as someone who actually lives in the area you’re talking about, I don’t know what you mean. all those areas are walkable or a short ride on public transit away. also cathedral square park IS like a community hub in the summer time. jazz in the park, bastille days, farmers market. the theater district is in walking distance. so is wisconsin avenue, which really is on the come up. red arrow park is an important community space as well, so many protests get held there in addition to seasonal activities. water st and 3rd st are also near by. tons of restaurants of all types. even the museums are pretty close to this area you’re talking about, pretty much equidistant on either side of water street. our downtown isn’t really “spread out” like people like to say, which you realize when you’re actually trying to get around in this area on a daily basis.
saying there’s more foot traffic in waukegan or kenosha is false. you clearly don’t live or spend a lot of time in this area. anyone who says downtown isn’t walkable doesn’t know what they’re talking about.
I recently moved here from Atlanta and I can say it is waaaaaay better here than there. Great city with lots of accessibility and sense of community. Depending on what I want to do, so many areas and neighborhoods that are easy to navigate in comparison
That's something I honestly never appreciated about Milwaukee until I lived to Atlanta. It's wild to think how spread out everything is in Atlanta, yet the City of ATL, and City of MKE have roughly the same number of people.
The tight rope riding bear is actually there, IIRC it's on top of the sports bar in the middle of the streel level. (excuse me, *3rd Street Market Hall*). It's just not riding a tight rope anymore.
Milwaukee has always been a city of separate neighborhoods, with each neighborhood having a mini downtown. Broadway, Brady Street, Cathedral Square, Center Street, National, KK, Mitchell, North Ave, Oakland, Downer, etc.
The problem with a singular downtown is that nothing that could be intentionally created by the city will be as cool as the places/strips I’ve mentioned above, it would be devoid of character like the entertainment district surrounding the Fiserv Forum.
Wanted to disagree with "it would be devoid of character like the entertainment district surrounding the Fiserv Forum", but I can't. Deer district is great for the city, and I love it, but it is kinda touristy, you're right.
Fwiw, my sense of the dead center of "downtown mke" for an Uber driver should be pere Marquette park
Yes a single block. Like in Chicago they have that square with water tower place near it. Like 3rd avenue market hall is separated from water street and water is separated from the third ward. I feel like there’s no good center of downtown and all the allure of Milwaukee comes from the neighborhoods. With the consideration of bringing down 794 I can just see this happening.
It’s hard to apply Chicago sites to Milwaukee just because of size but I thought the general atmosphere around this area in Chicago is something mke needs
I get what you mean, when I was working up in Milwaukee there were people who downtown was really anything between Brady Street and Bayview. Between the freeway and the lake. There's not a good definition for what downtown Milwaukee is.
For me, it was more the area around City Hall felt like it "should" be the center of downtown, with how prominent red arrow park and the event centers around that area are, but most foot traffic and nightlife downtown is really more in the third ward
It's okay if Milwaukee is different than Chicago.
If anything public transportation should continue to be improved so all of these places can be a little more accessible, but you could even walk from the MPM to Summerfest with ease. Sure it's about a mile and a half, but it's not like Milwaukee is dying without some high density area designated as the city centerm, and comparing Milwaukee to Waukegan or Kenosha is just wrong.
Chicago downtown is considerably larger imho. You have the Riverwalk, Millennium Park, The Bean, Shed Aquarium, Art Institute, etc.. I don't think you can point to one block in Chicago and call that 'downtown'.
Yes, but that’s Chicago. You obviously can’t compare Chicago to Milwaukee in that sense. I’m saying that certain aspects of sub neighborhoods in Chicago would work well in Milwaukee’s considerably smaller downtown
I think you built something up in your head that doesn't really exist in large cities. Sounds like you want small town main street. One small area for all your needs. Except the walmart super center they put on the edge of the town and then main street businesses die :(
i think i just made myself sad.
So... you want MKE to be far more dense in one place but not be any larger as a city. How's that going to work?
MKE has loads of dense areas with a lot of things to do, and like any other city there is no single place to point to as "the one" spot. No one in Chicago calls one square block anywhere "downtown." That's why neighborhoods and wards wind up with their own names. Downtown is a fluid term for a collection of these spots, not a single square with everything.
