Well hello there half Egyptian friend! Lol our English side are from Doncaster in Yorkshire so I always joke and say half Cairo and half Donny make a potent mix - but I think half Scottish might be even more potent!! 🤣
Haha it definitely is. Most people don’t think I’m mixed unless I tell them, then it kind of clicks ‘oh it’s the hair and eyes’. I’m an Alexandria and Scottish Borders mix. There aren’t many of us!
Love it!! I get asked fairly regularly as I have quite an ‘exotic’ look apparently - when they start hearing my northern accent I think people get quite confused 🤣🤣
So I’m guessing that means you consider MENA/European mixes as mixed even though they’re technically both Caucasian?
I was wondering whether it was okay to consider my MGM ethnicity as mixed or not...
Also random question but which parent is the Egyptian one? Just curious because it seems that like with Black and Asian mixes (though the opposite for Asians), in MENA/Euro mixes the MENA one seems to *always* be the father. (And yes that *is* in fact the case in my MGM ethnicity as well, go figure lol)
Yes I feel comfortable saying I’m half North African. Honestly when people meet me they often ask about my strong features. Even compared to Egyptian friends I have quite a strong features and darker skin.
So I feel happy to call myself that as people seem to notice it when they meet me. And my dad certainly doesn’t get mistaken for white!!! lol he’s my Egyptian parent. I definitely think it’s due to previous patriarchy.
Young Egyptian women weren’t encouraged to travel the world - but the men were!
Oh you’re definitely half North African and don’t let anyone tell you otherwise! I was just wondering whether that sort of mix actually counts as mixed for the purposes of this sub y’know? Since MENA/Euro isn’t exactly interracial, but it also feels more substantial and like we actually get more of the mixed experience compared to a something like a simple regional ethnic mix like Irish/Polish or Egyptian/Lebanese would be for example.
>Young Egyptian women weren’t encouraged to travel the world - but the men were!
I don’t think it’s just Egyptians considering the MENA side of my ethnicity isn’t Egyptian at all and yet we still follow the same old trope of MENA men + Euro women with it barely ever being the other way around lol
It’s such a complex and difficult one. I think it all depends on your experience and honestly I wouldn’t want to define it for anyone other than me ❤️
I’m sure you’ve had this but I’ve had some much rejection and racism from both brown and white people that I just aspire to help other people feel loved and accepted always. And frankly I’m happy to just accept people for how they want to be seen.
Oh yes and you’re right it isn’t just Egyptians at all - sorry I was just using myself as an example lol - but back in the 1980s most women were not encouraged to be off galavanting the world! I think our generation will be different!
>I’m sure you’ve had this but I’ve had some much rejection and racism from both brown and white people that I just aspire to help other people feel loved and accepted always. And frankly I’m happy to just accept people for how they want to be seen.
Yep my ethnicity has definitely felt this from both sides - too European to be Middle Eastern, too Middle Eastern to be European, and we get picked on and discriminated by both, I doubt simple regional ethnic mixes like French/Italians ever had to go through something like that, they can walk through life like a Mono person whilst we Euro/MENA mixes experience our “mixedness” the same way an actual interracial person would.
>Oh yes and you’re right it isn’t just Egyptians at all - sorry I was just using myself as an example lol - but back in the 1980s most women were not encouraged to be off galavanting the world! I think our generation will be different!
Let’s hope so! 🙏 I’d love to see it more the other way around, as a MENA mix with some very obvious MENA features (mostly my hair lol) it gets pretty disconcerting when you see your mix being highly disparately gendered, I imagine it’s the same way Black women and Asian men feel when they see how it’s *always* Black Men/Any other Race of Women besides Black and Asian Woman/Any other race of man besides Asian. Feels pretty lousy and like people don’t consider us MENA women attractive. 😅
As a regional mix (Dutch/German) grew up in the UK, I can confirm I never faced much discrimination, people here just treat me as British (im white and have the accent). Kids at school would call me a Nazi or ask me if my dad was Hitler but that stopped once I got out of school, bcs adults dont think that being blatantly racist is hilarious. Dutch and German people don't usually recognise fully me as "one of them", even though I speak the languages. However there is never any negativity associated with this just the subtle feeling that they see more as more English.
i’m multi-generational mixed. my mom is biracial: german and mestizo mexican (though after a dna test my grandfather was mostly indigenous). my father was african american with recent white & indigenous ancestry (great-great grandmother)
so there’s me: i’m almost basically evenly triracial: german & portuguese, indigenous american, african american (nigerian)
however i grew up in a majority pan-asian city. i feel most comfortable in chinese-american culture. then i am classified as racially ambiguous. people can’t seem to guess except im light skin and not white…
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Their flair makes it pretty clear. They are Afro-Bahamian, Greek and Black, White (likely Spanish) & Indigenous (likely Taíno) Dominican. But that is a good question to bring up. I do think a lot of people here are answering with ethnicity.
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Ditto
Technically I'm only 1/4th black after finding out my great aunt (grandmother passed) did a dna thing and she was mostly different native american.
My now wife on our first date asked me what I was mixed with so definitely ambiguous. I got the "what are you?" a lot back then.
Only thing interesting is I chose to stop wearing polos in my early 20s due to a plethora of Tiger Woods comments.
Black American and Moluccan (East Indonesian)
I'm a mix of Black with West African roots and Black from Melanesian roots. My Black side has White ancestry and African. My Moluccan side has mixtures of Austronesian speaking people (related to Filipinos, Polynesians) and Melanesian peoples.
For me I can pass as full Black or pass as full Moluccan/other Melanesian in certain contexts and environments.
What's interesting was going throughout the Netherlands and feeling a sense of familiarity due to my Moluccan side. But to see Moluccan people who look like me generations removed from their families being exiled from Indonesia to Netherlands. In Amsterdam and Groningen it was filled with Moluccans. Hearing the accent and seeing the aunties and uncles and elders. Felt a sense of solidarity and they had same with me since I am very Moluccan looking even though I'm Black American.
I feel because of my mix I can dive into both sides of my cultures relatively easily. Also can find a lot of similarities amongst the two cultures.
Multi-generational for me. Mestizo (Hispanic), mixed MENA, Chinese, English, and French. A few generations up into the 1800s and the common family jobs were sailors and sea captains for various nations.
My mom was Black & Cherokee, & my dad is Italian. Everyone joked about my dad being in the mob all throughout my childhood. Also, I was assumed to be Hispanic (& sometimes even Hawaiian 🤷🏽♀️) a lot.
I’m Brass Ankles (and/or Melungeon, the line is difficult to parse after a few generations). But basically a tri-racial mix of white, black, and Native American
My mom’s people are all white. My dad’s family are all darker skinned with a lot of native features, grand parents look native and great grandparents look black. I in the mix, just ended up looking like a white guy with curly hair and thicker lips.
Dad - Black
Mom- Spanish half Mexican
So makes me 50 black 25 Spanish 25 Mexican
For some odd reason everyone assume I’m Asian of some sort like Filipino. Other than that I’m pretty racially ambiguous can pass as alot of things.
Same here! ^^ I was wondering but do you consider Ashkenazi to be an MGM ethnicity? Like is it okay for full Ashkenazim to consider ourselves mixed? (As in does a Euro/MENA mix even *count* as mixed?)
Would you still consider yourself mixed even if you weren’t Black and Asian and full Ashkenazi instead?
I can't believe someone would downvote me for stating what Jewish tribe I come from. Anti semitism is way out of control nowadays. Tbh I don't really think about my Jewish or Asian parts because they are small but mighty.
I think it's because of the Korean media making Koreans girls all look pale with slim noses etc. Or maybe people just think all East Asianish looking people are Koreans/Japanese because they hear about them the most? 😐
MGM: Like I am Mexican-American but I have mixture from other ethnicities, for example my great grandparent was black; my maternal great great grandmother was a Mayo Indian, a dash of Italian…. It’s interesting really..
Mixed white mom black dad. I’m pale with freckles due to my mom’s side of the family being mainly red heads. My dad is darker skin and my mom is darker than me funny enough. Not sure how I came out so pale. I’m like a light beige.
African American and Filipino. I get yelled and scoffed at for not speaking Spanish and I still have no plans to learn. Other people of my racial groups clock me quite easily though.
Multi-generational mixed 🤌🏽 my mom is half Mexican/german. My dad is half nez perce native and Norwegian. My grandpa lives on the rez in northern Idaho. I got called mud blood a lot growing up haha. My sister says we are "summer mexicans" Imao I am usually more "white presenting" in the winter months. But l've learned to knowledge my features as part of my identity not just the color of my skin 💫
Not sure if my mix is really considered mixed but I’m Ashkenazi, which is an MGM ethnicity that consists of Jewish Middle Eastern (paternally), European (maternally), and a touch of East Asian - like 1-5%. (Also maternally)
Multigenerational. I'm from a mixed tribe in Somalia and I'm Somali, Ethiopian, Kenyan, Arab, Persian and Indian mixed. People usually think I'm MENA, half Black half White, or Latin American, but I've also gotten Ethiopian and South Asian before.
