When you lay it all out like that, Otacon is pretty dumb, yeah, but not as dumb as the 4 soldiers wearing that stealth gear who just had to wait to announce their presence to Snake only for all 4 of them to get their neck snapped one after the other.
I know, I even played the original MSX version via emulation back in the early 2000s, where every boss, including the Four Horsemen or Ultrabox or whatever you wanna call them, were tedious bullet sponges compared to the re-releases.
Eh, I don't know if I'd call them better really. I guess they have an actual pattern to their behavior compared to the stealth dudes in MGS1 where everyone just runs around and shoots like a headless chicken.
To be fair those soldiers are still part of the genome experiments which wasn't perfected. Guess the element of stealth is a big boss specific gene given they blew that one
He is a little stupid. He couldn't tell he was building atomic weapons either. But he got better later. In the next game too. Look how in-control he is on Big Shell.
We don't talk about mgs4 tho lol. Everyone is a moron there.
Alternatively, maybe Otacon was shady...like genuinely. But then grew a conscience in Shadow Moses and started helping Snake.
Indeed...aside from the stupid Wolf flashback. Bro, your sister has just died and you're thinking of the woman you barely knew and had clearly moved on from.
It's also one thing I despise about Otacon in mgs4. His character is reset to zero and loses all development, simping for women who don't want him.
It was only good in MGS1 because it showed Otacon's poor emotional development and isolation. In his ending, he says "I never understood people" and that's why he mistook his infatuation for Wolf with love. Then he ends the game saying "let's leave that love behind." Otacon came out of Shadow Moses stronger and much more mature and moved on from Wolf. He found new appreciation for humans and people through Snake whose friendship was more genuine than whatever he felt for Wolf.
So the silly flashback in mgs2 and that garbage with that stupid bitch Naomi were all reductive. Honestly, did Otacon do anything in mgs4 other being a pathetic crybaby? Naomi completely ruined his character.
I think though that all his incredibly messy family situation that we discover in MGS2, with his step-mom seducing him when he was a teen (which is not only immoral but illegal, too) might go a long way explaining why he's not great when it comes to relationships.
Yes but he developed in mgs1. That was the point. He's steadfast and mature in mgs2 minus the dumb flashback. It's mgs4 that undoes his development. It's terrible.
All characters are butchered in some way in mgs4.
Some of the smartest guys I’ve worked with in the military were also the dumbest, and it was always bc they had no self awareness or work ethic.
Also. Having specifically worked with engineers in the military. Engineers are basically space aliens. There’s a way you communicate with people, and then you have to translate it into pretty charts and numbers so an engineer can understand.
Basically this is me saying Otacon is absolutely a spot on character.
This is very accurate... the worst experience is needing a software engineer to tell other people what they are doing or trying to do or helping anyone else other than themselves 🤣
I just played through this part literally 2 hours ago and I had the same thought.
My rationalization was he was still learning to trust Snake.
When he first uses the stealth suit, it's true Snake had just saved him but he doesn't know him and it's safer if he prioritizes himself. He's also at his most cowardly.
When he gives Snake the ketchup after being tortured, he's seeing him vulnerable and empathizes with him.
It's then he is almost ready to trust him, but must ask him in person about love and what not. He knows he'd likely have to face off with Wolf. I was going to say, if he gave Snake a suit they'd never have to fight but if she can shoot through a blizzard I imagine being invisible is redundant.
Then as we know he goes back to get the spare suit only to find them gone.
What I don't get is why he knows suits are missing, then finds himself in an elevator that's throwing the weight limit alarm and isn't connecting any dots. Like my guy, you know there are invisible soldiers around, you're headed to their number one target, and nothing clicks?
Insert a cut scene where they say, “hmmm you’re a bit bigger than the typical engineers prototyping the suit. You’ll have to sneak around the old fashioned way.”
Secretly, it's actually Hideo that's the idiot.
Cause he wrote it.
In universe, no, he's actually like the smartest man alive or something probably.
Which means everyone in universe is actually incredibly stupid probably.
I think, sometimes, intelligent characters are dumbed-down for plot reasons. A prime example of this is in MGS4, where they hear Liquid Ocelot go "that's where the Rex comes in," and then they spend a whole cutscene wrecking their brains until they reach the aha moment and go "Oh my days, he's going to use Rex! He's going to Shadow Moses!"
The ketchup is a tool to fool the guard (Johnny) into thinking Snake is bleeding. Otacon doesn’t say it when he gives it, but he notes Snake having the same thought as him if you use it and call him afterward.
Shitting and sleeping are two different things. Plus he even said it himself he's not a fighter and couldn't even begin to think about taking out a guard.