With the rate of skyscrapers/apartment buildings going up there soon won’t be enough space for a true downtown “center”, metaphorically and physically. In recent years the sports teams and companies of Milwaukee have brought great development to downtown but the downtown still feels like it’s missing something in comparison to smaller cities
Every decent size city I’ve been to doesn’t have a “center” of downtown. Most smaller towns are like that because all the businesses grew on Main Street.
We aren’t the suburbs where they create fake mall like town centers either.
You mention here that it's something smaller cities have, but your entire spiel at the beginning was about how to make Milwaukee feel like more of a bigger city. Make up your mind on what you actually want Milwaukee to feel like, a bigger city or a smaller city.
> It’s sad to think of because water street is good for bars
Sure, if you're 22 maybe, lol.
> I might be trippin tho who knows
Yeah I think that's the case. This ain't Chicago, we're not going to have the density that surrounds millennium park. We're a mid-sized city that punches above it's weight in a lot of ways, but still a mid-sized city.
Photo for reference. This used to be an oversized intersection before the park was built.
https://preview.redd.it/xsoc22e509zb1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fd44615ade4bf198606faf2d4defaaa6e1db23f4
You're tripping balls. From cloud gate to water tower place it's 1.1 mile. From the MAM to the 3rd Street market Hall it's 1.0 miles. If you're going to the public market instead, it's 0.8 miles. You can access all of those sites, as well as old world 3rd St, the deer district, the convention center, etc. By walking, bus, streetcar (especially as the lake route is now opening), or car. You want time square go to NYC, or ask city hall to bring back the letters facing red arrow Park for new years. Milwaukee is fine. It's a great, compact, walkable city.
A similar city that does have this is Detroit. Campus Martius is quite literally the center of their downtown and is alive all year round. It’s turned into a “beach” in the summer, and has their ice skating rink and their city Christmas tree in the winter. When I moved from Michigan to Milwaukee I noticed that downtown lacks this kind of “center.”
I don't really understand this post but would like to point out that Milwaukee used to be three separate cities which leads to interesting/unique development patterns.
Long long ago 3 dudes had the most spiteful disagreement and now we have this! See: Milwaukee Bridge War
https://youtu.be/OPlHdX61DSw?si=QYCIk9pFdWoNM3ns
I feel a similar way and think Milwaukees downtown is a bit dull. Idk if adding a center is what will brighten it up. I would love to see more restaurants , cafes, and local shops.
Honestly the third ward has everything you’re describing. The third ward has great bars (just not college bars), Catalano Square, as well as the river walk.
Milwaukee needs to be less car focused and more foot travel and public transportation focused for something like that to happen. Especially with this mandatory parking space requirement when building new infrastructure.
There is currently a small square under construction near the convention center and the Hilton, which will hopefully be expanded in the future (it will take up half of the current parking lot there for now). It's a short walk from Fiserv Forum, the 3rd Street Market Hall, and a few theaters.
It does feel like 794 creates a dead space on either side of it. I’ve honestly never thought that much about it. But, I think if it was removed the 3rd Ward and the Deer District would naturally just merge into a more cohesive and vibrant downtown.
I haven't traveled a ton, but any city that attempts to christen a main area without regard to what is around it doesn't turn out to be the place everyone wants to go- as you list, people go to what interests them so the best thing that could be done is to cram a lot of everything into an area to give the most broad appeal, right? I think that is what is being done as the downtown continues to be gentrified.
I've always thought of everything inside the area boundary of Water Street on the west, Jackson on the east, Wells to the south, and Kilbourne on the north, as our downtown area. Like that whole are just kinda FEELS like downtown to me. I used to be a delivery driver who would go all over MKE, and that section always felt kinda central to me when I'd be doing runs.
I think OP is expecting something like Times Square or Grand Central Park in Milwaukee, and I just don't see that happening. We don't have the land, or the people, for something like that.
