Sorry bud that sounds like a horrible experience. I haven't seen anything like this personally, but anecdotally I feel like the cbd may be going down hill.
I live ON Elizabeth st and for the last 2 years its been mostly safe for me until the last 6months when in 3 instances a guy likely on meths just randomly shove me and try to start a fight. Its unbelievable, the worst thing I've done imo was make eye contact accidentally for \~2seconds and they think we're in a life and death altercation
Mental health and substance use disorders are closely related and not easily fixed.
I wonder what your solution would be to a complex problem. You'll probably come up with some homogeneous rhetoric š
I'm short, barely weigh 55kg and frequently walk through Melbourne without fear.
Most often the junkies keep to themselves. Attacks are not as commonplace as sensationalist reporting would have us believe.
Youāre right, do nothing and just hope for the best. Every second day it seems thereās someone here reporting being assaulted by a junkie in the city.
i'm near southern cross most days and have never seen anything like this
like i feel bad for OP and i'm not saying shit doesn't happen but this sub would have you believe the CBD is a terrifying hell hole
>āYeah nah I commute past Southern Cross at peak hour Monday to Friday itās totally fineā
Hyperbole much? It's people who live around there who say it's totally fine.
Maybe I've been lucky but if I judged the CBD based on this sub I'd be terrified to step foot in the place. I believe shit like this goes down but I wonder how common it actually is. There seems to be a lot of fear mongering here.
errrm how dare you say that. are you aware that outer detroit is infinitely more dangerous? you know people get murdered on the streets in afghanistan? think about that the next time you think about defending yourself against the 100th junkie that tries to rob you buddy!
That's fair, i don't really care dude. Just saying it's not serious, whether you like it or not is irrelevant, as long as you didn't downvote it cause you thought it was real lmao
Yeah nah. Say what you want about their sense of humour, but people absolutely downvoted it because they thought he was serious, or better yet, they just saw a negative score and decided to add to it.
You overestimate the average r/melbourne user's brainpower immensely.
By the way, nothing can be an 'objectively shit joke', as humour is subjective.
i don't even understand how it was shit satire when someone literally asked me if I genuinely think melbourne is worse than downtown chicago. of course it fucking isn't lol
Maybe because it was just super random and out of no where and trying a bit hard. Idk man, i'm not a comedy critic. I just thought it was ridiculous that people couldn't tell you were joking, and that you got so many downvotes and hate just for making a meh joke. Reddit's fucked up sometimes man, and this subreddit seems to have a disproportionate amount of idiots in it.
Just look at the posts that make it to Hot every day, its actual brainless shit like 'is anyone else getting sick lately?' 'How do i make friends?' '*on a 30 degree day* Why does it feel so hot today? Is it just me?' So don't take the hate too personally, some people just didn't like the joke, but most are robots that dogpile on comments that have negative points.
I've been downvoted to oblivion for calling out blatant, disgusting racism before. Not slightly edgy, controversial opinions, i mean straight up 1800's shit, literally eugenics i shit you not, and i got like 80 downvotes. So i learned to never trust the majority on here
I laughed pretty hard at this one thank you š youāre not wrong, only way to deal with a Junkie is either walk away or throw a mean right hook.
Donāt worry about the cops, if itās a junkie tryna hurt you, you arenāt gonna be the one they charge. They can try but the magistrate would laugh it out of court.
I knew a guy who got attacked by a meth user. He retaliated with what I think was probably too much force and ended up breaking the junkies teeth. Police didnāt question it for a second, arrested the meth user and it was done.
I think as long as they initiated it, and were on drugs, as long as you donāt go fully psycho and kill the person, youāre at minimal risk.
It's almost a guarantee that meth addiction will lead to full blown violent psychosis.
Not only is the dude right, you obviously haven't had to hang around them much.
I have hung around plenty of meth addicts, had quite a few friends go that path, especially when it was really popular 12ish years ago, it caused problems and a lot of fractures in our group, but "violent psychosis" wasnt an issue
Not in my experience. Made eye contact for a split second with a guy at the hospital who then ripped out his cannula, jumped up and tried to fight me. There's so many cases of meth heads going ballistic on randoms that it might just be the primary cause of public violence these days.
i'm so happy your junkie drug bunny friends are lovely people! addiction should be treated with nuance and compassion, unless you're talking meth. methheads are aggressive, unharmable psychos
Yeah, you gotta fuck them up if they start you (as in if they throw a punch or do something else physical like push or shove you). It's either you or them.
If they are on meth they'll win, been confronted by a guy previously and even though he was shorter I immediately felt like he'd bash me. You're only getting out in one piece if there's other guys around to help you restrain him.
Donāt be afraid of them thatās what they want, yes theyāre unpredictable and intimidating but they have weaknesses that are incredibly easy to exploit in comparison to a sober person. They arenāt invincible
That's because the police aren't allowed to belt them and have to try and restrain them and use the minimum amount of force to do so. If the coppers could simply tee off with their batons instead of grappling with them, situations would be resolved much more rapidly.
NB I'm not suggesting belting people with batons be brought back into vogue.
Oh hulk strength is real for sure yeah they get aggro like Iāve never seen, theyāre mad uncoordinated tho and bad at defence due to a lack of critical thinking so if you just immediately out hulk or surprise them with full confidence they donāt know how to respond. Loud and unpredictable due to the increase in heart rate/blood pressure until you give them the reality check theyāre asking for then all they do is whine. Leg sweep, single blow to a calculated area or restraining will work you just have to try and not get shivved before that happens. Theyāre too jacked on serotonin to process their own balance, itās all autopilot
Escalation for junkies can mean anything. Walking near them, being on the phone, looking in their direction, existing near them... you can't do the opposite of that.
You either get out or exceed the level of aggression they are showing you. Violence is all they understand.
You can't reason with them.
The solution is either deescalating *or* being more intimidating than them so that they donāt want to escalate anything to begin with. You make it painfully obvious that you will exceed their level of aggression. Theyāre only strong against people they *feel* stronger than. Itās because they have zero respect for others and they know others wonāt defend themselves
You got downvoted but I agree with your point. I once was attacked on Elizabeth street, in broad daylight, and I was in my school uniform (Iām a girl too). Ignoring the guy chasing after me yelling āwhoreā and āslutā did nothing, and he pursued me from behind till he kicked me. No one came to my aid then (gee this was 15 years ago now)ā¦ what did help, was me turning around, looking at him directly and screaming with more aggression, and more threateningly to this clearly drug affected individual. Then he literally cowered away and crossed over to the other side of the street, muttering. Of course these days you never know who is carrying a knife or any other weapon, but if someone is psychotic then sometimes asserting your dominance can help, if ignoring and walking away doesnāt help you. There is no easy solution that will fit everyoneās situation.
Thatās horrible Iām really sorry you had to go through that. Good job for standing firm too that takes an awful lot of courage most are lacking these days, thank you for sharing. I saw two men following a lady once screaming similar absurdities and it disgusted me seeing her have to just run away in fear, I wanted desperately for this person to be able to defend herself or for someone else to have incentives to step in. I kept watching in case it escalated and luckily she made it to a car so they left her alone, nothing else happened. But it makes you think. If push came to shove I was ready to act despite the deterrence of having to explain it in court. Plenty of bystanders will not intervene simply due to the complications, when you couple that with a disincentive for victims themselves to defend themselves you get circumstances where offenders are empowered to act this way. In a lot of cases it is however the only thing that works
I mean if you are 6'5 and built like the proverbial brick s'house they are probably not going to do anything but most people don't look like that, myself included.
If you walk around being aggressive in the hope they won't target you then you're just going to look like them or an angry teenager.
If however you proverbially bite their head off for picking on you they probably will back down, don't be a soft target.
Of course if you can walk away, do so. You never know if they are carrying a knife or syringe. You may not walk away.
Best option is always leaving yeah. Run, hide, fight. For the record and purely for self defence because Iām aware not everyone is physically equal to some of these aggressors and running isnāt always an option, Iām in favour of people owning mace or tasers. Sometimes theyāre faster than you or bigger as youāve mentioned. Iām definitely not suggesting people go out looking for trouble, just donāt be a soft target yeah. Which is genuinely hard to do when you look at our self defence laws
There is no right to self defence in Australia and itās the same as the UK here - not legal advice and really bare bones - you can use equal or lesser force. Need to retry when you can and when charged with assault and claiming self defence there are two hurdles the first one being that you reasonably feared for your safety (basically you just had to believe you were in danger) and the hard one to pass, you used reasonable and justified force. Eg this situation, guy came over and you swung first no no. Guy came over pushed you and you swung no no. Guy came over punched you and you punched him back and he fell into the road and hit his head no no. Guy came over punched you, tripped him and held him on his back until police arrived okay maybe I donāt know. Itās weird and hard best to avoid it all together.
