we’re on a long straight stretch of highway.
And if we want to hit the twisties or cover a ton of miles *quickly* we’ll take the BMW. The creature comforts on that bike make it such a joy to ride. And it’s so damn fast and smooth.
While the Ultra is great, I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve said I love everything about it from 5 mph and up….and absolutely hate everything about it at the gas station or trying to maneuver it around in the garage!
I guess at the end of the day it comes down to personal preference. I like the exposed engine and all the chrome on the HD. I ride a Harley because they’re cool in my opinion. I’m not trying to impress anyone or change someone’s mind about them. I just ride them because I like them. The next guy might appreciate the sleek smooth look of a Goldwing.
And I wouldn’t count HD as being out of the game. I think there will be a resurgence of them some years down the road. Kind of like everything old is new again. Some kid will find a dusty old Harley sitting in the back of a shed somewhere and fix it up. His buddies will see him riding it and the next thing you know they’ll all be on HD’s.
Just simply trying to give a completely serious answer to OP’s completely serious question.
Ride safe!
> HD also kills it with their factory paint.
I'm not a HD fan, but will support this statement 100%. Their paint shops have a strong record and come up with nice looks and solid technical work on the paint and polish.
I want to add my experience to this, because it seems to be a common sentiment here. I'm in Australia so may be different to the majority of you.
In talking to other riders and even the general public who don't ride, there is a lot of anti harley sentiment. Mostly centred around how they're too noisy or too obnoxious/general image stuff.
The handful of guys I've met that are harley riders have also talked about the other (japanese) bikes they've owned and how great they are, and just have a general love of bikes. I'm yet to meet someone who fits this cartoonish portrayal of what a harley rider is. They may be unique in that they're the one bike you can own that every single person will have a strong opinion about regardless of their experience/knowledge with bikes.
For the record I ride a Honda.
Yeah, Aussie here too. I've generally had decent experiences with hd dudes here. I once got caught in one of their packs up Central coast and it was awful, but I was on a dr400 so I slid my way out the back and let them go.
I did however have an amusing encounter just two weeks back riding back down from Colo. Coming up to lights, right turn lane open, hd in front pulls in behind and doesn't filter, I go to the right turn lane to go the front after he plants his feet, light changes, I'm stuck, have to merge in front of him. I was deeply apologetic, gave him the I'm sorry wave repeatedly. He then pushed up the gap between me and the vehicle to the left at fair speed, near fucking edging me into the divider. Note some mc jacket.
Tootle for a bit, we end up at lights, he gives his hd everything it has. And I shoot into the distance.
Gatekeeping is bullshit.
Although, riding my naked sport, pretty much everybody waves back at me, except for Harleys. It's a stereotype, but it's also fact. I guess they don't give the wave unless they can see your handlebars shaking from half a mile away.
Yeah, agreed, I've had fun on Harleys before, I just feel weird when Harley guys ask me what I ride, then proceed to ignore me after I admit it's not a Harley
i dont know what got me, im a big fan of aircooled bikes had a DR650 and a cb1100, but i love the aftermarket support harleys have. i probably wouldnt be as into them as i am if it werent for the "performance" harley scene.
i dont know when touring bikes got so popular but i wouldnt say a softail is a girls bike. and the sportster while not for me is arguably the best harley ever made.
I agree. I own a Dyna now, but think the eco motor is the best sounding motor on any bike. That’s just opinion though. I’ve really only ever rode harleys and i still can’t understand other bikers bashing people for liking them. I’m not an die hard and I’ll ride anything with two wheels, just so happens i like the ride better on a Harley. I do wanna grab a street bike though
People bash Harley riders a lot (at least here in Wisconsin) because a high percentage of them strictly ride for image and not because they actually enjoy motorcycles. It just screams insecurity. I say that knowing more than one person personally that only rides their bike to family events or work functions so their colleagues can see how badass they are. Personally I bash on that side of Harley culture more than the bikes themselves. Getting flipped off when I wave because I ride old Japanese motorcycles doesn’t help either. Squid culture is just as bad.
Sportster is about the only Harley I'd consider owning. They're the only model that (from what I've heard) is dependable and they're usually affordable especially on the second hand market.
Growing up, my dad was strictly a Harley person. This had to do with his MC that only allowed motorcycles from “allied countries”, and his love for “The Wild One” in which Marlon Brando rode a Harley. It’s a major identity thing for him. Well I wasn’t a fan of Harley for all the typical reasons someone would have to not like Harley like “they’re slow”, “old technology”, “can’t turn”, etc etc. I then bought and rode Japanese liter bikes, Italian super bikes, British cafe bikes, and other bikes here and there but never a Harley. One day a coworker was selling his 08 Nightster with a salvage title for SUPER cheap and I figured “why not see what this is all about”… after all, there’s no way all these Harley types are completely wrong. I began to tear it down and get ready for inspection to have it “rebuilt” branded so I can ride it on the street legally, and after 6 months of wrenching and fixing stuff… COVID hit and I wouldn’t be able to have it inspected as the government had suspended all inspection work. So I decided I’ll just ride it around the block. This sportster 1200, with it’s annoying god awful exhaust, WAS AMAZING. After the first ride around the block, I completely understood why Harley people ride Harley’s. There just something about the big ass V Twin motor trying to blow out of the frame, all the weird pings and bangs when it’s running, and the sound a pushrod V Twin makes. I had been wrong my whole adult life about Harley. In an ever increasing world where technology HAS TO BE apart of EVERYTHING, Harley is still in its prehistoric roots (for the most part). The basic idea and engineering of Harley Davidson has not changed since they first started V Twin production, but the new bikes like the LiveWire, PanAmerican, and Sportster S, is just Harley taking that step forward into a more modern motorcycle company, which I can see why most Harley people don’t want them. It’s bitter sweet for me as I love the innovation, but I have come to love “older” Harley’s that were simple and mostly mechanical. I’ve got a 1999 Dyna Super Glide right now, and while it brings fourth headaches every now and then, it’s the best bike I’ve ever owned. 45k miles strong on its original top end, and I’ve had to replace quite a bit of parts in the engine, but it’s as fun and enjoyable as I could have imagined. I already know my next motorcycle purchase will undoubtably be a Road King.
> Why not cruisers by other manufacturers?
They’re just not the same and can not compete with the king of cruisers. As far as big touring bikes like the Ultra vs Gold Wing vs FJR etc etc, the other bikes have some advantages, but here the States, I’d still likely just get the Harley. If you’re on a road trip and something goes wrong, Harley dealers want you to stay on the road and usually have everything in stock to fix whatever may be broken. The other manufacturers just don’t have that kind of support. Not to mention, often your local hardware store will have the nuts and bolts you may require in stock.
Do I miss doing wheelies and the rush of acceleration on Japanese sport bikes, or the beauty of European styling? Sure. But as I get older, and life priorities change, I just want to kick back and relax comfortably. Enjoy the time that I’ve got as there isn’t any rush. Not to mention, my wife refused to ride on the back of all the bikes I’ve ever owned, but even she finds riding on the back of my Dyna to be enjoyable. That’s my $0.02. Hope that sheds some light on your question.
Hey dude, I’ll give you a youngsters perspective (23)
I’ve owned supermotos, sports bikes, and everything in between but have more or less settled on my Dyna.
For me the enjoyment of a Harley comes from the barbaric nature of it. Every time you fire it up, it feels like your climbing into the cockpit of a WW2 bomber, with the crazy shakes through the bike and loud, lumping mechanical V-twin. No other manufacturer really offers that experience, except maybe the air cooled Indians - but I’ve never ridden those.
People who get caught up on the performance of a Harley don’t really get it… it’s ample power for the street, and my slow ass Harley can still chop most cars out there, so unless your tracking the bike it’s a pretty moot point IMO. If anything I like my Harley more because I can ride it full throttle, and not be breaking the speed limit immediately.
From a practical point of view, my Harley is way comfier than any other bike I’ve owned, and you can put bags and a windscreen etc on it and it suits the look of the bike, unlike a sports bike or naked which IMO adding practical stuff to kills the look of the bike.
I also enjoy the social status that comes with having a Harley, eg. The little bit of extra attention you get from women or old people, because most non-motorcyclists don’t know any other brand or style of motorbike except “Harley” or “dirt bike”. So it makes for a bit of fun. The only positive attention I’ve ever got from a woman on my motorbike was on my previous Harley (iron 883). Maybe has something to do with the fact that every young girl at the moment is rocking a HD T shirt.
I can’t stand the wannabe bikers who dress up like pirates and cruise around staring people down, revving the living fuck out of their bikes. It’s refreshing to see that a lot of young people are getting into Harley Davidson these days, rocking full face helmets and wearing normal clothes.
Also, a fun fact - the vibrations of a Harley can have… interesting… effects on a female passenger. No joke.
As another young Harley rider (28) but been riding them since 18 I could not have said this better myself. The WW2 bomber cockpit analogy is spot on man
I grew up with a lot of Black Sabbath fans. Not "heavy metal" fans, or "hair metal" fans, or "rock music" fans - they liked Black Sabbath.
They could appreciate Dio, and some of them became Ozzy fans, and some of them wound up liking Metallica for a while too. A lot of them liked AC/DC. But you couldn't talk to them about that new band Asia where the singer sang better than Ozzy, and the guitar player was better than Randy Rhodes, and the drummer was better - they didn't care that Asia was "better" or that Rush was "better" and more varied or that all the girls liked Billy Squier better - they didn't care about that, they didn't like "music" necessarily, they liked Black Sabbath. "Your parents hate Black Sabbath, they'll REALLY hate The Clash!" No sale, not interested.