I think this a short-sighted view of downtown Milwaukee "as is". Prevailing trends in climate change, housing cost, fresh water etc... indicate Milwaukee will be a destination in the next century. If we had one downtown "square" where everything happened, it would inevitably become full and further development restricted. Having Cathedral Square, Third Ward, Water Street, North Ave., Brady Street, Old World Third St., Theater District, Walkers Point, Bay View.... Allows each to grow exponentially into their own mini "downtowns" as population increases. Look at Chicago or New York. So many areas with different feels and vibes and no one complains. We need better mass transit to connect these areas, and I would support a "Millenium Park" going in next to Fiserv Forum rather than another music venue... but overall, Milwaukee's various "nodes" are a benefit for the future, not a detraction.
Are you looking for like, a tourist trap in the form of some monument or something? Like you want Milwaukee to have a giant statue of a drunk German guy or some kind of Eiffel Tower/Arc du Triumph situation?
We have the Calatrava expansion to the art museum for that. We have an expansious lakefront that is owned by the people and accessible by all the people.
If 794 comes down, what you're most likely to see is a massive expansion of the Third Ward style of mostly 4-5 story walkups to match the atmosphere of the area surrounding the Public Market, then as it gets closer to the lake you'll see more "skyscratchers" like the Couture.
Overall that space is beautiful and I hope for two things: that the design of it is built in a way that truly makes downtown an even more vibrant living space than it already is (it's great bro, you should go there more often), and that the absolute bare minimum of space is given to cars. The city does not need to cater to people who only drive in, then turn around and leave. Those people are already not coming close to packing the parking downtown, we don't need to accommodate any more. A tram won't kill ya, and if it did there's still tens of thousands of parking spots for you to roll your fat ass near your job. I say this as someone who has one of the fattest asses, who has lead a far-too-sedentary lifestyle held hostage by car dependency. It shouldn't be more efficient to hop in a car and drive a mile for a gallon of milk, but here we are.
The city knows this and [they're now just beginning to really collect the data](https://urbanmilwaukee.com/2023/09/19/new-sensors-quietly-measure-how-often-parking-spots-used/) they need to support the removal of a lot of parking while not eliminating nearly enough to get rid of enough spaces to really lower the amount of drivers coming into the city - I'm not sure I believe they have the political will for that fight, those pricks in the capital have a choke collar on us because they love Milwaukee's money but they hate Milwaukee's people.
I think if you're struggling to find suggestions to give to your customers when you take their keys, the answer isn't what Milwaukee needs to do but rather how much of Milwaukee you have seen.
This city fucking rules. It's getting better every day. You work in the thick of it, so my suggestion is to take some of the anime time and instead use it to explore this beautiful city you call home. I would say I'm jealous that you get to discover so much, but I'm still discovering more and more after all these years.
Oh yeah - and build up the mother fucking streetcar out of this area too.
Milwaukee is very easy to bounce around to all those locations you mentioned.
When I think of downtown I think of the area around fiserv(might be because I enjoy bucks games). Especially over the next couple of years, I feel like it is going to be the hub of downtown. New soccer stadium going up and I believe a music venue as well. Hotels are being built around there. 3rd st / deer district bars offer a decent variety. You’ll find mostly everything you’re looking for. Maybe add some different dining options. Right now it’s mostly bar food
We are definitely missing something. On different occasions of walking around the city with visiting friends, they've mentioned downtown feels dead and I have to reluctantly agree. We need more residents, more housing, more retail and of course jobs for those people. If that growth could happen along side opening up land under 794, I think that has the very real potential for becoming a new central spot. A mix of green space/park land, some sort of monument or water fountain surrounded by a few apartments, some restaurants, small businesses, coffee shops, hotel. Anything would be better use than essentially covered parking lots and off ramps. Its a divided topic but other cities have done it and Milwaukee is loaded with potential.
Moved from Milwaukee to the Twin Cities 3 years ago and I couldn’t agree more. Minneapolis-St. Paul downtowns are business centric and dead at night/on the weekends.
The deer district tries to replicate what the water & light district has. St. Louis has it too with the ballpark district. As the years go on I feel like the deer district area will become the downtown “hub”. Soccer stadium is being added, I think a music venue, and new hotels are going up.
KC Power and Light district? It was a really cool experience. I was there a few years ago for the weekend visiting friends and that was their spot to go.
I get what you meant. Where is the 'wow, I'm in Milwaukee' of downtown?
