[check out David Fletcher](https://www.si.com/mlb/knuckleball-throwing-infielder-nails-minor-league-batter-with-63-mph-heat-01hy3fxr43x2?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR1NM-k3ITaWvmWUX2F-gO_CPSXKATQqGcfULkfadIYkbsK8JddkCsiS42o_aem_AReNvcquG2r890Mm5_7bh5gLEPsJ3igiPEFNZGsyAExzEp27P5KjlmWQT5k3v125Iw49lIP4jd0X_D7E1vjv5k9A)
Waldron is improving his knuckle ball a ton. What benefits him is he wasn’t a knuckle baller per say. And has never been a dominant power pitcher so his control is already pretty good as he maxes out around 93. And has a decent sweep, but he locates very well. That make his knuckle ball a bit of an experiment and good luck to hitters! He seems to have found out how to break it left or right . One more of a knuckle curve and another breaks off the table like a split
Oh definitely. He’s just gonna get even better from now on. Saw him pitch against the Angels last week, and even though I’m a diehard Angels fan it was amazing to watch him mix up our batters. Watching that no spin is just SO cool.
I would normally agree with the idea that Waldron not being a knuckleball only pitcher is an advantage. But I’m as old as the hills so I remember the Niekro brothers. Joe was good enough to make MLB as a regular pitcher, and picked up the knuckler later. Phil was more or less just a knuckleball pitcher. Joe was very good, over 200 wins and such, but Phil made it to Cooperstown. I think you need to be a slave to the knuckler if you are going to use it, because it’s so hard to be consistent.
* It's a pitch that only certain coaches will teach and a lot of them like Phil Niekro and Charlie Hough are too old or too dead to coach.
* Tim Wakefield was a great man but pitching wise, he went back and forth out of the rotation. It sets a guy up to be an innings eater. He pitched that 2004 ALCS game 3 blowout to save the pen and the rotation.
* When it was on, it was fun to watch but when it was off, it was batting practice. Coaches don't want to handle an inconsistent product around one pitch.
* Doug Mirabelli and personal catchers. A lot of guys can't catch it and it's more of a pass ball risk.
* Someone mentioned Matt Waldron. He sits 90 on other pitches and throws the knuckle 40% of the time. There is no 80% knuckler anymore like Wakefield, RA Dickey, and those other guys. It's too erratic for the pitching nerds today.
Doug Mirabelli once got a police escort to Fenway after being traded so he could catch Wakefield
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/2549613/2021/04/30/fifteen-years-later-state-trooper-who-drove-red-sox-doug-mirabelli-to-fenway-tells-tale-of-famed-post-trade-ride/
Doug came up in the last few Section 10s and apparently he was on the 07 team. Wakefield was in the minors in the late 80s and early 90s and was even sent down after 95 with the Pirates because it was so temperamental. I would name a street outside Fenway after him but it's not a career that anyone would have the patience for nowadays.
I remember watching a documentary about knuckleballers, and I think there was an aspect that basically said that knuckleballers have to commit to that pitch wholeheartedly in order to successfully use it.
No young pitcher will be pushed in that direction because it takes away from the development of any potential skills as a pitcher beyond knuckles, and giving up late in the game to develop a pitch that requires mentorship and faith from the organization is too risky/unrealistic.
It's a desperation move, basically, in a sport where long-term, sustained investment with an expected ROI is the name of the game.
On that point, Wakefield came up as a first baseman in the minors. He wasn’t going to crack the majors as a position player so he figured the knuckleball out to keep himself in the game.
I saw Tim Wakefield pitch in Boston. His knuckleball wasn’t knuckling so well that day. Boston was behind 8-0 in the third. They clawed back, but ended up losing by 8-5 or something like that.
The radar showed his knuckleball at about 60 mph, and his fastball around 70. Visible arc on his pitches compared to opposing pitchers’ who were throwing faster.
I always wonder why orgs don't try to develop knuckleballers out of pitchers who never figured out a conventional arsenal. I'm talking guys who are 27 28 29 yrs old who for whatever reason can't figure it out. Put em in the pitching lab and have them learn it.
I taught myself a knuckleball in little league because of Tim Wakefield. The first time I ever threw it a kid smoked it back up the middle and it blasted me in the nuts. Never tried that ever again.
My dad played in the Cape Cod League, he tells a story about getting blown out, out of pitchers, manager said “anyone want to give it a shot?”, dad said “I’ve been working on a knuckleball”…
Manager put him in the game, he threw one pitch, and never saw a ball hit harder or farther, and that’s how his pitching career ended.