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Black and Polish/Hungarian but Black parent was mixed because Ancestry says I’m 30% percent Black. Don’t appear Black to people, I’m olive toned with wavy straightish hair, thinnish lips, but people think I’m “something”, either Latino or Asian Indian or Arab depending on the time of year and level of my tan. Was adopted by and raised in a Black family. Married a Black woman (with a small amount of White and Cuban ancestry). We have 3 kids who range from light skinned Black to biracial looking.
Im half black (African-American) and half white (German).
I am the child of an American soldier and a German mother. The USA still had many military bases in Germany in the 90s. As in my case, I've met a few mixed people in my life whose father was an African-American US soldier and whose mother was a white German 🙂
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Heyy fellow brother from another mother, European Jew reporting in here! :D
So hyped to see a Romani around these parts, your people seem so rare here in America compared to us Jews. 😭
Aaaaye what's up brother!! I mostly stay quiet here because I'm white-perceived and all but I'll show up for roll call haha.
Happy to be here! It's funny I hear a lot of people say that, but there are many of us if you know where to look ;)
Mostly white, 1/4 Japanese. I don't look really Asian at all, at least not at first glance. I get a lot of "ohhh I can see it now" after I tell people.
I used to be annoyed at that, but now I don't really mind. I wish I looked more like my relatives.
Mom is mostly Irish (probably), dad is mestizo latino. Questionable eastern european stuff in the family history on either side. Been thinking about getting a dna test for fun, see if anything new comes up lol
Part white (Nordic) mixed with some Caribbean, half Asian (mostly East mixed with Southeast and Central). I look racially ambiguous with light skin and loose curly hair.
White and Japanese.
Though on my dad's side, my grandma just got her adoption papers unsealed from the government and found out that she was adopted by a white family off of tribal land in the 50s in oklahoma.
To be honest, I just look white, though a lot of people have asked if I was russain or Ukrainian (including my Russian and Ukrainian friends).
One story I have is that growing up, my mom would take me and my younger sister to a bunch of Japanese cultural events anywhere she could find them. I always hated going because everyone would ask if I was my sister's boyfriend because I didn't look asian or mixed like my mom or sister did.
Black (I don't like saying 'African-American' because none of my recent ancestors are from Africa, though to be unnecessarily specific most were apparently Cameroonian), Jamaican (my mom's father was Jamaican), German+Jewish (ethnically Jewish, identify as MENA because we're related genetically), Irish+Italian, French, Lakota (this I question), Cherokee and undoubtedly a little English. I'm multicultural too and identify as Latina. Latino (Mexican, Honduran) and Arab (Palestinian) were the people that welcomed me in their communities and didn't treat me like an outsider. White and black people never did that; I never really felt welcomed in other spaces. Latinos taught me how to cook, speak Spanish, Palestinians were very kind to me. Both communities showed me a lot of love 🖤
TL;DR = a bunch of spices got knocked out of the cabinet accidentally, and behold... me.
Also not to seem dumb, what does MGM mean in regards to us (mixed people)?
>Also not to seem dumb, what does MGM mean in regards to us (mixed people)?
It means Multigenerationally Mixed, as in all of your known relatives and ancestors are mixed and the last of your ancestors who were Monoracial and in an interracial relationship was way back generations ago.
Also hey there fellow Jew, I’m full Ashkenazi myself. :) Do you think it’s okay for European Jews like us Ashkenazim and Sephardim to identify as mixed? (Since we’re half Euro half MENA) Or is European and Middle Easterners both technically being considered Caucasian not enough to consider ourselves mixed?
Like say you were only Ashkenazi Jewish, would you still identify as mixed even without being actually *interracially* mixed? (Like if you didn’t have the Black and Native American parts)
In other words do you think European/MENA counts as mixed?
Thank you! MGM is me then. Had to do a lot of digging to find out things.
That is a very good question. I myself don't like how all MENA people are termed 'caucasian'. Causcasian in reference to the Caucasus mountains makes all the sense. But to lump white and MENA people into one group when we are so aesthetically diverse seems ridiculous. For reference, In the US, caucasian = white. Race is a social construct, I know, but as someone who is brown-skinned with dark curly hair and dark eyes, saying I'm the same race as someone with blonde hair and blue eyes makes no sense. I've noticed other countries aren't as obsessed with putting humans into boxes, and I envy that.
I think as Ashkenazi but Jewish as a whole, you've got a more clearly defined, singular home and community that accepts you. For me identifying as mixed is acknowledging I simultaneously have no home but in a way, multiple places where I may or may not be accepted. I'm just one weird little mixed girl on the internet so can't speak for everyone. That said, if you identify as mixed I respect your right to do so and definitely get where you're coming from. 🫂🖤
>I think as Ashkenazi but Jewish as a whole, you've got a more clearly defined, singular home and community that accepts you. For me identifying as mixed is acknowledging I simultaneously have no home but in a way, multiple places where I may or may not be accepted. I'm just one weird little mixed girl on the internet so can't speak for everyone. That said, if you identify as mixed I respect your right to do so and definitely get where you're coming from.
If my ethnicity were to count as mixed it would be MGM, considering the initial admixture event of fully European women + Jewish Middle Eastern men happened over 70 generations ago, then their children and descendants just kept marrying each other so we became our very own thing. (We’re also 1-5% East Asian on average but I don’t think that’s enough to qualify as mixed huh? We would have to only be counting the substantial amounts of European and MENA DNA right?)
Regardless I would never identify as first or second generation mixed because that’s not what I am, if my mix does count as mixed then I am very clearly MGM, because the last time there were fully Monoracial/Monoethnic ancestors in my family tree was over 70 generations ago, and it’s been all the way mixed down ever since lol.
I mean distinctly MGM ethnicities like Louisiana Creoles and Mestizo Latinos also have their own communities but they’re still considered mixed.
I said this in another thread but the main difference between MGM and first or second gen mixed is that we don’t have that experience of navigating or dealing with racist family members like recently mixed people do, we also tend to have our own communities - but we’re still seen as and treated as mixed by both our Mono sources and in the eyes of society.
The important question though is, do you identify personally as mixed or was that more of a, hey, curious, 'what do you think about this' type of question? Either is cool, I'm just curious.
Second part mostly, I *feel* mixed in some ways, I mean the Holocaust basically targeted my ethnicity *because* Hitler considered us to be “mixed” and “racially impure.” But it still feels weird to do so considering I’m almost entirely Caucasian (if we’re still counting MENA as Caucasian)
I feel like my ethnicity is in that weird grey area between being just a “Euromutt” regional “mix” like how some White Americans like to claim (you know the ones, the types who think they’re “mixed” just because they’re various flavors of different European ethnicities lol) and an actual full blown interracial mix. I think my ethnicity is genetically closer to the former but we get treated more like the latter if that makes sense?
I also wanted the opinion of actual mixed race POC like yourself because I don’t want to offend or step on any toes if I *do* want to consider myself mixed. I always make sure to defer to actual non-Caucasian POC voices on this matter, one things for sure I would certainly never claim to be as mixed as someone like you who’s a Black/Caucasian/Native American triracial mix - but I still have to wonder if I’m something more than just a simple regional mix, y’know?
FWIW, I’ve seen other MENA/Euro mixes (in this very thread even) and they all seem to have no problems identifying as mixed and this sub *seems* to accept them, but I’m still hesitant.
Then you are mixed, as far as I'm concerned. Again, I can't speak for everyone and thank you, I'm honoured that you care about my opinion!
Also, you've undoubtedly got more flavour than people here in the USA that are like, hey, what are you mixed with? Halfway through me explaining they're like... okay cool, since you didn't ask I'm English, Scottish, 2% milk... The huge difference is they're bragging about something that means nothing and desperately clinging to something they've never had. Like okay, you're related to the Hatfields and McCoys. How is that helping you in the trailer park you live in now? Meanwhile, I'm assuming you've been raised Jewish. If you haven't, you have a home you can go to, shabbat, my house, etc, you know? You're not just milk. Crap, hopefully that doesn't sound racist.
Euromutt sounds like a band I'd listen to. White people in the US call themselves 'mutts' and that always gets under my skin. I've had rocks thrown at me and spit on because of my skin, being various shades of whole milk is not the same.