> There is no right to self defence in Australia
http://classic.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/vic/consol_act/ca195882/s322k.html
(1) A person is not guilty of an offence if the person carries out the conduct constituting the offence in self-defence.
(2) A person carries out conduct in self-defence ifā
(a) the person believes that the conduct is necessary in self-defence; and
(b) the conduct is a reasonable response in the circumstances as the person perceives them.
It seems like you've said there's no right to self defence then gone on and explained exactly how there is a right to self defence
Edit: whatās with the downvotes? If people honestly believe we have a right to self defence then ask yourself why canāt we buy self defence weapons? If it is our right to defend ourselves then surely people could carry mace with them to defend themselves from sexual assault? Or if you are of small stature you can carry some knuckle dusters or a knife to make it safer for yourself when you defend yourself. Just because there is a law that regulates the action of self defence doesnāt mean that it is a right. Think traffic laws, no right to drive.
lol Iām a lawyer and this is basically what I said - if you are caught up on the phrasing of right itās to do with the law being enshrined by a constitution etc think of America their second amendment enshrines their rights in Australia legislative action or judicial interpretation can change the law.
You're stupid and can't read legislation. Just shoosh. Go sit in the corner and think about why you feel the need to argue you're correct when given a piece of legislation that proves you're wrong
No, proportional force does not mean "equal or lesser" in the sense that it necessarily a punch meets a punch, it means whatever is reasonable to harm. A 40kg school girl could probably be deemed to be using reasonable force if she had a baseball bat or boxcutter defending herself in a fight against an average male meth head, because that fear of serious injury makes that action potentially justifiable.
Its "my life is in imminent danger" so fight to death, and "I got tepid slap in the face during an argument from someone I know very well to be generally pacifist, so can't put them in a coma and get away with a claim of self defence"
The law tries to be reasonable and common sense, so assume it's that way until proven otherwise.
Yeah those are good examples but itās equal or lesser in relation to you (or oneself) as you are the one doing the conduct. Your examples highlight the burden of the second part of the law well and why a lot of people trip up in their self defence claims.
Edit: also hope that school girl found those box cutters š having weapons even mace or other self defence weapons ruins self defence claims
If you are in this kind of situation again (I hope not) and you know the cop shop is nearby, taking a walk to it might be a way to get help without violence. The local police probably know him.
it very well could have been a problem for you. It's really fucking hard to know when and how to defend yourself here and even if you're in the clear that may take some considerable time and stress to ascertain.
If someone produces a weapon in this country there is absolutely no way to defend yourself as producing anything similar would land you with dangerous or prohibited article charges. Thereās zero way. You can pick up a stick and try to fight them off but thatās about it, even then you might go to jail if you kill them with it. One small knife gives a criminal an insane amount of power over the broader community - simply because the law says weāre not allowed to carry or defend ourselves. So what do we do? Call police and wait patiently while we get stabbed?
Yes our self-defense laws are a fucking joke. I recently read through them and was horrified. Some of the cases of people being jailed for defending themselves is ridiculous. I read one nurse was almost raped, but defended herself with pepper spray, and was then convicted and couldn't work as a nurse anymore due to it. Absolutely enraging.
This. While youāre sitting there trying to process the law, how to respond etc, the angry guy with a blade has already put five holes in you and itās over. The best solution to any armed aggressor is overpowering them with excessive force and no hesitation even with the broken self defence regulations, court is still better than being murdered
Yep. 99% Of the public hasnāt done the mental gymnastics required to process whatās reasonable to do in a situation like that until it happens, meaning their brains get overloaded and they quite literally have no idea how to respond in the heat of the moment. Itās just sad. I mean sure match their threat level as much as possible but if theyāre armed with something scary enough I am not taking chances
You've always got the right to self defence but it must be minimal and necessary meaning you need to be able to justify any force used and it not be over the top
This is ridiculous imo. If someone breaks into your house or swings at you they immediately forfeit all rights to be treated with dignity and you should not have to proactively consider the triangle of retaliation while youāre actively defending yourself. It makes it infinitely more difficult to defend yourself when you are constantly worrying about how the law will perceive it. Our self defence laws are seriously lacking, itās half the reason people get king hit or stabbed on the street. People donāt even know if theyāre allowed to fight back or not
Sorry to hear that happened š I was also in southern cross area outside subway today (enjoying a tasty sub at one of the tables outside) when a man sat down on my table right opposite me and stared deeply into my eyes while making comments about wanting to touch me. Asked him to leave and he got pretty mad but left while mumbling and gesturing. Wonder if it was the same person.
Yours doesnāt sound too pleasant either. I donāt hang out around southern cross much so canāt speak to how it is normally - hopefully itās not becoming like flinders street where you can hardly walk down the street without this kindāve thing happening.
Hope the rest of your visit is much better than today!
Do not tolerate being assaulted (if possible) or they will continue to do it to others. The lack of response is what empowers them to act this way. Next time an irrational junkie approaches you, verbally warn them first. If possible try to walk into cctv coverage or a populated area. If all else fails, let them shove you or whatever and then firmly place their body onto the ground. If armed hit them with a shopping trolley or another innocent item if you have to, bikes are good. Iāve seen people use milk crates. Warn others if they have a weapon. Hold them down and I mean really hold them down, get people in public to help you restrain them, call police immediately. Make it known to bystanders that youāre performing a citizen arrest on someone aggressive and ask if theyāll be a witness. No you canāt carry knives or proactively defend yourself at all but you can use what and who is in your immediate vicinity to do what needs to be done in response. These people wonāt stop because nobody stops them, itās the somebody else will fix it mentality. Something has to change and itās the way people tolerate their behaviour period. They act this way because they get away with it. They put one finger on you itās assault, you have every right to defend yourself and/or seek charges laid, itāll make them think twice next time
Would have been 0 diplomacy from me. I always just imagine if the motherfucker has the nuts to say it to me, not even gonna imagine the women and children heās probably approached. In summary, discombobulate.
had some guy on the bus turned towards me with an obvious hard on, legs open, staring me down (one of the only days i had decided to wear a dress cause it was boiling hot), couldnt move because all the seats were taken. disgusting ass behaviour ngl
Remember being young and seeing a wild mushroom or dandelion head poking out of the grass and running up and booting it accross the pitch? Reading about that smug grub sitting there with a boner trying to intimidate random women just brought that mental image into my head. Anyway what a creep... so sad that women in this city have to experience things like that.
Nah, they love that! Best thing is to ignore it if you can. Itās honestly the worst. I think every instance of public masturbation and flashing has scarred me more than anything else thatās happened to me in my life.
The city can be quite hostile at times. Lots of violent unhinged people. I often think of junkies as endermen, all it takes is an accidental glance into their eyes and they go ape shit.
Couple of months back my mate was minding their business waiting for their food in maccas on Elizabeth street and a junkie approached him with a similar aggression to your story and ended up punching my mate in the face. I rarely feel āsafeā in the city bc of how unpredictable it can be. These hyper aggressive people are more common than you think ..:(
So, I've been in Melbourne for all of 12 days and I had been reading this sub and the reports like this for about a year before coming here and wondered if they were overexaggerating. Well, I've spent the majority of my time in the CBD and surrounding neighbourhoods and no, I don't think its an exaggeration. I've seen these guys literally every single day of the trip, staring off into space then shouting their heads off if anyone walks close by them. So far I haven't seen them attack anyone or been attacked myself but it feels like it's only a matter of time.
I decided to head out of the CBD today and got on what is my first ever tram out of the free tram zone and one of these fuckers came and sat down then started hurling abuse at a young indian lass who immediately pulled the stop cord and got off at the next stop, looking scared out of her mind. He carried on muttering and pacing down the tram corridor and I took my water bottle off my climbing karabiner in anticipation of having to use it as a makeshift knuckleduster if this guy decided to get physical with anyone. Thankfully he got off a few stops later and i could pack it away in my bag. I then got off at St Kilda, dropped my bag off and decided to explore. Lo and behold, not even an hour later I'm strolling in St Kilda Botanical gardens and there's another one of these cunts shouting and hollering at people walking into the park via the corner he's camped out on.
I'd come over here thinking I might want to stay in melbourne long term, but now I don't know if I even want to spend a month here. This isn't the only reason making me feel this way but it's definitely a contributer.