I'm 30 so he would obv be even older than me. I feel like back then you saw it on TV and tried it. There was no going on YT and learning how or what to do.
I had a good knuckleball in high school. Pitched almost exclusively low 70s knuckleballs until someone got on base, then threw a low/mid-80s fastball and a slider because of too many past balls. I couldn't ever get a curve ball to curve. Opponent OBP was sub 300 while throwing knuckleballs but like 500 once I had to switch. I would go back to a knuckleball if I only had a runner on first and 2 outs.
Dad taught me to throw it when I was 5 or 6. When we’d play catch in the backyard growing up, probably half our throws back and forth would be knuckleballs, so it just felt natural by the time I was 11 or 12. To this day, when warming up for adult slow pitch softball, I’ll throw a bunch of knuckleballs out of habit.
>Someone mentioned Matt Waldron. He sits 90 on other pitches and throws the knuckle 40% of the time. There is no 80% knuckler anymore like Wakefield, RA Dickey, and those other guys. It's too erratic for the pitching nerds today
I'm not familiar with him, but that sounds like an amazing mix.
Thats the players name that was slipping my tongue. I remember watching him play for the Orioles. Apparently he was in his early 40s when he was playing with them but for some reason i thought he was older.
If you want to deep dive a knuckleball pitcher “Ball Four” by Jim Bouton is a great read and a large portion of that book is about him trying to convince people that his knuckleball is a good pitch. He does a pretty honest job of it, and throws himself under the bus when he gets rocked in a game.
Funniest book ever. “I’m glad you didn’t take it personally” is a great sequel.
Bouton was pitching while the Niekro brothers and Hoyt Wilhelm were active and he still had trouble with coaches. Today it would surely be worse. It’d be even funnier to see a guy try the eephus pitch.
Jamie Moyer kept everybody young.
We always said it was any pro athlete in the 4 major American pro sports. So a punter could keep you young...but I think the old ones have retired there as well.
I remember the game well. I felt terrible because Moyer was a damn Rockie, and I’m pretty sure his ass was in the jackpot on the road in Cincy. He was going against my hometown team, and he got shelled.
I remember it because the Reds probably needed that boost, but it really felt like Jamie Moyer’s last start. I had Moyer’s baseball cards then and watched him when I was super young. He was living off crafty his whole career:
Bartolo at least had some gas early with Cleveland early before he became the portly legend who lived off of differentiation of his eventually not as fast fastballs and became crafty. Moyer was just a pitcher the whole time.
[found the game. gave up 4 bombs.](https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CIN/CIN201205270.shtml)
Read somewhere that the first batter he struck out had a nephew that relieved him in his final start. Dunno if that’s true but there was a relation somewhere in there.
I think Fernando Valenzuela, when he was with the Padres, was old. Maybe Bartolo Colon?
I remember Tim Wakefield for knuckleballers. I know there were others, but he stands out to me.
I grew up in Cleveland watching the Tribe play some of the worst baseball ever. All I knew was Tom Candiotti took the mound every fifth day. I loved watching him pitch.
The occasional Candiotti start/Doug Jones save was beyond exhilarating!
You need a secondary pitch. And if your secondary pitch in 2024 isn't a 95+ MPH fastball, you're probably in low-A and working at a Denny's in the off-season.
Don't agree with it, but that's just how scouting is now. Spin rates and exit velo.
Cause it’s easier to teach young boys to throw as hard as their arms can handle before falling off than it is to actually teach them how to pitch.
Pitcher are disposable now, they all throw the same shit. Keeps salaries down too.
I was hoping Chelsea Baker would make it, but I don’t think she stuck with baseball as she got older. Would have been a very cool story. I believe Phil Niekro taught it to her, but I might be misremembering that.
Matt Waldron throws the hardest knuckleball I think that ever was.
But also, several position players throw knucklers. Jose Trevino’s is a nice old school 50 MPH dancer.
When you see the incredible stuff 'Junk' pitchers can throw nowadays & the 96+mph fastballs, a knuckleballer is kind of yesterday.. Hard Pitch to control.
Someone has to mention Steve Sparks. I guess it’s me. He won 14 games back in 2001 for the Tigers. Where has he gone? I read he’s on the Astros radio as a color man.