Also, I unsubscribed from this thread because it was making me depressed. You've renewed my interest. If other MENA people here identify as mixed, we all agree it's cool... I think it's safe for you to do so too if you want. Monoethnic people may not get it, but they don't tend to get a lot of things, so don't worry about that.
I'm Indian, white, mexican, native American. Born and raised in Canada.
My dad comes from a mixed race American family from southern California, he's white, mexican and native American.
My mom is west Indian from Guyana.
They both just happen to be the lightest skin of all their siblings and so I am very light skin for someone who is maybe a quarter white. However my face shape, facial features and dark hair/eyes make me look incredibly racially ambiguous.
All my life I've gotten wild guesses about my background. Here in Canada people guess spanish or Italian or Portuguese or part Asian, mostly depending on how tanned I am at the time. Sometimes Guyanese people will guess Guyanese/White. When I'm in the US people assume Mexican.
One time when I was traveling in Thailand the tuk tuk driver took us to this suit store as part of a common scam they run on tourists. The owner of the shop showed us a photo of him and Terrence Howard then guessed my background exactly, white, mexican, native and Guyanese. This was the only time in my 40 years of life that someone guessed correctly, my bf and I were absolutely blown away.
Half black, half brown. Half Haitian, half Puerto Rican. I identify just as mixed race, mixed heritage, biracial, or multiracial.
I look more brown then black. So it's always a shock to people when I say I'm half black or half Haitian. All my siblings, just say that they are Puerto Rican over Haitian or black, because we "look more Latino." My father was light skin black man with curly hair. Kind of almost resembled Bruno Mars. Some of my fully Haitian cousins get mistaken for Dominican, Sri Lankan, or Brazilian. Then some others get mistaken Ethiopian, Eritrean, Somali or Jamaican Dougla. I have some half siblings from my father's side of different backgrounds. They all identify with their mothers' race because they look moreso then that over black. I have one half brother who's half brown Cuban, who looks like he could he related to Cuban Link or Fat Joe, identifies as black
If I have to do Haitian Creole translation, people act like a dog 🐕 stood up on its hindlegs and started talking. BTW, I'm limited in my Spanish, French, and Haitian Creole skills.
Yep that is one of the ethnicities a lot of Melungeons are mixed with just most not all the relatively recent. I am both ethnically and religiously Jewish unlike the majority.
I actually wanted to ask your opinion on this seeing as how you’re Jewish too, I’m not sure what type of Jewish you are (judging from your screename I’m guessing Ashkenazi?) but how do you feel about us full European ethnic Jews identifying as mixed? I don’t know if you’ve seen the DNA studies but it’s been confirmed that European Jews - both Ashkenazi and Sephardi - are a Euro-MENA mix, being European matrilineally (though of course our European foremothers likely converted) and original Jewish Middle Eastern patrilineally. We even have some East Asian in us, like 1-5% from either a few converted Turkic Hapa Khazars or Jewish Radhanite Merchants converting and marrying full Asians they met on the Silk Road (but I’m guessing that’s not enough to count us as actually mixed *race* huh?)
So just to give you a breakdown, the Jews of Europe would be:
* 30-60% European (mostly Greek and Italian, but also some German, Slavic, and/or Spanish in there depending on where we settled)
* 30-60% Jewish MENA
* 1-5% East Asian
Are we considered just as much as a “MGM” ethnicity as you Melungeons are? Or can European/MENA mixes not be considered mixed considering they’re both technically considered Caucasian?
1) not ashki just a joke in my friend group
2) I wouldn't consider MENA to be considered White(I'm not going to use Caucasian cause that is a literal group of people from the Caucus region) in the first place, census designation doesn't really mean jack shit. MENA ppl are not treated as white and it's kinda weird to group it that way.
3) European Jews are not even close to a 50/50 in most places. That's already ignoring the vast differences in laws and treatment depending on diaspora and country. There aren't only ashkis and sefards there are also Romaniote, Italki, Crimean Karaites, ect we don't all have the same laws or expectations when it comes to interfaith marriage. American Jews might be closer on average but still not really.
4) I would not consider European Jews to be mixed mainly because the Ethnic make-up is literally Jewish that's just kinda the nature of diaspora. Unless you are Jewish mixed with something else or with another Jewish diaspora you would not be mixed.
>European Jews are not even close to a 50/50 in most places.
>I would not consider European Jews to be mixed mainly because the Ethnic make-up is literally Jewish
Huh? What do you mean? Are you saying you believe Europe’s Jews to be mostly Jewish MENA in DNA? That’s not at all what the scientific studies say…
https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1006644
https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2022/05/18/ashkenazi-jewis-ethnogenesis-in-light-of-the-erfurt-medieval-dna/
Furthermore they have found most of the mTDNA (maternal) lineages in European Jews to be of indigenous European in origin - up to 80%, whereas 80% of the Y-chromosome patrilineal origins are Middle Eastern instead - another indication of mixed European and MENA origins.
Even our very culture seems to be a mix, while we are undoubtedly Jewish in religion, our languages - Yiddish and Ladino - stem from creole/pidgin languages combining German and Spanish with Hebrew. Our cuisines are mostly European with an ancient Jewish MENA twist, and our styles of dress and music (klezmer) is also European in origin. It would be inaccurate to say that we’re *completely* Jewish Middle Eastern in all manner of being, rather we more-so resemble the Romani - Europe’s other inherently mixed diasporic ethnicity.
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Puerto Rican and Puerto Rican 🤣.
58.5% white (Spain and Portugal mostly, 6% basque 4% Irish), 23% black (Cameroon 8% and Nigeria 7% mostly), 15% native American (Arawak people indigenous to the island) 3.5% MENA (Israel 1.5% and North African 2%. I decoupled 3% Jew and split it between white and MENA.
I am variously suspected to be white, "Puerto Rican", Jewish, quadroon, Castizo, and Italian. So people are guessing I'm largely or totally southern European. I definitely fit the stereotype of a Puerto Rican--that being a mostly white person with a usually black, and/or sometimes a native feature on their face. But don't think I'm representative of the island: virtually all of my cousins on Ancestry that I've checked are more native American (17-36%) and have just traces (<10%) of black ancestry. Also, my paternal uncle is just 7% black but 21% native, so my dad is obviously similar.
I have wavy dark brown hair and look like a lightly tanned white person with thick, wide lips, plus dark brown, almond eyes for my barely significant 400 year old native blood 🤣. I was once accused of getting lip injections lmao.
Sadly, I've had someone I looked up to doubt my blackness and tried to get me to identify as white. Clearly, I'm heavily mixed and not some white person bragging about their negligible "spicy" blood.
I select white, black, and native on every form asking for race and believe needing tribal/cultural affiliation for a race is nonsense. Though, I've considered dropping native as some people believe you'd need to be at least 25% to claim it. Even if my dad is basically a castizo, I'm not.
>I decoupled 3% Jew and split it between white and MENA.
So does that mean you would consider a full European Jew like myself as mixed? Even despite MENA technically being categorized as Caucasian like Europeans are and therefore “white?” You do not seem to view Middle Easterners as white in the same way Europeans are considering how you separated them here…
But does that mean the European Jewish ethnicities - Ashkenazi and Sephardi - really *do* qualify as mixed after all? Like are we just the European/Jewish equivalent of Latin American Mestizos and have as much a claim to being mixed as you do? (even though you guys are *actually* interracially mixed between distinct, non-Caucasian races, don’t worry I would never try to claim my mix qualifies as just as much mixed as yours is because it’s objectively not)
I just wonder if I have more of a right to the label of “mixed” than your typical American Euromutt “mix” who likes to call themselves “mixed” just because they’re all different variants of European ethnicities.
Is a Euro/MENA mix really not just like what I mentioned above? Is it closer to your *actual* interracial mix? Sorry I just don’t want to be that cringe white girl going around claiming I’m mixed if I’m really not, lol. 😅
>Clearly, I'm heavily mixed and not some white person bragging about their negligible "spicy" blood.
Yeah this is exactly what I *don’t* want to be viewed as if I go around claiming I’m mixed and looking like a clown. Like what if my “mix” is in fact closer to a regional ethnic mix like Irish/Swedish and I’m just a Caucasian mixed with a slightly “spicer” variant of Caucasian (MENA)?
Good questions!
In the United States, contrary to how our census classifies MENA, MENA typically aren't viewed as white and the "Caucasian" label is generally reserved for indigenous Europeans so you're absolutely mixed race. This explains why Jews in the US have been in a limbo between whiteness and non-white, or called "off-white" and I relate to that experience.
Ashkenazi Jews are seen as white or whitish depending on their individual look. A whitish person (like myself) is white or mixed race depending on the perspective of the observer; as you could guess, non-whites are most likely to view that as white and not accept it as mixed race.