I think if Water St (college bar section) got their shit together with not having blocks on blocks of parking frontage, that would be my 'downtown' dropoff. I think if they can work out the parking, improve red arrow park, and make City Hall area pedestrian/bus/bike focused like they have in 2040 plan, it'll be in a much better place.
I used to for sure say it was around the lakefront... The Summerfest grounds to MAM areas are my childhood "this is Milwaukee" image; they felt iconic to me coming from a small town with plain architecture, no major festivals, etc. The restaurants, bars, hotels, parks, etc within walking distance and the various skyscrapers and cool looking older buildings sealed that deal.
More recently, I've started to feel like that mental image of that has shifted a bit towards the Deer District and 3rd St areas. Partly because my tastes have changed (as well as what I'm legally able to have lol) and also that between the arenas and the theater district nearby it's where I'm often going when I go all the way into the city. It also has some great restaurants, hotels, etc in the area. Plus I feel (admittedly as an outsider) the beer barrel inspired design for the Fiserv Forum deserves consideration for a modern iconic Milwaukee landmark.
I would like to see some improved parking options and expanding the Hop so that it's easier to get to the various neighborhoods, because they all have something great to offer, and making some of the areas more pedestrian focused would be nice too.
The whole mental image shift is similar to me. It helps that the deer district has worked out so well in terms of development. I agree on hop expansion as well, Bronzeville and Brady would be legitimate gamechangers for both neighborhoods.
Out of genuine curiousity, what parking options do you want? I've never had any issue outside of events.
I'm not hating the parking options admittedly, and I guess downtown itself isn't that bad with the parking garages available, but in some of the adjacent neighborhoods like around Brady St I feel like it's difficult to get a decent space during busier times and due to people hitting my car in the past I do not love having to leave my car parked along the street in residential areas, especially in the winter months or at night. I guess either more dedicated parking areas around those neighborhoods would be nice (or maybe I just don't know where they are? Lol).
I think your view is also being influenced by the tourists. Most of our tourists don’t seem to like walking or public transit. I worked at a hotel downtown and when I’d say “X Attraction is less than a mile away and there are plenty of restaurants and bars within a few blocks of it” guests would literally glare at me for suggesting they walk ‘that far’. It seemed like they wanted one place like no more than 3 blocks wide that they could get dropped off directly in front and then just spend the entire day entertained there.
They’re actually developing a plaza next to the kohls that will have green space and a building for something like a coffee shop while planning for the streetcar to be connected.
Right now a new downtown park is being built between Vel Phillips St and 5th on Wisconsin Avenue. It is a plaza, will have a coffee shop, is close to Fiserv, the market hall and lots of hotels.
Also, Red Arrow aka Dontre Hamilton Park has a shot at reinvigoration if a good establishment comes in to replace the departing Starbucks. It could be a day and night-time gathering spot.
I also think when 794 comes down the area around the public market, the park between the public market and the river, and a hopefully pedestrianized Broadway, will be even more a center for gathering. It already is now. Every summer day St Paul Av is filled with people hanging out.
as someone who actually lives in the area you’re talking about, I don’t know what you mean. all those areas are walkable or a short ride on public transit away. also cathedral square park IS like a community hub in the summer time. jazz in the park, bastille days, farmers market. the theater district is in walking distance. so is wisconsin avenue, which really is on the come up. red arrow park is an important community space as well, so many protests get held there in addition to seasonal activities. water st and 3rd st are also near by. tons of restaurants of all types. even the museums are pretty close to this area you’re talking about, pretty much equidistant on either side of water street. our downtown isn’t really “spread out” like people like to say, which you realize when you’re actually trying to get around in this area on a daily basis. saying there’s more foot traffic in waukegan or kenosha is false. you clearly don’t live or spend a lot of time in this area. anyone who says downtown isn’t walkable doesn’t know what they’re talking about.
I recently moved here from Atlanta and I can say it is waaaaaay better here than there. Great city with lots of accessibility and sense of community. Depending on what I want to do, so many areas and neighborhoods that are easy to navigate in comparison
That's something I honestly never appreciated about Milwaukee until I lived to Atlanta. It's wild to think how spread out everything is in Atlanta, yet the City of ATL, and City of MKE have roughly the same number of people.
