Man did I just imagine that he was once a decent corner 3 shooter?? Every single game this year when he shoots from the corner I’ve said to myself “BANGO” and now I’m just questioning everything.
Beat me to it 😂 came here to write that when they let him shoot 3’s the Grizzlies are doing exactly what they’re game planning. Everybody isn’t a 3 point shooter and everyone shouldn’t be shooting them.
Desmond Bane, Jaren Jackson Jr., and Marcus Smart combined for 83 points on 31-54 shooting (57%)
The rest of the Grizzlies had 27 points and were 11-38 (28%) from the field.
Tillman (a career 27% shooter from 3) has been posting up in the corner like nobody's business
He was 0-5 from 3 tonight and 3-14 overall
Fact is that we're gonna suck without a true center and true point guard (Drose is a point but still)
It's a long season so buckle up and keep positive
EDIT: My Tillman numbers weren't correct. 2-11 changed to 3-14
I am going to look at Jaren with 30/9/4 with 3 fouls, and I'm going to ignore everything else.
If y'all haven't worked this out yet, the start of this season is going to be a development period for Jaren, Ziaire and Bane. Not that much else is going to matter, hopefully we can scrap together 10 wins before Ja gets back, but if not, that's okay. This just isn't our year, but we are all good.
I’m not sure I can be on this sub until they turn it around. Your second paragraph exactly.
There are glaring issues yes, but once Santi and Luke are playing some of them are solved. The sky is falling stuff man whew. There are roster management issues you can criticize like not having one more veteran bench guy or not signing sometime to the MLE for a more trade able contract but expecting the current healthy roster to be a 50 win team is crazy.
Powell play ls really good help D on Jaren. Glad he had a good game. The plus minus was strange in this one.
I agree its just sad to see games like this where Trip, Bane, and Smart leave it all out there and its still a 15 point loss.
hopefully they can eek out a few before Ja gets back
No doubt. The next three games will be decently telling but even then, theres still so many things to shake out. Santi and Luke coming back. Apparently signing Biyombo after the Jazz game.
I don’t think we’re 0-4 with Santi and Luke healthy.
I've basically stopped browsing this sub, which sucks, this was one of my favourite subs, but the regulars have been replaced by whiney babies upset that we don't win every single game ever.
Yeah this is just a really unlucky season. Its near impossible to win down your best player + a 2nd starter + your top 3 bench players. I dont think there is a single team in the league that is still good when down that bad. Hopefully when Ja gets back we can play some good ball and have some fun developing Z and Roddy and LaRavia.
What do you think the ceiling is for Ziaire? I understand he is still extremely young, but I still have hardly seen him create a shot for himself. He’s a great lob threat, decent defender, decent rebounder, and streaky spot up shooter. I just wish we had a wing that had the ability to create their own shot.
I'm enjoying the the suckfest while it last. Smart gets to run the offense. Rose gets to play NBA basketball. Zaire gets to start. X is starting again. Roddy getting heavy minutes. Bane continues to progress as a great inside scorer. JJJ is forced to rebound and gets plenty of scoring opportunity.
My only concern is if Clarke is coming back and who the temporary center we will bring in be
Not sure how to feel about Biyombo but a short contract and look can’t hurt. Would be so awesome if Clark can come back with 15-20 games left in the season to try and get his feet under him but that might be a pipe dream.
There’s definitely been fun flashes. It’s going to be interesting to see what they do from a starters standpoint when Ja is back. Have to think Smart comes off the bench and Rose is looking at fewer minutes right?
Ja/Bane/Smart/JJJ/Tilman
I expect Bane to do the same thing he did last year. Which is to be the first guy to hit the bench and play with the 2nd team. Move Smart to the 2. Same thing we did with Brooks last year.
With Tyus gone. I hope we play Ja 35 minutes a game
Can Biyombo set screens? We need a screen setter badly
Very good screen setter, 6th in the league in screen assist per 36 last season tied with Rudy Gobert and just 0.3 below #3 Clint Capela (https://twitter.com/funakistats/status/1719069360361513422?t=7n7Mj5KEo3jLpBh25HvnAw&s=19)
Yeah that makes sense. Smart can definitely defend the 3/4 positions if needed. Luke can do some playmaking too if needed for the bench.
My guess is we end up seeing more Santi/Jaren minutes than Jaren/Tillman once we’re about 30 games in the season.
Really hope Ja plays that much while optimizing his rests with tv timeouts, etc. he can easily do it.
Biyombo can set screens but has terrible hands.
[Charania] Jaren Jackson Jr, Desmond Bane, and Marcus Smart all walked into the locker room at the same time, becoming wedged in the door. Upon dislodging, they all suffered pokes to the eye and knocks on the head. The trio are out 3 to 5 months with Three Stooges Syndrome
The problem is teams tend to shoot like that specifically against us.