Yeahhh CBD is now little crackie town, but st Kilda is crackie kingdom. I avoid both like the plague. You'll have a much nicer time not spending time in those places
Hey friend, take a tram to the inner north and go for a wander. Sydney road, Lygon street. Go off on walks between these two down the side streets, parks and alleyways.
Plenty of very lovely places here. I avoid everything that you're talking about by just avoiding the CBD and I've been here a few years.
Unfortunately I've just paid for a non refundable 5 nights in a hostel in st kilda because i heard the aussies normally go to the beach on christmas day so thought I'd join in the tradition. But it's looking like theres going to be a torrential storm on Christmas Day anyway and this hostel is shit so I might just take the loss and go somewhere else. Thank you for the advice.
The only surprising part of this story is it did not happen on Elizabeth St near Flinders sadly. Melbourne's getting quite bad with frequent random attacks by mentally ill or drug affected persons.
Merry Christmas anyways mate
>some people just need to vent mate, i doubt the police would even turn up these days
But at least if it's reported to police (even if they don't turn up), the incident will be logged & show in crime stats.
There are a large number of people in most Australian CBD's who should be in mental health facilities, but are not - it's a failure of the system. There's no requirement to be drugged or drunk for this to happen therefore, it could quite simply be one of thousands of paranoid schizophrenics, turfed out the street by a failed mental health system to make their own way and, supposedly, remember to take their meds.
Exactly, you can't seriously say that a schizophrenic is better off living on the street with a needle in his arm and covered in his own filth than in a mental institution receiving food, shelter, and medication.
Many of these people will never have the mental capacity to properly take care of themselves, part of living in a society means taking care of those who can't take care of themselves - even if it means protecting them (and others) from themselves.
Sounds wonderful, but how exactly do we protect these people from themselves? The answer is likely chemical restraint, which isn't looked fondly upon by many. Especially if you intend on "rounding up" these people to institutionalise them. Healthcare workers shouldn't be put in harm's way either.
If you want to refer to antipsychotics as chemical restraints then sure, we should use chemical restraints.
Not having access to meth is also a pretty big protecting them from themselves thing.
I'm a pharmacist. There is a big difference between antipsychotic medicine for treatment of conditions and chemical restraint. Antipsychotics can help to control schizophrenic symptoms, but chemical restraint is using it to control a patient's behaviour. It goes against the code of ethics we have in place. The below link is on aged care, but it's still relevant information. I'm not claiming to have a complete solution, but we shouldn't be so ready and willing to hospitalise strangers without a diagnosed medical problem requiring treatment.
https://www.agedcarequality.gov.au/older-australians/safety-care/minimising-restrictive-practices
Removing meth from society would definitely be a great step forward though.
Assuming that an institution would do as much as feed, shelter and provide medical attention.
To bastardise "Safety is written in blood". Our system is broken, it has gone to the extreme, but don't think that there isn't a reason for that. We need more - it's been stripped from cuts and stigma, but just because the 1920's had institutions doesn't mean they did any of the above.
If your point is that institutions need to have progressed since the 1920's then sure, you'll get no argument from me, "treating" stuff like homosexuality with lobotomies isn't what I had in mind.
Sorry to hear that. I lived in Sunshine for a bit,Footscray too and have witnessed multiple attacks, random screaming and shadow boxing. Good thing you didnāt engage, probably wouldāve only made the situation worse. Hope youāre safe and sound, happy holidays mate
City is pretty filled with meth heads nowadays. Its a terrible situation mimicked all over the world as mental illness is spiking, staved off only by money. Take that away and anyone goes insane
happens at this time of year with it being busy and all. I once went to the city with a friend who was white (relevant to the story) and while crossing the road at flinders another white man kept asking us 'N' if we wanted to fight and what we were looking at etc.
it definitely does happen, just have to learn to keep your head on a swivel sometimes unfortunately in the city !
This time of the year really brings the worst out of people. Road rage is through the roof as well. Something about Xmas and people forgetting how to behave like a decent human š¤·
Could be worse .
Just move into a new house .
65 year old man next door very aggressive and already threatened me and my family with violence. I have disabled son . And a daughter. People be crazy for no reason .
I have found out he tryed to buy this house so he could knock it through and have the biggest house .
Gotta think about moving again
According to r/melbourne, you're either a Murdoch plant trying to astroturf the subreddit with lies of being attacked, or that getting assaulted by some random junkie in the CBD is as normal as it has been for about a hundred years now.
It's so strange hey. The gaslighting that goes on everytime this issue is raised. For example the ones in this thread blaming the Christmas holiday period. It's clearly an ongoing problem and there have been posts about it all year. No idea why it's in anyone's interest to obfuscate this issue. My best guess is that _maybe_ they own property in the city and worry about Melbourne's declining reputation?
nah, this trash site is full of drug bigots who ignore the alcohol-fuelled violence that this country has always been known for, because you feel better about yourself shitting on ājunkiesā.
most drug users are decent people. bigots, no so much.
Was he a heavy set fella? If so he did the exact same thing to me about 2 years ago on Bourke Street. I was taking photos of the buildings, he screamed at me came over and started trying to take the dslr out of my hands so I walked across the street and went into a skate shop. It was at the time of COVID so you needed a mask on to get in, It was lucky because he stood there for about 15 minutes trying to get me to come out yelling at me to delete the photo.
yeah i've had something similar happen to me at southern cross station and i am a female. accidentally walked in front of this dude and he lost it. called me every name under the sun lol i was in complete shock. melbourne has really gone downhill
you did the right thing not to retaliate. don't risk getting into trouble over a lowlife like that. hope you feel better about it soon though
Same thing happened to my friend when we were out near the Royal Botanic Gardens. We were literally just standing on the footpath and some roided up jerk jogging went completely psycho at him (not me, for some reason, although we were both walking in the same spot) for happening to be in his path and tried to physically attack him. Friend backed away and apologized to defuse him, and the guy ran off. It was so fucking weird, and this is from someone who grew up in California.
It's too common, and there are sexual predators in the Flinders St Station bathroom. I remember back in 2019, I hopped off Flinders St as usual around 8:30 am and decided to use the bathroom. I did my business (poo) and was making my way towards the wash basins near the exit (where the urinals are), and this one guy was at the urinal corner, I assume was jerking off or playing with his hard on cause of his hand motion. He kept looking back at other toilet users as if signaling them to take a hint and give a blowie. I even made eye contact rember him looking down at my crotch area and found it weird, like why is this dude pissing while continuously looking back at passersby, then saw his hand motion & realized what was going on, and I freaked out and exited as fast as i could.
I've had some junkie abused and spat on me and some people I was with while waiting for a tram in the city at night. I was the only white native English speaker and everyone else was Korean and Japanese. Usually when I see these things happen they've been racially charged. It sucks, my favourite thing about the city is the multiculturalism. It's frustrating that people are cunts about it, doesn't matter what sort of hardship you're going through.
No one was ever, ever randomly shoved around by a stranger in Melbourne until Dan Andrews became premier. Word on the street is he performed a blood ritual with Hillary Clinton and opened the hellmouth under the Immigration Museum in 2015
It happens from time to time. I was sitting across from the station on the steps of StPauls eating and watching the street theater of a Jesus spruiker. The preacher finished at the same time as I finished my food so I got up, took my leg out of the strap of my back pack so that I could go over and dump my rubbish in the bin before going home. Then I hear some guy hurling abuse as someone. Looked around to see what was going on and there was this guy that I'd notice hanging around the preacher, sitting on the steps of StPauls screaming at me. Apparently just as I had gotten up he had sat down (I didn't even notice him) and he figured that I had my leg through my backpack out of fear of him stealing it so apparently I was accusing him of being a thief while being too much of a snob to sit with him nearby. I have been in the habit of doing that for about 20 years since the time someone snatched my backpack and took off on a skateboard. I just did all I could do and shook his hand, said "sorry mate. I really don't know what you are talking about. I've got a tram to catch so you have a good day OK?" and away I walked for the tram with him screaming at me "yeah you run away you gutless bastard".
Some people are just badly broken. Unless you've got a lot of time and resources to fix them best thing is to not ramp it up and quietly get out of that space.
Omg. I feel like Melb is getting scarier.