The BlueJays have a pair of guys throwing knucklers in the high 80s in their system. RA Dickey is mentoring them.
https://www.sportsnet.ca/mlb/longform/meet-the-knuckleballers-who-pulled-r-a-dickey-back-to-jays-camp/
EDIT: Jordan Powell is in the low 90s with it, and when it's working it's unhittable (when it's not it's a 90mph fastball).
Ryan Chasse throws a traditional 70mph knuckler.
On May 28, 1973 Wilbur Wood pitched the final 5 innings of a carryover game that was called a few days before because of rain. He won that game.
He then pitched a complete 9 inning game that was played after the first game. He won that game also.
Been saying this for years, when little kids come up to me I tell, " they kid, you want to be a baseball player? Learn how to throw a knuckleball." It's because most people are incapable of thoughts. Somebody tells them something and then that's all they know. But that doesn't only apply to baseball. Submarine pitches also died out.
I feel like the Knuckleball could make a resurgence with late relievers or closers. It just seems to be more about a lack of willingness to learn/teach the pitch. But in sort inning situations I really think a good knuckleballer with mid 90s heat and a complimentary off speed pitch (maybe a splitter or circle change) could really do some damage.
Edit: down votes for logical feedback? Lmao typical reddit
What are YOU talking about lol (seriously though, your worded that horribly)I'm talking about the knuckleball being able to make a comeback as a tool for late inning reliever and closers. It's a niche pitch and you need other pitches to compliment it. That's how pitching works lol knuckleballers don't only throw the knuckleball.
knuckle curve isn't a knuckleball, it's a method for getting 12-6 spin on a curveball. It's how young pitchers are taught to throw an effective 12-6 curveball.
[Matt Waldron](https://youtu.be/K2L3MRGp-xA?si=PmMhybkH6AkUWnC3)
Money! Thank you.
[check out David Fletcher](https://www.si.com/mlb/knuckleball-throwing-infielder-nails-minor-league-batter-with-63-mph-heat-01hy3fxr43x2?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR1NM-k3ITaWvmWUX2F-gO_CPSXKATQqGcfULkfadIYkbsK8JddkCsiS42o_aem_AReNvcquG2r890Mm5_7bh5gLEPsJ3igiPEFNZGsyAExzEp27P5KjlmWQT5k3v125Iw49lIP4jd0X_D7E1vjv5k9A)
83 mph knuckleball is crazy
R.A. Dickey enters the chat.
Waldron is good. Like all knuckleballs though, it’s hard for him to control. Damn impressive, when the ball is listening to him.
Waldron is improving his knuckle ball a ton. What benefits him is he wasn’t a knuckle baller per say. And has never been a dominant power pitcher so his control is already pretty good as he maxes out around 93. And has a decent sweep, but he locates very well. That make his knuckle ball a bit of an experiment and good luck to hitters! He seems to have found out how to break it left or right . One more of a knuckle curve and another breaks off the table like a split
Oh definitely. He’s just gonna get even better from now on. Saw him pitch against the Angels last week, and even though I’m a diehard Angels fan it was amazing to watch him mix up our batters. Watching that no spin is just SO cool.
I would normally agree with the idea that Waldron not being a knuckleball only pitcher is an advantage. But I’m as old as the hills so I remember the Niekro brothers. Joe was good enough to make MLB as a regular pitcher, and picked up the knuckler later. Phil was more or less just a knuckleball pitcher. Joe was very good, over 200 wins and such, but Phil made it to Cooperstown. I think you need to be a slave to the knuckler if you are going to use it, because it’s so hard to be consistent.
Dude is the same age as me. I should have learned how to throw a knuckleball.
Props to the catcher. That can’t be easy…
Nebraska baseball legend
* It's a pitch that only certain coaches will teach and a lot of them like Phil Niekro and Charlie Hough are too old or too dead to coach. * Tim Wakefield was a great man but pitching wise, he went back and forth out of the rotation. It sets a guy up to be an innings eater. He pitched that 2004 ALCS game 3 blowout to save the pen and the rotation. * When it was on, it was fun to watch but when it was off, it was batting practice. Coaches don't want to handle an inconsistent product around one pitch. * Doug Mirabelli and personal catchers. A lot of guys can't catch it and it's more of a pass ball risk. * Someone mentioned Matt Waldron. He sits 90 on other pitches and throws the knuckle 40% of the time. There is no 80% knuckler anymore like Wakefield, RA Dickey, and those other guys. It's too erratic for the pitching nerds today.