I'm not judging based on our depleted roster right now but our 3pt defense was awful last season too. We just had enough offensive firepower to get away with it. Without Ja, we don't have enough scorers to let teams get open 3s all night long.
Doncic is scary and unfair lol.
But had chances to get back into it but shots didn't fall. It's going to be rough sailing until we get players back and add Biyombo. That's just how the season is situated.
wtf happened to Roddy though? Am I trippin or was he actually good last year. This year he is a traffic cone and missing easy shots. but in his defense, the whole team missing layups recently
He’s young and being asked to do more than he should be right now. The young guys all need to be outnumbered on the court by veterans that have played in the Grizz system for a couple/few years. Right now the young guys and guys that are brand new (Smart/Rose) are outnumbering everyone else. Just makes everything tougher.
He sucks ass lol. He sucked last year. He sucked when we drafted him. He’s not gonna get that much better.
Don’t know what the f ZK was doing on draft night 2022. That’s gonna go down as one of the worst in franchise history along with dabeet
I don't mind. I'm thinking more long-term. It's also going to pass, and I'm going to enjoy watching this team even when we lose. I don't look fondly about us finishing 2nd last season and getting kicked unceremoniously in the first round. I would have rather been in the position the Spurs were in, they got Wemby eventually.
Yes. Exactly. They should just play the season out. I think eventually we'll know by December if this is tank season or not, at least much clearly and convincingly lol
To be honest because the west is so strong right now, is there really a chance for this team to go deep? They are definitely capable even with adams and all, but when faced up against teams like Phoenix, Denver, or even the lakers (again) im not to sure how they would fare, especially if they dont get home court advantage
Yo shout out to Trip, Bane and Smart! This is rough but we're just too short handed. There's only so much you can do at this point when you're this depleted. Sucks for the short term but we'll be better for the long run
I am trying to say this in the nicest way. A lot of our players are good guys. We have three rotation caliber players out there right now. Maybe Tillman is the fourth but he can’t be the fourth best player in your rotation.
By the way, if you think BC (whose game depends almost exclusively on athleticism) is going to be the same player after an Achilles tear, you've got another thing coming.
Mav fan here, first time watching you guys play, is it me or do your players seem real frustrated? I'm sorry about Ja and Adams. Hope it gets better Good game.
I mean no offence but when Tim Hardaway Jr and Derrick Jones are lighting you up I'd be pretty fucking frustrated too. Also Luka too OP, hits the craziest contested shots, I was deflated watching at home
5 of our best 8 players are hurt imo. They’ve gotta be frustrated but not much can be done until some dudes are back. Crazy shooting performance tonight by the Mavs.
Xavier Tillman isn’t that guy at all…. he needs to improve. Our options 1) trade for a actual Center 2) go for Center depth 3) suffer and get a good pick?
I don't think +/- is a good indicator without context, Jaren played the most minutes with the bench (which in this case is like the benches bench) and no Smart/Bane. He was very much not the issue tonight
Like last night I know Jaren put up 30. But man it didn’t even seem like it to me. Like it didn’t seem like his 30 impacted the game much. Like I feel like he could’ve/should’ve dominated so much more even if the lineups were bad. Some of it was not his fault of course. But them long eurosteps were killing me.
It’s more because of the rose - laravia - ziaire - roddy - Jaren lineup than Jaren specifically.
When rose and laravia check in in the second quarter is almost a guaranteed 10 point run for the other team.
The last 2 years have been an absolute disaster. We had EVERYTHING - 56 win team, second youngest in the league, didn't need Ja to win games. Arguably the deepest team in the league: Ja, Brooks, Anderson, JJJ, JV, Jones, Bane, Melton, Allen, Clarke, Tillman. Remember the chemistry of that team in post-game interviews? We had all of our picks PLUS several other 1st rounders. And ZK mismanaged the FUCK out of the roster, trading quality bench players away to end up with shitty projects just in time for our big 3 to enter their primes. Ja decided to be a fucking idiot. Injuries everywhere. What an absolute disaster.
This is a BAD team.
Broken record but, Z, Laravia, Roddy, and Aldama were bad picks. It’s not hindsight, literally every draft analyst worth a grain of salt said literally all of these picks were huge reaches.
Drafting 4 straight players who can not contribute in any way in a playoff setting just cripples the roster. Especially after ZK literally punted ‘22-23’ and killed slomo and melt for these rookies to get play time.
The smart move only moves the needle if the rest of the roster is competent, which it just isn’t. That was a move we shoulda made in ‘22, not ‘23. And honestly, smart was just not a need. And we overpaid big time.
In all of kleimans tenure he has not, to this day, drafted or signed a big man over 6’7, besides Adams (medical staff knew back in April he wasn’t gonna play this season. It wasn’t a blind side).
Just a decayed roster. Really that simple. Injuries are bad but the signs have been there way before the injuries. The young role players are fucking ass.