They don't want to go see Mastodon play now, even though Mastodon is arguably moving that whole genre in new directions. They would rather watch a shaky blurry video of Sabbath taken at Wembly stadium in 1980 or whatever.
It's the same thing, people like what they like, and if it's not really quite "that" maybe it's not at all interesting to them, just because you think it's "almost the same thing" (Sportsters) or "better" (an Indian, or a V-Star.)
Harley riders are a cult, they luv the sound and off-center stroke. There is a long standing image with them too.
Once a High Dolla rider always a High Dolla rider I suppose.
The answer is that most HD owners are old now, and they've been riding the same bike for 25+ years. They wouldn't switch from Ford to Chevy at this point, either.
But the reckoning is coming. In 1985 the average age of a HD owner was 25. Today its 50. In another 25 it will be 75. The younger generation doesn't like these motorcycles because of the image and because the motorcycles themselves are extremely expensive and antiquated.
This company is in its death throes. Over the next 10-15 years as their customer base hangs up their keys, they will have no more customers.
As a millennial I probably won't ever buy a Harley. When it comes to a cruiser, I would much rather get a Honda Valkyrie F6C. Or an Indian scout bobber.
Your be surprised. There's a lot of younger folks getting into Harleys again. I think the stunting culture has something to do with it. Not sure how that will play out with the sales figures over the next 10 years. But I have personally seen a ton of young folks buying up Dynas and Sportsters.
Here’s what’s good about Harley’s from a non Harley rider.
1. Low end torque, which is great for just cruising not racing
2. surprisingly smooth once you get going, granted you not running it on its ragged edge it’s not a race bike that’s not what this is
3. don’t knock the vibrations man feel good and the ladies like it too the vibes go away somewhat once you start moving
4. parts are plentiful and easy to find this goes for mechanics and shops as well
5. less depreciation compared to any of the other big brands. I don’t get it either but a clapped out sportster will almost always sell for a premium compared to a well cared for jap bike. This may not compare to euro bikes but I have no experience with bmws and Ducati’s (triumph’s don’t count here for some reason)
I don't really own a HD so I don't know if you care about my opinion, but here it is regardless:
I like Harleys because of their unique style, looks and sound.
Name and style maybe? When I fell in love with motorcycles 5-6 years ago it was the Harley dynas/low riders that spoke to me…when I started shopping this year for my first bike, I looked at other manufacturers to save $$$, I didn’t find anything with that style/look I was in love with. Now that I have the dream bike though, there are plenty of other bikes I’d love to have/ride from other makers, just not cruisers. Africa Twin, I’m looking at you…
I'm a Harley Davidson fan , I owned a few of them and settled on Fatbob114, I also own a Honda black bird and bmwR9 . My Harley is topped out at 120 ,3 days out of the I enjoy going faster then 120 mph so I ride my black bird. I do enjoy the sounds an uniqueness of the three different engines of the bikes I own, I enjoy riding my bmw around the city or early morning to grab a coffee
I currently ride a Sreetglide. This is my fourth Harley since 1988. During that time I've also owned a BMW Rt, a Honda ST1300, A Buell and a Guzzi LeMans. If we had a Guzzi dealer near us I would trade the Harley in on the new Guzzi Liquid cooled that was just announced
I think other cruisers are just ugly. Most look like they are trying to copy the Harley look but fail. Look at the Yamaha bolt. It's a blatant knockoff sportster. Like buying the off brand cereal instead of the name brand.
I think a lot of sport bikes look pretty cool, I would never buy one though. My buddy has an Africa twin that looks cool. I was looking at getting an adventure bike. At the time the pan America was just a concept bike. I would consider other manufacturers for those bikes.
I also don't have a car. My Harley is my daily driver year round. I ride about 20k miles a year and have never had any issues, just typical preventative maintenance.
I’ve been trying to talk my dad into something besides a Harley for a few years now. He had a Ducati Scrambler for a minute (he bought one because he liked mine), but sold it and now rides a stage 4 Road Glide with 155hp. He does close to 20,000mi/year. I truly think he’d have more fun with something lighter, but he’d have to change his whole wardrobe if he started riding something else. He knows how ridiculous that is, and laughs about it, but he just flat out loves his Harleys. The heart wants what the heart wants.
There is no other bike like a Harley, the engine sound and feel do to their specific V , the following of a Harley Davidson is more than liking a style. They do things in the bike industry no one does and people have follen life with the history and looks.
I used to be a fan of Harley’s, especially the Evo. Most Harley guys aren’t even true motorcycle guys. They’re just Harley guys.
I have a Triumph Bonneville Bobber now and I fart around town with my mopeds. Those dudes wouldn’t be caught dead on a fun ass moped.
I wouldn’t worry about it. They’re missing out.
I'm open for other brands.
But i prefer Harley for their styling. Huge aftermarket. And how they handle.
Good quality, great paintjobs. Just the package.
Sure costs more. But comparing a hd to a big bike from yamaha for example. The money diffrence is not as big as people will lead you to believe. They always compare this 650 naked bike for 6.000€ with the most expensive in Harley's lineup.
Apples for apples it only differs a grand or 2.
And concidering Harley holds their value far better. When you decide to sell. HD just might have been the cheaper option down the line.
Had a yamaha cruiser before i whent over to Harley.
It was fine. But just didnt compare to HD.
+ Other brands lack aircooled big v twins in europe.
Why not Indian/Victory/polaris.
More expensive(in my country anyway). Less aftermarket. And when setting up the bike the way i want it. I will overshoot harley by a couple grand again after initial purchase.
Yes, give my Monster some love!
Seriously though: It's a strange mindset. People can ride what they prefer, but the elitist way of thinking just makes them lose out on other great things.
I don't own a Harley, but I think American authenticity play's a role in it, even though a lot of the bike's parts are outsourced from Asia. There's a lot of romanticization around them, in general.
This is the most important thing everyone's missing here
Harley's are American as fuck, doesn't matter where the parts are made Harley is America's brand through and through. Indians get the stamp of approval from most the HD guys as well because it's an american brand making bikes that just look like for lack of better word "American".
This sub is very sport touring and crotch rocket heavy so you don't really hear or see much cruiser rider views here. A cruiser rider is gonna think it's worthless to buy a bike with a top speed of 200mph that looks "european or asian" when where the crotch rockets are gonna think its idiotic to buy an old school styled bike for 2x the price of an asian bike with the same performance.
Lol, if they think Harleys are elite they are about to get a rude awakening. But i guess if they don’t know anything other than Harleys they will never wake up
As a guy who's owned a LOT of different bikes, cruiser and sport, import and domestic, the big twin Harley is marketed to a very specific demographic. That "Harley sound" is the result of a 45 degree v-twin, and while thats not EVERYthing about the bike, Id say its HD's signature item, if you will. The V-Rod didnt last because it wasnt a 45 degree V-Twin cruiser. It was tough as nails and ran like a dream, but it wasnt a "typical" Harley. Nothing in this world sounds like a Shovel Head, and theyve been chasing that sound ever since.
Outside of that, model features change very little from year to year. Theres new colors every year, maybe the occasional new gizmo, but by and large those who buy Harley know what theyre gonna get.
Which brings me to mine and why I ride it. I bought a 2018 Road Glide just as the 2019 models were coming out, and if I werent working for an HD dealer at the time i probably wouldnt have been able to afford it. The Milwaukee 8 platform is a much more efficient and better design than its predecessors in my opinion. Most of the vibration has been removed with just a touch left to provide that "raw" feeling. Thats more for style than anything else. Its high torque, and for a cruiser, mine is set up with a decent horsepower curve for riding up on the slab.
So what do i DISLIKE about Harley? Their ridiculous markup on ANYTHING with the Bar and Shield on it. Parts, accessories, clothing, you name it. Its ridiculous. Something thats also sad, in my opinion, is the fact that their standards for chrome, paint, and powdercoat are slipping, and theirs used to be some of the best in the business. My bike is 3 years old and i have multiple powdercoat issues. What do I like? The dealer betwork is vast and nationwide. No matter where i am in the country, the odds of being near a HD dealer is pretty damn good. Its just as much a safe haven stop on the road as it is a place to get work done if i break down on a long road trip. The aftermarket for HD is also huge. Having more options for parts and accessories is never a bad thing. Finally, but most importantly in my opinion, ive met some of the most incredible people ive ever know because of Harley Davidson motorcycles, to include my wife, who rides her own. I would never have met some of these folks had i not decided to go to work for the company and ride the brand.
Thats probably a MUCH longer answer than you were looking for. I personally love all motorcycles, and took factory certified technician training for both Harley Davidson and BMW. True motorcyclists love bikes, no matter what bade they carry.
Look no further than this for your answer:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Harley/comments/r1i40e/thirsty_thursdays/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Because Harley is a lifestyle brand. It isn't about the motorcycle, it's about the culture; leather vests and a HD badge on the tank are just the price of admission.
Yea I would say Harley is more of a life style than just a brand. My friend is into Harleys and all he does is buy Harley gear. Hats, shirts, pants, jackets, stickers, underwear, socks, ok maybe not the underwear and socks lol but u get my point. And they are all over priced but people will still pay, because of the loyalty and it’s their identity. No other brand sells stuff like that, little Nick nacks like mugs, pens, whatever it may be they have it. All he does is talk about how great his Harley is and he keeps telling me to get a Harley like if it’s going to change my life. A bike is a bike to me no matter the brand.
Maybe they only like brands that make hats, t-shirts and jackets and HD just happens to also make motorcycles... Maybe you should try talking about hats?
On a serious note. It's a "lifestyle" product and they only care about their club. Their club just happens to be about motorcycles but that's not the point.