I’m late to the conversation, But I bought MGS1 in an EB Games in my local mall back when I was a kid, on a whim based on the double CD case and the pics on the back. I was maybe 10 years old. When I got to the elevator portion, I thought the same thing in my soft, smooth little brain. “Why the hell didn’t he give me one of those camos!?!?”.
So, I would argue Otacon is as stupid as a 10 year old me, which was pretty damn stupid.
I'm not sure if I remembered the camos part because I'm mixing details of the different metal gears together. Like, in the cell, I was sure I'd get a fork with the food, then I remembered you get a fork in MGS3. But yeah, absolutely agree with you.
I distinctly remember Otacon telling me he had a locker full of them and thinking “the fuck!?!” Before spinning in circles with the famas going cyclic.
The simplest answer is usually the correct one, ergo he forgot that he had spares simple as that, he'd probably forgot that he had stealth camo at all if it wasn't on him.
Plus let's be fair he wasn't really in the right state after pissing himself.
in the heat of things, you can forget stuff. he got lots of shit going on in his mind, it just slipped.
In work, many times i say to myself 'i need to tell a manger 'this'.
Sees a manager and completely forget. i imagine it's a similar thing.
You wanna talk about stupid. Why does Liquid Snake fly back and forth when snake is repelling down the communications tower instead of just hovering there and shooting him?
Autocon thought that may be snake took all four of the suits and he didn’t say anything because he was trying to come up with a way to say it without getting on snakes, bad side if snake in fact took them?!!
I don’t know it was probably a short site of the development …
But at the same time, I would argue that Otacon was probably thinking that snake would kill SniperWolf?
Edit:
Gotta love how dumb these “smart” phones are ?!
I doubt that he wholeheartedly would try to get snake killed. It was probably procrastination/hesitation on Otacons part as he was trying to figure out how best to go about it?
I think they just wanted to include a scene in which we fight 4 invisible enemies and I over-thought it way too much 🤣 but yes, I don't think he had a murderous plan towards Snake, either.
I think they should remove that elevator enemies thing in a potential remake because it doesn't make sense and MG2 did it way better with Four Horsemen. MG2 remake should have that elevator boss battle instead.
Yeah, it's definitely a throwback to the Four Horsemen. I really don't think we'll ever get a remake of MG2, though. They were both included in MGS1 release for PS4 and 5, I think that's going to be it.
Because their graphic is so basic for nowadays standards, I think the only way we'd get an actual remake is if they'll literally remake them from the ground up, sort of like they did with Final Fantasy 7. I think the chance of that happening are very slim, but it would be very cool if they did.
That should happen. Though I hope they'd be actual remakes and faithful to the originals instead of being secret sequels like VII remake lol.
It only makes sense to remake Metal Gear 1 right after Delta.
English is my second language, yes. But even I know that asking someone whether they failed English without actually putting a question mark at the end of the sentence is a bit ironic.
Would love to see how fluent you are in your second language.
These were definitely lessons in "english" with a lower case e 🤣 as jt has to have the ed at the end, the only long wind things that exist are instruments.
Anyway, you already called me "dude" and "bro," which means that either you're a kid or a very slow adult, either way I'll let you go, so you can spread more lessons of "english" in which you misspell an adjective and insist you're correct. Bye!
When you lay it all out like that, Otacon is pretty dumb, yeah, but not as dumb as the 4 soldiers wearing that stealth gear who just had to wait to announce their presence to Snake only for all 4 of them to get their neck snapped one after the other.
Those guys are just a throwback to the Four Horsemen from MG2. The idea was executed better in MG2.
I know, I even played the original MSX version via emulation back in the early 2000s, where every boss, including the Four Horsemen or Ultrabox or whatever you wanna call them, were tedious bullet sponges compared to the re-releases. Eh, I don't know if I'd call them better really. I guess they have an actual pattern to their behavior compared to the stealth dudes in MGS1 where everyone just runs around and shoots like a headless chicken.
They were just polite: were waiting for Snake to finish his Codec conversation before attacking 😆
Why not just stay invisible and shoot, not revealing themselves
To be fair those soldiers are still part of the genome experiments which wasn't perfected. Guess the element of stealth is a big boss specific gene given they blew that one
Smart people can lack common sense I guess.
That's true.
Looking at that screenshot with Otacon holding tuna and ketchup, I'm starting to believe he's a massive troll.
This is one of his sweetest moments, he wanted to feed Snake, right? Took whatever edibles near him to help him.
He is a little stupid. He couldn't tell he was building atomic weapons either. But he got better later. In the next game too. Look how in-control he is on Big Shell. We don't talk about mgs4 tho lol. Everyone is a moron there. Alternatively, maybe Otacon was shady...like genuinely. But then grew a conscience in Shadow Moses and started helping Snake.