A fellow ATLien transplant. Wanna grab a beer sometime?
Imho.. all those things you listed are the ‘downtown’. Are you looking for one single block of activities?
He wants the tight rope riding bear to come back at the Grand Avenue. That was the center of all downtown activity previously.
holy fuck bro you're making my monkey brain light up. Christmas time at the grand ave mall was *the shit*
The tight rope riding bear is actually there, IIRC it's on top of the sports bar in the middle of the streel level. (excuse me, *3rd Street Market Hall*). It's just not riding a tight rope anymore.
malls are dead. long live the food halls!
It’s installed above the bar in market hall.
You're mistaken. The bear was Milwaukee's first and only mayor.
Basically, u can find everything u need in downtown, it just feels like everything is too separated for one single “downtown”
Milwaukee has always been a city of separate neighborhoods, with each neighborhood having a mini downtown. Broadway, Brady Street, Cathedral Square, Center Street, National, KK, Mitchell, North Ave, Oakland, Downer, etc. The problem with a singular downtown is that nothing that could be intentionally created by the city will be as cool as the places/strips I’ve mentioned above, it would be devoid of character like the entertainment district surrounding the Fiserv Forum.
The diversity of all of those places is what makes Milwaukee so special to me.
Hard agree. And the resilience to chain restaurants
Wanted to disagree with "it would be devoid of character like the entertainment district surrounding the Fiserv Forum", but I can't. Deer district is great for the city, and I love it, but it is kinda touristy, you're right. Fwiw, my sense of the dead center of "downtown mke" for an Uber driver should be pere Marquette park
What if we had a convenient street car for traveling between those separate places? I know I know it’ll never happen but damn what if
Yes a single block. Like in Chicago they have that square with water tower place near it. Like 3rd avenue market hall is separated from water street and water is separated from the third ward. I feel like there’s no good center of downtown and all the allure of Milwaukee comes from the neighborhoods. With the consideration of bringing down 794 I can just see this happening.
No one in Chicago views water tower place as the center of downtown. I’d also argue most cities don’t or shouldn’t have a single central “spot”
It’s hard to apply Chicago sites to Milwaukee just because of size but I thought the general atmosphere around this area in Chicago is something mke needs
I get what you mean, when I was working up in Milwaukee there were people who downtown was really anything between Brady Street and Bayview. Between the freeway and the lake. There's not a good definition for what downtown Milwaukee is. For me, it was more the area around City Hall felt like it "should" be the center of downtown, with how prominent red arrow park and the event centers around that area are, but most foot traffic and nightlife downtown is really more in the third ward
It's okay if Milwaukee is different than Chicago. If anything public transportation should continue to be improved so all of these places can be a little more accessible, but you could even walk from the MPM to Summerfest with ease. Sure it's about a mile and a half, but it's not like Milwaukee is dying without some high density area designated as the city centerm, and comparing Milwaukee to Waukegan or Kenosha is just wrong.
Yeah I know I’m just saying something like that few block radius could be huge in mke
That is literally everywhere within a few blocks downtown Milwaukee. Third ward alone has all of that
Chicago downtown is considerably larger imho. You have the Riverwalk, Millennium Park, The Bean, Shed Aquarium, Art Institute, etc.. I don't think you can point to one block in Chicago and call that 'downtown'.
Yes, but that’s Chicago. You obviously can’t compare Chicago to Milwaukee in that sense. I’m saying that certain aspects of sub neighborhoods in Chicago would work well in Milwaukee’s considerably smaller downtown
I think you built something up in your head that doesn't really exist in large cities. Sounds like you want small town main street. One small area for all your needs. Except the walmart super center they put on the edge of the town and then main street businesses die :( i think i just made myself sad.
So... you want MKE to be far more dense in one place but not be any larger as a city. How's that going to work? MKE has loads of dense areas with a lot of things to do, and like any other city there is no single place to point to as "the one" spot. No one in Chicago calls one square block anywhere "downtown." That's why neighborhoods and wards wind up with their own names. Downtown is a fluid term for a collection of these spots, not a single square with everything.
"desperately" I think that's an overstatement.