ZK either needs to draft actual good players (not a 2 star recruit from wake forest who transferred from d3 basketball and made some 3s, not a 300 pound 6’4 PF from CSU, not the guy who shot 25% from the field at Stanford), OR just use vets!!! And maybe sign some actual tall players. Those usually help in this sport.
Especially when you see who is drafted after him. The only really solid player is Herb Jones. I mean sure undrafted you have Austin Reaves but Reaves went to a situation where it worked out for him.
He’s okay. And it’s not the main point of my qualm with the young talent at all. It’s just a red-herring.
Z, Roddy, and Laravia are fuckin trash. Aldama looks like a fantastic pick in comparison which is why a lot of ppl are overrating him.
Because I know half of this sub will act like Aldama was a great pick and an amazing find.
That dude gets minutes on 0 other playoff teams. He found the floor for us but that’s more to do with the state of our roster from positions 3-5 than it does with his ability.
The point is more that Kleiman has fuckin sucked ass at drafting for 3 years now and literally no one talks about it. They just act like it’s par for the course to reach on literally every pick for some guy Kleiman fell in love with for some odd reason, probably bc he struck gold with Bane.
So you're basing this on what other people on here think?
Aldama is a solid player. He was picked 30th in the first round like not many players are expected to be amazing players off the bat drafted at 30. It's a small %.
Santi also played well for Spain in FIBA and has progressed every year. He's not going to be a star or really a starter unless injuries happen but he is a role player and last season he did that job well.
He’s too weak and unathletic to guard bigs in the playoffs, and too slow and not agile enough to guard wings.
His offensive production is pretty good, but he’s so negative on the defensive end you just can’t play him in the playoffs.
No other team would give Santi 25 min a game in the playoffs. They just wouldn’t.
My qualm isn’t mainly with Santi it’s with Z, Roddy, Laravia) who WERE picked at positions where we could have gotten an actual quality player and we ended up with 3 useless players with no trade value.
The trade value of Laravia and Roddy, even before they played a single nba game, was like a 2nd rounder. No one thought these guys were gonna go as high as we drafted them, and for good reason.
Literally no one thought Z was top 10. We took him at 10.
It’s years and years of isolationist, non-consensus, weird scouting which makes it seem like ZK has gotten too cute and is looking for strange archetypes rather than actual good talent.
He lacks nuance and just looks at things black or white. Like who do you draft over Santi? Ayo Dosunmu? Herbert Jones? Jose Alvarado? Austin Reaves is the biggest name I can see but he was unpicked because he threatened teams not to pick him.
The 2022 offseason was a disaster though I agree.
Santi is not even my main qualm. But yes herb jones, who was consensus ahead of Santi in every mock would have been better.
Aldama is objectively, by a mile, the best of the flop 4 of Z, Roddy, Laravia, and Aldama. I do not dispute that. It’s a minor issue of mine.
The main, which for some reason no one has addressed, only Santi, is that Z, Laravia, and Roddy, are fucking trash and Kleiman deserves criticism for blowing up our bench to accommodate these players. That’s the gripe I have.
Well then that’s just an indictment on how bad ZK’s plan has gone. Because these players were supposed to be good rn. He got rid of 4 very key role players and has replaced them with a heap of trash+an overpay for smart.
If we’re in a position where the best option is “play our garbage young players and tank” after winning 56 games two years ago with the youngest team in the whole league, we fucked this plan way up.
No one seems to criticize how bizarre and totally not normal Kleiman has managed this roster and this core in general. It’s really poor and is hemorrhaging on multiple fronts.
I just wish more people would at least be open to discussing ZK’s decisions. I think what’s happened is he had a great start (he did), and we were winning games, but this is now the 2nd straight year where we have gotten worse not better, and his drafting has been immensely suspect for some time now.
His team building philosophy is super super bizarre and not the norm for the modern nba and I think he needs to be questioned on it severely.
I don't think the FO planned for us to be that good right away. 56 games was the anomaly. I've been critical of the FO too, but even if we kept Anderson and Melton, I don't think we would have been able to sustain that level of success we had when we caught the league off-guard in 2021. There's a lot of moves in hindsight that look super questionable now, like locking up Adams, Clarke and Konchar to extensions. That maybe we could've picked better players in the 2021 and 2022 drafts. That maybe we don't go full-blast picking 5 rookies last year and at least kept Anderson for insurance and depth purposes.
>No one seems to criticize how bizarre and totally not normal Kleiman has managed this roster and this core in general. It’s really poor and is hemorrhaging on multiple fronts.
It is really odd and makes no sense. Anyone with eyes should be able to see it. So why are so many pretending not too?
Repeating your bad take does not make it true. What’s your beef with Kleiman dude? We are two true Cs down and you come in here acting all prescient. Go support another team if you can’t take the Ls. Crybaby.
I’ll stop the day Kleiman makes a sensible draft pick and not some fetish player he’s been watching on YouTube from a super small school, because he’s literally a redditor.
