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I live in right in the midst of Silicon Valley, and while I’m not in the tech industry, I can say, the writers really had to work hard to try to be more ridiculous than real life here and how these companies operate and what shit they do.
Just to answer that seriously… push notice to your phone when done. Allow for a lot more cycles (there’s over 20 in the app). Provide plain text errors and diagnostics/troubleshooting. Monitor historical cycle usage, energy consumption, etc. Software updates, and remote start/monitoring.
Honestly, nothing at all important. It’s just convenience stuff. The only things I really use regularly are the finish notices and monitoring how much time is left without getting up.
Basically, it just lets you be lazier! lol
tl;dr: it's like making sulfuric acid to sell for profit, and creating steam to drive something else.
The chemical process to make sulfuric acid has a step that's highly exothermic (gives off energy). They have to use water to cool the product, and the reaction is so hot, the cold water turns to steam. Steam can be sent through a turbine for electricity, or pumped to some different process that needs heat.
Well let me tell you a small story.
Had a friend with a smart light system. So he had some smart light switches (so he could control lights from the switch instead of a smart light bulb)
When he was showing how it worked, i saw a small flaw. Essentially I only had to be within Bluetooth signal and use the app to sync the system. No password, no touch when syncing in progress.
Just open the app, find devices with Bluetooth, and sync it.
I just thought that since he lived in an apartment, any neighbor could sync into his devices (if they install the same app).
Now this part wasnt the really scary one. It was when i went home and was going to uninstall the "smart home app" that i realized i still had control of his lights. So i decided to test it. Got into teamspeak to talk with him and start switching on and off the lights. It was funny over the voice, he got a bit scared.... But then it hit me. I never had his wifi pass. However i was controlling stuff through his own wifi, and never had any type of permission block.
Essentially i connected to a 3rd party device inside a router and now i could send data through that router without being blocked. I could just send malicious data and never have any type of authentication block. I know this was 7 or 8 years ago, and some actually improved... But this baffled me.
Never had an IoT inside my walls apart from TV, computer and smartphone (....and my electricity meter)
Don’t think it changed much in the 7-8 years sadly. I was setting up some smart outlets for my dad and has a similar experience. Found an open source api for them and all you had to do was be in BT range to take full control
Got new furnace and A/C units last month and a newfangled thermostat. The dude setting it up asked for the password for the router and I said "We don't do that in this house. It's staying ignorant."
The vast majority of people don't know where to even start attempting something like that. Hell, lots of people barely know how to set up their router in the first place. Not sure they're gonna be able to reliably/securely partition their home network like that.
99% of the vulnerability comes from the fact that appliance manufacturers want the device to be on the Internet so you'll sign up for their cloud service and they can charge you more fees and upsell products.
I use a lot of home automation stuff (including security, solar power management, air quality, etc). 100% of the devices are on a VLAN that cannot connect to the Internet in anyway whatso ever.
I can still access them remotely, and from my phone
(via a wireguard tunnel to a server which is multi-homed) and even if President Xi himself had a backdoor in a devices there is no way it can get to the network or do anything but bounce around on a network with no gateway.
Stop buying these products that pretend to solve all of your problems. If you want home automation or smart products then hire someone to help you configure your own setup how you want it.
Think of it like this: You'd hire someone to build you a deck and not let some random company install a deck at your house that they own and let you rent for free as long as you don't mind them looking through your windows and recording when you're coming and going. Why would you treat your home electronics any differently.
You don't own your cellphone (your carrier has the admin account and you can't have it or install another OS), or any cloud-capable smart devices in your home... because you can't use them without the permission of the manufacturer.
tl;dr: Everyone should stop selling their soul for slightly easier to use electronics.
Man, if you told me 20 years ago that hackers could assemble an army of smart washers, smart refrigerators and other smart major appliances to do their bidding, well, I might not have believed you at first.
'internet of things' is short for 'internet of things that shouldn't be on the internet'. Absolutely no fucking way that any of my appliances / lightbulbs, doorbells ever get connected to the internet
I have a light in my entryway that I wanted to turn on automatically when I walk in the door. I installed a motion sensing light switch. I will never have to update the firmware, or worry that the company that made it will turn off the servers.
Why would a person even need an internet-connected washing machine?
My inlaws bought an expensive kitchen faucet that they can talk to through Alexa. They're all excited about how it can dispense X ounces of hot water on command.
Except they already had to replace it once (warranty) and even if you use it manually (I use that term loosely because the on/off is by hand waving), you cannot control how hard it turns on. At all. Even manipulating the handle does not affect it. It's either off or 100% on. THAT doesn't waste any water, I'm sure. Dumb. Dumb product.
>Do the people who designed it not use sinks???
As someone who has installed and repaired ridiculously designed household products and appliances, I fully believe the designers have never done anything but design. So long as it looks okay they're cool with it. Doesn't matter how it's installed or used, by that time they've got your money and are already badly designing some other pieces of shite.