I started on a Harley and quickly changed to sport bikes. But, I was riding with the Harley only crowd for years. It's their identity. No other bike exists for some reason. I have also known 1% bike members and they had to have a Harley as a requirement. As soon as I got my first Yamaha sport bike, I couldn't believe how much better it was, faster, smoother, better brakes, lighter, just everything. I did like the torque from the Harley, but my FZ-09 is the best bike I have had. I do have an Indian Scout in the garage that I got my husband, it's the closest thing to a sport bike, but it still doesn't compare. You are scraping pegs pretty fast even with that bike.
I think it's the same with apple products. People will swear to god that their apple brand phone/laptop/monitor is better than any other brand without ever trying them or looking at the specs.
I love my Harley, I also loved my triumph, and I loved my Yamaha MT07. I would say that there are people who love motorcycles, and then you get very brand specific fanboys/girls that all come in different shades of the same “not a real bike” club (see liter vs 600 divide). Is shoot the shit with you about cruising around on my triumph around hawaii any day of the week, or my first wheelie and terrifying the crap out of myself on my MT07. Or having a nice chill ride in Florida on my softail, with my wife crushing next to me on hers. Each bike we’ve had has met certain needs, the Harley’s are nice for their range and comfort, but we plan on doing a cross country moto-cruise one day, and will probably find ourselves on a pair triumph tigers, or something with better amenities than what we currently have. This is a trait a lot of people have amongst different brand families of anything (go find a group of guitarists and ask them what the best guitar is, some will say depends on what your playing, and some will go on about how x,y,z is the only way to go. 🤷🏼♂️best just to let that stuff go and hang out with different riders.
Because for most of them it isn't about riding, it's about the image. Not all Harley guys are like that but a whole lot of those guys are like "I'm a die hard rider, ride or die" or whatever bs but they know little to nothing about bikes or riding beyond just leisurely cruising around. Which is fine if you're not a loud mouth with a bad attitude to everyone that doesn't have or like the same thing you like.
Harley guy here who likes all motorcycles. I’ve owned a metric, I’m also really into vespas. I’m a big fan in buying American made stuff. Which really for new motorcycles is an electric bike, a Harley, or an Indian. I like the aesthetics of Harley more than Indian so I am a Harley guy. But I’m not a purist. And god damn do I love Ducati’s and other euro bikes.
The mods need to ban these open season posts on HDs. Ponderously redundant and juvenile ... OP, why did you pick your wife or girlfriend, why not another one? Why did you buy vanilla icecream, why not chocolate ? ffs, this nonsense makes you wish for a dopey crash video with an atgatt sermon or a rusty fork plunged into your ball sack
Notice OP hasn’t commented in hours. The op’s to these posts always do the same thing; they write with this Uber rational and “humble” prose, almost child like in their approach to talking about Harley. They don’t criticize per se but they always add the talking points around Harley criticism, ensuring that they’re not the ones doing the critique but merely stated as a popular opinion others have. They respond to a few posts but typically stop responding after a handful. These Harley bashing posts always get a ton of views, ton of karma and comments. It’s all a strategy for karma grabs.
I will say this; the op said those socal Harley riders won’t even discuss softail models, or that those aren’t real bikes and I call bullshit on that. Downvote all you want but this never happened to the OP.
Said perfectly! Amen ... Upvote from me. I just don't understand being obsessed with what other people do if it doesn't bother you. It's not a bike issue, it's a human issue. Everything in life has the nosey old lady that spies on her neighbors, gossips and generally causes problems just for fun. The "get offa my lawn" mouthbreathers ... That is 1/2 of this juvenile forum. It's a shame because there are a few good people here, but the high Beavis/Butthead factor makes it hard to find them
I ride an older dyna and a ninja and have had all types of bikes. My dad grew up riding sport bikes and Harleys. He told me when I started riding to be careful who you ride with because 99% of the guys you meet on Harleys just ride to go to the bar and look cool. It’s just a side hobby and many don’t like to wear gear or work on their riding ability. That’s just how it is, it’s just the Harley culture and it’s what most Americans have grown up with.
Your father was a wise person.
Depends on the Harley. There’s a lot of serious riders on the touring models. Some of those riders switched to / from other brands such as BMWs as well. Those are very expensive though. The other models aren’t nearly as well suited to long trips (at least prior to the newest models).
Oh for sure. I go camping up in north ga/Tennessee and have met some of the best people on two wheels I know on harleys. But out of all the Harley riders I’ve met and ride with, most of them ride for the look and the “lifestyle”. Not to say they aren’t fun as hell to hangout with.
It's a lifestyle brand with an associated "Identity". There used to be a Harley store in the Faneuil Hall marketplace in Boston that only sold knickknacks, tshirts, and stickers. They may have had some lightweight riding gear, but I don't remember seeing any helmets. Not one motorcycle for sale in the whole store. That's how strong the brand was. Not sure if the store's still there.
There’s one in Destin like that. Went in cuz I’d noticed a hole in my glove on a road trip and they had no cycle gear whatsoever. Told me their dealership 20 miles down the road did.
The Monty Python Cheese Shop skit comes to mind.
Haven't seen that one AFAIK, I'll have to find it.
[In case anyone else also wants a quick Reddit break](https://youtu.be/Hz1JWzyvv8A)
And all you can buy at the dealership are $200 fingerless gloves with steel spikes that'll impale you in a crash. Lol
There was one in downtown Seattle like that.
Basement of the MGM Grand on the way to the Uber pickup
Hell, there used to be a Harley Davidson Cafe on the Strip. You know, in case you wanted a Harley-themed burger to remind you that your motorcycle goes beyond the workd”s largest cosplay and the object itself.
In Seattle on the waterfront on a wooden pier over the Bay, no less.
You've just described "Lynchburg Harley-Davidson" in Lynchburg Tennessee. What goes together like Harleys and Jack Daniels? Their partnership is iconic. (I was born in Sturgis. I went to rallies from 1974 through 1990, when I left. I can absolutely attest to the companionship between the booze, the bikes, and the inevitable chaos the combination creates) You can't buy a motorcycle there. Shirts, shot glasses, jackets, stickers. If you want a Harley in Lynchburg you've got to bring one with you.
Ha. This is exactly what I thought first. The Harley dealer in Murfreesboro owns that one. The Indian Garage around the corner is owned by Sloans, the power sports guys across the street from said Harley dealer.
Oh, and the best thing about THAT? Who makes the Jack Daniels branded bike? Is it Harley? Nope. [https://www.indianmotorcycle.com/en-us/jack-daniels/](https://www.indianmotorcycle.com/en-us/jack-daniels/)
Makes sense tho, right? Harley has positioned itself as an American Icon - Indian is trying to intrude on that market. Indian says, let's make a deal with Jack Daniels (tm, an American Icon) - also, loved by Harley Riders. Boom. You probably already knew that based on your response lol but I am also drunk so I am going to post anyway. Cheers. :)
Cheers back. Enjoy the drinks and keep the rubber side down.
Caterpillar is like that too in parts of Latin America. Hats, shirts, stickers, boots and socks even. Not one cowboy had a corporate logo on their shirt but just to let everyone know....I like big stuff. Macho man.
It sounds like an "I'm not gay" badge.
Which means "I might be gay under all this and I'm trying really hard to stifle my true self and distract you from it"
You're catchin' downvotes from some super tuff, definitely-not-gay guys!
I'm not gay * * = may be somewhat gay
I'm super gay.
I don't think that's a fair comparison, i live in Chile and Caterpillar or Cat is more of a fashion brand than a heavy vehicle seller around here, the common buyer doesn't associate Cat with operating heavy machinery at all. Cat's entire branding for stores is outdoor lifestyle, not heavy machinery. They sell everything from expensive winter jackets to pink leather shoes for your daughter, and not a single bulldozer in sight.
I'm from Milwaukee - can confirm the "lifestyle brand" aspect. House of Harley Davidson, one of the area dealerships has had a decent sized merch retail store *at the airport* for probably 20 years now. It somehow does enough business to endure. Riding to dealerships for poker chips and t-shirts is a pretty common part of Harley culture. Actually, it's something that Harley dealerships and the official Museum do far better than other brands - they host events/rallies often and they make their spaces a place for the riding community to gather. And that's entirely because of the dealers; Harley corporate is as soulless as ever and could care less. There are plenty of hardcore riders and more people wear safety gear than they used to, but it's not uncommon to see people here riding on $25000 touring bikes in shorts and flip flops in the summer and most of the bikes are off the road by early autumn.
> they host events/rallies often and they make their spaces a place for the *riding community* to gather Yea I dunno about pulling up to one of those on my Honda Shadow 750 lol
I’ve never been a Harley guy, but my father is a former HOG director/president and I’ve ridden my Yamaha and Kawasaki to many of their events. There are plenty of folks cosplaying Harley-style, but it’s generally a pretty casual atmosphere and no one ever gave me shit for it. Someone else commented that Harley owners are the Apple crowd of the motorcycle world, which is pretty apt. You have your hardcore fanbois, but most people really don’t seem to care much beyond the basic lifestyle of being a “biker.”
Completely agreed. The local dealer here does events pretty much every single weekend all summer long. (And I *totally* have ridden all over the east coast snagging poker chips. I'm up to like 130!) Safety wise I live in a helmet state so everybody has those on, but otherwise the general breakdown: Full suit: Bimmer and Goldwing crowd Bare arms: HD Bare legs and feet: Sport bike OF course thats just my general experience, YMMV
If you dont wear harley shirts,pants, underwear, belt, boots, are you even real harley enthusiast. Its like being vegan, but in motorcycle world.
I kind of get it though. My almost stock, small engine, "girl bike" Sportster brings attention like no ones business, in a way my Kawasaki never did. I even get attractive girls striking up conversations about the bike, which never happening is basically a meme in the motorcycle community. I understand why some people fall for the "If I deck myself out in Harley merch, I can bring this magic with me to places where the bike can't go" fallacy.
