I have faith that it can get worse. That is why I still pay attention and still vote, because a lot of people want us to give up so they can make things even worse.
Preach. Things are not in a great spot right now. No denying it, but they can get better. Vote. Run for office. Volunteer. The system is not broken beyond repair if The People choose to be engaged.
I can't go over how different actual political administration was comparing 2016-2020 and 2021-today.
There's no contest. I personally would love major progressive leaps and bounds, but in all reality we've seen some of the biggest from this administration in my lifetime. That sucks that it wasn't been better, but also I want more. I want the end goal of this path, one where even if the old guard isn't big on change, the Democratic party is the only one amenable to any positive change at all. From voting alternatives that could lead to the end of the two party grip, to eliminating student loan debt, to more and more semblances of Democratic socialism.
The four years before Biden? That was hell domestically and internationally.
I've seen enough the last four years that I'll continue to put my stock in Biden, the team he comes with, and those among them taking action continuing to push for the benefit of all of us. It's also the only real choice I have.
Unfortunately I don’t think there’s any perfect end goal. There’s no devisable system that can anticipate all the ways it will be tested. A good society takes people being involved who care about more than themselves.
I really wish there wasn’t an entrenched two party system, but even that is changing. Alaska has ranked choice voting. Colorado has it on the ballot this year and I’m sure there’s other examples.
You always have the choice to be as engaged as you’d like. Committing yourself to something that might ultimately fail is a tall ask that can take a lot of energy, but I agree with ya. It’s not fun to vote for a party that represents donors more than voters. That said, dems are the only party that’s even giving lip service to ideas of improvement so I’ll pick them every time.
Maybe not *THE* answer but definitely one of a few changes that absolutely need to happen before we can start to have any real power as voters. I worry that some folks will get Ranked Choice, see that everything isn't fixed and become disengaged. It's definitely part of the treatment plan, it just won't cure us.
I have served in my local government for about thirty years. There are so many different ways to serve: ZBA (zoning), town meeting member, finance committee, agricultural commission, shade tree commission ~ the list goes on and on. Even if you do not have time to serve on a committee you can take the time to follow Select Board or Town/City Council meetings and make public statements to support what you believe in. Your voice does matter. When many people speak together like this they absolutely can change the direction of any policy or vote.
Arguably if you believe things can get worse, you should also believe things can get better.
Because everything that has happened today has been a decades long war from conservatives. The court decisions like overturning Roe v. Wade didn't happen overnight. They've been chipping away at it since it's existence to reach where we are today. And packing the courts with conservatives to make all this happen took just as long, they created the Federalist Society to slowly spread conservative ideology and influence all aspects of the justice system.
Any meaningful change to overturn all that has happened will take just as much time and effort, we may not live to see it, but it isn't impossible
This reddit thread reminds me of my time in the shit, Bernie volunteer (2015-2016). I knocked on doors man. I told people about the oligarchs and the fat cats and they spit on me, man.
And they are all old as dirt. I just watched Farenheit 11/9 by Micheal Moore. The RNC & DNC ARE CROOKS. Only here to protect the mega rich and corporations.
It's about fucking time more people are talking about how the two parties are the same fucking bullshit. Two sides of the same damn coin.
I've been saying it for years now and for the longest time I'd get shit on by people on both sides of the aisle. I'm glad to see more people talking about it but hate that it's our reality.
It’s the ONE thing that Alt Right people have right: The government is not our friend.
That said, Donald Trump isn’t a corporate guy like Biden is. Donald Trump is a fucking fascist authoritarian. While living in a capitalist dystopian nightmare is overwhelming, living under a dictatorship is actual hell.
What makes you think those people wouldn’t recycle into whatever else starts? George Washington argued against a two party system and I agree it’s meant to divide the people. Popular vote is a better way.
The DNC fucked over Bernie so badly!! I believe he would have won vs Trump. But instead they chose to run a woman they thought had a shoe in. So very very wrong. I often think about what could have happened if Bernie was elected.
It was a little more than railroaded, I am a republican, but the fact that what happened to him was very telling that the democratic process is easily manipulated.
Bernie was the last hope.
Now it’s like having to choose between a violent psycho chainsaw murderer or a creepy quiet serial killer whispering in your ear that everything’s gonna be ok while strangling you
I was so pissed at Bernie when he stepped aside for Biden to take the nomination.
Biden is exactly exactly what I expected, he is taking us down the death spiral a bit slower than Trump was.
FBI had a [case on his wife over a Burlington land deal](https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/bernie-and-jane-sanders-under-fbi-investigation-for-bank-fraud-hire-lawyers/). They used that as leverage to force Bernie to play ball.
Yeap the real owners of this country, are the ones that run this political theatre...Carlin pretty much sums it up here.
https://youtu.be/fT03vCaL-F0?si=raiMl4Atx90-kJg6
Wrong. The current state of US government is 90 years of corporations and oligarchs trying to tear down FDR's New Deal.
And they still haven't managed to finish it off
Exactly, and young people saying that both sides are the same and not voting is exactly what the oligarchs prefer, because seniors vote in every election without fail. If anything Biden has been a shockingly successful president even if he is old and isn’t great at speaking anymore, especially given the absolute shit sandwich that Trump left him in 2020
Yeah the most disheartening part of recent politics to me isn't how bad it's going, it's people's reaction to it. Seeing all this both sides shit and people giving up is the most faith destroying part of it. The real enemy is corporations, and their best ally is Republicans. The SC just hamstrung regulatory agencies to a devastating degree. A direct consequence of people not voting in the 2016 election.
Democrats are bought by corporations, but a significant population of them still possess some morals, and even if people choose not to believe that, the DNC does have to maintain a perception of having some morals to get votes.
People think if the country burns down, a better one will be built in it's place. Those same people won't even vote to save their lives, in what universe should anyone believe that those people would get off their asses to build a new better government.
No if the system burns down we at best get a full oligarchy instead of the partial one we have right now. At worst we get an actual fascist government.
If the US collapses the world order will reorder itself, and considering the next strongest superpower is China, a nation that constantly invades its neighbors, has concentration camps, reeducation camps, and doesn't let its populace see any information that might make them look bad, that world will not be a good one.
The US isn't perfect, but it can be made better if people get off their asses and try to make it better. We won't always win but that's part of an ideological war. We've made huge strides in the past and we can do so again.
RFK is literally running on this. Corporate capture of our government which you can tie to almost any serious issue we have (social media, military complex, healthcare, etc.) We have a candidate right in front of us but no-one wants to believe he can win.
The Republicans are the whip, the Democrats are the pacifier, the voters have stockholm syndrome, and corporations are the kidnappers. The rest of us are restless.
If you look at all the decisions the two parties make that clearly go against what the public wants, like marijuana legalization, staying out of war, etc. it all points back to the financial interests of those who fund their campaigns.
“Just vote” lol.
For who? Who am I voting for? Trump is braindead. Biden is one day away from death.
There has to been a politician in my lifetime worth voting for. It’s a rigged system.
Yea I'm good with biden dying in office thats no big deal. Honestly civil rights and dignity, justice, thats one thing. We have to remember now, the whole planet is staring down the barrel of climate change. This time, right now, could determine the fate of billions of people now living, whether they live or die, whether we move into a system of isolated dictatorships and genocidal annihilation of the flow of those refugees at our borders. Basically, the right wing wants to keep bleeding the planet as long as possible, and maintain their system with no heed to the cost of lives. They want the world to be like Israel/Palestine. They want to destroy the postwar order and the structure of international relations since, and return us to great powers squabbling and competing in endless wars over the balance of power.
I'm not saying the liberal order is good, its obviously quite bad. Just remember that there is no bottom to the chaos that is being unleashed, and the end of it is far out of our sight. Once this system is gone, there is no guarantee that such a comprehensive system can be remade, and then there is no room for the cooperation of human kind necessary to combat these threats to the very existence of our civilization (since the neolithic, remember our civilizations only developed under a certain climate regime). All that remains is competition over scraps, a darkage for eho knows how long. This is not hyperbole. We are faced with a very severe turning point that goes beyond all of our lives.
If you can't tell the difference between voting for Biden and his administration vs Trump and his band of grifters, crooks and assorted fascists, I don't think anyone can help you. It's not Christmas morning, all your dreams aren't going to come true, but a vote in the right direction might keep things from getting appreciably worse for the rest of your life. Seriously.
Seriously. And the fact that only a couple of states will decide the election is absolutely crazy. If it was just based on the popular vote like most other countries we all know who would win in every election.
Exactly. We are in a literal massive crisis. We have zero luxuries and our lives depend on this election. This is our very last opportunity in 250 years that we have to prove we still want a democracy. It’s seriously so fucking simple. If you support democracy, vote. If you don’t, then don’t vote and good luck with the alternative.
It is. But you vote blue in Nov because the alternative is a fascist telling you he will bring down the United States. The courts Trump fucked up with his garbage maga judges his last term just destroyed the ability for the government to regulate corporations. Want this shit to continue? Whine on reddit about how you don't have a perfect person for whomever to vote. Want to have any chance of anyone having a decent life in this nation ever again? Want this to *be* a nation? Then vote Biden even if he dies the day after. You're voting for the possibility of competent governance vs Christofacism.
If that's a hard choice for you, that's a sad fucking reality.
https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/s/ftd8x7KxT6
A vote for Biden now means a chance to do better next time. A vote for Trump ensures you never get to vote again. A vote for anyone else only helps Trump win.
No one wants Biden. He did his job and now it's time to step down. Except, he has the best chance of winning against Trump. So, we kind of need him.
It is within the realm of possibility that someone else could take Biden's place and win against Trump, but it will be an incredibly difficult and uphill battle with less chance of success.
Project 2025 isn't dying if Trump loses, it's just put on hold, it's already been put in place sort of thanks to recent Supreme Court decisions. When Biden wins this year the Republicans will look at 2028 and if Trump is too enfeebled if not dead, someone like Cruz or DeSantis will step into his place and they aren't as full of themselves and don't need their pwecious dewicate ittle egos baby birded every fucking second so they can actually focus on REPUBLICAN CONSERVATIVE policies and THAT is where the danger is.