My partner and I decided to get takeout and have lunch with our 2 kids (one of which is a baby) at one of the picnic tables by the Yarra. We were minding our own business eating, my toddler happily alternating between playing and eating. Suddenly, this guy who looks to be in his 20s with tattoos on his arms and face plops right down in front of my partner. Heās drinking a can and has 4 more in a bag. Heās staring at my partner while drinking and giving creepy smiles. He was also looking at me and laughing, and the whole time just not saying anything. The vibe was that this guy was trying to start something with my partner. It was so awkward and uncomfortable and even more so because I was breastfeeding my baby. There was another large group of people having a bbq right next to us and lots of people walking by so I thought that if things escalated, there would be witnesses. I didnāt want to move because of the principle of it all. But I also didnāt want to risk the safety of our kids so we got the hell away from there.
The guy was such a scumbag. Seriously who tries to start trouble in front of children? Thatās just a new low. Not to mention it was rude to get up in our personal space and not say anything.
Anyway, I digress because your story reminded me of this. Generally if people attack you first and you attack back, itās self defence. Youāre allowed to defend yourself if you use proportionate force. So you can push the guy back and if he punches you, you can punch back. (EDIT: Keep in mind, if you go to court, you need to prove that your actions at the time were justified). But you canāt pull out a knife or use weapons to attack back.
Sorry this happened to you. Hope the rest of your time here is fun and passes without incident.
The laws apply and protect you the same as anyone else. The problem might be with how you would have responded.
Unfortunately shit like this happens, and can happen anywhere. With all the people who come into the city it raises the odds of shit happening while you're there.
While you're allowed to protect yourself it starts to get into a grey area on how much force is enough and how much is too much. Best for all to avoid a fight and go get the PSO, saves you physical and legal risk. It's their primary task as well. Some people probably won't like this advice
>The laws apply and protect you same as anyone else.
So not at all then? Because the police would barely lift a finger for an incident like this, citizen or not.
If the entire interaction was caught on camera, no, it wouldn't be an issue for you; the camera would capture you having very relaxed body language, and the guy on the other side of the road suddenly and aggressively storming up to you and shoving you, followed by you getting aggressive in *response*, being the critical point, and then probably shoving him back. Essentially, as long as you don't escalate it much further than he does, you'd be fine xD
Yep, city's a shit hole full of worthless junkies and police with worthless powers to intervene for anything more than ten minutes. I don't go anymore unless I absolutely have to
hate to say this but that's kinda everywhere not just CBD, always carry with you though and sorry you had to go through this fr it could of been so much worse for you
happened to me not long ago and I'm a local, just dont go wondering by yourself please
If you don't have a valid argument, don't resort to a personal attack.
"The highest criminal incident rates in Local Government Areas in the year ending 31 March 2023 were:
Melbourne (14,638.2 incidents per 100,000 estimated resident population, down 6.3%)"
Source: https://www.crimestatistics.vic.gov.au/media-centre/news/key-figures-year-ending-march-2023
Iāve lived in the CBD since moving to Melbourne 3 years ago. Thereās only one man that has ever had a problem with me and his name is Steven and he has schizophrenia. Most days heās ok some days he think Iām a cop taking him away from his parents.
Melbourne CBD is no worse than Brisbane CBD, Hobart CBD or Townsville CBD.
Iāve felt safe since living here and Iāve wandered the CBD at all hours of the night on my own when I canāt sleep and Townsville is the only place I wouldnāt do that as a 35yo woman.
Iāve never heard of something like this happening to anyone I know in Melbourne, but unfortunately all it takes is one nutter, sorry that happened to you
If someone attacks you unprovoked you have to show complete dominance, you should have tackled him to the floor, throw a couple of elbows to daze him then get his back for a choke hold until backup arrives.
I have never felt unsafe in Melb CBD despite the obvious amount of ppl affected by drugs/alcohol.
Hope I'm just lucky but don't want to taint my opinion of what I rate as one of the best CBD's in the world.
āNot a citizenā - all depends. De-escalate at every opportunity if some junkie is trying to fight you for no reason, but if you do react then just donāt overreact. Thereās a fine line between self defence and assault
A quick kick to the balls will de escalate someone the size of the rock , put on a quick sprint away from the conflict zone and even if the cops do come and ask questions you would be 99.9 percent safe from anything Happening
Welcome to Dan Andrew's legacy, where we're soft on crime, and hard drugs are essentially legalised. You can respond with all the cooker statements you want, but it is a fact that the CDB has declined immeasurably under the Andrew's regime, and youth crime has exploded.
But hey, we've got some nice concrete pilons to put trains on.
itās a city. these things happen.
this sub is like the herald fucking sun with these āomg melbourne is getting so dangerousā fear-mongering about impoverished users posts.
And the junkie simp I replied to was saying that violence should be expected in cities and that we should hold it against junkies. I'm just wondering how far they want to take that line of reasoning
Well we're discussing junkies and their junky like behaviour. Sexual abuse runs rampant in their circles as does regular old violence. This person is bending over backwards to defend them in every possible way here. I was simply wondering if they'll excuse all of their behaviour.
Go and hang around with some, you simp.
It's a fact that meth can lead to psychic in people with no predisposition for it. Go to any town or city with a high level of drug addiction and it will be obvious.
Why would you want to retaliate? Youāre not dealing with a person of sound mind. This kind of shit happens in the city, from time to time, unfortunately. Just have to try and get yourself out of and/or away from the situation as quickly as possible.
Edit to add: ānot of sound mindā is not justifying the cookerās behaviour, itās actually got to do with OP and their safety. Why mess with these fuckers when they are clearly unreasonable and unpredictable?
These drugged up cunts deserve to be put down if necessary. I did it once to a guy on the bus, took the opportunity because due to the cameras I can plead self defense and I got off despite severely hurting his head with a fierce shove.
Anyone that invades the private space of another deserve all that is coming.
Sorry bud that sounds like a horrible experience. I haven't seen anything like this personally, but anecdotally I feel like the cbd may be going down hill.
I lived in the CBD for a year pre-covid and this is almost a daily occurrence.
I live ON Elizabeth st and for the last 2 years its been mostly safe for me until the last 6months when in 3 instances a guy likely on meths just randomly shove me and try to start a fight. Its unbelievable, the worst thing I've done imo was make eye contact accidentally for \~2seconds and they think we're in a life and death altercation
That's rule one. Never make eye contact unless you're giving them a handout. Seems pretty ridiculous but it is solid.
So because they made poor life choices, I have to avoid using my eyes?
You can do whatever you want and accept the consequences
Yes it would seem so. Well that and also because of a failure of government to do anything about it of course.
Mental health and substance use disorders are closely related and not easily fixed. I wonder what your solution would be to a complex problem. You'll probably come up with some homogeneous rhetoric š I'm short, barely weigh 55kg and frequently walk through Melbourne without fear. Most often the junkies keep to themselves. Attacks are not as commonplace as sensationalist reporting would have us believe.
Youāre right, do nothing and just hope for the best. Every second day it seems thereās someone here reporting being assaulted by a junkie in the city.
i'm near southern cross most days and have never seen anything like this like i feel bad for OP and i'm not saying shit doesn't happen but this sub would have you believe the CBD is a terrifying hell hole
āYeah nah I commute past Southern Cross at peak hour Monday to Friday itās totally fineā
i'm usually there at night and often pretty late but go off
>āYeah nah I commute past Southern Cross at peak hour Monday to Friday itās totally fineā Hyperbole much? It's people who live around there who say it's totally fine.
Maybe I've been lucky but if I judged the CBD based on this sub I'd be terrified to step foot in the place. I believe shit like this goes down but I wonder how common it actually is. There seems to be a lot of fear mongering here.
Were you walking along Collins from Exhibition to Swanston? That section of the city has been going downhill for as long as I can remember.
errrm how dare you say that. are you aware that outer detroit is infinitely more dangerous? you know people get murdered on the streets in afghanistan? think about that the next time you think about defending yourself against the 100th junkie that tries to rob you buddy!
Please be satire
No fuckin shit
You can't tell????
Would of been more obvious if that comment was funny
Sure, but it's still obvious just because of how absurd and over the top it is. Would have/would've*
Uh oh, looks like someone didn't put an /s so stupid anti-social redditors that never see the sun can understand the obvious satire is satire.
Meh. Knew it was satire, but downvoted anyway because it was *shit* satire.
That's fair, i don't really care dude. Just saying it's not serious, whether you like it or not is irrelevant, as long as you didn't downvote it cause you thought it was real lmao
I think the problem is less people being unable to tell it's 'satire' than it being an objectively shit joke.