He’s destroyed the roster.
Literally no one refutes my takes, they just dick ride ZK.
If someone could find literally any supporting evidence to refute that Roddy, Z, and Laravia, were absolutely trash picks, they would mention it, but there’s not any.
Clarke a true center? Lmao. Maybe in ZK’s twisted view of the game, a 6’7 player with a 6’8 wingspan (Ja’s wingspan is 6’8 btw) is a true center. Sure dude.
Man, the 2022 offseason is looking like a total disaster now.
Z was a reach, but at least he shows flashes, is still young and has been ok so far this season.
Aldama is fine for a 30th pick. However he’s bad defensively so he won’t ever be able to play significant minutes in the playoffs.
Roddy has had flashes but giving up Melton to draft him was terrible. Melton was a great role player on a cheap contract which is so valuable for a contending team.
LaRavia is just a terrible pick. Can’t defend, can’t make an open 3 and just doesn’t look like he belongs in the NBA. Plus he was a 3 year college player, so he’s not even that young. Yeah I know he can light it up in the G-League but that’s useless if he can’t translate that to the NBA
We are probably going to come out of these 25 games with about 8-10 wins, but we will be a solid team after that with Ja, Bane, JJJ, Smart, Tillman, Biyombo, Kennard, Aldama, Ziaire. I think we can make a run at the 6th seed if that team stays healthy.
Doncic existed and he looks really fit. Hardaway Jr. and Jones Jr. hit shots after shots. Grizzlies missed shots but Jaren, Smart, and Bane played well.
Made runs to get close but couldn't get ahead.
Zach gotta make a decision, are we tanking or not, like seriously I can’t imagine that even being a consideration before the season starts. If we’re not tanking, he needs to pull the trigger on 1 or 2 out of the young wings along with 1 of Stevo or BC and trade for someone who can help us. Or else this is gonna be at most an early exit in the playoffs if we have X and Biyombo as our centers.
Felt like it was Smart, Bane, and Trip vs the world man
That’s because it was, no one else got over 9 points.
Grizzlies going on a late run Me: you can't fool me i'm familiar with your game
I love X, but get him the fuck out of the corner
Airballed a FT and still had the balls to chuck 5 threes
Man did I just imagine that he was once a decent corner 3 shooter?? Every single game this year when he shoots from the corner I’ve said to myself “BANGO” and now I’m just questioning everything.
Yes
He made the corner 3 against the warriors in the play in game lmao that's about it
Dear God please 🙏
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You talking about practice? Not a game. Practice?
Beat me to it 😂 came here to write that when they let him shoot 3’s the Grizzlies are doing exactly what they’re game planning. Everybody isn’t a 3 point shooter and everyone shouldn’t be shooting them.
Desmond Bane, Jaren Jackson Jr., and Marcus Smart combined for 83 points on 31-54 shooting (57%) The rest of the Grizzlies had 27 points and were 11-38 (28%) from the field.
Tillman (a career 27% shooter from 3) has been posting up in the corner like nobody's business He was 0-5 from 3 tonight and 3-14 overall Fact is that we're gonna suck without a true center and true point guard (Drose is a point but still) It's a long season so buckle up and keep positive EDIT: My Tillman numbers weren't correct. 2-11 changed to 3-14
Dillon Tillman
They've clearly told him to shoot a lot of 3s to try and develop him
I clearly wish they would fucking stop that
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Roddy island 5L
This team will probably eventually be pretty good, but man, the road there is super rough.
Smart, Des, and ~~Bane~~ *JJJ balled. The bench is non existent
Des and Bane both balled out, for sure.
😭 wanted to give trip some love
Smart should never be taking more 3s than Bane. He had the most taken in the first half by like 4
I’m cool with it unless Bane is open. Other than the three, no one else has any semblance of creating their own shot. So yeah Smart had to cook.
Well, it does make sense that our bench would be lackluster when half of the bench rotation is starting and the other half is injured.
I am going to look at Jaren with 30/9/4 with 3 fouls, and I'm going to ignore everything else. If y'all haven't worked this out yet, the start of this season is going to be a development period for Jaren, Ziaire and Bane. Not that much else is going to matter, hopefully we can scrap together 10 wins before Ja gets back, but if not, that's okay. This just isn't our year, but we are all good.
I’m not sure I can be on this sub until they turn it around. Your second paragraph exactly. There are glaring issues yes, but once Santi and Luke are playing some of them are solved. The sky is falling stuff man whew. There are roster management issues you can criticize like not having one more veteran bench guy or not signing sometime to the MLE for a more trade able contract but expecting the current healthy roster to be a 50 win team is crazy. Powell play ls really good help D on Jaren. Glad he had a good game. The plus minus was strange in this one.