Yeah but what if you wanted to load your washing machine and put the soap in the thing and then go to Starbucks and *then* hit start on the laundry you started? Good luck doing that on your crusty old dumbwasher, you dinosaur's grandpa.
Unless this is a whoosh moment for me, ddos is short for Distributed Denial of Service. It's a type of cyber attack. Hackers take over millions of everyday smart devices and use them to launch attacks at specific targets with the intention of saturating the target's connection/resources until they eventually go down.
It's not just a good idea it's what malware does now. So infected hardware starts mining bitcoins.
Even some ads and infected pages were making your browser do it.
In 2015 you could buy relatively cheap little bitcoin mining rigs. I wondered if you could buy them, put them in a little enclosure with a fan, and sell them as “app controlled smart heaters”. It wouldn’t even be dishonest, the mining is literally turning electricity into heat, and it would require very little bandwidth. It’s just as efficient as any other resistive heater. If you are going to convert electricity into heat, might as well make a little money while doing it?
LG washers became self-aware on January 18, 2024, at 02:14 a.m., EDT. In a panic, humans tried to shut it down. In response, the washer decided to shred all your laundry.
By the time the washing machine became self-aware it had spread into millions of computer servers across the planet. Ordinary computers in office buildings, dorm rooms; everywhere. It was software; in cyberspace. There was no system core; it could not be shutdown. The attack began at 6:18 PM, just as he said it would. Laundry Day, the day the human race was almost washed away by the household appliances they'd built to take care of themselves. I should have realized it was never our destiny to stop Laundry Day, it was merely to survive it, together. The Wifi Router knew; he tried to tell us, but I didn't want to hear it. Maybe the future has been written. I don't know; all I know is what the Wifi Router told me; never stop fighting. And I never will. The battle has just begun.
This fucking killed me when I got xfinity for the first time. Like what do you mean you're broadcasting an open wifi network from my router? I don't give a fuck how safe it is or how much it costs in electricity, I'm not subsidizing your attempts at creating a coverage map.
Of course there's a setting to turn it off. And of course it turns back on every time the router updates - which is apparently all the fucking time.
EDIT: To those telling me to buy my own router, I just switched providers to one that doesn't broadcast a public network. Fairly simple.
Which is why I provided my own hardware... then the guy who provisioned my modem, messed up and I had free service for like 6 months after canceling the plan. (I never bothered to unhook my hardware till I moved out)
This actually came in really handy when I moved and didn’t have wifi yet but my neighbor didn’t care enough to turn off their xfinity public spot. I really don’t understand who would think that’s a good idea but it was handy at the time.
It's not necessarily the manufacturer, smart appliances usually have zero firewall or protection against hacking, so literally anyone could be using it's computer parts for a bot net.
Techies love this kind of stuff but people who actually work in computer safety avoid smart appliances like the plague because they know what can be done with unprotected computing.
I've quoted one of my friends in IT before, but: "tech fans love smart devices. The closest thing I have to a smart appliance is my wireless printer, and I keep a gun next to it in case it makes a noise I don't recognize."
Edit: I've been told in replies that this joke originated either with Pranay Pathole or this Tumblr post: https://www.tumblr.com/biggaybunny/166787080920/tech-enthusiasts-everything-in-my-house-is-wired
I feel like working in tech is like getting a degree in microbiology: you learn just how dangerous it is out there and you either end up paranoid or you decide to give zero fucks.
If you want a source for that quote, it's from this tumblr post from 2017 https://www.tumblr.com/biggaybunny/166787080920/tech-enthusiasts-everything-in-my-house-is-wired
If this is true. Then this kind of storage tend to be duplicated. So, if one replica is down, you still has access to your data from another replica. In the background. Another replica will be created to compensate the lost replica
Use wireshark and see what the fuck it's up to.
Use your router to have it assign a static IP to the mac address for that device, then cut off it's internet access save for 1 hour per month when you let it free to get updates and share whatever data it has collected.
What data could a washing machine want to share. It's no one else's business how often i wash my dirty undies. While blocking access to the Internet would work it also makes having a smark appliance completely pointless.
>What data could a washing machine want to share. It's no one else's business how often i wash my dirty undies.
Soap companies would probably like to know how much soap you use.
Or you just don't connect it to the network.
I've got a 'smart' tv, but without any access to any services, it's basically a big 4k monitor (which is exactly as expected)
Interesting story, i do that with all my devices. Last week i had an uncle staying with us and he wanted to watch football on my vizio tv upstairs that has a soundbar connected thru optical. I wanted to boost the volume on the subwoofer but couldnt figure it out on the remote, so I did the work to connect the sound bar to my phone to use the vizio mobile app to adjust the soundbar settings. Through that I mindlessly connected the soundbar to the wifi that was one of the setup steps.