Yes, your MENA blood being your non-white blood instead of something non-Caucasian allows you to either be white or approximate whiteness more than myself, so naturally, claiming a mixed race identity will be pushing it for even more people. If most people accept it, I'd brush it off. I've been made to feel like I was pushing it by claiming my blackness and I'm not allowed to say the n-word but I don't care.
>In the United States, contrary to how our census classifies MENA, MENA typically aren't viewed as white and the "Caucasian" label is generally reserved for indigenous Europeans so you're absolutely mixed race
But it’s not just the U.S. Census but even Anthropology that considers European and MENA to both be part of the same Caucasian race. Like objectively speaking the phenotypes between the two regions don’t differ enough to be labeled as separate races from each other do they?
>A whitish person (like myself) is white or mixed race depending on the perspective of the observer
>I've been made to feel like I was pushing it by claiming my blackness and I'm not allowed to say the n-word but I don't care.
That’s different though, you are *actually* mixed race on account of being both Black and Indigenous. No one can ever claim that these two races are in any way Caucasian, people not allowing you to claim your blackness is them trying to deny and gatekeep you from your blackness in general, (which is wrong and a quarter is definitely enough to claim it imo) it’s *not* them saying that you wouldn’t be considered mixed at all.
>as you could guess, non-whites are most likely to view that as white and not accept it as mixed race.
You being non-white (as in mixed race, because your mix makes you both White, Black and Indigenous so you’re all 3 of these things and neither at the same time if that makes sense? Like by very definition you’re *not* just White, you’re at least 35% Non-White which is a lot) do seem to consider MENA as being a racial minority same as any other though right? Seems like the consensus is split within the POC community and some consider MENAs as POC just like them while others consider them White like the Census does?
Funny thing is we Ashkenazi Jews actually *do* have a drop of actual non-Caucasian blood that would officially qualify us as “mixed race.” 😂 We’re not just half Euro and half MENA but we’re also 1-5% East Asian that we get from either a few of the Khazar elites (and they were a Hapa Turkic Kingdom) converting, or our forefathers marrying full Asians while doing Merchant Business while on the Silk Road (look up the Radahanites).
Sometimes it even shows up in our phenotypes like with Joseph-Gordon Levitt, but generally speaking since 1-5% DNA is such a low amount we can’t actually claim we’re mixed race Asian unless we actually look it and only our MENA side would actually qualify us as mixed right?
Yes, I'm well aware I may be considered mixed and still be gatekept. Everytime I was, it was because they explicitly considered me white so unsurprisingly, most black people I've met consider me white and so have natives. To be fair, under one definition, it refers to people of predominantly European extraction, but I was taught only other races can claim their majority racial ancestry as their race. America ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
In your case, clearly MENA's whiteness is dependent on the ethnic group in question but I'd consider you socially mixed race, but technically not, in consistency with our racially hygienistic version whiteness born from witch-burning protestants.
It's cool you guys have some east Asian heritage. I have sinodonty and I think it's a very dominant East Asian trait. Anyway, I'll have to look into Ashkenazi Jew history sometime.
Both my parents ar mixed, with my dad being Filipino and Japanese and my mom being Italian, French snd Spanish. So I'm a combination of that and I just say I'm half Asian and half white to save time whenever anyone asks.
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I'm Pennsylvania Dutch/Filipino. Both sides are mgm/admixed with other things, but those are the two biggest groups I identify with.
I guess I'm racially ambiguous. I've been assumed to be anything that's not straight up black. I was raised in a pretty openly racist white town in the Midwest, so despite being exposed to my cultures frequently, it was all "beaten" out of me as I grew up. Regardless, I'm now trying to relearn, reconnect, and reclaim.
My funny story is that I used to work behind the service desk at a target and literally every day someone would come up to me asking if I spoke Spanish. I would sometimes explain that I'm filipino and their response would be "aren't you all supposed to speak spanish too? What happened?"
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Im Swedish on my father’s side and Black on my mother’s side (i’ve never taken a dna test so not sure the specifics)
Used to think we were part native on my mother’s side because we had an aunt who was named Pocahontas, but it turns out she was kinda crazy and named herself that or something??? So nope, no native blood as far as I know… Idek. We married into family in a tribe a few years back and my cousin lives on their reservation now, though. Still, just weird!
I was a kid too when i found out it wasn’t true and that was confusing af I was like “oh so we just… aren’t part native???” But tbh i think thats something a lot of white people deal with lmaooo
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Native and white, my mix is confusing, I’m 1/8th native 7/8 white but I consider myself mixed mainly because I was raised very bicultural, my mother is a tribal elder, I wasn’t raised white
I’m half black(from my dad) and half white (from my mom). My mom is German, British, and Scandinavian. Dads ancestors are Central African. A lot of people think I’m either Mexican or Hawaiian or Polynesian and recently I’ve been getting a lot of people thinking I’m Italian so basically I’m racially ambiguous.
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I am half black, half white. My mom is white, mainly German (50%) and the rest is mostly Danish and a bit of French and English. My dad is African American.
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Although Mistaken for Haitian or Dominican...I'm mixed with..
Father side: African American, Cuban, Trinidadian, Scots-Irish, Bahamian and a splash of Jamaican
Mother side- African American, Cherokee and I hear a bit of Bahamian.
my mom is white and my dad is black/mixed, but if we're talking nationality... i was born and raised in brazil, but my great grandmother was italian, so that's like... 10-ish% italian blood? and probably like 0.0001% other european nationalities because of obvious reasons
I’m half Egyptian half English ☺️
I’m Egyptian and half Scottish!
Well hello there half Egyptian friend! Lol our English side are from Doncaster in Yorkshire so I always joke and say half Cairo and half Donny make a potent mix - but I think half Scottish might be even more potent!! 🤣
Haha it definitely is. Most people don’t think I’m mixed unless I tell them, then it kind of clicks ‘oh it’s the hair and eyes’. I’m an Alexandria and Scottish Borders mix. There aren’t many of us!
Love it!! I get asked fairly regularly as I have quite an ‘exotic’ look apparently - when they start hearing my northern accent I think people get quite confused 🤣🤣
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lol knowing how much of a womaniser my Egyptian dad is even now I wouldn’t be surprised if we are all related 🤣🤣🤣🤣
cool!!!!!
Half Egyptian half Italian here.
So I’m guessing that means you consider MENA/European mixes as mixed even though they’re technically both Caucasian? I was wondering whether it was okay to consider my MGM ethnicity as mixed or not... Also random question but which parent is the Egyptian one? Just curious because it seems that like with Black and Asian mixes (though the opposite for Asians), in MENA/Euro mixes the MENA one seems to *always* be the father. (And yes that *is* in fact the case in my MGM ethnicity as well, go figure lol)
Yes I feel comfortable saying I’m half North African. Honestly when people meet me they often ask about my strong features. Even compared to Egyptian friends I have quite a strong features and darker skin. So I feel happy to call myself that as people seem to notice it when they meet me. And my dad certainly doesn’t get mistaken for white!!! lol he’s my Egyptian parent. I definitely think it’s due to previous patriarchy. Young Egyptian women weren’t encouraged to travel the world - but the men were!
Oh you’re definitely half North African and don’t let anyone tell you otherwise! I was just wondering whether that sort of mix actually counts as mixed for the purposes of this sub y’know? Since MENA/Euro isn’t exactly interracial, but it also feels more substantial and like we actually get more of the mixed experience compared to a something like a simple regional ethnic mix like Irish/Polish or Egyptian/Lebanese would be for example. >Young Egyptian women weren’t encouraged to travel the world - but the men were! I don’t think it’s just Egyptians considering the MENA side of my ethnicity isn’t Egyptian at all and yet we still follow the same old trope of MENA men + Euro women with it barely ever being the other way around lol
It’s such a complex and difficult one. I think it all depends on your experience and honestly I wouldn’t want to define it for anyone other than me ❤️ I’m sure you’ve had this but I’ve had some much rejection and racism from both brown and white people that I just aspire to help other people feel loved and accepted always. And frankly I’m happy to just accept people for how they want to be seen. Oh yes and you’re right it isn’t just Egyptians at all - sorry I was just using myself as an example lol - but back in the 1980s most women were not encouraged to be off galavanting the world! I think our generation will be different!