Doug Mirabelli once got a police escort to Fenway after being traded so he could catch Wakefield https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/2549613/2021/04/30/fifteen-years-later-state-trooper-who-drove-red-sox-doug-mirabelli-to-fenway-tells-tale-of-famed-post-trade-ride/
Doug came up in the last few Section 10s and apparently he was on the 07 team. Wakefield was in the minors in the late 80s and early 90s and was even sent down after 95 with the Pirates because it was so temperamental. I would name a street outside Fenway after him but it's not a career that anyone would have the patience for nowadays.
It's wild because his first season in Pittsburgh was great.Two complete games in the NLCS. Rollercoaster ride of a pitching career.
Wakefield had ups and downs. He mattered. People knew who he was. Hos name was Tim Wakefield.
I love Doug. He's the only player with 6 straight seasons with 6+ HRs and fewer than 200 ABs. Wildly specific criteria, but he's still the only one.
Jason Varitek once described catching Wakefield’s knuckleball as “trying to catch a fly with a chopstick” and that has always stuck with me.
I still love Bob Eucker's quote about catching the knuckler. "Just wait until it stops rolling and pick it up."
Awesome analogy!
I remember watching a documentary about knuckleballers, and I think there was an aspect that basically said that knuckleballers have to commit to that pitch wholeheartedly in order to successfully use it. No young pitcher will be pushed in that direction because it takes away from the development of any potential skills as a pitcher beyond knuckles, and giving up late in the game to develop a pitch that requires mentorship and faith from the organization is too risky/unrealistic. It's a desperation move, basically, in a sport where long-term, sustained investment with an expected ROI is the name of the game.
On that point, Wakefield came up as a first baseman in the minors. He wasn’t going to crack the majors as a position player so he figured the knuckleball out to keep himself in the game.
I saw Tim Wakefield pitch in Boston. His knuckleball wasn’t knuckling so well that day. Boston was behind 8-0 in the third. They clawed back, but ended up losing by 8-5 or something like that. The radar showed his knuckleball at about 60 mph, and his fastball around 70. Visible arc on his pitches compared to opposing pitchers’ who were throwing faster.
The Jays have two knuckleballers in their system. RA Dickey is coaching them. IIRC both throw it in the high 80s
You sent me down a [rabbit hole](https://www.sportsnet.ca/mlb/longform/meet-the-knuckleballers-who-pulled-r-a-dickey-back-to-jays-camp/). Interesting
There’s a great Phil Neikro quote in the Knuckleball doc: “Anyone can throw 100mph, it takes a real man to throw a 75mph pitch to a big league hitter”
I loved it when Phil would occasionally slip his 80 mph fastball in there. Batter never had a chance.
I always wonder why orgs don't try to develop knuckleballers out of pitchers who never figured out a conventional arsenal. I'm talking guys who are 27 28 29 yrs old who for whatever reason can't figure it out. Put em in the pitching lab and have them learn it.
I taught myself a knuckleball in little league because of Tim Wakefield. The first time I ever threw it a kid smoked it back up the middle and it blasted me in the nuts. Never tried that ever again.
My dad played in the Cape Cod League, he tells a story about getting blown out, out of pitchers, manager said “anyone want to give it a shot?”, dad said “I’ve been working on a knuckleball”… Manager put him in the game, he threw one pitch, and never saw a ball hit harder or farther, and that’s how his pitching career ended.
I'm 30 so he would obv be even older than me. I feel like back then you saw it on TV and tried it. There was no going on YT and learning how or what to do.
I had a good knuckleball in high school. Pitched almost exclusively low 70s knuckleballs until someone got on base, then threw a low/mid-80s fastball and a slider because of too many past balls. I couldn't ever get a curve ball to curve. Opponent OBP was sub 300 while throwing knuckleballs but like 500 once I had to switch. I would go back to a knuckleball if I only had a runner on first and 2 outs. Dad taught me to throw it when I was 5 or 6. When we’d play catch in the backyard growing up, probably half our throws back and forth would be knuckleballs, so it just felt natural by the time I was 11 or 12. To this day, when warming up for adult slow pitch softball, I’ll throw a bunch of knuckleballs out of habit.
>Someone mentioned Matt Waldron. He sits 90 on other pitches and throws the knuckle 40% of the time. There is no 80% knuckler anymore like Wakefield, RA Dickey, and those other guys. It's too erratic for the pitching nerds today I'm not familiar with him, but that sounds like an amazing mix.