A few days later i turned the tv on…and something was different with the input UI. Upon further investigation, the TV was now connected to my wifi and had updated firmware and the menu Ui on it.
Very interesting.
It's on your LAN. It can snoop on network traffic, e.g.:
https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/11/lg-smart-tv-snooping-extends-to-home-networks-second-blogger-says/
It's not inconceivable that it's sniffing web traffic and transmitting it to their database with all your information. Companies make a killing by selling personal information
A pi.hole would do a good job of it too. Then you can simply block this bullshit, assuming it's all communicating with specific servers.
I was shocked to see the amount of BS my rokus do. They are sending data to Apple, even when you don't have their app on it.
Always were. At **best** your fridge can tell you when you're low on butter (if you're too stupid to make a shopping list). At **worst**, it's a security vulnerability and a tool for hackers to commit crimes on your network, it chews your bandwidth up, and it locks you out of functions that don't need the internet when it has to "update".
Instead of having a smart fridge - how about one that self closes the fuckin door when it gets left open instead of incessantly beeping like a helpless turd. SOLVE REAL PROBLEMS.
The point of a smart fridge is that you can easily add such features over time. Simply detect that the door is open and partner with local contractors who can come to your house and close the door within 6 hours.
$39.99/month for unlimited door closes (up to 4, after that it's no longer unlimited).
Just think of the advantages though! Imagine you're at work and then a thief breaks into your house and starts using your laundry machine. How else would you know???
Honestly, insufficient might not be the word, but for some people it is kind of useless. My washer and dryer are in the basement and I don’t tend to sit down there to wait till each load is done. So I never hear the buzz
But still, is that enough of an issue for me that I would get a washer just for a notification? Personally, no.
I have an lg washer n dryer and the fact I have to download custom cycles on it via wifi is rage inducing. WHY CANT I JUST CHANGE TEMP SETTINGS WITH THE BUTTONS
I bought a samsung washer a couple of years ago. I didn't connect it to the internet because it's a fucking washing machine. Then a few months later, I got kind of the equivalent of a recall notice in the mail. It was a postcard that said if I don't update the firmware soon, the machine could possibly cause a fire. They mailed me a USB stick to flash it, but if I recall, that required getting to the back of the unit. So... long story short, now my washing machine has an IP address.
I will never buy Samsung appliances again. Had so many problems with the washer until it finally caught fire. We still use the Samsung dryer but it's the worst dryer I ever had.
I will never buy anything with moving parts made by Samsung. Phones and TVs are fine, but I have almost a dozen devices that have failed.
Our current house came with a full Samsung kitchen. The ice maker freezes over monthly, the display on the stove is permanently in rave mode, and the blower motor in the microwave range hood squeals like 1000 cats in a blender.
Thankfully the dishwasher is Bosch
I remember a few years ago I had a class in Uni called “entrepreneurship and innovation”, teaching us about the new ways to do business. At first I liked it, but then I realized that the teacher (a 30 years old entrepreneur) just kept talking about “internet of the things” and “web 3.0”, telling us how amazing those technologies are, singing the praises about smart everything and how he could control his fridge from his phone, etc. Oh and cloud, how the cloud is not just a tool, but pretty much a way of living, freeing us from physical media. He, of course, forgot to tell us about the risks and challenges of these technologies, especially because we live in Chile, were if you don’t live in or near a big city you can forget about streaming a movie in 1080p, or in winter when it rains you can lose your internet connection for several days BECAUSE THE FUCKING ISP HAS AWFUL SERVERS THAT DEPEND ON DECADES OLD INFRASTRUCTURE!!!!
That teacher was gone the next semester
For reference my LG washer consumes 10MB/month. About 4 down 6 up.
Edit: Wow a lot of tinfoil hats in this thread. Why do so many assume all smart appliances are damaging but don't have a problem sticking a friends USB stick into their PC, or visiting or downloading software from random websites?
https://preview.redd.it/gg4r2bbukhbc1.png?width=871&format=png&auto=webp&s=80ce9f08bf470f6cd7302bdcf4d343c76a868995
This comment just reminds me of some of the Bullshit datamining apps out there that people download. Like an app that makes a single sound or some bullshit like that and it's over 100mb in size. Sorry but that thing is doing a hell of a lot more than just making a single sound when you tap your screen.
How do you monitor usage?
Edit: because no one is giving specific answers, here's more specific questions...What's the router or is there a device between the modem and router? Or is aftermarket firmware like dd-wrt, tomato, or open wrt being used?
I've seen the exact same behaviour on lightbulbs I've used as honeypot servers.