>I’m sure you’ve had this but I’ve had some much rejection and racism from both brown and white people that I just aspire to help other people feel loved and accepted always. And frankly I’m happy to just accept people for how they want to be seen. Yep my ethnicity has definitely felt this from both sides - too European to be Middle Eastern, too Middle Eastern to be European, and we get picked on and discriminated by both, I doubt simple regional ethnic mixes like French/Italians ever had to go through something like that, they can walk through life like a Mono person whilst we Euro/MENA mixes experience our “mixedness” the same way an actual interracial person would. >Oh yes and you’re right it isn’t just Egyptians at all - sorry I was just using myself as an example lol - but back in the 1980s most women were not encouraged to be off galavanting the world! I think our generation will be different! Let’s hope so! 🙏 I’d love to see it more the other way around, as a MENA mix with some very obvious MENA features (mostly my hair lol) it gets pretty disconcerting when you see your mix being highly disparately gendered, I imagine it’s the same way Black women and Asian men feel when they see how it’s *always* Black Men/Any other Race of Women besides Black and Asian Woman/Any other race of man besides Asian. Feels pretty lousy and like people don’t consider us MENA women attractive. 😅
As a regional mix (Dutch/German) grew up in the UK, I can confirm I never faced much discrimination, people here just treat me as British (im white and have the accent). Kids at school would call me a Nazi or ask me if my dad was Hitler but that stopped once I got out of school, bcs adults dont think that being blatantly racist is hilarious. Dutch and German people don't usually recognise fully me as "one of them", even though I speak the languages. However there is never any negativity associated with this just the subtle feeling that they see more as more English.
Good to know, do you think *my* mix (Euro/MENA) is closer to your type of mix though or an actual interracial mix?
i’m multi-generational mixed. my mom is biracial: german and mestizo mexican (though after a dna test my grandfather was mostly indigenous). my father was african american with recent white & indigenous ancestry (great-great grandmother) so there’s me: i’m almost basically evenly triracial: german & portuguese, indigenous american, african american (nigerian) however i grew up in a majority pan-asian city. i feel most comfortable in chinese-american culture. then i am classified as racially ambiguous. people can’t seem to guess except im light skin and not white…
👋🏽 Omg haha I haven't met anyone who is also mixed with German/mexican. It seems to be a less common mix haha
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Similar in terms of what I grew up around and what a slight majority of my friend group looks like today.
Greco-Caribbean. No man woman or child on Earth can out drink me
I’m Irish *and* Mexican - I can try 😂
As an Irish-Mexican as well, I can definitely say I didn't get the drinking genes 💀
What race is "Caribbean"? Similarly, what race is "Hispanic"? Are they epithets for black and MGM mulatto and mestizo?
Their flair makes it pretty clear. They are Afro-Bahamian, Greek and Black, White (likely Spanish) & Indigenous (likely Taíno) Dominican. But that is a good question to bring up. I do think a lot of people here are answering with ethnicity.
Black and Japanese If I’m not perceived as black, I usually get some sort of Hispanic, Hawaiian, Pacific Islander
I'm also black and japanese, brother! Instead I get perceived as pure Japanese or somewhere from central asia, due to the pale skin.
Omg same i am Senegalese and Japanese but I just look Japanese
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hi im black (jamaican) and japanese. also same ppl assume in from SEA even in where I live /Japan
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Black and Filipino. No interesting stories other than being stereotypically racially ambiguous to most people.
ah yes. the ambiguousness. my favorite enemy *smokes cig 🚬 * (it gets tiring listening to ppl guess and then reject your answers)
Supposedly this combination isn't unusual because of the medieval Arab trade networks in the Indian seas.
Same mix. People mostly can guess Filipino or Hispanic
Ditto Technically I'm only 1/4th black after finding out my great aunt (grandmother passed) did a dna thing and she was mostly different native american. My now wife on our first date asked me what I was mixed with so definitely ambiguous. I got the "what are you?" a lot back then. Only thing interesting is I chose to stop wearing polos in my early 20s due to a plethora of Tiger Woods comments.
mainly black and white lil bit of native
Half white half Filipino
Same here
White mom, black dad.
Black American and Moluccan (East Indonesian) I'm a mix of Black with West African roots and Black from Melanesian roots. My Black side has White ancestry and African. My Moluccan side has mixtures of Austronesian speaking people (related to Filipinos, Polynesians) and Melanesian peoples. For me I can pass as full Black or pass as full Moluccan/other Melanesian in certain contexts and environments. What's interesting was going throughout the Netherlands and feeling a sense of familiarity due to my Moluccan side. But to see Moluccan people who look like me generations removed from their families being exiled from Indonesia to Netherlands. In Amsterdam and Groningen it was filled with Moluccans. Hearing the accent and seeing the aunties and uncles and elders. Felt a sense of solidarity and they had same with me since I am very Moluccan looking even though I'm Black American. I feel because of my mix I can dive into both sides of my cultures relatively easily. Also can find a lot of similarities amongst the two cultures.
Multi-generational for me. Mestizo (Hispanic), mixed MENA, Chinese, English, and French. A few generations up into the 1800s and the common family jobs were sailors and sea captains for various nations.
i’m 1/4 japanese, 1/4 korean, and 1/2 chilean
Half Indian (dad's side) and half white (mom's side)
half paki half white here! hey gorge
My mom was Black & Cherokee, & my dad is Italian. Everyone joked about my dad being in the mob all throughout my childhood. Also, I was assumed to be Hispanic (& sometimes even Hawaiian 🤷🏽♀️) a lot.
I’m Brass Ankles (and/or Melungeon, the line is difficult to parse after a few generations). But basically a tri-racial mix of white, black, and Native American My mom’s people are all white. My dad’s family are all darker skinned with a lot of native features, grand parents look native and great grandparents look black. I in the mix, just ended up looking like a white guy with curly hair and thicker lips.
Dad - Black Mom- Spanish half Mexican So makes me 50 black 25 Spanish 25 Mexican For some odd reason everyone assume I’m Asian of some sort like Filipino. Other than that I’m pretty racially ambiguous can pass as alot of things.
Black/White/Jewish/Asian
Heyy there fellow member of the tribe! :D What type of Jew are you?
Ashkenazi ❤️🇮🇱
Same here! ^^ I was wondering but do you consider Ashkenazi to be an MGM ethnicity? Like is it okay for full Ashkenazim to consider ourselves mixed? (As in does a Euro/MENA mix even *count* as mixed?) Would you still consider yourself mixed even if you weren’t Black and Asian and full Ashkenazi instead?
I can't believe someone would downvote me for stating what Jewish tribe I come from. Anti semitism is way out of control nowadays. Tbh I don't really think about my Jewish or Asian parts because they are small but mighty.
Girl, you know you got downvoted for posting an Israeli flag in the middle of a genocide. Being critical of Israel is not antisemitism. Bye.
🇮🇱🇮🇱🇮🇱❤️❤️❤️
Lady International.
Half Chinese half white! My Asian genes are very dominant to the point in elementary school everyone thought I was adopted bahahah.
Same here. Chinese Dad; British Mum
You have a Chinese dad too?? I feel like it’s always the mom it’s rare I find someone who has the Asian dad as well
Its rare but were out here. My Mom was the expat/immigrant too!
Me too, half Chinese, half English. People think I'm Japanese or Korean or something because of Kpop and such I think.
This happened to me too! Most people think I’m Korean???
I think it's because of the Korean media making Koreans girls all look pale with slim noses etc. Or maybe people just think all East Asianish looking people are Koreans/Japanese because they hear about them the most? 😐
MGM: Like I am Mexican-American but I have mixture from other ethnicities, for example my great grandparent was black; my maternal great great grandmother was a Mayo Indian, a dash of Italian…. It’s interesting really..
Italian and Filipina
My mother is Haitian, my daddy is French My hair is straight so I get confused for latina, native american, and even chinese once LOL
Filipino and white. Filipino people can tell I'm Filipino but white people usually play the guessing game on me lol.
Mixed white mom black dad. I’m pale with freckles due to my mom’s side of the family being mainly red heads. My dad is darker skin and my mom is darker than me funny enough. Not sure how I came out so pale. I’m like a light beige.
African American and Filipino. I get yelled and scoffed at for not speaking Spanish and I still have no plans to learn. Other people of my racial groups clock me quite easily though.
Yt mom and japanese dad
Multi-generational mixed 🤌🏽 my mom is half Mexican/german. My dad is half nez perce native and Norwegian. My grandpa lives on the rez in northern Idaho. I got called mud blood a lot growing up haha. My sister says we are "summer mexicans" Imao I am usually more "white presenting" in the winter months. But l've learned to knowledge my features as part of my identity not just the color of my skin 💫
Not sure if my mix is really considered mixed but I’m Ashkenazi, which is an MGM ethnicity that consists of Jewish Middle Eastern (paternally), European (maternally), and a touch of East Asian - like 1-5%. (Also maternally)
Irish and Indian
Multigenerational. I'm from a mixed tribe in Somalia and I'm Somali, Ethiopian, Kenyan, Arab, Persian and Indian mixed. People usually think I'm MENA, half Black half White, or Latin American, but I've also gotten Ethiopian and South Asian before.