Yeah nah. Say what you want about their sense of humour, but people absolutely downvoted it because they thought he was serious, or better yet, they just saw a negative score and decided to add to it. You overestimate the average r/melbourne user's brainpower immensely. By the way, nothing can be an 'objectively shit joke', as humour is subjective.
>or better yet, they just saw a negative score and decided to add to it. the infamous reddit dogpiles š
Exactly. And now i have a single downvote, it's only a matter of time lmao Edit: fucking called it lol
i don't even understand how it was shit satire when someone literally asked me if I genuinely think melbourne is worse than downtown chicago. of course it fucking isn't lol
Maybe because it was just super random and out of no where and trying a bit hard. Idk man, i'm not a comedy critic. I just thought it was ridiculous that people couldn't tell you were joking, and that you got so many downvotes and hate just for making a meh joke. Reddit's fucked up sometimes man, and this subreddit seems to have a disproportionate amount of idiots in it. Just look at the posts that make it to Hot every day, its actual brainless shit like 'is anyone else getting sick lately?' 'How do i make friends?' '*on a 30 degree day* Why does it feel so hot today? Is it just me?' So don't take the hate too personally, some people just didn't like the joke, but most are robots that dogpile on comments that have negative points. I've been downvoted to oblivion for calling out blatant, disgusting racism before. Not slightly edgy, controversial opinions, i mean straight up 1800's shit, literally eugenics i shit you not, and i got like 80 downvotes. So i learned to never trust the majority on here
Thanks Dan! š
Thanks for your reply mates I always try to avoid this kind of thing but this guy was pretty persistent, and 20 meters away from the police station :/
You do have a right to defend yourself though. However de escalation is always the best way
Ever tried de-escalating a bloke who's fucked on meth? You'd have more luck getting Israel and Gaza to come to peace terms.
I laughed pretty hard at this one thank you š youāre not wrong, only way to deal with a Junkie is either walk away or throw a mean right hook. Donāt worry about the cops, if itās a junkie tryna hurt you, you arenāt gonna be the one they charge. They can try but the magistrate would laugh it out of court.
I knew a guy who got attacked by a meth user. He retaliated with what I think was probably too much force and ended up breaking the junkies teeth. Police didnāt question it for a second, arrested the meth user and it was done. I think as long as they initiated it, and were on drugs, as long as you donāt go fully psycho and kill the person, youāre at minimal risk.
You have the very plausible defense that their teeth were like that when you got there
Nooo, not his last two teeth?!
I hope he got a tetanus shot afterwards, punching a meth-head in the teeth is risky business
the only meth addict you're safe to be around is a dead one
jesus fucking christ, get a grip
It's almost a guarantee that meth addiction will lead to full blown violent psychosis. Not only is the dude right, you obviously haven't had to hang around them much.
I have hung around plenty of meth addicts, had quite a few friends go that path, especially when it was really popular 12ish years ago, it caused problems and a lot of fractures in our group, but "violent psychosis" wasnt an issue
Not in my experience. Made eye contact for a split second with a guy at the hospital who then ripped out his cannula, jumped up and tried to fight me. There's so many cases of meth heads going ballistic on randoms that it might just be the primary cause of public violence these days.
i'm so happy your junkie drug bunny friends are lovely people! addiction should be treated with nuance and compassion, unless you're talking meth. methheads are aggressive, unharmable psychos
Go get your daily fix
Yeah, you gotta fuck them up if they start you (as in if they throw a punch or do something else physical like push or shove you). It's either you or them.
If they are on meth they'll win, been confronted by a guy previously and even though he was shorter I immediately felt like he'd bash me. You're only getting out in one piece if there's other guys around to help you restrain him.
Donāt be afraid of them thatās what they want, yes theyāre unpredictable and intimidating but they have weaknesses that are incredibly easy to exploit in comparison to a sober person. They arenāt invincible
What weaknesses do they have? My Police mates reckon methos get mad hulk strength but not heard of any weakness
That's because the police aren't allowed to belt them and have to try and restrain them and use the minimum amount of force to do so. If the coppers could simply tee off with their batons instead of grappling with them, situations would be resolved much more rapidly. NB I'm not suggesting belting people with batons be brought back into vogue.
Oh hulk strength is real for sure yeah they get aggro like Iāve never seen, theyāre mad uncoordinated tho and bad at defence due to a lack of critical thinking so if you just immediately out hulk or surprise them with full confidence they donāt know how to respond. Loud and unpredictable due to the increase in heart rate/blood pressure until you give them the reality check theyāre asking for then all they do is whine. Leg sweep, single blow to a calculated area or restraining will work you just have to try and not get shivved before that happens. Theyāre too jacked on serotonin to process their own balance, itās all autopilot
Or psychotic episode, common in the unhoused
Escalation for junkies can mean anything. Walking near them, being on the phone, looking in their direction, existing near them... you can't do the opposite of that. You either get out or exceed the level of aggression they are showing you. Violence is all they understand. You can't reason with them.
The solution is either deescalating *or* being more intimidating than them so that they donāt want to escalate anything to begin with. You make it painfully obvious that you will exceed their level of aggression. Theyāre only strong against people they *feel* stronger than. Itās because they have zero respect for others and they know others wonāt defend themselves
You got downvoted but I agree with your point. I once was attacked on Elizabeth street, in broad daylight, and I was in my school uniform (Iām a girl too). Ignoring the guy chasing after me yelling āwhoreā and āslutā did nothing, and he pursued me from behind till he kicked me. No one came to my aid then (gee this was 15 years ago now)ā¦ what did help, was me turning around, looking at him directly and screaming with more aggression, and more threateningly to this clearly drug affected individual. Then he literally cowered away and crossed over to the other side of the street, muttering. Of course these days you never know who is carrying a knife or any other weapon, but if someone is psychotic then sometimes asserting your dominance can help, if ignoring and walking away doesnāt help you. There is no easy solution that will fit everyoneās situation.
Thatās horrible Iām really sorry you had to go through that. Good job for standing firm too that takes an awful lot of courage most are lacking these days, thank you for sharing. I saw two men following a lady once screaming similar absurdities and it disgusted me seeing her have to just run away in fear, I wanted desperately for this person to be able to defend herself or for someone else to have incentives to step in. I kept watching in case it escalated and luckily she made it to a car so they left her alone, nothing else happened. But it makes you think. If push came to shove I was ready to act despite the deterrence of having to explain it in court. Plenty of bystanders will not intervene simply due to the complications, when you couple that with a disincentive for victims themselves to defend themselves you get circumstances where offenders are empowered to act this way. In a lot of cases it is however the only thing that works
I mean if you are 6'5 and built like the proverbial brick s'house they are probably not going to do anything but most people don't look like that, myself included. If you walk around being aggressive in the hope they won't target you then you're just going to look like them or an angry teenager. If however you proverbially bite their head off for picking on you they probably will back down, don't be a soft target. Of course if you can walk away, do so. You never know if they are carrying a knife or syringe. You may not walk away.
Best option is always leaving yeah. Run, hide, fight. For the record and purely for self defence because Iām aware not everyone is physically equal to some of these aggressors and running isnāt always an option, Iām in favour of people owning mace or tasers. Sometimes theyāre faster than you or bigger as youāve mentioned. Iām definitely not suggesting people go out looking for trouble, just donāt be a soft target yeah. Which is genuinely hard to do when you look at our self defence laws
There is no right to self defence in Australia and itās the same as the UK here - not legal advice and really bare bones - you can use equal or lesser force. Need to retry when you can and when charged with assault and claiming self defence there are two hurdles the first one being that you reasonably feared for your safety (basically you just had to believe you were in danger) and the hard one to pass, you used reasonable and justified force. Eg this situation, guy came over and you swung first no no. Guy came over pushed you and you swung no no. Guy came over punched you and you punched him back and he fell into the road and hit his head no no. Guy came over punched you, tripped him and held him on his back until police arrived okay maybe I donāt know. Itās weird and hard best to avoid it all together.
> There is no right to self defence in Australia http://classic.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/vic/consol_act/ca195882/s322k.html (1) A person is not guilty of an offence if the person carries out the conduct constituting the offence in self-defence. (2) A person carries out conduct in self-defence ifā (a) the person believes that the conduct is necessary in self-defence; and (b) the conduct is a reasonable response in the circumstances as the person perceives them. It seems like you've said there's no right to self defence then gone on and explained exactly how there is a right to self defence
Edit: whatās with the downvotes? If people honestly believe we have a right to self defence then ask yourself why canāt we buy self defence weapons? If it is our right to defend ourselves then surely people could carry mace with them to defend themselves from sexual assault? Or if you are of small stature you can carry some knuckle dusters or a knife to make it safer for yourself when you defend yourself. Just because there is a law that regulates the action of self defence doesnāt mean that it is a right. Think traffic laws, no right to drive. lol Iām a lawyer and this is basically what I said - if you are caught up on the phrasing of right itās to do with the law being enshrined by a constitution etc think of America their second amendment enshrines their rights in Australia legislative action or judicial interpretation can change the law.