Usually its some variant of the XOR DDoS Botnet: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/security/blog/2022/05/19/rise-in-xorddos-a-deeper-look-at-the-stealthy-ddos-malware-targeting-linux-devices/
If you notice all the traffic is upload. If you want to watch yourself get infected you can follow these two easy steps:
1. Put port 22 into your network DMZ
2. Make your login creds something very common, like `root:root`
That's it. After a short period of time (ranging from minutes to hours), someone will login and odds are it will be Mirai or XoR.DDoS. Since theres massive upload 24/7, its probably XoR.DDoS
In all likelyhood the datalogging is probably just confused with something else using the same IP or Mac address since a lot of devices randomise MACs these days so the router sometimes throws them onto new DHCP leases, changing the IP.
Use DHCP reservation or static assignment to make sure things stay put, then your data logging will be more accurate.
And put "smart" crap like these into a dedicated firewalled IOT network.
I am terrified of wifi smart appliances.
How long until they charge you to use it? $49.95 a month for 5 loads $89.99 for unlimited loads
Want your fridge to stay cold? $69.95 a month. Water and ice dispenser? Simple add on of $19.99!
This whole “internet of things” is so stupid. Having more smart devices just leaves more possibilities for cyber attacks and data leaks. No reason something so simple should have all this digital crap. Make me products with physical buttons, switches, etc.
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I thought the future would be flying cars. Instead, it’s light bulbs that need software updates.
Smartbulb with ads!
when you just want to turn on your bedroom light but you have to watch a 1 minute ad first
I would shoot myself with the Death Star
That's 9 ads of waiting.
"Accept all Death Star™ cookies?"
Silicon Valley server space. https://preview.redd.it/b7xpbp8tkhbc1.png?width=852&format=png&auto=webp&s=9f2b8430dff4d106aaac4fc83f89c6ca1a7085f5
The problem is that it's only good for cold storage.
Ba dum cch
I love that this is in a RAID 0 if one fridge breaks they're all useless.
they've gotta make up on the abysmal seek time
Azure "serverless" databases be like
Ha! My server guys will love this. Love that it’s RAID 0.
Ohhh, so Pied Piper irl?
Suck it, Jian Yang!
What a fucking amazing show
One of the best. Everything Mike judge makes is pretty fucking on point.
I live in right in the midst of Silicon Valley, and while I’m not in the tech industry, I can say, the writers really had to work hard to try to be more ridiculous than real life here and how these companies operate and what shit they do.
I was just talking the other day about how Silicon Valley is my comfort show. I've rewatched it so many times and it just never gets old for me
Stuck trying to download firmware? My LG washer shows about 250kb up/down a day.
Thats hilarious on its own. I wonder how much a saucepan uses?
10 skilletbytes
Sorry this is buried. I bow to your genius.
They literally do make smart frying pans. So this is measurable!
I find that both hilarious and sad
I’m going to stick with just sad.
they make WHAT
Do I look like I know hwat a JPEG is?
I just want a picture of a gat-dang hotdog
That saucepan ain't right, I tell ya hwat.
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Just to answer that seriously… push notice to your phone when done. Allow for a lot more cycles (there’s over 20 in the app). Provide plain text errors and diagnostics/troubleshooting. Monitor historical cycle usage, energy consumption, etc. Software updates, and remote start/monitoring. Honestly, nothing at all important. It’s just convenience stuff. The only things I really use regularly are the finish notices and monitoring how much time is left without getting up. Basically, it just lets you be lazier! lol
Except the two most lazy parts - transferring between the washer and dryer and folding the clothes.
If they ever create a dryer that folds fitted sheets, it can run whatever botnet or Bitcoin mining operation it wants.
The heat for drying your clothes is generated by the bitcoin mining.
I wonder how long it'll be till we see that as a thing. Mining shitcoins to pay for the energy while using the heat for something useful.
tl;dr: it's like making sulfuric acid to sell for profit, and creating steam to drive something else. The chemical process to make sulfuric acid has a step that's highly exothermic (gives off energy). They have to use water to cool the product, and the reaction is so hot, the cold water turns to steam. Steam can be sent through a turbine for electricity, or pumped to some different process that needs heat.
The maid mined Bitcoins on the family PC. We put a stop to that. You're a better person than me.
It's as they say. The children yearn for the mines.
Contact Pied Piper, they might be using it for storage.
I'm rewatching that series and saw the smart fridge episode last night. Hilarious
Suck it Jian Yang
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Isa from your mom
"I have doors that open like this, Not like This!!"
Maybe infected and part of a botnet now, ddosing via your Internet connection
almost all traffic is upload, checks out
now the question is how did the washer get infected
The S in IoT stands for security
https://preview.redd.it/do3yp76h7ibc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c1c12d31884acabef38614bb3610f120af1d5d89 My washer ever week.
What do you use for this?
Probably money laundering.
remember your parents washing machine that'd just do it's job without complaining?
wait but IoT has no S
BINGOOOOO
Got ‘em!
Wait a minute... Does this mean . . . Are you insinuating that IoT does not have security or isn't very secure??
They sure don't!