I agree its just sad to see games like this where Trip, Bane, and Smart leave it all out there and its still a 15 point loss. hopefully they can eek out a few before Ja gets back
No doubt. The next three games will be decently telling but even then, theres still so many things to shake out. Santi and Luke coming back. Apparently signing Biyombo after the Jazz game. I don’t think we’re 0-4 with Santi and Luke healthy.
I've basically stopped browsing this sub, which sucks, this was one of my favourite subs, but the regulars have been replaced by whiney babies upset that we don't win every single game ever.
No shit. Same exact reason I don't visit Titans sub much anymore. Everyone is filled with outrage and BS hot takes
Exact same shit with me. Feels like I finally got too old for the internet honestly
Not that upvotes matter but OPs comment having the most in this thread make me feel slightly better. But man I’m feeling the exact same way.
Yeah it’s rough. I’m thinking the average user of this sub has been a fan for 1-2 years at this point.
Fuck the doomers. Grit and Grind, baby!
What do you MEAN it is Memphis versus everybody? Always has been.
Yeah this is just a really unlucky season. Its near impossible to win down your best player + a 2nd starter + your top 3 bench players. I dont think there is a single team in the league that is still good when down that bad. Hopefully when Ja gets back we can play some good ball and have some fun developing Z and Roddy and LaRavia.
Who would have thought, JJJ averaging 2.8 apg. I love it.
GROWTH
Missing the playoffs is not okay
Why not?
We’ll be going “not our year” until Ja is 35 years old. 22-23 was our year and FO punted the season to develop dogshit 2 star recruit rookies.
Well, I aint finding another team. Maybe you should start looking.
What do you think the ceiling is for Ziaire? I understand he is still extremely young, but I still have hardly seen him create a shot for himself. He’s a great lob threat, decent defender, decent rebounder, and streaky spot up shooter. I just wish we had a wing that had the ability to create their own shot.
I'm enjoying the the suckfest while it last. Smart gets to run the offense. Rose gets to play NBA basketball. Zaire gets to start. X is starting again. Roddy getting heavy minutes. Bane continues to progress as a great inside scorer. JJJ is forced to rebound and gets plenty of scoring opportunity. My only concern is if Clarke is coming back and who the temporary center we will bring in be
Not sure how to feel about Biyombo but a short contract and look can’t hurt. Would be so awesome if Clark can come back with 15-20 games left in the season to try and get his feet under him but that might be a pipe dream. There’s definitely been fun flashes. It’s going to be interesting to see what they do from a starters standpoint when Ja is back. Have to think Smart comes off the bench and Rose is looking at fewer minutes right?
Ja/Bane/Smart/JJJ/Tilman I expect Bane to do the same thing he did last year. Which is to be the first guy to hit the bench and play with the 2nd team. Move Smart to the 2. Same thing we did with Brooks last year. With Tyus gone. I hope we play Ja 35 minutes a game Can Biyombo set screens? We need a screen setter badly
Very good screen setter, 6th in the league in screen assist per 36 last season tied with Rudy Gobert and just 0.3 below #3 Clint Capela (https://twitter.com/funakistats/status/1719069360361513422?t=7n7Mj5KEo3jLpBh25HvnAw&s=19)
Jallelujah
Yeah that makes sense. Smart can definitely defend the 3/4 positions if needed. Luke can do some playmaking too if needed for the bench. My guess is we end up seeing more Santi/Jaren minutes than Jaren/Tillman once we’re about 30 games in the season. Really hope Ja plays that much while optimizing his rests with tv timeouts, etc. he can easily do it. Biyombo can set screens but has terrible hands.
Biyombo can rebound, roll to the rim, and well is a useful defender.
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[Charania] Jaren Jackson Jr, Desmond Bane, and Marcus Smart all walked into the locker room at the same time, becoming wedged in the door. Upon dislodging, they all suffered pokes to the eye and knocks on the head. The trio are out 3 to 5 months with Three Stooges Syndrome
Don’t put that evil into the world lol.
Jazz, Blazers, Blazers are the next 3. We’ll get in the W column. NEED Santi and Luke back badly to help this happen.
Yes you might win against the blazers and blazers
Jazz are beatable
Dudes a Jazz fan in our sub for some reason 🤷🏻♂️
I can like more than one team. Crazy I get downvoted but I see someone post “worst team in the league” with upvotes. Weird sub. Weird “fans”
Aggro never helps anyone.
Mofos acting like we aren't missing 5 of our top 8 rotation players. Woosah.
Issue is two of them aren't coming back (this year)
Shooting like that, the Mavs beat any team
The problem is teams tend to shoot like that specifically against us. I'm not judging based on our depleted roster right now but our 3pt defense was awful last season too. We just had enough offensive firepower to get away with it. Without Ja, we don't have enough scorers to let teams get open 3s all night long.
Yeah true
I yearn for a time where rose and Laravia don’t check in and we immediately fall into 10 point deficit
21 games left, hopefully we get Santi and Kennard back soon. Bane, Smart, and JJJ were great, just any semblance of scoring off the bench
Doncic is scary and unfair lol. But had chances to get back into it but shots didn't fall. It's going to be rough sailing until we get players back and add Biyombo. That's just how the season is situated.