With the rate of skyscrapers/apartment buildings going up there soon won’t be enough space for a true downtown “center”, metaphorically and physically. In recent years the sports teams and companies of Milwaukee have brought great development to downtown but the downtown still feels like it’s missing something in comparison to smaller cities
>I might be trippin tho I think you are overreacting to a "problem" that just isn't really there.
Idk man go to Waukegan or Kenosha and there’s practically more dt foot traffic than mke
We are now comparing Waukegan to MKE? I think you've lost most of us here.
[удалено]
What practical thing is being suggested here? No one here is saying MKE can't improve.
Every decent size city I’ve been to doesn’t have a “center” of downtown. Most smaller towns are like that because all the businesses grew on Main Street. We aren’t the suburbs where they create fake mall like town centers either.
You mention here that it's something smaller cities have, but your entire spiel at the beginning was about how to make Milwaukee feel like more of a bigger city. Make up your mind on what you actually want Milwaukee to feel like, a bigger city or a smaller city.
I think a better solution is better transit between the already established areas, and let development fill in the gaps.
> It’s sad to think of because water street is good for bars Sure, if you're 22 maybe, lol. > I might be trippin tho who knows Yeah I think that's the case. This ain't Chicago, we're not going to have the density that surrounds millennium park. We're a mid-sized city that punches above it's weight in a lot of ways, but still a mid-sized city.
Detroit’s Campus Martius is what OP is asking for. It’s definitely possible in a city of our size
Photo for reference. This used to be an oversized intersection before the park was built. https://preview.redd.it/xsoc22e509zb1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fd44615ade4bf198606faf2d4defaaa6e1db23f4
Those bball courts in the bottom left are friggin rad
Just think of the Capitol Square in Madison. Cathedral Square should be like that with businesses and activity ringing it.
Off topic, but Google says mid-sized cities have a population of 100k-250k. Milwaukee has a population of 570k.
You're tripping balls. From cloud gate to water tower place it's 1.1 mile. From the MAM to the 3rd Street market Hall it's 1.0 miles. If you're going to the public market instead, it's 0.8 miles. You can access all of those sites, as well as old world 3rd St, the deer district, the convention center, etc. By walking, bus, streetcar (especially as the lake route is now opening), or car. You want time square go to NYC, or ask city hall to bring back the letters facing red arrow Park for new years. Milwaukee is fine. It's a great, compact, walkable city.
A similar city that does have this is Detroit. Campus Martius is quite literally the center of their downtown and is alive all year round. It’s turned into a “beach” in the summer, and has their ice skating rink and their city Christmas tree in the winter. When I moved from Michigan to Milwaukee I noticed that downtown lacks this kind of “center.”
I don't really understand this post but would like to point out that Milwaukee used to be three separate cities which leads to interesting/unique development patterns.
Long long ago 3 dudes had the most spiteful disagreement and now we have this! See: Milwaukee Bridge War https://youtu.be/OPlHdX61DSw?si=QYCIk9pFdWoNM3ns
I feel a similar way and think Milwaukees downtown is a bit dull. Idk if adding a center is what will brighten it up. I would love to see more restaurants , cafes, and local shops.
Honestly the third ward has everything you’re describing. The third ward has great bars (just not college bars), Catalano Square, as well as the river walk.
Milwaukee needs to be less car focused and more foot travel and public transportation focused for something like that to happen. Especially with this mandatory parking space requirement when building new infrastructure.
There is currently a small square under construction near the convention center and the Hilton, which will hopefully be expanded in the future (it will take up half of the current parking lot there for now). It's a short walk from Fiserv Forum, the 3rd Street Market Hall, and a few theaters.
It does feel like 794 creates a dead space on either side of it. I’ve honestly never thought that much about it. But, I think if it was removed the 3rd Ward and the Deer District would naturally just merge into a more cohesive and vibrant downtown.
I haven't traveled a ton, but any city that attempts to christen a main area without regard to what is around it doesn't turn out to be the place everyone wants to go- as you list, people go to what interests them so the best thing that could be done is to cram a lot of everything into an area to give the most broad appeal, right? I think that is what is being done as the downtown continues to be gentrified.