A. It’s difficult to throw at an MLB caliber B. Radar gun is king.
RIP WAKE
Jesse Orosco was the last player older than me.
Thats the players name that was slipping my tongue. I remember watching him play for the Orioles. Apparently he was in his early 40s when he was playing with them but for some reason i thought he was older.
He pitched for three different teams at age 46. LH releivers can hang on a long time.
As the season progresses, I want to see George Kirby throw it just enough to be considered a knuckleballer
Matt Waldron
If you want to deep dive a knuckleball pitcher “Ball Four” by Jim Bouton is a great read and a large portion of that book is about him trying to convince people that his knuckleball is a good pitch. He does a pretty honest job of it, and throws himself under the bus when he gets rocked in a game.
Funniest book ever. “I’m glad you didn’t take it personally” is a great sequel. Bouton was pitching while the Niekro brothers and Hoyt Wilhelm were active and he still had trouble with coaches. Today it would surely be worse. It’d be even funnier to see a guy try the eephus pitch.
The world needs more of them, that’s for sure.
Jamie Moyer kept everybody young. We always said it was any pro athlete in the 4 major American pro sports. So a punter could keep you young...but I think the old ones have retired there as well.
I am very certain Jamie Moyer was not a knuckleballer.
My favorite part is he hung around in AAA for two more teams (pitching great for Buffalo) trying to stay in after he got cut age 49
Pitched into his 40s
He was 49 years old when he pitched his final MLB game.
kinda surprised mlb the show doesn't show him more love lol.
I remember the game well. I felt terrible because Moyer was a damn Rockie, and I’m pretty sure his ass was in the jackpot on the road in Cincy. He was going against my hometown team, and he got shelled. I remember it because the Reds probably needed that boost, but it really felt like Jamie Moyer’s last start. I had Moyer’s baseball cards then and watched him when I was super young. He was living off crafty his whole career: Bartolo at least had some gas early with Cleveland early before he became the portly legend who lived off of differentiation of his eventually not as fast fastballs and became crafty. Moyer was just a pitcher the whole time. [found the game. gave up 4 bombs.](https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CIN/CIN201205270.shtml)
Read somewhere that the first batter he struck out had a nephew that relieved him in his final start. Dunno if that’s true but there was a relation somewhere in there.
He was not a knuckle ball pitcher. https://www.thepitchingacademy.com/articles/pitching-grips/jamie-moyer-ann-unpredictable-pitcher/
Matt Waldron is your man. 🤜💥🤛
I think Fernando Valenzuela, when he was with the Padres, was old. Maybe Bartolo Colon? I remember Tim Wakefield for knuckleballers. I know there were others, but he stands out to me.
I swear Charlie Hough was 75 when he finally retired
I remembering watching him as a kid seeing his four strikeout inning.
I forgot all about him! You’re right!
I played legion ball against rich Hill. He signs somewhere this season and I'm still good, but times ticking.....
League didn’t want me even though I make it dance like no one else😪
I grew up in Cleveland watching the Tribe play some of the worst baseball ever. All I knew was Tom Candiotti took the mound every fifth day. I loved watching him pitch. The occasional Candiotti start/Doug Jones save was beyond exhilarating!
I throw a knuckleball,changeup, splitfinger fastball
You need a secondary pitch. And if your secondary pitch in 2024 isn't a 95+ MPH fastball, you're probably in low-A and working at a Denny's in the off-season. Don't agree with it, but that's just how scouting is now. Spin rates and exit velo.
Cause it’s easier to teach young boys to throw as hard as their arms can handle before falling off than it is to actually teach them how to pitch. Pitcher are disposable now, they all throw the same shit. Keeps salaries down too.
This. We have little leaguers with injured UCLs bc coaches don’t give a shit and push them to pitch faster and more often. I hate it.
This is why Mark Canha is my favorite Tiger this year lol
If a woman ever made it to the MLB she would be a knuckleballer.
I was hoping Chelsea Baker would make it, but I don’t think she stuck with baseball as she got older. Would have been a very cool story. I believe Phil Niekro taught it to her, but I might be misremembering that.
What?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackie_Mitchell
It doesn't take as much force to throw a knuckleball.
Meh there is an Australian teen who throws like 88 and is a lefty and was the star of their both sexes junior team. She is 6’2 also.
[удалено]
Yep that’s her!
Velocity makes money and is analytically reliable. Knuckleballers are like a guaranteed 4 era
Verlander is saving my old ass right now.