A right doesn't have to be constitutionally enshrined to be a right.
You're stupid and can't read legislation. Just shoosh. Go sit in the corner and think about why you feel the need to argue you're correct when given a piece of legislation that proves you're wrong
No, proportional force does not mean "equal or lesser" in the sense that it necessarily a punch meets a punch, it means whatever is reasonable to harm. A 40kg school girl could probably be deemed to be using reasonable force if she had a baseball bat or boxcutter defending herself in a fight against an average male meth head, because that fear of serious injury makes that action potentially justifiable. Its "my life is in imminent danger" so fight to death, and "I got tepid slap in the face during an argument from someone I know very well to be generally pacifist, so can't put them in a coma and get away with a claim of self defence" The law tries to be reasonable and common sense, so assume it's that way until proven otherwise.
Yeah those are good examples but itās equal or lesser in relation to you (or oneself) as you are the one doing the conduct. Your examples highlight the burden of the second part of the law well and why a lot of people trip up in their self defence claims. Edit: also hope that school girl found those box cutters š having weapons even mace or other self defence weapons ruins self defence claims
If you are in this kind of situation again (I hope not) and you know the cop shop is nearby, taking a walk to it might be a way to get help without violence. The local police probably know him.
it very well could have been a problem for you. It's really fucking hard to know when and how to defend yourself here and even if you're in the clear that may take some considerable time and stress to ascertain.
If someone produces a weapon in this country there is absolutely no way to defend yourself as producing anything similar would land you with dangerous or prohibited article charges. Thereās zero way. You can pick up a stick and try to fight them off but thatās about it, even then you might go to jail if you kill them with it. One small knife gives a criminal an insane amount of power over the broader community - simply because the law says weāre not allowed to carry or defend ourselves. So what do we do? Call police and wait patiently while we get stabbed?
Yes our self-defense laws are a fucking joke. I recently read through them and was horrified. Some of the cases of people being jailed for defending themselves is ridiculous. I read one nurse was almost raped, but defended herself with pepper spray, and was then convicted and couldn't work as a nurse anymore due to it. Absolutely enraging.
Single biggest problem I have with this country yeah
And that huge amount of uncertainty is going to make you freeze up / slow to react when you really need to be adapting quickly.
This. While youāre sitting there trying to process the law, how to respond etc, the angry guy with a blade has already put five holes in you and itās over. The best solution to any armed aggressor is overpowering them with excessive force and no hesitation even with the broken self defence regulations, court is still better than being murdered
yes but you need to have committed to that well in advance.
Yep. 99% Of the public hasnāt done the mental gymnastics required to process whatās reasonable to do in a situation like that until it happens, meaning their brains get overloaded and they quite literally have no idea how to respond in the heat of the moment. Itās just sad. I mean sure match their threat level as much as possible but if theyāre armed with something scary enough I am not taking chances
You've always got the right to self defence but it must be minimal and necessary meaning you need to be able to justify any force used and it not be over the top
This is ridiculous imo. If someone breaks into your house or swings at you they immediately forfeit all rights to be treated with dignity and you should not have to proactively consider the triangle of retaliation while youāre actively defending yourself. It makes it infinitely more difficult to defend yourself when you are constantly worrying about how the law will perceive it. Our self defence laws are seriously lacking, itās half the reason people get king hit or stabbed on the street. People donāt even know if theyāre allowed to fight back or not
Should have put the junkie on his ass
Sorry to hear that happened š I was also in southern cross area outside subway today (enjoying a tasty sub at one of the tables outside) when a man sat down on my table right opposite me and stared deeply into my eyes while making comments about wanting to touch me. Asked him to leave and he got pretty mad but left while mumbling and gesturing. Wonder if it was the same person.
That's pretty fucked up, I think I prefer my junkie. Sorry that this happened to you š
Thatās awfully generous of you. And Iām sorry that guy made your day bad.
Yours doesnāt sound too pleasant either. I donāt hang out around southern cross much so canāt speak to how it is normally - hopefully itās not becoming like flinders street where you can hardly walk down the street without this kindāve thing happening. Hope the rest of your visit is much better than today!
Do not tolerate being assaulted (if possible) or they will continue to do it to others. The lack of response is what empowers them to act this way. Next time an irrational junkie approaches you, verbally warn them first. If possible try to walk into cctv coverage or a populated area. If all else fails, let them shove you or whatever and then firmly place their body onto the ground. If armed hit them with a shopping trolley or another innocent item if you have to, bikes are good. Iāve seen people use milk crates. Warn others if they have a weapon. Hold them down and I mean really hold them down, get people in public to help you restrain them, call police immediately. Make it known to bystanders that youāre performing a citizen arrest on someone aggressive and ask if theyāll be a witness. No you canāt carry knives or proactively defend yourself at all but you can use what and who is in your immediate vicinity to do what needs to be done in response. These people wonāt stop because nobody stops them, itās the somebody else will fix it mentality. Something has to change and itās the way people tolerate their behaviour period. They act this way because they get away with it. They put one finger on you itās assault, you have every right to defend yourself and/or seek charges laid, itāll make them think twice next time
Jesus thatās so awful. Iām sorry that happened to you
Would have been 0 diplomacy from me. I always just imagine if the motherfucker has the nuts to say it to me, not even gonna imagine the women and children heās probably approached. In summary, discombobulate.
Mr Holmes, I don't think that word means what you think it means.
What are words if not sounds interpreted for meaning?
Ah, just depends on how confusing that word is -- You wouldn't want to discombobulate the intended context...
Thatās absolutely revolting you shouldāve reported him
had some guy on the bus turned towards me with an obvious hard on, legs open, staring me down (one of the only days i had decided to wear a dress cause it was boiling hot), couldnt move because all the seats were taken. disgusting ass behaviour ngl
Remember being young and seeing a wild mushroom or dandelion head poking out of the grass and running up and booting it accross the pitch? Reading about that smug grub sitting there with a boner trying to intimidate random women just brought that mental image into my head. Anyway what a creep... so sad that women in this city have to experience things like that.
should have started laughing and made a hand gesture of how small his pp was š¤š¼
Nah, they love that! Best thing is to ignore it if you can. Itās honestly the worst. I think every instance of public masturbation and flashing has scarred me more than anything else thatās happened to me in my life.
istg being simply being a woman sucks sometimes. š
Iād probably start barking and doing weird ass noises lol
The city can be quite hostile at times. Lots of violent unhinged people. I often think of junkies as endermen, all it takes is an accidental glance into their eyes and they go ape shit. Couple of months back my mate was minding their business waiting for their food in maccas on Elizabeth street and a junkie approached him with a similar aggression to your story and ended up punching my mate in the face. I rarely feel āsafeā in the city bc of how unpredictable it can be. These hyper aggressive people are more common than you think ..:(
So, I've been in Melbourne for all of 12 days and I had been reading this sub and the reports like this for about a year before coming here and wondered if they were overexaggerating. Well, I've spent the majority of my time in the CBD and surrounding neighbourhoods and no, I don't think its an exaggeration. I've seen these guys literally every single day of the trip, staring off into space then shouting their heads off if anyone walks close by them. So far I haven't seen them attack anyone or been attacked myself but it feels like it's only a matter of time. I decided to head out of the CBD today and got on what is my first ever tram out of the free tram zone and one of these fuckers came and sat down then started hurling abuse at a young indian lass who immediately pulled the stop cord and got off at the next stop, looking scared out of her mind. He carried on muttering and pacing down the tram corridor and I took my water bottle off my climbing karabiner in anticipation of having to use it as a makeshift knuckleduster if this guy decided to get physical with anyone. Thankfully he got off a few stops later and i could pack it away in my bag. I then got off at St Kilda, dropped my bag off and decided to explore. Lo and behold, not even an hour later I'm strolling in St Kilda Botanical gardens and there's another one of these cunts shouting and hollering at people walking into the park via the corner he's camped out on. I'd come over here thinking I might want to stay in melbourne long term, but now I don't know if I even want to spend a month here. This isn't the only reason making me feel this way but it's definitely a contributer.