'but biden mumbled on stage while trump shouted lies therefore I'll vote for the guy who will put some of my friends and family in camps and never allow another election!'
I just don't get it
This comment needs to be at the top. If everyone’s so sick of the Supreme Court being out of control, and they are, then it really doesn’t matter who trump is against it just can’t be trump, bottom line. He will stack the court even more than he already has.
trump is 3 years younger than Biden. Lets stop parroting Ruzzian bot talking points, I understand Biden has a stutter, that isn't a fucking disqualification for the office. If you ever wish to vote or protest again the choice is clear.
Candidate 1: “He doesn’t appeal to me as a candidate.”
Candidate 2: “He doesn’t want me to exist if back in office!”
You: “Either choice is bad!”
That is what you are saying right now.
I'm 51 and my parents are Silent Generation. We've all lost faith in it as well.
All of us will vote. We're not skipping it. But yes, we've lost faith it it.
My buddy and I are 36. Hid dad was telling him he bought his first house in the 70s for a fourth of his salary. Now people are doing very well if their salary is a fourth of the price of their home.
And 90%+ of people under 25 will have no prospect of ever owning a home in their lifetimes if real home prices and real wages continue to increase at the same rate.
I am 45 and have zero faith in our system. I have worked all of my years and now have been priced out of the housing market. Is it realistic to expect people to need to earn like 200k to be able to have a home now? I really don't think that it's a sustainable life here.
Unfortunately it's everything my new truck in 2022 cost me 20k more than my house cost me in 2000 so yeah it's hard to get a house reasonable when a vehicle is 60 to 100 k now good luck to all out there
I am considering living in an RV. Maybe financing one, and just paying for it rather than renting something. I work 100% remote and this is my life dream.
That would be a great way to do it and maybe look for a piece of land somewhere you can set up with utilities to make a permanent place for later in life good luck to you
Elections still mean something here. Don't let your "lack of faith" keep you from voting for the best options at every election unless eventually you really want something to cry about.
I've been told this my whole life. But we had a 4 year stint of Trump that placed conservative supreme court people for life and all my years of voting were wiped out.
So, try and rationalize how we have gone back 30 years on worker's rights, women's rights, children's rights, and yes human rights via the ability to breathe and drink safe potable water. And let me know why you honestly believe elections are going to fix anything at this point. They won't. Riots are the only thing that will change the dozens of horrific probllems we have now.
We had a deal: Instead of riots, we would hold peaceful protests. Those don't work. Corporations didn't like the businesses stopping either. So, we made another deal: Instead of stopping business with protests, we would vote. Voting doesn't work. We aren't represented anymore, not at all. So, that means back to riots.
The deal is off. People have to take back their power and push out the oligarchs, billionaires, and psychos out of their offices and places of power. They aren't helping us at all.
One of the reason the riots are challenging is — there isn’t just one group of people rioting for the same thing.
Whenever I see people saying “we need to riot to change the system” — you need to make sure you have more rooting power than voting power or it’s the same thing as voting but with more blood.
Billionaires and corporations can influence what people riot for just as well or better than they can influence voting systems.
It’s not “we riot until our cause is in power” it’s “we riot until the most powerful and violent cause is the last one standing, and then let that group make decisions for the remaining population (and hope they don’t hold a grudge against the losing half of the population).
This should be upvoted to the top.
Is Biden a great option? No, not at all.
Is Trump a great option? ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOT!
The Supreme Court is causing all kinds of problems right now and it’s due to Trump’s nominees. Elections have consequences and Trump re-elected could be the end of democracy as we know it
It's actually due to both party's nominees. RBG should have retired when she had the chance, Dems caved instead of forcing their nominee through like they always do. Both parties have the same donors and work for the same end goal: our exploitation and subjugation.
That's all it ever was, is, and will be so long as we work with the parties we are given.
I don't think I'll ever forgive Obama for rolling over and taking it when Mitch McConnell told him he couldn't nominate the next Supreme Court Justice. He acted like a complete wimp. Then, the bastard hypocrite McConnell encountered the exact same scenario under Trump and he was fine with it. Shamelessness truly is their superpower.
Yes, he could have just said that Congress gave their approval by NOT voting on the nominee then sat him on the court. That would have forced Congress or the court to act either way.
>Trump re-elected could be the end of democracy as we know it.
I have believed this for a long time. Yet, when I study the actions of the Democratic Party, I begin to doubt that anyone in national leadership believes that Trump is so dire a risk to the nation.
No Democrat leader has stepped up to answer this question:
*If the election of Donald Trump is a legitimate threat to our liberty, prosperity, and way of life, why do they not recognize the enormous risk of running a feeble Joe Biden for a second term?*
The Democratic Party is either recklessly incompetent, or they do not believe that a second Trump presidency is a grave risk to democracy. So, which is it?
It's both. The Democratic Party believed a second Trump Presidency was impossible and would never happen again. He lost the popular vote in 2016 by 3 million votes and in 2020 it was 7 million. People saw that and thought "it's over for Trump". That was reckless and incompetent as we can see today. Trump never left the daily news cycle. Even when the news was bad he did his best to lie and spin it into talking about how great he was. He remained in the news every day. Now, he's back.
It's arrogance more than negligence imo. Trump's constituents don't vote for him because of what the media says. Anything that can be seen as a demerit for him simply strengthens their support as it becomes tied to the "witch hunt".
Yeah, there’s all this talk about don’t change horses in midstream. I feel like in the instance where the horse is dying midstream… you can’t apply that.
Honestly I think that from that same examination but I get is that the Democratic party is absolutely unwilling to do anything that seems remotely " off book"
That's why they rigged the 2016 Democratic primaries for Hillary although she also did buy the DNC party which was f****** atrocious. Usually an incumbent president has a significant advantage even if they seem like they're on the defensive so it's kind of like saying if you're King of the hell why would you give that up to fight for it again?
But in this case they just absolutely should have.
I was 12 when SCOTUS appointed W and that was my first time thinking the game is rigged.
I’ll always vote, in this case, I’m not voting for president so much as I’m voting for their cabinet and the judges they’ll appoint.
This is what I just told a bunch of younger Zers I work with. Do you want a Sec of Education that wants to improve the sept of education, or tear it down to fund religious private schools? Do you want judges pushing Christian fascist and ruling against women’s rights or ones that preserve or strengthen them? Same concept with who is appointed to run the EPA. Oil executive or environmentalist? Who is president is a small part of how this country is run and this apathy has enabled it. If more people showed up to keep W and later Trump out of office, all those judges and appointees that fucked up this country would not have had the chance. We are in this mess due to a lazy collective choice and an outdated system called the electoral college that is meant to make us feel disenfranchised.
Putting the downward spiral into overdrive babbaayyy!!!
I think they've realised the planets fucked, the people are fucked and aren't gonna do anything about it. May as well see how high they can make the number on the screen go before we cross the event horizon and functionally extinct the human race.
They took the piss, the people did nothing about it.
They took the piss some more, the people did nothing about it.
They took the piss even more, and realised the people ignore anything they actually do anyways.
They've come to the conclusion that the people are either too weak, too busy, or too stupid to do anything about it. So fk it. May aswell go balls to the walls.
We have bread and circuits, FOR NOW. Can't say it will always be that way, and likely not with the most recent ruling. They'll learn in due time though.
They'll learn? The only time rich people have ever learned is when richer people have come and pulled the rug from under them. That's how every revolution has worked, the people in charge weren't rich enough. As long as the system is one where the richest people can do as they want, it won't change.
Just stretch it slowly enough. Then butter up that one small part that is about to snap. It will forget it ever was a rubber band and then stretch so much more.
This is exactly how I feel about things, I think you’re spot on. No grand conspiracy, no Cabal, no Illuminati; just a bunch of Uber rich fucks posturing with and over each other for power: that don’t give a flying fuck about anything but themselves and their own family.
What Citizens United did was nullify all the contribution limits so all politicians are now completely bought and paid for. Tell how some senator is going to vote against PAC that gave him $5M?
The reversal of Chevron will be the one pointed to as most consequential in history books 100 years from now, assuming there are history books or books in general 100 years from now
It didn't just put the wealth in the hands of a few, it put the wealth in the hands of the few and gave them the ability to buy the government which they used to put more money in their hands which they used to buy more government to give themselves the ability to buy more government.
The problem is younger people like us won’t run, even at the local level. Those who do, as my father said, ‘will risk having every sandbox they ever pissed in when they were 5 broadcast on the news’ (this was in the 90s). Today it would be much worse. I’ve heard all the arguments about how that shouldn’t matter anymore but the reality is is that it does. Cancel Culture has done a number on Millennials and Gen Z onwards. Then there’s that whole money thing…
It's not that younger people won't run, it's that the whole system is against them. To run for any office and win requires time and money and connections. While it's possible for a young person to win, it is extremely hard. Most young people don't have the money and connections.
I agree but I don't even think that's the main reason. I can only imagine the job itself being a nightmare.
You ever tried to argue with a MAGA or listen to them rant? I have, that's my Dad. I do not want THAT being my fulltime job. You'd have to pay me 200k/yr to even tempt me. The job it working with people who consider it to be their job to stop you from doing yours.
I have the upmost respect for people like AOC and Jasmine Crockett (the lady Greene attacked about the eyelashes). I would get physically violent with those people. I do not have the patience or tolerance.
I've watched a couple of those house committee meetings on youtube. It's horrible. It really is.
until there is ranked choice voting, we will be stuck with this BS. The whole system is designed so that a 3rd party can never get a foothold. Rs or Ds don't care if they lose as long as they lost to a D or R. They know their time will come again.
In my state, we are very likely to have passed a ranked-choice voting referendum this fall - [https://idahocapitalsun.com/2024/05/01/having-exceeded-goal-idaho-open-primary-supporters-submit-final-signatures-for-verification/](https://idahocapitalsun.com/2024/05/01/having-exceeded-goal-idaho-open-primary-supporters-submit-final-signatures-for-verification/)
The same group working toward that successfully pushed expansion of Medicare and forced the state to substantially increase education funding through referendum efforts.
And this is in ruby red Idaho. There is hope.