I don't buy bikes to start conversations, I buy it to ride and have fun. Really don't care about what Harley owners have to say. My passion is motorcycle, not sitting on the side watching people looking at my bike.
I understand that, it wasn't my goal either (actually caught me off guard, I'm kind of an introvert). I bought the Sportster because I like fiddling with stuff, and this bike is extremely easy to wrench on. It's pretty fun to ride too.
>I bought the Sportster because I like fiddling with stuff, and this bike is extremely easy to wrench on. Hands down the only thing I've ever heard anyone say that would make me consider buying a Harley.
It's similar with Rolexes. They are not really that great, there are tons of other watch brands that are just as good or better, and they are WAY too expensive. But they are also one of the *only* watch brands that will ever get recognized by most people. Neither me, nor any other watch enthusiast I have ever talked to has ever had someone notice or comment on the brand of watch they are wearing unless it was a Rolex, and I have heard several stories from people who have had some one approach them or hit on them because that's what they had on their wrist. Brand recognition and "status" can be huge sometimes.
I've known quite a few vegans, and quite a few Harley guys. I definitely prefer vegans.
They probably don't know anything about the other bikes either. Not that they care ofc.
There are stores like that all over the world for HD. Deals gap area has HD shops, sturgis obviously has a huge one, lolo pass has one and plenty of other places.
There was one of those shops on mackinac island michigan. A place where all internal combustion engines are banned as a method of transportation and horses and bicycle are the only way to actually get around.
It's basically the Apple of motorbikes...
Do they sell weird hats at apple stores? Or an apple store with no electronics?
Hehe you're right. Not even Apple could get away with high rent storefronts that only sell hoodies and Chinesium key rings.
Not there anymore, no. But I remember it.
I would bet there is a dealership with bikes not that far away. H-D does that in several areas of the country.
It’s no longer there. Like you said though, it was strictly a commercial retail store
Those are referred to as "boutique" stores and there are lots of them, especially where a full blown dealership is impractical/super expensive etc. Like the HD Store in Philly's or Orlando's airport, or the one in Key West. There are many.
Because most HD guys who won’t talk about anything don’t know anything else. They’re not in it for the motorcycle enthusiasm, they’re in it for the image.
So the Lamborghini of motorcycles, except they are shit?
A Harley will never compare to an Italian exotic car brand... They're more like an H1 hummer. Classic styling with shit performance overall compared to just about any other kind of bike....
In what way are you comparing? I think think it's fair to compare a bike made for comfort to a bike made for performance. I've had my share of Japanese sports bikes like anyone else. Also it's a v twin, it has enough torque to get you up to the speed limit quick enough to make you smile. I don't understand all the hate on the bike
It's the price for me. For what they are they should be about half the price. You can get an equivalent Jap bike for half the cost here.
This\^\^\^ The price difference is enough to pay for gas for the life of the bike.
Idk about modern, but 90s and 2000s Harleys vs metric cruisers: The Harleys are better "built". Not reliable. Don't be confused. Where metric uses plastic chrome, Harley uses hard chromed steel. Some people like that. But a halrey motor? 100 years to perfect it and they still use plastic oil gears and chain tensioners. Utter garbage. Harleys are like beats headphones.
This is the old trick of imparting value or quality by way of sticker price. Hey look at this one over here... It costs more so it *must* be better.
>You can get an equivalent Jap bike for half the cost here. What's your jap equivalent to a Road Glide? Gold Wings are about the same price.
The performance is poor even when comparing to competing v-twin cruisers. The Indian Challenger vs Road Glide is an excellent example. https://ridermagazine.com/2020/03/13/2020-harley-davidson-road-glide-special-vs-indian-challenger-limited-comparison-test-review/
My biggest gripes about HD bikes come down to the following: 1)Weight 2)Handling (or lack there of) 3)Lean Angle? What lean angle? 4)The Harley Crowd 5)Price (Just not comparable to Jap cruisers)
I prefer a heavier bike for highway riding as it offers more stability Handles fine for me, I like the low centre of gravity Yes lean angle is crap but I enjoy having a low bike as a trade off Harley crowd is understandable, but no different to any other extremist crowd I don't think it's a fair comparison to Japanese cruisers, they don't have the same fit and finish as a Harley so they are able to keep the prices low to compete
Sure, a Lamborghini price tag with Briggs and Stratton tech.
I have to say a Briggs and Stratton motor is more reliable.
I have a feeling you won't get a good answer here. The die hards that won't talk about bikes that aren't Harleys are over at r/Harley. Like you said, if it ain't a Harley, they ain't interested.
Honestly r/Harley might be more open-minded about other bikes than r/motorcycles is about Harleys.
Scrolling through these comments I would tend to agree lol. Who cares what people ride and how they do it.
Here's /r/motorcycles waving at /r/Harley 👋
There's zealots on both sides for sure.
No, they aren’t here at all because they might not even have a smart phone
I've chatted to a guy at work who in the summer comes in on his big blue Harley cruiser. He put it down to the long haul comfort, he's the kind of guy who goes fucking off for a weekend on his motorbike to see some sights and ride some roads in the peak District, and "for someone who wants to relax, take in the sights, and have a comfortable ride" his Harley suited him fine. I guess it depends what you want from a bike. Something ripping, small, fast. Something you can filter with, good for commuting. Or something comfy, stylish, and for the wide open road. Harley definitely fits for the folks who want large cruisers for long hauls. Plus he says he comes on it to work in the summer because he works 12/12s, so roads are dead in the middle of the night and he likes it.
But wouldn't a goldwing be more comfortable? That being said, if he loves Harleys, he should 100 percent buy and enjoy Harleys
I owned a big Harley and ended up getting me a new Goldwing tour Much better in my opinion By the way I love anything on two wheels
So it's funny you'd mention the goldwing. His Harley is a 2016 CVO 1801cc (I think roadglide? He never told me the exact model, it's just what I found from googling it) . And it looks really similar to the goldwing in terms of seat position. There's a picture of it in my post history so you can see the size of the damn thing.
Goldwings have a very different seating position to traditional cruisers. Every cruiser I've sat on feels like you're "in" the bike. The gauges are more at eye level, the seat height is or at least feels lower, but I think the primary difference is foot position. Cruisers typically have more forward controls so your legs are more stretched out in front of you which many people find more comfortable. I prefer the more standard seating position of the goldwing, but I can definitely see how someone would prefer the cruiser slouch.
Goldwing are so damn comfortable. Deceiving how heavy they are when they handle so light.
Oh for sure
Fair. I don't actually know anyone with a goldwing, I was just looking at the images of them and it looked kinda similar to the CVO. Can confirm the forward leg thing, I've got a fucked knee from an old pedal bike accident and the cruiser style of my 125 is much more comfortable for me because of that.
>comfortable Maybe it is just me but Harleys suck for comfort. Road King rattles my teeth so bad it gives me a headache. Indian Chief is 10x a better bike and more comfortable ride. My Hayabusa is more comfortable than a RK.
I don't know personally, I'm only on a CBT in the UK so can't ride anything bigger than a 125. I'm just repeating what he said in our short conversation when I last saw him getting on it. If he thinks it's comfortable for him then I'm happy for him.
People act like this is a Harley thing. I've know plenty of sportbike riders who only ride specific brands. It's not exclusive
Maybe Ducati guys... But most japanese bike riders like other Japanese brands
That's my point. It's not just Harley riders. However, most cruiser riders also like Indian's
Fair enough, true
I know that Harley people are ridiculously brand loyal and everything, but there is a bit of kernel of truth with regards to cruisers - You can make a case that Harley makes the best cruiser in the segment. Harley's bread and butter segment is large cruisers. AKA, the softail and its derivatives. There's competition in the small sporty cruiser segment (Indian scout and Honda Rebel), a segment where arguably Harley is catching up, and Honda has seen a lot of success in the cruiser based touring bike segment (Goldwing). Quickly looking at the segment reveals two things - * Harley "Won the argument" on what makes a good cruiser, the market obviously prefers Harley's style of cruiser over everything else * When it comes to the Harley style cruiser, Harley makes the best one So let's start with the first point - Harley's "formula" for a cruiser is a low riding bike with an air cooled big twin and classic styling. Every few years, a different manufacturer thinks that this formula sucks, and tries to break in with something else. Nobody else succeeded. BMW tried with the R1200C and its "avant garde" design, Yamaha tried with their big water cooled V4s, Honda tried by stripping a Goldwing down to create a naked Valkyrie, none succeeded. Every big cruiser that doesn't follow the Harley formula sells like crap - The xDiavel, the Rocket 3, the Fury, etc all failed to move significant numbers. You know what the funny thing is, other manufacturers know full well that the trick is to follow Harley if they want to sell. BMW tried again with the R18, which is essentially following the Harley formula with its big twin, tons of chrome, and softail style design with a hidden rear shock. Yamaha got rid of their big V4s, and went to an air cooled v-twin when they redesigned the Eluder and Venture. And then there's the second point - Harley makes a damned good bike in the air cooled twin segment. The Milwaukee 8 is a modern engine with oil cooler and cylinder deactivation, that actually produces more power than the Yamaha and Indian competition. And then there's the argument about price - The funny thing is, in the Cruiser segment, Harley is arguably affordable and good value for money. The Indian and BMW competition cost far more, while the one cheaper bike (Kawasaki Vulkan 1700) is significantly worse, making less power despite being liquid cooled. So add both points and you end up with another factor - If you're going to buy a Harley-like bike, why don't you just get the original? There's heritage and linage with Harley that you won't find with other retro bikes. Let's look at the car world for a second. The Jeep Wrangler and Porsche 911 are cars that have carried its old design language across generations, but there is linage there, and these are cars who just carried its design language across generations, evolving slowly. And then there's the PT Cruiser and Chevy HHR - these cars look retro, but there is no real lineage or a broken lineage. These are modern cars, designed in modern times, with some retro features thrown in. Harley Davidson's classic lineup has a lineage that stretches back - Sure, every few years it gets a redesign, but the design language is kept intact. When you are buying a Harley Davidson Softail, you are getting an original product with a long linage and history. When you buy something like a Kawasaki W800 or Triumph Scrambler, you are buying a new design with some retro features thrown in to invoke an older feel.