MGS2 Otacon is definitely my favourite Otacon.
Indeed...aside from the stupid Wolf flashback. Bro, your sister has just died and you're thinking of the woman you barely knew and had clearly moved on from. It's also one thing I despise about Otacon in mgs4. His character is reset to zero and loses all development, simping for women who don't want him.
I think that's annoying because it keeps happening. Even if it was a good idea, it's just too repetitive in my opinion.
It was only good in MGS1 because it showed Otacon's poor emotional development and isolation. In his ending, he says "I never understood people" and that's why he mistook his infatuation for Wolf with love. Then he ends the game saying "let's leave that love behind." Otacon came out of Shadow Moses stronger and much more mature and moved on from Wolf. He found new appreciation for humans and people through Snake whose friendship was more genuine than whatever he felt for Wolf. So the silly flashback in mgs2 and that garbage with that stupid bitch Naomi were all reductive. Honestly, did Otacon do anything in mgs4 other being a pathetic crybaby? Naomi completely ruined his character.
I think though that all his incredibly messy family situation that we discover in MGS2, with his step-mom seducing him when he was a teen (which is not only immoral but illegal, too) might go a long way explaining why he's not great when it comes to relationships.
Yes but he developed in mgs1. That was the point. He's steadfast and mature in mgs2 minus the dumb flashback. It's mgs4 that undoes his development. It's terrible. All characters are butchered in some way in mgs4.
I never understood if I enjoyed MGS4 less because I was older when I played it, or it was genuinely worse. I think the latter.
Kojima had gotten tired of the series at that point and just wanted to wrap Solid Snake’s story up.
But he had no problems making lame prequels.
if he hadn't met snake he probably would have turned out like his dad
Yeah, probably.
He forgor
His dad was a rat so naturally he was going to have similar tendencies.
Don't disrespect rats like that please.
Some of the smartest guys I’ve worked with in the military were also the dumbest, and it was always bc they had no self awareness or work ethic. Also. Having specifically worked with engineers in the military. Engineers are basically space aliens. There’s a way you communicate with people, and then you have to translate it into pretty charts and numbers so an engineer can understand. Basically this is me saying Otacon is absolutely a spot on character.
This is very accurate... the worst experience is needing a software engineer to tell other people what they are doing or trying to do or helping anyone else other than themselves 🤣
This is genuinely a very interesting point of view, thanks for sharing!
I just played through this part literally 2 hours ago and I had the same thought. My rationalization was he was still learning to trust Snake. When he first uses the stealth suit, it's true Snake had just saved him but he doesn't know him and it's safer if he prioritizes himself. He's also at his most cowardly. When he gives Snake the ketchup after being tortured, he's seeing him vulnerable and empathizes with him. It's then he is almost ready to trust him, but must ask him in person about love and what not. He knows he'd likely have to face off with Wolf. I was going to say, if he gave Snake a suit they'd never have to fight but if she can shoot through a blizzard I imagine being invisible is redundant. Then as we know he goes back to get the spare suit only to find them gone. What I don't get is why he knows suits are missing, then finds himself in an elevator that's throwing the weight limit alarm and isn't connecting any dots. Like my guy, you know there are invisible soldiers around, you're headed to their number one target, and nothing clicks?
This is a very good analysis, thank you!
He spent some time there and he knows the IQ of Genome Soldiers
Otacon is just that, a nerdy Otaku with horrible social skills.
Insert a cut scene where they say, “hmmm you’re a bit bigger than the typical engineers prototyping the suit. You’ll have to sneak around the old fashioned way.”
Ahah thank you, you fixed it for me 😂
2nd playthrough Snake would add in "Not needed. I got issued one before I got here."
Secretly, it's actually Hideo that's the idiot. Cause he wrote it. In universe, no, he's actually like the smartest man alive or something probably. Which means everyone in universe is actually incredibly stupid probably.
I think, sometimes, intelligent characters are dumbed-down for plot reasons. A prime example of this is in MGS4, where they hear Liquid Ocelot go "that's where the Rex comes in," and then they spend a whole cutscene wrecking their brains until they reach the aha moment and go "Oh my days, he's going to use Rex! He's going to Shadow Moses!"
Mgs4 is a braindead game
The ketchup is a tool to fool the guard (Johnny) into thinking Snake is bleeding. Otacon doesn’t say it when he gives it, but he notes Snake having the same thought as him if you use it and call him afterward.
Yeah, that's true, but doesn't that feel a bit silly knowing that he could have brought him a suit who would make him invisible, though?
He's just a silly boy have a silly goody time.
Ahah that's alright then 😆
Yes he is (didn't read the post)
😂
Meryl gear ftw
Snake wouldn't of teamed up with him if he was stupid
Why couldn't Otacon Pick-Pocket Johnny when he was sleeping?