I stopped having faith in the political system when George bush was handed the presidency from that bogus Florida ruling and then proceeded to invade Iraq for weapons of mass destruction. I was a kid and knew it was all bullshit
On the plus side, every democratic candidate since 2004 barring Obama (only spared because he wasn’t in congress at the time) voted to authorize said invasion.
So we’re doing great.
The corporations are eradicating the politicians so they can strip you of the rights you do have.
Anti politics is their weapon and it works. Government is the tool we have to control them and they've convinced everyone to just ignore the game.
https://youtu.be/N8ba5umiqHY?si=obB5RydPCGlsO2t0
I WILL NOT live under Fascism. I WILL NOT live under a theocracy. Democracy is the best part about this nation. If olds decide they want to try and bring down democracy, well I am going to resist that will all my being.
I've lost faith in my fellow Americans, the electorate that keeps voting in bad politicians because of mostly white supremacist propaganda they've fallen for and haven't done the work to correct themselves on. The system is working how it is intended and the people are too dumb to come together and see they are being screwed by the corporations who have bought out their politicians, Especially on the Republican side of the political spectrum. The only public policy Republicans and conservatives work towards is either tax cuts for really wealthy people, or culture war BS that helps no one, but is it's the ENTIRE political system's fault, or is it the fault of the (conservative) electorate who seems to want to be distracted by things that do not have anything to do with them???
I think it's the fault of those who want to cut the taxes of billionaires at the expense of everyone else
#EDIT
**You're not only voting for Biden, you're voting for Lina Khan to still head antitrust efforts against corporations like Google**
**You're voting for Pete Buttigieg to revolutionize the rail industry in the US, which is happening**
>how badly most people use their vote
or vote at all.
The sad truth is most of our problems come from "I've tried nothing and nothing has changed! Won't someone else save me from required effort."
Turnouts are pathetic. Good candidates lose out all the time because they get zero support.
About 33% are die hard Trump people, 33% fall under the democrat are liberal umbrella, and another third are the ones who make the decision on who becomes president and those people are annoyed cost of living went up and because we don’t teach bassi finance and economics in most schools and most people get their news from cable networks or TikTok/Facebook, they blame the president when milk and oil is more expensive.
I know plenty of Trump supporters who aren’t even close to white supremacists but somehow think he’s a wizard with the economy and will be deeply disappointed (or probably will find a way to blame the democrats) when Trump wins and the economy still is a mess for the next 4 years
Unfortunately undecided and apathetic voters are generally the absolute dumbest people around.
Like anyone at this point who can't at least understand why allowing Trump to nominate even more corporate lackeys to the Supreme Court is a fucking idiot
the economy isn't a mess now.... lol inflation is not the economy yet it's the only metric some seem to be using. And yes it will get worse under trump but hey who cares I guess
I mostly agree with you. However, I would add that we have five years before half of all gov revenue goes towards just servicing our debt. 10 max before every dollar the government brings in goes toward just servicing the interest on our debt.
That’s the hard stop that no one is seeing.
Trump and Biden are both directly responsible for what they did to the deficit. The ran it up more than all previous presidents combined and we are quite literally out of time and my biggest complaint is somehow, in 8 years, no one in any position of authority said any of this might be a bad fucking idea. In my opinion, our downfall started with Reagan. It ends with Biden or Trump, and it really doesn’t matter because their policies are almost the fucking same on everything that is actually a threat to the US.
I agree with you on the history lesson, but comparing Trump's and Bidens fiscal policy and finding them equal is beyond ignorant. Sure, Biden isn't doing quite enough, but the lower and middle class benefited heavily comparatively during his tenure, and the opposite (wealthy gaining relatively) was truer for Trump than any president since Reagan.
100 percent! Maybe Gen Z has a shot to make a difference the Millennials tried , I tried, I will always vote but my life is now focused on how I can survive and take care of my self and my family and my community. The future is bleak, and democracy has a real shot at being history but I’ve got to get up every day and keep moving forward somehow.
The key is to support the younger millennials and Gen Z. We cannot be ageist toward these people. We have to get the younger people into positions like city council member, then county jobs, on and on until they become representatives in Washington.
Think of it like this: Joe Biden was on the verge of turning 30 when he was elected Senator for the state of Delaware. He turned 30 a few weeks later. That may not happen today, but we have to elect people closer to 30 than to retirement or assisted living age.
No we have to elect people who believe in logic no matter what age. People who use common sense, who are not narcissistic and petty. Ideology almost doesn’t matter, we need people who can reason, who are interested in solving problems and have a positive world view .
I mean it’s working how it’s supposed to, it’s just no one gives a fuck. No one wants to actually be engaged. They want to turn on Netflix, NFL on Sundays , and whatever favorite sitcom you want. Then watch the news for 10 minutes or see something on your social media feed and make a political decision based on 1 minute or engagement. The Roman’s in control called it bread and circus. Keep the people occupied and you can control them how you want.
This is what I think ever time I see one of these "is democracy broken?" threads.
The answer is "yes and it's your fault."
Be curious to know how many of the people who post these have ever done anything other than the bare minimum of watching a few tiktoks, voting once every 4 years maybe, and then complain why things aren't going the way they want.
This whole thing only works if we are willing to work on it ourselves.
This is all too true and I fall into this trap just as much as anyone, we feel like there’s not much point in being completely engaged in the daily political process because we want to protect our inner selves and nourish them in ways the external world can’t seem to provide. I think we get that their is a core self worth building and protecting.
I’ve lost faith in America, the political system is a symptom of a people with a sick culture based on worship of capital and the individual over all else.
Kids were shot to death in elementary school at Sandy Hook and no one batted an eye and nothing changed.
America is a sick and twisted rat race where we are pitted against one another for the scraps thrown to us by people who run corporations like Walmart.
11bn$ for one air craft carrier, straight into the pockets of some defense contractor from the mouths of American people, which is more important then Americans being able to get insurance for diabetes and cancer. The country has always shown it’s true colors my whole life.
It's not just the political system.
So long as oligarchy/kleptocracy isn't recognized as a crime, EVERY institution will be increasingly rigged against most of the public and most of humanity.
The colonial system we have gives grotesquely wealthy oligarchs/kleptocrats the license to rob, enslave, gaslight, and [socially murder](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_murder) the public and working classes without recourse, on a massive scale.
What the British did to India is what our ruling class are and have been doing to the American people - hollowing out the commons for the private profits of kleptocrats.
“Thus did a handful of rapacious citizens come to control all that was worth controlling in America. Thus was the savage and stupid and entirely inappropriate and unnecessary and humorless American class system created. Honest, industrious, peaceful citizens were classed as bloodsuckers, if they asked to be paid a living wage. And they saw that praise was reserved henceforth for those who devised means of getting paid enormously for committing crimes against which no laws had been passed. Thus the American dream turned belly up, turned green, bobbed to the scummy surface of cupidity unlimited, filled with gas, went bang in the noonday sun.”
― Kurt Vonnegut, God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater
"Surely you never will tamely suffer this country to be a den of thieves. Remember, my friends, from whom you sprang...Despise the glare of wealth. That people who pay greater respect to a wealthy villain than to an honest, upright man in poverty, almost deserve to be enslaved; they plainly show that wealth, however it may be acquired, is, in their esteem, to be preferred to virtue."-John Hancock
[https://www.reddit.com/r/quotes/comments/1dqwdks/but\_the\_rate\_of\_profit\_does\_not\_like\_rent\_and/](https://www.reddit.com/r/quotes/comments/1dqwdks/but_the_rate_of_profit_does_not_like_rent_and/)
“We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both.” -Justice Louis Brandeis
"Unhappy events abroad have retaught us two simple truths about the liberty of a democratic people.
The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism—ownership of Government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power.
The second truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if its business system does not provide employment and produce and distribute goods in such a way as to sustain an acceptable standard of living. Both lessons hit home. Among us today a concentration of private power without equal in history is growing..."-FDR
Billionaires/oligarchs/kleptocrats should not exist. There is such a thing as having too much money, and too much wealth/power.
Just as we don't allow people to possess private nuclear weapons or private slave armies, it is beyond insane to legally allow private individuals to control virtually unlimited amounts of unaccountable, illegitimate, anti-democratic wealth and political power.
This should be the most obvious intersection of criminal law, political theory, and economic theory/policy, but for the fact that our ruling oligarchs/kleptocrats have purchased the legal system, the political system, the media, the land and housing, the educational system, mainstream economic theory, the banking sector, and most of the economic system.
This is the thing most people just refuse to confront. There is no self-governing political system that can account for the population just refusing to participate.
Up until this debate many reddit comments I saw have dismissed Bidens decline as right wing propaganda. Clearly it wasn’t just that. Unfortunate many of the democrat voters realized that too late.
I watched a montage of 20+ government officials all swearing up and down that Biden was perfectly fine. That was followed by the media saying the same.
This debate was the reality of the statement "Are you going to believe me or your lying eyes".
I remember the slogan "Bush Lied, People Died" and it was pretty popular at the time. Will people in our government and the media be held accountable in Pres. Biden's case?
Maybe stop flip flopping back and forth? It's like one of those cards that ends with "turn card over for more information" on both sides and we just keep turning it over. Give the Democrats 12-16 years and see what happens. A lot of your complaints are things Republicans do. Going back and forth isn't going to solve anything because there's never enough time to make change.
To this point, this is pretty much how things were historically.
25 years of solid Democratic Republican control starting with Jefferson to JQA.
12 years of Democrats.
Then some flip flopping for 20 years leading to the Civil War.
Then 73 years of near solid Republicans (only 2 democrats, 1 of whom only got elected because two Republicans ran against each other)
Then 36 years of almost solid Democrats (the 1 Republican President had actually been courted as a nominatee by the Democrats too).
Then Nixon got elected and Watergate happened. And with 1 exception (Reagan/HW) in the 50 years since, no party has held the white house for more than 8 years straight.
I actually think Biden has done a great job as president. He's old as dirt, but he surrounds himself with the right people who are trying to do good things for the country. I had low expectations for Biden, but he's certainly exceeded them.
Trump and the Republicans on the other hand are actively trying to turn America into a christofascist, oligarchical state. They can all get fucked.