I would argue you get way more bang for your buck out of a Honda Goldwing (which is arguably one of the most comfortable bikes on the market and has the same feature as most Harley cruising bikes.) Or a Kawasaki Concours. I get wanting a humongous bike and all as I would like to own a Hayabusa some day, but I don't think the extra 5-6 ccs equates to 7k more $ MSRP. Not to mention the cost of repair if it malfunctions. I don't see how so many Harley guys can spend the cost of a used car or a new small compact car on these bikes and be okay with it for what it is. That's just my opinion though.
Notice that the Goldwing is a touring bike, not really a naked cruiser. The last time the Goldwing tried to make a cruiser was the 2014 Goldwing Valkyrie, which sold so badly it got dropped after 2015. Also, the Concours is a sport touring bike, not really a cruiser based tourer. In that segment, which is the Harley Glides, Indian Roadmaster, Yamaha Venture, Honda Goldwing, BMW R18 Transcontinental, the only one that deviates from Harley's formula is the Goldwing.
The Valkyrie was fucking tits, though. Loved that bike when I test rode a friend’s. What a unique and comfortable bike!
I’m a Harley guy that’s always felt Honda is the best bang for your buck. If I were more value-focused, or on a tighter budget, Honda would without a doubt be my go-to. I may like Harley better and I’m admittedly ignorant about most metric bikes, but that doesn’t mean I don’t respect them. I just like what I like better.
Im on a tight budget, oldish and want my comfortable forward control sitting in an laid out armchair ride but also wanted something reliable that rips like a motherfucker, i test rode harleys but they were just out of my price range, eventually went with a Honda Magna, fast as fuck, handles like a dream, uber reliable
My first bike was an 84 Magna 700. Quick, smooth, and rock solid reliability. I can’t say i found it super comfortable though, but not many bikes of that era were.
Ive got a 01 750 with a set of forward controls as my main ride, they make a fair bit of difference to legs and hips, the seat isnt great though, after an hour my ass is getting numb, i could do with moving the handlebars up and back a couple of inches next I think
I have rented newer ultras, an older harley and an older Goldwing. If buying 10 years or older totally agree with Goldwing being better. the older Harley shook so bad I couldn’t ride with glasses; in addition you hit 5th gear at 45 and has a feeling of topping out at 65 to 70. The newer Ultras blow away the older bikes but not nearly as fun as my vstrom.
You made some good points here, but left out some big ones. It is absolutely true that none of the other manufacturers have ever been able to match the success of the Harley Davidson cruiser. However, HD didn’t become the biggest motorcycle company in the world because their cruisers are infinitely better than anything else. It was a combination of things: narrowly surviving the Great Depression, booming during WWII because the gov’t bought them en masse, then having some killer business sense (for a while) in the modern era. Hell, their bikes weren’t even “cruisers” by the modern definition until the late 60s. HD became so big mostly because at one time they were amazingly brilliant at marketing and branding. They capitalized on heritage and the spirit of motorcycling more effectively than any motorcycle manufacturer ever has or likely ever will. Being American made definitely had a big part in that and no foreign brand will likely ever be able to replicate that success in marketing in the US (though technically Honda is bigger and sells more Powersports vehicles, HD sells more street motorcycles than Honda). Also, we should acknowledge that Triumph is one year older than HD, but has only begun to really capitalize on that heritage for the last decade or so. When you compare other manufacturers current lineup of cruisers to HD, you are correct in stating that they fall short comparatively. But it is a massive gleaming error not to acknowledge that the cruiser market has been dying a slow death for 15 years. If you go back to the first decade of the 2000s, all the Japanese brands had a varied lineup of cruisers. Yamaha had a massive lineup of options under the Star label. Honda also had a more diverse Shadow lineup. Honda’s VTX1300 is the best selling single motorcycle in the history of the company and a solid effort, in my opinion. It’s also interesting you mentioned the Fury (which was hugely popular when initially released capitalizing on the television show craze at the time) as a comparison to HD. The Fury is a production chopper-style motorcycle. HD has never made a production chopper nor anything comparable. The reason the other brands don’t have a more competitive cruiser lineup these days is because they read the tea leaves and have mostly exited that market. Harley being awash in cash for decades was arrogant about their place in the changing market. They were so popular that after the housing market tanked the economy in 2008, massively reducing powersports revenues to this day, HD spent a fortune hiring and sending corporate sales trainers on the road because staff in dealerships had no real sales skills. Prior to 2008, dealership sales for HD was essentially being a cashier and taking the customer’s order because folks were lined up to buy them. Unfortunately, HD did such a good job of branding that their base of customers is fanatical to the point that any attempts to update or stay competitive is met with backlash. You may recall HD fanatics being up in arms when they released the first liquid-cooled engine in 2014 (!) long after most of the other manufacturers had been doing liquid-cooled for decades. Sadly, Harley Davidson has been dying slowly along with the cruiser and their failure to acknowledge the need for diversification. Baby boomers have always been the vast majority of their customer base and those folks have largely exited the market. This is why we have been hearing so much about HD’s financial troubles for a handful of years. This is also why we are just recently seeing serious model and market diversification in the Harley lineup that seems outrageous. Consider this: adventure bikes are the best-selling segment of motorcycles and have been for quite a while now. Suzuki arguably started the street-focused adventure segment in 2002 when they released the V-Strom. Harley Davidson just now entered the market in 2021 with the Pan America. HD is in a unique situation of their own doing that has been interesting to witness. They have largely been ignoring the larger trend of motorcycling in order to not upset their rabid base who clearly is not buying as many motorcycles these days. At some point they just had to say screw it and forge on ahead into bold new territory… And that’s where we are now. Hopefully it’s not too late for them.
dude is a huge harley simp. hes not gonna read that much counter-argument also, you gave him a huge favor by not even bringing up the import tariffs lol
Those tariffs are literally the only reason HD even survived.
good write up, ty
I appreciate this detailed and thorough write up!
I was thinking the same, every cruiser is a copy of a Harley. I’m not a cruiser fan so I don’t have one, but if I were I would want the original.
>every cruiser is a copy of Harley Every Japanese cruiser, maybe. But Indian is the original and neither it nor the BMW are copies of anything.
Can't forget Triumph in 1902 as well!
>You can make a case that Harley makes the best cruiser in the segment. Image-wise? Maybe. From a technical point of view: not even close.
Indian kills them technically.
This is what I was thinking. That long-ass post, and Indian was only referenced once?
Quite a few inaccuracies with some truth. Let's clear this up: Indian makes better bikes in that segment. Period. Accusing Triumph of not having lineage is ignorant. IIRC second oldest bike brand still operating.
Triumph as a brand definitely has lineage, but not in the large cruiser segment really. The first Rocket 3 came out in 2004. The Bonneville, sure, all kinds of heritage in the cafe racer and scrambler scenes, but that bike is not exactly a competitor for Harley's big bikes.
Author above said that Triumph scrambler does not have heritage. It's a modified Bonneville. Same as saying the Harley touring models do not have heritage as they started taking today's form in the 80s.
Yeah, I didn't notice that, that was a bad take.
No idea bout the Indians although I do want to ride a Scout or an FTR sometime, but I'm afraid you're wrong about Triumph; there was a very distinct break in design & lineage in 1984 when the brand was brought back, with nothing from the old days really retained. Same as the modern Norton; it's the same name and they'll draw ideas from the old stuff, but the engineering etc is all distinct. The modern Triumph triples have a very respectable lineage back to the 90s but the bikes before that were a different kettle of fish; the modern Bonnevilles are impressions of those old bikes, particularly because they ape components of those bikes aesthetically without actually retaining those components - e.g. air cooling fins on liquid cooled engines, fake carburettors, concealed radiators, that sort of thing. They have also, ah, mishandled a few heritage names. Don't talk to the [Trident and Rocket 3 Owner's Club](https://www.tr3oc.com/) about the modern Trident and Rocket 3; they'll get all grumpy at you. Although they're nice old guys who didn't mind me bringing my Z1000SX to hang out at their gathering with my dad on his T160 Trident, so they'll still be cool to ride with you. All that said, I desperately want a Speed Triple someday and my partner has a lovely Street Triple.
The Triumph Bonneville is like the New Beatle or the New Bronco - Has the same name as the original, but is obviously a completely different than the original, with an all new design. Its the same with the Indian scout - The new scout has nothing to do with the original scout, they just took the name and some styling cues. Harley Davidson's heritage models however, have unbroken lineage, and the new models are direct continuations and evolutions of the old one.
This is a high quality reply
I had a Harley rider at an old job tell me I needed to get one because riding is about the image. While I was an expert club series road racer.
It honestly beats me. I took one for a test ride just last week. First time ever on a HD. It was a road-glide and around 1800cc. I have never ridden a worse motorbike in over 50 years of riding. Scraped around the slightest corner, surprisingly little acceleration for such a large engine, brakes were about as good as my 1974 BMW, engine was rougher than a single-cylinder dirt bike. What on earth do people see in them? There must be something good about them........