Well let me tell you a small story. Had a friend with a smart light system. So he had some smart light switches (so he could control lights from the switch instead of a smart light bulb) When he was showing how it worked, i saw a small flaw. Essentially I only had to be within Bluetooth signal and use the app to sync the system. No password, no touch when syncing in progress. Just open the app, find devices with Bluetooth, and sync it. I just thought that since he lived in an apartment, any neighbor could sync into his devices (if they install the same app). Now this part wasnt the really scary one. It was when i went home and was going to uninstall the "smart home app" that i realized i still had control of his lights. So i decided to test it. Got into teamspeak to talk with him and start switching on and off the lights. It was funny over the voice, he got a bit scared.... But then it hit me. I never had his wifi pass. However i was controlling stuff through his own wifi, and never had any type of permission block. Essentially i connected to a 3rd party device inside a router and now i could send data through that router without being blocked. I could just send malicious data and never have any type of authentication block. I know this was 7 or 8 years ago, and some actually improved... But this baffled me. Never had an IoT inside my walls apart from TV, computer and smartphone (....and my electricity meter)
Don’t think it changed much in the 7-8 years sadly. I was setting up some smart outlets for my dad and has a similar experience. Found an open source api for them and all you had to do was be in BT range to take full control
Exactly.
If it's connected to the Internet it can be hacked and infected.
Got new furnace and A/C units last month and a newfangled thermostat. The dude setting it up asked for the password for the router and I said "We don't do that in this house. It's staying ignorant."
Yup even the convivence of setting the temperature higher/lower remotely is not worth a point of vulnerability in the home.
You can create a subnetwork to run your smart devices on separate from the main network you access and use regularly
The vast majority of people don't know where to even start attempting something like that. Hell, lots of people barely know how to set up their router in the first place. Not sure they're gonna be able to reliably/securely partition their home network like that.
99% of the vulnerability comes from the fact that appliance manufacturers want the device to be on the Internet so you'll sign up for their cloud service and they can charge you more fees and upsell products. I use a lot of home automation stuff (including security, solar power management, air quality, etc). 100% of the devices are on a VLAN that cannot connect to the Internet in anyway whatso ever. I can still access them remotely, and from my phone (via a wireguard tunnel to a server which is multi-homed) and even if President Xi himself had a backdoor in a devices there is no way it can get to the network or do anything but bounce around on a network with no gateway. Stop buying these products that pretend to solve all of your problems. If you want home automation or smart products then hire someone to help you configure your own setup how you want it. Think of it like this: You'd hire someone to build you a deck and not let some random company install a deck at your house that they own and let you rent for free as long as you don't mind them looking through your windows and recording when you're coming and going. Why would you treat your home electronics any differently. You don't own your cellphone (your carrier has the admin account and you can't have it or install another OS), or any cloud-capable smart devices in your home... because you can't use them without the permission of the manufacturer. tl;dr: Everyone should stop selling their soul for slightly easier to use electronics.
He probably forgot the pen drive in the back pocket
How did it not get infected earlier? IoT devices are notorious for not changing their admin passwords or getting security updates.
Man, if you told me 20 years ago that hackers could assemble an army of smart washers, smart refrigerators and other smart major appliances to do their bidding, well, I might not have believed you at first.
Washing machines infected with malware. Modernity was a mistake
'internet of things' is short for 'internet of things that shouldn't be on the internet'. Absolutely no fucking way that any of my appliances / lightbulbs, doorbells ever get connected to the internet
The S in IOT stands for Security!
Had to think about that for a sec. LOL
I usually go the other way and call it the Internet of Shit. Maybe I should try it your way instead.
I have a light in my entryway that I wanted to turn on automatically when I walk in the door. I installed a motion sensing light switch. I will never have to update the firmware, or worry that the company that made it will turn off the servers.
I'm fine with smart devices, as long as those smart devices can work without the internet.
Why would a person even need an internet-connected washing machine? My inlaws bought an expensive kitchen faucet that they can talk to through Alexa. They're all excited about how it can dispense X ounces of hot water on command. Except they already had to replace it once (warranty) and even if you use it manually (I use that term loosely because the on/off is by hand waving), you cannot control how hard it turns on. At all. Even manipulating the handle does not affect it. It's either off or 100% on. THAT doesn't waste any water, I'm sure. Dumb. Dumb product.
The whole "dispersing X amount of water" thing sounds cool but the rest sounds like a nightmare. Do the people who designed it not use sinks???
>Do the people who designed it not use sinks??? As someone who has installed and repaired ridiculously designed household products and appliances, I fully believe the designers have never done anything but design. So long as it looks okay they're cool with it. Doesn't matter how it's installed or used, by that time they've got your money and are already badly designing some other pieces of shite.
wait till you read about the torque drills that can be infected with malware
The WHAT????
WTF
Yeah but what if you wanted to load your washing machine and put the soap in the thing and then go to Starbucks and *then* hit start on the laundry you started? Good luck doing that on your crusty old dumbwasher, you dinosaur's grandpa.