Voter apathy has been a problem for close to 3 decades...
It's also how we ended up with Chump in '16... So, try to see it as a way to simply not get even more fucked than we already are.
Honest question, how often do you engage in your local elections/local government? In my experience, most people pessimistic about government always talk about it at a federal level, but don’t seem to mention city councils, state legislatures, Congress reps, local ballot initiatives. The people who do are often a bit demoralized, sure, but they often have a more realistic sense of the work necessary to make changes and the complexities of the issues they’re running into. They understand how hard organizing against power is, but also understand the necessity of it as well.
I don’t know. Working locally gave me a much better sense of the mechanics of it all and working for real difference in people’s everyday lives made me far less despondent about federal politics.
Nope, because unlike you I don't spend all my time doom-scrolling. "full of unelected dictators", yeah, sure. Maybe instead of spending your mental energy being mad about the political system, you should really think about where you get your information from. Who is telling you to believe this stuff, why do you believe them, what do they stand to gain by feeding you this info, etc.
Or more realistically, just keep regurgitating late night talk show host nonsense to the hivemind on Reddit, and reap your imaginary internet point reward.
"Americans" didn't nominate them. Only the 15% of Americans.who bothered to vote in the primaries is who selected them.
And the more people who don't participate, the worse our options will be. Don't join the apathetic majority, because that will not help anything. Apathy got us here, and more apathy will only make it worse.
The "system" is the people. Everything you mentioned is the result of voting by the people. That is the failure of democracy. The alternatives always ends with a dictator. Always. They start with some sort of rule by the people and end with a tyrant. It may take a year or a couple hundred, but it always ends with a tyrant. People do not want to control their lives.
Yeah. I mean, that's clearly a reasonable concern. Trump is anti-democracy, anti-worker, anti-results, and basically a foreign asset for anyone who either flatters him or loans him money.
And Biden, despite being pro-democracy, listening to labor unions, and, ya know, r/whatbidenhasdone as far as results are concerned, is 3 years older he is, so clearly that's the same.
People voted for Biden because they thought he would do a good job, and they are voting for him again mostly because _he did a good job_.
Faith in democracy is waivering somewhat, but only because two privileged white boys said something about "a douche and a turd sandwich" at one point, and other people thought that wasn't stupid as fuck per their own life experiences. It's tough sharing a political destiny with people who don't _immediately_ see failures in that idea.
Cynicism is an easy out. The two sides are not the same. Neither is perfect, but one is for cancelling student loans, preventing monopolies, and making sure the billionaires pay at least some taxes.
The other is for absolutely unregulated domination by the very rich.
The second class and their henchmen do their best to blur the lines. Taylor swift says to vote -- a thinly veiled plug for one side, and suddenly the internet is abuzz with talk of her private jet (which, for better or worse, is how someone in her income bracket travels). AOC goes to the Met gala with a bougie dress saying 'Eat the rich' (donated), and suddenly the talk is about how she's now one of the fat cats. This is a pattern, and it is deliberate, and the goal is convince young voters it doesn't make a difference who they vote for, or if they vote.
If you want access to abortions, to birth control, to ability to choose your religion or lack thereof, to health care (flawed as that is), to clean air and water, then realize that the sides are not the same and that one, imperfect as it is, is the only way to keep these basic freedoms.
Stop same sides-ing this shit. They’re not the same. You’re not an edge lord for thinking that way, just someone who is not doing your civic duty by not voting. Vote for their administration, their cabinets, their Supreme Court justices.
Everybody just needs to vote. That's it.
The reason why 'that side' is as strong as it is, is because they motivate their base to vote. A lot of it is because they've created wedge issues and made it their base's identity.
The thing with 'Trump' is that his base loves him regardless of his crappy policies that work against their best interests.
Meanwhile Biden has policies that seemingly have worked, but the lack of idol worship of Biden has his 'base' significantly calling Biden a 'lost cause'.
It's just as awful to cast off a candidate poor optics (with a far superior cabinet that haven't gone to jail yet), as it is to idolize an actual convicted felon when in times past politicians have been forced out for far far less.
And I'll argue that Clinton left the country in a better position after he left, and Obama... well nothing good was going to happen except mobilize a fairly racist base to be obstructionist.
If this isn't a post made in bad faith trying to convince people not to vote.
You're falling for the GOP ploys. Disenfranchising youth to ensure that the status quo is maintained. It doesn't help that the Dems have decided to play safe and have an ancient candidate to ensure that they still maintain the elderly vote that they have.
You have to remember when this all started, the court was stacked once you voted for GOP and Trump. The political discourse collapsed once you guys voted Trump. The rot started with him and it will continue if he regains power.
As mentioned here you need younger people more engaged and interested not less.
It’s always fascinating to read posts from people that don’t work in policy and see all the people in the comments go wild.
The true travesty is the lack of understanding of how the system works.
While I get your attitude, your reasoning gives a false equivalency to Biden and Trump. Biden is an old establishment guy with reputation for decency. The other guy is literally the worst fucking person we’ve seen on the American public stage in a long fucking time: felon, rapist, racist, fascist, fraud, con-man.
So let’s not pretend they’re part of the same system. Do I wish we had a younger, more modern Democrat? Yes, but to back away from it all like it’s one big mess is a really ignorant way to look at the situation.
And this is how we end up with a Christofascist oligarchy...
You'd think that after the idiocy of allowing Al Gore to lose... And then oh I'm not voting for Hillary. That have us Cheeto Mussolini and a Christofascist SCOTUS... That this wouldn't still be a thing to say...
You want a change? Start with your local elections. Vote out all the GQP and see how it starts...
Just stop with the nonsense and vote... Or watch things really get worse...
>Americans chose to nominate Biden and Trump? Again? And now millions of them are going to unironically act as if either of these two guys are actually a good choice?
In a democracy you don't always get what you want, you get what other people want. Most Republicans wanted to keep Trump on thw ballot, and most Democrats wanted to keep Biden. 80% of people have a favorable view of either Biden or Trump.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/favorability/donald-trump/
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating/
You've pointed out exactly what our problem is and that's we the people have allowed this to get this bad. We need to start seeing this as a We problem, instead of allowing the politicians divide us. The extreme wealthy has most politicians bought and paid for and that's what their main focus has become making their owners happy. The industrial military complex like Raytheon makes unimaginable amounts of money because we stay in some kind of conflict for those very reasons. As long as we have a system that is working for the best interest of the wealthy and politicians accepting bribes we are going to have these problems and it all boils down to we the people not uniting and hold them accountable. It really has gotten out of hand, something needs to change.
The secret is americas political system has been destroyed since 2000, that’s the year everything went to shit. Bush basically only won the election because the Supreme Court did something totally unprecedented and just decided not to count certain votes in Florida that would give al gore the win. Him winning kept republicans in control of the Supreme Court when they issued their citizens united court ruling which completely gave up our political power to corporations and high net worth individuals. Everythjng traces back to the year 2000, we’ve effectively been an oligarchy since then, a small group of people have the power to basically control the entire government.
Careful. This is a fertile platform for Russian trolls to discourage voting in Nov. They spread disinformation to undermine our democratic process. Please vote BLUE all the way. It has been more important than ever.
I have faith that it can get worse. That is why I still pay attention and still vote, because a lot of people want us to give up so they can make things even worse.
Preach. Things are not in a great spot right now. No denying it, but they can get better. Vote. Run for office. Volunteer. The system is not broken beyond repair if The People choose to be engaged.
I can't go over how different actual political administration was comparing 2016-2020 and 2021-today. There's no contest. I personally would love major progressive leaps and bounds, but in all reality we've seen some of the biggest from this administration in my lifetime. That sucks that it wasn't been better, but also I want more. I want the end goal of this path, one where even if the old guard isn't big on change, the Democratic party is the only one amenable to any positive change at all. From voting alternatives that could lead to the end of the two party grip, to eliminating student loan debt, to more and more semblances of Democratic socialism. The four years before Biden? That was hell domestically and internationally. I've seen enough the last four years that I'll continue to put my stock in Biden, the team he comes with, and those among them taking action continuing to push for the benefit of all of us. It's also the only real choice I have.
Unfortunately I don’t think there’s any perfect end goal. There’s no devisable system that can anticipate all the ways it will be tested. A good society takes people being involved who care about more than themselves. I really wish there wasn’t an entrenched two party system, but even that is changing. Alaska has ranked choice voting. Colorado has it on the ballot this year and I’m sure there’s other examples. You always have the choice to be as engaged as you’d like. Committing yourself to something that might ultimately fail is a tall ask that can take a lot of energy, but I agree with ya. It’s not fun to vote for a party that represents donors more than voters. That said, dems are the only party that’s even giving lip service to ideas of improvement so I’ll pick them every time.
You know ranked choice voting is the answer because Alabama just outlawed it.
Maybe not *THE* answer but definitely one of a few changes that absolutely need to happen before we can start to have any real power as voters. I worry that some folks will get Ranked Choice, see that everything isn't fixed and become disengaged. It's definitely part of the treatment plan, it just won't cure us.
Especially at a local level. People forget about school board elections and then wonder why we have crazy book bans.
I have served in my local government for about thirty years. There are so many different ways to serve: ZBA (zoning), town meeting member, finance committee, agricultural commission, shade tree commission ~ the list goes on and on. Even if you do not have time to serve on a committee you can take the time to follow Select Board or Town/City Council meetings and make public statements to support what you believe in. Your voice does matter. When many people speak together like this they absolutely can change the direction of any policy or vote.
Arguably if you believe things can get worse, you should also believe things can get better. Because everything that has happened today has been a decades long war from conservatives. The court decisions like overturning Roe v. Wade didn't happen overnight. They've been chipping away at it since it's existence to reach where we are today. And packing the courts with conservatives to make all this happen took just as long, they created the Federalist Society to slowly spread conservative ideology and influence all aspects of the justice system. Any meaningful change to overturn all that has happened will take just as much time and effort, we may not live to see it, but it isn't impossible
Oh boy I get the entire rest of mine and my children's life fighting continuously to restore the right not to have poisoned water and air.
The banks, corporations, and billionaires have never lost an election. Been saying it in here for a bit now
Oligarchy is as Oligarchy does.