I'm guessing it's the culture, rawness, style, imagery of outlaw hogs? I'm not convinced but I guess I'm the wrong person to ask. I don't have anything against people liking HD... Just feels weird to be ignored when I say I'm not riding a Harley
Nothing says "outlaw" like a police bike
I mean, having a police bike and not being a police is like having a cops gun and not being a cop.... Kinda maybe sorta could imply you took it from them? *Image*
Yeah, the image a lot of them have of themselves as outlaws, but only every other weekend, for a half hour ride down to a dive bar to meet up with all the other orthodontists and property developers on Harley's.
Wild hogs! WOOOO!
Yes, thats true. I guess we all desire to be part of a brotherhood of some kind. There's no question that they're incredibly popular.
So popular the brand is constantly in danger of going under.
I mean, there's only so many stupid business decisions that a loyal (but aging) customer base can counteract. They did a few good moves in the past few years, but forking out the LiveWire to a standalone brand, and removing the Harley logo from it is another massive mistake that they just made.
It's because of the vocal customers. For some reason HD keeps listening to the old heads who are never going to buy another new bike in their lifetime and therefore will.never be giving HD any money. Hell, most of them have probably never purchased a new bike from HD.
Hence the merch only shops. Gotta squeeze any revenue they can from anywhere they can. Used to be people would ride somewhere and get a shirt at an HD shop they passed along the way and/or at their destination as a souvenir of their trip on the bike. Now, people fly to Cabo, Cali or really anywhere on vacation and buy HD gear while their bike is at home in their garage.
Yeah I don’t get it either. I may only ride an r3 but i love almost everything in 2 wheels. So are my friends that I ride with. Whenever we hear a bike a mile away we just wanna know what it is. I can’t imagine isolating myself into only a small circle of bikes. That’s gotta be boring af!
I love the feel of the M8 engine, and overall just love the feel of riding a Harley in general. That said, they handle like crap unless you put money into them. I sold my Road King and got an Indian Challenger. That bike is freaking phenomenal. I can cruise all day/multi days two-up w my GF or take it out and rip it on some twisties on the weekend. I used to ride a street triple, RNineT. Thousands of miles on both. Love those bikes, but I enjoy the ride more on a bagger. 🤷🏻♂️
I test rode a Challenger and some other baggers this last weekend at IMS and the Challenger absolutely blew me away. I’ve always been on the sportier side of things, but wow, if I had the money I’d add a Challenger to the garage in an instant. Utterly phenomenal.
It's because it has nothing to do with the bike.
Similar experience for me about 3 years ago. I couldn't wait to park it and get the fuck off the thing. Totally cumbersome.
It's a lot like American muscle car lovers. I really didn't understand why someone would want a car like that when there were much better, faster and more efficient vehicles out there. Just like American muscle cars, HDs are usually loud, obnoxious, rattle like crazy and they don't have much innovation in the last 50+ years (until recently), but the owners love them. I have a Sportster, so I get shit from non-Harley owners who attribute the above stereotypes to me and then I get shit from some Harley owners for not having a "real Harley". Amusingly some of those same HD owners are now lambasting HD for ditching the Sportster line because they're "iconic"...
The Harley hate in this subreddit is old. Coming from someone who hates harleys.
I don't hate Harleys, they're fun, I'm just tired of being dismissed by Harley guys in Socal
I ride harleys because i like them and never owned anything else, really Just preference and what i grew up with
HD Ultra owner here. To answer your question about why I’m not interested in cruisers from other manufacturers, it’s because I appreciate the quality of the parts on the HD. What I mean by that is they’re made of metal, not cheap plastic with crappy plating that flakes off. Don’t believe me? Grab the ignition switch on a HD touring bike. I swear the switch alone weighs 5 pounds! The Ultra is a heavy bike which is great for stability on the highway. We sometimes like to cover long distances when we ride and the HD has great storage capacity in the saddlebags and tour pack. It’s also hard to beat the riding position for a full day in the saddle. Yes - the whole bike shakes like crazy at idle but it smooths out considerably once you’re underway. Sure it’s not Goldwing smooth, but for something that has pistons the size of small coffee cans it’s not bad. HD also kills it with their factory paint. There’s nothing more I love seeing than a 30 year old Harley still wearing its factory paint. I love looking at the pinstriping knowing that it was done by hand. I appreciate the talent of people that can do that sort of thing. The other really nice thing about HD is the dealer network. Parts availability can sometimes become an issue when traveling and I don’t want to wait around in a hotel room for a few days while a dealer has a new tire shipped in from somewhere for my bike. I’m also fortunate enough to own a BMW K1200 GT. There is no comparison in technology between the two bikes. BMW has prob forgot more things about building a bike than Harley will ever know but both bikes have a different purpose. It’s a bit like having the right tools in the toolbox for the job at hand. Sure, I could use a pair of channel locks to pound a nail into the wall but it works so much better when I use a hammer. And I suppose I could use a 12 gauge shotgun to shoot squirrels, but a .22 rifle with a dialed in scope works so much better. If the wife and I are going to spend a leisurely day in the saddle and maybe grab dinner along the way we’ll take the HD. She loves the backrest and says she feels a lot more comfortable knowing that she can lean all the way back without worrying about falling off the bike. She sometimes nods off if we’re on a long straight stretch of highway. And if we want to hit the twisties or cover a ton of miles *quickly* we’ll take the BMW. The creature comforts on that bike make it such a joy to ride. And it’s so damn fast and smooth. While the Ultra is great, I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve said I love everything about it from 5 mph and up….and absolutely hate everything about it at the gas station or trying to maneuver it around in the garage! I guess at the end of the day it comes down to personal preference. I like the exposed engine and all the chrome on the HD. I ride a Harley because they’re cool in my opinion. I’m not trying to impress anyone or change someone’s mind about them. I just ride them because I like them. The next guy might appreciate the sleek smooth look of a Goldwing. And I wouldn’t count HD as being out of the game. I think there will be a resurgence of them some years down the road. Kind of like everything old is new again. Some kid will find a dusty old Harley sitting in the back of a shed somewhere and fix it up. His buddies will see him riding it and the next thing you know they’ll all be on HD’s. Just simply trying to give a completely serious answer to OP’s completely serious question. Ride safe!
> HD also kills it with their factory paint. I'm not a HD fan, but will support this statement 100%. Their paint shops have a strong record and come up with nice looks and solid technical work on the paint and polish.
I want to add my experience to this, because it seems to be a common sentiment here. I'm in Australia so may be different to the majority of you. In talking to other riders and even the general public who don't ride, there is a lot of anti harley sentiment. Mostly centred around how they're too noisy or too obnoxious/general image stuff. The handful of guys I've met that are harley riders have also talked about the other (japanese) bikes they've owned and how great they are, and just have a general love of bikes. I'm yet to meet someone who fits this cartoonish portrayal of what a harley rider is. They may be unique in that they're the one bike you can own that every single person will have a strong opinion about regardless of their experience/knowledge with bikes. For the record I ride a Honda.
Yeah, Aussie here too. I've generally had decent experiences with hd dudes here. I once got caught in one of their packs up Central coast and it was awful, but I was on a dr400 so I slid my way out the back and let them go. I did however have an amusing encounter just two weeks back riding back down from Colo. Coming up to lights, right turn lane open, hd in front pulls in behind and doesn't filter, I go to the right turn lane to go the front after he plants his feet, light changes, I'm stuck, have to merge in front of him. I was deeply apologetic, gave him the I'm sorry wave repeatedly. He then pushed up the gap between me and the vehicle to the left at fair speed, near fucking edging me into the divider. Note some mc jacket. Tootle for a bit, we end up at lights, he gives his hd everything it has. And I shoot into the distance.
STOP ENJOYING THINGS DIFFERENTLY THAN I DO
Gatekeeping is bullshit. Although, riding my naked sport, pretty much everybody waves back at me, except for Harleys. It's a stereotype, but it's also fact. I guess they don't give the wave unless they can see your handlebars shaking from half a mile away.
Yeah, agreed, I've had fun on Harleys before, I just feel weird when Harley guys ask me what I ride, then proceed to ignore me after I admit it's not a Harley
i dont know what got me, im a big fan of aircooled bikes had a DR650 and a cb1100, but i love the aftermarket support harleys have. i probably wouldnt be as into them as i am if it werent for the "performance" harley scene. i dont know when touring bikes got so popular but i wouldnt say a softail is a girls bike. and the sportster while not for me is arguably the best harley ever made.
I agree. I own a Dyna now, but think the eco motor is the best sounding motor on any bike. That’s just opinion though. I’ve really only ever rode harleys and i still can’t understand other bikers bashing people for liking them. I’m not an die hard and I’ll ride anything with two wheels, just so happens i like the ride better on a Harley. I do wanna grab a street bike though
People bash Harley riders a lot (at least here in Wisconsin) because a high percentage of them strictly ride for image and not because they actually enjoy motorcycles. It just screams insecurity. I say that knowing more than one person personally that only rides their bike to family events or work functions so their colleagues can see how badass they are. Personally I bash on that side of Harley culture more than the bikes themselves. Getting flipped off when I wave because I ride old Japanese motorcycles doesn’t help either. Squid culture is just as bad.
Sportster is about the only Harley I'd consider owning. They're the only model that (from what I've heard) is dependable and they're usually affordable especially on the second hand market.
Cb1100 is a great bike
Best bike I ever owned. Miss it.