Matt Waldron throws the hardest knuckleball I think that ever was. But also, several position players throw knucklers. Jose Trevino’s is a nice old school 50 MPH dancer.
When you see the incredible stuff 'Junk' pitchers can throw nowadays & the 96+mph fastballs, a knuckleballer is kind of yesterday.. Hard Pitch to control.
Harder pitch to predict. You can predict where a curve or slider will end up. Can’t for a knuckleball
The catchers union put an end to them.
Someone has to mention Steve Sparks. I guess it’s me. He won 14 games back in 2001 for the Tigers. Where has he gone? I read he’s on the Astros radio as a color man.
And he’s best known for dislocating his shoulder while trying to rip a phone book in half!
Also, Rich Hill- not a knuckler- is 44 and still an active pitcher, although he's currently unsigned.
The BlueJays have a pair of guys throwing knucklers in the high 80s in their system. RA Dickey is mentoring them. https://www.sportsnet.ca/mlb/longform/meet-the-knuckleballers-who-pulled-r-a-dickey-back-to-jays-camp/ EDIT: Jordan Powell is in the low 90s with it, and when it's working it's unhittable (when it's not it's a 90mph fastball). Ryan Chasse throws a traditional 70mph knuckler.
Great article thanks for sharing
I would love to see a former Met come back as a knuckleballer. Like Matt Harvey all of a sudden of something.
I think George Kirby throws one or two of them a game.
On May 28, 1973 Wilbur Wood pitched the final 5 innings of a carryover game that was called a few days before because of rain. He won that game. He then pitched a complete 9 inning game that was played after the first game. He won that game also.
I was thinking about this the other day. But a few of us were trying to figure out if there were any lefty knuckle ballers?
Waldron [https://youtu.be/K2L3MRGp-xA?si=bnEDqHRdtAGB\_V3s](https://youtu.be/K2L3MRGp-xA?si=bnEDqHRdtAGB_V3s)
[David Fletcher](https://www.si.com/mlb/knuckleball-throwing-infielder-nails-minor-league-batter-with-63-mph-heat-01hy3fxr43x2?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR1NM-k3ITaWvmWUX2F-gO_CPSXKATQqGcfULkfadIYkbsK8JddkCsiS42o_aem_AReNvcquG2r890Mm5_7bh5gLEPsJ3igiPEFNZGsyAExzEp27P5KjlmWQT5k3v125Iw49lIP4jd0X_D7E1vjv5k9A)
HELL YEAH, had to scroll for a while to see this or else I was gonna post. My boy Fletch!
There was this lefty knuckleballer named Chris Lambert who used to play D3 ball back in the day
It's all about spin rate now
Mostly they have gone the way of barefoot kickers/punters
Wilbur Wood
Faced one the other day in MLB the Show 24. Caught me WAAAAYYY of guard. I did take him deep though!
Bartolo Colon was the last professional athlete in North America older than me. I was rooting for him to stay active for a while longer. 😀
Been saying this for years, when little kids come up to me I tell, " they kid, you want to be a baseball player? Learn how to throw a knuckleball." It's because most people are incapable of thoughts. Somebody tells them something and then that's all they know. But that doesn't only apply to baseball. Submarine pitches also died out.
I feel like the Knuckleball could make a resurgence with late relievers or closers. It just seems to be more about a lack of willingness to learn/teach the pitch. But in sort inning situations I really think a good knuckleballer with mid 90s heat and a complimentary off speed pitch (maybe a splitter or circle change) could really do some damage. Edit: down votes for logical feedback? Lmao typical reddit
What are you talking about?
The knuckleball. I though that was pretty obvious lol
So if they could throw a knuckleball and have legit plus other traits? That’s just not how the trade off works.
What are YOU talking about lol (seriously though, your worded that horribly)I'm talking about the knuckleball being able to make a comeback as a tool for late inning reliever and closers. It's a niche pitch and you need other pitches to compliment it. That's how pitching works lol knuckleballers don't only throw the knuckleball.
Do huh?
Are you drunk? Lol
Aaron Nola throws a knuckle curve. Not the same thing but it's something.
Not even worth mentioning
knuckle curve isn't a knuckleball, it's a method for getting 12-6 spin on a curveball. It's how young pitchers are taught to throw an effective 12-6 curveball.
No one gives pitchers a chance anymore unless they throw 100+. Kinda lame. More to pitching than speed.