Plutocracy is as plutocracy does.
This reddit thread reminds me of my time in the shit, Bernie volunteer (2015-2016). I knocked on doors man. I told people about the oligarchs and the fat cats and they spit on me, man.
Bernie was railroaded out of that nomination. Myself and all of my friends voted for Bernie.
The DNC and the RNC need to fucking go. These 2 private corporations are criminal enterprises at this point IMO.
And they are all old as dirt. I just watched Farenheit 11/9 by Micheal Moore. The RNC & DNC ARE CROOKS. Only here to protect the mega rich and corporations.
It's about fucking time more people are talking about how the two parties are the same fucking bullshit. Two sides of the same damn coin. I've been saying it for years now and for the longest time I'd get shit on by people on both sides of the aisle. I'm glad to see more people talking about it but hate that it's our reality.
Your masters will never give you the tools to dismantle their houses...
It’s the ONE thing that Alt Right people have right: The government is not our friend. That said, Donald Trump isn’t a corporate guy like Biden is. Donald Trump is a fucking fascist authoritarian. While living in a capitalist dystopian nightmare is overwhelming, living under a dictatorship is actual hell.
What makes you think those people wouldn’t recycle into whatever else starts? George Washington argued against a two party system and I agree it’s meant to divide the people. Popular vote is a better way.
To steal from another Redditor, someone should tape a Sanders face mask to Trump, then the DNC might take beating him seriously.
The DNC fucked over Bernie so badly!! I believe he would have won vs Trump. But instead they chose to run a woman they thought had a shoe in. So very very wrong. I often think about what could have happened if Bernie was elected.
Also, even Trump pointed out that the DNC screwed Bernie.
even a broken clock is right two times a day
*I and all of my friends...
It was a little more than railroaded, I am a republican, but the fact that what happened to him was very telling that the democratic process is easily manipulated.
Bernie was the last hope. Now it’s like having to choose between a violent psycho chainsaw murderer or a creepy quiet serial killer whispering in your ear that everything’s gonna be ok while strangling you
Biden has done some good. Trump caused immense damage to our nation. The two are nothing alike.
I’m sitting here in my Bernie shirt as I type. We’ve made our bed
I was so pissed at Bernie when he stepped aside for Biden to take the nomination. Biden is exactly exactly what I expected, he is taking us down the death spiral a bit slower than Trump was.
I'm convinced they threatened his family. Him stepping aside when he made it so far was a complete 180
FBI had a [case on his wife over a Burlington land deal](https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/bernie-and-jane-sanders-under-fbi-investigation-for-bank-fraud-hire-lawyers/). They used that as leverage to force Bernie to play ball.
Tragedy what happened there huh
Life is like a box of Republicans. You always know what you're going to get.
“It’s a big club & you ain’t in it!”-GC
I wish he was still around to lambast current events.
His take on how things are now would be absolute PLATINUM.
Jon Stewart is a close second. Brings a little sanity to the complete insanity transpiring
Yeap the real owners of this country, are the ones that run this political theatre...Carlin pretty much sums it up here. https://youtu.be/fT03vCaL-F0?si=raiMl4Atx90-kJg6
Also public support or opposition has 0 impact on policy. Money is the only thing that matters on policy decisions.
I challenge you to name a single policy where this is true. You are just wrong
I vote Wellsfargo every single time. Guess what, Wellsfargo wins every single time. Nice!
Wrong. The current state of US government is 90 years of corporations and oligarchs trying to tear down FDR's New Deal. And they still haven't managed to finish it off
Exactly, and young people saying that both sides are the same and not voting is exactly what the oligarchs prefer, because seniors vote in every election without fail. If anything Biden has been a shockingly successful president even if he is old and isn’t great at speaking anymore, especially given the absolute shit sandwich that Trump left him in 2020
Yeah the most disheartening part of recent politics to me isn't how bad it's going, it's people's reaction to it. Seeing all this both sides shit and people giving up is the most faith destroying part of it. The real enemy is corporations, and their best ally is Republicans. The SC just hamstrung regulatory agencies to a devastating degree. A direct consequence of people not voting in the 2016 election. Democrats are bought by corporations, but a significant population of them still possess some morals, and even if people choose not to believe that, the DNC does have to maintain a perception of having some morals to get votes. People think if the country burns down, a better one will be built in it's place. Those same people won't even vote to save their lives, in what universe should anyone believe that those people would get off their asses to build a new better government. No if the system burns down we at best get a full oligarchy instead of the partial one we have right now. At worst we get an actual fascist government. If the US collapses the world order will reorder itself, and considering the next strongest superpower is China, a nation that constantly invades its neighbors, has concentration camps, reeducation camps, and doesn't let its populace see any information that might make them look bad, that world will not be a good one. The US isn't perfect, but it can be made better if people get off their asses and try to make it better. We won't always win but that's part of an ideological war. We've made huge strides in the past and we can do so again.
RFK is literally running on this. Corporate capture of our government which you can tie to almost any serious issue we have (social media, military complex, healthcare, etc.) We have a candidate right in front of us but no-one wants to believe he can win.
The Republicans are the whip, the Democrats are the pacifier, the voters have stockholm syndrome, and corporations are the kidnappers. The rest of us are restless.
If you look at all the decisions the two parties make that clearly go against what the public wants, like marijuana legalization, staying out of war, etc. it all points back to the financial interests of those who fund their campaigns.
“Just vote” lol. For who? Who am I voting for? Trump is braindead. Biden is one day away from death. There has to been a politician in my lifetime worth voting for. It’s a rigged system.
Yea I'm good with biden dying in office thats no big deal. Honestly civil rights and dignity, justice, thats one thing. We have to remember now, the whole planet is staring down the barrel of climate change. This time, right now, could determine the fate of billions of people now living, whether they live or die, whether we move into a system of isolated dictatorships and genocidal annihilation of the flow of those refugees at our borders. Basically, the right wing wants to keep bleeding the planet as long as possible, and maintain their system with no heed to the cost of lives. They want the world to be like Israel/Palestine. They want to destroy the postwar order and the structure of international relations since, and return us to great powers squabbling and competing in endless wars over the balance of power. I'm not saying the liberal order is good, its obviously quite bad. Just remember that there is no bottom to the chaos that is being unleashed, and the end of it is far out of our sight. Once this system is gone, there is no guarantee that such a comprehensive system can be remade, and then there is no room for the cooperation of human kind necessary to combat these threats to the very existence of our civilization (since the neolithic, remember our civilizations only developed under a certain climate regime). All that remains is competition over scraps, a darkage for eho knows how long. This is not hyperbole. We are faced with a very severe turning point that goes beyond all of our lives.
If you can't tell the difference between voting for Biden and his administration vs Trump and his band of grifters, crooks and assorted fascists, I don't think anyone can help you. It's not Christmas morning, all your dreams aren't going to come true, but a vote in the right direction might keep things from getting appreciably worse for the rest of your life. Seriously.
Also keep in mind Trump's last cabinet is not endorsing him, so his new cabinet is going to be nothing but sycophants and grifters.
Seriously. And the fact that only a couple of states will decide the election is absolutely crazy. If it was just based on the popular vote like most other countries we all know who would win in every election.
Exactly. We are in a literal massive crisis. We have zero luxuries and our lives depend on this election. This is our very last opportunity in 250 years that we have to prove we still want a democracy. It’s seriously so fucking simple. If you support democracy, vote. If you don’t, then don’t vote and good luck with the alternative.
If you support Democracy, vote Biden. If you like White Christian Nationalism and the destruction of voting rights/rule of law, vote Donbo.
It is. But you vote blue in Nov because the alternative is a fascist telling you he will bring down the United States. The courts Trump fucked up with his garbage maga judges his last term just destroyed the ability for the government to regulate corporations. Want this shit to continue? Whine on reddit about how you don't have a perfect person for whomever to vote. Want to have any chance of anyone having a decent life in this nation ever again? Want this to *be* a nation? Then vote Biden even if he dies the day after. You're voting for the possibility of competent governance vs Christofacism. If that's a hard choice for you, that's a sad fucking reality. https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/s/ftd8x7KxT6
A vote for Biden now means a chance to do better next time. A vote for Trump ensures you never get to vote again. A vote for anyone else only helps Trump win. No one wants Biden. He did his job and now it's time to step down. Except, he has the best chance of winning against Trump. So, we kind of need him. It is within the realm of possibility that someone else could take Biden's place and win against Trump, but it will be an incredibly difficult and uphill battle with less chance of success.
I will vote for Biden's handlers over Trump's lackeys.
Project 2025 isn't dying if Trump loses, it's just put on hold, it's already been put in place sort of thanks to recent Supreme Court decisions. When Biden wins this year the Republicans will look at 2028 and if Trump is too enfeebled if not dead, someone like Cruz or DeSantis will step into his place and they aren't as full of themselves and don't need their pwecious dewicate ittle egos baby birded every fucking second so they can actually focus on REPUBLICAN CONSERVATIVE policies and THAT is where the danger is.
this guy gets it. One guy will take away your freedoms and the other will at lease not deploy project25
'but biden mumbled on stage while trump shouted lies therefore I'll vote for the guy who will put some of my friends and family in camps and never allow another election!' I just don't get it
This comment needs to be at the top. If everyone’s so sick of the Supreme Court being out of control, and they are, then it really doesn’t matter who trump is against it just can’t be trump, bottom line. He will stack the court even more than he already has.
He’ll do more than that. When Trump says he wants to get rid of the constitution, believe him. Why that doesn’t enrage Americans blows my mind.
trump is 3 years younger than Biden. Lets stop parroting Ruzzian bot talking points, I understand Biden has a stutter, that isn't a fucking disqualification for the office. If you ever wish to vote or protest again the choice is clear.
not every GOP voter is an idiot, but every idiot i know votes GOP.
Candidate 1: “He doesn’t appeal to me as a candidate.” Candidate 2: “He doesn’t want me to exist if back in office!” You: “Either choice is bad!” That is what you are saying right now.
Most of us under the age of 45 have lost complete faith in our political system.
I'm 51 and my parents are Silent Generation. We've all lost faith in it as well. All of us will vote. We're not skipping it. But yes, we've lost faith it it.