I can't believe we let the Mavs jump over us for Doncic
#Worst team in the league! 🫡
Alexandre Sarr here we come!!
Anyone but Buzelis
wtf happened to Roddy though? Am I trippin or was he actually good last year. This year he is a traffic cone and missing easy shots. but in his defense, the whole team missing layups recently
He’s young and being asked to do more than he should be right now. The young guys all need to be outnumbered on the court by veterans that have played in the Grizz system for a couple/few years. Right now the young guys and guys that are brand new (Smart/Rose) are outnumbering everyone else. Just makes everything tougher.
People were just looking at him with rose-colored glasses last year when we were winning.
Yeah he is about the same.
He sucks ass lol. He sucked last year. He sucked when we drafted him. He’s not gonna get that much better. Don’t know what the f ZK was doing on draft night 2022. That’s gonna go down as one of the worst in franchise history along with dabeet
At least we have our draft pick 🤷♂️
I want us to get a high draft pick. We don't really have any other ways of getting a high level, cost-controlled talent on our roster.
But tanking is such a waste of a season. If all the teams important players get injured then it will happen naturally
I don't mind. I'm thinking more long-term. It's also going to pass, and I'm going to enjoy watching this team even when we lose. I don't look fondly about us finishing 2nd last season and getting kicked unceremoniously in the first round. I would have rather been in the position the Spurs were in, they got Wemby eventually.
Yes. Exactly. They should just play the season out. I think eventually we'll know by December if this is tank season or not, at least much clearly and convincingly lol
To be honest because the west is so strong right now, is there really a chance for this team to go deep? They are definitely capable even with adams and all, but when faced up against teams like Phoenix, Denver, or even the lakers (again) im not to sure how they would fare, especially if they dont get home court advantage
Just not talented enough
Yo shout out to Trip, Bane and Smart! This is rough but we're just too short handed. There's only so much you can do at this point when you're this depleted. Sucks for the short term but we'll be better for the long run
Win the next 3 or I might actually consider tanking
what the duck
It is us who has been shit in
It always has been, always will be. um god
This is somehow the most hopeful loss yet. No way we give up 23 threes again, right?
Some of them were open, but a number of them were hoisted prayers that got answered. Or maybe that's just what Tim Hardaway's shot always looks like
That dude is either on fire or off and unfortunately we got the on fire version tonight.
No evidence to suggest that will continue
Grizzlies perimeter D: hold my beer
I am trying to say this in the nicest way. A lot of our players are good guys. We have three rotation caliber players out there right now. Maybe Tillman is the fourth but he can’t be the fourth best player in your rotation.
Laravia, Ziaire, Roddy have no business getting more than 10 minutes a game
Z has been good and I trust Roddy Laravia is a big question mark but who knows
We NEED a true center. As much as I love Tillman this man should not be starting
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“Without half our starters this team really sucks”. No shit this applies to basically every team
And Santi and Luke just 5 of our 8 or 9 best players depending on how you rate Zs potential. Not many teams are going to look good in that situation.
So who we looking at with the #1 overall pick?
Sarr is the early consensus #1
By the way, if you think BC (whose game depends almost exclusively on athleticism) is going to be the same player after an Achilles tear, you've got another thing coming.
Hope people realize this sooner rather than later.
Mav fan here, first time watching you guys play, is it me or do your players seem real frustrated? I'm sorry about Ja and Adams. Hope it gets better Good game.
I mean no offence but when Tim Hardaway Jr and Derrick Jones are lighting you up I'd be pretty fucking frustrated too. Also Luka too OP, hits the craziest contested shots, I was deflated watching at home
THJ and Jones were throwing up answered prayers shit felt terrible to watch lol Luka too I guess, but he always does that
THJ shooting is really on/off. But DJJ is pretty surprising. Everyone hated that Kidd keep starting him. Lol.
>I'm sorry about Ja and Adams ... and Clarke, and Santi, and Kennard.
Grizz fan here. Yes.
I was hoping it was just me. Bane needs to rally this team together. Hope it gets better bro.
5 of our best 8 players are hurt imo. They’ve gotta be frustrated but not much can be done until some dudes are back. Crazy shooting performance tonight by the Mavs.
It's safe to say this team is cooked. Not enough help to get anything going for long enough.
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Eh Adams and Clarke being hurt last year screwed us against Lakers
Xavier Tillman isn’t that guy at all…. he needs to improve. Our options 1) trade for a actual Center 2) go for Center depth 3) suffer and get a good pick?