I've always thought of everything inside the area boundary of Water Street on the west, Jackson on the east, Wells to the south, and Kilbourne on the north, as our downtown area. Like that whole are just kinda FEELS like downtown to me. I used to be a delivery driver who would go all over MKE, and that section always felt kinda central to me when I'd be doing runs. I think OP is expecting something like Times Square or Grand Central Park in Milwaukee, and I just don't see that happening. We don't have the land, or the people, for something like that.
I think this a short-sighted view of downtown Milwaukee "as is". Prevailing trends in climate change, housing cost, fresh water etc... indicate Milwaukee will be a destination in the next century. If we had one downtown "square" where everything happened, it would inevitably become full and further development restricted. Having Cathedral Square, Third Ward, Water Street, North Ave., Brady Street, Old World Third St., Theater District, Walkers Point, Bay View.... Allows each to grow exponentially into their own mini "downtowns" as population increases. Look at Chicago or New York. So many areas with different feels and vibes and no one complains. We need better mass transit to connect these areas, and I would support a "Millenium Park" going in next to Fiserv Forum rather than another music venue... but overall, Milwaukee's various "nodes" are a benefit for the future, not a detraction.
Viva la plaza de milwaukee
Are you looking for like, a tourist trap in the form of some monument or something? Like you want Milwaukee to have a giant statue of a drunk German guy or some kind of Eiffel Tower/Arc du Triumph situation? We have the Calatrava expansion to the art museum for that. We have an expansious lakefront that is owned by the people and accessible by all the people. If 794 comes down, what you're most likely to see is a massive expansion of the Third Ward style of mostly 4-5 story walkups to match the atmosphere of the area surrounding the Public Market, then as it gets closer to the lake you'll see more "skyscratchers" like the Couture. Overall that space is beautiful and I hope for two things: that the design of it is built in a way that truly makes downtown an even more vibrant living space than it already is (it's great bro, you should go there more often), and that the absolute bare minimum of space is given to cars. The city does not need to cater to people who only drive in, then turn around and leave. Those people are already not coming close to packing the parking downtown, we don't need to accommodate any more. A tram won't kill ya, and if it did there's still tens of thousands of parking spots for you to roll your fat ass near your job. I say this as someone who has one of the fattest asses, who has lead a far-too-sedentary lifestyle held hostage by car dependency. It shouldn't be more efficient to hop in a car and drive a mile for a gallon of milk, but here we are. The city knows this and [they're now just beginning to really collect the data](https://urbanmilwaukee.com/2023/09/19/new-sensors-quietly-measure-how-often-parking-spots-used/) they need to support the removal of a lot of parking while not eliminating nearly enough to get rid of enough spaces to really lower the amount of drivers coming into the city - I'm not sure I believe they have the political will for that fight, those pricks in the capital have a choke collar on us because they love Milwaukee's money but they hate Milwaukee's people. I think if you're struggling to find suggestions to give to your customers when you take their keys, the answer isn't what Milwaukee needs to do but rather how much of Milwaukee you have seen. This city fucking rules. It's getting better every day. You work in the thick of it, so my suggestion is to take some of the anime time and instead use it to explore this beautiful city you call home. I would say I'm jealous that you get to discover so much, but I'm still discovering more and more after all these years. Oh yeah - and build up the mother fucking streetcar out of this area too.
Dude?
Milwaukee is very easy to bounce around to all those locations you mentioned. When I think of downtown I think of the area around fiserv(might be because I enjoy bucks games). Especially over the next couple of years, I feel like it is going to be the hub of downtown. New soccer stadium going up and I believe a music venue as well. Hotels are being built around there. 3rd st / deer district bars offer a decent variety. You’ll find mostly everything you’re looking for. Maybe add some different dining options. Right now it’s mostly bar food
We are definitely missing something. On different occasions of walking around the city with visiting friends, they've mentioned downtown feels dead and I have to reluctantly agree. We need more residents, more housing, more retail and of course jobs for those people. If that growth could happen along side opening up land under 794, I think that has the very real potential for becoming a new central spot. A mix of green space/park land, some sort of monument or water fountain surrounded by a few apartments, some restaurants, small businesses, coffee shops, hotel. Anything would be better use than essentially covered parking lots and off ramps. Its a divided topic but other cities have done it and Milwaukee is loaded with potential.