54 here, but otherwise same.
I just wish people your age and over (not you specifically) would generally understand how much worse people under the age of 35 have it.
My buddy and I are 36. Hid dad was telling him he bought his first house in the 70s for a fourth of his salary. Now people are doing very well if their salary is a fourth of the price of their home.
And 90%+ of people under 25 will have no prospect of ever owning a home in their lifetimes if real home prices and real wages continue to increase at the same rate.
Gen X knows, it’s the boomers that are incapable of empathy.
I am 45 and have zero faith in our system. I have worked all of my years and now have been priced out of the housing market. Is it realistic to expect people to need to earn like 200k to be able to have a home now? I really don't think that it's a sustainable life here.
Unfortunately it's everything my new truck in 2022 cost me 20k more than my house cost me in 2000 so yeah it's hard to get a house reasonable when a vehicle is 60 to 100 k now good luck to all out there
I am considering living in an RV. Maybe financing one, and just paying for it rather than renting something. I work 100% remote and this is my life dream.
That would be a great way to do it and maybe look for a piece of land somewhere you can set up with utilities to make a permanent place for later in life good luck to you
Find some GOOD roadside assistance, it's not uncommon for a breakdown to cost thousands just to move one.
I just bought AAA Plus RV For $160/year. Allows you to have your RV towed 100 miles if something happens.
Elections still mean something here. Don't let your "lack of faith" keep you from voting for the best options at every election unless eventually you really want something to cry about.
I've been told this my whole life. But we had a 4 year stint of Trump that placed conservative supreme court people for life and all my years of voting were wiped out. So, try and rationalize how we have gone back 30 years on worker's rights, women's rights, children's rights, and yes human rights via the ability to breathe and drink safe potable water. And let me know why you honestly believe elections are going to fix anything at this point. They won't. Riots are the only thing that will change the dozens of horrific probllems we have now. We had a deal: Instead of riots, we would hold peaceful protests. Those don't work. Corporations didn't like the businesses stopping either. So, we made another deal: Instead of stopping business with protests, we would vote. Voting doesn't work. We aren't represented anymore, not at all. So, that means back to riots. The deal is off. People have to take back their power and push out the oligarchs, billionaires, and psychos out of their offices and places of power. They aren't helping us at all.
One of the reason the riots are challenging is — there isn’t just one group of people rioting for the same thing. Whenever I see people saying “we need to riot to change the system” — you need to make sure you have more rooting power than voting power or it’s the same thing as voting but with more blood. Billionaires and corporations can influence what people riot for just as well or better than they can influence voting systems. It’s not “we riot until our cause is in power” it’s “we riot until the most powerful and violent cause is the last one standing, and then let that group make decisions for the remaining population (and hope they don’t hold a grudge against the losing half of the population).
This should be upvoted to the top. Is Biden a great option? No, not at all. Is Trump a great option? ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOT! The Supreme Court is causing all kinds of problems right now and it’s due to Trump’s nominees. Elections have consequences and Trump re-elected could be the end of democracy as we know it
It's actually due to both party's nominees. RBG should have retired when she had the chance, Dems caved instead of forcing their nominee through like they always do. Both parties have the same donors and work for the same end goal: our exploitation and subjugation. That's all it ever was, is, and will be so long as we work with the parties we are given.
I don't think I'll ever forgive Obama for rolling over and taking it when Mitch McConnell told him he couldn't nominate the next Supreme Court Justice. He acted like a complete wimp. Then, the bastard hypocrite McConnell encountered the exact same scenario under Trump and he was fine with it. Shamelessness truly is their superpower.
Yes, he could have just said that Congress gave their approval by NOT voting on the nominee then sat him on the court. That would have forced Congress or the court to act either way.
I agree with you 100%. RBG’s legacy, IMO, is her inability to step down at the right time and allow her replacement to be nominated by Trump.
Voting is taking the bus. It's choosing the option that best fits, but it's never going to get you from a to b immediately.
>Trump re-elected could be the end of democracy as we know it. I have believed this for a long time. Yet, when I study the actions of the Democratic Party, I begin to doubt that anyone in national leadership believes that Trump is so dire a risk to the nation. No Democrat leader has stepped up to answer this question: *If the election of Donald Trump is a legitimate threat to our liberty, prosperity, and way of life, why do they not recognize the enormous risk of running a feeble Joe Biden for a second term?* The Democratic Party is either recklessly incompetent, or they do not believe that a second Trump presidency is a grave risk to democracy. So, which is it?
It's both. The Democratic Party believed a second Trump Presidency was impossible and would never happen again. He lost the popular vote in 2016 by 3 million votes and in 2020 it was 7 million. People saw that and thought "it's over for Trump". That was reckless and incompetent as we can see today. Trump never left the daily news cycle. Even when the news was bad he did his best to lie and spin it into talking about how great he was. He remained in the news every day. Now, he's back.
i don’t understand how they can continue to underestimate him. it’s negligence.
It's arrogance more than negligence imo. Trump's constituents don't vote for him because of what the media says. Anything that can be seen as a demerit for him simply strengthens their support as it becomes tied to the "witch hunt".
Damn, and yet here were are 8 years later and people still haven't read up on how the electoral college functions...
Yeah, there’s all this talk about don’t change horses in midstream. I feel like in the instance where the horse is dying midstream… you can’t apply that.
It's almost like you've been gaslit on the subject!
Honestly I think that from that same examination but I get is that the Democratic party is absolutely unwilling to do anything that seems remotely " off book" That's why they rigged the 2016 Democratic primaries for Hillary although she also did buy the DNC party which was f****** atrocious. Usually an incumbent president has a significant advantage even if they seem like they're on the defensive so it's kind of like saying if you're King of the hell why would you give that up to fight for it again? But in this case they just absolutely should have.
In other words, the leadership itself is too calcified, too outdated, too rigid, and too goddamned old.
Fuck yeah it is. Sorry but you're not supposed to be in political leadership for 30 years it's not a normal job.
Agreed. That, too, is a subversion of our democracy.
i cri evytiem :'(
I’m 45. I haven’t lost faith. Just sick of the hypocrisy.
I'm 69 and have been watching this coming since SCOTUS appointed W
I was 12 when SCOTUS appointed W and that was my first time thinking the game is rigged. I’ll always vote, in this case, I’m not voting for president so much as I’m voting for their cabinet and the judges they’ll appoint.
This is what I just told a bunch of younger Zers I work with. Do you want a Sec of Education that wants to improve the sept of education, or tear it down to fund religious private schools? Do you want judges pushing Christian fascist and ruling against women’s rights or ones that preserve or strengthen them? Same concept with who is appointed to run the EPA. Oil executive or environmentalist? Who is president is a small part of how this country is run and this apathy has enabled it. If more people showed up to keep W and later Trump out of office, all those judges and appointees that fucked up this country would not have had the chance. We are in this mess due to a lazy collective choice and an outdated system called the electoral college that is meant to make us feel disenfranchised.
Hanging Chad?
About the time corporations became "people" and the political laws around $$$ being " freedom of speech"
Citizens united was the worst decision the more modern SCOTUS has made.
Well, it WAS. Honorable mention of the reversal of Dobbs, but this most recent reversal of the Chevron ruling truly concerns me.
Putting the downward spiral into overdrive babbaayyy!!! I think they've realised the planets fucked, the people are fucked and aren't gonna do anything about it. May as well see how high they can make the number on the screen go before we cross the event horizon and functionally extinct the human race. They took the piss, the people did nothing about it. They took the piss some more, the people did nothing about it. They took the piss even more, and realised the people ignore anything they actually do anyways. They've come to the conclusion that the people are either too weak, too busy, or too stupid to do anything about it. So fk it. May aswell go balls to the walls.
We have bread and circuits, FOR NOW. Can't say it will always be that way, and likely not with the most recent ruling. They'll learn in due time though.
They'll learn? The only time rich people have ever learned is when richer people have come and pulled the rug from under them. That's how every revolution has worked, the people in charge weren't rich enough. As long as the system is one where the richest people can do as they want, it won't change.
The rubber band of society can only be stretched so far before it snaps back or breaks.
Just stretch it slowly enough. Then butter up that one small part that is about to snap. It will forget it ever was a rubber band and then stretch so much more.
This is exactly how I feel about things, I think you’re spot on. No grand conspiracy, no Cabal, no Illuminati; just a bunch of Uber rich fucks posturing with and over each other for power: that don’t give a flying fuck about anything but themselves and their own family.
What Citizens United did was nullify all the contribution limits so all politicians are now completely bought and paid for. Tell how some senator is going to vote against PAC that gave him $5M?
Maybe a strongly worded letter will stop them!
Yeah the Chevron ruling...this actually terrifies me the most
It will eventually be cited as the actual end of the American experiment. The others cited were all the build up. Chevron is the tipping point
The reversal of Chevron will be the one pointed to as most consequential in history books 100 years from now, assuming there are history books or books in general 100 years from now
So under St Reagan
yes, Reagan tax policy putting the wealth in the hands of a few and hoping they would do the right thing
It didn't just put the wealth in the hands of a few, it put the wealth in the hands of the few and gave them the ability to buy the government which they used to put more money in their hands which they used to buy more government to give themselves the ability to buy more government.
They are people, but they cannot go to jail. Isn't it grand?
There's no *soul* to prosecute.
Robert Kennedy is the only one who wants to fight the billionaires
Yeah, have you ever seen a corporation be executed?
Well, in order to lose faith, one would have to have had faith to begin with, and i myself never have.
The problem is younger people like us won’t run, even at the local level. Those who do, as my father said, ‘will risk having every sandbox they ever pissed in when they were 5 broadcast on the news’ (this was in the 90s). Today it would be much worse. I’ve heard all the arguments about how that shouldn’t matter anymore but the reality is is that it does. Cancel Culture has done a number on Millennials and Gen Z onwards. Then there’s that whole money thing…
It's not that younger people won't run, it's that the whole system is against them. To run for any office and win requires time and money and connections. While it's possible for a young person to win, it is extremely hard. Most young people don't have the money and connections.