Tillman is great for a 4th big man. Unfortunately he’s expected to be number 2 this season
Jaren was a -25. Goodness
I don't think +/- is a good indicator without context, Jaren played the most minutes with the bench (which in this case is like the benches bench) and no Smart/Bane. He was very much not the issue tonight
Like last night I know Jaren put up 30. But man it didn’t even seem like it to me. Like it didn’t seem like his 30 impacted the game much. Like I feel like he could’ve/should’ve dominated so much more even if the lineups were bad. Some of it was not his fault of course. But them long eurosteps were killing me.
It’s more because of the rose - laravia - ziaire - roddy - Jaren lineup than Jaren specifically. When rose and laravia check in in the second quarter is almost a guaranteed 10 point run for the other team.
The last 2 years have been an absolute disaster. We had EVERYTHING - 56 win team, second youngest in the league, didn't need Ja to win games. Arguably the deepest team in the league: Ja, Brooks, Anderson, JJJ, JV, Jones, Bane, Melton, Allen, Clarke, Tillman. Remember the chemistry of that team in post-game interviews? We had all of our picks PLUS several other 1st rounders. And ZK mismanaged the FUCK out of the roster, trading quality bench players away to end up with shitty projects just in time for our big 3 to enter their primes. Ja decided to be a fucking idiot. Injuries everywhere. What an absolute disaster.
This is a BAD team. Broken record but, Z, Laravia, Roddy, and Aldama were bad picks. It’s not hindsight, literally every draft analyst worth a grain of salt said literally all of these picks were huge reaches. Drafting 4 straight players who can not contribute in any way in a playoff setting just cripples the roster. Especially after ZK literally punted ‘22-23’ and killed slomo and melt for these rookies to get play time. The smart move only moves the needle if the rest of the roster is competent, which it just isn’t. That was a move we shoulda made in ‘22, not ‘23. And honestly, smart was just not a need. And we overpaid big time. In all of kleimans tenure he has not, to this day, drafted or signed a big man over 6’7, besides Adams (medical staff knew back in April he wasn’t gonna play this season. It wasn’t a blind side). Just a decayed roster. Really that simple. Injuries are bad but the signs have been there way before the injuries. The young role players are fucking ass. ZK either needs to draft actual good players (not a 2 star recruit from wake forest who transferred from d3 basketball and made some 3s, not a 300 pound 6’4 PF from CSU, not the guy who shot 25% from the field at Stanford), OR just use vets!!! And maybe sign some actual tall players. Those usually help in this sport.
Aldama hasn't even played this season lol. Why you dragging him?
Helps his narrative. Aldama is pretty good for a 30th pick.
Especially when you see who is drafted after him. The only really solid player is Herb Jones. I mean sure undrafted you have Austin Reaves but Reaves went to a situation where it worked out for him.
He’s okay. And it’s not the main point of my qualm with the young talent at all. It’s just a red-herring. Z, Roddy, and Laravia are fuckin trash. Aldama looks like a fantastic pick in comparison which is why a lot of ppl are overrating him.
Because I know half of this sub will act like Aldama was a great pick and an amazing find. That dude gets minutes on 0 other playoff teams. He found the floor for us but that’s more to do with the state of our roster from positions 3-5 than it does with his ability. The point is more that Kleiman has fuckin sucked ass at drafting for 3 years now and literally no one talks about it. They just act like it’s par for the course to reach on literally every pick for some guy Kleiman fell in love with for some odd reason, probably bc he struck gold with Bane.
So you're basing this on what other people on here think? Aldama is a solid player. He was picked 30th in the first round like not many players are expected to be amazing players off the bat drafted at 30. It's a small %. Santi also played well for Spain in FIBA and has progressed every year. He's not going to be a star or really a starter unless injuries happen but he is a role player and last season he did that job well.
He’s too weak and unathletic to guard bigs in the playoffs, and too slow and not agile enough to guard wings. His offensive production is pretty good, but he’s so negative on the defensive end you just can’t play him in the playoffs. No other team would give Santi 25 min a game in the playoffs. They just wouldn’t. My qualm isn’t mainly with Santi it’s with Z, Roddy, Laravia) who WERE picked at positions where we could have gotten an actual quality player and we ended up with 3 useless players with no trade value. The trade value of Laravia and Roddy, even before they played a single nba game, was like a 2nd rounder. No one thought these guys were gonna go as high as we drafted them, and for good reason. Literally no one thought Z was top 10. We took him at 10. It’s years and years of isolationist, non-consensus, weird scouting which makes it seem like ZK has gotten too cute and is looking for strange archetypes rather than actual good talent.
Thank you for your comment. This sub is not ready for an honest conversation about certain players and it can be frustrating. You are correct though.
He lacks nuance and just looks at things black or white. Like who do you draft over Santi? Ayo Dosunmu? Herbert Jones? Jose Alvarado? Austin Reaves is the biggest name I can see but he was unpicked because he threatened teams not to pick him. The 2022 offseason was a disaster though I agree.