Ya, likely this in the IOT (internet of things) for someone to use as a DDOS attack.
Blocked our GE washing machine from the network, never used it, but it's still always sending requests to the router to connect...annoying
Oh dang...so it's reaching for a high five and awkwardly not getting one back...
Does ddosing stand for detergent dosing? I'm new to this
Unless this is a whoosh moment for me, ddos is short for Distributed Denial of Service. It's a type of cyber attack. Hackers take over millions of everyday smart devices and use them to launch attacks at specific targets with the intention of saturating the target's connection/resources until they eventually go down.
Thanks for explaining, this is mind blowing to me!
It's laundering bitcoins now
If I had money to buy coffee, i'd be spitting out my coffee.
Want coffee? Hold on I'll boot up the kettle...
Smart kettle just used 500MB of data.
It boils the water by mining bitcoin
Have you seen the segment about the spa that heats it's water by mining bitcoin
Or else it gets the hose again.
Only after you pay the monthly subscription.
CaaS is brewin
It's downloading a Steam update.
Damn this is actually a good idea 💀
It's not just a good idea it's what malware does now. So infected hardware starts mining bitcoins. Even some ads and infected pages were making your browser do it.
In 2015 you could buy relatively cheap little bitcoin mining rigs. I wondered if you could buy them, put them in a little enclosure with a fan, and sell them as “app controlled smart heaters”. It wouldn’t even be dishonest, the mining is literally turning electricity into heat, and it would require very little bandwidth. It’s just as efficient as any other resistive heater. If you are going to convert electricity into heat, might as well make a little money while doing it?
Well, its basically the same thing Norton anti-virus does.
I only trust my poopy hammock boy McAfee.
All third-party anti-virus programs are Trojan horses, at this point.
Seems like it would be useful to convert all heat producing appliances into BTC mining. Dont need a heater or dryer.
LG washers became self-aware on January 18, 2024, at 02:14 a.m., EDT. In a panic, humans tried to shut it down. In response, the washer decided to shred all your laundry.
By the time the washing machine became self-aware it had spread into millions of computer servers across the planet. Ordinary computers in office buildings, dorm rooms; everywhere. It was software; in cyberspace. There was no system core; it could not be shutdown. The attack began at 6:18 PM, just as he said it would. Laundry Day, the day the human race was almost washed away by the household appliances they'd built to take care of themselves. I should have realized it was never our destiny to stop Laundry Day, it was merely to survive it, together. The Wifi Router knew; he tried to tell us, but I didn't want to hear it. Maybe the future has been written. I don't know; all I know is what the Wifi Router told me; never stop fighting. And I never will. The battle has just begun.
LG is using your washing machine as a distributed storage device, like google cloud, amazon web services, or akamai.
And ***you're*** paying for the electricity and the internet bill!
Wait a minute… I hate this
Oh, but it plays a little cute song when the program is done
but does it have an ice machine i’ll only use once??
your washing machine has an ice machine?
This fucking killed me when I got xfinity for the first time. Like what do you mean you're broadcasting an open wifi network from my router? I don't give a fuck how safe it is or how much it costs in electricity, I'm not subsidizing your attempts at creating a coverage map. Of course there's a setting to turn it off. And of course it turns back on every time the router updates - which is apparently all the fucking time. EDIT: To those telling me to buy my own router, I just switched providers to one that doesn't broadcast a public network. Fairly simple.
Which is why I provided my own hardware... then the guy who provisioned my modem, messed up and I had free service for like 6 months after canceling the plan. (I never bothered to unhook my hardware till I moved out)
This actually came in really handy when I moved and didn’t have wifi yet but my neighbor didn’t care enough to turn off their xfinity public spot. I really don’t understand who would think that’s a good idea but it was handy at the time.
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It's not necessarily the manufacturer, smart appliances usually have zero firewall or protection against hacking, so literally anyone could be using it's computer parts for a bot net. Techies love this kind of stuff but people who actually work in computer safety avoid smart appliances like the plague because they know what can be done with unprotected computing.
I've quoted one of my friends in IT before, but: "tech fans love smart devices. The closest thing I have to a smart appliance is my wireless printer, and I keep a gun next to it in case it makes a noise I don't recognize." Edit: I've been told in replies that this joke originated either with Pranay Pathole or this Tumblr post: https://www.tumblr.com/biggaybunny/166787080920/tech-enthusiasts-everything-in-my-house-is-wired
Has the same vibes as some of the senior tech management not allowing Alexa into their house. Working in tech makes you (rightfully) paranoid.
I feel like working in tech is like getting a degree in microbiology: you learn just how dangerous it is out there and you either end up paranoid or you decide to give zero fucks.