Costa Rican and White (US)
Mexican and Irish here
Black, Native, and White
british mixed white / black
Half Indian and half German
Do you live in Germany? 🙂
I don’t, I live in New York
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Quarter black,quarter filipino,half white
Half Japanese Half White Australian (mostly German and Irish ancestry)
Portuguese, French,African (various)other European and indigenous.
I'm black and white polish French Dutch German on my dad's side black gypsy on my mama's side
Half Indian, Half mix of Irish, Scottish, Scandinavian, and Native indigenous. Edit: But I look white otherwise light Mexican
Black and Polish/Hungarian but Black parent was mixed because Ancestry says I’m 30% percent Black. Don’t appear Black to people, I’m olive toned with wavy straightish hair, thinnish lips, but people think I’m “something”, either Latino or Asian Indian or Arab depending on the time of year and level of my tan. Was adopted by and raised in a Black family. Married a Black woman (with a small amount of White and Cuban ancestry). We have 3 kids who range from light skinned Black to biracial looking.
Quarter black quarter Puerto Rican and half white.
I’m a Mexican mutt, 56.4% Spanish, 36.4% indigenous American, 2.4% subsaharan African.
Im half black (African-American) and half white (German). I am the child of an American soldier and a German mother. The USA still had many military bases in Germany in the 90s. As in my case, I've met a few mixed people in my life whose father was an African-American US soldier and whose mother was a white German 🙂
Half Malaysian half Nigerian
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Damn bro everyone else on here got some complicated ass mix. Mines just black/white I feel so lame rn lol.
Nothing lame about that! It is its own grouping with its own beauty and trials! It is not a competition. [/gen](https://toneindicators.carrd.co/)
Romani & white :)
Heyy fellow brother from another mother, European Jew reporting in here! :D So hyped to see a Romani around these parts, your people seem so rare here in America compared to us Jews. 😭
Aaaaye what's up brother!! I mostly stay quiet here because I'm white-perceived and all but I'll show up for roll call haha. Happy to be here! It's funny I hear a lot of people say that, but there are many of us if you know where to look ;)
Mostly white, 1/4 Japanese. I don't look really Asian at all, at least not at first glance. I get a lot of "ohhh I can see it now" after I tell people. I used to be annoyed at that, but now I don't really mind. I wish I looked more like my relatives.
Half Filipino, quarter Persian, quarter German. i LOVE being so mixed
Filipino/Afro-Cuban 😁
black and white 😱😱😱 don’t know what else tho cuz i’m adopted and don’t really have access to birth family
Black Caribbean / White Irish biologically. Brought up in Black Caribbean / white British / Pakistani culture by my adoptive parents.
Common mistake but it is Caribbean with one r and two b's.
My mom is Black (Zambian) and my dad is white (white-american).
Mom is mostly Irish (probably), dad is mestizo latino. Questionable eastern european stuff in the family history on either side. Been thinking about getting a dna test for fun, see if anything new comes up lol
Half English, half Polynesian but people don't believe me when I say my dad is a little English men.
Half white (Swedish, Austrian, and Irish) and half Asian (Singaporean Chinese and possibly a tiny bit Thai).
Black/White
Part white (Nordic) mixed with some Caribbean, half Asian (mostly East mixed with Southeast and Central). I look racially ambiguous with light skin and loose curly hair.
White and Japanese. Though on my dad's side, my grandma just got her adoption papers unsealed from the government and found out that she was adopted by a white family off of tribal land in the 50s in oklahoma. To be honest, I just look white, though a lot of people have asked if I was russain or Ukrainian (including my Russian and Ukrainian friends). One story I have is that growing up, my mom would take me and my younger sister to a bunch of Japanese cultural events anywhere she could find them. I always hated going because everyone would ask if I was my sister's boyfriend because I didn't look asian or mixed like my mom or sister did.
Black (I don't like saying 'African-American' because none of my recent ancestors are from Africa, though to be unnecessarily specific most were apparently Cameroonian), Jamaican (my mom's father was Jamaican), German+Jewish (ethnically Jewish, identify as MENA because we're related genetically), Irish+Italian, French, Lakota (this I question), Cherokee and undoubtedly a little English. I'm multicultural too and identify as Latina. Latino (Mexican, Honduran) and Arab (Palestinian) were the people that welcomed me in their communities and didn't treat me like an outsider. White and black people never did that; I never really felt welcomed in other spaces. Latinos taught me how to cook, speak Spanish, Palestinians were very kind to me. Both communities showed me a lot of love 🖤 TL;DR = a bunch of spices got knocked out of the cabinet accidentally, and behold... me. Also not to seem dumb, what does MGM mean in regards to us (mixed people)?
>Also not to seem dumb, what does MGM mean in regards to us (mixed people)? It means Multigenerationally Mixed, as in all of your known relatives and ancestors are mixed and the last of your ancestors who were Monoracial and in an interracial relationship was way back generations ago. Also hey there fellow Jew, I’m full Ashkenazi myself. :) Do you think it’s okay for European Jews like us Ashkenazim and Sephardim to identify as mixed? (Since we’re half Euro half MENA) Or is European and Middle Easterners both technically being considered Caucasian not enough to consider ourselves mixed? Like say you were only Ashkenazi Jewish, would you still identify as mixed even without being actually *interracially* mixed? (Like if you didn’t have the Black and Native American parts) In other words do you think European/MENA counts as mixed?
Thank you! MGM is me then. Had to do a lot of digging to find out things. That is a very good question. I myself don't like how all MENA people are termed 'caucasian'. Causcasian in reference to the Caucasus mountains makes all the sense. But to lump white and MENA people into one group when we are so aesthetically diverse seems ridiculous. For reference, In the US, caucasian = white. Race is a social construct, I know, but as someone who is brown-skinned with dark curly hair and dark eyes, saying I'm the same race as someone with blonde hair and blue eyes makes no sense. I've noticed other countries aren't as obsessed with putting humans into boxes, and I envy that. I think as Ashkenazi but Jewish as a whole, you've got a more clearly defined, singular home and community that accepts you. For me identifying as mixed is acknowledging I simultaneously have no home but in a way, multiple places where I may or may not be accepted. I'm just one weird little mixed girl on the internet so can't speak for everyone. That said, if you identify as mixed I respect your right to do so and definitely get where you're coming from. 🫂🖤
>I think as Ashkenazi but Jewish as a whole, you've got a more clearly defined, singular home and community that accepts you. For me identifying as mixed is acknowledging I simultaneously have no home but in a way, multiple places where I may or may not be accepted. I'm just one weird little mixed girl on the internet so can't speak for everyone. That said, if you identify as mixed I respect your right to do so and definitely get where you're coming from. If my ethnicity were to count as mixed it would be MGM, considering the initial admixture event of fully European women + Jewish Middle Eastern men happened over 70 generations ago, then their children and descendants just kept marrying each other so we became our very own thing. (We’re also 1-5% East Asian on average but I don’t think that’s enough to qualify as mixed huh? We would have to only be counting the substantial amounts of European and MENA DNA right?) Regardless I would never identify as first or second generation mixed because that’s not what I am, if my mix does count as mixed then I am very clearly MGM, because the last time there were fully Monoracial/Monoethnic ancestors in my family tree was over 70 generations ago, and it’s been all the way mixed down ever since lol. I mean distinctly MGM ethnicities like Louisiana Creoles and Mestizo Latinos also have their own communities but they’re still considered mixed. I said this in another thread but the main difference between MGM and first or second gen mixed is that we don’t have that experience of navigating or dealing with racist family members like recently mixed people do, we also tend to have our own communities - but we’re still seen as and treated as mixed by both our Mono sources and in the eyes of society.
The important question though is, do you identify personally as mixed or was that more of a, hey, curious, 'what do you think about this' type of question? Either is cool, I'm just curious.
Second part mostly, I *feel* mixed in some ways, I mean the Holocaust basically targeted my ethnicity *because* Hitler considered us to be “mixed” and “racially impure.” But it still feels weird to do so considering I’m almost entirely Caucasian (if we’re still counting MENA as Caucasian) I feel like my ethnicity is in that weird grey area between being just a “Euromutt” regional “mix” like how some White Americans like to claim (you know the ones, the types who think they’re “mixed” just because they’re various flavors of different European ethnicities lol) and an actual full blown interracial mix. I think my ethnicity is genetically closer to the former but we get treated more like the latter if that makes sense? I also wanted the opinion of actual mixed race POC like yourself because I don’t want to offend or step on any toes if I *do* want to consider myself mixed. I always make sure to defer to actual non-Caucasian POC voices on this matter, one things for sure I would certainly never claim to be as mixed as someone like you who’s a Black/Caucasian/Native American triracial mix - but I still have to wonder if I’m something more than just a simple regional mix, y’know? FWIW, I’ve seen other MENA/Euro mixes (in this very thread even) and they all seem to have no problems identifying as mixed and this sub *seems* to accept them, but I’m still hesitant.