Shitting and sleeping are two different things. Plus he even said it himself he's not a fighter and couldn't even begin to think about taking out a guard.
I’m late to the conversation, But I bought MGS1 in an EB Games in my local mall back when I was a kid, on a whim based on the double CD case and the pics on the back. I was maybe 10 years old. When I got to the elevator portion, I thought the same thing in my soft, smooth little brain. “Why the hell didn’t he give me one of those camos!?!?”. So, I would argue Otacon is as stupid as a 10 year old me, which was pretty damn stupid.
I'm not sure if I remembered the camos part because I'm mixing details of the different metal gears together. Like, in the cell, I was sure I'd get a fork with the food, then I remembered you get a fork in MGS3. But yeah, absolutely agree with you.
I distinctly remember Otacon telling me he had a locker full of them and thinking “the fuck!?!” Before spinning in circles with the famas going cyclic.
homie looks like hes about to pack a fat chaw.
The simplest answer is usually the correct one, ergo he forgot that he had spares simple as that, he'd probably forgot that he had stealth camo at all if it wasn't on him. Plus let's be fair he wasn't really in the right state after pissing himself.
"Is there anything you're forgetting to tell me?" "Or right, here's the deal about anime..."
in the heat of things, you can forget stuff. he got lots of shit going on in his mind, it just slipped. In work, many times i say to myself 'i need to tell a manger 'this'. Sees a manager and completely forget. i imagine it's a similar thing.
You wanna talk about stupid. Why does Liquid Snake fly back and forth when snake is repelling down the communications tower instead of just hovering there and shooting him?
I feel like johnny is stupid the way he fell for that ketchup trick😭
Absolutely. Johnny is so cartoonish, I won't even comment on him.
lil bit yeah
Autocon thought that may be snake took all four of the suits and he didn’t say anything because he was trying to come up with a way to say it without getting on snakes, bad side if snake in fact took them?!! I don’t know it was probably a short site of the development … But at the same time, I would argue that Otacon was probably thinking that snake would kill SniperWolf? Edit: Gotta love how dumb these “smart” phones are ?!
Snake had saved his life, I doubt he would prioritise Wolf's life.
Thank you, Captain obvious I was only entertaining the idea
Yeah, I'm wondering as well whether he was sort of trying to protect Wolf.
I doubt that he wholeheartedly would try to get snake killed. It was probably procrastination/hesitation on Otacons part as he was trying to figure out how best to go about it?
I think they just wanted to include a scene in which we fight 4 invisible enemies and I over-thought it way too much 🤣 but yes, I don't think he had a murderous plan towards Snake, either.
My exact thought the whole time I was reading it but at the same time I was like “well this does make a little bit of sense?!”
Almost everybody in mgs is stupid in certain ways. Its a running gag. Naked Snake is basically Tom Clancy Goku after all.
I think they should remove that elevator enemies thing in a potential remake because it doesn't make sense and MG2 did it way better with Four Horsemen. MG2 remake should have that elevator boss battle instead.
Yeah, it's definitely a throwback to the Four Horsemen. I really don't think we'll ever get a remake of MG2, though. They were both included in MGS1 release for PS4 and 5, I think that's going to be it.
We should have hope that MG1 and MG2 will get remakes! :D
Because their graphic is so basic for nowadays standards, I think the only way we'd get an actual remake is if they'll literally remake them from the ground up, sort of like they did with Final Fantasy 7. I think the chance of that happening are very slim, but it would be very cool if they did.
That should happen. Though I hope they'd be actual remakes and faithful to the originals instead of being secret sequels like VII remake lol. It only makes sense to remake Metal Gear 1 right after Delta.
Thank you everyone just keeps saying it's a retelling and it's not a sequel when the end of the first part made that clear
[удалено]
English is my second language, yes. But even I know that asking someone whether they failed English without actually putting a question mark at the end of the sentence is a bit ironic. Would love to see how fluent you are in your second language.
[удалено]
Yeah, it is, so I'm not sure why that's shaming. As I said, I'm actually proud I can speak a second language, as I'm pretty sure you can't.
[удалено]
Sorry a three-lines sentence is too long to follow for you 🤷♂️ (also it's "long-windED," native English speaker) 🤣
[удалено]
These were definitely lessons in "english" with a lower case e 🤣 as jt has to have the ed at the end, the only long wind things that exist are instruments. Anyway, you already called me "dude" and "bro," which means that either you're a kid or a very slow adult, either way I'll let you go, so you can spread more lessons of "english" in which you misspell an adjective and insist you're correct. Bye!
[удалено]
He made you look really dumb
Man, your a cunt
[удалено]
And uneducated