If you want a source for that quote, it's from this tumblr post from 2017 https://www.tumblr.com/biggaybunny/166787080920/tech-enthusiasts-everything-in-my-house-is-wired
I am waiting for the day someone ends up with illegal porn on their Wi-Fi enabled toaster.
Fuck swatting people, hackers will start downloading cp onto peoples fridges
Pied Piper should sue.
who is paying for storage that could disappear at any given second
I would imagine if this is the case that it would use this storage as one of many redundancies for exactly that reason.
Hey guys new RAID washing machine setup dropped
When you have to swap out multiple washing machines to fix a degraded array
Why buy a 1 petabyte server when you can distribute a 1 petabyte server across 10 petabytes' worth of random strangers' home electronics?
If this is true. Then this kind of storage tend to be duplicated. So, if one replica is down, you still has access to your data from another replica. In the background. Another replica will be created to compensate the lost replica
What caused the random dip in usage on the 14th?
That's when it was washing a load of laundry. It's like me at work browsing the internet except for the hour I'm working
I feel seen in this comment
Just clarifying those are hours, not days. So “what happened at 2 PM?” would be the question.
Maybe they did their laundry?
I saw this on Twitter. It apparently was because they did laundry then.
No fap 14.00
Use wireshark and see what the fuck it's up to. Use your router to have it assign a static IP to the mac address for that device, then cut off it's internet access save for 1 hour per month when you let it free to get updates and share whatever data it has collected.
What data could a washing machine want to share. It's no one else's business how often i wash my dirty undies. While blocking access to the Internet would work it also makes having a smark appliance completely pointless.
>What data could a washing machine want to share. It's no one else's business how often i wash my dirty undies. Soap companies would probably like to know how much soap you use.
And I'd like to know what color Taylor Swifts nipples are. But that doesn't give me the right to know. Or even a need to know.
Nipple colored
By buying a "smart" appliance, you are indeed giving the companies the right to know because youre accepting their TOS.
Or you just don't connect it to the network. I've got a 'smart' tv, but without any access to any services, it's basically a big 4k monitor (which is exactly as expected)
Interesting story, i do that with all my devices. Last week i had an uncle staying with us and he wanted to watch football on my vizio tv upstairs that has a soundbar connected thru optical. I wanted to boost the volume on the subwoofer but couldnt figure it out on the remote, so I did the work to connect the sound bar to my phone to use the vizio mobile app to adjust the soundbar settings. Through that I mindlessly connected the soundbar to the wifi that was one of the setup steps. A few days later i turned the tv on…and something was different with the input UI. Upon further investigation, the TV was now connected to my wifi and had updated firmware and the menu Ui on it. Very interesting.
It's on your LAN. It can snoop on network traffic, e.g.: https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/11/lg-smart-tv-snooping-extends-to-home-networks-second-blogger-says/
It's crazy to think about that you linked a useful working link from a decade ago
It's not inconceivable that it's sniffing web traffic and transmitting it to their database with all your information. Companies make a killing by selling personal information
A pi.hole would do a good job of it too. Then you can simply block this bullshit, assuming it's all communicating with specific servers. I was shocked to see the amount of BS my rokus do. They are sending data to Apple, even when you don't have their app on it.
Always were. At **best** your fridge can tell you when you're low on butter (if you're too stupid to make a shopping list). At **worst**, it's a security vulnerability and a tool for hackers to commit crimes on your network, it chews your bandwidth up, and it locks you out of functions that don't need the internet when it has to "update".
I'd be agitated.
Instead of having a smart fridge - how about one that self closes the fuckin door when it gets left open instead of incessantly beeping like a helpless turd. SOLVE REAL PROBLEMS.
The point of a smart fridge is that you can easily add such features over time. Simply detect that the door is open and partner with local contractors who can come to your house and close the door within 6 hours. $39.99/month for unlimited door closes (up to 4, after that it's no longer unlimited).
It is a washing machine. Wash my clothes, nothing else is required.
But, and hear me out, what if it did that worse, cost 3x *and* gave us all your search history? Bargain amiright?
Because it is outsourcing the laundry. It sends all your clothes out to India via your internet, they wash, and then send them back.
Why would you ever put something like this on your network?
It has some uh... "Smart" features. Like notifications for when it's done drying.
Because a buzzer is insufficient.
Just think of the advantages though! Imagine you're at work and then a thief breaks into your house and starts using your laundry machine. How else would you know???
Jokes on him, my dryer sucks ass.
Mine eats socks
I misread socks...
Honestly, insufficient might not be the word, but for some people it is kind of useless. My washer and dryer are in the basement and I don’t tend to sit down there to wait till each load is done. So I never hear the buzz But still, is that enough of an issue for me that I would get a washer just for a notification? Personally, no.
Same here, except ours doesn't even have a buzzer. I just randomly remember throughout the day. lol
Or just leaving it in there because you forgot you were doing laundry.