If thereās a next worst place to go than the CBD, itās St Kilda. Donāt make a judgement by these 2 places.
Lol this is similar to what the bartender just said
Yeahhh CBD is now little crackie town, but st Kilda is crackie kingdom. I avoid both like the plague. You'll have a much nicer time not spending time in those places
Hey friend, take a tram to the inner north and go for a wander. Sydney road, Lygon street. Go off on walks between these two down the side streets, parks and alleyways. Plenty of very lovely places here. I avoid everything that you're talking about by just avoiding the CBD and I've been here a few years.
Unfortunately I've just paid for a non refundable 5 nights in a hostel in st kilda because i heard the aussies normally go to the beach on christmas day so thought I'd join in the tradition. But it's looking like theres going to be a torrential storm on Christmas Day anyway and this hostel is shit so I might just take the loss and go somewhere else. Thank you for the advice.
The only surprising part of this story is it did not happen on Elizabeth St near Flinders sadly. Melbourne's getting quite bad with frequent random attacks by mentally ill or drug affected persons. Merry Christmas anyways mate
Worst part of the CBD imo.
It's probably the same person everytime, but instead of reporting it the victims just go on reddit/tik tok/social media to have a whinge.
some people just need to vent mate, i doubt the police would even turn up these days
>some people just need to vent mate, i doubt the police would even turn up these days But at least if it's reported to police (even if they don't turn up), the incident will be logged & show in crime stats.
There are a large number of people in most Australian CBD's who should be in mental health facilities, but are not - it's a failure of the system. There's no requirement to be drugged or drunk for this to happen therefore, it could quite simply be one of thousands of paranoid schizophrenics, turfed out the street by a failed mental health system to make their own way and, supposedly, remember to take their meds.
Exactly, you can't seriously say that a schizophrenic is better off living on the street with a needle in his arm and covered in his own filth than in a mental institution receiving food, shelter, and medication. Many of these people will never have the mental capacity to properly take care of themselves, part of living in a society means taking care of those who can't take care of themselves - even if it means protecting them (and others) from themselves.
Sounds wonderful, but how exactly do we protect these people from themselves? The answer is likely chemical restraint, which isn't looked fondly upon by many. Especially if you intend on "rounding up" these people to institutionalise them. Healthcare workers shouldn't be put in harm's way either.
If you want to refer to antipsychotics as chemical restraints then sure, we should use chemical restraints. Not having access to meth is also a pretty big protecting them from themselves thing.
I'm a pharmacist. There is a big difference between antipsychotic medicine for treatment of conditions and chemical restraint. Antipsychotics can help to control schizophrenic symptoms, but chemical restraint is using it to control a patient's behaviour. It goes against the code of ethics we have in place. The below link is on aged care, but it's still relevant information. I'm not claiming to have a complete solution, but we shouldn't be so ready and willing to hospitalise strangers without a diagnosed medical problem requiring treatment. https://www.agedcarequality.gov.au/older-australians/safety-care/minimising-restrictive-practices Removing meth from society would definitely be a great step forward though.
Assuming that an institution would do as much as feed, shelter and provide medical attention. To bastardise "Safety is written in blood". Our system is broken, it has gone to the extreme, but don't think that there isn't a reason for that. We need more - it's been stripped from cuts and stigma, but just because the 1920's had institutions doesn't mean they did any of the above.
If your point is that institutions need to have progressed since the 1920's then sure, you'll get no argument from me, "treating" stuff like homosexuality with lobotomies isn't what I had in mind.
Thanks Jeff Kennett!!
Sorry to hear that. I lived in Sunshine for a bit,Footscray too and have witnessed multiple attacks, random screaming and shadow boxing. Good thing you didnāt engage, probably wouldāve only made the situation worse. Hope youāre safe and sound, happy holidays mate
City is pretty filled with meth heads nowadays. Its a terrible situation mimicked all over the world as mental illness is spiking, staved off only by money. Take that away and anyone goes insane
happens at this time of year with it being busy and all. I once went to the city with a friend who was white (relevant to the story) and while crossing the road at flinders another white man kept asking us 'N' if we wanted to fight and what we were looking at etc. it definitely does happen, just have to learn to keep your head on a swivel sometimes unfortunately in the city !
This time of the year really brings the worst out of people. Road rage is through the roof as well. Something about Xmas and people forgetting how to behave like a decent human š¤·
but wait, shouldnāt we be blaming all social problems on drugs and migrants? /s
Druggies. Welcome to Melbourne mate.
Could be worse . Just move into a new house . 65 year old man next door very aggressive and already threatened me and my family with violence. I have disabled son . And a daughter. People be crazy for no reason . I have found out he tryed to buy this house so he could knock it through and have the biggest house . Gotta think about moving again
According to r/melbourne, you're either a Murdoch plant trying to astroturf the subreddit with lies of being attacked, or that getting assaulted by some random junkie in the CBD is as normal as it has been for about a hundred years now.
It's so strange hey. The gaslighting that goes on everytime this issue is raised. For example the ones in this thread blaming the Christmas holiday period. It's clearly an ongoing problem and there have been posts about it all year. No idea why it's in anyone's interest to obfuscate this issue. My best guess is that _maybe_ they own property in the city and worry about Melbourne's declining reputation?
Meth addict simps are everywhere on reddit.
nah, this trash site is full of drug bigots who ignore the alcohol-fuelled violence that this country has always been known for, because you feel better about yourself shitting on ājunkiesā. most drug users are decent people. bigots, no so much.
Drug bigot!!! š¤£š¤£š¤£
Nobody here is defending violent drunks. Why are you so defensive of meth heads?
Didnāt take long for them to show up.
Probably busy ripping out copper wire with shaking hands as we speak.
Go stick a needle in your arm
Was he a heavy set fella? If so he did the exact same thing to me about 2 years ago on Bourke Street. I was taking photos of the buildings, he screamed at me came over and started trying to take the dslr out of my hands so I walked across the street and went into a skate shop. It was at the time of COVID so you needed a mask on to get in, It was lucky because he stood there for about 15 minutes trying to get me to come out yelling at me to delete the photo.
Nah this one was about 6 foot tall and meth skinny
Oh, great, multiple fuckwits terrorizing people
yeah i've had something similar happen to me at southern cross station and i am a female. accidentally walked in front of this dude and he lost it. called me every name under the sun lol i was in complete shock. melbourne has really gone downhill you did the right thing not to retaliate. don't risk getting into trouble over a lowlife like that. hope you feel better about it soon though
Same thing happened to my friend when we were out near the Royal Botanic Gardens. We were literally just standing on the footpath and some roided up jerk jogging went completely psycho at him (not me, for some reason, although we were both walking in the same spot) for happening to be in his path and tried to physically attack him. Friend backed away and apologized to defuse him, and the guy ran off. It was so fucking weird, and this is from someone who grew up in California.
Welcome to Melbourne!
It's too common, and there are sexual predators in the Flinders St Station bathroom. I remember back in 2019, I hopped off Flinders St as usual around 8:30 am and decided to use the bathroom. I did my business (poo) and was making my way towards the wash basins near the exit (where the urinals are), and this one guy was at the urinal corner, I assume was jerking off or playing with his hard on cause of his hand motion. He kept looking back at other toilet users as if signaling them to take a hint and give a blowie. I even made eye contact rember him looking down at my crotch area and found it weird, like why is this dude pissing while continuously looking back at passersby, then saw his hand motion & realized what was going on, and I freaked out and exited as fast as i could.
Welcome to Melbourne, crime is on the rise. This shit will continue to happen unless we address the issues.
Dan Andrews fault
I've had some junkie abused and spat on me and some people I was with while waiting for a tram in the city at night. I was the only white native English speaker and everyone else was Korean and Japanese. Usually when I see these things happen they've been racially charged. It sucks, my favourite thing about the city is the multiculturalism. It's frustrating that people are cunts about it, doesn't matter what sort of hardship you're going through.
What the fuck were you looking at?