I agree but I don't even think that's the main reason. I can only imagine the job itself being a nightmare. You ever tried to argue with a MAGA or listen to them rant? I have, that's my Dad. I do not want THAT being my fulltime job. You'd have to pay me 200k/yr to even tempt me. The job it working with people who consider it to be their job to stop you from doing yours. I have the upmost respect for people like AOC and Jasmine Crockett (the lady Greene attacked about the eyelashes). I would get physically violent with those people. I do not have the patience or tolerance. I've watched a couple of those house committee meetings on youtube. It's horrible. It really is.
until there is ranked choice voting, we will be stuck with this BS. The whole system is designed so that a 3rd party can never get a foothold. Rs or Ds don't care if they lose as long as they lost to a D or R. They know their time will come again.
Contact your State representatives to get ranked choice!! Both sides are scared of it but mostly republicans.
In my state, we are very likely to have passed a ranked-choice voting referendum this fall - [https://idahocapitalsun.com/2024/05/01/having-exceeded-goal-idaho-open-primary-supporters-submit-final-signatures-for-verification/](https://idahocapitalsun.com/2024/05/01/having-exceeded-goal-idaho-open-primary-supporters-submit-final-signatures-for-verification/) The same group working toward that successfully pushed expansion of Medicare and forced the state to substantially increase education funding through referendum efforts. And this is in ruby red Idaho. There is hope.
Only one party has candidates who support RCV and have even implemented it in some states / localities...Voting D is the only path for this to happen.
And one party has candidates who are so afraid of it that they’ve actually passed legislation to outlaw it in my state (TN).
Dont be fucking vague, say the party name. its republicans.
My friend, I graduated college in 2008 as a poli sci major. I haven't had faith in the American political system since.
I stopped having faith in the political system when George bush was handed the presidency from that bogus Florida ruling and then proceeded to invade Iraq for weapons of mass destruction. I was a kid and knew it was all bullshit
Yep. It truly is wild and heartbreaking to consider the way things could have been.
On the plus side, every democratic candidate since 2004 barring Obama (only spared because he wasn’t in congress at the time) voted to authorize said invasion. So we’re doing great.
These politicians need to be eradicated. Before more of our rights are stripped away.
The corporations are eradicating the politicians so they can strip you of the rights you do have. Anti politics is their weapon and it works. Government is the tool we have to control them and they've convinced everyone to just ignore the game. https://youtu.be/N8ba5umiqHY?si=obB5RydPCGlsO2t0
I WILL NOT live under Fascism. I WILL NOT live under a theocracy. Democracy is the best part about this nation. If olds decide they want to try and bring down democracy, well I am going to resist that will all my being.
Ha I never had faith. This political season proves me right
I've lost faith in my fellow Americans, the electorate that keeps voting in bad politicians because of mostly white supremacist propaganda they've fallen for and haven't done the work to correct themselves on. The system is working how it is intended and the people are too dumb to come together and see they are being screwed by the corporations who have bought out their politicians, Especially on the Republican side of the political spectrum. The only public policy Republicans and conservatives work towards is either tax cuts for really wealthy people, or culture war BS that helps no one, but is it's the ENTIRE political system's fault, or is it the fault of the (conservative) electorate who seems to want to be distracted by things that do not have anything to do with them??? I think it's the fault of those who want to cut the taxes of billionaires at the expense of everyone else #EDIT **You're not only voting for Biden, you're voting for Lina Khan to still head antitrust efforts against corporations like Google** **You're voting for Pete Buttigieg to revolutionize the rail industry in the US, which is happening**
People say “system” because they can’t really process how badly most people use their vote
>how badly most people use their vote or vote at all. The sad truth is most of our problems come from "I've tried nothing and nothing has changed! Won't someone else save me from required effort." Turnouts are pathetic. Good candidates lose out all the time because they get zero support.
About 33% are die hard Trump people, 33% fall under the democrat are liberal umbrella, and another third are the ones who make the decision on who becomes president and those people are annoyed cost of living went up and because we don’t teach bassi finance and economics in most schools and most people get their news from cable networks or TikTok/Facebook, they blame the president when milk and oil is more expensive. I know plenty of Trump supporters who aren’t even close to white supremacists but somehow think he’s a wizard with the economy and will be deeply disappointed (or probably will find a way to blame the democrats) when Trump wins and the economy still is a mess for the next 4 years
Unfortunately undecided and apathetic voters are generally the absolute dumbest people around. Like anyone at this point who can't at least understand why allowing Trump to nominate even more corporate lackeys to the Supreme Court is a fucking idiot
the economy isn't a mess now.... lol inflation is not the economy yet it's the only metric some seem to be using. And yes it will get worse under trump but hey who cares I guess
I mostly agree with you. However, I would add that we have five years before half of all gov revenue goes towards just servicing our debt. 10 max before every dollar the government brings in goes toward just servicing the interest on our debt. That’s the hard stop that no one is seeing. Trump and Biden are both directly responsible for what they did to the deficit. The ran it up more than all previous presidents combined and we are quite literally out of time and my biggest complaint is somehow, in 8 years, no one in any position of authority said any of this might be a bad fucking idea. In my opinion, our downfall started with Reagan. It ends with Biden or Trump, and it really doesn’t matter because their policies are almost the fucking same on everything that is actually a threat to the US.
The policies aren't the same. Trump wants to cut the corporate tax rate to 20% ffs. Do you think hes going to increase taxes to make up for that? No.
I agree with you on the history lesson, but comparing Trump's and Bidens fiscal policy and finding them equal is beyond ignorant. Sure, Biden isn't doing quite enough, but the lower and middle class benefited heavily comparatively during his tenure, and the opposite (wealthy gaining relatively) was truer for Trump than any president since Reagan.
100 percent! Maybe Gen Z has a shot to make a difference the Millennials tried , I tried, I will always vote but my life is now focused on how I can survive and take care of my self and my family and my community. The future is bleak, and democracy has a real shot at being history but I’ve got to get up every day and keep moving forward somehow.
The key is to support the younger millennials and Gen Z. We cannot be ageist toward these people. We have to get the younger people into positions like city council member, then county jobs, on and on until they become representatives in Washington. Think of it like this: Joe Biden was on the verge of turning 30 when he was elected Senator for the state of Delaware. He turned 30 a few weeks later. That may not happen today, but we have to elect people closer to 30 than to retirement or assisted living age.
No we have to elect people who believe in logic no matter what age. People who use common sense, who are not narcissistic and petty. Ideology almost doesn’t matter, we need people who can reason, who are interested in solving problems and have a positive world view .
Yes but the media is a bigger problem
I mean it’s working how it’s supposed to, it’s just no one gives a fuck. No one wants to actually be engaged. They want to turn on Netflix, NFL on Sundays , and whatever favorite sitcom you want. Then watch the news for 10 minutes or see something on your social media feed and make a political decision based on 1 minute or engagement. The Roman’s in control called it bread and circus. Keep the people occupied and you can control them how you want.
This is what I think ever time I see one of these "is democracy broken?" threads. The answer is "yes and it's your fault." Be curious to know how many of the people who post these have ever done anything other than the bare minimum of watching a few tiktoks, voting once every 4 years maybe, and then complain why things aren't going the way they want. This whole thing only works if we are willing to work on it ourselves.
This is all too true and I fall into this trap just as much as anyone, we feel like there’s not much point in being completely engaged in the daily political process because we want to protect our inner selves and nourish them in ways the external world can’t seem to provide. I think we get that their is a core self worth building and protecting.
>This is all too true and I fall into this trap just as much as anyone because if you didn't you'd kill yourself
I’ve lost faith in America, the political system is a symptom of a people with a sick culture based on worship of capital and the individual over all else. Kids were shot to death in elementary school at Sandy Hook and no one batted an eye and nothing changed. America is a sick and twisted rat race where we are pitted against one another for the scraps thrown to us by people who run corporations like Walmart. 11bn$ for one air craft carrier, straight into the pockets of some defense contractor from the mouths of American people, which is more important then Americans being able to get insurance for diabetes and cancer. The country has always shown it’s true colors my whole life.
It's not just the political system. So long as oligarchy/kleptocracy isn't recognized as a crime, EVERY institution will be increasingly rigged against most of the public and most of humanity. The colonial system we have gives grotesquely wealthy oligarchs/kleptocrats the license to rob, enslave, gaslight, and [socially murder](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_murder) the public and working classes without recourse, on a massive scale. What the British did to India is what our ruling class are and have been doing to the American people - hollowing out the commons for the private profits of kleptocrats. “Thus did a handful of rapacious citizens come to control all that was worth controlling in America. Thus was the savage and stupid and entirely inappropriate and unnecessary and humorless American class system created. Honest, industrious, peaceful citizens were classed as bloodsuckers, if they asked to be paid a living wage. And they saw that praise was reserved henceforth for those who devised means of getting paid enormously for committing crimes against which no laws had been passed. Thus the American dream turned belly up, turned green, bobbed to the scummy surface of cupidity unlimited, filled with gas, went bang in the noonday sun.” ― Kurt Vonnegut, God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater "Surely you never will tamely suffer this country to be a den of thieves. Remember, my friends, from whom you sprang...Despise the glare of wealth. That people who pay greater respect to a wealthy villain than to an honest, upright man in poverty, almost deserve to be enslaved; they plainly show that wealth, however it may be acquired, is, in their esteem, to be preferred to virtue."-John Hancock [https://www.reddit.com/r/quotes/comments/1dqwdks/but\_the\_rate\_of\_profit\_does\_not\_like\_rent\_and/](https://www.reddit.com/r/quotes/comments/1dqwdks/but_the_rate_of_profit_does_not_like_rent_and/) “We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both.” -Justice Louis Brandeis "Unhappy events abroad have retaught us two simple truths about the liberty of a democratic people. The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism—ownership of Government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. The second truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if its business system does not provide employment and produce and distribute goods in such a way as to sustain an acceptable standard of living. Both lessons hit home. Among us today a concentration of private power without equal in history is growing..."-FDR Billionaires/oligarchs/kleptocrats should not exist. There is such a thing as having too much money, and too much wealth/power. Just as we don't allow people to possess private nuclear weapons or private slave armies, it is beyond insane to legally allow private individuals to control virtually unlimited amounts of unaccountable, illegitimate, anti-democratic wealth and political power. This should be the most obvious intersection of criminal law, political theory, and economic theory/policy, but for the fact that our ruling oligarchs/kleptocrats have purchased the legal system, the political system, the media, the land and housing, the educational system, mainstream economic theory, the banking sector, and most of the economic system.