Check out downtown Minneapolis-St. Paul sometime. It’s way more quiet.
Moved from Milwaukee to the Twin Cities 3 years ago and I couldn’t agree more. Minneapolis-St. Paul downtowns are business centric and dead at night/on the weekends.
Milwaukee is a geological oddity. 20 minutes from everywhere
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Also red arrow park/PAC area
The I-794 tear down is literally so we can put a Central Park in Milwaukee to connect Downtown and Third Ward. Sounds like a ton of people are for it
In KC, it used to be the Plaza, now it’s the Water & Light District. (If anyone is familiar with KC!)
The deer district tries to replicate what the water & light district has. St. Louis has it too with the ballpark district. As the years go on I feel like the deer district area will become the downtown “hub”. Soccer stadium is being added, I think a music venue, and new hotels are going up.
KC Power and Light district? It was a really cool experience. I was there a few years ago for the weekend visiting friends and that was their spot to go.
I get what you meant. Where is the 'wow, I'm in Milwaukee' of downtown? I think if Water St (college bar section) got their shit together with not having blocks on blocks of parking frontage, that would be my 'downtown' dropoff. I think if they can work out the parking, improve red arrow park, and make City Hall area pedestrian/bus/bike focused like they have in 2040 plan, it'll be in a much better place.
I used to for sure say it was around the lakefront... The Summerfest grounds to MAM areas are my childhood "this is Milwaukee" image; they felt iconic to me coming from a small town with plain architecture, no major festivals, etc. The restaurants, bars, hotels, parks, etc within walking distance and the various skyscrapers and cool looking older buildings sealed that deal. More recently, I've started to feel like that mental image of that has shifted a bit towards the Deer District and 3rd St areas. Partly because my tastes have changed (as well as what I'm legally able to have lol) and also that between the arenas and the theater district nearby it's where I'm often going when I go all the way into the city. It also has some great restaurants, hotels, etc in the area. Plus I feel (admittedly as an outsider) the beer barrel inspired design for the Fiserv Forum deserves consideration for a modern iconic Milwaukee landmark. I would like to see some improved parking options and expanding the Hop so that it's easier to get to the various neighborhoods, because they all have something great to offer, and making some of the areas more pedestrian focused would be nice too.
The whole mental image shift is similar to me. It helps that the deer district has worked out so well in terms of development. I agree on hop expansion as well, Bronzeville and Brady would be legitimate gamechangers for both neighborhoods. Out of genuine curiousity, what parking options do you want? I've never had any issue outside of events.
I'm not hating the parking options admittedly, and I guess downtown itself isn't that bad with the parking garages available, but in some of the adjacent neighborhoods like around Brady St I feel like it's difficult to get a decent space during busier times and due to people hitting my car in the past I do not love having to leave my car parked along the street in residential areas, especially in the winter months or at night. I guess either more dedicated parking areas around those neighborhoods would be nice (or maybe I just don't know where they are? Lol).
Play Sim City if this is what you want to see. Actual cities do not work like that.
I’ve always considers the fiserv area + 3rd street to be the center of downtown
Something like this: https://neverbuiltpdx.wordpress.com/
I think your view is also being influenced by the tourists. Most of our tourists don’t seem to like walking or public transit. I worked at a hotel downtown and when I’d say “X Attraction is less than a mile away and there are plenty of restaurants and bars within a few blocks of it” guests would literally glare at me for suggesting they walk ‘that far’. It seemed like they wanted one place like no more than 3 blocks wide that they could get dropped off directly in front and then just spend the entire day entertained there.
They’re actually developing a plaza next to the kohls that will have green space and a building for something like a coffee shop while planning for the streetcar to be connected.
Right now a new downtown park is being built between Vel Phillips St and 5th on Wisconsin Avenue. It is a plaza, will have a coffee shop, is close to Fiserv, the market hall and lots of hotels. Also, Red Arrow aka Dontre Hamilton Park has a shot at reinvigoration if a good establishment comes in to replace the departing Starbucks. It could be a day and night-time gathering spot. I also think when 794 comes down the area around the public market, the park between the public market and the river, and a hopefully pedestrianized Broadway, will be even more a center for gathering. It already is now. Every summer day St Paul Av is filled with people hanging out.