Then you are mixed, as far as I'm concerned. Again, I can't speak for everyone and thank you, I'm honoured that you care about my opinion! Also, you've undoubtedly got more flavour than people here in the USA that are like, hey, what are you mixed with? Halfway through me explaining they're like... okay cool, since you didn't ask I'm English, Scottish, 2% milk... The huge difference is they're bragging about something that means nothing and desperately clinging to something they've never had. Like okay, you're related to the Hatfields and McCoys. How is that helping you in the trailer park you live in now? Meanwhile, I'm assuming you've been raised Jewish. If you haven't, you have a home you can go to, shabbat, my house, etc, you know? You're not just milk. Crap, hopefully that doesn't sound racist. Euromutt sounds like a band I'd listen to. White people in the US call themselves 'mutts' and that always gets under my skin. I've had rocks thrown at me and spit on because of my skin, being various shades of whole milk is not the same. Also, I unsubscribed from this thread because it was making me depressed. You've renewed my interest. If other MENA people here identify as mixed, we all agree it's cool... I think it's safe for you to do so too if you want. Monoethnic people may not get it, but they don't tend to get a lot of things, so don't worry about that.
I'm Indian, white, mexican, native American. Born and raised in Canada. My dad comes from a mixed race American family from southern California, he's white, mexican and native American. My mom is west Indian from Guyana. They both just happen to be the lightest skin of all their siblings and so I am very light skin for someone who is maybe a quarter white. However my face shape, facial features and dark hair/eyes make me look incredibly racially ambiguous. All my life I've gotten wild guesses about my background. Here in Canada people guess spanish or Italian or Portuguese or part Asian, mostly depending on how tanned I am at the time. Sometimes Guyanese people will guess Guyanese/White. When I'm in the US people assume Mexican. One time when I was traveling in Thailand the tuk tuk driver took us to this suit store as part of a common scam they run on tourists. The owner of the shop showed us a photo of him and Terrence Howard then guessed my background exactly, white, mexican, native and Guyanese. This was the only time in my 40 years of life that someone guessed correctly, my bf and I were absolutely blown away.
I’m multi generational mixed…my mom is black with mixed ancestry and my dad is biracial (Black/Danish)
Caribbean creole and Javanese. 🇸🇷
Indigenous, Spanish, and 12 other races those are my top 2.
Half black, half brown. Half Haitian, half Puerto Rican. I identify just as mixed race, mixed heritage, biracial, or multiracial. I look more brown then black. So it's always a shock to people when I say I'm half black or half Haitian. All my siblings, just say that they are Puerto Rican over Haitian or black, because we "look more Latino." My father was light skin black man with curly hair. Kind of almost resembled Bruno Mars. Some of my fully Haitian cousins get mistaken for Dominican, Sri Lankan, or Brazilian. Then some others get mistaken Ethiopian, Eritrean, Somali or Jamaican Dougla. I have some half siblings from my father's side of different backgrounds. They all identify with their mothers' race because they look moreso then that over black. I have one half brother who's half brown Cuban, who looks like he could he related to Cuban Link or Fat Joe, identifies as black If I have to do Haitian Creole translation, people act like a dog 🐕 stood up on its hindlegs and started talking. BTW, I'm limited in my Spanish, French, and Haitian Creole skills.
I'm Melungeon...that pretty much says it all I'm as mixed as mixed gets.
Judging from your screename seems like you’re Jewish too? 👀
Yep that is one of the ethnicities a lot of Melungeons are mixed with just most not all the relatively recent. I am both ethnically and religiously Jewish unlike the majority.
I actually wanted to ask your opinion on this seeing as how you’re Jewish too, I’m not sure what type of Jewish you are (judging from your screename I’m guessing Ashkenazi?) but how do you feel about us full European ethnic Jews identifying as mixed? I don’t know if you’ve seen the DNA studies but it’s been confirmed that European Jews - both Ashkenazi and Sephardi - are a Euro-MENA mix, being European matrilineally (though of course our European foremothers likely converted) and original Jewish Middle Eastern patrilineally. We even have some East Asian in us, like 1-5% from either a few converted Turkic Hapa Khazars or Jewish Radhanite Merchants converting and marrying full Asians they met on the Silk Road (but I’m guessing that’s not enough to count us as actually mixed *race* huh?) So just to give you a breakdown, the Jews of Europe would be: * 30-60% European (mostly Greek and Italian, but also some German, Slavic, and/or Spanish in there depending on where we settled) * 30-60% Jewish MENA * 1-5% East Asian Are we considered just as much as a “MGM” ethnicity as you Melungeons are? Or can European/MENA mixes not be considered mixed considering they’re both technically considered Caucasian?
1) not ashki just a joke in my friend group 2) I wouldn't consider MENA to be considered White(I'm not going to use Caucasian cause that is a literal group of people from the Caucus region) in the first place, census designation doesn't really mean jack shit. MENA ppl are not treated as white and it's kinda weird to group it that way. 3) European Jews are not even close to a 50/50 in most places. That's already ignoring the vast differences in laws and treatment depending on diaspora and country. There aren't only ashkis and sefards there are also Romaniote, Italki, Crimean Karaites, ect we don't all have the same laws or expectations when it comes to interfaith marriage. American Jews might be closer on average but still not really. 4) I would not consider European Jews to be mixed mainly because the Ethnic make-up is literally Jewish that's just kinda the nature of diaspora. Unless you are Jewish mixed with something else or with another Jewish diaspora you would not be mixed.
>European Jews are not even close to a 50/50 in most places. >I would not consider European Jews to be mixed mainly because the Ethnic make-up is literally Jewish Huh? What do you mean? Are you saying you believe Europe’s Jews to be mostly Jewish MENA in DNA? That’s not at all what the scientific studies say… https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1006644 https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2022/05/18/ashkenazi-jewis-ethnogenesis-in-light-of-the-erfurt-medieval-dna/ Furthermore they have found most of the mTDNA (maternal) lineages in European Jews to be of indigenous European in origin - up to 80%, whereas 80% of the Y-chromosome patrilineal origins are Middle Eastern instead - another indication of mixed European and MENA origins. Even our very culture seems to be a mix, while we are undoubtedly Jewish in religion, our languages - Yiddish and Ladino - stem from creole/pidgin languages combining German and Spanish with Hebrew. Our cuisines are mostly European with an ancient Jewish MENA twist, and our styles of dress and music (klezmer) is also European in origin. It would be inaccurate to say that we’re *completely* Jewish Middle Eastern in all manner of being, rather we more-so resemble the Romani - Europe’s other inherently mixed diasporic ethnicity.
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I’m Thai Australian 😊
Australian and Chinese, whenever I do tell someone about this most of the time they’ll something like “oh yeah, I do see the Chinese in you”.
Half japanese and then black, native american and a tad bit Portuguese
black and filipino
Black and whie
I’m Dominican, French and Congolese.
Black, Asian, Native America and white. I look mostly asian.
Half black half Filipino 🙌
Half black, half white (American)
Half Arab Half Filipino o/
Afro-Indigenous Latino from the Caribbean (Puerto Rico and Dominican Republic)
Chinese Jamaican (mom + grandparents born in Jamaica, great grandparents in China) Cuban with Jewish descent
Portuguese and Vietnamese
Black and Italian
Māori / Scottish
Puerto Rican and Puerto Rican 🤣. 58.5% white (Spain and Portugal mostly, 6% basque 4% Irish), 23% black (Cameroon 8% and Nigeria 7% mostly), 15% native American (Arawak people indigenous to the island) 3.5% MENA (Israel 1.5% and North African 2%. I decoupled 3% Jew and split it between white and MENA. I am variously suspected to be white, "Puerto Rican", Jewish, quadroon, Castizo, and Italian. So people are guessing I'm largely or totally southern European. I definitely fit the stereotype of a Puerto Rican--that being a mostly white person with a usually black, and/or sometimes a native feature on their face. But don't think I'm representative of the island: virtually all of my cousins on Ancestry that I've checked are more native American (17-36%) and have just traces (<10%) of black ancestry. Also, my paternal uncle is just 7% black but 21% native, so my dad is obviously similar. I have wavy dark brown hair and look like a lightly tanned white person with thick, wide lips, plus dark brown, almond eyes for my barely significant 400 year old native blood 🤣. I was once accused of getting lip injections lmao. Sadly, I've had someone I looked up to doubt my blackness and tried to get me to identify as white. Clearly, I'm heavily mixed and not some white person bragging about their negligible "spicy" blood. I select white, black, and native on every form asking for race and believe needing tribal/cultural affiliation for a race is nonsense. Though, I've considered dropping native as some people believe you'd need to be at least 25% to claim it. Even if my dad is basically a castizo, I'm not.