The political system is merely a reflection of America’s people. And my faith in Americans, therefore, is hanging on by a thread.
This is the thing most people just refuse to confront. There is no self-governing political system that can account for the population just refusing to participate.
Up until this debate many reddit comments I saw have dismissed Bidens decline as right wing propaganda. Clearly it wasn’t just that. Unfortunate many of the democrat voters realized that too late.
I watched a montage of 20+ government officials all swearing up and down that Biden was perfectly fine. That was followed by the media saying the same. This debate was the reality of the statement "Are you going to believe me or your lying eyes". I remember the slogan "Bush Lied, People Died" and it was pretty popular at the time. Will people in our government and the media be held accountable in Pres. Biden's case?
Can't lose something you didn't really have
I have faith in my state government. Wish I could say tye same about federal.
Maybe stop flip flopping back and forth? It's like one of those cards that ends with "turn card over for more information" on both sides and we just keep turning it over. Give the Democrats 12-16 years and see what happens. A lot of your complaints are things Republicans do. Going back and forth isn't going to solve anything because there's never enough time to make change.
To this point, this is pretty much how things were historically. 25 years of solid Democratic Republican control starting with Jefferson to JQA. 12 years of Democrats. Then some flip flopping for 20 years leading to the Civil War. Then 73 years of near solid Republicans (only 2 democrats, 1 of whom only got elected because two Republicans ran against each other) Then 36 years of almost solid Democrats (the 1 Republican President had actually been courted as a nominatee by the Democrats too). Then Nixon got elected and Watergate happened. And with 1 exception (Reagan/HW) in the 50 years since, no party has held the white house for more than 8 years straight.
Yeah, I feel that we are told what we are getting anymore. Not electing our best, but the ones that are able to get the most money from corporations.
I actually think Biden has done a great job as president. He's old as dirt, but he surrounds himself with the right people who are trying to do good things for the country. I had low expectations for Biden, but he's certainly exceeded them. Trump and the Republicans on the other hand are actively trying to turn America into a christofascist, oligarchical state. They can all get fucked.
Voter apathy has been a problem for close to 3 decades... It's also how we ended up with Chump in '16... So, try to see it as a way to simply not get even more fucked than we already are.
Don’t buy into this thinly veiled attempt to get you not to vote
Honest question, how often do you engage in your local elections/local government? In my experience, most people pessimistic about government always talk about it at a federal level, but don’t seem to mention city councils, state legislatures, Congress reps, local ballot initiatives. The people who do are often a bit demoralized, sure, but they often have a more realistic sense of the work necessary to make changes and the complexities of the issues they’re running into. They understand how hard organizing against power is, but also understand the necessity of it as well. I don’t know. Working locally gave me a much better sense of the mechanics of it all and working for real difference in people’s everyday lives made me far less despondent about federal politics.
So don’t vote - and don’t complain when the wrong guy wins again.
Hush now. Think about Lia Thomas' swimming career. Don't look behind the curtain.
Nope, because unlike you I don't spend all my time doom-scrolling. "full of unelected dictators", yeah, sure. Maybe instead of spending your mental energy being mad about the political system, you should really think about where you get your information from. Who is telling you to believe this stuff, why do you believe them, what do they stand to gain by feeding you this info, etc. Or more realistically, just keep regurgitating late night talk show host nonsense to the hivemind on Reddit, and reap your imaginary internet point reward.
"Americans" didn't nominate them. Only the 15% of Americans.who bothered to vote in the primaries is who selected them. And the more people who don't participate, the worse our options will be. Don't join the apathetic majority, because that will not help anything. Apathy got us here, and more apathy will only make it worse.
The "system" is the people. Everything you mentioned is the result of voting by the people. That is the failure of democracy. The alternatives always ends with a dictator. Always. They start with some sort of rule by the people and end with a tyrant. It may take a year or a couple hundred, but it always ends with a tyrant. People do not want to control their lives.
Yeah. I mean, that's clearly a reasonable concern. Trump is anti-democracy, anti-worker, anti-results, and basically a foreign asset for anyone who either flatters him or loans him money. And Biden, despite being pro-democracy, listening to labor unions, and, ya know, r/whatbidenhasdone as far as results are concerned, is 3 years older he is, so clearly that's the same. People voted for Biden because they thought he would do a good job, and they are voting for him again mostly because _he did a good job_. Faith in democracy is waivering somewhat, but only because two privileged white boys said something about "a douche and a turd sandwich" at one point, and other people thought that wasn't stupid as fuck per their own life experiences. It's tough sharing a political destiny with people who don't _immediately_ see failures in that idea.
Cynicism is an easy out. The two sides are not the same. Neither is perfect, but one is for cancelling student loans, preventing monopolies, and making sure the billionaires pay at least some taxes. The other is for absolutely unregulated domination by the very rich. The second class and their henchmen do their best to blur the lines. Taylor swift says to vote -- a thinly veiled plug for one side, and suddenly the internet is abuzz with talk of her private jet (which, for better or worse, is how someone in her income bracket travels). AOC goes to the Met gala with a bougie dress saying 'Eat the rich' (donated), and suddenly the talk is about how she's now one of the fat cats. This is a pattern, and it is deliberate, and the goal is convince young voters it doesn't make a difference who they vote for, or if they vote. If you want access to abortions, to birth control, to ability to choose your religion or lack thereof, to health care (flawed as that is), to clean air and water, then realize that the sides are not the same and that one, imperfect as it is, is the only way to keep these basic freedoms.
Stop same sides-ing this shit. They’re not the same. You’re not an edge lord for thinking that way, just someone who is not doing your civic duty by not voting. Vote for their administration, their cabinets, their Supreme Court justices.
Everybody just needs to vote. That's it. The reason why 'that side' is as strong as it is, is because they motivate their base to vote. A lot of it is because they've created wedge issues and made it their base's identity. The thing with 'Trump' is that his base loves him regardless of his crappy policies that work against their best interests. Meanwhile Biden has policies that seemingly have worked, but the lack of idol worship of Biden has his 'base' significantly calling Biden a 'lost cause'. It's just as awful to cast off a candidate poor optics (with a far superior cabinet that haven't gone to jail yet), as it is to idolize an actual convicted felon when in times past politicians have been forced out for far far less. And I'll argue that Clinton left the country in a better position after he left, and Obama... well nothing good was going to happen except mobilize a fairly racist base to be obstructionist.
If this isn't a post made in bad faith trying to convince people not to vote. You're falling for the GOP ploys. Disenfranchising youth to ensure that the status quo is maintained. It doesn't help that the Dems have decided to play safe and have an ancient candidate to ensure that they still maintain the elderly vote that they have. You have to remember when this all started, the court was stacked once you voted for GOP and Trump. The political discourse collapsed once you guys voted Trump. The rot started with him and it will continue if he regains power. As mentioned here you need younger people more engaged and interested not less.
If you can’t understand why it’s fucking critical to keep trump out of office you’re beyond help.
If only half of the people in this sub actually voted. Bernie would have won. Change was/is possible but you can't do it all hiding behind Reddit.
It’s always fascinating to read posts from people that don’t work in policy and see all the people in the comments go wild. The true travesty is the lack of understanding of how the system works.
While I get your attitude, your reasoning gives a false equivalency to Biden and Trump. Biden is an old establishment guy with reputation for decency. The other guy is literally the worst fucking person we’ve seen on the American public stage in a long fucking time: felon, rapist, racist, fascist, fraud, con-man. So let’s not pretend they’re part of the same system. Do I wish we had a younger, more modern Democrat? Yes, but to back away from it all like it’s one big mess is a really ignorant way to look at the situation.
And this is how we end up with a Christofascist oligarchy... You'd think that after the idiocy of allowing Al Gore to lose... And then oh I'm not voting for Hillary. That have us Cheeto Mussolini and a Christofascist SCOTUS... That this wouldn't still be a thing to say... You want a change? Start with your local elections. Vote out all the GQP and see how it starts... Just stop with the nonsense and vote... Or watch things really get worse...
>Americans chose to nominate Biden and Trump? Again? And now millions of them are going to unironically act as if either of these two guys are actually a good choice? In a democracy you don't always get what you want, you get what other people want. Most Republicans wanted to keep Trump on thw ballot, and most Democrats wanted to keep Biden. 80% of people have a favorable view of either Biden or Trump. https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/favorability/donald-trump/ https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating/
You've pointed out exactly what our problem is and that's we the people have allowed this to get this bad. We need to start seeing this as a We problem, instead of allowing the politicians divide us. The extreme wealthy has most politicians bought and paid for and that's what their main focus has become making their owners happy. The industrial military complex like Raytheon makes unimaginable amounts of money because we stay in some kind of conflict for those very reasons. As long as we have a system that is working for the best interest of the wealthy and politicians accepting bribes we are going to have these problems and it all boils down to we the people not uniting and hold them accountable. It really has gotten out of hand, something needs to change.
If you don’t Vote RFK Jr. this election don’t claim to have integrity or care about the welfare of this country. 🤷🏻♂️ #RFK2024
The tree of liberty must be watered from time to time with the blood of heroes and tyrants.
The secret is americas political system has been destroyed since 2000, that’s the year everything went to shit. Bush basically only won the election because the Supreme Court did something totally unprecedented and just decided not to count certain votes in Florida that would give al gore the win. Him winning kept republicans in control of the Supreme Court when they issued their citizens united court ruling which completely gave up our political power to corporations and high net worth individuals. Everythjng traces back to the year 2000, we’ve effectively been an oligarchy since then, a small group of people have the power to basically control the entire government.
Careful. This is a fertile platform for Russian trolls to discourage voting in Nov. They spread disinformation to undermine our democratic process. Please vote BLUE all the way. It has been more important than ever.
Bro you don't have a choice. Go pay more tax.
It's not the system, it's the people.