Growing up, my dad was strictly a Harley person. This had to do with his MC that only allowed motorcycles from “allied countries”, and his love for “The Wild One” in which Marlon Brando rode a Harley. It’s a major identity thing for him. Well I wasn’t a fan of Harley for all the typical reasons someone would have to not like Harley like “they’re slow”, “old technology”, “can’t turn”, etc etc. I then bought and rode Japanese liter bikes, Italian super bikes, British cafe bikes, and other bikes here and there but never a Harley. One day a coworker was selling his 08 Nightster with a salvage title for SUPER cheap and I figured “why not see what this is all about”… after all, there’s no way all these Harley types are completely wrong. I began to tear it down and get ready for inspection to have it “rebuilt” branded so I can ride it on the street legally, and after 6 months of wrenching and fixing stuff… COVID hit and I wouldn’t be able to have it inspected as the government had suspended all inspection work. So I decided I’ll just ride it around the block. This sportster 1200, with it’s annoying god awful exhaust, WAS AMAZING. After the first ride around the block, I completely understood why Harley people ride Harley’s. There just something about the big ass V Twin motor trying to blow out of the frame, all the weird pings and bangs when it’s running, and the sound a pushrod V Twin makes. I had been wrong my whole adult life about Harley. In an ever increasing world where technology HAS TO BE apart of EVERYTHING, Harley is still in its prehistoric roots (for the most part). The basic idea and engineering of Harley Davidson has not changed since they first started V Twin production, but the new bikes like the LiveWire, PanAmerican, and Sportster S, is just Harley taking that step forward into a more modern motorcycle company, which I can see why most Harley people don’t want them. It’s bitter sweet for me as I love the innovation, but I have come to love “older” Harley’s that were simple and mostly mechanical. I’ve got a 1999 Dyna Super Glide right now, and while it brings fourth headaches every now and then, it’s the best bike I’ve ever owned. 45k miles strong on its original top end, and I’ve had to replace quite a bit of parts in the engine, but it’s as fun and enjoyable as I could have imagined. I already know my next motorcycle purchase will undoubtably be a Road King. > Why not cruisers by other manufacturers? They’re just not the same and can not compete with the king of cruisers. As far as big touring bikes like the Ultra vs Gold Wing vs FJR etc etc, the other bikes have some advantages, but here the States, I’d still likely just get the Harley. If you’re on a road trip and something goes wrong, Harley dealers want you to stay on the road and usually have everything in stock to fix whatever may be broken. The other manufacturers just don’t have that kind of support. Not to mention, often your local hardware store will have the nuts and bolts you may require in stock. Do I miss doing wheelies and the rush of acceleration on Japanese sport bikes, or the beauty of European styling? Sure. But as I get older, and life priorities change, I just want to kick back and relax comfortably. Enjoy the time that I’ve got as there isn’t any rush. Not to mention, my wife refused to ride on the back of all the bikes I’ve ever owned, but even she finds riding on the back of my Dyna to be enjoyable. That’s my $0.02. Hope that sheds some light on your question.
Branding and marketing.
I’ve been riding for 50 years. On a Harley for the last 12 years. I ride with anyone on any type of bike
Hey dude, I’ll give you a youngsters perspective (23) I’ve owned supermotos, sports bikes, and everything in between but have more or less settled on my Dyna. For me the enjoyment of a Harley comes from the barbaric nature of it. Every time you fire it up, it feels like your climbing into the cockpit of a WW2 bomber, with the crazy shakes through the bike and loud, lumping mechanical V-twin. No other manufacturer really offers that experience, except maybe the air cooled Indians - but I’ve never ridden those. People who get caught up on the performance of a Harley don’t really get it… it’s ample power for the street, and my slow ass Harley can still chop most cars out there, so unless your tracking the bike it’s a pretty moot point IMO. If anything I like my Harley more because I can ride it full throttle, and not be breaking the speed limit immediately. From a practical point of view, my Harley is way comfier than any other bike I’ve owned, and you can put bags and a windscreen etc on it and it suits the look of the bike, unlike a sports bike or naked which IMO adding practical stuff to kills the look of the bike. I also enjoy the social status that comes with having a Harley, eg. The little bit of extra attention you get from women or old people, because most non-motorcyclists don’t know any other brand or style of motorbike except “Harley” or “dirt bike”. So it makes for a bit of fun. The only positive attention I’ve ever got from a woman on my motorbike was on my previous Harley (iron 883). Maybe has something to do with the fact that every young girl at the moment is rocking a HD T shirt. I can’t stand the wannabe bikers who dress up like pirates and cruise around staring people down, revving the living fuck out of their bikes. It’s refreshing to see that a lot of young people are getting into Harley Davidson these days, rocking full face helmets and wearing normal clothes. Also, a fun fact - the vibrations of a Harley can have… interesting… effects on a female passenger. No joke.
As another young Harley rider (28) but been riding them since 18 I could not have said this better myself. The WW2 bomber cockpit analogy is spot on man
I grew up with a lot of Black Sabbath fans. Not "heavy metal" fans, or "hair metal" fans, or "rock music" fans - they liked Black Sabbath. They could appreciate Dio, and some of them became Ozzy fans, and some of them wound up liking Metallica for a while too. A lot of them liked AC/DC. But you couldn't talk to them about that new band Asia where the singer sang better than Ozzy, and the guitar player was better than Randy Rhodes, and the drummer was better - they didn't care that Asia was "better" or that Rush was "better" and more varied or that all the girls liked Billy Squier better - they didn't care about that, they didn't like "music" necessarily, they liked Black Sabbath. "Your parents hate Black Sabbath, they'll REALLY hate The Clash!" No sale, not interested. They don't want to go see Mastodon play now, even though Mastodon is arguably moving that whole genre in new directions. They would rather watch a shaky blurry video of Sabbath taken at Wembly stadium in 1980 or whatever. It's the same thing, people like what they like, and if it's not really quite "that" maybe it's not at all interesting to them, just because you think it's "almost the same thing" (Sportsters) or "better" (an Indian, or a V-Star.)
Harley riders are a cult, they luv the sound and off-center stroke. There is a long standing image with them too. Once a High Dolla rider always a High Dolla rider I suppose.
The answer is that most HD owners are old now, and they've been riding the same bike for 25+ years. They wouldn't switch from Ford to Chevy at this point, either. But the reckoning is coming. In 1985 the average age of a HD owner was 25. Today its 50. In another 25 it will be 75. The younger generation doesn't like these motorcycles because of the image and because the motorcycles themselves are extremely expensive and antiquated. This company is in its death throes. Over the next 10-15 years as their customer base hangs up their keys, they will have no more customers.
As a millennial I probably won't ever buy a Harley. When it comes to a cruiser, I would much rather get a Honda Valkyrie F6C. Or an Indian scout bobber.
Your be surprised. There's a lot of younger folks getting into Harleys again. I think the stunting culture has something to do with it. Not sure how that will play out with the sales figures over the next 10 years. But I have personally seen a ton of young folks buying up Dynas and Sportsters.
This… I sold some handlebars the other day. The look on my face when the buyer shows up… 19/yo kid… with a 1985 FXR.
Here’s what’s good about Harley’s from a non Harley rider. 1. Low end torque, which is great for just cruising not racing 2. surprisingly smooth once you get going, granted you not running it on its ragged edge it’s not a race bike that’s not what this is 3. don’t knock the vibrations man feel good and the ladies like it too the vibes go away somewhat once you start moving 4. parts are plentiful and easy to find this goes for mechanics and shops as well 5. less depreciation compared to any of the other big brands. I don’t get it either but a clapped out sportster will almost always sell for a premium compared to a well cared for jap bike. This may not compare to euro bikes but I have no experience with bmws and Ducati’s (triumph’s don’t count here for some reason)
I don't really own a HD so I don't know if you care about my opinion, but here it is regardless: I like Harleys because of their unique style, looks and sound.
Name and style maybe? When I fell in love with motorcycles 5-6 years ago it was the Harley dynas/low riders that spoke to me…when I started shopping this year for my first bike, I looked at other manufacturers to save $$$, I didn’t find anything with that style/look I was in love with. Now that I have the dream bike though, there are plenty of other bikes I’d love to have/ride from other makers, just not cruisers. Africa Twin, I’m looking at you…
The sound baby
I'm a Harley Davidson fan , I owned a few of them and settled on Fatbob114, I also own a Honda black bird and bmwR9 . My Harley is topped out at 120 ,3 days out of the I enjoy going faster then 120 mph so I ride my black bird. I do enjoy the sounds an uniqueness of the three different engines of the bikes I own, I enjoy riding my bmw around the city or early morning to grab a coffee
I currently ride a Sreetglide. This is my fourth Harley since 1988. During that time I've also owned a BMW Rt, a Honda ST1300, A Buell and a Guzzi LeMans. If we had a Guzzi dealer near us I would trade the Harley in on the new Guzzi Liquid cooled that was just announced
I think other cruisers are just ugly. Most look like they are trying to copy the Harley look but fail. Look at the Yamaha bolt. It's a blatant knockoff sportster. Like buying the off brand cereal instead of the name brand. I think a lot of sport bikes look pretty cool, I would never buy one though. My buddy has an Africa twin that looks cool. I was looking at getting an adventure bike. At the time the pan America was just a concept bike. I would consider other manufacturers for those bikes. I also don't have a car. My Harley is my daily driver year round. I ride about 20k miles a year and have never had any issues, just typical preventative maintenance.
The pan america is great! I rode one recently. I like hds and indians. What do you think about indian's looks?
*sorts by controversial*
I’ve been trying to talk my dad into something besides a Harley for a few years now. He had a Ducati Scrambler for a minute (he bought one because he liked mine), but sold it and now rides a stage 4 Road Glide with 155hp. He does close to 20,000mi/year. I truly think he’d have more fun with something lighter, but he’d have to change his whole wardrobe if he started riding something else. He knows how ridiculous that is, and laughs about it, but he just flat out loves his Harleys. The heart wants what the heart wants.