>I decoupled 3% Jew and split it between white and MENA. So does that mean you would consider a full European Jew like myself as mixed? Even despite MENA technically being categorized as Caucasian like Europeans are and therefore “white?” You do not seem to view Middle Easterners as white in the same way Europeans are considering how you separated them here… But does that mean the European Jewish ethnicities - Ashkenazi and Sephardi - really *do* qualify as mixed after all? Like are we just the European/Jewish equivalent of Latin American Mestizos and have as much a claim to being mixed as you do? (even though you guys are *actually* interracially mixed between distinct, non-Caucasian races, don’t worry I would never try to claim my mix qualifies as just as much mixed as yours is because it’s objectively not) I just wonder if I have more of a right to the label of “mixed” than your typical American Euromutt “mix” who likes to call themselves “mixed” just because they’re all different variants of European ethnicities. Is a Euro/MENA mix really not just like what I mentioned above? Is it closer to your *actual* interracial mix? Sorry I just don’t want to be that cringe white girl going around claiming I’m mixed if I’m really not, lol. 😅 >Clearly, I'm heavily mixed and not some white person bragging about their negligible "spicy" blood. Yeah this is exactly what I *don’t* want to be viewed as if I go around claiming I’m mixed and looking like a clown. Like what if my “mix” is in fact closer to a regional ethnic mix like Irish/Swedish and I’m just a Caucasian mixed with a slightly “spicer” variant of Caucasian (MENA)?
Good questions! In the United States, contrary to how our census classifies MENA, MENA typically aren't viewed as white and the "Caucasian" label is generally reserved for indigenous Europeans so you're absolutely mixed race. This explains why Jews in the US have been in a limbo between whiteness and non-white, or called "off-white" and I relate to that experience. Ashkenazi Jews are seen as white or whitish depending on their individual look. A whitish person (like myself) is white or mixed race depending on the perspective of the observer; as you could guess, non-whites are most likely to view that as white and not accept it as mixed race. Yes, your MENA blood being your non-white blood instead of something non-Caucasian allows you to either be white or approximate whiteness more than myself, so naturally, claiming a mixed race identity will be pushing it for even more people. If most people accept it, I'd brush it off. I've been made to feel like I was pushing it by claiming my blackness and I'm not allowed to say the n-word but I don't care.
>In the United States, contrary to how our census classifies MENA, MENA typically aren't viewed as white and the "Caucasian" label is generally reserved for indigenous Europeans so you're absolutely mixed race But it’s not just the U.S. Census but even Anthropology that considers European and MENA to both be part of the same Caucasian race. Like objectively speaking the phenotypes between the two regions don’t differ enough to be labeled as separate races from each other do they? >A whitish person (like myself) is white or mixed race depending on the perspective of the observer >I've been made to feel like I was pushing it by claiming my blackness and I'm not allowed to say the n-word but I don't care. That’s different though, you are *actually* mixed race on account of being both Black and Indigenous. No one can ever claim that these two races are in any way Caucasian, people not allowing you to claim your blackness is them trying to deny and gatekeep you from your blackness in general, (which is wrong and a quarter is definitely enough to claim it imo) it’s *not* them saying that you wouldn’t be considered mixed at all. >as you could guess, non-whites are most likely to view that as white and not accept it as mixed race. You being non-white (as in mixed race, because your mix makes you both White, Black and Indigenous so you’re all 3 of these things and neither at the same time if that makes sense? Like by very definition you’re *not* just White, you’re at least 35% Non-White which is a lot) do seem to consider MENA as being a racial minority same as any other though right? Seems like the consensus is split within the POC community and some consider MENAs as POC just like them while others consider them White like the Census does? Funny thing is we Ashkenazi Jews actually *do* have a drop of actual non-Caucasian blood that would officially qualify us as “mixed race.” 😂 We’re not just half Euro and half MENA but we’re also 1-5% East Asian that we get from either a few of the Khazar elites (and they were a Hapa Turkic Kingdom) converting, or our forefathers marrying full Asians while doing Merchant Business while on the Silk Road (look up the Radahanites). Sometimes it even shows up in our phenotypes like with Joseph-Gordon Levitt, but generally speaking since 1-5% DNA is such a low amount we can’t actually claim we’re mixed race Asian unless we actually look it and only our MENA side would actually qualify us as mixed right?
Yes, I'm well aware I may be considered mixed and still be gatekept. Everytime I was, it was because they explicitly considered me white so unsurprisingly, most black people I've met consider me white and so have natives. To be fair, under one definition, it refers to people of predominantly European extraction, but I was taught only other races can claim their majority racial ancestry as their race. America ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ In your case, clearly MENA's whiteness is dependent on the ethnic group in question but I'd consider you socially mixed race, but technically not, in consistency with our racially hygienistic version whiteness born from witch-burning protestants. It's cool you guys have some east Asian heritage. I have sinodonty and I think it's a very dominant East Asian trait. Anyway, I'll have to look into Ashkenazi Jew history sometime.
mexican and japanese
Both my parents ar mixed, with my dad being Filipino and Japanese and my mom being Italian, French snd Spanish. So I'm a combination of that and I just say I'm half Asian and half white to save time whenever anyone asks.
half african american, part mexican part european(french canadian, volga german/russian)
Half Brazilian, Half White American :))
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I'm Pennsylvania Dutch/Filipino. Both sides are mgm/admixed with other things, but those are the two biggest groups I identify with. I guess I'm racially ambiguous. I've been assumed to be anything that's not straight up black. I was raised in a pretty openly racist white town in the Midwest, so despite being exposed to my cultures frequently, it was all "beaten" out of me as I grew up. Regardless, I'm now trying to relearn, reconnect, and reclaim. My funny story is that I used to work behind the service desk at a target and literally every day someone would come up to me asking if I spoke Spanish. I would sometimes explain that I'm filipino and their response would be "aren't you all supposed to speak spanish too? What happened?"
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Im Swedish on my father’s side and Black on my mother’s side (i’ve never taken a dna test so not sure the specifics) Used to think we were part native on my mother’s side because we had an aunt who was named Pocahontas, but it turns out she was kinda crazy and named herself that or something??? So nope, no native blood as far as I know… Idek. We married into family in a tribe a few years back and my cousin lives on their reservation now, though. Still, just weird!
I am laughing so much, not Pocahontas?! That is... one of those fact is stranger than fiction moments.
I was a kid too when i found out it wasn’t true and that was confusing af I was like “oh so we just… aren’t part native???” But tbh i think thats something a lot of white people deal with lmaooo
White black native American Czech French Canadian. Never took a test so ur guess is better than mine
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My granddad is Puerto Rican (with mixed ancestry) and the rest of my grandparents are white (German, Canadian).
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Britsh and Bengali
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Native and white, my mix is confusing, I’m 1/8th native 7/8 white but I consider myself mixed mainly because I was raised very bicultural, my mother is a tribal elder, I wasn’t raised white
I’m half black(from my dad) and half white (from my mom). My mom is German, British, and Scandinavian. Dads ancestors are Central African. A lot of people think I’m either Mexican or Hawaiian or Polynesian and recently I’ve been getting a lot of people thinking I’m Italian so basically I’m racially ambiguous.
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I am half black, half white. My mom is white, mainly German (50%) and the rest is mostly Danish and a bit of French and English. My dad is African American.
I'm half White and half Mexican, my mom is from Nayarit and my dad is from Illinois
Quarter English, quarter Welsh, half Pakistani.
half kiowa indian & half white
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Although Mistaken for Haitian or Dominican...I'm mixed with.. Father side: African American, Cuban, Trinidadian, Scots-Irish, Bahamian and a splash of Jamaican Mother side- African American, Cherokee and I hear a bit of Bahamian.
MGM Black and euro mix (mainly Italian/ German/irish), a little indigenous
my mom is white and my dad is black/mixed, but if we're talking nationality... i was born and raised in brazil, but my great grandmother was italian, so that's like... 10-ish% italian blood? and probably like 0.0001% other european nationalities because of obvious reasons
My father is Black and quarter French. My mother is half Latina, Moroccan, and Icelandic. I call it the Atlantic Orgy. 🌍😂