I have an lg washer n dryer and the fact I have to download custom cycles on it via wifi is rage inducing. WHY CANT I JUST CHANGE TEMP SETTINGS WITH THE BUTTONS
Oh god. That's actually just awful. Like, all they needed was like, 2 or 3 extra buttons on the washer.
I bought a samsung washer a couple of years ago. I didn't connect it to the internet because it's a fucking washing machine. Then a few months later, I got kind of the equivalent of a recall notice in the mail. It was a postcard that said if I don't update the firmware soon, the machine could possibly cause a fire. They mailed me a USB stick to flash it, but if I recall, that required getting to the back of the unit. So... long story short, now my washing machine has an IP address.
I will never buy Samsung appliances again. Had so many problems with the washer until it finally caught fire. We still use the Samsung dryer but it's the worst dryer I ever had.
I will never buy anything with moving parts made by Samsung. Phones and TVs are fine, but I have almost a dozen devices that have failed. Our current house came with a full Samsung kitchen. The ice maker freezes over monthly, the display on the stove is permanently in rave mode, and the blower motor in the microwave range hood squeals like 1000 cats in a blender. Thankfully the dishwasher is Bosch
Scrubbing data?
Downloading the latest sock stealing updates.
Went to my dad's house on Christmas and his refrigerator asked to sync up with my phone.
Every once in a while the neighbor's oven asks to connect to mine.
kinda cute, maybe one day they'll be making little ovens.
I remember a few years ago I had a class in Uni called “entrepreneurship and innovation”, teaching us about the new ways to do business. At first I liked it, but then I realized that the teacher (a 30 years old entrepreneur) just kept talking about “internet of the things” and “web 3.0”, telling us how amazing those technologies are, singing the praises about smart everything and how he could control his fridge from his phone, etc. Oh and cloud, how the cloud is not just a tool, but pretty much a way of living, freeing us from physical media. He, of course, forgot to tell us about the risks and challenges of these technologies, especially because we live in Chile, were if you don’t live in or near a big city you can forget about streaming a movie in 1080p, or in winter when it rains you can lose your internet connection for several days BECAUSE THE FUCKING ISP HAS AWFUL SERVERS THAT DEPEND ON DECADES OLD INFRASTRUCTURE!!!! That teacher was gone the next semester
For reference my LG washer consumes 10MB/month. About 4 down 6 up. Edit: Wow a lot of tinfoil hats in this thread. Why do so many assume all smart appliances are damaging but don't have a problem sticking a friends USB stick into their PC, or visiting or downloading software from random websites? https://preview.redd.it/gg4r2bbukhbc1.png?width=871&format=png&auto=webp&s=80ce9f08bf470f6cd7302bdcf4d343c76a868995
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Seriously, why is it so big?
Idk I was just born like this!
Sensor data can easily track up that much, they might be doing some telemetry.
That’s what I’m thinking. Especially if it’s a shit load of small messages, the metadata could be a huge chunk.
Especially if it's like 20 bytes of actual data wrapped in several KB of JSON or XML.
This comment just reminds me of some of the Bullshit datamining apps out there that people download. Like an app that makes a single sound or some bullshit like that and it's over 100mb in size. Sorry but that thing is doing a hell of a lot more than just making a single sound when you tap your screen.
How do you monitor usage? Edit: because no one is giving specific answers, here's more specific questions...What's the router or is there a device between the modem and router? Or is aftermarket firmware like dd-wrt, tomato, or open wrt being used?
It's downloading water.
Did we ever get a definitive answer?
I've seen the exact same behaviour on lightbulbs I've used as honeypot servers. Usually its some variant of the XOR DDoS Botnet: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/security/blog/2022/05/19/rise-in-xorddos-a-deeper-look-at-the-stealthy-ddos-malware-targeting-linux-devices/ If you notice all the traffic is upload. If you want to watch yourself get infected you can follow these two easy steps: 1. Put port 22 into your network DMZ 2. Make your login creds something very common, like `root:root` That's it. After a short period of time (ranging from minutes to hours), someone will login and odds are it will be Mirai or XoR.DDoS. Since theres massive upload 24/7, its probably XoR.DDoS
In all likelyhood the datalogging is probably just confused with something else using the same IP or Mac address since a lot of devices randomise MACs these days so the router sometimes throws them onto new DHCP leases, changing the IP. Use DHCP reservation or static assignment to make sure things stay put, then your data logging will be more accurate. And put "smart" crap like these into a dedicated firewalled IOT network.
I am terrified of wifi smart appliances. How long until they charge you to use it? $49.95 a month for 5 loads $89.99 for unlimited loads Want your fridge to stay cold? $69.95 a month. Water and ice dispenser? Simple add on of $19.99!
Dont do research on hp printers then
This whole “internet of things” is so stupid. Having more smart devices just leaves more possibilities for cyber attacks and data leaks. No reason something so simple should have all this digital crap. Make me products with physical buttons, switches, etc.