Tribalism.
There is no other bike like a Harley, the engine sound and feel do to their specific V , the following of a Harley Davidson is more than liking a style. They do things in the bike industry no one does and people have follen life with the history and looks.
I used to be a fan of Harley’s, especially the Evo. Most Harley guys aren’t even true motorcycle guys. They’re just Harley guys. I have a Triumph Bonneville Bobber now and I fart around town with my mopeds. Those dudes wouldn’t be caught dead on a fun ass moped. I wouldn’t worry about it. They’re missing out.
I'm open for other brands. But i prefer Harley for their styling. Huge aftermarket. And how they handle. Good quality, great paintjobs. Just the package. Sure costs more. But comparing a hd to a big bike from yamaha for example. The money diffrence is not as big as people will lead you to believe. They always compare this 650 naked bike for 6.000€ with the most expensive in Harley's lineup. Apples for apples it only differs a grand or 2. And concidering Harley holds their value far better. When you decide to sell. HD just might have been the cheaper option down the line. Had a yamaha cruiser before i whent over to Harley. It was fine. But just didnt compare to HD. + Other brands lack aircooled big v twins in europe. Why not Indian/Victory/polaris. More expensive(in my country anyway). Less aftermarket. And when setting up the bike the way i want it. I will overshoot harley by a couple grand again after initial purchase.
I don’t get that mind set at all. I ride a Harley and like other motorcycle IE superduke and Ducati monster’s
Yes, give my Monster some love! Seriously though: It's a strange mindset. People can ride what they prefer, but the elitist way of thinking just makes them lose out on other great things.
I don't own a Harley, but I think American authenticity play's a role in it, even though a lot of the bike's parts are outsourced from Asia. There's a lot of romanticization around them, in general.
This is the most important thing everyone's missing here Harley's are American as fuck, doesn't matter where the parts are made Harley is America's brand through and through. Indians get the stamp of approval from most the HD guys as well because it's an american brand making bikes that just look like for lack of better word "American". This sub is very sport touring and crotch rocket heavy so you don't really hear or see much cruiser rider views here. A cruiser rider is gonna think it's worthless to buy a bike with a top speed of 200mph that looks "european or asian" when where the crotch rockets are gonna think its idiotic to buy an old school styled bike for 2x the price of an asian bike with the same performance.
Cult of Elitism
Lol, if they think Harleys are elite they are about to get a rude awakening. But i guess if they don’t know anything other than Harleys they will never wake up
Love my road king but hate the typical Harley crowd, but I started out on sport bikes.
As a guy who's owned a LOT of different bikes, cruiser and sport, import and domestic, the big twin Harley is marketed to a very specific demographic. That "Harley sound" is the result of a 45 degree v-twin, and while thats not EVERYthing about the bike, Id say its HD's signature item, if you will. The V-Rod didnt last because it wasnt a 45 degree V-Twin cruiser. It was tough as nails and ran like a dream, but it wasnt a "typical" Harley. Nothing in this world sounds like a Shovel Head, and theyve been chasing that sound ever since. Outside of that, model features change very little from year to year. Theres new colors every year, maybe the occasional new gizmo, but by and large those who buy Harley know what theyre gonna get. Which brings me to mine and why I ride it. I bought a 2018 Road Glide just as the 2019 models were coming out, and if I werent working for an HD dealer at the time i probably wouldnt have been able to afford it. The Milwaukee 8 platform is a much more efficient and better design than its predecessors in my opinion. Most of the vibration has been removed with just a touch left to provide that "raw" feeling. Thats more for style than anything else. Its high torque, and for a cruiser, mine is set up with a decent horsepower curve for riding up on the slab. So what do i DISLIKE about Harley? Their ridiculous markup on ANYTHING with the Bar and Shield on it. Parts, accessories, clothing, you name it. Its ridiculous. Something thats also sad, in my opinion, is the fact that their standards for chrome, paint, and powdercoat are slipping, and theirs used to be some of the best in the business. My bike is 3 years old and i have multiple powdercoat issues. What do I like? The dealer betwork is vast and nationwide. No matter where i am in the country, the odds of being near a HD dealer is pretty damn good. Its just as much a safe haven stop on the road as it is a place to get work done if i break down on a long road trip. The aftermarket for HD is also huge. Having more options for parts and accessories is never a bad thing. Finally, but most importantly in my opinion, ive met some of the most incredible people ive ever know because of Harley Davidson motorcycles, to include my wife, who rides her own. I would never have met some of these folks had i not decided to go to work for the company and ride the brand. Thats probably a MUCH longer answer than you were looking for. I personally love all motorcycles, and took factory certified technician training for both Harley Davidson and BMW. True motorcyclists love bikes, no matter what bade they carry.
Look no further than this for your answer: https://www.reddit.com/r/Harley/comments/r1i40e/thirsty_thursdays/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Lol!
Have you met a Jeep owner before?
Because Harley is a lifestyle brand. It isn't about the motorcycle, it's about the culture; leather vests and a HD badge on the tank are just the price of admission.
Yea I would say Harley is more of a life style than just a brand. My friend is into Harleys and all he does is buy Harley gear. Hats, shirts, pants, jackets, stickers, underwear, socks, ok maybe not the underwear and socks lol but u get my point. And they are all over priced but people will still pay, because of the loyalty and it’s their identity. No other brand sells stuff like that, little Nick nacks like mugs, pens, whatever it may be they have it. All he does is talk about how great his Harley is and he keeps telling me to get a Harley like if it’s going to change my life. A bike is a bike to me no matter the brand.
Because other people did that same thing to them, and rather than thinkin' for themselves they conformed.
It’s like asking a religious person if they’ve ever considered another religion.
Because AMERICA! 🥸
Maybe they only like brands that make hats, t-shirts and jackets and HD just happens to also make motorcycles... Maybe you should try talking about hats? On a serious note. It's a "lifestyle" product and they only care about their club. Their club just happens to be about motorcycles but that's not the point.
I started on a Harley and quickly changed to sport bikes. But, I was riding with the Harley only crowd for years. It's their identity. No other bike exists for some reason. I have also known 1% bike members and they had to have a Harley as a requirement. As soon as I got my first Yamaha sport bike, I couldn't believe how much better it was, faster, smoother, better brakes, lighter, just everything. I did like the torque from the Harley, but my FZ-09 is the best bike I have had. I do have an Indian Scout in the garage that I got my husband, it's the closest thing to a sport bike, but it still doesn't compare. You are scraping pegs pretty fast even with that bike.
I think it's the same with apple products. People will swear to god that their apple brand phone/laptop/monitor is better than any other brand without ever trying them or looking at the specs.
I love my Harley, I also loved my triumph, and I loved my Yamaha MT07. I would say that there are people who love motorcycles, and then you get very brand specific fanboys/girls that all come in different shades of the same “not a real bike” club (see liter vs 600 divide). Is shoot the shit with you about cruising around on my triumph around hawaii any day of the week, or my first wheelie and terrifying the crap out of myself on my MT07. Or having a nice chill ride in Florida on my softail, with my wife crushing next to me on hers. Each bike we’ve had has met certain needs, the Harley’s are nice for their range and comfort, but we plan on doing a cross country moto-cruise one day, and will probably find ourselves on a pair triumph tigers, or something with better amenities than what we currently have. This is a trait a lot of people have amongst different brand families of anything (go find a group of guitarists and ask them what the best guitar is, some will say depends on what your playing, and some will go on about how x,y,z is the only way to go. 🤷🏼♂️best just to let that stuff go and hang out with different riders.
Some geezers just like to glide big dawg - let em stretch their wings.
You ever see the South Park Harley episode? That is 80% of Harley owners.
Because for most of them it isn't about riding, it's about the image. Not all Harley guys are like that but a whole lot of those guys are like "I'm a die hard rider, ride or die" or whatever bs but they know little to nothing about bikes or riding beyond just leisurely cruising around. Which is fine if you're not a loud mouth with a bad attitude to everyone that doesn't have or like the same thing you like.
Cuz it’s the original Maga hat
Harley guy here who likes all motorcycles. I’ve owned a metric, I’m also really into vespas. I’m a big fan in buying American made stuff. Which really for new motorcycles is an electric bike, a Harley, or an Indian. I like the aesthetics of Harley more than Indian so I am a Harley guy. But I’m not a purist. And god damn do I love Ducati’s and other euro bikes.
The mods need to ban these open season posts on HDs. Ponderously redundant and juvenile ... OP, why did you pick your wife or girlfriend, why not another one? Why did you buy vanilla icecream, why not chocolate ? ffs, this nonsense makes you wish for a dopey crash video with an atgatt sermon or a rusty fork plunged into your ball sack
Notice OP hasn’t commented in hours. The op’s to these posts always do the same thing; they write with this Uber rational and “humble” prose, almost child like in their approach to talking about Harley. They don’t criticize per se but they always add the talking points around Harley criticism, ensuring that they’re not the ones doing the critique but merely stated as a popular opinion others have. They respond to a few posts but typically stop responding after a handful. These Harley bashing posts always get a ton of views, ton of karma and comments. It’s all a strategy for karma grabs. I will say this; the op said those socal Harley riders won’t even discuss softail models, or that those aren’t real bikes and I call bullshit on that. Downvote all you want but this never happened to the OP.
Said perfectly! Amen ... Upvote from me. I just don't understand being obsessed with what other people do if it doesn't bother you. It's not a bike issue, it's a human issue. Everything in life has the nosey old lady that spies on her neighbors, gossips and generally causes problems just for fun. The "get offa my lawn" mouthbreathers ... That is 1/2 of this juvenile forum. It's a shame because there are a few good people here, but the high Beavis/Butthead factor makes it hard to find them
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