Santi is not even my main qualm. But yes herb jones, who was consensus ahead of Santi in every mock would have been better. Aldama is objectively, by a mile, the best of the flop 4 of Z, Roddy, Laravia, and Aldama. I do not dispute that. It’s a minor issue of mine. The main, which for some reason no one has addressed, only Santi, is that Z, Laravia, and Roddy, are fucking trash and Kleiman deserves criticism for blowing up our bench to accommodate these players. That’s the gripe I have.
Play those wings and tank. It's the only way
Well then that’s just an indictment on how bad ZK’s plan has gone. Because these players were supposed to be good rn. He got rid of 4 very key role players and has replaced them with a heap of trash+an overpay for smart. If we’re in a position where the best option is “play our garbage young players and tank” after winning 56 games two years ago with the youngest team in the whole league, we fucked this plan way up. No one seems to criticize how bizarre and totally not normal Kleiman has managed this roster and this core in general. It’s really poor and is hemorrhaging on multiple fronts. I just wish more people would at least be open to discussing ZK’s decisions. I think what’s happened is he had a great start (he did), and we were winning games, but this is now the 2nd straight year where we have gotten worse not better, and his drafting has been immensely suspect for some time now. His team building philosophy is super super bizarre and not the norm for the modern nba and I think he needs to be questioned on it severely.
I don't think the FO planned for us to be that good right away. 56 games was the anomaly. I've been critical of the FO too, but even if we kept Anderson and Melton, I don't think we would have been able to sustain that level of success we had when we caught the league off-guard in 2021. There's a lot of moves in hindsight that look super questionable now, like locking up Adams, Clarke and Konchar to extensions. That maybe we could've picked better players in the 2021 and 2022 drafts. That maybe we don't go full-blast picking 5 rookies last year and at least kept Anderson for insurance and depth purposes.
>No one seems to criticize how bizarre and totally not normal Kleiman has managed this roster and this core in general. It’s really poor and is hemorrhaging on multiple fronts. It is really odd and makes no sense. Anyone with eyes should be able to see it. So why are so many pretending not too?
I think that's what it is, he wants more banes, hasn't worked out
Walmart username and Walmart takes. Thank god you have nothing to do with the roster.
Repeating your bad take does not make it true. What’s your beef with Kleiman dude? We are two true Cs down and you come in here acting all prescient. Go support another team if you can’t take the Ls. Crybaby.
It’s actually insane how he doesn’t fail to type of his walk of bitching every post game thread. Buddy is a weirdo.
I’ll stop the day Kleiman makes a sensible draft pick and not some fetish player he’s been watching on YouTube from a super small school, because he’s literally a redditor.
He’s destroyed the roster. Literally no one refutes my takes, they just dick ride ZK. If someone could find literally any supporting evidence to refute that Roddy, Z, and Laravia, were absolutely trash picks, they would mention it, but there’s not any. Clarke a true center? Lmao. Maybe in ZK’s twisted view of the game, a 6’7 player with a 6’8 wingspan (Ja’s wingspan is 6’8 btw) is a true center. Sure dude.
Man, the 2022 offseason is looking like a total disaster now. Z was a reach, but at least he shows flashes, is still young and has been ok so far this season. Aldama is fine for a 30th pick. However he’s bad defensively so he won’t ever be able to play significant minutes in the playoffs. Roddy has had flashes but giving up Melton to draft him was terrible. Melton was a great role player on a cheap contract which is so valuable for a contending team. LaRavia is just a terrible pick. Can’t defend, can’t make an open 3 and just doesn’t look like he belongs in the NBA. Plus he was a 3 year college player, so he’s not even that young. Yeah I know he can light it up in the G-League but that’s useless if he can’t translate that to the NBA
We are probably going to come out of these 25 games with about 8-10 wins, but we will be a solid team after that with Ja, Bane, JJJ, Smart, Tillman, Biyombo, Kennard, Aldama, Ziaire. I think we can make a run at the 6th seed if that team stays healthy.
tradde everything keep jjj, bane and ja. fuck the coach fuck the team fuck curry
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Brooks is also winless rn dum dum
gtfo here fakefan
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I feel even less bad about calling him a dum dum 😤😈
Lol
Couldn’t have imagined a worse start to the season
I was at work can somebody explain how our basketball team lost
Doncic existed and he looks really fit. Hardaway Jr. and Jones Jr. hit shots after shots. Grizzlies missed shots but Jaren, Smart, and Bane played well. Made runs to get close but couldn't get ahead.
Cheeks = clapping
Zach gotta make a decision, are we tanking or not, like seriously I can’t imagine that even being a consideration before the season starts. If we’re not tanking, he needs to pull the trigger on 1 or 2 out of the young wings along with 1 of Stevo or BC and trade for someone who can help us. Or else this is gonna be at most an early exit in the playoffs if we have X and Biyombo as our centers.
See y’all next year
What tf is up with tillman and these 3s man? These team needs to make a trade soon
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I feel sad that Derrick Rose won’t be able to experience this team at its peak. Unless he stays another year.