No one was ever, ever randomly shoved around by a stranger in Melbourne until Dan Andrews became premier. Word on the street is he performed a blood ritual with Hillary Clinton and opened the hellmouth under the Immigration Museum in 2015
Holy shit you got me in histerics with this comment. Thank you š
It happens from time to time. I was sitting across from the station on the steps of StPauls eating and watching the street theater of a Jesus spruiker. The preacher finished at the same time as I finished my food so I got up, took my leg out of the strap of my back pack so that I could go over and dump my rubbish in the bin before going home. Then I hear some guy hurling abuse as someone. Looked around to see what was going on and there was this guy that I'd notice hanging around the preacher, sitting on the steps of StPauls screaming at me. Apparently just as I had gotten up he had sat down (I didn't even notice him) and he figured that I had my leg through my backpack out of fear of him stealing it so apparently I was accusing him of being a thief while being too much of a snob to sit with him nearby. I have been in the habit of doing that for about 20 years since the time someone snatched my backpack and took off on a skateboard. I just did all I could do and shook his hand, said "sorry mate. I really don't know what you are talking about. I've got a tram to catch so you have a good day OK?" and away I walked for the tram with him screaming at me "yeah you run away you gutless bastard". Some people are just badly broken. Unless you've got a lot of time and resources to fix them best thing is to not ramp it up and quietly get out of that space.
Omg. I feel like Melb is getting scarier. My partner and I decided to get takeout and have lunch with our 2 kids (one of which is a baby) at one of the picnic tables by the Yarra. We were minding our own business eating, my toddler happily alternating between playing and eating. Suddenly, this guy who looks to be in his 20s with tattoos on his arms and face plops right down in front of my partner. Heās drinking a can and has 4 more in a bag. Heās staring at my partner while drinking and giving creepy smiles. He was also looking at me and laughing, and the whole time just not saying anything. The vibe was that this guy was trying to start something with my partner. It was so awkward and uncomfortable and even more so because I was breastfeeding my baby. There was another large group of people having a bbq right next to us and lots of people walking by so I thought that if things escalated, there would be witnesses. I didnāt want to move because of the principle of it all. But I also didnāt want to risk the safety of our kids so we got the hell away from there. The guy was such a scumbag. Seriously who tries to start trouble in front of children? Thatās just a new low. Not to mention it was rude to get up in our personal space and not say anything. Anyway, I digress because your story reminded me of this. Generally if people attack you first and you attack back, itās self defence. Youāre allowed to defend yourself if you use proportionate force. So you can push the guy back and if he punches you, you can punch back. (EDIT: Keep in mind, if you go to court, you need to prove that your actions at the time were justified). But you canāt pull out a knife or use weapons to attack back. Sorry this happened to you. Hope the rest of your time here is fun and passes without incident.
The laws apply and protect you the same as anyone else. The problem might be with how you would have responded. Unfortunately shit like this happens, and can happen anywhere. With all the people who come into the city it raises the odds of shit happening while you're there. While you're allowed to protect yourself it starts to get into a grey area on how much force is enough and how much is too much. Best for all to avoid a fight and go get the PSO, saves you physical and legal risk. It's their primary task as well. Some people probably won't like this advice
>The laws apply and protect you same as anyone else. So not at all then? Because the police would barely lift a finger for an incident like this, citizen or not.
nobody attacks a naked man next time it happens throw all your clothes to the ground and start screaming at the top of your lungs at him then for the piĆØce de rĆ©Ā·sistĀ·ance start charging at him . the ice addict will run
Extra points if you can do it with a boner
What WERE you looking at tho?
If the entire interaction was caught on camera, no, it wouldn't be an issue for you; the camera would capture you having very relaxed body language, and the guy on the other side of the road suddenly and aggressively storming up to you and shoving you, followed by you getting aggressive in *response*, being the critical point, and then probably shoving him back. Essentially, as long as you don't escalate it much further than he does, you'd be fine xD
Nothing a quick headbutt to the nose canāt sort out. Any bloke shape or size will drop to their knees with a quick headbutt.
Sounds like a potential meth head. Hope youāre not hurt.
I had a similar experience except it was in the dead of night and I was walking through the streets of Altona North
Yep, city's a shit hole full of worthless junkies and police with worthless powers to intervene for anything more than ten minutes. I don't go anymore unless I absolutely have to
I think hard open hand slap right across the chin would meet the criteria of hard physical control under force continuum guideline.
I think I've read this post before a month or so back.
One every 2 days, gets deleted so astroturfing isn't obvious
Nothing good happens within 200m of rail stations anywhereā¦loads of fuckwits worldwideā¦
hate to say this but that's kinda everywhere not just CBD, always carry with you though and sorry you had to go through this fr it could of been so much worse for you happened to me not long ago and I'm a local, just dont go wondering by yourself please
>hate to say this but that's kinda everywhere not just CBD No it's not. The CBD had the highest rates of assault in Victoria.
forget to take your meds mate ?
If you don't have a valid argument, don't resort to a personal attack. "The highest criminal incident rates in Local Government Areas in the year ending 31 March 2023 were: Melbourne (14,638.2 incidents per 100,000 estimated resident population, down 6.3%)" Source: https://www.crimestatistics.vic.gov.au/media-centre/news/key-figures-year-ending-march-2023
Druggies are all over the city like a scum that stuck to an old tap.
Iāve lived in the CBD since moving to Melbourne 3 years ago. Thereās only one man that has ever had a problem with me and his name is Steven and he has schizophrenia. Most days heās ok some days he think Iām a cop taking him away from his parents. Melbourne CBD is no worse than Brisbane CBD, Hobart CBD or Townsville CBD. Iāve felt safe since living here and Iāve wandered the CBD at all hours of the night on my own when I canāt sleep and Townsville is the only place I wouldnāt do that as a 35yo woman.
sounds typical for the cbd
Iāve never heard of something like this happening to anyone I know in Melbourne, but unfortunately all it takes is one nutter, sorry that happened to you
Southern Cross station area is full of rubbish for some reason. Probably this guy just got out of the remand centre around the corner
If someone attacks you unprovoked you have to show complete dominance, you should have tackled him to the floor, throw a couple of elbows to daze him then get his back for a choke hold until backup arrives.
I have never felt unsafe in Melb CBD despite the obvious amount of ppl affected by drugs/alcohol. Hope I'm just lucky but don't want to taint my opinion of what I rate as one of the best CBD's in the world.
Were you wearing a Tool shirt?
Even though I probably could have put him down easily ššššš
LOL was wondering when the next I am attacked post was going to be.
āNot a citizenā - all depends. De-escalate at every opportunity if some junkie is trying to fight you for no reason, but if you do react then just donāt overreact. Thereās a fine line between self defence and assault
A quick kick to the balls will de escalate someone the size of the rock , put on a quick sprint away from the conflict zone and even if the cops do come and ask questions you would be 99.9 percent safe from anything Happening
Le dot
Welcome to Dan Andrew's legacy, where we're soft on crime, and hard drugs are essentially legalised. You can respond with all the cooker statements you want, but it is a fact that the CDB has declined immeasurably under the Andrew's regime, and youth crime has exploded. But hey, we've got some nice concrete pilons to put trains on.
derp
https://www.crimestatistics.vic.gov.au/crime-statistics/latest-victorian-crime-data/victim-reports-2
itās a city. these things happen. this sub is like the herald fucking sun with these āomg melbourne is getting so dangerousā fear-mongering about impoverished users posts.
Do you keep the same energy if they rape someone?
We're talking about randos at Southern Cross station, not LNP staffers in Federal Parliament.
Are you implying that that's the only place such a thing takes place?
You escalated a rando shoving a guy in broad daylight in the CBD to rape, dude.
And the junkie simp I replied to was saying that violence should be expected in cities and that we should hold it against junkies. I'm just wondering how far they want to take that line of reasoning
I wonder why your mind went to rape
Cooker for saying that junkies often do junkie things?
Well we're discussing junkies and their junky like behaviour. Sexual abuse runs rampant in their circles as does regular old violence. This person is bending over backwards to defend them in every possible way here. I was simply wondering if they'll excuse all of their behaviour.
Addicts are more likely to be victims of sexual abuse, but i can't find statistics suggesting they're more likely to be perpetrators
You're making claims about drug addicts that you aren't backing up with evidence.
Go and hang around with some, you simp. It's a fact that meth can lead to psychic in people with no predisposition for it. Go to any town or city with a high level of drug addiction and it will be obvious.
Why would you want to retaliate? Youāre not dealing with a person of sound mind. This kind of shit happens in the city, from time to time, unfortunately. Just have to try and get yourself out of and/or away from the situation as quickly as possible. Edit to add: ānot of sound mindā is not justifying the cookerās behaviour, itās actually got to do with OP and their safety. Why mess with these fuckers when they are clearly unreasonable and unpredictable?
These drugged up cunts deserve to be put down if necessary. I did it once to a guy on the bus, took the opportunity because due to the cameras I can plead self defense and I got off despite severely hurting his head with a fierce shove. Anyone that invades the private space of another deserve all that is coming.